Sense of Soul - Human Pleaser to Soul Pleaser

Episode Date: April 2, 2021

Shanna and Mande had a wonderful conversation with Tracy Secombe, a respected speaker, coach and founder of the Soul Pleaser Program.  Her mission is to help you to remember your unique magnificence and realign with your highest potential so that you can live a life that fulfills you in every way.

Soul Pleaser Online Coaching Program If you are unfulfilled, lack confidence or clarity, and would like to rediscover the inspired you, join me on my NEW 35-minute class so you can use your purpose to make the world a better place. Joining the program is by application and you can book a complimentary call with me at the end of the class to learn more.  All this and more here at Tracy’s website!
 www.tracysecombe.com.au

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Check out Mande’s new program EVOLVE.  www.mysenseofsoul.com


Welcome to the Sense of Soul podcast. We are your hosts, Shanna and Mandy. Grab your coffee, open your mind, heart, and soul. It's time to awaken. Today on Sense of Soul, it's my pleasure to introduce Tracy Seacombe. She has been on and off her soul's path all of her life. She grew up with a selfless, caring mother and an entrepreneurial father. She was taught to put everything else first and work hard. She was grateful for those lessons, but she did eventually burn out. When her mom passed in 2016, she remembered what was important in life and vowed to prioritize her connection to herself, family, and service without losing herself in the

mix any longer. Her mission is to now help others remember their unique, magnificent self and to realign themselves with their highest potential so that they can live a life that fulfills themselves in every way. She has an amazing website blog and offers many freebies on her website to help you be a soul pleaser rather than a human pleaser. She also has a great book that you can actually download from her website. It's called find the real you and love her so that you can live the life you choose. Thank you so much, Tracy, for being with us. I have a feeling we have a lot in common after looking at your website. I'm so pleased to be here. It's just such a great collaboration with you being Sense of Soul and my business being Soul Pleaser. So

we were destined to meet. Yes, I love that Soul Pleaser. We're usually human pleasers. So tell us about how you came to be a soul pleaser. Well, I started out as a serial people pleaser and it really started from modeling that from my mom. So a lot of people really put my mom on a pedestal because she was a martyr and she was a beautiful woman and she cared so deeply about everyone that she met. So she was a nurse, but she was so much more than somebody's nurse. She went to everybody's funerals, all of her patients' funerals. She became friends with all of the family members. And so it was the way she lived her life and apart from looking after her five children I'm the oldest of five she also welcomed in everybody that was even vaguely related to us so if they ever had a problem they'd move in with us so she held a whole community and she did it with love but ultimately

on reflection in the end she did a lot of it through resentment because she was exhausted because you can only do so much when you leave yourself out of the equation. And so when she passed away, I woke up to this realization that I was heading down the track of being just like her, thinking that that was admirable and that's what I should aim for. And I was burning out too. And I thought, I'm just going to end up with cancer like my mom and die like my mom, exhausted. So I knew that she has been with me ever since she passed. I have goosebumps because she's here now. And she is guiding me saying, don't do it. Love people, but love

yourself as well. So that's sort of how I woke up to my people pleasing ways and realized that there is a different way and soul pleasing to me is the way. When I was reading your book last night, there was a part where you talked about the frog in the pot. Could you talk for a moment about what your life looked like when you were the frog in the pot? Yeah, thank you. So it's funny, like on hindsight, it's so obvious, you know, I guess that's how life is. But when you're in the middle of it, you're oblivious because it's not where your focus is. But before my mum passed away, I was running three businesses. I have three children and I was managing all of our investment properties.

My husband was always away for work. I was traveling for work as well. And I was running the whole household. And on reflection, I think, how did I do that? But then by the same token, I remember that when people said to me, how do you do it? You know, there was a sense of pride. I felt like they admired me because I was a frantic lunatic. But then I would show up at the school with a smile on my face, you know, dressed reasonably well, looking like I had it all together. And I realized now that I was not doing them, I was doing them a disservice to show up and pretend it was okay, because it wasn't okay. I looked like I had it all on the outside. And on

the inside, I was slowly dying. But I was in denial of that. on paper I was ticking the goals that I had been taught to tick, looked good, exercised, kids looked good, you know, they're at the right school, successful, but no meaning to my life, just like a robot, waking up and working until I hit the pillow and I would fall asleep instantly. My husband said I'd be mid sentence and I'd be asleep. But then a few hours later, I'd be awake again, thinking about what I needed to do the next day or rehashing a conversation that I had the day before worrying about whether I'd offended someone or didn't quite say the right thing. So yeah, it was torture, but I was happily enduring it until I woke up to it and became aware of it like the frog in the pot. My grandmother was very much like your mother. I admired that.

I really wanted to be like that because I thought that that was what you were supposed to be. She was like a saint, just so selfless. And I remember trying to live up to that role model to that role as a mother and just running and running and running. And yes, yes, I can. Sure. I'll do it.

Involved in everything at my kid's school, you know, doing the freaking talent shows and coaching every sport, trying to be like this perfect mother. And then was so stressed yeah I remember actually my cousin saying you're like going so fast you're gonna like run into a wall and like I did I crashed and crashed and burned and like who am I yeah what just happened and whenever someone's like who's gonna volunteer I'm like oh not me like did mine. Even by the time my kids got in high school, I was like, screw that. I've already, I've, I've done that. And I, so I can totally relate to that so much. So how would your family like take it though, when you broke out of that?

