Sense of Soul - It’s Time to Awaken

Episode Date: August 29, 2025

In today’s episode special guest Rajashree Maa interviews Sense of Soul’s host Shanna Vavra. Shanna is an Intuitive, Ancestral Genealogist, Reiki Master Teacher, and Spiritual Journey Mentor. She is the creator and host of the acclaimed Sense of Soul Podcast, a sacred space for authentic, conscious conversations with seekers, light-workers, and thought leaders from around the world. A self-described Spiritual Sleuth, Shanna follows her inner compass into the depths of mystery and meaning—from uncovering ancestral truths to exploring the Gnostic gospels and other ancient texts. Her path has been one of revelation, healing, and awakening. With over two decades of experience as a coach and guide, Shanna brings wisdom rooted in lived experience, ancestral research, and hundreds of transformative interviews. Her mission is to raise consciousness, amplify untold histories, and empower others to live in alignment with their truth. She is also a devoted mother, a passionate advocate, and a soulful storyteller—bridging the mystical and the practical with grace and heart. --- 🎙 About Sense of Soul Podcast Sense of Soul is soul food for seekers. Ranked in the top 0.5% of all podcasts on Listen Notes and named the #1 Spiritual Awakening Podcast by Feedspot, it offers real, raw, and resonant conversations twice a week with authors, healers, and visionaries from across the globe. With over 500 episodes and more than a million downloads, Sense of Soul invites listeners to awaken to their inner light, explore spiritual truths, and connect with a global community of kindred spirits. 🔗 Join Sense of Soul’s Inner Circle on Patreon 🔗 Visit the Website   *Rajashree Maa is a prior guest and the author of “May the Loveforce Be With You~Kali-Ki Reiki: Healing Through Divine Mother and Yogic Wisdom” and founder of Kali-Ki Reiki. 🔗https://thewisdomschool.us

Sense of soul. Hey soul seekers, it's Shanna. Journey with me to discover how people around the world awaken to their true sense of soul. Now go grab your coffee. Open your mind, heart, and soul. It's time to awaken. So today on Sunday, on Sunday, sense of soul, we have a Raja Sri Ma. And she is actually not my guest. I'm going to be the one

being interviewed today by this beautiful person. And if you don't know who she is, Raja Shrema is an author and she is the founder of Kali Kyi Riki, which I had her on years ago. And I say my podcast always brings me exactly what I need at the right time. And she came into my life at that time when I was just awakening to the divine feminine. And she was a big part of me rediscovering, you know, the divine feminine within me. So thank you, Rajeshima, for being just such a beautiful soul in this world, not in just my life, but in many others, and for offering to interview me, which is interesting because I'm not usually in the spotlight on my podcast.

Oh, thank you so much. you know from the first time I met you and before you interviewed me you know I listened to a number of your podcasts and I just love well first of all I love the title of your podcast sense of soul because it has multiple meanings and the name you give yourself of being a spiritual sleuth I really saw something I saw this is a a woman who is truly seeking her own path to inner wisdom. And the beautiful thing, right, is as you've been seeking your own path, you've been sharing this with your audience, which is like huge now for good reason.

And so you've been a guide and an inspiration. Even as, at least as I saw it, you would often invite in. guests who were like guides to you. You know, it's like at one point you discovered Nicholas Tesla. And so you brought in a guest who was an expert in his work. And then that, and that's how I saw you unfolding. So it's like not only do you get this expertise of people that have these specialized areas, right, but you get to.

apply it to your own heart opening, your own consciousness expanding, and to, you know, really finding your own place in the world. And that's a model and an inspiration for your listeners. And so maybe I was a part of that when you were really tuning in to the Divine Feminine because that's one of my deep experiences and one of my deep experiences. And one of my deep truths in life and and i just i feel so certain that your sleuthing has led you to so many truths and that it's guided others to find their truth so i thought we need to interview you and let your listeners hear a little bit more about your story like how did this spiritual sleuthing begin. What, you know, what were the remarkable crossroads as you discovered things,

interviewed people. I know your introduction to the Gnostic Gospels has been very profound for you, but I wanted to just give you a chance to take some time. I mean, you've talked about your journey, right, from time to time when you're interviewing people. But let's just hear your story. Please begin where, you know, you are guided to begin. You know, I think that throughout the years, you're right, I have been divinely guided. So much synchronicity in my journey within the podcast. But I started out in a place where I was living how everybody wanted me to live. I felt like I was checking off all of the boxes I was supposed to. I was playing the role that I admired, which was the serving woman. And I do remember, like, my son's first

birthday party, my mom said, aren't you going to feed your husband? And I really, truly was excited. I was like, oh my God, I get to feed my husband. Like, this is what I've waited. for my whole life like I'm having a party and I get to serve everyone and and I did and I did it good for a while until I started to have anxiety like really bad anxiety and it was something that I had as a child but I didn't really understand it and I had no control over it I didn't even have a word for it but I I went to the doctor got on meds and I had always always been a very, very emotional person. Like I was called a cry baby my whole life, you know.

