Shaun Newman Podcast - #378 - Nicole Murphy

Episode Date: January 27, 2023

She has a decade of experience in the media world & runs East Anchor Media. She is the host of the Nicole Murphy Podcast, organizes events that build community, & is educating content creators in media literacy. Let me know what you think Text me 587-217-8500

I'm Rupa Subramania. This is Tom Korski. This is Ken Drysdale. This is Dr. Eric Payne. This is Dr. William Mackis. Hi, this is Shadow Davis from the Shadow at Night live stream, and you are listening to the Sean Newman podcast. Welcome to the podcast, folks. Happy Friday.

Man, it's been a full freaking week. You know, with another five, well, this would be the fifth episode out this week. SMP Presents, Happened, live streamed, was the live show Sunday night. It's just been busy. Mel actually let me sleep in Thursday morning. And I was just like normally I get up right away. I mean, sleeping in, sorry. With the kids, sleeping in was like 7.45 and she just took care of things,

and I owe her one now. But I got to sleep in and just kind of like recoup a little bit. You know, I've been pushing her pretty hard here. And today is a fun little interview. Of course, we're going to get to that. But I got exciting news. I'm just waiting on a couple of things before. I can give everything.

I know I said I'm going to give a few things away here this week. Well, March 18th is the next SMP presents. It's going to be focused on Legacy Media. It's going to be in Eminton. So mark your calendars. March 18th in Eminton, Legacy Media. I got some cool speakers coming. But before I release all that, I want to make sure that it is nailed down and we got no issues.

We've got two or three. Um, ready to roll. And I'm just waiting on the third. As soon as I have that, uh, tickets will be on sale. I'll have links posted everything. And believe me, I'm pushing hard. I want to get this out to all of you as soon as humanly possible. I'm excited for it.

Uh, after the way the SMP went in Lloyd here. I mean, I just, I'm just excited for the next one. And, uh, I think everyone who came certainly enjoyed themselves. So, uh, March 18th, Eminton, we're coming for you, uh, with met, uh, uh, the, uh, the title or the topic being legacy media. I think that's going to be a lot of fun and it should be some interesting thoughts shared, some different speakers that you're going to be excited for. Some podcast guests, let me tell you it's going to be fun. All right, let's get on to today's episode sponsors before we get to Nicole. That is rec tech power products. They've committed to

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lubricants, methanol, and chemicals delivering to your farm, commercial, or oilfield locations for more information, visit them at hancockpatroleum. com.ca. She has a decade of experience in the media world and runs East Anchor Media. She is the host of the Nicole Murphy podcast, organizes events that build community, and is educating on media literacy. I'm talking about Nicole Murphy.

So buckle up. Here we go. This is Nicole Murphy, and you're listening to the Sean Newman podcast. Welcome to the Sean Newman podcast today. I'm joined by Nicole Murphy. So first off, how is Nicole this morning? And thanks for hopping on. I'm feeling good.

Excuse me, as I cough. No, I'm feeling really good. I'm excited to chat with you because I know we have passions that align. And, yeah, I'm curious to see where this conversation goes. Yeah, well, I was saying to you just got to meet Tuesday as he was walking in out of the studio. And twos for everybody who follows the show knows exactly who he is. He's, you know, he's been a part of one of my events. He's been on every Tuesday now for like, you know, minus Christmas, I think, you know, 39 in a row.

So he's become a fixture of the show, so to speak. And so I was saying to him, like, the last time we talked, we talked for like an hour and a half. And I'm like, anyway, she just, you know, click the record button next time. And, you know, because it was a lovely little chat on a whole bunch of different ideas. But let's start here. Let's start with Nicole, who she is because, you know, I chuckled when this, all these things keep kind of, you know, colliding. And, you know, my thoughts on this. But I go back to my Instagram, the start of the year, I said, hey, guys, who do you want to hear?

And they said, Nicole Murphy. And I went, I quickly did Google search. And I got Eddie Murphy's ex-wife. and there's been people say to me, you're getting Eddie Murphy's ex-wife on? I'm like, no. I'm like, I don't know why I would do that. But anyways, I'm sure it would be interesting. And you reached out, and from there, you know, all of a sudden you realize there's close connections that that's why you got filtered my way.

But maybe we should start with a little bit about Nicole so people can get a feel for you and we'll go from there. For sure. And we'll just say, I saw your story. And I replied to you, it's me. It's not Eddie Murphy's. Or I said, or Eddie Murphy's ex-wife. Because I've Google searched my name before. So I've been in media for just over 10 years, just about 10 years.

I took the radio and television broadcasting program at Nate. I worked at CTV Morning Live while in school. I have worked in alternative media. I've worked creating documentaries, doing community television, getting grants, working on short films, working on longer form films, running the school newspaper at Nate later on in my career, and also teaching in the radio television program when 2021 hits. And we get some mandates coming in.

And long story short, I lost both my positions at Nate. One, I was put on unpaid leave because that's what the school was doing. And then I was working for the Students Association running the school newspaper for at that time. It was around four years. And they fired me without cause. Now, they also asked me to sign a do not disclose for, extra mullah and I did not. I was really lucky because I was hired at the Pulse, which is an alternative media company, so I didn't need that money at the time. So I'm really grateful I

didn't sign that because I can talk about it. I was like, I'm a storyteller. I can't be scared to share the story. And I worked with alternative media for about nine, 10 months when I was fired for budget issues. But I was in Ottawa, which was amazing. That was one of the best things. And now I'm building my own stuff, doing a podcast, creating a media company, and really dedicated to media literacy. But really, that's just critical thinking and self-awareness in so many ways. So, yeah, that's kind of the media overview. Can we, when you talk about creating a media company, what do you mean? So right now, I've had an incorporation for a few years because I was really, really lucky to get a grant to create a web series.

from Tell a Story Hive. But in order to get that grant, you needed to incorporate. And this was pretty early on in my career. And so I've had this incorporation sitting there. So I've just kind of rebranded that incorporation to East Anchor Media. This is new. And what we're going to be doing on East Anchor Media is we are going to be looking at content from all walks of life, from all sides, if that's what we want to say,

alternative, mainstream. And we're going to say, hey, here's some good things about this article. Here's some things that could have been better. but nobody's safe. We're going to do it really nicely. I'm going to look at my past articles and say this is what works,

this is what didn't. Because what I see is fear mongering happening on quote unquote both sides. And simple broadcasting things that I learned in school about writing articles, things like that, are not being utilized. And I think we can just bring attention to that. Yeah.

Where does the name East Anchorage? media come from. Okay, so really years ago when I incorporated, it was East Anchor productions, that's my incorporation. I, my family, my dad's side is the family's from the East Coast, but East also means like new beginnings. Okay. And the sun.

And there's symbolism in all kinds of religions that that is like a new beginning. And Anchor is like that solidness. It's hope. It's groundedness. So there's symbolism with both the words. And if I'm honest, there is. is spiritual meaning, but also I thought it sounded just like a production company. I thought it sounded, it was something that I could create that wasn't Nicole Murphy.

