Shaun Newman Podcast - #324 - Ben Trudeau

Episode Date: October 5, 2022

He’s a self-confessed "serial entrepreneur" to give you an idea he Designs, manufactures & installs ground screws in the oilfield, produces birch syrup & imports used atv’s from Japan. He���s also a Trudeau (not related to Justin) and grew up in Quebec steeped in the political world. He had important roles in the organization of the 1995 Quebec Referendum Campaign and did over 12 years of active politics in Quebec.  November 5th SNP Presents: QDM & 2's.   Get your tickets here: https://snp.ticketleap.com/snp-presents-qdm--222-minutes Let me know what you think Text me 587-217-8500

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No, not related to Justin, but he did grow up in Quebec steeped in the political world. I'm talking about Ben Trudeau. So buckle up, because here we go. This is Ben Trudeau, and you're listening to the Sean Newman podcast. Welcome to the Sean Newman podcast today. I'm joined by Ben Trudeau. Yes, folks, don't swerve into oncoming traffic. It's not that Trudeau.

It's a different Trudeau. But Ben, thanks for making the drive and coming out here. I do really appreciate it. We bumped into each other. Geez, how many weeks ago is that now? At the Alberta Prosperity Project debate with... Who was leading that? Ezra Levant.

Ezra Levant, yeah, yeah, yeah. And Dr. Mordrey. Yes, that's right. And appreciate you. Rebel News is the word I was looking for. I appreciate you making the drive and coming out here. Well, thank you. It's my pleasure to be in your studio. Now, for people, they're going to be like, okay, who is Ben Trudeau?

I don't know where you want to start because a lot of what you have to, the reason you made the drive was I've got to go back now to Western Standard of Roundtable 2 when we talked about the Alberta Sovereignty Act, and you wrote me quite the email that was hard to hard to forget and hard to turn away from. So a lot of what was said in there was the Quebec strategy, and certainly your upbringing and everything else is very relevant. So I don't know how early you want to start,

but fire away and all picking prod and everything I do. Okay, well, so I'm like my accent will tell. I'm from Quebec, and I'm... You're from Manitoba? Yeah. I'm from Quebec. Even started speaking English quite late in life, So that's why I will never get rid of my accent.

So I started like speaking fluent English, probably around 19, 20 years old. I was raised in a family of entrepreneurs. My dad, though, is a PR specialist, public relationships. He's a specialist in crisis management, and he's a speech writer. And he's been working for all Prime Minister of Canada since the early 70s, except Stephen Harper. and for all Quebec premieres on special mandate special assignment. When they put themselves in trouble, he's the one that ditched them out in the media. So he became very good at that and he dragged me to all kinds of political back meetings,

so no public meeting but like in small rooms, no, to strategize how to get them all trouble. And so after it was on the weekend, so he would just like drag me there when I was. Most of us are going to a ball game or a hockey game. You're going to political meetings. Exactly. With the Premier, we're the prime minister, with ministers, and with other Jack or communication directors or party trying to find a way to spend their stuff. So I've been raised quite in that.

So you bring up a question I've really thought about for a long time, right? And I think you're just your case in point right now. I've wondered if different families think about politics different. And I'm like, they must because certain people grow up in it. But I've never met Ben. And now I have because what you just said, I'm like, oh, yeah. So most of us don't start thinking about politics until I was 30, let's just say 30, 30, 31 somewhere there. You were pretty much growing up in politics.

Well, I believe there's a double one in my case because my dad was involved. It wasn't a political size. If you asked my dad, he never been a liberal, never been a conservative, he's never been anything, no. But he's a strategist. And my name is Trudeau. And I was born in the early 70s

when Trudeau was in power. And then I have a very fond memory of the 1980 referendum in which my dad was quite involved on the yes side. And of course, I can, it's funny because now living in Alberta,

I moved to Alberta 15 years ago, got married here, have four kids, including my youngest one. So I have two step, one step, the other, one step son. And two boys, one 10, one seven. And it's funny that when Justin came in power, I realized that, and most in Alberta, with these F-3-Doo on all these trucks, no, you have to explain your five years old

why his name is all on these pickups, no? So when you bear that name, whether you want it or not, politics is in your face, no? Yeah, I guess I'd never even thought about what a poor thing for a young kid to have to, you know, experience. I mean. Yeah, it is what it is, no. So, and it's regular. But now the good thing is that I learned to turn that in joke and I know how to handle that, no.

So my kids are quite politicized. My little seven years old can tell you exactly what he thinks about most politicians. My 10 years old is very opinionated as well. And as well, I recently with COVID, I kind of went back in politics, got involved in Take Back Alberta, Engineering and all that, and drag my kids in these assembly as well, because I think it's part of the education, you know, that kids should be initiated to politics and to public life.

And so for me, it's super important because it's part as well of who I am. Because through the process as well, no, I have two big thing in my life, well, which is business and politics. I will say that all that is covered by my belief as well. I'm a born-again Christian, so I'm a very, very rare specimen for Quebec. No, there's only 70,000 born-again Christian for 8 million population in Quebec. So 70,000? 70,000. Yeah. Why is that? Because Catholicism over-overruled everything. And Quebec has a very, very, very, very, very, very, very bad, history with the Catholic Church as well it's like a mixed feeling because in the after the Patriots like the Civil War of 1838 where where the English government

hang most of the Quebec generals for trying to rebel against the government they they can't made the deal with the Catholic Church and that that's basically they said to Catholic Church you take care of these crazy of your crazy French man and let us deal with our business no and so so Catholic Church took over education and health very early and and and they became overpowerful on the population until the Expo 67 in the Xpo 67 in Montreal all the teenagers my dad was part of that kind of they were now the majority of population all these baby baby boomers

and and they they the eyes why it was open to the world And they did realize the overarching control that the Catholic Church had over them. So in 1967, 94% population in Quebec was going to church at least twice a week. And every night at 7 p.m., they would put the radio on, but on their knees. And it was the archbishop doing the rosary on the radio. It was forbidden to sell fish on Friday for stores in Quebec. not to sell meat, sorry, only fish on Friday. So, and then that generation decided to throw everything out.

So from 1967, 1968, it's never happened anywhere else in the world. The attendance to the Catholic Church went from 94% to 4% of the 4% in one year. The church totally emptied like that year. In one year, in 12 months, no more. Nobody was going to church anymore. But they were so used to be told what to do by the priest, Matakiaheic Church. At the time, there was the rising of that independence movement

with the FLQ and with, and basically, Quebecers replaced the overarching control of the church by the government. That became their new church, that became their new way of, so Quebecers are very, I never been popular for saying that in Quebec either, but Quebec are very comfortable being told what to do.

They kind of look forward to that from the government, which bring them in overall sense very much to the left. They're very comfortable in that system. Do you think that's something all-Canadian share in common, or do you see something different coming West and how we react to government? Oh, West is way different. Way different.

Oh, way different. When I move West, it's funny how for me, I often say jokingly that I immigrated to Alberta just because the culture is so different that it was like a rough adaptation to live here. It was a rough adaptation to live here. And even now my accent is way better and it was like 15 years ago when I moved there.

So to move there, I moved here as a land developer in the Ukrainian community, not very loved and with a way stronger accent than I do have now. and with a way, a totally different set of values, I can't say. And the chasm is almost unreachable between the two. It's like another country. So, so. You think the chasm, like the divide is that big?

Well, I mean, the divide is made bigger because of the language. So, so again, Western, Western Canada, no, there is some, a lot of factor that is not very well understood. Like the true history of Canada is not well understood by Western Canadian, no. I don't believe that the history classes in Alberta make good justice of Canadian history. Did you just say the true history is not understood? Yes. No, your accent's playing tricks with me. Yes.

Okay. What's the true history? What were you born? What do you think were missing? Well, there's a reality that did exist even when it was young, where until again 1968, until the, until the, until the time where the generation of my dad started putting bombs in English area of Montreal and kind of turned stuff around,

you couldn't be served in French downtown Montreal. They were a restaurant for the French, restaurant from English. All the big stores were for the English. You can be served in French at the Bay. You could be served in French at Eaton. You couldn't. Couldn't.

These were English stores. And then there was one general store in Montreal for the French was DuPuy and Frère. So when you were French, you had to go. And then there's a Beauvoir, Montreal, named San Lorenz Boulevard. West of San Bernard's Beauvoir is English, east is French. And it even shows by the way Montreal is built. Like the Catholic Church has so much control that on the east part of Montreal,

they develop a very special type of architectures. And I'm a urban planner. This is where that tie in. But on the east of Montreal, the Catholic Church, when they start building a lot of how triplex in the early, like 1920, 1930, it was always the format was one big apartment on the first floor and two small apartment on the second floor and the stairs were outside because the category was saying that it's too dangerous to have inside stairs something can happen in these stairs no something inappropriate so so montreal as as most of the french part

all the stairs of the apartments are outside the buildings and it makes it make quite peculiar site, no, the streetscape. But as soon as you cross St. Lawrence Boulevard, all the stairs are inside the buildings. So their thought was we're going to make life extremely difficult on French-speaking people. Is that the idea? Well, the idea, in fact, there's

Pierre Reneuve in the 60s, one of the at that birth, that movement of the FLQ, Front Liberation de Quebec, who ended up with the war measure in 1970, with Pierre Trudeau. Well, the

the birthing of that movement was made there's there's a guy from Quebec that went to study in Harvard and he was a sociologist and he he published a book named the white Negroes of the North talking about the French Canadian and and that that really had a huge impact in that saying that no like like even the Quebec administration 90% of the deputy minister were English if you were a French deputy minister you would be paid a quarter of what an English the Supreme Minister will be paid. If you were, again, you couldn't be served in French, downtown Montreal.

You couldn't. I'm going to say a really dumb thought, but so here it goes. Because I just can't help myself, you know, with Truth and Reconciliation Day being just this past week. Yes. And I've done one show on it and soon to be a second. I just keep finding these little pockets of people. But the government has pretty much ostracized. You know, the most recent has been the unvaccinated.

