Sex, Love, and What Else Matters - It All Happened – Last Night on VPR S11 E4 with Ryan Bailey

Episode Date: February 21, 2024

Episode 92. In this episode, Kristen and Luke recap Vanderpump Rules Season 11 Episode 4, “Dog Days of Summer” with guest, Ryan Bailey! Sponsors: Nutrafol is offering our listeners $10 off your first month’s subscription and free shiping when you go to Nutrafol.com and enter promo code Doute Get started with EveryPlate for just $1.49 per meal PLUS $1 steaks for life by going to EveryPlate.com/podcast and entering code 49doute Follow us: @kristendoute @luke__broderick Email us: [e-mail] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Fanduil Casino's exclusive Live Dealer Studio has your chance at the number one feeling, winning, which beats even the 27th best feeling saying, I do. Who wants this last parachute? I do. Enjoy the number one feeling, winning in an exciting Live Dealer Studio, exclusively on Fanduil Casino, where winning is undefeated. 19 plus and physically located in Ontario, gambling problem, go 18665-3126-Hundred or visit connexontario.ca. and physically located in Ontario. Gambling problem? Go 1-866-531-2600

or visit connexontario.ca Please play responsibly. Order up for Damien. Hey, how did your doctor's appointment go by the way? Did you ask about Rebelsys? Actually, I'm seeing my doctor later today. Did you say Rebelsys? My dad's been talking about Rebelsys.

Rebelsys? Really? Yeah, he says it's a pill that's... That's right! Did you know it's also covered by most private insurance plans? Well, I'll definitely be asking my doctor if Rebelsys is right for me. Rebelsys, ask your doctor or visit Rebelsys.ca. Order up for Rebelsys! Hi guys, what's up everybody? We are the blah, welcome back to another episode of It All Happened, Vanipum Rules Season 11, Episode 4, Dog days of summer. And we have Ryan Bailey with us back by popular demand.

And my first note says I needed Ryan. And I wrote that before this episode even started. Ryan, thank you so much. I've never heard somebody need me ever. So this is truly incredible to be needed. And listen to you guys, thank you for having me back. And I guess my first question to you guys is, are you truly taking a shot at adulting?

I've been taking a shot at adulting for like 10 years. And I think I've, I think I got it. I see that Valley commercial every 10 minutes now. And that's the whole tagline after you guys. And I'm like, I'm really excited for the show. And I know we can't really get into it. I just want to see some clips from the show. I'm tired of seeing that one commercial.

I want to see the whole thing. I mean, Ryan, I'll be, I'll tell you a little bit of my perspective. If giving a shot at adulting means trying to assimilate with Chris and Zala friends, then yes. However, I would not completely compare the two. So, wait, Luke, I gotta tell you, wait, sorry. I would not completely compare the two. So, Luke, wait, Luke, I got to tell you, wait, sorry, I'm so excited. I got to tell you, listening to those clips of you,

when you, sorry, when you went over to Sandaball's Modern Farmhouse and I was like, oh my God, to listen to that night and you were trying to explain it and I was like, oh my God, that's wild. And Luke, when I talked to you the first time in this show, I don't think you would even, you were like in the process of moving down or something.

And I was like, how's it going, man? How are you, are you sane still? Like this is, this has gotta be a lot for you. Yes. It's a lot, it's a lot. There's no question about that. It's a definite culture shock. Not, I mean, I knew there was going to be some differences, but damn, what a culture shock.

Just being in LA and becoming part of this group is, is interesting. So I gotta leave it at that. And Ryan, speaking of the valley, I'm just going to say this because, and I don't know like the total truth to it, but the word on the street from my camp will just say is that there should be a super teaser out about the valley in the next week fingers crossed thank god I haven't seen it I'm none of us yeah so we're we're just as hopeful as you are because I've seen Luke and I take out the recycling and like our you know dressed to the nines so many times I mean we're teasing the teaser right now. No I'm more disturbed with Jackson the nines so many times. I mean, we're teasing. No, I'm more disturbed with Jackson, the baby car. Yeah. Like that's I need to I need to stop seeing Jackson, the little baby car

with the serial killer gloves. I was like, by the way, there's a chance the valley is about you guys, but at night, Jackson's a serial killer. Like, is the show about that? Is it like Dexter? I don't know. We can't tell you. That's what I'm saying. You'll have to wait and see. Oh my gosh. Yes. So I needed you so much in this episode. I mean, just the intro to teeth brushing, you know, like they open up the scene and everyone's just brushing their teeth. Like you got to know how they start their day.

Totally. How else would you know what they do in the morning? I didn't know how they start their day. Totally. How else would you know what they do in the morning? I mean, but also it was Santa Claus like, no, they have to show me, they need to know that I have good dental care still. No matter what happened, like was he passionate about letting us see his dental care?

And wasn't he shirtless? Did they just say, what's up? He was shirtless. I think he was shirtless in the brushing of the teeth scene as well. Cause maybe they were like, no more shaving the forehead. We're like 10 years past that.

I'll be honest. I wouldn't get in trouble for this, but brushing my teeth with a camera on me, was one of the weirdest things I've done in my life. I mean, I can't even imagine how you guys do those, those little morning scenes where they do the round robin thing of you guys getting ready to go somewhere.

So it's cold. How did, of course you know that. I just don't know. I don't know how like, of you guys getting ready to go. Round robin, is what it's called. Of course you know that. I just don't know. I don't know how you behave naturally in those scenarios, but I will say, I mean, and I, well I'm sure we'll talk about this later, that New York Times article about Tom's perception of how he lives his life, it's wild. He is so comfortable probably doing bullshit like that, that it's scary, and that he, you know, I mean it just goes to show.

After you do a show for 10 years, you start thinking in this really messed up way that is not real or reality anymore. Right, right. Yeah, the New York, do we start, do we end with the New York Times? Do we end with it? Yeah, yeah, let's end with it.

Let's get in it, we need to get started. Or else we won't get started. Yeah, yeah, let's end with it. Let's get into it. We need to get started or else we won't get started. So, see this episode opens with, obviously from brushing their teeth, but then as James is pool party prep. No, oh no, but it's Lisa, Sheena and Flowers and Lawn. No, it's not. Oh, I miss that. No, no, because they do the round robin

and then it's DJ JK host on, cosy Kennedy cosy Kennedy and he said you know he's really excited about the pool party then we cut to Ariana's room with Katie and Ariana talking about the lift driver hundred percent yes that's where I'm at and Katie says she'd rather work in the shop and then go to Lake Tahoe so they immediately pull back in you know the last episode about the Lake Tahoe which is what's to come in this episode. Woof, woof, woof, woof. You've got to come to Woof.

In the midst of a short scene last week where he's talking about really insane things that are happening to his brother, Lisa then mentions, but we've got to go to Woof. Like she brings up her business right directly after that insane conversation that's really tragic. Like so uncomfortable, so uncomfortable. Uh, like I don't, you guys, I know it's called Vanderpump rules and I'm not

trying to be a hater, but just the heaviness of the Lisa and the new place she has and like how she feel. And I don't want to be a fucking, I'll just say cunt. I'm not, it's my podcast. I don't want to be a cunt I'll just say cunt. I'm not, it's my podcast. I don't want to be a cunt because trust me, I do remember when her brother passed away and I remember how insanely, impossibly difficult that was on her.

And like the amount of empathy that I had for her and like love I wish I could have offered to her at that time. So I cannot even imagine what it was like for her to be filming this and hearing Tom Sanibel say those things and the way that it affected her. Like I do get that.

But what I mean by the Lisa Hevvie is I feel like they're just like, oh, we're not really sure what else to do. So Lisa, do you wanna jump in here? That's how it felt to me as a viewer. Oh yeah, I did that. She's also a producer, so I'm the analytical thinker, right? I'm the one that thinks about this. And clearly she has this aspect, but I did say,

while we were watching this. Luke laughs so hard. Oh, I laughed at her placing flowers when she's like, when she's like, I have to talk to you about something and you're not going to like it. And she's placing these flowers in her face. We rewound it like 15 seconds. I laughed. Watched it again. And Luke was just like flowers in her vase. We rewound it like 15 seconds. I laughed.

Watched it again. And Luke was just like giggling so hard. I was like, how many times have they done this scene and how many flowers did you have set aside to keep placing them? And then I was like, wait a sec. This lady has like eight different restaurants, so many businesses, and it looks like she's a horticulturist. Like she only focuses on flowers.

And it starts with her like picking flowers up as she's welcoming Sheorticulturist. Like she only focuses on flowers. And it starts with her like picking flowers up as she's welcoming Sheena and LaLa in like different flowers than the one she's actually placing. And I'm like, how many fresh flowers are delivered to Lisa's place every day? It's like the Kardashians. It really is. But Lisa goes downtown. For sure. So we think. So what I said, though, was so funny. I said, do you think I could find a bookie that'll give me an over under odds on how many Vanderpump cast members stay in touch with

Lisa when the show ends? Yeah, he's like, I can't. The show is like done done. How many are going to stay in touch with her? Right. Well, I mean, I mean, I think if anything, it'll be the men. She seems to definitely have better feelings for the men of Vanderpump rules than she ever does the women. And Luke, what you had said said and I think is you know she's a producer on this show but she also is campaigning for this show I mean she is one of the biggest proponents along with Schwartz of let's get Tom back into the group we've got to be nice to him we've got to be and she's going around to each person or each group of people and trying to wear them down.

