Senses Working Overtime with David Cross - Zach Woods

Episode Date: June 13, 2024

Zach Woods (Silicon Valley, The Office) joins David to talk about deadbeat dads, Santa Claus, and more. Catch all new audio & video episodes every Thursday. Catch all new episodes every Thursday. Watch video episodes here.Guest: Zach WoodsSubscribe and Rate Senses Working Overtime on Apple Podcasts and Spotify and leave us a review to read on a future episode!Follow David on Instagram and Twitter.Follow the show:Instagram: @sensesworkingovertimepodTikTok: @swopodEditor: Kati SkeltonEngineer: Nicole LyonsExecutive Producer: Emma FoleyAdvertise on Senses Working Overtime via Gumball.fm.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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well-being. As an Audible member, you choose one title a month to keep from their ever-growing catalog. Sign up for a free 30-day Audible trial and your first audiobook is free. Visit audible.ca to sign up. Touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, tell me Where do you like this? This is this feels I fucked up. No, no, no, you didn't I always offer you I don't know what they're over there. I'm panicking. I'm gonna start breaking stuff in a second Okay, I'm just start breaking stuff then by process of elimination. Whatever's not broken That's what that'll be mine. What does it go? Where does everyone go? I've seen your show, but I haven't, but I don't remember what's couches. Wait, you don't remember what a couch is?

I know what a couch is. I don't have a severe brain injury, but I do not remember who goes. It's pretty simple, man. I'm panicking. No, I don't, because I always, what I said is I always, This is good.

I always offer the guest your choice. You can sit in the chair sit in the big chair That's my go-to emergency exit in any interaction Yeah, all right. So you can... Someone or something smells good. Really? Yeah, is it you? I doubt it. Look at my hair, my hair's so greasy.

I'm sorry. Do you have water though? Yes. We can get you water David, do you want anything? Will you tell me where to sit? Do you want me to tell you? It's totally up to you. It is up to you.

Okay. Mmm... F** to you. Are you comfortable? I feel great. I feel confident above all else. But that's what you're trying to say. That's what I thought I was supposed to say. I know that was my fault.

We just rushed in and there was no greeting. Do you know people who have like a side where they're like they'll only be photographed from a certain like Mariah Carey heard that that's crazy It's interesting Or crazy. Yeah, it's crazy. Yeah crazy is usually interesting These are cool cameras these look fancy, thank you so much. Yeah, I I

Made these I have a shed, you know. Right, make offer men of like optics. Yeah, yeah. So like sensors. But they're made of wood. This is all wood. Oh really? This one right here, number two, is all balsa wood and wormwood.

There's a, did you say wormwood? Yeah. Oh, there's a very homespun quality to them. Thank you. I feel like when I came in, I thought, oh, did Shakers make these cameras or the Amish or something? But no, it was you. It's joinery, right? There's no nails or anything. Yeah, it's all Morteese and Tenon. I don't even know what that is. What is do you... Did you have...

It made you laugh. It did. I just... The depth of your reference, I was like, it sounded funny. Thank you very much. Did you have a father who, or mother, but generationally, I guess, and archetypically, it would be a dad thing, who taught you how to like, work in the shop and like do change a tire and do that kind of stuff? No. No. My dad was a traveling salesman. No way. Initially, yeah. And I mean, it's the easiest way to have affairs, I think. Do you think that's why you did it?

I think that was a lot of it. Really? It's the easiest way to have affairs, I think. Do you think that's why you did it? I think that was a lot of it. Really? And I've kind of, I'm getting so old now, it's not going to happen, I guess. But I've always, there's in the back of my mind somebody going, like, hey, I'm your half brother. You know?

But he, so he wasn't that guy. He wasn't a builder maker kind of person and my mom even less so I Have a lot. Well, first of all, what did he sell? Initially it was he worked for a company called coal of California and he sold women's bathing suits. Oh and that If you're looking to have a few years. Being a traveling salesman for women's spaces. But, and it's also, it's such a kind of antiquated idea,

the traveling salesman. And people still travel for work and sell things, but it doesn't feel like it felt back in, you know, when I was a kid and the, I guess he would have, this would have been like 60, 70s. Did you ever go on one of his jaunts with him? No, but we did. This is part of a much longer story,

but my dad left us and moved to Phoenix, Arizona in 19, I was nine or 10. And I went to live with him when I was 13. And it was a lot of little mini disasters. It was a terrible idea. He had no money. He was, I mean, it was ridiculous. And there's all kinds

of stories from that thing. But he convinced me that I really missed my mom and my sisters and Atlanta, and that I should go back. He felt terrible for keeping me there. And that was not the case at all. I was still like, I had just started a school in Camelback High School, I believe in Scottsdale. And so he got one of those drive away cars and he, oh, hang on a second, it's my wife. Hey, I'm doing the podcast with, is it Zach Woods or Wood?

Whatever. Yeah, with Zach Wood or Woods. Okay. Just, could you have like one and a half seconds, or are you in the middle of doing it right now? Oh, I'm doing it, but I can, he's saying, do your thing, what's up? Oh, I just wanted to talk about our marriage That's an amazing thing That is so annoying because now I'm nothing I will say will be remotely as funny as that Do you have a minute? I want to talk about our marriage

I was completely fucked up about that college center request. Yeah, you don't, I mean just, that's a text, honey. You don't have to call me in the middle of work. And that's a text thing. Okay, cool. Boys have fun! Thank you. I prefer you call with that kind of thing.

Um... That was totally... She could have texted that to me. She loves you. She wants to hear your voice. She wants to know. Well, tell her to fucking listen to the podcast. It's half of it is my voice.

So okay, so you were, he gaslit you to use the parlance into thinking that you wanted to go back to your mom. Yes, because he had run out of options. We were, he, I'm convinced was fucking the wife, the alcoholic wife of the landlord. We lived in this weird, and I've never seen this before or since, but you know those kind of classic motels that are two stories

and there's nothing to them really. And they had, somebody had subdivided, I want to say there were maybe total, let's say 12 units, right? And they had subdivided it into three sections, and they were each painted like a different color. And it was like Geronimo Court and Sitting Bull Gardens or whatever. And it's just trash. It's just a shitty. You know, two Jackson's victims.

Yeah, the Trailer Tears spot. It's just trash. It's just a shitty, you know, with like- Andrew Jackson's victims. Yeah. Civilian. Trail of Tears spot. And there was like a one, there was like an empty, very tiny, like kidney-shaped pool, one of those things, and there was like a faded shuffleboard thing. And it was, so we were in, so there were like four units on each thing. And they were just divided by kind of imaginary paint lines and its own sign. And initially when I went out there, he was staying with his family. He was in a guest room, a family whose, the father clearly did not like the situation.

