Shaun Newman Podcast - #1003 - Prodonick - Parker - Moen

Episode Date: February 18, 2026

Today I’m joined by David Parker, Tim Moen and Chuck Prodonick where we discuss all things Alberta Independence. David Parker is a prominent conservative political activist and founder of Take Back Alberta (TBA), a grassroots organization he established in 2022 that played a key role in ousting former United Conservative Party (UCP) leader and Premier Jason KenneyTim Moen is a Canadian libertarian politician, former leader of the Libertarian Party of Canada, and he hosts "The Tim Moen Show" podcast discussing fitness, politics, and related topics.Chuck Prodonick spent 20+ years in the Canadian military. He is a retired sergeant who served as a member of the Princess Patricia’s Canadian Light Infantry and served in 4 tours overseas. Tickets to Cornerstone Forum 26’: https://www.showpass.com/cornerstone26/Silver Gold Bull Links:Website: https://silvergoldbull.ca/Email: [e-mail] Grahame: [phone]Bow Valley Credit UnionBitcoin: www.bowvalleycu.com/en/personal/investing-wealth/bitcoin-gatewayEmail: [e-mail] Get your voice heard: Text Shaun 587-217-8500

This is Viva Fry. I'm Dr. Peter McCullough. This is Tom Lomago. This is Chuck Pradnik. This is Alex Krenner. Hey, this is Brad Wall. This is J.P. Sears. Hi, this is Frank Paredi.

This is Tammy Peterson. This is Danielle Smith. This is James Lindsay. Hey, this is Brett Kessel, and you're listening to the Sean Newman podcast. Welcome to the podcast, folks. Happy Wednesday. How's everybody doing today? Well, March 2nd, okay?

March 2nd is a big day. That is the RRS deadline. Also, it's Ignite Distributions Filter Sale. Just throwing that out there. So March 2nd, multiple reasons to pay attention to that day. You can save a bunch of money with Ignite. And, of course, you can put precious metals, your R-R-R-S-P. You can invest it into physical precious metals before then, after then,

as long as you make contributions into your R-R-R-R-S-P, T-F-A, R-R-I-F, or Kids-R-E-S-P. You can also add a physical gold and silver to your account. this year's deadline, of course, March 2nd. I'm going to keep hammering that out because it is just around the corner, less than two weeks now. And the Silver Gold Bull, they got all their in-house solutions, whether buying, selling, or storing precious metals. They can help you with your RRSP contributions. And you can text or email Graham for details with any questions you have around investing in precious metals or for future silver deals exclusively offered to the SMP listener.

Speaking of silver, let's take a look at the price, 101, 56, the old silver wagon hovering right. around that $100 mark for anyone paying attention. Silvergoldbull.ca.com. Just make sure to reference the Sean Newman podcast folks. Bow Valley Credit Union. Well, Red Deer, you've got, Bow Valley Credit Union, has a lending and advice center open now in Red Deer, and they're working towards opening a full service branch there.

It's all about lending, deposits, real financial advice. You can open up bank accounts, talk through lending options and get help with banking, all in a space designed for conversations, not transactions. If you want smarter banking with gold, silver, bitcoin, sound money, and personal freedom, head to bow valley,CU.com. If you're wondering who to trust with your savings, well, integrated wealth management. They're a full-service wealth management firm that actually manages money, watching client portfolios daily and making real-time adjustments when markets change. They see the same things you and I see.

Massive government spending, rising instability, and a lot of risk in government debts. So they use tools like precious metals and commodities to help protect. your purchasing power. Most importantly, they work with people who share their values, family, community, hard work, living within your means, and personal freedom. If that sounds like you, you can go check them out at i-welfth.ca. That's i-dash-wealth.ca and see if integrated wealth management is the right fit for you and your family.

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Oh, get it together, Sean. With exactly what you need. Find them on the north end of town, Highway 17 and 67 Street North, or you can give you Diamond 7 call today. 306, 825, 9718. Caleb Taves, Renegate Acres in the Community Spotlight. Well, we've been highlighting one thing and one thing alone right now. Cornerstone Forum March 28th at the Westing Calgary Airport.

Okay. I forget what I wrote, I got 150 tickets remain sitting on this sheet, and I'm like, oh, that's not right. We have 20 tickets remaining, okay? 20, two-zero, two tables. So if you're sitting there going, yes, I'm talking once again to myself, another version of me out there that's like, I still got time. I know exactly what this is. And no matter how many times I bring it up, you're going to be the one that is going to text me when we're sold out going, hey, can I get a ticket? I know it's coming.

I just know it's coming, but I wish you'd just go buy a ticket right now. Anyways, Coral Forum returns March 28th. It is going to be a sellout, which is super cool. and yeah we got quite the line-up coming Tom and Alex Vince Landry Matt Erritt Sam Cooper Karen Kutowski Premier Daniel Smith Neil Oliver yeah the list goes on there's there's a Mark Cohotis we slid in the last minute to fill out our economics roundtable so there's going to be a lot of

interesting conversations happening there you're not going to want to miss it go grab a ticket before they're all sold out here's your fair warning okay now if you're listening on Apple, Spotify, YouTube, Rumble, X, Facebook, Substack. Make sure to subscribe. Make sure to leave a review. And consider becoming a paid member and supporting what I do on this side. You can do that through Substack. There's some things going on for paid subscribers.

We're working on that all the time to try and make it a better atmosphere. I don't know. More there for all of you wonderful people. Anyways, consider it. Don't consider it. It's all good. Oh, I should point out to all the. people listening out of country who've been asking because I just had an email from Australia

and I had another one from England. If you can't make the Cornerstone Forum, the entirety of it will be put on Substack, you will need to become a paid member for that. But the entirety of the show will be edited out and put on Substack in the week following the Cornerstone Forum. So for people not making it, you can find the entire thing on Substack. There you go. All right. Let's get on on the tale of the tape. the founder of Takeback Alberta, our second, the former leader of the Libertarian Party of Canada, and our third spent 20 years in the Canadian military. I'm talking about David Parker, Tim Mowen, and Chuck Pradnick.

So buckle up. Here we go. Welcome to the Sean Newman podcast. Today I'm joined by David Parker, Chuck Pradnick, Tim Mowen. Gentlemen, thanks for hopping on. Good to be here, Sean. Thanks for having us, Sean. Now, I feel like this could be interesting or this could be a terrible idea,

in Sean said, one of the two. I've got three guys folks that I think are known to the podcast audience but aren't known to each other. Three Albertans, three people who've been on the podcast and spoken at length about lots of different things. And today I've brought you all together to discuss Alberta independence. I thought what are some voices I haven't heard from on this from the podcast side? And your three names were among several others. And we thought it'd be fun to put you together and see what comes of it. Now, to the audience, I'm going to go.

around the horn, let you guys introduce yourself in case somebody doesn't know or haven't heard each one of these guys folks has been on the podcast before. I mean, in Chuck's case, you know, it's been almost monthly for the last year and a half. So Tim, we'll start with you, just a little bit of your background and anything you want to add in. Sure. Yeah, I'm a firefighter paramedic by trade and, you know, I've been a paramedic for about 30 years. I got into political action when the province took over emergency medical services back in 2009 and uh i realized how important it was to um you know as much as you want to ignore politics politics can't ignore you so that kind of springboarded me i did um a bunch of work in fort

mcmurray my side hustle as a firefighter was filmmaker and uh so i worked with every environmentalist that came up trying to get them to direct to direct the cameras to everything good that my community was doing all the great things that the oil sands produced so i got to work with neal young and darrell hannah that got me some national attention, and I started getting kind of headhunted by political parties that saw me all over the news media speaking about kind of free market issues. And I eventually, they wore me down, and I ran for the party that most aligned with me, which was a libertarian party, and I ended up being party leader. And so I took a break from my career to run for prime minister.

