Sexe Oral - Noémie Bigras: Pourquoi tu bloques en relation et en s3xualité expliqué par une psychologue

Episode Date: April 30, 2026

Cette semaine sur le podcast, Lysandre et Joanie reçoivent Noémie Bigras, psychologue, pour une conversation aussi éclairante que vulnérable sur les traumas d’enfance… et tout ce qu’ils laissent derrière.Sans filtre, on plonge dans des sujets qu’on évite souvent : les blessures invisibles, les réactions qu’on ne comprend pas, les patterns en amour, la s3xualité, le corps qui se souvient… et cette peur universelle de “mal faire” comme parent.Noémie explique avec clarté et nuance comment les expériences vécues dans l’enfance, qu’elles soient évidentes ou plus subtiles, peuvent influencer nos relations, notre manière d’aimer, de communiquer, et même notre intimité. On parle de styles d’attachement, de blocages, de libido, de sécurité émotionnelle, et de tout ce qui se joue inconsciemment dans nos couples.On aborde aussi une question qui frappe fort : est-ce qu’on va tous “f*cker” nos enfants? Comment réparer, comment faire mieux, et surtout, comment comprendre d’où viennent nos réactions aujourd’hui.Entre prises de conscience, exemples concrets et moments plus légers, c’est un épisode profondément humain qui risque de résonner chez beaucoup de gens.Pour celles et ceux qui souhaitent aller plus loin ou participer à la recherche, voici quelques ressources mentionnées dans l’épisode :🔗 Projet de recherche en cours à l’Université du Québec à Trois-Rivières (UQTR), pour lequel je suis co-chercheure et pour lequel nous recrutons actuellement des participant·es :https://cripcas.eu.qualtrics.com/jfe/form/SV_1Y2z91uYGFUYZ26?Source=PubSXO🔗 Projet abordé dans l’épisode avec Joanie :https://cripcas.eu.qualtrics.com/jfe/form/SV_5BfjpcNOGBU7id0🔬 Laboratoire de recherche RESET Lab :https://resetlab.uqo.ca/Instagram : @resetlab_uqo🔬 Groupe de recherche CRIPCAS :https://www.cripcas.ca/fr/🧠 Trouver un·e psychologue (Ordre des psychologues du Québec) :https://www.ordrepsy.qc.ca/💬 Ordre professionnel des sexologues du Québec :https://www.opsq.org/fr/📖 Lecture recommandée :« Vous n’êtes pas votre trauma » – un ouvrage récent écrit par une collègue, qui offre des pistes de réflexion importantes sur le sujet :https://editionstrecarre.groupelivre.com/products/vous-netes-pas-votre-trauma?variant=48251478311169Le podcast est présenté par Éros et CompagnieUtiliser le code promo : SEXEORAL pour 15% de rabais sur https://bit.ly/EROS-MEILLEURSVENDEURSLe podcast est présenté par Oxio. Utilisez le code promo SEXEORAL pour obtenir 1 mois gratuit sur oxio.caRéserve ta soirée entre amis au SHAKER de ton choix dès maintenant sur shakercuisineetmixologie.com🔔 Abonne-toi pour ne pas manquer les prochains épisodes!Pour suivre Lysandre Nadeau : https://www.instagram.com/lysandrenadeau/Pour suivre Joanie Grenier : https://www.instagram.com/joaniegrenier69/Pour suivre Noémie Bigras : https://www.linkedin.com/in/no%C3%A9mie-bigras-58774761/Pour écouter sur Youtube :https://www.youtube.com/@sxoralpodcastPour devenir partenaire du balado : [e-mail] travailler avec l'équipe du balado : [e-mail] Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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So, a good pleasure Annal, all, everyone, thank. One of my partners me said that it would be

not super-bom. So I have a trauma to that. Today, I have many of the difficulty to move to m'emone

to mind, you know, my poor Miami, in what I'm in a while, we're doing. We're doing so, we're present,

me, with No, Amy, Bigra, psycholog. It's not more frequent that we think, it's a

person on three, who canada who report to have vicaring one of these different

forms, that trauma or maltreatens in the infance. How you the planche to do you.

I think that stress because I know that I see that I'm not bat my my children,

I know not they're not aggris, that I'm voluntarily they're not voluntarily, I'm not

voluntarily, you know, but it's all. But it's a moment to do you make a

board. How I'm how I'm doing that fucker my un-of- my I think

we're we're fucking we're we're talking we're we're gonna we're gonna we're

really excited that you're to be with today, that we're gonna do this to get at trade

to trauma at infance. But the two, we have a lot of questions for you.

We have a lot of trouble. We're going to a lot of a therapy for us in the fact. In fact,

it's that we're going to we're going to get back with you. We want to a therapy gratuit.

Yeah, not that not so. But before to see in the trauma, why we could be

to talk to talk about to you a bit how you've to come your

career of a psychologist. It's long. I'll try to

to do you have to secur to get to this title to do you get to be in college, so bacaloree

in psychology. Then I'm I'm going to do with a matrize in sexo for all to try to try to get

to get rarely in psychology. And then I've made my doctorate in psychology and it's

really, at the part of my matriise that I'm interested, first, to the agressions

sexual viku during the infancy, is how is how is it of the effects, how is it impact the

sexuality at at an age adult? And, we're talking in the things in the things in the

people, we're in a lot of physical, but a sexuality while that it's quite, we're

spontaneously, when we see something that, it's too in our life, it it's

it's not there's there's there's certain consequences on the gender and the

role of my doctorate, I'm interested more largely to what we call the trauma

that's the trauma interpersonal particularly or the maltreatence during the when you can use different terms to be in

but when we talk about the trauma I'm saying now in the phone we talk of violence physical,

psychological, of the negligence that can be at the physical, so I'm not my child at my

child at my medicine, I'm not my question physiologic to

or there the negligence emotional, so I'm I'm not, I'm ignore these I have a need

I'm going to I'm going to hear the I'm going to he's like there's a not a lot of there's not

to be able to be able to be used to and then you talk about all that's really all that's including the

aggression sexual also and during my doctorate I'm asking how it's it's just regarding the

aggression sexual in line with the sexuality so that it it's a sphere that's a

super extremely intimate it's really the sphere where we are the more vulnerable, where we're literally at new,

and a sphere where we have to have confidence, and it's a experience that we've seen, we know,

we learn all the contrary to the confidence, we know that it's perhaps not so security than that to be in relation with

someone of other. So I didn't know why we're not interested to this large gam, that,

of experience, of trauma or of maltreatence in line with the sexuality, don't see what my

doctorate has my thesis. So my travel have made to consider that

the people who had had been used more of the trauma during the time, so that's

those which I had tend to be more satisfied on the plan of their sexuality. After that,

