Sense of Soul - Microdosed Mindfulness

Episode Date: March 11, 2022

Today on Sense of Soul Podcast we have Janet Fouts. She is an author of 7 books, Certified Coach, Resilience Facilitator, Podcast host, speaker, and a Mindfulness and Meditation Teacher.  Janet’s mission is to create stronger leaders, compassionate communicators, and better humans who will define the future of our world. Her journey as a caregiver inspired the transition from social media marketer and CEO to mindfulness coaching after discovering the value of mindfulness and emotional intelligence in rescuing her from depression and anxiety. She is the host of TWO podcast The Mindful Social podcast, and Nearly Mindful. For individuals who want to learn more about living a mindful life and corporations who want to create a safe, productive, and collaborative environment.  Janet coaches one-on-one, with teams, lead retreats, workshops and speak about mindful living. Janet believes deeply in the value of self-awareness and mindful attention to self-care and teaches mindfulness and emotional intelligence online as well as in person.  She earned her certification as resilience facilitator from the National Wellness Institute and is a Life and Mindfulness Coach. She trained with the Search Inside Yourself Leadership Institute to teach mindfulness and emotional intelligence, UCLA’s Mindful Awareness Research Center in their Mindful Awareness Practices program, Dr. Rick Hanson’s Positive Neuroplasticity Practitioner program, and Stanford’s Center for Compassion and Altruism Research and Education (CCARE).  Her studies and exploration in emotional intelligence, mindfulness, positive neuroplasticity and positive psychology led to launching Nearly Mindful, where she shares her knowledge of mindfulness, meditation, bringing joy to life through public speaking, podcasts, programs, and writing.  Subscribe to Janet’s newsletter for updates and a free e-book of Microdosed Mindfulness® practices. microdosedmindfulness.com nearlymindful.com janetfouts.com Listen to her talk on TED!  https://www.ted.com/talks/janet_fouts_what_is_the_caregiver_s_dilemma  Follow her journey on social media https://instagram.com/jfouts?utm_medium=copy_link https://www.facebook.com/jfouts Janet Fouts - YouTube Visit our website to learn more about us www.mysenseofsoul.com Join our community of seekers and lightworkers who get exclusive workshops, live events like SOS Sacred Circles, ad free episodes and more. You can also listen to Mande’s mini series about her two NDE’s. You can listen to the first episode of Shanna’s ancestral mini series  called “Untangled Roots” at no charge at Sense of Soul Patreon. Sign up now! https://www.patreon.com/senseofsoul NEW!! SENSE OF SOUL’S NETWORK OF LIGHTWORKERS! Go check out our Affliates page, adding new amazing programs each month. Check it out! https://www.mysenseofsoul.com/sense-of-soul-affiliates-page  

Welcome to the Sense of Soul podcast. We are your hosts, Shanna and Mandy. Grab your coffee, open your mind, heart, and soul. It's time to awaken. Today we have with us Janet Fouse. She is an author of seven books, a certified coach, a resilience facilitator, the podcast host of two podcasts. She is a speaker, a mindfulness and meditation teacher. And today she's joining us to talk about her upcoming book called Microdose Mindfulness. Thank you for taking the time to come on Sense of Soul. I'm really excited to be here. I've listened to a few shows and gosh, how'd I miss you guys? I'm thrilled to be here. This is great. Thank you. It is fun. It's so fun to meet people like you. We feel very blessed. And I love the name of your upcoming book, Microdose

Mindfulness, because of course we only hear microdose lately with the word mushrooms attached to the back of it. And so it's a trending word. And I also love that you chose that name for me because I found that I wasn't microdosing it. I was trying to take mindfulness and implementing it too much and too fast. And I actually almost got overwhelmed from trying to be mindful. That sounds crazy, but you're shaking your head like you understand. I'm intrigued because I know people in your area in Silicon Valley could use this mindfulness and a lot of companies are implementing it. It's a hot topic and I think it's amazing. Yeah. And you know, to speak to the micro-dosed part, you know, it really comes from the fact that we all think, okay, I'm going to be mindful now.

