Shaun Newman Podcast - #394 - Brandi Hofer

Episode Date: March 3, 2023

Entrepreneur, artist, author & mother of 3 boys.  SNP Presents: Legacy Media featuring: Kid Carson, Wayne Peters, Byron Christopher & Kris Sims March 18th in Edmonton Tickets here: https://www.showpass.com/snp/ Let me know what you think Text me 587-217-8500 Here is the video link explaining the mural project: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C2oS__yPq7w LINK to Project to DONATE: https://www.lrhf.ca/events/choose-love-join-hands-in-truth-reconciliation/ Amazon.ca Link to BOOK: https://a.co/d/cj6QfLL

This is Francis Whittleson. This is Benjamin Anderson. This is Dallas Alexander. I'm Alex Craneer. This is Forrest Moretti. This is Chris Sims. This is Chris Barber and you're listening to the Sean Newman podcast. Welcome to the podcast, folks.

Happy Wednesday. Hope everybody's week is cruising along. We got lots on the go on this side. First off, March 18th in Eminton, Kitt Carson, Byron Christopher, Chris Sims and Wayne Peters. I'm sitting in Emmington as I record this right now. I got to sit down with Byron Christopher. That's going to be money. day, excellent, excellent stuff. So if that is at all of interest to you in the show notes,

is the link to that event, of course. We're talking legacy media, censorship, a whole bunch of different things. And I hope to see you all make a trip to Amiton. And if you're sitting in the Amiton area, come on out. It's going to be a fun night. Pretty excited about it, to be honest, and just tidying some things up, getting some things locked away. And I'm excited to do it well to be there and everything else. I think it's going to be an electric night. I'm really excited for the four people on stage that night. They've played different parts and roles in interviews on the podcast.

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I'm talking about Brandy Hofer. So buckle up. Here we go. My name is Brandy Hofer, and this is the Sean Newman podcast. Why it helps you cool. Well, let's do this. Welcome to the Sean Newman podcast today. Let's just start.

Today I'm joined by Brandy Hofer. So welcome to the studio. I don't know if we've ever done this. Yep. Twice. No, no, we've recorded, but we've recorded in your studio for sure. That was the first one. You were in here for the second one?

Oh, right. I was in here for like the Mother's Day special second one. So you have been in here before. Yeah, I have. You have seen your husband's handiwork. Yeah. But you moved things around maybe since the last time I was here. Well, I used to sit on the end and I'm like, you know what?

I'm going to grow up. It's a bit like cozier. Yeah, well, it feels a little better. Anyways. I feel like I have, when I get, your nose never stops growing. What? Yeah, your nose in your ears. So, it sucks.

So I'm going to have a giant noise. Bad news. And I feel like as I get older, I'm like, oh, there's always. And I do, I see it in my camera when I'm like doing a story or something. I was like, yep, there was a booger in my nose or like just like something. You know, and you can see it. When you look at old people, they, like, their noses are. are quite large. I've always noticed the ears. I get the ears, but I'm kind of sad about the

nose. I'm fine. I'm not going to bring the camera back over to me, folks. What do you think? Ear growth. I need ear growth for sure, but I'm not psyched about a nose growing. But it's everybody. Why can't other things grow? You know? Another fun fact, your eyeballs are the same size from when you were born to when you get old. Really? When you ask me what we're going to talk about this definitely He wasn't top of mine, but... Well, that's all right. I just had on Dallas Alexander, I was saying he's the Canadian sniper and me and him got talking about hair because he's got like this like model-like hair.

I'm like, what do you do with your hair? And finally, he's like, oh, I never thought I'd talk about this on a podcast. He puts eggs in it once a week, two eggs. To, like, condition it? He doesn't use shampoo or conditioner. Oh, I see. That's what washes it. Yeah.

Smart. So then anytime I look at a picture. I don't know. I don't know, but it's funny. When I bring that out, then the audience is like, oh, yeah, my dad used to use, one of them was that my dad used to use egg shampoo. And I'm like, what? And he's like, yeah, it was a thing back.

I remember the bottle and everything. I'm like, okay. And these stories just slowly trickle in of people using eggs for different things. A farmer said they used to give their milk cows eggs, and it used to make their coats shiny. Okay, I get it. Yeah, I hear that. I did a stint in Montreal for a couple months, an artist thing. And yeah, a lot of people our age weren't washing.

