SERIALously - 286: Toxic & Cheating Wife Takes “Over His Dead Body” Literally | The Case of Michael Shaver

Episode Date: June 9, 2025

This week on Serialously with Annie Elise, when Mike Shaver suddenly vanished after a heated argument with his wife, Laurie, the story she spun raised more questions than answers. His car, wallet, and... clothes were left behind, but Laurie insisted he had "left for Georgia." As the investigation dragged on, strange texts and erratic Facebook posts only deepened the mystery. For years, there were no answers, until a welfare check uncovered a devastating truth that no one expected… 🔎Join Our True Crime Club & Get Exclusive Content & Perks 🔎  Join The Club: https://www.patreon.com/annieelise 🎧 Need More to Binge?  Listen to EXTRA deep dive episodes every week on Apple! https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/serialously-with-annie-elise/id1519456164 🌸 SPRING MERCH IS OFFICIALLY HERE! 🌸 Shop now at https://annieelise.com/collections/shop-all Don't miss out before your faves sell out! 🛒🌷 Follow Annie on Socials 📸  🩷Instagram: @ _annieelise, https://www.instagram.com/_annieelise/?hl=en 💜TikTok: @_annieelise, https://www.tiktok.com/@_annieelise?lang=en 🗞️ Substack: @annieelise, https://substack.com/@annieelise 💙Facebook: @10tolife, https://www.facebook.com/10toLIFE ⭐️Sponsors ⭐️ Olipop: Head to http://drinkolipop.com/AE and get a free can of Olipop. Chime Financial: Open your account in 2 minutes at http://Chime.com/Serialously. Liquid IV: Go to http://liquidiv.com and use code AE for 20% off your first order. RoBody: Head to http://Ro.co/AE to see if you qualify. Mint Mobile: Grab 3 months of service for just $15 a month at http://MintMobile.com/ae. Shop Annie’s Closet & Must-Haves! 👗 Poshmark: https://posh.mk/Tdbki6Ae0Rb ShopMY: https://shopmy.us/annieelise Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/shop/10tolife?ref_=cm_sw_r_apin_aipsfshop_BKN1ZMCMEZHACVFQ2R75&language=en_US Disclaimer ‣ Some links may be affiliate links, they do not cost you anything, but I make a small percentage from the sale. Thank you so much for watching and supporting me. 🎙️ Follow the podcast for FREE on all podcast platforms!  Apple:https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/serialously-with-annie-elise/id1519456164 Spotify:https://open.spotify.com/show/6HdheEH8WeMTHoe5da34qU All Other Platforms: https://audioboom.com/channels/5100770-serialously-with-annie-elise Get Involved or Recommend the Case 💬  About Annie: https://annieelise.com/ For Business Inquiries: 10toLife@WMEAgency.com Episode Sources 🔗 ABC News Click Orlando Court TV Daily Commercial Daily Mail FOX 35 Orlando FOX News Inside Edition Law & Crime New York Post Office of The State Attorney, Fifth Judicial Circuit, Florida People.com Soap Central Spectrum News 13 The Independent WESH WFTV WKMG WWNY *Sources used to collect this information include various public news sites, interviews, court documents, FB groups dedicated to the case, and various news channel segments. When quoting statements made by others, they are strictly alleged until confirmed otherwise. Please remember my videos are my independent opinion and to always do your own research.  •••••••••••••••••• Disclaimer: The views and opinions expressed in this video are personal and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of any other agency, organization, employer, or company. Assumptions made in the analysis are not reflective of the position of any entity other than the creator(s). These views are subject to change, revision, and rethinking at any time and are not to be held in perpetuity. We make no representations as to the accuracy, completeness, correctness, suitability, or validity of any information on this video and will not be liable for any errors, omissions, or delays in this information or any losses, injuries, or damages arising from its display or use. All information is provided on an as-is basis. It is the reader’s responsibility to verify their own facts.

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Starting point is 00:00:00 33 year-old Michael Shaver left work and was never seen again. Lori Shaver is accused in the 2015 shooting death of her husband Michael Shaver. He put his foot on my face, smashing it into the patio porch. When Lori took the stand in her trial, she immediately became emotional, wiping away tears before telling the jury how she first met her then-husband Michael. When that motion was filed to say, Lori Shaver didn't do it, it was her daughter stepping in to defend her. That daughter was seven years old at the time. I had nothing to do with the murder of Michael Shaver.
Starting point is 00:00:41 My name is Lori Filmer, also known as Lori Shaver. I'm coming before you guys today just to let you know that we have our suspicions, but I don't know why I've been targeted. I am a daughter, I'm a friend, I'm a neighbor, I'm a servant of God, I'm a wife, and I'm a devoted mother of four. Hey, true crime besties, welcome back to an all new episode of Serialistly. I am your host, Annie Elise, and I'm here to break down another true crime case for you.
Starting point is 00:01:43 Now, if you are brand new to the podcast and checking it out for the first time, let me just kind of give you the breakdown of what we do over here on Serialistly. I know it's a mouthful, okay? Trust me, I know the name is hard to say. But over here what I like to do is discuss these cases in more of a conversational way. Almost like you're talking with your friend or your sister or you know your true crime BFF, which I would love the honor to be that for you but like just in less of a clinical and sterile way that I feel like a lot of the times these cases are discussed you know I grew up watching 60 minutes, Dateline, documentaries, all the things and I still watch them don't get me wrong but I felt
Starting point is 00:02:23 like I was kind of craving for something where people would just talk to me about these cases as if it were like my sister and I on the couch or a friend of mine was like trying to update me on a case. So we talk about things a little bit more casual over here. I call things out like I see them. I talk about the red flags and just kind of like we're friends having a conversation.
Starting point is 00:02:42 And today's case, okay, the one I'm talking to you about today is a wild one. And I felt like it was kind of like a lifetime movie when I first heard about it. And it might very well be one or definitely will be one in the future, but it kind of just goes to show the level of like unhinged that people become, okay?
Starting point is 00:03:02 I want you to just imagine this for a moment, okay? Imagine that your friend suddenly disappears. Meanwhile, their spouse has a dozen different stories about where they went, who they were with, what happened. Then boom, all of a sudden, a huge piece of evidence, a clue turns everything about the case upside down. And guys, there's a twist at the end of this that I bet none of you are ready for.
Starting point is 00:03:26 I know that I wasn't. It is one of those like roller coaster cases. So let me just shut up. I'm gonna get right into it and buckle up because we've got a lot of twists and turns ahead. So in November of 2015, Michael Mike Shaver disappeared without a trace. One moment he was at home with his wife Lori
Starting point is 00:03:44 and with their two kids, Isabelle and Aiden, but then the next moment he was at home with his wife Lori and with their two kids, Isabelle and Aiden, but then the next, he was just gone. Now Lori says his disappearance happened after yet again another argument between the two of them, which these arguments were happening pretty frequently. It was apparently like their marriage was just unraveling. It was this long string of arguments and then boom, this one happened, and in the heat of all of it, Mike just walked out of their Clermont, Florida home. Just walked out and never looked back.
Starting point is 00:04:11 And this was the last time that Lori, Isabel, and Aiden would ever see him or ever hear from him ever again. Now at first, Lori thought that Mike would come back. I mean, maybe not right away, but eventually. But as the weeks dragged into months, the reality began to settle in. Mike was gone. For good. So Lori did the only thing that she could do.
Starting point is 00:04:32 She began to move on. She wanted to continue to live her life. But starting over for her wasn't really easy. Because by 2015, Lori and Mike were both in their mid-30s. They had been together for over two decades also. So starting over after 20 years, I mean, not an easy feat. Their relationship had begun long before marriage and children had even entered the picture as well.
Starting point is 00:04:53 I mean, so the history that they shared also kind of made Mike's sudden disappearance just even more difficult to comprehend. Now Lori was suddenly in a position where she was a single mother, trying to navigate that, trying to navigate raising her two kids on her own, but keeping things together and emotionally intact for them as well. So she did what she could to keep things as normal as possible, even when neighborhood chatter and rumors and whispers started to add up. Because to those who knew Mike, something about his disappearance just was not adding
Starting point is 00:05:26 up. It wasn't making sense. I mean, a husband doesn't just vanish into thin air, right? A father doesn't just walk away from his kids without a trace, I mean, usually, unless they're a full on deadbeat. Yet, that's exactly what seemed to happen here. Now let's go back a little bit and talk about how Mike and Lori met and what their upbringings were.
Starting point is 00:05:44 Because I feel like you need to have a full picture of these two people before we get into what went on. So their story began in upstate New York where they both spent their childhoods. Mike was the third of four kids. He was raised by a single mother. And from a very early age, he just was super fascinated
Starting point is 00:05:59 with figuring out how things worked. I mean, he loved tinkering, fixing, and building, whether it was old radios, broken appliances, discarded mean, he loved tinkering, fixing, and building. Whether it was old radios, broken appliances, discarded bicycles, he would just collect what a lot of people considered junk, and then he would take it all apart and put it all back together again. And the two of them, Lori and Mike, first met in middle school. That's how far back they go. From the moment that they crossed paths, something just clicked between them. So eventually their friendship evolved into a crush, then the crush evolved into dating, then dating went into a serious relationship, serious relationship
Starting point is 00:06:30 went into engagement, engagement went into marriage, I mean, over the course of many, many years. They married shortly after their high school graduation, and then they started building their life together. Mike had dreams of becoming a pilot and really wanted to pursue this commercial flying license. Eventually, he even secured a job at Piedmont Airlines. Then, in his spare time, he worked on competitive racing airplanes, which I didn't even know that was a thing, but the more you know, right? So, as their relationship grew, Lori also was working, and she built a career in the insurance industry, all while Mike was pursuing his passion with aviation.