I was very attached to people's stories too. I would hear their stories or their traumas or whatever, whether it was friends or family, you know, I would feel it in my body. And that was something, I had no boundaries at all back then. Kind of a codependent, I wouldn't say, okay, not kind of a codependent, I was a codependent, 100%. But my children were everything to me, everything.

And that's what I was taught to do. It was faith, family, friends, and there's no you in that. I really had turned off that part of me. That really was my soul. And I was very lost. And so one day, it really was around my Saturn return, I must say. I think it's a real thing. I did too.

Yeah, I mean, but I really was, who am I? What have I done with my life? You know, I was very blessed with a wonderful therapist, after several therapists, by the way. And she said, let's not call you codependent anymore. Why don't you look up the word impath? I looked it up and I was like, wow, this is me. This is me.

This is always been me. since I was really little so got off the meds and then the next thing was they suggested a mindfulness class which this was after they had diagnosed me with ADHD anxiety all these things and I'm thinking well I have no problem with my mind being full so I don't know what kind of class this is but I've been divorced I started a new career because I've been working for my father for most of my life. It's a family. It is a family business. My brother still owns a store. He owned a sports equipment store. And he passed away around that time. Very difficult for me because he was really my foundation. He was my go-to, my

solid, my kid's solid. And then I lost my best friend around that time. Yeah, right there. And all of a sudden, all those foundations, as you said, just dropped away. Yeah. Yeah. But the good thing was, is I did take that mindfulness class. And you didn't just get filled up in the mind? I didn't. You know, the internet wasn't, like, huge back then.

So you couldn't, like, get a lot of information. But what I did is I went home and I researched the word mindfulness. I wanted to know more because that experience really did shock me. Because I thought it was a failure. There's something started. You started researching this. I know. I've always been actually.

I used to be a true crime junkie. Like, I still am a little bit. Yeah, there is something in me that's always wanting to explore. Yeah, that's true about me. And I'm really good at it, actually. So most people will come to me if they want to know, like, hey, can you look this up? And I'm usually that go-to person because I'm pretty good at it. However, I couldn't find much on mindfulness, but I saw that sometimes mullahs were connected to this.

And I didn't know what a mala was. I'd grown up Catholic my whole life. I knew what a rosary was. So I couldn't find a mala. Like the only mala that I could find was like at Lulu, and it was like $100. And I was like, I can make this. That's another thing. Around 36, I started to make everything.

Like, I had all these talents that did not come from anywhere. Like, I could sew, like, you wouldn't believe, and I didn't even know what I was doing, but I could. I could crochet, and I loved to make these rag rugs. And I would sit there, and in the middle, and as I get bigger, you know, it's, like, spiraling around you. And I would sit there, and I wanted to do mindfulness, and I was. you know, as I was, it was almost like a malo.

That's a meditate, yeah, a meditative practice, a labyrinth, and a spiral. And when I, when I look behind you, you know, with your sense of soul logo, and I see those beautiful colored dots, it's like, oh, there's a mallow right behind you. Wow. And you know, I'm just putting this together for the first time. So this is so beautiful, you know, about telling your story, because you end up learning through recounting it and I never put together that here I was in this labyrinth this spiral and I found this mantra it was called God is love love is God and that felt safe to me and so all the other

words were in Sanskrit or whatever and they were foreign to me so I'd put on this mantra as I was doing my rug and I didn't know what it was saying but whatever it was saying were so touching it's like my soul knew and I would listen to it over and over I mean my whole house I kind of knew this mantra because it was and then I end up finding later it's like one of the most powerful ancient Hindu mantras ever and little did I know I was absolutely awakening myself unconsciously and it was beautiful because I was finding that I was like in the center of a tornado often that's how I felt or in the center of a hurricane that I was in the eye where everything around me was the same but yet here I was in

this safe space and I was healing in that space and I really didn't know what was happening but as I changed I realized everything around me was changing to but yet really nothing changed and therefore it was new as if I had been reborn awakening for so many years not only was I diagnosed with all of the mental health issues but I also had fibromyalgia I had so many strange symptoms and I had gone to massage school and so I was starting to learn about the body and how your memories can be stored in your muscle tissue and so I was at the same time like really merging this inner journey with also understanding the body as I worked on other people all of it was kind of unconscious like I didn't

understand there was no understanding yet what was happening until I asked myself this question this is the question how much had I believed in had I been told to believe and of that how much of that had I known to be my truth

like what was I living and believing in you know that I had experienced to be my truth and the only thing I could get because I really sat with it And the only thing I could get was that I knew what love felt like for my children. It was that unconditional love that was so deep that could, like, bring me to tears and, like, affect my whole body.

And I had felt the Holy Spirit. I couldn't deny that experience, not the beliefs, but the feeling, you know, when you're in church and everyone lays their hands on you. And you feel it. It's like those truth bumps happen. And yeah, so that was what I knew to be true. You know, that is so beautiful. And you probably are aware that in yogic understanding of awakening, it's that beliefs are of the mind.

