Sex, Love, and What Else Matters - Wild at Heart: Balancing Animal Training, Motherhood, and Entrepreneurship

Episode Date: May 31, 2024

Episode 113. This week, one of Kristen’s closest friends, Kirstin McMillan joins the podcast! Kirstin is a studio animal trainer that has been featured on ABC, Animal Planet, CBS, NY Times, and so much more! From the Circus to Hollywood, Kirstin shares her story of how she grew up and what got her into training animals. She also opens up about how group therapy completely changed her life, having imposter syndrome while starting her business in a male dominated industry, and what it was like growing up in a hostile enviornment. She also shares tips on training dogs such as working with dogs with separation anxiety and more! Sponsors: Go to Addyi.com and use code DOUTE for a $10 telemedicine appointment Go to JamesMae.co and use the code Podcast15 for 15% off your order. Follow us: @kristendoute @luke__broderick Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Hi Luke. Hi, only 2,000 miles away at the moment. Only? Oh man, only 2,000. Oh yeah. Yeah, not too bad. Well, we're never really that far apart otherwise unless you're traveling abroad. We have a very special guest today.

If you guys follow my Instagram, you have many questions for her. She has been my lifeline for the past like seven and a half years. Now I want to introduce to the podcast professional animal trainer, lady boss ass bitch, small business owner and working mom, Kirsten McMillan. Hi Kirsten. Hey guys. Happy to been. Hey, guys. Happy to be here. Oh my God, I'm so excited.

When we started, we rebranded to the Balancing Act, you were one of the first people that I wrote down on my wish list to have on the pod. I wonder why. Why would that be? We have so much to talk about today. I mean, I can't tell you the amount of people that wrote in with probably most of the same questions for you, which we'll get to later at the end of the pod. But I just want to start with, so how I met you, it was, I wish I could remember because I'm not on Twitter anymore.

After they took my blue check mark away, I got like pissy about it because of Elon Musk. It's fine. I'll be okay. But I was on Twitter when I first got my dog Bowie as you guys know, he just passed away recently Rest in paradise little buddy, but when I first got Bowie He was a rescue. He was somewhere between six and eight years old. He was very underweight I got him to a healthy weight and then I just knew that I had a lot of a lot of work to put in because He was a shelter dog. He was a street dog a lot of work to put in because he was a shelter dog. He was a street dog. He, even though small but mighty,

but he was very aggressive. And I went on Twitter and said, does anybody have a dog trainer? I had never reached out to a dog trainer before. Gibson and Bowie are my first dogs that I've ever had all on my own. And someone on Twitter recommended you. And I reached out and you brought Bowie back to life.

And he became like the happiest dog ever from like a reactive dog. He just had so many issues. So that's how I know you and you were pregnant with your twins. Yes, I was. Very pregnant. I was pregnant. I was heavily.

Yes. I mean, is there any such thing as unheavily pregnant when there are twins involved? No, there's not. I learned that one. It's like you're three months pregnant with twins, you're heavily pregnant. Unheavily pregnant when there are twins involved. No, there's not I learned that one Your three months pregnant with twins you're heavily pregnant But I want you to just sort of talk everyone through because yes, you trained my dogs But you don't just train dogs by any oh, yeah

So just like how you got started when did you move to LA? How did how did you get into business? Because I know it goes back generations in your family. It does, yeah. So in my family, I'm technically third generation. My dad and my uncle in England ran away and joined the circus, literally. Circus called Circus Canis, which is a Swiss circus. From the town in England that we're from is up north called Workington.

It's a wee tiny town near the Lake District. People do not go outside of London. When they visit England, they visit London. It's a wee tiny town near the Lake District. People do not go outside of London. When they visit England, they visit London. That's where they go. But there's a whole other country and it's really cold up there. It's near Liverpool, so if that gives you an idea. Cold, gray, foggy, where the Beatles came from vibes. Accent is extremely different and there's really not a lot of opportunities in that area. So my dad and my uncle literally ran away, joined the circus. They came to America, met my mom, and had my brothers and I. And my dad stayed working. At this point, he's working for Ringlings, and he stayed working for Ringlings up until I was eight. My

brothers were in the... My dad was the tiger trainer in Ringlings. He had 16 tigers and a black leopard and an African lion in our act. Also, we had an Asian elephant and a bear, and my mom worked the elephant and the bear and the birds, we had birds too. And that is how I grew up on a wild animal compound, wild animal ranches. I never had a dog growing up. I never had a pet growing up. Wait, stop it. Yeah, yeah. Those were prey with the animals that we had grown up with. I grew up with things that had serious teeth and nails.

Yeah. You sound like it. Wow. Yes. So there's no pets involved. Actually, my dad used to have a German Shepherd in his act, but that was a whole other story. But we had never had a pet or a dog that was like anything like what people have today. So then in America, we started transitioning out of that circus life around age eight, and then went more into Hollywood animal training, studio work, and that's where it stayed. My uncle

settled on the West Coast in the Antelope Valley, which is where pretty much all the studio animal ranches are that train animals, actors for Hollywood. And then my dad settled on the East Coast, mainly in Florida. We were in New Jersey for a while as well though. And then it just kind of became the Hollywood thing. Then cut to on my grandfather's deathbed. My grandfather was illegitimate. He tells my uncle who his dad was

and he was a local race horse trainer. So it ended up going back a third generation, which was really, really interesting. And of course he was married, which was why it was a scandal. Right. And I knew obviously, cause you're my bud, you're my friend, I love you.

And I did know a bit about your background. I just want the listeners to really understand, but I don't think people really grasp, maybe more nowadays they do, but like every movie that you watch, every commercial that you see, every television show, if there's a dog, an animal of any sort, any kind, it requires a trainer on set. There's an animal in it.

Yeah, correct. There's usually a union trainer. There's a union for us, believe it or not. And there's one of us on set. I just worked on set this morning. I worked on a TV show called Blippi this morning with a Dalmatian who is a firehouse dog. Is it the Dalmatian that I know? Yes, Caspar.

Caspar? Cool. At Caspar the Dalmatian on the Gram, you guys. Get it. Get it. Yes. I know Caspar's dad. Brett Alan Nelson, who is an incredible Hollywood stylist.

Yes, he's brilliant. Doja Cat, Ariana Grande, Lizzo. I mean, so many incredible, he's a really incredible guy. Anyway, but so yeah, and then we got into dogs separately. And that was, I would say, mainly because of my little brother, Brandon. Who I think people know. They don't know that they know, but they do. Yes. So my little brother, Brandon, Brandon McMillan, is also a trainer. He has a show

called CBS Lucky Dog on CBS. It's a Saturday morning show. It's a lot of MILF viewing and kids. Perfect for Saturday mornings. That's right. Saturday morning. That's right. Right. Who else is watching TV Saturday morning? And he's an incredible dog trainer. And he's, you know, also does shark diving for Discovery during Shark Week. Amazing. Wow. I didn't know that. Yeah. Yeah. Look him up on, you can go and see on YouTube some of the videos from Discovery Shark Week. Yeah. He's one of the hosts. Which is my favorite week of the whole entire year. I mean, better than Christmas. Yeah. Kristin loves sharks, but she's terrified of them.

Terrified. Right. A weird obsession. I've got a question, Kirsten. Have you ever worked on a movie like 101 Dalmatians or a movie that is very animal heavy? Beethoven. Yeah, yeah. A movie like that. Let me think. I've not done. My family went because we were not known for dog work.

Right. You would have also been so young. Very young during the Beethoven's, that's true. But because we were not known for dog work, we did not do a ton of dog movies. But I'll tell you that like, you know, my family did like we bought a zoo, you know, that was us, the tiger in what is the movie about with Bradley Cooper in Vegas? I forgot the name of it now. Hangover.