Starting point is 00:07:06 And their lives were a little bit all over the place, right? Because his job was in the commercial airline industry. It took him from city to city, state to state, I mean all over the place, constantly on the move, even international occasionally. So all of this back and forth in this travel, this meant frequently relocating their small but growing family. But then with the arrival of their two children, Isabelle and Aiden, they started rethinking
Starting point is 00:07:29 the whole lifestyle. It was difficult to manage. It was a lot. I mean, moving from place to place is one thing when it's just you and your partner, but now when you have kids in the mix who you want to establish a routine, give them roots, it makes things more challenging, right? So Mike and Lori decided to set out on their search for the perfect home that they could raise their family in. And eventually they found it. A spacious,
Starting point is 00:07:51 beautiful property in Clermont, Florida. A very quiet and rural area just outside of Orlando. And it was everything that they had hoped for. It was five acres of land, plenty of space for the kids to run around, even room for animals. So they really embraced this country lifestyle. I mean, so much so that they even added ducks and chickens to their home. I mean, they loved this life. But now, having this settled home balance and home life, it really sparked something in Mike.
Starting point is 00:08:19 He was now craving that same kind of, I don't know what you call it, like not roots, but like that same kind of stability I don't know what you call it, not roots, but that same kind of stability in his work life as well. He loved aviation, but he didn't love the long hours. He didn't love the constant travel that was draining. And more than anything, he just hated being away from his family for so long. So over time, he found himself really craving a change,
Starting point is 00:08:40 something that would keep him closer to home, keep him grounded. And then the absolute perfect opportunity came along, because he landed a job as a mechanic at Disney World. He was working on the monorails, which are the things that transport guests all around the resort. You've probably seen them. And for somebody who loved fixing things ever since he was a kid, this now felt like a dream come true. He was going to be helping them as a mechanic, so like a little bit of engineering, I suppose. It's also at, you know, Disney World, the happiest
Starting point is 00:09:09 place on earth, and if you loved doing that as a kid, I mean it just kind of feels serendipitous, right? So to the outside world, Mike and Lori had built this life that so many people would envy. I mean, high school sweethearts, two kids, this beautiful home with plenty of space to have animals, to grow food, to do all these things, two careers that provided stability. I mean, truly, what everybody would hope for one day, right? But as we know, the truth isn't always what it seems from the outside, and behind closed doors, their relationship was far from perfect. Over the years, tensions between the two of them started escalating. So what may have started as a typical marital spat or argument, it started to grow into
Starting point is 00:09:52 something far more toxic and dangerous. Their marriage was marked by these heated arguments, these accusations, and even at times, violence. So much so that Lori confided in her friends that Mike was physically abusive to her. Not only would he hit her allegedly, but he would even lock her inside a closet for hours at a time. Nobody ever witnessed these alleged incidents, but her friends believed her. They were convinced that she was a victim of domestic violence. However, Mike's close friends saw the situation very differently. They believed that Lori was the aggressor, that she was the one frequently attacking him. Because on at least one occasion, Mike apparently showed up to work and he had visible bruises on his face.
Starting point is 00:10:35 When his co-workers asked him what had happened, he admitted to them that Lori hit him. They urged him to go to the police because they were obviously really concerned for his well-being, also for the kids living in a toxic household like that, but Mike just dismissed the idea. He told them, no, you know, it's not worth the hassle of involving the police or going through any sort of legal battle. I'm just, you know, it's a toxic marriage. I'm just going to deal with it.
Starting point is 00:10:57 This is just the way that life is now. And you might be wondering, okay, well, why did their relationship go so south? They were high school sweethearts. Like, seems like they had everything. What happened? Well, it had gone bad for a lot of different reasons. I mean, for example, Mike and Lori were accusing each other of infidelity, both of them, against each other. Each suspected the other of being unfaithful, and these suspicions ended up leading to explosive arguments. Now, as I've hinted at, their arguments, they weren't just verbal, they often got physical. And on multiple occasions,
Starting point is 00:11:29 both Lori and Mike allegedly escalated from the physical violence aspect of it to threatening each other with guns during their arguments. I mean, these got especially intense. By September 2014, one fight escalated to a particularly dangerous level too, because one night a pretty bad argument erupted right after Lori supposedly discovered very suspicious text messages on Mike's phone. It's unclear what they said, and some sources say that Lori only found a woman's number on his phone, not these incriminating text messages, but whatever it was that she found, it was enough for Lori to spark this massive confrontation.
Starting point is 00:12:08 And this fight got really intense, so much so that it prompted Lori to call 911. When she called, she told the operator that although they have had arguments in the past, this is the first time that it got physical and that there was actual violence involved. But she claimed that Mike grabbed her and that he attacked her.
Starting point is 00:12:25 Yet when the police arrived, Mike told a completely different story, just like they were telling their friends two different stories. And according to Mike, Lori had been the one to escalate the situation to physical violence. Not him. He said that she was furious over these text messages, and that in a fit of rage, she went and grabbed a gun and not only threatened to use the gun and kill him, but said that she was going to turn the gun on herself as
Starting point is 00:12:49 well. Now both of them had apparently been drinking that night, and fearing that she might act on these threats, Mike ended up taking her car keys and prevented her from leaving. Although to me personally, I don't really know how that would stop the threat or even like yield it or curb it at all because You would kind of not that she should drink and drive obviously But you should want her out of the house so that she doesn't use the weapon in my mind But anyways regardless he took her keys and that only made matters worse because then allegedly lori
Starting point is 00:13:20 Lunged at him again with the gun still in her hand from, a struggle between the two of them ensued, and during this physical little altercation, Mike said that Lorie struck him over the head with the gun, almost like pistol whipping him, leaving this really deep and bloody gash. Lorie, however, claimed that no no no no, I only hit Mike's hand, and that caused him to then accidentally strike himself in the head. I didn't do that. But whatever happened, a neighbor who saw the aftermath of the fight took photos of Mike's injuries, and the images showed a deep wound with significant bleeding, an injury that didn't look
Starting point is 00:13:55 casual or accidental or even self-inflicted. Meanwhile, Lori appeared relatively unharmed. Now, despite all of that, when the officers interviewed Mike, he admitted that he had grabbed Lori, not in an attempt to hurt her, but rather to restrain her when she was trying to reach for the gun. However, that admission in and of itself was enough for the police to arrest him
Starting point is 00:14:17 on domestic violence charges. He admitted to touching her, so he was arrested. Mike ultimately accepted a plea deal, which allowed him to enter a 12-month pretrial intervention program. However, he ended up completing the program in six months instead of 12, and then ultimately the charges were dropped. Still though, the judge ended up issuing a no-contact order between him and Lori, forcing Mike to move out of their shared home. So with nowhere else to go, Mike took up residence in an airplane hangar.
Starting point is 00:14:45 Now many sources said that the airplane hangar was at his work, but as far as I know, there isn't an airplane hangar at Disney World. I mean, maybe I'm missing something. I did do some research, but I couldn't really find a definitive answer. Now, as I mentioned before, Mike did compete on a competitive flying team. So because of that, other sources say that he was staying at his team's hangar, which also makes a little bit more sense to me. But whatever the case, he ended up living there for a while, sleeping among the planes, using the locker room showers to bathe, eating microwave meals in the break room, and just getting by. Eventually, though, Mike ended up moving back
Starting point is 00:15:21 home, and unfortunately, this kind of became a pattern in their marriage. I mean, Laurie would kick him out, he'd live in the hangar for a while, he'd return, they'd make up, and then it was just a cycle, ongoing. It was always the same thing. And during the periods where Mike was not living at the home, when she kicked him out and he was in the hangar, rumors started swirling that Laurie was seeing other men during those times. Friends and neighbors would tell Mike
Starting point is 00:15:45 about these frequent visitors, and Mike even went so far as to fly over their house in a plane just to see if there were unfamiliar cars parked in the driveway, which I gotta say, maybe because I don't have a plane at my disposal, but I will say in my day, in my toxic relationships, I've done drive-bys to see if other cars are over at the house or like if they're dating other girls,
Starting point is 00:16:04 which I know that sounds totally psychotic and like crazy girl behavior, but look in my 20s. I was a stage five cleaner I'll just say it like it is you guys are my friends here I'm gonna tell you like it is and I would definitely do drive-bys taking a plane now and flying a plane overhead That kind of goes next level but you know, I can't say I wouldn't do it if I had a plane when I was 21 years old. Maybe I would. Although he was of course much older, but you get what I'm saying. So he flies over seeing if there's any unfamiliar cars, and ultimately he confronted Lori about the rumors. And when he did, Lori made her stance crystal clear. She was allowed to see other men while they were separated, But Mike was not allowed to see other women.
Starting point is 00:16:45 And she even warned him that if he did, he would never be allowed to see their kids again. Which I don't know how you can really have that argument and think that you have any merit in that. Like how are you gonna say, I can see other men, but you can't see other women? Like that feels a little hypocritical. That doesn't really track, right?
Starting point is 00:17:03 Well, it turns out in the spring in 2015, during one of their many separations, Mike did begin dating a coworker named Kendall. And when Lori found out about that relationship, she was furious. She even tracked down Kendall's Facebook page and began sending her just all of these threatening messages, one after another, saying I'mI'm gonna expose you as a home wrecker. "'You better not mess with me. "'Back off my husband.' Just like truly going at this girl.
Starting point is 00:17:32 She even went so far as to report their relationship to Disney's HR department, hoping to get Kendall in trouble at work for, you know, what is that, fraternization. And I don't know if he was her boss or what it was, but she was like pulling out all the stops. And she didn't stop there. She took it next level.