No matter how much it's been pounded into us that they're true. there's still a belief and that is of the mind and true awakening is greater than outside of the mind that's what's meant by transcendent experience but it also needs to be felt within the body and so by you somehow being guided to ask that question you recognized what was mental what was ego what was this this formulation you said like you had been modeled after and you know been told you should be this that you aspired for but wasn't necessarily the true nature of your being and when you looked in and saw felt your true nature that was love and that you know resonated for you as truth and our beliefs are just things we build around that experience And of course, I think religions are all based on that same experience, but then all these beliefs are woven around them, kind of, you know, like the spiraling around a mandala or something like that. And so it's like, yeah, those things may be, they may be true. But if they're not felt truths, if they're not my experience, they're just icing, they're not the real cake.

and you discovered that actually, I think, quite early on, Shanna, and it was beautiful. You did it through your own inquiry. You know, this is a famous inquiry. Who am I really? What am I? I am not these thoughts. I am not even these sensations or these emotions. They are part of this suit that I wear, and they're good, and they're useful, and they're informative.

But the I that feels and thinks is not the feelings and the thoughts. It's something much more true and much greater than our own individual selves. So, yeah, this is wonderful. Keep going. Well, what was a miracle was that all of the pain that I had been experiencing, all the anxiety, all of those things fell away as I really grasped on to what you just said. They're all thoughts. They're all thoughts about past and future.

And when we truly come into present, they drop away. Yeah. Yeah, I couldn't believe it. And honestly, Rajas Srinni, I wanted to shout this from the rooftop. I wanted to share this with my friends. I mean, I remember calling my best friend, going, you're not going to believe this. Like, I have no more pain. I mean, it's gone.

I mean, you couldn't even hug me before. It hurt to hug. The anxiety that I lived with since I was very, very little was gone. And my relationships with my children also was changing because I was more present with them. And, you know, being a mom, I was so busy. I mean, could you imagine me? had three kids in three different schools with a newborn. And my kids were in everything.

And I was in everything and coached everything. And I thought all those things were so important. I got a do, do, do, do, do and that's gonna make me successful. When I asked myself that question, things fell. It was truly like I was shedding. One thing that I think, was difficult was the religion because it was deeply, deeply rooted.

In fact, in my ancestral journey to me, I learned a lot about history, but I learned that I had an ancestor who came on the first five boats. He actually was from Germany, because the Germans and the Swiss also came over with the French on those first five boats. His job was he was a witness on the boat before you got on it, you were to be baptized Catholic.

Then I learned of an Anast, ancestor from Canada. He was a first nation, and he was a great shaman. He was a sorcerer. And he was known as an apostate because in the 1600s, the Jesuits had come and they made him and his tribe convert to Catholicism. And they said when they would go back to his village, he'd still be doing his tent-shaking rituals. And they wrote volume. on him. So I was able to really read how very divine this man was. And to me, it was a travesty that he and his people had to give up their culture and their belief systems. Well, isn't it interesting that that we talk about our country as being founded on religious freedom? Louisiana was bigger than

France itself. Where I'm sitting was Louisiana. Right. That's right. It was a huge part of what's now this nation yeah so we it was france for a long time of course went back and forth between the spanish and france but they also had the same beliefs in fact sometimes um i had noticed in my tree that some of the women who were in my tree had bought their freedom under spanish rule which i thought was very powerful and and reading these things i felt power as well i was like wow This woman, like, bought her freedom. She must have, you know, been pretty strong to do such a thing. I mean, she freed the rest of her lineage, which I'm a part of.

So that's pretty powerful. But I also know that in the black code, every slave that came here had to go and get baptized. I mean, they got Sundays off. So in every one of my lineages, including my father's lineage, who was Jewish, who denied their religion, their culture, and became Catholics. So every single lineage I had, I saw how very deeply rooted this was in me. And I knew, and I could feel within me, it was going to be a struggle. Because one of the first emotions I felt, and I think people don't talk about this enough,

but that there is this religious trauma syndrome that people can experience. and this explained why I was so angry at first. And I'd go around my house and scream for 2,000 years. I was angry. And I think I had to go through that. And it did last probably longer than maybe it should have. It's one of the reasons why I think when I found the Gnostic Gospels, it was a safe space.

Because it is still Christian, even though people don't realize that. but it is taught by Jesus. It was his disciples. It was still safe. Which gospel in particular of the Nostak Gospels speaks to you, Shannon? That's hard. Thomas definitely spoke to me. It was one of the first ones I ever picked up.

And I love the book of Thomas. It speaks of many of the same things that Jesus said in the Bible. I was, of course, I think my brain's right. looking for the safety of what I know, right? But it was speaking to my soul in a different way. Like, the kingdom is inside of you and it's outside of you. And when you come to know yourself, then you will be known. It reminded me of things that Jesus said in the New Testament, but yet there's this more.

