Shaun Newman Podcast - #1056 - Benita Pedersen & Allison Pejovic

Episode Date: May 18, 2026

Benita Pedersen is a Westlock, Alberta-based professional entertainer, DJ, karaoke hostess, children's entertainer, event coordinator, and workshop facilitator who operates All Fired Up DJ Services. In June 2023, she created and distributed flyers urging residents to contact town officials and oppose plans for a rainbow/Progress Pride crosswalk in Westlock, citing concerns over its association with specific ideological symbols. This led to a human rights complaint against her under the Alberta Human Rights Act for allegedly inciting hatred, with a tribunal hearing scheduled for September 2026.Allison Pejovic is a senior constitutional lawyer with the Justice Center for Constitutional Freedoms. She specializes in Charter rights litigation, frequently challenging government actions on issues such as COVID-19 restrictions, vaccine mandates, assisted suicide in faith-based settings, and freedom of expression cases. Pejovic has represented clients in high-profile matters including Manitoba church challenges to public health orders, Federal Court cases on travel restrictions, and interventions before higher courtsWatch the Cornerstone Forum 26’https://shaunnewmanpodcast.substack.com/Silver Gold Bull Links:Website: https://silvergoldbull.ca/Email: [e-mail] Grahame: [phone]Bow Valley Credit UnionBitcoin: www.bowvalleycu.com/en/personal/investing-wealth/bitcoin-gatewayEmail: [e-mail] Expat MoneyExpatmoney.com/SNPGet your voice heard: Text Shaun 587-217-8500

This is Brett Weinstein. This is Tom Longo. This is Bruce Party. This is Alex Krenner. Hey, this is Brad Wall. This is Dr. Pierre Corey. Hi, this is Frank Paredi. This is Daniel Smith.

This is James Lindsay. This is Vance Crow and you're listening to the Sean Newman podcast. Welcome to the podcast, folks. Happy Monday. How's everybody doing today? Man, what a wild May long weekend here. And you know, if I go back to my high school days, that meant a whole lot different. You know, you'd be showing up on Tuesday to school.

talking about all the things he'd done on the weekend, which did include snow, I might add. Every May long that I recall from high school always had the white stuff on Saturday or Sunday morning. It was kind of a right of passage and the old polar plunge before it was ever cool to do so up at the lakes. There'd always be ice on the lake and you'd stick your feet in that or maybe you get thrown in there and that was a shock to the system. Good way to wake up, I might add. But, no, this past weekend, we got a ton of snow, and I was getting teased by a few different listeners about talking about deck season.

Yeah, it's deck season. I don't care. Bring on the white stuff. It's just going to melt, folks. We're brighter day. The sun's shining, okay? The sun is shining. All this snow is going to go away.

But no, this weekend, we celebrated my parents' 50th wedding anniversary. And, you know, I thought here as I sat this morning, I might share just a couple thoughts on it. and I feel like maybe the sponsors will forgive me for one day that we don't talk about the silver wagon or other things and for sure I will find a way to make it up to you but this past weekend you know 50 years of marriage and you know when when every every day here on the show

we stare into the chaos that society is creating today is no different and you know this past weekend I just find comfort in what a strong family, a strong marriage can offer. And when I talk to all these people, you know, all the people trying to understand make sense of the world,

one of the things that is stuck in my brain is that when the Giants fight, and believe me, they are fighting right now. We the people should make sure not to get stepped on. And lots of people go, and I did too. What does that mean? What means the best, well, the first and foremost, the best way to do that.

is to take care of your own family. And this past weekend, celebrating my parents' 50th anniversary, their golden anniversary, very few people make it this far. I don't mean that as a jab at anyone. It's just that 50 years together is a genuine accomplishment in any era. You know, when I was looking for statistics, Canada, percentages on divorce, I had to go a little ways back.

And back in 2004, they said 38% of all marriages that took place in 2004 will have ended in divorce by 2035. And four in ten marriages still end that way. Those numbers are real. And the average age of marriage rose from a low of 25, you know, most people get married to 25 years old in 1968 to 35 in 2019. So, you know, now on average, people would have to be still married at 85, 15 years later than my parents. The probability of ever marrying drop from 95% from between the 40s and 70s, or 40s to 70s, to 59% by 2019. So the probability of getting married is dropping.

The age at which people are getting married is increasing, right? They're later and later. And so, you know, a golden anniversary is something that, it's funny. It's just, to me, it seems important. It's kind of a reminder, you know, of maybe a way out of the darkness we're living through today starts with remembering what actually matters family take care of yours build it strong so we can find a way out of this mess together you know uh we got a cousin cousin bob he's traveled the world he's a lifelong

bachelor who's been everywhere and his stories are just something to sit sit and listen to and he sent this note to my parents. Congratulations on a wonderful achievement. Being a lifelong bachelor, I have no expertise, advice, no real understanding of how you reach this lofty peak. But I do know this. I sometimes found myself looking back at some place or person or setting that I just left with the realization that the fleeting reality had been a delight.

