Sense of Soul - Anxiety Tools for Generation Panic

Episode Date: September 27, 2021

Today with have with us Agi Heale she is the author of the book Generation Panic, CPCC, PCC, Professional Certified Coach and a Certified Neuro-Linguistic Programming (NLP) Practitioner. She has coaching practices in London and Singapore, where she helps clients who are feeling overwhelmed to cultivate a positive mindset, be calm and confident, and make lasting changes for the better. Agi prides herself on helping people make sustainable change to build a life that they are happier with. Through tailored individual coaching programs, Agi encourages her clients to perform at their best consistently and deal with any challenges that come up. As the youngest female Director of a fast-paced and growing business, who personally learned to manage anxiety to achieve high performance and manage multiple teams, Agi supports rising talent, high-potentials and leaders to stay energised, confident and resilient even in times of high stress and big change. To find out more about Agi and her work https://ekho.academy/agi Follow her journey on Instagram https://instagram.com/agiheale?utm_medium=copy_link Go to Sense of Soul Patreon to listen to more Sense of Soul Podcast, early releases, extended and exclusive episode available now!!! Visit www.mysenseofsoul.com

Hey, did you know that Sense of Soul now has a Patreon where you can get exclusive episodes, mini series that Mandy and I have been working on for a long time that we can't wait to share with you, monthly readings, Sense of Soul sacred circles, workshops, behind the scene clips, and much more. Hop on Sense of Soul Patreon right now and sign up. Welcome to the Sense of Soul podcast. We are your hosts, Shanna and Mandy. Grab your coffee, open your mind, heart, and soul.

It's time to awaken. Today we have with us Aggie Heal. She is an author and a certified personal coach. She uses a blend of coaching, leadership development, NLP, and neuroscience techniques to find the best solutions for clients. Her services include one-on-one coaching, leadership development programs, and group facilitations. Aggie was born in the U.S., but she's hopped around the world. She grew up in Hong Kong, studied in the U.K., and now is in Singapore joining us. She's here to share with us about her new book, Generation Panic, which has many tools inside of it for anxiety, which you definitely need tools. And that's something

Nancy and I talk a lot about because both of us, you know, experiencing anxiety, but thank you so much for joining us. It's morning in Singapore and it's evening in Colorado. So I know. Well, thank you so much for having me and the joys of technology. We can do this. I know um best last name ever for a life coach yeah yeah I know I love it that is cool where were you born in the U.S. I was born in California in Palo Alto and then Hong Kong what took you to Hong Kong Hong Kong yes both my parents were working there so they kind of lived the expat dream and uh we followed them age one one I I got kind of whisked along as well and yeah and then we

grew up in Hong Kong for about 14 years which was brilliant it was a very cool very very cool upbringing wow so tell us about that how did that your life? How did that inspire you to be where you are today? I think it's affected me hugely because I have continuously moved. Like it doesn't scare me as much. I feel like that's kind of almost exciting. It's part of the joy of life is that change and that movement, that energy. And Hong Kong was particularly in those days, a wonderful place to have a childhood. It's incredibly safe. I had a lot of freedom from quite a young age. And it's interesting as I've grown up and I've become more aware of myself, I've realized how important those things are to me. And so I feel very grateful that I had such a foundation without even realizing. I didn't even realize how, you know, how good that was.

Growing up in Hong Kong has definitely gave me the taste of Asia. I just loved it. And so I, yeah, coming to Singapore was a no brainer for us. And where else have you lived then? Just back in the UK. So I then went to university up in Leeds, which was up in kind of the middle north of England, and then was living in London before we relocated here. Okay, so the accent. So you're born in US, you don't sound like you're from US. Well, I went to an English speaking school, obviously, and my parents are British. So

and, you know, we often went back to the UK. And so I have bounced around a lot, not different countries, but different states. Have you found that you struggle with getting grounded from moving around so much? I don't think so you know it's so interesting you say that I get asked that a lot whether I feel like that core that that kind of deep groundedness that you talk about and I do feel it but I think wherever I've been just becomes the new home and then I'm the kind of moving part within that so as long as I'm grounded in myself then it kind of is irrelevant what my surroundings are where I am physically and actually the song that we had at our first dance at our wedding was home is whenever I'm with you and that phrase feels very true for me like home is whenever I'm with him and our family and that

I mean we could be in a cardboard box and we'd be grounded. And since the soul, we have found that there's kind of a common theme amongst our guests. A lot of our guests have turned pain into purpose and have kind of landed where they're at because of that pain. Is that a theme in your life? Yes.