And also, I love in the book of Thomas that he's not telling stories of Jesus. He's telling quotes of Jesus. In fact, it even says, the secret teaching. of Jesus, this is the quotes of Jesus. This is his words. So I can just imagine, like, you know, Thomas just sitting down, writing down the quotes of Jesus. No, absolutely. And in truth, you know, when you read the New Testament, there isn't a lot about Jesus's teachings. You know, yeah, there's the sermon on the Mount, which is wonderful. There are a few of them, but mostly it's the story of what he did. And there's a lot about his healing work, which is of particular interest to me.

But the Gospel of Thomas also very much parallels a yogic non-dual philosophy. And some people say that this is evidence that that Jesus was trained by some yogis. There are, you know, scholars that believe that that may have been the case during his law years we don't really know but certainly Thomas presents his his words as as so deeply mystical and profound and so yeah it's a beautiful bridge between the traditional Christian teaching and the more contemplative meditative soul awakening I would say teachings of Jesus and of other great masters around the world and over time. Until you get really into the Gnosticospels, do you then learn about something I was very shocked about,

and that is Sophia, or the idea of a Mother God. You know, being Catholic, Mother God would be Mary, right? Which I also find to be interesting. There's many texts, Gnostic text, text, apocryphal text, the infancy of James. These books also talked about Mother Mary and told her story. So I started to read the Gnostic Gospels, but really how I got further into him, which was probably around the time that I met you. It kind of started with my little girl, and it usually always does. I mean, my journey has, she's always been like one step ahead of me. You know, it was she that

had mentioned one time she was an old man when she was little which kind of sparked me to go have my first past life regression but she had one day come in my room in the middle of the night and said I had a dream about this angel mom and she has long red hair and she has this long green dress with this burgundy trim around it I mean such detail that I couldn't believe that I wrote it down in the middle of the night and then the next day I had on a woman, and she spoke about the goddess Bridget. And I didn't know much about Bridget, but also there was this Catholic Saint Brigitte of Kildare connection. And so the next day, I had a listener, and we did a reading, and I had just got a new deck.

And I said, let me pull a card for you. I never even looked at this deck before. pull the card it's bridget oh so i get to learn a little bit more i said someone just talked about her the next day i have this man on sean johnson from the wild lotus band yogi band and he is going to release his album on my podcast and i get to listen to his music before he does it and i'm falling asleep to his music, which was very divine to do, by the way. And the beginning of one of his

songs called Healing, he's chanting, Bridget. Bridget Dolomous. And I'm like, who the hell is Bridget? Is this like his girlfriend or something? But this is getting weird

now. We've got like several this is all in one week so then the next day I have a guest on her name is Bridget Finclare and she's from England oh my goodness another another woman who sticks out to me like you you know there's just certain ones that I just have a connection with and she's one and she's telling me how she teaches courses on the keys of Enoch which I would was just reading the book of Enoch so I was curious and then she says so I have a small online group that I teach on a Tuesday evening and then every other Monday I'm teaching as part of a roster the pistis Sophia which is also part of the Academy for Future Science and I was like oh well

I really want that keys of Enoch book so I get online and I order the book and I was doing I was making my own deck Roger Schema I never actually finished well I did finish the deck but I kept it for myself. And in this deck, I was making a card. It was a oneness card. And I had made this world with like hands around the world. And it was very, it was getting very dark like the colors. So I threw a dove on it. And literally while I was doing the art, my doorbell rings. And there my book is. It's the keys of Enoch. And I've heard lots of people experience opening their book of the keys of the Enoch, and I did also, like, feel like this electricity, and I just open it to whatever page. And there is the return of the dove. It has a map of the world, and it has this

dove on it. Your dove. And I'm like, this is so interesting. I'm making this right now. So I've felt called to reach out to The Her Talks. While I was on his website, I was like, I wonder what that other book was the priestess of fear i want to find that book and then underneath the keys of enoch because there's these beautiful white pearly books with like gold etching and underneath the keys of enoch was pistice sophia and i heard bridget think claire's beautiful accent the pistice sophia she was saying pistas sophia and i was like well i don't know what this is but i'll order it And that's how I learned about Sophia, which I had no idea who was. I'd never heard of it.

And that book is a Gnostic Gospel. It was not found in the Nagamati with the rest of them. It was found prior to that, actually, I think late 1700s. And it really fills in the blanks of many of the Gnostic Gospels in the Nagamati Library where they speak of Sophia. She's also known as the Barbello or Zoe or many other names. But in the Pistice Sophia, Jesus tells the stories of Sophia. And what I love about it most is that, like myself, who's so inquisitive and curious and seeking, so was Mary Magdalene.

She was just like me. Who also had red hair, like Bridget. Which I also continued to study. I still was dipping my toes into, this isn't fairy tales. Women can be inquisitive to Jesus. I mean, Peter didn't like it, I must say. He was, why are you always telling her all this information? Why are you sharing all of this with her?