Cause I know in my life, everyone was like, what? Like you're the yes person. What happened? Yeah, exactly. There's such an adjustment for everybody around you because you really get what you expect from others and vice versa. So if you just keep showing up a certain way, that's just what they expect of you. And people treat you the way that you expect. So everyone expected the world of me because I expected the world of me and I expected them to expect it. So I was very blessed and am very blessed with a husband who is the complete opposite. So he grew up in a very different setting. He grew up in Dublin, Ireland, with just a very loving lifestyle and no push to achieve at all. And it's interesting because he

says, I wish my parents pushed me a little bit more. And I'm like, yeah, everybody, you know, everybody would like more balance, I'm sure. But I have the probably extreme and not that my parents pushed me, I pushed myself. When I was with one of my businesses that I was getting exhausted in, he would say to me, just stop. And I'm like, I can't stop. And he said, yes, you can. And so I became very aware in that moment that I had a choice. Sometimes we think we don't have a choice. When we're a people pleaser in particular, we think that we're doing what we have to do.

And so it was a huge awakening for me to finally believe him and realize I'm choosing to stay here. And he said, why can't you stop? And I said, I don't want to let everyone down. It was the biggest thing that kept me in this particular business because I had a team of 10,000 people around the world. And I used to answer their messages day and night. And they used to praise me and say they loved me. And so I felt like, who will I be without that as well? You know, that was the underlying thing. And so they did feel let down. People rang me up and said, you know, I'm so disappointed. Why are you leaving? Please stay, please stay. But a few months down the track,

they stepped into their own leadership because I wasn't doing it for them. So we can be codependent with people where we're the fixer, we're the helper. And some of our self-worth is linked into people relying on us, which does not serve them. And so now as a coach, I'm like assisting you and guiding you to tap into your own inner wisdom so that you don't need me because I don't need to be needed anymore

and so being able to say no without a big explanation or lie because let's face it that's what we we do as people pleasers we soften the road by telling a lie to get out of something is just that doesn't feel right for me right now. But I wish you all the love with what you're up to. It sounds great, but right now it's not for me. And just owning it, you know, instead of, instead of betraying yourself to do what you think is right for someone else, you just feel so good about yourself by saying what's true for you. And so it's a big change and it takes some practice and you feel nervous when you first do it

and you slowly get better yeah and not only do you feel nervous but you're right I'm so glad you brought that up it takes practice because I was sitting at breakfast this morning with some friends and we were talking about how we could give our daughters their own voices and how to teach them about boundaries and it sounds so crazy but like sometimes you don't even know how to teach them about boundaries. And it sounds so crazy, but like sometimes you don't even know how to say the boundaries. You don't know what words to use and you need help. And, and we, you know, we sat there and we kind of threw around like sentences of how we could say certain boundaries and teach our girls certain boundaries. And I think sometimes people literally get hit, like get stuck on the fact that they just don't know

how to say them. Yeah. And you're not used to saying it. You're so trained to say what you think you should say and say what's going to be well received by others. I think even people that don't identify with the word people pleaser have been trained to speak in a way that's acceptable so that everyone feels okay because we avoid confrontation and we avoid what we think is the cause of somebody else's emotion

so I think what's helped when I'm talking to my daughters who and my son who are 15 21 and 22 now is that how someone else feels is completely up to them. If you can just let go of this idea that you can cause an emotion, you've got to understand that someone could have woken up, they're having a really bad day, they're feeling really insecure, and no matter how you deliver the no, they're going to be offended because of what's going on in their lives and you cannot control that. And if your happiness is always going to be dependent

on everyone else's happiness, you will never be happy because that's impossible. If you have been seeking though, their affection through your good deeds though, I mean, because that's really how I was taught. The more you do, the more they'll love you. Yeah. You know, so it's something that you do, the more they'll love you. Yeah. You know? So it's something that you really,

truly have to like disconnect from how you have been loving people. I mean, it's like a whole new learning experience of how you give and receive love. And I was just writing that same stuff you were saying about your mom. I was, I was writing about my mom and, and just how much I really admired like that in my brain was so wonderful. And I still think she was so wonderful. I do, but I just, I was never taught to ever put myself first. I was never taught boundaries. So you're talking about, we have to have boundaries.

What, what are boundaries? Like, I didn't know what the hell that was. Yeah. You know? And so, you know what the hell that was yeah you know and so you know not only did I you know and here we're talking about we need to teach our child but like as as parents do we really truly know what boundaries are I love how Mandy always talks about him as like a fence because I know I got pretty good at him I was like building up these brick walls yeah because once I was like oh this is brick walls. Yeah. Because once I was like, Ooh, this is fine. I can say now, and I can go back. I'm just going to build a whole freaking

wall, like Donald Trump. I mean, and I've had to let mine down a little bit. I got so good at it, but I didn't even understand what that meant. Yeah. Well, for me, I think that I only felt good about myself if other people were giving me a pat on the head and they were confirming, yeah, you're good, you're good. And so I didn't know how to be myself. And so now for me, boundaries are trusting how I feel and tuning into that. And I had kind of put up the, like you said, that wall that you actually then start to let down this armor to keep me from having my heart broken. And so, and my heartbroken means what watching two mums in the schoolyard snicker and think that it's about me. Like, you know, when you're that sensitive about what people are thinking about you. And I realise now that they weren't talking about me. You know, it's just that whole obsession with what do people think about me?

And so my boundaries have been letting down this armour and to find out who I am and own that and be okay with that. And so being able to say, in answering your question about what can you say, is the first thing I did and what I teach my clients to do is say, can you give me some time to think about that? Because when we're on the spot, we're so confused about what to say and we're not even sure.