You know, the hangover. Yeah, the tiger in the hangover. That was KD, our tiger. So my family has done a lot of movies that you guys have seen. A lot of our animals are animals that you have seen on different commercials and TV shows, features over the years. Because we were never the dog company, we were always the wild animal company, we don't really get called for the big dog movie. But my little brother's show is dog-oriented, but it's more about pulling rescue dogs from shelters and training them to be pets.

Cool. Have you ever met Caesar, the dog whisperer? In person once, what's funny is it was in New York, which was so out of context. He seemed to know who I was at that time. I've always liked him. Caesar is obviously the controversial name drop. And the funny thing is, right? He is, the funny thing is I've noticed over the years,

so many people like to use him as the divisive point, right? Almost how like Trump has become the divisive point in politics. It's like, Caesar Milan has somehow become the Donald Trump of the animal training world, or the dog training world, I should say. Yeah, and you can get people into camps. And then, he somehow became the Donald Trump of the animal training world, or the dog training world, I should say. Yeah.

And you can get people into camps. I love what he has done for this industry because he's brought so much attention to it. And because he was the first person that got people to question, like, wait a minute, am I the problem? What if it's me? Everybody else was like, you do this with the dog. And he was literally, right?

Yes. He was the first person. One million percent. It is not about a bad BAD dog or a, it's the human, it's the owner, the, you know, the mom, dad of the dog. Dogs are just dogs. Yes. Exactly.

Oh my gosh. 100%. So I love that. And also he brought a lot of money into my industry so that they were green lighting other animal shows, which brings my whole industry a lot of work and we get to you know A lot of fulfillment from that work and a lot of people don't realize this but in the animal actor world about 80% Of the dogs and cats that you see on film are rescues that we pull from shelters So the more we work we have the more animals we will adopt and you know bring out of these

What makes a terrible pet you guys guys, makes an incredible studio dog. Like the Marley and me of it is the best metaphor. Yeah. That dog that's digging up the yard and destroying the furniture and like peeing everywhere and barking its brains out and your neighbors leaving a note. I love that dog because that dog wants a job. That's all he wants. Yeah. It's going it's going over your head. Yeah. It's like one of the things you taught me

that it's so, it's like a keep it simple, stupid kind of a thing is, does your dog, just speaking of dogs specifically, cause that's what we have, obviously, I don't have a tiger, but like your dog wants pay, pet, or praise, right? Yeah. It was like, is your dog a dog that responds to payment,

like kibble or a treat and that's what makes them happy. We're like, is your dog a dog that responds to payment like kibble or a treat? And that's what makes them happy. We're like, my dog Gibson, my Yorkie is all about the praise. All he wants is attention. He wants to be totally as a good boy. He wants to be that big, nice, long pet. That's a good boy. He will do anything. But I think that's so interesting that you that you're talking about how Rick rescues. they want a job, like they want purpose. Yeah, that's right. That's really what it is. It's so true.

Those over the top ones that a lot of people can't keep in an apartment or that just dug up the yard and that was the final straw or pick up the furniture. It's so true. That I will definitely agree with. And then, okay, so obviously you're a mom, a mom of three with twins, as we said earlier. How is that balancing? Like when you first started, when you open, you know, when you first started your own business, number one is a woman.

And you and I were texting just before this about that, because I do, I, what you said to me in a text was a lot of women have imposter syndrome where they have they believe that they have to have this MBA or they have to have all of this schooling or training or whatever to start a business which you do not have which I mean I got lucky except reality tv I have a platform but it's like it's hustle it's hard work and hustle so like how did you coming from your background obviously we we get that but like that doesn't mean you have a business at your fingertips. Yeah. Yeah.

Well, so, you know, as far as skill is concerned, here's what's funny. When I started my own business, I was going to start a dog training business, right? Because my industry is always, you know, we famously had a big strike over the summer, which I'm sure a lot of you guys heard about. So that has been happening for years, you guys. A different version, there was producer strikes, writers strikes, actors strikes. There's all different strikes.

Then all the work goes to Canada for a few years. Then all the work goes to New Zealand for a few years. There was time all the work went to Louisiana, all the work went to South Africa, over and over because of tax codes, tax breaks on and on, a different value system. So because of that, I realized years ago that I didn't want to be an employee really. I had a killer work ethic, a killer work ethic,

right? And so was I going to channel that into other people's businesses. I always ran my family's businesses for them and that was amazing. And I went off and worked, I left animal training for two years and I worked in beauty. I think it is so important. I did not know that either. I did. I worked in beauty for two years, you guys. I managed a medical spa, not just any medical spa, one of the top medical spas in town, you know, Calvin Klein, Michelle Pfeiffer, big politicians, Barbara Streisand, Catherine Zeta-Jones, like all the people.

And it was so incredible to use my work ethic in a totally different field. And I also got to have clean fingernails, which I was so excited about. And I got to like brush my hair and not go home greasy and things like that. It was so cool. But then when I left that and I was like, okay, I want to start, I had a boyfriend. He was like, you should really start your own business.

And I had a lot of skill, but I did not have a lot of credibility with dogs. And I didn't have a lot of skill with dogs, and it's a totally different world. It's almost like reality versus scripted, right? People are like, oh, you work in TV. It's like, yes, but it's two different worlds. And so I had to really gain, yeah.

I had to gain skill in that area. And so the studio animal trainers, they don't have that pet dog training skill, right? But we all work together all the time on set. So we collaborate a lot, right? Like you work with a cast a lot. You worked with one cast and you got thrown in with another. You know how to do that.

When I started working with pet dogs, I tried to learn and I tried to reach out to other pet dog trainers. They do not work with people. They're lone wolves and they were very odd. I don't know if the industry has changed a lot in the last 20 years. They were very peculiar, mainly at that time females, but they were peculiar, very lone wolf. And they had short tempers and didn't socially were strange, but they could teach your dog to heal like a mother. So I was like, okay, I didn't really feel like I knew what to do.

But I gave myself permission. I just said, I'm not going to wait for permission. So I started at the bottom and I was like, I'm going to just start hiking dogs and teach them to be off leash. I knew how to do that one thing is getting dogs really good off leash and getting them socialized. And then I built, so I sort of built backwards from there. And here's, I'll tell you this, is that like, it really is the 10,000 hours rule or like

the one kick 10,000 times instead of 10,000 kicks one time each. There is something to that. I just kept my nose to the grind and learned from the bottom part of the industry. And I do see that today a lot of people want to start higher. There's a dues paying period and the work builds the worth. And people want to skip that step. And the thing is you can skip that step. You can skip through connections.

You can skip it through financial privilege. You can skip it through, you know, if you're a super hot girl, you might get, you know, connected in a certain person, place or situation. There's a lot of different ways. Absolutely. That's Hollywood, baby. Right. It is. It's just that if you do skip that step,

you're going to also be skipping a lot of the grit and the strength that you've built, you know, along the way. And that's kind of essentially it's like a disservice to yourself. It is. It definitely is. But I actually had I'll tell you this. You can get success, right? Holding onto the success that you get is a whole different bag of chips. So I came from a very, you know, this is going to shock you. But when you are the kind of man that gets into

the ring with 16 tigers and African lion and a leopard every day, and we don't declaw in my family, so we got hooks in the ring, That's not a super emotionally stable person. Okay. I know that's weird, right? You think that would be like a really level man. Right. A very stoic like person that has it all kind of figured out mentally. One would think.

Really figured out. So I had a really violent childhood with a lot of trauma in the house, trauma with the big T. Child protective services were at my house. Child protective services were at my school. I was court ordered into psychotherapy at a young age. So I came out of my childhood. I was a teenager. I ran away when I was 17 to get away from my dad.