And it was just very strange. It was a strange thing. And it was immediately apparent in hindsight. It is immediately apparent like he never should have let me come out there. He had no place for me to be. He had no money. He had no job. He was in debt to people who were foolish enough to loan him money.

Eventually we left there, went into this Geronimo court thing and he had no job. When we left, we had been there for a couple months and he got this drive away car and it was very much like, you know, he didn't say this exact thing, but I understood what was happening, which was we were leaving while they were away and we were very quickly packing up the car with whatever we had. And it was a station wagon.

I remember it was a station wagon with a corrugated metal back that he had put some cardboard down. And just whatever, you know, my suitcase and I had a guitar at that point that I had and some other stuff that I had gotten from my bar mitzvah. And then we loaded it up, we made sure to get out there and not let anybody see what we were doing. Because he was clearly owed a lot of rent. I think he was fucking this really kind of sad. Very much like the, what's her name? Jennifer Coolidge character in... White Lotus.

White Lotus. Very much like that, but more alcoholic and more like ruddy faced and the effects of drinking nonstop and- Broken blood vessels. Yep, yep. And just bad skin and she was overweight, wore moomoo's. I have a character name that I put in a lot of things that I do in the TV shows and movies and it's called, her name is Ms. Santiso and it's based on her. And I just have the name Ms. Santiso and it's basically her.

And was her, so her husband was the landlord? Yes. Who he owed money to. Yes. And he was, they were having sex. I'm pretty sure. And then in the middle of the night? Yes. Who he owed money to. Yes. And he was, they were having sex. I'm pretty sure. And then in the middle of the night, like. No, it wasn't in the middle of the night.

I remember it was daytime because, but yes, we, the whole thing was like, do it, be quiet, don't, you know, they're gone, let's get out of here. And then we, so he'd gotten the car up, we loaded it up, we didn't, there were no possessions really, except stuff that I brought out there. We, on the way out of town in Phoenix, we stopped by a pawn shop and he took my guitar.

Come on now. Yes, he took my guitar. He took, I had gotten also a Jade Star of David for my bar mititzvah, took that and hawked it for gas money. Did he tell you that he was doing that? Yeah, it was part of, and I still had dad worship. I mean, it hadn't worn off yet.

I still had like, this is going to be fun and awesome. And then the reason I brought this whole thing up is on the drive back to Georgia, he was from England. And so he had an English accent, but it wasn't really strong. It was like, you knew that he was English, but it wasn't like thick

cockney and you know, he was from Leeds. So it was that that Northern kind of sing song cadence. But he really wasn't, he moved to the States when he was like 15. So it was, it was there for sure. But I would watch him when we'd go to a diner or something and I would watch him flirt with the waitresses and the English accent always went up by a good, you know, three times. Like three times as much of the accent that I was used to. And I found out my sister and I figured out some And I found out my sister and I figured out some explanations for why certain people acted the way they did towards us when we were kids.

And we realized he was having an affair with the woman who lived downstairs from us in this apartment complex who one day out of the blue, and it's always been a weird story that my sister and I shared, she remember big wheels, those plastics? So I can't remember which one of us, one of us is riding big wheel, the other one was over at the mailbox hut. And she knocked the person off the big wheel and then threw the big wheel at the other one of us. I can't remember

which one. My sister would know. And she said, y'all stupid little brats, no wonder your father left you. And then we realized, so my sister, it was always just a weird thing. Like that was strange. You know, we were like eight and 10, you know? She said that to you? Yeah. And then Wendy, my sister figured out just with some other little clues piecing things together like oh He was having an affair with her and he told he must have told her You know, I can't stand these kids or whatever and because he left and he you know, she was single mom and It was just yeah. Did that hit like a wrecking ball when you were a kid for an adult to say that? I feel like that would be kind of stratically hurtful.

It was very strange and weird and but also strange and weird enough to know that she was fucked up. She's crazy. Yeah, she's kind of crazy and also we had dealt with weird shit. Like, you know, we were always moving. We never stayed in one place for more than a year, like since I was born. And I didn't go to the same school back to back years until sixth grade. That was the first time I went. Are you serious? Yeah, that's the first time I went back to the same school and with kids that I knew.

And as I said, we moved like every year, we were moving all over. We were in three places in Florida, two places in Connecticut, three places in New York. And then we got evicted. The first place we went to, we lived in a, we were in a motel for a month in Georgia. And then moved to this apartment complex called Grand Creek. And we were evicted from there. And because my dad never paid the rent. And they took our stuff and they, you know, what do you call

it? They seized it or whatever. Pounded or whatever. Yeah. And then we stayed at neighbors, you know, people were really nice and, you know, I stayed with some folks and my sisters, Wendy and Julie stayed with some other folks. And then we got another, went to another apartment complex in Roswell called Sandalwood. And then I was there.

That's where I stayed for a few years before I moved closer into the city to go to the School of the Arts. It's interesting that all of these kind of idyllic named places, right? Geronimo Court. What was the other? Grand Creek or something?

Grand Creek. Grand Creek. That these are the? Sandalwood. Sandalwood. Sandalwood. Shitty. And it's where all of these, where through your father's negligence,

things that belong to you were taken and you were left without a place to stay. And they were, yeah, but it's that very suburban kind of, you know, vegetation ridge and verdant, you know. And I, you get a lot of that in LA too. Like you, you'll be driving down and there's that kind of sunbaked, washed out, dilapidated, you know, 50s, 60s looking thing on, you know,

Genesee Avenue or whatever. And it's always called like, you know, you know, Casa Del Avenue or whatever. And it's always called like, you know, Casa del Sol or whatever, it's just garbage, it's just a shitty, you know. There's never been domestic abuse chateau here. Yeah, but in Spanish. Yes, exactly, exactly. Yeah, the combination, that's my favorite word,

it'll be like a combination of French and Italian or Spanish and then French or whatever, just to like top load the exoticism. I mean, I have so many questions about this. One thing I'm curious about is like, it's funny too, is your bar mitzvah guitar. It seems like that's like the real world bar mitzvah. Like, you get your guitar for your bar mitzvah, but the real entry into adulthood is when your father pawns the guitar.