And in one point, he says, well, I've made her like a man, which even that, oh, infuriated me. Why did he say that? And it wasn't until I started to, like you said at the beginning, you know, using my podcast to reach out to Gnostic scholars and to people who are also on this journey. Yeah, isn't there also a verse in the Gospel of Thomas that basically says when the male should be the female and the female shall be the male, there I am. Meaning that ultimately we're one soul, were one spirit and that, you know, our gendered differences. don't matter when it comes to truth and wisdom. That was the biggest thing in my journey, I think, because I really always felt that we had these roles

and that we needed to play. You know, and I felt, I'm staying in my own lane. And I remember there was this one moment outside in my backyard in meditation or mindfulness as I bring my dogs outside. And I looked up into the sky. I saw the sun and the moon. they were equal and it was a wanting crescent moon just the little i had learned the little i had learned and had opened myself up to that there being a possibility of this mother god

all of a sudden it was like i got it it was like you can't have one without the other you can't have the masculine without the feminine you can't have light without dark you can't have the sun without the moon you can't have above without below like it was all there and as i sat there and had like this huge realization and they are equal and i did literally did not have to move my head i was taking pictures because i figured no one's going to believe me yeah um one white dove came above my head oh my goodness one it just was like things were being revealed to me and it was around that same time that i also was studying sophia at that same way at that same week and I had come across the Vov. My last name is V-A-V-R-A-V-R-A-V-R-A-V-R-A.

And never really had that connection, much connection to my last name. But I kept seeing Vov as I studied Sophia. And Vov is the sixth letter of the Hebrew alphabet. And it's also in Yodevahe, right, in the name of God. It's a word that I've learned all about the word now, but it's a connector. It's and it's also a hook that would connect things together. It's, yeah, it's like, it's also known as the Star of David sometimes, the divine feminine and masculine. Right. Right, right, right.

Oh, that's fabulous. That is just so lovely. So when you're saying, Yeho, you're saying Jehovah. Yeah, yeah. And that it's part of that. Wow. Right. So, you know, then I had on the Her Talks,

but let me just say a few things about the vaub so amazing name really it is the divine name in hebrew you've seen it y hw h dr her deck has it on the cover of his book the keys of enoch and the w is also the v actually double v so it's v a v it's the letter v it's the number six but that's not you know negative it's not a six six it's the number of man but it's the code if you go six and six you get the 12 so that's very powerful Hebrew for the linkage. It used to be the hooks for the temple curtain. So it meant it brought heaven and earth together. So that's what you're doing. And then the power of Ra, of course, most people do realize the name Ra was the Egyptian god. But also the name of Israel. So when the children of Israel were to Egypt, they were influenced by the Egyptian cosmology. In my opinion,

they elevated this into a sense of taking this into the public dimension. But it can also be seen like ray, right? The vibration is ray. So you're like bringing in the light energy. What's the origin of that name? Do you know? My dad's family, both sides were from Czechoslovakia. My grandfather came from Czechoslovakia also. The name or the Vov letter is the sign of vibration or the vibatory nature of divine language, which all great cultures have, to elevate the normal mind into the higher vibratory creative mind. I can see why you got into your ancestors you could actually do a mantra Vavra which I do now which is the most powerful thing there's not any chant that I'd ever done in my life that could be more

powerful than me chanting Vavra and I've learned so many things about my last name over the years it's also a Sanskrit word it means hidden it's also I just learned recently raw actually in Hebrew and Hebrew means evil or bad. And that at first, not as it would. If I would have learned this years ago, I think I would have been like, but now I was like, that's okay.

That just is exactly what I said before, that hilarity, which I really have learned to hold chaos instead of fearing it. It's been like, it took a long time me to learn to do that, but it helps in this life. Can you talk about that a little bit more, Shana? Like, it can give us a time where you really were able to hold chaos as the witness? Yeah.

Yeah. I had an experience not too long ago at this cave. It was a beautiful experience. I went into the Cave of the Winds here in Colorado in Manitou Springs. and they did a sound bath in this cave. I mean, like, can you imagine how amazing this? I'm fabulous. I love kids.

But here I am. I really had no expectations. I kind of was just enjoying the sounds. They had not just sound bowls, but they also had the Native American flute, drums. It was like a whole performance live. It was very amazing. And I did go into a deep midday.

and I was in a womb in the darkness and I really was kind of like floating around and I felt super safe and warm and cozy and then I was bobsledding like down this tunnel like going through like dimensions of space time and I'm making this I mean it was much longer and more in depth but I'm giving the short story and then all of a sudden I was like birthed and that was a really difficult time I mean it was it was I was squeezing through these dimensions going super fast like so then I come out and the one the first thing I noticed surprisingly is I had tears falling out of my eyes and

in that moment it was like I popped back in to like be a witness of this and I was like oh my gosh like I wonder if this is why babies cry like it was but it wasn't crying because I was I was in pain or anything I was crying because it was so beautiful to come here and experience this 3D world in my mother's arms And it reminded me of the story of Sophia once I thought about it all. Because in the story of Sophia, she's like the first fallen angel that falls from the highest dimension all the way down to this three-dimensional world. And she vows pretty much to stay here on earth until all of us find her spark within, our light within. And, you know, many people think that, and Fagnostics often think that we are stuck here and we're being punished in these bodies and we're, you know, imprisoned in the body.