We're not even sure whether we want to say yes or no. And then if you can go away and sit with it and let it just ruminate and see how you feel about it and then trust your feeling and then not have to have words for it. We always want to have words for everything. We always want to analyze a feeling. And sometimes there are no words for it. And I've said to people, I can't explain it, but it just doesn't feel right for me. So I'm going to pass and I wish you were in bed with it. I mean, what you're doing is you're giving yourself space. So that way all of those subconscious things don't rush in and take over as they have

your entire life. So when you have had certain, you know, patterns or like, you have to be able to pause. So that way you can then, like you said, make a choice. Yeah, exactly. It's that feeling. So making that choice based off of feeling and bringing awareness to that feeling. And you also talk about it with breaking habits To replace an old habit with a new one, you need strong motivation. And the way you get that is from that feeling, right? Yeah. Yeah. And if you haven't honored that in the past, because you're so busy honoring everybody

else's feelings, then you don't have any way to do that. So one of the symptoms of people pleasing is second guessing yourself. I've met a lot of people who of people pleasing is second guessing yourself. I've made a lot of people who find it hard to make a decision. And that's because they're actually taking into account what so many other people are going to think. So if you want to actually make a choice or create a new habit, then if you tune into the feeling, what I, I use the language of tuning into your soul and so when you're soul pleasing you're choosing something based on what you're being guided towards by your soul which is the bigger part of you so the non-physical part of you which includes the physical part of you

and it's just wiser and it knows how to make the choice, which is for the highest good for all. I think people's biggest fear when they embark on the From People Pleaser to Soul Pleaser program is, will I become selfish? Will I still be nice? Will I still help people? And I say, oh, I get thank you letters from people's spouses because you become so much nicer because you're happier. But also when you're guided by the soul, it's going to be for the highest good for all. The other person may not see it in the moment. So for example, when I say no to my son who wants to go to a party, the people pleaser in me is like, oh, he's upset. Maybe I'm being too tough. Maybe I should let him go. But I know in my heart or my soul that it is the highest good for both of us that he doesn't go to that

particular party. And he might not know that right now, but I trust that feeling that's guiding me with those decisions. So it's a very powerful way to live your life, to tune into your soul, which is always feeling good. So you need to get into that space. Quite often I'll say to people before you make a big decision, you know, really align with that emotion of feeling good. And then you'll hear your soul's whispers. You know, that reminded me when my younger brother was like 17, he asked my mom if he could go camping one weekend. And she said, absolutely not.

And my mom was a yes, yes, yes, yes. And so he was completely taken back by the fact that she said no. And then he wanted an answer of why. And she couldn't give him one. She said, I don't know. Something is telling me just not to let you go. Two days later, they found out that these kids and the car he would have been riding in took a corner on a dirt road too fast, flipped and an electrical pole fell over and

killed the kids in the back. Wow. And that would have, that would have been the cart my brother would have been in. And I mean, that's a really extreme story, but I just remember how mad he was all weekend that she could not give him a reason of why he wasn't allowed to go. Yeah. I had goosebumps before you even told the ending of that story, because as a mother, we do have, as a human, we always have this instinct, but quite often it can be about our children

and we just know and we can't explain it. And that's what I've said to my son. Like, I can't always explain it. I just know that this is the best choice and you're going to have to trust me on this. So yeah, that's amazing. When you started to become a soul pleaser, did you get called selfish all the time?

Don't know if I did because I didn't to my face. But I do know that people who didn't know me very well and had always seen me in a particular light where they'd made an assumption about who I was, I did filter back that they were kind of making fun of me. And the business that I had prior to my Soul Pleaser business was a physiotherapy business. So very science-based, something that people can really understand because it's quite tangible. And so I think they thought that I'd lost my mind and that, you know, I didn't care about material things or obviously what other people thought. And so,

yeah, they thought that I was weird and you know I don't drink alcohol and I don't gossip and I don't eat meat and you know so you know a lot of people think I'm weird now and I actually don't care if this is weird I love it and for anybody you know some of the people I work with they start to fill the pool to not drink as much for example because they might be in a social situation where people get drunk to have fun, and they start to feel uneasy around that. I'm just like, trust the feeling, trust the feeling. I know that you feel like this is the only way you can have friends, but it's not true. You can be yourself and surround yourself with people who are like-minded and attracted to your new vibration.

Yeah. I think it's awesome though, too, that your husband was supportive through this because mine wasn't at the time. Cause I remember I was around 30 years old when I kind of was like, Oh, I think I want something more. I think, I think that more than a mom, I want to go to school and do this. And he's like, and I was just like, Oh, I'm like stuck and trapped in this life that actually my whole life I wanted. But then once I had it, I hadn't afraid them. I was just my own prisoner in many ways, not even his necessarily, because he was just going along with the ride. You know, I'm trying to play this role and he was playing it with me. ride. You know, I was trying to play this role

and he was playing it with me. And of course, the more you give to people, the more they'll take. Yeah. I was speaking to a lady the other day who said that her two daughters have grown up and moved out of home. And her husband, when the first daughter was born,

became very jealous of the attention that she was giving to the child. And now that they've gone, he wants to be number one center of attention again. And she's outgrown that. She's like, oh, no, I'd actually like to find out what I want. So we're going to work together and help her with that. And she said, I'm nervous about how he's going to respond. And I said, he may not like it initially, because you

have always shown him that that's okay. So when you actually allow a behavior, you're condoning it and you're saying yes to it. So when you start to say no to it, the person who's got away with it for a long time might not like it to begin with. But you know, if you continue to make your own personal growth, the priority and feeling good and aligning with your soul, your priority, the people will either meet you there or leave. If you're a great rock solid relationship, the relationship will just strengthen like my marriage, it was already good. But now that I am truly myself, my husband has started to do yoga and, you know, he's an Irish Guinness drinking, you know, like, and now he comes to yoga with me and I never asked him to, he has just been drawn into the vibration that I'm on. And, and that's

what happens if you just continue to say, this is my priority. My expansion is my priority. That's why I'm here. I like that. I like how you worded that. It sounds just so loving. It's not coming off like this is my new me and you can deal with it or not, you know? Yeah, exactly. And it is for the highest good for all. Like the best thing I can do for my family is demonstrate to them expansion. I'm not getting old. I am becoming wiser. I am becoming more of my true self. And so my kids are doing it too. I'm watching them just expand and expand. It's like they're accelerating because they're observing me doing that. It's so funny. We're talking about a lot of stuff.