I mean, you couldn't have put it better, pain to purpose. And for me to rewind slightly, so I used to work in financial services recruitment and I got to this point where I had everything on paper, like tick, tick, tick, director, managing three teams, earning great money, engaged to be married, you know, all of the, all of the things that I was meant to be doing in my life I had achieved. And yet I got to this point where I was just so anxious. And ultimately, my body overtook it. And I started having panic attacks and was completely out of control with my body. And what's interesting is I sit here now, obviously, with the beauty and the benefit of hindsight, is that I can realize that those

darkest, hardest, most challenging times that I've ever faced have absolutely given me all of the light that I have now. Like all of. Did you only get anxiety as an adult or did you ever experience it as a child? So what's interesting is that looking back now, I realized that I had had anxious moments, but I, I didn't even know what was happening. I was like, you know, I just kind of rushed off. I'd had coaching at a couple of points of my life, but I always thought it was me just struggling with one little thing, but didn't quite add the phrase or the terminology of terminology of anxiety so I didn't have that knowledge right like your parents never talked about it no it just wasn't part of our kind of world I don't know it just didn't fit in it was so it's so weird looking back on it now right so then when you had it did you feel like

oh my gosh I'm like the only one in the world that is having this or? Oh, absolutely. I was like, oh my gosh, like everyone else is totally fine. Like I am completely flailing here. Like I have no idea what's happening and I'm terrified. Like I don't know. I honestly don't know what's happening. Can you describe it a little bit for our listeners? Like what did that feel like in your body so what initially happened is I remember sitting at my desk and even my boss came over and she was like you hung over and I was like no I was just I think all the color had washed out I looked like I was about to kind of hell and I remember so adamantly trying to fight it like I was just sat there being like, what is happening? I don't know.

I must keep going. Like I must find my way. And ultimately I took flight in the end. And I remember just kind of almost like blindly running out of there. And my whole body just didn't feel myself. Like my heart rate went through the roof. My palms were sweating. My stomach was doing

backflips. And I think for me, the scariest part was my mind went blank. It was like I was unable to string together thought or like even sentences. And so historically, I'd always been able to rationalize it. I'd always been able to in my head being like okay you know put everything as it was whereas in this moment I couldn't even control my thoughts I couldn't calm my breathing and yeah so I absolutely took flight I remember kind of standing around the back of the back of the office in this little courtyard and calling my husband and being like I don't know what's happening like help me yeah it was really you know I actually had two anxiety attacks last month and all the night and I just was like no what is that and I but you know what I was able to fight through it and I was able to breathe and eventually you you know, went away. You know,

you have this panic at first when it comes over you. I don't even realize like how much time went by, but it feels like forever that I was able to both times kind of get control over it, which was huge for me. And I still don't really consciously understand why they came on but I'm sure there is something underlying I've since done some self-care and haven't had any knock on wood good for you yeah I think there's been a lot of research that a panic attack actually only lasts for 20 minutes like the apps the core of it what surrounds that is that 20 minutes is a long time though yeah it is a long time and it's and your body is in such a heightened state of alert that it takes a huge advantage I'm sure you felt exhausted after or even the next day or even even a few days after

and I think that's what's kind of scary is that it feels so debilitating across all of your life. Like all I could see was the anxiety. It was like right in front of my eyes. And so even if I wasn't having a panic attack, I was exhausted from one or I was so scared of one happening. I was like living in fear that I was going to get blindsided at a moment that was, yeah, not going to be a good moment. It's interesting because I was thinking about my panic attacks were usually always brought on by asthma. So because I was never even actually taught to breathe correctly, which blows my mind that all of these years, since I was two years old, I sat in doctor's offices and they never actually spent any time with me teaching me how to breathe and how to exhale. And then also alcohol,

alcohol had a huge effect on my anxiety to the point where if I had drank and then the next day I was a little hungover, I literally could not even go to the grocery store because I felt like my pupils were popping out of my head and people were staring at me and everything was like in slow mo and my vision was off and it just kept getting worse and worse, which obviously eventually led me to having to just cut alcohol out of my life completely. But I mean, it makes sense because it affects your nervous system, right? Yeah. And so does the breathing, but I do, I feel like my entire life I have walked around in, um, almost 90% in flight and fight and flight.

