Sex With Emily - Alternative Relationships w/ Nico Tortorella + Jason Ellis

Episode Date: August 31, 2022

Have you ever wondered what it would be like to have a sexually fluid relationship? As in, you and your partner discuss bisexuality openly…either yours, theirs, or both? What about having multiple partners? Or trying a threesome together? Are these possibilities you’d consider, or are you like: NO THANK U, NEXT! Well on today’s best-of show, I’ve got two individuals who can tell you exactly what it’s like to be in a successful, alternative relationship. First you’ll hear from actor/model Nico Tortorella on navigating bisexuality, how sex changed once they got sober, and what it’s like for them to fall for someone outside of their primary partnership. Next, you’ll hear from MMA fighter, fellow podcaster and Aussie fan fave Jason Ellis on how he and his fiance (now wife) conduct a radically open relationship, why he’s thrilled for another man to give her sexual pleasure, and his best recommendations for your first threesome. Come for the open minds, stay for the sex tips. Show Notes:Where is the Clitoris?The Love Bomb w/ Nico TortorellaThe Jason Ellis Show Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

I just say people shouldn't get married before 30 at least. I agree. Completely. Right? Like, you don't know yourself, but they don't know if they don't know themselves. I love it. I think they're so in love. Yeah, it's the first thing I say.

I mean, they're lucky, I'm not sure what to do. I'm a hell of an oldie. And if it's under 30, it's hard for me not to laugh at them. Do you get these questions on your show? Yeah, you don't understand a really lever. I'm like, you're 25. You don't even know what really loving anyone is. Exactly. Does jealousy come up for you a lot?

I'm the least jealous person you'll ever meet. Like, I have no problem dating somebody and then sleeping with other people. You're listening to Sex with Emily. I'm Dr. Emily and I'm here to help you prioritize your pleasure and liberate the conversation around sex. Have you ever wondered what it would be like to have a sexually fluid relationship?

As in, you and your partner discuss bisexuality openly, either yours, theirs, or both. What about having multiple partners? Or trying to threesome together? Are these possibilities you consider? Or are you like, no thank you? Next, not for me. Well in today's best of show, I've got two individuals who can tell you exactly what it's like to be in a successful, alternative relationship and what we can learn from them. First you'll hear from actor model Nico Tertarella, unnavigating bisexuality, how sex changed once they got sober, and what it's like for them to fall for someone outside of their primary partnership.

Next you'll hear from MMA fighter and fellow podcaster Jason Ellis on how he and his fiance, now wife, conduct a radically open relationship while he's thrilled for another man to give her sexual pleasure and his best recommendations for your first threesome. Come for the open minds and stay for the sex tips. This episode has got it all. Intention with Emily. For each episode, I want to start off by setting an intention for the show. I do it. I encourage you to do the same.

So when you're listening, what do you want to get out of this episode? How might this episode help you? Well, my intention is to let you hear the variety of ways people conduct an open relationship. Both Nico and Jason love their partners dearly, and you hear the different boundaries each one has for their partnership.

So whether Naminagami is right for you or not, you'll finish this episode with lots of valuable real world insight. Please rate and review Sex with Emily wherever you listen to the show. My new article, Where's the Cliterus, is up at sexwithemily.com. Also, check out my YouTube channel, social media and TikTok. It's all at Sex with Emily for more sex tips and advice. If you want to ask me questions, just leave me your questions or message me at sexwithemily.com slash ask Emily or call my hotline 559 Talk Sex or 559 825 5739.

Always include your name, your age, where you live and how you listen to the show. And it's totally cool to change your name to remain anonymous. Alright everyone, enjoy this episode! Nico Torturella is a gender-fluid American actor and model known for his roles in Younger, Screen 4, and The Walking Dead, World Beyond. He's also the author of Space Between, Explorations of Love, Sex, and Fluidity, and a collection of poetry, all of it, is you. Read all about Nico at his website, Nico, Nico, Nico, Torturella.com.

I have Nico Torturella. Torturella. Torturella. Torturella. That's how you say it, right? Nico la Luigi Torturella. Of course. I have Niko Torteruela. Torteruela. Torteruela. Torteruela. That's what you say, right? Niko L'Oweji Torteruela. Of course.

Just as Irish as you can count. Exactly. Oh my God, that's amazing. Okay, so I'd read that you're just inspired by the conversations that you are already having in people in your day-to-day life. Yeah. Right? I was having a lot of conversations about sexuality and gender identity, and that was the

focus of the podcast in the beginning. That was like what I was getting a lot of conversations about sexuality and gender identity and that was the focus of the podcast in the beginning That was like what I was getting into it's kind of just where my head was Circling as time has gone by it's definitely shifted a really natural beautiful shift It started to shift into this world of spirituality and sense of higher self and and next level Which I think is really based in this idea of figuring out who you are and what you want, right? And if you're taking that step into your own sexuality or your own gender identity, that is inherently a first step in a spiritual exploration of sorts.

It's true. It's so interesting because I think the journey to figuring out who we are and what we want is just, I mean, I think you're first of all you're never done because I think the journey to figuring out who we are and what we want is just, I mean, I think you're, first of all, you're never done because I think you're always changing. But you think like, I already know who I am. I know who I am. And then you get, hopefully, you get to the point in life where you're like, you know what? I think I really don't know.

And you think it would be easier because you're like, it's me, but there's always different layers that you go back and we're always changing. So I want to get into your spiritual journey next, but I want to talk about gender and sexuality. So let's start out with how you identify. So I want to get into your spiritual journey next, but I want to talk about gender and sexuality. So let's start out with how you identify. Yeah, I am a human being most of the time. I am a cisgender bisexual who explores polyamory. Okay, so I want to have you break down. We were a lot of the terms that we're talking about today

because I think it's the wild, wild west of gender identity right now. I think it's very confusing to people, including myself sometimes. I'm like, wait, since I got to stop and think, so you're born as a man. So shoulder male. Male. Bisexual, yeah. Bisexual. I didn't say male in there.