I was speaking with my friends at breakfast about today. And one of them was how you always have that child come to you and go, well, you didn't, you know, make Connor do this, or you didn't make Trina do this. And I was thinking the best way to explain to her is that the reason I didn't have my son doing the same thing she's doing or not doing is because I've evolved. You know, I was young when I had him. And since then I have evolved as a human and I have more tools in my toolbox and I've learned

what I should and shouldn't be doing. And I made choices and I've gotten wiser. And that is why my thoughts and things that I share with her are different. And when I said that, she was like, oh, okay, that makes sense. Yeah, exactly. That is so good. Because I think sometimes we're taught that you have values and you never change them. But we're here to evolve and expand, which is change. And so changing your mind is a good thing. You know, people are like, I'm a man of my word.

Like I have this belief and I'll hold onto it till I die. But in actual fact, if we're going to expand, it's the opposite of that. And when my older daughters, because of the six year gap between the girls and my son, say to me, oh, you would never have led us away with that. I say, because I was modeling my parents' parenting with you, and now I am tuning in, and this is okay for him to do this. So you just came into the world at a different time when I was a different person, and that's okay. So same as what you're saying is so cool.

Yeah. It's like when old people, older people, older generations say stuff like, well, back in my day, we didn't sit on social media. I hate it too. It triggers me because I'm like, or back in my day, you know, we didn't sit in front of the TV this long and I'm like, come on, come on. We've evolved now. Maybe we haven't evolved in all good ways, but let's embrace it a little bit here. Yeah. We want things to change. That reminds me, I visited my dad, my dad's in a nursing home and I visited him a few months ago and the little activity sheet was on the bed and in the afternoon it said meditation classes. So I said to dad, oh, wow. They do meditation here.

Did you go to the meditation class? And he goes, why would I do that? That's for dickheads. Oh my God. I'm not even going to try to explain to him that I meditate every day. What's the point? It's wasted energy, but you know, that reminded me, you know, I, so Mandy and I both are like, we have kids that are miles apart, you know, lifetimes, generations apart. Yeah. And my oldest daughter will say the same thing. Aren't you going to do this for her? Aren't you going to do that? Aren't you going to sign her up for this? And I'm like, no, I'm not. Look at you. You had anxiety your whole life. I fucked you up. Yeah. You know, I was sitting with a group of women and we were talking about going to back to school night. And I was like, I have to be completely honest with you. And, and let me tell

you, I have no shame in saying this. I said, I don't go. I don't go because I haven't had a pleasant experience when I do. And quite frankly, they were, they're doing great in school and I don't need to go. And I, I have other things that I felt like I could do within that space. And you should have seen their faces. They were like, what? And I'm like, I just don't go. And I'm like, Shanna, you know, I don't volunteer for everything. I don't care if their cupcakes look better than the ones I bought at the grocery store for the party. I just, you know, especially when you become a new mom, you think you have to have the coolest stroller and you have to abide by all these rules and you can't, you know, you have to let the baby cry in the crib and you have to feed them certain foods and now you have to blend it.

And, you know, you can't just feed them a cold bod. I mean, there's just so many rules and you're so stressed because you're, you're trying to abide to everyone else's idea of what a perfect mom is. And, you know, when I got older and had that self-love and that self-trust, I didn't care what anyone else thought. I did what felt right to me, period. Absolutely. Absolutely.

Mothering is one of the most intuitive things that we do. And so for us to read books about it and for us to ask other people for their opinions, like tune in, like tune into the baby and feel what the baby needs. Like just love, just love and be guided by love because it's just crazy when we try to keep up with everybody else. And the materialism around, you know, having a baby as if it's about, you know, having the best gear that is not going to bring up a healthy, well-adjusted, you know, expanding baby. It's really about your connection and what

you model what you model yeah you know what's really funny is that you know like all of the social media and the family is all smiling and pictures every time they do anything good which I realized is not a good thing I mean because then they're like well when I don't do something good you don't put a picture on of me and I haven't done good in a while. So now, you know, you don't acknowledge me. I mean, I just, it's all bullshit, but I mean, I literally just went away for a whole week and didn't take one picture of me or my kids. I was like, I don't give a shit. Yeah. I mean, like, why would I, you know, we have our memories. We don't need Facebook to fricking, you know, see it all. I mean, and even the pictures that I did take there for me, you know, but it's just so many things have changed because I'm not trying

to please people outside of me. Yeah. It's that constant validation. And one of my daughters said to me, um, because I was 30 when I started having children, she said, I'm going to have my kids when I'm younger, I want to be a young mom. And I look at who she follows on Instagram and I'm like, she's looking at these supermodels that have popped a baby out and looks like, where did that baby come from? You know, so it's called this unrealistic sort of vision that she has based on the social media influence. And, and, you know, and I don't say anything. I'm like, oh, great. You know, whatever you want to do, but it's just this influence from people that are pretending. You know, I remember one night, Shanna actually like not being able to sleep because my middle