I think that's been, that's been. And I go, the way this feels like it happens is nobody knows or nobody pays attention. I don't know if it's nobody cares. It's just nobody really is talking to each other. You start talking to each other and you go, that's kind of insane. Yes. Right? Because, I mean, literally what they did to First Nations was kind of what you're talking about

they're trying to do to the French. Well. It's make life difficult. Now, different. I'm not going to say it's apples to apples because it isn't, but the same mentality is taken harsher in different cases. And this is now, I guess where the stupid thought comes from is like, you know, if you just align all these groups, get them talking to one another,

man, you've got like three quarters of population of Canada at this point. I mean, I'm being a little tongue in cheek, Ben, but I mean, really, you know, for a guy who was just falling along, plod along, oh, government's doing great. Yeah, it's great. Yeah, everything's great. And then to get sideswiped and now just be like, every time I talk to something, I'm like, man, like what has the government done that's been so great? Like your dad must have been in dire order. You know, like they must have needed him every second day just to write a speech to go, all right, what are we, how are we going to dig ourselves out of this one? Yeah, well, and it's funny that you say that because, again, Quebec cars are very, very particular relationship with the Aboriginal people in Quebec.

and a lot of Quebecers like, and we look, we look at the, you know, at the school and the way they will handle the, with the First Nation. But at the same time, you know, the numbers of people that suffer equal or more in Quebec is probably 10 times because we were more populous. And in the early 30s, 40s, 40s with the Catholic Church,

if you were a woman, a girl getting pregnant, they will pick you out of your house and put you in a barn during your pregnancy. And after that, they would take your kids off and send it to an orphanage. But the problem is that... Who's kids? The Catholic. So Catholic priests were known to control... But who's pregnant?

Wait. Who's pregnant? Okay, so a young girl, not married, an unmarried girl getting pregnant. That would be picked out of the community by the Catholic Church and put. in a barn during a pregnancy with other pregnant girls in a farm. And then when they would give birth, unless... They take the child away. Unless she can marry the dad of the kids.

Holy man, that feels like ancient times. The child would be taken away. And then there was orphanages in Quebec where these child would be put. But the thing is that the Catholic Church had to deal with the government with hospital and orphanage in school. So they would get twice the money to put that child in the... a psychiatric hospital than in an orphanage. So these babies usually ended up

a psychiatric hospital instead of orphanage. And there have been a settlement with the Quebec government like in the 90s. I think we had like 85,000 kids that were put in psychiatric hospital in Quebec instead of orphanage because the culture were receiving twice the money. So, and this is why I could know

Quebecers sometimes say, okay, tourism and good, okay, good. Yeah, nice for them. Like it's not the same. it's not that we don't have a, and in fact it's funny. It's because you got your own scars. Yeah, exactly. You have your own deep scars.

And the things that we get, the own scars, and we get over it. And this is why probably as well that Quebec is so, first we're French, so we're pride to start with, and secondly, we're pained up because we're French, and that goes to the culture. And then thirdly, we know, we think that we're, like that sentiment that were better than anybody else comes from repairing that scars,

taking our place, come from, no, like, we won't let anybody do that to us anymore. So a lot of these moving comes from there. I don't think, I could be wrong.

I don't think thinking you're better than everyone or thinking you're the best is a bad trait to have. Yeah. I do think not working with other people, that's not a good trait, right? Like, it's okay to think you're the best. I think Manitobans think they're better in Saskatchewan.

Saskatchewan thinks are better in Manitoba. I don't think that anyone, I mean, we can all chuckle about it, But I mean, like, that's literally, that's the case. Yeah. And yet, you don't see Saskatchewan going to war with Manitoba over whatever. You know, you get the point. Oh, man, I, you were dropping some serious bombs today.

I was excited about today because I'm like, I literally think I know Jack Squad about Quebec. You know, I go back through my Canadian history, like you say, and I go, huh. Like, what did I actually learn some things and this and that, but they don't amount to much. You've dropped more of knowledge bombs in the last like 10 minutes than I probably learned in my entire school age, you know, life. Yeah. Is there a way by doing things like this? Because what I saw, I guess I got to think this thought up for a second. What I saw in Ottawa was for the first time, you know, Alberta hates Quebec.

Quebec hates Quebec. And then you go to Ottawa. Quebec don't hate Alberta. They don't give a damn about the rest of the country. Fair. Fair. And we can slide it everywhere just what you want. But, you know, you go, you get to Ottawa.

And you realize, man, there's just people. And we're just people. And we're all just frustrated. And if we come together, we can do a lot of good. And I look at this and I go, I know I'm hokey and I think the best of humanity and people and everything else. And I hear you talking. And I'm like, what we need to do is just get the government out of the way.

Now, that's a scary thought because I'm not saying anarchy and burn the place down. I'm just like, you get good people talking. to one another. I don't care if it's community to community or province to province or, you know, et cetera, et cetera. I'm like, only good things come out of that. And what you're, you're just shining a light on again. Like there's so many different groups of people in Canada that have been, you know, have had their stories, you know, and I think of even immigrants who came to the rural one-room schoolhouses out on the prairies. There was, you know, this isn't a unique story either. there was Europeans, I'll say, lightly, came over, didn't speak English, got beat every time they

went in and used their home language, you know, got, that was a tough, like, those were tough years. And I'm not making, trying to put them in the same comparisons as anyone. I'm just saying, 100 years ago, life was not good. And somehow, I'd really like to get to a point where we move past the division, because all it is, that's all the government seems to be feeding us right now, Ben. Yes. And I don't like it. I just really don't like it.

I'm trying to find ways to break through some of that. And anyways, I'm on my little story time here. But I just, you come in this way and doing what you're doing right now and talking about some different things from your background. I'm like, I just see the world as endless possibilities of great things that can come from conversations like this.

Well, I do agree. And I believe, I truly believe in a better knowledge of each other. I believe that that's the only way to at least find a solution. And I'm not sure that the solution is to get together necessarily, because I believe that, in the case of Quebec,

the independent movement started in 1760, no? So it's not a new thing, no like this. So in 1837, 36, there was a manifest from the Patriots of independence. and the American back back off on recognizing the sovereignty of the French people looking because they wanted, they started, no, it was new for them as well, new, and they didn't want to, they want to remain neutral at the time. So, so, so they didn't say yeah or nay. They, they, they protected a lot, like when, when the English army starts shooting on these patios, they, these parlias moved down to Vermont and New York and, and reassess and buy guns there and came

no so so but but all that to say that that that and and and and it's funny because the their their request even at the time was equality between French and Indians and English was equality in pay was equality in access to land was equality of I mean yeah nothing and nothing too much exactly where we're we're trying to be today And they were sure that England would grant them these basic rights, no, has, no, I said, we don't want to go against the crown, but let the crown treat us, let us treat us equal among each other, no. So, and London refused. London said, no, they, they, they increased the power to the, to their governor general, Gosford at the time. And Gosford called Coldborn with his 5,000 soldiers and, and killed everybody that they, that they can see. and burn down cities and village and to take over control, and to put the French back in line. And then he signed that treaty with the church,

so you wouldn't have to deal with the French anymore. And all that was fueled already by economics at the time. There was the Molson and Miguel's were the big fortunes, in Montreal. And you have to remember at that time as well, Montreal was bigger than New York City. So Montreal was a bustling metropolis already, you know. in the 1820s. So in the 1820s, it was bigger than New York City in the 1820s?

That's correct, yes. So in 1850, both cities were about the same size, and then they were competing of who will basically take control of the interland. And the businessman from New York started building the Erie Canal channel, or canal from the Hudson River to the Great Lake, while Lord McKay in Montreal, Mackay, start building the Lachine Canal and then the Rideau Canal to connect Montreal to the Interland and the American finished five years before us so they they won the race to supply

commercial traits in the in the Great Lake so and that changes everything but until that point Montreal was the same size as New York and they were competing with the same the same families like by car Manhattan downtown Montreal it's it's a seven-hour drive no so it's very close everything is tight, you know, up there and New England and all that. So, so there was a, yeah. I heard, it might even been Michael Binion say on the Alberta sovereignty, that out east, they've been doing politics for a lot longer than we have out west. And the problem with out west is, you know,

we just show our relative age in politics. Like nobody's really paying attention. And that's naivety that you think that, you know, everything's going to be all right. Is he right in that thought? Well, I believe that the context is very different. I mean, I mean, like the West, like the Western province were bought by, by, from the from the from the from the from the from the from the company for 18 million, I believe in 1878, something like that and and the and the United States bought Alaska and then they fought in 1905 on the on the border because the American wanted the Klan Dike to be on their

side and it wasn't the Yukon and anyway. So all that to say that the West was just a resource territory for the East. That's how it was sold. That was it was presented to the rest of Canada. That was it was like this is how they raised the money to acquire the land. And then the government made sure that it would not be populated by Canadians. And Canadians, by the way, Canadians at the time were specifically French Canadians. The name Canadian has been took from the French Canadian and put at large.

and then kind of split, no? But at the time, it was the English and the Canadians. And when you would say Canadian in 1950, you would know that they are French, no? Really? Yes. So, so Canadian. And this is why the Montreal Canadians were bare the name Canadians,

because it was typically the name given to the French. Are you sliding some hockey trivian on me? Oh, we're going to become good friends, Ben. He says to me, listeners, as he gets here, he goes, I don't know, you know, he's looking around the room. He's like, I don't know anything, hockey. And then he slides that beautiful fact in, carry on. So I don't know how to keep a new history.

Fair, fair. So, yeah, so I... So it was English and the Canadians. That's correct. That's correct. So they were called the Tories, eh? So they were the Tories and the Canadians. And the Tories were for the Upper Canada

and the Canadian, lower Canada, along the Vermont, New York border. That was the Canadians. and then starting Montreal was kind of a mid-area. And then west of that, it was the Tories that were there, and they were English-Canadian. But they were not, you would insult an English guy in the early 1900, if you would have called him a Canadian.

