Shaun Newman Podcast - #274 - Jason Gregor

Episode Date: June 2, 2022

He hosts the Jason Gregor Show on TSN 1260 & is a lead columnist for oilersnation.com  We breakdown the Edmonton Oilers playoffs thus far, Nurse on the back end, Smith in Net & the New York Rangers. Let me know what you think Text me 587-217-8500 Support here:⁠ https://www.patreon.com/ShaunNewmanPodcast⁠

This is Jordan Tutu. This is Glenn Healy. This is Mark Letestu. Hi, this is Scott Oak. Hi, this is Braden Holby. This is Tim McAuliffe of Sportsnet. Hi, everybody. This is Darren Greger.

Welcome to the Sean Newman podcast. Hey, folks, happy Thursday. I've changed it up this week with the Euler game tonight and getting Jason Greger to hop on. Your Friday episode is happening on Thursday. And so there will be no episode on Friday whenever you pop this up. but we're going to release this as soon as it's done, and that way it can preview a little bit of tonight's oiler game. And, of course, we talk just everything.

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I'm talking about Jason Greger. So buckle up. Here we go. Welcome to the Sean Newman podcast today. I'm joined by Mr. Jason Greger. So, sir, thanks for hopping on. No problem. Well, it's been a while since we've got to talk oilers in this part of the country.

It feels like having meaningful games at this time of year, I mean. And, well, I think we've all been waiting for a Colorado, Eminton to squeak through and get to where they are. And maybe it doesn't squeak through. But what do you thought so far after game one, of course, game two coming up tonight? What's your early thoughts there, sir? Well, the orders didn't play very well. It's kind of symbolic of their game won so far in the postseason. They just, they haven't been very good, specifically the last two.

And I expect them to be better. They've got a little bit of a break. No Darcy Kemper, Pavel Francius is going to start in goal for the avalanche. And, you know, you look at a say percentage 889 and three appearances this year, all time in nine games. It's 891. That's a goal that you got to get to for sure if you're the Eminton orders. But they also have to do a better job, I think, of limiting the chance.

chances for Colorado. Colorado was a high-flying team and Emmington allowed them way too much space and time through the neutral zone with speed to enter the zone. The scoring chances off the rush were double in favor of Colorado. You look at the zone entries were significantly higher for Colorado than Emmington. So, you know, Jay Woodcroft and this team has done a good job of bouncing back. Now, Colorado is a different opponent. So we'll see. If they don't, they're going to go down to 02 and And that's not good when you consider that in the first 98 series of the conference finals, team who goes up 2 and 0 is 91 and 7. So not good odds if you're the orders, if you want to come back.

It's not impossible. But tonight, I think, it's not a must-win game. It's just a very important game. And they got to play better. And really, the order's top six-fours have to play better. They didn't play to their strengths at all. They only had one scoring chance off the rush. That was Evander Cain.

which opened up the scoring. But when McDavid dry-sidal, Nugent Hopkins, Yamamoto, and Hyman have no scoring chances off the rush, that's the order's bread and butter. They can play better, and I expect they will. Yeah, they're going to come ready tonight. Can we talk about game one, though, for a second? What is it, you know, like, I feel like game one, a conference final,

game one against Calgary Flames, or game one of the opening, you know, of the Saline Cup finals against the L.A. Kings, you expect them to come out and be like, here we go. Instead, you're watching and Mike Smith looks, me, and you talk about how much space he gave the Colorado Avalanche, like Colorado Avalanche were all over us. And it's almost like they just, I don't know, going through the motions. Is that on players or is that on coaching? Is that on everyone?

Well, I'm a big believer. Players motivate themselves. Any coach, if he has to sing kumbaya before every game, that gets old very quickly. Every player that's ever played professional hockey will tell you that 98, percent of it preparations on themselves and the order's just you know the the other team you know eminson was just sloppy they were a bit behind in calgary you know what two goals in 51 seconds you know smith wasn't great but the team in front of them wasn't much better and uh last you know against colorado the first few minutes of the game they were they were okay right they got the first goal but