Starting point is 00:17:48 She even took photos from Kendall's personal Facebook page, pictures that, in Lori's mind, she deemed as looking inappropriate. And she submitted those photos to Disney's HR department as well, arguing, you know, Kendall's not the type of person that you would want representing your brand. She shouldn't work at Disney. She's not innocent. She's not wholesome. Take a look at these pictures, which I will say Disney does take their employees and their reputation, I guess, you would say, very seriously. I had a friend who worked at Disney, not even like at the park, but worked in downtown Disney at a restaurant, and they're so strict.
Starting point is 00:18:26 I'm sure you've heard of Disney fingers. If you haven't, it basically means you're not allowed to use like your single index finger to point to anything. Like if somebody's like, hey, where's the bathroom? You can't say, oh, over there. The rule is you always have to use two fingers, that that's like the polite way. Guys, I know that that probably sounded way worse than I meant it, but get your minds out of the gutter.
Starting point is 00:18:49 But you have to say like, no, it's over this way or this way. Kind of how Chick-fil-A has to say, what do they say, my pleasure to everything that you, if you say thank you or whatever. So I kind of get where she was trying to go with this, but I also don't know that it's gonna hold much water, but whatever. And her harassment didn't just stop there with Disney. but whatever. And her harassment didn't just stop there with Disney. Lori also managed to find Kendall's grandmother's phone number. Then, in the middle of the night, she called her grandmother at 3am demanding to know where Kendall lived. Basically being like, Grandma, Grandma, tell me where Kendall lives. I need to know her address. Fully unhinged, right? There was even one time when Mike apparently called
Starting point is 00:19:24 Kendall and told her she needed to park in a different parking lot than usual for work because Lori was driving over, she was on her way to Disney and she had a gun and he was worried that she was gonna do something crazy to Kendall, which at that point, I mean, I think you gotta call it and you just gotta divorce. There's no way to save a marriage like that in my opinion. Again, not that I advocate for divorce, but like, come on, I mean, if you're worried somebody's gonna commit murder, maybe you
Starting point is 00:19:48 don't stay with that person. And while nothing significant came of Laurie's threats, the relentless harassment did take its toll. And by May of 2015, Kendall had enough, and she ended her relationship with Mike. The constant threats and the interference from Lori had just become way too much to handle. But once again, history repeated itself and following this breakup, Mike moved right back into the home with Lori and his two kids and tried to make their marriage work. And their toxic relationship didn't just affect the two of them and I would imagine their children too, it also affected their extended friends and family. I mean, over time, he just became increasingly distant from his loved ones. His family, who lived out of state,
Starting point is 00:20:30 made several attempts to come visit him, but time and time again, the plans would just fall through. At the last minute, Mike would just call them and say, you know, it's not a good time right now. You can visit another time. All was really citing Lori as the main reason behind it, saying she insisted that they needed to focus on their marriage and these family visits would just only be a distraction. So as time passed in their marriage, Mike seemed more and more isolated,
Starting point is 00:20:53 just completely trapped in this relationship that was spiraling further out of control. Those who knew Mike and Lori wouldn't have been shocked to hear that they were gonna be divorcing. Some even encouraged it, saying, look, this is probably the best decision for you. Then on November 7th, 2015, Mike and Lori attended a local tractor show with his coworker and his friend, Frank Merritt. Some of Frank's family members also attended this show. And from the moment that they arrived, Frank could just sense
Starting point is 00:21:20 that there was tension between Mike and Lori. Have you ever been in a situation like that when you're like third wheeling or you're in a group setting and there's another couple and you could just sense that there was tension between Mike and Lori. Have you ever been in a situation like that when you're like third wheeling or you're in a group setting and there's another couple and you could just feel like okay they must have just had a huge argument right before they arrived or like the tension is so thick you can cut it with a knife. It's a really uncomfy position to be in, right? Especially if you ever have been that couple. I have even with my husband where we've gotten into an argument and then we have somewhere to go and we have, we get there and we're like, okay, we have to put on a happy face, like, we'll talk about this later when we get home. Like, it's not good for anybody involved, right? So at this tractor show, they barely interacted with each other. Laurie also refused to even
Starting point is 00:21:57 acknowledge or make eye contact with anybody who was there. The unease between Mike and Laurie was just so obvious, making things awkward for everyone around them. And while there wasn't a dramatic argument or big moment, the atmosphere just felt off, creating this really uncomfortable situation. What was supposed to be a fun afternoon turned into an experience that was honestly anything but enjoyable, and it eventually led to Mike and Lori leaving early. Then the next day, after all that awkwardness at the Tractor show, Frank decided he wanted to check in on Mike just to see, you know, how's he doing?
Starting point is 00:22:33 Is everything okay? Like, did you make it home safely? You know, whatever, whatever, whatever. So he sent him a text message, but he got no response, which he wasn't really worried about it. He's like, you know, I know that he and Lori had a lot to work on. They probably are still talking, but I'm not too worried. So wanting to respect Mike's privacy, he kind of held off on contacting him again for
Starting point is 00:22:52 the rest of the day. But by November 9th, two days later, his concerns started growing and he decided he was going to check in again. And this time he finally got a text back. But it was nothing like he expected. It wasn't a text that he would have thought that a text back. But it was nothing like he expected. It wasn't a text that he would have thought that he would have received, because it was brief and it was just completely out of character. In this text, Mike told Frank that he was not only quitting his job,
Starting point is 00:23:16 but he was doing it to quote save his marriage. And Frank found that really strange, because Mike had always been dedicated to his work. He has always been reliable and passionate about his job, so it didn't make sense that he would just suddenly and abruptly quit and walk away without any prior warning. The wording of the messages also felt a little bit odd, almost like impersonal, as if it wasn't really coming from Mike at all. So Frank couldn't shake this uneasy feeling that something was just very wrong here. And unfortunately, he was right. All right, you guys know, especially if you've been listening or watching for a while, that I am obsessed with Diet Coke. I live, breathe, and die by Diet Coke.
Starting point is 00:24:04 But I also see all of your comments where you're warning me being like Annie you need to lay off the diet coke It's so bad for you. It has so much sugar It has aspartame all the things and look I get it But what I will say what might make a lot of you listeners and commenters happy is that one of you commenters? Recommended that I try ollie pop and I. And I think that I might be converting. Now let me just tell you about Oli Pop for those of you who haven't heard about it. They offer a delicious alternative to traditional soda. So for me, I tried their vintage cola, because you know I wasn't going to go too far out of bounds from my beloved Diet Coke, and it tastes
Starting point is 00:24:41 almost identical. And you're so you're not trading off the flavor that you're used to yet it is so much better for you. And when I started looking into Olypop, let me just tell you about this stat. 90% of Americans consume more than the USDA's daily recommended added sugar intake, which is already high. It's 30 grams. So different drinks like soda are also the leading source of added sugars in the American diet. And Olypop is so much lower in sugar than conventional soda. They only have two to five grams of sugar and it's from natural sources.
Starting point is 00:25:14 There's no added sugar. So my favorite, my new favorite, their Vintage Cola, it has only two grams of sugar compared to a regular Coke, which has 39 grams of sugar. And their orange squeeze, which tastes so good and is like perfect for summertime, that of sugar compared to a regular Coke which has 39 grams of sugar and their orange squeeze which tastes so good and is like perfect for summertime that one only has five grams of sugar compared to orange Fanta which has 44 grams of sugar so I think I'm fully converted guys it tastes really good if you've tried Ollie pop I want you to tell me in the comments what your favorite flavor
Starting point is 00:25:41 is because I definitely want to like branch out and try. But here's the thing, if you're like me and you always thought Diet Coke or regular Coke was the end-all, be-all, the only answer, you can try Olypop and you can get reimbursed. Listen, get a free can of Olypop by buying any two cans of Olypop in store, and Olypop will pay you back for one of them. It works on any flavor at any retailer.
Starting point is 00:26:03 Just go to drinkolypop.comcom.ae and Olipop is sold online at drinkolipop.com and also on Amazon. It's also available in almost 50,000 retailers nationwide including Costco, Walmart, Target, Publix, Whole Foods, Kroger, and HEB. So check it out. Let me know the flavors that you guys love because this is gonna be my new staple, especially for summertime. So thank you to Elizabeth179 for recommending it to me. I am so excited and thank you Ollipop for sponsoring today's episode. I'm gonna go crack one open. Can I tell you guys something that I loathe more than anything else on the planet?
