Sex With Emily - Living Outside the Binary, Ending Relationships in COVID and BDSM Play

Episode Date: July 15, 2020

Happy International Non-binary People's Day! In this episode, Emily talks to the charming non-binary actor Vico Ortiz about how they keep dating interesting during COVID. Vico’s gone to great lengths to keep themselves busy and satisfied while stuck at home so if you’re missing human connection, this one’s for you. They also discuss the difference between gender and sexuality, what to do if you get someone’s pronouns wrong and healthy ways to make time for yourself.Later in the show, Emily helps a caller find perspective on his long-term relationship. Are you wondering if it’s time to end things? Tune in to learn the communication tools you need to figure it out. Plus, how to find community if you’re dipping your toes into BDSM.For more information about Vico Ortiz, visit: www.imdb.me/vico-ortizFor even more sex advice, tips, and tricks visit sexwithemily.com Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

A bratty boy with a femdom. That dynamic really gets me because in a way I have a lot of top energy, but it really gets me off when someone tells me what to do. I've been contemplating and in relationship, or I don't know what my next move is. You know, BDSM bondage discipline, St. Omaschism, you know, just can you even mean handcuffs and blindfolds. Look into his eyes. They're the eyes of a man obsessed by sex.

Eyes that mock our sacred institutions. Betrubize they call them in a bygone name. Vico Ortiz is a non-binary, Puerto Rican actor, drag king plays a character as the straight whisper on these Thames, which is a super hot web series on YouTube right now. It won awards, top trans creatives, and stories to watch in 2019. So that's these Thames. Hello, Vico. Welcome to the show. Hello, hello, Emily. Thank you so much for having me. Yes, of course. I'm so glad you're here.

Like to the rescue. We really, we have a lot to cover. So, I do. I when you said the whole like four months without sex, like, that really, that really hit me. Right. It's been a whole thing. Like, tell me about because you are legendary now. So my producer Marie, so I was like, we got to have Vico on because Vico has all these stories and it's successfully been meeting people. I mean, I guess like I sort of successfully in a way, like I've definitely been out and about. I wasn't planning to be honest. I pre-COVID, I love meeting people in person. I'm very, I'm always going out to an event. I pre-COVID, I love meeting people in person. I'm always going out to an event. I'm always at an event, performing as a drag king.

I'm always meeting people and I love the organic, et a bar, et a dance. If I see you and I like you, I'll come over and say something. But then COVID happens and you're like, I can do any of that at all. So how do you go about it? And the first couple of weeks I was like, this is good, you know, maybe I just need to like just chill it out for a little bit, like be at peace

with myself. But a little bit after you're like, I'm getting really horny, like I'm like watering my plants and one of them touches my hand and a weird and I'm like, oh, that felt like, oh, what's happening? Like I'm very sensitive to everything. And in the queer world, especially in LA, even if it's like LA and it's a city, it's so small. And I was so reluctant about going on Bumble or Hinge or Tinder because I just know I'm gonna see my friends in the app and I'm just gonna be swiping my friends, like being like, hey, friend, like, what's up, homie? How you doing?

And in the very beginning of COVID, I didn't wanna date. I was just like in a very beginning of COVID, I didn't want to date. I was just like, in a very fun dynamic of like friendships that I was like, you know, opening that like physical intimacy with. And it was openness and transparency that like we were getting what we wanted, but also like not having to worry about a relationship. But then again, COVID and you don't know when this is going to end. It's never ending. And then part of it is like when you're stripped of like,

you know when people like get blindfolded, all of your senses get heightened. So in a way, you know, we get stripped of physical intimacy and then all the other senses get heightened, you know? So it's like, okay, is it a good thing that I'm doing this or is it because I'm like, craving that intimacy, is it real? Right. Exactly.

But yeah, my first couple of weeks, after having my like, monkish moment, where I was just like, okay, I'm just going to chill. And then wanting to like crave that like, that desire, that want, I opened up Lex. Alexis, a queer dating app that's just personal ads and you just like, put up a personal, there's no photos. You can add your Instagram, I kind of, be into and you can have no photos. Like, I think that's kind of crazy.

