Shaun Newman Podcast - #277 - Cathay Wagantall

Episode Date: June 13, 2022

Cathay Wagantall is an MP who represents the Saskatchewan riding of Yorkton—Melville. On June 3rd she was removed from the House of Commons because she would not provide proof of vaccination. Let me know what you think Text me 587-217-8500 Support here:⁠ https://www.patreon.com/ShaunNewmanPodcast⁠

This is Jordan Tutu. This is Glenn Healy. This is Mark Letestu. Hi, this is Scott Oak. Hi, this is Braden Holby. This is Tim McAuliffe of Sportsnet. Hi, everybody. This is Darren Dregor.

Welcome to the Sean Newman podcast. Welcome to the podcast, folks. Happy Monday. Hope everybody had a great weekend, man. It was a beauty. The sun was shining. Kids out playing. We had a comedy show on Hillman Saturday night.

And certainly getting together with some people sharing a couple of pills. and a whole bunch of laughs. It was healthy for me. Healthy for a lot of people, I think. That's been something missed dearly over the past couple of years, as we all know, and to get everybody back out and together and then have some good comedians

that had some pretty good material, I'll say, and, you know, shared some laughter. It was a good time. Today we got a great one on tap for you. So before we get there, let's get to today's episode sponsors. Canadians for Truth, they're a nonprofit organization,

of Canadians who believe in honest integrity and principal leadership in government as well as the Canadian Bill of Rights, Charter of Rights, and Freedoms of Rule of Just Laws. And they've been cranking out some interviews. They've teamed up with Thiegoe Flurry. And this week, Joseph Borgoe and Ryan Olson were interviewing Tom Marazzo. You may have remembered him as one of the speakers for the Freedom Convoy out in Ottawa. He's got military background, that type of thing. All you got to do is go to Facebook, look up Canadians for Truth, or go to their website,

Canadians for Truth.net and you can follow along with some of the stuff, material content. They're starting to crank out. And of course, yeah, teaming up with Theo. And then Theo's been on Tucker Carlson as well. So it'll be interesting to watch what Canadians for Truth continues to do. And certainly teaming up with them has been fun and getting to know Joseph and Ryan for that matter a little bit better. Tyson and Tracy Mitchell, Michico Environmental, their family-owned business that's been providing professional vegetation management services for both Alberta and Saskatchewan, the oil field and industrial sectors since 1998. And this past weekend would have been a perfect weekend to be on spraying. The wind was hardly blowing. And I don't, if, back in my day when we

were spraying, if it rains, not a good day. If the wind is a howling, which in this area, Western Canada and particular, you know, you have more of those windy days than we care to admit. But this past weekend would have been perfect for it. So if you're back from college, maybe you're still looking for that job. Or maybe you got, you know, we used to go around to spray, you know, obviously oil field is a ton of work. But, you know, when you're in the commercial sector of cities and that type of thing, if you got problems with weeds and you need some service,

you need some spraying done, Michigan Environmental can help you out. 780-214,0004. if you're still looking for a job, of course, they're always ready to hire good people. So if you're interested, reach out, or if you just want to find out a little bit more about them, go to MitchcoCorp.ca.ca.ca. Clay Smiley and the team over at Profit River,

you know, as these, they are the major retailer of firearms, optics and accessories serving all the Canada. And I was going to say, as these, you know, this scenario keeps going on with handguns now and everything else, Clay and the team over there, they're the experts. They're going to let you know what you can and cannot do. They're going to know all about the paperwork, that type of thing. They're staying up to date on legalities that just seem to be as just a minion on this side.

Trudeau declares one thing immediately, and I go, you think that means, okay, all, everything is done, is done. Well, stop into Prophet River, if you got questions. They're here in Lloyd Minster or go to Profitriver.com. and they can get you sorted. They help, you know, have been helping Canadians, you know, since 1994 with the legalities of firearms here in Canada. Of course, Profitriver.com, that's where you're going to find out all your information. They are the major retailer of firearms, optics, and accessories serving all of Canada, and there ain't no one better than Clay Smiling the team over at Proffert River.

Gartner Management, there's a blowing Minster-based company specialized in all types of rental properties to help your needs. I was in the timber cafe today at, I was in the timber cafe at home hardware today with the kids, and it was, you know, it was late morning. And the reason I'm bringing this story up is Wade walks in, right? Wade Gardner walks in, and I got the kids ice cream and, I don't know. I was having a dad morning, dad rules. And Wade walked around the corner, he's ice cream, eh?

I'm like, ice cream, Wade, ice cream. That's besides the point. Fun little story. If you're looking for space in town, you're looking for an office, maybe you've got multiple employees, give way to call 780808, 5025, he'll get you hooked up. Now, this is a new one. I got a new sponsor for The Tail of the Tape. I'm excited to be teaming with Hancock Petroleum, so bear with me as we iron up the kinks of a new tail of the tape. But let's get on to the tail of the tape.

Brought to you by Hancock Petroleum for the past 80 years. They've been an industry leader in bulk fuels, lubricants, methanol, and chemicals. delivering to your farm commercial or oil field locations for more information, visit them at Hancockpetroleum.ca.ca. She's a Canadian politician who is elected as a member of parliament in the House of Commons of Canada to represent the federal electoral riding of Yorkton, Melville, since 2015. I'm talking about Kathy Wagonthal, so buckle up, here we go. Welcome to the Sean Numa podcast today. I'm joined by Kathy Wagonthal.

So first off, ma'am, thanks for hopping on with me. I'm glad to be here. Thanks for having me. Now, you're the MP for Yorkton, Melville, a good Sasky girl. But for the listener, I was just joking with you before I started. Like, you know, I'm waiting into, you know, I'm dipping my toe in these waters and and just trying to, you know, the last two years is really throwing a lot of things on its head. And so I feel like I owe a service to not only myself, but to anyone who listens to me, to get Kathy yourself to explain a little bit of your background.

and then maybe we'll slide into the recent events and we'll see where it goes from there. All right. Well, I am a member of parliament, been since 2015. This is something that was a little tiny spark in my life way back when I was grade six. That happened to be Canada's centennial year. And I got this great little book about Canada and how government worked. I thought, wouldn't that be something to someday go there and be part of that? Obviously, that was mega years ago, but over time, I had an opportunity to get involved in politics as a volunteer, local EDA, that type of thing. I'm a experiential learner and took on every job I could realize that, wow, if you want to do this, you can take a crack at it and work hard and possibly end up there.

And I lost the first time in a nomination race by four votes on the first ballot. Or? Yeah. you know and people said oh you know God doesn't have that for you Kathy that's not his plan I went no no no I hear me saying seriously like four votes but anyways we ended up moving home to Saskatch when my dad got very ill and I had an opportunity to run again in a rural riding and love it so real privilege to be a member of parliament like drinking from a fire hose often but and I love the job but of course you know know, the dynamics of these seven years have been unprecedented, I would say, in Canada. Well, I would say that nothing could have prepared you for the last little stretch we've had. I would agree with you. Yes, for sure.

Now, digging into some of your background, did I get it right that you were in Lloyd for somewhere between, I don't know, six to eight years? Is that about right? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. 91 to 97, I think we were there. Yeah, loved it. loved being in Lloydminster. I bring it up because obviously I sit here in Lloydminster. I grew up just north of town and Helmand on a farm there. And so, you know, the first thing, well, not the first thing, but I'm, you know, I'm reading your bio and I'm like, does that say Lloydminster?