So it could expand, if that makes sense. Yeah, certainly. I mean, obviously, you know my backstory on Sean Newman. It isn't West Anchor, you know, or whatever. I'm not clever enough to come up with different things. I always just went simple and made sure it, but the problem with Sean Newman and I've experienced this and you've probably experienced it with Nicole Murphy

is like I feel really uncomfortable having people talk on my behalf because it's me and so like but it comes with its downs and ups. One of the great things is it's me, you know, you get who you get and if you like me, you like me, if you don't, you know, kind of move on. The downside is is having, I tried this for a little bit, having somebody run my Twitter

and it was really difficult because at some point I lost, you know, I don't know how to explain this, but I'll try, kind of lost, the Twitter is me. And then once you start having people say thoughts for Sean Newman, it's like, did I say that? You know, and it got really confusing even for me. So I just backed off that. Exactly. And like I have the Nicole Murphy or Nicole Murphy podcast, which is branded towards me. but exactly what you're saying.

I don't, it gets a little bit sticky and I wanted that ability to have expansion and other projects like, you know, big movie companies and stuff where it can be other teams. Yeah. So when you look at media, you know, I can say this aloud, I think, now, but now that the SMP presents, the rural urban divide is over this past Sunday. The next one coming in March is going to be S&P. presents legacy media. We're going to discuss that's going to be the next topic.

You're a lady who's been in it for a long time, or in my opinion, a long time. You know, different people would say different things. But you said that simple things in broadcasting aren't being used or aren't being done. What sticks out to you that you're like, man, we need to get into the space and we need to start, I don't know, I'm going to say correcting,

but you are maybe pointing out or whatever word you want to use. What's really sticking out to you? The biggest thing I would say is the point of journalism, the point of media, and what I was taught in school is to hear the people's story, right? The people on the ground, what's happening to them? I had a really amazing instructor who said she'd be sitting in restaurants and just listening to conversations around herself. She's like, some people think that's nosy, but as a journalist,

as someone who's looking for the stories, you want to be looking and listening to the people around you. And so at the beginning of the pandemic or when vaccines started to roll out, I was listening and going on the internet and trying to find the stories that weren't being told. That was my training.

And very quickly, you find a lot of vaccine injury. And to me, a journalist is dedicated to citizens. We are dedicated to the average person and finding truth for them and sharing their voice. I'm not dedicated to the government's website. I'm not dedicated to the authorities. I'm dedicated to the citizens. I'm getting emotional actually talking about this right now. And that's been the most frustrating part is a wave, and I'm sure it's existed for a long time,

but this wave of ego overcoming the media. industry where they're dedicated to feeling special from a politician or a celebrity or whatever it is or they themselves are now in celebrity status and they're not listening to the stories of the people on the ground in fact there's like a fear and that has been um the most painful thing to see um and then there's simple things like i was taught not to use adjectives and articles. Don't use descriptive words and articles because you're going to guide your reader. When there's adjectives, it should be in the quotes of the people that you've interviewed. That's where you get the perspective.

So go read articles. You'll see that there's lots of adjectives now on both sides. Yeah. You know, when you phrase talk about journalism is for the common person, common people, I always, one of the things, you know, as a kid, I think there's an allure to being a cop. I just, I think there's something role model, something, I don't know, maybe it's just the gun. I have no idea. But one of the things I always wanted, I had multiple things I wanted to be when I was growing up, but one of them was a detective. I always thought, you know, like, let's solve some problems and help people and everything else.

And one of the things that journalism does, right, is, is it, is it, is, is it, is, that you're a detective with media credentials but with without the you know the guns and everything but you watch any movie and usually the you know a ton of it is done by somebody who has found something out by digging and you know I laugh in Canada here you know you you want it to be I think we all want it to be the CBC the CTV the global blah blah blah blah and and actually we just talked about a global story and I'm spacing on what it was about now it was a not what is about it was about federal liberal government corruption on the inside and it was actually relatively

pretty good but I draw back and the thing I've noticed through COVID is how many regular citizens including this guy who have no training just started talking to the regular person and that became that became like taboo like you're you're doing something wild and when I hear you talk I'm like no that's I mean I mean, it feels like that might be journalism 101. You talk to people, you let them say what they don't want to say, and you followed up with different things, and you start to, anyways. I think that's what's cool about journalism.

It allows every citizen to be a bit of a detective trying to dig and find out stories, even though they say doing your own research is bad and don't do that. It's like, that's journalism, is it not? 110% and of course there's going to be people like anything like someone who can sing there's going to be different degrees as to equality of it certainly and I would highly recommend everyone practice researching discernment skepticism you know seeking out the truth questioning themselves debating nuance and it is that is journalism 101 yeah like I want to just put into perspective here for people who are listening and yourself. Like I was taught,

if there's an issue or something, I'm doing a news package on it. I'm doing a minute 30 news package or an article. I'm supposed to find the people person, the person dealing with the problem. They're more important than the expert in the story. Like that was what I was taught. Now, of course, you want the expert opinion. That's not, you want that. But they're like, without that people person who's dealing with the thing, the story is like, it's not as, it's what it needs to be. Just think about that. Where there's been this huge light on the expert. And experts are important.

However, there's expertise within expertise within what makes someone an expert. So, yeah. Well, and I mean, even if you get an expert, if you got three experts with slightly different backgrounds together, they would probably argue about said problem. what I mean, I come back to the SMP presents, and I hate to beat my own drum a little bit, but the idea comes from a conversation me and Mike Kuzmiska said back on episode, I believe, 215, where we're just like, why aren't we putting different people in a room together and talking about a said problem? We'd probably get some interesting ideas. I'm not saying we're

going to solve anything, but we'd probably get some interesting ideas. But when you treat one person as of the gospel, which we did, and nobody challenged or questioned or an imping. they did, I mean, people did question and challenge, they got silenced or removed or I mean, like, we all laugh about it at this point because it's just like we all witnessed it and watched it. Yeah. But the big media corporations didn't report on it. Or if they did, they called them, you know, like, what are the keywords now, Nicole? I don't know, conspiracy, right wing, extremist. There's a couple other ones there. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. It's, it's wild. It's been wild to see. And it's been wild to see, yeah, people I went to school with, instructors that I

were taught by, people I mentored, like, lose it. That's the other thing I want to clear up is, for the most part, I think a lot of people on the alternative side want to just say, like, legacy media is just a bunch of liars. They're just people who are lying. And what I would say is knowing a lot of these people, either directly or through a friend, or working with them or whatever, it's mostly, I think, just being uninformed, not wanting to know. There's people my age who I've seen are like four-vaxed. Like anybody in their 30s or 20s who are quadruple-vaxed, they believe it. And they're working in media. Nobody's doing that, not believing it. So, yeah, I think there's a lot of, like, wanting to make media the bad guy for just just, justifiable reasons.

But I think it's also just a lot of people who don't know. Well, I think the skeptic or the person who sits where I sit and watches it, one is they have a slant, a very big slant to what they write. One. Two, they're funded by the government. Like, me and you get a million dollar contract with, and I don't know, Nicole gets signs on with whatever company. you want immediately you're less likely to talk bad about said company because they're paying your bills I mean this is just a conflict of interest and so you have a government who is giving you money to continue what you're doing in your career

that you probably love and you already have a bias to one side of the argument chances are you're going to that's just human nature is it not so yeah I don't I don't think they're all evil people by any stretch I think the process of what's going on or the structure is certainly not good and the thing is is like you already said it if you did just a little tiny ounce of digging you're going to run into somebody who has a story that is heartbreaking that should be pushed to a mainstream media that they do not want out there you would find just all these stories over like just go anywhere anywhere in the independent media right now. And there's all these stories of people just hurting, like, immensely, and none of it

being talked about because they're sticking to a narrative. Anyways, rant over for Sean. No, it's interesting. I just did a little reel the other day, and I want to dive deeper. CBC actually just did an article showcasing vaccine injuries. And I thought it was so fascinating because the main, like, point at the close to the top is that the person who dealt with this vaccine injury, the doctor, it was hard to convince the doctor that it was connected. And then once this person spoke out, a bunch of other people had a similar reaction, and it was hard to convince the doctors that it was a reaction. Now, here's where it gets interesting. They put inside of here, but like, just so you're clear, this is very, what was the word they use?