I've been doing a post-doctoral just in the same thematic, but with

a bit more diadic, so the couple, how is my experiences of trauma to

me, have influenced to be my own, my proper sexuality, at

I'm a panopuished sexually at what it's a function well, at what I'm that's the good, that I'm that's a good,

or at what I'm comfortable with these contacts that, but also how is that can influence the sexuality of my partner? So it's

these analyses a little bit complicated that we're making that we're so that it's been my stage postdoctoral and during

these years, one time that when I've had had a practice of psycholog also that I maintain of the

other. But I'm also principally at the university of Quebec in Ottawa at New York, the Department

of Psycho-Education and of psychology. And I continue to mone some work on with other questions of

research that develop, it's going to be in post at Lucco. So, it's a

career still young, but I have plenty of ideas for the suite. And we

see that, there's a interest, and it touch so people, it What's what you've really

done to really don't to go to go to the aggression sexual and all that? In fact,

my interest that's arrived a bit, in the fact of the directress that the director's that I had

a bit of amnely there but I'm always wanted to understand the relations, the couples I've had

a course at St.Gep of St. Jerome it's a book, but on And just the theory of the attachment, which is at the base of all, we'll have

on repalate. It's the base of all our relations, it's the so-sure-what-on-fond, all our representations of who we're-n. How we see the other? How we're in the relations? And I've also always used an interest for the sexuality.

So for me, to buy these lives on that, you know, to me informer, it has always been part of my interests. So when I'm aware of the maitrice, the thematic of the aggression sexual, interpersonal, well, it's it was a sense

with my love of the theory of the attachment, it was a sense with, I'm interested to the sexuality,

and at the final, it's developed in something more grand, which continues to also, you know,

to be something that's a place in my research. You're like specifically with the adult?

Exactly. So, you're going to go to plunge with them in their past? Yes.

It's the approach that I'm in therapy, effectively, the people have all sorts of problems or have

to have some their daily in their relationship and their relationship and their sexuality, but not necessarily to understand

to understand where it's very exaggerated with their chum their blonde for these little things. You know,

the everyday we can't on the famous example of the vacele, he doesn't he range not the rache

like I want to, it's like it's not you make not, you m'em not, and I'm not important for you, and it's

some things that we're talking, and sometimes, I mean, when it arrives at repetition, it can become an irritant in the coup, and that's an example of many of others, but sometimes the people, justly, these problems that, and they're not capable to be able to them explicate,

and they want to better understand. And it's the manner which I function effectively, so in my I'm going to I'm going to question to people for

really to learn to learn to be and try to try to formule these hypotheses of how it's how it's

that's going to your relationship with your marriage, the ambiance at the house, how it's how it's

how we can understand that this part that for example of the life conjugal or

of your sexuality it, it function more when I when I propose these

hypotheses by a rapport to the past, justly, that we make to

a coat or that we're in the whole of it, it's not for the

that we're not that our or that we're that we're in the life vessel,

the chaos of the of the life with the mind, the more indice of, I

can't make a very great reaction, that the person

can't explain not, but in therapy, we can get to get to

explore, maybe it's a lot of the past, you know, in relation, it's that the

feeling that I'm not important, I'm not amy, and there, even if it's probably not

what your child or your mind, it's, it comes to activate the perfect

good piton to put to get in a detress in fact that you

don't tell, so it's things we're clarify, that we explore

in therapy, often alone as as a therapy of couple also.

And it's it's drollely mal-fait because the vulnerabilities, it's like

if two people get together and active exactly the perfect biton for that

it's enflant. And so the everyday doesn't not the task

to s' to talk and to talk, and to talk, but the therapy

permits that, but it's sure that... It's what the cop typical that you're the most often to be

without to say all the things, but what are the people are the people who are people who are being abused,

who are there and that they're there are what the most popular? Well, I'm going that's a

better choice. No. It's what the more that's the most so of the

role. It's a bit of shaming. What is the response the most popular that you

receive. Let's we reformule that the motive of consultation the more than the question. Yes,

thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Honestly, it's super cliché but it's really the

communication. How it's it's not capable to me make an tone? How it's it's quite he can't

not? In couple principally it's really something that's that's present

to all sort of form and if if we see we in, I've

granded by example in a family or the parents cried, or the parents were absent, or the parents

punished, blam-ed, or even, you, ,,, you,,,, it's, it's sure that we're not in being in

an environment that we don't the tools necessary for develop these good abilities of communication, of regulation,

of the emotion, if I, if I, the theory of this theory he has said that the manner that

we're that we know, don't we know, don't we understand the relations

is really based on the first relations that we have had used with our figures of our

parents or donor of their care, when it's not the parents necessarily

and so if the first experiences in relations that I have,

it's that, there are that parents who respond not my I'm going to feel feel like I'm not

good, that I'm not fine, that I'm agress, who's, I'm not trying to live something that's not sure that's a sure

I'm sure, I'm trying to have the attention turned to be the exterior, when is the next danger will arrive?

Because, yes, my parent and my source of comfort and of security, but there's at the source of danger. And that's the

grand drama that the children who live these experiences like that do have

composed with they're with which they have composed because they are pre. So it's the environment in

the world, and they are all with the tools that they have like their own

quite quite quite we're in version in a little version of us, we

don't know not the ability not put to understand that it's not we

the problem, it's the parent. I'm erred not that. But, just, with this lack of resource, that, of capacity to to think,

it's a lot of more than it's a problem. It's all the sense that you know, in the sense that's it's not, it's not

that's normal, because it's all that you know, and I think that's taboo also. You know, don't know it's not, but

it's not, but it's, but it's, imagine if I'm talking to what I'm to what I'm about to what I'm have

been having to it. It's it's indues all sorts of

impression in the little body of the little he's and so

he and so finally we're we're to be that's that are

developed so so just I'm not not how I'm

because I'm not that I'm not I'm not I'm don't know I'm

too of because I'm going to I'd like to say to much. So it's

these things that rest. There's a author, a researcher who has written a book that's

called The Body Keeps the Score where the body keeps the whole, and it's a bit that

when at age adult we have some we're not that, but it's that's that's not

digered, say, or metabolized of the emotion, the, of the color, the deuce, you know,

of these things that that I 've lived that I merit not, but with

the I'm pogned today, you know, I'm with which I do have

to get a way, so it's not a terrain that's a good ability to

communication, a good, because we think we don't, and we don't know and we

know. I'm the impression that you me will be about that I'm brainstorm a voice out.