And, you know, I think we got, I led the party to its most successful. year in 45 years history so I think I got about 1.5% of the vote which is by the way what a libertarian blows at a check stop I'm just kidding and so that yeah and then of course during COVID I had a bunch of co-workers on the fire department that were banned from work even though they were willing to come to work and test daily and I thought it was ridiculous so I helped them I created an organization called Fight for the Front Line. We raised over $100,000 to mount a constitutional challenge. But eventually we got the health minister along with a bunch of other activists to order

AHS to send health care workers back to work. So we didn't have to launch that challenge. But here we are today. So my best friend calls me the patron saint of lost causes because that sort of kind of seems like I sign up for lost causes. So here we are in Alberta, I guess. Well, Tim, thanks for hopping on.

I appreciate you answering the call. Chuck. Well, lost cause is, first of all, are the only ones worth fighting for. I did just over 20 years in the military with Princess Patricia's Canadian Light Infantry. Four combat deployments. Retired from that and did what everybody else out here does,

and at least in the infantry, and that's hop into corrections because that's about what your resume will get you. Did that for just shy of 10 years. Worked for an Army buddy for a few years in the private field, doing some stuff for him, and then managed to retire. I figured if I'm going to pay all these taxes.

I'd save more money not working, and I was able to structure things so that I could. I was very fortunate. So mostly I just hop on Sean's show and grab silver every now and then. David I don't have as noble of a career as either of these two gentlemen I started my political career at 14 as a volunteer at 23 I worked in the prime minister's office

I've also worked for the minister of heritage this is all under the Harper government I worked for the minister Ambrose as well in an internship so I had a lot of political experience in Ottawa. And then I left Ottawa and moved back to Alberta right before COVID, lived here through COVID. I founded three companies that have seven, two have seven figure revenue. One has eight figure revenue. I founded a political organization known as Take Back Alberta. And we removed Jason Kenney from office.

and took over the board of the United Conservative Party. I am currently in the process of founding a new third party advertiser that will be launched on Wednesday for the petition and the referendum. I do a lot of work across the border as well. I have an events company that puts on large speaking events and helps raise capital for them, raised about $20 million for various things over the last four years. I have two sons and a wife. My wife's decently famous, Albertan journalist, Rachel Parker.

And we, yeah, we live pretty simply. Love my life. I have a lot of nieces and nephews, three siblings, my parents. I read a lot. I've read more than almost anyone I know, a lot more than most of the people who call themselves academics. I'm mostly interested in sociology, economics, and obviously politics. And then the core of my life is my faith, which is my faith in Jesus Christ, and was raised by a pastor and a missionary. So I had a very deep education on Christianity. That's my number one passion. That's what I

spend most of my time thinking about, writing about things like that. And yeah, I'm, I'm a hardcore Alberta independent supporter. I want to see us be made our own country. I want us to be the wealthiest per capita place on the earth. And I believe it's possible. And I, I'm helping to execute the plan to make that happen. Okay, gentlemen. Now that everybody's got their introductions. Congrats on the second, by the way, David. Thank you. Thank you. Fatherhood. is a true blessing. And that comes from a guy with three who's chasing his, you know, I just got over a staff infection gentleman.

Or I'm in the process of getting over it. You can imagine having three children trying to climb on you with, yeah, you got no energy on a whole bunch of things. Now, that aside, Alberta Independence, this independence petition. People keep talking about the referendum. I'm like, the referendum. What are we talking about?

We got, as I just pulled up, 74 days till May 2nd, but you got to shorten that back. May 2nd is Saturday. So, you know, let's say we got 70 days left. It's like we got 70 days left. You got to,

but like, what are we talking about a referendum for? Let's get the signature thing. If you're believing this, you got to go get the signatures, which is push me out of my comfort zone. I was telling you guys, and you all laughed at me.

Before I would go to the hockey rink or I'd go to a, whatever, the restaurant or a friend's host, and I'd stay out of the political conversation, which might surprise people, because I'm just like, it'll come to me or it won't.

I'm not going to upset people by, you know, imposing, you know, me being a party guest and a pooper on most conversations. But on Alberta, the petition in itself, I've started, like, asking more and more people. And I found the results very interesting. Some people that went through COVID the same way I did are against it. And I'm like, really? Oh, interesting. And some people, I would think, would have never even heard of it. They're like, oh, yeah, I've already signed it.

have i'm just curious the psychology of this the alberta independence you know them calling you know doing different things calling it traders uh you know like really pushing on these people as awful human beings and and that being part of the propaganda push your gentleman's thoughts on this feel free to hop in each one of you i'm willing to start if you guys are fine with that um I find that when we're looking at politics, a lot of people want to look at things like policy. And I'm sure Tim can speak to this well as a former party leader. He's probably been bombarded by people coming to him and telling him all their great ideas of what policy should be announced that will convince people to vote for him. Or I have people come up to me at events all the time to try to tell me how I should run my organization and try to give me their thoughts on what I'm doing right.

wrong. This is a very normal human perspective, right? There is a supplication nature to most people. They want to supplicate to the leader. They want to bring their idea to the leader and then have the leader implemented. This is the system that we grew up in that we exist in. We are a colony. We were founded as a colony. We exist as a colony. Our systems are colonial. And I don't say that in the Marxist sense of the colonizers were bad. I'm descended from the British and the Scottish and the Irish who were the greatest colonizers in human history. So I'm not saying that that is a bad thing. I'm just saying that if you don't want to be a colonial, if you don't want to be at the behest of Ottawa or before Ottawa, London,

then this system is created to do the opposite of what you want. And most people don't get that. let's boil it back down to just basics, right? Most people think that engaging in politics is voting. Like for your average person to be a good citizen, you're a voter. And I want to put this in a little bit of perspective for your listener, Sean. In Red Deer during the municipal election, less than 21% of people voted in the municipal election. Okay.

So less than 21% even bothered to go and cast a ballot. And they probably think they're pretty good citizens because they're, went and voted at least right the other 80% of their fellow citizens didn't even bother to vote let's go to a provincial election right we're seeing maybe 40% or 35% of people not even bother to vote so in our society voting is seen as your civic duty that's the part that you need to do that's not being a citizen that's not your civic duty that's the bare minimum to have any sort of say in anything to be a real citizen is to be engaged in your governance on a weekly or monthly basis, maybe even a daily basis if you want to really push yourself

down that road of engagement. But that's what being a citizen is. If you look at how the Greeks thought of citizenship or the Romans thought of citizenship and the high level of engagement that you had to have, I mean, as a Greek citizen, you were voting every year, right? And as a Roman citizen, you were voting every year on who is going to govern you. And you were taking your turn as the judge or magistrate in your local community and that and and you were if you were a citizen you were engaged you were incredibly engaged you were listening to debates you were participating in the debates um people who had the best debating skills were elevated and honored because they were the ones that were leading the way of thought right now our now citizenship is your rights to get

welfare from the government essentially and even you don't have to be a citizen for that in Canada anymore. You can just be a permanent resident. You're going to get money from the government. So we have a population that's way of thinking about their politics and how they are governed is very subservient, is incredibly, you know, top down is we look to those who provide for us. That's sort of, that's the psychological frame that most people engage with politics. And that's the psychological frame that I've been trying to break with Take Back Alberta.

We have not for everyone, not for even a huge number of people, but at least I would say 4,000, if you look at attendance of the United Conservative Party of Alberta's annual general meeting, the attendance has gone up 4X. So it used to be between 800 to 1,500 people, regular attendees, lobbyists, parliamentarians, staffers, CA presidents. that used to be who attended annual general meetings. Now we have thousands of people that are attending them. And I think that the natural evolution of that has been the work that Mitch did

and built off of what people like Chris Scott and Dennis Modry have done with APP and turned it into the largest political organization in Alberta. It's bigger than the UCP. It's bigger than the NDP. And it's bigger than the unions. They already have more canvassers. than the forever Canadian people had at the end of their collection period. So this is the largest political movement in Alberta's history.