I'm sure it does. Yes, it does. I'm like, I wonder what under brought you to Lloydminster? What brought you to Lloydminster? What took you around to all these different places? Oh, my long story short. married my high school sweetheart, met when we were 1516. Marty's always had a love for the church and for ministry and someday was going to do that.

He's also an entrepreneur, so we spent our first 10 years in business doing different things. And in the early 80s, our business was doing well. We decided to buy out our partner. And that was, you probably don't remember this, but that was the previous Trudeau's time in government, which was very tough on the West. And long story short, instead of him going off to college and seminary, you know, with all this money we were making, everything tanked, and we lost everything.

So we took off to college and seminary. This you can do in Canada, you know, you can lose everything and come back. And with three small children and 500 bucks to our name and didn't have jobs yet, took off to college in Edmonton, college and seminary there for six years. I got to run the athletic program there, which was, I loved it. And then our first place that he went into ministry was in Lloydminster. We planted New Life Community Church that is in town there.

So, yeah, so our kids loved it. Well, I always love hearing bits. To the listener who has been following along since the beginning, which, geez, I believe you're going to be episode 277. So, you know, over the course of three years and change now, if you've been following along, you've definitely heard lots of different pieces. And one of those pieces is I've been doing archive interviews. I worked with the Lloydminster Archives, and we went around and we interviewed people anywhere from, I would say, majority of them were mid-70s to early 90s.

And you get to hear all these different stories of how people came to Lloydminster and what events shaped their lives. So when you bring up the 80s, if you'd asked me a couple of years ago, you're right. I was born in the 80s, 86 to be exact. And so my formative of years were, you know, well past or I guess on the horizon from when Trudeau was in. But since doing this podcast, I've learned and heard a ton about the 80s. You were not the only family to lose a business during the 80s. And those were some extremely tough, tough years.

What did, like how did you, you know, you mentioned 500 bucks, no business, three kids. How old would your kids have been back then? two four and five to it give you an idea i got six four and two right now so i i go to go all the way back those must have been some stressful times well if you want to get into it a little bit um my husband is a man of faith i am more the one that says well we have this much and we can do this right so we're a perfect match that way so um the experience was very challenging more so for me than for him in a lot of ways because it took me longer i'm i joke i don't know if you know in the bible there were the israelites right and they were supposed to be following

god and they'd be doing great and they'd say oh life is amazing god is good and then they'd go we're gonna die you know they were just like a yo-yo and that was me but over time we just had amazing experiences and opportunities that i think really helped to form who we were going into ministry if you go into some things all prepared and ready and self-sufficient you're not nearly as effective i think as uh as sometimes when you have to face life with some of those challenges and come through them so it was good we loved our time in lloyd yeah when when you say you're an experiential learner i feel like um going into 500 bucks three kids uh a man of faith a woman of maybe a pragmatic background going, oh boy. But I tell you what, the only way you learn that lesson is by

going through it. Yeah, true. True. Now, if you fast forward, actually, you know what, just before we fast forward, the other thing that I found interesting, I've been across our wonderful country. I did it by a pedal bike. So I got to see all the, you know, one of the, the probably, and I can't remember what guests said this on here, but it would be really good for young. adults, probably teenagers in school kids to, instead of, you know, in grade 12, we got to go to Europe. And you think, yeah, but you don't know anything about your own country. And an individual brought up the idea of having an exchange program across Canada, so you could actually go to the other side and learn some things. And because, you know, West here, I'm sure you know, all about it.

We hate the East and they suck. And they're the worst people ever. And they're all out for themselves. And then, you know, I went and biked it, and I couldn't get over how some of the nicest people I met were in Ottawa or were in Maritimes or, you know, you kind of get the idea. You went across the country and, well, it's labeled a singing group. A band. A band. Were you a singer?

And what did that experience teach you of going across Canada? Okay. Yes, I was one of the singers. I grew up in a home where singing was a big deal and being part of a business. band and my dad loved music. And so we did a lot of that as a family. And then my husband, who was my buddy at the time, was a drummer. So that worked out really well. He kind of joined the team. But Marty is really the one that is the musician phenomenally. And so he had this opportunity. And obviously, we were married. So my mom taught us each our part and mine was tenor. So that's pretty

all I hear. I can hear the tenor part. So that was my little spiel. But I love doing the talking in between it's called bridging in between songs and meeting all the people and that type of thing so we did go right across canada from st john's newfoundland all that was the other direction out to uh tefino right across the whole country staying in people's homes so um that was you know really pretty amazing to do um they would take be very proud and show you everything that was amazing about that particular area that you were in at the time and take really good care of us and We traveled in a school bus. Well, first we traveled in two vans and I wanted to drive.

And this is back in the day, you know, they said, well, no, maybe just the guys will drive. And Marty said, well, you better go get your license, right? Because you're gonna do this. So we had walkie talkies back then. I'm really dating myself. So we were heading out west in the middle of not great weather. And I just got on the walkie talking and just said,

I'm gonna be driving for the next while. It was just Marty and me and the equipment, but I managed to overshoot a turn into a gas station on the highway and a semi had to pull me out. And those white big sticks with the black on top of them, they're along the highway. I took one of those out and they are way bigger than you think they are. And I got to carry it all the way to the West Coast. They thought that was pretty funny. But anyway, so we, yeah, we did schools, schools and coffee houses, a few bars along the way. churches and just shared life's values and our faith with, you know, back then, school is so different now, right?

Because we, yeah, they'd have a whole assembly and everybody would come in. In Newfoundland, their student council president introduced us. And the whole room, the whole gym is just laughing. And we're going, well, why are they? What is he doing that so funny? Well, we didn't realize he didn't sound like a newfee at the time. He sounded like us. So he was actually mocking.

Apparently we have an accent. I don't know. But yeah, a lot of fun stuff that we did through the course of just that one year we traveled right across the country. And it is all it did is make you want to do it more, which I can attest to you saying it is unbelievable. This country is phenomenal. So, yeah.

Well, you fast forward the clock to now you've now you've had to, you know, whether you wanted to or not. You've been making that trip a few different times because as a lot of Canadians know, yeah, there's a group of Canadians that can't fly, can't train, can't bus, you know. Walk us through how this last, you know, sure a week ago and we'll get to that. But like the last little bit since Trudeau basically said, you know, no more. I mean, your job relies on you being in in Ottawa, which I mean, if you're in Ottawa, isn't that big a deal.

But as we know out here in the prairies, that isn't exactly, even if you can fly, getting to the airport, flying that distance, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You look into the math of how many hours are spent traveling, being in an airport, et cetera, et cetera. Before this, it was difficult. Now it's, I don't know the word. I'm sure you have one. Well, I, yeah.

Well, what's happening with the airports right now? I kind of think it's good to be driving. No, it's not that good. But, yeah, I mean, I went home every weekend. I love being home in the riding. It keeps you grounded and it's where your people are, right? So I would spend 20 hours altogether from this door to my home and then getting back on a weekend. So fly out on Friday and then you'd have to come back on Sunday to get back in time for Monday.