daughter who's 16 said, mom, it hurts my feelings that you don't have like a baby book, like that's all put together. Like you did albums with pictures like you did for Connor. And I thought about that and I felt so guilty and I, I, I was just so hard on myself. And when you spoke earlier, Tracy, you, you remind me a lot of me. I, I can't tell you how many nights I, I sat there and didn't get any sleep overthinking. If I hurt someone's feelings, if I said something the wrong way, if I should have said it different. And when I was in Alcoholics Anonymous, I had to go back and apologize to people for a lot of the resentments I was holding onto towards myself. And it was so eyeopening because most of them that I went to meet and apologize to didn't even remember what I was

talking about. It was me that was carrying that. It was me that was being so hard on myself and the baby book thing. I finally realized I don't love you any less. It's just when I made his, I was just trying to keep up with, you know, what everyone else told me I needed to do and should do to be a good mom. And I was tired and I was exhausted and I don't even have a baby book for my youngest one who's six. And guess what? I don't care. No, exactly. And you had more time with one child than you did with two. It's actually really harder the more kids you have to actually find the time to do those things. But yeah, the rehashing is exhausting, like going over and guilt. And one of my biggest shifts is I don't have any regret for anything that I've experienced,

even when I'm not proud of choices that I made. One of my big turning points and probably the catalyst for Soul Pleaser was a year before my mum died, we were away on holidays and I received a phone call to say that mum's breast cancer had spread into her lungs. And in my mind, I thought she probably has a year to live. I'm going to take her out for lunch every Friday for the next year. I made that commitment in my own mind. I didn't say it to anyone else. And I got back and I kept chasing achievements and saying yes to all of my clients from all of my businesses. And I saw my mum, like I really was close to her, but I didn't do the lunch every Friday that I told myself I would do. And when she died, I said to myself, what are you doing?

Like, what on earth are you doing? And when I reflect on that now, I don't regret that I didn't do that. It was the catalyst to my awakening. I had to get so far away from the truth of who I am to feel the pain of that so that I would be willing to give up the things that I thought I needed to feel whole in the world and surrender to something else. And when you look at it in that light, no matter how bad you think you've been in inverted commas, or how much you wished you said something different or did something differently, it's the thing that has led you to where you are now. So all of it is good.

All of it can be embraced. Wow. I'm so sorry for the loss of your mom. I lost my dad in 2016 as well. And during, during my dad's loss was kind of like during a lot of heavy work that I was doing. So prior to him passing, I was doing a lot of work on codependency. I mean, you could look up codependency in the year, in the dictionary, it was the Shannon space, like, hey, I'm codependent. I'm the yes girl. And literally after he died and I had done so much work, Tracy, I was like proud of myself. I was saying no, I was really coming far.

And then he died. And then I was like, oh, my God, had I not been so selfish? Had I not been doing this codependency? I should have been working for him. I should have been helping him. I could have saved his life, but I was so, I did. I was like, everything like reverted. Everything went away.

And I was like, oh my God, this is my fault. Like literally I was just, it was just like this moment of maybe everything I was wrong about. Maybe I was wrong. Maybe I just should have been, you know, right next to him the whole time helping him. So that way he could have had more time to deal with his health and that I could have died early. Myself so stressed out that I had heart attacks. But I mean, after I was able to come out of the grief and see everything clearly again, you know, that wasn't on me.

You know, his staff had nothing to do with me, but I really did. And like these deep thoughts had those thoughts like, God, had I just done more, maybe he would have stayed alive. And he didn't want to stay alive. If he wanted to stay alive at a soul level, he'd still be alive. We just take on so much responsibility for things that are out of our control. My uncle died recently and my cousin, his daughter, messaged me and she said, it's getting close. And I'm just, I'm just not sure

if I'm making the right choices. I just hope I'm doing the best thing. And I said, Marion, this has nothing to do with you. Like, just love him, just sit there and love him. He's doing his thing. And he died an hour later and he died peacefully. And she was so relieved that she just let go of that angst for the last hour, instead of fussing around thinking she could save him. Shan, I remember when John Woodruff had us come up to the hospital for his mom. And it was kind of the same thing. He, um, this, this fireman that saved me many years ago, him and I become really good friends. And he called me and said, would you come up to the hospital? He's, he's

like, I don't know why, but I need you to come up here. And I didn't know his mom. And, um, so Shannon and I went up just so much stress and worry in that last hour about decisions that he felt like he needed to make when he could have just been using that time to sit by her side and love on her. But he was so worried about the decisions. And then the decision ended up being out of his hands and she just passed away. And it always will be, you know, we're just, we take on the responsibility of things that we're not responsible for and we can't control.

And I think the only thing that we can control in any moment is how in alignment we are or how out of alignment we are. And when we're in alignment and we're feeling trust, you know, we trust life, life is for us, life is for everyone, then we just allow, just allow what's going to come, come and be at peace with it. Can you do me a huge favor? Can you tell our listeners about the

part of your book? It was a quote and it said, it takes a storm for a pilot to switch off autopilot. Can you explain what that means? Yeah, great. So we are on autopilot. When I look back at me being the frog in the pot, I didn't have time to be conscious about my choices. So we are making micro choices every microsecond. And so we think on autopilot unless we pause and

consciously choose a thought. And so the autopilot is just what we've practiced. And what we've practiced is often what we've picked up during our lifetime. From zero to seven, we don't have the filter. And so everything comes in and we accept all of it without question. After seven, we start to question it. So sometimes we'll take it on and sometimes we'll dismiss it. But you can have different children in the same family perceiving what they're taking in differently. And that's why our conditioning can be from the same environment, but we turn out differently.

