Sense of Soul - The Atheist and The Afterlife

Episode Date: October 15, 2021

We welcomed Ray Catania on Sense of Soul Podcast, Ray is an Author, Publisher, Master Certified Life Coach, Master Usui-Reiki Instructor and Certified Meditation Instructor. He is a Ph.D.(C) in Metaphysical Parapsychology at the University of Sedona.  In 2020, Ray published the first book of his 3-part Awakening series: “The Atheist & The Afterlife: An Autobiography – A true story of inspiration, transformation, and the pursuit of enlightenment.” Available on Amazon and other bookstores.   This book is the true story of his own spiritual awakening. Ray shares with us the story of how he came to have mediumship and how he came to write his first book of the Awakening Series titled "The Atheist and The Afterlife - An Autobiography" which is currently available for sale in fifty-one countries and on all major bookstore's websites or at his website below.  Spiritual Coaching LimitlessCoaching.Life Coaching LimitlessCoachingNow.Com Publications LimitlessPublications.Com   What’s new with Sense of Soul… check out our website www.mysenseofsoul.com Did you know…anyone can listen to Shanna’s Untangled Mini-Series - Episode 1, available now on Patreon and you can join our Patreon membership at any level to listen to the entire series released weekly exclusively on Patreon. You can also get exclusive episodes, Mande’s RAW, live readings and more!  Please take a second to give us a 5 STAR review, it help sponsees find us so we can continue to bring you amazing lightworkers each week!

Welcome to the Sense of Soul podcast. We are your hosts, Shanna and Mandy. Grab your coffee, open your mind, heart and soul. It's time to awaken. Today we have with us Ray Catania. He is an author, publisher, master certified life coach and certified meditation instructor. He has a PhD in metaphysical parapsychology, and he is here to talk about his first book of a three-part awakening series, The Atheist and the Afterlife, an autobiography of his true inspiring story of inspiration, transformation, and the pursuit of enlightenment. This book is the true story of his own spiritual awakening. Thank you for taking the time to talk to us today.

Thank you for having me. Yeah, we're super excited to talk about your first book of your awakening series. So there's more to come then. There is more to come. Yes, the second book, I am about three quarters of the way finished. Hopefully, it'll be done by the end of this year, end of 2021. The next one after that, we'll just pick up where that one left off. It kind of just became a project that at the end of the first book, I felt like the book wasn't over. There was more for me to tell, more for me to do and experience.

So at that point, I decided to do the second book. The second book is filling up so quickly with information that there will definitely be at least three. Cool. The title of the first book is The Atheist and the Afterlife. Can you tell us where you got that title? Absolutely. So I am the atheist or was an atheist who visited the afterlife. Even though I had that experience of crossing over and coming back, I still tried to suppress the notion that there was anything after this life, if you can believe that. I guess it was fear of being ridiculed or lack of a true understanding of what the universe was all about at that time in my life, because I was only about 20 years old. I was a non-believer for the first half,

maybe you could say first three quarters of my life. And it wasn't until very recently when I literally started speaking to beings that were not in front of me, let's say, that I simply had to accept the fact there is something different. I do have an ability and I've got to learn more about it. That was the transformation. It was a huge transformation, 40 years in the making. So you weren't a believer right after your near-death experience. This was many, many years later that you kind of accepted these abilities and these different feelings and connections you were having. Yes. So even though it was, I'll tell you, you've had an NDE, you're familiar with it. It's euphoric. It's amazing. It's probably the best feeling in the world. And even though

it was so vivid, so clear, so real, when I returned, my analytical mind insisted on finding a way that I could just simply chalk it up to something that could have happened to anybody. I just would not accept that there was something more. I figured that the gas fumes I inhaled made me high. So I was hallucinating. I fell in front of a window, therefore the white light. And I just talked myself out of it. I just completely talked myself out of it. Okay. It's interesting. I was kind of the same way. I knew I was different after the first one. I was 18 when it happened. And then 18 years later, it happened again. And the second time it was definitely undeniable. First time it happened, I was close. You were 20, I was 18. I wasn't very educated on a higher power. My parents were atheists and I really didn't know much about any of that.

And at the time I was partying a lot and doing a lot of drugs and drinking a lot. And so, you know, I think I also subconsciously pushed it out of my mind because I didn't feel like I was worthy of it or I didn't. I was confused about religion and all the rules that I didn't feel like I fit. So I kind of just like pushed it away. I think that we have very similar stories in that regard. Yes, absolutely. It was so easy to push it away with drugs and alcohol. You didn't have to deal with it in the moment.

However, I came from a very Christian background, very, very Catholic. And that was kind of forced upon me. And I rebelled against it, I believe. And that was part of me becoming an atheist. Certainly suppressing having to deal with these things with drugs and alcohol just makes it easier to not have to face the reality that there's something huge here. There's just, there's something amazing happening. Right. Well, if you don't mind, let's go back to that day. Can you talk a little about what happened?