And it's a one-two punch between her and Schwartz. And that's really fascinating. And I would imagine or I would wonder watching these back, if Ariana even watches these back, how that makes her feel in a way. Yeah, I feel like Ariana is a good cast member. So she probably at some point will do her due diligence to like do her homework and her job but at the same time she's on Broadway right now so if I were her I wouldn't. Oh Ariana's living her best life and also to put things in perspective so everybody in cases anyone's missed this this was being filmed only a couple

months after the same scandal all broke. Three months right? Yeah couple months after the scant of all broke. Three months, right? Yeah. Three months after. Right. And we're watching it. Of course she's feeling the way she feels. Yeah. This wasn't like a year and a half later. Like, why hasn't she forgiven him? Like they had cameras up in March when this happened, like March, April, and then

just started filming what? Like June. Yes. So you also find it interesting that also the women of Vanderpump rules, even Sheena, are able to explain their feelings very point blank. And they make sense, but we always will then say, oh, they're just bitches, they're just that, they're just this.

And the men of Vanderpump rules, they speak with like both feet in their mouth and they're like, oh, it's a cosmic experience. And like, oh dude, like Santa ball, he's like, I miss my friend group. But then he gets like, then he gets a chance to hang out with his friend group. And he's like, fuck Sheena and la la, fuck those guys. And I'm like, choose a lane, man.

Do you want your friend group back or don't you? It's for me, it's so, so this is why I'm so happy to not only, especially of you on, but also to have Luke on as well. Because can you imagine if I had to recap this myself? I would just sit here in my own shit going, oh yeah, Tom. Well, remember when everyone hated me? Remember when? Remember when?

Because I just feel all of these feelings that I don't actually imagine. Yeah, that I don't think about truly anymore unless I'm watching this. But I'm seeing this person who did get a mob mentality after me. I accepted it because I just kind of felt like I deserved it to be honest with you, you know? And Tom sitting here laying in his muck,

but he's going, why is everyone so mean to me? I'm like, dude, because you messed up and you're continuing to do so all this time later. That's why. I will say this and to Luke, I mean, I would be so curious is that this has got to be like inception. I mean, first off, we're recapping a show that you were on. Secondly, you've dated a couple of these cast members. Thirdly, you're doing the show with the love of your life

right now. And he is being introduced to all of your past cohorts and cast members and things like that. So the weirdness that you guys are in, like that's why I say it's Inception. And on my show, I always talk about the current cast of Vanderpump Rules. It's almost like if you watch the show as a prison, then it makes more sense that these people can't escape. Like they're like, let me out, dude, let me out.

And they're like, guess where like, we're like handcuffed to this show at this point. Katie has like, like Katie like, Katie's like, no, I don't want to go to Wolf. I want to stay here. Like they don't why and what reality would you want to start keep hanging out with your ex-husband, even if you respect where he's headed in life? Oh, man, that's gotta be why.

And I won't drop names. I'm trying not to get in trouble, but some people have actually said they'd per they want to move to the valley. The valley hasn't aired yet, but people think that the concept of that show makes more sense for their life. And some people currently, VPR people, would like to shift over. So in real life, in real life, Wow. Well, you guys, I love that you guys are potentially poaching people from Vanderpump rules. Hey, come to Valley Village.

It's so much cooler out here. Like that's, by the way, those are the scenes I wanna see. Those are the scenes I wanna see Lala directly over there. In fact, I don't even know where Lala lives. And I think Sheena, it would just help to commute. It's a- It's not even us poaching though. It's us finding out.

That that's what they want. That, mm-hmm. They want their families highlighted. As you start growing up. Right, exactly. So the Valley's all about it. And it's, by the. That, mm-hmm. They want their families highlighted more. Who would want that as you start growing up? Right, exactly. So the valley's all about it. And it's, by the way, it's all evolution. It's all Alex Baskin.

So it's all the same family, but it is interesting to watch everybody grow older. And that's why I think it's so, it's not dark like Scandiball, but it's dark because, yeah, people are in their 40s or nearing their 40s. And it's like, there's this darkness of having to keep going back to the well of really horrible behavior.

And then where do we go from here? Like, oh, Schwartz, you're going to try to convince Lala to be your friend again? I know. It was really painful to watch as someone who is friends with a lot of these cast members, as someone who is on the show. I'm like, ugh, I don't know. It just feels really like the depression talk. I think it's an important talk if it is something that's going to be brought

up. But the way that it's framed on the show just felt, it made me feel icky. Like it hurt my heart, but it also made me feel like really physically uncomfortable. Like this is in this box, this is how we're talking about it and forcing people to do things. Well, two things could be true at once. We always say that on the show is that, you know, like Tom can have these really dark thoughts that I do empathize with. And I got like, oh, I imagine how lonely and how paranoid.

And even in that New York Times article, you really feel the paranoia and all of these things. But you also have to, and Sheena points this out in this scene with Lisa in the beginning of the show is like, he created this, he could also be, I mean, I'm no Rachel artist formerly known as Raquel fan, but like, she went off and did intensive therapy in house therapy. Like Tom could, Tom might want to consider that at a certain point to actually try to release some of that anger that he's pushing off on other people

When it should be looking like more inwards, right? We thus far have not seen a Tom Sandvall that looks inward in my life. I'll agree with that Yeah, I'll agree with that. It's easy. He's lucky to have He's definitely lucky to have Schwartz and Kyle Chan in his life. I'll say that's due specifically that I know pretty well. I know Kyle Chan better than Schwartz. Do you think he's lucky to have Billy Lee though? Because this is now the actual return. I didn't realize Billy Lee was going to be like on the show.

Well, I got to tell you, when he hit that cold plunge, I was like, well, all is fixed. Tom's doing an intense cold plunge. I guess everything's forgiven. Like it was wild to watch that. And then Billy Lee, like the staring, No offense to Billy Lee, but the, like, you know, I think it was last week's episode of the week before when, you know, they had that conversation at Tom's birthday party and she, the overreacting

of like, Oh my God, Tom, yes, yes, Tom. Oh my God. You just, Sorry, the wide eyed as he like gets into the plunge pool and like he goes, I've never been an outsider. And he's like standing there with his hair dripping forward and her eyes are just so big. Like, wow, you were like, he said, it's cosmically changed as if he just did, I don't even know. I lost her. Yeah, I lost her.

He's like on an intensity scale, what is it Tom? And he's like, it's a nine dude, it's a nine. She's like, wow, wow. And I just thought this was so funny that this is supposed to be like some kind of rebirth potentially But also you're right. I mean Kyle Chan does make a lot of sense when he speaks It's I would prefer Kyle Chan to be around Tom Moore I think Billy Lee sometimes comes off a little bit of a sycophant in a sense. Okay, and I don't know if that's true I don't know her personally, but it does seem to be, I don't know, it's hard.

You start to be suspect of everybody's, their true meaning of why they're there, their true reasons of why they're around. So if I can put into a bit of perspective, because when I had my thing, I'll just say it, like let's be real obvious, the thing with Jack's early on season two, lost all my friends, lost my boyfriend, blah, blah, blah,

right, they were like, how the hell are we gonna film with Kristen? We're not kicking her off the show, what are we gonna do? They brought Rachel O'Brien on to like be my friend. Rachel and I joke, like she was like my find a friend, like my pay to friend, like even though she wasn't paid just so everyone knows to be on the show. But it was like- It was felt good for Rachel.

It was like, how do we film with Kristen? Oh, well, Rachel will do it for free. Well, that's nice. And that was a real true friend of mine had been for many, many years and Rachel also wasn't really, wasn't my yes person. Like if I fucked up, Rachel was like, oh no girl, what are you doing? What are you doing? And if anyone hasn't picked up yet, because we've said this a number of times, but Rachel O'Brien's wedding is where Kristen and I linked up. Rachel's also how, well Rachel's also how

Vanderpump really started because Rachel started dating Jax, we met Jax at the same time. They introduced me to Tom Sandoval. She drove me to drop my resume off at Sir the day that I got hired there. So Rachel was- This is like hearing how the Beatles formed. Well, it's very Fleetwood Mac, remember, Ryan? Exactly. We're the reality TV of Fleetwood Mac. We all fuck, we all fight, but at the end of the day we're family. Did you know that hair thinning will happen to approximately one in two women?

I'm one of them. And if you're among them, please know you're not alone. Thinning is normal, but it's not openly talked about and going through it can feel lonely and frustrating. Join the over one million people that are doing something about it with NutriFool. I know you guys have heard of NutriFool. NutriFool is the number one dermatologist recommended hair growth supplement with over one million people seeking thicker, stronger, faster growing hair with less shedding.