Like, essentially very rare. Here's the numbers from a Canadian government spot. And I'm like, where's our ability to think critically? where do you think those numbers come from? The doctors that you're featuring in this article that the people are talking about who are denying the vaccine injury. So what's interesting, and this is what I'm going to be pointing out a lot, is the reason why legacy media is trusted is because they actually know how to write a proper article

where the skill set sometimes lacks on the alternative side for people who aren't trained, right? Yeah, the skill set lacks in Sean to write an article. That's fair. Yes. And to do it in a way that's like presents as fast. factual because they were presenting facts, but you need that critical thinking piece. You need a journalist who goes, wait a second, the number I'm saying here. And maybe this journalist does know this, but they're trying to get around that by showing the vaccine injury. To be fair, like, I think there's people within the system who are doing their best and trying

to create an article that they're not going to get in trouble for. But it's like the pieces aren't clicking. It's like the number you're presenting is very rare is, is, is, coming from the people who are denying the injury. Yeah. It's interesting. I always go back. Well, right now I talk about, I think it's a Seymahultra, the doctor from Britain. He's been on the BBC now, so they've had him on. He's talked about it. And he has this lovely, you know, is it rare? Yeah, it, like, in a sense, it is rare. He uses the number one in 800. We can probably assume that, you know, that that's, that's probably, it's a little

more than that, but even use the one in 800. But then he then he goes on to talk about COVID and how it's like one in, you know, whatever number it was. Like it's, it's like triple that. Let's just 3,000. You get the point. It's like when you do the math on that, it's a small percentage each way that anything was. But he goes, but when you do a risk analysis, it's like it's like the, the vaccine is way more harmful essentially. And you're like, ah, it makes, that makes, you know, that pretty much makes perfect sense. And we should probably just let everybody know that. so we can move on with life except you know this is where people get so frustrated because our lovely leaders going you know just get vaccinated and we'll keep on

pushing through everything and blah da da da da meanwhile the number you know and then they won't talk about that and here I am getting caught up on it all over again it's it's this you want to talk about emotion from you on media it's like when the same message gets drilled into people even though it's so clear to I think more and more and more people, let's just get back on with life. And yet, that's where we are. You know, I just, I'm, I'm, I'm almost talking myself into a circle, Nicole, this morning. No, it's true. It's, it's the frustration of, like I was said this the other day to someone. I'm like, what am I missing? Because I really like to see the other side. Like, I really do. So I'm like,

what am I missing at this point? Because I don't see how someone can still, be into the vaccinations, not with, yeah, doctors coming forward and I can't remember his name again. He's great. Assamahalra. Yeah, he's going to be, it's going to be people like him or John Campbell. John Campbell has done an amazing job. John Campbell has done an amazing job. I'm taking, yeah.

He is the most unbiased guy. If you don't know who that is, I think you do. I think everybody on this show probably knows who Dr. Campbell is. But his YouTube videos where he just takes any study, anything, and just goes through it, just was like, well, let's just talk about it. And he just checks things off. But he, I mean, he was one of the earliest guys I saw talked to vaccine injured people

and actually just hear their stories and just share their stories. That's all he was doing. And, like, that stuff was wild. You know? He's great. So I think people like that are going to bring along others that, for example,

some people who know truth but are maybe a little more hyperbolic in it or expressing it. They're going to bring along other people. They're going to do, they're going to feed their audience and serve them. But it's going to be the people who've changed their mind and we see that change that it's going to be, it's going to be huge. Okay, here's a question for you then. So we did the SMP Presents Rural Urban Divide.

And I had a listener say, you should do an SMP presents in a city this time and do it the urban rural divide, right? Had the different speakers up and people can tune in to. to that on well I forget what episode it is but anyways it just came off anyways the point is when we got talking the idea I had in my mind was we assume the cities are like raw raw vaccine and I don't know why I say this because I you know it it sounds stupid even as I say it but I just I just assume they're against everything that I believe and then when the longer we talked you know we we had some very smart guys on stage that are talking about you know like the ability for social media and AI chat and a bunch of different things to really

construct arguments that maybe none of us believe and so I go I assume because world leaders are still talking about it that people are still like heavily bought in and certainly there are some people that are still getting boosters and everything else but I wonder how much or maybe you can shed a light or maybe you have an idea or maybe you don't. How much do you think the cities or that group of people that I think think way differently than me are actually still bought into all this? So I believe we are definitely the majority in general. And the way I came up with that is I went and looked at how many booster shots were taken.

and I don't know what it is today, but I think it last time I checked a while ago was like 25% in the booster uptake across Canada. So that statistic leans itself to those are the fundamental believers. I think that's about it. I think in cities there's definitely more. I talked off the record to someone in the financial industry that confirmed from me

that a lot of people in the banks in the cities didn't believe that bank accounts were shut down because it was a lot of rural branches that were shutting down bank accounts for Ottawa. So it wasn't as much in the city. So I can say that there is a divide. Most of my friends are from the city and a lot of people are questioning things now.

There's a fear, though. There seems to be like a, yeah, So I'm wondering if we certainly in the middle of in the middle of COVID this wasn't an urban rural divide this was like it didn't matter where you were didn't matter if you wrote a little home on Saskatchewan where I'm originally from or you were in the big city of Toronto there were people that had different ideas the pressures were different because obviously in a city of being around that many people etc etc versus being out on the farm you can understand the pressures

were different, but everybody had the same arguments. Everybody had the same like interactions with family, friends, et cetera. And that is a lot of fear. That is a lot of propaganda. That's a lot of different things. Now I sit here and I go, as we're all coming out of this and some have come out of it two years ago. Others are coming out of it today. Others are still stuck in it. You get the point. I'm like, how do we find a way to bridge a gap that I feel like might be artificially there. Certainly, certainly on different topics and what impacts each life. I know there's a gap there. I get it. But when it comes to this one thing, it's like, I feel like we could bridge a gap and have everybody on the same page. Well, not everybody,

but you get the point. Uh, is it one, a first nations man once said, come to us, come out to the, to the different areas that we live and come talk to us instead of us always coming and talk to you and now with the listener giving me the idea of the urban rural divide and going to a city and having them talk about their thoughts on it as a way to bridge that gap i don't know i'm spitballing this morning and you're you're the you're the person who's catching it live so i love it i love it because this is what i'm really passionate about is the bridging the divide that you're speaking of that that that act is the it is the issue um i actually didn't interview this might uh tricker some people i didn't interview with a guy who has supernatural abilities and he said he got a download in 2019 that said

there's going to be a great deception and they're not the darkness is not going to care which side people pick they just want you on a side fighting the other side they just want you and i'm just going to say my thoughts they just want you in self-righteousness. They just want you tying your identity to your rightness. They just want you in that angst because that's where people are controlled. That's where that's where love diminishes, right? Love can't survive in that any or doesn't exist there. It's not the frequency. So how do we connect and build that bridge? Is that even possible? Like, these are great questions. I know it's possible.