It's the most well volunteer backed. I'm just by pure math, it looks like we're already over the number that we need to force the referendum. So that is going to happen. The question is how many people do we get before then? and people say, well, why do we need more? And the answer is because we have a referendum. And if we want to win that referendum, we want to do the work of building the movement

before the referendum is called, not after the referendum is called. But from a psychological perspective, going back to your question, I think this is important. You said, well, some of the people who are against government overreach, they still want to stay in Canada.

And some of the people I never thought never cared about politics at all. They want out. Well, I've been to a lot of these events. now probably about 12 of the kind of the stay-free Alberta petition collection events and I've done myself over 200 and now it's over 240 speeches on politics here in alberta plus i've put together hundreds of events for politicians all over Canada over the course of my 40 election campaigns that i've actively been a participant in and i would say i've never seen numbers like this ever it's just it has not happened it does not happen

He went Jason Kenney was running to unite the two parties and then became the leader of the United Conservative Party. The biggest event he ever had in Central Alberta was in Red Deer and there were 350 people there. I was the biggest one. In Eckville, when I went there, 1800 people showed up. In Bentley, 1600 people showed up. We're talking about crowds and lines and groups of people that you only see at sporting events or like large content. You're not seeing normal politics in Alberta right now. Now, and so I've thought about the question that you asked Sean.

Who? Who are these people? Who are the supporters? They're not COVID people. Okay. We need to understand that. They're there. There's lots of COVID people there. There's lots of health, freedom, whatever you want to call that group.

I call them freedom fighters. You know, but whatever you want to call them, those people are the core. Many of them are the volunteers. tears, many of them are doing a lot of the work, they are not the people. The people are, many of these people have wanted independence for Alberta for decades. Okay. So many of the people who are, I mean, Marty was doing collection down in Calgary yesterday at a 92-year-old

woman showed up to sign and said we should have done this 50 years ago. Okay. We're talking about a group of people who, who have seen the abuses. suffered by Alberta from Ottawa for decades that are fed up and they're ready to get out. Those people, I believe, are the base that supported reform under Preston Manning and then under Stockwell Day and then under Stephen Harper. These are the people that supported Wexit, which was, you know, a movement that did not succeed, but was quite large. I remember after the 2019 election, the Wexit Facebook group went from like a few thousand fans to hundreds of

thousands. And then of course, we had the 2024 election and I think that was the spark that has set off this phase, we'll call it, of Alberta independence. Obviously the most successful phase we've never had anywhere close to a referendum before. But I think when you're, what you're dealing with is a lot of young people who see know hope in the future. And you're seeing in the polling that the young people are the highest supporters of Alberta independence. So people under 35 are the highest supporters of independence that can vote. And then the other category, the one we're seeing in a lot of these events, people over the ages of 55, these are people who've been fighting for this their whole life or wanted it and

be told by politicians that they wanted. Tim, Chuck, feel free to hop in. I know David had a bunch there, right? Like, I think, you know, with your background, David, it's always interested to hear your thoughts on what is happening going on in Alberta. But Tim, Chuck, feel free to hop in and, and just tell us from your side what you're seeing and hearing. And I don't know, I go back to the question of, you know, I think David may have answered it, right? This isn't just the freedom crowd. This is a brand new crowd that have wanted out of Confederation for some time. And I've ran into that as well. People that are 20, 30 years in the making of wanting this. My interaction in Lloyd, I had the strangest interaction. I had a guy from Lloyd who was like vehemently opposed to it.

And 10 seconds before that, I had a doctor from Africa walk up to me and be like, everything Midstelvester just said is true. I want out of here because otherwise we're going that way. And I'm like, it's such a strange thing to have that and then the next one. But Tim, Check, fire away. Yeah, well, I mean, look, I've been keeping my head kind of low up until the last couple weeks. I was on our union executive. I was trying to get some movement on decentralizing health care in Alberta.

I thought that might have been a place to do it. I kind of ended up banging my head against the wall. That's another story. So I've kind of been biting my lip on political opinions for a while, living in that world. But I'll just say that, you know, amongst me. my coworkers and family and friends, it's viewed as kind of, I guess, they're kind of apathetic about it. They're like kind of shrug. Some of them are disdainful towards separatists because of the message that is being foisted by establishment types. You know, you have a premier next door

calling us traitors or treasonous or whatever. And, and, you know, a lot of the progressives, you know, I work in a very kind of progressive riding. And so it's definitely an uphill battle. You know, I've noticed on social media, it's a very kind of emotional debate. It reminds me of the, you know, the work up to a divorce or something like that, a toxic marriage about to dissolve.

You know, very rare do you see someone say, yeah, we recognize Albertans have gotten a raw deal here in Confederation and let's stick it out. And I promise we'll work together and we'll work better and we'll try to make things better for Albertan. You know, the kindest words are maybe you guys are losers and you'll never survive without us. And, you know, some people are just outright kind of obnoxious like that. other people kind of flowered up and do all sorts of spreadsheets and economic analysis explaining why Alberta would be much better in Confederation, but it's the same message. It's like you guys will never cut it alone. You need Canada or you're going to, you know, wither and die. You know, I had one guy say basically he would, he would join the military to fight me. I actually respect

that guy because he's, you know, willing to kill me personally rather than most people. who, you know, when someone says you're a traitor or you're committing treason, what they're saying is, I want the government to use force against you. And if you defend yourself, I want them to use lethal force. So they're basically calling for you to die for wanting to leave this marriage. And, you know, I don't respect those people at all because they're not even willing to do the killing themselves. You know, they're like a person who advocates for the minimum wage, but they're not willing to go to a business, brandish a gun and say, you need to pay your employees X amount of money. money or else they want the government to do that for them so these are all emotional reactions they're

very toxic i get the impression that these people in their personal lives that are the loudest on on social media well i think a lot of them are single i mean you look at guys like dean blundell and how toxic he is on that side i'm guessing no woman would tolerate being in a relationship with that certainly you know most of the people i think i just imagine their relationships are all toxic. So it's very difficult, I think, on social media to get a grasp of what's actually happening on the ground. But like I said, in the fire stations and in my world, I think people are open to the idea.

In fact, my best friend is president of the Alberta Firefighters Union. And he, you know, he's listened to for the Forever Canada people. And he's, to his credit, listened to the Alberta Prosperity Project. But unfortunately, you know, he kind of baited the representative into a talk about whether she supported unions or not. And she was pretty much opposed to unions. And so that didn't go very far with him. So, you know, we have all these special interest groups in my world that are like, I don't know what we're going to get out of the Alberta going independent. Canada has given us lots of goodies, lots of freebies.

So it's going to be a tough slog, at least in my world, to convince people. Chuck? Yeah, there's a bit to unpack there. So, like, you guys have all brought up the different crowds of people, the different types of people, the different age brackets, all of it. It's not a, like it's been stated before, it's not a COVID crowd or anti-COVID crowd, whatever. You know what I'm saying? It's everybody. And it's people, like you've all said, you wouldn't expect from the, my.

perspective in the veteran community, the conversations I have had and some of the the churps that have gone back and forth, everybody, I think a lot of people think that the veteran community is this one hive-minded, homogenous group think. We all had a uniform and a flag on at one point, so everybody thinks the same way. And that's the furthest thing. You couldn't get two army guys to agree on any. You've seen Jamie and I on your show. We, you know, there's two different, I mean, we agree on a lot of stuff, but there's also a lot of stuff we don't agree on. But one fellow I'd served with for 20 years,

I'd seen something, I think I reposted something Marty had posted, and he started chirping in on it about this Alberta separation BS, calling me out. And essentially started posting all this shit about, you know, the deal we had in 1905, and the deal is this and the deal is that.