Everyone's root cause of hair thinning are different, so a one-size-fits-all approach to hair growth doesn't cut it. NutriFull has multiple formulas that are tailored to give your hair what it needs to grow throughout different stages of life, such as postpartum and menopause, as well as for different lifestyles like plant-based diets. Physician formulated with drug-free ingredients, Nutri-Ful supplements support healthy hair growth from within by targeting root causes of thinning, including stress, hormones, environment, nutrition, lifestyle, and metabolism as they evolve throughout a woman's life. Take their hair wellness quiz

on Nutri-Ful.com for a personalized hair health plan based on your specific root causes. Why I love Nutri-Ful is because Nutri-Ful has a proactive approach that targets the root causes. Why I love NutriFull is because NutriFull has a proactive approach that targets the root causes. So take the first step to visibly thicker, healthier hair. And for a limited time, NutriFull is offering our listeners $10 off your first month subscription and free shipping when you go to NutriFull.com and enter promo code DODI. Find out why over 4500 healthcare care professionals and hairstylists recommend NutriFull for healthier hair. That's nutriFull.com spelled N-U-T-R-A-F-O-L.com promo code DODI.

That's nutriFull.com promo code DODI. A dollar means something again. Got a buck? Get $1 steak for life. Simply add a 10-ounce ranch steak to your weekly order for just $1 per box while your subscription is still active. Now that's raising the stakes for dinner. Looking to budget your food expenses this February? Save big and eat great with America's best value meal kit. Their meals are cheaper than your average fast casual meal, so ditch the takeout and save money

while still enjoying fresh, satisfying meals. They're the easiest way to eat affordably. Get every plate and take back your time this February with fewer trips to the grocery store and meals ready in six simple steps. They plan the meals and deliver pre-portioned ingredients right to your door so you can spend less time meal prepping and more time on you. You can count on every plate to make meal times easier without compromising on quality. Make the sustainable choice this February. Every plate offsets 100% of their delivery emissions and their meals have a 31% lower carbon footprint on average than supermarket meals of the same portion. I'll be honest, at first I was skeptical thinking meal

kits might be expensive but now I am convinced you can get the same deliciousness at a much lower price. You can also customize recipes to your liking by swapping proteins and sides or adding a protein to a veggie dish. Plus, add even more delicious options to your order with over 25 convenient sides, breakfast items, lunches, snacks, desserts, and even more. Get a meal starting at just $1.49 plus $1 stakes for life by going to everyplate.com slash podcast and entering the code 49doty. Subscriptions must be active to qualify and

redeem $1 stake. Get started with every plate starting at just $1.49 per meal plus $1 stakes for life by going to everyplate.com slash podcast and make sure you enter the code 49doty. Subscription must be active to qualify and redeem your $1 stake. What season would be your rumors season? Would it be like fourth season? Yeah, like season four. Yeah, totally. Yeah.

I haven't seen that yet. But just saying that like I get that Sandoval needs to have sort of like an extra person who's not Tom Schwartz, right? Like he needs to have someone he can film with on the side who's his friend, quote unquote. And whether that's the Kyle Chan, it feels more like the Billy Lee. But having someone just worship the ground you walk on and say, everyone's crazy and you're right, isn't, in my opinion, the way to go, especially when what we're seeing from Tom Sannell right now. Right, which absolutely is not Kyle Chan.

That's not what Kyle Chan does. Right, Kyle loves Wishi Washi on the show, but he's not. Kyle gives it to us straight, I will say that. Everybody speaks very highly of Kyle Chan that I've, you know, but it is interesting, like Billy Lee even has that scene where he's like, are you dating again? And it's like, why would you even ask that question

if like the episode before he's saying like, oh, I'm still in love with Rachel, she didn't call me on my birthday. How would he have possibly started dating Billy Lee like were you told to ask this? Like why would you even and like or is it just an opportunity for Tom to be like no dude I'm taking until I hear from Rachel like like it's supposed to be noble in a sense that he is hanging on to like I find it very interesting of like those lines of like you don't understand dude it wasn't just like having sex it was was like hanging out, dude. And it was like, the hanging out was the best part of all of it. Like, they're trying to make it into this grand design romance

when I'm sorry, I just don't know. And by the way, Rachel does it, Rachel even realizes what it actually was now. And so for sure. And again, so everyone was like, I'm not sitting here as a Raquel, Rachel, whatever her name is, fan, don't speak to her. I have no clue. But at the same time, I'm like, he's saying like she hasn't answered my calls or my texts, but I'm in love with her. I'm like, you don't know what love is, homie. You miss the, the person that told you you were so great. And if Billy Lee were like your BFF, wouldn't she, instead of saying, sorry, dating anyone, wouldn't she, instead of saying, sorry, dating anyone, wouldn't she say, I know you're not dating anyone, but do you think you can get back out there?

Why are you asking what he does? Like what he, what he's done the last six months, essentially. Hey, before we get too far ahead, cause I think we're, we're moving along at a pretty good clip and I really love it. But there's a specific comment that Schwartz made at the pool party that I've got to highlight because it made me laugh out loud. I love Schwartz. He's a good guy, I've hung out with him a number of times.

But when he says, I'm on this semi sober curious journey, I laughed so hard. I thought that was such a Schwartz line. But he was not today. Today I'm gonna have a couple drinks. Today it's not a semi sober curious journey. Semi sober curious journey, I thought was such a great line. Oh, shortsy shortsy.

I think you bring up a point. Like all of these guys, they're a blast to hang out with. Like they're so fun. Like shortsies a blast to hang out with. Like, Sandoval I've had a good, I've had a really good, like they make you feel good about yourself and stuff like that.

Yeah. That's not the problem. I think all of these guys are. I've never really hung out with Jax, but I mean like, they are fun people. I just think when it comes down to it, they make some really poor choices as a lot of us men do, including myself, that then comes back to kind of rear its ugly head and they seem to want to fight against that instead of actually learning from it. 100%. And again, Tom Schwartz, he'll never listen to this, but I fucking love you.

With Tom Schwartz, he's like the quick to be aggressive one and then quick to apologize one, but there's rarely or never a true learning moment. Now I've grown. We're seeing the same things. I'm saying this is a viewer season 11 as we did in seasons one, two, three. It's the same bullshit. Boom. I look the way this episode's going. I truly think it will be Velysa and Schwartz bringing everyone back together. And I think that they are going to turn Ariana into the villain here because she's gonna try to hold her ground and the majority of the people are going to turn Ariana into the villain here, because she is gonna try to hold her ground and the majority of the people are going to turn to being like sympathetic with SantaVol's feelings and the attacks and everything.

And you know, I do think there were legs to what he said about, there are legs to this. I don't like the way he approached it, but saying that Lala and Sheena jumped on the train so hard, told everybody how to treat him, and that overflowed into kind of maybe beyond what was deserved. Look, how many people on this show haven't cheated on somebody else? Okay, I'm not here in the defense.

But it's different in a nine-year relationship that nobody suspected. People, you know, unfortunately, people suspected Jax of cheating so many times. 100%. They also, like, saw so many times on the show where Schwartz would like get tanked and be like, I don't remember what I did. And I believe him, but it did seem that he would get to that place and go, I don't know what happened,

but he still was doing that repeatedly. And I do find it odd in this episode where Schwartz very nobly says, I'm not gonna give up on the guy, dude. I'm not gonna do that. He's going so hard. And I was like, man, I wish he had went this hard for his marriage. wish he had like I mean how he's talking about

Sandeval is how you actually talk about a partner you share your life with and I'm not making any kind of weird gay joke or anything like that It's like man He is so noble when he talks about his love for sandball that it almost disappoints you that he couldn't do that for Katie You know Kristen's actually said that before. She has said that long before this. She's told me, and maybe even on a previous podcast that she wishes he would have gone to that length for him and Katie, for his marriage, instead of being so dedicated to his brotherhood,

essentially, we'll say. Yeah, yeah, we're not making the gay jokes. We all make the jokes like Tom and Tom, like, find whatever, but truly at the core of it. Like, I love to see it. Like, I think Tom Sanibel does need that kind of friendship. I just sometimes, and then the thing was, like, Luke, like you said about Ariana, you're right.

Like, even in that talking head when she had, like, the mirror up and she's like, oh, talk to, like, the person who said this, like, referring to Schwartz, I was like, man, she is going to get dinged from the audience on that because people don't want to see her standing up for herself or she's gonna get dinged for that conversation in the pool when Sheena's explaining this and saying, hey, Tom, it sounds manipulative, it sounds like this.

She's spitting the truth, but people don't like to hear women spitting the truth because men actually, like you do feel bad for him. I feel bad for Sandoval at times. I feel like, but then it's like, Luke Luke he would have gotten away with it too if it weren't for that pesky New York Times article. The guy keeps doing stupid things and putting things in his path where it's like every time you build up some goodwill with the audience you tear it down completely because we see like that

Nick Vile in an interview. Oh God. You're still so angry you haven't learned any. Sorry to get so passionate. No. You're good. You're good. Ryan you're still so angry. You haven't learned any. Sorry to get so passionate. No, you're good. You're good. Ryan, you're speaking exactly like from my soul and my court. It's exactly how I feel. Honestly, when I remember when our friend Ali died and Tom, we all worried about Tom. Sheena and I were texting and I said, I need, I feel like I need to text Sannevol and see how he's doing.

Like I'm a little, I'm a little concerned if I'm being honest. Sheena said the same thing. We both text Ariana and said, we want to do this, like separately and she was like, absolutely. Ariana even texts Sandoval to make sure that he was okay. Yeah, I heard you said that. Is that really true? Absolutely.