A safe haven, a calming point of joy in a vast sea of madness. In short, an oasis. I suspect that a fine marriage is just that, remarkable oasis abiding in time. So congratulations on finding that oasis. May you long to partake of its joys, drink deep from this well and journey on. Another way that it's been said to me often is from Ken in the book club, and he always points to a country song. You see, I come from a long line of love. When the times get hard, we don't give up. Forever's in my heart and in my blood. You see, I come from a long line of love. And mom and dad,

Specifically to you, I remember as a kid, I think all of us siblings do, celebrating our grandparents' 50th anniversary in that same hall. In this past weekend, you gave my kids a memory that I hope one day I'll help give them to their own kids. So congratulations. It's no small feat. Thank you for showing us what a long line of love actually looks like. And to all of you out there, listening wherever you're at,

thanks for being along for the ride I know there are days when you're just like what is going on and I reminded or I guess my parents reminded me this weekend take care of your families

you know I'll I'll end it on this maybe Frodo said to Gandalf I wish the ring had never come to me I wish none of this had happened and Gandalf replies so do all who live to see such times but that is not for them to

decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There's a lot of bright days ahead and we need all of us to pull in the same direction. And with the past events of, you know, the Alberta independence movement, democracy, not having to say, there's chuckle because I know what this group, I know what Albertans, Canadians, humanity is capable of. And just have to remember that. And if we remember that, brighter days are ahead of us. And I believe that.

So take care of your families. Let's get on to that tale of the tape. Our first guest is an Alberta-based professional entertainer who operates all-fired-up DJ services. Our second, a senior constitutional lawyer with the Justice Center for Constitutional Freedoms. I'm talking about Benita Peterson. and Allison Paiovich. So buckle up, here we go.

Well, welcome to the Sean Newman podcast today. I'm joined by Benita Peterson and Alison Paiovic. Ladies, thanks for hopping on. Thanks for having us. Now, neither one of you have been on the podcast before. So why don't we just start with, you know, like I assume the audience knows a bit about both you, for that matter. I've ran into both you before. But Benita, how about you?

We start with yourself for the audience, just a little bit about yourself. I've called this community my home for over 20 years. I love this community. I started a DJ service back in 1997, and so I've served the community of Westlock as a DJ for many years, also as a karaoke hostess and a children's entertainer. Plus, I serve other communities as well. I love kids. I love being a part of events.

I'm also an event planner now, and I've donated a lot of my services to the communities for either discounted rates or even just for free with community dances and children's activities in the park, that sort of thing. So I just have a strong love for kids, a strong love for community. And essentially, when I get the sense that something's wrong, I want to do something about it. And so that's happened more than once in my life where I got the sense something's really wrong. And the good news is because I have a background as a DJ, and a karaoke hostess and a workshop facilitator,

I'm not afraid to speak up or speak out and let my views be known. Even in difficult times when there's people with opposing views, I've learned how to be diplomatic and fair, yet assertive to get my point across. And Alison? Yeah, so I am a lawyer with Charter Advocates Canada, and it's an organization of lawyers who take legal action against government action across the country where we feel that the government is infringing Canadians' charter rights and freedoms. We are funded by the Justice Center for Constitutional Freedoms.

Before I was with this organization, I was a Crown Council at the Manitoba government working in their constitutional law branch, so I've been on the other side. I really enjoyed my time there, and I really enjoyed my time there, and I left there right when COVID started because I just knew that there would be action against government for some of the COVID lockdowns, and I would have to be defending. I'd have to defend the lockdowns and the mandates and everything, so I wanted to jump to the other side and try to stand up against those lockdowns. So, you know, I've had a varied career. Before that, I was in private practice and also did a master's degree in law in Toronto. So I've been all over the country. As I said, started out in Manitoba and went to Toronto.

I went to Los Angeles, and Ottawa, and now I'm in Calgary. And I'm really enjoying the work that I do. It's not an easy job in the sense of we're pushing very, you know, we're doing lots of controversial cases. But the work is very important and very meaningful to me. Yeah. And Allison, I was saying, as soon as you popped up on screen, I'm like, Hey, we've sat with each other before.

You were pointed out the Wii Unify conference last year. I got to host a panel discussion with your husband. And forgive me, who was the third? It was another lady. Lisa, Lisa, Bildy. Yes, that's right. Yeah, that was a fun discussion. Now, anyways, regardless, it's always interesting when,

when a duo comes on around this, in this case, this specific story. but anytime they come on, I'm like, I feel like I recognize that name and then your face pops up. So very, very, well, awesome to have you both on. Now, thank you. Let's talk about what has gone on here in Alberta in Westlock, walk us through the story, Benita. And then after, you know, we've discussed, you know, the series of events, maybe we can get to what's brought Allison on board and the JCCF. in early June of 2023, I learned that the town council here in the town of Westlock had decided to paint a rainbow crosswalk with the progressive pride symbol downtown.

And that really bothered me because the progressive pride symbol has a chevron on it and there are some colors on there. It's white and light pink and baby blue. And those colors promote transgenderism. that's what those three colors mean on that progressive pride flag. And it just really bothered me that this symbol was going to be painted as a crosswalk. Because to me, it's wrong to promote transgenderism to children. Children are precious and they're innocent. And it's important we protect that innocence.