And so we don't change while we continue to live on autopilot. And if we're semi comfortable, like I was, like I wasn't starving, you know, my husband wasn't leaving, I wasn't unwell, nobody was dying at the time. And so I could have just kept going on autopilot, because it was getting me where I thought I wanted to go. But then to me, it sounds crazy because parents die. It was the worst thing that could happen to me when mum died. I thought I adored her and I thought that I needed her to be in the physical form. And so when the thing I was most afraid of happened and I was still alive, I was like, what I'm doing doesn't work. I surrender. I surrender. I've always rolled up my sleeves and made it happen. I can fix it myself. I don't need

anyone's help. I'm an independent woman. Like I'm fully, you know, feminist, you know, I can do this, all that kind of thing. And I just went to my knees and went, this isn't working. This isn't working. I surrender. So I feel like for a lot of people, they'll come to me after a life-changing event or it just builds so and gets so bad that they're so uncomfortable that they're willing to do what it takes to get off autopilot and start to become conscious and pause and choose their choices deliberately instead of just automatically.

So this book is called Find the Real You and Love Her So You Can Live the Life You Choose. And even though the title says her, don't you think that boys could read it too? Totally, totally. Lots of men have read it and said that it completely applies. Yeah, because when you write a book, sometimes you're writing it about yourself. So it was kind of my story. But yeah, men have really related to it too. And you even have a soul pleaser for men, right? Yeah, yeah. And I didn't mean to. So I started off happily, you know, doing it with women, doing it with women. And then one of the women said, you know, my husband would really benefit from this. And I was like, oh,

but the logo is pink. Does he like the word soul pleaser? And then I realized that wasn't the point. That just wasn't the point that just wasn't the point so yeah I've got this lovely group of men and oh my goodness they cry in front of each other and it's they're just so vulnerable and they love having this space where the men are talking about their feelings to each other um a lot of them are Australian farmers and so they're like another level of toughness in terms of talking about yeah so you know it's probably also good for the flip side to understand yeah you know because that was one thing that you know I'm from a southern family so the way I looked at my parents and the roles of women in my family were

one way. And then I'm here in Colorado and the women for generations over here have been going to school, being educated on their own businesses. So the dynamic was so different on the flip side of, I think that men could understand or women that when someone's people pleasing, that it's not a positive thing, that you're not so lucky you hit the jackpot lottery, that someone's like your submissive woman doing everything for you. That really you need to support the fact that she shouldn't be doing all of it. So it's so confusing for them, though. I will say it really shifted my marriage. You know, when I started putting myself first, he didn't, he was like, wait, what? Like, you know, um, I used to sit by his side and suffer through like movies that I didn't like that were painful for me to watch.

Yeah. I used to, um, you know, say yes. When I wasn't feeling well, just because I felt like I had to. Like, I can remember there were so many baseball games that I was so exhausted from sitting at. And I mean, we're talking 10 hour days in the heat. And these tournaments would go on for like three or four days. And he'd be like, come on, get up, 5 a.m., let's go. And I remember one time I was like, I can days. And he'd be like, come on, get up 5am. Let's go. And I remember one time I was like, I can't, I just can't. And I felt so guilty that I tried to go back to sleep and ended up getting in my car and just driving there out of complete guilt when my body was screaming,

give me some love. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. And, you you know I think just people don't understand because they believe what we show to them we're saying this is who I am and it's not true but I was exactly the same thing about the movies like my heart would be racing with all the shooting and violence and it's not for me I don't want to be around it. And yeah, five years ago, I said to my husband, you can watch it. I can't even be in the room. I have to go upstairs. In fact, I don't even want to hear it. So, you know, and he was like, but you love these movies. No, I don't. And I thought that's my fault. What a great actress I am, but he thought I loved them. Oh my God. Oh, that is so great. I used to say the same thing. I was such a great actress I am that he thought I loved. Oh my God.

Oh, that is so great. I used to say the same thing. I was such a great actress as well. I, you know, and I think it, you know, it's shocking to them because they're like, wait, what? You're like, yeah, I've been like totally trying to be, you know, in your energy and it's just, it's, I got to find mine. Yeah. And I think the main thing when you do come out and be truthful

is that you don't make anyone right or wrong. So it's like, okay, please forgive me for pretending to be a certain way for all these years. That's not who I really am. And it's absolutely okay for you to like that movie. Just because I don't like it, I'm not judging you for liking it. I'm just not going to join you in it. And equally, you don't have to watch romantic comedies with me.

I accept that you don't like them. You know, that's okay. We can find places to come together and we can find things to do on our own. I'll never forget. It was Mamma Mia. It was Pierce Bronson. Okay, so we get like into the movie i'm like please watch it with me i've been wanting to watch this movie you know this is like a long time ago

it gets to the part where he starts singing he's like oh no turn that shit off yeah and he was like sorry i gotta do it oh do it. Oh my God. That's so funny. I actually almost took a picture of my husband last night because he knew I didn't want to watch the movie that he was watching. And so he said, then let's watch something together. What do you want to watch? And I said, well, I've been hearing from lots of people that Bridgerton is good. He said, okay, let's give it a try. So here we were four episodes into the first series.

And the next day I'm telling someone about how much we enjoyed it. And he's like, yeah, not so much. And I was like, well, why didn't you say something? Oh my gosh, we watched four. So then last night he's like, I'll give it one more try. I'm like, you don't have to, you don't have to. And he's like, no, I'll give it a try. I'm not even kidding you.