It was a concern about true life. And you know what, I like about that person that Ariana didn't do a press release about that. Ariana never like tried to get attention for that. She just did it. She just did it. And it hasn't even a press release about that. Ariana never tried to get attention for that. She just did it. She just did it. And it hasn't even been said on the show. I'm just saying, you guys, we all have a heart and a soul

and know when something very tragic happens. You care about a life. And I was very concerned for a moment about Sandoval. And I didn't hear back from him for quite a while, months later. But at the same time, exactly what you were just saying, Ryan, like the New York Times article, the Nick Vile thing, even the Howie Mandel thing, which wasn't too long after it, there's just no growth whatsoever.

It's like he's doubling down on everything that he's done. So how am I supposed to continue to have any, let alone empathy, but you're like sympathy or empathy for this person? It just shows that there's such a big ego there. There's such a big ego that he can't seem to get around and he personalizes everything and I know it's his life. So you would obviously do that, but then you have to look at like the pain you caused other

people and start making amends towards that and realize like, dude, I am human. I messed up. I wanted to have sex. I thought like I was in this nine year relationship. I thought I was a rock star. I still think I'm a rock star. I'm so confused. There's so many things that you can speculate that Tom is going through, but he doesn't help it. He doesn't do himself any favors. Even when he's

trying to show that he is miserable, he'll always then bust out with some kind of angry move like at the end of this episode where I'm like, why are you saying this about even if it's true about Sheena and Lala about the podcast, why say it if you're trying to actually build some kind of bridge? Right, because it's the I'm sorry, but of the, that's what I'll speak from like a survivor standpoint. It's the I'm sorry, but of the narcissistic behavior where it's not, I'm just sorry. You can also still have feelings with I'm sorry, but everything with Tom that as a viewer, we've seen is an I'm sorry, but you did this.

That's why I felt the way. So there is no apology. There's no genuine apology there. And that's what, well, even that, even like the podcast scene, it's like, it's our fault. Our fault that we monetized off this. It's our fault that we talked about, like, I talked about this thing for four years. Yeah. But it's all of a sudden our fault for continuing to do the same thing that we do.

I'm not standing there for Hala and Sheena, but like at the same time, their podcasts do involve the show. It did happen around them. Like, I think it is weird that they're crying more than Ariana is, but it did happen around the show. That's the only point I was trying to make. And I don't want that to be confused for me standing up for all of Santa Vols' actions. That's what I want to make sure that's clear. Oh, I didn't take it as that.

I didn't take it as that at all. So there are certain things I can relate to and there are certain times that other people, I think, may have gone too far. And that's what I'm saying. And also the attacks specifically on shorts and sandies. I spoke out last year, but a little almost a year ago that I that was going, I think too far people putting up Yelp reviews, saying how there's a trash establishment and these sorts of things and retaliation.

I mean, I think that's going too far. Well, I mean, Luke, Luke, you're right. Like that's a I even said on my show. If you're actually going into this restaurant and doing something like it's not funny, it's not like if you're actually leaving Yelp reviews, but I had somebody from Yelp reach out to me and said, like they froze those Yelp reviews, so they were able to expunge like,

cause they did get a massive amount of poor Yelp reviews all at one time. But Yelp reached out and said, hey, we don't like, we know when this stuff is happening. We wanna run a reputable business site. And by the by the way shorts and sandies from all that I hear is doing better than ever over the last couple of I've heard the same Yeah, people want to be around this stuff in this part of the show and it's not something that Continually like we do need to move on from that as well But like Luke like but like being now in a reality star or about to be a reality star,

do you see how it also pressurizes the situation where you do start having to talk about other people that you necessarily wouldn't? Like, Sandoval himself said, when I did an interview with him a long time ago, he said, reality shows make you run towards conflict and in real life, you usually stay away from conflict. That's 100% true. That is something that struggles with.

I 100% acknowledge that. Yeah, completely acknowledge that. I had another point, but it slipped me because the dogs are barking. But something I wanted to add about the Sheena and Ariana thing. And Gibson, it's okay. It is what it is. Gibson loves to bark the second we podcast. He just wants to be heard. No, it's good. It tells the audience this is real. Like bark the second we podcast. He just wants to be heard.

No, it's good. It tells the audience this is real. I always like this little lighter. And this opinion has nothing to do with how I feel about Lala personally and all the garbage and stuff we've seen just so everyone knows. But watching the show and even in real life, because I know the show is edited, but seeing them go so hard so quickly and then turn a couple of months later. And whether you're on a show or not, like you have a choice to make. I think that they do have pressure where they can't just say, I'm not filming with him. I'm putting my foot down. I'm not talking about this stuff. That does not fly. And so you have to cut them some slack and give those girls some graces.

However, when you're talking about this on your podcast and then two to three months later going, I mean, we got to cut them a break and we were best friends for so long and we just like need to talk to them and it's okay. That's the truth you're living in that moment on this show we're watching. And I feel for Ariana and I just feel for Ariana and I get why she is like rolling her eyes and shaking her head and going what the hell. Totally. So let's let's drive back to the to the show a little bit because I know I can't I know that there's this is a scene that Kristen once probably doesn't have comments about but the pool

party. Ryan and I can cover it. No, we're mostly through the pool party. I don't think there's much. Can we talk about how that I love Tom Schwartz brings plants everywhere? Because I just, I wrote that down. Well it is the third plant. He actually is like probably shopping with Lisa at this point for like flowers and plants.

It's like, like even Ally points out, this is the third plant he has given us in a couple of weeks. I wrote it down and then Ally goes, this is the third plant he's given us. And I was like, I love that Tom brings plants for people. So sweet. I was like, OK, Tom and I are the same.

Maybe it's a little much. Anyway, the scene I was bringing up that Kristen has no interest in talking about is Lala's apartment, post cool party, and Tom and Billy Lee, cool plunge. When we get to Lala James about James arrives and they start talking about James the sobriety right I said he's doing it for Ali and talks about that to two and a half years he did for

Raquel essentially and I will say and I believe every psychologist psychiatrist out there will agree that when you are doing something like that for your lifestyle for somebody else, it will not last. You have to do it for yourself, right? Yep. And you agree or disagree there? Yes, I completely agree. I think you're about to bring up the conundrum of that scene potentially. Where he says, no, it's very different with this one. We did get into a fight and she did leave. Yes. And she took the cats and it wasn't homie. So then I decided to not drink anymore to get her back.

And but it's for me this time. It's for me. So my confusion with that scene. And I think what you might be leading towards is that how was it that for two and a half years was for Rachel. But the literally the the onus of that event of her leaving was a huge fight with you of Reading Instagram comments all of those things. Well, it sounds like this is for her once again to actually keep her with you I mean, that's how it sounded to me

And I thought that was like another hypocritical scene in Vanderpump rules where I'm like, does LaLa not point out in this scene that it sounds like you're once again doing it to save a relationship rather than do it for yourself? And I know he gets great benefits in his career from it, like he said, but it seems like the nucleus of that was Allie. Absolutely. That was the biggest portion of why he did it. He brought up the other things. They were just like sprinkles on the donut, but the donut was alley. And that is why he's doing it. And that's why I don't believe it'll last, unless, no, not even unless, I just don't believe it'll last. Something else will trigger and bring it back. I fully believe that that is what will come about in the future. If it's already happened once, it'll happen again.

Well, listen, I don't know DJ James Kennedy, obviously, like you guys do, and especially obviously Kristen here, but I will say it's very dark. I don't personally know him. But I will say it's very dark. I can find no one. Well, it's very dark to watch that pool party where he is sober, but he's pounding THC beverages. Even so much so if Schwartz is like, oh, those are crazy, man, you don't want to do that. And he's like pounding them.

And it was like a flashback for me of that scene. The fireball scene. When he was pouring the fireball in his mouth. And or even that scene where he was like on five edibles at the end of the season when Jacks fought DJ James Kennedy. And I was like, once again, there is this element if anybody wants to face it or not of, and by the way, I've done that. And they're like, I used to get so nervous in public situations.

Like, you know, like, yeah, drinking would would help take or I thought drinking would help take that Yeah, that that that nervousness away, but it doesn't really help but just to see him even with the THC like I can't handle weed at all So like I can't imagine pounding that many Milligrant or whatever it is of like that's like God that's like insane in its own right I'm glad that he I don't know but that that was the one thing that it I that's the thing about having 10 seasons or 11 seasons of this show. You keep having these flashbacks like like Vietnam flashbacks, I would imagine. I'm like, wait a sec, I remember him doing that with a bottle of Fireball, all of these scenes where he was out of control. And Ali

seems like a really nice person from what we've seen of her on this show. I don't know how that all operates when cameras are down. Right. But she does make a lot of sense every time she speaks, even like at the end and dealing with sandball. I'm just so conf I think I'm just so confused about a lot of things that I want to believe that people can change. I do want to believe that. Ryan, I always want to believe that. And I would be the pot calling the kettle black if I didn't want to believe that because I want to everyone that watches season one

and two of Ante or Pumper Rules three, four of now going, I still get messages all the time like, you're so crazy and you're this and you're that. And I'm like, okay, please catch up to speed. That's the thing. And I do want to believe that people can change, but when I see the James Kennedy of it and the Tom Sand of all of it, and it just flashes back to, you know, the last five to 10 years, what really has changed. And it did baffle me because I know Lala with her sobriety is so strong in that and stands

by it so firmly, but that scene frustrated me. It's the only thing I'll say, but it did frustrate me because she was like, I'll never have a relationship with anyone like what I have with James. And I literally said out loud, I hope not. Right. Like I really hope not. Yeah, for sure. I mean, the last thing I want to say too before we move on is that, you know, if you crave

intoxication no matter what your vice is, that's something that's not going to fade away. It's going to shift, but it's not going to fade until you commit to giving them all up. Like that's why, I mean, Lawline in the previous episode said, California sober is bullshit. You know, she's calling it nonsense

and him pounding these THC drinks, which I'll be honest, I'm a very frequent THC consumer. However, I would not go after that. Like that would be so fucked up, pounding multiple THC drinks. I would be so fucked up. I have no interest in that.