But I'm an impression that when we hear of trauma in the we're in always like four

coaches in but let's in the sense that I'm let's think at my own my proper

my proper infance okay there are there's there's terrible that I'm

there's but there's specific that I'm that I affect really really really

really really that I'm that should maybe an other infant,

and if it's not been important, or, you, it's something something of banal in a moment, but

it's really, you know, I'm going to say, an affair completely naisoose, okay, but I'm worried. Example,

I'd in my chamber and my family, and my, my, I, I'm, I'm sure,

I'm, I'm, I'm a lot, that's, you know, but a joke, that, like, you, like, you,

like, you, nothing, the, she, at 30- today, she's, she's,

she's a, You know, you know, there's some of the thing, you know, there was all the thing, you'd have all chanted in choral, and I was even not capable of chant in choral because my little bull was punged in my gorge, and I was going to

me to gochew, and I was like, I pleurray. But, you know, that's, it's these tricks and, you know, my father, I've heard of that, and he's like, ah! But, you know, he's got to, let'sone, mon chum, he did the music, and he made me ask, to find out of and he's the first to me to create, and be like, to be like, wow, you.

something that he was banal, a joke, I'd like that I'd like, so that I'd say by trauma of infance, that's in the

affairs super, but sometimes it's about it's a bit little, little things, what's what I do you say?

All right, and I think that's a nuance important to do, it's true that there's there's

I've done an example minseu, yeah, but it's probably it's quite to be

too pretty, yeah, and like there's there there are there's and that,

and they, it's not it's it's it's like they're like we're we're not

we're talking that let's see that yeah, well, it's a question, it's an excellent

question, we're talking of trauma interpersonal in the infanels but it's very,

you know, all not necessarily traumatic, all not sure not a trauma

and there there's there, there's using the term trauma, is that's

a bit in my case, in my case, in my Because it's a consequence to something that's a question

a little blockage, a joke a joke of, is it? Is it not necessarily not the term appropriate,

perhaps? Well, it's a good question. I think it's, and it's, and it's, and it's, it's,

you know, we've got to a category, you know, but in the same time, we're, for statutes, what's the

problemat, what's the problem, what's the problem, in the importance that has left and,

and there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there,

there, of these of the that they've been made, who also evaluated, by example, let's on, we're going to, in the aggression sexual, there was a, a good idea of the was just a victim in line with these

comportment and in fact we realized that that while that they had coached all the that was

a a act of the law, there were there was people who were not and the

importance were different that the people were that the people who were and it may arrive also

in my practice to see, to talk of people who can be used people who

could qualify to more severe to the sense of what what we we're going to

the manner on the way we're scourer the events of a

manner very very very scientific and little of

the the aspect clinical sensitive and but so

those elements more severe but but still you

know are are marked of that really profoundly

in their identity in in all in all

their manner even to respond to of people in their entourage. So,

we could talk of maltreatence also, because when we say trauma, it's that it is that something that's something

that's I would say that my father, it's not of the maltreatence. But I think there's a

word, you know, when you on have talked about, you know, there's also,

to give, to them to talk. So, I think, so I think that's just, it's,

it's good, it's been there, there's capacity to talk to process what's

to process what it's not going to no, he's never coming not, well,

is that if it's for categorize for a for say a fact it has to it has to

it has to have a impact in the life, like I with what she has

said it's a trauma because it has a impact in his life yeah but it's

very serious it's not a bit if it's not a There's a trauma. There's a lot.

There's just that we're not in, I know what, I'm going to say, that I'm going to say, who, I'm who for determining what's what, for you, or for

you? I, there's a one of my partner, my partner, me said that it would be not super

good. Now, that it's, it's, so I'm a trauma to that. It's a bit comparable

because, let's think, today I've been to be able to move to the nun to the moment, you know, so it could be comparable

to your trauma or it's not these traumas? I think there's something there's a clear markant. It's a

blessed, it's a fact, it's a question. It creates the blockage, it's like,

it's like, it's like, it's, it adds, it's, it's, it's add, some,

it's, to who you're at how you perceive how you're in relation also you know, it's your it's important, how our father we perceive, how our father we're and how our parents we're trying, independently of these intentions

who were just not not due to, not du but we don't know and we know how is that our words, our gestures in the world internal of the other and I think that's important

that it's with all the people, with the parents sometimes it's more evident for all sorts of reasons, but to recognize

that and be able to be able to repair, there's there something really important, and it's that's appell

to couple also, you know? It's even in time that parents, let's let's think what I'm,

let's think to think that I'm that I'm that, it's that I think that I'm

that I'm not batting my children, I know that I'm not they're not that

I'm not voluntarily they denigree, the humiliate or they're all right, but it's all. But it's a moment

of a moment of a moment of a time, that I'm saying, that's something like, and that he

that's a mark all his life and that's a super great impact at long term. So,

so, I'm so, I'm so, I'm a sort of, without voluntarily to have a aggression,

you know, you know, because I'm, examples of the same, there are many, there's a

plenty, like, to, like, to say, your wife, she has started to find out of the swing, it would have you

know a way to do you know, that's veer, but that's on the other board of the door, and it's the

same, that I'm that I'm know, there's a opportunity, the first thing that I'm

when I'm present to a question, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm in the

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sex oral, on the site ofoxio. OXio.com. Thank you, OXio. How do I fucker my son? How much do you do you do for not focky my infant? I think we're going to

fucker? It's a good question. Is it possible to not focky my own, my my own, my own, my own, my children? I've I've already I've got to

have two. Well, you know, there's a lot of, I mean, it's to be a parent, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's,

we know, we can't, you know, and we've ever be mal-intentioned, but it's, it's far probable that we're, or the leg, in saying something

of something of correct, in being perhaps, you know, it's, you know, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, we've got,

we're occupied, we're occupied, we're occupied, we're milled, we're many things to and think, what is

important is the frequency of that. Asi, on every year, the majority

of the time, you're a maire amant, accueante, chaleureuse, who is there, who is there, who responds to

the own own to the health, the security, who can have some with the

parent, with the other parent, but who is capable to repair also, but after

that, the way when incontreusement, you'll have maybe said something of blessing, well, you'll be sure, this time,

all right, and it's not the experience generalized of the life of your children. And I think that's that's what you have to be

to create an harmony general in the house and in the relation, already, it's a raper much on the

long term. But so we're, that we think, that we, that's, agression

sexual. No, but, you know, to, you know, to trauma, deep, of the people who have been, who have vizuresions of the violence, of the negligence. Is that you have these, things concrete, for them to help them to get,

to them? And what the repercussions? Let's talk about, someone who has vogue, I'll have an example, abuse, okay? And he comes in your bureau, who'd say, me,