So I didn't feel like I had a lot of self-esteem and stuff. You know what I mean? And I came to LA from where my dad was on the East Coast in Florida, and I didn't have a big network out here. I was trying to make it on my own. So when I got to that point though, a few years later, when I was trying to start my own business, there was a big mess inside of me. I had a ton of work ethic though, and I had developed that. So I hadn't spent my time doing nothing, and I think that was valuable. But then I ended up going into a group therapy program,

and it changed my entire life. Everything before that, when I would build things up, I would build them up over a period of years, and then they would always fall apart on me. Sometimes it was other people, sometimes it was me. I was the common denominator in any given circumstance. So, but they would always fall apart. That's so interesting. Just real quick, if I can ask a question. I've obviously like a huge therapy advocate, but I'm not familiar with group therapy.

Yeah, I went to therapy my whole life prior to then. I also, I like therapy, like talk therapy. I definitely felt heard and I understand why I was doing the things that I was doing, but nothing changed. That was for me. Or the changes were not profound and I needed profound changes because I was a really destructive person. I was always sweet. I always had integrity. So it wasn't bad, right? But there was a huge destructive side to me. And you know, I think a lot of people don't like talking about themselves that way because there's so much shame attached to that. And I'm okay with outing myself because whenever I look at people that I admire and I only hear that it was for the most part

pretty good or things get rose colored, goggled over, I have a hard time relating to them. There were ugly phases of my life where I was given opportunities that I destroyed or I didn't get opportunities and other people did and I felt a ton of resentment and envy, you know, and things like that. And then I would.

Oh, do I ever, yeah. I said, do I ever know? Like, I feel like all the listeners that do know me are like, is she talking about you or herself, Kristin? Oh, yeah. And of course, human emotions, and I think especially at certain ages, but you can feel those things without those things owning you.

And you can have some self-destructive qualities without those things owning you. And those things were owning me at a certain point. And I just really saw that if I kept on the path I was going on, that it was just going to get worse and I was going to build greater things and then they were all going to come down. And I didn't know how not to do it because as they say in the 12 step program, I'm not in a 12 step program, but there's so much brilliant wisdom there. There is. Yeah. Self-knowledge fails us nothing. Right? You can know why you do something and that

doesn't mean you can fix it. Right? Like people can know why they're drug addicts and not stop using drugs. Right. You can be self-aware, but not hate the word change, fix, whatever you want to call it. Yeah. So group therapy. So talk therapy, of course, is what I'm sure you've talked about that a lot, right? And like I said, love it. And I had exceptionally trained people, people that I actually really liked, and I had a lot of comfort going to them. I met someone who was going through group therapy and we ended up being a couple.

And I watched him do this stuff and I was very judgy about it. And I watched his entire life change. And then I got like, I got pissed off, you know, because I was like, everything was, I mean, quick, you guys, in less than a year, like things were changing. And then I was like, part'm pissed off. Because I was like, everything was, I mean, quick, you guys, in less than a year, things were changing. And then I was like, part of my problem at that time was I already had everything figured

out. So when you're in that space is you're not going to learn, right? You're really not because you're closing yourself up. Yeah, you're saying I'm good. And it's because we don't want to be vulnerable. But anyway, I humbled my egotistical ass and I went into this program. And this was a Jungian based group therapy program and it was excruciating.

It was so uncomfortable. I hated it so much. I literally hated it so much and I felt all this stuff get stirred up inside of me, but my hubris kicked in again. And this was, I started off with a seven-day workshop. It was a workshop, right? Or I think it was six days. And I was like, okay, that was good.

And we're good for now. As if, because I fixed what was wrong in six days. Yeah. So anyway, let's fast forward. And I'm sure you can guess I ended up in similar situations like a year down the line. And I called her back and I asked her to take me into a six month program that she doesn't let you go into unless you do the little five, six day program.

And they're extremely different. The five, six day program is very boilerplate, which is why my hubris came up. I already know this stuff. I've already done a lot of this stuff, right? And so, yeah, it's not embarrassing at all to look back at that. And so I did the six month program and it was like a tidal wave in my life. Everything that I was doing

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from two to 13,000 Canadian dollars. Mass skill tests required. Visit coke.com slash Marvel24rules.ca for official rules. There was so much work involved. There was homework, there was rituals. It was psycho-spiritual. It was unbelievable. And everybody that I was working with,

I watched their lives changing. So I ended up doing work with her for a few years and because I enjoyed it so much. And it was like a garden. It was like there were harvest, it was harvest after harvest. After that, the things I built became bigger. The growth I got, the returns I got were so much greater than what I put in because I was not in that place. If you get a million, most of us, if we get, we pray for money, if you get that $10 million, you will blow it.

You don't know what to do with that money. You cannot handle that money. Just like if you get that incredible relationship with like a super hot woman, you'll probably blow it with her because you aren't ready for that woman, right? Like whatever that is, or a really developed person. And so it's to prepare ourselves in all these inner ways to have the strength to hold the opportunities

that the universe or God or whatever word you want to use brings to us. Right. And so that to me was the biggest game changer, which has nothing to do with dogs, animals, dog training, clean skills. It's just full on self work for everything that is going to come in your future, your children, your relationships, your business, where you're going to move, your friends, but mostly the you, the you of it, which is massive. I had no desire to have children at this time, and that's not uncommon for adults that have gone through abusive childhoods. And I don't mean like a bad year.

I'm talking about where it was like 15 years of really hardcore stuff going on. So that was not surprising that I didn't mean like a bad year. I'm talking about like where it was like 15 years of like really hardcore stuff going on. Yeah. So that was not surprising that I didn't want to have kids. And then I built my businesses and I had just such a great time with them. I had my pet dog training business, which I put all my focus into and I started getting celebrity clients. Like my first celebrity client that I got referred to was Justin Timberlake.

And it was right before he dropped. No big deal. The sexy. Yeah. getting celebrity clients. My first celebrity client that I got referred to was Justin Timberlake. It was right before he dropped the Sexy Back album. He's so sweet. To this day, I'm still in touch with that camp. They're the sweetest people. He had two boxers and then got a third. Then his business partner, Tracy Yalla, and then Josh Groban. It just kept going up and up from there. I just remember being in situations that just kept getting bigger and up from there. And I just remember being in situations that just kept getting bigger and bigger and bigger, then it felt like surfing to me. I was never seduced by the celebrity of it. I always kept my integrity intact, kept a basic rate sheet instead of a lot of people will, in LA, they'll size up a person for what they have. Yeah, I've never done that touchwood, not even once. And so all of that, me holding that my character to myself, my word to myself,

and not being shady, helped me hold on to my success, I believe, in addition to that personal development work, but that personal development work informed my value system. And it was really incredible. So that's how I built my business. Then I went back and started a little studio animal training company because my family was retiring out of exotics. That is a thing of the past. We don't do that anymore. The world has changed so much in the last 10 years, 20 years since I was little. Everything has completely changed. Yeah. It's not appropriate to do those things now. We realize, what do they say? Maya Angelou, when you know better, you do better.

Luke knows how much I love Maya Angelou. What a gal. So yeah, then I started my studio animal training company just with like small dog jobs and just kept it really simple. And then that set up and got bigger to the point where I got called by CBS to do a huge dog show. Animal Planet brought me on an animal show, gave me my first producers credit. Nickelodeon called me in on a huge animal show, gave me a producers credit. What I shouldn't say gave it to me. That was my position on the...

Yeah. Yeah, it was the appropriate role. Same thing with Fox. Like it just went on and on and on, and I'm the only female animal trainer in my industry that has gone on these shows from development and produced and then worked on them. I feel really proud in a humble way to have helped. Yeah, done things like that because the studio,

the on-camera animal training world, you guys, in my world is male-dominated, which is ironic because the pet dog training world is very female heavy. Yeah, I've kind of feel that way. Yeah. I'm like, I mean, obviously I've been a client of yours or my dogs have, I guess, and a friend for so many years. And even friends I have outside of California with dog trainers, I feel like it's maybe like one guy. I'm racking my brain for this. I'm like, wow, that's so interesting.