They're like, yeah, shampoos, like, well, they were like more of like, they were artists and naturalists and stuff. And, you know, they're like, you're washing out all the good stuff. And so I get it, yeah. I kind of get it. I've switched to natural products, but I don't know about rubbing eggs all over. The plumber will come and they'll be like, what have you been doing while I've been showering with eggs like and that's how this happened

that would happen to me that would be a thing and then my husband would ask you'd be like what what have you been doing here and I'm like well I've been showering with egg why right I tell you what I'm I think I'm just going to try it for a week yeah I mean why not I would try for a month I feel like trying are we going to a week is like not really trying um do you wash your You scrub and wash your hair every day. Not every day. I shower every day, but I would say I don't scrub and wash my hair every day. I would also say, are you offering a challenge right now?

Is Brandy and Sean going to do an egg challenge in the hair? Gross. Okay. There you go. I bathe, so I don't even know how I'm going to wash my hair with eggs. I'm a nighttime bather for self-care and, like, just relaxing. Like a bathtub, you're talking. Yeah.

I have a glorious setup. And you just went on a holiday. And like I hate going on holidays for the fact that like I don't have my soft sheets and like my bathtub and like I was thinking about it the other day because everyone says you're supposed to like sit in gratitude. I've been trying this for years. To the listener, Brady has three young boys. So how's that going?

I'm just like, you know, I'm 30 something and we're around 36 or 7 or something. You're maybe 37 already. I turned 37 here in a lot. couple months. Yeah, there we go. And like, I'm just like, you know, my house is very, and I'm trying to be gracious. Like, it's spectacular. I actually, I lived in a house like 30% this size growing up. And now at this young, bright age, I'm living in this like dream home. And how did I get here? Just a, it's, it's pretty phenomenal. Anyways, I don't like leaving. I like going adventuring, but I don't like leaving the essential like place where you get the.

best sleep on her. You know, I tell you what, we came home. Okay, so let's tell a child's story here, shall we? Every time we get to, I was thinking, I'm like, to the new people who've never heard of Brandy Hover, this is an interesting way. She's been on the podcast twice, yes? So go back and track down those episodes. We always have funny kids stories. So here's my latest, okay? We arrive in Calgary Airport, and we're supposed to fly, I don't know, we're supposed to have an hour layover. So we're sitting in customs getting ready. Casey has already passed out on the first flight, that's our youngest, and we brought along a stroller, or a wagon. So we put him in there and he is dead to the world. So we're going through customs. And like, I'm, I'm like laughing at this

because like, he doesn't even has to see him. We're pulling a child across and he's just like out to the world. I'm sure my face looks like I've been through Helen back. Then the flight gets delayed. We end up flying out of Calgary at one in the morning to Eminton for like a, a 37-minute flight. To put everybody in, to put everybody back in. Mel's like, well, you just want to get a hotel room? I'm like, no, I am driving home. And so we had, what, the three kids in cars slash airport slash plane for something like 15 straight hours.

Awful. I mean, they were great. My children were great. But I think any parent can just be like, oh, my God. kids is not fun it's frustrating yeah I know but but now that you do like if you get to travel with those kids I've always I used to have the I did this video once upon a time like when I was traveling this is well before COVID I was traveling by myself Mel and the kids were already in Minnesota at her family's place and I had like my carry-on and I was like walking and I was like

did to did and then and then the way back I felt like the Grinch that stole Christmas we had we had car seats we had we had the stroller we had 18 bags right because i mean like going there you just you almost packed pack the kitchen sink it's ridiculous yeah no that's that's i went to new york in september that's like well i was uh showing my art there and and yeah i like it was it was so great it was it was the best it's a real holiday it's a real it's a real treat because but now that our kids Did you go by yourself? Yes, I went. Yes, there's no fucking way.

I'm taking three kids and my partner to New York for five days. Like that would be my nightmare. That would be my nightmare. And it was an art thing. I was there to meet people I have been, like, meeting with for like five years online, right? How was that experience? It was phenomenal. It was really cool.

It was like a bucket list moment for me exhibiting artwork in New York, right? So it was. And it felt like I knew that I still like it felt like we had just yeah known each other that whole time. It was like we weren't meeting online. It's like here are all my friends and we had the best time ever. Most of them live in and or around New York. But so it wasn't like I was like super high right. I was like this is the best.