Like my body just naturally lives kind of there because of my asthma. Isn't that, that sucks. Yeah, that does suck. And it's interesting interesting I've done some work recently actually on particularly on breathing and what's interesting is that it sets your baseline you know like your baseline state for you because your breathing is so interconnected with our mind our heart the rest of our body it's probably saying like oh things are a little tighter or a little harder and so then your baseline state is in a heightened state of stress and then that becomes your normal like the way that I describe it is you know like on an air con or a heating you set you set the temperature for like 23 and then

throughout the whole day it will look to maintain that 23 so if you get to a 25 or a 21 it's like uh-oh we're off like we need to re-get back to that baseline and so if you're used to that kind of stress or like the heightened response then your body if you're in a very calm place it might be like whoa whoa hold on like we need to get uncomfortable it was very uncomfortable for me to be in a calm place. Yes. Exactly. So then you've got to retrain yourself of like, how can I then feel comfortable with that calm state and then therefore like reset the baseline?

Yes. Thank you for explaining that. I've never had anyone explain it that way. And I think you're absolutely on point. So then what does someone like me do to reset my baseline? For every single person, it's going to be completely different what they need and what's going to work best for you. Breathing is the easiest way to do it. And it's something that I bang on about because I agree. I've never been taught how to breathe. And for me, when I'm anxious or feeling panicky, it's like

super high up in my chest and everything gets tighter. And that then feeds those messages that say, oh, maybe I'm in danger in some way, or I'm under attack in some way. And then the fight, flight or freeze response comes on. Okay, why do you think I really have only had anxiety in the middle of the night? So I think you and I are probably similar in that, forgive me if I'm, I'm putting you into a box or anything, or it doesn't feel right. But

for me, I feel like in my everyday life, I'm relatively in control and I can rationalize everything. Yeah. Like I've got it down. Like I'm totally rational. Something knocks me off. I'm like, my head can kind of put things in its place and make sense of things. Whereas in the middle of the night, my defenses are down. My body is then more able to react because my brain is hopefully switched off and doing all the amazing things to kind of process the day. I think that's the time when your body can come to light and it's so much more stark. You're like, huh, okay. And you're not able to rationalize. Well, I don't know about you, but for me, three in the morning.

So there's no processing, you mean? Is that kind of like, so you think I'm like saving all the processing and then I go to bed. And so now my brain's processing maybe. And so then it's boom. Yes. And I think. That's terrible. I'm too busy to even have stress during the day exactly but you're probably

thinking in the day like sense of everything like I've got everything sorted whereas in the middle of the night it's like okay well maybe maybe everything isn't 100% sorted and there are things that are actually having more of an impact or making you feel a little bit more worried than you've kind of discredited it the first thing. That figures. You know, only I would not have time enough to have an anxiety attack consciously. Exactly. I don't have this scheduled in my day.

This does not work for me. I mean, it's just such bullshit. I mean, I can't even fit in an anxiety attack. But that's probably it as well. Like if you're so back to back and you're, you're at such a. My last near death experience is aligned perfectly with that. I mean, that that day, I didn't even realize the impact it was having on my lungs. And I fell asleep. And at 4am I woke up and couldn't breathe and ended up in a coma. So right there, my body started processing it probably while I was asleep

and I had a full on panic attack and quit breathing in my sleep. So what I'm thinking is that before I go to sleep, I need to kind of sit with my day a little bit maybe, and like let things kind of process more and just kind of like end some things in my mind before I go to sleep. Absolutely. I think there's, again, there's been a lot of research around um the power of unwinding from your day and whether that's like exercise or some journaling some free writing just how you can really process and then look forward to the next day but also I would maybe consider stepping back from your life and kind of big picture when you when you think about everything in its entirety like is this as a whole working for you like is this creating the baseline that you want is this how you want to be

conducting your work is it the healthiest for you or is it working and maybe it is that's cool but good to check in with the big picture in my day do I need more downtime do I need more more deep breath yeah so this is clearly something you're incredibly passionate about. So passionate about it that you wrote this book. Can you talk about the inspiration behind this book and what your hopes for people that read your book is? Yes. Generation Panic was really born out of that time when I was struggling so much and I was so desperate to make sure that no one saw that I was struggling, you know, so intent on being like, okay. And like I was handling life when I clearly wasn't like, I clearly was, was really struggling. And in that time, I just was desperate to find

anything that was going to make me feel better. and I was reading books that were 350 pages on like one technique or one specific thing that wouldn't work for me or someone would recommend and say hey try out headspace you know that's going to be great and I would sit down and be like I don't understand how this works like I can't even sit still and so generation panic was written from all of these techniques that I've tried and since also learned on my coach training over the last seven years it's just jammed packed full of full of tools so that the individual can come along and be like huh breathing works me really well today but tomorrow I need to read about getting out of my comfort zone. And the next day I need to understand about perspectives. It's really giving control to the reader that they can decide what best works for them.