And we build all this stress around it and we overdo it. We say, okay, from now on, for the rest of this month, I'm going to sit for an hour every day. Okay. You don't start like that. It doesn't work. You get burned out, you get pissed off at yourself, all the judgment comes in, and you're just overloaded. And then you walk away,

and you're another one of those people that says to me, mindfulness doesn't work for me. Oh, I have a monkey mind. Oh, it just, nope, I tried it, didn't work. How long did you try it? How did you try it? It's actually in our nature to be mindful, but we get so rushed. We try so hard. We put all this pressure on ourselves that we don't need to just take a freaking breath. Let's just start with that. Let's just start with the fact that we don't breathe. We don't breathe. I mean, how many times in our days do we find ourselves not breathing? Yeah. Right. I often tell my clients who are my massage clients, when you take a deep breath, as soon as you exhale, what happens to you? Your shoulders go down. It's like, we're so tight up with our shoulders to our ears, taking these very shallow breaths throughout our day. Just let it out. Let that shit go. Isn't

that what they say? Did Buddha say that? I think he would have said that. I'm sure. I actually have a t-shirt that has Buddha on it that says let that shit go underneath it. Of course, my son says shit is my favorite word. That's better than my favorite word. So Janet, let's, let's start with your journey. We always like to take our guests back to like your upbringing. Sense of Soul does a lot of talk around turning pain into purpose. And pain is different for everyone. What was your upbringing? What did your childhood look like? Was mindfulness something you were taught? You know, let's start there. Oh, Lord, no. No, I grew up in one of those households where we were all distanced from each other. Feelings were not something that we managed. You just powered through everything and got through it. My parents were running a private retreat center, kind of, for fishermen in northern

Wisconsin, the middle of nowhere. And they were always very distanced from us. So I was actually raised by my grandmother, who was Scottish. So they don't believe a lot in touchy-feely either. So, you know, it was a pretty, it wasn't cold. It just, you know, emotion wasn't something that we brought forward very much. And as I grew up, I started to open to it, but it was really hard. It's been very challenging for me to be the person that I really believe I am. And gosh, you know, I'm 63. I think I figured it out

around 40. So, you know, and that's normal for a lot of people. It's not just me. I think that that self-discovery, you know, that midlife crisis we all talk about, that's when we finally, okay, I'm just going to say it. That's when we cut the shit. That's when we saying, okay, what is this purpose here that I'm, you know, what is this? Or you get hit by a bus with a bunch of pain, which often happens because you have all these things that are unprocessed within you. And much like you were just talking about the mindfulness, when I was around, well, it was my late thirties. I had so many diagnoses, fibromyalgia, you know, anxiety, ADHD, they were trying to diagnose me with anything and everything. After being on the meds for years in my thirties, I was just like, I want to go and find out what's wrong. So I chose

therapy to get off the meds. And they said, well, you know, if you're not going to, if you don't want to take meds and you have to, you know, find a tool. And I'm like, okay, you know, what kind of tool is that? A hammer? Because that's what I feel like taking a hammer to this. But I went to my first mindfulness class. And I remember, first of all, I remember typing in the word mindfulness because I didn't even understand it. Mindfulness? Wait, what? I have a lot in my mind. I need mindfulness is what I need. So I sit in this class and I'm like, I suck at this. The whole time I sat there with monkey mind, I'm thinking I could be doing something more productive. I could be spending time with my kids. Oh, I suck at breathing. He's telling me to

breathe. I don't even know how to breathe. The one thing that came out of that class though, was probably one of the biggest things ever. It was that I had in that moment, even though I was talking shit to myself the whole time, I was aware of that. I became a witness to the monkey mind. So even though I didn't really practice the mindfulness necessarily, but it was the very first time I heard myself and how I talked to myself. And that was shocking because I was like, I wouldn't tell a stranger this. That was my mindfulness. But that's all it is. You know, we think that mindfulness is this big deal. And what it really is, is simply becoming aware and going, oh, my God.