Yeah. I mean, we're at a house in the Burbank. Like, I mean, those four airplanes flying over, they're like, who is that man jumping off the roof repeatedly with a DJ system out there? Like that has got to be like planes potentially are going to crash midair seeing this. But no, it's your, you know, I know we're moving on.

I just think it's really interesting as a viewer to watch because you can even point it to Sandoval as well, who points out in this episode that he is also sober, but he is strictly doing it for Raquel. Right. He says, no, I'm doing it for her. Like, maybe we can have our first drink together on a date. Like, he's only doing this to impress her as a romantic gesture. And I feel sad for Tom because obviously he is back on, you know, he's off the wire, he's drinking again. And hopefully responsibly. And, you know, who knows about that Nick?

I mean, I think you were there the night before, but like, Oh, he was so drunk. When I don't know if everyone knows this, but when he showed up, I'm sure you guys get it, but I know for a fact, when he showed up to Nick Vile you guys get it, but I know for a fact when he showed up to Nick viles podcast He was still drunk. I know this for an absolute Like signing my name in blood fact. He was wasted. I mean we all be honest

We all left we all left the house early enough. He would have been totally fine. We was like two one thirty No, no, no, sorry, but he doesn't stop it. It was like two probably like two thirty when we left. Oh Anyway moving on No, no, no, sorry. But he that Schwartz's first line was like Joe is um She's a human being and I'm like wow we finally the mystery itself She's an actual human being Schwartz like the fact of him fumbling around of like we had a situation ship She moved in um, uh like it was so weirdly darkly comedic to me It really was a blessed Schwartz's little heart. Yeah, the struggle to just, she's a, Joza, she's a human being. She's just reaching, just reaching.

And then what did he say? Which was brought up later in the episode, but he said, no, he said this on Watch What Happens Live, like she wasn't my girlfriend, we weren't together, but we had a whirlwind romance. So you're like, It's like a situation ship and like, dude, I mean, like we weren't living together. But like, and the funny thing is, like a lot of us kind of knew what was

how I mean, and that was the thing is like, there were so many like pieces of information flying back and forth. Is that like I had known about Joe and I had like, and, you know, Katie didn't know everything that was going on at the time. So it is interesting for her to come back on the season, but she's coming back on the season as another one of those people like Billy Lee of, I just need to show these, I need to show the world these guys are pretty awesome. And Joe came off like a parrot. Like George would be like, you know that, Sandoval.

And she'd be like, you know that, Sandoval. Yeah. No, 100%. And maybe I pay attention differently, which I'm sure that I do, because I have known her for so many years. But then when there was a moment where she thought Tom was, Schwartz was going to say something, and she went to like interject.

But then he said something different, and she immediately like kind of sat back and like zipped her lips. She was like, oh, I didn't mean to, oh, I didn't mean to like agree with that thing. You still don't talk to her, right? Or do you talk to her? No, no, I have not spoken to her since July of... I've got two, yeah, I've got two things for that. One thing...

Tell us, Luke. One thing is the fact that they had to use scenes where she was talking over them just spoke volumes to me. That means it happened a hell of a lot more than they showed that she was continuously Interjecting and trying to cut in and talking over the Tom's talking right they had to use two scenes of her talking over them To get the content that they wanted from the Tom's you mean to get in order to get the conversation from the Tom's They were like shit all we have is the one where she talked over them twice. 100%.

That was what they wanted. They wanted to get her, or they wanted to get his stuff. They're not highlighting her. They didn't want that. They wanted to get the conversation that was happening between them. Right. 100%.

And then two is that when this was all going down, yeah, I just, it's such a first person thing. She was the first person, first friend of Kristen's I met when I came to California, girl Jo was. And then she completely ghosted Kristen and- When she started staying with shorts. Right, but we didn't find out that till later. Kristen's like, I don't know what's up with Jo.

I haven't heard from her in weeks. She doesn't respond to any of my texts. And then it comes out, she's been staying with Schwartz. And it's like, what the hell is going on? I mean, to me, that just screams this social climber that is an LA kind of normative thing that's like, okay, maybe she's stuck around all these years for a chance to get on TV.

And then she saw Schwartz as the opportunity and decided to leave Kristen behind because of past stuff, you know? Who knows what the reason is? Also, I think there's something to it too that I mean, what it feels like where Schwartz is really so charming. I have so many girlfriends that are like, I've seen everything that he's done,

I would still sleep with him. And I'm like, why do you say, why like, please, we need to help yourself, help yourself from this kind of behavior, is that even Schwartz would be like, stay away, you don't want me, I'm bad. And that just pulls girls closer towards him. And I think it's so interesting. But even like, you know, I know she had reached out to Katie after they broke up and was like, what's up girl, you're strong. And that's the kind of darkness I'm talking about that reality shows, like breakups and all of these things are your worst nightmare regardless.

And then to have reality shows thrown into that mix That's why I think sometimes the audience doesn't understand How exponentially harder of a nightmare than it becomes because you have these people that you don't eat like no You probably didn't expect that Joe would all of a sudden be staying at Schwartz's place No, that's got to be shocking to you as a real friend of yours. No, it's a real friend I haven't who lived down the street where I'm like, wait, but why don't you just come to my apartment? Like you literally helped me move into this apartment.

This is so weird. And why would she just decide to not respond to any of her messages because she was doing that? Why would she not have been like, hey, I think I saw Schwartz the other day. I might be crashing to his place. Why wouldn't she say that if she's a true friend? But that's where I come from.

What about in this scene though where Tom Schwartz invites Tom Sandoval to Tahoe and says, I'm inviting everyone, all the girls, everyone, right in front of Joe. I was sitting there with my head in my hands going, she's just sitting there going, so am I invited or like what's. I was invited on your ski trip with you and Rachel and I mean, yeah, by the way, I want to point out to the audience if they forgot they, you know,

they all like the four of them went on a ski trip where a Sandoval when she was still with Ariana, they got caught at and you know, like fans saw them and you know, Sandoval took a sheepish picture with a fan and that got posted everywhere. Like so Joe was even a part of that little foursome and knew a lot, like went to kind of chance jewelry opening together. So Joe had a relationship with Rachel, and I would assume that she knew exactly what was going on, and that's why I know Schwartz is like a fun, awesome guy,

but when he says like, this isn't about me, I'm not a necessary in any of this, you kind of are because you did know from like, Sandeval admitted on the podcast and all that, he note the day after Schwartz knew about this. So he kind of was an accessory. Like that's the definition of an accessory. So as much as I love, I do really like Schwartz.

Like it is interesting that I hope he can actually understand why sometimes he gets the heaviness that he gets from people is because he kind of did help. Like he might've been trying to tell Sandoval, you gotta tell her, you gotta tell her, but he did know way more than he had let on and I think Joe knew a lot as well. Oh my God, Ryan, for months and months of,

I won't say the names of all the girls, but like a bunch of us in the group truly thought that Schwartz and Raquel had a thing and the only friends they had to hang out with were Joe and Tom Sandoval. So we would, that's why we had, I mean, Katie Maloney would run into them at the bar down the street in the valley

and we would see them together a lot. And we were like, man, they only have Joe and Tom Sandoval to hang out with when in all reality, it was the four of them having essentially these double dates for so long. I mean, that was really so devious and such a weirdly like that's why Sandoval knew what he was doing. So when he now is on the backside of it, where it just feels really bad

because all of it came out, he does have to like remind himself of like, oh, remember, I kind of use Schwartz as an accessory to kind of keep this lie going because I didn't want to tell Ariana yet potentially because the season was still filming. So I was trying to keep potentially these balls in the air and Joe was a part of that as well. So for Joe to come back and kind of like, these guys are great. Let's all give him a cheer. It's kind of disingenuous and I don't know if we're meeting Joe in the way that we should be meeting Joe. I agree. I mean, agreed from the Joe that I knew this isn't the Joe that I knew really so I could agree with you there

But I feel like we all have to remember that being an accessory to things like murder You don't get just get probation like you still get charged So we're not wrong Sandoval reminds me of OJ Simpson and I will say that We're not there yet, Ryan that. Oh my God. We're not there yet, Ryan. It's really hard. Trust me, I can't wait till we go there because I have things. So close. But I will say that I do remember hearing about the four of them being at the bar, Raquel, Joe, Tom and Tom. And that is at the same bar that I ran into Kyle Chan and Santa Vol before I ended up back at his house

a couple weeks ago. But all that aside, we'll just move on with that. I just felt like that was a funny little nugget. This is like, where are you hanging at? Like is this Laurel Tavern, Jackson Saloon? What are we doing here? Should we drop it or not?