So why do you call it generation? Do you feel like it's a generational thing that is more in our generation? And Mandy and I are in our mid forties. Absolutely. So I think it was almost my naivety and not that I should have regrets, but this was how I wrote it at that time. So I was in my twenties at the time. I'm now my thirties. And for me, the generation panic was really focused on those people who were busy professionals, desperate to keep up, trying to to trying to have it all and that time of such transition you know people in their 20s and 30s can be anywhere from very single to divorced to having kids or not like trying to buy their first property to living in a house with eight other

people um trying to find their way there's just so much transition so for me I wrote Generation Panic with those people in mind like those people on mind who are not only facing such a huge amount of change but also have to look the part and to be going to the gym and to be on social media and nailing life and that for me creates this like perfect sweet spot of very anxious people. Well, and Anne, like you said, your parents weren't talking about it at home. My parents definitely weren't talking about it.

And I know they both experienced it. Never really discussed, you know, such a thing. We didn't talk about it. And then I know my generation, had that and then we just went straight to the doctor and got a pill a happy pill exactly that's what I called it yeah I I think that's such a um important point is that they didn't have the understanding of what was going on either and that kind of just get on with it mentality but actually it was my mum in the end when I went and I was like I don't know what's happening and I and I'm really scared she was

she went away and did the research and came back to me and said right I think you're having panic attacks and I think you're struggling with anxiety and thank god she did because I then had something that I understood that I could hang it on because up until that point I didn't even like I said earlier I mean I just didn't have the words I didn't have the understanding but I think what's interesting particularly with the last year which has been unprecedented in terms of the challenges and change that's happened in the world as a whole is that actually Generation Panic seems to have kind of broadened was originally focused at that group but you know we had a book launch um a couple of weeks ago and there were people on the call

from teenagers to I think there was an 87 year old and you know people were there because they yeah and the biggest question that I kept on getting was like, oh, can I read this too? I'm not in that like sweet spot, but can I read it? And Generation Panic for me, the book is the tools are so applicable. It's not like, okay, if you're a 20 year old, you can try this. It's like, here are some incredible tools, like some gems that you can then flip in and out of and return to it again and again to get what you want. I find it interesting. Maybe I'm off base here, but I think the older generations went through a heck of a lot more than we do now. I mean, our life is pretty damn cush. I mean, we can order DoorDash. We can, you know, take Ubers. I mean, you look back at the Vietnam War, that generation, World War I, World War II. Why is it that the amount of people that suffer from anxiety is going up and not down? And don't get me wrong, I am not degrading how horrible and hard COVID was in the year. Is it because we're so fast-paced or what's going on here? Is it because

we're bringing more awareness to it? Or is it because we're manifesting it more? Because there's also a lot of younger kids these days that are attaching that label to themselves as well, almost like it's trending. I think it's always been there, Mandy. I just think no one had a word for it. Kind of like autism or, you know, ADHD. I think all those things were always there. Just no one, you know, I know in my family, you didn't have anything wrong with you. So you just shut up if you had something. I think it's just more accepting now. So people have given it words so that we can get help. And so we get, like you said, have something to hang, hang up your symptoms too. I don't know.

That's my thoughts. What is your thoughts? Yeah, I think I agree. I think, I mean, whatever time, wherever you are, whatever's going on, there's always pros and negatives. I mean, you can argue it any way. I think the challenges that people might be facing today might not be comparative to the Vietnam war, but are very different and real for them and I don't want to like internet social media I mean oh that's someone that can be so mega you know that can be and to an outsider it might say how can someone fighting in a war be so different to um someone on social media but for them that's their war and like that's their battle um well I appreciate you saying that

because one of our very first episodes we did we talked about how everyone's pain is different and every it affects everyone differently so a trauma for me might look like a near-death experience but someone who just had like a fender bender it might trigger off that same trauma for them so we can't compare yeah and I think that's true even for anxiety you know something that might feel completely overwhelming for you for me will be like a total walk in the park for you and you're like I can't believe that she hasn't turned up park for you and you're like I can't believe that she hasn't turned up to her best friends like what like I can't believe she's let us down or she's being so useless whereas actually for that person like we don't know everyone's fighting their