That's when you really learn what it's to be an adult. I got something even better than that. So I did, well, of my friends, I did not make very much money as some of these kids had blowout things. And none of, I shouldn't say none of my relatives, very few of them ventured down to Roswell for my bar mitzvah and some people sent, you know, 20 bucks or whatever. And I just didn't have a lot of people there,

a lot of family. Well, my family's back in New York. And I got in cash, checks, whatever. I ended up with about 300 plus dollars, let's say $340, and just put it in a savings account. My dad, when we came back, we had a nickel. That's literally we had a nickel as we were pulling, writing in on fumes for the drive back from Phoenix.

We'd go to the store and we'd get a thing of balna and some cereal, and that's what we'd eat, you know, whatever. So we got, we literally had a nickel. And you know, and we didn't, oh, another thing, shit, I forgot about this great part of it. He also, he also convinced me not to say anything to my mom or my sisters that I was coming back. Let's surprise him. It'll be great. And I thought that was an amazing idea. I thought, oh, that's great. And clearly had a ulterior motive, which is he needed a place to stay. And he was, we'd show up and be like, and my mom couldn't kick him out, right? So I didn't realize that at the time.

And so I surprised them by coming back. I did this kind of funny thing where I knocked on the door and my mom opened it. I was like, hey, I forgot a sweater and walked in and everybody was, oh, David's back, whatever. So my dad crashed there. And then he said he was going to stay in Atlanta. And, you know, we were like, great, daddy's back, you know, and he's going to get his own apartment downtown.

And he took my bar mitzvah money. He asked me for it so he could put a down payment on the. He asked you for it. Yeah. How did you for it. Yeah. How did he frame it? That it would help him, you know, stay there and be there. And I was like, yeah, sure. And you know, I didn't see that money again.

But it was just... This is pretty hardcore stuff. I mean, like... Well, one thing, because I don't want to forget it. I don't know why this feels important to me But I do want to say this Who no one will ever know what that woman who yelled that crazy shit about the big wheels? Mm-hmm where that was from but my first thought when you told the story was They'd been sleeping together. He left and had never said anything disparaging of you guys

But it but if you're that woman sure you need to be like it it wasn't me he left, it was these fucking rugrats. It's absolutely a possibility, for sure. It would be pretty grisly. I don't know much about your dad, but that would be a pretty bizarre thing to say to someone you were, yeah. But my dad, it's very in line with what he would do. He would, because he was never, nothing was ever his fault.

He was never, there's no reason to apologize for anything. He's very, I've said this before, but he's very similar to Trump in that way of, he's a victim, nothing's his, he was all, he was, and he had stories like this where he was, he was a, you can't fire me, I quit guy. Oh, I see. So he would just say whatever was most expedient.

It wasn't, it didn't matter if it was sincere. I'll throw my kids under the bus, I'll throw anyone under the bus. For sure. As long as it lubricates my exit. Yes. Got it. Yeah.

When you saw, this is maybe a ridiculous question, but I'm curious about it. When you saw Death of a Salesman for the first time, did that hit or were you like, this is bullshit? This isn't what it's like? Uh I saw the I saw the um version with Philip Seymour Hoffman on Broadway and I didn't care for it at all. I did not like it. I think I read it before I ever saw it and it read better than the production, but it was not a good production. You didn't like it.

Okay, can I ask you another one? Yeah. Again, this is sort of stupid and trivial compared to what you're describing, but I'm just interested. Like, when you said, did you see Florida Project? Oh yeah. Did you like that one?

I did very much. Did that resonate with your? Well, I mean, not in the same way. I mean, that woman, the mom, was, you know, she was addicted to drugs and that kind of lifestyle. My dad wasn't, he wasn't like, I mean, he drank, but he didn't abuse alcohol and he didn't do drugs. And he was just a, what I've always imagined was he had a conversation with himself and

just came to the conclusion that, yeah, it's not for me. Kids, I don't think he hated us. I don't think he Hated my mom or fell out of love with my mom To I don't know what degree he was ever in love, but I I think he was like like I'm gonna Have a wife and a family and it's gonna be great. Yeah, I was wrong You know, I'm gonna I'm gonna head out going to be great. I was wrong. You know, I'm gonna I'm gonna head out. You know, I think it wasn't there wasn't like abuse and there wasn't you know, he wasn't

violent. He wasn't he just is all about himself and doesn't have that thing that a lot of people have, should have, which is like, how will this affect other people? You know? And I think he was all about himself and he was a really good liar, like a bad liar because we knew he was lying, but he would make up these grandiose stories one time. I'm hesitant to go into all this stuff because they're kind of longer stories and then what, I really wanna hear what you're promoting.

I'm interested in it. I don't, also you might not want to, you know, it's obviously up to you, it's your show and you'll edit it however you want. But this is very interesting to me. And I don't give a shit about talking. I mean, I'm happy to talk about whatever, but I, but I, this is fascinating.

If you feel comfortable, you might. I do, I do. I just, you know, want to save it for the memoir. Okay. All right. This episode is sponsored by Bluechew. I hope the guest it for the memoir. Okay. All right. This episode is sponsored by Bluechew. I hope the guest is happy with that.

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He would tell us these stories and it's clearly he has needs and insecurities and he needs validation for things because he would make up these stories about, he was dating, I remember Donna Mills was somebody, he said he was dating Donna Mills, who was on Falcon's Crest or one of those type of shows. She's one of those ladies, you know? And Wendy and I would be like, he's not dating Donna Mills. This is when I was older.

This is when I was, I haven't talked to him since I was, I think the last time I talked to him was when I was 18 or 19 and there was this kind of, this whole thing that happened where I went, it was, it's a long story. I was doing standup in Florida and he was, he was gonna show up, he never showed up. He lived in Florida at the time and just kept saying like, yeah, well, I'm coming up, I'm

bringing a bunch of people. Okay, I'll get tables for it. I was opening and it was not good. It was actually resulted in a story or I should say this story that I tell in early stand-up about the funniest thing I've ever seen about a circus elephant that pees all over the, it's a true thing. And that happened during this time.

When I was in Tampa Bay, I went to Busch Gardens. And you saw an elephant piss on someone. Oh, it was, it's in my, it's in an early stand-up special. It's either the first half hour on HBO or it was the Pride is Back. But every word of it is true. And it's truly one of the funniest things I've ever seen in my life.