I've had these traumas of infance, vicarues of the abysexual is what the things that's the things that that's the

that's on a time, what you know, concretely, concretely. The planch is to do. Well,

you know, you do, you do you do you do , and then you know, and then, it's not

a lot more frequent that we think, it's one person on three on Canada who reports to have

have been made one of these different forms of trauma or maltreatens in the infance. So that

it means that if we consider that one person on one of these three people, she is in couple

with one of these three people. So it starts to touch a lot of people to be able to

get to the world with different experiences of maltreatens different levels that can

have us have influenced at little, grand scale and in the spheres different.

the effects of the aggression sexual, but also of all these other forms of maltreatens, you know, if we're on the fact that,

you know, the aggression sexual is, it's, it's more, it's more evident to be the

space same, the sphere of the function of the fact, in the trauma, in the

experience negative, that is in the infancy, and that comes, and that's, and that

attachment, I'm going to rectify here. It's not create the rupture necessarily because that's with a person who is

known, it's made, it's not always the aggression in the rural that we see, there's a very complicated

for the for the child to understand also what's to understand also, but we're

also of these consequences on the sexuality to the people who have vugugues negligence.

By example, if more negligence emotional. So, we've not validated, we've not recognized as being

the person that I'm not not taught to me to know, I've not used the space for to learn

what my my job my so, so it's a environment like very very very

very effectively well, this person that's not who he is, it's not

what he is, grandies like that. So when we're in a relationship

in a marriage, or no import, in the sexuality with kinkink, or even,

I'm sure who, I'm like, I'm like, I'm even not, I'm even who's not,

I'm never ever done the power, we've never valorized in who I'm in who I'm can't,

how is I'm my preferences on the plan of the sexuality, by example, what I don't,

my limit, we've never given the occasion to, to be to be there to be

there so, we can be that it can do a sexuality, who is probably not very satisfactory. If we don't

what we're not, we don't know what we're not, we can't even, we can't maybe, we can't be able, because we have fear to be rejected, we're afraid, to not be able to be and be able to be the most great fear

that all the humans on the planet. You know, even in therapy, at final, what we're seeing, I don't know I'm not be abandoned, I want to be all, it's all the base of all.

And it's normal, we're these actors social, if we're it's still there today, it's because we're made for to be in

relation, but just when these relations bless, traiiss, abim, like we're doing, you know,

in the same type of violence physical or all sorts of other type of maltreatance can leave a certain

aversion or touch. It's can I'm not in security when I'm close to

when I'm because it's totally not not secureizing. I'm it's really applied to be

so mifier so I'm in a space of an aspect of hyper-vigilance at the affue to,

there's a there's a question, there's a to make a in a sexuality, we can be perhaps

that it's going to do a lot of a car that's crispe, and when we're the stress,

the attention, it's not necessarily the ingredient a key for an question of, an response

sexual that will be being be able to be able to be able to be able to have in

having of this sexuality or again, of an erection that will be going to

because the stress is probably one of the most great enemy of a question

very much the question well, the consequences of these experiences relational there

negative that are marked by the violence, the traisone that

that subside of the defiance that will give to develop to

all different of different mechanism of strategy of reaction

and that's that that will come to be able to be to be

my partner, to the intimacy, at how point I'm to respond to these advances or not. So it's,

it's not experience of trauma equal, sexuality, alterate, you, or it's not not quite

sexually. And that also, I think that's a nuance that is important to do it, it's not because we've

that, that we've been that's that's obviously to be to be to be this sexuality

and it's just some of the things that we can do you know, to talk of that, that's not, that's not, that's the

when we realize that we've seen, that has been a impact on my capacity to noming my preferences, by example,

then after that, I'm more capable to me say, okay, my partner in this moment I'm even,

I'm, I'm feel, in security, he me not of mal. And maybe

we can go to a pas a bit a bit a step to get a to get to

to get to to get to to get to that we're that's that's that's the time,

but who also the that I'm to discover with that not for all the people,

but sometimes it's not for a changement of the 27? Yes,

of the lunette on the relations and the other. I'm the impression that can be

an apprenticeship that's in a relationship in the sense that you can, you can, you can,

you can't all the time and it's that, and there's there, and there something that

can't be a just that all the time that, now you know, now you

understand to come where you have a or tell or this reaction, and that at

the way, that's the reaction that, this reaction that, you know, that I feel at the I'm at the

I'm in the I know who he's there, and why he's there. So, so I can, at the

say, to it's to add to the apese rather than just to just to the

impulsion. Totally. I think you think you decry magnificently well

also this work on that on aspired in therapy. as

as uncomfortable that can be so farchant because we've not been merited that, we know not sure but now

today we're being with the kind of the space of the task to doves our day to learn

where it's to find where it's going to we do we do with that? Is it I continue

to to reaction to these experiences that of the past or I

think I'm reflish I'm fash I have the right of

being fashed, I'm that's not the things that I'm doing that

I'm doing what I'm in so. So, to, we're to mentalize, so to

think to to think to do in therapy also. And when we know where it

actually, we're like we're, we're like, we're ultimately to a kind of to be able

to do you, or if my my, my, my vie responses,

my my vie reactions, And it's not It's not grave if it's that's what I'm I know where it comes or I'm

or I'm actually to reactive these mechanisms that's all these mechanisms that's all absolutely. Absolutely. Exactly.

And in therapy, it's that today you're with a partner that you like you're an adult, you depend upon you're not

of these parents you're, you are you're autonomous, you have your work and you're always kind of

some sort of this little version blessed of us. who is the fool who who,

who, who, he, he, with some , you know, with some

the situations, the present that that's, these reactions, that are

also generatrice of a distress. It can be, subtle, subtle,

you know, I'll give a example, that I'm came to happen super

recently, that, let's, let's, the last little realization that I

had all all the time fear to, let's let's that all the night,

and that I know that I know to get a toilet, I'm like, live a color of

an, of the parent, let's let's have include a beau pair.

