Shaun Newman Podcast - #1029 - Leighton Grey

Episode Date: April 7, 2026

Leighton Grey is a senior partner at Grey Wowk Spencer LLP and a constitutional lawyers, with over 30 years of experience conducting hundreds of trials. A Status Indian from Alberta, he holds a Ph.D. in Philosophy, was appointed King’s Counsel in 2010, and was named one of Canada’s Top 50 Lawyers in 2024. He has collaborated with the Justice Centre for Constitutional Freedoms on high-profile cases defending civil liberties and challenging government overreach. Grey also hosts the Grey Matter podcast, where he offers principled commentary on law, culture, faith, and current events from a Christian perspective.Watch the Cornerstone Forum 26’https://shaunnewmanpodcast.substack.com/Silver Gold Bull Links:Website: https://silvergoldbull.ca/Email: [e-mail] Grahame: [phone]Bow Valley Credit UnionBitcoin: www.bowvalleycu.com/en/personal/investing-wealth/bitcoin-gatewayEmail: [e-mail] Get your voice heard: Text Shaun 587-217-8500

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This is James Lindsay. This is Vance Crow and you're listening to the Sean Newman podcast. Welcome to the podcast, folks. Happy Tuesday. How's everybody doing today? Let's talk a little precious metals, shall we? Well, Breaking France sold its gold stored in New York and purchased an equivalent amount in Europe. All France's gold reserves are now located.

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Today's guest is a constitutional lawyer, senior partner at Gray Walk and Spencer, and hosts the Gray Matter podcast. I'm talking about Leighton Gray. So buckle up. Here we go. Welcome to the Shroddenumabu podcast. Today I'm joined by Leighton Gray in studio.

How's Layton doing? Great. Now, you're asking me a thousand questions. I'm just like, I'm just going to sit down. That way I can settle down and you can ask whatever you want. Then we can go wherever we want.

We've got plenty of time today, I think. So, yes, leaving in July for a year. For those of you who didn't pay attention to the Cornerstone Forum at the end, that was the big announcement this year. And yes, I just finished building this studio, and yes, I am leaving for a year. With Mel and the Kids, we're going to homeschool.

Everybody's coming with. We're going across Canada, down the east coast of the United States, and then hopefully a few different countries along the way. And my thought process on the studio was is if I waited for this trip to happen, then I wouldn't build a studio for, you know,

like two, three more years. And I had the time, because we started planning the trip two years ago. So we've been talking about this for two years, and I was sitting here, and I'm a busy body, as everyone probably can imagine. I put on the cornerstone forum,

and then you try and tinker with it and you try and make it bigger, and then you try and do this, and you're doing five shows a week and you're just tinkering. And so I'd wanted to have a new studio for a long time. And finally, I think the big guy upstairs kind of pointed me in a direction. I'm like, that doesn't make a whole lot of sense, but I trust where you're going. All right.

So your long trip makes zero sense to me. If I'm being completely honest. So what's the why? Okay, well, let's go back. Yeah. When we first started talking about it from a podcast, point of view, I believe this is better than through the screen. Would you agree?

Oh, absolutely. Yeah, 100%. So the thing about going on the road is I'm going to try and do this for majority of my episodes. Now, it's going to be a little different because it won't be in a studio setting. It'll certainly be in somebody's living room or somebody's backyard or in the camper or whatever. But regardless, I've crossed the 1,000 episode threshold.

And I'm like, I want to meet these people. I don't want to figure out who the people. are like Layton or like, you know, for fans of the mashup twos or, you know, I just had the Cornerstone Forum. There's a whole bunch of people there that I've become friends with because we met in person and you get to see who they actually are instead of what an hour on screen tells you. Right. Yeah. So from a podcast standpoint, I believe in meeting people and doing it in person. I think it's way better. So I think the opportunity to go do it and talk to people is really important. Mm-hmm. I think that'll bleed out.

opportunities, you know, Layton has his group or his network and you're going, where? Maybe you should stop and talk to whoever. I don't even know who that is. Right. Yeah. I think that's going to be a huge opportunity. One of the things I've always said is when the podcast starts to take me away from my family, I think I'm done with the podcast because I don't want that.

And so I get asked to go speak at different things, and I'm sure I frustrate the living crap out of people, Leighton, because I'm like, I just can't. And that's basically around my kid's age and what I'm doing with. them. As you know, I coach their sports and I'm very involved with them and I want to be very involved. So that's, you know, a bit of a struggle on the podcast side because lots of things happen at night and weekends and I'm tied up on evenings and weekends. And so Mel and I talked about this idea a couple of years ago. And what it does is it allows my family come with me. They're going to homeschool for the first time, which is interesting or should be interesting. But my wife's a teacher and that could go good or bad, you know, like there's plenty of,

ups and downs, I'm sure, coming ahead of us. And so that's another thing about it is like, well, my wife and kids get to come along with me. I have my own thoughts on homeschooling and them getting to come and see all these different things at different places. I also think from a host standpoint, some of the people that I follow, they are world travelers. They've been to the places they're talking about. And going to the freedom coming, being in Ottawa gives me ground on experience of like that you just can't change my mind about what I saw there. Right. And I hope that by going and exploring some of these different ideas and these different places that these ideas are happening in,

that maybe that'll help build what I'm hopefully becoming for Albertans and Western Canadians is a host with a little more depth to them. Does that all make sense? Yeah. Wow. What an amazing opportunity for your kids. Yes. But I guess are there sports then going to be put on hold? I know they're very active in hockey and baseball.

Yes. Yeah. So that's, we've had their, we've, you know, our oldest turns 10. Next is nine and then our youngest turns seven. We've now told them. And, you know, like, I just hope we can find opportunities with sports along the way, right? Obviously not on a, you know, everybody knows I'm a huge hockey guy. Obviously for a year that won't be the case.

Yeah. But can we find them, you know, going down the East Coast somewhere in where the sunshine and a baseball camp or something they can do that's, they wouldn't normally get? here? I have to assume yes. Yeah. Yeah. Exciting. Well, I mean, you know, I understand it's, it's an intriguing idea because, and also the timing is such that if you wait, you probably couldn't do it, you know, because even with your kids, let's say if they really get excited about hockey, as you know, it's not such a big deal to take a year off at 10 years old. In fact, it's benefited. I can think of Ryan Nugent Hopkins. I think when he was 11 years old, he took a whole year off of organized hockey because his parents went.

went through a divorce. And a couple of years later, he was the first overall draft pick in the WHL draft. So if your kids have hockey dreams, you know, taking a year off or baseball, it's, it's not going to, you know, it's not going to end there if they really, if they really want to do it, right? But if taking a year off at 15 or 16 might be a different story. So I understand the timing, but kind of excited for you. We'll miss you.

But, yeah, well, the thing is that you're asking is the podcast going to keep going? And the only way, what this works. Yeah, I'm going to be interviewing people all across Canada. It's going to add so much to your show, right?

And then the other thing that's exciting, just sort of kicking around out loud is what a catalog that's going to be. It's like a real live travelogue experience, documenting your experiences on the road and seeing all these places and meeting all these people.

Yeah, it's going to produce some incredible content, I'm sure. Well, I hope so. I, uh, I don't know, I, I've got a whole bunch of emotions around it, right? Yeah. I, my wife teases me all the time that I might be the one that's hurt more that we're not going to play whatever level of baseball more than my son. Yeah. Because I, I really value those experiences.

But when I think about it as a whole for a year, the thing I've been praying a lot about, right? I just, I don't get it. I don't understand because, you know, I, once again, two years ago, we started playing this. wasn't two months ago. So you got to think two years ago, Alberta independence was not a thing. I mean, there was rumblings of it,

but certainly, you know, Pierre was in the lead. You can go all down the thought processes, right? Now we're looking down the barrel of a gun or of like a referendum, October 19th.

And I'm like, where am I going to be? And then so a bunch of people, what are you going to do about it? I'm like, well, my plan is to find a way back, to come voting it.

Yeah. And then to carry on. I'm like, my also plan is to ask a bunch of Canadians what they think about this. Mm-hmm. Yeah. I'm kind of curious.

Yeah. Wow. Well, of course, you could take the message of Alberta on the road, too. It's true. To many people who don't understand or understand what's going on. It's true. I just laugh because I'm like, man, I go back to it. I pray lots about it.

I'm like, why now? Why not like in a dull year? I don't know what that is, but I feel like there must be a down year where Alberta isn't trying to leave the country and, you know, the home promise you just built a studio all these things and I'm like but the studio will still be here yeah um the vote studio is great by the way it's beautiful well I'm glad you when you reached out I was like I got a place we can do and you know um the province I'm not going anywhere right like I fully plan on coming back the show isn't going where I fully plan on doing the show as I go and so I think

you know like there could be some twists and turns for sure but overall Mm-hmm. Yeah. Well, if nothing else, there's no doubt it's going to enrich your experience as a producer of your show, right? Because you're going to learn so much and you'll have that bank of experience. It's going to, I'm sure, is going to enrich all of your production over time, you know, because it's just going to broaden the scope of your knowledge and your understanding and your appreciation of the things that you're presenting on the show. So very excited for you.

I hope you have an incredible journey and that it all comes off safely and successfully and looking forward to, you know, seeing some of the shows that you produce out on the road. Yeah. Well, I appreciate that because I keep telling my kids, you know, they're like my daughter, boys and girls react about this in funny ways. The boys very typical of like, so what can we do? Can we do this? Can we do that?

More of what they're losing? It's more like. in the immediate, can we do these cool things? It's like possibly. I'm interested. My daughter, not going to get to see my friends. I'm going to miss my teacher, very emotional. And so that's been interesting.

But like when I think about it, I tell them, this isn't like goodbye or never see you again. It's like, yeah, we're going to see you soon. Don't get me wrong, a year is not a short period of time, but in the grand scheme of things, a year also isn't, you know, like in your life, time. What's a year? Yeah. They're going by faster all the time. So are you going to be one of their teachers or is that going to be mom's responsibility? Well, it's mom's responsibility.

But you know, I don't know. I mean, like I have zero clue late. I'm never homeschooled before. Yeah. So maybe there's a way that dad gets to be a part of that. I would love nothing more than the opportunity. Or maybe dad just messes things up and that's okay too. Well, I mean, the experience just itself is going to be an education for them, right? One thing that you might want to consider doing, or you probably thought of it already, is maybe have each of them keep a journal. A journal.