And that's how it used to be, like, whatever, 30 years ago, when do people use to do puts up in the newspaper? Like it would just be the column, right? And you just have words. Exactly. And back to the paper, like the guardian. So now, yeah, they're like, okay, what does the person have to say?

Well, you know, they have to be able to read. I loved it, because it was that, because it's like, you were able to, well, I guess, on my end, I opened the app with the intention of just sexting. I don't want to like get to know nobody, know, know, know, know, okay. I just want to like get a steamy sext here.

I'll read you what I wrote on my account. Yeah, because I need to hear like you're legend already. So tell me, because I think sexting, can I just say this like I, I've had moments where I enjoy sexting for sure, but it isn't art. And I do think that we've had to rely and a lot of other resources right now because we can't meet art. And I do think that we've had to rely on a lot of other resources right now because we can't meet people. So I'm always encouraging people. Listen, we can't

run out of meat right now, but I kind of like that the quarantine has slowed down making everything believe it or not. This is coming out right now that we jump right to sex sometimes. We jump right to intimacy when we don't even know the person. Maybe you want a relationship and you're like, how to get caught up in the sex. So now we have to get to know people a little bit more sex and just have conversations on FaceTime. So anyway, I love that you're an avid sex star. And we love to talk into you real quickly. This is Viko or T's is with me.

You can find Viko on what's your Instagram? Puerto Rican Ninja and the same N for Puerto Rican is the same N for Ninja. So just one N. Okay, check that out and you can also find us on our Instagram. We tagged you, carry on. Oh, you got it.

So yeah, so again, in the very beginning quarantine, I wasn't really wanting to connect with people like really, like I was in the down for like the FaceTime Zoom thing and the whole idea of meeting somebody like through the quarantine, like was like a no-go. So I went to Lex and wrote a personal that said, like was like a no-go. So I went to Lex and wrote a personal that said, I want to make you feel desired, hot, wet. I want to taste you with my words and I want to feel you with my thoughts. I'm an NB mask presenting Latin Queerdo. You're just servu. That's so good.

Was just the amount of people that were like super down to just like boom. Some people got it immediately and they just sent me a message being like, I'm wearing this and like, I'm here and I was like, great awesome. And some people that were emailing, messaging me and stuff that's like, hi, I want to get to know you. I was like, just ignoring that because I was like, I'm not here for this. But the, but then the amount of people that were like, just going. How many, your hands going up and down like there was a row, like you had a scroll and scroll.

I did, it was like 30 people. I wanted to go out, because the ad gets, stays there for like 30 days. So like every day I was getting like 15 people, like liking it and like commenting on it and whatnot. The first day I was like, ooh yes, and I was like here for it, but then it got really overwhelming

and I had to like make a document with people's user names and like the style in which they fucked because obviously we all have different ways that we wanna but it got overwhelming because I was like, I don't wanna all suddenly send, you know, someone, okay, I'm like pinning you against the wall, I'm choking you on inside of you.

Well, and then that person actually wants to be like loved, you know, like making love to and like in a different way. And I'm like, oh no. So I made a page with like user names and styles so that like I would be able to keep up. You know, I was making essentially personalized queer erotic, like in some cases I was like being the romantic

Latino, there was like doing all these things and then like another ones I was being the sub. I was a very interesting dynamic backup. So I want to know this. I understand like being a switch of being into so many different things because that's what makes the world around. I think most of us reopened out what's possible. We would find that we are into so many different people events activities. So I'm with you on that. However, is it more like, can you really be like the daddy one day in your sub or what are you in your heart?

Like what do you really want? I'm just hearing pleaser in you because they let you before. Wasn't just like that, but I'm just I'm curious Like are you getting your needs met? That's what I'm feeling. No 100% I definitely am a pleaser in a day to day I had really I have a very fun dynamic with being a bratty boy with a femme d'âme. That dynamic really gets me because in a way, I have a lot of top energy, but it really gets me off when someone tells me what to do that places them. It's a little bit of, I am not so much of the one that's dominant, but I like someone d'âme knee and letting me tell them that I'm talking about.