And part of it is that the elephant didn't just piss on this trainer, but the whole, it's outdoors and it's like this little amphitheater, it's kids and elderly people. And they cannot, there's just a mad scramble because the elephant is pissing on them, purposefully. The elephant's moving. Yeah, they're very smart and they're very emotional. They're moving, the elephant with this, it was hot,

it was, you know, muggy, and it was just the worst conditions to be, have a bunch of elephant pee hosed on you. And the- Right weather, I'll take it. But, you know, if it's humid, keep that elephant piss off of my face. No, thank you. And these elderly people can't move very quickly. And there's a good 10 seconds, long seconds of this elephant

going over to different people and just pissing all over them. And I was up at the very top of it. And I was high, too. I'd gotten high. And I was crying laughing. It was truly one of the funniest things I've ever seen. But anyway, it happened and my dad just, I don't know, I'm merging stories and I'm gonna get off it. But he didn't come to the show and this was around the same time that you saw the elephant piss on people.

It was the same. It was the same. It was the same. Yeah. It was the same event. I was in Tampa Bay doing stand up and he was living in Fort Myers and he kept saying, I'm going to come up. I'm here. But that's what he did. And then there was, it's a long story.

Anyway, I drove. It's fucking long story. I have two. It makes me think of a few different things. One is, do you know the Harlow monkey experiments? No. I mean, this is anti-comedy, so apologies to whoever has to cut this up.

But there was this experiment, I'm probably gonna get some of the details wrong. In the 50s, these psychopath scientists trying to establish affection as a primary need had these two groups of baby monkeys. And one group of baby monkeys they gave a soft, warm, kind of terry cloth mother to, to simulate maternal love. The other ones had a milk source but no affection kind of proxy.

The ones that didn't have the warmth, right, died. Then, as if though that weren't enough, they took the monkeys that had bonded with the soft terry cloth mother, and at arbitrary intervals they had blunt spikes protrude from that mother to replicate an abusive or neglectful dynamic. And they preserved the cold milk source that you could go to that didn't have the warmth. So this mother monkey would attack these baby monkeys with these blunt spikes. The baby monkeys would retreat for the duration of the abuse and then endlessly try to repair the relationship.

They would hug it and they would pull out their hair and they would try anything they could to repair this relationship with this primary attachment, not knowing that it was just these fucking psychopath scientists with their random algorithm. How are they supposed to know? They're stupid monkeys. I'm empathizing with the monkeys.

But the thought that, well, if I just get it right, then this will stop. When it's like, no, it's doctor whoever is the one. And then they would never go to the milk source, the safe milk source that they didn't have the attachment to. And when you're talking about dad worship and that kind of thing of like endlessly coming back, it's

Lucy and the football again and again and again. But you just have to repair it. It's so important until you realize. I was the first kid to go. Cut bait. Yeah, fuck this guy. Good for you. And my sister, I have two sisters.

The youngest one never really had any relationship with her. I mean, he was gone when had any relationship with, I mean, he was gone when she was five and, I mean, he never reached out, he never called, he never, you know, he never, he was a deadbeat dad too, never, what's it called when you give money to- Provide. Yeah, the mandated- Alamo.

Oh, child support. Child support, yeah. Never any alimony, never any money. And another story that I'm not going to get into, but when I was in Phoenix with him, and he had no job, and he had to do something with me, I couldn't just leave me wherever we were at the time. So I went into the city and I went into like City Hall or wherever it was to a court thing where he went in front of the judge and there's a long line, just a never ending line of people going up there. All right, you know, the number says, Barry Cross, you know, and he, you know, we waited there and he

went up and the judge asked the same five questions. He asked every single person I watched, you know, just rotating them in and out. Have you looked for, uh, have you, do you have any game, meaningful gain, full employment? No, sir. Have you looked? Yes, sir. Um, how long have you looked? Uh, uh, I looked all last week and, uh and do you have any upcoming potential things? Yes, I have five of, you know, well, bullshit. All right, thank you. See you next month, whatever it was. For unemployment.

For, so that he, unemployment and getting, not paying child support because my mom was looking, so she was in there to get. And I just watched him go, I have got no money and, you know, I can't send anything to him. He brought you to watch him. Well, he brought me because he didn't know what to do with me. Right, but he knew you would see him say, I can't support my son who is also here. Yeah, and the people but my sister, the middle sister is like the glue of the family, the nicest, you know, who just got stomped on by him like repeatedly.

And then eventually she came around like, fuck this piece of shit. But always try and tried for, you know, long, long, long time. Well, that's the other. My father told me this thing once where he's like, often, if there's a family that gets blown apart because one person's really chaotic, you know, dad's off doing meth in Reno or whatever, or in this, you know, selling bathing suits to people he's sleeping with or whatever, that often the children will be angriest at the stable parent because they know they can take the punch. So the chaotic parent has demonstrated to the children

that they're not to be, they're not reliable. So if you express anger to them, they might go away forever. Was it like that for you where you might netted your mom? No, we, I felt a massive amount of sympathy for my mom. Really? Yeah. And, you know, she. And she had no skills. She was a teacher when they met. You don't consider that.

That's not a skill. Yeah, you don't view that as valid. Hey, you know when you're teaching those third graders, can you also build me? Build something. Build something. Because it's like, I mean it's easy. They know literally nothing.

So how is that a skill? Yeah. Just putting them in a room, they'll learn something. Ready? Ready for this? A, B, C, D, E, F, G, A, just put it on a fucking- I guess give him his master's degree, I guess. I mean, record it and put it on, hit play,

put it on a loop, walk out and build a fucking dresser. Go build a dresser cause teaching is not a job. Nursing is not a job. Oh, put it on a loop, walk out, and build a fucking dresser. Go build a dresser, because teaching is not a job. Nursing is not a job. Oh, forget it. Yeah, nursing is what? You got milk in your tit, and you give it? I swear to God. Oh, you're talking about physically nursing.

I mean, I meant the actual RN registered nurse practitioners. My mom's a nurse practitioner, and I would always say to her, when are you going to get a real job? When you get a real job, yeah, like stand-up comedy. That's what I said, good day, improv. Mom, when are you gonna stop doing pediatric medicine and get a real job? Get a real job. Pretending to be on the deck of a cruise ship.

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their best selling frame. That's AuraFrames.com. This deal ends June 18th. So don't wait! Use code senses at checkout to save. Terms and conditions apply. One time I was at a dinner with Molly Shannon, and she's the sweetest.

I adore her. Yes, very nice. She goes, Zach, do you do improv, right? And I said, yeah, I've done it. She goes, so like, you'll go in, and you'll say, your table is ready, and've done it. She goes, so you'll go in and you'll say, your table is ready. And then you'll put out the. And she started kind of doing the pantomime.