Of their experiences, because it'll be interesting to compare them and see, you know, how they relate and how one of them experienced it versus another, you know. So normally, this is where I would throw you a silver coin. so I don't know if I'm figuratively doing it so when we get back to the studio I can actually give it to you and you're going the studio it's like all since Sean came back from Cornerstone he's been discombobulated folks I forgot the mics I had to go grab the mics and bring them in because I took the entire studio roughly to Calgary and I didn't use any of it so it was a waste of my time to take it all there regardless I don't know if you're a silver man or precious metal silver oh absolutely I got a one ounce piece of silver sitting there

No, I love those. I have the ones from my previous appearances and I cherish them. I did bring some gifts for you, though, some gray matter swag that hopefully you'll enjoy and wear proudly on your journey. How is gray matter doing? Like, I mean, you know, I go back to the time of lockdowns, COVID everything, can't talk to anyone. Gray matter was and is, I should say. Don't. But at that point in time,

I think your interviews and probably my interviews, who am I kidding? That time anyone who had any voice and was using it to talk about the insanity that was going on in the world, it was just, it was an interesting time, it might even be a special time. But I mean, your journey, how many episodes are you up to now? We're at around 400. And I don't, I don't, you're the busiest, hardest working podcaster, I know. I mean, you do several interviews in a day.

But yeah, we're at about 400. And the answer to question is what's happening with is it's growing. Unfortunately, and I don't know what you think about this, but as I look back to six years ago when we were emerging out of lockdowns, I don't think that the COVID-19 pandemic has ended for Canada. I think it's ended for places like the United States. But I don't think it's over for Canada. Canada because when I look at, in retrospect, what COVID-19 actually was, and that is,

you know, essentially a sci-op and a mass experiment as opposed to a health crisis. That's my view on it. We're not out of that yet. The same propaganda tools that were used on us during the pandemic are being used now. We're seeing a rationing down, a restriction of the same freedoms. that were violated during the COVID-19. And maybe the best example, the ultimate example is the case, the only COVID case that was successful in showing that the government actually violated our rights is now going to be going before the Supreme Court of Canada.

And our government has never accepted responsibility for what it did during the Freedom Convoy in freezing people's bank accounts and violence. and violating the rights and freedoms of all Canadians. And until that is closed, and I think until we have a full-blown public inquiry, I don't think we're ever gonna emerge out of it. I think that I believe that somewhere,

the liberal government has a plan, and they were on stage one or two, say, in 2019, and now they're probably on stage four and five. If you look at the legislation that they're bringing in, so that it's all, to me, it's all, part of one experience in Canada. And because when you look at what our government is doing, it just keeps getting worse and worse. I mean, just yesterday I saw this morning, I was looking at a bunch of the Carney government acolytes are over in China, signing an agreement, a joint agreement

with China on banking and financial structure. I mean, do we want Chinese banking in Canada? Do people know what banking is like in China, you know, where you, where they can, they can shut off your ability to spend money if you don't have the right social credit score because you know you you you bought the wrong thing or you listen to the wrong pot you listen to the Sean Newman podcast that's it's really scary but I it's my view now looking at it sort of taking the long view back it seems like all part of one story so I can't even look at the the freedom convoy and the pandemic and say oh yeah well that was really bad but it's over. I personally can't do that.

I can. I mean, but in fairness, but in fairness, what I had leading up to the freedom convoy was a different life. What I mean by that, we were talking about Easter. Right?

Sorry, in text. And before the freedom convoy, I had zero faith. And after the freedom convoy, I would say I'm a completely changed man. I mean, people can argue about that. But by adding that part into my life, will there be hard times?

Yes. But I no longer fear them. I don't welcome them. I don't want them. Nothing more than the NHL playoffs are right around the corner. I want nothing more. Not of your relief fan. True enough.

Or a flames fan. Or a Knox fan. Yeah, sad, eh? It's actually kind of sad when you think about it. I just, you know, I want nothing more than to not stick my head back in the sand, but just that the world maybe just kind of goes, but to me,

the matter how far back you look, there was always problems. And there was always the late in gray who tried shining the light on the problems. And there was always the people who looked at it and went, yeah, we better do something about that or we don't, right? I keep reading Matthew right now. the tax collector sometimes tax collector

and I was sitting at the cornerstone forum people were talking about different things and I'm like you know Jesus was betrayed by his own disciple he knew it was coming and yet he still did it I mean every Pharisee sadducee

all went out against them all the ruling powers hated him still went and did it I mean how do we think for so special. Like we're just in a, we're in a time and place where things are going to be, yeah, looks like things are going to go crappy. And they were probably crappy 20 years ago. You just weren't paying attention. Oh yeah. Now that we're all paying attention, it's like, well, buckle up. Yeah. I mean, I don't know. I would love to snap a finger and have a politician do the right thing. And there probably are politicians doing the right things. And those politicians

probably get scoot inside. But like, I don't know. This is, this is our, our, uh, Time. Yeah. You point to a really important message about Easter, though, and that is that suffering is important, right? And it's a teacher. It teaches you gratitude. But, you know, people ask the question, you know, people who are maybe new to Christianity, or even some theologians ask the question, well, why?

Why did we, why did Jesus have to go on trial? And I just actually, I wrote a piece from my show that people can listen to about the trial of Jesus. It's often overlooked. The whole trial of Jesus was just the most, just the greatest travesty that you would not believe. The Jewish law, and the Jewish people were very legalistic, as you know. They violated every rule to convict him and he was innocent. And of course, what happened before Pilate, he's crucified. he's innocent to fulfill the prophecy that's in Isaiah 53.

But people ask the question, well, why does he have to suffer? Why does he have to die? Well, because there's a lot of reasons. But as Christians, you're right. If we look at that suffering, that's an example. Jesus' life is an example to all of us, but suffering is a big part of it. You're always going to have, or you should be able to believe, that through suffering, you're going to get something on the other end.

It might be an end to your suffering. It might be greater knowledge. If you're a woman who's carrying a baby for nine or ten months, right? And that's a suffering, but in the moment that you see that baby, all of that, it all disappears, right? And so suffering for Christians is something that is important. And it's a huge part of Easter. Yeah, well, I mean, it's just a very, very, very good reminder of no matter what goes on in this world.

I'm not worried about. Battles won, yeah. I don't mean to say you sit around and twiddle your thumbs. I don't even need to explain that. It's just that should give everybody a moment of pause and a moment of peace. I keep saying, you know, like when we go back to the Freedom Coppoy, it was probably like six months to a year after it. when I finally had the moment of peace just slam into me, I was like, holy crap, what is that?

Mm-hmm. Huh. And I just never looked back since then. I don't mean to say there isn't stress in a day. There certainly is. There is stress putting on an event. Mm-hmm. But, you know, you look at what the liberal government

and all these governments are doing, you know, like I just go, yeah, the walls, they sure make it seem like the walls are closing in. Yeah. Well, I think that... And I, I, I, I go, I guess in the back of the head, I got a little bit of Chaco Wilnick, a little bit of pissing vinegar in me. It just says good.

I think times need to get tough. You know, when times are tough in the middle of COVID, you have 200 people in a hall going, what are we going to do? And now they've been lulled back to sleep. Not all of you, obviously, there's lots of you lovely human beings here. But certainly when there's so many vectors that are coming in from, it's almost like, where do we, what do we do here? Yeah. It's like, don't worry. They're going to overplay their hands soon enough.

and when they do, everybody's going to know it. I'm curious, I want to ask you a question about the decision. This ties in the decision you've made to take a year off with your family. That's a big decision. I'm sure your decision to go to the convoy was a big one too. It was. Do you find that now that you are a believer, which you've been very open about on your show, that your decisions are less impacted by fear so that you're able to make a very bold decision

like the one that you're making and not have all this anxiety and fear about things going wrong so that your faith is sort of emboldened you? Is that something, is that a fair way to describe how you feel about things now versus the way you were before? Faith is definitely emboldened me. When I went to the convoy, I was very naive about what was going on and what situation I'd even rolled into. Going out the door every day, I'm certainly aware of the situations going on, not only

my community, but as you travel, the different things. But I'm like, I don't know how to say this late. I'm like, it's not really my choice. Like, it is, but I've prayed a lot about this. And I'm like, you sure? I don't have, I don't have a little bit of Jonah. Yeah, I'm just like, I don't get it. God's giving you a job and.

I don't, I don't get it. I don't get it. I've given them million, well, thousands of opportunities to be like, nope, this isn't, you need to be right here. Yeah. And yet every domino just keeps falling. And I'm like, okay, that's what we're going. And I've tried my best to just kind of give over the wheel.

I'm trying my best. Yeah. It's hard because I want to drive. Yeah. But I've found when I, this is right here, this is what you're sitting in. I gave over the wheel. This place that we're sitting in made zero sense to me, except for when I measured it up. It does now.

Now it does. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I went, really? But I felt it. I was like, okay,

walked it. Like, I'll show you a picture of this place before we ever did any work on. Oh, I love to see that. Yeah.

But I was saying, when I was in the studio that you've been in multiple times in Lloyd. The only thing I miss here is that lovely table. I was, that is a, this is beautiful too.

Yeah. This is beautiful too. But that table, let's face it, that was, that was, that's a, artifact. Yes, it is. I tell you what, you get a sitting around this, what I want to do is have more

round tables where it's like you and take two others. It doesn't matter. You get this place lively and everybody's talking. Oh, yeah. This place is fun. But regardless, go back to it. I was sitting in the studio and somebody asked me, well, how big of a studio would you want? I said, I would want it 24 feet long by 14, no, probably, no, I said 12 feet wide. I said 24 long by 12 feet wide. And then I went, no, no, 14 feet wide. I think I need a couple extra feet on each side. When I measured this place out, it was 24 feet long by 16 wide. And when we put the walls in, 14 wide.

And I'm like, I just, I'm like, I don't get it. And then you walk in and you're like, oh man, this is, this is something. This was not where I thought I would be. I had no plans on being in this spot at all. It's zero. At times I still probably lose faith of like, what the heck am I doing? You know, in my brain, late and I go, referendum is in October.

Why am I leaving? Why am I leaving the student? I have all these human questions. Sure. But I feel pulled to go a completely different direction. It makes zero sense to me. But I don't think it's supposed to make sense to me.