So basically in a rural riding or in, you know, I could land at the airport in Regina. If I was going home, it's two and a half hour drive, but my riding takes me four and a half hours to go from one end to the other. And that's something I hadn't calculated is that if I'm in my riding and doing events, I'm not going home on the weekend. So Marty calculated, he does all my driving. I mean, we're kind of a team in a lot of ways. So everything. We maybe got home and slept in our own bed five times in the course of a session on a weekend because you go where you need to go. And then now, obviously, it's really important for me to be home, but it's also really important for me to be here.

And he has made it impossible for me to do both. So driving out takes me three and a half days to get from Esther Hasey to Ottawa. We go to Winnipeg, so drive to Winnipeg for me to get a rental car to drive the rest of the way. And that meant driving here and dropping it off until this last time around. Our supply chains, everything is such a mess. The car rental businesses won't let you take a vehicle out of province and leave it out of province anymore. So my husband had to take a week off work if I was going to get here to drive me here, take a day to sleep, and then turn around and get this car back to Winnipeg.

So that gives you an idea of how crazy it is. And even to go home for an actual break week, I mean, it takes me six, seven days to go each directions, or to go and come back. So it's hard. It's hard to get done on the ground there what I want to do. And of course, I'm here, but I'm not allowed in the precinct anymore. Or I wasn't, and now I'm not again.

So I haven't been in my own office here on the Hill since last October. Not allowed in my own office. Not allowed to attend committee meetings, stakeholder events, be in the House of Congress, any of that that is so crucial to doing my job. So I have, I mean, all of us were living on Zoom for a while and I voted against it going back to the virtual this time around. it's not my preference by any stretch but I guess I'm grateful I can at least still participate in that way yeah that's I think for a lot of uh I don't know us blue collar folk um there was a stretch there right around the time frame you're uh you know basically you're told you're not allowed in

that people were being shuffled out of jobs you know here in Alberta uh you talk about the healthcare workers. You can talk about CNRL. You can talk about so many different ways that people have really been backs pushed up against the wall, do this or else, which goes against so many things in so many different legal documents. It's not even funny to, you know, to bring up. What I find interesting in this in your case, and I mean it from a sense of like sympathy, I guess, is like we've seen it down the the lower ranks of society and not to put government on a high pedestal by any stretch. Please don't. But now it's at the level of the highest, you know, government.

You're paid to represent a group of people from your riding that, you know, in the best of days in Canada, to get across to Ottawa and everything else is a challenge. And now it's like a monumental task. You left out, you know, when you're driving, it's only like a month or two ago where the road from, I'm going to say, Winnipeg to probably like Sudbury, that is some stretch you're going through. So not only is it dangerous and everything else, limited daylight, like, and this isn't drive three hours one day, take a break. We're talking 12 hour days and you've really got to be motoring. You've had to, like, it's interesting to watch us play out at the highest level. I'm like,

I'm waiting for the host of cars to fall and just be like, mandates are off. let's move on with life. At some point that has to happen. I guess I'm just curious your thoughts on that. Yeah, well, you're right. I mean, this has been going on for a very long time. And what I'm going through is awful. What my constituents have gone through and Canadians have gone through

where they have been coerced or basically, I mean, I'm hearing about it all over even more now people are amazing in responding to me just and saying, yeah, like I can't believe I was told do this or you don't have a job. And so many people are in a situation where they can't fend, they can't care for their own families. They can't travel. I had one person contact me, he said, Kathy, I'm in the States, my wife's in Canada. We have not seen each other for a year. Like this type of thing is just insanity. And I mean, when they made the decision, the Board of Internal Economy made this decision, which,

which all parties are on, but of course it's weighted heavier with the government, so they control what the decisions really are. And they decided that you could not come into the House of Commons into the precinct at all if you were not double vaccinated or had an exemption, right? So those exemptions were waiting to find out, well, what does that even mean? And I think it was on Friday. No, it must have been Thursday. I decided I was going to call the speaker and talk to him and just say, what's happening? Because on Monday, the house is sitting and what's the procedure if a person needed to do this? Like we haven't heard anything. And he said, well, it's my responsibility.

And I've been working really hard to make sure it's done right, Kathy. And he said, first of all, if someone needs to get an exemption or wants to request one, it will be done in total privacy, respecting the right to your privacy in regard to your medical decision. And it will be done by the only person on the hill who has the authority to make professional medical decisions. And that's the House of Commons nurse. And believe me, it was done so well. And then people, the parliamentary precinct services, would get a list of who was allowed in the House. And it would not be a list that said, here are the vaccinated, here are the ones with an exemption.

It was just a list of every member of parliament. at least that was my understanding who could go in and lo and behold we were all in the medical professional looked at the people who needed an exemption and made those decisions on the basis of her profession and then we as a party challenged the board of internal economy doing this we said to the speaker this is out of their purview out of their scope he agreed with us at which point that basically dissolved their right to do what they did so you would like like to think well that was the end of that but unfortunately the prime minister then brought it in as a motion in the house of commons and was supported by the other parties and it was to bring back virtual which they all love not being in

the house like the amount of people who are not there is ridiculous but they uh they did that but they tagged on this exemption thing and made it even And it made it impossible to get one, quite honestly. And so a number of us were no longer allowed in the House of Commons at that point, again, on his political interference with what the medical professional on the Hill had done. And you hear all the time, we're listening to science, we're listening to the medical professionals, we're just responding, we're just politicians, we're not the authority on these issues. but yet he chose to override the decisions of the medical professional on the hill.

So that kind of gives you an idea of what we're dealing with here. Anyways, so I worked from home. It was winter. You're right. Before we go. Well, I'm sorry. I wanted to let you finish up with that. No, no, that's fine.

You know, so many Canadians, specifically coming from the West, I feel like a lot of Western Canadians go, I hear that story and I just go, I can't imagine being part of the Liberal Party and watching this go down and being like, this is getting really strange. Like this has been a little, you know, testy couple of years.

And every day that goes by, it just gets a little more. But you talked about how so many people, like you're saying actually there, it's pretty empty that. For a number of months, The only person in the House of Commons was M.P. Gerritsen for the Liberals. They were all staying home and working from home.

And I love working from home too, but not on Zoom 24-7. I'll tell you that. But I just told people here when I did my little scrum, I just said, there is no way. And I know because I'm a multitasker. You get doing a number of things while you're doing what you know, right? And I said, there is no way that our public. servants are anywhere near as efficient as they should be working from home. And we experienced that in our office, all these delays with immigration, with Canada

Revenue Agency, all of these things, it is because of this new approach to working away from home and they have not come back and they're not intending to, which is not in the best interest of Canadians. Right now, if you need something done by Canada Revenue Agency, the person that you're working with, we're only allowed to have five calls in at a time out of my whole office because they can't handle it. So for a long time there, when they, you know, everything was shut down, they would get turns to come back to the building. You need paperwork. You need information. And they'd get the paperwork they need for their files they're working on. If they went home and didn't have something they needed, they would have to wait till it was their turn in the queue again

to go back to the building to get what they needed. Like it's just. inefficient like extreme. Destroying our, yeah. And people are pulling their hair out with so many things already, let alone having to deal with an ineffective bureaucracy. Well, then let's fast forward. And by fast forward, I mean, rewind a week. Because I think for a lot of people, if they understand your story,

they don't need to hear it. But you've set the stage for what's going on. A week ago, you, you're arriving, well, you're probably in Ottawa before that, but maybe lead us through the events of what actually happened on Friday, and we'll go from there. Sure. Well, I, yeah, I've been here since April, and I'll be going home June 14th. I'll start driving back. So I've missed a lot of home time in my riding. But Friday, what happened was I had actually on Wednesday, I decided enough, I've been patient so long, I'm just going to go in. So I thought I'm going to go up to the door and just show my card because on the back of our card it says very clearly that as a member of parliament by law, I have the right to be in the precinct. So there's that. So I walked up the hill and there were some tourists behind me and I was going in on the side door. And as I was walking up, getting close to the door, the prime minister's detail showed up.