So, I'm I'm used, to be stressed to have the patate that's if you have

to be to get not, let's I'm not I'm don't, I'm not,

you know, because you've done, and I'm going to suburb someone in cholera, you know, because you're saying,

or you've made to because you're doing, but you're doing, but the minimum, you're not, you're doing, a sort of power constant,

then, and recently, my wife, and we, we've had, chambre, my conjoin, and me,

he's, he's, with our son, I, she's got with the night, and she, and then,

and I, I'm, I've been, and I've been, I've heard, the path, at the side of the room

because my chum is just at the toilet and the door and the door

I'm in my pootrines to get to get, I'm back it, right, I feel like

my eyes like my my eyes like, I'm, my two children, I'm my

chum that's my frisely, my my core is crisp my car

is made to be a bat just because I've heard of the door to be

the door to the night, you know, it's it's there

that's that's like, but why is you know, I think that's said, you know, that's made

a bit more what you've been to putt in lade, that's not that. No, no, it's like

to be to stress. I'm, I'm sorry, I'm, I'm afraid to go to go to

get in the other sense, to, you know, to find, you know, I'm just, like, in genre,

like, you've, you've re-vue the trauma, in the but it's it's not re-reve necessarily

the trauma, It's just these reflex physical, corporal, that you're emagazin with the time that's still there,

but that's not serve more. It's not to be stressed and to be to get stressed, but I'm

talking about it. I'm like, this night, you know, when you're to have been and then you know,

and then, Chris, my power of my bad person to when I have 15 years, that's still

that's, you know, is that's, let's, let's, if, if, if,

if, if, Is that in the experience that's something that's something that's something that's or as you're saying, it's all the time be there, the fact of

the fact of it's going to be anewing, but we'll probably not anew. I example, someone who has been sexual, it's very long

before that I feel like I feel like you because you say that the car he's sovere so that someone who's not

when he's has been to sexually due to his trauma sexual, is there or it's it's, it's,

it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's easy, to get,

it's easy, to get so, or? I think it's very variable. You know, sometimes just have named

a thing, noming a, name, a, having a, having a reflection that is arve,

like, to be able, to, you can, to, to, operate certain changement, and

often, you know, there's a lot of things that's there's a lot of our insue

in our inconsiant, you know, and there sometimes, to just have done the place

for that, it can't have been something, it's false. Because I'm as the story,

let's talk that I'm that, I know, that's, I know that's a thing that

I know that's the first time that I put a word on why I 've seen

that's a bit more clear. But, you know, it's all all the time that's a matter, let's,

I'm doing it's on the end up on the other way, and I'm going to make sure that's a lot of reason. But this

this time that it was a clear that I'm able to make the door to make the name when I'm going to be, and that

it's a okay, in the case, in the it's a thing, I'm not, I'm not

different from, but at least it's attenue to find, okay, it's irrational, you know, and probably

Maybe maybe at the time or if it it's ateneur we'll see not, but at the same

as you know Joanney, well, you know, I think there's there's kind of at the

level of the body of the body's there's there's there to be there

to make there to make sure to be to be in security also, but

there's there's there there's there that exist in therapy

it's not in seance, it's made at the house, but that's a kind of reappropriation of his car, and of

his sexuality, and then sometimes it's a aid to, justement, on it's in a context security,

where we're well, we try to, because what's what's what's, it's in all,

it's not just in line with the trauma, but I think that it's adds, like a pressure

to plus. When we talk of sexuality, all right we think to the penitration

penis vagin, it's that a relation sexual, it's so. But when it's so,

depending on also, the nature of the aggression of the a question, but there

there also of even more more more aversive. So,

when also we realize that sexuality, it's a whole event of

the comportment that not necessarily the penetration and that there's plenty of other

things, it can also diminue the tension, the pressure that we can't be quite quite, to connect with some attention long time

cuted or, you know, that our core has not permitted to have been able to. And, and justly, there's not no penetration

for several weeks, because we're reconnected with other parts of the body of the core, that we neglige

often, but just for to try to reappropriate this core that that's a there's a

there's often there's a lot of people that's a little traumatized by about their infancy when they their parents,

they've got chicaned when they they were at five and six years, they were in public because they had their

car and they said, no, we're not, they're not doing that, there's a there's many

people who are there's there's not to do you, if you're in your in your bureau of your

women, especially, perhaps, who have have the difficulty to to touch with that and it's to something that

you're never that's irreversible? Well, that's that or the education sexual in general, it's not

something that's not something that's made in all the house, not so, so that's a example,

like you say, or just at the house, we don't don't know my parents to show

their love, or, you it's like, it's like it's like something that's just

that can also let's the idea that you something in that of taboo, of mal-saint, not there,

so touch-to-to-not, you know, I think that in a case as you know, precisely, it's all this exploration

that, it's certainly how we're how we go to react to that that's important. And,

you know, the importance is not to, to humiliate the the child that is in

doing it is in the normalize the to say that, well, we'll do it in his intimacy, in his chamber, and

all that, because, effectively, we don't know that that's associated to something to be an because if it

associated to something of an we can emette the hypothesis that it will be it, it can be something that

is a base, it's something that's a bit mysterious, that we can learn, frankly, to discover,

we can't the people and it's things that arrive at these ages different also

so, so there's something in the sexuality and the discovery and the

that's I'm I'm just, I'm just mysterious but it's mysterious,

yeah, curious, we're not too, a bit taboo, you know, so it's sure that

when we part with this sentiment that, it does more to ask

to ask to be to be questions, and perhaps to have some to have

some conversation at the subject that. And at age adult, we can't think that it's still, and how is that I'm saying, more, as well as being sexual, is

that I'm at least to, just, to be able to, just, certain comportment that I've always creed as being, just a salle, not permiss. So, it's sure that our rapport to the sexuality also will influence how we will be

to be in this sexuality. Is there a little bit It's correct. It's really good. Now, we've we're talking. It's when the last time

that's done that you're doing, okay, we're talking. And then I'm not like a story or to have a

emoji of a few on your first of your selfie. I'm talking, you're talking, you know,

and your and you're that I'm a shaker. The shaker you just to say to tell your

gang, okay, shaker I'm in, all the people are in, all the month, there's 23

Shaker on Quebec. So you can't say the excuse to be to be a little bit of to be in your or there's sure that you're all right where you can't

all your life. All right, bring an verre, to take a cup of cocktail, bring these tappas, these things to get the time.