Someday, hopefully it will. You know, I'll be sitting there. I'll be like, oh, well, I didn't see that coming. Do you know the most quoted phrase in the Bible? Do not be afraid? Do not fear. Do not fear. Right.

Because that's, that's what the, enemy uses to infect the human mind and either either corrupt us into inaction when we should act or to behave in a way that is motivated by fear rather than reason or faith right so so here you are and now you you don't live your life by fear clearly you're you're a seeker you're out there trying to figure out what you know how then shall I live right That's the question of the Bible. How then shall we live?

And you're figuring that out. Now, here's a question for you. This feeling that you have, this new feeling you have in your heart since COVID, since the convoy. How as a producer of a show, as a communicator, as a media producer, as a media personality, how do you get that feeling that you have across to, other people who don't have that yet. How do you do that?

That's a very good question. If I had the answer, I'd be like, one, two, three. But is that the goal? Is that the goal of the Sean Newman podcast? Because I can tell you, that's what I'm trying to do. That's what I'm trying to,

that's why I'm doing gray matter, is I'm trying to get people into that mindset to see what's going on in the world through the lens that is given a lens of truth, right? and you and I both know what my idea of truth is, objective truth, so that when all these things are happening in the world,

they can look at that and go, yeah, okay, this is principalities and powers. This is, I can see that, I can frame that in terms of good and evil, right? So I got asked after the, I hope I'll tie this all back to this. After the Cornerstone Forum, I got asked by a bunch of people, you know, you got this like, just feeling really good, like, but I didn't get any solutions. Like, what am I supposed to do? I said, oh, well, the reason I don't ask those questions to these big geopolitical guys is they say, don't get stepped on. When the Giants are fighting, don't get stepped on.

My next logical question is, what does that mean? It means take care of your house, talk to your neighbors, build a community. If you get those things done, then you're supposed to look at, you know, what are my pinch points? Is it, you know, all of us are different? Is it food? Is it water? Is it energy? Is it money?

I don't know. There are all these different things. Tom Marazzo has a book on it for Pete's sake. Yeah. He's writing a new one too, actually. Yes, he is. And you're supposed to identify the problems in your life and go fix them. Mm-hmm.

And I'm a firm believer. If all of us fixed our house, it doesn't freaking matter what the government does because we'd all be like, no, we're not going along with that. It's a terrible idea. Right. But when we're running around chasing our tail, it's pretty tough.

And then you bring up the faith portion. There's a song that I like, and I'm forgetting the name of it, which is terrible. But there's a line in it. It's actually a hip-hop song. And I listened to it for a lot of years. And then once I found God, I would have taken you for a C&W guy, but. I listen to all types of music. I just love good music.

Anyways, I was listening to it. And in it, it's talking about God, and I didn't realize that. I'm like, no, it's not fascinating. And one of the lines is when you go searching for truth, truth finds you. And for people listening to the show, they don't have to believe anything I say, anything a guest says. Right, yeah.

I've had that mentality since I started this. I think a lot of these people are smarter than me, probably smarter than both of us combined. But if they haven't fallen in the ultimate truth, they just need to keep looking. Because when I ran into it, I always say it was like the crash test dummy going into the wall where they did those speed tests,

and then he goes flying, when he wasn't wearing a seatbelt, goes flying through, and his legs are going everywhere, his shoes are falling off. To me, that's what it was. And when I talked to more and more believers, they all have their kind of red pill moment,

you know, to have the red pill moment put in for Christianity. I find that fascinating. People would call that their testimony. And so my goal of the show is I want society to be better. And the only way I see that happening is people taking care of all the things I just said. And for me,

the ultimate truth of finding, God help me really wrestle with some demons I had. Drinking, probably like management of time. And where I was putting that, I was very much a yes guy. I'll be everywhere. And then you give away your children's time and your wife. It's like I wasn't shown up for him. So like I stack a lot of different things.

Jordan Peterson taught me this in the beginning. And then I found it all over again in the Bible. read the Bible. I'm like, there it is. I was chuckling the other day. I know I'm all over the place on you, Leighton. No. But you asked for it, so here we are.

I'm reading Matthew, and Jesus is saying, basically, this isn't his how he says it, but forgive me, folks. You know, red sky by night, sailor's delight, red sky by morning, sailor take warning, however that goes. Yeah. And I'm like, man, I've heard that since I was a kid. I didn't realize that it was a 2,000-year-old saying. Probably older. And older because he's talking about it and they all know about it. And he's the Jewish gospel, right?

He's the gospel. He's the Jewish voice of the gospel. So a lot of the stuff, one of the great things about Matthew is that he brings in so much of the Old Testament, oftentimes through the voice of Jesus. It's Jesus invoking the Old Testament. So you actually learn a lot of great nuggets from the Old Testament by reading Matthew, which is one of the things that's really great about his gospel.

Anyway, I didn't mean to interrupt you. Oh, no. This is a conversation. You interact as much as you want. So when you go to the goal of the show, at times I'm like, man, if I had said from day one, all I'm going to do is talk to hockey players, I wouldn't have found this journey I'm on. Yeah. So you'll know the line.

I was just reading it once again in Matthew, forgive me folks, for everything being Matthew. But it talks about being humble. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And I just like, I got this wonderful audience. They're brilliant. Shout out to all of you who listen and send me things. And I don't know where this journey's going.

I have zero freaking clue most days, right? Is it going to marching on the government? I don't know. I didn't predict the freedom convoy. That's not why I started the podcast. And so. But you're definitely taking a message, right? Well, I'm finding the things that I've found along the way.

Right. The scripture is those who exalt themselves will be humbled. Those who humble themselves will be exalted. I sit there and I stare at that line and I'm like, that's a, huh. There's a lot there. There's a lot there. So I stand back and I go, who am I? I mean, honestly. That's the question you ask in the mirror every day, right? Right. So I'm trying to be a good husband, a better father. And as a human being, I'm trying to treat everyone with as much respect. as I can garner as long as they're not attacking my, you know, immediate family or honestly, the more I stare at the Bible attacking my faith, right? You can have your different thoughts on it.

That's fine. Just don't come at me with all the things. And so that's what I'm trying to do. And I think, you know, in society, we lack good role models. And I'm not saying I'm a great role model, but I certainly strive to be one because you look at... That's the first prerequisite to being a good role model. model because people who aren't good role models don't strive to be one. Right.

Well, who are we learning off of? Are we learning off Pierre Poliye of and Kearney or Pierre Polio and Trudeau and parliament or Daniel Smith and Nenshi or Scott Moe and uh, forgive me the Saskatchewan lady's name. I'm forgetting it right now. Mm-hmm. And you go like, that isn't the way we're supposed to behave. No, but it like, that's not servant leadership.

That's not washing, right? your friend's feet, right? The very Jesus did with his apostles. But I got a question for you, getting up to that. Okay? So what do you call, I'm going to put another label on you.

What do you call a person who packs up his whole family and travels around to spread a positive message to the world? What do you call that person? I don't know. What are you? Missionary. Oh, really. So you might have started.

a podcast that is becoming a ministry. You need to meditate on that. You know what? It came to my mind? It was a gypsy. My gypsy? I just wandering the air. But what a missionaries do?

Right? You're on a mission. So the Sean Newman podcast is more than just you talking to people now. Now you're taking it out there, right? And you're bringing a message. That's not all you're doing, but you are bringing a message. Right. And talking about the why, I asked you about the why, you told me the why,

doesn't it sound like maybe God's given you an important job to do and going on this journey with your family, this mission with your family might be part of it? Could be. That's why I bring people like you. Sounds like it to me. It sounds like it sounds like God's giving you a job. do. And I think there was a test there for you, right? Um, you know, because there's a lot of a lot of pros and cons there you talked about, but you're still going to do it. And, um,

that's a pretty good sign that, uh, you're going to be blessed in a lot of different ways for doing it because so you're taking on something really big. It's going to be hard. There's sacrifice and struggle. It's going to be involved in it. It's taking you totally out of your comfort zone. and, you know, I think God's giving you a job to do, my friend. Well, I appreciate that. I mean, I don't even know what to say to that. I'll go think on that for a bit. I don't know.

To all the folks listening and delayed, it's not why I did it. No. Right? I was pretty emotional. I didn't mean to be emotional on the stage. It kind of hit me be. It just hit me.

I was, I don't know why I was so emotional on stage, but, uh, when I was announcing it. Mm-hmm. Really excited for it. People are obviously going to miss the cornerstone events. Well, they're, they're great. I've been to them. In theory, there will be a cornerstone next, next, next summer. There you go.

So in theory, it doesn't, you don't even skip a beat with it. Sure. It's just, I don't know where we're, you know, like I have the general, my wife laughs at me, because I'm the spontaneous guy. If I could just set out in a vehicle or the, Mike, I think I'd end up You're not very risk averse. I don't know.

I think I'd end up in, I'm spontaneous. I think I'd end up in Timbuktu. And you'd be like, how did you get there? I talked to this guy and I bounce me over there. My wife's a little more structured than that, right? And with kids along, so we're a little more structured. I don't know. I'm, I must have told you the first time I prayed.

Well, not the first time. The first time I prayed where I'm like, okay, let's do this. I was looking up and I'm like, just don't make it dull. I'd like an adventure. I don't think I knew what I was asking for back then, Leighton, and this wasn't part of, I don't know, this wasn't part of it. Yeah. Right? But how the heck would you know?

So you just buckle up the best you can. My family's coming with me. I'm excited for that, right? Like as much as everybody's been telling me, you know, like, it's always interesting to hear other people's thoughts on something you're doing. Yeah. I don't know how you're going to, for instance, I don't know how you're going to afford that. And I always go, well, I didn't plan this two days ago. Like we've been saving money for two years for it.

Like we've been really diligent in trying to set away. Or I don't know if you're going to be able to survive your kids. It's like, well, well, the reason we think we can is because we've traveled for a long period of time with our kids. And there are moments where you want to go home or Simpson on them. Yeah. But then the other parent always steps in and gives you a break. And once you've had a break, you realize like this is, this doesn't happen all the time, like where you get to spend. this much time around your kids.

And the list goes on and on. Like how will you figure out how to podcast on the road? It's like, I don't know. Probably suck for the first couple and I'll figure a couple things out. And I've learned that one podcast doesn't make or break you. And nor does five. And we'll probably figure that out.