I'm an eternal optimist. Eternally, in some days, I'm sure it annoys people all the living can be. And I have to assume great things are possible. We've seen great things happen in history, you know. I just, I lean back on, I think that everybody knows this name, Gandhi, right? What he pulled off, and I, Sean Newman is not Gandhi. Let's be very clear. Like, that man was special.

But what he did with noncompliance and no violence and everything else and just like changing. the British Empire, like, it's possible. It doesn't mean that it won't be hard. It certainly will be, right? But like, I just go, it's artificially, like, if, I forget, you know, one listener's not going to be yelling at the radio, I always joke, but they're certainly going to be firing me off a text as soon as they hear this because I'll butcher this a little bit, but like a population that's all aligned is pretty hard to control, right?

because they're going to be like unless you have the right leader it's way easier to have us fight amongst each other and just do whatever the heck you want and no accountability and everything else and what have we had for the last probably three years if not longer is just like a leader walk around pit two populations against each other that went all the way down to the family unit I don't know how many people I've talked about that are divorced that aren't talking to family aren't talking to friends and the list goes on you know how unhealthy that is for us all ridiculously. And yet that's where it is. And somehow people have to work on themselves and repair those relationships because the amount of fear that got absolutely injected into everyone, nobody escaped

that. I don't care who you were. Nobody escaped that. Even if it didn't come into your brain, it definitely came into people all around you. And so like to acknowledge that and to move forward and then to start talking to people, I'm just like, how many people that I think don't think like me, or at least don't agree in some parts, or walking around in a deep depression or like, you know, like when we went to Ottawa, you went to Ottawa, I remember seeing this. I'm so happy because I've been walking around relatively awake

or whatever for a year, maybe longer. And so to me, no mask, I was just over the moon, right, to see all these people and hugging or whatever. But there was people in Ottawa that were literally terrified. I can remember this like it was yesterday to pull their mask down to even smile and just say hello because they're like, you know, I can lose my job for this. I could, whatever. And you could see it literally on their face.

And I'm like, I never lived in that much terror. I was never terrified that much. Like that level of terror, you could literally read the body language and everything else. And somewhere, while that happened not just there, it happened across all these different cities and different areas, maybe even different rural community. Yeah, rural communities. And somehow we have to be gentle about that to like, but at the same time, there has to be a bridge form that, I don't know, maybe I'm wrong.

So I just want to clarify, so you were seeing people who were terrified to take their mass downs for being seen at the protest? For being seen, for being seen. Or being afraid. Being seen for anything to do with, like, not following mandates, regulations, everything. Yeah.

They were just getting a coffee at a, Tim Horns. This was like day one and a half. Yep. And you're like, all you got to do is, man, is open your eyes and look outside and see what's going on. There's like a thousand people racing around with nothing on. Nobody cares what you do, but it was put into everyone's head so much that you were being watched at all times and you don't do it. You're fired. And that was Ottawa. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that never happened in Lloyd. I'm sorry. It never got that bad. It got bad. It never got that bad. Yeah, it's so interesting. I posted the other day, just putting the question out there, what would the world look like right now if over the last few years no one was afraid to

lose their job for actually saying whatever they thought? What would the world look like if people weren't afraid to lose their job? And it would be different. I know lots of people who, man, they're so scared to speak out because of that exact reason. Um, Yeah, it's wild. But, but with every good or bad, the opposite grows as well. So with all this that came, think of the rise of independent media. Even Joe Rogan, he saw an exponential growth in what he does because people were searching it out.

They wanted to hear somebody talk about what was actually happening outside. And one of the best things that maybe happened through COVID was people such as yourself or there's a whole list of them that have found their voice and are starting to use it. And that might be the best thing that happened. So the world, although would be maybe not so dark, we probably wouldn't have had the rise at such an exponential rate of some of the independent media who are willing to talk openly about what they're seeing and how crazy it is. I totally agree. And I think it's just getting started because there's people changing their minds. So even though I know people have taken a hit with censorship and things like that, what's going to start to happen is people are going to go, oh, this person had the guts to say something when it was not popular. And that's how you build trust in an audience. People aren't seeking perfection.

They want, like Joe Rogan, I disagree with Joe Rogan on things sometimes. but I trust Joe Rogan is seeking truth and that he's authentic in some capacity. I don't get the strong vibe he's trying to control me or guide me to something or that he has, you know, like we all have our biases. However, I don't think people are seeking perfection. They're just seeking someone who's trying to seek truth, right? Like this is something I talk about too is every single, the people who are seeking perfection, I think might lean towards legacy media.

If you're looking for certainty, if you're seeking to feel certain, you're going to be attracted to different media than if you're seeking to explore and get curious and learn and grow. So every single media professional, you and I, we have said something that's probably not true. That's misinformation. Yeah. Just like every media company out there,

just like every media professional, the truth like it's it's an exploration so um people need to learn to discern within themselves and i think that's really scary if they're seeking certainty that sean newman is always going to say what it's what exactly right and if he doesn't i'm a fucking out of here like that's someone who i don't think trusts their ability to discern truth so they're always seeking outside of themselves somebody to tell them what to think. And that's happening on both sides, in my opinion. That's,

that's a interesting point. Because one of the things I always applaud my audience for is like, listen, don't, you know, I'm just, I'm a guy sitting in a chair. You guys, there are, some of the people listen to me or, I think, are way smarter than I'll ever be, you know? They really catch on to things. They're critical thinkers, et cetera, et cetera. And, you know, I love and also don't want to, you know, pump their tires too much. But at the same time, like, you know, they catch on the things that I sometimes, you know,

glaze over or we're all in the same line or everything. But like, no different to Joe, he brings on people all the time where they're, you know, like I was just saying, like my quote on my wall is from one of the worst episodes I ever listened to them from. But sometimes I listen to a podcast and I just want the little gold nugget because the gold nugget can change your life. life or change, change how you look at different things. And certainly, um, for a lot of people through COVID, they were just wanting to know they weren't alone, right? Because the, the way the narrative was formed made a lot of us feel like we're alone.

We're going crazy. And what you're seeing in front of your eyes isn't real. And the truth of the matter is once people started talking about it and you started bouncing into people that are like, no, I'm seeing the same thing as you. You're like, oh, okay, well, that's good because for a while there, I'm like, well, what am I doing different, right? And it felt really alone, I think is one of the words you probably hear the most. When you talk about the rise and you see like, you're an interesting lady.

Somehow we run into each other. Now I'm coming to Sylvan Lake, you know, and it's funny. It's sold out now, which is cool. Congrats, by the way, for all you ladies that are putting on this event. When you talk about the rise and what you're excited about and seeing things, It's like, what excites you about what's coming in the future for you? Because, you know, a lot of people want to stare at the World Economic Forum. They want to stare at, you know, for me, I stare at the Alberta election.