Something I never even thought of. Is that something that's changed more recently too? Like you said, decade after decade, was it mostly male dominated 20 years ago and it's shifted or? Oh, oh my God. So in the studio animal training world, all the company owners were men. It

was just especially wild animal companies. It was all men. And the women that worked for them were always like super hot. And they would like date the guy. And there was a lot of that, like, you know, where they have a lot of power. And then they were so cool because there they are, like working with lions and horses and elephants and like that's not attractive or anything, you know, women and they're always tall and masculine. Like it's, it wasn't a bad situation you guys. Like these men weren't pulling women because of their money. It was a good package deal, you know?

Starting a company up until I don't know what year that it became easier. Literally Kirsten, while I was just a random little fact while you and I were texting, I swear it's the universe, I was on Instagram looking at the questions that our listeners wrote in for you. And the first thing that popped up on my feed was Sarah Blakely, who owns Spanx. And she and she just did this, this little video where she said, do you know what year it was when women were allowed to get a business loan without a man cosigning? And whoever she was with off camera said like, mm, 1974. She was like, 1988.

88, okay. 1988 was the first year that a woman was allowed to get a small business loan without a man cosigning. My God, that's wild advice. And it just blew my mind. It was like the universe is throwing this at me while you and I are texting about being a powerful woman that owns her own business. It used to be next to impossible, to be honest. It was that way with mortgages too, back in the 70s and 80s. Women couldn't get a mortgage

without a man's signature. I know, right? It is wild. Yeah, it is. Thank goodness we've come a long ways. Yes. Yeah, agree 100%. Yeah, so it was super male dominated. It's still a lot of the company owners are men. There are more women now. But I think as far as on camera, the animal shows... I'm going to wait. Tell me which animal show you like with a cool on camera woman trainer.

No, you're not wrong. My brain just went bindi Erwin. We're thinking of Steve Irwin. We're thinking of Jacques Cousteau. We're thinking of Cesar Millan and my brother who's amazing. Absolutely. Yeah, it really is that way. And so what's funny is, so years ago I was put up for a show. It was called Alpha Female. And it was about my life when I was still working with the wild animals on the ranch. We're going like maybe 12 years back now.

And maybe 13. Yeah. And so they pitched it to own and pitch it to TLC to own Discovery, NBC. And one of the women at NBC, NBC for like the Saturday morning lineup, it was the woman too who said this. So we did a killer pitch reel. So for the people that don't know a pitch reel, a lot of people call it a sizzle reel, but truly within the industry, we call it a pitch reel.

You film a seven minute synopsis of what the episode is going to look like, right? So you do a little intro of the person, very short, and then you chop up what that 30 minutes would look like into seven minutes. It's the high notes. It's just the high notes, and it's edited. It should look pretty darn good.

Then from there, they will decide if they want to make a pilot out of that. You don't get to skip the pitch reel step unless you're a big name already. If you're a big name, then they'll go ahead and just pilot you. So Owen ended up picking it up. But the decline we got from NBC was really interesting. The woman said, while Kirsten is very pretty, we're not looking for a female animal trainer show yet. And I was so offended because I was like, there was not a makeup job. I put on like tinted sunblock and probably lip balm and mascara. Like there were no fake lashes.

There was no lip injections. There was no, I did not go and get a blowout. I did my own like wash job that morning. You know what I'm saying? Yes. And there was no makeup team. There was no hair. I was so offended and it was so condescending

and it was that sideways dig. So it's a lot of times the female in a position that can be also keeping us down, we can't just pin the tail on the men because there's an internalized thing with women as well. Oh, for sure. That's just fucking wild though, but. Yeah, and then when Animal Planet had declined,

they were like not doing, at that time, they have a, every season they have like, okay, here are the kind of shows we're looking for. They were like, we're only looking for shows that are A, B, and C this year. We love Kirsten though. It was so refreshing to see a female animal trainer that wasn't annoying. Yeah. Yeah.

I know. It was again from the woman and I was like, she did not mean this in a bad way. And I totally, I understand what she's saying also, but that's like a lot of times they don't greenlight the female animal trainer shows because apparently we can come off as annoying on camera. So yeah. Like air quotes annoying, which is annoying. Yeah. I've worked on a couple of pilots and shows over the years with the odd female dog trainer where they're trying to put something together and there is less of an

authority figure sometimes that's instilled like that I'm very take charge I grew up with like a my dad's a caveman like a chrome magnum take charge well you're you're an alpha female which I'm totally not I don't think I am anyway it might work I'm an alpha female right that would might be the only place in my life that I am but like it is true that a'm an alpha female. That might be the only place in my life that I am. But it is true that a lot of times on the shows that we females, we've internalized more of a school mom type personality. And that's not, it's something really important to kind of like, we don't have to do that.

We don't have to. There can be a wisdom figure involved without it being that. So like, I mean, that's just so much growth and so much bravery, so much courage, so much hard work. Do you feel like all of that instilled in you and working so hard and then finally having this better view of yourself? I'm just totally throwing this into the wind like as a guest, but is that when you decided like, I would love to be a mom? Because you said before you didn't, your upbringing, whatever, but what made you want to be a mom knowing that you have these businesses and these companies and you're busting your ass?

Yeah. So, um, I had, because of my dysfunction, my inner dysfunction, I picked on suitable men for a long time. This is extremely symptomatic when we don't have our stuff worked out as women, we are going to pick partners that are really great reflections of our issues, but not somebody who you feel safe taking on a massive responsibility with.

So I did not realize that part of that with me, that part of my lack of desire to be a parent, once I had worked through my issues, it became apparent that that was largely due to me not feeling safe with doing this with someone, especially the people I had been formerly with. Once I had really internalized that therapy that I had gone through the group work, because it takes a few years to practice it as well. You get the information and then you grill those muscles, right? It's not like, cool, we'll just add water and now I'm fixed. No one's fixed, right? We're going through the layers, right?

And my choices and partners completely changed. They say that your life isn't a window, your life is a mirror. Absolutely. You're not looking at people. Everyone in my life that is close to me and in my life on a regular basis, they're reflecting something about me back to me. That could be positive or negative. When I was with those unsuitable dysfunctional men that said more about my character, then

it really, I could take their inventory all day, but it wasn't about them. That hit home. At the end of the day, but it wasn't about them. Ooh, ooh, that hit home. At the end of the day, there really are no other people. And if you wanna win every time, you're unstoppable if you continue to look at every person, place, and situation as a reflection of something that's truthful about you.

This is very, very Jungian, and this is not my personal concept. I could never take credit for something so brilliant. And so I picked more suitable partners. And not every relationship that I chose at that time, and this was conscious. Previously, all of my choices in men were unconscious, right? They worked out amazing

because I got so much from them, you guys. But when I became conscious, I remember picking someone that was very unlike them than I had been with previously. And I thought to myself, this is a really good place for me to practice high functioning behavior because my previous relationships I was practicing very destructive low functioning behavior and I didn't want those muscles were

big right we didn't have to work that body part at the gym. Like now I needed to do leg day okay and leg day for me okay was practicing this with a really good partner. But maybe I didn't want to be with him forever, but I needed to work on these parts of me. And so I did that. And then that relationship ended very functionally without any negativity or drama or anything. And then the next person I picked was Drew, who was the father of my kids. And it was so easy with him. I just decided, like, okay, he really wanted to. He really wanted to have kids and he proposed to me. At this point, I just turned 40 though.

So don't worry you guys about like not figuring it out right away and don't worry about figuring it out until later, but start figuring it out. Like, it's not gonna figure itself out and no one owes you anything. Go get what's yours, go get it. You don't wait, it's not going to figure itself out and no one owes you anything. Go get what's yours. Go get it.

You don't wait. It's not going to come knocking. You go put time into it and that is how it works. And so when I found Drew and he and I connected and he proposed to me and PS, I've had men proposed previously, but there was no jewelry involved. I'll tell you this ladies, don't let them go there. If they start talking and saying those pretty words, shut it down. I always say that unless there's jewelry, you don't even like there needs to be jewelry. They're not taking it seriously.