Starting point is 00:26:43 It's overdraft fees. I feel like it is such a nuisance of a fee. Like, I get it, I get it, I get it. We shouldn't be overdrafting, whatever. But then to like stack a fee on top of it, I don't know. It just, something about it feels kind of like grifter-y and scammy to me, which you're probably gonna be like,
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Starting point is 00:29:07 When Mike failed to show up for work for three consecutive days, his boss reached out to him directly and saying like, what's going on, where are you, is everything okay? Yet, Mike's text back was just short, dismissive. He said, you can fire me. I'm not coming back. Not surprisingly, Mike's boss was completely caught off guard by this sudden resignation. It was so unlike Mike to do something like this, something so drastic without any prior discussion. However, there
Starting point is 00:29:35 also wasn't really much that he could do. If Mike was determined to leave, nobody was going to be able to force him to stay. He was a grown man after all. Frank, though, his friend was still concerned, so he decided to go check on Mike in person. And on November 13th, he went over to Mike's house in Clermont wanting to check on him, and Lori answered the door. And Lori told Frank, you know what, Mike left. We got into a heated argument because he was talking to other women. I called him out on it, and he took off. He left. And according to Lori, he not only stormed off in the middle of their argument, but he drove off in a very big hurry. Now something about this story didn't really sit right with Frank, not only because it again was out of character, but also Mike's car was still
Starting point is 00:30:16 sitting in the driveway, right there, exactly where he usually parked it. So if he had really left on his own and drove off in a hurry, why wouldn't he have driven his own car? Why was his car there? So Frank started pressing Laurie on that, and when he did, she started changing her story just slightly, saying, you know, a black SUV actually pulled up to the house, and it was driven by Mike's friend Robert. And then Mike got in that car, and that's the car that sped away. She says he took off in such a hurry, and that Robert and Mike were apparently heading to Georgia, of all places, that he sped off so quickly he left behind his car, his wallet, his clothes, I mean everything. Which obviously Frank was still super
Starting point is 00:30:56 suspicious, but despite his concerns, Lori maintained that she had no idea where Mike was or what his plans were. And that was the last known interaction that anybody outside of the family had regarding Mike's whereabouts. From that moment on, he seemingly just vanished without a trace. Then after his disappearance, Lori's story about what happened to him
Starting point is 00:31:17 seemed to change a little bit, depending on whoever she was talking to. Lori told family members that he had left for the airport and that he moved to another state. Sometimes she said he moved to Georgia, sometimes she said California, other times she even said New York, but there is just constant shifting in her story.
Starting point is 00:31:34 And that of course raised some eyebrows, yet nobody could quite figure out what was going on, what was the truth. And just about a month after he left, Lori started doing something else that raised a lot of red flags. She started selling all of his stuff. I mean, his expensive aviation tools, his guns, literally anything that he owned. She was trying to clear it out. It was almost as if she could not wait to get rid of all of it. She sold some of his stuff to friends,
Starting point is 00:32:03 to co-workers, to family members, many of whom, by the way, still couldn't believe that Mike, this guy who had spent years of building this collection of expensive tools, would just walk away from everything that he had worked for without a single word. So naturally, these people started asking Lori a lot of questions, right? You know, where did Mike go?
Starting point is 00:32:22 Why would he leave all of this stuff behind? But Lori's answers were just vague. She would shrug it off and say, You know, where did Mike go? Why would he leave all of this stuff behind? But Lori's answers were just vague. She would shrug it off and say, you know, well our relationship was on the rocks, or you know, he was more trouble than he was worth. He's out of my hair now. Just vague and kind of not really giving much context. Now despite how toxic their marriage was, she and Mike were together for over two decades, 20 years, and the fact that he had just disappeared without a trace, she didn't really seem particularly upset. There was no panic, no frantic searching, no real concern for even her children, who were, by the way, under the age of 10 at the time, and whose father just up and vanished. It was almost as if Laurie just accepted that Mike had left her and their two children without even so much as a goodbye.
Starting point is 00:33:06 And at first, even with Laurie's weird responses about his disappearance, his family and friends didn't immediately jump to conclusions or get too concerned, because Mike was still in contact with them. He would send them text messages sporadically here and there, sometimes Facebook messages, and even though it wasn't constant, it kind of tracked with his communication. Remember, he had been distancing himself for quite a few years at that point, so they kind of just chalked it up to, all right, he left, he's moving on to another phase in his life, and you know, we'll talk to him when we talk to him, but we don't need to really worry. However, then the tone of Mike's messages that he was sending started to shift. They became even more cold, more distant, and they all kind of had this unmistakable theme of just, you know, leave me alone. Leave me be. In one strange message to a family member, Mike even wrote, quote, I'm done with all
Starting point is 00:33:57 this back and forth crap. Everyone just needs to leave me alone, just like they did my entire life. Needless to say, it was uncharacteristically harsh. I mean, definitely a bold and abrupt statement. But still, it also didn't really immediately set off any alarm bells. After all, people go through rough patches. Sometimes people just need to go off the grid and regroup for a moment. So it seemed like, okay, he just needs some space and his friends and family figured he'll reach out again when he's ready to talk.
Starting point is 00:34:25 But as days turned into weeks, Mike's contact became even more sporadic. Everybody heard from him less and less and at the same time, they had no idea where he really was or what he was doing. And the messages that they were receiving got even more weird. One time, Mike's niece, somebody who he was really close with, Mike's niece, somebody who he was really close with, messaged him just to check in. And Mike replied asking who she was, claiming he never even met her, saying like, leave me alone, I don't know you, get away. In another instance, Mike texted his brother, and in this text he said, I tried calling mom, did she change her number?
Starting point is 00:34:58 Which to be clear, their mom hadn't changed her phone number for years, and Mike knew that, so if he really was trying to contact her, he would have been able to. And the odd behavior didn't just stop at text messages. His Facebook activity also started taking a drastic turn. Previously, his posts were filled with photos of himself, his friends, the planes that he worked on, some family shots here and there. But now, his timeline was flooded with these random memes, different posts that seemed just totally disconnected from his usual personality.
Starting point is 00:35:29 And then things got even stranger when his Facebook profile picture just suddenly changed from a personal photo of him to a random image of this group of people at a bar, where Mike wasn't even in it. His friend Scott noticed the switch and immediately tried to find Mike in the photo, but he realized he wasn't even in it at all, not even in the background. So super confused, he decided to take a closer look and do a reverse Google image search on the picture.
Starting point is 00:35:55 And to his shock, he discovered that the photo wasn't even original. It was a stock image that was used by a Bloody Mary company, like a bar promotion company, or company, like a bar promotion company. Or I guess rather a liquor promotion company. Meanwhile, everybody else still surrounding Lori was just growing increasingly concerned about his sudden disappearance because she still seemed completely unfazed by the situation. Her lack of worry or urgency was just extremely unsettling, especially considering the circumstances.
Starting point is 00:36:26 Because in fact, Lori seemed to move on remarkably quickly. Just about a month after Mike left, she met a man named Jeremy Townsend at a park. Jeremy was married, but he still pursued Lori like the garbage human that he is, and she didn't seem to mind. Lori told him she had recently become single and explained that her husband had abruptly left her and her children behind, though she didn't go into too much detail. But she seemed to be more than ready
Starting point is 00:36:53 to embrace this new relationship. And it didn't take long for Lori to become infatuated with Jeremy. In fact, less than a month into their relationship, Lori showed just how serious she was about this relationship. She tattooed Jeremy's nickname J right above her crotch. Which look, even a tattoo of somebody's name on the arm is a lot for only being with somebody for a month. Tattooing it right above
Starting point is 00:37:18 your, you know, private area, that's next level. That is dedication. But also I will just say, you know, to each their own I personally will not ever get somebody's name tattooed on me. I think it's the kiss of death, but you know, go Lori, I guess. Now, she's obviously taking this relationship very seriously and like very committed to this guy. Meanwhile, he initially was under the impression that this relationship with her was purely casual, purely sexual. He was married after all. So now he was becoming way overwhelmed by Laurie's like stage five clinger intense attachment to him. And at this point she was constantly bombarding him with text messages. Also questioning him about his marriage, asking why he was still wearing his wedding ring, why he hasn't divorced
Starting point is 00:38:01 his wife yet, whether or not he was in love with her. I mean, the constant just harassment of questions and emotional demands, it was a lot for Jeremy to handle, and it definitely was not what he thought he signed up for. But then, the situation took another unexpected turn when Jeremy's wife Vanessa received a very bizarre delivery at her job. She received this oversized bouquet of flowers that also had a card with it, and on the card it read, roses are red, violets are blue. My wife is a whore, your husband is too. Sorry about this, check your Facebook messages, we need to talk, Mike. So completely confused, and also, rightfully so, a little freaked out, Vanessa checked her Facebook messages.
Starting point is 00:38:47 And when she did, she found a series of hundreds of messages from Mike. In these messages, he shared details about Jeremy and Lori's affair, he included screenshots of their text message exchanges, he even included the inappropriate nude photos that they had sent one another. So, Vanessa was understandably very upset, and she confronted her husband Jeremy about this. Which he didn't try to deny it. Instead, he admitted to this affair, and he immediately ended things with Lori. He assured Vanessa that he was committed to working on their marriage. If she would just give him another chance,
Starting point is 00:39:21 he would never see Lori again. Nothing like this would ever happen. It's officially over. Now you can imagine, Laurie was hurt. She was frustrated, and she really tried to win Jeremy back. But her efforts were useless. He wanted to make his marriage work. He was done with her. And Laurie didn't really stay that upset for very long. Instead, she quickly set her sights on somebody new. A guy named Travis Filmer, who also happened to be a local church leader that she met through mutual friends. Their chemistry was undeniable, and they quickly grew close with one another. Travis, who had always wanted a family, was drawn to Lori's bond with her kids, which he just found incredibly attractive. I mean, here she was, left by her husband, embracing motherhood on her own.
Starting point is 00:40:06 Then by the beginning of 2016, Lori hosted a bonfire party where she and Travis became even closer. This really was the spark of the beginning of their relationship. And as they continued seeing each other, she assured Travis that her marriage with Mike was officially over,
Starting point is 00:40:21 that they were completely officially divorced, that Mike was no longer involved in their children's lives, that he wasn't paying child support, that she was fully independent and on her own. Which, meanwhile, Mike's friends and family couldn't help but notice how serious Lori and Travis' relationship was now becoming. And understandably, they started asking her about it. Because their curiosity about Mike hadn't faded. At this point, it had been almost a year
Starting point is 00:40:45 since anybody had seen him or talked to him, and they still had no clue where he was or what he was doing. But Lori told them, no, you know, me and Mike are divorced. I've gone to court for it. We're done. I, like, he left. I'm done. I'm moving on with my life. However, I will say she did claim that she never actually saw Mike at the divorce hearing. She said he didn't want to be there, so they stayed in separate rooms during the entire proceeding of it, and they were divorced and it all worked out. But again, the whole story just seemed a little bit odd. Yet Lori seemed confident in this story, so they didn't question her any further. And she really seemed to quickly embrace this new reality of hers.