Isn't that I'm wild? And then when they start colonizing or mainly around the war, after the First World War and all that, they start colonizing very intense. intensively Western Canada, there was program for immigrants to get a core section down west. Well, if you were coming from Europe and not speaking French, you would get a core section for over like 500 bucks, something like that. If you were French-Canadian, you had to pay for your train tickets and $5,000, it was 10 times more if you were French-speaking to acquire a quarter section in the West. So they didn't want the West, sorry, they didn't want the French coming out West.

Absolutely not. That's the plan since 1760. since 1763 when they signed the Treaty of Paris, that's the plan was to colonize. And this is okay. I mean, I believe that English are very gentleman colonists compared to Portuguese or Spanish. They are very softer, a way more Roman way to do stuff. Like you read the Bible and you see that the Roman were keeping Herod as king of the Jew.

So the English, that was their method. They just kept on that Roman tradition of keeping some government in place. And finally, they're just like not functional because all the power remain in their hand, no. So I believe amongst all the the colonials, I believe the English were the most gentleman, the best one, no, to at least keep people alive where they were colonizing. It's, man, history is complex. You know, you think it's so simple. And then to hear you rattle off things from the other side of only Canada, not the world, just Canada. And I'm like, huh, yeah, this is a little more, you know, I mean, I always knew it was complex.

Yeah. But, yeah, this is, this is, I'm showing my naivity all over again in different ways that, you know, it can just be moved forward in such an easy way. Yeah, and this is what I almost grieve on, is that these basic fact of history should be known by everybody, and that could change so much the relationship between us, no? That could just, like, switch stuff over. And there's so more ignorance, and the system is made to keep in that ignorance. Like, even that naivety of thinking that journalists are neutral, I mean, that concept just came like, Recently, it came probably during the Vietnam War, not even, maybe even more recently than that, because it's obvious, like in Quebec, you know, like as I grew up, there's three French

French newspaper, one English, no, in Montreal. So you know that that English newspaper is owned by a group of English elite and the stance and the angle they will take will always be to put down the French. And then in the three French newspaper, one of them is very pro-independentist. Journal of Montreal is like, you know that when you read the Ronald de Montreal, the owner is an independentist.

He became, even the son of the original owner became leader of the Parts Quebecois. I mean, that newspaper is definitely like left-wing, no independence. Then you have La Prés, but La Préce is a, they like to put themselves as an in-between, but La Préce was owned by

the longest time by the Demerre Power Corporation, which is kind of trust, Friends of Pierre-Yat-Trudeau and all that. So the press always have a more federal-liberal point of view on stuff. And then you have, and then you have the Devois, and the Devois used to be controlled by French universities, professors, mainly. So that was the most, I'll say, mitigated of the two, but very intellectual, like, like, no. So is it just because? the West is so young. I mean, literally, you know, I was, I was thinking about even Lloyd, you know, your beautiful Lloyd Minster, the bustling metropolis, Lloyd Minster coming from Montreal. That's, you know, funny that it, you know, anyways. But, you know, like, I remember a time where every

large business in town was owned by somebody in town. So the money stayed in town. Yeah. Now, certainly there's a ton, and I'm not saying that, just in my lifetime, I guess, There's so many more corporations pulling the money out of town, right? The money doesn't stay, you know, you get the point. Like, and yet Lloyd is a fascination to me because we're kind of treated like the ugly stepchild of both provinces because we're right on the border. You know, Saskatchewan doesn't really want to deal with us, but Alberta doesn't really want to deal with us. And it creates problems and, you know, really you can leverage that in great ways, I assume, right? play provinces against each other, everything else.

But even in my 30-some years, I remember when every business in town, the person who owned it lived in town, I might be a little bit naive, but that's the way it looked and felt. All the companies were privately owned, et cetera, et cetera. And as time moves on, there's still a lot of that heartbeat here. But you're starting to see more and more chains, corporations, that type of thing, start to come in and the money is distracted and pulled out. I assume that it was not the case. Well, I mean, you're just talking about all these different papers,

that that's not the case for different parts of Canada. Well, and I mean, it's funny that you bring that economic aspect of it because that's the first thing. So in the 70s, so after the, after 1970, what was a rep pivotal year in Quebec history, political history. So in May, May of 1970, there was an election where the first seven candidates of the PQ were elected.

And they were in advance by, they were supposed to have 23 candidates elected, but Pierre Lod Trudeau made a deal with his good friend, Paul Demerre, and his other good friends from the Gazette to pull a trick on Quebec people. It's called, in the Quebec history, the brain scoop. So what Trudeau did, he and, announced that if ever Quebec would go towards independence or separation, that we would see massive capital leaving Montreal. And then that same night that he announced that, there's 10 brink struck that showed up at TD, at Canada Trust, with these steel boxes, with these guards. And it was said that just that night, half a million in cash left Montreal for Toronto. And it was not true.

It was a move of computers between the branch of Canada Trust. But Trudeau used that. The liberals used that to modify the narrative of what was happening to show that, look, what I told you this afternoon, it's happening tonight. And the vote just swang. We went from 23 candidates in advance to 7 because people were totally scared that independence will make money flee to the province. and all that. So the liberal have been using these tactics like for forever.

Have both sides been using these tactics? Everybody always likes to point at the liberals and all the things they do. And I'm not so sure at this point that I just blame, don't get around. I don't got a whole lot great to say about liberals at this point. But I'm learning.

And I go, is it both sides or is it just a sneaky, sneaky on the liberals part to do what they, done in different times in history? Well, I'll say that what's on the liberal side a bit different than the conservative is that usually the owners of media are leaning towards the liberal, more than conservatives.

So technically, and since the beginning, even since the inception of CBC, I mean, Montreal, the first headquarter of CBC, the first radio show ever broadcast by CBC was in Montreal. And the area where the first CBC building was in the 30s became the first gay area of the city and when they moved a quarter the gay quarter followed followed that so what I mean is that media always been more leftists it was been like like the stomping ground of left people and people are different and

artists and also so so so that that brings them more in line with how liberal things so so ways or conservative to find other ways to manipulate stuff they do but but not let's say not often not as probably not not not has as as as powerfully as the role can because of their network so that that's a difference between the two but but definitely on and we can see more and more polar rights no I often I get angry at listening to true conservative channels because Sometimes it's just like they use the exact same tactics that I've been used, no, by, no. Since I'm born, I see tactics used on both sides. And my dad, again, never, never.

When you listen to this show, what tactics am I used in my ears? Am I using any? Well, in fact, why I like your show is that I like that true, honest, no, you're, you, you very, very rarely. I don't remember have you use a question that will lead to the answer. from this get-go. And that's the tactic number one. It's always in your question, built it the answer that you want to get

from your, from your, and that you don't do that. You want to know why I don't do that? Because I hate it. Yeah, exactly. Right? Like, I'm like,

I want to ask really good questions, but sometimes that can guide you to exactly what you're saying. And it's like, well, what are you trying to get out of the question, right? Yeah.

Yeah. It's an interesting thought. And most media does that. I mean, it's including rebel news, including like, no, like, of course, they cater to a certain crowd. To a different crowd, 100%. And I believe you get the best of it when you read both of it. Now, I'm still reading Quebec Media, and I still laugh my butt off when I see stuff. There are some times that they do believe that.

Come on. What makes you laugh? What do they believe that you chuckle a book? Well, it's really funny because, so in 1994, I got involved personally in politics. I was 22 years old. I joined a group of young guy. We started a provincial party named ADQ, ACU, Action Democratic to Quebec, which is now the CAQ, coalition, which was re-elected yesterday.

I love how you look at me like I'm supposed to know all this. Yeah, exactly. Well, anyway, so. I'm sorry, listener. I'm doing a very, he's rattling off like 18 things in French. I'm like, uh-huh, uh-huh. Sounds very fancy. I'm sorry, when it's French word, I cannot try to pronounce it in English.

It sounds silly to me, so I don't do it. But yeah, so basically we started that party. So again, Quebec history, 1980 referendum. Let's talk. Actually, I'm going to hold you in the 1980s for a second. Okay. What is the referendum, the concert, all these different things. Pierre Elliott Trudeau, you know, when I read up on him,

you know, for all he's hated out West, one of the things he wanted to do is what a bunch of Westerners now, you know, stand on. It's that little document over there, right? Yeah. It's the Constitution. It's a Charter of Rights and Freedoms. Which lack of a big part for, they kept out one very crucial principle

in a charter. They kept out ownership of property, private poverty out of the charter, which is a big mistake, but that's another story. Sure. Yeah. Well, it took me back. Back to the 80s, you would have been a young boy at that time. I was eight years old at the 1980 referendum, but my dad was very, very involved, and he was

very very involved with René Levac at the time and the yes. And my dad is a very good writer, not only speech, but documents and all that. And at the time, the PQ came in power in 1976 with a huge majority. And they start shifting everything. they basically laid off three-quarter of the staff of the government of the public worker and rehired French people because a lot of them were English. So they got rid of all the English at the top and replaced them by French and then start putting up new structures.

And for doing that in the Quebec Legislative Assembly, which is called the National Assembly in Quebec, not legislative assembly. Assembly Assembly National, there's different books, color books for different policies. And when the government put a vision together, it's called the Livre Blanc, so white books. So when the government can empower, he can have white books adopted in National Assembly

to state, make formal statement on their policies, on different subjects. And the PQ came in with 12 white books, from 76 to 80, onto their referendum, and my dad wrote six of them. So during all this period, that's why I'm saying

that was often dragged. Your dad's still alive? Yeah, of course. Yeah, yeah. Road trip to Quebec? He's 76 years old, and we don't have the best relationship, him and I, but...

He didn't like you coming out west. Well, he didn't like me becoming Burrigan Christian. He doesn't like my right-wing stance. He doesn't like me being out west. He doesn't like, yeah, we don't see eye to how many things, him and I. He sounds like a fascinating man. Yeah, but the problem is that you cannot trust what he says ever.

So that kind of eroded a relationship. Just because he's so far into the liberal side of things? Just because he's so far in his jobs, he spent his life making stories and inventing stuff. So I guess it did affect him, no, because even sometimes I relate some stuff with Rabat-Bor-Assad. I said, oh, yeah, I remember when you did that for a rabble. So I never did that. Yeah, you did. I was that meeting.