You didn't, but some people don't want to be identified as either male or female. I mean, there's what, 72 different gender options on Facebook right now. Yes. If you don't want to be identified as either or there are a plethora of words that you can choose from. Hey, gender, gender nonconforming, gender nonbinary. The list is dead. Do you know what they do? You understand all of them? I don't understand all of them. And as interested as I am in gender identity, I am also not attached to the idea of like having definition for each gender personally. If I meet somebody and they identify as Agender, right? And I'm not

sure what Agender means. That's okay. Like I want to hear it from the person that actually identifies as an Agender, you know? With men, though, as much as your book. Yeah, for sure. I think it's a pretty even split. Okay. I think for, I don't know, the nine years that I was really drinking, there were a lot of relationships with men and women that seemed really foggy to me, right? That like, I don't think I was treating myself well, so I wasn't treating anyone in my life.

Well, I think that I'm a firm believer that you will love other people the same way that you love yourself. And I like wasn't really loving myself that much. And the second I got sober, I started taking my life seriously and like started taking relationship seriously too, right? And kind of. Right, right.

To the best of your ability. You gotta, you gotta, you gotta, when you have a mission, you're like, doing your art, you're doing your work, you're like, you don't, I don't have time to be in like a committed lockdown, living with some relationship where you're compromising things, right?

I love relationships. I know, right, they're fun. They're totally fun. And I love starting relationships and falling in love with somebody and getting to know somebody. And I've had. That's the best part we call it the honeymoon phase.

The honeymoon phase, yeah. I love a honeymoon phase. And I've had a good handful of like four or five six-month relationships that physical out. Yeah. Yeah. Those are the bad. I've been with them and women. I made a career on that. I have. I was like, well, years, I was like, why can't we just keep doing this? Right. It's like you always get to eat the frosting and start all the time. Yeah. But like at the end of the day, I've heard a lot of people, you know? Right. Right. This is sounds annoying. And I've talked about this before, but I've never been

broken up with. I've never been the one that is like destroyed. I've destroyed myself a couple times in it. Yeah, I've like left this trail and that doesn't feel good. And I think that at the end of the day, I haven't necessarily treated the people in my life as good as I could, but I'm trying to be better. You're learning.

And I think that where that might come in is, and I did the same thing I'm telling you, I left so many, I never have been broken up with. I'm trying to think if I have now. Now it's a little different, because, but back, I'd say I was a serial monogamous, but that would happen, and I would break up with them. I think I was, you know, intimacy issues. There's a lot of different reasons, but also I think it comes down to communicating early on. Like, this is amazing.

I love this, but I'm seeing other people, but when you're under that spell, the honeymoon, it's amazing. They're like, yeah, yeah, yeah, I hear your words, but oh my God, the sex is explosive and looking to your eyes and I can't imagine this is ever gonna. But also I have a podcast, right? When I people can go and listen to all of these stories

of different people that I've dated, right? And that is really something that I'm struggling with these days. Oh yeah, I've been doing this for 12 years. So yeah, I got it. I'm like, oh my God, I've had guys call me back. You went on another date last weekend? Yeah. Yeah, I got a phone call last week that was like,

you know, maybe I shouldn't listen to this podcast. Maybe I should just like really get to know you face to face instead of listening to the podcast. I tell people not guys not to like when I've met people recently and they're like, oh, we talking the phone, a hard-booted meet, they're like, I'm going to go listen. I'm like, and then I'm afraid if I say please don't, then they're absolutely going to. Absolutely.

Well, the thing is, it's like, it depends on what episode they're listening to. Exactly. They're all different. Yeah, and like when I recorded it, because I'm changing so fast, right? I'm a different person than I was last week. I know, exactly. So like I may have said some shit,

like a few months ago that like I don't necessarily totally stand by right now. Right, exactly. But it's out in the world, and I listen to it. And it programs the person that I'm dating. And you can just tell it's your art and that's what you do. And you'd, it's like performance art. And in a way, you'd love them to get to know you.

Right. When I'm on. I've got to listen. But they're still gonna do it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Dating, right? Yes. It's hard with the podcast. People always say to me like our guys and intimidate you or people intimidated because of what you're saying or you're the expert. And I said, you know what? I could think about all those things or maybe they're just dating me for another reason because they think, I'll teach them something, you know, oh no. But I think I feel like I'm a pretty good judge of character and I would know once I met them with their intentions were.

And then I realized I'd be been taking more time than I would in the past. Maybe like just jumping about with someone, not that I wouldn't do that, but I'm saying I feel like I'm a better, I can kind of tell their intentions, but it's still gonna happen, because it's all out there. Totally. And I'm talking about being polyamorous all over the place,

right? And I think I realize that the people coming into my life either see that in one way or another, I don't know. I mean, I can't imagine somebody that's coming into my life, doesn't fucking Google me. Well, if you Google, yeah. Okay, so here's what I wrote right here.

Right, let me, you guys, then you guys have a Google right now, because you gotta check about it. It's like, younger star Veal, he's sexually fluid. This, okay, here's another title. This is what a queer family looks like. Right, yeah, well, that's a really important one, that one, because Bethany and I are on the cover of the episode.

Yeah, that's a beautiful piece. We're the first ever male, female couple to ever are on the cover of the episode. Yeah, that's a beautiful piece. We're the first ever male, female couple to ever be on the cover of the Avicad. Yeah, that's amazing. But we got a lot of shit for that cover. They're from the gay community, yeah, I got it. We're two white people who look and pass as a heterosexual couple who are talking about being queer. It's a problem for a lot of people.

Right, it is, but I love that C.S. loves it. You're breaking down all these barriers. I really do. So mostly for you right now, it's a problem for a lot of people. Right, it is, but I love that you're breaking down all these barriers. I really do. So mostly for you right now, it's not like you're so concerned, you know, other people you have to define maybe what you're into to other people, but for you now with relationships, it's really more about being polyamorous and how would you define like your primary partner, I guess, would be Bethany. Bethany, yeah. For sure.