You know, oh, I'm not listening. Oh, I'm holding my breath. All those things. And all mindfulness is, is noticing. And once we start noticing, then we need, we just need to celebrate. Wow, I noticed I wasn't paying attention. And that is a mindful epiphany that we should all embrace. And that is what microdose mindfulness is about. Wow. I can't believe that I wasn't paying attention. Yeah. Okay. My whole life. Pay attention. Right. Right. I mean, and now I can't even brush my teeth without wondering where that water's going. Just awareness to the most simple things can take you down, take you down also rabbit holes or the holes down your sink. Mindfulness to me at first was, I felt like it was so difficult, but it's not. It's like you said,

we just complicate everything. We do. You know, my first experience with mindfulness was somebody telling me to meditate and that what I needed to do was stare at a candle and that would make me mindful not mindful but help me meditate and in my mind these were a long time ago I thought I would become pain from you know kung fu the show I was like okay then I'll be able to like totally observe everything around me and know when somebody's sneaking up on me or whatever it was I thought it would make me instantly aware to stare at that candle I was so disappointed not only had I never heard of it but I was scared of it I was scared of it because I thought it would take me away from the spiritual part, which is the exact

opposite. What I discovered in those spaces was love for myself and a closer and more greater connection with my soul, which hence the name of our podcast is exactly what that is. Yeah. A connection with yourself and an acceptance for yourself, whatever it is in this moment is what it is and stop struggling so much. Some of us are addicted to that because it just is that we're so uncomfortable in the space that we need to fill it with something. Right. And that's why we're always watching, you know, they call it maladaptive behavior to end up on Netflix for nine hours at a time. And it is maladaptive. You know, look, I studied at the Search Inside Yourself program, which was founded at Google by an engineer. And he discovered for himself, wow, this is really powerful. This is going to change the world. And he started doing little meditations at work.

Gradually, more and more people joined him. Then he eventually started a program within Google and then shared it with the world with this huge idea that if we all were just a little bit more mindful, we would be more productive. We would be more productive, we would be more focused, and most importantly, we would be happier with where we were and who we were. And it's been amazing to really see more data coming out and people doing more, you know, 10 years ago, even fMRIs weren't common. And so fMRIs really study the brain. And so, you know, they've studied monks, the Dalai Lama brought a whole bunch of people to study. And they did fMRIs on their brains to see what happens when we meditate and see how the changes happen.

And then this whole idea of positive neuroplasticity developed that we can actually change the way our mind responds to things by simply being more aware. And this, all of the science fascinates me because I'm kind of a geek, you know? No, I am too. In fact, when I was going through all of the mindfulness classes, my insurance had offered me around that time, a nighttime meditation study. Now, honestly, they called me, they asked me a few questions. They said, you know, you don't qualify for our study. I was too stressed for their study.

And I was like, dude, I'm in a good place right now. I just figured out mindfulness. They're like, you're doing everything good. Keep doing it. But I was so excited. I start doing it for myself. I started to see this huge change in me. I was sleeping way better than I had my entire life. I was more clear. I was more present. I didn't have as much pain all of a sudden. So I too wanted to figure out what is happening and how is this doing that? Of course, that's my brain. I need to understand why I can't just accept it. And so I did some research and I'm like, well, that's very interesting. When I'm dropping down to these very deep levels, my brain, my pineal gland is actually releasing the hormones that I needed, like melatonin to sleep, serotonin that I was

taking in pill form, all of the things that my body and my mind needed, my brain was producing in those deep levels of meditation. Yeah. And one of the things that I learned, I don't know, fairly recently, it was about how the vagus nerve really affects us and how that taking a breath and a long, deep exhale can totally change you physically, mentally, everything. Yeah. And we are afraid to do that because somebody might see it or it might be woo woo. Well, and why don't people know that? I just went through a long journey of discovering the vagus nerve because I had post COVID symptoms and I was having these upper digestive issues. And here I am, someone had suggested I work with the vagus nerve to

stimulate that because that's what it is. It's damage to the vagus nerve. Your, your body's not, you know, you know, responding as we get older, our cells getting smaller. And for everything I tried for months through the doctor, nothing worked. I started doing some humming and all of a sudden I'm healed from it. And every time this happens, I've been going back to that and it's been working. So important. They're saying in COVID right now, like that cytokine storm, that is really what puts people in the hospital. That's very dangerous. It causes inflammation and they have a new device that they got for the COVID patients in the hospital. It's a device you hold up to your neck that sends a frequency to your vagus nerve. Oh, wow. I haven't heard that.