Starting point is 00:41:23 She was posting updates on social media, photos, I mean, as if nothing ever happened. She was sharing photos of herself and Travis enjoying time together. She shared photos of her kids. She was even posting some photos of various projects she was working on around her house, particularly some remodeling. One specific detail was pouring a concrete pad for a fire pit in the backyard, and she and Travis even etched their initials into the cement, officially finishing the project. It was almost as if she was carrying on like everything was perfectly normal, without a care in the world. And to any outsider, it would have seemed like nothing strange had
Starting point is 00:41:59 happened at all. Then, on December 31, 2016, Laurie and Travis took the next step in their relationship. They got married in a small, intimate ceremony in Laurie's backyard. And this event was very close-knit. Only a couple close family and friends were in attendance. And everything was going really smoothly. It seemed like a very happy, very joyful, loving occasion. But then, out of nowhere, Lori had an unexpected emotional breakdown. She locked herself in the bathroom with a gun, threatening to take her own life. And the situation came completely out of left field. Everybody around her was just stunned, kind of unsure of how to react. It wasn't like the usual, you know, pre-wedding nerves or jitters
Starting point is 00:42:42 that people sometimes experience. This was obviously far more intense. And why? Today's episode is sponsored by Liquid IV. Now it is peak hydration season. I'm actually getting ready to go on vacation with my family and it has been so hot here lately and where we're gonna be going is even more hot. And you know, I'm a diet coke girly through and through.
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Starting point is 00:44:49 We've heard about Ozempic, Wegovi, but I know there's a lot of questions about if you qualify for it, does your insurance cover it? What does it really entail? And that's where Roe comes in, because let's be real, nobody likes calling their insurance provider and seeing if their medication is covered or if they are qualifying for it, especially not for GLP-1s like Ozempic or Wigobi. Yet, Ro's insurance checker lets you know if you're covered for GLP-1s for free. And they can also help you understand GLP-1s, see if they're right for you, right for your goals, and if you qualify. So if you are eligible for
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Starting point is 00:45:42 to check their coverage for free. Go to ro.co.a.e for your free insurance check. That's Ro.co.a.e to see if your insurance covers GLP-1s for free. Go to Ro.co.safety for black box warning and full safety information about GLP-1 medications. Fortunately, a family member was able to talk to Lori and calm her down and kind of bring her back down to reality, so the wedding continued as planned. They got married, she seemed to snap back to her cheerful self, she was going through the motions of enjoying the wedding, and there was no sign that a breakdown had even happened. And that in and of itself kind of left people feeling a little bit unsettled, right? Like how
Starting point is 00:46:28 do you go from one extreme to the other? But nobody really knew how to make sense of it. It was just a bizarre moment that didn't really seem to fit in with the life that Laurie had been portraying to the world. But Laurie moved on. She and Travis were married, they continued their relationship, and they even had two kids together, making Lori now a mom of four. And by mid-2017, the mystery of Mike's whereabouts had deepened, but still nobody had heard a word from him. Some people, like close friends and family, would receive an occasional text from him, you know, saying he was okay that he was just checking in, but that was pretty much it. No calls, no details about his life, basically nothing. Lori, however, started building this whole new narrative about his absence because now she was saying he didn't vanish and he didn't
Starting point is 00:47:14 leave her and like go off on his own, but he's actually stalking her. He's following her everywhere that she goes. She even claimed that she had to call the police because she spotted him tailing her while she was driving. And according to Lori, when the police arrived on the scene to investigate, they even discovered that Mike had placed tracking devices on her car. And she claimed that there were so many
Starting point is 00:47:35 hidden tracking devices that the police had to take the car to the station so that they could remove all of them. It took him two weeks to find all of them and to get rid of everything. I mean, he was stalking her to like the one millionth degree. Yet despite what happened, she for whatever reason didn't file an official police report for stalking or for harassment. Instead, she just continued to confide in her friends about it, talking about this ongoing surveillance, stalking, but never really wanting to take legal action to address it.
Starting point is 00:48:05 And there was kind of a strange mix with this that had her friends and family's curiosity piqued. I mean, she was raising red flags for anybody who was close to her because on one hand, she was portraying herself as a victim of Mike's stalking and obsession, yet she also wasn't willing to take any legal steps to protect herself or protect her children. If she was truly scared, why wouldn't she act on it? So by 2018, Mike's family and friends had reached their breaking point. Something was clearly wrong, and the fact that nobody had heard from him in now over two years, it was becoming harder to ignore. For people who knew Mike well, it just didn't add up.
Starting point is 00:48:42 They couldn't reconcile the idea that he would just voluntarily cut off all contact, especially with his children. While it was possible that, yeah, he might sever ties with Lori, the one constant in his life was his kids. Mike had always been a dedicated father, and everybody was certain that even if he had tried to distance himself from Lori,
Starting point is 00:49:00 he definitely would not have abandoned his children. So by February of 2018, his friend Scott, the same one who noticed that weird Facebook profile change, the picture to the stock photo of the group from the Bloody Mary site, he knew that he just could not ignore this nagging feeling in his gut anymore. He knew something was wrong.
Starting point is 00:49:19 So he decided that he was gonna take action. I mean, he hadn't heard from his friend in over two years. So he requested that the police perform a welfare check on Mike at Lori's house, and he wasn't really sure what to expect, but he knew that there was just something between all of the stories that wasn't adding up. When law enforcement arrived, Lori appeared calm and very cooperative, answering all their questions without any hesitation. She explained how and when Mike had left, she stuck to her story that he had simply just walked away from their life back in 2015, she allowed the police to come in to search
Starting point is 00:49:51 through the house, I mean just seemingly unbothered by this intrusion, not worried at all. But then, once the officers made their way through the house and into the backyard, everything changed. Because right there near the fire pit that, remember, Lori had so enthusiastically been posting about on social media, the police found an unusual depression in the cement slab. This area was about 6 by 9 feet in size, and the indention was a few inches deep, and, suspiciously, this indention was shaped like a human body. So this discovery immediately raised concerns among the officers, and they asked Lori like, hey, we're gonna come back this evening with search dogs. Is that okay?
Starting point is 00:50:36 And up until that moment, Lori had been warm, chatty, accommodating. But when it came to the backyard, her demeanor drastically shifted. Gone was the friendly cooperative woman. Suddenly she was now cold, guarded, and angry. So she ordered these officers off her property saying, I'm not allowing any dogs in unless you have a warrant. Get out, get off my property, and beat it. If you have any questions, talk to my lawyer.
Starting point is 00:51:03 So this was the kind of reaction that made the investigators pause a little bit. Because if she really had nothing to hide, why the sudden change? Why was she totally fine and open and willing when they were inside the house and now turn into like, you know, this mean guarded person
Starting point is 00:51:20 the second they were in the backyard? And they knew something was up, so they got their warrant. And on March 9th, nearly a month after their very unsettling first visit, the investigators returned to Lori's property. And this time, they didn't come empty-handed. They brought excavation tools, cadaver dogs, and they just had this growing sense that something was very, very wrong. It didn't take long. As soon as the dogs were released into the yard, one of them made a beeline for that fire pit, circling it again and again,
Starting point is 00:51:50 signaling that something below the surface demanded their attention. So a team of officers got to work digging through this thick concrete slab, and within a few hours, their efforts paid off. They saw the first sign of human remains, specifically a partially exposed arm. And from there, the team just continued to dig. Once they were done digging, they found an entire body wrapped in a sheet and secured very tightly with a tarp. It was
Starting point is 00:52:19 discovered approximately three feet underground, and at this point point it was basically just a skeleton wearing only socks and underwear. It was clear that these remains had been there for months, possibly even years. Now while this search was going on, it kind of is reminiscent of Chad Daybell a little bit, she just stayed inside the house just quietly watching as everything was unfolding. But then the moment that the body was uncovered she got in her car and she took off. Investigators kept working, but her exit didn't go unnoticed. I mean, if anything, it only raised more questions about what she knew, right?
Starting point is 00:52:52 And what she might have been trying to avoid. So the body was carefully removed and it was sent for further examination. And using DNA from Mike's father, the authorities confirmed in 2018 that these remains belonged to Mike. The timeline of his death was narrowed down to late 2015, a date that of course matched the last time that anybody had seen him or heard from him. And eventually an autopsy revealed the shocking truth behind Mike's death. He had been shot in the head with a.38 caliber handgun.
Starting point is 00:53:23 Coincidentally this was the same type of gun that Lori kept in her nightstand and had used to threaten Mike in the past. So this discovery confirmed what all of Mike's friends and family had feared. Mike had not just walked out on his life, walked out on his children. He had been murdered. And with each new piece of evidence, they were increasingly convinced that Lori was the one responsible for his death. But proving it? That was going to be a whole different challenge because while the truth was finally starting
Starting point is 00:53:52 to surface, Laurie was not going to go down without a fight. And the investigation into Mike's death? It was only the beginning. Because remember, I told you there was a twist in this at the end that nobody, even myself, saw coming. So after the discovery of Mike's remains, police issued a second warrant a few weeks later so that they could examine the property further. Investigators used specialized lighting to detect blood stains inside the home, and they found evidence of a trail of blood that stretched all the way from the dining room all the way to the back porch. Among the blood stains, they also found multiple hair follicles. The blood in the hair was sent
Starting point is 00:54:30 away for testing, and test results later showed the presence of mixed DNA, lori, and an unidentified male. Now, unfortunately, a direct match would never be found for either, so while it couldn't be directly linked to Mike, he also couldn't be ruled out. So the investigation that followed the discovery of Mike's body started to paint a picture. Not only that Lori had potentially murdered Mike, but that she lived with this secret for years, and also lived with his body in her backyard for years. Investigators found that the last call that Mike's cell phone made was on November 7th, 2015, the last day that anyone ever saw him. His bank accounts also told a very troubling story because by late 2015 his bank activity just came
Starting point is 00:55:16 to a halt. No ATM withdrawals, no credit card purchases, no signs of him living anywhere, nothing. However, somebody had been using his accounts for a short while after November 7th. And all of that evidence pointed directly to Laurie being the one using the accounts. Records showed that on November 19th and 23rd, somebody used Mike's debit card to go buy clothes and also buy lingerie online.