And so, we've had sex twice in the last like two years. Okay. So we're not really sleeping together all the time. Right, so you're more like, what do they call that single poly? Or like, poly single when you're single, but you're dating a lot of people. Well, I'm not even dating a lot of people. I'm actually like, or sex, what are you doing? Yeah, no, no, to be honest with you, I'm actually pretty monogamous in my idea of polyamory.

Like, I will explain that one. Mon my idea of polyamory. Like I will- I explained that one. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Monogamy, polyamory. Okay. I will meet somebody new and I will give, like most or all of myself to that new person from the get-go to like really get to know that person.

And I think especially on a physical level, I like can't have sex with more than one person at a time or I haven't, I haven't been able to in the past. Like if I'm sharing with somebody, that is what I'm working on right now. And that like I'm giving so much of myself to it, there's not actual space to like, like sleep with him on Thursday nights, sleep with her on Friday night. Like I just can't do it. Because that's a thing about paleoamaries.

There are a lot of people I know in that world. They're like, yeah, it literally is my day nights with this person, Thursday and then this person. And that's beautiful. Yeah, I'm so into it. Because it's fine, but for you, it's more like four to six months

with this person, four to six months to the next person. But yeah, and like if you build the stable groundwork with a new person in your life, and then you decide to like open it up and start seeing other people. I think that can be beautiful. But I don't think you can jump into a new relationship

and be like, yeah, we're both gonna sleep with other people for the next couple months. And good luck. I have the same issue. So that's what I've always been kind of considering. I guess I have been, I don't really label it, but Palliarmorce, my past, and I guess maybe now I'm dating and sleeping with people. so I don't say there you go.

Now I'm going to get out and go, yo, just sleeping with me. But I think that it is, but when I meet someone and I actually like them, it is hard for me to be like, wait, I can't help, I get attached. I'm like, I think that you do need to build that foundation first and then be like, okay, maybe we should open it up. Because otherwise, then you're just, which is fine as well, you're just sleeping with several different people, but you're not gonna go any deeper with somebody. I think if that's what's happening,

it's harder, at least for me to not have that intimacy. But maybe that is what I should do, actually. Like maybe I don't need to get that deep. I know, well, yeah, to touch an intensity that you have, right? But, well, that's what I was gonna ask you. So, right, are you doing it because it helps you feel safer? Safe. You like, you know, you want them to make sure they really like you

and get you, you want to feel understood. I want to hold somebody's hand and like have fireworks explode, right? And like, that doesn't happen unless you know that person. Right? Well, we know them how like where they grew up, and then their mom's name, or like, like, intimately know that person.

Okay. So energetically, like share on a level that I think can only happen when you give yourself totally to that person for a certain amount of time. Right. I understand what you're saying, but I've also had experiences.

And again, this is not for everybody. We're, I can get really close with someone, quickly, like, I'm not like a bullshit person, so I think I'm pretty much the same wherever I go. Like if you talk to me on this podcast, or we met on the street, like I'm pretty much, I don't know secrets. You guys know everything.

I can connect with people, like really, pretty easily. I can tell. Yeah, I'm like, oh my God. So I feel like I can kinda go there, a lot of you will interpret that as well. This could be something where I'm like, not that, so I feel like I can kind of go there. A lot of people interpret that as, wow, this could be something where I'm like, not that I don't feel with everybody.

And it might, yes. Do people fall in love, do you really fast? More than you fall in love with them. Yes. Yes. That's historically is what's happened. It means the same to you, right? Yeah, for sure. And that feels good though, too, right?

It feels great, right? Yes, it feels great until it doesn't, until you feel like you're fucking drowning. Right? And what I'm really working on right now is understanding how much love and affection I can actually receive, not necessarily how much love and affection I can give. Right.

And I think that's been my struggle recently. Is it easier for you to give it or to receive it? Well, what we talking about here. I don't know. I don't know, anything. Absolutely. No, no, no. Yeah, I think it's much easier for you to give it or to receive it? Well, what we're talking about here. I don't know. Anything. No, no. Yeah, I think it's much easier for me to give than it is for to receive anything. Oh, no.

Anything. Right. But you're saying you're not seeing several than it wants. So this is more like a few months and a few months and a few months, and then they're all like, what were you going now? I mean. But a few weeks and then how do you? You know, and like you meet the people that are like, yeah, that say they love the same

type of way that you do or Or say that like this freedom exists and you realize it maybe it doesn't right or they'll say anything to get to like Oh, yeah, I want to be Polly Amherst or I want to be open or I'm cool. Just jealousy come up for you a lot I'm the least jealous person you'll ever meet back. I have no problem dating somebody and then sleeping with other people Not at all not at all never but what about the people that are in love with you? Do they get jealous? Do you? Yeah. Right. That's the problem, right? They get possessive and jealous. Right. Like, I used to have this thing with men. They'd be like, oh, yeah, I love that you're so independent and free. And then eventually, they would say something to the effect of, oh,

I love that chairs were out there, but I really just want to put you in this box. Right. Let me just put you in my pocket. Yeah. There's a million different ways I've heard that. They want to own it and keep it to the set. So what they're so attracted to in you, they actually just want to own it. Lock it down. What I think it is, I think that. Clip your wings.

You and I both share this same light, right? And I think that people are attracted to that light. But once they realize that the light is ours, and it's just there for them to stand in, to not take, we immediately become the asshole. Right. Yeah, I guess so. You're right. That is what happens. Well, look how stuff are where you are. This is happening. I mean, I think this is the next step, right? Well, it sounds like my path. No.

It's understanding. Yeah, exactly. And then being really honest, I don't think that I was as honest with people earlier. I'm, I never felt that monogamy made sense to me. Like I was in college and I was like, I'll do it because there was really no other options on the table, but then I always felt like I struggled with it. And you're also a woman too. So it's like, it's a totally different space for you.

It is. And so but now I think this is great that you're shedding light on it. It's like people don't have a lot of great role models of what it means to be bisexual and to be open in the world. To be a man who's bisexual. Like people just say, oh, you're just gay.

It was funny. I was sent to your Sheel Nevin's podcast. I love Sheel. I used to be a documentary filmmaker before I was, before I did sexual demolition. I just, I was such a Sheel Nevin's fan. Like she was like the queen. She still is.