I know. I'm like, we have this amazing body that was created so divinely that we can do that. Yeah. Yeah. And one of the things I work with clients to do is to really develop that vagal tone that you can actually create like toning a muscle. It's the same thing. Give me an example. Like what does that look like? Well, it's really just about how we breathe. You know, if we do box breathing, you know, breathe in for four, hold for four, breathe out for four, hold for four. That's one way to get a regular breathing. But when we want to do bagel tone, we want it to be more like breathe in for four, breathe out for eight.

Develop a pattern of the long exhale because it's the long exhale that really develops that tone. And we can actually have an app on my watch that works sort of well, that sees if your heart, it judges HRV, whether your heart rate variability is changing and how that goes with your breathing. And when you can get your breathing and your heart rate to get in sync, you start to be so much healthier and calmer. And it really starts with this breathing practices that are very basic and still incredibly impactful in seconds. It's amazing, wonderful stuff. My youngest child, I see her sometimes in stressful moments, take these really deep, heavy, loud breaths. And I'm like, that is so.

So what a skill to be able to teach our children. So powerful. Not just children, but my husband works in corporate America and has a very stressful job. He cannot in his mind put together that you can be more productive if you practice mindfulness. In his mind, that doesn't make sense to him. He doesn't understand how you can sit there and take time away to be mindful and get things done. Can you talk about that? That is so the beauty of the micro-dosed part. for all the people that say, I'm too busy for this stuff. Oh, no, I'm not going to do it.

Oh, it's going to take me all day. All those things that we tell ourselves. It's kind of like we also tell ourselves about multitasking, that multitasking is effective. Bull. It's not. Because, for example, we are checking our email, right? And we're answering an email. It's a really important email.

And the phone rings. And it's our boss or somebody really important to us. But we're still finishing the email. Do we finish the email? Do we answer the phone? We go back and forth for maybe 10 seconds. But in the meantime, our brain is exploding with, what should I do? What should I do? What should I do? And we kind of kick in that fight or flight response. And all we really have to do is just stop, take a breath and answer the phone. the same time can disrupt our minds for a very long time. Even when the tone goes off, it says,

hey, you've got email. Even if we don't answer the email, the studies show that we are distracted for about 20 seconds. So if you add that up throughout the day, it's insane. So if we can stop trying to do so much and focus on just what we're doing, be present with this task that I'm doing right now, then that makes all the difference. And it makes us more productive because we're not scattered. I used to write code. How many times have we gone through our day going, I'm going to power through this. I'm going to get it done. I do all this stuff. And then we go, oh, I have to go back and redo that because we weren't present in the moment. It's interesting that you brought up the fight

or flight in recovery. I help a lot of people struggling with addictions and we always feel like we're kind of in fight or flight and that's our baseline. I feel like the nervous system has a lot to do with this. And I see a lot of these people that have addictions issues, getting prescribed a lot of medications that have to do with the nervous system. They also teach mindfulness. Like if we just slow down, can our nervous system reheal itself? And are we walking around as a society and so much flight that we're doing damage to our nervous system. What do you think? Yeah. You know, it starts with the trigger, right? Oh, you know, I'm addicted to food.

We'll make it something pretty much all of us have some kind of food addiction, you know, Oh, I need more chocolate. You know, I'm, I'm suffering right now and I need more chocolate or whatever it is. And we recognize that trigger, then that's the beginning of mindfulness. Even if we go eat the chocolate, we recognize the trigger. And that's what Sean was just saying about how she came to this epiphany, like, oh. And there's two steps to that. I'm also a tiny habits coach. And one of the things that BJ really talks about is that we don't celebrate when we notice. If we go, oh, I really need chocolate right now. I don't really need chocolate right now. Okay. I'm going to celebrate that I noticed that I didn't need it right now. I'm going to