And I know that from past events when I've interacted with kids. There's just there's fun, but there's also boundaries. So what I decided to do that first week of June is I decided to do a flyer distribution campaign. I spent many hours writing the flyer, putting it together, and organizing a distribution campaign with a few friends. And our first day of distributing flyers was on Sunday, June 4th of 2023. So we put flyers on the windshields at churches to let people know that our municipality, had plans to paint this rainbow crosswalk. In the flyer, we promoted that there would be an upcoming council meeting.

And we also said, if you're not happy with this idea of a rainbow crosswalk, make sure you write to the elected representatives and to administration. So flyer distribution started June 4th, and then it carried on. And I believe there was distribution right up until June 11th. Then June 12th was the council meeting. And there were two people at the council meeting speaking in opposition to the rainbow crosswalk and other people there are speaking in favor of the rainbow crosswalk. And because of the flyer distribution campaign that was in hard copy right here in Westlock, but also online, there were a lot of people there in opposition to the rainbow crosswalk. We filled council chambers to capacity plus we filled up the hallway outside of Campbellton.

council chambers, plus we had a crowd in the parking lot that day, June 12th. And I was in the parking lot with my sound system and my generator. I'm a DJ. And I said a few speeches. We did a live broadcast of the council meeting in the parking lot to everybody there. And we were all there in opposition. And council knew why this big crowd was there. Now, something to take note of is my flyer distribution campaign was not the only action taken. against the rainbow crosswalk. There was a lot of pushback action. And one of the things I noticed shortly after the flyer distribution campaign had started is someone had initiated a petition online at change.org. And it just took a few days. And that petition had 500 signatures and then it disappeared.

And I don't know who initiated the petition. I don't know where the data went of those 500 signatures. but the fact that that petition was launched and it gained so much support so quickly, I found that encouraging. But at the same time, I was very disappointed when I found that the petition had disappeared. And so I launched a petition in June as well. And I had my petition pages at that rally outside of town council chambers on Monday, June 12th. And I got some signatures. I got over 100 signatures.

But the problem was at that time, I didn't know how to write a petition. I've since learned that there are a lot of rules to petitions that you must follow. That petition was written in just a very casual way. There was one statement and then an area where people could sign up. So people signed the petition and later in June I submitted it with 134 signatures to the CAO. But because the petition process wasn't done properly and there weren't enough signatures, that petition was disregarded and they later painted the rainbow crosswalk anyway in June.

Now, another interesting thing to add is when they had first announced the crosswalk and first announced the date that the crosswalk would be painted, they had chosen Father's Day as the date to paint the crosswalk. They had chosen Sunday, June 18th. And as time unfolded, it turns out it was going to be rainy that weekend. So the crosswalk was not painted Father's Day, June 18th. And so another form of pushback action is that I got together with a friend who also opposes rainbow crosswalks and in the rain. We went and stood in front of town office and we had a mini rally. It was just the two of us with just a few onlookers and we broadcast it online and it got over a thousand views within days. So we had this mini rally.

We presented our points and it was very well received online. And so that was another version of pushback. action. So later on, I submitted the petition to the CAO of the town and then shortly thereafter, the crosswalk was painted. And so it was painted on Tuesday, June 27th of 2023. I didn't go to the event. Some people thought that I might come to the event and attempt to disrupt, but that's not my way. And so they had their event and they painted the crosswalk and the mayor wore rainbow colors and he was there with all his enthusiasm and that's what happened. So after that, another group started up.

They're called the Westlock Neutrality Team. And what's very great about this team is that they have people on their team who know how to write a proper legal petition. They know the rules of the Municipal Governance Act in Alberta. So they composed this petition. They had an excellent spokesperson. The spokesperson, Stephanie, went in front of town council in August of 2023, submitted the petition, submitted in a sense the launch of the petition,

informed them, registered the petition, and then launched it. And in a matter of 45 days, Stephanie and the Westlark Neutralty team collected over 700 signatures. They only needed 500, but they collected over 700. And I signed up as one of their canvassers and I helped them collect signatures as well. So one of the busiest days in small town, muslock every year is the fair. And so on fair day, I set up a big display at a quiet area in town and I had petition signing there. That display actually had a big sign that read hashtag reject agenda 2030 because I knew that would get people's attention. They'd either be curious about it or they, you know, they'd want to know what's going on. So they'd stop by. So collected some petition signatures.

Anyway, moving forward, the Westlock Neutrality team collected more than enough signatures. they submitted it to Westlock Town Council before the end of September. Within 30 days, it was ratified. And interestingly enough, the mayor resigned. So I just found that interesting and I found that timing, very interesting. Shortly after the mayor resigned, one of the counselors resigned because he wanted to run for mayor in the by-election. Then on Monday, November 27th of 2023, there was a town council meeting which I attended. And that's when they reviewed the petition and they had a decision to make.

Town Council had to decide are we going to now make this bylaw on neutrality, do first reading on a bylaw on neutrality, or put the matter to plebiscite. And each and every one of those counselors was completely opposed to the concept of a bylaw on neutrality. In other words, every single one of those counselors wanted to keep that rainbow cross. walk. So they instead put the matter to plebiscite. So the, just another side note, there was a by-election that December, January, so December of 23 and January 24. And I chose to run for the position of counselor. The individual who initiated the complaint against me in June of 2023 and complained about me to the Alberta Human Rights Commission was also running for counsel.