You're like, I just want Sheel Nevin to meet with her. She ripped me apart. She was so much like, honey, you're not. You're not. You're not bisexual. You're gay. You're like, I just want you to live in Simeon with her. She ripped me apart. She was so much like, honey, you're not. You're not. You're not bisexual. You're gay. You're gay. Are you seeing a psychiatrist?

She was hilarious. So you're really in this place right now. Well, look, I think that at the end of the day, we only believe what we see. And we've seen predominantly one story since the beginning of time, you know, and it is a white man and a white woman with kids. That's it. That's the only thing we've seen. And now in the last like 50 years, maybe a little bit longer than that, we're seeing all these other stories. And in the last 10, 20 years, now with social media, we're seeing all the stories. And we're starting to believe

that more things are real, which is what I love It's not possible. I'll turn to relationships. Yes, polyamory Lifestyles for me. It's all about normalizing the quote-unquote abnormal. Right. So let's talk about sex for a bit Let's talk about that. How we met being full circle to our panel. I don't know. How is it changed for you? Yeah, sex was like a lot scarier once I got sober. Yeah, right? Yeah, because I mean, I was so used to like going out, getting wasted and bring somebody home. Not like random people, but like having drunk sex.

Yeah, and it just made things easier or a lot harder because you couldn't get it up when you were blacked out. Right. Exactly. But yeah, sex has become a lot more sacred since my sobriety. Okay. sex, sex has become a lot more sacred since my sobriety. I'm really starting this exploration of my own sexuality and acts of sex to better understand how I can reach higher levels of it.

Do you mean more energetically using breath? Yeah, having more intense sex, opening my mind to other possibilities of what sex can be and what sex can look like and what sex can feel like. I thought, if I could just describe one of those experiences that you've had lately where it was like, this is a different experience. I want everyone to have expansive sex lives

to not be set in the, I know, he gets off, she gets off, that's what we do, we fall asleep. It's like, no, there's so many ways to have sex and to enjoy it in our bodies, have an unlimited capacity for pleasure. And I think we don't even tap into it. Like they say, use 10% of your brain. I don't even think that we understand

our sexual capacity, they're like our bodies, what we're capable of. So, yeah, I mean for men, right, prostate play, I think that that is like something that I'm starting to understand more what that actually means. And like how to achieve next level orgasms from prostate play, right?

And at J.K. So you're jerking off, right? You got some good porn on or something and you stop right before you're about to come. Okay. And let it set for a second. It's hard to stop right before you're about to come. Okay. It's like like a quarter of a second that exists in that space.

And you gotta let it breathe for a second, right? Not touch it because if you touch it, it's gonna go. And kind of start back against low and get back up to that point and see how many times in a row you can go and do that before you come. And it's all about controlling different muscles, right? And the longer you wait, the better the orgasm will be. And the more you will come, too. You're just building up this shot.

And it's just, yeah. And just like actual calm itself. You're right. Guys love that. I'm just shooting across the room. So much calm. I was just gonna say, and you can do it with other people too. Exactly, right?

It's so fun. Female edging, that's the thing. Yeah, it kind of isn't saying, yeah, definitely. It isn't saying, what do we call it for women? It's not really edging, but it's more like delaying your, I think it's the same thing as building up your energy. It appears to theme out for women, which it's a more of an advanced practice, because I think a lot of women are just happy when they have an orgasm.

It's harder for women, right? It's more elusive. Like, one thing happens, and it's disappearing. Organism. But I think it's great to practice like when you're masturbating, when you know you're going to get there, and it's the same thing, and you stop, and then you build it up again, and it's much more. Yeah, explosive, amazing. And then you can start to have full body orgasms.

And when you just hold, I know a lot of men who've done that kind of practice where they just actually don't even ejaculate. Right. Just hold onto that. body. So that's what I was wondering if you were talking about. There's definitely some tantra work in my future. I haven't tapped into it quite yet, but I know that it is something that I will study

at some point soon. For me, I'm also like really at a point in my life where I'm understanding what the difference and if there is one really between having sex with a man and a woman and someone in between, the two, right? I think I'm opening myself up more to doing the work on understanding where those differences lie right now. What would you say are the differences between having sex with a man and woman? On a basic level, it's just most of the time easier having sex with a woman because you don't

prepare her everything else. You know what I mean? Like a vagina, you know, naturally loobs. It's like, it's just, we're good to go. It's smooth sailing for the most part. And it can be that way with a dude, just like, you have to get to that point. And just energetically, it's totally different, right? Like, granted, there are, there are men that I've slept with that are extremely feminine,

right? That is much more like having sex with a woman than it is having sex with a man. There are women that I've slept with that are extremely masculine that like definitely dominate the entire experience and it's a lot more primal, more like having gay sex. And I've had sex with trans people that just, you that just fuck it all up and you're all confused. Now what's going on? It must be. So you've had sex with trans women.

I have not had sex with the trans men. I would love to have sex with a trans man at some point. That should not be hard for you. No, I'm fine. But I'm not like, you're so busy. But I'm almost like not like being like, oh, hey, trans men, you want to have sex. I want to fall in love with the trans men at some point. Really? Yeah. Okay, so you seriously, you have these have sex? I want to fall in love with the Transman at some point. Really?

Yeah. Okay, so you seriously, you have these experiences where it's a blank slate. You're not going through your phone when I get late tonight. Tonight I want to be with a less dominant female. I gauge what I'm into based on the porn that I'm watching. Oh, okay, what porn are you watching now? Well, I mean, I watch everything. The last couple days I've been watching straight porn.

Straight porn, okay. Yes, but I mean, I've watched every type of porn that exists. Do you always watch porn when you masturbate? Not always. Right. So you go on, I've got it, so you're at a straight thing, so then it's in your mind. So the porn is dictating your sexual behavior.

In my head. It's not necessarily dictating the type of sex that I'm having, but I know that if I'm dating a dude and I'm all of a sudden start watching straight porn, something's going on. I'm wondering as you're in these places with people, there must be something else that goes on because you're saying you don't do any overlap. I could very easily see, I'm into this guy, but I just watched him straight porn.