So, you know, the individual with the firearms standing there and people on the sides and waiting for him to come. And they said, I'm sorry, but you people have to go back. You have to just wait. And I just said, oh, well, I'm a member of parliament. And it's kind of funny in a way. They ushered me in. So I just went in. And I went into my National Caucus meeting. Had a wonderful time being there with my caucus who have been amazing in the House of Commons challenging him with all of this inconsistent. And so I did that that day.

And then the next day I thought, well, I'm going to go in the house. So I went the same route, got in, and I was part of doing my job where I'm supposed to be at my seat, participating in debate, participating in question period, listening and voting. And they're looking at me because now I'm in the house. So you have their house leader and the prime minister and their whip and people realizing that, wait a minute, she's here. how'd that happen? And so I just did my job and then I left and Friday came so I went to go back in again.

And I knew something's got to happen at some point, right? Because I'm breaking their rules. Isn't that a strange feeling? Hugely strange. Like, I mean, they're looking at you going, she's in here. She shouldn't be in here. No, I'm a danger. That right there is a wild.

wild sentence to have to come out of your mouth, to be honest, just sitting over here. When I listen to your interview and you talk about the National Prayer Breakfast and the fact that you sat beside Trudeau and he was there and no mass and no nothing, like it's really. And that was on Tuesday. Yeah. Right. So this, so on Tuesday, it's all good by Friday, hauler out. So I did, I was walking in and down the hallway and the sergeant at arms, who's in charge of the precinct, came out of his office as I walked by him. And he turned around, or he said, Mrs. Wagontoll? So I guess, you know, they were aware by that point.

And I just turned around. I said, yes. He said, can you come in my office? So we had a little chat just about, you know, he said, I haven't seen any paperwork from you. Do you intend to provide paperwork that shows you qualified to be here? And I said, no. And he said, well, you realize you're not allowed to be in the precinct. in these buildings. I said, yes, I understand that. And he said, okay, and then I left and I went in the house.

So at that point, you know that something is going to happen. Now, in the house, if you say something that's considered unparliamentary and the speaker says you need to apologize across the floor or to whomever, you have to apologize. And if you don't, you can either leave, you know, on your own accord, or they will come right in and escort you out. So I thought, okay, this is going to happen at some point. my house leader just came, he said, Kathy, they are going to apprehend you today. Now, I was in the House of Commons, and I didn't know this myself, that I'm safe in the House of Commons or in my lobby. But as soon as I step out the door, then they can apprehend me. So as long as the house was sitting, I could stay.

I know crazy hate. You know how silly this is? Yeah. Like, I'm married to an American woman, right? We all know what's going on in the United States at this point. Yeah. Like they're just flying and going, what are you guys doing? Like, this is, this is absurdity.

This is absurdity at this point. I apologize. You're staring at me as I'm like shaking my head, carry on. Because I do want to hear the end of the story. I just, I keep hearing. I'm going, Kathy, this is getting, we're getting into further insanity here. Yeah, it is. And so anyways, long story short, I could have stayed for the whole day,

but I also had committee in the afternoon. And I've been on Veterans Affairs Committee for seven years. I love it. I'm passionate about it. We're doing the final report on service dogs for veterans. And I had things that I wanted to say and participate. So I decided I need to go to committee. Now, I don't mean go to committee in the committee room. I mean go to my apartment and get back on Zoom, right? But I didn't want to miss it. Quite honestly, saying I was going to be apprehended, I didn't know what that meant. And they're going to handcuff me? Am I going to be taken down to

a police? Like, how does this work and will I miss my committee? So I decided to just leave at that point. So because I was determined to go home and be part of my committee. And as I went out the door, two of my friends, you know, they said, we'll walk with you. Just kind of create a bit of a diversion or something. I don't know. But they were very good just to support me. And we went out the door. And of course, there's always these people do their job and they're wonderful.

Like I am grateful they're there. But this particular day, of course, right outside the lobby, they're there. And he has his phone and he's looking. And then at the stairs, you know, we go down there's more there and they're looking at their phone and trying to find me and out the door nobody picked me up and and it sounds funny but i mean i have four pictures over course of time in this place and i don't look like any of them even the one that was taken this last campaign it's just i don't know so they missed me but then as i walked down the hill the sergeant-at-arms was halfway down

the hill he knows my offices it can fed and where i park and so he apprehended me at that point and walked me down the hill to make sure I didn't go in my office him and you know a couple other people on the edges but I had a good talk with him and I just said you know you realize how absolutely insane this whole thing is and he says ma'am I said I know we have no control over it but I just feel really good venting right now and then I say goodbye and I thanked him and went home and at that point he said you realize you are not allowed anywhere else you cannot come back into the precinct And I don't know if you noticed, but someone who was a staffer took a photo at the desk of the guards at Wellington. And my picture is, he took it off of Facebook because that one is accurate, right?

And so every, every doorway, my picture is there. Yeah, so for the listener, basically, if you haven't seen what the staff, the staffer's photograph, was a picture of a desk with a headshot of Kathy sitting there for the guards to be on lookout for Kathy coming in or leaving or etc. That's quite the special treatment I might add. Yeah, it is. It is. You know, we talk about this an awful lot and I hate to beat a drum or whatever on it.

But you just, you think like as countries all over the world are just like, all right, we got to move on. and it's you know we got to open things back up we're going to do these things i mean vaccines in general at this point uh you know like i i highly doubt uh trudeau can answer the question of you know well why does it matter when if you're vaccinated or you're unvaccinated whatever your choice one it shouldn't be made public one two uh you can still get it and you can still pass along no matter the choice you've made so it's your choice to make and yet here we say having one of our lovely MPs from Saskatchewan, treated like, I found this interesting.

You know, when I dig into different things, I always learn something. And today, or yesterday, I guess, I knew all about Louis Riel. But one of the reporters says, you're the only the third person ever in Canadian history to be removed. One was Louis Riel. And I'm sure I don't need to explain that out here in Saskatchewan.

I mean, he pretty much led revolt against the government. The other one was Fred Rose. And did you recognize the name Fred Rose? Because I certainly didn't. Not till he explained him to me. No, no, I didn't know. Fred Rose was part of the Communist Party and then eventually a couple different ones,

but was expelled for being what they deemed a communist spy. He was also, once he left Canada, never allowed to come back yet, he had a citizenship revoked and a whole bunch of other things. I had no idea about that. all I know about is Pete Rose, and that's a whole different ballgame, although kind of similar. Anyways, you're an interesting company for something that probably nobody should even have any knowledge of. What are, like, how do we get out of this?

How do we get out of this? Well, that's a really good question. You know, people are so frustrated right across the country, hurt and abused, really, and coerced in a lot of ways. Not everybody, you know, what I love is right now in Ontario, in Ottawa. You can be masked, you can choose not to mask. I can tell when people are choosing to make sure they're social distancing. That's all, you know, an individual's choice and we're all good with it. And life is going on everywhere except in the House of Commons in the precinct on the hill.