the problem was well and that's been a problem at any juncture in the playoffs is you back this happened twice against LA. It's happened three times, well, technically four, because two of them came in 36 seconds for Calgary. And then again, three times in game one where the orders had a goal and they allowed them to score in nine seconds, 36 seconds, and 99 seconds. And so that's an element that has crept into their game at different times. We saw it in game five even against Calgary. So I think it's just a mental focus. That's really all it is. You know, the orders, there's lots of different lessons you can learn at different times. And I give them credit because they found ways to overcome. They've got a good job of having a short memory. They don't let their previous

bad performances or previous good performances really carry over to the next game that they park it. That's what their head coach has talked about since he came in. And I don't really have an answer. If I had an answer, I've, you know what? I'd get him to pay me in. I'd tell them what it is. But there's, there's really no answer other than the orders just haven't matched the effort and execution of their opposition in game ones. Well, one thing, you know, that's been fun to watch of this Euler team and it hasn't been their years previous has been, if they get down like four goals, I feel like everyone's like, well, I mean, their offense is so dynamic. All they have to do is get the puck in the opposing end and it goes in the net. And the one thing else on this series,

you know, when you look at the Rangers Tampa Bay, which, I mean, there was more goal scoring last night than I think everybody thought there was going to be. But they got Schisturkin and Vasselowski. In the Oilers series, you're going against Fransus now. I mean, or Darcy Kemper. I don't think any oiler fan or any oiler player um you know you can't uh overestimate your talent or anything but you're looking down there and going we can score on these guys and it feels like this team no matter how many goals they give up early have found a way uh to i mean score it will jason i i don't know how better to put it that way like they just if they get a if they get a chance it seems like it goes in the net and what was fun about even last game was they started to get scoring from different

places. I mean, McDavid and Drysettle, how many are they at right now? 29 and 28 and 13 games. They're both on nine game point streaks. Like, they're, unstoppable. And when their other lines start chipping in, Nugent Hopkins, guys like that, like, man, they become a team that can really, you know, find their way out of any hole. Or, I mean, if you don't score on Mike Smith, Mike Smith has a bounce back game tonight, let's say. They're not slowing down the oilers. Like the Oilers have proven through the first, you know, how many games 13 that they can

score when they want to. Well, they can, but the challenges they're facing a team that actually can score just as much. And right now is actually slightly ahead of them. So you can play exchange chances for sure. And maybe with Franus, you'd feel more comfortable than you would against Kemper. But ultimately, I think Eminton's, you know, Calgary's offense wasn't the, didn't have the depth overall as Colorado's, and LA definitely didn't. And Eminton's guys have been great.

I don't think their top players had a very good game, to be honest, in game one. Their top line wasn't very good at all for the most part, so they can be better there. But Eminton, when they were, when they're come from behind, the game has changed a little bit. There's very few teams that just sit back anymore, which I appreciate. I think the mentality that teams used to sit back and protect leads and, you know, let the other team just clobber you in shots in the third period that's really kind of gone by the wayside you don't see that very often anymore teams want to hey if we got up two to one why why are we sitting back now that's just stupid so it's a change in philosophy and so the orders can counterattack as good as any team

in the league right but the problem is they're playing a team that can counterattack just as well as them so emminton has to be smart when they turn over the puck and be very wary of who's on the ice when they do it and then conversely I think tonight they like you can get into a track me and I think Evanton's comfortable with that, but it's risky because you're going against a team that is just as good as you. Like the orders and abs, if you look in the history of the NHL, they are now ninth for Colorado, 11th for the orders, all time in goals per game, minimum of 10 games in the postseason. And all the rest happened in the early 90s between 90s, well, I guess one year in 1970, the Bruins. But then the other, so we're all in the first eight years of the 80s, right?

Like we haven't seen teams produce like this. It's exciting. It's why I've taken the over in almost every order, well, in every order game here recently. And even though it's up to 7.5 tonight, I'd still probably punch it, especially with no Kemper. But Eminton is going to have to be better aware defensively tonight.

