Sense of Soul - Beyond Us with Fred Matser

Episode Date: May 10, 2021

Today we are sharing one of the most amazing conversations we have ever had on Sense of Soul with the Author of “Beyond us,” Fred Matser. “This is an important book, whose message must be heeded.”-  Deepak Chopra, MD, best-selling author   Fred Matser is a leading humanitarian and philanthropist who has made it his life’s work to contribute towards creating a more functional society by means of inspiration and empowerment. Formerly the CEO of one of the largest real estate and project development companies in the Netherlands in the 1980’s, he has since devoted himself to initiating and co-creating numerous inspiring and influential foundations and projects. Fred Matser is the founder & chairman of the Fred Foundation. He has been active in social and ecological transformation and is the founder or co-founder of a wide range of charitable foundations that span the fields of health, environment, nature conservation, peace and global transformation.  Fred believes that the development of our consciousness will allow us to experience, in our finite world, the unconditional love inherent to the Infinite. This, in turn, will help us act according to universal principles and values, so to lead our lives in ever greater harmony with the interest of the whole and all. He joined us to share the wisdom behind his book Beyond Us: A Humanitarian’s Perspective on Our Values, Beliefs and Way of Life and his beautiful documentary Beyond Me, you can watch at the link below. Buy the book Beyond Us Documentary Instagram Facebook YouTube Interview with Deepak http://www.essentiafoundation.org/   Hey ladies, join us in our Sense of Soul Sacred Circles over the next few weeks, support and be supported with a new theme each circle, visit www.mysenseofsoul.com and go to the menu and click on Sense of Soul Sacred Circles, use this code (SOSCIRCLE) to join free to any circle of your choice, hope to see you there!

Welcome to the Sense of Soul podcast. We are your hosts, Shanna and Mandy. Grab your coffee, open your mind, heart and soul. It's time to awaken. Today we have with us Fred Matzer. He is a leading humanitarian and philanthropist who has made it his life's purpose to contribute towards creating a more functional society by means of inspiration and empowerment. Formally the CEO of one of the biggest real estate and project development companies in the Netherlands in the 1980s, he has since devoted himself to initiating and co-creating numerous inspiring and influential foundations and projects. He is the founder and chairman of the Fred Foundation. He has been active in social and ecological transformation and is the founder

and co-founder of a wide range of charitable foundations that span the fields of health, environment, nature, conservation, peace, and global transformation. He joins us today from the Netherlands to talk about his amazing book, Beyond Us, a humanitarian's perspective on values, beliefs, and way of life, and his beautiful documentary, Beyond Me. It is such a pleasure to have you, Fred. Are you sure? Yes. I'm just kidding. You don't know what's going to happen. Right. And you never know with Mandy and I. It should be a great experience. I know Mandy actually read your book. She just finished it this morning. And I loved your documentary, your mission and what you stand for.

And I, too, am from a family business, by the way. Good. Same team. Same family. Shanna had me jamming out and getting dressed this morning to Billy Joel. You know the song, Honesty, in such a lovely world. And James. James. We were always friends. Yep. That's the one she had me listening to and i wanted to send it to my son for some reason i was being told to send it to my son me too

you went on the road i pursued an education. Remember that line? I went on the road. Yeah. You pursued an education. The heart of the message. I see the heart behind you. Beyond you. Shanna. Do you follow your own dream?

Or do you go into the footsteps. Of somebody else? And it's so important. So important. When you have children, like you say, that it's important that you develop the trust in themselves and support them in their own chosen path. Yeah.

And, you know, with awakened eyes, as my son was becoming a young adult, I could see the resistance in him because he was going to be all these things before he was even born. We had it all planned for him. And he tried to do his best to live up to everyone's expectations. Just like James. I could see what was happening with him. And I remember just thinking, oh my God, what did I do? The only thing I could do at that point is give him space. Yeah. What's his age now? He's 23. So he's younger than you. Yeah. Do I look young? I get told that. Do you have kids? Three and seven grandkids. I loved watching you with, is it your granddaughter in the film at the beginning? When I turned 65, she was my birthday present. But my daughter was kind enough to do the delivery so i had a kid on mandy's birthday i gave her birthday present too my last one good good good wow well done yeah it was the

best birthday ever i felt like she probably should have named her mandy and she didn't there can only be one mandy okay that is okay that is a fabulous one that's right mandy and i both just very much align with your message so thank you so much for being with us well lovely to hear because we basically are in line with knowledge that is beyond us. And that's why it is easy, apparently, also for you. You have both let go of enough stuff to be there too. So that is wonderful. Fred, could you tell us how you came to awaken to this information? Well, first of all, when this happened in 83 for the first time,