And you mentioned the gas fumes. And can you talk about not only what led you to your near-death experience, but I know it's so hard to describe with words and I struggle with it today, but maybe a little bit about what you experienced. Of course, there was a fire in my home. I was unaware of it. I was asleep in my bedroom. Now, my bedroom at that time in my parents' home was just above the kitchen, which is ultimately where the fire occurred. So I started to hear

commotion downstairs. I was sleeping. I was sound asleep. It was a Saturday morning. I had called out sick to work the night before so I could sleep late and sleep in. And I started to hear all this noise downstairs and it was getting louder and louder and it accompanied police sirens. So I was like, wow, I don't know what's going on, but I have to get out of bed and find out what's happening. And it was at that moment when I tried to move, I found that I was paralyzed. I could not move much of my body. I was limited to some of my right side and my right arm. And I could not yell because I couldn't move the muscles in my face. At that point, I knew I had to get out of that bed. Something was very, very, very wrong. And so I

tried to, with the one arm that would work, I tried pulling myself to the edge of the bed and I passed out again. And what awoke me one more time was more commotion, more yelling and screaming from downstairs. And I tried to pull myself again and pull myself again. And I passed out again. The third time I came to, I was like, this is it. If I don't get out of this bed, I'm dead. And I knew that that was going to be the result. I could feel it. It was getting harder to breathe. Legs were completely paralyzed. So I pulled with everything that I had to get to the edge of the bed and I passed out. But this time when I passed out, I fell out of the bed. So I hit the floor, which must've created this loud thump right below in the kitchen, which is where everybody was.

So my father came running up. Now I'm out cold. So from this point, what I'm viewing, I'm not seeing inside my body, but I see my dad and he's holding me and he's screaming and he's crying for the paramedics. Get up here, get up here. It's my son, my son. I am watching this not from inside my body, but I feel like I'm up on the ceiling, looking downward at myself, not moving. And my father screaming, there was a huge, welcoming, warming, euphoric feeling white light that was on me like a spotlight just me and a being at the end of the light that said it's okay to come into the light and it called me by my first name ray it's okay to come into the light. So as I started to go into the light, the euphoria built. It was just an amazing feeling that is, like you said, impossible to put into words.

There's just no describing that feeling. There's no pain. There's euphoria. It's just amazing. It's the best word I have for it. But looking down and seeing my father in that state of mind, and even though we did not have a terrific relationship by any means, I guess it was the longing for that relationship that made me want to go back into my body. Because I said to the

being at the end of the light, I said, I can't leave him like that. And that was when I went back into my body, but I didn't wake up in that room. When I woke up, I'm now on the living room floor and I have these paramedics around me and they're working on me. And I'm like, guys, Hey, wait, I'm fine. I feel great. What are you guys doing here? I was trying to figure out what was happening. I was like, did anybody see that light? Did you see the light? That was phenomenal. Did you hear that? And then they started looking at me a little crazy and I'm like, I better shut the hell up now because they're going to take me to a different hospital in five minutes and not let me out. So I just closed my mouth, let them do what they wanted to do and take me to the hospital. But that's the short

version of a long story. That's amazing. I was thinking about your parents being Catholic. And did you ever tell them about your experience? Did you tell them after everything settled in? I did. And they, yeah, it came up in conversation. I think part of it was their beliefs, but also part of it was denial for them. Because remember now, they left me in that bed to experience, to technically die. So I think there was a period where they went through this denial, that never happened. It wasn't that bad. You're making it sound worse than it was. They didn't want to take responsibility for what had occurred, which I don't blame them for. The way I heard the story later on was that the fire was very, very small and it was condensed and put out very quickly,

even before the fire department arrived. And what my mother had told me much, much later on was that she said, my son is upstairs sleeping. Should we get him? And the fire chief was like, ah, it's not that big of a deal. The fire's out. But what everybody forgot about was that the fire originated from the stove and there was a gas leak for hours that was coming out and going up into my room. So I was that be. But it was recently after the book came out, my mother actually sat with me and told me more details of what happened that day. behind the ambulance and the ambulance kept pulling over to do something. And she, what's wrong? What's wrong? And they just told her, well, they're just working on him. They're just working on him. Apparently I'd flatlined about three more times on the way to the hospital. They normally don't pull an ambulance over unless they're going to use the paddles, right? Because they don't want to slip and hit somebody else or whatever. So that was what I later found out was occurring, but I didn't know that in the time.

So the book made my mom acknowledge it. And we actually kind of had a pretty serious bonding moment over it. I would say my father's passed. So I never got to have that conversation with him. Oh, I'm sorry about your dad's passed. So I never got to have that conversation with him. Oh, I'm sorry about your dad's passing. Were you able to have a good relationship before he passed? No, unfortunately, we never really did. No. I'm sorry. In your bio, it mentioned that, I thought this was so interesting, that you had an attitude growing up that kind of did not fear death. And then what's really interesting about that comment in your bio is that now you probably