And I'll probably have some mistakes along the way. And I hope everybody will be patient with me while we figure out a few things. And there's going to be a painful adjustment because right now I work five days a week, right? Where I get up, go to work, And it's work. Yeah.

My family been around all the whole time. That's going to be an interesting adjustment of like when dad's got to go where does you go and how do you interact with kids while you're trying to put on a show and there's going to be some pain. But in pain comes growth. Yeah. That's what we were talking about coming back to one of the lessons of Easter, right? Pain, suffering, but then rebirth, right?

Then you get. And what's going to be on the other side? for you of this journey and for you and your wife, you and your wife, if you don't kill each other, you're going to grow closer together. You're going to have to, right? But no, it's funny you talk about how your wife sort of grounds you. I'm fortunate. I have my wife, Jennifer, she's the same thing for me because I'm like you in the sense that I'm not risk averse. I will take chances. I will, one thing, one of the things I learned from my late father, I actually wrote this in when I eulogized him a few years ago when he died,

is that one of the best things my dad taught me, he wasn't perfect by any stretch, nobody's father is, but he always taught me to bet on myself. The bet on yourself, and I'm not saying that in a humanistic way apart from God, but that's the best bet that you can make, because you control so many of the controllables, right? And I find that so few people, especially young men nowadays are willing to do that. They just don't seem to be unwilling to take chances and to bet on their own, you know, their own mind, their own will, their own heart, their own sweat.

And that's, I mean, that's what you did with the Sean Newman podcast. And that sort of said, it sounds like it's set in motion, a whole series of decisions. Yes. That's leading you, you know, to this extraordinary mission. I'm going to call it a mission now. You're going on the Sean Newman mission. Wait, that's S&M. I would, the only thing I'd add into it is although I set my mind,

I just ran into the Joe Rogan quote again, which is on the wall in the virtual studio with the beautiful table. And the only thing that I remind, I just want to remind anyone listening that's, setting off on a goal. It took three years to become a full-time podcaster, and I worked at it while I was working a full-time job, and we had three kids, and I was just pushing.

And I was still playing senior hockey, and I think back on it, I'm like, man, I probably was not the greatest husband back then. And I am married to a wonderful lady. But regardless, it took time, and it took effort, took consistency, it took getting better at your craft, all these, you know, different things.

And when we come to leaving here in July, it's full on two years we've been are we actually going to do this? Yes well in order to do it we need to accomplish these things before we could ever leave this isn't like six months ago I'm like we're leaving and we're going this was very much you know like

there's going to be a ton of people at least some of this at homeschool and they're like you're doing the greatest thing ever for others they're probably terrified of that right we probably fall into the ladder just a little bit we've never homeschooled before always a teacher So we think we can tackle it, but we know that's going to come with some pain. And then, you know, the finances.

You know, like to go out on the road, you've got to do all these different things. So like trying to get rid of any bill we ever had so that when we're on the road, we're not paying for XYZ and it's bleeding us out back home, right? And so like we've been, I was very methodical on how I got to being a full-time podcaster, but there did come a time where I'm like, I've got to jump in both feet if I'm going to ever going to crack at this, you know, and I told the story the other day of riding around on a pedal bike because I didn't own a vehicle in pouring rain, trying to, it's straight up a movie, trying to get a dealership to sponsor the podcast or give me a vehicle so that I could drive around and actually

have something, you know, and that meeting didn't go that well, folks, you can imagine I walked in soaking wet. But eventually, you know, by betting on myself, I did see more and more wins. That never ends for me. I'm always betting on myself. And now I just, you know, now I just got somebody walking alongside me where it's like, yeah, you get nothing to fear. And your kids are learning it too, right? Yeah. You're seeing you do it, right? And this was the first Easter Sunday we've gone to as a family. Maybe we went last year. I this is the first one, you know, so when I say, you know, I found God in late 2022, 23, 24, 25, 26, it's been four years of wrestling with a whole bunch of things. Maybe we made it there

last year, but this one really stuck of like, this is important when we're going. And I felt that while I sat there, right? And you hear the story. And I had a whole bunch of things, including yourself, sent my way. And this was just a really important weekend and an important reminder, you know, like everything gets so commercialized about the Easter Bunny and everything. And the more I see that, the more I probably start to twitch in my head. Like, you know, this is, this is really important. Let's not forget what's going on here. Let's not forget what he died for and why that's important, why we should be talking about it. Easter is really under attack too. I did a deep dive on this into Christmas on my show. I was trying to debunk, and I think I did successfully debunk the idea

that Christmas was originally a pagan holiday. Clearly that's wrong. But what I discovered was that the early Christians in the first two or three centuries of Christianity, really paid no attention to Christmas. They were not interested in anything about Jesus's birth. And that's why even today, we don't really know exactly when he was born. But what's interesting is the opposite of true is true of Easter. Easter was vitally important to the early church because, of course, the whole foundation of Christianity is the resurrection.

The resurrection is the life. And what we're finding now, though, just recently is that certain governments, certain public figures, including King Charles III, doesn't think Easter is very important. You know, even the good people at Cadbury won't put Easter on their Easter cream eggs anymore. You know, Prime Minister Carney's Easter message, I don't know if you saw it, Sean, but had no mention of faith or Christianity or anything like that. On the flip side, I don't know if you notice this, I was very heartened and encouraged when I saw our premiers' message, Easter message, which is the most blatantly Christian thing she's ever said publicly. And even Pierre Polivier, who I criticize often on my show, people will know, same thing.

He said, Christ is risen. He's risen indeed. That's encouraging. So you're so right. We have to keep Easter. Easter is really important. It's actually much more important. I shouldn't say much more because, of course, we couldn't have the resurrection without the birth of Jesus.

But in terms of the theology of Christianity, Easter is now and has always been, you know, the preeminent event of Christianity. That's the foundation, right? St. Paul says in the gospel, he says, well, if Christ isn't risen, then everything else is for not. Like, we're just, you know, we're just kidding ourselves. If Jesus wasn't, if he didn't die and he didn't come back, then, you know, this whole Christianity. gig, we're just, we're not doing anything, guys. So it's very important for us as Christians now to market and talk about it, as we're doing right now.

And hopefully we're going to reach people, the Christians who are listening to this are going to really appreciate it. And people who are just curious like you were about Eastern, about Christianity, maybe something is going to be ignited in their hearts. And maybe it'll lead them to Christ. I hope so. I hope so, too. I just, I, on my end, I was the guy who wouldn't listen to this.

I was the guy who always say, mom probably gave me a thousand Bibles and I left him scattered across Canada. Yeah. And then one day it just hit and sunk, you know, I just had. God bless Mom, say? Oh, I just had Vance Crow on the show. Vance Crow from St. Louis and got diagnosed with cancer. And out of nowhere, he starts talking about it.

it and he said yeah I was I just thought it was for you honestly then I started reading it with my kids again I'm like holy crap like oh my goodness what is happening here this is super cool you know and uh I don't know for anyone who uh is fast forwarding or could just tune this part of the conversation up someday I just hope something just collides in you with not too much pain yeah hopefully you don't have to go through too much stress yeah yeah you just open it because I mean like tell people all the time just read proverbs you you'll like a good Marcus Aurelius book or something that on meditations and you think it's so profound. Go read Proverbs.

Greatest repository of wisdom in the world. And it's insane. You just read it and you're like, that's actually, yeah, fair enough. And that's every day. Yeah. One for every day. Just go read it. And I swear after 12 months of reading, so that's 12 times of each chapter roughly,

I still read some chapters. I'm like, how did I forget this part? Like, why can't that sink, you know, anyways. The late Jerry Falwell did just that. He recommended reading proverbs, one proverb every day for knowledge and wisdom and read one Psalm for encouragement and inspiration. It's funny. I read the Psalms and I can't get into it.

Why is that? Well, it may be that you're not in the right moment, you know. I read the Psalms a lot during COVID, especially the ones that were written by David. because during that time he was very much under attack and he was under threat of being killed all the time. And prayed for strength. Also, in some of the Psalms, he prays for forgiveness, right? Because, and this is one of the great things about the people in the Bible, and it speaks to the truth of the Bible, the authenticity of it,

is that apart from Jesus Christ, there aren't any perfect heroes in the, in the Bible. All of them have flaws, real human flaws that we share, right? And David is no exception, even though he was an extraordinary man, you know, you could call him, I guess, the Elon Musk of his time. He had faults. He was an adulterer. He, you know, he wasn't the world's greatest father at times. You know, he neglected his family because of affairs of state, you know. He had a big ego at times, you know, that got away on him. So, you know, we can learn so much from just from those struggles. But, you know, it may be that the Psalms don't speak to you at this moment in your life.

And the Proverbs will speak more. And then you'll be another moment of your life when, wow, those Psalms are really, they really speak to you, you know. Well, fair enough. That's usually how the Bible goes. Yeah. Nothing sticks. And then all of a sudden you start reading a certain part and you can't get out of it. Yeah.

Fast, not switching, not fast forwarding, not switching. Yeah. You know, Alberta independence, right? It just got announced, well, I mean, it's obviously got to be made official by elections, Alberta, but everything pointing to the number has been reached, which leads to a whole bunch of different questions, one of which is, you know, the First Nations veto court case, et cetera, et cetera, can they get this shutdown before it ever gets there? And then, I don't know, Leighton, we talked about a lot. of different things on the way out here. You can steer whichever way you'd like with what message

you'd like to try and get out to Alberta independence folks. Yeah. Well, I think what I'd encourage people to do, and I gave a speech in Smokey Lake a couple of months ago on this, and it upset some people, other people really were shocked to hear me talk about this, but Nietzsche has a parable, a parable of the tarantula. Friedrich Nietzsche was a very troubled German guy. But he wrote some really brilliant stuff. But the parable of the tarantula works like this. Imagine there's this big, fat, hairy spider.

And it creates this web. And by analogy, in the modern world, and especially in places like Canada, that spider is the state, is the executive state. And what that spider does is it goes and it says to victimhood groups who are the people that the spider wants to invite into the web so that they'll be consumed. It says, come to me.

You are powerless. You're small, but I'm powerful. I can redress your grievances. I come to you and I offer you equality. I offer you revenge. I offer you retribution. I offer you even reparation, right? Against these people who are oppressing you.

I'm not the one of pressing you. It's those guys over there, right? It's, you know, the Donald Trumps of the world or the conservatives or whoever. And the victimhood groups get pulled into this. And it's, you know, it's people like, and you see what happens to them. You know, look what happened to BLM.