Or when you did that for a lot, I never did that. No, no, no. When you say he invented things, what do you mean by that? Well, when I mean, like, my dad is a crisis management PR guy. So, for instance, I won't choose politics. I will use, like, McDonald's restaurant. Sure. When the McDonald's restaurant started was one of my dad's client in the late 70s.

And they need to find a way. that if ever they had food poisoning, that wouldn't crash the entire franchise. Okay. So then my dad developed a protocol at McDonald's that if ever there's a food poisoning and there's a problem with franchisee that becomes too hard,

they call the G operation. The G operation is that they call the crane and they remove the M of the restaurant. As soon as the M is not on a McDonald restaurant, it's no longer a McDonald's restaurant. So when they face too hard crisis, they just go there with a crane, they remove the sign, the big M, the arch,

and it's no longer a McDonald restaurant. And then they deal it as a non-McD McDonald restaurant from there. So that way doesn't affect the rest. So this is the type of thing that... I got to think about this, and I got to regurgitate it to you so that I fully understand, okay? So you're saying back in the day, is this even today?

Probably even today. The de-operation is not common in franchise. But if McDonald's... Donald's had a horrific burger, the worst burger ever, dropped a man dead. It was just laced with something not good. If it got that bad, they'd walk in, remove the M, and then in every media from that point on, they'd talk about it as not a McDonald's.

Not a McDonald anymore. In fact, there's a case in Quebec that happened in the 80s. There's a franchisee that was in a bad divorce and start developing schizophrenia and went to his restaurant and hold all of these employees hostage, like with a gun in the restaurant. Well, first thing before the media got there, of course, the first people you call in this situation like that,

it's not the police, it's your PR guy. It's your PR man. And then after that, you call the police. And then the third, and then your PR guard, the first thing he does when you hear that, he calls a crane to get the M out of there. And this is what happened. So that's a good example.

Because from that point when the media show up, up, it's no more a McDonald restaurant. You know, I've worked at some large companies and we've had where, you know, what do you do in the case of it? And it reads off actually pretty much what you're saying, not identical,

but, and I've always been like, I mean, why would we call in a P. But then I hear you, I'm like, I'm just playing in a different game. I'm like playing bingo and what you're talking about is like 40 chess. And I know to the listener, I sound like a complete nutter more.

on like I get the purpose of it. I just, you know, it seems wild to me that, I don't know, I guess it doesn't even seem wild to me. It's just, that's a, you know, once again, you just understand the level of games that are being played from a McDonald's standpoint all the way up to Pierre and, well, now Justin Trudeau and everybody else who stood in that seat or sat not stood in that seat, sat in that seat. Well, I do remember a meeting when I was 17. I was private chauffeur for one of my dad's ex-partner.

He lost his driver's license many times. He had a bunch of cool cars, so I wanted to be chauffeur for him. What a gig that. Yes. So he hired me for a summer as private chauffeur. And one night, I was, of course, waiting for him. I was just like, and he called my dad in because he had one of his friend. He won't become Prime Minister of Canada.

And he said, okay, my dad's, His name is Jill. So, okay, Jill, how... Here's the guy's name is Paul Martin, and he wants to become prime minister, so can you take care of him? So I'm like, sure, when does he want? And Paul Martin became Prime Minister of Canada.

So that's how the game is played a lot, no, in these circles. So... And then Christian that left was stuck with the sponsorship scandal. So, you know, his job was to make sure that sponsorship scandal wouldn't be spread on him, no, like anybody else but him, no? So you see all these scandals that Trudeau is in, you know, like, I mean, the list is just ever growing. Yes.

Emergency's act, though, is at the top of my brain right now is, as they, I think he's even going, he's on stand, isn't he? I think he's got to be questioned about it. Once again, when you see all these different scandals, do you just laugh and you're like, none of this is going to stick? Or are you like, ooh, that might stick? Well, it takes a lot In times of crisis, it takes a lot to stick. So what place for Trudeau this time is that COVID pandemic, no?

So basically, it's known that in any government in the world, in time of crisis, people won't vote for change ever. And this is why he went in the election in the middle of it because he was planning to get a majority government and the best time to go, it's the middle of a crisis because nobody wants to change the one's the captain in the middle of crisis. When you say nobody,

you mean majority of people don't want that? Like common, common people. Because I'm a common person. I was really looking for change. But I mean as a group. People as a group, things very differently than individually,

and people, peer pressure and the fear of doing a dumb thing is way more powerful than anything else. else. And that makes no society move in a certain way in certain times

with certain reactions. And Trudeau was looking for major government, knowing that in period of crisis, the population won't vote to change the government. It's not something that... So did the minority surprise you?

Or were you like, no, that makes sense? Well, I mean, that makes sense. The result makes sense because it came back exactly like it was. So, it kind of makes sense because, but for me, that showed a lot of, I think he lost a lot of points when that happened. Because if you're doing a good job in a crisis, you should go in with a higher majority. Like for instance, Legu, it was Quebec election yesterday. Leguo came back in that highest majority ever in Quebec and the guy imposed like lockdowns, curfew, I mean, I mean,

terrible stuff to people. And he went in like totally like, floored everybody but the thing is that in quebec there there's a culture of there's a PR culture that has been in in bread and the way you do stuff is very well known and and and and there's there's there's a method that are used systematically in quebec to maintain like okay for instance in 1998 we had that big ice storm idro quebec was was one of my clients as well at that time i wasn't business with my with my brother we had an event production company so we're producing event we were probably doing about 80% of all the press conferences in montreal we had like 200 employees and and we're doing

a lot of official opening and stuff like that and and my dad's company was a big clients of us know as much as other PR companies in town but but in 98 i drew quebec lost one third of their network now of their distribution network. Everything fell under their ice. And it took them like three, four months just to rebuild the southern Montreal in the most populated area. And of course, the president of Hydro-Covecotech.

It was like from the elite, the guy was like not very approachable, not very like very much like president of a big corporation. So what the strategy that was put in place at the time is that he would do a press conference every day and dress with a turtle color, like not a tie. So remove your tie.

At the time, it was like 90s, when no student tie was still very much in when you were in public. So basically we hadn't removed his tie. We had him look at it more casual. Casual and fatherly. And all of his speech every day was very like, like caring and anyway, it just actually transformed the crisis. Everybody started loving him.

And the guy became like a superstar by the end of the three months that you don't have electricity and you lost everything. Suddenly you like the guy that run the corporation that made that to you. So what do you think? Because when you say that story, I think Hinshaw, at the start, that's exactly what happened with her. She was a superstar. Yeah.

Everybody loved how posed and calm, you know, poised and calm she was on stage. Yeah. And by the end, people want to lynch her. I mean, there's still people who love her. I'm not suggesting either. I'm just, or Jason Kenny, you know. He's a guy that went the full gambit, right? And now here in a couple days, as we record this, you're going to have a new premier of Alberta because of the of there.

When you watch both of them on stage, what did you think? Well, I believe that they tried the tactic of daily. press conference, but they don't use all the ingredients. It's like a cake, you know. If you don't use all the right ingredients, you won't get, you won't get the cake out of the oven. And I believe when you use that tactic in crisis, you need to lower yourself. So you never do a press conference on the, at a lectern. You sit at a table. You don't do it with your suit and tie. You wear something more casual. I mean, I mean, the one that does it very, very well is the president of Ukraine. I mean, they're running the show

impeccably. Yeah. I mean, it's impeccable. I mean, he's an actor, so it's easy for him. But they're running a very, very good show on the Ukraine side, no? So, so I believe that the... GM, I'm jumping you all over the place, but you bring up Ukraine, what do you think in Nord Stream

1 and 2 going? Well, like, are you... Do you... Are you... I sit here, Ben, and I'm listening all these stories, and I'm just... I'm trying to rack my brain. You know, I go back to what I was trying to get at earlier. And like I grew up and by the age four,

I probably knew every hockey team in the NHL and knew the superstar and who was playing on which line and who to cheer for. And I'm not shitting yet. Like the Newman's came out of the womb and we were hockey. Yeah. When the Trudeau's came out,

they were the complete opposite. They were, well, not the complete opposite. They were just a different style. They came out knowing who all the party members were and what they were talking about and how you go about this and how you go about that. Well, that means you're paying attention

to politics in general. When you stare at what's going on with Russia, Ukraine, the US, NATO, all these different things, are you like, oh, yeah, this is just another day? Are you like, nope, this is getting to peak insanity?

There's something very different that happens that is happening right now on the political scale. I believe that the thing very different that happens, I believe nobody looks at it is China. And I believe, China to really wreck the geopolitical

stability in the world and a lot of stuff that happens right now everybody looking at Ukraine it's actually China that pulled that pulled the rope in the back and meanwhile they're becoming Well I mean I mean know what Until China

Until 2000 If you want to be prosperous You need to be free So To prosperity was linked freedom We knew that communist regime

were not create prosperity so don't go there remain but then suddenly China changed the whole thing

they say you know what you can be a total itarian regime you can kill whoever you want whenever you want and still be prosperous and that's way

more efficient as a way to operate a country because you don't have all these commissions all these opinionated people

and all that you just do whatever you want whenever you want that's the best way to run a country so

people, the fearless leader we have right now enjoyed what was being said. Well, the problem is that now the West cannot have that argument anymore, that we better stay free, otherwise we will become communist. Well, it's not that bad, becoming communist. Look at China. So that totally wreck everything. Because now there's these leaders, Trudeau and Biden and Macron and France and all that. They're pulling the rope of totalitarian,

here and there to see how their people react and to which they can go. And oh, okay, yeah, we can't go there. And they're just testing the water to bring it somewhere else. And this is what totally changed now. I mean, we, and it's that perception. It's that because money became the master of all over God, you look at who has the most money.

the states is China. So you have an example of a very well prosperous totalitarian regime. So why would in, so why us are we keeping on doing, no, while we try to change stuff, we, well, we try to build a pipeline. I mean, we have to care about the frog that migrates like every, every spring and about this and about that, while China can build a pipeline on the phone call, no? And then we start to envy that kind of power. I mean, human nature leads towards that.