really don't fear death because you're absolutely right. Yeah. No fear. And I'm sure you have that as well. When you cross over and you see what's there and you see how great it feels and looks and everything about it, you don't fear it anymore. It's not something, but now at 20 years old, you go all the way back to that age. I'm 53 today. You go all the way back to 20. Now I'm reckless. You know, I don't care what situations I'm putting myself in. I don't care how much drugs I'm taking. What's the worst going to happen. I go back to the light. That was pretty cool. Right. So that made for a rough ride for the next 10 years between being 20 and eventually having children in my early thirties. Okay. I sense when I read your bio and the beginning of your book that, and maybe I'm wrong,

but that you were living from a space of ego. You were young, you wanted to make money, you wanted to just ride or die. That was kind of your mindset. And then there was like this limbo. And then now you've created this life of living from a very soulful place. Exactly. The change began when I had children. That's when I checked myself into rehab and said enough is enough with the drugs and the reckless behaviors and the big turnaround for me, the beginning of the turnaround, but it was still another decade probably until I met Jessica's father who was dead. And he wasn't the first dead person I've ever spoken to, but he was the first one that I realized what was happening, that this was real, you know, because he was able to communicate very freely with me. Not everyone who's on the other side can always come to this side and speak to someone here. So they have to kind of be a medium, too, on their end. Right. And then we have to be a medium on our end, and that's how we can communicate.

So it was meeting him and immediately after meeting my girlfriend that solidified everything. And at that point, I was on a mission to determine my spirituality. What do I believe in? What do I not believe in? And that began my studying, my learning, my researching, my mentorship, and everything else came and evolved out of that. Okay. So just to clarify, you met Jessica before or after her father came to you? Oh, I met her first. Okay.

I met her first and it was probably, you know, in the very beginning of our relationship. Now she's a doctor of psychology, mind you. So here I am. Yeah. Here I am speaking to someone who's not there. I don't know. It's her dad. I have no idea who this guy is.

Right. The way it presented itself is I see it on a movie screen. It looks what looks like a movie screen is the best way I can describe it. And it's a little bit fragmented, but the man, he gets up, he turns to me and also she's looking at something with a look of horror on her face. And he turns to me and says, I fucked up. I made a mistake. You can help her. I cannot. That's the same eight seconds over and over and over that I kept seeing for four days. Now, by the fourth day, I could no longer function. I was shaking. I was trying to pay the lady at the store and trying to get my credit card out. And I was

literally shaking because I'm still seeing this guy, whoever he is. And she's like, are you okay? And I said, yeah, I think so. And I put my credit card in and I went out to the car and I was like, this is it. You know what? I have to discuss this with my girlfriend. She is a doctor. If I'm completely nuts, I need to know I'm nuts. Right? So if she dumps me, she dumps me, but I'm going to get the help that I need because I need to know what the hell's going on here. So when I told her, she was like very nonchalant. She's like, oh, that's probably my dad. He always tries to contact me.

And I'm like, no, it's not your dad. It doesn't look like the guy. I saw that picture on your desk. It looks nothing like him. And she said, oh, wait a minute. And she went to her phone and she texted me a picture of him with a beard, a mustache and heavier. And I was like, that's the guy I saw. She goes, Well, that's my dad, silly. And I was like, you're kidding me. And as I'm telling the story,

things are like falling off. I don't know if you saw that behind me, but things are falling off the shelf. He's very active and around quite often. So I was glad to find out I wasn't crazy. And I then knew what it was. And I met with my first mentor, who was Bonnie, who explained to me when I told her how I saw things, how they came to be. She was like, Ray, relax. That's exactly the way I see them. It's fine. You're a medium, you're psychic, you're okay. And I was like, oh, thank you, God. Okay. So I am this now, what's my obligation with it? What am I supposed to do with this? I can really relate to that because I was confused too. I was like, first of all, it's a very lonely place to be when you're in that space of limbo, like you're getting messages, but you don't

know if you want to tell people because you're afraid you're going to go to a mental institution, but you got to own it. You feel like you're doing a disservice. You don't share these messages. And, and then, you know, your intellect comes in and you're like, Oh, I must just have PTSD. There must be something wrong. Yeah. Literally feel crazy. And then that moment, it literally almost makes me want to cry. Like, you know, and I'm going to trust this and trust myself, you feel just this release of this heaviness. I don't know if you felt this way. But I also really got hard on myself, like, I should be so happy to be alive. So that means that there's I shouldn't have bad days, I should be doing more

with my gifts. Like I put a lot of expectations on myself. Did you? Yes, absolutely. That was the thing. Once it was validated, the big question is now, what do I do with this? Where do I take it? There may be a reason that I was given this. What is it that I'm supposed to do with it? And of course, the first thing was we had to figure out was what was her dad telling me? What did he fuck up? What did we have to deal with? And that was actually a very serious matter in the book, because it was a relative who I have to protect people's privacy. So I got to be careful how I say this, but someone in the family would have died had I not intervened. And this is a person I've never met. I don't know. How do you go about telling somebody, Hey, by the way, you really need to

address this here or you're going to die. And by the way, I know this because I spoke to John. Yeah. The dead one, you know? So it's just not a good conversation starter, you know, but I had to get this message across somehow. So she helped me quite a bit with that. And thank God she was a hundred percent believer and she had experiences with other mediums before me. So yeah, there's a great amount of pressure. You don't know what to do with it. What's your obligation to people, to humanity? Say, holy crap, I feel bad for you because my first message that I got was just simply about the color of a truck. Yeah, it started that way and it's never been anything other, you know, it's, it's been like