That dynamic, I really am. tell them that I'm having it. Like that kind of dynamic, I can't really. Yeah, absolutely. I'm here for it. My incline, most of the time, is like go in the very like love making incline, but like if I know that we both had developed a BDSM dynamic, then I'm like, okay, like yes, let's talk about this.

And then like negotiate and see how it feels good. And so- But this is all through the app. So, and you have all these people, and you have not met them, you're not going to meet them because we're still in quarantine. It's not safe out there. Especially in other places. I don't even know their phone numbers. I don't know nothing. I just know their user names. Of course, but are you getting turned on? Oh, yeah. I mean, the first

couple of days I was like super turned on, but then it became a job. I was like, whoa, I need to organize myself when I'm sexting. For me to write good, I need to imagine exactly what I would be doing in that scenario. I can't just write something titillating and call it a day. I want to really give you that experience of like, OK, so I'm here and my hand is going this way. And then this other hand is going here. I'm actually really trying to put myself in that position.

But then when I'm going back and forth with several people, and one I'm in this position, but then the other one I'm like backwards now, like in them. Yeah, you and I were begging the person who just wanted to be loved in case I get it. Yes, right. This is a lot of work. I'm exhausted hearing about it. So I want to talk about your character.

You play Viro and these vams, which it's a YouTube series. Very different. Viro and I are a little bit very similar. Definitely Viro, I feel like is more, who knows? Actually, maybe Gretchen wants to ride Viro to be a kink of a suyanato, in which case I'm like, you're a four. What I liked was that you spent your time teaching

and newly outbursts in all the terms and rules of identity and queerness, like identity versus sexuality. And so it's still a new frontier for many of us, for many people. How is it to do this on the show? But how can you help my listeners understand this? People here this, they want to do the right thing. They're not sure where to start.

The way that I think it's easier to describe sexuality versus identity is that sexuality is who you go to bed with and then gender identity is who you go to bed as. Does then gender identity is who you go to bed as. Does that make a little bit of a difference? Yes, absolutely. So meeting like non-binary, meaning you're not thinking that it's not just male, female. Yes, non-binary.

So I'm outside of the societal, like binary description, binary meaning man, woman, non-binary meaning I'm neither. Now, non-binary, gender-non-conforming, gender queer, gender fluid, these are very similar terms. And to each person, it could be a variety of things, not everyone that's non-binary uses all pronouns. I specifically like to use all pronouns. Like, I like to go literally back and forth between all three,

because that's how I feel in terms of like my gender fluidity. Like, also, gender identity and gender expression are different as well. So, like, even though I might be wearing makeup and might be wearing heels. That doesn't make me more of a she. I'm still non-binary. And I like to still play with all three pronouns. So the way I express my gender doesn't have to necessarily match my gender identity based on society or terms.

So again, what gender are you dating? Species of all genders? Yes. like, again, what gender are you dating? Spacing all genders? Oh, yes. So it's been, I'd say I'm pansexual with lesbic tendencies. But yeah, the same way that I've like, I've come out as non binary, I feel very comfortable in the fluidity of my gender. I have met people that are like non binary trans femme, non binary trans mask, uh, you know, although the spectrums and I just, I don't want to like limit myself

into being like, well, I'm a lesbian, which is totally fine. Like, that's totally okay. That's like what you want. But in my case, I definitely want to keep exploring and keep like meeting new people. And I think honestly, like personally, having physical intimacy with trans and non-binary folk has been amazing because there's so much like, there's so much communication prior to when you're being physically intimate with somebody before coming out. It was like for me sex was like penis goes in vagina and then like now sex has

changed so much for me and it's so, I feel like it's just more beautiful and more vulnerable and comfortable and sexy. Like I feel taken care of. When I'm coming in with somebody, like before just jumping and grabbing tits, or going in my hand between the legs, I always ask what are some trigger places that you don't wanna be touched? Cause there are some people that haven't pre-op,