We're going to take the time, you know, take it to share the shaker. The shaker is a place where we

enelves all the reasons to remit that we're not no reason we can't just be texted

and see in gang. We have we need collectively of that. For you organize

this show, to shaker Cuisine and Mixology com, you booked that right now.

Is that, just by curiosity, is that has you have you have you have seen

in your trauma related to the religion by about to the

sexuality because I feel that it can be something

that can be in the an infancy, you know, a kind of, just a taboo particularly around

the sexuality, in certain cases. I'm not to make everyone in a same battle, but... I'd say that the first thing is

in the moment, also because it's a new axe of research that I develop in this moment, but it's in the people

more aged, who, who have been a point clearly different of the other, in with the education sexual.

That, not only only there were not but in plus it was just very reprimanded. You're not not being in 13 years.

That's and to talk to talk when you know when you've had been some bad or the

movey and it's so it's so so, so these pensac that I don't

that's not that I'm, I'm I'm more I'm more in current

of that but spontaneously what I'm made in the people aged

today of 70, 80 years, who have granded in these messages

that, who, who, they're they're in the malase to the

same, the way, to name the words, the own their own their own their own,

you know, vulve, penis, it's something of a , you, to be to be a , you,

to understand, because they don't tell them in that, and, they were puny,

it's salle, it's not something that's, it's sure that has a impact, But it's

I'm to what's you think of the idea of the trauma that's

transmitting to generation to because if your your grand mother that 80

years, that's a big taboo about sexuality to do it's

it's it's it's kind of it can't it can't do differently

to it's what you think what you think it's that it traversed the car

of the womb just to... We're more in spirituality, but I'm I'm the impression I think I think

I'm 100% but it's medicine conventional I don't know but in any case go, go see.

It's not scientific. There are there are there of the transmission intergenerational of the

trauma but not necessarily in liable with the sexuality. There are of the colleagues of the Crickrace, the regroupment of research,

to which I partying, we'll probably but there are some group of this groupment that who find some work on that. But in line with the sexuality,

it's a good question. I would have tend to think that effectively, there are some there's some there's always even implicit.

There are some some of the things, there are not being said for that it or a sort of a kind of

a kind of climate and that allgrey all the difficulties or the

difficulties or the defies be in the plan of the intimacy sometimes to

unfortunately not not want to not other things that's

it has a effect a effect but it's it's

it's very so I'm in the I'm in the sense that

I have the good to believe that if it's something that's real for the other trauma it would be

for the sexuality personally it would be to what I'm in the way I'm at no doctorate the test

you've made there's actually there's a there's a research that you're in trying to do you that you

wanted to that you wanted to that's what the kind of questions and you know you've said

you're saying you're on the phone to be a good or it's in couple, and it's

you're going to question, can you can you do this? And what's what's what's the

what you're that? In fact, the, the, the, the, the,

the, the, it's interested especially to the individuals, so how, my

experiences of trauma, influence my sexuality via what my mechanism.

What my case has revealed by example, it was at the level

of the regulation of the emotion. So, so I 've 've been

different types of trauma, more I'm , I'd say there had different types of trauma

at the house, it would have been to be able to make sure that I'd be able to my emotions. And so, I was less satisfied sexually because

if ever I was anxious, nervous, it'd be able to compose with these estal there in terms. What it said not, my thesis was on the

plan conjugal, when the partners are together, so this project that, and also with the idea behind the

that's not these, it's not these lines direct. So there's always there's always the mechanisms

that the people are going to be to be able to be able to explain to the line that between the

experience that I've experienced and how I see to understand how is that the experience

that I'm able to have been in the infancy to communicate to communicate the affection

to my partner. The affection is a mechanism key in the function of my conjugule,

in the sexuality, but there are very few of studies that they make in line with these experiences like that's been in the past. So how is

the affection that I communicate to my partner, that's so in saying, I'm saying, I'm, with the

touching or in the aidant to do different tasks, on the daily, will be to explain

to explain how is my sexuality support. So it's a project that is quite interesting

because, actually at each night we'll have done a little questionnaires

on the day that we have done to pass. And it will be able to see how the fluctuation

of affections can't help us help us to understand our sexuality. So we can't

after having completed the questionnaire individually because that's what we're that can

give to do a conversation interesting with some and our partner because

we realize that finally I'm you don't be able to say with my

maybe more with my more with my more maybe I'm that I'm that I'm in that I'm that I'm

that you're to make a way in passing that I'm that I'm that I'm that I'm that I'm

we're sure that's interesting because that's a partip to participate in some of a bit like

a pose also in the time we said we're we're occupied when we're when we're parents

it's a routine the bed the bed, the bed, the bed, the bed, to work,

all that. It's not much of time after for to sit- and then to think to have a couple,

have some having a lot of that's a time, to be an occasion, to do it to do you get in line,

it's just that I'm supposed to be partaged in Starby that I'm that's going to be able to be able to

make a or maybe a link. Example, let's let's give an example that we're

not a person who does a question gestual, I'm not very, and so you'd probably the link with my trauma, or, like, my, my, my, my, my,

my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my affairs negative that I, I've seen, when I was, you, that's, you, you know, that, you know, how is, you know, is that, you know, between what has been

in the infancy, and the sexuality? And there's a link indirect. Or indirect. Okay. By the affection. What is to say, by example, when we're talking, it's always, it's always confidentialial,

so, so it's, it's, it's, there's, it's, group. It's really a effect of group. We're not

we're not, we know the responses individual of person. But, yeah, and it's,

for us, it's super important. It's so our work, and it's that we partage,

and that, usually, like, resumed, and give access to these information that,

being done that it touch so the time, and also, you know, what we can expect

ultimately, it's that can, it's, it will help help or, do more informer

of interventions, or, of intervention for these couples or of the people who are who are doing these events

and that report the difficulties in their sexuality. And it could identify, perhaps, the affection

like a leviour, something on something on something on therapy. Like the communication, by example,

if we said a lot of a motive key to consultation, but so, of the processes or these,

these, the, these, the, of the, uh, who are really, who are,

they're influenced by these experiences, negative during the infanctives, but who are also, forcibly,

in the sexuality. But, like, we're all, all, the travel that, the, the,

the, the, the, that's, so, I'm going to do that, you,

you say, you say, I just the, like, my chum, and, that's chicanne that, that's in fact that's chisande

who's doing these affairs that, in the front, they're frapped these moor, because it's completely linked to something, that's our little people who are in

our own own our versions adult. You know, to you? But, yeah, I was, I want to do this formulae

we'll make, and if there's, like, as, as it said, I think it's interesting, because it's to really be to put some

to ask you to ask you, and to see, maybe there's some of the things, there's some of the people, we're doing it,

but in the whole of course, it's related to our infancy. It's very interesting. You know,

you talked about a bit a baggage of all of what we've and what we have, and it's for that we see the life

with our lunettes to us, but there's there's more traumatic or negative than other.