When the convoy was downtown, it was poor, you know, Ottawa. Well, we know how we're finding out more and more how disconnected this government was and what they were claiming versus what the truth was on that too. But then all of a sudden, when it came to us and members of parliament, that precinct is federal land, right? It's territory. Same with the reason he can stop you from flying or getting on a train because those are federal responsibilities. So he is basically soloing on something that is totally contrary to every other part of our country, everything that's going on. Ontario is, you know, removing masking. Saskatchewan, we've been good for how long, right?

You know, it's just so contrary to anything that would say you're doing this for the reasons you say you are, which is to protect Canadians. No. So if you're not doing it to protect Canadians, I knew you were going to go there. Well, why are you doing it then? Exactly, exactly. And I got in trouble actually, my staffer just sent me, he says, just so you know how many times, because now I'm part of the mantra in the house that, you know, we have this member from Yorkton Malville who has these conspiracy theories, right? And all I said was the person asked, why is he doing this? Every Canadian is saying, why is he doing this? And when Canadians know, we all know, thank goodness for social media and people who are out there sharing the breadth of information out there.

And all I said was, well, it's not COVID. COVID is not the reason because it's antithetical to common sense about what we should be doing in regard to COVID. So Canada's sovereignty is at risk. We need someone in power who will protect Canada's sovereignty, more than. anything and he has no no respect i mean when you hear what he calls people who don't agree with him i just can't believe those words come out of the prime minister of canada's mouth that that's how he feels and treats and is willing to to describe Canadians and it's a tough position to put you in i i it's easier to talk about when your

job isn't literally being in ottawa and everything else but you've been put put in, I don't know. So where do you go from here? You just stay in your apartment and hang out. Yeah, people have said, well, they asked, are you going to try again? Are you going to try again? And I just go, you know what? I think at this point, there's a turning.

You can sense it. Even in the House of Commons, we have been hitting them so hard with all the facts, with all the truth. Oh, that's my better half. Just a minute, I have to tell my cat talk. Sorry. No, I'll get. Real life.

Real life, right? No, no. This is all good. What were we talking about? I forget. Well, about possibly going back in. Oh, yes, yes, yes. Well, clearly at the moment I wouldn't get in anywhere. And, I mean, they're determined to enforce what the prime minister is requiring, right? But today in the House of Commons, you know, it's come out that the majority of his caucus have been pushing to end these mandates.

He has a medical doctor who has been challenging and saying, here are the reasons this has to end. And yet he's not listening to them. I heard that about the firearms legislation too. You know, this is impacting. This is something I'll say for Saskatchewan because I go home and it's true. You know, you hear, oh, it's the east, the east versus the west, right? And I said, I got to tell you guys something, you know, having gone to Ottawa, Ontario is a huge province. a lot of it's rural and they grow stuff and they do things just like we do and they everything we're suffering with they're suffering with too okay it is it is more of an urban rural issue in canada than east and west plus i have a son-in-law from prince edward island and he hates it when we call

ontario east it's you know it's not it's not but anyways so it's it's it's i don't know about going to back in. I'm prepared to continue to do whatever I can to make a difference on this issue, but it's turning on him. It is turning on him. I don't see how he can move ahead. We're hearing the rumors about, oh, there's this other variant that's coming in the ball. Seventh wave. Right, seventh wave. And, you know, in the house, Adam, he keeps saying, well, you know, and you should be making sure that everyone you know is double vaccinated and has that third. has that booster. We're going to need that booster. And they may very well change, you know, the term vaccinated again to mean something different, which means you're not vaccinated unless you

have three shots, right? And if you look at the numbers, that's a lot of Canadians that would then fall into the unvaccinated. Well, I mean, they did that in Israel, right? Israel was one of the first countries where they changed the definition of fully vaccinated from two to three. I remember when it happened and being like, oh man, Matt, like, that is, oh, and here we sit. And honestly, there was a time in Alberta when they talked about it. So it's, it's not like it's this crazy out there idea. It's already been tried in, in the world. And here in Canada, it's been talked about more than once.

So it shouldn't surprise anyone listening. I don't think that that's even a comment. I think just at some point here, like the represented, representatives of government have to step forward whether the leader of the country wants or not. You know, it's always the naked emperor, right? Like nobody wants to tell them. It's like he doesn't want to listen.

He doesn't want to. But it's like, this is wild. Like we're getting into just, I can't imagine being one of your colleagues, Kathy. And actually standing there and being like, so she's the notorious, Kathy, Wagonetton all now? Like, is that what we're doing? Okay, sure, right? Like, we're going to ask for it.

out we're going to have all the guards worried about that like that's our biggest concern uh at this point in stage of the game it must be you know i don't know uh yeah they're there yeah we're pulling our hair out you know that that that two swords length that is between the opposition and the government there's a reason for that like it just it's very very difficult especially now with this official coalition that's going on. We are, it's not easy. But that the public opinion is so crucial. You know, it's one thing, it has turned because those that are vaccinated and I have family and friends who have been severely impacted by COVID. So I'm not belittling it in any way. I mean, I've had flus where I thought I was going to die. Like it's just, you know, some of those viruses can be

Really, really nasty, right? But when you coerce your people, I have a young man who got COVID and he was so sick, but he survived it. He, you know, he was told basically to stay home and go to bed kind of thing. So there's no sense of let's do everything we can to help Canadians deal with this rather than wait until they're in the ICU when you are facing far more serious circumstances. But he had it and came out of it and therefore has immunity, right? But this prime minister would give no credibility to natural immunity. I mean, this is our amazing human bodies that know how to take care of us, but you had to be double vaccinated.

You could not in any way even look at whether you had natural immunity or not. So he faced what a lot of young people faced in this country, and it makes me so angry where, well, if you're not vaccinated, you're a danger so you can't go to university and you can't travel. And these, a lot of, you know, yes, the numbers are high that chose to get vaccinated, but why did they choose to get vaccinated, right? You're going to lose your job or you're not allowed to do these things. And a young person, you know, life is so short already to them. that to not travel this summer, right? And he had two of the worst reactions after he did that. And that's another thing we're not doing as a country is properly tracking what's going on. Even if you're not sure if it's the vaccine, like an individual I was talking to his, his

sister was very ill after it. They tried to convince her it was everything and anything but that shot. So well, I've, listeners will remember Adam Conrad. He's a fishing guide from near Saskatoon. And he'd, he'd had the vaccination and then had been rushed to hospital. At that point, I think it was three different times and had to be revived three different times and was going in for an emergency. Oh, man, it was a heart surgery. And I forget what it was. Anyways, and it was directly related to having the shot. Now, does that mean everybody had that problem? No. No. I mean, all we have to do is open her eyes and look around and realize this isn't the zombie apocalypse of everybody dying. But we can't acknowledge that there are people that

probably shouldn't have had this thing. And we should acknowledge a bunch of that. And I find it interesting, strange, weird, whatever the word is, that there's just certain taboo things in society right now and actually I don't even know if it's society anymore it just feels like it's it's just in government that you can't acknowledge what's actually happening going around everywhere it's like and even then when I hear you talk and it sounds like actually no most of us agree it's just one man who won't give up anything on it and that to me kind of nerves me even more Kathy like hearing that yeah yeah well and it's it's the this is what you have to do but this is what I get to do you know there's all kinds of pictures out there and i just said you know you guys look across the

floor they're all masked up when they're in the house but then when you leave the precinct and you go out and you go for drinks or you go to this or you go to that nothing so i said is covid only on the hill like this is insane right this just makes no sense so i hear you i hear you it's and it's one nation right i mean we're being looked at and quite honestly people are you know other countries shaking their heads. I'm not sure what they're doing, but, you know, we've lost our way. There's no question. And we need to get our country back.