Starting point is 00:55:42 The purchases weren't sent to Georgia, where remember Laurie claimed Mike had moved, but instead it was shipped to her home in Florida under her name. And in the weeks that followed, somebody completely drained Mike's account, which it was mostly online transactions, and that was kind of also out of character for Mike
Starting point is 00:55:59 because he was more of like an in-person kind of shopper, not a big online shopper. But by that December, his account was overdrafted and then never used again. Detectives also uncovered other alarming financial discrepancies, including the fact that those flowers that were sent to Vanessa, remember Jeremy's wife, they were purchased using Lori's personal debit card. Checks addressed to Mike also continued arriving at the house, and they were endorsed and deposited right into an account that Lori controlled. Meanwhile, all of his bills went unpaid, his passport expired, a loan was taken out in his name and never were paid. I mean, come on, it's pretty clear what happened here, right?
Starting point is 00:56:38 But then, beyond just this financial trail, the investigators uncovered a mountain of digital evidence. All those messages that appeared to come from Mike, the text messages, the Facebook posts a mountain of digital evidence. All those messages that appeared to come from Mike, the text messages, the Facebook posts, all of it, they were tracked back to Lori's IP address. So for Mike's friends and family, it confirmed what they had suspected all along. The messages didn't sound like him because they weren't from him. Someone had been impersonating Mike and again all the signs pointed directly to Lori. But that wasn't all.
Starting point is 00:57:07 One of Mike's close friends came forward with text messages that he had received from Mike shortly before he disappeared. And in these texts, Mike shared something chilling. He said Lori was after his life insurance money, and he admitted that he was scared she might kill him for it. Even more disturbing, he told his friend that if anything ever happened to him, Lori would cover it up by pretending to be him online, that she would assume his identity and take over.
Starting point is 00:57:33 It of course sounded unthinkable at the time, but now it was starting to look like a plan that was already in motion. Then there was of course the gun, right? It was a.38 caliber gun that Lori always kept in her nightstand that she had allegedly threatened Mike with in the past, and Lori had ended up selling this gun to a nearby neighbor. And while it was the same type of gun that was used to kill Mike, the bullet that was recovered from his remains was too damaged to conclusively match to a specific gun. So they're building their case, they're gathering all of this evidence, and the investigator sat down with Travis, Lori's new husband. He repeatedly insisted he had no idea that Mike was dead, let alone buried in the backyard of the home that he was now sharing with Lori. He claimed that he always believed that Mike had simply just vanished, that he and Lori were officially divorced. However, when the police dug into the records, it should be no surprise that
Starting point is 00:58:24 they found no trace of a divorce ever being filed. Now during this interview, Travis did recall a very strange comment that Lori had made to him once about Mike, where she said, it's not that he's missing, he's no longer walking this earth. Now at the time, Travis didn't really take it literally, he just assumed it was Lori's dramatic way of saying that Mike had left their lives for good. But investigators, this like peaked their curiosity. And they also discovered another odd detail. Travis and Laurie were never legally married. I mean, despite having that wedding ceremony in Laurie's backyard, there was no official marriage certificate on record. And when they questioned Travis about it, he tried to explain this away saying, you know, we chose not to make it official for financial reasons, that's the only reason why.
Starting point is 00:59:08 But given everything else that the detectives had uncovered, his excuse didn't really seem that convincing. Especially when they found out that Travis was the one who helped Lori pour the concrete that Mike was buried under. So all the evidence piled up, and one thing became undeniable. Mike had not vanished by choice. He had been murdered and all signs pointed to Lori. So finally in September of 2020, Lori was officially named a person of interest and she was arrested. She was charged with second
Starting point is 00:59:36 degree murder and accessory after the fact. But this story was far from over because as you're about to hear, the spotlight would shift and the blame would be placed on two other people that no one ever saw coming. I think I've talked with you guys about my cell phone provider in the past. If I haven't, I'm not going to put them on blast here, but I'll just tell you it's a yellow logo provider and it rhymes with print, but I did not like it because not only was my monthly bill going up every single month, I barely had service anywhere.
Starting point is 01:00:18 I'm not talking like the mountains or a dungeon, literally in the wide open spaces on a beach, I had no service. So finally I heard about Mint Mobile when they became a sponsor of this podcast several months ago. So I decided to give it a try. I was like, okay, hold on.
Starting point is 01:00:30 Like it feels maybe a little gimmicky. Same plan started just $15 a month and that it's on the nation's largest 5G network. But it turns out it's true. And I did the legwork. I called Mint Mobile. I transferred my phone number because I was definitely not about to get a new phone number.
Starting point is 01:00:45 I asked about all of the red tape, all the information and it took literally 10 minutes. I mean, I got the coverage and the speed, not only that I was used to, but obviously way better and for way less money. So while your friends are sweating over maybe data overages or surprise charges, if you switch over to Mint, you will just be like chilling financially.
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Starting point is 01:01:24 with any Mint Mobile plan, and you can bring your phone number along with you, along with all your existing contacts. So ditch overpriced wireless and get three months of premium wireless service from Mint Mobile for 15 bucks a month. I use Mint Mobile and you definitely should too. This year, skip breaking a sweat and breaking the bank.
Starting point is 01:01:44 Get your summer savings and shop premium wireless plans at MintMobile.com slash AE. That's MintMobile.com slash AE. Upfront payment of $45 for a three-month 5-gigabyte plan required equivalent to $15 per month. New customer offer for first three months only, then full price plan options available. Taxes and fees extra., see Mint Mobile for details. ["Dreams of a New World"] Initially, Lori was held without bond in the Lake County jail, but in December of 2020,
Starting point is 01:02:17 she posted a $50,000 bond and she was released while awaiting trial. She pleaded not guilty to the charges. She said she had absolutely nothing to do with Mike's death. But instead of keeping a low profile while she was out on bond, she made a really bizarre move. She posted a very long YouTube video in this attempt to like defend herself and also solicit financial help for all of her legal fees. So right there, sitting on a dock by a body of water, Lori sat next to her defense attorney, denying any involvement in Mike's murder, and introducing what would then become their main
Starting point is 01:02:50 defense argument in this. And I gotta just say, you have to hear this thing to believe it. And it's not like an awkward press conference, it's this way overproduced video that is titled, I'm Innocent. And it is complete with these like overhead drone shots, a sunset, soft music, an American flag. It's almost like a commercial. It's honestly ridiculous, especially because of who she was blaming and the confusing story that she told. Good morning, I'm Jeffrey Weggs. I'm an attorney, criminal attorney here in Lake County, Florida. Sitting to my left is Lori, a client of mine. Lori regrettably is charged with the most onerous crime that any individual could be faced with
Starting point is 01:03:37 in their lifetime. Lori is charged with the crime of murder. This incident stemmed from a relationship having been married to her first husband, Michael. Lori was the victim of repeated physical violence by Michael. This went on for a period of years. It involved the state attorney's office, involved obtaining injunctions for the protection of Lori.
Starting point is 01:04:05 It involved the Department of Children and Families being called into the residence. Michael was removed from the residence and at that point or some point thereafter, Lori starts seeing somebody else. We're not going to mention his name, but he's the subject of this action. This relationship came upon Laurie by Laurie dropping the children off at school and this same individual observing bruising and injuries to Laurie. He confronted Laurie and we don't know to this day or to some extent. We'll find out though. But he proclaimed he had been in the special forces. He had been appointed to protect President Bush
Starting point is 01:04:53 and that he had the special ability to protect Laurie from Michael Shaver. He even advised Laurie that he had the ability and the knowledge and the special skills to kill somebody and that nobody else would ever see it, know it, or be able to pin it on him in any fashion. Michael being out of the house, Laurie had a relationship with this same individual.
Starting point is 01:05:20 The same individual became close to Laurie and during the relationship, Michael was gone. Michael was out of the house. He had disappeared through some means, of which we suspect we have the answer to. Anyway, the same individual, this mystery man, advised Lori that she needed to create a sitting patio in her backyard, told her how much concrete she would need,
Starting point is 01:05:50 told her where to put it, and even assisted her in purchasing the concrete. Well, later these two individuals broke up. This individual went back to his first wife, and later on, Lori began to date somebody else. Well, they had concrete sitting there, and her and this individual who she's now married to, Travis, built this patio.
Starting point is 01:06:20 Unbeknownst to Laurie, underneath the patio lay Michael Shaver. Later in time, law enforcement approached her, having received some word or advice or suspicion that a crime had been committed. Now, we don't know who exactly told law enforcement, but we'll find out about that. And underneath the patio lay Michael Shaver. told law enforcement, but we'll find out about that.