And then had the nerve to say, if Albertans would give up their third ATV, just to help us Easterners out that sure go a long way. So my, I wanted to jump through my fucking phone. Excuse my language, but this attitude of the East that if Albertans gave up their third ATV, wouldn't it just be helping out these poor Easterners? You know what?

I don't know any Albertans right now with a third fucking ATV. I know a lot of Albertans don't shop with a shopping cart. They're using a handbasket because we're all hurting here too. You know, we're all hurting. Only we're still sending money east so that you can have your roads and your infrastructure. And you know, if you look at Nova Scotia, I think like 21% of their provincial budget comes from the feds, which directly comes from us if you break all that math down. I can't do math.

I was in the infantry. So somebody smarter than me did the math and broke it down as like 21% of their budget. Fucking Ontario is somehow a have-not province and gets whatever amount of our money every year too, because they're able to shell game all their money. Same as Quebec, same as everybody else. But we'll just keep dipping into Alberta's pockets. So these people still want to call you a traitor and, you know, treason and all this other shit. Well, the guys who formed America were called traitors and, you know, treasonous as well when they did that.

So I'm okay with that company. Then they'll go into like, well, all the veterans didn't fight for Alberta. They fought for Canada. You know what? When I fought, and I did a shit ton of fighting, I didn't fight for the country necessarily. went where the country told me to go, and I fought for the guy next to me, and my family behind me. Well, these people, and just like Tim had said a minute ago, now they're getting all threatening on there. You can see it on Twitter, and on other social platforms, too, but Twitter's the big one.

You can see that escalation. You can see it from other veteran groups, from other veterans. Don't get me wrong, there's a lot of veterans who want out of this, too. This isn't the country we went to war for. It's not even close to the country we went to war for. 20 years ago, 10 years ago, a minute ago. You know, this isn't what any of us wanted to sign up and defend. And I think if you could pull our war dead from the last two big wars in Korea,

I don't think you'd find more than a percent of them. You know what? This is the direction we saw things going a hundred plus years ago when we did all this. No, that's not the case. And I'm not going to speak for people who have been gone for, you know, that one. But I have done all of that. Not what they did, but I went to war. I did my thing. I signed up and wore the flag. I did all that. I've got every greasy t-shirt there is. This isn't what I signed up for. This isn't what I went to do for this country for to become. Where my kids who are 30 and 31, you talked with that demographic, there's no hope of them owning a home. They make decent money. There's no hope at all for them. Their age bracket will never get ahead. Heaven, your kid, Sean, or a generation, or, you know, damn near a generation behind mine, I couldn't even imagine what they're going to face at the rate things are gone.

So, yeah, I want out. And these people, like Tim had said, now they're getting to that point of, you know, I'll sign up to fight. The fuck, they won't sign up for shit. We were in a shooting war for 15 years. I didn't see any of them over there. We all went multiple times because people weren't signing up. They're not signing up now when there's other wars that they could go,

they could go protect Canada from. No, they won't sign up. They're going to chirp about it. But you're going to get the nutters out there who are going to make things get spicy at the right things are going. You're seeing First Nations groups starting to post Oka pictures again on the Twitter with them running around with AKs back in, you remember back in that area. I grew up in that region.

I remember it quite well growing up. Chuck, I don't know what you're talking about. First Nations posting pictures of AKs and what? From Oka. There was a big like showdown between the police and a First Nation in southwestern Ontario. And it was big in the news and they had AK-47s. And what year was this? Was it 90?

In the 90s. In the 90s. Yeah. Yeah, there's 90. It was, oh yeah, I keep forgetting how young you are. That was over. It was over, I think, land. a golf course or something that they claimed.

And, yeah, they took a stand and... Basically brought in guys from all over the country, mostly Ontario, but all over the country. Had a standoff for, it's got to have been a couple months, brandishing every making model of weapon you can imagine, everything. They're posting these pictures again saying, we'll do it again if I'll be.

Well, and that's fair, though. I mean, they can, they can, blockade their reserves, right? I mean, that doesn't, like, how does that affect Alberta separate? We're not going to storm the reserves and take them over. It baffles me because you'd think they, after they'd complain about the deal they've had with the federalist government now forever in a day, you would think they'd want to negotiate a decent deal with us, with Albertans, people who live beside them and with them and work with them. You'd think that they'd get that, that note. And some do, some do. Yeah. But you'd think.

think the prevailing thought would be, you know what, we've been screwed over by this government forever, generationally. Maybe these guys will give us a better deal, and we can get in at the ground floor. Veterans the same thing. I see veteran, certain influential veteran guys on the Twitter chirping off about Canada this and Canada. And they've been the guys who've also complained the loudest about getting screwed over by the government we went to war for. And now they're like, well, we'll go to war against Alberta. Well, then bring that on to. you know what and do you got do you guys um like i've noticed it seems to be kind of uh the the dividing line seems to be between people who like produce tangible things who aren't relying on government

for a handout versus those that that kind of are and especially people who have you know higher levels of education and kind of work in the world of abstractions where and get a lot of taxpayer their money are against it. You know, First Nations, the chiefs, it's really clear why the chiefs want to stay in Confederation. I mean, they're making out like bandits. The people on the reserves aren't. But going back to David's point, a lot of people are just subservient, right?

And so I wonder if those veterans, just like those, you know, chiefs are dependent on the government on one hand. And I mean, that's their kind of. how they profit, right? They complain about the government and they get more handouts from their complaints. I mean, that's what works for them. And we're, you know, Alberta separation kind of threatens that arrangement. I think there's that mentality.

I think it's, it also depends where that veteran's from. A lot of the East Coast guys go, and I'm not saying all of them, not painting that brush, but a lot of them go back east because you can buy a house for $7 and a pack of smokes. and leave Alberta with, you know, everything that you've put into Alberta and go back and say, well, no, no, no, no, no, Alberta, you don't get a say. Well, I know I don't get a say. My vote doesn't count because it's over before it hits, when it hits Toronto. The Eastern votes have a higher representation in Parliament. So these guys, they already have twice the voting power I do represent, you know, just by representation. We want out. And when they bring up this bloody deal,

well, there's a deal of 1905. Well, we're fucking changing that deal. That's done. We want out. I don't care about your deal. That's one of the funniest things that's going on right now. And it just goes to show the subservience of the mental framework that so many people. Going back to your point, Tim,

the First Nations are a system of tyranny. The chief is a tyrant, right? And that is how they view the world, right? Like, that is how they built their social system. It's how they've operated for thousands of years. And so even for them, like Mitch recently had an experience where he was, there was a small First Nations protest outside of one of his events. And he just walked in amongst them and looked at them all, let them talk.

And then when they stopped, you said, I want to talk to your chief. And they immediately brought their chief and he sat down with their chief. and when it was done, the chief went out and talked to them, and now she's setting up meetings for him with all the other chiefs. Because that is how they think. You have to understand that First Nation culture is a hierarchical culture. Now, here's the thing. All of our cultures are.

It's just that how we treat hierarchies different. So you were in the military, Chuck. You understand hierarchy better than probably, and you're in a very hierarchical business situation. I guess industry right Tim where like authority is structured that's a paramil military organization right I mean exactly happens lieutenants chiefs battalion chiefs yeah right so so that is that is how you think right that is the the system in which you are existing as a mental model now you may have gone out of it and you may have looked at it you may have observed it but still the water you swim in is the

water you swim in the water they swim in is totalitarian that you swim in the water they swim in is totalitarian leadership. Once you're the chief, you're in charge and you decide where all the money goes and you sign all the checks and like you are the boss in a way that even in the military, even in a paramilitary organization, you're not going to have even that level of authority they have over the First Nations. So David, how do you break that? Like I'd be curious to know from actually from all of you. You know, how do you what arguments or what what persuasion talking points, I guess, are doing the most to convince people. It's a very emotionally charged people. Like I see a lot of people and it seems to me a mistake to argue like nuanced economics

back and forth, tit for tat kind of thing. You know, to me it seems like a better strategy would be to address the kind of the moral root of the problem. Like shouldn't the relationship Alberta have have with Ottawa be voluntary. Like shouldn't we be a voluntary part of Confederation? We were forced into this marriage to begin with. And now we have the opportunity to one way or the other, say we're in this either voluntarily or we're out voluntarily. But what's persuaded people, tip people over to our side?