So she had issued the complaint back in June, 2023 and then chose to run for counsel in December, 2023. So there were five people altogether running for the seat of one counselor's seat, a gentleman one, and then I came in second and Lori Hodge came in third. And then there were the other two contenders. And so voting day was January 10th of 2024. So just a side note on that. But the rainbow crosswalk was a hot topic during that.

campaign, not just for the counselor by-election, but also the mayor by-election, because the, there was a gentleman running for mayor who was a strong supporter of the bylaw on neutrality. He doesn't want rainbow crosswalks in the community. He didn't end up winning the seat as mayor. The former counselor ended up winning the seat as mayor, and he is a supporter of crosswalks. So fast forward then to February 22nd of 2024, it was a Thursday. And that was the day of the Plebah site. And that's a very, very special day for Westlock.

That's when people came out and they voted. And they voted yes. The majority of those voters voted yes for a bylaw on neutrality. So in other words, they don't want the progressive pride symbol painted on the street. They don't want transgenderism promoted to children. And so it was a big win, February 22nd of 2024, a huge win for us because the entire town council was against the people. The entire town council wanted to keep that rainbow crosswalk. And it was the people who organized and took political action and made it happen so that

later in 2024, the rainbow crosswalk was removed. Okay. There was a lot there. Um, just a really simple, stupid question to begin with. And it's probably always been called this. Is it always been called the progressive pride flag. I feel like that's such a simple, stupid question, but I'm like, I don't know if I've ever heard it's called the progressive pride flag. I know that has nothing to do with the story, but you mentioned it like four times. I'm like, a progressive pride flag. Like, have I been just living under a rock? It's possible. Well, the pride flag, the original pride flag that came out has just six colors. It's just six stripes. Yes. And that was associated with the pride movement where lesbian and gays,

and bisexuals were looking for equal rights. They wanted to have the right to marry, etc. The progressive pride flag is when they changed that flag and they added the Chevron. And so the Chevron, the white, the blue and the pink colors on the Chevron represent transgenderism. The black and brown have different meetings. The circle has a different meaning. But for some reason, the LGBT movement got connected to the transgender movement. And it's actually as confusing to me as it is to you because to me, the transgender movement

doesn't belong with the LGBT movement. Because when I speak with people who identify as LGBT, lesbian, gay, or bisexual, these folks share with me that essentially they were born that way. They were born with the attractions they had. And they knew from a young age, that was their attraction. That was what they were drawn to. But when you think of transgender, transgender is essentially saying, I was born in the wrong body. That's what transgender is saying.

And to me, it's incongruent. So I personally don't think that it belongs together, but those are my personal beliefs. But my core concern is I don't want transgenderism promoted to children. And Rainbow Crosswalks are one of the ways transgenderism. is promoted to children. And when I think of children and the things they go through, I have nieces and nephews and great nieces and great nephews and I'm a children's entertainer. I've been doing this since 1997. I have a really good sense of kids and how they feel and their energy. And I've noticed especially since 2019, 2020, there's been a change in the energy. The kids,

especially in 2020, 2021, the kids, especially in 2020, 2021, the kids. The kids, the kids were different. It was like they were more scared. And I'm this children's entertainer. So I can just go in and make friends with a child anywhere. It's just my thing. But something changed and kids became more closed. And anyway, so I just, my whole thing is read the crowd, right?

Read the room. What's going on here. And so. I won't put it. I won't make you put words. I mean, what changed? We locked everybody up. We put masks on everybody.

on and on it went. Kids were at the short end of the stick on that. They missed out on years of their life. When it comes to the pride or the progressive pride flag symbol, it's funny because like if you are being taken the Alberta Human Rights Tribunal right now, I wonder if it's even, and maybe a lawyer can chime in on this, Allison, like I wonder if it's even relevant anymore because every time, you know, you start to stare at this, like, well, we're, you know, you got to remember that it was in Manitoba where they started talking about MMIW before you even get to all the other acronyms, right? Murdered, missing indigenous women or murdered and missing indigenous women.

And you go, like, the problem with it is you can't even keep up to it. That's why when I heard progressive pride symbol, I'm like, what is that even at this point in the game? Because I can't keep up to the amount of things that are going on. That's a side note. and for me to chime in on. When you go back to this flyer, like I could be wrong,

but when I read it, I wrote down a couple things. One was like, message counselors, attend the meetings, here's the contacts for your city representatives. Maybe I miss something. It's possible.

Was there anything else on there that has really caused the attack or to, the the human rights complaint against you that I don't understand. Yeah, so side one of the flyer, most people have already seen it. It says cancel the rainbow crosswalk and those other items you mentioned. Side two of the flyer, I got in more about why I'm so concerned about the topic of transgenderism being promoted to children. And one of the reasons I'm concerned about this topic being presented to, children is because some people who choose the transgender pathway can end up infertile.