And I'm not saying this from a monetary place. I'm saying this, did you go and invest in something? It means something. This is the ritual of partnership on a deeper level, commitment on a deeper level. So I remember I said okay because there were cameras there, he hired people to like do the surprise. Touch the moment. And then I was thinking, I was like I can't say this while they're filming because I don't want to like screw up the video. Afterwards we went and got Chinese food, we were in San Francisco and I said to him, I said listen like, like, you know, I said yes and all. But like, just so you know, like you talked about wanting to have kids

for the last year, like I'm 40. Like I have never wanted that. I would totally try to have kids with you. I'm not going to try indefinitely. I'm not going to do 50,000 rounds of in vitro. I will try this. But you have to decide if you want to be with me anyway, because I might not be able to.

I would be open to adoption and things like that, but I'm not going to put my body through six rounds, seven rounds of in vitro. I have friends that have done that and it has been really hard on them and the relationship. And also I just decided it wasn't right for me. If that feels right to you, like go. And so he said, no, it's fine. And I said, no, you need to think about this. So I made him go. So you really were 40 when you first said, OK, I could give this a go.

Because I'm 41. And I mean, I'm the chick who's, I want a baby, I want a baby, or I want a baby. But this is the first time at 41, well, we tried when I was 40. So I think it's really interesting because we have a lot of women and men who listen to our podcasts that are in that same space.

So I think it's really fascinating. Yeah, so I made him go think about it. So he came back to me after a week and was like, I'm sure, and I can do this. I want to do this with you even if we can't have kids. And I was like, great. I will proceed then with the engagement. Carry on. Forget about that.

Just move on. Like nothing happened. So I really believe that like the inner work that I did helped me be in like a good state with myself spiritually, emotionally and physically. And it made me make better health choices for myself. I wasn't doing those destructive things that I was doing when I was young. So we got pregnant after a few months and I miscarried after like, I want to say like two months, was it? Or like maybe three months, something like that. And I was not emotionally wrecked about it because I know that a lot of, you know, I forgot the percentage of pregnancies and miscarriage, but a lot do. And so then we tried again and I got pregnant,

like I wanna say like six months later, I was 41 at that time. And I did not do any fertility treatments or anything like that. I was taking chased berry, which my friend told me about, it's like this herb and it like, you know, other than that, what is it called? Chased berry, chased berry. Chased berry. Yeah.

Or is it chaste berry? C-H-A-S-T-E-B-E-R-R-Y. Okay. You're writing this downberry. Chasteberry. Yeah. Or is it Chastberry? C-H-A-S-T-E-B-E-R-R-Y. Okay. You're writing this down in the early. Yes. Yeah. You can get it on Amazon.

Y'all. Or Whole Foods. That is what I took. But I have always taken really good care of my health. I've always worked out regularly. And I really think that that is because I've done that, I don't think it works against you in the big picture long term. I don't think that's everything either.

But it was pretty detox. And every couple of years, I've always done a detox on myself. I mean, there's plastics in everything. Like there's plastics in your cells. You know what I'm saying? Totally. Yeah. It's not like woo-woo. It's like there's plastic in your cells. So, and I got the clarity you get from that on top of it. But anyway, cut to, got pregnant at 41. I had a very easy pregnancy, very easy, no drama, everything was normal. They do crazy genetic testing on you.

Yeah, we've done that. And then he was born nine, Apgar, whatever they call it. Everything was good, no issues. And then a couple years later, once you've been pregnant and carried a baby to term, they say it's easier to get pregnant again and carry a baby to term. So we were deciding on if we should try for a second. Little did I know, I was already pregnant. And oh my God, it was twins.

And I was like, wait, what? And so once you're over age 36, you become a lot more likely to drop a second egg. So you yeah, I didn't know that. I thought you were going to say geriatric pregnancy. I was like, yeah, oh, it is. Oh, yeah. Geriatric. We all know that. Yeah, I know. It's like horrible. You're like, get me the cane and the shawl and the rocker, you know, and the baby. Like, it's so degrading. Whatever, man.

So don't make me bring up Charlie Chaplin having a child that anyone, no one calls it a geriatric paternity hood. It's just geriatric pregnancy, but okay, with geriatric sperm. I was pregnant with the twins and I didn't, again, I had not done any fertility treatments. We did just come back from Italy that we were gone for a month in Italy with the kid, with my baby. He was one year old at that time. And I was just feeling myself again.

I got back into yoga and all the things. So I do believe that that actually is something to do with it. And again, I always ate pretty clean, barely drank at that time at all. And I think that those things are very important when you're trying to ask your body to do like, grow life in me, please.

Yeah, good point. Yeah, and especially as we get older. But yeah, after age 36, you become more likely to drop that second egg. Tall women are also genetically more predisposed to twinhood, to bearing twins. And I was both of those things. So it is not shocking. But in LA, everybody has in to bearing twins. So, and I was both of those things, you know? So it is not shocking, but in LA everybody has in vitro twins. So everybody assumed that I did fertility treatments

or I, yes, I did not do any of that, nothing of that. And I did, at that time I wasn't even taking my chest berry, chest berry. So that was my experience you guys, as far as like actually getting pregnant. So you'd attribute it more to like health, eating clean and working out and yoga and everything like that, just being a healthy individual. Yeah.

Yeah. I think that because of that, my body stayed in such a good state of homeostasis for so long. And PS Luke, because I had done a lot of that inner work, I was being very good to myself. I saw myself as all of that was worth it every day. Those things became something that I was doing for myself with myself every day. It became an act of self-love.

And self-love is created in the repair process. Again, it's a step that does not get skipped. And I think that a lot of people underestimate the value of doing that inner work and what it's not, it wasn't because of self-discipline or because I was trying to be in those jeans or wear that dress to that thing. No, it was an act of self-love for me every day. And that was such an accomplishment for a girl like me that came from a situation where there was the person that's supposed to love you the most would physically hurt me, you know

what I mean? Or degrade me or say horrible things to me that nobody else had ever. You internalize that. The way we speak to our children becomes the way our children speak to themselves. That was very true with the vicious voice of my dad. And I have that going through my head and I got that out of me. And my children, some people say, you know, children, they're like healing and stuff. And that can be true, but I think it's our responsibility to bring a healed parent to that child.

Oh, I love that. I don't think it's their job to pull the poison out of us. I think it is my job to pull the poison out of me. Absolutely. Absolutely. Nobody's going to of us. I think it is my job to pull the poison out of me Absolutely, nobody's gonna be perfect. I think that the world does not need more damaged people right now No, I like your point. Yeah your whole point of view about well, just simply I mean I eat well But like working out I feel like I work out to fit in the jeans I work out I used to work out when I notLuke of course, but like with a toxic boyfriend, I would just be so angry with him that I was like, I'm going to fucking work out and I'm going to be the hottest version of myself and then you're going to look back and you

know what I mean? Rather than doing it for self love. So like working out and doing all of that now, is it still a part of your self love? Because something I was telling Luke about that I wanted to bring up in one of my, your Instagram is one of my favorite Instagrams to follow, not just because I love you and we're friends. You're so sweet. You're always talking about your job, talking about your kids, you're balancing, balancing,

balancing. Like you were the epitome of balancing act to me. And then you will do a time-lapse of your workouts. And there are dogs running all over you. They're in your face. You're on the ground doing yoga, you're doing your abs or you're doing leg work and you're like on your yoga mat and it's just like, there's a dog, there's a dog. And you're like giggling like, oh, get off my face, you know, and it just blows my mind

because now that I just have Gibson, I feel like I don't have any excuses. But before I was like, well, I'm such a psycho, as you know, about my dogs. And I'm like, he needs attention and he he needs more attention, and da da da. I can't possibly do something for myself. Which that won't fly once I get pregnant and have kids. I can't just be like, oh, stop taking care of me because I have other shit to do, you know? Hey babes, are you ready to inject some serious style

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That's where the, and I'm not trying to put anything on you, Luke, but once- Let's put it all in. Oh my god, right? Bring it on. Bring it on. Let's go. Bring it on. In that phase, that's where the partnership, where you want to have that support. That support is now for those of us that are dysfunctional and toxic or were, support often can feel like a vice because there's vulnerability. And I don't have to

rely on anyone. And you know, so we become that hyper-visual and self-reliant because when we are relying on the support of somebody, it feels vulnerable. And that's disgusting. That is a horrible feeling. And you know, I'm very familiar with that because that's, that can be weaponized when we are relying on the wrong person or the wrong person is in our support structure and we still have not fixed or worked with and healed our mother wound or our father wound, that support is weaponized against us and is extremely damaging to us. And so that has got to be healed, right? Because it's very hard, I think, for the body to get pregnant when it knows there's a wisdom to the body that knows that

it is going to have to rely on some help because we are going to be weaker. You know, I got it, the bounce back mom and then this, that and the other. We don't know the real story. You don't know the real story. I have a lot of clients that are Instagram influencers, just influencers, no outside, not on a show, nothing like literally just influencers. And there's not a lot of congruency between what is portrayed and what is actually going on, what their result is and how they got there. They're selling a different path than what they took.