I think by expensive. I think the, I don't think you can convince. I think people have to have the, lived the way we have, and I have kids at the age that I do, that are suffering. And anybody with kids in that age bracket, it's rare that they're not suffering. People at all age groups in our province are suffering. Even, you know, I had to give up Disney Plus and my third ATV to make it better for some Easterner. I don't know that there's convincing people at this point.

It's us putting our head down, barging through the door to get the referendum them and the signatures we need. The convincing part, like you said a second ago, Tim, we can't argue point, tit for, you know, tit for tat with any of them about economics. Our oil can't go to work because we're landlocked. Well, guess what? You're not letting our oil go anywhere anyway because you keep landlocking us. These, you know, the ebby guy, they're calling us traitors and treasonous. He's part of the problem with it all. They all are part of the problem and we want out of this problem. There's no, I don't think there's convincing. And I know Sean on your show a bunch of times you asked me about this particular question and do I see things going in a Bosnia 1991-ish, two-ish, three-ish-fourish direction. And I didn't think it would. I didn't, I told you time and again, I hope it sure doesn't. And I didn't think it would get to this escalation and elevation of language that they're using. But they're talking about neutralizing, killing camps, put us in camps, do this, that, and the other thing. They're using. They're using.

all this language and not just the Muppets on Twitter, the politicians and the media are starting to use this language. They're starting to parrot the crazy or cheerlead the crazy because... Only difference I see from a COVID standpoint when we were having that discussion as well is you have a leader of Alberta and Daniel Smith who will parrot it as well. Yes. So you actually have some sane politicians saying, I'm not going to demonize a million people. That is a terrible idea and now she's taking all the heat for not demonizing them that is a that's a large difference from the middle of covid when we're having that discussion in the middle of covid all politicians were demonizing this is a bad group this is the reason you're still locked down blah blah blah blah blah

blah all media everything right now it's it's largely kept in a box that is called x because the politicians, not all of them. Ebby's come out, he's come out and said it. I'm sure there's other ones saying it. Yeah. But by Daniel- Jason Kenny's saying it a lot. Jason Kenny's saying it.

I know, I assume on this panel, there's very little time for Jason Kenny, but regardless, yes, there are some people coming out and saying it. But as long as Daniel Smith is the one of the leader of Alberta keeps saying, I'm not going to do that. That is a poor idea. That is different than what happened during COVID times, in my opinion.

She is different. And thankfully, we do have her at the moment. You know, good bad or, good bad or other, at least she's doing the things she's doing. I think she gets it maybe. Maybe I'm being naive on that. But I think she's understanding the tone right now. She's got to play the game. She's got to play.

She's a politician. I get that. But there is no convincing. People are either going to live and understand why we have to do what we do. There's people in other provinces too, and I know I shit on other provinces a lot, mostly because they're shitty, but there's great people in other provinces who are moving here or trying to move here because they get it. Do you want your elderly and you're insane and your crazies to be euthanized and given made? Or the thing with the babies now, like a baby that has been born

that just might be too hard for this kid. We're going to euthanize that thing. Like, this is the country you're all fighting for. Are you kidding me? We're a post-national state last I heard from Trudeau. what does that even mean? Well, we're not a country anyway. So we'll just take our shit and we'll go. And we're going to keep Banff and Jasper too. Can I build up that? Because I think there's a good point there that I want to like draw out.

Sure. Like politics is not about facts. Like I think like this is the problem that most people have in politics is they want to make the really good argument. Like when people first get into politics when they first run, they're like, I'm going to have a great, the greatest policy and I'm going to have the greatest ideas that people are going to love my vision and they're going to get behind me and we're going to fix this country and it's like no that isn't how it works that is not how politics works there's three things you have to know about politics if you're going to be successful in politics and the first is people don't vote

with their heads they vote with their hearts period end of story they vote with their feelings you will i think you're absolutely right they will not be convinced you are not going to argue people into supporting independence. But here's another thing that most people don't understand about politics. Everybody's not the same. They don't make their decisions the same. So there's early adopters. We saw that with APP in the middle of COVID.

Those people said, we want out long before a lot of us did, even before I did. APP was having meetings saying that a long time ago. Those are early adopters. Then there's, you know, the first consumers, the first people, the first believers, whatever you want to call it, the first disciples. That would be kind of in the phase we're in right now, where people have bought into the vision that has been created through the hard work of many leaders and many,

many just volunteers and people. And now they're going out and doing the work. But the people in the middle, okay? So there's basically three camps in Alberta right now. Let's stay with Alberta. Let's not talk about the rest of Canada right now. In Alberta, there's three camps. There's the people on this call, the independent supporters, right?

We are, we see the argument. We believe it's true and we want out because we care about our children and their future. Okay. Then there is the largest group right now, the undecided. Now, this is not reflected in the polling, but there is probably the largest group of Albertans are like, well, I know we're being abused by Ottawa. And all you have to do is look at the vote for equalization. 60% of Albertans voted to get rid of equalization. That is our base.

That is the base of voters we can. get is people who know they're being a screwed by Ottawa. But not everybody in that camp of being a screwed by Ottawa wants to leave. I used my mother as an example. She was born in Ontario. My mother's side, my maternal side, we were the first settlers of southwestern Ontario on this side of the Grand River. John Graham was the first white man born this side of the Grand River in Ontario. So my people have been here for hundreds of years. And further back, they came over on the Mayflower. we've been traveling for freedom for a very long time like that's that is my ancestral history but my mom's like i love canada i remember singing about canada on it's a hundred

hundredth birthday i remember watching the olympics my mom loves canada she she is an independent she's a reluctant against her emotions independent supporter because when she's realized and this is the real thing that if we're going to convince people they have to realize a reality which is not will be better or worse or here's the spreadsheets or here's how we're going to get our product to market or any of that. It's going to be Canada is dead. Okay, that is it. That's the truth. Is the nation that you love, the things that you loved about it are gone.

They no longer exist. They are not coming back. And currently the direction that Canada is going is godless, truly godless. It is 26% of general. generation Z, my wife's generation, 26% was killed in the womb, 26%. Now, you can be pro-choice and you can be pro-women, but if 26% of the descendants of a generation is killed, that's more than the world wars, that's more than any other mass killing in human history, abortion. And now we've added Maid, the number, if you put Maid, the government,

is killing more Canadians than anything, than any disease, any accidents, than anything. With abortion and made, your government is killing more Canadians than any other institution than any other accident than any other disease. But it gets much worse than that. Our government is pushing the trans agenda so hard that it is corrupting the minds of our children, turning them insane, making them into serial killer or making them into mass murderers, but worse than all that, teaching them that they were born in the wrong body. Can you imagine the mental anguish of actually believing that you were born in the wrong body?

That is insanity. That would drive anybody nuts. And not only are we teaching that that's possible, our law enforcement is now implementing this propaganda when talking about it. They're still calling the shooter a her. They're still worried about a mass murderer's pronouns. this is the nation that we now live in. The Canada that we loved is dead. And until people realize that,

he was getting good too. Yeah, he was getting wound up there. Well, I mean, I think, you know, I really like what he said there about the emotional argument, right? Like Canada's dead. And what I've noticed in my coworkers, I think what David said was right. It's the undecided, right?