Starting point is 01:06:45 And underneath the patio lay Michael Shaver. Now when law enforcement confronted Lori, Lori wisely said, I want to talk to an attorney. I don't want to speak with y'all unless I first speak with an attorney. Thus she came to me. I haven't interviewed Laurie. I understood what had happened and confronted law enforcement telling them things that I had discovered, what I knew about the case, who we suspected had committed this crime. Law enforcement evidently turned a blind eye on this line eye on this and sometime later eventually arrested or did arrest Laurie for the crime. Now there was no, there's no forensic evidence that ties Laurie to this crime, let alone
Starting point is 01:07:36 any other crime. There's no gun, there's no ballistical evidence, no chemical evidence, no evidence of any other matter that they can link Lori to this particular crime of murder. So the focus of her defense was Jeremy, the guy that she had once been in a relationship with, the one that dumped her because he wanted to make his marriage work. They say he killed Mike out of jealousy. He wanted Lori. He was aware too of the abuse that she had suffered at Mike's hand,
Starting point is 01:08:06 so he wanted to protect her, and he just was so in love with her. Then, without her knowledge, he secretly buried Mike's body on her property, leaving her completely unaware of what had happened. Kind of feels far-fetched, right? But then, after asking for money for Lori's defense, she spoke directly to the camera, fighting back tears, talking about her kids, and she was actually pretty convincing. I'm coming before you guys today just to let you know that we have our suspicions, but I don't know why I've been targeted, why I've been set up or charged with this heinous crime. I am not guilty.
Starting point is 01:08:55 And anybody that knows me knows that my life is my children. I am a daughter, I'm a friend, I'm a neighbor, I'm a servant of God, I'm a wife, and I'm a devoted mother of four. My life is my children. The well-being of my children has and always will be my top priority, and that is the reason that I would never cause any harm to the father of my children. And I know that everybody, there's people out there that are trying to paint this picture of me, but that's not me. I'm loving, I'm caring, I have a servitude heart.
Starting point is 01:09:42 I don't judge people. I accept all, and I always try to see the good in everybody. And right now I am up against something that I would have never imagined possible. And so today I'm coming to you, my family and I are begging you, asking for your assistance to help prove my innocence in this case. Without you, we don't have the financial needs to pay for my attorney's fees. But I can tell you that I am not guilty. I had nothing to do with the murder of Michael Shaver, nor did I have any knowledge of his body being buried under where we were building a gathering place, a conversational fire pit area for our family and friends to spend time together at.
Starting point is 01:10:43 After that, things stayed relatively quiet for a few years and her team was preparing for trial. But then in 2023, the case took an even more shocking turn because instead of just blaming Jeremy with that earlier accusation, her attorneys now filed a motion claiming it wasn't actually Jeremy who pulled the trigger, it was her daughter.
Starting point is 01:11:04 They alleged that Lori's seven-year-old daughter, Isabel, had shot Mike. According to the motion, Isabel had grown up witnessing years of abuse between her parents, and in a moment of fear, while Mike was allegedly beating and threatening to kill Lori, she acted. The claim completely contradicted everything we had heard before. Isabel also had been questioned by police multiple times over the years, and not once did she mention this version of events. But still, Lori's defense said that Isabelle wanted to testify. So a judge ordered a psychological evaluation to determine if she could.
Starting point is 01:11:38 And by this time, Isabelle was a teenager. So her trial began in September of 2024, and of course, her defense team painted Mike as this abusive, violent husband that, you know, Laurie was the victim. She suffered for years and years and years, physical, emotional, mental trauma, even sexual abuse at the hands of him. They portrayed her as this battered woman who just lived in constant fear and did whatever she had to do to survive this toxic relationship. And beyond attempting to destroy Mike's character, they also put forth a wildly contradictory timeline arguing that Mike hadn't actually been killed in November of 2015, you know, even though all the evidence suggested that, but instead he was killed in May of 2016, six months after he had supposedly disappeared. Now as for the actual shooting, they said that Mike and Laurie were in a heated argument,
Starting point is 01:12:29 it got physical. Mike allegedly pinned Laurie down at one point, just beating her horrifically, pressing his foot against her neck. So as she was struggling below him, her seven-year-old daughter came, intervened, and wanted to save her mother's life. According to Laurie's defense, Isabel somehow knew exactly where her mother kept a gun. So she ran inside, she retrieved it from Lori's nightstand, and
Starting point is 01:12:52 she returned just in time to shoot Mike in the head with almost perfect accuracy. Which I gotta say, that's hard for an adult to do, no less a seven year old. And the defense didn't stop there. They further alleged that then Jeremy, the boyfriend, arrived at the house shortly after Isabel fired this shot. And, for reasons that were never explained, he took the gun from her and he shot Mike a second time, so that he could ensure that he was dead. However, the medical examiner's testimony completely contradicted this claim. Mike had only been shot once, and there was only one bullet recovered from his body.
Starting point is 01:13:29 Her defense also then argued that Jeremy told Lori, you know, leave, take the kids with you, which she did, and that by the time that she returned, Mike's body was gone. She didn't know what Jeremy had done, where his body was, what happened, but Jeremy told her, keep quiet, I've handled everything, and stay quiet because if you talk, I will not take the blame alone. But Jeremy testified for the prosecution and he denied everything. He insisted he wasn't at the house during the shooting or the aftermath and that during that time he wasn't even with Lori. They had already ended their relationship. He was working on things with his wife. At any point when you were over at the Shaver residence,
Starting point is 01:14:05 was Michael Shaver there? No. At any point did you arrive on a scene where Michael Shaver had been shot? I say what? At any point did you arrive at the Shaver residence or any other place where Michael Shaver had been shot? No.
Starting point is 01:14:23 At any point were you involved with any sort of altercation with had been shot? No. At any point were you involved with any sort of altercation with Michael Schaeffer? No. At any point did you shoot or injure Michael Schaeffer? No. At any point were you involved with disposing of the body of Michael Schaeffer? No.
Starting point is 01:14:39 And after the affair was exposed, what happened when you were released to the court? I cut it off. Then, on September 12th, Isabelle, who was now 15 years old, she took the stand and she told her side of the story. She started by telling the jury about her parents' relationship and also that she had witnessed them fighting on multiple occasions. It would happen pretty often.
Starting point is 01:15:01 They'd at least argue and fight really bad, pretty much on the daily. But it would escalate to those points a few times a month. Like it was, it wasn't a rare occurrence. Like it happened often. And as a matter of those events, I may have asked this question before, did you feel a need to attempt to protect your mom in any fashion? I did, yes. Did you perceive your mother as a victim through those events? Yes. those that response that transpired on you, did it become a natural and automatic response? You talked about the feeling inside of yourself, of the need to protect your mother. Did that become automatic inside? Yes, it did. Growing up, I mean.
Starting point is 01:16:07 Yeah, I've always stepped in for my mother. I was, I mean, I would, you know, do whatever I could do. Then she went on to say that she witnessed a very violent confrontation between her parents on the back porch of their home in 2016. She claims she heard her mother screaming for help, so she ran to her mom's room, grabbed the gun out of the nightstand, returned to the scene where they were fighting, and she fired the gun at her father. She testified, quote, I grabbed her gun and I went back out and I went to the door. The door was already open and he had my mom on the ground still, still laying on the ground, still kicking her, and I shot him.
Starting point is 01:16:43 But there were a lot of inconsistencies in this story. Isabelle had never mentioned shooting Mike in the past in any of her police interviews over the years. It was only now during the trial, which was nearly a decade after Mike's disappearance, that she now was suddenly claiming that she's the one who pulled the trigger. Her testimony also had other contradictions, including getting the date wrong. She stated that the shooting happened in May of 2016, which, remember, was six months after he disappeared in November of 2015.
Starting point is 01:17:13 So it was almost like she was trying to protect her mom in these moments. Her testimony was shaky at best. Do you know anything about the death of your father? I do. Do you know anything about the death of your father? I do. Do you know anything about how your father died? I do. Could you tell the jury?
Starting point is 01:17:38 So, it was a school day and I'm sorry. And he... First, let's relax, go slow, make sure the jury understands the events, okay? Okay. It was a school morning. Me and my brother were getting ready for school. He hadn't been at the house for a while. He was kicked out, removed.
Starting point is 01:18:02 And me and my brother were in separate rooms where we had pretty much been ready for school. I was eating my breakfast and I was watching TV. We had these like little plastic tables in our rooms. And I was watching TV and I heard arguing. Initially I thought it was a TV and then I was like, no that's not the TV. So my room, it was my room, and then it had a bathroom and then a spare room. And so they all connected to each other, like through the bathroom, it was almost like a little like pathway.
Starting point is 01:18:33 And so I heard, you know, the fighting and the yelling and it escalated. So I went, I always, when I was little, I would go through there to like sneak around and I opened the spare room door, and in front of the spare room door was the dining room. And in front of the dining room, there was a glass door, like a sliding glass door.
Starting point is 01:18:57 So I opened the door to the spare room, and I stood there, and I saw my father and he wasn't supposed to be there and my mom and my father were fighting and my mom went to leave like leave the argument leave the porch around the porch and he pulled her by the arm and he pulled her into her lap onto one of the porch chairs and he held her there and then she was like we can work things out like it's you know we'll figure we'll figure this out it'll be different and he was like no there's no next time there's no figuring it out and he pushed her onto the ground he pushed her onto
Starting point is 01:19:38 the ground and he started kicking her in the stomach and in the back and then he took his other foot and he put it on the side of her face and she was screaming and he was like saying there's not gonna be another time and then he was going to kill her at this time and Her mom's screaming for help obviously and then He put his foot on the side of her face and pushed it into the ground and I didn't hear her anymore and Sorry and So I went to my mom's room
Starting point is 01:20:14 And I went at her end table and I grabbed her I grabbed her gun and I grabbed her, I grabbed her gun and I went back out and I went to the door. The door was already open and he had my mom on the ground still, still holding her to the ground, still kicking her. And I shot him. And nothing happened. He didn't fall. Nothing happened. And then Jeremy... He was sitting in the chair. He was sitting in the chair. Right.