own stuff like everyone's got things behind the scenes that are going on and we make so many assumptions or like put on how they should or shouldn't be whereas we should take out that judgment and that's even one of the chapters like that non-judgment and being able to take that out and saying okay well that's their version of reality like that's where they're at how can we be more accepting or accommodating of wherever that is and look at the news as well I mean you know I feel like we know way too much about people. I mean, the stuff that we learned about presidents and all this, I mean, that is none of my business. I don't even want to know about some of those things. And they're always just like heightening and so excited

when something bad happens and play it all over and over. That also, the collective is going to cause a lot of anxiety. And then I think about the fact that women, prior to a few generations ago, women didn't have a lot of opportunities. So now we're trying to do everything. Not only are we trying to keep the home and the family, but we're also trying to be strong women and have same opportunities as men. So yeah, I can see like this cultural and, you know, evolving society of stress. I could see it snowballing. And snowballs can be really fun. You know, they can be like awesome and you can play around with them, but they can also

gather real strength and momentum, don't they? Like, you know, you push them around and around and they just get bigger and harder. So yeah, I mean, what can we do to make sure that it stays fun? I don't know. Yeah, well, what can we do? You tell us, what can we do to make sure that it stays fun? I don't know. Yeah. Well, what can we do? You tell us, what can we do? Well, the chapter one. Because I mean, you actually say that you haven't actually had any panic attacks since you've learned your tools. No, I haven't. So back in 2014, I was having them pretty regularly and just was struggling with anxiety as that was my baseline.

You know, that's where I was residing in myself. And since that time and since learning all these incredible techniques and having just such a deeper awareness of what was going on, I haven't had another panic attack. And I think that even now now as and when I feel anxious because I will feel anxious like things will knock me off center and make me feel like I'm on the back foot in some way but what's changed is that I have a greater awareness of what's happening like I've got almost like little flags that pop up being like huh you had a bad night's sleep last night or you had a glass of wine you know just little things that pop up being like, huh, you had a bad night's sleep last night, or you had a glass of wine, you know, just little things that usually I would shrug off and be like, oh, I had a bad night's sleep, or I've got a bit of a crick in my neck, or, oh, I'm feeling a bit

short of breath today, or that presentation is making me feel on the back foot. I'm much more mindful of that and willing to take the time to kind of deal with it or not just ignore it and not just push it away. I was talking with someone the other day. He said he had struggled with anxiety and often felt like he couldn't breathe, but had kind of shooting pains and he ultimately had a heart attack, but didn't realize because he had just kind of brushed off these, like all these little symptoms, like these little tweaks and pains that were like, oh, I don't want to complain or it's no big deal. I've just got a stiff shoulder or I can't be bothered to, I don't know, do X today. We kind of brushed them off. One of my best friends since I was young, she was having shooting pain down her arm and her shoulder hurt. She's 44 years old. I'm so glad I'm going to give

her a shout out, Jessica Price. We're so glad you're okay. But age 44 and she went into the doctor and they said she was having panic attacks and she had, she had a heart attack. Yeah. I mean, they told her it was anxiety and sent her home because what 44 year old has a heart attack. I mean, it's not, it's a very young age. It's just going back to the point of discernment and really taking time to listen to those signals from your body. Right. But she did what she did though. She went to the doctor, right. And they said it was just panic attacks. Like my dad had that young, I mean, he had a critical bypass at 50 and he used to have anxiety attacks all the time

and he actually had heart when they went in they had found that he had had heart attacks and didn't even probably flinch used to living in that yeah yeah and that's the thing isn't it like we become used to something and that becomes the baseline it's like oh well I always have like little twinges or get like a flutter in my heart or feel a bit kind of jittery and then we kind of discount it we don't we don't really listen and like I think that's a very powerful thing is even like as cheesy or as weird as it sounds like asking your body okay so what do you want to tell me? Like what's going on? Hey body, what's happening? How are you feeling? Tell me what's happening. Is this something that you think that is preventative if we do learn the tools in advance, knowing how to breathe, like Mandy said, especially someone with asthma, you know, having self-love, self-care.