That's what I'm going to be talking about lots. And people are going to have to get used to politics being back on here a little bit because, you know, May is a big deal, I think, for this area and maybe our country. But when I hear optimism, I'm like, ooh, that's something that's been lacking for a long time. So what makes you optimistic about the future and what are you seeing from me? your end. Yeah, our whole event set up for sovereignty. Our thing is thriving over surviving, right? So I'm really optimistic. I'm really optimistic. Why am I optimistic? I think if we take a bigger picture, look and a step outside, like, why are we here? Why are we alive? What are we here

to do on this planet? I don't think we get to tap into our potential. And I've, and I've, I've actually heard a good argument against using the word potential because they're saying, like, you are the thing. It's just like an unfolding. So it's not like where you're getting to. It's like, it's already there. Anyway, we don't tap into that without certain challenges and adversities. However, the challenges and adversities that are authentic to us will expand us and will, I think,

kind of push us towards thriving and listening to our hearts and a bunch of other things. But it's not comfortable. It's not comfortable. And so this time in the world, I think, is really key to unleashing a lot of people. And it's tough because it comes at the cost of, yeah, some pain and some people who won't take that invitation. And I don't know how to grapple with that. But I guess the optimism is, I think this is what we're here to do. It's to, even in the quote unquote, worst time, worse time, whatever that means,

one of the worst, the most difficult times, that we thrive and we connect and we experience deep love. I mean, you're in Ottawa. You get it. It was freaking cold. It was cold there. There was reasons why that shouldn't have been what it was. But it felt like there was just so much love.

So what am I trying to say? Well, when you talk about the tough times and everything and pain and things like that, you know, I've read into a lot of people that, well, the first thing that comes to mind is Cy Campbell. He was episode 18. It's funny, I've been talking about Cy a lot here the last week or two. Listeners, if you haven't done it, episode 18 of this podcast, I interview a World War II vet. He's 94 years old. He talks about D-Day. He talks about that time of his life.

He is sharp as attack. And I got to meet at the S&P Presents on this past Sunday, one of his golfing bunnies. And so if anywhere out there, SIE is listening or whoever knows Sye, I pass along a hello because he's one of those episodes, Nicole, where you go, like, out of the 400 and some I've done, you know, that's Tuesday mashups. That's archives for the people counting along. It still sticks out because here's this old guy talking about World War II. And I said, man, wasn't that time terrifying? And he looked at me and he said, that was the best time of my life. Tons of emotion, lost friends, had emotional parts in that podcast where he just wouldn't, he's like,

I don't want to talk about it. You know, a rear tailgunner of a Lancaster bomber. He saw some shit. But he said, everybody was united behind a con. common purpose and we went and I think for a lot of people who stood up to the mandates and things I've heard you know now that the pressure's off the way they had the pressure just like stoked they've talked about like you know like every day it felt like it was a fight like I'm literally going to have to go and I'm going to have to use my words or I'm going to have to use I'm going to

keep reading and analyzing whatever and when you talk about pain I guess I'm trying to wrap this all together it's like sometimes the greatest meanings in life come in the darkest hours right like that makes a lot of sense to me that's where a lot of wisdom probably comes out of that's you know how are you going to pass along what happened for two and a half years to your kids or to other people who come after us it's like we're not out of it I'm not acting like we are but that the truth of the matter is in my entire lifetime those two years are extremely strange like you got to go back to how far ago where you even get close to that in Canada you know World War II maybe there's a couple times the 80s lots of people talk about the the depression of the 80s and and out west and losing

businesses and you know and how they banded together and found ways through and in different things like that like that that that I could see so like we went through something that although difficult, painful, overall, we're finding a way through it. It doesn't mean that it's all sunshine and roses and things like that. Definitely not. But optimism, anyways. You know, I want to bring up something because this is where it gets like, I don't know if I'm going to, okay, let me see.

How well I describe this? Here's the thing, though. It's like Man Search for Meaning, Victor Frankl. It's like, great book. Yes. Great book. we need meaning in our life. Now here's where I'm like,

ooh, we need to go to that next level because I think there's going to be some people who that fight in the last couple years really gave the meaning. And so you don't necessarily want the fight to end if you don't know who you are without that fight as well. And so how do we shift our problems,

shift our challenges into a creative place instead of a survival fighting place. That's where I find the optimism. And that's what this event is about, is how do we get people in a state of creation? And seeking, because, again, you can't stay in the fight. That just fuels the fight. Like World War II, I think that I'm interested.

I wrote down that episode. I'm interested to listen. But how do we create meaning that is, yeah, innovative, not destructive as well, if that makes sense? I'm stuck on Victor Frank. You've probably landed on my favorite book of all time, Man Search for Meaning. That's a book everybody should pick up.

It's a really short read. It's not a long read whatsoever. And he has some thoughts in there. And, you know, I wish I could rattle it off. I wish I could find it. You know, I was going to Google search it. I'm like, I'm never going to find this. It was something I highlighted.

And he talks about what is the meaning of life. And essentially, you know, and I'll paraphrase it poorly, but he talks about, you know, like the meaning of life can be found every single day wherever you're at. Yeah. And once you recognize that, you know, and this is, once you recognize that, you know, like that you don't need to go searching across the world for it or some book or whatever, because it can be literally in that book on that day or it can be with your kids and et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. And this is a guy who chose to go through the Holocaust. right chose to stay with his family and endure one of the worst atrocities done to human beings you know right up there with a lot of different things and he talks about it it's just it's like really powerful um and my brain always goes it'd be like for me and this doesn't need to you know

listeners can take this whichever they want it'd be like jordan peterson choosing to go through the holocaust and then talking about it right like he was a psychologist who stuck around went through it and survives and gets to write a book about it. And like, it's just like, it's a little bit mind-numbing, but in the greatest way possible. It is. And I often say this. It's everyone has their own curriculum, I believe, on this planet.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And for Victor Frankel, like, I say this off because there was a time where we were a little bit, and who knows what could happen in the future. Like, I've interviewed people who've been in labor camps in China. Okay, so it's happening now. Okay. So there was a time when I was like, like, what if I ended up in a camp like that? Like what?

And then I was like, you know what? For Victor Frankel, that was his curriculum. That doesn't have to be everyone's curriculum, right? That was something that he went on to talk about and make huge impacts in the world, huge impacts in the world. That's not everybody's curriculum. Right? I'm going to write that down. Sorry, folks.

I'm going to think about that here for a second. And then I'm going to just quote Victor Frankel, because here's one of his quotes for people who have never read them. He said, ultimately, man should not ask what the meaning of his life is, but rather must recognize that it is he who is asked. In a word, each man is questioned by life, and he can only answer to life by answering for his own life. To life, he can only respond by being responsible.

and that's just like a little taste of what Victor Frankel writes about. When you talk about curriculum, I think that's a wonderful thought. We were just sitting yesterday in the men's group talking about books and a whole bunch of different things. Movies, video games, blah, blah, blah, blah, you know, addictions, how you get like, you know, healthy addiction versus like how you get sucked in a bag. And I was saying, you know, in my mind, even a healthy addiction can become detrimental, you know. It takes over your life. You never see your family, et cetera, you know, or what have you. Everyone can input what I think I mean by that.

But when it comes to books in particular, or even good documentaries that really break down, you know, because, like, there's some YouTube channels that just break down, like, little short things that are complex ideas really, really well. Um, certain people are impacted by someone's book, Victor Frankel, and other personal read it and be like, oh yeah, that was a good book. It was a good book. Yeah, it was good. And on this podcast, I went back and listened to an episode with me in Vance Crow, who was here in Lloyd.