And to me, that's really scary. Children are very impressionable and they're drawn to bright, beautiful colors. And it's very easy. It's easy for me to guide a child and say, hey, come on, let's dance over here, you know, pretend it's a party. So children are drawn to things that are fun. They're drawn to things that are colorful. And we need to have the best of intentions when we're guiding children in any manner.

And for there to be a progressive pride symbol painted as a crosswalk and for children to be walking across it to go to the post office with their parents or whatever they're doing, it's to me, that's part of introducing them to the concept of transgenderism, promoting the concept of transgenderism. and that's what bothers me. So in the flyer, I wrote about how some people who pursue the path of transgenderism can be rendered and fertile. And that's one of the phrases they're using to say that I'm guilty of incitement of hatred. But that's not hatred at all. That's not contempt. It's truth.

Alison, oh lawyer, walk me through this because I'm like, I don't know, I feel like I can speak for most of the audience. I've had things put on my windshield. I've had things come in my mailbox. I've had, I've had, I've had, I've had. What is it about this one? I mean, certainly the topic, okay, fair enough. I, I think on this show, we've seen how when you go directly against, um, this particular subject, you can face very serious backlash. But when you're talking about a flyer, a piece of paper, what is it about this that gets it caught up in legal framework where they can all of a sudden pull you into the Alberta Human Rights Tribunal?

And I don't know, like to me, when I read the story, I'm like, this is, this is bizarre. But maybe you can help clear up some of this. Yeah, so there's a section in the Alberta Human Rights Act, section three. I'll just read some of it for you here. It says, quote of conduct, discrimination regarding publications, no person shall publish any statement which indicates discrimination or an intention to discriminate against a person or class of persons or is likely to expose a person or class of persons to hatred or contempt

because of, and then they list religious belief, color, gender, gender identity, physical disability. And of course, here we're talking about gender identity and gender expression. And so they're saying that she's fallen within this section three because she's published this flyer in person and online. And they're saying that the content rises to the level of creating content. for transgender individuals because they're protected under the gender identity and gender expression part of that section. And I know that the director took a look at this and had the power to dismiss the complaint, but decided to send it forward to a hearing at the tribunal level.

And it's my sense and understanding that some of the language in the flyer that was most concerning to the, the director had to do with Benita's phrasing that if you transition, especially in respective kids, there can be genital mutilation and infertility and shortened lifespan. Those are some of the phrases I think that caught their attention, but I mean, we'll see how they argue it, but that's my understanding. And, you know, when I look at that, I understand that the phrase genital mutilation is not a nice thing to say. It's not, it's not people don't want to hear terms like that. But when you hear from people that have gone through the transition process and we have witnesses who are willing.

to testify that they've been through the process. Some of them have detransitioned. What happens to a person physically really does fit the description because you're getting surgery in your genital area and, you know, we're not going to go into all that. But there are, there can be severe complications. The reason you won't go into it, sorry to interrupt, once again, as I go, because it's pretty awful. And, I mean, we're talking about kids transitioning.

and what does that actually mean? Yeah, and, you know, we have expert opinion coming that's going to verify that, unfortunately, and it's very sad, the rate of suicide of individuals who transition is higher amongst people who have transitioned than amongst the general population. And a lot of these individuals are being told, that they, it's a strong possibility that they could become infertile if they go through the process. And of course, I think, I think the concern for Benita and speaking with her and what she's trying to convey to parents is, you know, if your child is, you know, introduced to this, they may not understand at a young age.

I mean, kids can't vote. You know, they can't drink alcohol. Are they going to be able to really make that decision that, that they don't want to have kids or there is a strong possibility that they might not be able to have kids if they start going through this process when they're underage.

So those are some of the concerns. And again, it's understandable that there are some people in society who can have hurt feelings by the discussion. It's a very sensitive topic. Some people that really feel really strongly about it, but in terms of rising to the level of contempt and hatred for transgender individuals,

we don't see how it gets there. Because when you look at some of the case law where people have been found to have been hateful or how the Supreme Court of Canada describes hatred, you know, the language is often wishing harm on certain groups, which Benita certainly has not done. Saying things that will get people to look at that flyer and really hate this group, really, really hate them.

And what Benita's flyer has done in our perspective and, you know, we're going to make the submission is that she's trying to educate the public. She's trying to get people to take action against the crosswalk, but that's one side of the flyer, but the other side is really trying to educate the public on some of the risks to kids and, you know, parents could pick that flyer up and maybe learn something. So it's an attempt to educate. She also pointed out that there was an upcoming drag queen show that was, I believe, marketed to kids. You know, she can correct me.

But, and I think that the concern there is, you know, drag queen shows are colorful. And as she's talking about, she knows kids are drawn to colors. And this is not appropriate for children. And then the time and place for the drag queen show is for adults. So, you know, it's, it's, the flyer does not call out the transgender community as a whole as being bad or as being, you know, worthy of violence against them or anything like that. She's, she's drawing attention to specific problems in respect of kids and risks for children. And the commission is coming after her pretty hard and saying that this, you know, she's guilty of discrimination. And, you know, we're saying just wait a minute, this is an issue that she should be able to talk about freely, understanding it's controversial, understanding some people aren't going to be happy about it.