Yes, I completely agree. And that's where generation panic comes into its own is that you then find what works for you. Because for you, you know, breathing or having that awareness is going to be the most powerful thing. Whereas for Mandy, understanding what happens in a panic attack or how your body might be reacting is the most powerful. What are some techniques that you have in your book that maybe not everyone would be familiar with? Like, for example, NLP, people might not know what that is. What are some other ones? And what is that? So NLP is neurolinguistic programming, and it's a wonderful study into how the brain works and ultimately understanding how we operate and changing what doesn't work. So if you can understand where you might get stuck or how you do something and then working out actually what's

an optimal way for me to be operating or how can I be making sure that I'm on the front foot and working in the best way, that's essentially what NLP is. So a lot of NLP is actually understanding two things that really come into NLP is one is modeling, like who else can you model? Do you have someone who you really admire, who has a great way of handling life? And that can be anyone from an oak tree, to Mickey mouse to barack obama you know like whoever whoever comes to mind but how or even just i don't know your best friend john down the road whoever it is um but kind of learning from them and really stepping into their shoes like how do they handle life what advice would they give how do they kind of get up and go through

their day because we can learn so much from other people in the way that they set things up for us and the other piece of nrp that i particularly love is gaining perspectives and being able to kind of work out different ways of viewing things whether that's um fast forwarding in time looking back with the benefit of hindsight you know little tricks like that that can be very powerful if you stop and get slow enough to allow it to happen we can rush through these things right do you teach your children these things so my kids are three and one so they're super young but what we've started to do with our daughter is even just having this conversation of like what's going on and if she if she's getting into you know something's not going her way even something as small as taking some deep breaths

with her together and talking her through what's happening can be quite powerful we have definitely tried so there's an amazing nlp technique which essentially it's looking at so whatever the whatever the problem is that you're facing it's usually manifested in your body in some way so just say i'm struggling with an upcoming meeting that i'm gonna have and it might be sat in my chest. If I can take that out of my chest and put it out. So it's like an actual object in front of me. What do I see? And I mean, I've done this hundreds of times and the amount of different responses that I've heard is, is amazing. You know, like people, people see all sorts, but for the purpose of today, just, just say, I imagine I'm saying I've got a glass of water in front of me, a glass of water, the glass will always be spinning in

one direction. You know, like our whole world is spinning all the time. And so understanding which way it's going can be really interesting. So for me, as I look at this glass now, it's going clockwise. And what happens if I spin it the other way and then through that there's a whole technique that follows but we often do that with our daughter we're like if she's frustrated with something like hey what where is that in your body take it out spin it spin it the other way and then there's a whole process of like getting gifts from the universe that that kind of follows and so we have tried that with her and when the first time I did it I was like this can't work I mean she's three years old she was like this way and I was like oh my god this is so cool it really works yeah and they

don't have filters you know they they just say what's in their mind if it's like a little gruffalo or like a little gremlin they'll say it whereas adults like oh I can't possibly say that I'm seeing like a rainbow with little leprechauns jumping over. I don't know. That's awesome. I love that. So you've taken this and implemented it into coaching groups. So you, would you go into like large businesses, large corporations and teach this? The bulk of my work now is I work with individuals and organizations. Okay. Particularly on a coaching front, like I want a one-on-one coaching program over a course of say kind of three or six months. And essentially I'm just equipping them with the

tools to feel good and like confident and ready to face each day whatever the challenges are going to be because we're continuously going to be knocked off center so essentially how you can get back to you like your best self the way that you operate when you know that you're on the front foot and then in terms of the facilitations I do with groups is that absolutely I'll be around providing them tools but it's not training them use it it, but it's not training them to use it. It's more about, sorry, not training them to use it to pass it on as in I've been trained, but more about just giving them the tools so that they can use it

and then apply it to their everyday. Well, I think that's just so important because if the leaders and the big bosses have these tools, you know, Shanna and I are both energy workers. I mean, one person's energy can shift an entire office, an entire meeting, an entire group. So if you're giving those tools to, to those people, then talk about a beautiful wave and butterfly effect that will help them all be more effective together with that energy. Absolutely and I like to think of it like a sun it just kind of radiates out doesn't it it's like the sunlight just kind of

comes across and can really filter down and have that ripple effect you talk about down to the little person and I think where I was historically and where I think many leaders are today is that they just don't have the knowledge. They just don't have the tools. So as long as you can give it to them. A lot of times when anxiety comes on, of course, this is like, it's already on. So there's no preventative here. It's here in the middle of the night or wherever. It's almost too late to say like, huh, what is, what triggered me? Or like, there's no reasoning is what I'm saying. A lot of times tools are going to have to be more like something that is

presently getting your body back to a normal baseline, right. Or homeostasis or, you know, whatever it is. Cause I mean, I almost want to go to like next time I'm feeling that, that it's, it's a little different than pain because with pain, you know, you can kind of sit with it and investigate, you know, you can kind of use your mind to try to, you know, figure it out. But when you're're having anxiety using your mind is like the last thing you want to do because that just kind of feeds it for me anyways do you know what I'm talking about yes absolutely so like essentially what can you do when you're feeling really anxious yeah I mean because you don't want to necessarily think about the anxiousness