I already had a deep interest in why are we having poor people and why are there rich people and there are so many differences that we could solve together. And then in a healing session, I met in Switzerland on an introduction of a Swiss friend who had a healing session with this person from New York. This person gave me a lot of food. I mean, brown rice, freshly cooked vegetables, and I had to bring two liters of water.

And he said, I'm going to give you a miniscule portion of condensed nutmeg. And to give me a feeling of safety, he said, this is an invention of Dr. John Salk. He's the father of the polio vaccine. And I treat Dr. Salk with the same stuff. So that gave me quite some assurance that it was dangerous. So after the lunch, after having swallowed this stuff, after two liters of water, I was put in a hot bath. And then they put me on the floor and I got a profound massage from them

and at the same time we are the world the song of uh what was it uh we are the world Michael I love that song like we need again something like that oh yes. It gave me a lot of hope at the time. Millions and millions of people got a really boost of inspiration, of hope, of support, of being together in a positive way. That was all amazing. Beautiful. I heard that at a level of intensity and vibration that I never experienced before. And while I was enjoying it on a very profound level, all of a sudden it came into my mind. I said, Sally has broken her collarbone on the nearby ski slope. I was in a ski resort and she will be here at the door in 20 minutes.

And it's the right color bone. And she will ask for a cab or an ambulance to bring her to the hospital. Whoa, you got all this from a massage? Yeah. And the nutmeg and the food and the water and the whole bath. Whoa. And indeed, she showed up after 20 minutes with the information that I already knew.

Wow. And from then on, I started to be very interested in how is it possible that through my senses, I pick up information that normally I cannot connect with a happening that happens on a spot that later on appear to be one and a half K away, say a mile away from me. So I could also ask the question in a different way, what blocks me from having that information? So that was experience one. Experience two was with the same stuff

that I was sitting in a room. This I describe in the documentary in the kitchen and on the clock in front of me, it was three hours in the afternoon and 10 minutes. On my watch, it was three hours, 10 minutes too. But with the second indicator, it had also 10 seconds. And now I take you at the hand, dear listener, with me. Imagine there is a curtain behind me in that kitchen. Of course, that was not the truth, but

that was the metaphor I choose for the moment that I close my eyes. So the eyes closed and I go in the darkness behind the curtain in the kitchen where it is dark and I look around and I can't see a curtain. I can't see anything. And in the meantime, I feel superbly well. It's like a eternal non-sexual orgasm that is so strong, it feels as a complete bliss. And in the meantime, my clarity gets stronger and stronger and while this all happens

i feel no beginning nor an end it is so intense that yeah it's beyond me without me so in a way my ego my eye melted away there was no me anymore there was just bliss there was just eternity and now in that state without beginning nor and don't forget that you hardly can imagine that the thought entered my mind and that said, why me? All of a sudden I hit the word me, word me again and I opened my eyes. It was three hours, 10 minutes and what was it? 22 seconds. So in real time, in sequential time, the way we live, we live sequentially. It was 12 seconds. But on the other side, not that I want to convince anybody, that love and eternity is equal to infinity and that in a way the infinite is the womb of the finite of time and space or in other words the whole universe the whole universe is a physical expression of consciousness and consciousness in itself doesn't know a time

doesn't know space it's spaceless and it's timeless yeah this other dimension well obviously we're not in the 3d when we're in this space yeah it is it's dimensionless so let's not forget using words is all a function of time and space later on very fast forward i heard they do a fantastic research on the level of consciousness and brains, Imperial College in London. And they found that some drugs, but also through profound and deep meditation, a kind of barrier in your brain falls away so that you can have transcendent access to infinite information. It may have happened with me. So then the question comes up, why are we expressions in our case, in the body of humans, dogs as expressions of consciousness, arms, trees, rocks, crystals. There are so many expressions of consciousness. What is the meaning of that fact