or post-op, or whatever. You wanna make sure that they're being taken care of, and then you care about, you wanna worship their body in the best possible way. And they wanna do the same thing with you. And make sure that are being like taking care of and you care about like, you want to worship their body in the best possible way. And they want to do the same thing with you. And they love that. Well, I love that too. And it's so funny because so many people

just are not comfortable. People who are married for 20 years are not comfortable talking about their sex life and what they want. And what I would love is everybody get to the place where you're at, that it's just like we're talking about where we're going to dinner, are we going to have Italian food tonight,

are we having Mexican, are we cooking, what kind of sex are we having, what are you into, how are you feeling, let me go get something out of the dishwasher dryer, I'll be back, you know, it's like I think we make it so uptight and we get so concerned, but that's exactly how it should be like, what are you into, where do you like to be touched, and then be so much more satisfied and fulfilled, I think, as a species. Absolutely. And you're not so much in your head, you know, like once you're like, once you have established all these things, like you're not like halfway through being like, oh my God, I just touched this and like, I don't know.

If you've already like established all of that, you've got all the questions out of the way. And not just with like what makes you feel good or not good, but also like SDIs and a lot of good stuff. So it's like, let's talk about that. Let's talk about for a minute. Like if someone tells you like, do they tell you like, I have herpes,

but I'm taking daily suppressant or I have HIV. I'm like great fantastic. Thank you so much for telling me like what are things that let me know if you have something coming up or like what are things that we can do now that will make you feel good and desired because I feel like a lot of that pressure comes in like oh if I say something they're not gonna desire me anymore and I think that shouldn't be that way you know I still desire you I just want to desire the way that like will make you feel comfortable and beautiful and sexy and hot. So I much rather have that conversation before than all of a sudden and be like, oh, shit,

what just happened? Now, the conversation is afterwards if we don't have that is way worse. So I try to avoid you. Yeah, you eradicate awkward sex. We're saying because so much of the sex that we have, it's just awkward, it's weird, we worry. All of that can be avoided if we just got comfortable with this. And it's a practice too.

It's like we are born with this ability or we would all be doing it and I would never job. But I don't know, we're so far from that but I feel like you can learn from people like how to just ask for it, ask for what you want and ask for what you need in a place to feel safe. Now some people don't know too. Like some people have never felt safe expressing it. You know what I mean?

They just haven't even thought about it. But if you're with someone who shames you for it or is awkward about it, the thier person, like why would you, because somebody doesn't want to get your needs met, right? So, okay, so what are you gonna do now? So now you've all these people that you're dating, and so you know sex, yeah, you have any sex.

But yeah, no sex, no physical sex at least, like with somebody else. I definitely have partaken in self-pleasure, a plenty because that's all I do. That and eat and watch Netflix and TikToks. Right, let me talk about that too. Okay, so we're gonna take a quick break. This is Sex with Emily.

I am Dr. Emily, you've great cast and collars ahead. So hang out. so hang out. Okay, let's talk to Tony 55 in California. Hi Tony, what's going on? Hi Emily, how are you? Hi, I'm good, thanks for coming. I'm in a relationship for almost 15 years and 55, she's a little bit younger than me. And I have been contemplating ending the relationship, or I don't know what my next move is. We've invested time into this relationship, but I've just seen it's not going in the right direction

at times, kind of bickering, consistent basis. Sex went from fairly consistent to almost, you know, I think the last time we did it was a story months ago, I find her sexually attractive, but she's very conservative, whereas much more liberal in the bedroom, just from my past and the way I grew up, whatnot. And I've suggested counseling and she's fiercely against it. Just, you know, I'm hesitant to try and force her into it, consider just going for myself and my own sanity to find out if I'm going, if I'm nuts or not.