and like where it's coming from because that only just seems to like put like feed it almost it amplifies it it does yeah so three things that I would say actually probably four like breathing number one it's with you absolutely everywhere and it's the easiest way to feel good so yes probably kind of um take take your breath from out of out high up in your chest and push it right down deep belly breathing as mandy will know i do like that whole thought about taking it outside of you and seeing it as something else though now that's not necessarily a thought you know it's just kind of like a visualization yes yeah yeah and good to visual if you can though i think when i was struggling i don't know whether I would have had that ability to think. Um, one of my favorite techniques is called the heartbeat

tapper, which, um, essentially if you just, you open your wrist and you put two fingers almost like as though, you know, when someone's checking your pulse, um, and what happens is that your heart rate obviously goes through the roof. And what I like to do is just up and down very gently and slowly on my wrist, create that beat, that, that heart rate that you want to have. So it's not, it's not saying being able to very calmly and very slowly go up and down, because I think of that as like the do you know dragon boat racing which they do in Asia um anyway they have someone at the at the front of the ship who bangs a drum and then everyone goes in tune with that drum and

it's kind of the same like if you bang your wrist as in bang the drum on your wrist yes drumming it again sends a message like this is where I want to get to and this is what I want to do um the other two things that I would recommend is which is a bit of foresight but I had cue cards so I had a pack of cards that I would carry around with me that um had a whole bunch of different messages. I probably had about 20, 30 in total. And there would be messages that I'd written to myself when I was feeling strong. So like, you know, today, both of you could get your 25 cards and write down,

I'm going to be okay. Like, take a deep breath. Remember the heartbeat tapper. Call a friend. Change your body, whatever it might be for you so that you have something that you can work through. Even just I remember one of them for me is like the panic can only last 20 minutes or like this will pass. And so that when you're in the moment, have cards that almost kind of remind you like, huh, I know there's a place out of this that I can think rationally or like understand what's going on and so here's something that I can work through and you can put whatever you want on the cards whatever will work for you

um and the final thing that I was going to say is try and amplify it this doesn't work for everyone but sometimes we're so scared of like the anxiety and we're so worried about it taking over and taking control that with that our whole body is just fighting desperately to kind of suppress everything but actually in accepting and just being like huh we have anxiety like hooray how can we like, make this even more and see where we where we go, which can be kind of counterproductive or counterintuitive. But often, so much of the fight is not having it that actually just in the acceptance of it, that in itself is like yeah so anyway just allowing it yeah that's great yeah I might try that and that come on anxiety yeah come on yeah bring it on exactly like if it said a six oh my god let's make it an eight what would that be how many techniques do you have in your book there's over

a hundred what's the most fun crazy one I mean I don't know do you like go outside and run around naked or something I don't know what do you have in there um what's the most crazy one that's a really good question oh one that some people find bizarre you know those voices in our head that aren't hugely charming you know those those pesky saboteurs those gremlins is actually bringing them out and creating characters for them and within that even like almost making a profile like a facebook profile or something for them like hey who are their friends what are their taglines what are their mantras what do they where do they check in where do they love cropping up and getting tagged in a photo? And actually, as soon as you have these like objects, so for me, the first one that I had was panicky Pete. And he was this like horrible, I don't know, like this kind of little thing that

would turn up at the most annoying times. But as soon as I was like, hey, he's checking in on Facebook, you know, that kind of, I don't know, just it just, it physicalized an emotion. And I think that's quite powerful. It separates you in some way where you're like, I am not the anxiety. It's just temporary. It's just this outside thing. It like just kind of gives you a different perspective. Yes. I love that you've dedicated this book to helping others out of that place of concern and empathy and compassion and love for others, not wanting them to have to go through what you did. Again, it's turning that pain into purpose, right? And your book came at such a divine time because you're right. COVID is going to have lasting effects and trauma and anxiety on people.

So I feel like it's unfortunately probably going to get worse before it gets better because we all know that trauma and fear store in our, you know, in our bodies and in our bones and in our joints. I will say that it frustrates me highly when I get together with a lot of women around my age who are just being put on Xanax. That especially bothers me because it's very addictive. And a lot of women drink wine at night and Xanax. And I've known so many women who just haven't woken up because they don't realize what a deadly combination that is. Anxiety is a real monster in our world right now. Yeah. I think I'm going to make me a card that says it's okay to sleep through any authentic attacks

in the future. I love that. So that's like a perfect example of tailoring it for you. And for someone else, they're're like what is she talking about and I can see like your whole face is lit up it's like a relief or a relief yeah like say like write that take that how can you make more what else do you need to say to yourself like what else can you give yourself permission to do oh Oh, yeah, that's great. I was going to just add, you know, we can edit this out. But I was thinking that my whole life I had a hard time distinguishing. I can't talk.