celebrate that I was aware in this moment. And when we do that, we trigger endorphins, we have all kinds of wonderful things that happen. And it helps us to make that shift. But when we take these medicines that are supposed to help us, it dulls our ability to notice. Because that's what it's supposed to be doing. It's supposed to be deadening us, deadening our nerves, deadening our awareness. That's not helping us at all. It distracts us, but it keeps us in a loop that's very harmful. And so for me, when, you know, working with things like addiction or repetitive things or OCD, noticing, just keep noticing every time you get a second to notice and the more you notice the more it aggregates it titrates it has the same effect as microdosing mushrooms but hopefully

that's not your addiction have you ever tried mushrooms i mean you don't have to answer if you don't want to i'm a total lightweight with any kind of drugs. Even the microdosing? Mandy was sensitive to it too. I did it for a few weeks and I tell you, I had a hard time not being mindful. And number two, I was actually multitasking, noticing that I was multitasking successfully though. It was like I was writing about microdosing and as I was writing I could feel the wind I could you know feel it on my skin but yet I could hear the dog but yet I'm on the paper and it was all happening at once I guess a good trip wow that sounds wonderful I'm gonna have to give it a try yeah I did it for like three weeks. I was kind of journaling and kind of the guinea pig, you know, just with the experience so that I could share.

And yeah, and no one could tell that I was microdosing. I was very, you know, low dose. And actually, I'm a mom of four kids and And I went about my life, being extremely present with them. I bet they really appreciated that. I know, right? Exactly. And you know, I had like tunnel vision, it was like, I could only focus on what was in front of me at the time. I couldn't, I didn't even have like, peripheral, not just vision, but you know, kind of like that you could maybe hear what's going on on the side. I didn't have any of it. It was so strange. But yeah, it was very cool for someone with ADHD to experience that because it was, it was pretty major. But you know, you talk about on your website, that caregiver's dilemma. And, you know, much of who I am as a mother is very generational.

And some of those things I've really had to break because the selflessness that was really passed down in my family and the codependency. I mean, I used to really honor that in like my grandmother, who I saw as the most selfless person ever. She never chose herself. She never did anything for herself. Always, you know, outside loving, giving, giving, you know, empty, emptying it out. And I really admired that. So it was definitely a big, big part of my journey once I became aware. So the mindfulness then took me to that awareness. And that was huge. Yeah, that really is huge. It's amazing how long it takes us to recover from our history. And then there's this epiphany and we go, Oh, I don't need that anymore. And it's mind blowing. There's a really cool story about Gandhi that reminds me of what you said about your grandmother, that somebody said, how can you give,

give, give all the time? And he said, well, I'm not giving for them. I'm giving for me because I get it back. And it's that the beauty of generosity is just amazing. And we don't allow ourselves really to give that weight. You know, if we give a dollar to somebody on the street, or we give a kind word to someone who really needs it. We need to celebrate that within ourselves. I guess one of the things that I've learned most over the last few years is that celebration is one of the most powerful tools in our kit to help us feel better. Like, wow, I gave that comment to that person

and it made her smile and she was really sad. And so I don't have to dance, but I can certainly celebrate my heart. And that's powerful. That is powerful. And you know, you just really hit something. I went through this kind of like transition period when I finally found self-love and I realized, cause I had been seeking outside of me, I went through this time where I was really, really happy about that. I felt very free and I was very proud of myself for it. But I battled with saying no, right? The people pleaser in me kept on trying to come up and I remember having to really kind of just sit with myself and say, wait a second, just

because you found self-love and just because you're trying to break the pattern of maybe never having self-love in your family doesn't mean that you're not who you are, though. You're still, you are a very compassionate, giving person. And so don't feel bad or see it negative every time you say yes, because sometimes your soul is saying, yes, you know what I mean? Like you will push those boundaries, um, to help someone who you love or who's in need. And it doesn't mean that you don't love or care your care. It's just you are an empathetic, compassionate person. And that's okay.