I agree. Well, I appreciate you giving me some of your hard-earned time. I know it's, well, it's getting to the later hours there in Ottawa right now as I stare at the time. If you'll give me a few more moments, I guess I'm curious, you know, there's multiple things, layers that I'm sure would take their own podcast to talk about. But we'll see where it goes anyways. You bring up service dogs for veterans. I guess my brain just to me that goes, okay, we don't have that before or why do we want it now?

And you're on the committee for it. Right. I'm curious. Why service dogs for veterans? Well, their service dogs, we've discovered that there's a lot of ways that they make a huge difference in a veteran's life. They're used to team and to have a dog. Well, they find even just in hospitals or schools or wherever, there's something about that relationship. And they can be highly trained to meet the needs of a veteran.

They'll watch their six, so they'll people who've been in theater. they're always aware, right? They're hypersensitive. And so the dog just is that extra person looking the other way because you can't look to the back and the front at the same time. And they work with them long enough to where they can eventually, I mean, a lot of them don't even get out of their home. And it enables them to get back out into society. They can know when they're stressing in the middle of the night. They can tell them when to come take their medications.

They're just amazing what they're finding too. And amazing research is being done in Saskatchewan at both of our universities with dogs from O'Dameas, who is a dog provider, Chris Sloan's, who is running it, kind of the spearhead of it, worked with the RCMP dogs, which is a totally different dynamic. But it's amazing what they're doing, and it lessens their PTSD symptoms. It lessens their need for pharmaceuticals, all kinds of things. So it is worth it if the veteran is in a place where they can handle a dog. Obviously, it's a team thing, so they have to be able to care for that dog and work with that dog. And they work with them right from beginning to end. So the challenge in Canada is we have no standards, no national standards.

Every province has, well, not every province, some provinces have some standards and they're not consistent. A veteran who gets a dog, say, in Ontario, cannot take it on. the ferry and take it with him on the ferry if it doesn't meet certain standards that they use there that are brought up from the state. So it's a mess. So we need standards. And so what we're working on is helping to create that environment and define what it is that needs to be done to enable us to get those standards across the country. Because in the meantime, of course, it's exploded into businesses and charities and things. And there isn't the proper oversight to make sure when you get it. a dog, one person in Saskatchewan who was given a dog, thought he had a service dog,

it was just an obedience dog, like they're not the same thing. And some people are paying thousands of dollars and they don't really know what they're getting. So this is all something that not every veteran is going to have a service dog, not every veteran will be in the place to qualify to get one. But because of how significant it is in making their lives better, including with their families that it's something that back should be doing more of but we can't really they don't they don't provide funding for service dogs they provide some funding for veterinarian care but not to get a dog and of course when you go from 30 000 down to 5,000 to get one it's a mess so it's something i'm really excited about to see us get to the place where

the government does its part but government shouldn't be in involved in determining standards. Neither should dog breeders or dog sales, you know, the stakeholders should not be involved. And unfortunately, that's kind of where it was going and exploded, imploded. And now we have to do it right. Well, anytime it comes to our veterans, I think majority, if not all Canadians, can get on board for things that can benefit them. Because I certainly know this. I want no part in more. I want no part in going across to the other side of the world to do what they've done. And I've gone to school with different men who've served. And I can't say they all come back changed because I don't know.

I certainly haven't sat down and talked to them all. But there are some that have come back that their lives will never be the same. And if there's any way to help that, and I come from a bad, well, a mindset of, you know, taking pills every single day to get through the day. I don't know if that's living. So if there's a way to do that in a different way, I got to think most people would be energetic to see that through. You know, when we're talking veterans, one of the things that came up in your bio and certainly in different press places, and I won't try and butcher the name of the drug, but it comes back to veterans. This is one thing I was saying, you know, I'll circle on the wheel a bit in that a little bit green to the political realm. What is this anti-malarial drug?

And it sounds like it had devastating results on the Canadian armed forces and that our government didn't want to acknowledge that. And I went, oh, that's, that's, I didn't hear a single word about that. In fairness, I don't think I was paying attention to hear a single word. Well, and it's, it's a long-term thing too this happened back in the early 90s our Canadian Airborne went to Somalia our Canadian Airborne are elite parachuters and amazing what they do you don't want to know i mean it's tough it's tough and what happened then and has happened in the past as well you look at that body of soldiers Canadian Armed Forces they are a cohort of people that well they could be a study group And so what happened is pharmaceutical company, Roche, wanted to test out this new malaria drug because you know how drugs are.

Eventually, they get immune to whatever it is that you're trying to use. And so they were creating this new drug. So they asked and agreed, the armed forces agreed, the government agreed, that they could give it to our armed forces. And they, of course, it was supposed to be a proper study. They were supposed to know what they were getting. They were supposed to report on different things. none of that happened. So they're being required to take this,

and they had to dose up before they left to go to Somalia. You have to build it into your system for a couple of weeks before you go, which is problematic too. And it didn't impact everybody, like you're saying, even in this case with the vaccinations. But Marge Matchy, whose husband was Clayton, Matchy, took it at home, and a number of them had experiences where it drove them crazy. She woke up with him trying to hurt her in the middle of the night and he wasn't in control of himself.

And then you get there and you're required to take this drug. Now it didn't cost anything because they were a study. There's always that element too. And the other medications for malaria cost, you know, $3, $6 per pill. And this was like nothing at the time, but even now is pennies comparatively. And you don't take it every day. take it once a week. And so a number of them over there,

they would call it whatever day it was that they had to take this. It was freaky Friday or wacky Wednesday. Whatever day they had to take this particular drug, many of them just lost control. They'd end up outside the wire with their guns loaded in their underwear and wake up. Like they were just a mess. Now, that regiment, I mean, they're a tough bunch, and there were other things going on.

They, as well, but what happened is this young Somalian boy, sometimes they try to steal food and things. And so they put them in the compound and try to deter it and just say, we'll rough them up a bit. And Clayton Matchy and Brown, I think his name was, they were taking care of this young man and Clayton started hallucinating. And he was seeing these, I forget what kind of spider they are, but they're huge and they're, and basically pounding the walls and,

pounding he killed this young boy and that was in the early 90s and the whole world heard about it and obviously they needed to be an inquiry and long story short when they got to the point where they're supposed to be studying the impact of this mephloquin um krechan went into an election and shut down the inquiry and then they disbanded the Canadian airborne so these people have and and it's long term they've discovered now it causes brain stem injury and they will not recognize it as like they'll treat you for all different symptoms but they will not recognize that mephloquin causes this and there's an amazing group of individuals and veterans who continue and we have tried to do this on our side of

the floor to challenge them to to basically they should reinstate the airborne and tell the truth on the wall in the War Museum about the dynamics around that particular drugs. So, and as you say, you know, there are people who can take it and we challenged it to where, finally, Health Canada quietly changed the black box on it to say, if you develop hallucinations or, you know, extreme anger or any of these things, you must stop taking it immediately. But our armed forces up until now which year was that for me, 16, 17, 18, they were still using it as their first line of defense against malaria. And you didn't have the option. And now it's a drug of last resort, but they've also still said this no way impacts its use in the civilian population. Because I have a friend who took it and went on a trip to Thailand with her husband.

and he woke up and said, she said, I have, should we be taking this? She said, because I'm having just horrific experiences in, he said, oh, well, mine were pretty good. Anyways, they went to Thailand and the Australian people they met there, they said, you've got to get off that. Because in Australia already, they were banning it. It's banned completely in Germany, I think, in Ireland. But we are not, because they have to take responsibility because they didn't do the, proper procedures. They didn't give them options. They didn't tell them what they were taking.