one serious thing after another, after another. So it's been difficult. And I don't know if you've dealt with this aspect, but when you get messages, it's hard to determine what's right to give to another person and what isn't. What Bonnie taught me was some things you just don't tell people, right? You know what I mean? And I was like, ah, yeah, I think I do. But I really don't because when you get a message and maybe I can tell you something that's going to make you avert a trauma or a tragedy in your life, but does that make you a better person? Did I do the right thing? Because my traumas and tragedies are the best things that ever happened to me because that's what makes me who I am. And if anybody told me

how to avert them, although it would have created a happier environment, I would never be the person I am today. I would never be able to help anyone else. So trying to determine what you should tell someone and what you should not is the most difficult thing that I face today. I just, I don't want to take something away from someone else's life, even though it may be tragic in nature, they may need that to grow. Yeah. Well, what I do is I try to lead them there. I try to give them hints because often i will receive something tragic or whatever or just have the absolute knowing that this happened and so it'll be it'll look more like well you know this area you know develops between 7 and 14 years old it's very connected to the sexual organs you know sometimes a child, our voice is taken around these ages. And that's kind of my

breadcrumbs. And then I figure if I tell them, give them these hints, and they discover it, then it's good for them to go through it at the time. And if they don't, then it's not the time. That's a good point. So that's usually and I usually sit with discernment definitely and feel it. Ask my guides, like show me clearer if I'm supposed to, or more details. I use my guides. What about you? You said you speak to beings and see beings.

Who are you talking to? I definitely have guides. I don't know if you get the same thing, but what Bonnie explained to me is that it's light language. And what I hear it in each of my ears, and there's one on this side and another one on this side. I call them guys, but I have no idea if they're male, female or what they are, right? But this guy over here often gives me day-to-day advice.

And as I'm saying or doing something, if it's wrong or I shouldn't do it, I'll get this really loud noise, you know, very disturbing noise in this year. And that's okay. Right. Shut the fuck up. You're not supposed to be saying that you're not supposed to be doing that. And so they kind of guide me a little bit in that area. So yes, the answer to your question that that's how I get my guides information. Okay. So you, so you have a little bit of both clairvoyancy and clairaudience then. Absolutely. Do you work with any of the archangels? I couldn't say for sure one way or the other, because these beings on higher levels,

I don't get a full picture of them anymore. Maybe that's something that'll come in time. I'm not sure, but they pretty much present themselves kind of like a ball of energy. You know, that's why I can't tell male, female or anything like that. For me, how I can describe it like during sessions and who I'm working with, like, you know, there's obviously some support around me for myself and for my clients. And it's like closing your eyes and listening to people's voices and you're like, yeah, I know that voice. I know that voice. And it's, so it's almost like I've identified these large energy balls because I've worked with them so much that I know exactly who they are. They have their own personalities. They have their own voice, their own tone. They definitely have their own personalities. That much I know. Yeah, absolutely. I love that. You know, when I can validate that with other

people. So I'm not just a loony in my own, but some have these massive energies and, and some are very distinctive where it's not within my energy. It's within my client's energy or the mother's energy is very strong. And I started to get to know, you know, it's almost like getting to know colors like, Oh yeah, that's a red, that's a blue, you know, whatever. It's just so amazing. But when you're able to tap into that, I feel like you realize that we're It's just so amazing. But when you're able to tap into that, I feel like you realize that we're just not alone in this. And so that for me crossed out any kind of atheist

thoughts for myself, that we do have this higher power, higher spiritual, higher frequency, dimensional energy that's not visible to our 3D eyes. Yep, absolutely. I can definitely tell which personality I'm dealing with in that particular moment of time. They also have their own spot on the TV screen. I don't know if you have that, but whenever I'm speaking to a guide or anyone who's on the other side, they always show up in the exact same spot on the screen. So like my girlfriend's dad will always be a little to the center and over to the right. That's his spot. When he comes through, I know that that's where he's going to come. And certain guides always have their own spots as well. So, but they don't look like people,

obviously they look more like blobs for lack of a better word. Hope they don't take offense to that. You know, Hey guys, I mean nothing by that. Just, you know, I'm describing you, but I get the different personalities a hundred percent. Totally. That's funny. You're like, I'm not trying to offend you. It's just, Oh yeah. Yeah. Apologize often. I thought it was very interesting that you used the word paranormal occurrences that were happening to you because paranormal, a lot of people don't, they think of it, mediumship spirits and paranormal totally separate. We've had a lot of paranormal investigators who also have done, you know,

years and years of research who believe that they're one of the same. Do you believe that? Well, I, if in the beginning of my book, what I did was I put in the introduction were the definitions to the terms that I was going to use in the book. And it's for the exact reason that you're saying. Everyone has a different feeling as to what this particular word means or what that particular word means. So I wanted to describe how I was going to use that particular word in the book so that it was understood. Parapsychology, the definition that I got, if I remember correctly, I think I got it from pbs.org. I'm not a hundred percent, but it does not deal with astrology. It does not deal with tarot cards. It does not deal with Bigfoot. It does not deal with aliens. It basically is ESP and life and death and that sort of communication. So I