And that's what dangerous. Well, that thought in itself is quite terrifying. Yeah, it is. So if you're the guy sitting in the PR firm trying to show why the West's way is better, are you directing people back to what? I believe the future is go back to original strength I mean the future is to clamp down

that's why I believe the future the future lays for the future of a country the future of freedom lays on clamping down ourselves of what do you mean by clamping down what I mean by clamping down is that instead of trying to everything we we can to export our oil to China well let's use it here first

and let's build up here first. Instead of bringing our sovereign channel, let's build up back our manufacturing infrastructure here. And instead of sending weapons to Ukraine while we have a crumbling army, let's build up our army to protect our territory. Because while we do that, up north in the Arctic, we're losing hundreds of square kilometers a year because we have nobody living there.

Meanwhile, the Russian comes with their atomic icebreaker, and they take that island, take that island. Denmark do the other thing. The American do the other thing. the American right now are like pushing on the UN for the Northwest Passage to be international water. This is ludicrous. The Northwest Passage in Canada, it's halfway in our country. Our country is 5,000 kilometers wide by 4,500 kilometers high.

We don't realize it's as wide as high to the end of the Canadian territory. And the Northwest Passage is right in the middle. So it's like if you build a channel between New York and San Francisco and say, let's that be international water. Absolutely not. And then meanwhile, oh yeah, sure, no, friendly for everybody. No, we need to, no, we need to clamp down. We need to say, we are Canadian, this is our territory, we will protect it, we'll build up, we will, no, we will defend it.

And meanwhile, we will build our economy here because I don't want to partake with the totalitarian regime of China. I don't want to partake with Tesla and the, you know, the mines in Congo to build all these batteries. I mean, like, I don't want to partake in that. So, so, so. So this brings me, oh, man, you know, some days you just get information by water, water, man, I'm happy you came and did this. I'm in a hour in right now, folks. And I haven't got to anything of my notes, which I thought we were going to talk.

boat and that isn't because Ben's boring me that's because Ben keeps firing off interesting rabbit holes to kind of jump into okay how do we focus back on Canada with um is it is it just a changing government is it a change in the mentality of the people is it a change in media is it a change in what is it a change in because I think there's a lot of Canadians have a lot of time for what you just said. Let's focus back here. But everything we do in this country is to do exactly opposite of that. And that isn't from the people, I don't think.

That's from our politician. That's from our current political leader. Everything is to do the complete opposite of what you just said. We're going to become a globalist. We're going to help the world out. We're going to probably open that channel up. We're going to give away everything, you know, because that'll make the world a better place, not.

So I sit here and I go, okay, how do you stop scaring the shit out of me? And we start moving it the opposite way. Because there is a way. I mean, there has to be a way. Yes. So when you go back through all that you've been through, and geez, I apologize to listener because there's more to your story, but you just keep throwing these fastballs at my head.

I'm like, well, we've got to address this. Okay. So how do we get the population of Canada to address the things that actually matter? We have to break the country the way it is. We have to break off. We have to turn the system over. We have to, I think, start by... So the real strategy that I'm thinking of for many years,

and mainly since I'm... No, I moved to Alberta. I was a real Quebecer. I mean, I've done 10 years of active policies in Quebec. I got my car vandalized because of politics in Quebec. I got some death threats through to rock in my living room window during political campaign. Quebec, Quebec is rough, no. Like in 2008, when Pondmara was elected, somebody tried to shoot her at her speech,

and there's a technician that's been killed, and her bodyguard took the second bullet, no? So this is Quebec politics. I mean, so, so, so, so I believe, I believe, I believe, that the solution again is to so if you want to be more regional we have to sort out regional stuff so you you have to start micro and again i will use the bible there no jesus said start by evangelizing no doing doing disciple in jerusalem then samaria then the world well we have to do the same thing we have to set up our independence quote-a-quote provincially regionally and then do a new Confiration. We have to reconfirate that country.

So you're saying Alberta needs to force separation? Not separation. And then I come back to the same thing that made, Renévez won the 1976 election because it was promising not separation, but sovereignty association, sovereignty. So what he wanted, it's an independent Quebec in a strong Canada. And I believe that's the key. I believe he had it, no? In Quebec, no. In Quebec, no. We have 200 years of history, of thinking of how to be independent. No? So, so, so I believe that the solution is exactly what Daniel Smith proposed.

It's a sovereignty act. And certainty act, don't get me wrong, we don't need the sovereignty act. It's a marketing spin. It's a PR spin, the certainty act. But people need, needs an image you grasped on to see we can do that. I mean, the blunt proof is that suddenly our Minister of Justice wake up and say, we won't, we won't sees all these firearms. Well, this is a certainty act in action.

I mean, no special law was passed. There was no, no court. I mean, nobody is running out of the province with their money. But, I mean, this is what it is. And we have to reinforce that. And this is exactly what Quebec did in 1976. In 1976, Quebec said we need to take to take back our money, number one. So they created two organizations.

They created Kese de Pless Pless County, Quebec, which is a... La Cés de Poe, it's a bank, basically, but it's an investment bank that collect all the pension funds of every Quebec provincial worker. It's concentrated in one investment fund. And they are very powerful on the world scale, because I believe now there are something like $1 trillion management, which is all Quebec money. Like, so for Quebecer, foreign money is Ontario money. New Brunswick money is foreign money. Alberta money is foreign money.

In 1999, we had a cable company named Videotron. They were controlling 90% of all the cable industry in Quebec. The president was retiring, made a deal with Rogers. The government stepped on and used a second tool that Quebec put in place. General de Finanement. So it's like it's an investment. So they have that investment bank that managed that money and then they have that other other independent entity that is owned by the government that buys companies to keep them in Quebec owned. And when Rogers from Ontario... Sorry, just to ensure the province has control instead of outside influences coming in.

That's correct. That's correct. So, so and I believe, the way they do it is a bit too socialist to my liking but there's a way that we could do it here which would basically to create the same type of entity but for people to create kind of index the Alberta index so our government invest in the top 500 companies of Alberta take back 51% of ownership of CNRL of so which is owned by chinese right now of suncor of sync crude of just like buy massive plot of shares to take back our ownership of these companies much mainly in our resource industry, and then you can buy bond,

you can invest in that index. So basically the index itself is owned by the province, but no, it's not, it's, where Quebec, is the government that owns it. No, that's the big difference that I would make, but I believe we need to put

these type of structure in place in this province to take back our resources, to take back the ownership of these resources. You were talking about all these companies in Lloyd, I believe that any resource company that operates in Alberta should be, should be at least 51%

owned by Albertans. And not guy from BC and not guy from Saskatchewan, Albertans. And this can be put in place within our actual constitution, within our actual system. Quebec does it, no? And Quebec is intervened.

Like that shot with Video Tro and Rogers in 99. We were holding up the press conference. For three days, we had like a satellite channel just to be ready for a press conference when the negotiation will come to announce the deal.

And finally, it's called prime minister in Quebec as well. They don't call it a premier. But the prime minister of Quebec, Bernardi, came out and said, we won't let Rogers buy. This company will be bought by Quebecers.

And they totally like scrapped the deal of Rogers and Iraq Videotron. That's wild. One, two, it's not the premier of Quebec. It's the first.

Prime Minister of Quebec? Yes, so the Prime Minister of Quebec. It's funny because when you get downtown Montreal and get to San Maras Boulevard, that's what I'm saying. You have two signs, that's Highway 20. And that way 20 link Adelaire war to Quebec City. And you have a sign, blue sign, like for touristic stuff. And you have a narrow, say, 225 kilometers,

parliament Canadian, 225 kilometers, Parliama Quebecua. So we use the same, the same terms. We have two parliament, two parliament, one in another war, one in Quebec. There's two colon parliaments. One another one in Quebec. All the language has been changed since 76. And that's another job that PR is very good at, changing the language. What, no, whatever. And so in Quebec, you're not dealing with premier, or doing for prime minister, not dealing with a legislative assembly, you're dealing with a national assembly. And you have the parliament hill in Quebec and the parliament hill in other way. And yeah.

and all that under constitution, by the way. I mean, so when you look at, let's talk about, I don't know, geez, you got my brain just absolutely racing in 50 different directions right now, Ben.

Normally, folks, this happens, but not quite so substantially. I'm trying to keep my thoughts in order, which is becoming ever difficult, which is fun. When you stare at the Alberta election,

you know, you got, you got, Daniel Smith, Alberta Sovereignty Act. We need to pull things back. You got Travis Taves. I want to pull things back, but it's going to take time. Let's stick to the strategy.

Let's wait for Pilev to get in. You kind of get the feel. You got Brian Jean who wants to open up the Constitution. Says that's what he'll do. And then probably in the fourth spot, and I don't mean to knock Todd Lohen because I really like what Todd Lohen has to say. You got him just saying,

basically, like, we got to stop using their language. We got to, like, cut out what they're doing, right? What they're doing doesn't agree with Albertans at all. And I think that resonates with a lot of people, regardless. There's your four. Your votes going to Daniel Smith, I take it. I don't mean to put words in your mouth. I shouldn't even do that, but I'll take it. What do you like better, what do you like or dislike about the four ideas, right? Does it need to be slow? Can we open the Constitution? You've already said we don't need the Alberta Sovereignty Act. We can just start doing it, which is already happening. We've seen that with Tyler Shandrow and now Saskatchewan and Manitoba both saying they won't enforce the gun buyback program.

That's right. Well, so with these four candidates, I would start with Brian Jean. With reopen the Constitution, this is absolutely ludicrous. This is like, so what happened in 1981 when the patrication of the constitution happened they basically used the Vancouver Convention to be able to modify it in the future. The Vancouver

Convention was that you need seven provinces representing 51% of the population of Canada to reopen it and that will never happen because when you look everybody talks about about the redistribution sending money to Quebec

but in fact the that profits the most of the of that system in the country is newfoundland number one payout per capita so we subsidize newfoundland over anybody else in the country after that prince edward allen nova scotia new bronzwick and then quebec okay so so before we convince newfoundland to get to get away from there from their smoking deal uh i mean it won't happen And then the other danger that will happen. So to get these seven provinces, it's absolutely impossible to start with, to agree to reopen. And then when you reopen, then it's kind of warm because you will reopen with all these values.