And I was like, yeah, I guess I would do that. And she started laughing so hard at the idea of me just pantomiming cups and stuff. And it was one of the times that I realized like how patently ridiculous, a grown, not that, you know, Molly does the same stuff in different versions, but I thought it was very funny. She's a groundling. I know.

That's what they do. I know. Well, I don't know. For some reason, it struck her. It sounds like she was fucking you. I mean, fucking with you. Maybe. Yeah.

Anyway, maybe I liked it. It made me laugh a lot. I guess it's like, yeah, this is really undignified, but I still love it. You're pretending there's a cup and there's something in your cup. And your cup is in a cupboard. And you're pulling the cup out. And then you're pouring pretend things in the cup. Nice physical placement. Woo.

For those of you who would, if you're not watching this, Zach just demonstrated some. It's probably best because you would have came so hard from what I just did that you might die from dehydration. Yeah. Gosh. But anyway, it's, it's interesting. It's like the amount I'm also thinking too, with you and you were 13 when you

went to Arizona, that's so, it's so weird when I mean, it, when you're 13, you start to see the cracks in the plaster, right? The holding caulfield thing sets in even in the best of circumstances. Even if you're in a very secure, reliable, routinized life, you still start to see, oh, everyone's a little bit full of shit in certain ways. But if that kind of developmental moment for you coincides with such a kind of illustrious demonstration of the ways in which people can be disappointing and unreliable. It must just be like, I guess the thing I kept thinking when you were telling these

stories is like, now you're married, you have kids, right? Yep. I have a kid. A kid. But kids contain multitudes, so I can just consider. Well, you can't be wrong. No. You have to.

No, I'm like your dad. You have to really. Yeah, yeah. So point me. Well, no, you have kids. I'm sorry. Yeah. But anyway, so and you have a community of people.

All of this must feel foreign in a way. Like was it hard to, are you distrustful of the kind of routines and bonds and security in your life? Like, how did you, I don't know, it's just like, how did you trust any of it? Well, I was, and I've talked to my sister, Wendy, and she had the same kind of issue, which she thought about if she was ever gonna

hurt her wife, adopt a kid, and they were trying for a while. Like, do I have the gene that my dad will, I was, I didn't truly think that I did, but it always kind of scared me at night, kept me up as a word going, what if I, everything's great. And then I wake up one morning going, nah, fuck this, you know, and, and I don't, I don't have it. And I think because of my, specifically because of my childhood, that I am a good dad. I'm pretty exceptional, I think. And not that my daughter would agree, but I think I'm. But you'll scream at her until she at least says she agrees.

I don't have to scream. I just hit. Oh, yeah, yeah. That's talking. That's what I call dad talk. Hitting is just dad talk. You can put that on a t-shirt. Hitting is just dad talk. But anyway, you were saying, so you feel like you could sort of, based on the deficits of your father, you're saying, so you feel like you could sort of, based on the deficits of your father, you're able to be like, okay, I know what to avoid.

And then I also... Yeah. And I don't have, nor does my wife, have the issues that my dad had with needing validation and stuff. And I also am in a place in my life where I'm, I mean, every day I get validated. I get, you know, people will go, hey man, I love your stuff, big fan, whatever the thing is. I get to go out and do tour and do sellout shows and that's validation. But I don't have that thing where I need to kind of big up myself to my daughter, you know, and I – and you see some people do. And I can be – and I'm straight with her. I can be – I don't

really lie about anything. I'm pretty – you know, and I treat her as an adult. And she should be coming home from work now. She's working? Yeah, in a coal mine. Oh, like a plant? Oh, a mine? Yeah, a mine. I know. Those are pretty antiquated.

They don't even. No, they still got them. You probably have to look. Really? Yeah. There's big seams in West Virginia. You have her working in West Virginia. When you say come home, you mean she's like across the country?

Well, no. I don't live in LA. I live in New York. Oh, I see. I see. I see. I see. I gotcha.

OK. So it's a, it's, you know. Is it like a factory whistle, and then she has to go? How old is she? Seven. She's seven. Yeah. What's the Black Lungs situation?

I think they go out on tour. No, no, no. I'm not talking about the band Black Lung. I'm talking about with your daughters inhaling a lot of coke and smoke. No, no, no. I'm not talking about the band Black Lung. I'm talking about with your daughters inhaling a lot of coke and smoke. Yeah, yeah. You love the band Black Lung and your daughter works in a coal mine?

I know. Isn't that cool how that worked out? I don't like it at all. I think it's kind of neat. I don't think it's cool. I hate it. Now, just to Zach, to be clear, she's not. She doesn't have a pickaxe.

She's actually, she's literally like the canary in the coal mine. She's in a cage. They dangle her. They cage your daughter to see if there's enough oxygen for the miners. Yeah, if there's any noxious gases and all that stuff. And then, I mean, it's not like a cage cage. It's, you know. What's it look like?

Could you just describe the structure of it so I can. Because when you say it's not a cage cage, it's hard for me to understand what a cage, what a nine cage cage would be. Okay, it's cage shaped. It's, uh. All I need to know. When you see it, you're going to go, oh, that's a cage. Yeah, that's a cage. But it's got, uh, like a, the micro fleece, uh, kind of.

It's plush on the bottom? Yeah, they got some micro fleece in there. There's a couple books, Bluey books. on the bottom? Yeah, they got some Micro Fleece in there. There's a couple books, Bluey books. Bluey books? Yeah, she loves Bluey. Did she have to buy them with her own money that she made from the coal mine? From the company store, yes. She goes back to the company.

It's published by the coal mine people. So no money's getting out of that mine. It just goes round and round. You're familiar with American history, business history. And I made her watch Matewan several times. Oh, good. Good. Kids love that movie.

Kids love that movie. Yeah. She wasn't that into it the first 10 times. So then I think she got, you know. Yeah. There's very, acquiescence and enthusiasm are the same when it comes to kids in movies. As long as you. Have you seen Made One?

Yeah. That's one of my top three movies. I think it's a perfect. I think so. That's the one about the strike. Yes. Where it's like they shot up. And it's a documentary where they go into the.

No, it's not a documentary. It's a. Oh, what am I thinking of? Oh, you're thinking of, I know what you're thinking of. Carlin County or something? Yes. Carlin County, USA. Wait, what's Made One?

I may have seen that. I've seen a lot of coal movies. It's County or something? Yeah. Carlin County, USA. What's made of one? I may have seen that. I've seen a lot of coal movies. It's a John Sayles movie, Chris Cooper's in it. It's just the best acting, the best story. And there's not one frame of that movie and not one utterance of any dialogue that isn't, that is wasteful, that is there, it's there for a reason. David Straythorne's in it too.