Is that you travel? You talk of the style of attachment, but is that you go

to work with the evitant anxio, desorganized, is that? Is that you work with

that? Yes, it's the theory that I use. And it's also something

that's helping when I communicate also in therapy. It can make

to better to more to understand how we're working, why we're

doing that's very aidant to have a word also for something that

we can't explain And then, and then the theory of the attachment, it's a theory also that's quite well known in a fashion general.

It's not Louise Siguin who did that, no, I don't too of merit to Louise. That's what he's meant. No, the theory of the attachment,

it exists because 1969, at the base, it's a... I'm sorry, it's a Louis Siguyn who had invented that. At the base,

it's a psychiatrist, you know, it's a psychiatrist who a medicine, my God, it's a lot of time, but that I've read my first book of the theory of the

attachment, but it was especially, in fact, based on the relation of the marriage and then,

in 1918, if I'm sure, there had been a first model that applied the theory of the

attachment at the infance to the model romantic at the adult and it's with that that we've

can't let them if you can't just because I can't not by Kahn, I think

it's evitant that's you're more, if you're just, you're just chisker, you're going to be more

in the way, is you can just you can't just leave to be a bit,

I'm in my, I'm, I'm, I'm in my practice, but, um,

the person who will have an attachment evitant, will have a, have a great

need of independence. It's someone who will be more more comfortable with the intimacyity,

the devolement of the someone, it's someone who will have more tend to see

the other, like, not dignes of confidence, will not for me, so we can think that's someone who

has been able to be able to in the life. Personn't will be there for me, so also be me to arrange

me, sov that it's, it's very much in these in couple, or in the view in

general, when we have been to be able to be able to be able, but the

way to reactire to the other, it's completely to make a mur,

it's very active, uh, I'm not I'm not. It's true. We'd say that you're asking because I'm not sure.

I'm not sure. But if you said Tantor, it's a little you know, you're trying to keep people who when you're getting people

necessarily you go to get to get anxious because it's fide the other you know, I imagine it's rare I'm not.

I know the statistics I know even not if you're but it's true that two evitant in Coup and

they're not we're we're not the first day. It's doesn't more difficult

when the two people and when the two people are going to and there's it's hard to come

a lot of time to come to get back to get back or come reconnected with another. But I'm also

I'm also the impression that you can be a type in the life but with

someone you find someone you find someone you're more more impere than the most anxious of the two

I'm in the relationship with the partner amoeuery is often the relationship who

we're who is, who is, who is the good to say, the more, the more

the more the emotion, it's a relation of attachment, you know, when we know,

the relation of attachment principal, is with their mother or the parents, when we

when we're adult, it's the partner amourous, the partner amourous, the partner

amoeus, the principal figure of the person that will reveighed the minor

reactions of abandon, the reflexes for I me protect, or you know for you have been in

an attachment a little more anxious or or it's someone who would be more like being indign

of love I, I don't know. And, at the person, and then say that it's

someone who will probably have more to have to demand to be many,

many of proof of love to the other. So, will manifeste many of

demand of a lot of assurance. Is it you know, is you sure that you am, and it's never really enough.

It's like the reservoir to love and will never, so can't imagine, effectively when

someone is more comfortable in the intimacy, and there, and you get to get a

person who can't get a thing, it's a different for the two in fact,

and that's that's the things that can't try to that we identify in therapy

and that can identify in therapy and that can't Wow. What's what you think? Excuse me to say, I mean to say,

it's what the two other? Well, there's an attachment securisant, secure, secure, it's a person that's a

call-liss, it's a person who, who's quite very positive, who see, the relations of a positive

also, it's a person that's comfortable, and who, who is also a person on who can be a person

on the relationship amoeoeuels, and the other, and that's that depends like the manner to be categorized

but you've said it's organized it depends of the theories but I'm I'm using the crintif so it's

it's true that's someone who will oscillate between the two poles so it's more evitant more anxious

the attachment we're sometimes we're often sometimes something that's something that we're

something that's just the word it's the word but the idea there is

exactly the same it's just there there's a structure in the attachment to disorganized

and it's ex it's disorganized there's not there's not a structure so the theory that I'm

the law, the last it's the long of two dimensions so there there's kind of something

there's a way we know the between the dimension where I want to be independent

I'm to be to be able to be able to I'm and I'm really

need to love I'm really to be sure of but I'm mean you who you say I'm afraid

to be close in the end of the fact that finally I will do do you know to be in a new

where it will be going to be able to make a matter that I'm in a distance that's that I'm

sure more I'm in fact that I'm understand. It's so. It's but he also a

but they're also. But sometimes it's so let's say, meton, let's get anxious, I'm feel like

there's certain people who are different different things of so. Like, like I'm I'm in the, I'm in the, you know, but I've

already been in another relation that Krem, I'm certainly in the disorganized or I'm really not really, so, is that, is that, basically, well, that's probably, obviously, according to the relationship that, the person

is not condemned to be anxious in his comportment all the time, or he will always rest a little party by experience, let's know. Generally,

generally, the attachment is is quite stable in the time. It can be there are some of the relations. If we can

learn the time that we're in security in this relationship that, it can attenue the reactions

live of menace of abandon and all that. But it's also true that we can have, we

have several types of attachments, but we have generally one that is active more

in the relash-ambrose. And that will can still restate in you know,

but it's related to if you're to have a lot of you're a good chance

that you be able to be able to to get to get to your life adult and that that's

that's your mechanism of defense that you have developed. I'd say that depends

because that someone who has been a person could also would also want to

want to something more complicated in the measure where you have the environment

in the But there also our personality, our temperament, that with what we're in the way, which makes that

we're perhaps more introverties, more extrovertis, there are different things that will determine how we're to do that

that we're doing. How do, someone who, let's say, let's, let's, learn,

after being in a relation. What's what you, what you, what you, what you, what you think,

let's, let's, let's, let's, let's, really, and that can be you can't be with

someone? Well, I think, what's what's what's what's something

that, even that terrible, determine not the way that someone will live their life.