Distinguishing the difference between adrenaline and anxiety. So there's that happy adrenaline, you know, and then there's that anxiety. Because mine have always been so enmeshed because of that high baseline that I've always had does that make sense at all that makes super sense and I think I've really struggled with that um because I naturally get excited about things like I'm quite a kind of positive and you know so everything and in that moment when I feel excited and fired up about something like I do forget to breathe everything does get higher like everything's tighter in a good way for me and I think what I didn't realize

historically was when that just tipped over and it became something rather than renewing me and like firing me up, it was depleting me and had turned into anxiety. Because the cortisol, the adrenaline can be on both sides. And the anxiety was, yeah, I think I found that hard to distinguish. So even back in that role, I was so excited, you you know like I was achieving so much and then it would just tip over and I didn't realize that my excitement had like gone too far basically that's that is exactly what I was trying to describe so now it's bringing the awareness and then now I'm going to come up with characters for the two of them yeah exactly I love that but then and then also with that like

put them out in your hands so you've got these two characters you just I mean this is like perfect coaching you got them two in your hands then just turn them and like face each other and have a chat and like hey guys what do you want to say to each other and what do you notice about them is one bigger is one louder is one brighter you know like younger going on and you've got all the like that's the other thing sorry is that you know some of the stuff in this book isn't rocket science it's like you know having a good relationship to um alcohol or getting your sleep or eating food that fills you up rather than encourages this kind of adrenaline um but even something like that it's

just having the awareness these tools are all within you like you've just perfectly exampled that both of you throughout this like hey i would do this or like i've got these two parts like yeah you and and we're so amazing connecting we're so amazing our brain actually can produce and release all of the chemicals that you need you know that you take in pill form you know serotonin melatonin you know everything that you need is within you even your chemicals so it's so amazing but it's just learning how to use those and connecting with what works for you that you can access that within you. Yes. Yeah.

You have plenty of examples. That's awesome. There's one thing that just always sticks with me, and that is do different. Just do different. And if that's one thing, trying something new, just one a day or one a week, just you've got to do different. And if that's one thing, trying something new, just one a day or one a week, just, you've got to do different. So, oh my gosh, so fun. Let's talk about where our listeners can find out more about you. Let's talk about where they can get your book and your website. Oh, you're so kind. Thank you. So I'm pretty findable because my name's uh aggie a-g-i heel h-e-a-l-e so if you

pop me into google you'll find me on like linkedin I'm on instagram um the website is generation panic.com and the book is available everywhere I mean like amazon, Waterstones, Barnes and Noble, Book Depository, Booktopia um it's also available on Kindle and I also recorded an audiobook so you've got my if you liked what you heard then you've got my my poor voice like in your ears for the next seven and a half hours but yeah I love the British accent I could hear you guys all day long I love it thank you so yeah that would be a great audio one for me and now it's time for break that shit down oh but like a real sense of gratitude that I've met you both and you took a chance on me so like it's gonna be okay it will pass generation panic anxiety oh I am complete thank you thank you so much I love it you know

I think it's so important that's one of the affirmations I've been using a lot lately is Mandy remember this emotion you're feeling right now is not permanent it's only temporary it's only temporary yes should read a poem by Rumi called the guest house I don't know if you've come across it but it's about how these like different visitors come through and they they've all got their reason they've all got their purpose and if it's hard and dark and challenging it's just clearing the way for the next guest and I love that because it makes all the range of emotions or the range of things that are happening totally okay like totally normal so yeah that that would probably be my passing you've got this wherever you are it's

all meant to be yes thank you so much for joining us this morning or evening for myself I'm using half my brain right now. Cause this is like when I lose half of my brain about this time. So we did the best we could. I'm a deep breath. Half the brain and you guys are firing. Yeah. Are you kidding me? I couldn't even say distinguish. I just chose not to say words I was like nah oh my gosh you've been awesome thank you so much for you know taking a chance with us and and trusting us and coming on here to promote your amazing book and thank you so much and thanks Gavin for sending Aggie over love you Gavin yes ditto

thanks Gavin you're the best thanks Aggie you have a good day you too take care thanks for being with us today we hope you will come back next week if you like what you hear don't forget to rate like and subscribe thank you we rise to lift you up thanks for listening