wanted to put that in the book and preface the book by saying, so when I'm using that term, this is what I'm referring to. Speaking of aliens and paranormal and all that, growing up a Catholic as well, I was going through my journey, doubting my religion and everything I was told. Because someone asked me this question that fucked me over for a few years. It was, you know, how much of what you believe in have you been told to believe in? And of that, how much have you experienced? And I was like, nothing question. Nothing. I'm a puppet. Yeah. Brainwash. And so I started to really question everything. And I decided to look at the Bible from a different angle, a different perspective and started to read some of the

books that were taken out of the Bible, which are several, many. I started to just dig a little bit deeper rather than being told what things meant kind of, you know, from a different angle. And so one of the first things in the Bible I'm reading and it says God's angels laid with Adam's daughters and bread and had naphthams. And I'm like, what the fuck is a napkin? You know? And, and so we, I'm like, no one ever talked about this. I taught Sunday school for Christ's sake. And so I'm like, I've never heard of any such thing.

And I realized, wow, angel and alien, the same thing. And I looked at their definitions. Interesting. Holy shit. They're both basically described as the exact same thing they're both beings that are not here at this planet many of them say they're light beings many of them say they're above us i mean there's so many similarities that really just had me blown away that no one ever mentioned it. And then I started finding other people who had, I mean, we've met

our deacons who studied for years scripture and then went on deeper journeys to discover the same. And once I start reading the Bible in a different light, I was like, wow, there's a lot of history here, but it's told in a way that people want you to believe their narrative. Correct. You know, the stories that were left out are so significant and so beautiful, some of them. So that whole Catholic background of mine really was a struggle because it was so deeply rooted. And I still today have a hard time with saying the word God. As do I. Yeah. I'm much more comfortable saying

source than, or something that includes everyone. And, you know, doesn't give me the picture of a white bearded man on a throne in heaven. But my language changed and I felt like how you define, you had to define these things and how you perceived them were going to use them. I feel that way all the time because language is so funny to me now because, you know, what does that word mean? Sometimes there's not a word. Love. That's right. You know, love itself.

It's said so freely, but yet it's very hard to describe real, true, unconditional love. Have you ever heard, I'm sure you've heard of Eckhart Tolle. Have you ever heard him speak about Jesus and the way he studied Jesus to be and the things that he meant by what he said? And it's so eye-opening, right? Because it's not the way it was fed to us through Catholicism. And then when we go back and we read it like that, or look at it in that light, it's completely eye-opening. It was huge. After that, I started to look for a statue of Jesus meditating. It was so difficult to find one, but I finally did. Yes, I did i did yeah i don't know if you can see it but

let me see like an old depiction oh isn't that beautiful yes of course you know other people described him doing that in the bible yet but like it's always what we're told is what we're believing rather than to experience you know even the words for ourselves. And did you ever read the book that Dick Don Conn wrote? Living Buddha, Living Christ. Yes. Living Buddha, Living Christ. I mean, he, you know, he's just reading it from a different, from his perspective. And he's like, oh my God, Jesus is a Buddha.

You know, I mean, hello. But it was so beautiful. And I tell people that all the time, even if I see it a different way, you know, this is my experience. If Jesus was alive today, and I say this all the time, he would not be a Christian. And if Buddha was alive today, he would not be a Buddhist. They have piled on so much stuff on top of their teachings and changed it so very much that I don't think either of them would subscribe to. It's so fear-based, which is exactly the opposite of what their energy is.

And I love when people describe it as like Christ consciousness, because I get what that means. And it doesn't just mean one. And it doesn't just mean one Christ either. And now I'm so thankful that I was able to remove myself from that small box that I used to live in. Because love definitely is not supposed to be boxed in. Absolutely not. That's an amazing story. I was just looking at your definition again of parapsychology. So when you were talking about paranormal, you didn't mean it like in the alien UFO way.

No, no, no, no. It's just interesting how the two are kind of like being merged. So that's why I was curious and asking. So many words that mean something different to other people. I think there's at least 20 or 30 definitions that I placed in there to preface the book with, because, you know, it was really important to me that people understood what I was trying to say. And remember now, when I wrote that book, I didn't even know what the real terminology was for a called it video on demand. I had no idea that anything was called remote viewing. I didn't know. So that book is written as I'm experiencing, I'm writing it. So I don't even know what these things are called yet.

And then as I learned them, I went back and I updated the book to reflect like, okay, so now I know that this is called remote viewing. That happened to me with the word channel. I know that this is called remote viewing. That happened to me with the word channel. I was so afraid for the word channel, right? Growing up a Catholic, especially, I was like, Oh God, I don't want to channel anything. But when I realized I was writing and channeling my guide, he, when I look back, it was an obvious thing. Cause I mean, it definitely wasn't coming for me. Words are so, you know, people get hung up on them. And so I appreciate that you did that.