And yeah, it was a cool, cool experience. Well, you know when we first, I can't remember, you know, the first time I ever had you on, geez, what was that? That was like episode like I don't even know. I think this is a 2009, you think? Well, 2019 is when the podcast began. Right. And this is what I'm saying. You were one of the origin story episodes.

Yeah, because I was super pregnant. And in that time of my life, in the season of parenting, and I was pregnant with Teddy and chasing around my two other kids on the street so much, so hard. I was so tired. I remember I got to the hospital and nurses like, you're so tanned, you're glowing, you look so good. What have you been doing? Where did you go? Like, it's just that pavement was bouncing the sun back on my face on the road because I've been on the road all summer.

That's it. Just following around kids on striders and like playing street hockey and pulling my groin and... Episode 23. 23. When you think about this, you will be episode 3.9. 394. Good for you. I think.

That's cool. Let me pull that up too right now. I'm going to make sure for the, can't get it wrong. Yes, back to back. You'll be episode 394. You mentioned that. You mentioned it.

And so you came on my podcast and I was a dick and I forgot about it. So it's my last podcast. So you can go on my podcast and find out all the information. Yeah, you say your dick. It's like it's whatever. I've recorded with people and then been like, listen, this isn't going to come out for a very long time because I'm going to use this when I go on holidays because it really doesn't. And now I can't do that.

Like I'm releasing anywhere between four and five episodes a week. And so it's like. That's crazy. It is, but it isn't. Do you paint every day? No, not anymore. I used to. I used to be my thing.

And then it's just like, wow, I have a fuckload of paintings. Like so many. many. And, um, and I, but that's not why I was doing it. And I have this, I'm always myself. Like, I'm always honest. And, and that's what I needed at the time. Like, I was in the throes of parenthood. I had just lost my mom. And I was healing. And, and I needed to heal. And that, and I needed to show up somewhere every day because I have copious amounts of energy. And it needs to be channeled somewhere or I actually go crazy and drive all the other people around me. Pretty crazy.

So, yes, if you don't know, if you haven't heard of me, I have my own podcast, Color Me Happy. I just wrote a book in that time as well after I painted way too much and I was like, I was burnt out because I was selling art, but I don't think it was paying off. Like I didn't see the exchange of time and effort for money. And let's face it. And I had not good money mindset. You need money. If I want to accomplish the things that I want to accomplish, if I want to give back to my community, I need, I need money. Like I've volunteered my time and time is our most precious commodity. That is a commodity as well.

But like, I need to be paid for my efforts and my talent. And I have a great quote, maybe from Jim Carrey. I'm pretty good at memorizing my quotes, but I haven't memorized Jim. Jim is so great. He's a depth. Oh, yeah. His YouTube, anytime you hear him speak. His one about his father is probably my favorite. I don't know if you've heard that.

He talks about his dad working a job for pretty much all of his life and then getting, not fired, but basically bought out or, you know, what's the word I'm looking for, laid off? And he goes, you can fail at something you don't want. So why not try something you do want? Because I mean, I mean, both ways you can fail. I mean, he's so he's talking about his dad Not wasting his life, but he always wanted to be a comedian his dad Yeah, so the depth of Jim Carrey, yeah is well most some people think he's gone a little lulu, but at the end of the day like I kind of love it. I know He's a painter. He's he's brilliant. Yeah, he is be a he if you're speaking of extra energy Yeah, he'd be a brilliant interview. Oh my gosh. I

Everything I see of it. Yeah. Like a true dream. Yeah, he was with Jerry Seinfeld on his like show thing. The comedians in cars? Maybe that one. Sounds right. And they went to his art studio and stuff.

It was really cool. And he's just a goofball. But okay, so I found it. I didn't find it in the notes that I prepared for today. But I found it in my book because it's in there. How will you serve the world? What do they need that your talent can provide? That's all you have to figure out.

The effect you have on others is the most valuable currency there is. Don't let anything stand in the way of the light that shines through this form, risk being seen in all your glory. So you take something like that and he knows. He does manifestation. He does all that. Have you heard the dumb and dumber thing? He wrote a check out to himself, acting services rendered,

and $10 million. folded it and kept it in his wallet. And what was he paid for dumb and dumber? $10 million. Yeah. What's in your wallet then? Nothing. Well, you hear that story? I went, I went in my wallet yesterday to the co-op. She's like, because I had a gift card and there was $1.14 left and I was like, oh, I should cover this with cash at least. And then I was like, I don't have cash because I have three fucking kids who empty my wallet all the time. Of course I don't have cash.

what's in my wallet? Yeah, that's a good, let's just... Anyway, I had terrible money mindset. I was reading Jen Cicero's book. You're a badass at making money. Her book... Getting some paper out there, Sean. Well, you can't tell...