But rising to the level of, you know, being accused of discrimination, being hauled before a tribunal, we just don't get there. We shouldn't be there in this province, in this country. We should be able to talk about issues of concern without somebody pointing the finger and saying, you're causing hatred. and you have to be quiet. Going in front of a tribunal, what, if convicted or found guilty, would you face? So it's discretionary from the tribunal

has the power to order a variety of remedies. My guess is that she would be ordered to write an apology and or face a fine. Now, that probably brings up in your mind the fine faced by Mr. Barry Newfeld in British Columbia of 750,000, which is absolutely obscene. I can't see that happening here with this particular case. That was involving more than one teacher in British Columbia that he was accused of being discriminatory against. and it was a bigger, it was a bigger case. There were more than one statement put out on social media by him.

That was my understanding. Here we're dealing with one flyer. And I just don't see a fine like that here in Alberta. That would be awful. But, you know, there could be a fine, an apology. And so that's what I would see. But, you know, I can tell you that if we're unsuccessful, you know, depending on the way that this decision is worded, we will be appealing this.

This is a very important case. Forgive me because I'm not going to know the exact wording, but I believe you two women will be able to correct me. Daniel Smith, the UCP government, just came out basically saying you have to take out the, is it political symbols out of schools? Forgive me, I can't remember how they worded that, but I assume you both know what I'm talking about. Yes?

Yeah, I just heard about that. Bill 25. So my question then becomes to a lawyer, if the government is literally going no more of this, we're done with this. How can they come after an everyday citizen for doing roughly the same thing just before the government did it? So it's a good question. So it's not the government that's coming after her, understanding that the government has delegated this authority to the tribunal and the commission, but the tribunal and the commission are independent of the government. And so it's not like the government can say to the tribunal, you know, letter off the hook. That's not how it works.

They are independent. So this complaint came in years before, The Premier has decided to do this for classrooms, and we think it's great that that's what she's doing. But this case backdates that, and so it's going to go through based on what's in the Human Rights Act right now, which is that Section 3. We think it shouldn't be there. We think it should be removed because hate speech is already accounted for in the criminal code. If you're standing up there with a microphone and you're spewing horrible hateful things, against people, you're going to be arrested for it. So we think it should be removed. But regardless,

we think it's great that she's, you know, taking those steps. But it doesn't, it's not going to solve Benina's problem right now because she still falls under, according to the director, Section 3, and this tribunal has to do his job and see it through. I don't, I don't mean to say that, sorry, you know, because the government's changed things, you let her off the hook, more so. And as a lawyer seat, as you know, you're referencing different court cases and what the law says, the literal government has said we're not doing this anymore in schools. I mean, I guess that's not case law, but I'm just like that is the law of the day now. Right. Yeah.

So it's kind of strange to be in a tribunal going, you talked about a crosswalk. We got to be, you know, we can't be doing that. We're going to put you in front of a tribunal. Meanwhile, the UCPs literally come out. We're not doing this in any schools anymore across the province. Yeah, so that will be an argument that we'll make to the tribunal. You know, look what the government is doing. You know, when you look back at what Ms. Peterson has tried to do here,

you know, perhaps there's a indication that we shouldn't be, we shouldn't be prosecuting her in this way. and, you know, she's really not being hateful. The government is trying to remove this stuff too. That's sort of an argument we're going to make, but it doesn't, the tribunal doesn't have to find in her favor because of that is really the point that I was trying to make. Yeah, no, and once again, it's probably more just me, meandering thoughts.

I'm like, this is really odd, right? Because you're seeing what the government is doing. We're talking about, you know, like, when I go back through your story, Benita, It sounds like a lady was running against you for city councilor. And she was trying to find a way to, I don't know, knock you down a peg. I don't know what word to use. Let's just clarify that. She reported me in June of 2023.

So I distributed the flyers in early June of 2023. She reported me in later June of 2023. I received a legal paperwork from the Alberta Human Rights Commission in July of 23. It might have been August. So the paperwork started coming in and I was looking at this paperwork going, this is crazy. This has got to get dismissed. And so I didn't do anything with the paperwork because in my own mind, I'm thinking this, this will be dismissed because, and I even showed it to a couple of people who have some legal knowledge and said, oh yeah, that'll get dismissed. So, but the problem with not being proactive with the paperwork means the paperwork sits, the

Alberta Human Rights Commission Director reviews it and then eventually decided instead of dismissing it to escalate it to the tribunal. So I guess what I'm saying is the by-election wasn't until the following December. So when she reported me- Oh, so this is well before. Yes, she reported me in June and then the following December was the by-election. And during the by-election, I was running against her and I was well aware that she was the complainant with regards to the Alberta Human Rights Commission report, but it just, it didn't feel right to go public with that because I had assumed that the Alberta Human Rights Commission would just dismiss this,

because to me it was, it was ridiculous. Now, now just a side note, just so you can understand a bit about Westlock Town Council, at that November 27th meeting, immediately after they announced the plebiscite scheduled for February 22nd of 2024, they had, a motion to for the town of Westlock to join the coalition of inclusive municipalities and I read about that in this coalition of inclusive municipalities when you when you study it it's an initiative of the United Nations and it there's pictures and videos of municipalities and their progressive pride flags and how you know a municipality needs to declare itself as part of this coalition.