But what I've learned recently, and it really does help with life, no matter what struggle comes, is that we're here to experience, you know, humanity, nature. these things that are not in the highest dimension. And, yeah, suffering and all of it, too, the chaos. And all of it has only enriched my journey and given me more wisdom. That's so, so beautiful. Sophia is wisdom. Yeah. How lovely.

So yet, you know, you spoke at the beginning of how you felt like your purpose, your Dharma, so to speak, was to serve. And you did, and you served beautifully, and for many years you served happily. From my perspective, you're still serving, right? But what's different? How has your service changed? transformed, amplified since your awakening and since this journey. Wow, what a great question.

Roger Shuma, that's another thing I think I didn't put together until just right now. You know, sometimes we can't see ourselves, and I guess I'm telling you, you saw that. It's good to be our own witness, and then sometimes it's very helpful to have a witness for the witness. it was so true because at first I was so defiant I'm not going to ever be you know that codependent martyr anymore no more serving for me you know I'm an independent woman but it was innate in me it was natural in me I am nurturing but there was a point where it was like no I have to think about myself this is my journey I have to put down boundaries and they were it was like I had to go through this journey of that

where I was able to accept really my true nature in a positive and healthy way and on my terms right not what everyone told me that it looked not just serving as a matter of beliefs and values which are wonderful their great frameworks until we know our true nature and then to serve from your soul yeah and that's what i did and that i think that's where our sense of soul comes from when i was able to truly connect with who i was not who the world saw me as because that really wasn't who i was and serving is a part of that but it needed to be a healthy. I did need boundaries and I still need boundaries and I still work on that too. And I think also learning what we just spoke of of the divine feminine and the divine masculine

within myself. Help me find that balance. And finding the divine masculine was a journey of its own because I and actually it's a funny story. My friend had to ask me to do some art for her she wanted me to create a dragon um and i created the most beautiful feminine dragon with flowers all around her i mean she was gorgeous and i am a dragon when it comes to chinese astrology oh me too are you oh my gosh i love that see um a generation but absolutely yeah yeah my little one's a dragon too by the way okay so i i send her it over And she's like, ah, this is amazing, it's beautiful. And then she messages me back and goes,

you know, I was thinking about a more masculine dragon, though. I was like, no, what? You know, and she's like, yeah, a masculine dragon. I'm like, are you sure? I mean, I really, everything in my body was like, no, I mean, it's the feminine dragon. This is her. So I make this dragon, and I send it to her.

And she says, whoa. that's robust and I was like oh I made a scary Putin dragon I made a Nazi looking dragon

and that's not what she wanted she wanted a divine masculine dragon so then I had to really sit with myself and I was like wow this is how I see masculine energy oh it's kind of that warrior

fierce energy big and fulky. Right. I had talked to one of my listeners, a male, who absolutely is the definition of a divine masculine. And I was like, you know what, that's the energy she's talking about. So that was a huge teacher.

I created a divine masculine dragon after connecting with that. And yeah, that was a huge teacher for me. really I didn't realize that I still had that, that I thought of the masculine as dominating. And I think that as I hold space as a feminine, hold space for that masculine energy to come through, that's actually going to help make that space for them to feel that it's okay to, which is so amazing because, you know, oftentimes we look at the world and say, why don't you change? you know why don't you find your divine masculinity but really it's it is um all of us that need to to find it and when you find that balance um that is within you you can then see it in others right

you really do whatever's going on in you you see in the world you know whether that's good or bad there are other ways you can think of to explain how your journey has changed your own life, your worldly life, and, and like you were just saying, how you see others, how you treat others, and how you are treated, and how you receive those, that treatment yeah, that was a big one for me because, you know, I'd been so used to giving, giving, giving. I've never been a very good receiver at all. I mean, I still kind of struggle. with compliments you know but you know that self-love journey was so important early on you know in there I mean life happens you know the 2025 has actually

kicked my ass you know has been really difficult and I had to really lean back on a lot of the tools in my toolbox some that I had early on now that I hadn't used as much had to like and I think that one can be like this is a relapse you might feel or a disappointment that no no it's um it's the life experience and there's always going to be chaos right I remember sitting outside one morning and they don't always get messages I have gotten some beautiful messages from the Divine Feminine but this one was I'm the creator and the destroyer and yes this is a year that I think that I knew it was coming it was like this table that has wobbly legs that had been like that for so long and we're trying

to like prop up one side to keep it balanced but it's just not stable and this year you could tell a lot of things are collapsing a lot of things and you know at first it was just i think fight or flight right um was rising up in me and me remembering you know you have tools right just breathe actually that'd be the first one and you know just holding space for and holding that chaos um is what i did You know, when you are holding chaos or you, you're still driving. That's the one thing is I know that I do have the control, right? Control can be a masculine word too.