You're about to go on to a story, okay? Yeah. And for the listener, the last time me and you chatted that I recall, we were talking about, you know, don't sell yourself short, Sean. you might go across Toronto and blah, blah, blah, blah. I haven't been to Toronto. I haven't been to Toronto.

But at the same time, a lot of things have come to pass in the time since we last talk. And now you're telling me Jim Carrey carried around an I owe you in his wallet for $10 million. Now, that's setting the bar pretty high. That's where you want to put yours. I don't even need to put it over there. I don't think that's realistic. Okay. Yeah.

Hey. I mean, who knows, but 10 mil, like I'm all. So we're not in the acting industry. It's funny. I'm not going to put it. Although five years ago wouldn't have been caught on a video either. So. Oh, I'm sorry for the, I'm just like, okay.

Because I get self-conscious, I'm like, I for sure have boogers. Where are my hands? I think you look lovely this morning. And I'm sure the listener does too, if they are watching that is. You look handsome and lovely as well. Yeah, we're just paying each other compliments now. Yeah. Yeah.

So anyway, I'm a good manifester too. Actually, New York manifested that for sure. But not only manifesting, here's the thing about manifesting. You have to put purpose and action behind it. I truly believe it because New York didn't just, well, the podcast isn't just, it takes energy. Oh, for sure. Moving forward every day.

Copious amounts of energy. Showing up every day. I asked for that opportunity. I was like, so Alicia Pugg, who runs PXP Contemporary, we're going to put numbers on it today. I tell you what, if there will be one thing we'll remember about this episode, we're going to write. Well, if our last episode, not on yours, but on mine. And we talk about the same things kind of every time. But on mine, we did say, like we were, and we talk about it in person all the time, like, where is this going to go?

what is this, where is it going to lead? I hope it leads here. And then it like does in a certain way. The thing about manifesting is that you have to leave room for it to actually take its own path. Sure. You can't plan it out because we don't know. So I asked Alicia. So is it okay if I don't put a number on mine? Because I know exactly what I'm going to put in there. Okay, you're ready. Let me finish this one story. But does it have to be a number? It doesn't have to be a number. Just manifesting can be anything. Good. Manifesting.

Perfect. And actually I'm talking about on our podcast this week is writing is your greatest tool. Writing like daily is your greatest tool in life for so many reasons. Anyway, so I mess a turn. I was like, are you doing any exhibitions in 2024 for artists? Like, because you go to these art fairs, right? All over the world. You can go to Miami.

You can go to Europe. You can go to, they have these giant ass art fairs. And she's like, no, yeah, so we might go here in 2024, but we are going to New York in 2023, but we're full. So I'm like, okay, she's like, but I'll keep you in mind for the future. So in that message, you're like, she's just being kind, right? I'll keep you in mind for the future. That's like a polite, say, way of typically like brushing someone off, right, professionally. That's a great way to brush someone up professionally.

However, two days later, she's like, JJ Galloway wants to split a wall for female figurative artists, international ones, you know, celebrating the feminine. And are you in? I was like, fuck, yeah, I'm in. Like, of course, yes, yes, I had no money. I had no money to go to New York. and so because you have to think about like travel, shipping your artwork, that's like $600 and like all that. But I was like, if I go to New York, I also, it's an opportunity to, you know, meet all these women, whatever. So put it on my credit card.

Oh, for the best. I was like, I don't have the money to go. My auntie's like, I'll give you the money. I was like, no, no, no. I'll figure it out. It'll work out. I know. And then like I said to you before we started recording, I went on a vacation.

kind of left it up to the wind. My friend, Jesse, she shared my portrait class, which is such a great class, super approachable. She shares it with all her followers. She's a portrait artist, so it's just like, there was my New York money right there. While I was on holiday, just a whole bunch of classes sold. And it was just like, it was meant to happen. And it was just one of those things. And I trusted it.