Starting point is 01:21:06 You shot him. Do you know exactly where you shot him? I'm not exactly sure. No. Did you shoot him from the rear region? Where do you think you shot him? I was aiming towards his head, but I'm not sure where the bullet went.
Starting point is 01:21:28 Okay. And what happened after you fired the gun? He was just sitting there, I mean, he wasn't moving, nothing happened. There was no blood, there was no nothing. And then- You'll be standing there. Okay, let me interject here and there if I may. Did you feel when
Starting point is 01:21:49 you fired that shot that that had to be done or he would have killed your mother? Yes, yes. You're firm on that? I'm firm on that. Was he using that type of force in your mind? Yes. It was necessary? Yes. Okay. What happened after you shot him? Or you believe you shot him? Afterwards, Jeremy came and he...
Starting point is 01:22:17 How long? It was right, like right after it happened. Like I hadn't even had a chance to walk away, move nothing yet. And he came in and he took the gun from me and then he shot him again. And that's when he fell to the ground. And my mom had crawled away. He fell to the ground, Jeremy shot him. He told my mom to take us out of the house, take us to school and that we needed to leave. We're not to tell anybody. We can't tell nobody.
Starting point is 01:22:54 We can't call the cops. We can't say anything or else he was going to do the same thing to me and my brother. And he was going to, you know, hurt us too. So we went to school. It almost seemed rehearsed and uncertain, leading a lot of people to believe that she had, in fact, been coached. So realizing now that Isabel's testimony had likely done more harm than good, the defense made a last minute drastic decision.
Starting point is 01:23:21 The very next day, Lori, who was never originally set to testify, she took the stand. Lori used her time in front of the jury to paint herself as a long-time victim of Mike's alleged abuse, and once again claimed that she had filed for divorce even though there was no legal record of it. She then gave her own account of the day that Mike died, telling a story nearly identical to Isabel's, claiming that Mike had un the house that morning, lo attack and then was shot
Starting point is 01:23:50 the struggle. I knew he w I could see him through t out in the back patio. So and we started talking an and I went to walk back in because this wasn't going anywhere and he was not leaving and I opened the sliding glass door to go in and when I did that he took my phone and slammed it up against the sliding glass door. There was an imprint of my thumb on that sliding glass door. He grabbed my arm, pulled me down into his lap. And the furthest tear that was...
Starting point is 01:24:39 I don't have a picture in front of me, but the sliding glass door, there was like a post I don't have a picture in front of me, but the sliding glass door there was like a post and there was a We had like a bistro table sitting there in front and on This further side I guess in front of the sliding glass door there was a chair So he had pulled me down in his lap. He was holding on to me And At that point I Was just trying to convince him, like, okay, okay, okay. Enough. We'll work it out.
Starting point is 01:25:12 What's he saying to you during this? He's just, he's, I was talking at that point. I was scared. That's what I'm saying. Okay, okay, okay. We can work it out because that's what I did every single time because I was scared. I'm in his lap he's holding me there okay and then he pushed me to the ground. Okay as he pushes you to the ground does he do anything? After he pushed me to the ground he was
Starting point is 01:25:40 kicking me in the stomach. Okay presum Presuming you were pregnant or something. Yeah, and I had already told him I had the abortion. And I was screaming at that point. Okay. Is he making any threats to do any harm to you? Any serious bodily harm? Yeah. I mean, he said not this time.
Starting point is 01:26:00 He said I was not getting away. Okay. Not this time. I mean, we had been through so many events, but that's not the first time I mean he had pulled a gun out me at Publix in Claremont. This was not okay. Let's not talk about prior events Okay Yeah, I'm sorry So you're on the ground
Starting point is 01:26:22 And he's kicking you. In the stomach. Okay. Is he kicking you hard? Yes. Okay. Is he making any statements of any intent to kill you or anything of that nature? Yes. Okay.
Starting point is 01:26:41 Is he speaking in such a level that the children could hear this? Oh yeah, we both were. Okay. I was screaming. What's the next thing you recall? The next thing I see is... I can't even say that I've seen her. I... more or less heard it.
Starting point is 01:27:11 And then I think I've seen her. When you say her, who are you referring to? Isabelle. Isabelle? What's Isababel do? She had fired a gunshot. Now, when Isabel fires this gunshot,
Starting point is 01:27:36 do you see where it lodged into Michael or what? I could not. Where are you after Isabel fires the gun? Still on the ground. And the next thing you recall? The next thing I recall is seeing Jay, Jeremy, and hearing the gunshot essentially at the same time.
Starting point is 01:28:04 Is there much time that goes by between Isabel shooting the gun and Jay taking off, or jarring it? No, it felt like forever. I remember looking at her. Had you gotten off the ground? No, no, I had not. Michael was still sitting in the chair.
Starting point is 01:28:24 I had not. Michael was still sitting in the chair. After Jay comes, you hear Jay discharge the firearm. And after Jay discharges the firearm, what do you hear next or observe next? At that point, I started crawling away, but Michael fell forward out of the chair. Go forward on the chair. Out of the chair. Okay. Was that after Jeremy shot or after Isbell shot?
Starting point is 01:29:29 Jeremy shot or after Isabel shot?, and... Who has the gun at that point? I don't... I don't recall that he had the gun. I don't know. Okay, did you see this? He was the last one with the gun. I did not know what was going to happen after that, but I wanted to get the kids out. And the only place I had to take them was school. It wasn't that far away. So you take the kids to school, come back to the house. Is Michael there? No. Is Jay there? No.
Starting point is 01:30:09 Nope. Nope. And we had a conversation with Aiden. I remember that. He had obviously heard commotion and he didn't know what happened. He didn't see it. He was in his room, which was at the further end of the house. And I had just told him,
Starting point is 01:30:37 your dad's gone away for a long, long time, and insinuated that he was going to jail. Now, did you see any fresh dug holes on the property as you walked about it or moved about it beyond that point? No. When Jeremy said, I'll take care of this, did you have any reason to believe that that body was on your property? No, never. There's no way he could have.
Starting point is 01:31:09 I wasn't gone that long where he could have. Finding out the dimension? No. But the prosecution kept fighting back. I mean, the IP address, the credit cards, the text messages. Out of the entire five foot property, she just so happened to pour a new concrete slab directly over the spot that Mike's body was buried at. What's the likelihood of that? If you didn't know where he was buried, why would you pour the slab right there?
Starting point is 01:31:36 Like, was it a coincidence? No, it's clearly a cover-up. And in the end, they just argued the simple truth that her story didn't add up. The fake text messages, the money trail, the concrete project, all of it. It pointed at the same conclusion. Lori had killed Mike, and she had spent years trying to cover it up. So on September 13, 2024, after just four hours of deliberation, the jury found Lori guilty of second-degree murder with a firearm. She was acquitted of accessory after the fact, but two months later in November, 2024, at the age of 42, she was sentenced to life in prison.
Starting point is 01:32:11 Lori didn't speak at her sentencing, but in a 14 page letter to the state attorney's office, she still accused Jeremy of the murder and maintained her innocence, which I think it's interesting because then it's like she backpedaled and she went from Jeremy to her daughter, now back to Jeremy. It just doesn't make sense. Meanwhile, her new husband Travis to this day still believes that Lori is innocent and that she had nothing to
Starting point is 01:32:33 do with Mike's death. But a lot of people are divided out there. Some people think, okay, maybe her daughter did do it. I don't think so. Truly in my heart of hearts, I don't. Many people believe Lori did it and some people even think Jeremy did it. So I am curious to know what you guys think. But this is one of those cases that just sticks with you, not just because of all of the twists and the turns, but because of how long it took for the truth to finally come out. And it reminds us, you know, justice isn't always immediate. Sometimes it's buried, literally and figuratively, for years.
Starting point is 01:33:04 But when the truth does finally surface, at least it brings a little bit of peace to the people who were left behind. As his family said, because they said it best, they said, Michael will never be forgotten. We can be at peace knowing that the story is known by all. And that again is just so powerful and it reminds us why we talk about these cases and these stories. The family wants to make sure these stories are known by everybody, that his voice isn't forgotten. He was a father, he was a son, he was a great man. I mean, as long as the alleged abuse wasn't real,
Starting point is 01:33:35 I will say that, although even if it was, it doesn't warrant him being murdered, but you get what I'm saying. But now, even with Lori behind bars, it's like questions still linger. Why did Isabel testify the way that she did? What really happened that day? And did Lori act alone? Or is there still more to this story that we may never really know? So let me know what you guys think
Starting point is 01:33:56 in the Spotify comment section or the Apple review section, or if you're watching this on YouTube in the comment section. I'm curious to know your thoughts. I know this was a wild one, but I appreciate you guys hearing Mike's story and allowing his voice to continue to be heard. We'll see if we hear any more from Lori. I mean, it's relatively recent that she was sentenced, so I'd imagine we would, but stay tuned for that. All right, thanks again guys for tuning in. I hope
Starting point is 01:34:20 you have a great week. I'll be back with you on Thursday with headline highlights, where we talk through everything happening this week in true crime. And I'll be back again with you too next Monday for a deep dive. All right, until then, be nice, don't kill people. Say it with me, you know my new mantra, just get a divorce, right? And more than that, just stay safe.
Starting point is 01:34:41 All right, bye guys.

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