Oh, I like him. It's such a good movie. And it's just one of the few perfect movies, I would say. It's just Will Uldum plays the kid, the preacher. It's a great movie and it's one of my all-time favorites. Do you want to trade perfect movies? See how many we can come up with? I don't have that many. I mean, obviously, Pitch Perfect 2. Yeah.

But that's in the title. What was the character's name? Fat Amy? Fat Amy. Oh, that's what it was? That's much less offensive. I always thought that was a really mean-spirited name, but if it's Fat Amy, then it's... It's Fat Amy, and it was just mispronounced throughout the movie.

Oh, good. I'm glad, because I thought, this is really mean. Okay. So, Pitch Perfect 2. How do you say it? Madawan? Madawan. Matewan. Well, I'm trying to think, but there's another. Harlan County is not the right.

I can't remember what it's called. That is a documentary about a strike. I'm getting confused. About, oh. Lives of Others, I think, is a perfect movie. Have you seen that about the Stasi guy in East Berlin? Oh, that's great. That's a good movie.

I love that movie, yeah. That was a really good movie. I'm trying to think. Other perfect movies. Badlands. Badlands. Some of those Terrence Malone movies make me feel like, yeah. That was a really good movie. I'm trying to think, other perfect movies. Badlands. Badlands, that's a, some of those Terrence Malden movies make me feel like, oh, like.

Bicycle Thieves. Oh. Great movie. Did you ever see that Damien Bashir remake that's like takes place in East LA at Bicycle Thieves? It's like these two are documented. I'm not kidding. Wait, when did he do it? It's probably like 10, 15 years ago.

It's like. Wait, in pre La La Land? Am I, is that? No, 10, 15 years ago. It's like- Wait, in pre-La La Land? Am I, is that- No, no, no, no. The guy from, Damien Bashir is like the guy from- Oh, the silent movie. He's an actor. No, he was in like, what was he famous for?

He's like in- Willy Wonka. Yeah, Timmy Shalime. Dune. He's in, what is he? Someone help me. He was in Weeds as like a drug dealer. He's been in aem. Dune. He's in a, he's in, what is he? Someone help me. He was in Weeds as like a drug dealer. He's been in a bunch of different shit.

Anyway. No, I didn't see, I didn't see it. Whatever. But I wanted to, wait, we were talking about the coal mine, your daughter. Documentary. Documentary. Oh, here's something that I,

because you were talking about Trump, it must make you fucking climb the walls with Trump, right? Because then it's like, it resuscitates, I'm sure all kinds of old feelings. The thing is, though, everybody knows this, I have a love hate relationship with Trump. I love him as a person. And I just hate the brand. I don't like his name. Oh, really? I think it's a clunky, awkward name.

Oh, it's an aesthetic objection. Yeah. Yeah. It's like a stylistic thing. Yeah. I don't like the font he uses. Oh, it's like the kerning and stuff? Like on the letters?

Like the way the? The kerning? I haven't heard that term. It's Oh, it's like the kerning and stuff? Like on the letters? Like the way the... The kerning? I haven't heard that term. It's just like a graphic design thing, I think. So you're just saying, I see. So if he just did a little refresh. Yeah. You'd be on board.

Yeah, with his, I don't like the font he chose. But you're a huge Vivek Ramaswamy guy, right? I love him. I wouldn't vote for him because he's Indian. No, no, I understand. But, did you read that? I love him. I wouldn't vote for him because he's Indian. No, no, I understand. But, did you read that? I know over the day. This is yesterday.

He, that guy's a douche anyway, but he did Ann Coulter's, some whatever podcast or radio, whatever her thing was, she said to him, I like your ideas, et cetera, et cetera, but I wouldn't vote for you because you're Indian. And I think the president, we have a tradition in this country that we are founded by WASP principles. She said that? Yeah.

Dang. I mean, I'm paraphrasing some of this, but she said to him, I wouldn't vote for you because you're Indian and we should have we need to have a WASP President president, you know, which explains why she was so anti Obama and And then that's bad enough but also par for the course He But also par for the course with Sam Poulter. That's the prelude? I assume that was the advertising. He re-tweets or puts this thing out there of the interview. And I mean, I can't quote it because I don't, but basically he says, you know, she said,

showing the thing about I appreciate your ideas, but I would never vote for you because you're Indian. And he goes, uh, you know, I appreciate, uh, we may disagree on things, but I appreciate, uh, the guts that she had to, you know, say her truth. But you're saying that's not what the fuck,? Dude. David, I don't wanna create tension between the two of us, but I was promised that you would be off book on Vivek's tweets, and that there would be no paraphrasing.

And I don't know what, I feel like this is a breach. Well, you know what? Here's something I feel haunted by. This is now- I'm sorry, I just wanna go back to these soulless shells of human beings that have no that people like you know obviously there's like the Ted Cruz guys and Lindsey Graham and gotten a hot bar and the people that are so like obsequious and and

subordinate to Trump like just open your mouth and piss in it. Like yeah. The Republican elephant. Yeah, you know, just yes sir, may I have another. That thing. It's like when I offered to suck you. Yeah, yeah. I'm the Ted Cruz of this podcast.

Look, I'll rain check on that one. But these guys who, I mean, it's just, you have no dignity. Tim Scott, have you watched Tim Scott? I mean, there's zero dignity at long last, sir. Have you no dignity? I mean, it is, watching this shit is just insane. It's just what a sad human. Have you ever done that?

Have you ever, I feel like I definitely have. There's been moments where there was a chance to be dignified and I took option two. Where self-abasing in some way or just failed to speak up or. I'm sure, yeah. It's such a bad feeling. I remember. up or I'm sure it's such a bad feeling. Yeah, I mean. It's such a bad feeling and to do it all if you feel like it's happening all the time. It's when you know the thing you should say and you say something else,

the thing you should say echoes in your head for the rest of your life. I feel like it's so painful. Well, give me an example. There was, I'll keep it a little bit vague. When I was in elementary school, I went to see DUMBO, Operation DUMBO Drop at the, at the Dollar Theater where they showed like third run movies and this, and the, this floor was like fly paper. It was so sticky with Sprite.

Where'd you grow up? In Bucks County, Pennsylvania. OK. And I was the guest, the invited guest, of the little brother of the birthday girl. The birthday girl was older, and she was going with her friends. But he was allowed to bring one friend, and I went with them. And then afterwards, we were at this ice cream parlor.