And anyway, it was just, it was very concerning to me. And so when I was running for town council in December of 2023 against Lori Hodge, I included that in my flyer. I had a very detailed flyer. I spoke about the rainbow crosswalk matter. I spoke about this coalition of inclusive municipalities. And I stated in my promotional flyer as I'm promoting myself so people will vote for me. You know, I use that flower as well as an educational.

tool to let people know this is what town council is up to. And if if this is what you don't want, don't vote for the people who are pushing this. You know, vote for someone like me who's aware of it and who will push back against it. So now as it turns out, I was unsuccessful, but I did come in second place in out of five candidates that were running. And I did get more votes than Lori haunch. So later on, it was in October of 2025. So just last October, that's when I learned that this matter had escalated from the level of the Upper Human Rights Commission to the tribunal. And then that was a wake-up call for me because I suddenly realized, oh, I guess this isn't being dismissed. I have to take this seriously. I have to get a lawyer. And I reached out to the

Justice Center of Constitutional freedoms and I applied for a lawyer. And I'm, I'm, I feel very blessed that Allison is my lawyer and the JCCF is supporting this. And so I just recommend everybody check out what the JCCF is doing because I'm not the only terrific case they're working on. There's others and they have many successes. Yeah, I've had many a JCCF lawyer on. And we've got plenty of time for the whole group of you. You know, the more I think about this, the more strange it, comes because like okay you do the timeline everything fair enough but then you've had a plebiscite

so in the town of westlock they voted that there it's neutrality correct so the town that you live in where you handed out said flyers they no longer even support a crosswalk of any sort like this the government of alberta has put neutrality in schools and here in twenty-year in twenty When is the tribunal date? I don't know if I miss that. There's two weeks set in September. So in 2026, there will be a tribunal on discrimination for handing out flyers about a crosswalk. And I might add personal beliefs essentially on what it represents the factors they might argue crude language, even if it's true or not.

They don't care because it's crude and it's not very nice. Yet when you go into transitioning, there's a whole lot of not nice in there. Regardless, that's where we sit in 2026. Am I missing anything? Well, yeah, that is correct. There's another little detail that struck me. There's a section in section three. So I read Section 3 out earlier, which talks about, you know, you can't discriminate by using a publication against people because of their gender expression.

That's Section 3, 1. But subsection 2, so Section 3, sub 2 says, nothing in this section shall be deemed to interfere with the free expression of opinion on any subject. And in my mind, that could have given the director, you know, the authority to say, that's just her opinion, I'm dismissing it. So, and, you know, we're going to be arguing that that section is relevant and definitely in play here. And, you know, let's just say that we get to the tribunal and should the tribunal find in her favor, you know, based on the subsection.

Section 2, that's years of going through this, you know, process and all this stress of having this hanging over her head and, you know, just for them to find it's just her opinion. And so, I mean, who knows? They might find that she discriminated. I don't know. But there is a defense in there that this is her expressing her opinion and that that is what she's doing. She's expressing her opinion that, you know, these physical realities are harmful to kids.

And she doesn't want to see that on display on a crosswalk. That's her opinion. So, you know, we don't see language in her flyer again. That's, you know, screaming obscenities at any group or calling for violence against a group. she's expressing her opinion on issues of importance to her that involve kids and their safety. So, you know, we're going to see how this goes, but I was surprised that this didn't get dismissed early. Me too. One of the things I'd like to highlight is I have individuals supporting me who identify as part of the LGBTQ community.

I have lesbian friends, gay friends. I even have transgender friends who support what I wrote in that flyer. And so the value that we all share me and my lesbian, gay, and transgender friends is we don't want rainbow crosswalks and we do not want transgenderism promoted to children. So for these adult transgender people to come to me and say, Benita, I'm with you. I don't want transgenderism promoted to children. And these transgender individuals chose the pathway of transgenderism after they became adults, after they had thought it through, and they were mature enough to make those decisions.

And they themselves recognize, even though that decision was right for them, that that is not a decision a child should be making or pressured to make or guided to make. And so I feel very encouraged that I have lesbians, transgender people, detransitioners that have expressed support for what I wrote in that flyer. Yeah, forgive me ladies. I just, you know, any other timeline, I swear this is like an absolute non-issue, but you have stumbled on a minefield of, you know, there's a lot of pushback on this particular subject. We've watched it in a lot of different areas and a lot of different places across the country.

And to me, I feel like this is. is an absolute nothing burger. Like just it, I can't believe I'm sitting here talking about this. Yet it's Canada 2026 and there's a lot going on where I, by sitting there. How on earth did we get to this point? And saying that, Allison or Benitez or anything else that we should chat about before I let you out here. I mean, it's, it seems like, you know, we're going to wait until September and see what the tribunal decides. In the meantime, there's so many things, you know, just provincially going on with this particular issue that I'm like, you should just be thrown out. It should be thrown out before it ever gets there.

That's just my thoughts. Allison. Yeah, there's something else that sort of we're dealing with right now. And this will be resolved probably within a month or two. But it really bothers me that the commission, the director of the commission, they're trying very hard. to get our witnesses excluded. And some of our witnesses are some of the people that Benita was talking about.