Like when I look at their faces of my coworkers and people in my circle, um, there's a few that are against, obviously against, but they're a large portion of them are just they don't know what to think about it. And those are the people I'm interested in in persuading. And, and what are the, what are the talking points of persuading? I think that, that, that emotional one that Canada's dead is, is good. One of the, one of the ones I used in the, you can imagine, I got staff infection. I'm sitting at the hospital.

I'm talking to an old. old farmer who's sitting there and I brought it up right and he goes no no I haven't said that I'm not really that interested oh okay why do you want to stay in Canada and he looks at me goes uh it's a good question and I don't know if I planted the seat or not but I'm like you know you have David's fiery and well put rant on where Canada's at where what I'm finding is you know, like, if I truly believed that there was no convincing, can't convince anyone, I think I'd stop the podcast. I'd just be like, it's time to go.

I don't believe that. I actually believe there is the Overton window. I believe there's this ability that people have never really thought. I go back on my journey. I remember having Dennis Modry in this studio and having the Alberta First versus Canada first, and I was Canada first. I was sitting there and I'm like, oh, see what Dennis has to say. And Dennis spoke for, you know, an hour and a half.

And at the end of it, I'm like, huh, make some good points. I got to go think about that now. And I even think about the journey of waking up through COVID and going, it can't be that bad. What is going on and how uncomfortable that was. While there's a whole new group of people that are having to come to terms with, everything David just said, everything we've been talking about. That is uncomfortable. It's not fun. And then you have to realize, like, am I going to put my name to something?

How many people in our group are terrified of putting their name on a list? I'm like, folks, you're on a list. I've been on so many lists. It's not even funny anymore. It's like put your name on a list that actually matters and is actually going to push for something. I also think if you don't want to separate from Canada, you should still put your name on the list. You want a better deal for Alberta? Make that number 1.5 million so it actually sends a shockwave to Ottawa where they have to come and try and go, holy crap, we got to get rid of this and we got to treat Alberta better.

because if only 300,000 sign it, they're going to knock 50,000 off because they're not going to be signed right. And Ottawa is going to go, oh, they got nothing, right? Look at this. We just keep doing the same thing. It's like, we have to continue to talk to people.

And that has been my growing concern of like, I don't normally interject politics, but I'm like, well, I'm going to be going into some uncomfortable spots because I'm curious what people think and why they are or aren't signing it. There's a bit of it. I just address that for a second, I agree with you, Sean.

Sorry, I got a little, you know, passionate me. You can't. I'm not upset by the passion whatsoever. You can't, you can of course convince people. I'm just saying don't use arguments of like spreadsheets and facts and like people are not convinced by ethereal economics and policy and things and like good arguments necessarily in the sense of, oh, this is the fact. And you're not agreeing with the facts.

Like, we can have that argument all day long and people will just throw things at one another all the time. But if you, if you boil it down to what humans actually care about, which funnily enough is emotions. Yeah. Is how they feel. And particularly, particularly in the modern era where we're taught that our emotions are who we are. Right. Like, I don't feel like a man. So I'm not a man.

Are you kidding me? Like so your feelings are now the dictators of reality. But even if we say, oh, that extreme craziness is weird, okay, that's true. But that is the milieu. That's the zeitgeist. That's the cultural reality that we live in where that's even a conversation. And because it's a conversation, we have to realize that people prioritize their emotions a lot more. And this is a really hard thing for conservatives, especially conservative minded business people

or soldiers or people who deal with reality every day. day. They're like, well, my feelings really don't matter that much with this dealing with reality, right? Like how I feel about this person dying or having to shoot this enemy, that is irrelevant to the, to the reality of the situation. And business is similar. It's like you might feel like you should be selling more product. But if you're not selling more product, then that's bad. So we, we don't like that. Honestly, a lot of the rich guys I talk to, a lot of the people I talk to, Farmers don't like it either. And they, how can this, I hear this all the time.

How can they be so stupid? Right? You hear that all the time. How can they not see? How do they not know? Well, because they don't live in your world. They don't live in the world where you're interacting with reality every day. They live in a curated digital.

And a lot of them are going to adult daycare and sitting in an office and not producing anything of any value, but they call it their career. Right. Those people, they're not going to be convinced. with reason but they can be convinced with emotion yeah yeah that's right i used to tell us to candidates all the time in training because they you know libertarians do have the best policies but uh yeah i'd say look you're not going to convince them with policy they don't care what you have to say until they know they tell they feel they care that you care about them uh their feelings

don't care about your facts so so you know uh appeal to their emotion but i like what sean what you said there You asked that guy in the doctor's office, you asked them a question. And I think questions are really good. Like there's a lot of questions that this is bringing up. And I think for even if we don't get independence, this is a great kind of consciousness raising exercise because what's the right size for a nation? How are nations formed? I mean, most nations are formed through murder and theft.

And here we have for one of the first times in history, the opportunity to create a nation in a very peaceful referendum of the people. I mean, isn't that, like, there's all sorts of things about this that are worth asking people about. And shouldn't nations be voluntary? Like, shouldn't jurisdictions be voluntarily part of a nation? These are all seeds to plant and get people thinking about, I think. I think there's a big part of it, too,

that the people I talk to who aren't sure, the undecideds, don't know what the other, if we get independence, become the, Alberta Republic or whatever we're going to call ourselves, they don't know what the other side of that looks like. Like what, I mean, economically, I think everybody can agree and knows right off the back, we're going to be well, much better off. Everybody gets that on some level, you know, will be, we'll be really well off. But they don't know how the rest of it works. You need almost like a, I'm just thinking off top of my head, Keith Wilson being one of the smart guys I see all the

time and I've met a few times. He's he's somebody who speaks very well in his videos about what that looks like from a legal perspective, from a realistic going forward perspective. I just think that information, guys like him, he's not the only one, but his name comes to mind first for me. Putting what it really looks like the reality, the cement and the wood part of it after looks like. You also, you guys have both mentioned it too. And Sean, you mentioned it about the fella at the hospital like well why stay like what's what any didn't really know people have this nostalgic image of canada from like 20 years ago where it's like the lakeside cottage or taking your kids to hockey or or things were just a little cheerier back then and everybody's got that i do i remember it well

my proudest moments were serving overseas somewhere with other countries going up thank god the canadians are here thank goodness you're here none of that none of that exists any more. Our military has been so corrupted, sabotaged, broken down, that the best our government can issue to our soldiers in the event of an invasion from the U.S. is to fight a Taliban-style insurgency. I can't think of anything more insulting to tell professional soldiers that the most we can give you is this plan of fighting the Taliban-style insurgency. The shittiest humans in the last couple generations, you're going to emulate them. The ones you fought for 10 plus years, that's the battle plan you're going to go forward

with because we can't give you the weaponry, can't give you the training, can't give you the numbers, can't give you the morale to do anything other than, well, go blow yourselves up. That's the best. And there's still veterans going, no, no, no, that's okay. That's okay. Like, this is the delusional part of it. We just need to bring, like, and you guys have said it. It's not a matter of convincing, I don't think it's winning that argument against the nays.

It's the bringing the undecideds a little further on board. I think they just need that nudge. Some of them it's different things. It's not just one thing. But that nostalgic memory, and Jamie and I've talked about it on your show before, Sean, they think it can still be fixed. You just got to get further entrenched at the ground level. No.

That counts. Yeah, I get it. It does matter. But no, no, no, not with this country. This country's busted apart now. There's no fixing what we have as a country. You know, I didn't invent this thought or meme or whatever you want to call it, but somebody had posted that island off of India that nobody's allowed to go to with that group of that indigenous.