I just thought of one, by the way. You did? What is it? No, no, continue. So we're at this ice cream parlor. I just thought of one, by the way. You did? What is it? No, no. You continue, and I'll. So we're at this ice cream parlor, and all these older teenage girls are not teenagers, they're probably like 11 or 12. And I was maybe eight or nine or something.

And I'd sprayed a little bit of green spray, like Halloween green hairspray, in my hair, because I thought that would endear me to these older kids, because that's cool, to have a little bit of green hairspray in my hair because I thought that would endear me to these older kids because that's cool. To have a little bit of green hair. And then they started talking about somebody, someone they knew that I was very close to. And they started saying really cruel stuff

about this person. And they went on and on and on, just kind of like ridiculing them. And then they looked at me. Knowing that you... Knowing that I had a... Okay. And then they went, you don't care, right? You don't mind we're talking.

Someone was like, you don't care. And I was like, no, no. And then I remember going home and going to my mom and being like, I didn't, I didn't do it. I just let it, I cosigned it. I like, I rubber stamped their hatred. I can't do it. I just let it, I cosigned it. I rubber stamped their hatred. I can't imagine I used the phrase rubber stamped their hatred, but whatever the like little kid, sad little kid version of that is. And I, to this day, like even just telling it now, I feel the kind of clench of like, like it's, you know. I don't know. What about you? Um, there, I, I would have been in fourth grade, I believe. Um, maybe fifth grade.

Uh, and it was in Georgia and, uh, there was a guy, you know, redneck, tough kids smoked one of those guys who was was the boyfriend, quote unquote, of this girl that I somehow insulted by accident. I don't remember what the thing was or said I liked her to somebody, whatever the thing was when you're in fifth. Whatever thin pretext for fighting, yeah.

So this, no, I'm serious, phony. Gosh. I'm being serious here. So he was just like that classic elementary school thing. He's going to beat me up after school at the bus stop. Right. And it's why I had all day like, oh my God, what am I going to do? And this is so awful. And I know that I'm going to get, you know, beat up.

And there was, you know, I was, there weren't a lot of kids that looked like me. And it was very white, Baptist, that kind of crew, and not very diverse school. It was almost all white. And I had a Jew fro and broken glasses with tape on them. And it just didn't look like the other kids. So. Thank God your dad had hawked your. Yeah.

Your, and so I was the, so we got, took the bus home and got to the bus stop and I was, there were like two sides of the street and I crossed the street and this, this, there was this Indian kid named B2 and who we kind of looked like dark hair glasses olive skin and I saw the that guy go over to him oh yeah you know where this is going I do and, cause he only had a description of me. And he, you know, and it wasn't like a fucking

one of these modern day beat downs where they literally kill you or cause brain damage, but it's humiliating more than anything else. And I totally let him, I walked on and I walked quickly back to my apartment and I let this guy get the brunt of the shit. That one's complicated. It's still not.

That one's complicated. Listen, it's not great. But presumably this guy wanted to fight you. It's not like you had done something dreadful and then run from the consequences. This is a trumped up bullshit thing to begin with. It's the random cruelty of planet Earth coming at you and then ricocheting off of you to be two.

But like, what is the right thing? I guess to be like, no, no, I'm the guy you should pointlessly beat up for no reason. I guess that's- Well, if it was a movie- Yes. And a good movie that we all- You should both kick his ass. We should join up together.

Close line up. I would have done that. I mean, in the movie version, you go, you have an eloquent, articulate, scripted monologue written by a, you know, 42-year-old Jewish writer in Hollywood and everything sounds great. And then the girls go, he's dreamy. And you still get beat up, but maybe even a little worse for it. But you say your piece and you don't end up on a podcast. You know.

Many years later. Decades later going, yeah, it was kind of a piece of shit. It could have been like a Spartacus, like I'm David Cross, no, I'm David Cross, no, I'm David Cross, like everyone claims to be. Yeah. You could have started something. That would not have happened, I didn't have many friends.

I mean, I gotta say, I think yours is a lot. I grant you more dignity than I... In mine, I let someone I cared about get chewed up by the machine. In your case, it's every man for himself in the jungle. Okay, alright. I'll take it. I'll take it. What happened? We were out of time. No, no, not at all.

I want to see who... Oh, shit. What? So, hi, I'm Lucy Anna from Career Builder US Staff Recruiting. Oh, take that. We have many remote positions, part-time, full-time. You should take that. For you to choose from.

The company provides free training with no location restrictions. Hourly wages range from $80 to $300? Fucking hell! Job requirements. Don't tell them they're gonna- US citizenship. Oh, phony.

Why? All right. Let's move that to the spams. All right. Let's move that to the spams. I used to crue- I used to cruelly be mean to telemarketers when they would call the house. Oh, that's- come on, that is a treat. It was- That's almost an obligation.

But one time a woman, she called me back. She. So I did some stupid bit. And then she called back and left a voicemail on my family's answering machine, where she just went, you can't say it now, but the R word. She called me. Rigor mortis? Yeah, she said that. She's like stiff, stiff morbid flesh. And then she goes, dysfunctional family, like that.

And then that was the whole face of it. She called me the R word. I, my favorite thing to do, and I giving this out to the world to do it, you should do it too, cause it's really fun is when you get like the spam, the telemarketer thing, and they say, how are you doing? How's it going?

Something, whatever their opening thing is, answer and do not stop talking. And it is so much fun. I've done it a couple of times. They're like, hi, Mr. Cross. This is Dilanaga from from, you know, whatever, check kiting services. How are you doing today?

I'm pretty good. You know, I woke up, it wasn't so great, but I thought I was sick. But then you know how you just gotta give it like an hour and I got up and I had some tea, but guess what? I ran out of tea. So I went to, and I off and and till they hang up It's the best and you just go and you make shit up, you know

and but you know that the other thing is I'm at the dog park right now, but I'm supposed to I You know, I'm supposed to get go on this cruise on Thursday and I haven't even packed a thing You just go go go go go go And they're like, okay, well. Thank you very much. Oh my goodness gracious. I gotta say, I love my life. It's fun. I make things.

Sometimes it can be fun. It's fun. I try to make it fun, you know? I try to have fun. That's the happiest and the most upsetting you've sounded in this pun- something about the accent and the kind of joviality is deeply, deeply unnerving. Hmm. You're not a- I mean, you don't like the south then. I love the south.

Well, that's just the- I'm a huge... I actually haven't spent that much time in the South. And I went to, like, I used to do these, like, touring improv shows with the, you know... Oh, with the cup, and then you pretend the cup is in a cabinet. That's it. And then you pretend that you have to put some pretend stuff in it and pretend to drink it. People would go ballistic for it. They flipped out and they loved it.