So that way, at least people knew your view of where you were coming from when you use that word. Yeah. And I still, I'm continuing to learn to this day. I mean, I'm really, when you look at other people who have been psychic mediums, they've been studying this for 20 years, 10 years. I mean, for me, it's two and a half. So I'm an infant in this world. I still have much to learn.

Yeah. And a long way to go. We love talking to people like you that have had this experience and that are coming from a place of intellect and trying to make sense of it all scientifically. And like Eben Alexander that we had on that the book Proof There's Heaven. He talks a lot about how the two are coming married. You know, he was not a believer at all. He was all scientific. It's interesting to me that a lot of the people that have these experiences are the ones where God is like, I'm going to wake your ass up. You know, people like me, you and Evan, if someone was already super religious and had this experience and brought up already being a believer, the story would still be great, of course. But I mean, coming from people like me and you and Evan that were like, no, no, and no.

It's clearly something very profound happens. Absolutely. I don't know if you've, if you've read the section of my book where I, and this is just my theory. Now, I think I realize where we go when we die in actual physical place, which I say that when the consciousness leaves the body, it becomes dark energy. And I explained how dark energy consciousness leaves the body, it becomes dark energy. And I explain how dark energy is expanding the universe, why the density remains the same. It's always a constant. And yet the universe is getting larger and larger. And its expansion is because more quote unquote souls are entering the dark energy. So it just seemed to kind of make sense to me.

So, and I've never seen it written. I've never seen anyone else talk about it, but it just seemed to make sense. And regardless, if you follow any religion, there's got to be this first stop where you go immediately after death. And I think I found it. So religion, if you want it to, and my theory can work together in harmony, if you want them to. I love that you brought that piece up of your book, because I would love to expand on that a little bit, because you're right. I've never heard that theory before. So explain to the listeners, first of all, you said you think you found it. Is this something that you channeled that you were told? Did you see it? How did you come up with this? I'm just curious. In my spiritual journey, I had to find science to back

up the things that were happening, at least to some degree, so that I could quantify it in my mind. I'm extremely analytical when it comes to all things. I have no blind faith in anything, never did. So in order for me to go down this path of spirituality, I needed to read everything and anything that I possibly could that was relative to the subject matter. I started back with astronomy, physics, quantum physics, subatomic particles, everything from Heisenberg's uncertainty principle to Einstein's theory of relativity, and everything that I could just devour on this topic until I could get a really good understanding. Now, when you understand how things perform at the subatomic level, some of the crazy stuff that we see up here starts to make sense to you because in the subatomic world, craziness happens all the time. It's perfectly normal. It's not crazy, right? So one of the things that I was reading was about dark energy and how it is everywhere in space.

And the thing that was puzzling scientists was that the energy expands and yet the density of the universe always remains the same. So the first law of thermodynamics tells us that energy is only transferred. It never dies. It never disappears. It has to be transferred into something else. Understanding that my consciousness is energy and is not attached necessarily to my body. When my body dies, where is that energy going to go? It has to go somewhere. The only unexplained form of energy that we have is dark energy.

We pretty much recognize everything else for what it is. So it just kind of clicked. It wasn't a message from above or anything like that. It was just from my readings and studying. It just made sense that we die. Our conscious mind has to go somewhere because it's made of energy. And as we put more of this into the universe, the universe expands. Hence the density of the universe staying the same and the universe growing. Why dark energy and not light energy uh well just because of the theory that dark energy is what's expanding the universe and that that's not my theory that you know that's something it just kind of fell into place if you will see shanna you're getting you're getting hooked up but what's that no i just

wonder i'm thinking about scalar energy which would be more of a light energy true oh i gotcha nikola tesla was trying to work with and we had a guy on who believed that that is the universal god energy is the scalar energy which was much like Reiki energy, basically, is what he described, which you work with, right? You also do Reiki. I do. I am trained in Reiki. I wouldn't say that I do it other than I don't do professionally, but I enjoy it. And, you know, I, I just, when I found Reiki energy, I just, again, I found something that was

something I never would have believed in before. And not only do I believe it now, but I, I just, I love it. I mean, I can't even like these things that I found have just broadened my horizons and made me felt so much better about the universe, myself and humanity and everything else. Yeah. It helps you understand that you're an energy body. I think it's a really, really great, easy, tangible way to sense and feel your energy and have other people have that experience as well. It's amazing. I agree. Ray, did you have any physical symptoms after your near-death experience? Anything that you felt shifted inside of you? No, I don't think that I can say that I experienced experienced any huge change in the physical sense? Okay. The reason I asked was just because, you know, some people come back, like we had on a guy, David Ditchfield, who came back,

like being able to read music and he'd never been able to read music before. I felt more like in tune with like nature. And I had some physical symptoms of like what they described as fibromyalgia. And I felt like I wanted to, I love the word that you use devour. I wanted to devour books. I couldn't get enough knowledge. My senses were heightened. I could hear things. And this could also be from like trauma from my nervous system from being in a coma. But that's why I asked. And then some of those things led me to being able to get mediumship in different ways. So I was able to, because of the heightened hearing, I was able to hear the voices. Now, I don't see them like you. I can smell them sometimes as well. Do you get them always in that one way, like the video movie, or do you get it through numbers, synchronicities, other ways? From the medium aspect, everything that I see is typically, it's similar in the sense that I may see like a shooting line out of, you know, the side of my vision, not directly, the room starts to change