They cannot allow Colorado to just run roughshod with speed to the neutral zone because they'll score. Well, let's talk defense then for a second. Darnell Nurse obviously playing with an injury of some sort, right? do you dress like he's he if he when he plays tonight he will be better because it's darned he's going to come with a better mindset and everything else but do you address the seven are they dressing the seven do you i mean or do you stick with your six because he got exposed several times in game one um it's it's it's one game and it's a you know it's coming back but everybody knows he's he's got some nagging but at this point in the n a in hl playoffs lots of guys

are playing with uh different things that are nagging them it just looked like Nurse wasn't himself. And I mean, he's come back from an injury. He isn't himself. But I mean, against this high potent abs offense, when McKinnon's blowing the doors off, guys, what's your thoughts on Nurse and the Oilers defense? Yeah, well, the McKinnon goal, if nurse is 100% healthy, is still happening. You can't close the gap when a guy goes diagonal like that. And Eminton just parts the Red Sea. But nurse is clearly, I think it's a core muscle injury. And so it's not going to heal. I don't know if they would go. because I don't think that solves the problem.

I think what has to happen is Jay Woodcroft has been very confident and belief in his team all year long that they will bounce back. Darnell Nurse got exposed more, A, because he's injured, but B, because they were just allowing speed through the neutral zone far too often. So I think if they believe that they limit that, that'll help the whole team, not just him. But conversely, if they limit that and they're still seeing that, well, then to me, I would switch Kulak and Nurse. Kulak can play with Cici, and then Nurse can play with Barry.

And you know what? The minutes will more so just be different in who your opposition is. And I think Darnell Nurse can defend fine against the non-elite players, right? And actually, he defended incredibly well against elite players in the regular season up until his injury. And that's why that injury is so detrimental to Eminton because I'm not sure how many people recognize that when Dave Manson took over, Darnell Nurse played 51% of his five-on-five time against elite players. Most top defensemen are playing between 36 to 40%. 51 is a ridiculous amount.

Now, some would argue, well, that means the other guys weren't good. No, it's Dave Manson said, you and C, C, C, this is the matchup we're going to give you. They took Nurse off the power play. They limited his minutes, but they made him harder minutes. And he succeeded. He only allowed three goals against in three months against elite talent. Like, it was unreal. But now that he's hurt, he's not the same player.

And so the challenge comes from his organization. And, you know, Nurse is a proud player. He obviously still believes he can do it. But clearly at certain times, his body's just not allowing him to make. plays that he can make in his sleep when he's healthy. And so I would I would strongly consider a Kulak nurse switch. I don't think bringing in Chris Russell really solves the problem that much, because all you're doing then is now there's there's less minutes, but where are you playing nurse, right? It's more so who he's playing against, I think. And so Brett Kulak's been a very good

pickup. He skates incredibly well. And right now, because of the health issues with nurse, I think Kulak's better suited to take those minutes. So that's a change that possibly could happen midgame. Jay Woodcroft not be afraid to switch guys midgame and that might happen as well. Conversely, I think, Sean, I won't be stunned with Leon Drysettled healthier now. They'll see how the first half this game goes. And if the McCaradee's pairing is continually shutting them down like they did in game one, then I might see them split McDavid and Drysettled just to because say, hey, dry saddle we know on his own can still create a lot of magic. Well, then we'll split up our duo and we still feel we'll have a better chance to produce. I'm truckling over here because I can

hear all the Oilers fans going, Darnell Nurse sucks, this and that and everything. And what you just said, I'm like, oh, I don't think Jason Greger thinks they're overpaying Darnell Nurse. Well, I never really get into overpaying because you have to look at the situation. Darnell Nurse's contract went up because of Dougie Hamilton, Caleb Jones, and Zach Wrenzky. Now, go compare nurses' numbers to those ones. Because to me, it's an ignorant and lazy comparison when you, well, look at Kail McCarr. Well, Kail McCarr wasn't a UFA.

He's an RFA. You can't compare the two contracts. You compare nurse to the guys who signed in the same time period as him. The owner is a nurse, I was told we're very close to sign an $8 million contract. That was going to be the extension. And then all of a sudden, the Hamilton one. And most people expected Hamilton to sign around eight, but it jumped up to nine. And then Seth Jones came in at nine, five.

And then Werenzki came in at nine, five. And so that's just the market, right? And so I would understand nurses, Asians like, oh, market changed. Nine five it is? if you compare nurse to those three, it's a very, they all have different strengths. You know,

one might be a little bit better offensively. The other guy's better defensively. But in that group of players, that was the payroll for them. So comparing him to Yosi, who was signed three or four years ago, doesn't make sense. Compared them to an RFA in Macar,

doesn't make any sense. You have to compare them to who those contracts are. And that's just, I don't make the pay scale, but I understand how, and negotiations work. And once the new bar is set, you watch the UFA defensemen coming out now,

are going to be in similar boat. It's always interesting to hear a different person's take because around the water cooler, oiler fans are pretty hard on darn on nurse. We watch them an awful lot, right? And I always find that interesting because I'm like, I don't know who you're getting for, man, it doesn't matter. Sticking with defensemen here for a second.