What is it? I think it's a Seminole island. Maybe. You see drone footage of those guys on the beach like thrown spears and, you know, and everybody's got to protect that culture, don't interfere with it. But the second Alberta says, you know what, we're going to do our thing because we have a different way of living here than the rest of the country. We get labeled with everything. We're getting, you know what, folks, we're getting labeled with everything anyway. We're getting, we already get called everything in the book.

We get our wallets pride open for the privilege of getting called everything in the book. Sorry, my dog is like having a moment. Well, I chuckle between Tim's dogs, your dogs, everybody's dogs today. There's been a lot of dog. I hit all the squeaky toys, but that's what she wants. Going back to that, like that middle, right, let's call it, let's call it 25, 30%, okay? Because like all the polling, all the good polling and the averages are about 30% of Albertans want separation, right?

Then we got another 35 that are absolutely opposed no matter what they will not touch it, right? Then we have that middle. And they came up on the call already. Danielle Smith is the leader of the middle. Like we have to understand that. That is the, that is who she, she's not the leader of the independence movement. And she's not the leader of the pro Canada movement.

She is a leader of these middle. And that is, that is who she's chosen to lead. That is the group that she's chosen to represent. And I think, I think it was wise because there's nobody else leading it. Like, Nenshi's not leading it, right? Nenshi's not leading the middle. He's a hardcore pro-Canada. And there are really strong, powerful leaders on the independent side that have huge

following, bigger followings, to be honest, on an individual level than Daniel Smith. But that doesn't matter because the people that are going to decide this are the people in the middle. And the way that they're going to be convinced, in my opinion, is through personal relationships, not through arguments. It's going to be people like Sean talking to them, having a conversation in the hospital. I encourage all of my people, have 10 conversations a week. Okay, talk to 10 new people.

We've all got Facebooks. The average person has 200 friends on Facebook. We all have our phones with our contact lists. We've all got our social media. We've got our emails. We all have 10 people we can reach out to for a week for the rest of this time. And those conversations, those interpersonal dialogues where you're circumventing the hierarchical structure that they are used to existing in and you're integrating personal relationship.

This is the Take Back Alberta model. This is how we built the entire movement is you've got to realize. I think most people, and you asked this earlier, Tim, and I think it's very important. Well, how do we get them out of that mindset of the subservient mindset of the thinking there's nothing they can do? Well, the first step in that process, and it is a process, it's a, you know, it is a, it is a, it is a, is a series of thoughts and events that they have to go through, not just one epiphany, but the very first and most important thing

that has to happen is they've got to believe that they aren't powerless. Because if you think you're powerless, and most people think they're powerless, most people go through life, I mean, how many people do you know that would be terrified if they lost their job? They're terrified.

It would blow open their world, right? That is most people. Most people are slaves. And I say this very, very intentionally. Okay. Their life relies on the decisions of somebody else. That is how they exist in the world. And they think that money is something that somebody else gives you.

Okay, that is how they view money. And so they don't want to upset that apple cart. And that goes right over to politics. They think politics is like the weather. It's something that happens to you. Leaders make decisions and you become subservient. You're a libertarian. You understand this, but most people do not understand that they have personal sovereignty

and do not understand that the more personal sovereignty that they take on for themselves, the better their lives will be. Period. End of story. Like almost always. Almost always, if you decide to make your life for yourself, instead of having it made for you, your life will be better. There's difficulties, but that's the case.

So how do we get people to realize? Well, first we have to make them realize that they're, and this is the hard part of the whole project. It was the hard part of COVID too, is that they've been lied to all their lives. And the matrix that they exist in that was created in public school, that was created in their university education that's been created in their job, it's a system that was made by humans, just like money.

And it doesn't have, it isn't that system. isn't necessarily analogous with reality. And that teaching people that, there's actually, in my opinion, there's no words you can use, there's no arguments you can make, they have to act it out. And that's take back Alberta in a nutshell.

Go and do things. The world is run by the people who show up. If you show up, you will have a say. If you don't show up, you will not have a say. Like, I am not a believer. I think like a podcast, for example, that's taking action. That's broadcasting a message.

That isn't action even though you're talking, right? I think that, I mean, that's why one of my companies is named ACTA non-verbia, actions, not words. Right? We could spend all our time talking or we could take action. Now, words can be an action, but if it's just words and not action, then you're not going to learn that you have power. well i'm going to share this story again if glen ever listens to this so we're in lloyd mitch uh is on stage right and i've had like three interactions in a row that have been really from one extreme to the other holy man then glen gets up circumvents my rules on questioning and anybody who's been to my events

certainly knows i have my rules in place and he goes i just want to have a comment on Mitch Sylvester. And I'm like, oh, crap, here we go. And I'm thinking in my head, like, this is going to be a four-minute thing, and it's going to harp on Mitch or something. Anyways, actually, it's quite the opposite. It's actually quite beautiful. And I, forgive me, Glenn, if you listen to this, you should reach out to me. Because he says, and I'll torture this a little bit or butcher it a bit, which is, you know, Mitch told me I don't just have to be a snowflake. I could actually be part of the storm, and that I should get involved. And so I took my one signature, became a canvasser, and now sit at the, I think it's the Marwain car wash.

Forgive me if I'm wrong on this, folks. And now he's collected 70. I'm like, what a beautiful story, right? Just an older man. Just you want to get involved. It's everything you're talking about, David. He just gets involved. Now, is he getting 10,000?

No, but he's getting 70 times what he was going to get. And you think if everybody just went and did that, how many signatures would you actually get? How many conversations could you actually have in the next, you know, it says 74 days, but I would already. you, it's probably 70, maybe even a couple less than that because of getting everything in. It's like, how important are the next two months? Very important. And so I, if you run into me, folks, I'm just going to ask more curiosity's sake. You could tell me you're not part. That's okay.

I'm just curious. And think about this too. This is being done without a single leader, a single party movement, a single entity to everybody points out. There's no Trump here going do this thing. This is groundswell from a... Well, they try and point to wrath and Sylvester. But it's funny because a ton of the people in the movement don't have time for either one. Half the people I talk to don't know who they are. Correct. You know, they don't know who they are.

So it's, it's, I get that some people are having, they're behind the scenes moving things along. And I get that. And you kind of do need a mouthpiece now and then regardless of the mouthpiece sometimes. But the, mostly this is just ground swell. And that's why it's going to work. And I'll tell you what, if it doesn't work this go around, there'll be another go round until we get it gone because this deal is bullshit and we're done with it.

I had one other question before I let you out of here. I got a ton of people listen to me across Canada. And they're people who are seeing the same problems with Canada, full stop. To those people, and I don't know if this is a question of Tim, David, track it all three, I suppose. shouldn't they be rooting on Alberta for a couple reasons. One is if you're upset with the way Canada's going, you need something to change its direction.

And if we just keep going the same way we're going, nothing in your end of the world's getting better and certainly nothing here is getting better. When all three of these men talk about out east, they're talking about the government and what it's doing. They're not talking about the people, although there are some people that are continuing to hold that government in. And you look at it and you go, if you truly are upset with the way Canada's

heading, you should be coming to the aid of Albertans and cheering them on because if Alberta separates, there will be second, third, fourth order effects that happen because of that. Am I wrong? No, you're absolutely right. I mean, you know, if Alberta separates, Canada's going to have to do some heavy-duty soul searching and decide how to revive itself. And there are people, you know, I've campaigned across this country and there are people with the Albertan spirit right across this country, people who are longing to be free out from under Ottawa's boot and wanting just not handouts, but to be free to create their own destiny, to create their own prosperity.

And, you know, those people are in the minority now, but I think Alberta, independent, will bolster that. I think our fight for independence will bolster that. I think regardless of how this petition goes and how the referendum goes, this is a turning point for Canada because I think this is going to wake a lot of people up and motivate them to join the broader cause for liberty. Yeah, I think, look, I never served in uniform, but I did spend my 20 serving Canada as a staffer,

which is essentially a butler for politicians. So I didn't get to do cool stuff like fight and, you know, feel like a man in that sense. But I did give a lot of my 20s to, I gave all of my 20s to this country. I was one of the biggest patriots of Canada that you've ever seen. I loved the Olympics. I loved Canada.