So I had to like find this balance. I remember actually celebrating when I finally got to the point where it was like, you know what? I did that because I chose to do that. Not because I felt like I needed to. I chose to add that to my plate today because I love you. How empowering is that to be able to say that to yourself? I chose that I'm doing this because I chose. And when we recognize that we have choice, that, you know, that not getting into that place where I'm a doormat, everybody asks everything and I give everybody everything. And

then we get judgment about ourselves and we get into this whole mindset that is not helpful to us. It's not helpful to them. There's resentment that builds up and it's all about judgment of ourselves. And when we recognize that we have choice and we make choice and we set boundaries because boundaries are something we do for ourselves, but we also do it for other people. When we can say, you know what, I don't want you to go here. And then we set that boundary. Then they know that they can't go there. But until we tell them, they're going to keep asking. So it's really a nice thing to do for them as well as a nice thing to do for us yeah then we

can make a choice you have to you have to be the witness to the choice otherwise you burn out and I know for myself doing the podcast which is a huge thing for us it takes up many many many hours a week probably more than any job I've ever had except for for being a mother, that you have to find that balance and you have to have the boundaries with yourself, I think is probably far more hard than having them with other people. Yeah, that's true. It's very true. But it is, I love you use the word witness because it really is that noticing, witnessing. Hey, Sense of Soul listeners, sorry for the interruption, but we have some exciting news to share. Shanna and I have decided to offer an affiliates page on our website to our guests that we

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We love and appreciate you all so much. Now back to our amazing guest. You know, you talk a lot about this mindfulness. I think people have loved some mindfulness into meditation. Can you talk about all the tools that maybe possibly helped you during your burnout to find the mindfulness? Yeah. You know, meditation was very hard for me to get to for a long time. I had so much baggage around it that I didn't do it very well. And I went on a three-day retreat as kind of a, okay, last Hail Mary, I got to do something. I was amazed that I could have stayed longer.

But for me, the whole point of the microdose mindfulness is that when we recognize that we're burned out, we can get wrapped up in I'm burned out. And we can start a cycle that just keeps making it worse and worse and worse. And the depression starts. We start to do all kinds of things that, you know, don't take care of us. And what we need is to take a freaking breath. Pause. The most powerful things for me have been taking that breath, taking a pause, noticing where I am. What am I doing?

Should I be doing this right now? Is this helpful or is it a distraction? And that noticing and that witnessing of what's going on in my head right now, you know, is this really a crisis right now or has everything become a crisis? And I think that in this particular time, we know so much crisis going on around us. We are inundated with crisis. And everywhere we look, there's more crisis. It's kind of like, we call it blue car syndrome in our house, where you buy a blue car and all of a sudden all the cars are blue. You buy a red car, all of a sudden all the the cars on the road are red, or the same type,

whatever it is, we notice these things. And it's distracting. It keeps us in locked in a loop. And when we can break that loop, by being mindful, by being present, by being self aware, then we can start going, okay, this isn't such a big deal. This is not the end of the world. You know, sometimes I'll say, okay, what would the end of the world look like? Oh, okay. That's not going to come from this and I can move on. Or like my daughter says, you know, everything that's happening in the next five minutes like sure but I think about that in like five years from now like these minutes you won't even barely remember and I love how she she knows that but um let's talk about the pause you mentioned the pause

it's something that is that saved my relationships I would say 100% saved my partner. I would say a hundred percent saved my partner and I's relationship. It is saved, saved me from saying things that, um, I would have later regret, you know, cause I mean, again, you're making that space right to choose. And I realized a lot, a lot of things in that, in that small little pause is so fricking powerful. The power of pause. That's why it's called that. Many of the times it wasn't mine. That's the biggest thing that I think that I was noticing is that many of the feelings that were rising up in that pause, wait, this isn't even mine. Wait.

Right. You know, a lot of times that stuff that's coming up is, you know, there's all different kinds of ways that we learn things. Somebody told us something over and over and over again, and now we believe it and it's true. And we just forget about whether it's okay, he's kind of a jerk. And we carry that with us. And he's not a jerk. There's something nice about that person, but we've already decided they're a jerk and we respond to them in that way. So when we can take a pause and just check in with ourselves, our mind catches up to where we are. But if we keep just running, it's not going to catch up. And so we need that pause in order for everything to just settle for a moment, and then see what comes to be true for us. It's also incredibly important. And I kind of hear that you probably found this with your partner, that when we pause, it allows them to pause. And it's just as powerful. And, you know, if somebody is going off about something, instead of responding and reacting to