No, you're not nuts. Totally. You know, there's a lot of people in a relationship, you know, you, me and us. Exactly. Well, I think it's us, Tony. Yeah, I mean, have you, besides the therapy thing, Tony, and I think I'm always a fan for everybody, for you, your partner together. But tell me, have you talked to her specifically and said to her, you know,

let's talk about what's been going on lately. I feel like there's been some tension, we have been as intimate, have you talked to her specifically and said to her, you know, let's talk about what's been going on lately I feel like there's been some tension we have been as intimate have you asked her like what's going on? How you feeling about our relationship? From my perspective and I may be wrong. I don't know It just it turns into what I feel is a very contentious conversation. I think she immediately goes on to defense And starts pushing back against me. Sometimes it's all couples go through this or you did this, you did

that. I see you're going down a rabbit hole that is never gets anywhere. Yeah, so you're having the same argument over and over and over and over again. I feel like having been in this cycle for years, going this, they're good times in there. But I'm starting to look at photos and stuff and just go like, you know, associate, oh, we had an argument then. Yeah, that's not so this is what I always say. This should be your equation. It's like you want it to be more good than bad because Everyone's gonna bad days with their partners are gonna hate their partner sometimes, right? I think you know, I hate my partner. You know, I love him

So but right now you're telling me that it actually is more, you know, more bad than good and it's been that way for Well, so you're right to be thinking about this in a different way I always think you really can't leave a relationship Until you know that you've tried. You've really tried everything. And so I think there's some more steps here, but I hear what you're saying too, that it's like, I'm just frustrated, I'm always out, but I think the other way you talk to her is

it's some, it has to be at a time when you are relaxing, hanging out together, you're not stressed out. I like to think of halt, you're not angry lonely are tired and you're not you know And you're just sitting you said you know I really want to talk about something and I've been thinking a lot about our relationship and my feeling is that We you know you want to use your own feelings that we haven't really been connecting and I know that there's two of us in the relationship But I really think that it's gotten to the point where it feels more bad than good, that there's more tension.

And she went, oh, that's not true. You always say that you say, I'm trying, I'd like to put different conversation with you right now. I feel that I'm not sure that we could keep going in this way. I think of solution would be for us to go see a therapist.

And honestly, if she says, no, no, that's crazy. It's only for crazy people or whatever she says. She's like, well, I don't, you could ask her for her suggestion. Well, would you suggest? Now, listen, you've says, no, no, that's crazy. It's only for crazy people or whatever she says. She's like, well, I don't, you could ask her for her suggestion. Well, what do you suggest? Now, listen, you've been together almost 15 years.

This likely isn't a one time conversation. This is an ongoing, like maybe over the next, you know, a few weeks. Hopefully she'll hear you if you do it in different tone, right? Is that something you've tried before? Like in a different, like it's about both of us. I think we want to be great lovers to each other. We both want to have really healthy lives.

This doesn't feel great to me. How has it been feeling to you lately? This is how it feels to me. How has it been feeling to you? And you just keep staying calm and curious. That's why I remember Tony, you are calm and you're curious and you're compassionate. Like you just, it just helps. But if you don't feed into the fight the same are you do this

We use it that goes nowhere, but if you change it's called homeostasis, right? We change our partner change around us. So you change your response the argument's gonna change it won't have its fuel So what do you think about that Tony? All right, so I you know I'll try and find it. I don't I'll try anything. I don't really think that I'm thinking the relationship after so long. Of course not. Being back out there in the world and starting all over again from many different angles.

But yeah, it's something that has to change. It has to. You can let her know that. I want this to work. I love you. I care about you. I really want to make this work, but I can't keep going like this in the same way. We have to try something different. We have to. And that's the conversation, Tony. It's like, because I hear it in your voice, but I think unless you really try and hopefully

you can get her to go and listen to the other thing about therapy, people think I'm committing them to therapy and you should go for the rest of your life for so many couples. And this is not just me. This is studies and other therapists. The couples who go to therapy, you are fast tracking every issue you have. You're going to realize in a month, if you go every week for a month, once a week for a month, you're going to know so much more now than you figured out in the last five years. You might realize like, oh, this was the problem. Now we're going to move forward with something healthy or you're going to go through where it's still