One that I think I was afraid of for much of my life. I was always told, you're out of control. seeing control in that divine masculine space of boundaries, you know, all these things have been very important this year for me. You heard from the mother, I am the creator and the destroyer, and I resonate with that very much because the divine mother for me comes in the form, if you will, of Kalima, right? and Kali, of course, is she is the great mother. She is the creatrix of it all.

She is time and space, and that provides the ability for there to be material interaction, transactional world, et cetera. And just as she creates, she's always destroying. Of course, the destruction has to do with allowing some new creation to come forth. But it's not easy to love someone who's in the middle of a rampage, so to speak. Many people fear this part of the divine feminine. And so often, the feminine goddesses have been portrayed as pure love, pure good, pure everything positive, right? It's like putting women on a pedestal, but then no human woman ever lives.

up to that. And so then women get diminished in the patriarchal society, right? Instead of acknowledging, you know, that we're all creating and destroying at the same time. And this is part not just of the human structure, but it's the cosmic structure. And when you speak of that, I feel like it's very important to recognize that, you know, things have to be cleared for new things to arise and I don't feel we have control over what's going to arise all the time and it may not be to our preference and we don't fully understand the wise and the wherefores but to just understand there's this constant movement you know between creation and and destruction or or the dissolution of of what has arisen it's like okay

You know, in the cosmic scheme of things, there's a balance, even if I feel, you know, incredibly out of balance at any given time. And to acknowledge those forces within us, just as you are acknowledging, creation and destruction do exist simultaneously. And at a certain point, they actually do balance out. And there is only that which is. and it's ultimately beyond value judgment of good or bad. It's just the way. Yeah, that's beautifully. My God, that was so beautiful.

I love you. It's so true. But I mean, is this what you resonate? Yeah, yeah. You just spoke everything my soul feels. And also, you know, I remember when I did have you, one and I read your book and I would read Dark Mother. I'm colleagues known as the Dark Mother.

And I kept seeing Dark Matter. And do you know just my last interview with Wonder Bob, who's amazing, he talked about the dark matter being the dark mother. Holly is the Dark Matter. We go. I love one. I know. I love the synchronicities and, you know, these synchronities.

that you have brought onto this world stage, really, that you have. I think it's pretty great. I think overall it's pretty amazing because sometimes it could be so just like, holy cow, I can't believe, like the synchronicity. This is insane. But really what I've learned is that it's already in me, allowing yourself to be curious and go on these journeys and follow, you know, the moon when it speaks to you or the sun but it's already in you it is a remembering and there is i think

healing needed to be done in my ancestral line in my life you know um so that healing it was making space you know for me to remember and and the other thing is i've learned this this is kind of like my theme so far this year is i don't hold on to any belief too tightly because you never know you know in five minutes your entire perspective could change and that's okay that's okay and i think that has helped me um i don't feel so much trauma when my perspective completely changes it's not like this collapsing um of a table or a theory it's it's just the nature of life and you know when you talk about as we have been talking about all these synchronicities i mean they're absolutely amazing and they're wonderful. And I had a teacher once who used to use the phrase

when the extraordinary becomes ordinary. And, you know, at a certain level, it's like the synchronicities are already here because everything is interconnected. Everything is interwoven. So, of course, it's going to show itself over here with one face and show itself over here with another face and it's just that now somehow upon being awake right we recognize that oh this is related to this and this is connected to this because it's all connected which then makes the synchronicities not so necessarily spectacular it's like well of course we're going to see the divine reflected any place we look when we're looking through the lenses of divine seeing and that is awakening and I think this is the journey that you've been on now for so long and have been able to share again with tens of

thousands maybe hundreds of thousands of people so I'm just so delighted to be able to showcase this a little bit. Thank you. And I'm still working on my book, but I'm close to finishing. What about your book? Do you know the title? You know what's very interesting as I just had a dream about my book about three days ago. And it revealed something to me again that I was juggling with. Like should it be a trilogy, which it should. This is the now second year in a row I have a dream where I see this trilogy, three. books on the spine of the book it makes a goddess symbol when you put them together you put the three together oh i love it yeah so the very first one is going to be called desperately seeking sophia

and i just remembered more in my dream as i said that the first one i'm seeking wisdom right and then the next one is like so it's kind of like at the top of the cabalah tree it is a trinity and And so I think that first one is wisdom, and then there's the understanding and then bringing it all together, right? That alchemical marriage. And so it came through very clearly a few days ago. Again, I'd been struggling to put everything into one, and that was really difficult. Neil Donald Walsh had challenged me to write my book. You know, I was in a circle not too long ago, and there was just.

some time at the end to really pray and just reflect and instead of praying i kind of was asking for wisdom and i receive it who in two equals four you finally got it pretty much but really you know what it said this is what came to me and i felt like it was a feminine energy telling me this because it was like she spoke to me and said, I belong to no one, not no one, but no one, no one. And I am home to all. And I sat with it for days and just in amazement as well as how quickly I received it. You know, there wasn't a space to think about it. It literally just came flooding in.

And as simple as it was, I thought it was so wise. Then only is it so wise, it's the basis of a book that you could write. What if you wrote a book, what a daring book to write? That could be your next book. No, that would be your next book. If you write such a book, I'll write the forward to it. I told him it's a conversation with goddess, actually, not with God.