it, we can pause and respond to it. Totally different animals. And so powerful. So, so powerful because instead of you like literally being like on these patterns, right. And on this loop unconsciously, just spewing out, you know, all of your pain and all of this stuff all over everybody, you just take that deep breath and that pause. And a lot of times, one of the first things I do after my breath is, is I kind of just have this discernment with my body. Like, where is this that I'm feeling it? What's happening here? Let me process first. Like, cause you have control of it. It's just taking control of your energy, listening to your body. I mean, there's a lot that can go on in that pause. I mean, protection can go on in that pause, like you said, kind of sitting with

it, because then you get to choose to respond and react from a place of being very conscious. And you know, something people don't recognize, when we say this, when we talk about the pause, they're like, so how long is that pause? Okay. So right now. Yeah. Okay. We're done. Our brains work so fast and we don't give them credit. You know, it can be a millisecond and that can be enough. And when you do that enough during the day, you start to realize, you start to recognize, you start to witness more and everything changes. I had a guest on my podcast a little while ago. You guys should know her. Her name is Toy James. And she wrote a book about having conversations and the importance of that pause in conversations because she's one of those people who needs to be able to process.

And so she's teaching people, especially in the corporate world, to be okay with, okay, just give me a second. I just need to process that. And then she does. And she comes back to it more intent, more on point, more herself with an understanding of what it is. It doesn't have to take long, but for many people, you know, they pause and honestly, it still drives me crazy on occasion. I can recognize that that's what they're doing. And you know what I realized because in my mindfulness classes, and I did a lot of cognitive therapy because I was trying to not be on meds and trying to understand myself was that the reason why I wasn't having good communication really with people is because the whole time they were talking, I was thinking about what I was going to say. So you naturally will pause a little bit if you are actually listening to someone because you're not thinking about what you're going to say.

You're listening. And so then you process and then you speak. So there's an automatic pause. Yeah. Isn't that interesting? And so I've had a hard time. So what she challenged me was watch people's lips when they're talking. or, oh my gosh, you know, stuff like that. But it's true. If you are listening, then you're not thinking. And so then when they're done talking, then you are processing what you're about to say. So there's almost a natural pause. Yes. And also pausing after they're done speaking is really important because they may not be done yet. And a pause is so powerful in a conversation, especially a difficult conversation. Who's going to sit here and let you finish that? Because, you know, we're all thinking and things come up afterwards and you're like, oh, I should have said, well, give people time to do that. You know, that feeling when you can't say goodbye to somebody and it's like that, it grabs your throat. It almost is like someone has literally put their fingers like around your vocal cords and you know, it's like, oh, you can't, you can't tell them how you feel. You can't say goodbye. You can't express the love that you feel for them or it's just so crazy. But that energy, you can almost feel it rising as and as it's rising, like up your body and it gets your throat. I used to have it so much when I was a child and I don't have that anymore. And I'm not really sure what really shifted if it was, you know, that I connected with my throat chakra or

if that because of podcasting, this has really helped me speak my truth in many ways or be confident to be vulnerable because I thought vulnerability was negative. So through this podcast and Mandy, I mean, she's, you know, she shares her story to help so many people. And so I have seen the power and vulnerability and sharing and speaking. You know, I think that in this culture, we're starting to really open that up for all even men. Yes. I had a conversation the other day with someone. She's like, I just, the bro culture is driving me nuts. The bro culture a lot in finance and tech and they do not allow vulnerability. They have this driver driver stuff going on. They want to party. And it's very difficult when you are a mindful person to be in that environment. And she's like, I'm just overloaded. And I don't know. And I'm like, okay, let me introduce you to a couple of guys.

Because there are some wonderful men who are very connected with themselves, and fine with themselves, and still very productive, very successful. And it's really interesting to see that there is a shift. Of course, women lead the shift, but men are starting to fall into place and realize what this does for them because they're just as dissatisfied. They're just as unhappy right now in the middle of a pandemic, in the middle of trying to figure out what the next world is going to look like and everything else. And, you know, there's lots of different ways to manage that but there are a lot of people that are starting to realize that maybe they don't call it mindfulness but finding a space of calm a space to be accepting it themselves is good yeah i've seen a shift even just in more men coming to get massages in having this self-care from all different careers and politicians and, you know, down to, you know, people who are now full-time dads, you know, I mean, the shift is changing definitely.