that we are expressed through these phenomena? And I think we're here to learn, to develop, to take away the develops, to learn about unconditional love and learn to act accordingly. And to learn also to unshackle ourselves from the life, the lateral life, sequential life, and allow us to open up for the transcendence experiences. And basically, a different way also to explain that is that we often think so much,

and thinking is a way an activity of mankind but if we lower our brain frequency to a very low level then we can allow our ourselves to be thought basically allowing god to speak with you because how can God speak with you when the line is occupied? You're busy with your own thinking. So peace, listening to classical music, to work, to walk in the forest

are very good ways to come into that slower state, lower state of brain frequency and to come closer to, yeah, lower state of brain frequency, and to come closer to, yeah, be one with the whole at all. Or go get yourself some nutmeg and a few gallons of water, get a massage. Yeah, there you go too. I mean, yeah, and I'm a massage therapist.

I do know how very powerful touch can be. I think it just brings people to their body and present with themselves it gives them that space just needed that space didn't you oh yeah yeah the freedom the uncheckedness the awareness that your choices are endless instead of walking all the paths that are laid there already for you that society wants you to walk. It's amazing. And indeed, for me, massages do a lot of good to quiet down and to become aware after the massage or already in the massage, how much stress I've built up, you know, while you're not even aware, but going to massage, it de-stresses and you relax enormously, not only the body, but also your mind gets, your heart gets the space.

I find it fascinating that I felt like I was reading exactly what I experienced as well in my near-death experience. You know, I was on life support in a coma, so I was at a low level of brain activity. So that makes a lot of sense. Well, and your metaphors and your words were beautiful because it is a very hard thing to bring vocabulary to, to even give it justice. Three days ago, I was just sitting in a bath for an hour and listening to my favorite music. And I allowed myself to let go and feel the vibration of a voice or a violin and just to float into that vibration. As you know, all forms of matter going from subtle matter to dense matter, it is a different way of saying it's a frequency.

And a frequency, the source of frequency is the infinite. Now, having said that, music is frequency. of frequency is the infinite. Now, having said that, music is frequency. So when Bach or Mozart, they hear or they become aware of certain harmonies that express themselves literally. So they hear it, so to say, from the infinite. So the infinite has chosen Bach with the antenna out at a good time to listen in.

And it reaches Bach at a time that there already is a way to write tones down with music. Imagine that it would have happened 7,000 years ago and that you could not script music. So isn't it amazing that it hits Bach that the tools to give the symbols of the tones to describe it is amazing. So then for a moment it's frozen because it's on paper. And then people have the training to read what's on that paper. And they have instruments that all are calibrated and able to reflect that what was once in the ears or in the mind of Bach.

And then we have the orchestra playing those instruments. We have the conductor understanding and feeling what has been written. And then we have the audience that feels the music and they can determine themselves if they allow themselves to be lifted back into eternity where it comes from or that they are too busy to think of other things and just listen to the music. I once had an experience that I talked about is in a big concert hall in Amsterdam long time ago and it was Sunday afternoon four o'clock we went with the family to a music

performance classical music performance. You said hello to everybody. Oh, are you here too? How's your family doing? Blah, blah, blah, blah. Slowly the musicians come in and it gets more silent and more silent. And slowly the music starts to play. First I listened to the music. I quiet down and then the music

comes into me and I become the music. I'm one. That's a transcendental experience. And then I thought, tomorrow, what's on my agenda? And then all of a sudden, I was sitting in the concert hall, and I was listening to the music. Yeah, it's amazing, isn't it? I mean, it even goes back to indigenous tribes and their drumming and shaking. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, there's, there's something about the vibration of music in different forms. I mean, even like we just spoke about Michael Jackson, and we are the world and John Lennon. And, you know, I imagine and because we've