So you guys have to remember that. Social media is very, it's optics. There's so much optics involved here. Yeah, and you have got to, we all have to re-educate ourselves to like, you don't know the real story. You really, really, really don't. And so I think that, you know, with the partner, the partner has got to be a good support system for you

and that you got to be able. So it's, I think that once, you know, you're trusting that that person can show up and will show up for you, I do think your body finds it easier to get pregnant. That must be why I got pregnant with Luke. Yeah. I would think that-

We'll try to try again. Yeah. Yeah. That makes sense though. It was also like after our three-week road trip of you relying on me to make the decisions, to drive, to go and do these things- When I relaxed. Yeah. When drive to, you know, go and do these things. When I relaxed. Yeah.

When you relax, you find you're like, yeah. When I was like, distressed, not in LA, which I thought was really interesting that you said you were in Italy for a month, Kirsten, and then got pregnant. Luke always says it. He's like, I feel like we just can't be at the apartment in LA because you're just going to be like bananas, cuckoo, psycho stressed all the time. Yeah. Ball of anxiety. You look anywhere and you're like,

I should put more pictures there. I should get more plants. I should, you know, I need to do this. The carpet's not clean enough. I have a vacuumed in a week. This, that, and the other, it's like always there's something. My ADHD has anxiety. We aren't ahead on the podcast.

This is coming up. This is coming up. They just changed this for tomorrow. It's like constant. Well, Kristen, you are also very much out of, I think, necessity. You've become very alpha female in your life and that means a lot is going to come with you.

And so that's why it's extra important that you within yourself, you continue to build a really strong support structure because it will all collapse and go away. That way you can continue to carry more and with grace instead of with just grit. It's not fun when it's just done with grit, you guys. When there is grace involved, then it's like you get to actually enjoy these things. Oh, hell yeah. Bingo. Bingo. I want to get to some listener questions for you, Kirsten. I can't wait. And a lot of these were repeated like 50 million times, like from many people. So this is from MeadowPL. They said, my puppy has severe separation anxiety. I cannot leave the house. Please help. It's not funny. It's just like, I cannot leave the house.

Yeah. Yeah. If she's saying puppy, I'm going to assume she actually means puppy, like a young dog. Right. Yeah. We would guess. So anxiety is mentally uncontained energy, right? And so training provides structure to the brain. And so she could bring in a trainer. The other thing to do though, a lot of times dogs that have separation anxiety, it's actually

about that owner. It might not be about any other person. Sometimes if my dog is too Kirsten centric, that will happen around me. The best thing I could do, like when Hollywood, one of my dogs was around eight months, was after the pandemic and he was, you know, who knew it was going to be a pandemic dog. He was very Velcro to me. And I was worried about what that was going to turn into. Right. And so I had other people start spending time with him. I had, I can walk him, I can hike him, but I had him start going with a hiker instead of just me. And then he, he started to calm down and be able to settle

because his world got bigger. I wasn't, because it's like, Kirsten brings the love, Kirsten brings the food, Kirsten fills the water, Kirsten takes me on the walks, she takes me on the hikes, we go to bed, we cuddle in bed together, we watch TV together. Okay, why would he be excited about anyone or anything but me, right?

And so when we can make their world a little bit bigger, that can be a really, really good thing. And then some basic tips and tools are get your dog enough exercise because depleting them physically can help to put them mentally on the exercise walk. Don't let them spend 30 minutes in their nose and just going around one block in 30 minutes, get them walking, right? Get them moving. Let's go. And if they won't walk, jog and run with them. You'd be shocked how, because you're fun when you're jogging and they're like, we're running. And then bring them home tired. Feed them in their crate. If you have a crate, crate training

can be really helpful with separation anxiety. When you come and go from your house or your apartment, turn your TV on like 20 to 30 minutes before you go so that there's noise. Ignore your dog for 10 minutes before you leave, right? 10 minutes before you go so that there's noise. Ignore your dog for 10 minutes before you leave, right? 10 minutes before you go. Yeah, just start ignoring your dog. Don't say goodbye to him or anything. Then you can put a chewy, like a really good chewy, not like a greenie. A greenie most dogs can get through, I would say pretty damn quick, but get like a frozen marrow bone or a frozen knuckle bone, something that your dog will be so stoked on, right? And they'll be able to channel that mental anxiety into it, just gnaw and gnaw and gnaw.

And the chewing actually releases calming hormones in their brain. It's incredible, like suckling for a child. And then when you come home, this is going to be the hard part, ignore the dog for five to 10 minutes. Do not greet him. Do not pet him. Nothing. Go to the bathroom, close the door behind you.

You can pee. You can get on your phone. Just don't greet the dog. Give it five to 10 minutes. When the dog is given up and is in a calm state, then give him a chilled out greeting. The worst thing you could do with a separation anxiety dog is come in the door and be like, hi, baby, I miss you so much. If they have separation anxiety, PS, I greet my dogs like that now, but nobody has that

issue now. Right. Right? But when they did, I did have to practice self-restraint. So hopefully that was helpful for her. I agree with my dogs like that now, but nobody has that issue now. But when they did, I did have to practice self-restraint. So hopefully that was helpful for her. Kristen, Kristen gives me shit sometimes because I don't give the immediate acknowledgement excitement with Jill when I come in. If I've got to pee, I walk past her, go to the bathroom, do my thing. And Kristen's like, you haven't even said hi to Jill.

What are you doing? Get over here. Give her love. I'm like, she's staring at you. And when you leave, you just look at her very sternly and say, Jill, be a good girl or Jill be good. And then that's it. And I'm like, Gibson, I'm just going to the store.

I'm going to the Aunt Brittany store and I'll be right back. I'm probably giving my dog's anxiety. You're making me think something that I've never thought of ever. I wonder if dogs that have real dude-ish, masculine male owners have less separation anxiety than dogs that have feminine female owners because we are more emotional with them and you guys are more stoic with them.

Because when I'm thinking about all the people that call me for separation anxiety, it is actually female heavy. But I've never looked all the people that call me for separation anxiety, it is actually female heavy. But I've never looked at it like that before. So I think it's because we're so, we mother and we're so maternal and you're like, have a good day, Jill. Yeah. Yeah. He's literally like, Jill, be good.

Because she knows how to open the door too. And if he says be good, she's not going to do that. Yeah. Oh, that's so funny. It's so interesting. Okay. She's a good escape artist when she wants to be. Oh yeah, I know that one, Luke. Yeah. First hand. And this one week, I got a lot of for you in different ways, shapes and forms. But this is from Laura Mcgee 26

tips to train my fear reactive dog to be neutral around my nephew. And it says 10 months. I don't I'm assuming the nephew is 10 months old. Yeah. Okay. So fear reactive dogs that are fear based, have fear based reactivity, which can also present as aggression. That is something you don't want to take lightly when there is a baby involved.