They had their moment. then they get taken apart. It's happening right now to the LGBTQ. It's happened to Antifa. And the Indian is in this type of dysfunctional relationship with the government of Canada. And so when people see these Indian chiefs going off to see the king

to try and stop Alberta independence, what they're really seeing is the working of the spider. What the spider wants to do is it wants to use, this victimhood group as an avatar and we'll use them up and consume them to get what it wants, which is more and more power and control. And so these Indian chiefs are being used and they're being paid. Their flights are being paid for and everything to go over there and be the avatars for

destruction of Alberta independence and destruction of the referendum. And of course, what the spider wants, this web that the spider is spinning is it wants people like you and me to get really mad at the Indian. Oh, who do those chiefs think they are trying to block Alberta independence? But it's important to remember, you know, who are these chiefs? I think there were six of them. Well, if you take all of the First Nations people in Alberta, it's 1% of our population. Only 40% of those live on reserve.

Well, those six chiefs are a fraction of that 47%. And yet they want to go to court and block the political will. of an entire province. So I think what this speaks to is a couple of things. Number one, how dysfunctional the relationship is between the governor of Canada and the First Nations, Aboriginal or Indian or natives, so wherever you want to call us.

That's really bad. But it also tells you, I think it also explains in large degree why independence is not just an option. It's an imperative. Right. Any government that would treat its quote unquote most aggrieved population the way Aboriginal people are treated in Canada, any government that would do that is a government that we have to get away from as far as we can.

You know, for example, I was saying to you in the car that they call us first nations, but really what do we first in? Well, we're first in prostitution. We're first in suicide. we're first in drug addiction, we're first in alcoholism, we have the highest number of abortions. We are last in educational outcomes. We're last in successful marriages and healthy families. We're highest in almost every type of disease. So what is the lot of the indigenous or Aboriginal person in Canada?

And people will ask, well, why would you want to to maintain that. And then you bring this in, and this may shock some of your viewers and listeners. Did you know that the governor of Canada, this spider, as I described them, spends more money on the indigenous, about less than 5% of the total Canadian population than it does on national defense? Why would they do that, Sean? Why would the spider want to spin so much of its web on that? Well, it was a very simple answer. is that First Nations reserves are the biggest money laundering scheme in Canada. And if you go look at what's going on there, you see drug addiction, gang activity,

human trafficking, and yes, money laundering. Because when the money goes from the coffers, our money, our taxpayer money, leaves the government, and it's mostly borrowed money, leaves the government coffers and goes to a chief and counsel, it's gone. in the same way than when we give it to Mr. Zelensky, it's gone. And nothing is tracked. And those are the two biggest money laundering schemes that this federal government is doing right now.

And the indigenous grift is a huge, huge industry. And most Canadians are unaware of why it's happening. And it even extends to what's going on just to sort of close the circle, what's happening in Cowichan. Because back in 1997, the Supreme Court of Canada decided that it was going to create a fictional thing called Aboriginal title, which isn't in our constitution.

It's not anywhere in our legislative law. They just dreamed it up. These unelected bureaucrats who are former lawyers, political appointments, they decided that we're going to have this thing called Aboriginal title. And the Cowichan case is the longest running trial in Canadian history. Did you know that? And what's interesting is the court refused, even though the other side applied, refused to give notice to any of the potential private property owners who were going to lose their title or have their title affected by this Aboriginal title. And the court refused to let them know because reconciliation, right?

They thought there would be a backlash. So what happens? Well, finally, in 2025, when the decision comes out, all these people find out, oh my God, I don't even own, I don't own my property. So now you have Aboriginal title and fee simple title or private title on the same piece of property. Well, what is Aboriginal title? Well, Indians can't own land. Any land, it says it's right in the Indian Act.

All the land on reserves is held in trust for the Indian. It's the same thing with Aboriginal title. Your fee simple title that you have to your house or wherever we are. Folks, I don't know where I am, so if I don't get home, okay. But to that property, you have various rights to go along with it. One of which you can sell, you know, you can lease out anybody you want. Well, guess what? With Aboriginal title, the only party that can get a hold of that land is the federal

crown. And so really, what's happening in Cowichan and what's happening in Vancouver, through the magic of undrip, which spreads the lie that any land, Indians ever looked at is theirs, is actually this land is being expropriated, taken, seized by the federal government. And they're using the Indian, coming back to my analogy of the spider, the Indian is the mechanism, right? The spider is spinning the web using this Aboriginal title, this fiction of Aboriginal title to take private title away from people who are lawful property owners and giving it to the federal crown. Why? Well, because it, if you want to know, if you dig a little

deeper, this is part of the Silicon Roads initiative. And these Indian chiefs have already signed agreements with the Chinese government with the CCP for resource extraction and economic development. And if you see what the Chinese have done all over the world, they've scarred the planet Earth with lithium mines and things like this. And they're going to, they're going to do the the same thing. Enormous amounts of money are going to be paid. And the globalists like Kearney and such, this all fits into their grand plan,

which you know is agenda 2030. You'll own nothing and you'll be happy. The Indians have been living under you'll own nothing and be happy. Since Confederation. And I just described you, Sean, how it's working out for them. So how do you think it's going to work out for the rest of us? If the crown owns everything and we own nothing.

I mean, this script has been written. We've seen this movie before. We should know what the sequel is going to look like. And so that's why I'm saying, unlike, you know, people like Keith Wilson, whom I respect, he's a knowledgeable guy and he's a good lawyer, I disagree with the idea that we should import this terrible system of the Canadian version of apartheid, the Indian Act, which is the oldest statute in Canada, in 1876, which says, which creates a separate class of human being, the Indian, the otherness of the Indian.

One of the worst things we could possibly do if we're going to renovate and create this beautiful new country is to bring the most shameful thing that the government of Canada arguably ever did and the most dysfunctional relationship to bring that into a new Alberta, I think would just be a dreadful mistake. and it could, it has the potential to destroy the whole project entirely. So I'm very much against bringing in the current system of reserves and so on into Canada. I think we have to get together and find a new way. We have to renovate, right?

We have to renovate, just like you did with the studio, right? You took out the old stuff and you brought in all this beautiful new stuff, and now you've got a beautiful studio. Well, that's what we can do with Alberta. How do you, um, It's been always interesting to me. Your, your, your background lends a ton of credibility to what you're talking about. One of the issues has been getting the reserves or people that live on the reserves to voice anything, right?

And the private channels I've had with a couple, they've said, listen, I just can't talk. Because, like, there would be supreme consequences for me saying anything. I don't, I assume they're telling me the truth. I don't know why. You know, coming on and saying you're against independence or your for it would hinder your lot in life on a reserve, but I assume there is some things I don't fully understand. Yeah. In your mind, how do we, I see a lot of, like, I don't know how better to say it late. And so I'll just say, I see a lot of white old men talking about what the reserves want.

And I'd chuckle about that. I go, I don't know. Like, do they want a different thing? Did I like the thing? I don't know. I assume they have their thoughts, but when I've asked, it's been very,

I'll tell you off air, but I won't come on, no matter what I offer. And maybe this conversation can, you know, maybe someone will pipe up and say, I'd come on. But I don't know,

your thought. This is an astute point because coming back to my analogy, the parable of the tarantula, one of the things that creates, it has created in the Indian is a victimhood mentality. And I'm sure there are times in your life when you felt a victim.

Oh. Okay. And unfortunately, this. That's why you surround yourself with strong men so that they can call it that little. Right. But this can become a psychology, a mentality. And when it does, it creates a whole systematic way of thinking, whereby people lose agency. they lose self-respect.

They lose the ability to make decisions. They lose the ability to live in community with others. They lose the ability to live peacefully. They lose optimism. They lose faith. They become suspicious and distrustful of their neighbor, which is basically the opposite of the way our saviour wants us to live. And this is the way the Indian lives on reserve.

And the most oppressive, as oppressive as the government that we have in Ottawa is, it's not even close to how bad most chiefs and councils operate. Most these reserves operate as banana republics. And so this victimhood mentality, it perpetuates itself. So that what happens is the people from the, And I don't want to paint everybody with the same brush, but this is the reality in a lot of First Nations communities where you, if anybody's gone there or if you live in one, you'll see it basically looks like a third world country. We don't, you don't have schools, you don't have facilities, you don't have aquatic centers. Occasionally, you know, maybe you'll have a casino and some, a gas station, some business is there.

but it doesn't look like a healthy community. And what the spider does is it actually takes people from these communities and creates them and makes them into little spiders. They become copos. They become, you know, they become the Uncle Tom's. Right. And so what they do is they administer the system that the big spider wants and the victimhood mentality.

And so what you're describing, people who are afraid to speak out, who are afraid to go gains with Chief and Council. And the Chief and Council can actually vote you off the reserve. They can do that, right? They have that power under the Indian Act. It's frightening. And again, I come back to, we have to get rid of the system.

It's a terrible system. We can see that it doesn't work. It doesn't work for the Indian, and it certainly doesn't work for the Canadian taxpayer who's funding all of this stuff. It only feeds the spider. and only feeds the growth of bigger government. And this is why I say, and you're right,

we have to try and reach people who are living on reserve and convince them that the victimhood that they're living through, that there is something better for them. But, you know, it's like a Stockholm syndrome where you identify with your captor, right, and your abuser, or maybe if you think of battered woman syndrome, and people wonder, well, why would that woman stay with that a-hole pizza? Well, you know, and my life is a lawyer, I saw this over and over again.

I represented guys who murdered their wives. And it is a psychology where you begin to feel like, well, this is all I have. Almost like if you were in the ocean and you were on a ship that went down and you're clinging to this spar of wood and you can see the land. And you're pretty sure you can swim there, but you instead, you just hold on to that spar of wood. I mean, eventually that wood is going to become waterlogged and sink and you with it, right? And it's when you come back to betting on yourself, one of the things that it's kind of like going to the gym. First time you're in there, you can hardly lift. And over the course of a year, if you were to track that, you'd be amazed at how far you've come.

And when you bet on yourself, instead of the victimhood mentality, right? Is it a little unnerving to go out on your own? Or there are lots of learning lessons. There certainly is. But in a year's time, you look back and you go, I'm glad I went this path. And I can see when you're talking about it, when everything's, here's a, you know, like, here's a handout or whatever you want to call it. Hand out probably isn't the best term.