become such a material, wordy kind of people, those words were very powerful. They had a lot of energy behind them with the music. However, you talk a lot about in your documentary and in your book that, you know, we've really allowed language to define us to a point where we're no longer able to connect because we have too much words in our heads yeah yeah I start to think about it in several ways first of all when I got grandchildren and you can easily associate with it you look into the child's eyes the baby's eyes you feel connected something melts in me then and i am just connected with love with innocence and it's so beautiful pure it's so pure and i realize we already are busy doing information exchange without words because the child can smell it can taste it can hear so it responds or reacts and so it is that the child the baby communicates with me. And I, most of the time, I do not need words to communicate,

but I think because I'm trained with words, especially when I was a father, not when I'm a grandfather anymore, that I do good to invite the child to the world of words and numbers. And that is what we are doing on a collective level. And in a way that it is good. So before the child only referred to the apple with a taste and the smell and the texture feel. But now it also has a word, A-P-P-L-E. The communication that before happened without words is replaced with words.

So we learn in all our institutions, schools, we learn to trust words and numbers to express ourselves. Why? Because through words and numbers, we can make comparisons and we can do can make and through comparisons, we can compare and we can communicate, exchange information. So we learn to trust that that's the mental faculty as part of the human human consciousness but what we forget is that we also have under the level or under the umbrella of consciousness we have intuitive information and as you know and we all know we feel something when we enter a room we see some directly beyond words before words or just wordless we get input now the sad thing is that we have not learned to trust that information so what we do we trust the mentalization of the intuition or the feeling yeah that's what we trust so we can manipulate also our information because we may be afraid to really say what we feel and so it is that we get a kind of,

through the shadow world, not the real world, we communicate. Now, having said that, we are one of the billions of expressions of life. And perhaps the only expression of life that communicates in words and numbers as well and things that it only communicates in words and numbers ants do trees do elephants do dog and cats do take starlings look with what speed starlings fly through the sky, interacting with one another in milliseconds,

choosing movements, creating patterns, so they are much faster in their communication than we do. They are more natural than we are. And now the point is, we consider ourselves more bright than starlings. Why? If we look at the human track record, we created enormous stress, artificial information systems,

climate problems of enormous scale pandemics. Why? Because we exclude in an all-exclusive system, in an all-including system, everything on Earth and the universe expresses itself together, inclusively so is in connection to somebody else so we can never be on the same spot in the same time with anything else so we occupy everybody a different space from any atom eon tree or whatever you want to express the finite in.

It's an all-inclusive, ever-transforming system. So competition is non-existent, only in the mind of people. Because you cannot exclude, it's just an attitude of exclusion. But it's a misunderstanding because we are in an all-inclusive system where everything coexists. And I think animals, most of it, they understand. And we don't. Yeah. I loved how in your book, when you were talking about the language, you said we've replaced reality with stories.

Yes. I sat with that and I was like, oh my gosh, isn't that the truth? Yeah, it's the truth. Yeah. You know, we are so much better at words and thinking than we are listening and feeling and feeling and experiencing. It's so much harder to listen and experience and feel than it is just to think and, you know, fill your mind up with all kinds of nonsense and stories yeah and in the meantime if we go on a little bit about the stories but a well-told story

can generate profound feelings because your mind associates with the feeling to so often happenings in the past that evoke feelings or even emotions in that sense as a catalyst the story has a meaning. Yes. And you talk about the vulnerability, how important it is to be vulnerable. So when I had the infinite experiences, the question I asked myself was, by the grace of what phenomena does the finite exist? So remember, again again the infinite is unified something nothingness, so there's no duality. But what is the equality of the finite that is duality? So that the basis of the finite is polarity, a plus and a minus, the basis is resistance, and that is the energy that goes between plus and minus. So that is the leading principle by the grace of which the finite time-space exists. So what is that polarity?

How does it express itself? Giving, receiving, consciousness expressing itself through thinking and through feeling. It can express itself through physical power and here we go the power of vulnerability. And often we don't see the power of vulnerability, how important it is, I say often, without vulnerability, which is not a weakness, there would not be life possible. Think of the womb. Think of the dark where the seed is in the ground, very vulnerable. And it is before life expresses itself and shows itself manifest to the light.

And even when it is expressed to the light, the children, the flowers, the trees, the small animals, we have to carefully take care of them because through the stage of vulnerability, we cannot become who we are. And even now, I'm still vulnerable, which is okay. It's a quality. Sadly, we see that often we do bad things. We destroy. We see there's a weakness and we destroy vulnerability. We destroy life. In our country, each day we kill 13 million animals a day with 17 million people to eat them. And it's all normal.