I mean, I heard like the speech yesterday of Francois Laguen in Quebec has reelected for four years, is that we need to push Quebec in green solutions. This is priority number one economically. So he's embracing the Paris Accord. He's embracing all that globalist stuff. So how do you find something and in-between with that position? So to think that you can reopen the Constitution is absolutely what they introduced, knew what he was doing by doing that,

and this is why he accepted it that way. Without Quebec, by the way, because when the Constitution, and no, I respect Mr. Pickford, but he was very instrumental of locking down what he wanted for his province and spitting on Quebec. So because he's the one that lockdown, that final negotiation that night. In Quebec, we call it the long knife night, no, that we didn't know Kutu. When they said to Rene Levig, go back to your hotel, we're recoup tomorrow morning,

and Levik wake up the next morning, and all the other premier came to an agreement without him. So, and that was led by Peckford. So what do you think, Peckford's been on the show multiple times? I know. I know. I like hearing me. I like the guy. I like his position what he takes with that. But that doesn't remove that when he was younger,

he was a bit more feisty and did bad thing for Quebec. And used the occasion that he had because, I mean, Newfoundland was the newest, newer in the country as well. In 1949, they joined Canada. So, I mean, there was really a newbie, small province, no money, the one that could, that could, that could no suck the most from the feds and they did and they still do and and and yeah so i think he did a very good job for his province but let me say that no so so i believe he did

but at the detriment of another province at the detriment of another problem at the detriment of another even at the detriment of the country because now because of his push to to shut down the negotiation right there right now we're stuck by a constitution that we cannot reopen and and i'm I'm held him responsible for that. Aren't you a part? Sorry. No, no, I'm going, sorry. And by the way, I love Mr. Peckford, by the way.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. We have common friends, you know, I really love the way, what he's doing for freedom right now. I admire that that is fighting the way he's fighting at 80 years old. I really like the guy, okay? So, but on the political side, no, like, like he's... At the end of the day, I don't think it's, I sit in this chair,

and I get to hear all sorts of different sides of arguments. Yes. I see this all the time. I sit in this really weird chair. Because literally I hear from different provinces about different things, from their purviews and how they get it. Anyways, I can go on and on and on. And they're all really good people.

I haven't met too many people where I'm like, stay away from that human being, right? They don't want what's best. Everybody's trying to do what they believe is best. That's right. And so disagreements, I think, are perfectly, fine, actually probably needed. Yeah.

It's being able to sit back at the table when you have the disagreement that's a skill or an art and understanding that it's not all personal. That's right. But hearing more of the history, I think, is beneficial not only to me, but the listener. Like, I mean, we put a lot of different people up on really high pedestals of what they're doing currently, which is a good thing. I mean, honestly, what Brian's doing right now, and I literally just add him on. And you can't knock him for what he's doing at his age.

He could easily just put his feet up and enjoy the last couple decades or whatever. You know, I don't mean to say you're going out the door. No, no. Anyways. What are your thoughts on Travis Tave's thoughts on it being, you know, we've talked about the Constitution? The next one I hear, you know, is like, well, you can't do everything Danielle San. I mean, if you do that, investment out the door, people are going to flee. I mean, I'm just, I'm exaggerating a little bit, but not that month.

You know, everything is said, it's got to be time. We've got to take strategy. We've got to be this. And it's like, you fucking kidding me? At this point in time, you go, what I find out about politics is you've got to do what the, the mob, so to speak, wants. All right? When the irons are hot, you know, you go. And right now, people are like, let's do this.

If there's going to be a pain, it might as well come now instead of 15 years from now. I mean, we've already been here. But in saying that, maybe I'm wrong. Well, no taste. So again, respect the guy. I think he's a Barnegan Christian as well, which for me is a high esteem. No, I mean, I like seeing people that think the same,

theoretically speaking, at least the same line. But at the same time, I believe that I don't believe him just because of his position with Kenny. No, I've worked hard last January with TBA to get Kenney. out of there. I believe that he's a danger for this province and I believe that Taze is part of the team and still today have improved contrary to that he's just like Kenny 2.0 and I believe by the way it's a great strategy and I believe that he didn't he didn't if I would have been his council I would have had him

tying even more because can you still had 51% to vote no I mean it's not like so so so so I mean there was room for a candidate that would just partner with Kenny and start with that and start with that 51% base and build it. But somebody somewhere in Tay's team. So no, just separate yourself from him because no. And I mean, that was a mistake. Because now, now as the campaign goes, you see that it's the same lobby company that that cany dealt with that dealt with him. It's the same. It's the same, no. And for myself, by value, I don't trust the guy of being able, being a puppy of Kenny for that long. and staying again because he

know I heard that oh he regrets he was coming back home and almost crying because he was felt well no one just resign man like like if you really have conviction and this is what I respect of Lowen I mean I mean the guy just like stands for what he believe

and he does what goes with it no so which brings me to Lowen which is I believe a great candidate a great man I really like I really like the freshness of of him in politics. But I do not believe that he's,

that he has everything that he needs and mainly with, you know, to, to lead this province to what it needs to go through. So. And to steal, what does this province need to go through? And I'm going to finally get to what we talked about in an email. Was the Quebec strategy. Everybody thinks, oh, we got to take the Quebec strategy.

Do the Quebec strategy. Is that what Alberta needs to go through? I believe so. I believe Alberta needs to put his foot down and needs to put structures in place to get our money back here first, to get control of our resources, which by constitution we have the right to,

to get control of our institution, to get rid of the RCMP and other federal crap that comes. You know what in Montreal when I was 16 years old? I used to race against RCMP cars in Montreal because in the RCMP in Quebec

cannot give you a ticket. No, it's not something they do. They're like the FBI. They take care of drug case at the port of Montreal. They, no, they... You're telling me as a 16 year old kid

you pulled up beside an RCMP officer and said you want to race? Well, I mean, I mean, you're in the highway at 130. You have a RCMP car and you're passing it. You don't even slow down. because you won't pull you over.

This is not their job. They don't have the right to do that. That's what I'm saying. So as much as in the States, you won't slow down beside an FBI suburban, no? Like, they don't do that. They don't pull people over, no? So that was a big surprise for me coming to Alberta.

The first couple of months, I got a couple of tickets just because I was not thinking of it when I was seeing RCMP car. We're just not slowing down. And then, whoop. So, yeah. So I believe that that needs to happen, no. The RCMP needs to go out or stay as a federal police if there's a case between.

And in Quebec, no, you have the local police, then you have the provincial police. So basically, if a policeman, a municipal policeman, shoot somebody, it's investigated by the SQ, by the provincial police. If the provincial police shoot somebody, it's invested by the RCMP. So they are very limited in what they do. They do that. They do, they manage Interpol. So international warrant, stuff like that. They don't even manage local warrant.

Like they, the RCP, no, cannot go and take tomorrow each other at our house, no. That's the role of the provincial police. So I come back then to the Quebec strategy. I go, if I am reading this conversation right, literally whoever gets voted in here in a couple days, can, doesn't need anything. They can just start doing all of that. That's right. They can, they can start the steps to pull back money.

They can, I mean, they can, they can start the steps to have a provincial police force. Some of this isn't going to be, you know, flick a switch and it's overnight. But at the same time, you start marching towards that. Yeah. Things will start to change in Canada almost immediately, no? Well, I mean, I mean, it will change the perception of the other country towards Alberta. I believe the only one that has the grit to do that is the Daniel Smith. I mean, I mean, she's the one that

pre-not. I mean, she's just like campaign on it despite the attacks. I mean, I mean, two weeks ago, like four candidates against her. What, what's that? I mean, come on, guys. Like, like, have you that afraid? I mean. Well, I don't know. You're the, you're the policy. The guy who grew up in politics. When I saw the four

candidates come out and held a press conference, I'm like, this is the strangest thing. It shows so much weakness. It shows that, oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. She's winning. We have to attack her. I mean, man, There's so many ways to put somebody down, like, but this one, no? The other thing I thought was funny about it, and you being a guy who held press conferences,

I was like, you know, you couldn't just splurge a little bit and make it look just a touch more professional. Am I wrong on that? That's right. And that's something that I found that a lot in Alberta. In Quebec, we have a lot about the shoot, Misanen. Sometimes I have like French word that just come. Misan Saint-Saint is the way you set up stuff.

Yeah, yeah. And only that, but like we were organizing. Like in 99, I believe we, my company, we've done 480 press conferences in our year, no? Sometimes I would turn up the channel, like the news at night, and all of the press conferences were ours, our press conferences that were showing up. And then when you organize these stuff, you tend to know your journalist. and you know that this journalist know like shrimps

so you make sure that they're freaking shrimp at the buffet and then you organize your press conference closer to launch all the time to get good press if you're going to get too much journalists are the laziest people around no like if you want them easy I mean I mean

if you want bad press college at 6 a.m. somewhere I mean they don't like that no so so color press conference at 1130 have a nice a nice, a nice buffet, set up the place, put nice plants. I mean, depending of the theme of the press conference, you need to, it's a, it's a strategy. It's a strategy, and it's a theatrical setup, no?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. For the purpose of what you want to communicate. The little things, I used to always think the little things didn't matter. The little things matter so much because it gives a feel, the thought that you're thinking of people. Yeah. All these. and it adds up. It just continues to add up.

I mean, geez, knowing your background now, you got to experience an S&P Presents in March. What did you think of the feel of that event? Oh, I really love that event. Yeah, the S&P present in March. I really like it. I find it very... First, I believe that's probably the most...

These open conversation setting, I believe these are the most... exciting intellectually because because it kind of leave doors open to anything can happen there, no? And anyway, for me, this type of event just drive me in,

just like I really, but again, I'm an even junkie. So at the same time, but. Yeah, I guess I take that as an awfully high compliment as a guy who puts on and you're talking about putting on a shrimp because you know the guy, you know, and I'm like, I get what you're doing there. Like that makes a couple of,

complete sense. I mean, that takes time to understand the intricacies of different people and how media even writes and different things like that. That's really thinking out a problem in trying to

piece it together instead of just throwing the pieces on the table and saying, well, I'll see what happens, right? Yeah. Like it's really thinking out. So for you to have high compliments, geez, that's awfully kind. No. I believe it was very well done. and I like these set up, these settings. Well, what are you doing now, Ben?