No, that is what it is. Here's this. and you're constantly going back to the same place and they have control of you, that's an uncomfortable, even where I sit, that's an uncomfortable feeling. I don't like that.

I'm trying to remove as much of that as I possibly can. Because, well, you can't truly be who you are when you have that. You can't imagine being able, I can't imagine a life right now where I couldn't come on here and just say what's on my mind. You could do it in a respectful way, but you still just be able to be able. to come on and, you know, in our country, in 2026, just walk on and be like, I just don't

like Alberta independence. Why don't you like Alberta independence? Well, these, all these, in La La La La La, oh, that's, okay, that's a fair point. And then you bring on the next person. I like it. And why do you like it? And to me, that seems like a very healthy society when you can just have an open discussion on this. Right. One of the things about reserves in particular that I have found concerning is that they don't want to talk. And that, that's the, there is consequences I'd be alluded to of talking. Oh, my God, that's, that wouldn't be fun. That feels like COVID.

Mm-hmm. Where if we, we say anything, all your things are going to be stripped. Well, what I learned was that wasn't true, although there were consequences for speaking out in COVID, for sure. Oh, yeah. But the benefits outweighed the consequences tenfold, maybe 50 fold. Mm-hmm. Well, here's the flips.

I use the word handout. And that's an accurate description. And I actually wrote a piece for my show that's called Aboriginal. entitlement. Now, when I use the word entitlement, it's a bit of a play on words because entitlement means that you are entitled to something. You have the right to have something under law. Aboriginal entitlement, though, what I'm talking about also is the type of entitlement you remember as a hockey player. And I'm sure you played with the guy. And this is something that, and, you know, there are a lot of players, very talented players whose careers have been

ruined because they thought that they deserved everything that they didn't have to work and practice they didn't have to show up at the gym they could stay out all night they didn't have to listen to the coach they could abuse the other guys on the team they could take my tape and my sticks and whatever and you know they were just better than everybody and oh yeah I want to be on the power plan I want to be on the last minute of the period and I'll get all the juicy cuts of ice time and that's that that's the entitled guy well how is that different from the Indian who does nothing except the it will be be described and have the legal description of being an Indian and I have it I can show you the card if you like it's right

here in my wallet but does that entitle them does that entitle them to be a burden on the Canadian taxpayer does that entitle these chiefs to go over and get an audience with the king to shut down a political movement that hundreds, thousands, tens of thousands of people have worked on for years, something wrong about that, isn't there? I mean, entitlement stinks, right? That kind of entitlement stinks. And again, if that's the relationship that the governor of Canada has created and nourished and perpetuated with the Indian, why on earth would we want to bring that into a new Alberta. It seems to me that would be one of the main things

that we would want to get rid of about Canada. There's lots of great things about Canada that we want to conserve and make part of a new Alberta. In fact, I see Alberta independence not as a separatist movement, but as a conservation movement. We actually are trying to conserve this land that we love from encroachment and destruction

by an evil government. But why would we want to bring maybe one of the worst things, maybe the worst thing about Canada into a new Alberta. To me, as an indigenous person, as the son of a treaty Indian, as a guy whose grandmother and great aunt were raised in residential school, as a guy who's worked 25 years representing indigenous people all over Western Canada, I don't think that that's something that we should cherish that we should conserve, I think we need to dismantle it and build something new. That's what I think.

I think we need to kill the spider, tear up the web. You said people are upset with you on that? Yeah, because this thing, this is a cherished. Are you familiar with the Lord of the Rings? Oh, yeah, of course. So the Ring has power, right? But the ring destroys. At every single holder of that ring, it destroys them.

Remember, precious. Yes. It corrupts them all. Right? Well, the Aboriginal entitlement is that ring to the Indian. It's precious. They're afraid if they don't go along, if they don't go along with what's going on with their chief and counsel, if they don't do what they're supposed to do, if they don't vote, well, they don't, I mean, most Native people are not big on elections. They don't get out to vote very much.

But if they don't support the liberal government. you know, that ring, that ring's not going to be there on their finger anymore and there won't be any more checks. And they'll actually have to take responsibility for their own lives. They won't be able to call themselves a victim anymore. And, you know, this government in Ottawa has worked very hard to convince the rest of us to sell us on this guilt trip, this colonialism about how, you know, we stole the land and oppressed and, you know, you know, victimize the Indian. They sell us on that so that we won't balk when they come and they get Aboriginal

title. So we'll say on the flip side, I mean, that's really what the land acknowledgments are. You go to the hockey game and they say, oh, well, this is the, this belonged to, you know, A, B, C, D, EF Indian band. Well, ask yourself why there's so many Indian bands, folks. It's called the Law of Conquest. Okay. But they tell you all this and this, you're on stolen land.

This isn't our land. Well, the next move is Aboriginal title. They go together like this. So we've been conditioned by the land acknowledgements and the guilt, telling Canadians that we don't, you know, Justin Trudeau, 2015, no core values, right? No shared values. And that we're a post-nation state.

We get softened up by all that. So we'll agree to the Aboriginal title. But it's all part of the destruction and dismantling of Canada. Do you foresee, so one of the things with Cowichin and all that, and the piece in-pill title, one of the things I've heard lots about is Alberta has signed treaties with ever, you know, like there's no way it can come back. And I'm like, no way it can come back.

I truck about that. I'm like, how long is it until some wise guy goes, we signed the treaties under duress? And then you get a judge who, goes, man, it shouldn't make sense. You guys shouldn't assign. If we're going to go and undermine all of law with fee simple title and everything going on there, what is to stop it from getting worse? It's already happening. In Ontario, there are a whole bunch of these claims for, in relation to unseated land. Right now, with the lawsuits that are going on in New Brunswick, half of the

province is exposed to a deck, half of the problem, half of the landmass of New Brunswick. But those ones are on unseated, correct? I don't know if I'm getting this right. And Alberta's all been seated. Right. Correct? So they go, oh, well, it's seated. It's clear.

It's in the law. For now. This can never happen. For now. But understand, that's only one judicial decision away. Away. One judicial decision away. And these judges are progressives.

Okay. then the goal is to completely eliminate privately held land for people like you and me in this country that all the privately held land will be held either by the crown or by the brook fields and the bill gates is of the world that's that's the plan you see if you go back far enough in our history you remember in school you probably studied about feudalism futilism was a a way of the french call of the seigneurial system essentially you had a baron or ear or a duke you know own the land and uh people like you and me would work on that work our lives on that land we never owned anything and uh we got to to live off of the excess that the

leftovers of what the land produced and we were essentially hired slaves it was uh something like uh you'll own nothing and you'll be happy except you were miserable and the feudal system why why did people move to this barren land that was going to kill exactly why did they have revolution? Why do they have revolution in France to get rid of this? But, you know, the nobles, you know, the King Charleses of the world, the nobles, they love Marxism because Marxism looks very much like feudalism, right? And so that's what's being instituted here in Canada.

That's what they're trying to institute, is this Marxist feudalist system where the, you know, the gentry, the super, the super, elites, you know, globalists of the world, we'll own everything, and we'll just rent everything. I won't even own this cop that's in front of me, you know. And of course, what type of agency will we have? At that point, we're all going to be victims, right? We'll be dependent on our owners for everything, our protection, our food, our shelter, and it can all be taken away in a heartbeat. These guys who are doing this, they hate the idea of a middle class that has civil liberties and freedom. They hate the idea that people want to, I don't know, have a family and be able to go on the road for a year with a podcast and teach their kids out of the Bible instead of out of a textbook that's full of lies and filth about our country.

they hate that and they want to destroy it all. And so this, when people see the Cowichan thing, it's all part of, it's all part of one. Don't think it's going to end there, you know. It didn't end in 1997, you know. I remember here's a more recent example that's very vivid. Remember when made for a start, okay, 10 years ago, it was going to be limited to the very, very extreme cases, right? Now it's being offered to depressed teenagers. But you can, they're actually offering it to depressed teenagers without the knowledge or the consent of their parents.

I can tell you the only time in my life I ever thought about suicide was when I was a teenager. It was probably because, you know, some girl I like was ignoring me. When you're a teenager, I mean, let's face it, teenage boy, you're a massive hormones. And then, you know, the next day, you know, I got hit over the head with a hockey stick and then I was fine, you know. but that's that's that's how far all of these policies are progressive and they're all going down to one thing and it's misery and death that's where that's where they all lead for for uh they don't promote human flourishing they don't promote freedom they don't promote self responsibility all the good things that are in that book you're reading you know with the 66 chapters all the good

things. Everything that Easter is about, that's not what progressive is about. It's the, it's a very opposite. In fact, you could view it as a Christian heresy. Many theologians do. You can see wokeness as a, as a, as a, as a, truly as a Christian heresy. Because it tells you you're a good person, you know, uh, if you tolerate evil, right? That's Christian heresy. But, you know, so when people are seeing this, it's important that you don't blame the Indian, right? Because the India is like the fly that's caught in the web, a lot of them. I think most of them are totally ignorant of what has been done to them. And that's part of the reason why I'm speaking out about this. But, you know, when people hear the truth, they often don't like it. I mean, we're talking about Jesus. Remember when

Jesus goes back to Nazareth, and he said, this guy came down from heaven, right? This is the truth. is now revealed in your ears this day I'm the fulfillment of this prophecy. Hey, wait a minute, aren't you like the guy from down the street, your Joseph son, your mom was married. Now you're God. You know, so a lot of people don't, they don't want to hear the truth. Jesus was, Jesus was killed for it. A lot of people have been killed for it. You know, the other day we just was the anniversary of Martin Luther King's death, April 4th. No, he was killed for speaking the truth. And so a lot of people, when you tell them the truth, they don't like it. But the indisputable truth about the indigenous people,

Aboriginal people in Canada, is that we are in a grossly dysfunctional relationship with our government, and there will only be continued misery and suffering as long as we stay in it. There's just no way out. Alberta independence, to me, is an off-ramp. What do you not your, well, no, I don't know, your prediction. What do you see happening in a short period of time? I mean, obviously this year with a referendum coming.