mate. Like this can't work like you just it fast tracks everything so I would try that I mean I don't have any other solutions for you right now that healthy communication and and and keep going back to that but I am here every night so what I love is if you have a conversation with her you get stuck you can call me back all right okay that sounds like okay of course let me now goes Tony thanks for calling. Okay. Oh, you guys, relationships are challenging. They really are. And if we haven't spent the time in our relationship

to learn how to have healthy communication, you really see the impact that it has in resolving arguments big and small. You know, having healthy conversations when something gets like, when it gets contentious, I didn't ask if there was contempt yet because when it gets to contempt, saying nasty things, name calling, you know, that's when we're in deep water. When you don't want to get to that point, you don't want to get to the point where you're

hating each other and you're just awful. You want to get to the pre, you want to start right away in the relationship. What I hope is you are in your early phases, you're having healthy communication. But it's never too late to learn how to actually talk about what's going on in the moment, how to resolve conflicts, how to hear each other. But the thing is, if you don't know how, I mean, don't beat yourself up, or we're not taught how to do that, it's not modeled at home. That's where we learn most things.

And growing up, I, we didn't have any conflict resolution. We didn't talk about anything. It was just like, you know, my family just sort of looked the other way and we didn't talk about feelings or emotions or resolve things. It's like, you're the kid, I'm the adult, done, you know? And then how would I go into an adult who knew how to communicate?

And I wasn't in my earlier relationships. I certainly was not the best communicator. I was avoidant. And I didn't want to resolve conflicts. I thought that there was a conflict. It's just time to end the relationship. Because relationships should always be great. It should always be amazing.

That's what we see in television. Oh, and my neighbors are so happy. I see them holding hands every single night. It's like, you don't know what happens. Behind closed doors, and I believe me, your neighbors are not as happy's like, you don't know what happens behind closed doors and I believe me your neighbors are not as happy as you think and we know what happens to the movies. No, that's real. There's no for playing movies.

So it's okay to even take your partner. I know that we don't have the best, even now. Maybe you're just fighting about, maybe you're even disagreements about something like where you're going to go on a road trip this summer too. But it's gotten tense, right? That's the same skills you need. Diselving little conflicts are the ones that you're gonna need when you have bigger conflicts and eventually get to the point where and I promise you this

happens when you learn how to maybe it's once a week you're like Tuesday nights, we sit for half hour and we talk about whatever's on our mind and we each talk and we each share and that's when we start to resolve them Once you've learned these skills of listening and Reflecting back to your partner what you heard like I I okay, so I could say you I really want the bedroom to be green Right and then your partner says oh, I want you blue you know say well I think green reminds me of this example of Of warmth and safety. And I like to feel that way when we're in the bedroom.

And now I was like, yeah, but you know, I'm, are you saying I'm not, no, I'm just saying that's how I feel. But in healthy communication, your partner would say, oh, they would pair it back to you and say, so what you're saying is you would like the room to be green because it makes you feel safe and healthy. I would say back either yes, yes, you're right. And then they'd say, okay, now I could say no, I didn't say safe. I said settled. And then you just sort of, you get to agreement. And then your partner gets to respond and say,

I hear what you're saying. And so you want to be safe and healthy. And then you offer something like, you're like, okay, well, I hear what you're saying and I really want you to feel safe and healthy and and let me tell you why I want blue. And then I would do the same thing. And then we would then you're not fighting about you always get your way and because every couple has that argument, every couple has that place that they go that he was just referring to Tony was referring to this place they go where you're like, I can't get to the actual argument because we have our routine.

So what I want you to is learn healthy communication skills. There's a great course you could take online now called Nine Violent Communication. You can listen to these shows. All of these things. How do you communicate to a partner? Are you wanna listen? You wanna lead with feelings

and you don't wanna put your partner on the defensive? So I'm talking about it as a skill set. Like everything else we do in our lives that are important, our jobs and being a good parent, being a good friend. It's all the same thing, but we just aren't modeled it. We're not bad. We're not wrong. We just didn't take time to figure this out. And that's why I also love therapy because a great therapist will teach you skills on how to deescalate, conflict, and how to get to a quicker resolution. And then from there, you start to think, oh, yeah, we got this.