Uh, and one of the books I was talking about them was a gulag archipelago, Solgenitzen. And if I could hand out a book to every single, uh, person out there, but this is the one that changed how I looked at a bunch of things. It was Jordan Peterson's first one. And now you start to see my curriculum. And for somebody else, it doesn't need to be that, you know. I joke, in the last couple of years, a book that I have referenced in talks in different podcasts, et cetera,

was Jurassic Park. And everybody probably raises an eye to that. But you go read Jurassic Park, Michael Crichton, the first one. and there is like some in-depth, like meaningful stuff in there that you would never predict to be in Jurassic Park. Like, I mean, everybody remembers the movies

and the book is pretty close to the movie. And so I think the curriculum thing, that's a really, that's a really interesting thought. Yeah, and I love that you're actually bringing up movies and books and stuff. Story is so, we're living a story right now. You and I are living a story. And what we,

the stories we believe about ourselves, the stories we believe about the world, the stories like how we live through story, it's so powerful. That's why propaganda and media is so powerful, because it's implanting story, right? And there's stories that, that impact people differently, like you said, but I think that's why there's so many different ways to tell similar stories, is because some people people don't like Jordan Peterson let's not kid ourselves oh yeah no he's he's controversial

and even some people who like his messaging he still could like cause like a you know Joe Joe said it best and I agree 100% with him he should never ever ever do anything that's short format or where he can get clipped out

because when you do that he says too many things where he sounds like a buffoon but in a long format where he gets to expand on his ideas, he is excellent. Did you ever watch, do you know Africa Brooke? Africa Brooke, no. Okay, so she's, she was very left at one point and hated Jordan Peterson. Like, this was her whole, like, she's very, I love what she talks about, about self-censorship.

She's great on Instagram, we're online. She hated Jordan Peterson at one point, and then started watching his long-form stuff, challenging herself. and they do an interview together and he's like in tears and she's in tears and it's just like the most beautiful thing. I highly recommend everybody. It was Michaela Peterson, Africa Brooke, and Jordan Peterson

all chatting. It's great. To see someone change their mind so much and actually thank the person they once hated. Yeah, it's so cool. Well, I think that's right there that's an interesting thought because I think too many of us We were just literally talking about this,

and I apologize, you're getting me referencing the last event I did, right? The rural urban divide, but one of the things that came up over and over and over again is we need to challenge our thought to get out and have different discussions with people who disagree or think differently than you. And what they were talking about was the vibration

or the speed at which different groups of people move. And if you have an idea that resonates with people, now you're surrounded by the same sort of speed, the same sort of ideas, et cetera, and you need to break out of that. And there's a whole bunch of different things that went on in the night, but I'm like, and yet that is the most uncomfortable thing

for even me to do who's interviewed a frick ton of people and have had people that I disagree with on here, but not enough. Like, I'm like, truthfully, not enough. The most uncomfortable thing I did was talking about things that I believed in to begin with. Now it's probably the opposite. You have to find people who disagree to come on and tell you some things that you don't want to hear so that you can either start to formulate better ideas and articulate things so that I can understand why I dislike it or to change your mind and be like, oh, I had that wrong.

And that's extremely uncomfortable. So uncomfortable and it's so needed. And I think this goes back. Oh, what was, I might, I think I got this quote. Peter Crone said something like a poor man's, what was it? it's a poor man's self-esteem is being right, is rightness, something like that. And the idea is when you don't, like, it is very uncomfortable to have your stories, beliefs, things challenged, if that's who you think you are, if that's where your self-esteem lies.

And so, you know who talked about this really well, Dr. Phil also on Rogan recently? I really liked that episode. But he talked about like, it's almost like, it's painful to put yourself, in the middle and to hear ideas. But I think that's a fortification of a person. And the way I started changing my mind on things was finding, this is a good tip I'll give people. I started to seek out people who had different beliefs than me

that I liked as people. Because it's, yeah. Sorry, no, finish your thought. Because listening to the quote unquote other side from people who you agree with who are speaking to the other, side or finding someone that irritates you on the other side and hearing their thoughts, that doesn't really give you. That does the opposite. Yeah. It entrenches your beliefs. Whereas if you find someone that you're like, oh, like I would have a coffee with this person or a drink with them. Like I like

their energy. There's something I really like about them and they have different beliefs in me. That's where I think. I think that's brilliant. And I was already doing that. I just didn't realize I was doing that, you know, because that's what you're, that's, that honestly, right there is what I'm trying to facilitate in the SMP presents. Yeah. I'm trying to bring on multiple people that sure, sure have similar thoughts to me on some things, but that I actually enjoy how their brain works, even if they disagree with how I think. That's, uh, that's a wonderful thought.

It is. And that's where I think real growth and new ideas can be birthed, right? It's not about fighting and being right. It's about, okay, like, let's explore this. Let's get curious. And there's some people, yeah. Sorry, I keep cutting you off. I don't know why you get my brain just firing this.

Good. I'm saying the twos, I'm like, man, I'm really dragging my butt this morning. I need a good conversation to get me rolling while you've started off well. I said to Jody Carrington that we need to. to be we need to be adversaries not enemies and the idea is enemies want to kill each other

the entire goal is to destroy the opponent whereas adversaries you compete which competition makes you both better that's what it should do we've talked about this before this is what we talked about is when we were talking before that idea that like

participation ribbon was getting rid of like toxic competition but then I did some crazy damage. Competition when you are in a certain mindset. And again, your identity is not tied to outcome or results in the same way. Competition becomes very important because I'm going, Sean Newman has had a million downloads. That means it's possible for me.

First off, you've now created a space where a possibility is open for me. Like the four-minute mile. I'm sure you know that story. It's like no one can do it until someone steps into that. And then, okay, we go into maybe some judgment, okay, well, Sean's not that good at this and I've got these, but like, what about that, right? And we do it to each other. But the idea is you've opened possibility and then we get playful competition going. Play is about competition.

Like there's a competitiveness to that. Now, I think toxic competition is going, oh, Sean Newman did this. He's not that great. I'm going to now sabotage in some capacity somehow. I don't know what that would even look like. As you said, that enemy, you're like, I want to destroy to get to the top. But you certainly can do. Yeah.

People can take that step on whoever it is to get to the top, that kind of thought. But really, I believe how human beings expand and grow and raise everyone up is that healthy competition. Yeah. It's so important. Well, this is an idea we talked about, this was the hour and a half, and we can certainly talk about this, because to me, to the listener, you know, I've been a one-man show now for four years, right? Like I don't have twos coming on and doing a show with me weekly. It was the first time I've ever had to work with somebody over and over and over again, other than the listener. The listener is, you know, kind of at times I joke the captain of this thing because they really direct to a lot of what I talk to.

and certainly I have my input, but like I really listen to them because I, you know, I think they have wonderful thoughts and I think, you know, it's using a network that, you know, is across the country. So if they see something, they filter it to me. And one of the things that I was leery about different content creators was probably the race up a hill idea and that there can only be one person to reach the top of the hill. And so you need to be first. when that idea isn't exactly right. You know, it's like, it's, I was saying to you like, it's hard to let go and help everyone

because there has to be like a price of admission to where I understand that I'm not just, I don't know, I'm trying to spit it out here and I'm having a hard time all over again other than it's uncomfortable to work with other content creators because I want to be the best. And that sounds weird because it's not that you can't be the best and all these other ones can't be the best and we'd be all better if that was the case. Especially when I know the only person I should be competing against is Sean of yesterday.