and the vibration in the room changes significantly. My body will start to feel that and tremble along with it. And that's when I know that there's someone else here, at which point I can choose to shun them away. Or I can go into a meditative state, look at my TV screen or the movie screen and receive the message. So I don't know if that exactly answers your question, but that's kind of my process from a mediumship perspective. Do you ever have any other senses kick in, like smell anything, or is it always visual? I definitely have, I can hear the light language. So there's definitely an audio component. I don't recall anything with smell, not as of yet. I also get something called word drops. That's another

audible way of hearing something. And I remember way, way back when it was after my NDE, but before I had gone to rehab, I had my own kind of bachelor pad and, you know, it was a great place. And I thought it was great at the time anyway. And I would hear one word and I would see a shooting line or two, and I just knew something strange was happening, but I didn't know what it was. And so I would just get really, really drunk and fall asleep to try to shut it off. So I knew something was there, but I wasn't going to acknowledge it at that time in my life. I didn't want to acknowledge it at that time in my life. So the best way for me to sweep it under the rug was just to get really fucked up and go

to sleep and wake up the next day and get out of there. But that place had a lot of things going on in there. Yeah. I can relate to that big time. That's kind of what I meant. Like when I came back, I knew I was different. I just couldn't wrap my head around how, and so kind of drinking it away always helped. Yeah. Helped us not deal with it, not have to figure it out. And unfortunately, a lot of that is lost now. There was something significant that I might have realized. I probably messed that up for myself by using drugs and alcohol. You know what I mean? Because I wasn't clear. I wasn't sober. So that makes things very, very difficult to go back in that time and remember precisely what happened. Did you have any guests when you were younger before?

Yeah. When I was a child in the book, in the beginning, you'll notice that I kept myself very isolated. There was a lot of things going on in the household that obviously I wanted to know part of. So I would hide in a closet. I would hide in the basement, I would hide here or there. And I had no one with me, no one around me, didn't have a friend. So I would just kind of make them up. And one day, they answered me. And I didn't think that this was strange or weird or anything. I was just a kid. And I was like, cool, you know, I can actually communicate a little bit with someone who's not really there. And then of course, when I revealed that information to one of my friends, well, she was okay with it, but she told her parents who told my parents all hell broke loose. And I

never spoke to my imaginary friends ever again. I was told that's not real. It's not happening. Don't tell anybody you're going to be locked up, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So I just suppressed it to the best of my ability. Wow. That, yeah, that's terrible. I think that probably happened to me too, but mine was always called the boogeyman. Everything that was unseen was the boogeyman, which made it bad, you know, and scary, which I'm not sure if that's because of the religious background, which they didn't want me talking to, you know, the other side, you know, there was this girl we had on grace and she grew up Catholic. And as a child, the church embraced her and thought she was like so special and they were

calling her like this Holy child who could channel, you know, God and all this stuff. But as she continued to do it, they're like, wait, no, but it was okay. When she was a child, you know, of course it didn't go away. And then it became witchy, you know, which is so crazy. Probably got intimidated by the quote unquote power that she had and they had to destroy her to shut that down and keep the focus where it needed to be. According to them, which them exactly the church there you go yeah i think a lot of kids probably experience so much and i always wonder if my

older kids did because i didn't give them the opportunity to kind of express those things i probably said the same thing my mom said oh don't don't that's boogeyman. Where my little one, I allow her to, and I question her, you know, kind of explore that in a safe place rather than in the scary place. Right. Good. Yeah. They have no preconceived notions yet about what's possible and they're open to anything. So, you know, as kids, we do have this connection. We're born with a connection to this universal collective that we can communicate with, but it's years and years of people telling us that's not the way it's done. That's not right. That's not acceptable. You have to do it this way. This is the way life works, blah, blah, blah. We buy into it and we lose our connection that we have or back to basics where we were when we first came onto

this earth when we were first born and everything was possible because it is possible. And it's like that first doubt of self-trust too, because you have this experience and then you're told not to trust it. And so that becomes a deep rooted negative pattern of not trusting yourself from the very beginning, which is so sad. We're so intuitive naturally and just never taught to trust that first. I've had some of my daughter's teenage friends over who are explaining these sensitivities. That's a gift. That's a gift being told that it's bad.