It was two minutes. And then I look over and he's snoring at nine o'clock and this man doesn't go to bed till like 1am so clearly he doesn't like it there's not enough action in that that's the way men people please I you know the whole happy wife happy life I think sometimes men definitely do that to us to keep the peace you know let's watch this movie with her and you know and so I reckon there's a level of doing things because you want to because you want to you know show how much you love someone even if it's not your favorite thing in the world so it's just tuning in like do I want to do this you know my son's into musicals he acts in them and I you know wouldn't be going to musicals if

my son wasn't in them but I love seeing him so happy on the stage doing what he would love mama mia oh totally we watch if we're going to watch musical it's my son and I that's too much that's awesome yeah you know I would suggest to listeners and Tracy please add to this something that really worked for me was before I went to do something for someone, like if I got asked to go somewhere, if I got asked to do something, I pause. And then I, I, if I do decide to say yes, then I asked myself, what is your intention? Is this, is your intention to fill a void within you? Are you, are you doing this from a place of not expecting anything in return and doing it because you just, it feels right and your soul aligns with it?

Yeah, me too. I do things for the joy of it now, rather than to get something out of it. And that's a big shift for me. I realize now that I made a lot of choices based on what I projected the outcome might be. And now I just realized life is about joy. My purpose is joy. So does this feel like fun? Yes, absolutely. Let's do this. Yeah. Loving with no conditions, you know, loving with no conditions, because I think that that's part of the codependency that people don't realize is that it is that form of control and you are doing because you are also you have expectations of that coming back to you in some way and that's not loving with conditions no well that's what people pleasing is people pleasing is conditional love because it's i'll say yes to you so you like me. That's what I want back. And I remember a couple, so often couples will do the soul pleaser together. So the men are in the men's group and the women's group.

And we caught up at a retreat and the two of them were really angry because they went out of their way to help another couple and the other couple didn't say thank you. And I said, you did it for the thank you you know if you didn't want to do it you shouldn't have done it don't do it for the thank you you can't expect people to be grateful and as parents how many times as parents do we get mad because our kids are ungrateful like I did last night I did last night I made my daughter it took me like 45 minutes to make her the most beautiful dinner ever.

And she walked upstairs and looked at it and goes, what in the heck is that? My ego was hurt. Yes, exactly. Exactly. And you're like, I didn't do this for the joy of it. I did it for you to go, wow, this is awesome. I did. I did. And then I had to humbly be like, okay, it's okay that you don't like it. What else? Yeah. You know, I, I have to read this quote because it's going to go on my wall. I love it so much. Um, in your, from your book, you have given away your power in exchange for acceptance and appreciation because you don't accept and appreciate yourself. Boom. That is it. That sums it all up. That's really what we've done.

And when we accept and appreciate ourselves, then we have our own power back and we create our own life instead of just being blown around by the wind, trying to keep everyone else happy. That's absolutely huge. So happy. Like my daughter's the complete opposite of me. Well, you know, now I think she, you know, she sees it in me too, but I'm so glad that that stopped in my family. Yeah, I agree. I think that this is the generation of changing the generational habits that don't serve us. Yeah. Even my youngest, I mean, from like, like I said, we have kids that are miles apart, but from my 22 year old to my eight year old, literally both of them are in agreement that like, you know, do you, this is awesome. Yeah. It's fantastic. And I think the kids being born today

will totally be themselves, which is really exciting. Yeah, I agree. Okay. I have one more question. How do you know if you're ignoring your soul's calling and what are some questions you should ask yourself? Oh, what a great question. So you're ignoring your soul's calling if you're unhappy. Because when you tune into your soul and listen to it and follow it, it'll light you up. And so when I am triggered, and triggers are a blessing. So we attract somebody into our life or a circumstance into our life to trigger an old emotion that's been blocked. And it's an opportunity for us to let it go and stop holding it down. I will talk out loud to my soul. And I'll say, so what are you thinking right now? Because

I'm thinking, you know, he's a dick or whatever I'm thinking. And I know you're not thinking that. Could you just point me in the right direction? I love how you say dick. Yeah. Could you just say dick like five times? It's so great. Then I will talk out loud back to myself and my soul would just say something really wise, like what a blessing that he said that so you could be reminded that you are whole and it doesn't matter what anyone says or whatever it may be. And then I go, oh, yeah, of course, you know, and then I just get back on track.

You're a little crazy. I love it. But you don't have to say it out loud. You can just do it all in your head. No, I like it. It's okay. You know what? I have this friend, me and her used to work at children's hospital together. She's adorable. And even when she's mad, she's adorable. Like she's the nicest, meanest person you've ever seen. Like she always tried to say she needed to be like more assertive and discipline more within our classroom.

And she would try so hard to like, she's just cute. And I feel like that's how you would be. I totally feel like you remind me of her. Yeah. Me mad. Yeah. I bet you're adorable mad. Yeah.

Oh my gosh. You're bet you're an adorable man. Yeah. Oh my gosh. You're, you're so cute. You know, you and Shanna actually have a lot of your story in common. Like she said at the beginning, I mean, Shanna has said this many times on our podcast. And as I've been her best friend since she was 15. And I was even shocked when she said it, that she loved her father deeply and she still loves her father deeply, but it felt uncomfortable for her at first to admit that his death was a blessing.