Fox Fire. Oh, you're giving away the sweet spot. Oh, I love, no, I love Fox, Fox Fire by the way, they shot a scene, one of my favorite films, Magnolia, no, I love Fox, Foxfire, by the way. They shot a scene, uh, one of my favorite films, Magnolia, Paul Thomas Anderson's film at Foxfire back in the day. Yeah. I heard about that.

I think you told me that right. But that, it's just an awesome old die bar. I didn't want to ruin it and like have it too overwhelmed. It's okay. Go Foxfire. Anyway, uh, let's move forward to Brock and Sheena's dinner date with James and Ellie. Tori is a Zempik joke.

It made me laugh. Oh, that was funny. Yeah, when they're getting ready to go out. Don't be bringing up a Zempik joke. It made me laugh. Oh, that was funny. Yeah, when they're getting ready to go out. Don't be bringing up those Zempik around summer moon. I can't do a Brock invitation, so I do them as a little Irish man. You're a leprechaun. That was definitely Irish.

Yeah, a little leprechaun. I do like your Brock impression whenever you do it on your podcast. It makes me laugh so hard. I was looking at one of your TikToks earlier and it was cracking up. And I don't really have much to say. Just Summers like the cutest and I'm glad they show her because she's so cute and so smart and it just makes me laugh and smile. It's like, ah, here's a happy part until we get to a really sad and dark or shitty

part of this episode. Right. Totally. And my take on it though, the dinner, whatever, I have minimal memory of all that, but Ali has like kind of a longer interview has a longer interview at the end of that scene. And she says, you know, Sanivall's never done anything to her to make her like her personally, which is how I feel.

However, then she goes to say that she's uncomfortable being around Sanivall because of how much he hurt James. And just the depth of that to me says that she feels for her boyfriend being hurt because her boyfriend's friend hooked up with his ex. And it's like, so is he not over his ex? Or what is it there? Because I'll be honest, Kristen.

I'm still trying to wrap my head around the ultimate betrayal. It was, I'm still trying to wrap my head. It was like the blind leading the blind in that scene that it harkens back to. And I thought Ali was going to say, I don't like how he treated Ariana, but it says I don't like how he hurt, you know, James. I was like, wow.

But it also and Kristen, you could probably speak to this though you shouldn't is is I he must be or what we can speculate from watching the television is somebody that doesn't know him, is somebody that feels so insanely deeply about people, so much so that he sometimes will be inebriated to like, but it seems like he makes these connections, whether it be with his dog or the love of my life, or Rachel's the love of my life, Ali's the love of my life,

Kristen's the love of my life, Tom Sandoval's the best friend I ever had. Like he makes these bold proclamations where you almost kind of feel like, oh shit, this guy really felt so deeply that he didn't know how to understand it, where Ali feels bad to hang out with Tom because it hurt DJ James Kennedy so much.

And that's the part I'm trying to wrap my head around of what he's like in scenes off-camera that really lock people in till, I don't know. Do you know what I'm trying to wrap my head around of what he's like in scenes off-camera That really lock people in till I don't know you do you know what I'm starting to say? I know what you're trying to say I know so I don't say anything. I just think I think it's very obvious to anyone who watches this No, it a clear a very easy statement to me because that James has a very addictive personality Regardless with that addiction might be. Whether it's a connection, an intoxication, whatever it may be, it's his addictive personality.

I just say specifically to me, that tells me either one, she chooses not to recognize that how is Santa Claus betrayal hurtful to James, unless it's related to Raquel being his ex-fiance, right? So it's clearly not over her. I understand there being some feelings, but I'll be honest, if I have an ex-girlfriend, an ex-whatever, and a friend of mine starts dating him, I might feel a little something, but it's not the biggest freaking betrayal of my life.

And I'd be able to voice it to them, be like, you know what, you guys do your thing. I don't want to see it for a good amount of time, but one day I might get back to it. Luke, you seem way too, you, you, Luke seems like way too emotionally mature for reality. I gotta tell you, Luke seems like an actual man and it almost scares me because I'm like, oh shit, that's how I need to be in my life. You seem like you actually potentially deal with things like face to face or like don't take things to the extreme. I guess we'll find out on the valley, but it does seem like you have a really good sense,

an emotional matureness that's, I could be wrong, but that's how it seems if you come off. So it is interesting to hear you speak about this and to remind people that this way of behaving is not the norm. Right. And I'm going to say this one thing about Ali and I've said this multiple times. I've met her a handful of times briefly. I'm always very kind to her, play say hello. I've given her hugs. Like I have no issue with Ali. I think she seems like she has a really great head on her shoulders. So really not understanding her relationship, but I don't have to understand it.

What I'm gathering in this, in that specific interview bite, the way that I felt was she's just going to cover up for her boyfriend because it's her boyfriend. It felt like cover up a little bit too. Or just, I don't want to, maybe not even, I don't want to, I don't know. But do you think it's even in her head you even think she even realizes she's covering up? I think she's defending him no matter what and whatever they have. I think whatever they have going on between them, she's going

to keep between them and she's going to defend him on this platform on this show right now. 100% shot to hear she left. I was shocked to hear she did leave for like that. That was actually new information for me that I was like, oh wow, she had left the house at one point, which also goes to show she does have this brain, but I didn't even know that they were,

that they had fought like that at any point. I know, I know. So that was actually new information. Respect to Ali for that. Seriously though, to be, to have the strength to be like, this is behavior I will not deal with and separate herself from that and And to keep it quiet too. Right and to not go to tabloids or not say anything on social media to where no one else knew about it

And just so you guys know like women of domestic violence, and I'm not saying James Hitter Not saying it's physical violence domestic violence is a whole lot of things. It's, it can be mental, psychological, financial, it can be all sorts of things, okay? But women in relationships that are abusive, whatever that could be like, if that is their relationship, if, we'll go back on an average of seven times. So that's my perspective. If that is any, if that is their relationship in any way, shape, or form, her leaving and coming back would make sense. But I do not know anything about her relationship with James, so I also was surprised to hear that their breakup, or they had a moment like that. And you're not making that claim. You're not making that claim.

I'm not. I've just, no, no, I think she made that assumption. Alleged, alleged, alleged. But I'm just saying is that. All allegedly say that when Ali left, Joe tried to move in with the King's Kennedy. I'll say that. I'll say it right here. That's alleged. That's alleged. It might not be true. Yeah. It might. I don't know. I don't know. Like, oh, you have a room open.

Just kidding. Yeah. Yeah. All right. So Vader, pump dogs, right? Graham back in the picture. Well, they're really true. By the way, they're really true. At least it is like she must have had to be like, we've got to advertise Vanderpump Dogs more this season.

We need, it's not shown enough. Like we're all of a sudden, we're seeing a lot of Vanderpump Dogs. Yeah. And I too knew that Graham, I remember hearing when this scene came on, I remember hearing that Raquel had somehow gotten rid of Graham. I don't remember what the story was, but I remember this being in the tabloids last year,

Ryan. I don't know if you remember this or not, but it was like news. And that Graham had gone back to Vanderpump Dog. I just find it so hard to believe that James was totally clueless that this was happening. That's a big, if he was totally clueless that is I don't want to I want to be gentle but It's a very manipulative scene if he was clueless Because that's a real big thing to like just throw on somebody and I would imagine Psychologically that would break me in some ways. I'm not I'm not me not DJ James Kennedy

I know what you mean, but uh, thought, by the way, I was also, I thought he got brought to Wolf in Lake Tahoe. I thought that's where she surprised him with the dog. So I was surprised that it was this. But yeah, that was like a really big thing. But also, you know, the artist formerly known as Raquel, she has a whole different side of this story in terms of the Graham of it all.

And also made a point of saying on our first episode that Graham does not belong with DJ James Kennedy. And I'm just curious, like I'm so confused about these relationships and like I wanna believe that Lisa cares about everybody. I want to believe that Lisa, and he's a guy. Like she's obviously gonna love him more than the girls. It's DJ James Kennedy, like he's a man.

But like it's still confusing to me of like, I hope Lisa was like a hundred percent sure that DJ James Kennedy was ready for that dog. He's ready to take care of a dog. Yeah. Yeah. And the dog that he shared with his ex. Which we see in the preview.

That may not be the case. May or may not be the case. Right. That may or may not be the case. Uh, yeah. The preview, the big thing I took out of the preview for the next episode though was it seemed like they're saying people are being, everyone's being nice to Sandoval. Right? Does that not seem like that?