And then I ended up getting from the Canada Council for Arts. funding and support like it caused me like 10 grand to go to New York like it's not it's not pennies to go to New York and then they covered the rest I got a grant that you know I just put faith in it because it takes three months to process so and that covered the rest it was exactly the amount that I needed to go to New York have that experience did I sell any artwork no does that is that what matters lots of other artists like met me saw me message me and I exhibited in York. So that's always there. Sometimes, well, let me think about this.

Lots of times the initial going to a place, meeting a bunch of people, whatever comes of those experiences, like those are like little seeds that are planted initially, because you have no idea. Oh my gosh, you never know. Where I sit right now with the podcast and people like supporting it, which all of you are wonderful human beings. I have a few different businesses that have reached out that initially came from like,

I have no idea where, right? I actually meet with them again tomorrow. And they're like huge supporters, huge, not just financially, but like opening up doors that I had no idea were there, folks, you know, like you're just like oblivious. And I don't know, I don't know how that stuff happens, you know? That's a lot of why. Yeah, that's a large question. But regardless, I'm a huge, huge believer in Jim Carrey.

Like, this is, this is just a brief chunk of it. My father could have been a great comedian, but he didn't believe that that was possible for him. And so he made conservative choices. And then he goes on to say that, you know, he ends up getting laid off. And so the power, you know, like basically you can fail at what you don't want. So why not try something you do? I love that. You can fail what you don't want.

So you might as well take a chance on doing. what you love. That, yeah, could have been a great comedian. He got a safe job and as an accountant and when I was 12 years old, he got let go from that safe job. I learned many great lessons from my father, not the least of which was that. You can fail at what you don't want. So you might as well take a chance on doing what you love. Yeah, I think they like lived in a van at some point. And if I'm being truthful, I would say that is, and if you tack it on to the quote behind me that Joe Rogan did, I would say that's an easy thing, easier thing to do at an early stage in life. So if you're in your 20s list of this, you've got the world by the tail or world by the nuts

or world by whatever. You really have, you have. You have a real opportunity because you can, you know, you can, I can live off a lot. I can live off very little. But as soon as you have all the, you know, the responsibilities of house, kids, wife, you know, just. It can feel like a lot. It can feel like light and it's tough to make the choice but the reason why this always comes up with us to is because we're in the throes of pushing as hard as we can on that that's why it all every time I talk to you we go down this rabbit hole it's because you know like four years ago folks I interviewed Brandy on episode 23 so that would have been like you know at that time I was doing an episode a week so you know what's that that's five almost six

weeks into podcasting is what I was and we talked about a whole like different thing you know of like and at that time I looked at you and I was like I think you're successful I just do you are extremely talented are there hoops you get to jump through or hurdles you got across etc it's like yeah and so that every year we have one of these conversations it's kind like a check is well how things going well it's busy I didn't realize it was going to be like this right and yet here I am 394 you've been to New York you've done a lot of different things like I mean the the list you're the second you know I want to make sure when I say this, but I'm pretty sure that you're the second guest I've had on here when they came

on where it's not an author. They were just, you know, like an entrepreneur of sorts. And now you're the second one in literally the last month to release a book or to give me a book that you've written. I'm like, holy crap, this is pretty cool. Like that's a huge jump from four years ago. I wrote a book or what the purpose was. And I wasn't planning on doing like a book tour or public speaking or anything like that. I don't know how that works. I remember how much you love public speaking. Yeah, yeah.

And now I'm doing it all the time. It's terrible. I like it though. I like it because it's, it lifts me up. I'm excited to do it. I'm maybe not the best at it. I'm sure shit human when I do it. And I think that people connect to that.

And yeah, I'm finding myself excited to do the things that I would have like ran away from before. I still don't know why I read. wrote a book, but I did sit up one day when I was like, I was actually in a massage, so I was naked. And I had to stop her. I had to stop her and sit up. I was like, I have to catch us in a voice memo because I'll forget it. That's how ideas work. And I came home and I was like, I know what my book's called? Everyone looked at me like, what book? Like what? And just creatively leave from there. So like as a creative, you could stuff me in a closet. And I would like write you a song or some poems or like anything. Like I will create no matter what I was I was just burnt out from painting.