You know, I feel like you took a hiatus, if memory serves me correct, from politics, trying to remove yourself, I think, from it. Well, you're sitting here. This ain't removing yourself. Well, so what happened? So in 2003, I accepted Christ and became born again Christian. And until then, in Quebec, you have to know that.

I think they changed the rules now. But like in the 90s, it was impossible to do politics without breaking the law. There was so much scandal, so much stuff happening, that every time that the new legislature will come up, they will add up some rules on how to run your political campaign and to a certain point that makes running a campaign unbearable. You cannot do it.

In 94, we started that political party. The premier at the time, Perreou wanted to crush us as a new party, so he called an election right away. we had only 75 candidates out of under 25 writing. We still grabbed 6.5% of all the votes in the province, and our leader was elected in his writing. And then he wanted to do separation in 95 the referendum, and that basically put us, basically when they did their poll,

they saw that the people that voted for us were actually the people that were undecided if they want to separate or not. So that brought us as a young party, and that was 22, our leader was 24. at the table with Paris-One-Bouchard to negotiate what would be the question for the referendum. And we were not separatists.

We were mostly sovereign associations. We wanted a strong Quebec now in the United Canada, kind of. So we had their question shift. And the question in 95 referendum was, do you give the mandate to the premier to go negotiate with Radawa? And if Radawa don't want to engage it in a year, then we separate. So it was a separation with a with a with a with a with a clause no so but that that basically when you sit at a table then you have a gun on a table if it doesn't go your way you shoot so and then that that kind of brought me in the referendum campaign but it was weird because we're partnering with the block Quebeco and the Parts Quebecois so on the provincial level we're still adversaries so people with the PQ would not help us and they would give us like just a little bit of money no judge just a little bit of

just to run the campaign with them, but it was super difficult. And we were not running the campaign at the same level as they were. And then I'm an entrepreneur. I had my first company at 14 years old, and I still have five companies right now. And I'm just like a serial entrepreneur. So for me, it was super stimulating to find solution. No home. Our leader need a plane, to go from one place to the other. We don't have a budget for our plane. How do you find a plane?

We don't have a budget of a plane. Well, I'll find you a plane. I got him a plane. So I became kind of that solution finder, but by doing so, I was infringing the law. No, the law, the law, how, no, the Quebec law on political. So after the campaign, the PQ threw me under the bus. Well, they went to trum our leader under the bus saying, oh, 45 stuff that he did against the law and all that. And then I stood up and said, it's not him, it's me. And I just left the party with these. But I was so good at what I was doing, that then Bernard Andri, when he came, Premier, came together.

came to get me to manage their. So in Quebec at that time, we had all occult parties that we were calling. So it's always like four or five guys or personal guys, and we deal with the cash, we deal with the envelopes and all that, and we make stuff happen. So we find solutions.

So at the end of the day, when the books are audited, it's clean, no? So, and then after that, was recruited because I was mostly right, toward the rights. I was recruited by Jean Charray team when Jean Charray was paid to move from the conservative to the

provincial to become provincial premier. He received a hefty premium to jump and so he followed and then then I worked for the liberals to do the same roles and and then in 2003

the party I started in 94 became official opposition and for that election I went back to the party And so when I became Christian, I said, Christian can't do that. This is not a way to deal. I mean, it might be morally okay for me,

but it's not, in principle, it's not good. So I just like clutch out of politics altogether, stop calling my people and all that. And then in 2006, Harper came in power, and I was back to school. I went back to school in urban planning in that time, and I did my Bible college at the same time, parallel. And I was in a boring, boring,

class and I typed the name of the guy that trained me in politics. It used to be the communication director of the liberal party in the 80s and a good friend of my dad and all that. So I type his name and I saw that he was the chief of staff of a minister under Harper. And so, and they had an office in Montreal. So I just pick up the phone in my break and call them. And it's funny because when the receptionist pick up, she said, oh no, it's his first at the office.

He cannot talk to you. Can I take your name? And then I gave it and then she say out loud, Ben Trudeau, and I hear him shouting in the back. I want to talk to him. So he pick up the phone and said, where are you? I need you. Minority government minister needs to say another way. I need somebody that I trust in Montreal.

So you have to come in the work for us. So I say, well, I'm not in politics anymore. I'm pastoring a church in Quebec, no, in San Juan. I'm at the university finishing my stuff. Say whatever you want, Ben. I need you. So come to the office and so I sat with him and we came to an agreement where I wouldn't work on night and on weekends and I would spend one week a month with the minister and we just like wrecked the entire ministry which was economic development for the region of Quebec. It was like Grant Central.

It was like we were managing four billion of the infrastructure budget plus 1.5 billion of internal budget that would give at private companies. so they would die slower with Chinese competition. But my job, because now I was a Christian, I said, no, I would turn. And I saw all, it was really messy. I mean, of course, you're the ministry that gives money. So there was rule that didn't make sense. So first thing is that everything goes back to the minister. We change all the programs within six months.

I was hated. It was like war zone getting in there. But then I got no, I got, I kind of, anyway, just realized that the political party is a political party. And then I start seeing the crap within the party as well. And I got in an internal war with a guy at the prime minister's office. And of course, he's at the prime minister office. I'm not. So it's funny because the minister asked me to do something with Alberta, because we're giving

1.5 billion for manufacturing in Quebec and only 1.5% of what we were manufacturing were coming to Alberta that was in a boom in 2007-2008 with construction. So I took an appointment with the Alberta Premier Office to meet him and talk to him, can we do link with, you know, with Alberta project and stuff like that. And I flew here. And the morning I was meeting Stel Mac and having as well as press conference that day. I was asked to resign. So that's how I end up in Alberta. And then I moved here and I did business. You flew here, God had to resign.

Yeah. And then decided it's time. Well, yeah. To be frank between me because I'm a believer, no, God told me. I want you to stay. I say, well, I can't. So I lost my job like 12 hours after, like knowing my prayer time and all that I heard that. So okay.

So I'll stay then. So I moved to Alberta. So that's how it happened. And then I stayed away from politics until 2008. Well, no, I had a bit of with Mr. Stelmaq, just conversation, but not very involving. And then COVID hit. And then Kenny says one thing, one day, the other, the next day. And that blew all my fuses.

I say, I kind of stayed with a seven-year-old and ten-year-old, with a premier that doesn't even stand is ground like for 24 hours. He has to go. And then I joined TV in January. So that's how I came back. I think COVID for a lot of us really blew everybody's fuse, you know? Yeah. So are you currently working on anything?

I don't know if you're allowed to talk on it. You tell me. Well, I don't know. I feel that I need to do to do a shift in what I do. business is getting very tough. No, I have some contracts. I do piling solely in the oil field in Fort Mac and have like POs like for sync crude

that has been standby for eight months. Like kind of build a business on that. No, like I have POs like I'm at my third iteration of a quote for Suncor. So all these companies are, I see that they're kind of holding stuff because they're not sure what happened with the feds and with the old thing. So business is not going well, and at the same time I feel that I need to get more and more involved.

So I don't know what the future holds, but I do know that it won't be staying the way I've been to past five, 15 years in Alberta, that's for sure. I'm going to ask you a spiritual question. You come from a culture that is against being a born-again Christian. I think I heard in there and you became a pastor. How on earth does that happen? What happened? Did you, I don't know.

What did you see? What did you feel? What did you run into? Who did you meet? 9-11 happened. So I was running. So the company of my brother, the event company, no, I joined my brother in 98. We built it from 13 employees to 200 employees.

It was run by two guys that were the age of my dad. They wore the event producers of my dad already, and we just joined, like, as the kids of the good client. That's how we got in, no. So, and in 97, I was in multimedia before that. I was doing websites and C-ROM since 1990. And then I brought my computer stock market, picked market of Toronto in 97,

but it was rigged and it was reversed the core with a mining company, three months after doing the transaction. section, Ministry of Environment of Ontario come in my office and slap on me a lawsuit of $3 million for contamination of ground in Northern Ontario, which had to do with the operation before but not. So I lost everything. So then I went and worked for my brother, you know, like in quote-unquote the felony business. And then I took care of all the, and then we just like rack up the company, like 200 employees. And our plan was to go on the stock market again.

We just opened in Toronto. We had a good deal with Dome Production, who was the Dome was controlling the satellite channels at the time for stuff. So, you know, offices, starting to plan opening offices in the fashion district of Toronto. And then our other goal was to open in New York once we become public. And it was always a fight between my brother and I in New York because he wanted an office a loft in Soho and I wanted a corner office in the Walker Center. So, and then that morning of 9-11, of course, like a lot of people, I would always remember. That morning I was at, I mean, so we had a grocery chain named Pravigo in Quebec that was bought by Lobloz at the time.

And in Quebec, there was no no-names or President-Choice product. So working on the launch of no-name president-choice product, and that morning I was in meeting with Gowan Weston at the Montreal office to launch the, both product. And then it was a very early meeting because he had to go back to Toronto. And then I go back in my car. I had a convertible.

I love cars. Anyway, so driving back, I hear that there's a plane that hit the World Trade Center. I get in my office and because we're already planning to open in New York, we had at the time satellite

no, you had Canadian satellite antenna and American satellite antenna. So I had an American satellite antenna on my office. even my office, I had that big projector screen at the end of the office and put that on, look at that fire on the first. And then the guy was for Channel 5, local Channel in New York, and it was on the roof of a building

with the Waterway Center burning behind him. And then I saw that second plane coming behind his head and hitting that second tower. And he was live, so these images had never been recorded. And then when it hit the second tower, Channel 5 went off because their antenna was on top of that tower. And for me, I freaked out when that happened. I totally freaked out. I say, I say, and I was a workaholic. I had been a workaholic that morning because of that provigial launch,

I think it was my fifth day at the office not going back to my apartment. So, so right after that, after seeing that both towers collapse, I just went home and decided to sell everything and to that it's not worth working with a bunch of crazy guys. that want to kill us, no. So, so, and I want to know who they are. My mom worked for 20 years in Africa, and at the time she was based in Tunisia. So I just flew to Tunisia and went spent time in the desert with the blue men of the desert. They run between Libya, Tunisia, Algeria, Morocco, in the desert, that then and spent a bit of time with them just to know them. Who are they? Why, why you as Muslim want to kill us, no? So, and then after that, I ended up in Paris for a little while.