I want to go have sex with a woman right now, but yet, go back to the gay guy then of the week. Not even necessarily gay, but bisexual. Okay, bisexual, sorry. Yeah, no, no, no, no. I'm already messing with you, bisexual. No, it's fine. I usually did gay men, not bisexual men, sorry. Right.

Well, why not bisexual men? I've dated one bisexual dude. It was almost like we both knew too much about each other because we were both bisexual. I don't know, there was something about it that it was like, we have to go spread this message instead of giving it to each other. That could have nothing to do with the fact that we were bisexual. It was just that we were similar people. But I don't know, yeah, I haven't.

I've only did one other bisexual dude. All right, interesting. So do you have a type, though, within each one of these? No. Not at all. I mean, kind of. Okay. Who won't you date?

Is there any traits that's like a turn off for you, let's say? Like physical traits? I hate to do the physical thing, but yeah, I mean, kind of, though, like, is there anything that it just, or something that you leave, how about what you lean towards more than not rather than positive and negative. I lean towards men that are like, brawny men, like baseball player looking dudes. And historically, I like the women in my life to be very much so pocket-sized. Cool.

Yeah, baby. I'm, yeah, okay. Love to know that. That's great. So, sex, let's talk about sex, baby. So okay, what about with women in bed, the difference we were talking about, just like the cleanup,

but what about just like for women and like for-play? Like what have you learned about having sex with women? There's a softness about having sex with women that I'm really into. Just even like their skin, right? I am as attracted to like a beautiful, supple, soft skin as I am to like a hairy fucking leg. And like a soft face and like small lips compared to like

a big dude's face with a big fucking beard. I can get down with both. Right, and it really is just where I am. Well, we're at a different life. That's just so fascinating. Is there anything that you've learned about women that I got at your with so many different kinds of women? But if you had to say there's like these certain things

about women that is kind of a universal truth, even though we're all different. We're talking sexually or we're talking. Yeah, sexually. I love eating pussy. Awesome. And I think all women love that. Yeah, many do.

I believe that many women do and that for women, there's some women who really don't, like it's their super sensitive, like does doesn't feel good. But I love that you love it, because there's a lot of men who really don't, like it's their super sensitive, and like does doesn't feel good. But I love that you love it, because there's a lot of men who I think they just do it to get some means to an end. No.

And they don't love it. I could do it for hours. Wow, that's amazing. That's a great deal. That's like, that's the ultimate, I think. Yeah. Really. We come back.

I'm talking to Jason Ellis about his polyamorous relationship. Don't go away. [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ Jason Ellis is a former professional skateboarder, fighter, and author-acer. But in addition to his multi-highfinite athletic career, he's the former host of the Jason Ellis Show, a singer, and New York Times bestselling author of the book,

I'm Awesome. Get to know Jason at his website, thatjasonless.com. Hi, Jason. Hello, Emily. So good to see you. How's your relationship? Because we talk a lot about sex.

So when I first met you, like a year ago on your podcast, you were with your girlfriend, now your wife. Yeah, not yet. We're married at August August because you guys are like an open relationship still. Yeah. It doesn't get that crazy because we're allowed to and the novelty is worn off. It's like we could have sex with everybody and everybody, everybody wants to have sex with this. Let's do that. Look, we're very stable and we're super open and we have no fear. Like obviously make sure you don't have any diseases or anything. But once that's clear, we'll do anything with you.

Right. And then the next day, there's no weird hang-up. I don't care. You're coming home with me and that's the end of it. But how did you get to that place, would you say? In the past, you said your relationship's worn and is healthy. Because we've a lot of questions. A lot of people ask us, should I be, you know, a relationship? How does my wife

get over jealousy? Or I am jealous? Or how did you get to this place? You just got to be comfortable with yourself and you got to, you got to trust your partner. And I mean, when I was younger, it never really worked. If people ask me, you know, should I have a threesome? I would just say, honestly, if I have, because it's a super question, you should be asking me, you should ask yourself. But if you're asking me, I would ask yourself, but if you're asking me, I would say no, because if you're asking it, and then there's a little bit of hesitation, then you've got drama on your hands.

And if you really love the person you're with, do you want to add drama to it so that you can have an extra pussy in the scene? Because it doesn't solve me, man. And it's kind of overrated. So no more about that. Well, I don't know. Very, I mean, I've had so many orgies and threesomes and dicks and pussyes everywhere.

And I probably one hand, I can count the ones where I was like, that was amazing. And there was no backlash from it. Right. The rest of the world. You got to be really very heading into these things. Yeah. You know, part of the process you learn from them, you know, each one, I guess you learn how to do it better.

But you're right. People like, that's like the holy grail because they just want something other than what they have. That's how I want. They want the newness. They want something different. So it also comes with the experiment. Age of 25, you couldn't have felt this way because you wouldn't have had all those orgies and poiseys.

Well, I also think you don't, you know, there comes like a, you know, wisdom, you know, when you're 25, you're like, maybe that maybe she does like him more than she likes me or, you know, or, you know or a girl that I haven't slept with. It's like, I want to have sex with her more than I want to have sex with the girl that I'm with because I've never had sex with this girl. And then the girl that I'm with is like, wait, you're paying too much attention to her. Do not do this. If the girl's like, you're pumping that girl too much, then you shouldn't be pumping

anybody. Exactly. Because that is you looking at it the wrong way. It's like, I want, if somebody's fucking my fiancee really good, good. We didn't get into this for him to fuck her poorly. Right. Like, what?

That's such a healthy ad. You people don't understand that. And I was like, most guys, most guys, sex with a girl and another girl, because they want to have sex with two pussy's and feel like the king of the world. And they don't care what they have to do to drag this,

significant other into this thing. And a lot of sad stories are that the girl is okay with it to keep the man. And that's not the best solution. It's the worst solution. The worst. So what would you tell a guy that, because yes, now every guy's emailing me now about

or calling is 45, like in their 20s, can you have this wisdom then? Like do you think that you would have known this? I mean, I'm telling couples all the time way to your own solid ground, you don't have a reason to solve your relationship. I'm always, you know, we talked about this in the show but we're on the same page with this

but I don't know how else they're still gonna want to do it. It's almost like you had to go through that. I can let people make their own mistakes, but I'm telling you now if you love your partner and you're with them and you guys are in a good place, but you just see if it's sp spice things up, that's not the right way to do it. No, no, it's a risky move, say the least.