I mean, it's miraculous what it could do for many couples. Or you realize there's things you'll never agree on. You've grown apart. Maybe your values have changed. I mean, whatever it is, you find that out because the therapist is like your mediator, they're not taking sides. They're just there to help. We're going to take a quick break, but stay tuned for more sex with Emily.

Okay, John 64 in California. Hey, Dr. Emily, I came across your site and thank you for opening this forum. My wife and I have just very recently discovered a BDSM lifestyle. Who knew? Borminogamous, straight married couple about 20 years and do not image that changing. Although we thought we would be identified as switch in our play, I do almost immediately that I was the sub and that was all I cared to be. So when he says switch that someone will be dominant and then someone would be, you know,

submissive and then they would switch. I held off telling her as long as I could, three days, LOL, because I thought that she too expected him wanted to be the sub. She's naturally deeply caring and submissive. Contrary to this, I've been very dominant in every aspect of my personal and professional life forever, large corporate executive, et etc. We get you here.

We get you, John. We're still a bit aww at what this has opened up our lives, extensive communication, a broader and more fulfilling sex life, and a deeper mutual trust than we've ever experienced before. We weren't bad before, but we both feel like this has brought tremendous balance to our life beyond our sex life. My question, how do we expand our social circle to find and socialize with other like-minded couples? We aren't interested in changing our monogamous lifestyle or sharing our actual sex play with others just to save means to socialize with persons of a like lifestyle and life experiences.

Well, John, I love this first of all. I love that you guys have opened up your play to something a little bit different. Well, can't care for 20 years. This should be, I hope that there's people listening who've been in relationships and you think, this is it. This is how we're always going to have sex. I want me on the top. She's going to be on the bottom.

We're going to have missionary. We're going to roll over. It's going to be over. No, he's 64, 20 years together, and they've realized there's a new lifestyle. And not only did they decide that they wanted to be into some, you know, BDSM bondage discipline, say, no, masochism, you know, just could even mean handcuffs and blindfolds. We're not, doesn't have to be a whole dungeon. But he's saying we did something and we mixed it up.

And then he even went further to say, and I wanted to be submissive, which is very common for as far as this lifestyle goes, that there are men who are dominant everywhere else in their life, right? From the boardroom and they've got all the things going out, but in the bedroom, they want to be submissive, even then that was able to work. That was another layer he went through. So I just want to congratulate you, John. Thank you for your email. And also to answer your question, okay, well, the great news is right now there are some places, well, I don't mean right right now during COVID, because everything's a little more challenged, but as far as bridging that gap between like,

how do we find like minded people? There's a few places I can send you. There's one called, this is amazing. It's called hashtag open. You just spell it out hashtag open. And it's actually a dating app, but it's for single people, it's for couples, it's literally for people in every type of relationship looking for any kind of thing, LGBTQ, non-binary, trans, I mean, there are everything on there.

And so if you check out hashtag open, you could put a profile up there and you can sort of say, looking to socialize for people, you know, who are like-minded. And so I think finding someone on an app right now, I even was reading during COVID that there was like people having play parties on Zoom. And so that might be a great place to find that also another site that lists a lot of different kind of events like this is FET life. That's FET life. So those are some places where I think you could just start looking and finding people. The other place might be Reddit. Now, I'm thinking about it. I feel like Reddit has a lot of sub-communities of people. I don't know if

they've groups on there, but I just was, there's a lot of sex stuff that goes on there. But if you want something that's a little bit more people and you're like, mind it and not just talking about it, I would say, Bill, just have a profile and hashtag open. Tell me how it goes. I've heard so many great things and then fat life. What good news about that is I think you want you to find a good couple that you, you know, some people you like.

This is how I always found. Would you find someone you really get along with or or you like whether it's socially or professionally you tend to meet their friends and it tends to grow from there so I love it All right business with Emily find me Monday through Friday from five to seven pm specific Unserious XM stars for even more awesome sex top calls and segments. It's a great time. You can find more at sexwithemily.com slash SXM. Also follow me on all social media. It is sex with Emily across the board.

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