And I think it's a beautiful thing because as much as communication touch is so important too. Well, self-care is something that they don't think they should do. I know. You know, that's ingrained. And, you know, it's our responsibility as parents to make sure that that changes. You know, my son goes to a gym where he does jujitsu. And it was really amazing the day that he came home and said, yeah, you know, I was really, I was locked up in this thing and this and that and this. And I'm like, oh,

that's really interesting. And he goes, yeah. But then I remembered my mindfulness and I could get out of it because I really stopped thinking about what I was supposed to do. And I was just there. And I was like, oh my God, I'm so happy. Oh yes. You should be proud. I know. I mean, what happens if we all get on board and we all teach our children, mindfulness and self-care and self-love and empathy. I mean, it sounds like a pretty good future to me. It does. It does. Imagine if the next generation was aware.

You know, wow, all the things we could do, all the things we wouldn't do. It is hard working with people or talking to people or living with people within your family who are just so not aware. And it is very difficult. Yeah, my life has definitely gotten smaller and smaller and smaller with my social group of friends. It's interesting, though, you know, like I go into some of these corporate situations, and you always know the people that were forced to be there. This is something that has been mandated by management for me to come. And then the ones that weren't. And so, you know, I really try to bring those two together in some

way. And now it's time for break that shit down. To really help people just get a little glimpse. All I want to give you is a glimpse. I'm not going to make you be mindful. It's not going to happen, but if I can give you a tiny glimpse, then you can take that little microdose and carry it on and it'll pop up somewhere. And maybe you'll start thinking a little bit more mindfully. Oh, gosh, that's so awesome. Well, why don't you tell us about your website, your podcast, where they could find that your new book or all your books? Yeah, my my business is called Nearly Mindful, but everybody can find me at Janet Fouts dot com.

Nearly Mindful is really to separate, you know, 20 years as a digital marketer, which is still buried on my website somewhere. And so, you know, as I move out and and do sound healing and those kind of things, it's really nice to be able to separate that from all the digital stuff. But everything you can find about me, you will find at Janet Fouts.com. You'll find a way to sign up for the early release of the book, which is called microdosed mindfulness. And you can also find my other books and you can find all my social media because I'm sort of active on social media too. Are you? I have a Facebook group that's really active for Nearly Mindful. But I also don't use Facebook as much, but I love Instagram.

And I'm pretty active on LinkedIn. And I still use Twitter too. Crazy, that may seem. I'm Jay Fouts everywhere. Okay, cool. And that's F-O-U-T-S. Correct. You do have a podcast too?

Yeah, my podcast. I have two podcasts. Nearly Mindful has a podcast that meditations and just kind of not Dharma talks because I don't stick to Buddhism strictly. And then the other one is called Mindful Social. And that's more about business and how we bring mindfulness to business. Can you imagine like having like some serious leadership that were just awakened? Amazing. I see it coming. I do. Weird places in weird places. Like I was talking to someone who is the mindfulness person for 3M and, you know, teaching mindfulness within the corporation. Procter and Gamble, big insurance companies like Aetna, they're amazing corporate movements towards mindfulness. And, you know, it's wonderful to see. It is. And I have seen a shift in, like, I remember when my

daughter was in college, I mean, there was all of those things available to her, which was different. Even coaching was something they were promoting if she was stressed and stuff like that. So I see the need and I feel like we are moving in a better direction with it and more people are awakening. Thank you for doing your part in teaching these businesses and people and, and putting it out there in your podcast. Thank you. Thank you for that. Oh, I love it. It's, it fulfills me in so many more ways than digital marketing ever did. And so I'm so glad that I get to talk to amazing people like you. I'd much rather do that.

Oh, it's been such a pleasure to talk to both of you. I love conversations like this that just flow and it's not like, here's my nine questions and we're going to go over it. I hate that because it's, it's not. Oh, uncomfortable. Yeah. I never want to be that kind of podcast to listen to it. I'd much rather make friends than be a student and learn. So, but thank you so much, Janet. It has been a pleasure. You too. Thanks for being with us today.

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