It was a stepping stone in the catalyst to her awakening as well. And you're like one of the first people we've had on that has said the same thing. And for people in the outside world, they're probably like, what the hell, what do you mean? That's like horrible to say. Yeah. Yeah. It was the worst. And then the best thing that ever happened to me. And I'm so grateful to my mom because I believe that the instant that you move from physical to non-physical you're back to pure love and so my mom's not judging the things that she would have judged when she was alive so you know when she first died and I felt her presence you know if I was having sex with my husband I'd be like sorry mom but now I realize that she embraces that now like you know she's

fully loved without judgment. And so it's the best thing that happened to me, but it's the best thing that happened to her because it set her free from, she was brought up very religious and she had a lot of rules and sex was bad and everything was bad and there was so much guilt. And so there was this sense of freedom for her, but at the same time, she allowed me to start to become free as well and let go of all of those limiting beliefs of trying to be perfect and trying to be a good girl and live up to my mom's expectations. Because I know now that her love is unconditional for me and mine is of her. I have no judgment anymore of the choices she made as a mom and all those things. So it's a wonderful thing once you understand passing.

Recently, my mom has gone through a hard time and I've had to move her to Louisiana and all this stuff. And I had these thoughts. My dad would have been so disappointed in me. I should have done more for her, right? And then I was like, wait, what? What, who the hell is saying that? She didn't hate her. You better shut up. Whoever that is. And I turned that off very quickly, but it's so crazy how, if you're not aware, like those thoughts will come in and you will live in this,

this hate for yourself too. And this disappointment and always judging yourself. You can't please, here I am trying to please somebody that's not even here physically anymore. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And when we go out as a family, us five kids, you know, people will often say things like, you know, mom would be proud, mom would be happy. So there's still this, you know, people will often say things like, you know, mom would be proud, mom would be happy. So there's still this, you know, because mom used to organize the family dinners and we've kept doing them. And so there's still this kind of mommy pleased with us. Cause we're still doing the dinner.

I was saying that in my mom's house and like, wow, cause we just moved her into her new house and everything. And I was like, oh my goodness, my dad be so proud, you know, and he would, but it's different now that I say that I'm sure it is with you. It's not approval. I'm just happy, you know, for it. But before it would have been maybe to have that approval to fill up that way. Yeah.

Yeah. Even if you didn't want to, but now it's, I want to, and yes, dad would be proud to. Yeah. Yeah. Shanna did a really pretty blog on our Facebook about, you know, the gas tank. And she uses that kind of as her metaphor of, you know, we, you fill up your gas tank and you've got to remember to keep an eye on it because you know, if you keep giving that gas to other people, you're going to have none left for yourself. Of course, that's like the lamest explanation of her writing ever actually really pretty, but sometimes as humans, we need it to be just simply broken down. Like I didn't even understand the difference between service work and people pleasing. I had them kind of intertwined. And so like in my recovery,

the 12th step in Alcoholics Anonymous is service work. And I was like, wait, I'm doing service to keep myself sober. That feels selfish. What's my intention. And am I doing it to please other people or am I doing it for myself? And it had my mind all fucked up. Like, what's my, why am I truly doing this? And there's, you know, we've had doctors on that talk about how service work is so good for your brain and releasing those, you know, amazing chemicals that we all need. It's understanding that service work is absolutely amazing. Doing for others is absolutely amazing. Doing for others is absolutely amazing. As long as your intentions are right. And that you check in with yourself to make sure you're in a spot where you

have the energy to do it in a loving way. Yeah. You can still be there for people without giving them everything. And what I always say to my clients is energy should be exchanged. Like we can't just give it all and say, have a nice day. Bye. Take it. Take my energy. You know, no, it needs, you need to, you know, return it back, you know, and just come back to you. What, what do you say? How do you work on that when, when you're, cause it is so hard. I, I, this is something that a lot of people, you know, struggle with. How can you still be there for people without being a people pleaser or without being codependent? By being there, honestly. Um, so you genuinely want to do it. You genuinely want to do it for the joy of it.

And it just ends up being service to them. So soul pleaser is called a business and some people might call it work, but I just show up and live in my joy and people happen to benefit as a side effect of my joy. And now it's time for break that shit down. So in my heart, I know that you, the listener, you are here to live a magnificent life and you are here to discover the incredible goodness and creativity and love inside of you, which is who you are. And no matter where you're at at the moment, no matter what life feels like

and how far away you might feel from that, that it is possible and inevitable for everybody to expand into the truth of who they are and so don't judge yourself for where you are right now and in the next moment, just see if there is a thought that you can have that feels a little bit better than the one before and just take those baby steps towards living a wonderful life.

Awesome. Oh my gosh. Okay. So tell our listeners where they can find you, your website, your social media, your book, all your amazing stuff. So if you go to my website, it's just my name. So tracyseekham.com and we've got a free challenge. So I do them every two or three months, but I've got one coming up next week. The class is available all the time, the masterclass and the book is available all the time. And the links to everything that I have available for free is on my website. And I have a Facebook page, Instagram page and Facebook group called Soul Pleaser. So if you look for Soul Pleaser, you'll find me on social media.

Thank you. It was such a pleasure to meet you. I love both of you and want to stay in touch. I feel the same. Thank you for bringing light to this topic. Thank you so much. Thank you to both of you. You have a wonderful day.

I will. Thank you guys. Thanks so much. Many of our listeners have asked how they can support sense of soul podcast. You can now buy Mandy and I a cup of coffee by going to www.mysenseofsoul.com and go to the coffee fund. You can also take one of our many workshops or classes online. We love to meet our listeners and work with them. Thanks for being with us today. We hope you will come back next week. If you like what you hear, don't forget to rate, like, and subscribe. Thank you. We rise to lift you up.

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