I am ashamed to say that I was one of those people who thought Canada was better than America. 100%. Like I did not like America. I thought Canada was just the best thing that had ever happened. I worked under Stephen Harper. My ancestors built this country. Literally, like, I'm not some new immigrant. My people have been here so long that, you know, the ground is in their soil.

We farmed this land for hundreds and hundreds of years, the first white people here. I have a lot of family in Ontario. Most of my family lives in Ontario, my extended family, my cousins. aunts and uncles. They're great people. They're good people. My grandmother was a great person, faithful Christian, hardworking, supported all of her daughters, great grandmother. I love many of the people of Canada, but the truth of the matter is they have killed themselves. No country has ever survived the birth rate that we currently have in Canada. Never happened. And it will not happen because if you will not have children, your culture will die because the core of a culture

is not its art, it's not its military, it's families. If you don't, family is the progenitor of culture and we don't have families anymore. We 20% of Canadians are going to die in the, and people like, what? That sounds crazy. In the next 20 years, in the next 20 years, 20% of Canadians will die. That is the baby boomers. The vast majority of those people are old stock Canadians born here, raised here, lived here. By the time they are gone, 50% of Canadians will have not been born here. We don't have a culture. We don't have a nation anymore. And I love all of you. Any listener that's listening to this, and it is Canadian, like, I love you. I love, I want you to be better. But the truth of the matter is I have a family to protect,

and I will not go down the path that Canada is going without a fight. And I would hope not only would you support what we're doing, as Sean said, but maybe even come and fight with us because this is the last piece of Canada that's left. And it's not exactly like the Canada that you know in Ontario. It's not the Great Lakes region. It's harsher. It's prairies. It's cold.

I mean, we just had a foot of snowfall here. It's minus 16. It's not like your wonderful lake moderated land that you're from. I get it. But it's all that's left. Literally all that's left. 10% of BC is not even citizens. 10% of the people who live in British Columbia are not even citizens. We are a country that killed itself. And I didn't realize that it was happening when I worked in Ottawa. I didn't realize the importance of the cultural decline until COVID. I was a I was not, I'm not one of those great independence warriors like that 92-year-old woman who said we should have done this 50 years ago.

I believed in the Canadian project. I believe the West could get in. I believe we could bring about fairness. I believed all the arguments. The thing is they don't work. And now, if we lose Alberta, everything that made Canada, what we loved will be gone and we will be a waste land. So I completely agree with you, Sean. We have to do this. At least we have to try. We may we may not succeed i think we will but we may not but it's like you said earlier chuck in the show the only causes worth worth fighting for are the lost causes and um that is the history of the west i mean during the muslim invasion of europe vienna almost fell if it had if the polish hadn't showed up if you've seen lord of the rings when uh rohan shows up at the gates of gondor that's a real thing that

happened in history, right? And if the Polish hadn't shown up and saved Vienna, then the Muslims would have taken over Europe. We have been fighting. I mean, if the 300 nights in Spain hadn't organized himself and slowly built up until they took back the Spanish peninsula, you know, who knows what history would have been. But that was a lost cause, 300 versus the entire, you know, nation of Spain, we could call it. I liked lost causes. I mean, there's an old Roman saying that I like to quote a lot, which is how can men die better than facing

fearful odds for the ashes of their fathers and the temples of their gods? And I would rather fight with my boots on. I'd rather be called a traitor and love the thing that I've always loved, which is my home. And not

win than to have been someone who walked into the darkness that this nation is going into. Chuck, any final thoughts? Yeah, for the veterans out there on the fence or I'm not here to convince anybody, I'm not. You guys know, the listeners know where their heart is with it all, because that's how it's going to be voted in. There's, of course, the mechanical reality of how things are, and that's going to influence your decision too. But for veterans, I hear it all the time.

You took an oath. You did a thing. You wore that flag. How dare you? How could you? I didn't break faith with this fucking country. It broke faith with me. That's how it is.

That's how I see it. Just because I took an oath, doesn't mean I walk into the blindly forward for the rest of my life. My kids, they're the important thing to me, and they can't get ahead in this country. Country, I went to war for four times. I went to the worst greasiest spots, did the worst greasiest things so they could have a future, and there's no future. It's been pulled out from everybody's feet. And like has just been mentioned, Alberta's the last bastion of it. There's great people across the country.

I get it. I know them. We all know them. And hopefully they can make their way here in the great exodus of what remains of Canada. And I see it. If we do get independence, and I think we will, it's going to wind up like Bosnia, circa mid-90s. And I'm not talking to violence.

I'm hoping things stay. calm, but it broke into different, you know, Croatia, Serbia, you know, it broke apart. And it needed to break apart. Once things get to a boil point, you don't unsimmer it, you know, it will explode at some point. And we've been boiling here for a long time, you know, and they can call us traders and whatnot. When Quebec wants to do their little referendums and they have their own political party that's a separatist party.

You know, and here we are, you know, and people, I do get some conservative-minded people that are trying to say, well, if Pollyev can just, that fucking guy can't win a seat without parachuting somewhere. Don't hold your, and he's holding Carney's hands and they're doing their moments. These aren't the kumbaya moments I'm here for anymore. I don't give a shit about the synchronicity and everybody getting along. I want out of this deal.

I want my kids to have a future. And that's the end of it. My nation ends at my driveway on a good day, but whatever Alberta needs I'm here for. And we got to get out. Tim, any final thoughts? Well, I mean, so it reminds me of this call I was on, I was a fire lieutenant up in Fort McMurray,

and it was an apartment fire. And I led my team in and through the smoke, I saw this lady laying on a couch. She was all of 300 pounds, buck naked. I thought she was dead. She was completely motionless. I got face to face with her and pinched her. And her eyes opened and scared the crap out of me.

I thought for sure she was dead. And she looked up at me in, I'm wearing my mask. And, you know, the signs of her addiction to immediate gratification were everywhere. She had empty Cheetos bags, empty vodka bottles, empty cigarette cartons. beside her Cheetos in her fat rolls. I call that Saturday. Yeah, yeah. In her world was literally burning down around her.

She was in hell. And she didn't want to be safe. She, she, I yelled at her, we got to go. And she said, come here, honey. And she grabbed me around the neck and pulled me in. She wanted a makeout session. So she wanted immediate gratification right there on the couch while her world was burning down around her.

Well, I mean, I grabbed her by the ankles and started hauling her out of the apartment kicking and screaming, took her out to the EMS guys. And I turned around as I went back in to fight the fire. And she said, fuck you. Just the denim hate. And this is kind of what it feels like trying to save Canada. I use this story all the time when I was running as Libertarian Party leader. I know what the answer is.

I know how this country. could be great. I know how we could live together, but we're surrounded by people who are addicted to immediate gratification. And I mean, it wasn't the proximate cause of that fire was the cigarette in the ladies mattress. But, but you could probably map her decline decades back and see her life deteriorate into that one moment where she's literally in hell. And these people, you know, at the end of the day, people don't want to be saved and trying to save them. You drag yourself into hell with them. And so, you know, this is where I'm at with independence. It's like Canadians don't want to be saved. Albertans do. So let's build something great here and hope people have the, have to wake up and save themselves and move to Alberta.

Gentlemen, appreciate you hopping on and doing this. I think, I don't know, I'll be interested to what the audience says, but in some of my crazier ideas, this one seems to have panned out. I think I respect all three of you guys. There's a lot of wisdom that comes between all your ears from your lived experiences.

And thanks for doing this and hopping on.