I am not one of those moms that thinks the baby can do anything it wants to the dog and the dog better not do anything. I do not think that way. I do anything. I do not think that way. I do not agree with parents that think that way. I grew up on a wild animal ranch, with all my fingers still, all my toes, no facial scarring. I grew up with someone that had boundaries with us around the animals and boundaries with the animals around us.

I do the same with my kids. Do ever leave that dog alone with that child under any circumstance because it's not right to do. You have faith in the dog and believe in the dog, but we don't take risks. We do not take risks with animals and children because in the end, if something happens, we'll never say, well, that was worth it. It will never be worth it. So that is number one.

You want to have a safe zone for the dog. So ideally, you train your dog to go to a place and most of the time that's their bed, right? Get a nice big bed. Then in turn, that child is trained that they never go to the dog's bed. When the child is around the dog, please pick up all the toys and all the bones, just in case, dog toys and dog bones. Obviously children don't have bones, but you want to make sure that the kid doesn't ever try to take the bone or the dog toy or something that the dog feels a sense of, that's mine, just in case you didn't mention resource guarding. But let's not leave that off the table. Make sure you cannot impose the child on the dog. And what I mean by that is when the dog is sitting

there, here, bring the baby over. Let's inch the baby in closer to the dog. No, no, no, no, don't do that. At 10 months, you do not do that. I would say let them play, let the baby be around the dog neutrally while the dog is on a place, his place, and then with 100% adult supervision, let them spend a lot of time, meaning a period of months,

where there's no expectation other than no bad behavior, but don't force a connection or an interaction. This is where people really blow it is they rush it. I see these photos and these videos on Instagram where they take their conicorso and they put the baby and they lay it on the dog. Why are you doing that? Why? Why are you doing that?

I don't know why you're doing that. Yeah, it's so absurd These relationships evolve naturally. It doesn't matter if the dog is good with the baby. There's just no point So don't rush it that neutral time of the newborn hood is the best time for the dog Be starting the dog with boundaries around the kid, you know down, go lay down, over and over. Go lay down, go lay down, good boy, go lay down. Give them the odd pet, the odd treat, but they need to be expected to contain themselves while the child is around with no forced interaction. That's my best tip. Then take them on a walk.

Yeah, and for the dog, it becomes learned behavior. There's the baby over and over, but then again, the major thing is don't force the baby or the child onto the dog, which That's right. Makes perfect sense if you think about it. And then take them on walks together. So the baby in the stroller, the dog on the leash, right? And if the dog is a puller or it's a negative experience, go ahead and get a spring or prong collar.

Do that for the walk. Give yourself a mental break. You know, watch a YouTube video on how to fit that thing properly because it is extremely important to do properly or not do it all, and then walk them together. Then you're giving them a passive bonding experience together. Again, passive bonding, passive bonding, passive bonding. So those are the things that I would start with. Don't have the kid feed the dog. Don't have the kid put the dog's food bowl down. You know what I mean?

Don't do that. Don't let the dog on the furniture at aisle. I would just, when there's that situation going on, dog off furniture, really kick ass dog bed nearby but against the wall so that the dog feels nice and safe and secure. I don't mess around when it comes to the safety of children with dogs. It's so important to me because nothing will get a dog euthanized quicker than biting a child in the home. Nothing.

I don't want that on that dog. I don't want that on me. I don't want that on the. And I don't want that on that dog. I don't want that on me. I don't want that on the owner. Yeah, absolutely. And I don't want it on the kid. Yeah, absolutely. Good. Very good point.

This is not from me, but I'd like to tag on a question from at Kristin Doty. So this is from ChristinaGal73. How to help dogs deal with the loss of the other dog. They just lost their 14-year-old fur baby this weekend. And I'm tagging onto that. Well, I'll let you answer that, but my tag onto that is my Gibson, my Yorkie, as you guys know. We lost Bowie.

I did not see much of a reaction after two days. And I don't know if it's because we did have Jill, Luke's German Shepherd here, but Gibson now thinks he is a German Shepherd. So how to help? He started picking up frisbees bigger than him and carrying them around. He now sits in the back seat.

Like when we were on the ranch, he just gets in the back seat. He's like, mom, this is what ranch dogs do when he normally wants to sit on my lap. But yeah, now he wants to play, he carries a frisbee around. It's twice the size of his body. But so she wanted to know how to help dogs deal with the loss of his body. But so she wanted to know how to help dogs deal with the loss of another dog. And I'm so curious because I don't feel like Gibson is mourning Bowie.

I think he was confused for a couple of days and now nothing, which I which is great. I mean, I love that because that was my biggest fear. Yeah. So there's a couple of things I want to say about that. Number one, flip the routine on its head of the existing dog. If that dog goes into mourning, first of all, not every dog goes into mourning when the other dog passes away. If your dog has gone into mourning, you flip the routine on his head. If you wake up and then feed the dog within 30 minutes, don't do that. Wake up, get your coffee, put your shoes on, walk your dog. You know what I mean?, walk your dog.

You know what I mean? Then feed your dog in a different place of the house. Same thing at dinnertime. Flip it on its head. Don't do it the same. Get new dog beds. Do all of those things to help with the dogs need to come. Animals in their healthiest state are like human beings in their healthiest state. We are operating in present time. That's easier said than done. That is not a simple thing to do because you're thinking about things that have happened in the past and things that happen in the future and that's why things are a mess. Animals when they're operating in their best space are operating in present time. So do not put our sentimentality on it. Give it a window

of time and then move forward with rearranging things as far as like new beds and furnitures and crates and things like that. If you have a dog crate, move the crate to a different area. If you have a dog bed, move it to a different area, but you flip the routines around. Even change up the food bowls, switch to a slow feeder. If you were using a steel bowl, if you were using a slow feeder, switch to something different. Take him to the park if you don't take him to the park. If you did take him to the park, take him to the hike instead, but you want to flip it on his head.

Okay. Well, that his head. Okay. Well, that's amazing. Two more quick questions and then we're going to do a little rapid fire fun stuff. So this is from Tracy Michelle 71. If your dog is over a year, a year old with no training, is it too late? He is an Australian Shepherd. I already know this to be not true because Bowie was in possibly eight year old shelter rescue dog.

Right. And we socialized him. Yeah. One is prime. A lot of people don't call until the dog is one because the dog was so great. And then what happens is there's something that Ian Dunbar came up with, this vet in the UK, Dr. Ian Dunbar came up with years ago called canine anger phases. And there's two of them.

One is like between five and seven months. And the second one is like after the 12 month mark. And it's kind of like where the teenage rebellion kicks in and new things show up that were never showing up previously. Sometimes the dog is perfect until then. And then they do that and they're like, oh my God, what happened? And so you don't even call until the dog is one sometimes for help. It's a great time to train your dog. But go all in, you'll get a big flip if you go all in with it at that age. I mean, that's where you get the biggest change is where you take a dog that has had no training

around that one year mark, and you can just really shape them up. You wanna go with somebody really experienced, but go full throttle. Yeah, so I'll tell you, you got just to listen to, so you know when I got Bowie and I realized he was a little tough on a leash, he was just really pulling a lot,

which was, it didn't bother me as much because it's not like he was hurting me. He didn't weigh enough, but I was like, he's choking himself out. He's unhappy. It's like he wanted to go after people, birds, dogs, didn't matter what it was. And he stayed with Kirsten for three weeks, which at first I was like, Oh my God, is he going to miss me? Does he think that I just abandoned him because I just adopted him? And it's like, no, he's literally, he came back the happiest dog ever. He really did. Yeah. And you know what? And I remember he had a more serious, low energy stoic personality. So seeing this like happy little like playful side of him was incredible, especially, and he was already a singer at that time.