Well, because Ariana and Katie aren't there. Ariana and Katie aren't there. And like Swartz said in that earlier scene with Joe of like, it's a chance for you to pull like, like it's on Love Island. Can I, can I pull you for a chat? Like Sandoval will probably go around and pull each person for a chat. And Ali does say something very smart in this is that, listen, if I am forced to be around Sandeval, of course I'm going to be empathetic. Of course. Like when you're actually, like if I bumped into Sandeval, I know that about myself, that I would end up being not suck back yet,

but like I would be like, oh fuck, like I remember running away from him at BravoCon because I didn't want to have that interaction at all. And it wasn't because I was ashamed of what I had said on podcasts, but I just wasn't like, I know. It's uncomfortable. You don't. Yeah, I mean, I feel that, Ryan, I feel the same way. When he comes to Jack's bar and we're there and like grabs the mic on karaoke night and it's like Tom Sandoval in the most extras, minus the most extras. And I've been there all night.

I'm like, oh God, what is happening? And he always tries to give me a hug. It's so weird to hear that you do that. That is so weird. He always tries to give me a hug. No, I'm not saying it's wrong. It's just so weird that you- No, but I just, I do this kind of,

like what you just said, I don't run away from him. And I'm also not rude and I'm also aware of my surroundings but I'm not giving him a hug and I'm not going, hey, how's everything been? I'm just like, okay, here we are, like a little wave or whatever. This is what I'm talking about, prison. Like you're still forced to see your ex from like 10 years ago or however long it's been, or however long it's been.

In what reality, and in my sick mind, I'm like, why weren't cameras there? Why are cameras there? So I just be Kristen awkwardly on Tom. I think that every time there aren't cameras around, I was like, whenever they were up, screw that. But like, this is where they should be. Jack's is putting more cameras in Jackson's saloon. So we can sell it as a reality show.

Probably. Dude, I will say though, that over the last nine months, Jack's and I have become friends. And it wasn't reality show? Probably. I do. I will say though that over the last nine months, Jack's and I have become friends and it wasn't a case before that. So, uh, something to watch for in the valley. Listen, I have no, like I only know Jack's from this show and I have. Well, if you judge Jack's just by the show, there's a pattern of behavior that we see again and again and again. I see it.

So I don't know him personally at all. But that's the reality of it as well. So let's talk about the New York Times article. Okay. Let's just do it. I'm not familiar. Yeah, what? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Wild, wild. So this fell upon me this early afternoon. I forget where I saw it first, but I immediately reply, I commented, which I don't always do, and I just wrote, what the fuck? And then I looked and I saw that, I commented, which I don't always do, and I just wrote, what the fuck. And then I looked and I saw that Katie had written, the fuck. And then my favorite thing of my whole day is that then Katie also wrote, hey, Tom Schwartz, what did he really mean? And then someone else commented in quotes, like, oh, it was taken out of context or something like that.

And I was just laughing so hard because it's uncomfortable after everyone, very much uncomfortable after. But I only read the quote about OJ and George Floyd. And I messaged someone that Tom Sanibel and I are both close to. And I sent that meme and just said like, duh fuck. And the message that I was sent back by this person was,

it was taken out of context. It's clickbait. You need to read the whole article. Then I was sent the PDF and I, you know what? I did read the whole article. So did I. I read it. It was so much worse than the one.

Guys, I get an emergency podcast episode about this, where I broke it down line by line, because I was like, maybe it is clickbaity. And like, I will say, like, Tom Sandoval is not an effective communicator. He might be a lot of things. He might be fun to party with. He might be inspirational. He might be good at this and that. He's never been an effective communicator. And I made the point of when I would talk to Ariana, or even when she's on the show, the thing that made their relationship work, One of the things was she could speak Tom and she knew when he was struggling and what he was trying to say. So she would help him say those things.

There is no sandball whisperer anymore. And these crisis PR people, I mean, the New York Times article, this is a big get for Tom and you better come correct if you have these kind of opportunities. And the reporter knew immediately when there was a 23 year old assistant to a crisis PR that was a fan of the show and like in middle school, that person is there and all of a sudden starts chiming in on the conversation where he says, I am more hated than Danny Masterson. And I want to like the thing that made me sad was that I want Tom to sit and think before he speaks. And if he can't do that, he should stay away from Nick Vile. He should stay away from the New York Times until he's actually given some real

thought to this because the thing that Tom doesn't realize is Danny Masterson is in prison. He could not do special forces if he wanted to. He could not do like, by the way, but if Danny Masterson was in prison doing a reality show, Danny Masterson would be getting so much hate on a daily basis. Tom stayed in our faces the entire time. He never left, he never went away, he did his podcast,

he never left. So we never really thought real, and the Nick Vile thing kind of was a spoiler for the whole season, because it was like, oh, that was a couple weeks ago and he's angrier than ever. So my thought was that we were gonna get this season and see like some real contrition and we would actually see this redemption arc.

But the Nick vile thing for me kind of blew that out of the water. And I was like, Oh, he seems even angrier than he was before. Oh, absolutely. And I don't know when this, do you know when the New York times thing, like when it was actually, when they recorded it, when they did the interview? Yeah. It was late December. So this is even before like the, so this is a while back, this is before he got his new

lady love that he's with, you know, so it was late December that they were doing that. But it was a wild read, you guys, because they even mentioned that the reporter was like, oh, wow, the PR person let the Danny Masterson quote go. I was trying to explain to my audience, when I get the opportunity to talk to somebody from Bravo, a Bravo PR person is on with me. They'll cut in if like a line of questioning is like, don't go there, or they'll tell me afterwards, cut that out. We don't want that in there at all. And the fact that, and what I was told and with the Vial podcast as well is that Tom went rogue. They, Bravo didn't know that that vial interview was happening and

This Bravo was a part of but not for this part of the interview So the Danny Masterson quote happened and then George Floyd and OJ Simpson and I know what he meant But the thing is Tom what he doesn't sit and realize is just because your story made it on the CNN news ticker does not mean you are anywhere near a civil rights case or like straight up like I mean there were three people that murdered that he talked about George Floyd and two of the victims of OJ Simpson and I just wish Tom would sit and just think before he speaks because I know he

was trying to say that he couldn't believe it was this sensationalize that it made national news But his choice of the examples for that Were so infuriating to so many people and it kind of every time you mentioned they were tragic like name Yeah, it rips the band-aid off Yeah, it's not doing any favors for himself. That's definitely like adding fire or adding fuel to the fire for the global global or national hate Essentially, that is yeah, I mean I think that's the worst thing she's done in a long time

Just comparing yeah, so maybe what he maybe what he was trying to say was his level of celebrity that if you will like Being sure what he's trying to say all that sort of thing. I'm just trying to, I'm not trying to diagnose what he wanted to say. I'm saying what he did say is one of his biggest fumbles or like flubs he's had, period. That was, this is like astronomical to me. But if you're doing a redemption story, if you're doing a redemption story, you wanna focus on those aspects of the article

where it talked about Tom coming, wanting to be an actor on the 405, you know, like I've been through that. Like that's the stuff you need to focus on those aspects of the article where it talked about Tom coming wanting to be an actor on the 405. You know, like I've been through that. Like that's the stuff you need to focus on of this dream or the quote in there of him talking about, I used to want to be an actor and now I kind of like don't. Like I want to be this. But it also there was aside from those. The quote about the actor thing though. I know what he was saying. I read because I read the article and he's like, I wanted to be there. You try to do what I do. He said he, I don't have my phone right now, but it was something like I no longer, I don't know if it was respect actors or something like

that because they don't know what it's like to do this. Like dude, really? He's just not, he's not thinking. And I think it was a fascinating article aside from those quotes because we got Alex Baskin talking about hyper-reality, we got him talking about, but also Tom talking about the way he lives his life. Every scenario, he lives it three times. He lives it when he shoots it, he lives it when he talks about it, and then he lives it when the audience gets it. And my thought of that was like, it made me so immensely sad to hear him say that.

And it made me think maybe soon is the time to take a year off so you can live your life just one time. Because the fact that you were like, even the author, the reporter of this said, you know, he was acting like he was on a reality show. He was pausing for airplanes. He was like, you know, he had the lights dimmed in his place because they shoot in here so often.

And making sure they were recording at the right time. Yeah. And just like, yeah, he's so disconnected. He's disconnected from actual life. He compared him to Heath Ledger's The Joker when he was in his misfitting Zara outfit for the talking Harry the K. And I was like, oh my goodness, she compared him to Heath Ledger's Joker. And I just thought, oh my goodness, she compared him to Heath Ledger's Joker. And I just thought, I don't know. Like just mental, very mental health. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

I just hope he said something so dominant. He apologized for it. I hope, I hope he's okay. I don't know. But Ryan, like two hours before we started doing this, like right around the time, I don't know if this is when he posted it, but I saw that he posted an apology and it was the most non-Tom Sandoval apology I've ever read in my life. It was-

Well finally, his crisis PR is helping him. They stuck to him. It was just the most, like they panicked, someone panicked and said, we have to say something really quickly. And that to me just made it worse. And I say that from a first person perspective. You really think that made it worse? You think that made it worse? I don't think it helped.

I don't think it helped. I did. Do you think it did? I think, well, you gotta stop the bleeding. You gotta say something. And I think that's why we both watch what happens live because I thought they were like, watch what happens live, just ignored it completely.

I thought they were gonna address it. Yeah. I thought they were gonna address it and they just ignored it completely. And I thought that was interesting. Look, most people don't know him on a personal level to be able to dissect whether or not those are his words, like what you just said.