I want to make this a book that anybody can pick up, you know, whatever stage they're in, and I want them to be able to relate to it. I want it to be for, like, my neighbor. Well, and love thy neighbor, love thyself. I think that that is really beautiful and just by you being authentically who you are, it will be completely relatable. I look forward to it, all three. Yeah, yeah, me too. I look forward to it as well. Sometimes when I read back on it, I don't know if you felt that way, I've learned more.

Oh, you know what? I go back into my book all the time and it's like, really? Really? I wrote that? I knew that. It's like, oh, okay. And because we're always seeing things with our new eyes, right? And so things, even things we may have said or thought, they appear different to us from our current perspective. because awakening is a constant evolution. And, you know, we also forget stuff.

Have a reference. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. My journey's not going to end either, and that's another big part of the hang-up, I think, because I'm constantly still a student and I'm constantly learning. Well, yeah, and it's sort of like us taking this time now to talk, right? you're sharing your wisdom as it is coming through for you now, and I am to a certain degree as well.

And if we do this a year from now, two years from now, five years from now, it may appear very different. That doesn't make what we're doing become obsolete. That's one thing I've discovered that reading even an ancient text, you know, like it were thought, Gnostic Gospels, right, or reading some things that were written 25 years ago, 40 years ago. I mean, some of it does get a little obsolete, but stuff that is really written from soul, from transmission, from true wisdom, it's timeless. Yeah. Gosh, and you know what else is really funny.

I just popped up. So many times people will send me messages and say, oh my gosh did you hear about this do you know about this and i was like yeah i wrote that in my book i say it often yeah i wrote that in my book i have a chapter in my book about that or i did that and so i know it is the time for that book um today what you're saying yeah of course people are and yes that's that what morphogenetic field that um my word shell break so famously talks about it's it's like we're You're getting this down in writing, but that wisdom is already out there. You're pulling it together.

So those who are seeking a greater understanding, even though they've had the pieces of it, when they see it in the whole as the book, it will be very probably affirming and inspiring for them. Thank you so much for doing this for me and for being you. and you know what tell our audience you know a little bit about you and where they can find you they i mean because the wisdom that you share is is truly um very important for this time as well okay well i don't want to take up too much time but i am the founder of calli ki reiki which is a reiki based in yoga and the divine feminine. My book is called May the Love Force Be With You, and it's about Kali Ki Reiki as Divine Feminine in Yoga, and it's available in all different contexts. I'm also the

founder of the Wisdom School and have many teachings and free guided meditations on my website as well as We have a YouTube channel, but you have to find it by the WisdomSchool.U.S. Because there are wisdom schools all over the world, and you'll find something else. And so I teach courses in Kali Ki Reiki, and I do spiritual mentoring with people. And my background is one of, it's an inter-spiritual background. I studied comparative religions. I went to theological centers. seminary and I mostly work in the world of yoga and meditation.

You know, there's a video I found on your YouTube and I actually always show my students this video. And I really, I really like this practice, the five principles of Reiki. You have a little spin on them where it's like in the present moment. Right. I will not worry. I think that's beautiful and I think that that's another thing I've learned even with Reiki. It's like make it your own. You know, these things are great foundations, wonderful, beautiful foundations. But we're evolving. And, you know, all these things should evolve to with us, as you did with Kali Ki Reiki, which I love. And, you know, we should, you know, all these things should evolve to. Yeah. With us as you did with Kali Ki Reiki, which I love. And also, you know, Roger St. Ma is the type that when you're scheduling with it, well, I'm doing my day of silence that day, so I can't talk on that day, which has been such a great teacher for me too, because you don't need an entire retreat to have a day of silence or a day for yourself. You don't have to. You could have it just in your home, you know. Absolutely, it can be a half day, but you have to block it out and you have to unblock. I love you know, so much is coming at us.

Let me just to say a little bit about those Reiki principles because you too are a practitioner and a teacher of Reiki. And we know the original, right, is just for today, no anger, no worry. And, you know, how many of us get through a day without a little bit of anger and worry coming through. But the whole point about present moment is that when we are truly in present moment, There is no past, there is no future.

And so there's nothing in the past to be angry about in this present moment. And there's no future to worry about when we're truly in present moment. And our lives are present moment, present moment, present moment. So when we can stay, like you've said, in that presence, That's when we really can serve from the heart and speak from the heart. And so I think this has been part of your journey and I just really again want to just wrap a virtual hug around you and the work that you're doing and sharing. Yeah, you too. Thank you. Hey, soul seeker, are you curious?

Are you hungry to know? Do you have eyes that now see? Do you have ears that can hear? Have you discovered your sense of soul? You're more than you know, more than a body, more than the thoughts that echo in your mind. You've got that sense of soul You are awaking

Turn your pain into purpose Climb that mountain And only look back to see how far you come Share your story You'll find you not alone Find that a lot living Discover that sense of soul Thank you.