He was. Yeah. And then one more question, which I think this is something I never even thought of because it doesn't happen to my dogs, but I have friends like this that have dogs. So this is from, I think it's lj0687, how to get rid of excited peeing. My dog is two and a half and is still, in air quotes, not grown out of it. And I know a lot of dogs that do that when they're excited. Like Brittany, my friend Brittany Cartwright, her poodle Monroe, I just know when it's only myself and Tom Schwartz that she always pees right when she sees us.

So I walk in the door and I run to the backyard or we let her out the front door. I say hello, she gets it out of her system. Is there a way for them to grow out of it or is that just something that happens? What were you going to say? Luke, I don't want to step on you if you had something to add to that. Oh, you're fine. So my dog that passed away last year, he's a Brittany Spaniel and he

did it until about two and a half years and then never again. Okay. But it was so much excitement, like whole body shaking, like so excited that someone came through the door and he'd be all over the floor. So sweet. So, okay, assuming, you know, that you've already known to ignore the dog, when you have a dog that does excited piddling, and especially if it's one or two people, when those people walk in, they should not greet the dog. You shouldn't even make eye contact with the dog.

So I'm doing all the wrong shit. You're doing all the wrong shit. But no, running through the backyard is not a bad idea, because at least it gets repeating outside versus, you know, get out the nature's miracle and clean it up in the house. So ideally that person when they walk in and you just say, look, I'm a weirdo. Don't look at my dog. Don't talk to my dog when you come in. Just say that.

But don't greet the dog. The thing about separation anxiety, excuse me, submissive peeing, that's what that is. It's called piddling. Is that it comes from a lack of confidence in the dog, that submissive, that immature almost aspect to them. So correcting it makes it worse. Correcting it would look like, hey, no, don't. All of that choppy inflection that is going to do the opposite of what you want, and they're

going to feel smaller and smaller and more scared and then pee. So it really makes it worse. So ideally the people, the two people that make it in your situation that are the most excited about, the dogs most excited about, you would come in and not greet the dog. A better thing to do in addition to that is temporarily get a puppy gate like a better thing to do in addition to that is temporarily get a puppy gate like a pressure gate that goes in the hallway. Most floor plans are open these days, but there's almost always one hallway right downstairs where you can put up a pressure gate. When they're going to have company, you put the dog behind the pressure

gate. When people come in, they come in kind of quietly. Don't come in with main character energy. Hi, oh my God. Right? And if you need that main character energy, do it outside the front door. Close the front door, go freak out, and then come in and then go in the kitchen or out the back door. And then after a few minutes, the owner, the owner, right, goes up quietly, opens the puppy gate, doesn't make a big thing of it, right? Hey, okay, you're coming out now sit sit No, no, no Open the gate walk away walk out to where the people are The dog is then gonna be excited to see the people but we've already taken the cork off the champagne, right?

We've already done that so that energy is coming out then outside There's the dissipate the rest of the energy is there but the main part is already out Then they need to still ignore that dog for a few minutes after a few minutes one at a time the person could say hi You know, what's the dog's name? Brittany's August Monroe. Yeah, like hi Monroe. Hi, buddy. Like a two to three second normal greeting. Hi, buddy He's a good boy and then stop petting. Yeah, I do it all wrong I'm like I've run I open the front door I run to the backyard and I'm like, sissy girl, come

here, come here, come here. And then she gives me a hug on my knee and then she pees everywhere. And then we're back inside the house and she doesn't even think about me. You're training her to pee. You're training her to piddle. And Brittany, I'm really sorry. I was training your dog to piddle. My bad.

It's counterintuitive though, isn't it? No, absolutely it is. So hopefully that's useful for that listener, you know, because anybody can employ that. It's like, and PS, these pressure gates are like $25 on Amazon and you don't have to drill holes in the wall. Like I'm not good with anything like handy and I can put them up. Yeah. I love it.

It's so helpful. Okay, Luke, you want to throw some fun or rapid fire? Yes, this is not necessarily on topic, but just random, your favorites, this or that, with some rapid fire stuff. All right, what is your favorite restaurant? El Pasayo. El Pasayo, all right.

Favorite dog breed. This is where you're supposed to go, Luke, fuck you. Yes, I mean, I like a good old mutt, I'll tell you that. Not like a good old mutt. I do love, I love my Bernadoodle. I got a Bernadoodle. And then let me think here, I've rescued a lab. I've always loved labs.

So I'm going to say those are my top three. All right. I don't know if you have time in your day to watch reality TV or TV at all, but would you have a favorite reality show? I mean, I watched Kristin's shows. I used to watch Vanderpump Rules when she was on it, and it was such a great show. Loved that.

And I haven't watched it since then. Oh, no, no, no, I've caught a few episodes, I'm sorry, since then. And then I watch The Valley now. I really am enjoying The Valley. Yes, it's hard not to feel a little defensive for her when you watch it. Oh, a little.

You saw me. Yes, and you, yeah, I know, and I appreciate that about you, actually. I was like, oh, but. You saw me. Yes. And you, yeah, I know and I appreciate that about you actually. I was like, but yeah, so I like those. And then other than those two, I don't really watch, oh, sometimes, yeah, the Housewives. I catch the Housewives of Beverly Hills. Okay. You know, I'm an LA girl. Yeah, local, local shows. Right. Awesome. So you're a Bravo girl. Yes. Yes. Awesome. What's your favorite pizza topping? Oh, my goat cheese.

Goat cheese. Oh. And how I follow by jalapenos. Oh, wow. That's making me hungry. Oh, these are so good. I know. So would you prefer a road trip or fly to your destination on vacation? Oh, it depends on where we're going on the road trip. If we're going through Utah, I'll take a road trip. If we're going through Bakersfield, I'll take a flight.

That's funny. The next question is like national park or beach vacation? That's tough too. I mean, I'd say national park. I grew up on a lot of beaches. So I'd say national park. There you go. I'm in that too. All right. Do you have a hype song when you're getting ready when you need to get like your energy up? Maybe you're going to the studio, you're gonna be on set. Are you going out with your friends? Like... I listen to hype men. I hype people, I should say. I love Eric Thomas. He's a motivational speaker.

And that hypes me up more than any music and gets me like, uh! I love it. So that's like you and I know. Yes, more than music. So, yeah, sorry. Great answers. It's all good. I listen to Kendrick. Yes, more than music. So yeah, sorry. Those are great answers. It's all good. I listened to Kendrick Lamar. I listened to the diss track on Drake.

There we go. They not like us. They not like us. All right. All right. Last one. Go ahead. We have another one.

Go. Last one. Beer or wine? Wine. I did recently stop drinking, but wine. Wine. Okay. I figured that'd be the case. I'm beer, Kristin's wine. Yeah. Beer. I just don't get beer. I feel like I'm drinking a burp.

Yes. Drinking a burp. That is funny. I've never heard that before. That's amazing. And I'm English. So it was like, you know, they take me to the pub when I was little, give me, you know, a pint. It's called a shandy, which is like you miss 7 Up and beer. A pint of a shandy. They called it a shandy. Yeah. When I was a kid, it's so inappropriate. It's like 11 at the pub, I mean shit. That's how it used to be back in the day.

It was. Pretty sure I got said beer out of a baby bottle at some point in the 80s. Yeah. Oh my God. Well, Kirsten, I love you so much. Thank you for taking time out of your insanely busy life and schedule.

And everyone, please follow Kirsten on Instagram. It's at Adventures in Dog Training. And for those of you who did send questions, if you especially I forgot your name, I'm so sorry. But if you want to like re up with Kirsten and kind of give her context for things, she's fantastic. And your Instagram stories are just the best. And I love you.

Thanks, you guys. Thanks for having me. It's just fun. Thank you so much for coming on. It was great. Make sure. Love you. Thank you so much for coming on. It was great. Make sure to follow us on social media. You can follow me on all platforms at Kristen Doty and follow Luke on Instagram at Luke double underscore

Roderick. Be sure to click the subscribe button so you can stay up to date with new episodes. Thanks for listening. See you next week.