I mean, yeah. So indeed, the polarities are plus minus, giving, receiving, physical power, and the power of vulnerability, the mental faculty and the feeling faculty, and then the male and the female principle, both the idea being that if we develop our consciousness, then we can see how important it is to balance the harmony between those poles.

And if we do that, we can come closer and closer to be able to make decisions in the interest of the whole and all and the furthest away from the ego and that's what we call healing healing is to become one with the whole and all the universe years ago i was going through a lot of therapy to work on myself to just and i discovered this self-love and for the first time and i I was like, oh my gosh, you know, I haven't been loving myself. And I became like the witness of my thoughts for the first time. And with that, there was this question that I asked myself and it was how much of what you

believe in, have you been told to believe in? And of that, how much have you actually experienced for yourself? Yeah. And that screwed me over for years, Fred, that question, because I had realized that everything I believed in, everything that I thought that I was and wanted to be was just what everybody else wanted. I hadn't experienced it. And no wonder my life was not going so smoothly because of all of the resistance and the resistance to be vulnerable and the resistance to even be quiet in my brain. Because I thought the more we learn and the more we do, that's how it's supposed to be. Yeah. Yeah, me too. Yeah. You go all on the beaten path, you know.

And it's so important that we can give our children the gift of trust your intuition and explain to me or sometimes what you're doing. I often tell the story of Mary. Way back, I heard it from a father who had a lot of patience to finally be able to help his autistic son. He said, well, imagine there's a girl, we call her Mary, early in the morning, Sunday. And she's awake and light shines into her room. And Mary doesn't want to sleep again. And on the floor, there are a lot of crayons. And the day before, her parents have done new wallpaper in her room and all looking very beautiful.

And Mary thinks, wow, wow ideal here we go she picks up her crayons and she's gonna really with all it's gonna be on the canvas of the wallpaper she creates enormous whatever but and she's having fun she said she's not judged she has no judge and she's just enjoying her thing and then after a certain moment she hears footsteps on the hallway and with a big swing the door of her room opens and she's mom's breastfed by mom three times her size and mom says what are you doing we gave you this wonderful, beautiful wallpaper. You're completely destroying back into your bed. You're never gonna do this again. Mary going very timid into her bed. Mom closes the door. Mary becomes an excellent student in elementary school, in all the school systems.

She gets a doctorate, is a highly performing person. She is valued academically on a very high level. But inside, she burns. She is too afraid to go into her feelings. Her feelings are aborted or never opened and she's a very unhappy person and she has success in the eyes of others because she is applauded for what she's doing so i thought this was the most impressive story because this was in a way my story for a big part because i had to go my was never asked me I never got the question. What I wanted to do

my father was ill and I had to succeed him in his business. There was no way to as a point to discuss this. That was happened in the 60s. This was done these days. The other approach that the mom of Mary could have done was okay opening the door. And this is what Mr. Hoffman or so tells, said, Mary, what a lovely job. I see you created a beautiful, beautiful painting here.

But you know what we're going to do tomorrow do tomorrow we're gonna buy your sketchbook we go to the shop and we go and and next time you put all your lovely drawings in the sketchbook so yeah that was the most impressive story and then an authentic one my friend is Jane Goodall, the lady with chimpanzees and nature conservation and so much else. She's deeper in her 80s now. And she tells the story that when she was young in Bournemouth, if she was three, four, five years old, I don't know, but she lived with her mom on the Birches that's the name of the house where she still lives and she was always very curious where do those eggs come from from them so there

was a hen house and so early in the morning again she goes out and goes and sits into that hen house to watch. And finally, she finds out where those ducks come from. And then she re-enters the house. And her mom was quite concerned what's going on with Jane. And indeed, Jane's mom had the wisdom to say, well, Jane, what a courage and great that you have the capacity to be an adventurer, to do research, and great, and I'm very happy for you that you found out. But I was quite concerned.