Guys are like, I want to, even girls in their best short parties, they're like, I, this is why I'm doing it because I can never tell my partner again, they have this idea that once they get married, that's when they stop experimenting, stop doing all this stuff that's crazy and fun and exciting, but but doesn't have to be that way. It's the opposite. Right. I'm gonna get married, I'm gonna get wild and one more time before I get married

and spend the rest of my lame life with you, like wait, what? Right, it's like, I don't know where the culture will be there with you. I don't know where the culture will be there with you. Society, no one's talking about this really. I think it's because, because we talked about it today, I think it's because when people got married,

when they were younger, and it was like, maybe this is too soon and when you get married you are giving up your life. Things have changed now. You get married when you're older, a little more stable. This is not the end of it for you. This is not the end of the road. This is the beginning.

I think if you're 20 and you're gonna get married and you're under the impression that this is the only person I think if you're 20 and you're getting married and you are under the impression that this is the only person you're going to have sex, who for the rest of your life and you're 20, that's some harsh shit. I know. I might want to get drunk and have sex with a prostitute too. That sounds like terrifying. I just say people shouldn't get married before 30 at least.

I agree. Completely. You don't know yourself, but they don't know if they don't know themselves, they think they're so in love. It's the first thing I say, I mean, they're rocky, I'm not sure what to do, I'm like, how old are you? And if it's under 30, it's hard for me not to laugh at them. Right, do you get these questions? Yeah, you don't understand, I really love them, I'm like, you're 25, you don't even know what really

loving anyone is. Exactly. Yeah, it's a mistake, but you have to go through their own things, they get someone, they learn, and they're like, oh no, I don't know. The hard way, sometimes I see the only way you learn. It is, well I love it, you seem like you're in a good place. Can we go back to your sex life for a minute? So we were talking about, I love your sex life. Even if it's right now, you're still there. No, we didn't have sex for maybe two weeks before the fight. We played around a little bit, but no actual. In the end, it was like, maybe we could in the last two weeks, I In the end, it was like, maybe we,

in the last two weeks, I was just like, you know what, I'm not gonna actually come, I'm just gonna hold it off, because I just felt super low in sex drive. So that told me, and this could be, I'm not a doctor, I felt like, if I'm super low in sex drive, then my testosterone is being tapped to the max.

So I'm not gonna lose anything. And then I had this theory that if I get a direction a bunch of times, see some hot shit. Look at my girlfriend from a different angle, get her friends to like take their tops off, get a boner and then leave and go to the gym. That's building more testosterone. I'm farming more testosterone. So that's what you would do. You'd come to the point of not even close to orgasm, but you just get turned on and and you go to the gym. Yeah. It's like having a cup of coffee with better in a way.

It's something like that. I just can't add it. I get it. Okay. I want to talk to you about masturbation real quick because it's masturbation month. And we had a bunch of questions that came in. So here's the thing. Okay.

So everyone, Jason is talking about he just came in. He's been knocked out. He won a huge fight. What was the name of your fight? It was a king of the cage fight. Okay. It's like a huge. It was huge. And it was like, you got knocked out at the beginning. You can't act the way. I get knocked out, you won a huge fight. What was the name of your fight? It was the King of the Cage fight. Okay. It's like a, it's a... It was huge. And it was like, you got knocked out at the beginning.

You came back and... I get knocked out, I got out. I don't say I don't get knocked out. Talk about it because it's like a chick, talk about sports, I suck at it. But you do something awesome. And you came back. Yeah.

Okay. So, how are you for that? Okay. But masturbation, so went, think back before the fight, before the training, how often do you masturbate? Well, I masturbate in the steam room all the time because guys try to jerk me off or whatever, so there's that kind of thing that happens.

But I don't finish myself off. I don't really want to say the actual steam. Okay, got it, right? You're right, because it will. Maybe you'll get a lot more blow jobs. I get a lot of blow jobs. You do? And you just don't even know.

I'm the hottest person in. It's like being a pretty girl. I know what it's like kind of to be an attractive lady. Right. Because when I go there, everybody shits a brick. And I'm like, this is fucking crazy. It's kind of great. How can anybody, you know what I'ma chewed up?

Man, it's kind of weird. Is it wrong? You walk around there, because I have a very straight large penis. Well, that too, but I have a straight, I'm uncut and that seems to be a thing that gay guys love as well. There's like a I have all the things that a gay guy's really into being straight. They love that.

Having a big dick. It's uncut. All those things and I look bar forgot a lot of tattoos. I look like a war warrior of sorts. Gay guys love that shit. Love it. So there's just a constant like they, like I get like a little harem of gay guys following me into different

steam rooms like trying to jerk off in front of me and stuff. And I'm just, I am like a stuck out pretty lady. Like I don't touch anybody. I just sit there and then they're like, can I give you a, right? Yeah, and then I'll like maybe let somebody jerk me off or maybe blow me if you're lucky. Like a like a stuck out little bitch. Oh my god. And this was not you a year ago

No, I mean it might have been just didn't tell anybody. Okay, right, but now you come out You got so I mean this is like the whole one amazing transfer I'm allowed to I know this story get told to my fiance when I get home from it So this is this is this is what we're saying is you shouldn't get married to one of you can't share all these stories We're like what I couldn't but you can you really can find someone you can't share all these stories with. It's not really like what I couldn't, but you can. You really can find someone that would be, I've yet to. I haven't really been looking for it, but now it's a longer story about what I want, but I get that this is what I would want. I don't want any secrets. I don't want to cheat.

It's hard. I mean, I was squeezed to tell the truth. I felt like, even when she was like, you can tell me anything, guys, like, I don't, not this one. I mean, you got to admit, the story I just told you right then, I don't think a lot of women find me attractive when I say that. About what the men tell me. I mean, you're saying that, and I'm not that cool. You'd be sexy when you say it. I get it, the women might not.