People who are transgender, who saw her flyer, who support what she said, and or weren't offended by what she said, people who have transitioned and then detransitioned because of medical complications, you know, a parent of a transgender child, reading that as a parent, They want to exclude most of our witnesses because they say they're not relevant.

They really want us to come in there with just Benita and two other people who they can't really exclude, where we've got 10 people lined up to speak in support of Benita and her flyer who have personal experiences with the process, with complications, with children who are transgender, and they want them all gone. And I just, when someone's defending themselves against a serious accusation, I mean, I know this is not criminal level, but still, this is serious. This is newsworthy. This is hard on Benita.

She should be able to come in there and present her defense without having the other side saying, know we want to make sure that you can't bring in your witnesses to talk about these issues. At the same time, they want their witnesses to be able to talk about the same things, meaning their witnesses are in the LGTBQ Plus community, were unhappy when they saw the flyer and they want to be able to talk about how they felt, but they don't want our witnesses to say the opposite, which is they weren't offended. So it's really eye-opening for us. And we're really pushing back on this

because we can't have a procedurally unfair hearing. And I know that that happened to Barry Neufeld in British Columbia. He had witnesses who were detransitioners. So they went through the transition process and they transitioned. I'm not sure why. But the tribunal found after argument from the complainant side

that they were not relevant because they weren't in that community anymore. And so they were excluded. And I mean, this conversation is not black and white. It's very complex. And there are more than one, you know, there's more than two views. There's people within the transgender community

who have widely different views on the same flyer. You know, there are people who have gone through the process and are happy. there's people who have gone through their process and have horrible complications and, you know, we should hear from everybody. We need to hear from everybody and we need to have that discussion. And so I'm really troubled by that attempt to gut her defense. And so, you know, we're pushing back on that. But I really, really hope that this doesn't, we don't get to this hearing and be faced with a situation where we can't lead evidence to properly defend her.

Well, I guess, you know, like, you can both witness my body language on this side. And if you, obviously the audience can't see it all the time. But, you know, like I am almost in a little bit disbelief. And I chuckle at times because I'm just like, this is absurd. But when you say, this isn't criminal, oh, wait, Barry, you know, when you go, oh, it's only an apology or a fine. Everyone thinks, oh, like, 10 bucks. We're talking $750,000. Well, it shouldn't be that high.

Well, I mean, what's not that high compared to $750,000? We're talking $100,000? Like, yeah. I'm not going to speak for Benita, but, you know, I'm, you know, like, 100 grand is, I mean, like, we're not talking small numbers here. And when they're trying to, to remove your defense, yeah, that's pretty serious in my mind. Yeah, it's very serious. And, you know, going beyond Benita's situation and, you know, whatever. remedy the tribunal could order against her. It also serves as a chilling effect for the rest of

the province. People who have concerns about certain issues, this is going to, you know, if she loses, understandably, people will probably be afraid to, to post anything, you know, and people shouldn't be posting legitimate, hateful comments that, you know, call for violence against people, call for people to die or anything like that. Yes, but, Alison, you've already talked about that's already that's right. That's right. It's already all know that. But, you know, she didn't do that and she's still being called before this, this tribunal. And so in our view, this section three has to go.

I mean, that's the separate, that's separate from her proceeding. But I'm just looking at the section. And for topics like this, where there are factually based, legitimate concerns for people's physical well-being that are backed by science, people can speak to themselves and verify we can't have this kind of complaints made against people for raising legitimate issues. Now, again, had she raised those issues and called for violence or, you know, wished people were dead, that kind of thing. Of course, of course, rightly so, this should be escalated, but she didn't do that. She's trying to educate people and she's trying to get

political action. And so, you know, we're going to fight hard on this one. Any final thoughts, Benita, before I let you both out of here. Standing up for healthy boundaries is not hatred. Protecting children is not hatred. And I'm very hopeful that all your viewers and everybody paying attention to this issue does some reading and just realizes the importance of this and that the progressive pride flag promoting transgenderism to children, this is unacceptable. We have to put a stop to it. And we have to be bold enough to speak up and put a stop to it. Right now I'm actually hearing from parents who are concerned about the month of June

coming up because that's Pride Months. And they don't want pride pushed on their kids in schools again this year because it's been happening year after year. And so I've been chatting with some parents about some potential pushback on that because they've had enough. And the new law, Bill 25, it doesn't officially start up until September 1st. So the bottom line is protecting children is not hatred. And I encourage more people to step up to protect kids. no matter what the cost. Alison, Benita, appreciate you hopping on and doing this.

And best of luck. Is there any way people can, I don't know, support or is there places where they should pay attention to what's going on? You can support legal actions like Benitez by donating to the Justice Center for Constitutional Freedoms. It's jccf.ca. That's why I'm able to take her case on is because the public has, generously donated for this case and other cases. And in terms of watching the hearing, I'm not sure if the public is able to view it,

but we're going to determine that, and we will post about it on the JCCF's page. And certainly we'll notify the public if the public is able to log on and watch that hearing. It's going to be at the end of September. Ladies, thanks for doing this. Thank you so much for having us.