I met with my art consultant. She was like, the world's changing. Just try to sell painting after painting custom artwork on your website. And that year I did 130 pieces of artwork original. So I had to create that. It doesn't make sense. It doesn't make sense to it's not sustainable. I have a lot of energy again. So I was burnt out. So naturally I just like went into writing and it was like, what have I learned so far in this life? And then you put it down in words, 15 minutes a day. That's all it took. And not really all it took a lot of work. Did you enjoy it? Published. Like, like, it was like, it was. Oh, it was amazing. Yeah. It was amazing. And, and, and now I see it helping people and people connecting to it and people laughing out loud in airplanes sending me

messages and like I just laughed out loud and everyone looked at me I tell you I just I just started or I'm bawling I just started a sub stack yeah uh never thought I would do that but I was like exploring a bunch of different things and it keeps coming across my desk right I suck at writing and the reason I do a podcast and I'm not a blogger is pretty evident right Like, it's nice and easy. And then I wrote my first one, and I was very surprised at how addicting it was to sit in, like, I used to journal a little bit. And I understand, like, it's very good to get your thoughts out of your brain onto a sheet

and actually see them for what they are, if that makes sense, to, like, read them aloud after you've written them all and be like, well, that's dumb. Because that's happened. Or that's a really interesting thought. It doesn't matter, though. they say with your like mind dumps you're not supposed to reread them but I like to use everything that I create so I'm like I don't like to waste time um okay so that's interesting though why do they say that uh I think morning pages like when you talk about like the artist's way and morning pages

it's just like it's like treated like a diary but I don't I don't think it has to be that way it can be whatever because I you want it I I do it um I like to if I have a problem if I write about it then I can start to see how I'm looking at and then I can write about it some more and work it through it and work it through or at least uh it's complex the the next substack I'm writing right now which is funny that this comes up because it's anyways is I think if you write it down too it it's it's more likely to come true yeah well the next substack I'm right a spoiler here folks for this week is is about I got asked about my my journey towards religion God whatever you want to call it I'm faith.

Faith. Thank you. I'm mumbling around this. And this is kind of how the substacks been going. I'm like, I wrote a two, two page or three page or I'm like,

oh my God, Sean. Okay, we got to like, anyways. It's interesting to try and get something complex like that that I fully do not understand. And that's the disclaimer at the start.

I was like, listen, I don't know if I'd read this, but this is one guy's journey into it. And going from like almost atheism, three years ago where, you know, almost there is nothing or, or meaninglessness or, you know, you kind of get the anyways to, no, that's, that was bad shit crazy and I don't agree with that anymore.

I had a similar journey. And I feel like everyone has a right to believe in what they, whatever higher power they go with here, because anyway, we're not going to get into that. Well, here's the thing. How many different cultures are there? Right, right. And all of them have their belief system set up. Actually, you know, you mentioned listening to Francis Whitoson and Matricia Bauer.

Matricia Brower, when I sat, Bauer, not Brower, when I sat back and thought about it, I'm like, that's really, because she's finding her way back to First Nations, beliefs, culture, all that stuff. And, like, if you just take a step back and think about it, you're like, huh, my culture has been built through, the church just has. And so there's a little bit of comfort or maybe, you know, it's probably why I'm drawn so much to Jordan Peterson because he's breaking down something very complex that nobody does anymore. We all just wrote it off as like, nah, it's kind of like old, don't worry about all that.

They did a bunch of things to kids and don't worry about that. It's like, well, no, that's not exactly true. Anyways. I mean, it's true, but it's not like the whole picture. Definitely not untrue. But the thing is... Just not the whole picture. That's all I meant.

Right. So I haven't listened to him, but I have had conversations with people who do listen to him. And, but I don't want to go into it too much here. But there is, there is... Why not? Because it's such a fucking heated thing and it takes so much on it. You're not a Jordan Peterson. I haven't listened to him.

I just have had many conversations about, um, uh, Anyway, no. Well, no, no. But I do, Sean, I do see proof in, in higher, higher, a higher power, something else at work that we can't see or feel. Because that's how our brain works. Our brains can't, like, you know, I didn't talk to your sister about this. Probably. Yeah, I did.

A long time ago. Our brains are protecting, protecting us, right? because you can't bring in all the information at once because you'd be overwhelmed, like so overwhelmed. And I just had a guest on too, and she talks about there is actually neurons in your gut and your heart. So your brain's like your safety net, right? So that's like you're actually thinking from all those things.