So next time, please give me a little warning before you do these things. Yeah. I have met her mom. I knew Van. I know her. She was an amazing allowing woman and she indeed

guided Jane on her first trip to Tanzania in the early 60s he went with her to give her trust she was a very wise woman a very trusting

loving I love how you described her an amazing allowing mom yeah I love that because as a mom I'll be honest with you I had some mom guilt and shame when I read that story in the book because my daughter and actually I think it was Shanna's daughter were together and they drew pictures all over the side of my daughter's dresser with permanent marker. And I was not happy.

I'm like, I didn't even really ask them like what it was. And it's still there. I'm going to go and look at it now and take a picture of it. It reminds me of another story. This is funny. I feel like I should share it. So my brother-in-law was young. He was like seven or eight years old and he took a rock and he carved into my mother-in-law's car. I love mom on the side of her car. And she was pissed at first because obviously the huge scratches in her car.

But then she said she sat there and thought, I can't get mad at him. That is like the cutest thing ever. Well, the irony of the story is she had that car all the way until he turned 16 and the car ended up being his. Oh, wow, wow, wow. Good story, good. Yes. Wow. Good story.

Good. That is the best. I was reading in your book, you say our minds are aimed to serve our hearts. Yeah, that's true. How is that? If we use the mental faculty without a heart, we can take decisions that are like unguided missiles and hit somewhere and can create enormous chaos and sadness. Say, if we equal consciousness with heart, it's important before we take a decision to take a few breaths and allow the speed of the

mental faculty to be rested in the calmness of the heart and filtered through the heart, so that we know that the decisions that we make are as much as possible in the interest of the whole and all. Unless our society is not based, not founded on these principles anymore. Sometimes as a mental exercise, we go to a church and there's sometimes a priest or whatever that talks about it and you feel sometimes that the person that talks has not internalized it him or herself so it becomes a mental exchange

and it will not easily root in that heart it's a challenge in a human society an anthropocentric society that is every day more stressful to go to the oasis of silence to go to the silent spots to go to the silent times because it is not valued it doesn't have a price. It's priceless. But who still values pricelessness? The reason I felt like I needed to ask that was for selfish reasons. I have had this idea that my mind is my enemy. And when I read that you talk about this, it made me realize that it's a partnership, that my mind is there to support my heart. When your mind goes solo, it becomes its own misunderstanding.

Our mind and our body are really truly nothing more than filters for our soul, tools. Oh, yeah, true. tools oh yeah true you also talk about with that how gratitude and offering compassion like to those thoughts um loving those thoughts that come through and allowing them and then just seeing them on their way in its deepest essence and life has been given to us through the womb, physically, of a woman. But beyond the womb, there is the infinite love of God. So when we receive life, aware of life, we can receive receive it which is a present that is the presence of the present yeah so if you have been given a present what do you do you express your gratitude so it's at the very first moment that you become aware whenever and you go back to that moment of which we know nobody remembers but we know we were born one day you can think for all the qualities

that a body does it has a heart it has a brain it has hands it has a nervous. It has a brain. It has hands. It has a nervous system. It has blood. You know, you've got a whole package for free. And you can now dance, you know. And you get comrades around you. You and Mandy together, your family or whatever. You can dance with it. With the dogs, with the trees. And attraction, gravity is also a gift, you know. So there wasn't earth.

So you're not just somewhere you're running around in space without any gravity and we have oxygen you know we have tea lots of it anyway so that's the way i would describe why i became grateful on the deepest level i felt like your book was truly a guide to healing the world. I mean, I did. I did. I was like, everyone needs to get this book and read it. And then if we can all sit with it, understand it and practice it, I picture us holding hands, like in the song that Michael Jackson put out,

we are the world. It's simple. It's 120 pages of amazing knowledge that was easy to absorb. The way you wrapped it up with how important silence is was beautiful. The way you described silence and its importance was like mind-blowing to me. It was so beautiful. How important is silence to you? Key. I started with a group of men

and we come together every year twice for nearly a full day to talk about vulnerability. That's the only subject, man and vulnerability. I introduced to listen to the song of the Ave Maria of Noah, Noah, N-O-A. She's a Jewish singer, singing a Christian song. She sings basically about the female, the functional female principle. She says something like, where have you been hiding?