It's not because we've that we've to be to be able to be in couple, and that's

that's not that I think that's, I think it to be the same the travel what they

demonstrate, is that the liens, the liens are not so far that's, it's a

people who are to be able to be able to be satisfied sexually, to be able to get to be unknowed

in their sexuality. So that's we're not to be able to be a quite to be in couple,

be in relation, I mean, I mean, all the whole people is a little pokey

at that manner, you know, and I think that, we can all the whole,

but when we are in couple, it can also can be an occasion an

an big occasion to experimented of the situation, when the relationship

and the relationship, we're in security, we'd not that it would be that generate

other problems or that create other experience difficult. But I think that

yeah, the people can be in relation and be being a lot, and a

thing we're these issues, these these defies that, it's reflex, that

who can pose a problem in the relation, we have a perfect laboratory for experimented

different changes, different reactions or different reactions, or to understand with examples

like you know, like the name, the end of the night, you know, there are

some concrete that I can go to talk about my partner, if I'm can't

can't be able, but after there, there's there's sort of strategy also

that exists for that we can be communicate, but, but, but, yeah, I think

not that's going to it's like, it's like it's like, it's like, there's a there's

there's there's not that you can't not get that you can make sure, because you have not

the link of attachment far, like you don't, you know, you're not your

parents, and it versus that's that's transform in being your partenor

of life. I'm a person, I'm a try, no, I don't know, I know,

I've got to say, rest, on couple, and you'll be it. Well, well, you know, if we know,

when being alone, that there's a thing that's a bit of work that's a bit of on which we can get on,

on which we can get a lot of, it's a far when you it's sure, you know, in theory, I'm going to

be able to be jealous. That, but you're not in the terrain, that's so, you're not to be on the

terrain, yeah. You're going to get to make, but you can't, you can do, you can do a bit

bit of Chomain. Hey, Blatt, I'm sorry. It's not not quite a question. I'm a

question for the people who are in people. Let's on that I'm with a person who's

a lot of a lot of and that this person not is not not a reality. I'm just

relativate that's there's there's a lot of that's probably who have

that's with that's with someone who have there have some you have

the people, let's let's let's to me to me to help

this person or it's really, it's really, it's really, like that's, like the person that's,

she's, she has, she has to something, she has been, that's a person, the partner,

that's not that's been that's, how it's that's been about it, it's a question,

if it's, maybe, maybe, you know, I think, that, I think, it's,

to, to, to bring conscience of that, and the effect that has on, on,

it's, there, But before to terminate, let's let's I'm a auditor and

that I think I would have some of the trauma or or some that's I'm going to

do you think what the time? What's what you do you do you know to do?

Mm-hmm. Well, you know, I mean, I'd say, I'd say, I'd say, I'd like,

I'm a question, I'm not, I'm not the best things with the psychotherapy, when, well,

it's something that's accessible, because it's due time, it's the energy, but it's also the issues, and then,

you know, find the person who's with who it's so, if, for example, someone

was able to do this processus that, I'd recommender to consult the page,

by example, of the public, the association of the sexologists of Quebec, or

the order of the sexologue of Quebec? There also different organisms, it's

someone who could be not necessarily pre to enterpresent a psychotherapy but would go to find some research,

learn more more than that could be on the site of the Cavaq so there's really plenty of information

and resources that can be accessible and some just to read some without necessarily to learn

or to get to get to get to also, can also, make a and aid

to process what we is arrived or how we we've been, and I talked about the Crip Cass Tantau, which is the

Center of Interdisciplinary on the Problem Conggues and the aggressions sexual, which I'm

a member regular. It's for that we call the Cripcast, but in the fact, it

group people people, many of researchers who work on on some them on some

some of some people have some in the people, so, aggression sexual

with so it that can be that we're more we're more more tented

to to go to to learn, to try to to better to understand that. There,

there's I said a time I'm there times there's there

there's there work with the who are with the crew so

that can be really a site also that is a

resource and information for just to learn a little

more and I think also that first that

it's that that that that It's been part of our history. It's already a grand path.

It's a lot of courage for it for the fact that. And the trajectories of action after that are really

varied. But I think also to be there sometimes just to have an friend, a friend,

or even with some or her partner, if we can be, it can also be some

being some people are there being rich, who can have do good

also, sometimes detent, detent, to detend or to be inle a tension that we're not, but we're not

not to open the conversation, okay, it's that that all that, but again, but again, we're saying

we're getting prepared, and so I think there's a there's a lot of things that we can do that it's just

not pretty not and that that's not the first episode and we're mithed there's time, days,

days, days, and they're going to be ready to be to be able to and be able to it's not,

we're in fact, I'm going to I'm going to I'm doing, I'm doing that, and I've done and I'm doing

more, and it's well, and it's well, and it's well, and we're going to get all the resources that you're

in the description, and is there's something also that you'd like something that something that we'd like we're

that we're that's sure that there's the social also that exists and just I'm my laboratory

of research at Lucco who is the laboratory on the sexuality and the laboratory reset.

We have a page Instagram which is really very active, very nouried by an team of

people of students of my labo who do do the excellent work and and that

just resumed sometimes some some articles of the results and

the concept in research for that it be accessible possible because

because, I'm in French, we're we're quite in the resource. I think if

we're on on the other than there's a lot of course, a lot of different of resources.

Even the the books are all the books of family of personal, you know, yeah,

so I'm so I'm really, so, I'd have that's so, I'd want you to know,

it's just probably, it's over, I'm, so, so, my page of the laboratory

is kind of very well active and I think it's very pertinent so I think think it's a point of an entry to

get to be a language that in a language that, I say, I'd say, and digests, and then there are,

there are some, there are, there, there, we're, that we're, that we're, that we're,

that we're that, we're always, that people, interested, to participate and to make to make

advance the science, we can not have to make to have to have

to do the things, and ultimately with people that we

participate on the project, we can come to give to the

results, we can give access to these information that that

are not not always not still are still important

to transmit and to transmit and and I

think that's that. We're all so Noemi. We rest for the after-show. We'll

clear a couple of testimonies, and we'll know what you'd have to say to the time. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.