My accountant has an apartment in Paris and a very nice, very nice place. So I stayed at a bit. And then when I came back to Quebec, I decided to rent a farm and get some horses and decide what I do next in my life. And I had two houses on the farm. And as I told you, only 70,000 born again Christian.

But we had one friend. My dad was born again Christian. And his daughter were four years younger than me. But anyway, she went to Bible College in Baltimore. And when she came back, ended up talking to her and I was telling her, are you still a member of your American church? Because if you are, I have a house fully furnished here,

if you need a place for people to come on weekends, stuff like that, you can use it. So she said, well, I would like to have a house for myself. So she came, settled in that house, and started dividing people from church. And each time people were rolling in the property, they would stop and tell me they were praying for me, that they were, I said, okay, nice, but not nice.

I mean, whatever. But then curiosity, the way Noah was already, Like I was already two years in that process. That was in 2003, no? So I was already in my second year in that process of what do I do next? No, like, I'm freaking 30 years old, no, like, so I, yeah. And then I end up going to that church and really retouched by God and by what I saw. And we had a very personal experience of God, you know, that transformed my life.

And, yeah. So that's what happens spiritually. Yeah. Well, I appreciate you, Sharon. I don't know. People hear this now as the podcast. The new iteration keeps coming, you know, and I was saying this to Paul Brandt after me and him sat and had our chat,

and he opened up about his faith a little bit. Just in the world today, you know, we went from, I would be very uncomfortable to ask those questions. I'm just like, I just want to hear. Let's talk about it a bit because in our society, we've moved so far away from it. That's right. but people understand there's something like there's just something else going on.

I don't know what it is, but it doesn't surprise me that you're sitting across there had an experience at one point and that changed your life and now you're sitting in Alberta instead, you know, like I'm just like, I don't know why that is. Sometimes I don't want to know why that is. Just curiosity always leads me down this path of asking a few more questions on it because I generally, yeah, I'm just, generally curious about it.

Yeah. It's funny because I believe that the church is guilty of a lot of shame towards towards ourselves. I mean, I believe even even Barnegan Christian are very often legalistic and often like, I mean, when I became Barnegan Christian, I was on the board of the Gay Olympics organization in Montreal because I wanted to pick up their events production. So I mean, there's not much stuff that that disturbed me, no, and I believe that Christianity often just like shut door to people just for who they are

or what they do instead of just opening and discussing instead of chatting. So yeah, so I believe that we are in an era where we need to open on that. And we need to tell that that gospel of Jesus Christ have room for everybody, no? Not just like, and you don't have to be like a stiff ass not being open to anybody, you know? So anyway. Well, I guess I look at it. And I don't know. I don't know. Sometimes I wonder, you know, I'll get a bunch of texts after this.

But I was talking to Paul about, you know, just going to Ottawa and then coming back, it just keeps, I don't know, presenting itself. And me sitting here, I go by a moniker now of like endlessly curious. And when I hear that, I'm like, I just want to pull on the string just a little bit to see what happens, you know? And I go back through a ton of my interviews with different hockey stars, and they have these moments where I'm just like, and what is that? And they're almost caught off guard a little bit. I don't know, sometimes you shouldn't ask that question.

I'm like, oh, that seems strange. Like, I want to ask a question. Yeah. And Paul talks about traveling. You talked about going to the desert and different things like that. That must have been an interesting experience. Because Paul talks about going to Cambodia and different places like that and experiencing what, you know, I asked him about evil.

And he talked about seeing the worst that humanity has to offer. And he started up, not in my city, which is all about ending, you know, child trafficking. And, you know, that type of industry, which none of us want to admit goes on. Yeah. But knowing it does is like, oh, right? And he talked about how different parts of the world, especially the poorer nations, are really in tune with the spiritual side of the world because they haven't forgot. You know, when you talk about how busy you were up to 9-11, that's a story that isn't

actually quite commonplace in North America. Yes. You want to get ahead? You work every last hour you got to get there. And we lose part of what being human is all about. And I'm not sitting here, folks, I don't have the answer. I'm not, I'm just understanding that it's becoming a common threat. and that thread I pull on from time to time

and see what comes of it because I'm trying to learn just like everybody else. You know, when you go back to the desert, what was, you talked about getting to know people, wanting to understand why they were doing what they were doing? What did you find out in the desert around that time in your life? Well, what I found out, it's funny because what I found out the most is that as human, we all have the same desires.

We all have only to be loved first. foremost love accepted and and and and and and whether you're Buddhist, Muslim or or Christian or Hindu no like so so that that that's what I discovered first is that there's way more in common in human nature than we think there's more in common human nature than we think as well on the bad side as well and know that the the Bible says that that that the heart is corrupted and cannot be healed and that's true it needs to be changed so anyway so I won't I won't start preaching there but what I discovered mainly like for instance in

Algeria I was I was in a cafe and the they started again bombing a French own apartment from France and so the French were target in Nigeria at the time in Algeria and basically

what you found is these spiritual leaders just like put spins in the mind of these young men so basically no like in Muslim religion like in Christianity technically you don't have sex before marriage

but then they had up that layer in Islam that to get married you have to provide your wife with a house with so when you start impeding that first resource of housing for a Muslim guy

then you basically prevent him to have sex because he can provide housing to his wife And that spiral up. And then there's some imam and some spiritual leaders that just use that to crank them up against... Control their population.

Yes. And I guess, no, and then start saying, you know what? You know, why does that apartment mean that price? Because that guy from Paris just bought that condo for that price. And if that guy from Paris didn't buy that condo, you could be able to have it. So go and kill him and then we get it, no?

So that's where it goes. So when you go to the route, it's not that they hate that guy. It's just like they feel threatened by that guy, by the lifestyle that guys come and impose in their country. And I found out it's often that, you know? People feel threatened in their faith, feel threatened in what they know. So only their world get rocked and they don't want that

and then they react. And I believe Islam is very good at doing that. with their people. So, and I guess, I guess, I guess Christians too, but the thing with Christianity is that if you go to the core of Christianity, no, like, Mohammed and Jesus were both persecuted the same in their life. Jesus, no, and served by surrender and by love, and Mohammed and served by war. So, so that's the only thing that I, that I have, that the concern that I have is that if you have like 1% of extreme Christian that just dig in and just want

to be like Jesus, nothing wrong can really happen. If you have only one person Muslim that dig in and just want to be like Mahamed were in trouble. And that's a difference between the two, no? Well, I've really enjoyed this chat.

This has been, it's gone a full gambit here today, Ben. It's been all over the place. On the politics side one last time here in Canada, in Alberta, Saskatchewan. When you look at the general layout of things, is your thought that Alberta will lead the way in forcing change in Canada? Is that your thought? Or does it need to be a federal push instead of a provincial one?

I think it's both. I think Alberta, I need to take a stance quite quickly. And then I believe, I'm working in fact right now, I'm starting a new political formation with the guy named Grant Abraham who was candidate for a conservative and he's been kicked out very early in the race a bit wrongfully by the establishment of the conservative party.

And what I believe what I'd like is to create just like an organization just to bridge. I believe the solution would be for Quebec, for instance, Quebec and Liberia to do a referendum the same day on the same question with the same question of 95, saying we want to change the top, we want to take you out, you have one year to negotiate, otherwise we separate.

And then to bring that message there, I believe we need kind of a Western formation, like a Reform 2.0. So a Maverick party. Like a Maverick party that will gather. But we need a strong leader. We need a leader that like, anyway, I, yeah. I said enough for that, but, but, but I get what you're saying.

But, but we need that type of formation. And then, and then I believe what we need to do is to build that bridge with, with the block in Quebec, because, because they hold a lot of stuff. And, and know what? If we, if we go back in 96, 97, there was like 55 MPs for the reform. There was 54 MPs in Quebec for the block. Both of them could, could have formed a coalition party at the time and topple the power, no? So I'm just saying that I believe that's a solution

to steer up enough provincially that suddenly know that there's some fume that rise to the top and then you have a party that takes a strong stance, not only for Western, but mostly for against post-nationalism. So I believe to say that our party is only for the West, that's why I don't like the Mavericks. That's not true. So the party is for Canada,

but our candidates in our stance is for the West because we see our stuff our way. And our goal is to build a bridge with another party that wants to see separation on the other side and together topple the top. And I believe that's the way we're going to join Alberta with Quebec. Because at the end of the day, if we come with a solution to change the way the top works, I mean, we're in for a party, you know.

And then after that, Quebec can go as left if they want. They can do whatever they want, but we'll take control of our future. sure well I appreciate you coming in and doing this I've given you just about every curveball heater etc back at you to see where I can get you squirmer and I've really enjoyed the conversation I'll give you the final one here before I let you out it's the crude master final question showed it to Heath and Tracy McDonald they've been supported as a podcast since the very beginning I always joke around that has not been an easy thing but it's it's words if you're going to

stand behind a cause, then stand behind it absolutely. What's one thing Ben stands behind? I stand behind the faith. I believe that faith and a system that has been built with Christian Christian principle is the best system. And I believe, and again, I'm not against any other religion, but I believe that faith people know you have to stand for your faith. and this is why I stand for, I will always stand behind my faith in Jesus Christ. And of course, my judgment, everything would be biased with that. But at the same time, when I die, I would rather be said he was a man that loved God than anything else. So that's why I stand for.

Well, I appreciate you coming in and doing this. And being as open as you have been to all the questions I've had, well, I'm sure paths will cross in the future yet again. But either way, thanks for making a dry vote here. and you know you got a sunny day out there at least and appreciate you making the time to come do this. Yeah, thank you.