You know, I talk a lot about Duncan Keith because when I was younger and got to watch and play for the Chicago Blackhawks, me being a defenseman growing up, I had never seen a footwork like Duncan Keith's when he was at his peak. It was unbelievable. And now you see Kail McCar. And this Colorado Avalanche team, before Kail McCar, everything ran through McKinnon.

McKinnon had to be the hardest working guy on the ice it felt like, and he just went and went and went. And now the engine that drives the Colorado Avalanche looks like it's Kail McCar. Like he is, have you ever, well, I guess my question is, have you ever seen a defenseman quite like Kail McCar? He's unique for sure. Bobby Oren Paul Coffey were elite skaters, like elite skaters. Now, coffee, coffee didn't, he didn't do the edgework laterally side to side. Like McCar comes in and he kind of does, you know, the eagle turn that they call it, right? So coffee didn't have that, but coffee straightaway speed man was unbelievable, right? He had the perfect.

stride. He's bent over. He uses all his legs and Bobby Orr. So I think those two would probably be the closest. Roman Yosey right now is a dynamic defenseman in his own right. So he's pretty close. But K.L. Macarra is a very special player. The thing about Macar's, man, you look at that goal he scored. Like what a shot. There's not many D men that shoot the puck like that on a snapshot, right? Like a lot of D men, when you think of guys who are great shooters, you're thinking slap shots historically, but that, the release point of McCar. And you know what? He's, he's a special player. And he's still really young. Like, wait until McCar is 26. And he's, and he has like, all like, because look at, look at Victor Headman, compare Victor Headman to the first five years of his

career to now the last five years of his career. He's, you know, he's dominant. And so McCar's only going to get better, which is scary to think for the opposition. And he's, he's a fun player to watch, man. His skating ability, he's not on the level of a pure defender yet of headman because he's young and there's just little tricks of the trade right and so you know you go back to duncan keith right like duncan keith the thing that not only his footwork the thing about keith was an unbelievable and still is a very good passer you his ability to pass the puck is underrated but kale mccar's overall game is it's it's kind of like the new generation of defensemen and you there's going to be a lot more defenseman who now will tailor their game after kail mccar because it's it's a little bit

different. Kail McCar from the back end is kind of like Steph Curry of a shooter. Like he, now, I don't know if he'll revolutionize it as much as Steph Curry did, but he had a coach who just said, hey, I'm going to allow this guy because he's so good at something. I'm going to change how I coach. And I'm not going to worry about him taking what we consider low percentage shots. And it worked. And Kail McCar, how he attacks and defends. And the thing about McCar that I love the best is when you watch when Colorado creates a turnover, watch McCar. Like he is just, he's a hunter. And he anticipates so well, there's a turnover. And that's when he kills teams. And if you're not aware of McCar on the ice in a turnover, he'll crush you in

transition. And that's, that's one of the most dangerous parts of his game because he can get up the ice so quickly. Well, you bring up two defensemen that I was too young. I never got to watch Bobby or live. I mean, you can watch video of them, certainly. And everybody talks about how well he skated. And I, I've never seen that before. Obviously, he was, he was before me. And Paul coffee, I heard all the stories, but I was still pretty young when Paul Coffey was doing what he was doing. So to see Kail McCar doing what he's doing is unbelievable. And at such a young age, one of the things that always impress me is his confidence level. You know, here's a guy that comes from Brooks Bandits, Jr. A, hops in the NHL and is acting like a stud right from day one. It's impressive. The way he gets

up and down the ice when you talk about a transition reminds me of Scott Niedemeyer. Scott Niedemeyer, was a guy who got in the zone, but was always the first back. And that's something, not every defenseman can do, because they kind of want to stay in the zone a little too long. And then they get caught. And when you get caught, that's where two and ones and or a forward's back and they expose that and everything. And that kind, like he's just, I've never, once again, I've just never seen a defenseman. It's interesting to hear you reference coffee and Bobby Orr, because, I mean, that's pretty elite company. And watching Kail McCar is just, you know, well, I've heard Grexky and them talk about Bobby Orr and you're like, geez, I bet he was fun to watch.