And so I do believe that there is something more at work, whatever you want to call it, universal intelligence, anything like that. Because I've seen proof in it. I talk about it in my book. What do you think? If I find another dime somewhere after my mom died, I just like have thousands of dimes. And like family members like get up from a massage and like I had a dime stuck to my back.

Like like and then we all send each other or I just finished a mural outside and there's like a dime in the puddle and the rain. And it's like she's there. What's a what's the significance? On the right track. My mom had this thing about dimes that they were like a sign. They were a sign. And I was best man in a wedding.

I was like, I got to welcome Aaron into the family. And so I'm like, I need a dime because that was, it was my mom's best friend. I needed a dime. The only thing I would talk about what's in my wallet, there was just one dime. So I welcomed him to the family, gave him the dime. It's just like there's so many things that when you look back, it's just, it's almost like magic. And it's really beautiful. And I feel like the more open you are to that magic, because I was closed off, same as you.

I was like, I don't, I don't think so. And so the more you're open, the more, it's just, it's just more fun. You can just see the beauty playing out. Yeah, yeah. And when we talk about following your dreams and like, Jim Carrey and that whole story there's this quote and it's the greatest gift you can give yourself

is to find something that you are naturally adept at and find a way to make a living at it because if you do that every day will be a playday you're never battling upstream you love what you do and if you love what you do why do you want to stop doing it Judge Judy

Welcome. Judge Judy. Welcome. Yeah, but Judge Judy obviously loves sitting in front of people. She does. Like, and she's like, how long ago was Judge Judy like doing that? Like, you know? I don't know.

Just rocking out and like we all remember it from our childhood. Like she served the world. She, she, you know, that's one woman who, or Ruth Beda Ginsburg. Like there is some, you know. 2021 was season 25. She's still doing it. I don't know. It doesn't show that it's still going right now.

But 25 seasons for sure, she did it. That's got to be a record for like show numbers. Judith. Now I'm curious if she's still alive. Age 80. The thing is you do these things and you don't maybe know. No, now it's Judy Justice. So it is still going.

And she's 80 years old. Judith Susan Bloom is her name. Yes. We do these things and we just don't know and I think you have to like overcome fear and move past yourself. Isn't that cool? And the brain. Isn't that cool that, you know, for me, I don't look at painting and go, that's what I want to do, right? Everybody, you know, sitting on this side, I'm like, everybody wants to play in the NHL and that's the only way you can ever experience happiness, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

But for some people, it was, you know, we're pointing out it was being a judge, and I can't imagine that being fun. Like, I just, I just, I can't imagine that being fun. Certainly in your shoes, I'm like, I got zero artistic talent. You know, my wife makes fun of me. By the way, this is a creative platform. Sure. Sure. Well, I mean, in that you.

There's an art to this. In using your talents, I don't have those talents is all I'm getting at, right? No, but then I found this and I'm like, some people stare at four or five podcasts a week, and I'm like, listen, I have a goal at some point in my life to do 365 and 365. I think it will be unreal. What is that? I don't know what you're talking about. 365 podcasts and 365 days. Okay. A podcast a day for a year. With, with, I don't know if it, I'm still working through the thought process on this on whether it'd be 365 different people or just 365 different episodes. Yeah, you could cut some up. No, no, no, no.

No, no, definitely, never, never, never. Never? Never? I've done that only once ever where I cut one into two. No, if I did 365 and 365, all I mean is, could Brandy Hofer come on twice? I think so. I think that's a rule I don't want to put on myself. We could cut, like, I could come on twice.

Well, come on twice, but like I could, I have two big subjects that I don't want to talk about today. Well, anyways, let's talk about one of them. Sure. Yeah, what's, what's, well, do you want to talk about your mural coming up? Do you want to talk about your book? Yeah, we can continue talking about the book. I feel like it's a very human experience that we've already been talking about. Where can people pick up a copy of Color Me Happy?

See your Everyday Ordinary is extraordinary. Colour Me Happy is more like the podcast brand and stuff like that, which I just came up with on a whim, which, you know, never really thought that through. And that was the first motivational speech I gave was don't overthink it. Because if you do, you probably won't do it, right? And that was the first time I spoke publicly. Terran Kelly asked me to the Inspiring Women's Conference in 2018. I think it was the day I found out I was pregnant with Teddy.

So timeline here the year before I came on your podcast. And I said no. And they were like, just meet us for coffee. Because all that stays in my brain is me crying in front of my great eye. class when I read my poetry. And I never knew at that. So that stopped me from like writing and sharing myself because of that experience, which now I'm like, that's a beautiful thing.