You're a good pretender! Thank you! We did one show this was- Pretend you have a suit on! Oh, thank you! Just, that requires very little fan-mine. You're a good pretender! Thank you.

Pretend you have a little less hair than you do now. Just a little. Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah! Spot on.

Do you think, I want to ask a question from before. If your father had had fans like you had, people coming up to him on the street being like hey Love your stuff and had periodically been able to have the novelty of going to strange cities and having people cheer for him Do you think it would have topped him off enough self-esteem wise that he then would have been able to like return to a kind of Well, it's just such a strange hypothetical. It's just a completely different If people come up to him and been like, love your stuff. What stuff did they love?

Bathing suits. Look, yeah. Was he funny? He was. He was very completely the opposite of my mom. My mom is very book smart, not very street savvy. My dad was street savvy, not very book smart, didn't read. My mom read voraciously.

He was very jovial, very goofy, fun, life of the party type guy. He got me into Abba and Costello and different, you know, comedy stuff. And, and he was, he was very, you know, social. And did he know you were funny? Did I know? No, did he know you were funny?

Not that I am aware. He knew that I liked that stuff, and I had stand-up albums when I was a kid. But I mean, I don't know how funny I was until later. I don't know. But I don't know how funny it was when I was nine or 10. I'm not sure. Yeah.

It's, uh, when you were talking about him and then Trump and the validation thing, I saw this one thing. It was like back when I guess it was in the, the 2020 election and Trump had just had COVID and wasn't vaccinated or something, and he wouldn't, Biden wouldn't debate him because he was like, I don't want to get sick. I don't remember all the details, but Trump had a town hall. And there was the weirdest moment that happened where this woman got up in the town hall and went, Donald, Mr. President Trump, whatever.

I just wish you would smile more. She goes, you look so handsome when you smile. And the weirdest thing happened where he got this smile. I've never seen it before since. He looked kind of pleased and embarrassed, and he looked like a little kid all of a sudden, like a kind of like happy, vulnerable little kid. And it fucked me up real good because I was like, you know,

I just think of him as being kind of this, you know, character or whatever. But seeing a moment where it was like, oh, he's shy. He's having a moment of like shy delight. Well, now I got a boat trip. It was so weird. That, yeah. That's it.

That's all it took? That's all it took. Ha ha. The humanity. But did you ever see, would you see stuff like that with your, That's weird. That, yeah. That's it. That's all it took? That's all it took. The humanity. But did you ever see, would you see stuff like that with your, you might not want to talk about your pops anymore. But just the last question. Did you ever see moments where it was like something penetrated

his kind of, his like razzmatazz, like his manipulation of people, his, did you ever see a moment where he was like, like the little boy version? No, I don't think so. I don't think so. Got it. OK. I'll stop asking about this, but I was just curious about that last thing. Yeah. OK. Sorry. No, I don't think so. I don't think so. Got it. Okay.

I'll stop asking about this, but I was just curious about that last thing. Yeah. Okay. Sorry. No, it's all right. Okay. No, Zach, I... What?

What do you want? I end every show with a question to my guest from my daughter, my seven-year-old daughter. From her cage. From her cage. And so, yeah, I will say this. The other day, she tried to convince me that pumpkin pie is good for your voice. I can sort of, intuitively that makes sense.

It's like, it coats coats the it's like throat coat pumpkin pie Yeah, Louis Armstrong way before he had pumpkin pie Sounded just like a boring, you know, just like a little like a lounge singer, but then you'd get that Yeah So maybe that's what you meant. That's a shoot. Yeah, I guess yeah the context is everything Louie prima all those guys the big pumpkin heads I guess, yeah, the context is everything. Louie Prima, all those guys, the big pumpkin heads. Mm-mm.

OK. Do I have snot coming out of my nose? Nope. Good. So here's a question from my daughter. OK. Yeah, it's a question. No, no, no, about the snot, because I

feel like there's snot coming out of my nose. Is there? A little bit? No, I don't see any. Don't look in the camera. No? OK, CGI. OK, Zach, how does Santa come to some kids' houses

if they don't have chimneys? I'm glad she asked that. He has to come through whatever ventilation system that they have, but it's incredibly painful for him. Because he either has to kind of wedge himself in through the vent or departiculate in this way that's. Departiculate? Yeah, like he can become broken up into little portions,

but he screams. It's so painful. And it's so awful. And he'll wedge himself through. And he's screaming and screaming. And he's crying. But he's committed. He has to get those gifts in.

And one of the things that the real important takeaways there is it is very important that your parents have wealth. Because if they don't, you're torturing Santa. Right. Like they need it. If you're wealthy enough to have a fireplace, then you're doing it Santa. Right. Like they need it. If you're wealthy enough to have a fireplace, then you're doing it right by Chris. But.

So when you, so if he's going to the projects. God help him. The Robert Taylor home. Sure. Oh my lord. That's excruciating. It's terrible. Sometimes I have to go through window units, like people

who haven't, who have ACs in. They'll go through the window unit. And it just by the end, he's covered. If you ever see the real Santa, he's covered in scar tissue, just all over. It's like a, yeah. So that's how he does it. OK, I'll let her know. Yeah, and this is if you want to know, if you have a house that

doesn't have a fireplace, look at your vents on December 25th. And if there's just trace amounts of blood and flesh, you'll know, hey, you were a good kid this year. He hopes that you're a bad kid if you don't have a fireplace. Yeah. I guess so. So, I would, then it stands to reason that he thinks, hopes, wishes that wealthy kids are good kids and poor kids are shitty kids. Yeah.

There's a kind of unconscious bias that's been sort of braided into his, his, yeah. But also, I don't know. Yeah. I don't know how much he's aware of that as a, as a bias, but he probably feels that way. I know I do. Yeah. I know I do. Yeah. I know I do. Yeah, well, it's been proven.

Show me a rich kid, I'll show you a good kid. All right, Zach, thank you so much for coming down. It was a treat. Sense is Working Overtime is a HeadGum podcast created and hosted by me, David Cross. The show is edited by Katie Skelton and engineered by Nicole Lyons with supervising producer Emma Foley. Thanks to Demi Druchin for our show art and Mark Rivers for our theme song. For more podcasts by Headgum, visit Headgum.com or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Leave us a review on Apple Podcasts and maybe

we'll read it on a future episode. I'm not gonna do that. Thanks for listening.