And the damage is significant to that. And even right up into Afghanistan, it was still the drug of first resort and being used in Afghanistan where there is no malaria. So again, just one of those things that doesn't put a lot of faith in your government when you see that these things happen and there's no culpability. Well, the thing that I find probably the most troubling is, yeah, it loses trust in our government, certainly. Like, I mean, look at what's going on right now and what we've all talked about for the last little bit. I mean, we don't have to go any further than that. The thing that I can't figure out, Kathy, and this is, this is elections, this is running for office.

People all have their own theories on, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, is why people won't admit when they're not even people. It can be a government, like a unit. Like we were, you know, like especially now, geez, the 90s, that's 30 years ago. We're going to admit that we were wrong about this drug and this is what ended up happening. And yet, you know, that doesn't seem to be in the repertoire of politicians. You know, you're in the line of it. Why is that? I don't know.

Power, control. not if you admit wrong I mean it's interesting because even now quite honestly you know it does happen where yeah okay you made mistake if it's a mistake it's one thing but if it's done with intent right you shouldn't be there you should be out should never have done it in the first place and so that's I guess I mean it doesn't matter where you go sucks a lot of times, right? And that's what's happened in this circumstance. I mean, our armed forces, those guys and women are unbelievable.

I couldn't do it. They're very good to me. I have members of parliament call me because I've been involved for a long time. They'll say, this veteran called me. And I mean, you know, their language isn't as pristine. And when they get upset, they get pretty upset. you know and all this i said oh just let them talk just let them talk you know and they'll say oh sorry kathen whatever you know it's okay it's okay so it's we don't even the whole uh care for them you know we all

talk as canadians well we want to take really good care of them and the whole system is so convoluted and so um set up to really function like a insurance program that i truly believe they have a more sanctuary trauma, which you know, it means you get home and you think you're going to be cared for it and then you have to fight for every little thing. I mean, there are many that it's not a problem, but we have some very severely injured in various ways that are a small nucleus of the whole. Just take care of them. Because I think it's costing us more in, it's costing more to care for them it's costing more in public servants i mean the those that try to help them as um their uh first line of like they're all exhausted why aren't we just doing what's best with far more of the benefit of the

doubt and i don't believe that we would have the issues even now with a lot of the apprehension about even joining the forces so again it's it's yeah You know, you mentioned you first, your dream of becoming a politician or working for the government was when you were grade six. Grade six to now, is it what it's built up to be? Or are you frustrated or what happened? I always tell people, I love the job when I'm doing the job the way it's supposed to be done, of course. I love it. What's hard is what we're dealing with and being in a circumstance where, I mean, I'm amazed at what our opposition is able to do to, I believe, challenge and delay and prevent legislation that I think is damaging to Canada.

Right. In these circumstances, more than ever, I would say it's not just a matter of a little bit of a different ideology. It's things that are taking place like C-11 that is going to impact privacy rights and the ability to communicate in the way that we all should have the freedom to communicate. All of these issues around facial recognition, all of these dynamics that are going on. Yes, all over the world, but our country, our leadership should be protecting our sovereignty and our democracy. And, you know, I'm one of those people that, well, I'm significantly older than you. I wasn't there when we were fighting to, you know, and yes, you're fighting overseas, but it's, they do it because they were concerned about our, our protection as well as a nation.

And, you know, it's, yeah, it's, it's something that I realize now how important it is to always be aware that a democracy is always under attack. And it's when you're compliant or you're, or you're just, you're blessed with it, but you don't even know how you got it, what's challenging it and we found ourselves suddenly just driven into the circumstances where you know and that's why the convoy was here that's why canadians were lining up all over the place with their flags i drive home through the shield and even in the winter when there were big snowstorms you could tell they'd come out and move the snow off their off their roads but then they planted that flag right back in there there's flags all the way home you know it's amazing but what it's taken to

you know and and even though those truckers never got the opportunity any of them to speak directly with our prime minister they made the difference across this nation look what we did to the world like we blew them away right was very cool so we need more of that and we'll yeah yeah i i agree well wholeheartedly before i let you go we have a final question we do here it's the final five five brought to you by crude master transport. Shout out to Heath and Tracy McDonald, who've been supporters of the podcast since the very beginning.

Heath said, if you're going to stand behind a cause that you think is right, then stand behind it. Absolutely. What's something Kathy stands behind? One thing? Well, it can be multiple things. Well, I stand behind getting our country back

and removing this prime minister from power. I also stand for life. I'm concerned in the House of Commons the direction that this, well, the previous Minister of Status of Women, she's not in the house anymore. You know, coming to the house and standing up and saying it's so unfortunate that women still carry the biggest burden of raising children. And I just want to go, you know, like, hello. our most precious resource in the world and something that is so special that I think a lot of young women now are going, it's changing the mindset about the value of family and putting them first.

And so that's something that's really important to me that we protect the value of life right from conception to death. I'm very passionate about it. I don't believe that we should, you know, everybody gets to make their choices, right? And I support that. I believe in free will, and I don't think humanity or government gives it to us. God gives it to us, and we get to make those decisions for ourselves. But the ability to communicate and talk and argue and debate in the public square, we've found out that there are a lot of things that, you know, the media and the politicians have claimed Canadians are so, so divided on.

that actually there's much of it where we are of the same mind. And I found that out personally. Doing my private member's bills, a private member bill, literally they put everybody's name in a hat and pull you out one by one. And whatever number you get, that's when you'll get to present something to the house that is something important that you think your constituents want to see or the country needs or something of value that may not even be in your party platform. It's that individual private members bill. And there's a lot of people there that have served 20 years and never had a chance to do one because they never get through them all even in a four-year term. So if you're number 200 or 250, forget it. Like, you're just not going to get to get up.

I've had three. I'm on my third one. Like, that's just crazy. So I would talk to people when I go to trade shows. I'd have my three petitions, one on firearms because that's important. You know, firearms on palliative care is another huge issue in my writing. and I did one specifically on sex selective abortion. And you find out that people, you know, the majority of Canadians want access to abortion.

But also the majority of Canadians do not agree with some of the dynamics of like sex selective abortion, all these different things. When you, sorry, when you talk sex selective abortions, I assume you mean, I find out I'm having a boy or a girl and then after I find that chunk of news out, then I have an abortion. That's right. So it's not that they're wanting an abortion because of a child. It's the sex of the child. And people say, oh, how often does that happen in Canada? There's statistics. And you know, we're a multicultural country and people come with, you know, processes from their other countries, where they assume certain things. And what do we do?