And everybody says if I talk to the older generation, seeing Bobby Orr firsthand in the building because on TV is one thing. Actually seeing him in the building is another thing. And everybody talks about Bobby Orr. And to me, Kail McCar, you know, I don't want to put him on too high of a pedestal because he is still early in his career. But early in his career, like it's just unbelievable. And you're right. The shot, everybody wants the big clapper. and he's got an absolute rocket of a snapshot.

It's just unbelievable. And the goal aside, the goal aside on the ruling, I've listened to you talk about it already. And I know a lot of Euler fans are upset about it. But I mean, just go back to the Calgary kick. And I mean, you win some, you lose some. That one stung. And but you move on.

Yeah, well, I actually think the Calgary kick was more of a debate. Because when you see the video and people might, not like the rule, but if you, it's all about touching the puck. Kael McCar never touched the puck in the offensive zone until Nkushkin was out of the zone. And we've seen replays Charlie McCoy, McAvoy has done this. Colorado was actually on the receiving end when Chicago did this back in 2017. All the videos are out there. So it's actually being consistent in how it was called. It sucks because I get that it's where your eyes shows you one picture like, Nakushkin's still in the zone when McCar's in the zone, but he's not touching the puck. And it's,

It's the tag up rule in a bang, bang play, but by the rule, it was a good play. And so, you know, is Jay Wood. To me, the ensuing power play is what crushed them because they, the goal. And then they, you know, I think that was the first time the orders lost the challenge this year. And then they gave up the power play goal. So, you know, you give up the goal. Okay, fine. But then you give up the power play goal to start the second period.

That's just adds salt in the wound. And, you know, Ammitton's got to come back. But just like the Coleman goal, I don't think costs Calgary the game. That goal and that review didn't cost the orders the game. they just weren't as good. Yeah, I agree. Everybody gets hung up on possession because Kail McCar has possession of the puck.

But it's such a bang, bang play. It's so quick that it's hard for the fan to fully understand. But when you read the letter of the law, it's like, it just says it in there, right? Like, I mean, it's such a bang, bang play. But let's hop, Jason. I got a few minutes with you left. Let's talk quickly.

New York Rangers, are they surprising you? or did you think they'd be up, making it to the conference finals, up game one against Tampa? Does that surprise you at all? I know sure Sturkin's been great, but like against Pittsburgh until Crosby gets hurt, I'd argue Picksburg was the better team. And yet, here they are. They win game seven in Carolina. And now they're up game one.

And like, did you see that coming? You're certainly paying attention to the East more than this guy. Well, definitely the Crosby injury because at the time Crosby was dominating that. series. That that's a, that's a break. You can't discount it, but what the Rangers did is they took advantage of a break. Lots of times you get breaks, but if you don't take advantage of it, well, then it's kind of a pointless one. And, you know, Chesterke and I thought was struggling early. He found his game in games five, six and seven against the Ranger, sorry, against Pittsburgh. And then, you know, the Carolina series was such an oddity because it wasn't just Carolina.

The Rangers were the same. If you look at the Rangers, the road games, the only two road games they've won all year were when they had to win in game six in Pittsburgh and game seven. in Carolina. So I guess all they need to play well on the road is know that if we lose, we go home. But, you know, they've got, they've got a really young team. And so this is great experience for players, but Scherkerkin's obviously going to win the Vesna. He's a great goalie. You know, Adam Fox won the Norris last year. He's a pretty solid defenseman. You know, Chris Crider scored 50s. Continue that in the postseason. You throw in Panarin. The big evolution of the Rangers has been the emergence of a Cheetah with Lefrenier and Capo-Caco.

which is another great example of stop Russian young players, right? LaFrenier and those guys, you know, Cheetah, what is this now? It's fourth year in the league, right? You're talking two, three years for LeFrenier and Capo-Caco, and those guys are top picks, the last two. And so even top picks, just like Drysett. Remember Drysoddle 19 wasn't ready for the NHL. He went back to junior, right?