You know, like does that make sense? I'm word soup this morning. No, I love that you're saying this because this is something that I think a lot of people avoid in themselves. I've talked to other content creators and things like that. And they're like, no, yeah, I want everyone to do well. And I'm that person too. I'm like, I want everyone to do well. And when I saw your list of interviews you wanted to do that you put on social, my gutt had a like guttural reaction of if he wants to interview Jordan Peterson and David Goggins and he does, does that mean I can too? Because I love those guys, right? So it was like that ingrained competition. And I'm glad you're bringing this up. This is so seeped in the media landscape in the media professionals because it's like trained that there's not enough for everyone, that it's an elite industry. Like like it's it's not. It's not.

possible there's only like we've been inundated with Hollywood ideology and broadcasting ideology our entire lives right so there's kind of two prong here one it isn't true it isn't true two there are people who are not in the same curriculum or vibration or or like you you don't need to like everybody you need there's some content creators that are going to create content that you don't align with and so that's okay too like you don't need to support support that. Do you know what I'm saying? But we can't serve. Like you and I can't serve seven billion people. We'll have our audience and we can help each other get better. But yeah.

I want to, okay, I'm going to challenge my brain to think on this for a second and challenge you on it as well because to me it might depend on what your goal is because there's still even even healthy competition, there's still only one Joe Rogan. There's just, in my world, it only is. But in fairness, when I say that, if you're a Lex Friedman fan or you're Jordan Peterson. Jordan Peterson fan, you might go, yeah, but Jordan has his podcast, or Lex has his, or I'm thinking, Dax Shepherd has his, right?

And you go, they just don't resonate with me the most. but Joe is still at the top of the amount of downloads he gets per episode his guest list, etc. is something else. And so there's only one Joe, except one might argue then there's only one, there's only one Lex.

You know, Lex had Kanye West on and as soon as I listen to part of it, I'm like, I'm going to listen to that entire thing, right? Like, that was something else. That was off the planet, like, good. And I don't know. Or Russell Brand, or Russell Brand. Like Russell Brand interviewing Jordan Peterson, I love watching that.

Because he can actually challenge him in a way, like, yeah, yeah. I get what you're saying, though. Like, there's only one Joe Rogan. But everyone has their curriculum. Doing everybody doing great, everybody's going to be great. We're all going to be great. It's like, in my brain, this is how it's hardwired. This is why I want to talk about it.

This is why I probably have such a hard time talking about it. Is the participation, participation, ribbon thing in a in a in a structure and I'm thinking of a structure and media is this is probably why I have such a tough time with it think of like you're working for a corporation everybody if everybody's doing great there's only still one boss where media isn't that right like one media is a little different than that but you kind of get the idea and then two what I meant by goals is if you want to be Joe Rogan And maybe I just want to be, I don't know, let me think.

I'm trying to think of the opposite of Joe Rogan, but it's still really good. Who's somebody out there that just goes about their business but isn't a part of the UFC and wants to be top but doesn't need to be unbelievably famous. Is that out there? I don't know. See, but I think, I'm going to stop you here. I think that what's going on because I've done this before, Is there some projection going on around your dreams

and assuming everyone else has that same curriculum and those same dreams and those same goals? So it's like, I've done this before. I'm like, well, why wouldn't everyone want to own their own business and be an entrepreneur? Like, that's where freedom lies. Why wouldn't everyone want to do that? And then people are like,

they're like, genuinely there's people who just want to work for other people. And that's how they're built. And I'm like, I can't get that because I don't live that. so it's like I think because like something I I don't vibe with is okay I'm going to get real here at the beginning as as a young trucker once told me he said Sean I thought we're being real the entire time Nicole I thought we're being real the entire time we're like letting our shadow sides out on this which is good this is good for people to hear when I started my career in media

there were people who'd been in the industry for a really long time getting community funding community programming, like CRTC funding, and I was looking at their community content and grants that they'd been getting for like decade, maybe longer. And I was like, this isn't that good. Or like, this could be way better. And so like I'm watching True Detective

and I'm going, ooh, I want my web series to have an intro that looks like True Detective's intro, just less sex and crime, more female sports. And so I did a sports series called Heroic that showcases and it has like this awesome intro and like really awesome quality. Okay? I can look back and say like, okay, this is how it could be better, of course.

But like instantly early on in my career, I'm like, how do I get better? There's that achievement thing. Not everybody's like that. And so I don't think, like I want to let everyone have their piece of the pie and the people getting the CRTC grants and whatever they're doing. Like, I'm going to celebrate them and not think that they're taking anything away from me. because I and this is where my spirituality comes in God's my provider not the government not the grants not like I and they might I might I've been blessed with those things for sure but I know what you're saying like I've seen other people's stuff and been like and and it and it works against me too I just look at my stuff and I go oh god this could be way better but I think that's that's a mechanism that's not necessarily in everyone and it's going to reap its rewards and it's also going to have its downfalls because I'm sure you can get into a critical mindset as I can at times where, yeah, it can, it can be challenging at times. Yeah. It's still a hard thing to get around, you know, I've been, I've been, it's weird

to, like, think about, but since I've been, like, three years old, I play this game hockey where the entire objective is to beat the other team. steal the puck, go score, win the game. Not at all cost, but pretty close. But then if I use that same analogy, I go, but even the guys you hated the most on the opposing team, Sean, you go have a beer at the end of the game. And if they weren't there to compete against you, you got nothing.

You literally don't have a game anymore. And the team that was good and pushed you to the brink was usually the funnest to play in where you found the most. meaning in a sport in a game. And let's take it a step further. Those are the games that the audience wants to watch the most. Battle of Alberta is a perfect example. What games do people want to want?

I remember like in the late, I was just born, but like I've heard stories. Late 80s, Battle of Alberta, the flames and oilers. You can go back and watch it. Yeah, those are the games. So when we also think of our art, podcasting, whatever, as a service to other people, this is where, like, it can shift as well in our heart,

where I want you to push me, Sean. I do, because I need to get better. If I, if, this is what I've noticed, okay, this is another example. Have you ever noticed in cities where it's, like, a popular tourist area? There's shitty food sometimes. Have you noticed this? My friends have told me, like, where you find the best food is in, like, the back streets where, like,

there's not just massive amounts of people. Because in those streets, they have tourism. They don't need to try hard, right? They're going to get, they're going to have, they're going to get by, right? So, so that's why we need competition is because, like, and with restaurants too, oh my God, we need competition. Because we want better food. We want these conversations to be better. We want podcasts like Joe Rogan definitely is a standard.

He's a standard. And if you have a bunch of people pushing towards Joe Rogan standard, that means that everything comes up. And now we have better conversations. We have nuanced conversations and people, you know, growing. Yeah. Yeah, you're right. Like, I mean, as I hear it, I'm just like, yeah, that's a lot of truth bombs today, you know. Oh, no.

I read in the book, Never Split the Difference by Chris Foss. Oh, fantastic book as well. Yeah. But you said you're right. Not that's right. I don't know if that's okay. He says, you want people to say that's right. That's right. Yeah. Well, I mean, it's just, A, if you haven't picked it. You know, it's funny. Our curriculums seem like they're awfully close, you know.

Yeah. There's a lot of, there's a lot of fantastic books, a lot of fantastic minds out there. Somehow with independent thinkers or independent media thinkers, I mean, and this is what Tuesdays of me, we're just chatting. You know, it's funny. With this event coming up I have in March, I have this idea, and I shouldn't say I have this idea. It's Tuesday, and he told it to me, and I went, Tuesdays, I don't think people will do that.