If we do nothing, we're basically telling the world that we don't value men and women equally. Because if you're not willing to protect a girl in the womb, what does that say about you as a country, right? And it's interesting, with that bill, I had the full support across Canada of the sick and the Hindu communities. Because those tend to be the ethnic communities

that this would happen more in. But if we don't say when you come to Canada, you're coming to a place where these are our values, then that is not a good thing. And it doesn't reflect to the world that we value equality. So this is kind of the argument. And 84% of Canadians want a law that protects against that. But in the House of Commons, because of the way that it is currently,

well, it's rigged because there's only one party in this country that I can run for as a person who believes in pro-life issues. And that is the conservative part. The others will not even let me run in a nomination race. So when you get into the house and you're trying to debate these things, we debated it for the first time in 15 years, right? But it's so negative and so contrary, and they're not representing Canadians anymore.

They're representing ideology. You can't. Well, you're expanding my mind tonight. So you're saying you can't run as a liberal candidate who is pro-life. That doesn't exist? No. Now, to all my listeners who knew that, I apologize, this is where the Green Park comes in. You can't run in the Green Party, the NDP, any of them, if you're pro-life.

No. Isn't that wild? Yes. Yes. That's not democracy. I mean, I should have the opportunity. And they used to. They used to.

But with this prime minister, that became, and he grandfathered a few people in. But then. So that's a recent. That's Justin Trudeau? Yeah. His father, basically, because he, you know, during the whole Morgan Taller case. And this is the thing that Morgan Taller case was about how difficult it was to get an abortion. And the Supreme Court ruled that yes, it was too difficult.

But they also, Supreme Court Wilson said, However, you as legislators, the parliament, has a responsibility to determine protections for the fetus. But we never hear about that because the view is that this is, yeah, a woman's right to choose and pro-choice. And the pro-choice movement supports my bill because 84% of Canadians, that is the majority of Canadians. and those that are, you know, pro-choice are broad enough to go, okay, choice includes. And so the portion, that 16% are ones that believe in abortion at any time for any reason. And then the pro-life group that, I mean, their breadth is wide too. It's, you know, no abortion at any time for any reason.

and then there's the center that actually they agree a lot with parts of the pro-life movement. So the pro-choice people support that, but our house doesn't represent that. Right? They, you know, even my leader when he's, you know, the leader at the time didn't support my bill. He said, I'm pro-choice. And I just didn't actually know you're pro-abortion at any time for any reason. and the pro-choice movement is going, what's going on here? Because it's becoming more and more extreme.

And we're the only country in the world that's a democratic country that has no limitations. We have no laws in Canada because they didn't bring any in after that. And Prime Minister Trudeau, Sr. said, well, you know, this isn't, you have to deal with your conscience if you choose to go ahead with this. And there's a lot of things where, yeah, he was not of the mindset. You can't say, as the Prime Minister does, that personally I'm pro-life, but, you know, I'm not going to force my views on anyone. And I understand that, but there's all kinds of areas here where we do agree that we could set some parameters. When people would see my bill or see my petition, well, I don't agree, you know, I believe in the right to have an abortion in Canada. I say, okay, so to have an abortion because you don't want to have a little girl?

No. What about late-term abortion? Like, as that child's being born? And no, of course. And I said, well, there's no laws. You can have an abortion at nine months. You can have an abortion as the baby is being born. Now, does it happen a lot?

No. No. Does it happen? Yes. Yes, it does. All of these things happen. I know. Sorry.

This is why, no, this is why this is why this is such a difficult topic. The thing that absolutely shocks me, and maybe I, you know, this is where Sean needs to do a little more reading, I guess. I go, I can't imagine you got, I'm going to use hockey. Okay. It's a part time. You got Wayne Grexie. He is fantastic.

He's the best player in the game. He wants to be liberal. But he's pro-life. Sorry, Wayne, you got to go to the conservatives. That's what you're saying at this point. Yeah, I guess so I'd take Wayne Gretsky. I'd take Wayne Grexky too. Yeah.

Yeah. No, no, there's not an option. there's not an opportunity to run in any of those parties if you are pro-life and yet i know there are people on the other side of the you know uh i don't know what drives people i don't know how people well the thing is you can't pretend personally you can't separate your body your mind and your spirit like in the house right now the big push is towards secularism coming from the block right they want to remove the prayer completely well there's a person of a different faith than me standing up and saying no i don't want that prayer removed right so there's all kinds of dynamics going on

i just think and i come back to you know not being able to believe or you know not wanting to anytime you surround yourself with the same type of person with the exact same beliefs that spells danger you want to have discussion even in your own party you just want to right you want to have sure you don't want to yell at each other like you want to have it in a good forum that's how we learn things that's how you discuss ideas and that's how we probably all grow i didn't realize huh that is that's something to chew on and that's that's debate in the public square right shutting down conversation across our nation in our schools and our universities this if you don't agree with me you hate me mantra

is all part of we're losing that opportunity to challenge each other but still love each other, which is key to being a human and is something that our democracy was founded on, is that freedom of expression and freedom to debate in the public square. But you can do whatever you want as long as you do it, you know, where we don't know nobody else has to see you. We don't want to have to. And to think differently is healthy, right? For us to challenge each other.

I mean, around my table at home. Yeah. Crazy. I got four. No, I got four older siblings. And the three of them are brothers. We do brothers round tables where we argue a lot. And that's just the ones the public gets to hear about,

which usually revolves around the Amiton Oilers. Behind scenes, it's, you know, it's, but that's what's good because every once in a while you're going to hit on something and you're going to have to think about it you're going to be like huh it's a good thought right like that's what comes out of discussing issues and one of the things i've said for a long time is i feel like Canadians or maybe the world itself but specifically where i sit in our area and and certainly i mean Saskatchewan alberta for what feels like and you know i'm a young guy so maybe it's been going on longer and i think i haven't been paying attention kathy but i feel like we haven't been talking about this the issues that really matter. And the issues that really matter, now are starting to overflood the bathtub, so to speak. Like, we're really dealing with some things here. And they're not easy issues where you just, you know,

go talk to one person and it's all fixed. These are complex, complex issues that run deep into not only people's lives, but like society as a whole now. Yeah, yeah, very true, very true. And that's the thing is to be able to, have those conversations and it's a huge blame game out there right now right like you know this bill adds that came and spoke he was a residential school from age 5 to 15 without ever leaving and he talked about his life and you know he said reconciliation can only happen

amongst people if you reconcile with god and he He said to the people who interviewed him, he says, I'm not a survivor. I'm a conqueror. And he didn't do it by himself. He did it. He talked about all the different people in his life that just made such a difference to where he ended up. And I mean, when you look at what could have been versus who he is today, you just go, every person has that potential.

And what do we do to just build into each other that kind of opportunity, which is so important in Canada, right? You know, it's not equity, it's equality. It's everybody needs to have the same opportunities and hopefully encouragement and that type of thing to set their path in a good way. Well, I really do appreciate you giving me some time on this evening as it strolls into later. I've kept you longer than I said I would.

But I appreciate the conversation and your thoughts. And certainly I know for a lot of listeners, you know, standing up for your beliefs and walking in there and then getting escorted out and everything else. As silly as it is, I know it had to have been uncomfortable for you. And I know a lot of listeners have experienced different things in their work environment and everything else. So hats off to you for sticking Trude to yourself. And hopefully soon, sooner than later, things can turn in the right direction.

But regardless, have a great weekend. I appreciate you hopping on with me and giving me some of your time. Thank you, Sean. It was a pleasure. Take care.