What do you hear in your conversations? I think the referendum, I think the referendum is going to come out somewhere between 60 to 65% in favor. And people say, well, why do you say that? Well, because we actually already had a referendum on equalization. And I think that really was. if you think about it, that was a referendum on independence, right? Because if you end equalization, what does that mean? You know, it means that we want to change the constitution and restructure our political

relationship with Ottawa. And that's part of the reason why I think that. The political nerds would say they're going to be 30 to 40%. I know, I know. but what they don't factor in is that people know, will know and understand that, and this is why I think the vote will be more the way I'm describing. The people voting will know that voting in favor of independence will not automatically achieve independence. So there's a safety there. There's a cushion there, right? Because people will know, or they should know, that after the referendum, the referendum is

really just the beginning, right? It's an important stage, but once we get through the referendum, then we have to go through this period of negotiation, the what and the how and the and the when it's all going to unfold. There's this period of negotiation with Ottawa. And one of the big issues that I find no one is talking about is, let's say we have, if October, let's say I'm terrible. Let's say I'm wrong and these other prognosticators are right. They're as true as Nostradamus. The thing gets defeated. Okay, fine. That won't be the end of Alberta independence. Okay, firstly. It'll go on. It'll have some other iteration, believe me. But if if the vote goes in favor, the big question that nobody's talking about is, okay, who are the people who are going to enter into negotiations with

Carney and company. Well, it surely can't be Danielle Smith because, to her credit, you know, she's been very honest publicly, as she generally is. And she said she doesn't support it. Well, she's in a material conflict of interest. You know, so we can't have Daniel Smith negotiate independence. Well, who's it going to be that? Who's going to pick those people, right? You know, where are these people going to come from? This is maybe the most important question, as important as the independence question itself is, who are the negotiators going to be? Because if there are people, well, I'll name something,

like people like Michael Binion or Preston Manning or former Prime Minister Stephen Harper who think that the real purpose of the referendum is to gain leverage so that we can work out of, we can re-confederate and leave Alberta within Canada. That could be a total disaster because what they'll do is they'll cut

they'll cut some deal with Ottawa that will mostly perpetuate all the misery we're in now and they'll sell it to us down the line and meanwhile they'll cut political deals for their friends and they'll continue to make a lot of money off of the system that exists right now right

whereas if we get people who in place who are the negotiators who don't understand that negotiation maybe they're ideologues they don't really have any idea how to how to execute that, that's going to be a problem too. But we should be talking right now about when I say we, the people who are involved in the Alberta independence movement, we should be talking about who are going to be the negotiators.

That's a really important question. They might not even be people from Alberta. There might be people from other countries who would be very skilled on negotiators who have experience in this. Maybe, you know, someone from the United States or, you know, Christine Anderson from Germany. I don't know. I'm just brainstorming here. Um, but that's a very important question that I find no one is talking about, you know, because that phase after the referendum result is going to be a very key part of the whole question. Because if that negotiation breaks down,

what are we left with? Where does Alberta independence go from there? I don't think it's going to die on the vine. I think it's come too far. What do you think? Well, I'm no guy who can predict. I've been saying we're going to get a referendum. And then the thing about it being, what is it 20%? Is it 65%? I just chuckle. I go like all the people that are for independence that I know, there is a ton that are nervous of putting another name on a list.

Right? Yeah. Where does that come from? COVID and other things. Yeah. It could come from as simple as every time you sign up on, you put your name on a list, then you're getting another email and nobody wants that.

It can be as simple as that little figure, right? So I don't know where it sits. I just go, the polls thing, I just don't trust polls, right? I'm not a big polling guy. So, you know, you look to October 19th and you go, that should be interesting. Like, I mean, what place do you want to be in Ganda on that day? It's like, that'll be an interesting day. Who leads after who leads negotiation?

That's a good question. It is. It's a very important one. because I can tell you I'm dead certain that I know I know what the Alberta government is going to do with that referendum result. Absolutely nothing. They're going to treat the referendum. The Alberta government is going to treat the refraud. They're going to treat exactly the same way they treated the equalization.

Most people nowadays don't even know we had a, they don't even remember it. Yeah. You know, got wiped away by COVID. In fairness, you know, would be. be an interesting poll that I've never seen done and I'm sure it's out there is like how many of you actually engage in politics once a week and know what's no simple things because if you go back five years I engaged zero percent and I would say that I knew a little bit but like close to zero percent now you know I get sitting around a table with people late and I'm like wait a second you

forgot about this and they forgot about that and I'm like oh my god I know too much about politics I'm like, you know, I know too much. And what did that come from? That came from throwing yourself headlong into trying and understand the system in which we're governed by. And now sitting here watching it play out and you go, who's going to, who's going to negotiate our way out of this if you were to get past it? It's like, mm-hmm.

Not to blow your horn, but I mean, that's a big part of what your show has done. Because almost all the people, I shouldn't say this, but I would say that, the vast majority of people who follow you and listen to your show were just like you. They were not in tune, right? And without your show, listen, if they're, the people who are listening to CBC and CTV and global with a you, they're, they're lost. Like, they're not getting any truth on those networks. It's interesting because you go through the, the process of how we got here.

COVID was a catalyst. Then the freedom convoy happens. Then you come back. They jail Tamara and Chris and the pastures. And the pastors. You sit and you stew on that for a long time. And you're just like, okay. Then you get Jason Kenney out.

And once again, I act like I did it. I didn't. I was just watching it play out, right? But Albertans and some key individuals get it. Take back Alberta. Right. Then you go, how important was it? The group of podcasters and getting Daniel Smith elected, well, I would say more important than not.

They gave her air time and spread their message, right? She gets elected and you go, okay, here we go. And now Daniel Smith has she done lots of great things? Certainly has. And I said on stage, you know, like when they were calling us all traitors for even contemplating an independence referendum, she was the one that said, I will not say that. We're talking about a million people. what are we talking about?

I really appreciated her answer on that stage. But you're looking at it and you're going, while I've watched the conservatives federally, and I'm like, I've done the simple math. I just don't know how it works. I just don't see how. So then you come back to the drawing board

and you go provincially, okay, well here's it going to be the problem. Okay. So what do you get to? You get to an independence vote. Two ways. One, you actually go independent or two, you give yourself such big leverage.

You just reconfigure Confederation, as you've pointed out, so that it is more bad. balanced and you carry a very large stick into that meeting. So I assume, yes, there is a lot of people who have been along for this ride going, what are we doing? And they're trying to figure it out too. Yeah.

And we've all, you know, there's been a ton of, we don't talk about all the Canadians that have left Canada. Mm-hmm. Like there's been a ton of brain drain that is just, I'm done with this. I'm out of here. The number I saw was 40% of the people who can earn a, in the top 1% in the United States are gone. have left.

And, you know, the people who, those people are job creators. They are industry leaders that are creating technologies that create businesses and create jobs and generate wealth. And they're being driven, they're being driven out of this country. I mean, just look at what's happening in our country right now. I mean, with the price of oil. Okay. Canada is has the

Alberta has I believe it's a third or fourth largest reserves in the world third third yeah and yet we pay the highest price for gas of almost on the corner on the way in the cornerstone is a buck seventy right now and I looked up

and I looked up Toronto and it was a buck I think it was a buck 83 yeah I was like how the hell is that how does this how does this make sense we're the only country that has a carbon tax and it's going up folks it's going up it went up April 1st that was the gift the April fools joke played on you by Carning Company uh to their credit I saw Pierre Pallivier you know they're the CPC has a lot of problems uh but they're starting to they're starting to turn to the right they're talking about now uh on a moratorium on all federal taxes on gasoline and diesel um that's a

good idea. You know, I wish he would have said that, you know, last April when he was running for, you know, for a prime minister. But, you know, just talking about Canada for a minute, I've been saying for a long time, and you might disagree, the problem with the CPC that it has is it doesn't have an identity, right? Like if I was, if I was to ask you, you know, in a sentence or two, what Daniel Smith's premiership has been all about the last three and a half years. You could tell me. And you could tell me in a way that distinguishes her from... Any other politician?

Ralph Klein or any of her predecessors. But if I asked you to basically tell me what the CPC is all about, you couldn't. I mean, the best answer might be liberal light. I was going to say the illusion of choice. Yeah. They really don't have a distinctive... character. And when I watched Pierre Polyvere on the Joe Rogan podcast, that's what really came across

to me is that he doesn't really understand how his party is seen by the Canadian populace. And I think what those guys need to do, maybe you disagree, is they need, I mean, I think we need Maple Maga. At least we need something, like you said, a clear choice. Like, for example, it has a number. always been this way, but in the U.S., there's a very clear line between a Democrat and a Republican, especially a MAGA Republican. I think Canadians deserve that kind of a choice, and they don't have it right now,

and I think until the CPC does that. And I've been told all my life that the East wouldn't vote for that. And I'm like, how do we know? They just didn't vote for what Pierre did last time. Then why are so many people from other provinces moving to Alberta and Saskatchewan? Yeah. I was just disappointed in the election run. right so like I gave a little bit of this little tiny piece of hope folks like when we did the election live coverage

my prediction was a liberal minority and I was mad at myself for writing it but I'm like if I'm going to if I'm going to be honest with myself everything I've read to this point everything I've followed all the guess it's a liberal minority that sucks because that shouldn't be what it is this country I believe wants something different from what happened a liberal minority but I look at Pierre's strategy, right? In the last three months when Carney got elected, got nominated. And I just went, what are they telling him? This is a terrible strategy. Yeah.

I'm not saying you need to come on the Sean Newman podcast, but when Joe Rogan offers you to come on, you don't take it. That's a stupid idea. And now they're hiding behind this, what's the reason they didn't go? Unwritten rules, right? You don't go out of country during an election. What the hell are you talking about? Our country's being destroyed.

You literally go on everybody you can so that you can get your message out to people. If they want to slander you, they're already slandering you. CBC already doesn't like you. Global already doesn't like you. And yes, he has done some Canadian podcast folks. I'm not against Pierre.

Honestly, I'd hope to have them on here. Why not? Absolutely. I also said I'd also hope to have, I don't also have Justin Trudeau on here or Kearney. I mean, that'd be an interesting conversation. But like when you look at the strategy, it's like I watched the debate where Singh just literally ran his mouth the entire time. He just needed to put him in its place.

I'm not saying physically, he's turning to him and go, what are you talking about? You're the reason we're in this predicament because you held up this government for four years. We could talk about the NDP. They're new leader. We could. But you go back to it and you go, if you're not in Alberta right now, your hope is the conservative. Because, you know, everyone's talking, sorry Saskatchewan right now, you do not have a successful movement just yet, just yet. Everybody relax just yet on independence.