And just to see the switch that happens in their eyes and they get that piece off, wait, what? Something's not wrong with me. And I'm like, no. Yeah. It's so beautiful to watch. Ray, speaking of children, you had a traumatic childhood. How this experience and the knowledge and wisdom and research helped you heal? If you could talk about that for a moment. I would say that it's helped tremendously throughout my entire life. I've always had some sort of therapy, you know, an ongoing process. And I would say that I got a good result from it. But when you reach and you tap into your spirituality and you start to find what's really possible and what we can really do and the knowledge that we can get from the

universal collective. And there's just, I compare it to like the internet. The first time you opened up your computer and you played on your computer, it was limited as to what it could do, right? Because it only had the software that was on there. But then when you figured out you could plug it into the internet, and now you have this whole wealth of knowledge and all this information. It's the same feeling when you get back to that universal collective, and you tap into it, you're like, wow, there's just so much more to this than I saw before. And that awakening, if you will, is probably the most beautiful thing that anyone could experience. It doesn't take away what happened before, but it puts it in a different perspective for sure. One that's almost positive. Like I said,

at the beginning, when we started talking, my worst moments were not my worst days. They were probably some of my best days. It's because in those worst days, I grew and developed exponentially things that went easy, things that went right, or anything that's given. You don't learn from that. You don't take away things from that. And I have a coaching practice now. And when I talk to my clients, I explain to them those traumas that you felt, those things that you went through, that is what puts you on a higher level. That's what's putting you up here when the rest are here. You're not a victim. You're special. You don't realize how special you are because you went through that and watching their eyes light up is amazing at that moment. I'm always like the more fucked up you are,

the more blessed you are. Unfortunately, that's one way of putting it yeah i agree it's like you know i have had also many clients and friends and guests that we've had on who have had these relationships with people that was not good you know on earth and then on the spiritual side they get to know the soul of that person on a different level and have like this whole relationship with this person. And they're like, gosh, I really like them better. I mean, I know them now their soul, right on earth, they were a dick. But that was the life they had to live. And actually, part of the lessons that I learned was part of their journey. And it just is such a beautiful thing when you think of people as evolving souls,

rather than the scum of the earth, there's a, there's something way bigger. The bad things are lessons, you know, our lessons and, and gifts to help other people. And we're not here to suffer. What is that one saying? Pain is temporary. Suffering is optional or something like that. Yeah. Buddha said it. I can't say a shame. I can't say it right. He also said first we must suffer. So we know that there's a certain amount of it before we can be enlightened or be awakened that that has to transpire. Right. Yeah. And Jesus said the same. Yep. If you had to put yourself in a box. You want to put me in a box?

Oh my God. No, if you had to describe your faith today, what's the word? From atheist to what? Oh my God. What a great question. I have no frigging idea. I would just say spiritualist, maybe. I don't know that there's a word to, at least it hasn't been invented yet. Maybe you and I should make one up for people like us, because I don't think that there's anything out there.

I'm glad no one ever asked me that question. Mandy, that sucks. Do you have an answer to that? Well, when I was sitting with discernment, it felt uncomfortable even coming out of my mouth because I do believe vocabulary puts it in a box. I think you're right, Ray. There's no way to explain it. I guess my mind went to, actually it went to that dark matter that you were talking about. Like just the only way I can describe it is anything, everything, everywhere.

I don't know. Yeah. Like massive spirituality of collective oneness of all universe. I don't know. Put in every single, you know. What's your biggest hope with these three books that you want your readers to take from it? There's two things. First is no matter where you come from, no matter what has happened to you, no matter what has done, you can do be anything that you want to be. You do not have to become a victim. You are superior in the sense that you have been through these traumas and take that and run with it and use it. And secondly, get back to being attached and connected to the universal collective, because when you do that, you become limitless. And those two factors, overcoming the terrible

things and having that connection, I promise you, you will have and do anything you want to do. Yeah. You remember that cartoon, Blue's Clues? You've got kid in your 20s. Did they watch Blue's Clues? Yeah, they did. Remember, you can do anything that you want to do. I don't remember that song though.

Oh, unfortunately I do. And now it's time for break that shit down. Yeah, I would say explore, learn, keep an open mind. Don't let others tell you what can and cannot be. Get back to that childhood where you believed anything could happen and anything could be and explore that and run with that and learn everything that you can about that because the world and the universe is such an amazing place. And there's so much out there to explore, discover and do and love and pay it forward, pass it forward. Tell other people too.

Where can our listeners find your awesome book? Where can they sign up if they want to do some spiritual coaching? You can visit limitlesspublications.com and all the information for the book, as well as a link to the coaching site is all up there. And I'll be more than happy to speak with anyone who's interested in talking more about this. So thank you guys. Really. Thank you for having me. I'm honored. Well, thank you. You have been wonderful, you know, good for you for trusting yourself and thank you for all the research that you've done and putting it out there for all of us to learn from you. Thank you. Thank you guys. Thank you for allowing me this time to be here.

Thank you for holding this space. And thank you for having me. Well, we'll see you for your next book. How about that? That would be great. Nice to meet you. Likewise. We can do anything that we want to do.

Well, I guess that's the end of our play date. So long, friend. Hey, did you know that Sense of Soul now has a Patreon where you can get exclusive episodes, miniseries that Mandy and I have been working on for a long time that we can't wait to share with you, monthly readings, Sense of Soul sacred circles, workshops, behind-the-scenes clips, and much more. Hop on Sense of Soul Patreon right now and sign up. Thanks for being with us today. We hope you will come back next week.

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