And then that she says after describing all qualities, female qualities that we recognize but so often forget. And then I thought what is hidden is silence. And here comes the drama and then I started to cry. I realized silence can never have an ambassador because it needs to speak and then the silence is broken so the secrets of silence is it can only be discovered by itself and why was i crying because i realized that so many of the overstressed people and most of them men cannot even hear it

because they have no space, no time, no imagination. They have not the consciousness to even go there. And they are the leaders of destroying the world. And they think they do good. Because they earn money for the family. And they.

Little more than the neighbor perhaps. And they are. They are important in politics and I have been one of them Wow, what would you tell your old self?

I forgive my old self because if I knew that I on purpose that of course I sometimes on purpose, that, of course, I've sometimes on purpose, I have, yeah, out of revenge, I have bad thoughts, not actions, but bad thoughts. But I forgive, I forgive myself a lot. Any form of emotion or judgment, an emotion is not a feeling. A feeling is for me clear. It's like the body of a bass to which the tone goes where the emotions come from, or the judgment.

So paying attention, we bring light, and bring eternal light on it, it melts. And we can see what the cause is, and if we understand the cause, we can forgive ourselves or others, and go on. But if we look away from the problem, keep on looking away, the problem grows, gets bigger, and sometimes we can be infected with it. A lot of the message I got from you was about words. I mean, your words, Fred, are simply beautiful. And the way you clearly explain this, I think that most people can understand. I know we've talked to some people where sometimes we're like, what?

But you do. You have a beautiful gift of using your words to be able to express your experience and your vulnerability in your story it's very clear and beautiful thank you very much thank you both i want to say how much i loved it too because i can feel that we are in the same frequency. So yes, I sometimes have the words. We all have the feelings. We share. And you express both yourself in a vulnerable way. Beautiful.

I mean, so very functional. Very beautiful. Yeah, it's a great experience. So you're welcome to go and visit me whenever you want. And if I'm back in the Rocky Mountains, I'll come and see you if that's okay. Please, absolutely. Where can our listeners pick up your book?

How can they find out more? Well, first of all, I wanted to mention Essentia Foundation because that is the, say say the most important foundation because basically it's there to research with the top of scientists in the world to make clear to the top of science in the world as well that materialism is not the right philosophy. And with the power of proof in the language of the scientists, we hope within the next 20 to 40 years to get mainstream thinking, not materialism, but idealism or non-dualism. And we have an enormous quality level of people on board,

philosophers, quantum physicists, physicists, astronomers, anything that are already on board. And the idea is not to try to convince people, but to provide information that in itself is convincing so that those that listen to it or read it feel the freedom to allow that information in am i clear very so that is part of the attitude of non-dualism, to try not to convince, because that has as background that there's always a battle, a discussion or a debate, while the dialogue respects both participants and can just, in a dialogue, you can share different points of view without needing to be in the same line beautifully said i love that because that's what you're seeing in our world right now is a lot of people competing and i loved that chapter in your book yeah and it's causing a lot of separation with people trying to convince people rather than creating

that space of love where they can just absorb it yeah thank you thank you that you pick it up immediately because you knew already so no news to you very good mandy essencia foundation And the Essentia Foundation.org and Fred Foundation.org. And the book is published by John Hunt Publishing, Beyond Us. Your documentary is Beyond Me. Yeah, Beyond Me. And you can find it on beyondmedocumentary.org. And I'll put all that in the show notes. So that way our listeners can have access to all of it.

And you know, if the book sells by millions, I won't take the profit. It goes all in foundation and I won't take anything from it. I do nearly 40 years of charity with 23 foundations. We work in more than 50 countries. Climate change, refugees, homeless people, we do it all. Thank you. And now it's time for Break That Shit Down. shit down trust yourself you are an expression of divine love allow yourself to be the beautiful wonderful being that you're meant to be so glad you did that yes I am too thank you thank you so much

I hope this was not the last time I hope not also thank you Fred for you too miles of smiles sprinkles of twinkles and lots of love I love that

yeah I love that yes thank you thank you I love that. Yeah. Yeah, I love that. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks for being with us today. We hope you will come back next week. If you like what you hear, don't forget to rate, like, and subscribe. Thank you.

We rise to lift you up. Thanks for listening.