Right. Yeah. And I would argue if Alberta goes, you're following suit almost immediately. You think it'll happen that? I think it'll happen very quickly. in my opinion. So you're sitting in Manitoba, you're sitting in Ontario,

you're sitting out east, you're sitting in BC, and you're looking around and you're going, how do we get out of this? We need Pierre. Albertans, after he lost, no longer need a Pierre. It's like,

if we were holding on to that for a very minor, we're charting our own path, that is what is happening here in Alberta right now. Yep, yep. When you go, it isn't dead on the vine if they lose,

I would agree. I just think it becomes a hard, wrote it. You know, you're talking about another four years before you can put it forth and will there

be things happen in between there and here? Absolutely. But in Alberta, there is a very clear sense of like, listen, we didn't like Kenny,

we got them out. Yeah. We put Daniel Smith in. Danielle, to her credit, has done a lot of great things. But there's no fixing the relationship

that is happening right now. And we need to fix that. And so lots of Albertans are like, well, what are we going to do? Let's put a referendum forward. And let's try

and get out of the, this thing. Yeah. If you're sitting in all these different provinces laden, your hope is Pierre goes on Joe Rogan and diary of a CEO and cleans up his image and becomes the next leader and then turns around and gets rid of the carbon tax and gets rid of what to do to do. But it's a short period of time before he's out again and it's the liberals all over again. Is it not? That has been the history of Canada. The liberals have been in power almost 80% of the time in Canadian history. We've had basically liberal dominance and short periods of conservative interruption. And, you know, the last example was Harper spent nine years cleaning up the mess that he inherited.

And then liberals came in and within a very short time. Great, a giant mess. That's it. But the thing that's different about Alberta that you're talking about, and I'm going to draw a comparison here, maybe people won't like, some people won't. but Canada has become a place where politics are done top down, where we look to, we treat political people like rulers. And coming back to something you said earlier,

they are, underrepresented democracy, they're supposed to be servant leaders. Okay. And of course, the best example of a servant leader, is what's in the Gospels. That's Jesus Christ. That's the example we're following. Servant leader. Jesus said, in order to be first, you must be last, right? And so that's the role of a politician is to be a servant leader. But in Canada, politics doesn't work that way. What Alberta is doing is different. It's the same thing that's happening in the United States with

MAGA. Maga is not a top-down movement. It's not Donald Trump. It's a grassroots movement. Donald Trump is the man of the moment who's standing on the surfboard, but the wave is Maga. And Maga is a grassroots movement. That's why it's so much under attack in the United States. Same thing with Alberta. The independence movement is not a top-down movement. And that might explain why it doesn't have leaders. I complain about that, but that might be a good thing.

That might be a symptom of what I'm saying. Because it's a grassroots movement, it doesn't have somebody yet. at the front of the parade twirling the baton, that person will come, right? Or that group of people. It might be Danielle Smith. Who knows? I would not underestimate her.

But that's what's different about the independence movement, is it's not top down. It's grassroots. And what, that is something that could change throughout the country. But conservatism historically and foundationally has been grassroots party. That's what conservatism is. It's about conservation of the home and hearth. That's essentially what conservatism has been. And that's what causes the conflict with liberalism,

which liberalism tends to be more involved with, you know, big business and grafting power, things like that. But I think what we need to retain in Alberta and propagate, if we we can spread it throughout the rest of the country is this grassroots led movement. But the real challenge is is getting people involved, getting people out their doors. And this is what, you know, what the David Parker's and Mid-Sylvesters and of the world are so good at. They're very, very skilled at activating people, getting people excited, getting them out their door, just sign a petition. You know, in fact, I met your brother today.

and he was collecting signatures, right? Good people like that, that's what it needs. And if we can spread that, you know, throughout the rest of the country, well, maybe Canada isn't lost, you know. But maybe Alberta could be the catalyst. I know my friend, our mutual friend, Bruce Party. That's what he's hoping, you know, because he's from Ontario. He's a Queens law professor.

Well, you should, this is what I keep thinking. You're sitting in any province other than Alberta. You should be rooting it on. Because it's not about leaving Canada behind. When we look at the problems we have, it's like how else are we going to solve them? Yeah. And it's not necessarily leaving Canada behind. It's we want to retain the best things about Canada.

But we also need to, we need to renovate our house. There's some broken down things in our house. We have a prime minister who set a record this past year. we're taking 17 foreign trips. He even travels more than Justin Trudeau. He only attended crushing period 97 times in the year that he's been, Prime Minister. Some of the trips he made, he's been to Rome and London and Paris multiple times. Why?

On one trip, he spent over $200,000 on meals on that plane. I mean, come on. surely we can do better than this. You know, 24 Sussex Drive, which is the, you know, the historical home and the prime minister, sort of like a metaphor for the whole country. Our prime minister hasn't lived there for years. Justin Trudeau turned up his nose at it. Apparently it's going to take so much money to renovate it that Mark Carney, even Mark Carney

is saying, you know, don't bother, don't do it. At 24 Sussex Drive, it's like a metaphor for the whole country. No, we got to fix the house. You know, we got to fix it. You know, whether it's Alberta, you know, getting out of it, right, and building our own house. Or if we're going to fix the whole house, we got to get, we got to roll up our sleeves and get to work. Because Canada right now is a dilapidated shack of, it's a shell of what it was. Or it was.

Yeah. And there might be a better future for Canada down the road. I don't know. but I know that it's not going to change unless that change comes from the grassroots. And that's where I think faith comes into it in Christianity. Because, and I wrote a piece about this for my show, it's called the godless country. And the reality is that it has never occurred. You cannot have a nation of people unless they are bound together by a set of shared values.

Now, and I'm not saying that everybody in Alberta or anybody, everybody in Canada has to be a Christian. It's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that that set of shared values historically is the only way to create and keep a country that is going to promote human flourishing that's going to respect individual human rights, that's going to respect the family, that's going to allow people to be self-governing and to map out their own lives. and where they can actually live out their dreams. And there's no other set of shared values other than Christianity, historically, that I've ever done that in the way that Christianity has.

And that's been true of, you know, lots of countries in Europe, throughout Christendom, what we used to call Christendom. But we've lost that unifying idea. And it's something that we have to get back. And my friend Brian Peckford talks about this a lot. he talks about how important the supremacy of God is. Because without it, you don't have a functional rule of law. In Canada or in Alberta, we have a choice.

We can have the supremacy of man or mankind, or we can have the supremacy of God. I can show you the ledger, the death toll under the supremacy of mankind, and I can show you what it looks like under the supremacy of God. And I can tell you, your choice will be very simple in terms of where you want to live, even if you're an atheist, you would not want to live. Under the supremacy of man. That's right.

Because under the supremacy of man, our rulers act like gods. And isn't that when we're talking about Justin Trudeau, we're talking about Mark Carney, right? Comparing them to, not to idealize him, but I never got that impression of Mr. Harper, right? You know, but this is what we have in our country right now. We're living under the supremacy of man. And under the supremacy of man, what we get is we get laws that don't make sense in terms of that they don't align with our values. Let's talk about freedom of speech.

We get laws restricting freedom of speech, even though freedom of speech is almost a universally shared value. Under the supremacy of man, what we get laws instead are laws that enforce ideas that actually offend our values, right? That's what you get on the supremacy of man. Under the supremacy of God, you get laws that protect your God-given rights and freedoms and that promote human flourishing because that's consistent and aligned with our shared values, right?

Same thing with freedom of religion, freedom of association. The supremacy of man will want to destroy all of those freedoms because they're not useful. They're not useful to the dictator. They're very hindrance. They're an impediment to the dictator. And so, you know, running underneath all of this, we can talk about making Alberta the richest province in the world and having a great economy and all that.

But if we don't have shared values, the kind I'm talking about, we're not going to create a good country. And if we're not going to create a good country in Alberta, we shouldn't do it. We might be creating a Frankenstein monster. If we don't have a good country, if we don't found a good country based upon shared values, we might be worse off. The richest country in the history of the world was the Roman Empire.

Coincidentally, they're also the most murderous and evil. And it took Jesus Christ to come and civilize Rome. And Christianity used the roads and the infrastructure that the Romans built to spread Christianity to the world. And that's what civilized the world. appreciate you coming in. It's always a pleasure to, you know, we talk, but we don't talk, you know, all the time. And always curious, you know, as a man who looks pretty hard into the conversation of the world, right, and see where we're going in this area. It's always interesting to run back into you and see your growth and where you're at and what you're staring at.

I do this usually once a year with Drew Weatherhead where he comes back and I'm like, you know, I don't know if he's an interesting guy. I don't know if you've been falling wrong. He's a deep thinker. Boy, you're taking a bit of a page out of his book, aren't you? Well, I called him when I was, or texting him when I was going through it. But he's in Japan right now. Oh, is he?

He bought a house there. Wow. And like his Instagram, if you're not following that, folks, is kind of funny, right? Because, you know, he bought an abandoned house. and there's a lot of problems that come with that abandoned house and the only way to approach that was with a smile on

because, you know, the one video is he's got a leak. You know, we think of a leak as like a drip. No, it's like a full on. Like you turn the water on and it's just shooting out and you're like,

that's a leak, you know? And so regardless, my point with Drew was when Drew was putting out as many podcasts he was and writing his books and he still is. But I mean, now he's in Japan. It's like,

every time it comes back, you're just like, glad we got to know each other, you know? Like, and I certainly think that with you. I'm glad we get to do it here in the studio and across from one another. And I look forward to a year's time from now when I can maybe blow your, blow your mind on some things I've seen maybe going around the world. Well, what you should do is consider when you're, right before you end your tour and come back to Lloyd Minster, stop in Cold Lake. You make that maybe you're the last stop on your world tour. I'll host you.

and we'll have a conversation in a debrief. Maybe we could do it on the beach. Depending on the time of the year. Try to pencil that in. I would love to have a conversation in a year's time. Well, thanks for having me. It's a real pleasure. And that doesn't mean we can't talk the rest of the year by any stretch of the imagination.

It just means it won't be in person because obviously I will be elsewhere. So appreciate you coming along. You know, most people probably remember this, but you were one of the speakers at the one million March for Children, right? And certainly you've been around not only the Cornerstone events, but just events I've done and have been in the studio. And I don't know, we've built a bit of a friendship, I would say. So I appreciate you making the trip here.

I hope God blesses your journey and your family. Well, thanks again. I appreciate it.