And then he scored 51 points as a 20-year-old. It's such a tough league for teenagers. And those young guys in New York are giving them a huge boost. and you know, they've got Panarin who can be a game breaker. Zabanajad wasn't good early, but he's been quite good since. So they got talent for sure. I like their defense core. The fact, you know what, is it a surprise to me?

Yeah, I'm not surprised they won game one. History tells you teams that have a long layoff like that. Normally it isn't good. It's why I went with the over yesterday. Tampa will be better. There's no question about it. They'll be better. And, you know, New York, good on them.

But, you know, to dispatch of Tampa in four is going to be a challenge to win for them. I guess I'm a little surprised, but like I picked them to beat Carolina, so I'm not shocked. Like I just, Carolina doesn't have an elite forward. And I think it's hard to win deep in the playoffs without an elite forward. And I think the Rangers have some. Criders and elite forward this year and 50 goals and Panarin's an elite forward. And, you know, Zabanajad's really close. So they got a shot against Tampa for sure, especially without Braden Point and hearing that he might not return. That's a huge blow for them. But it's funny. You look at Tampa, look at their goals against

against Toronto and the Rangers. I know it's only, what, eight games, but then the four against Florida, they were dynamite. So which team are they? Even the defending champs have shown it's hard to be consistent all the time. Yeah, and they've played a lot of hockey over.

I know that gets overstated, but they, I mean, they're trying to win three straight cups. That's an impressive feat. And in saying that, they're going to, like you say, to win four against the back-to-back defending champs is going to be a challenge.

New York Rangers, they're fun team to watch. Like I watched a game last night. I'm like, like I guess I just, you know, as a, you know,

as a just a simpleton fan, I don't watch the East a whole lot. You watch the West. I certainly love paying attention to Colorado because they got a fun team to watch. So this series is, I think a lot of hockey fans like, man,

this is the dream, have the Oilers and Colorado and the semis. But the New York Rangers, they've surprised me because I, I mean, I picked them to win a couple series, but at the same time, that might be my dark horse.

And now I'm watching, I'm like, well, maybe not. Like, geez, like you just rattle it off. They got a lot of talent there.

With a few minutes left, uh, what are your thoughts? Everybody, everywhere I listen to, people are talking about whether you start Mike Smith tonight. It's ridiculous. You're starting Mike Smith tonight.

I don't even, it's not even a question. It's like they need the talking point. But if you're the oilers, uh, what's, what's a couple things you would do different tonight? And finally,

a game prediction. What do you think is going to be game two score. Well, two things I do different as I was Emmington. Number one, they've got to get back to what they were doing well in the regular season and every game except game one in the playoffs is they limit the speed of the opposition through the neutral zone. They completely negated Calgary's in games two to five. They took away their defenses transition game and you know what? It was key to their success. So that's the main one for Eminton. And then obviously your top six has to generate more. You at the end of the day, you're not, it's nice to have depth scoring, but you're winning, unless you're

Tampa Bay who's a freak show right now because their bottom six are outscoring their top their top six five on five but usually you're winning off the top of you off the back your best players and and eminson's best players they they didn't have their best game now that i know that you know what they still got points which is crazy but when you look at scoring chances for against and everything shots for and against that was not a great game by the order's top guys which is a positive because you know they can play better so i think their top guys will bring it tonight I started this interview talking about the importance of not going down 02. Eminton has proven they'll play desperate tonight,

and I think they'll take advantage of not having Kemper, and they'll get to Francie's. And I think Emmington comes back, and I picked Emmington to the start in seven, so I'll stick with that, that I think that Eminton finds a way to even up this series. And, you know, it's going to be a long series, I think. I'll be surprised if it's a short series,

although I was surprised that they got rid of Calgary and 5, too. So I guess you never know. But I think Evanton bounces back tonight, and the Fran Suz, they'll get to him. I appreciate you hopping on, Jason. Give me some of your time, and I'll get you out of here before the clock hits time.

So appreciate you coming on and doing this. And if people want more, Gregor, where can they find you? Well, weekdays, two to six on TSN, or you can listen to it at TSN-1260.ca. Ordersnation.com. It's where I write pretty much every day. So read and listen, and then Frank and I have the podcast at Daily Faceoff.

Frank Cerrevelli and I. So lots of places if you want to tune in or read. Awesome. Thanks Jason. Thanks, man. Have a good one. Yeah, you too.