And then we did the one in Lloyd, and as I'm sitting there watching these guys, you know, you got Vance Crowen from St. Louis, and I think awfully highly of the way his brain works. But then, you know, QDM is no different, and Steve Barber is no different. They're sitting on stage, and you're looking at it,

you've got a solo crying, And actually maybe Tuesdays is on to something. And what he was talking about was, you know, all these little, we're talking about how you work together. Well, part of it is getting to know one another and not real, and realizing that actually I kind of like this guy. Like Vance Crow is a prime example for me. He's a guy who has a podcast in St. Louis. He's a guy that at one point, I bet I would have had the mindset that, oh man, he got that guy. I want to get that guy before he gets him.

so I can have him first for whatever it is, right? And now that I know Vance, as well as I do, and we've had so many conversations, I actually want nothing but the best for him. And Drew Weatherhead, wherever you're at, Drew, you know, is a guy that's quickly growing into that as well. He's written a book, and he's a guy that had never written anything before. Now he's done like 200-some episodes, and he's got this podcast.

And at the start, I remember thinking, I don't know, I don't know. And now I'm like, actually, I just want the best. I'm like, is Sean turning a leaf here or something? Because I'm like, or is it just take what I think is the price of admission. You have to show up. You have to do what you say. You have to do a couple of things because I'm not going to just open the door for anyone, which sounds really weird to say because if you're walking into a building,

I'm going to open it up for anyone. What I'm talking about is like I think there has to be kind of a standard set. Like, here's the level. You want to cross through this level? Let's have a conversation. Because one thing I feel like is like, I'm careful with my trust in who I place it in. Because to trust everybody, I think, is honestly a silly idea.

Like, I think that dangers around that corner. But to act like you can do it all alone is almost like the opposite side of that coin. And that's about a silly idea as well. And somewhere in the middle lies an answer. And I don't know, Nicole, your thoughts. We're exploring that. Maybe it's because I taught media at Nate. So my job for four years was to like do my best to build people and to pump out my competition, actually, if you want to think of it that way.

And what I noticed very quickly, because I've gone into places at the beginning of my career where I could feel and maybe this is my story that I'm telling myself to feel good like I'm open to that as well but I could feel that my boss was like comfortable with me getting good enough to serve the company but if there was like any chance of me getting better than like a certain level of growth was now a threat and so the issue with that I learned very early in my career and and maybe this is again this is my specialty is I don't have that mechanism where I Like when I meet students, I can feel that guttural reaction like meeting you. I can feel that guttural reaction of that little, oh, there's a little baby feeling of threat.

And then the students I meet, I'm actually working with one of them now. I met four or five years ago, five years ago because I'm like, oh, they have strengths I don't have. I'm going to invest in this person because I know that I don't want to have those strengths. And now it's going to feed what I do later on for people that it's meant to align with. Yeah. you've probably seen some fruits of little investments like that I'm going to guess yes a lot yeah and so probably where I'm sitting and probably somewhere in your head you're laughing at me because you're like you just realize if you just start investing in people in two years you're

going to speak entirely different because you're going to start to see some of the fruits of what you've done and I just probably am not there yet which probably means Sean should zip it do a couple things and in two years we could revisit this conversation probably have a completely different eye-opening experience. And it's interesting because this is where I'm creating that media mentorship where I'm like, Sean, you want to come teach a little class on how to start a podcast? And we'll be talking on this other episode about some of the things that you found that have really helped you.

There's also investments you make that have no fruit. And the key is living from love, not for love. I know it sounds like very simplistic, but like investing and knowing that when you're living from love, not all investments, not all seeds sprout, you got to plant a lot of seeds. And if you're living from what can I get from this, you are actually going to damage your crop. There are a lot of students. Like I freely invested. But as you said, and this is I think what you're getting at, I've also leaned towards enabling before where I'm like investing in people who don't want to be invested in. And so there is a, what's important for people is you invest, you give opportunities, but you get them to stand up and walk through the door because that's what's best for them. That means I'm not just saying, hey, I'll give you this job and this job necessarily. If someone's interested, they can go online, they can start learning skills, like, they can grow. So it's not, it's a different thing.

It's, it's, yeah, investing in people is, actually, early on in my career, I was editing an interview that was done by Dave. Do you know David Foster, the music producer? So he's a big music producer. And for those who are listening, I'm sure, like, I'm sure he's down some not-so-great pass. But I'm talking, like, a very popular musical producer who worked with, like, Celine Dion and Whitney Houston.

He did the I Will Always Love You. That was him who produced that version, not the Dolly Parton version. Anyway, he's being interviewed and asked, what's the most important part of your career? Like, what brings you? success. And he says lots of people he talks to says determination, grit, grind. He said, networking. Above all else, he has had his success in his career because of his ability to network and build relationship. That's it. Now, he's also really good at what he does. But I took that

to heart and very early on in my career. This would have been 2014. I started meeting as many people as possible, going to conferences, chatting with people. And before COVID, I talked about this too, before COVID, I knew a lot of the Alberta film and television industry, and I had worked with a lot of people. That's how I connected you

with Adam Scorgy. I had done almost 10 years of networking. And how I network is not what can I get from people. It's how can I show up and serve. What is the skill set that I have that, that I could help them with.

That's why instantly, like, my brain works like that. I'm like, oh, yeah, Adam and Sean, they need to talk. I know this. That's from the skill that I've been building. That's a wonderful skill you have. Yeah. And don't get me wrong. I think it's your hockey background.

Like, you were, like, this is put in you. I get it. But I still get those guttural reactions. Like with, and, like, with other media companies, when I see them doing something that I am also wanting to do, I get like that feeling. I just know how to process it, and I think you hit the nail on the head, because I've experienced the fruit of investing in people quite a bit, I know that that outweighs the fear. Yeah.

Well, here's your final question before. For the listener, if they enjoyed this conversation, you should go check out Nicole's podcast because we're obviously, we're in this year of double headers on the Sean Newman podcast where I've been really enjoying doing the two sides. It really extends a conversation, to be honest. But before we shove off and go to the other side, let's do the Crude Master final question. These words, if you're going to stand behind a cause, then stand behind it absolutely. What's one thing Nicole stands behind? What's one thing Nicole stands behind? I think we've hit it on this conversation.

I stand behind connection, communication, and building people up. I really do. Is that what you mean? Are you talking like a more specific cause? Okay, that's what I stand behind is, is that we get way further together by building each other up. And the other stuff is a lie. Now, the caveat is that if people don't want to stand up for themselves and make movement for themselves, you don't want to carry dead weight.

That's a different thing. That's an enabling thing. But you'll go way further building other people up than anything else. Well, I've appreciated this. and I feel like the audience will enjoy it as well. I look forward to actually meeting you in Sylvan Lake. That should be fun. Either way, if people want to find you, find more of what you do.

Where can they go? So my personal Instagram is at Nicole S. Murphy. And we have just started and launched another Instagram at East Anchor Media. And that's going to be a place for media literacy, education, and mentorship. So like I was doing at Nate, I want to start supporting people in creating their podcasts,

their books, their content, their documentaries, their movies. I want us to, that's how we decentralize media, right? And it's already happening. As you said, we've gotten a lot of citizen journalists stepping up and it's been fantastic.

And I want to support the skill set because alternative media needs that skill set and that growth. So yeah. Cool. Thanks, Sean. Well, I appreciate you. I don't know. I appreciate somebody somewhere along the way and I'm forgetting who it is and I

apologize answering the bell when I threw out, who should we bring on in 2023 and Eddie Murphy's ex-wife came up on on who we should have. So either way, it's been an interesting hour and a half hour and change here this morning. And if people are looking for more, head over to Nicole's and we'll do it again.