You know what I mean? But my fiance thinks that it's hot, and we laugh about, we laugh about guys that, you know what I mean, I'll be like this guy came in and has like a giant dick and just sat in the corner and she's like, because she loves the Thomas Finland stuff. She's super into the gay guy, the big bus gay guy's a world like leather chaps and stuff. She's kind of a gay guy, that's why it works out.

But if there's anybody that's really big in there, I'll tell her the story when I get home and she just thinks that it's the funniest shit ever. And we laugh about it. And she's with women and men. She made out with a, I was like, I was making it after my fight, one of my friends, she's in porn, she cut her tongue cut. So it's like a snake and I made out with her. That was all I would do.

We made out with her. She's got a split tongue. She's so hot. She's got it split. I don't know what that is. She's so open. Her tongue goes like this. But she cut it so hot. She's got it split. I don't know what that is. She's serpent. Her tongue goes like this. But she cut it so, yeah.

Yeah, yeah. I've kind of heard about this. It's stitched and it's stitched up. So it's permanent like that. And she can make both sides move around. That's fucking crazy. I know. I'm gonna get a blowjob from her.

You did or you're going to? I didn't. There was people in the room, mostly inappropriate time, but it's coming. Okay, I believe that. I believe that you could probably get a blowjob. She said she would. Which is a pretty good place to be in the world.

But by a servant. Dude, I don't know anyone else who's done that. It's a medal, right? Yeah, I mean, that's not even now. We're happy and getting lots of blow jobs and I'm really happy for you. Thank you. Well, let's go to those questions on the... There was some good...

You can help me with this because I don't have a penis. Hi, Emily, love your show. I enjoy listening and get a lot of helpful tips to make my sex life way better. I got a question. My girlfriend and I really want to have a threesome and we're talking about it and we're getting really excited. We've never had a threesome before and I'm going for She Comes First, which is the whole thing I was talking about on the show. She has to come first, which makes sex life great. How can I get into three sums without giving one the feeling of being neglected? I want this to be a nice, relaxing time with lots of fun and no jealousy. What can we do thanks regards George from Germany?

We kind of touched on this earlier, but you are the three sum, I think we had a three sum once, you didn't even remember. That's how many times. You didn't? Just say that about it. Okay, okay, so, but you've had a lot. So this is the kind of question we could ask You didn't say that about it. Okay. I'm kidding. But you've had a lot.

So this is the kind of questions we could ask. We've been talking about it. We're both kind of excited. I think there's another question here. Like another girl says, wife's not so excited. But anyway, let's say they are both, let's say for the sake of this question, they're both really excited. They're on board.

They've covered all the ground. They've set the rules. They've set the, you know, you can't kiss or whatever. I don't know. People make these rules. You can't have sex. I know. Because during the moment you want to do it all. Three-some. Everyone has males and vaginas and buttholes. Lots of warforses to the bell. I got you. Well, the first rule of three-some club is that if you're the person that is the guest in this three-sem and I'm assuming there's a man and a girl here and then another girl, the other girl is lost. She's the girl that doesn't get as much attention as your girl. Your girl gets the most attention. So you need to remember that at

all times and the second one would be you need to make sure that there isn't a situation where one of them is sitting there out of the game be you need to make sure that there isn't a situation where one of them is sitting there out of the game. You need to make sure that they're both in play at all times. How do you do that? I mean, you've got a penis and a mouth. You know what I mean? So I always have to connect it to one of them.

Right. Or they're connected with each other and you're organizing that. and you can like tickle the bits that they have free. You're definitely, it's not about your penis. No, you're the only one that has one. So of course it's gonna be about you in the end. By default, but in your brain, you gotta prioritize. Get too giddy, cause get giddy, and they start slamming into one of them,

and they can't use their hands or their mouth or because their penis is busy. And that's a game that you need to learn quick and you also need to not come. You need to make sure that they come at least one siege before you even think about it. I feel like really, you need an athletical penis. You need to be like, have you girls had enough orgasms,

and then the end of the threesome is when you come. Unless you're, you know, I mean, a guy that can come and then and keep it up, I don't know that guy, because usually there's a break there. Right. So those are the, those are the rules.

Those are the rules. And also I tell, you know, they established rules we had a time meeting or even are we both, are we truly comfortable with this? And some couples say, look, I don't want her to sleep over or I don't want you to have penetrating your first.

No, you don't want her sleeping the bad, yeah. Yeah, you don't want her sleeping the bad. Figure all that stuff out. And then that's a great answer. I agree that you got to prioritize that's how she gets jealous. If you're kissing this girl for one second longer, she's going to get pissed at you. That's a good answer. Okay, Emily, thanks for making a space where sex can be talked about in a way which is healthy,

safe, and fun. I've been musing over whether or not an open relationship is a good or bad decision. My wife and I have been married for a decade, our sex life has definitely started to flatline. My brain, on the other hand, is wired for new experiences, not necessarily with other people, but new experiments in the bedroom that light my brain on fire. Plus, my sex drive seems to be quadruple hers. I think we've had healthy conversations about this, but she's hesitant to try new things. At one point, she suggests an open relationship, but she retracted. Our situation is causing some tension and open relationship might release that for both of us, but I also don't want to

treat the symptom and not the deeper problem, which might be a lack of sexual connection with my wife. Two questions. Are there ways to help make an open relationship healthy and more comfortable for her and are the things we could do better to connect sexually things at Denzel 29 Minneapolis? Yeah, he can't push this one. You can't push an open relationship on your partner. She's not on board.

It's like a threesome. Or anal. Or anal. Thank you. Thank you, Jason. You actually can't push any of these things on your partner. You're not going to talk her into it. You'll regret it. any of these things on your partner. You're not going to talk to her into it. You'll regret it.

She won't really be on board. So I'm going to answer your, because it's going to go wrong. Have you ever been in situations, Jason, in your past relationships where you tried to force open relationships they didn't want it or singing it didn't work, right? I've done everything in correctly. That's how I know how to do it. That's why you're the pit of me of health right now.