I'm saying it was a quick enough reaction that yes, it helped. Okay, that's fair. It was a fast reaction. I guess, it helped. Okay, that's fair. It was a fast reaction. I guess I'm just speaking from like my own perspective of going through things that were shunned in the pub, within publicity, and then having someone sort of take the reins for you and not letting you have your own voice isn't always well received when you would like to say something more heartfelt that's happened to me in the past where I've like regretted that and said like I really wish my words would have been said and not like those of a PR person because I don't think that PR kind of bullshit is

always well received but I do get what both of you are saying and maybe that's something I'm not considering because I do think of Tom in a very different way than maybe everyone else does. Yeah, exactly. Well, I mean Tom this is like the craft. Tom also thinks he's, I think savvy at this sometimes and he's not. And it kind of like Ariana in the pool today

when she's talking to Sheena and saying like, there's a bit of a manipulation that seems like it's happening here sometimes with Tom where, you know, and this is somebody that knows him very well and knows sometimes how he behaves in these situations. But it is frustrating though, is like he gets these opportunities like Nick Vile or the New York Times. That's a big opportunity that you should make ever like make sure everything

in your power where you. Want to express that you realize exactly what you did. You realize why it did hurt people. But man, I'm a human. I make mistakes. I need to move on. I really want to move on. I'm trying to get there.

And that's the part that is being left out of all of these things. And it's like, I made it like, oh, Jerry McGuire, like, help me help you, Tom. Like, you got to stop this. And if you're not, if you're going to keep doing this, stop with these opportunities because they're not going to keep coming around.

Like you'll always then like be like thrown off as a villain in reality shows for the rest of your life. And you know, you don't have to. Or God forbid we canceled at some point. Like truly like, I'm not a fan of cancel culture as everyone knows. But the more you double down on these huge opportunities, like I hope that's not the case because I don't think it is helpful to just shut some, like say, stop speaking forever, but you have to know when it's your time to stop speaking for a moment. Like what you were saying Ryan this whole time about the New York Times article is like, just stop.

Stop and think. Look inward, think about what you wanna say, what's the right thing to say, what you want to do and like speak clearly. And the venue in which you're saying it. Like, be aware of every venue. Like, when you show up to Nick Viles 45 minutes late, maybe just don't go at that point. Correct. Maybe go like, I'm hung over, I'm sad about my friend. Now is not the time because I feel anger in me. And I think he's got to find a, I don't want to die. I just hope he can find a way that doesn't involve another woman or booze or whatever

To actually let go of some of that anger and realize, man, I did this to myself. Oh god, those humans are so messed up Like, oh man, and I'm on a reality show that that's my job and the hot potato I have at this time It's all on me. It's not on jacks anymore. It's not on you, Christian. It's on me. And I am getting older. I feel like bringing up the past. It's like Here's my best years have passed me by all of these sad things that I understand the plate of man But like, you know, we're once again leaving out the victim of Ariana because she has a Broadway show and a big sponsorship Like also Ariana is not out there doing podcasts every day or like going, oh, fuck Tom Sandoval.

We're all doing that, I guess, but she is keeping her mouth shut. And I hope Sandoval can get to a point where he can do that as well. And, you know, even after last week's episode, I saw the good will start to come back towards him, you know, when he was talking about how deeply he was feeling and how dark that was. I think a lot of people were taking pause to reconsider the situation and even

how we responded to it. And that's why he's just got a, he's just got a chill. I agree. And Ariana is so great. I mean, because, and that's really the reason why I made the comment I did about his comment about LaLa and Sheena having some legs is because Ariana didn't act that way. Ariana is the one that had the most to say, the most experienced. She is the one that it happened to.

And she didn't go and do these things. Sheena and Lala are the ones that jumped at the opportunity and told, did essentially tell the public how to act, how to treat Tom in the future. This is what people should be doing. And so that's why I'm saying that kind of had legs. And that's also why I have so much respect for Ariana. Ariana is amazing. I have no, I can't come up with a negative thing to say about Ariana. And I never have.

And I'm so curious. Hey, Luke, the pins and batteries thing. What's that? She didn't get the pins and batteries. Yeah, she wasn't getting them. Oh, right, right. Not making her own lattes last year. That's horrible. That's horrible. What a bitch. Yeah, she wasn't getting the more. Not making her own lattes last year. That's horrible.

What a bitch. Yeah, yeah, that's horrible. Yeah, I'm really curious what the rest of this season is going to look like, knowing what we know because of the Vile podcast and obviously this New York Times thing. And if there's going to be ebbs and flows, are we going to see any humility from Tom

or is this just going to continue? But we know the way it ends. So I'm like, oh, I know that's it. It's like Titanic. We know the ship goes down. Like we know where he ends up on the vial thing. So it's like, Oh man, he's so angry still. And I, and I, I yeah, I don't know. I'm really cute. I mean, listen, we need Peter. Where's Peter? That's Peter. Peter this season. I don't know. I'm really, I mean, listen, we need Peter. Where's Peter? That's all we need. Where is Peter? We'll get him. There's no Peter this season. Let's get, we'll get...

We need Peter, sir, manager to sit down with Tom and have a talk. I need to hear what Peter needs to say. Either way, we need a big Peter scene with Tom, where he's like, dude, what did you do, man? Like, I don't know. Like, yeah, it's right. Everybody's cheated on everybody in the show, but we're getting older. And I think even the viewers, we're all getting older. And what was once cute and funny to us. And kind of like, it really took a turn with Scandival. And I think it really did shock us because we didn't expect that out of Tom. And we, you know, we were all, yeah, no, with Ariana. So I think that's it. And I think he's got to realize that. And that's a compliment to him at the end of the day, is that we liked him so much that we thought that that wasn't in him, but also at the same time I realized that he's human.

I thought that. Like I truly was absolutely mind blown until Vanderpump, like when they picked the cameras back up and he was kind of saying the same things over and over, but just hearing about the Scandival in itself at the very beginning of it, I was pretty shocked. I didn't think that that was even possible. So the doubling down of it that we're still seeing now, again, to repeat myself is just, it's frustrating is what it is. Right. And don't forget, we're only about 10 days.

What were we? 10 days away from the anniversary of the infamous night at TomTom. March 1st or March 4th or March 4th, and Kristen was there that night. You were there that night. So, I'm the reason we were there. Kristen didn't even know that was going on. I'm like, let's go to Tom Tom because they're playing.

And she's like, what? Tom Sanamal and the most extras are playing. I was like, I'm good. Yeah, I drug her ass there. And I was sitting next to Ariadna when she found the phone. Well, this is the kind of shit I, like I bet I just pray that Tom doesn't like, I just want him to start thinking it clearly.

Like, Tom just has such bad ideas now that I am like, please don't do a one year anniversary Tom Sandoval in the most extras concert. Please don't do that. Oh my God, Ryan. I was just trying to think of things that like in the moment sound like good to him. I just like, if you're getting these opportunities,

use them for what they are and use it as a force of good. And really, like I said, I do not like Rachel, but at the same time, how is she being able, like somebody that never was able to give a speech, how is she communicating better than Tom these days? It's why. Like how are we at that point? Like that's, I just, I need Kyle Chan

to be with him at all times. I need, I just, I don't know. It's really frustrating to watch. He needs to not have the guest people surrounding him. We need a better, we need like a Tom whisperer, someone like Ella and old Ariana. Okay, Ryan, I love you so much. Thank you for this. Thank you guys for inviting me back. I noticed, yeah, I know it's painful for you guys or for you, especially Kristin to talk about, but, you know, I, I, congratulations on the success of all of this, but it's got to be weird for you guys. And, you know, I'm always, it's always a joy to be here regardless if

we're talking about misery. So right. Here we go. But everyone, follow Ryan, you know, Ryan, subscribe, always comment, give it a billion stars, a K a five. That's all they will let you do. By the way, wait, wait, promise me that you guys will come on my podcast when you're allowed to do press. Any time. Totally. You tell me. Okay. Also, shout out to Vanderpod Recaps who

listens to your show every week. She does these great write-ups of your podcast. She does. And, you know, sometimes when I don't get to listen, I will go there and I'll be like, oh my God, this is really good. Like, this is good. So, Vanderpod Recaps, I hope we got something good for you to recap on your posts. Yes, actually that's a great shout out. Thank you so much, Ryan.

You're the best everyone. Ryan's always the best. That's why everyone has literally begged us to have you on, so thank you. But yes, I'm all over your podcast whenever you want me, per usual. Same, thanks Ryan. Thanks guys.

Make sure to follow us on social media. You can follow me on all platforms at christen doting and follow Luke on Instagram at Luke double underscore broad red. Be sure to click the subscribe button so you can stay up to date with new episodes every single Wednesday. Thanks for listening. See you next week.

Thanks for listening. See you next week Hey, I'm Christian I'm Erica and I'm Josh and we're the hosts of your new favorite show the judges come hang out with us as we chat about Hilarious odd and sometimes disgusting stories from the internet you like Scooby-Doo trying to quit Taco Bell You ever done ventriloquy with your vagina? Or have you ever came so hard you pushed your partner through a window? Then this show is definitely for you. Listen, we're obviously judging you for admitting that, but why not come be judgy with us? Listen to the judgies on the iHeart app,

on Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.