You can't make it a relationship healthy and comfortable for her unless she wants to do it. So you're not going to convince her. She's hesitant. She's gone back and forth. You love your wife. If you want to stay together, so I can answer your question, what can we do to better connect sexually?

Because that's where the problem is. Going out, having a threesome, open relationship, that's not going to heal your relationship. That's not going to feel better. You're going to have sex people. And I'm telling you, it will not. And your wife probably won't because she's not feeling like she's having sex right now. It's not going to feel better, you're going to go have sex people and I'm telling you it will not and your wife probably won't because she's not feeling like she's having sex right now, it's not going to work. But to connect sexually, you've got to just start to, first you've got to start talking about

it with her, like really like communicating with her because really it's about enhancing intimacy. So if you guys have never talked about sex and there are so many couples who just don't know how to talk about sex, it's not comfortable for them. We never learn the language, how to talk about. We think it's like this. It should be amazing. And when it's not, we don't know what to say.

And then we cheat. We won't have a three-zone, whatever. But you have to say, like, babe, I love you. I love our relationship. Let's put that open relationship, take that off the table. And let's talk about us. She might not even know what turns her on. You can go to a sex toy store.

You can watch porn together. You can just talk about some hot sexual moments you've had together, because I don't know know what turns out and you can go to a sex toy store. You can watch porn together. You can just talk about some hot sexual moments you've had together because I don't know what level your wife is at. So you could even take sex off the table. If you guys are like, might be a good idea to do that, actually. Right? And then start like exploring each other again.

She's just going to think that's all you care about, it's all about sex. You have to talk about everything else about that. You have to be your friend again. Right? And a lot of girls say that they're not into sex or they're into certain things when it comes to the bedroom because they don't know about it and they'd rather just deny that they were even interested

in it in the first place I find. But if you get on their good side and then it's sort of like you're doing it together as a team and they're like, well, maybe I would like to initiate some stuff because now you're not gonna be ridiculed for attempting to discuss something that in the bedroom though you're usually, you'd be like, whoa, I didn't know you'd be into that kind of stuff. I think girls get weird about that.

They don't want to be the first person to bring it up. They don't want you to think that you're freaky in the bedroom because freaky in the bedroom has been related to your slot. Right. They don't want to sound slutty. It's so bad for women because it's like, you can't win because then we're like if we're super slutty, then people call it slutty. So bad for women because it's like, you can't win. Because then we're like, if we're super slutty, the people call it slutty, which is so wrong.

I mean, and then if you like, you're not can't have any sex at all and you're pro, like it just, there's no end to this. There's no right end for women, except just to like do you and grow up and make sure that. Feel like being super romantic and all that stuff, go, I know that stuff, that was awesome. Is the way, is the only way.

Like if you're super understanding, romantic, and you do things that she would never see coming, that doesn't involve your dick, then other things like that, maybe later on, they come later, or maybe they don't, but I guarantee you your relationship will be better. Right, I mean, there's something going on after 10 years together.

So, there's 28, too, like come on. Oh, it's 29. So, yeah, there's some things that are 10 years together. So, they're 28, too. Like, come on. Oh, yeah, it's 29. So yeah, there's some things that are harboring. You're probably like, she's upset about some things. She doesn't realize it. Who knows what's been happening. So, you guys got to unearth whatever is holding her back from this intimacy.

And then, when I say, take sex off the table, what I meant was, also, I like the idea of the romantic gestures. But like, say, like, let's just start with the four play again. Let's start making out. Let's start doing an exploring to those bodies, the rod and soons again, and build up to like, how great it was foreplay again. Let's start making out. Let's start doing exploring to those bodies, rodentones again, and build up to like how great it was at the beginning. You can bring that back.

Girls really love when you don't just go further pussy. Yes. They love, I can't believe how long it took me for me to figure this one out, but you can do stuff to them where you kiss them and kiss their neck and like tickle their legs and their feet and stuff and don't touch their pussy. Don't touch their tits.

Don't touch too close to their asshole. Like you could touch their butt, but even that, you get in too close, but you can go every now and then if you go near their belly, which is near their vagina, you back off again. All those ones go, yeah, I would never know, which makes me feel like a lot of guys don't. It's like, yeah, it's like we're making out. Okay, the making out is getting pretty serious. So I should probably start grabbing your pussy. Exactly, do it.

No. I have a time with this for 12 years. I'm like, don't go straight for it. So how did you learn this just from? I learned, I studied this at Shady, but I learned from a lesbian friend of mine that was super into my girlfriend and would do this stuff. And it was the first time she told me about it, I was insulted. I didn't like that she was telling me what I should do with my fiance, with my girlfriend at the time,

that would make me better in the bedroom. I'm like, I know how to fuck my girlfriend. You're just like, you don't know. Right, I did talk about that. But then I started applying it. It turns out she was spot on because guilt's not girls. It's like guys know how to suck. Exactly.

Well, sorry. No, we know we want the teasing. And I think the guys, when I say this to them, I say this for a million times, like we, the last thing we want is when we're making out for you to go right for it. This still happens with men that I've been with all ages. And I love that you finally learn this.

And so it's more like the teasing thing. You realize that we're talking about a rousal. That will build. And in fact, you'll have to less work in the end because you so freaking turn on you wander like being like, I need you. It's time to be right now. That's how you get it. You'll have to learn this. That's it for today's episode. See you on Friday. Thanks for listening to Sex with Emily. Be sure to like, subscribe, and give us a review wherever you listen to the podcast and share this with a friend or partner.

You can find me on YouTube, Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter at Sex with Emily. Oh, I've been told I give really good email. So sign up at sexwithemily.com and while you're there, check out my free guides and articles for more ways to prioritize your pleasure. If you'd like to ask me about your sex life, dating or relationships, call my hotline 559 Talk Sex. That's 559-825-5739. Go to sexwithemily.com slash askemily.

Special thanks to A-CAST for powering the Sex With Emily podcast. Was it good for you? Email me feedback at sexwithemily.com. [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