Like I felt my poetry so much that I wept. Like that is good for you. And my teacher was impressed and she was the best ever. But like I was like never doing that again because I was what, 13 or 14 or something? Yeah. So I was like, fuck that. I'm avoiding thinking that hard ever again, and I will just, I don't want to feel that pain. And so anyway, we sit down for coffee with Tara and Kelly.

And I was like, I'm not sure what you guys are thinking. And I'm not sure what I would talk about. I don't have anything to say. And they're like, we think you have something to say. So I sat on that for like three months. I worked on that one like 11 minute speech. And I've come a long way because now I do weekly speeches on the podcast. and I weekly send out writing, right?

So I have a weekly inspiration newsletter. So, yeah, I try to, I try to connect people to that. Like, this is a creative forum. You are in a creative realm. You are connected to something. You do have purpose. It is meaningful. And that's what that is about.

That is about seeing your life as like a foundation and building blocks to who you are. and it's taking you to where you're meant to be and to honoring that path and honoring who you are and honoring the things that have happened. Like, no, I did not want grief-in-loss in my life. No, I didn't want to lose my mother, then lose my father-in-law and to have them not be around to be with us in this stage of our lives. Absolutely not. But what did that teach us?

And I sat about thinking about that last night is like, there are these, turning points in our lives, and we know what they are and they change, they change our life forever. And that is one of those things for me that my life will never be the same. I became a mother and lost my sense of home. So I've been working on building that sense of home from that point on and getting that back. And you do that through people and connection. That's what means something. meaning like your purpose you need to have your purpose and you need to also you know have that love in your life i think finding play in every part of your day like it's um it's like fitting play uh self-care all those things all those little things into one day and and you find this like incredible balance i'm

not saying there's not hard days i share that all the time there are shit days and uh I know you have them like highs and loads and... But if you didn't have the shit day, how could you tell the great day? Exactly. There's always light to the... If it wasn't dark, you'd never be able to find the light, that whole thing. That is a chapter in my book. Everything I talk about, pretty much a chapter in my book.

And actually, Steph, Steph Monroe, who I'm working with LHF, she's like, I ran into Kurt Price on the track, and I had a really long conversation with Kurt the other day. he let me say way too much. He probably, he was probably like, I know that Brandy will answer all my questions, honestly. So I'm just going to go with this and ask her so many things. And he did. Anyway, so I went on, I said vagina and made him very uncomfortable or something. Probably more than once.

My husband's like, you swore 16 times. I was like, you counted. Like, why? Anyway. but I mean part of your job is entertainment I get that and he's like where does the honesty come from anyway step runs into Kurt on the track and she's like we talked about something you said to Kurt that resonated with him and so like the things we do the things we say they're they're out there and they have value they have purpose and they have impact and I'm finding my value and impact and

it's like I don't even know how I got so lucky. Our community is really special. It's all I can say is I, my creativity has led to something way beyond what I ever expected. Well, I'll agree with you. We have quite the special community. We all fight in our own unique ways. I always find it interesting when,

when we sit across from each other, and you won't talk about Jordan Peterson because you know how much. Well, I don't know anything about Jordan Peterson, other than like I've had some like heated talks with. All I mean is, all I mean is there's certain things that you've said in the last 15 minutes. I'm like,

that could be interesting. I know I will piss off a lot of people if we talk about that and hear Brandy's views on X, Y, Z. And on the flip side, it's like, and yet we can still, to me this is like a lost you're asking me before we started how I go about dealing with two polar opposites conversations and people and yet it's so needed because if we don't allow for it what eventually happens is really dark times like really us that like I've talked to too many people now

that have either seen war been to war some of the worst atrocities that humankind has ever put on humankind and they always start with us and them and us and them is all about words and how you talk about the other side and whatever else right so when you bring up jordan peterson things like that it's like jordan peterson uh for me changed my life and anyone but brandy hofer what you're doing could be changing somebody's life and it's like there's beauty in that doesn't mean i agree with everything jordan peterson says doesn't mean i have to agree with everything brandy hofer says absolutely but sitting here it's like i want to give the opportunity for every guest i've ever had on here where I think it was crap or people are going to hate that or whatever thought goes to my brain.

There's always at least one. Always one text to say, man, that episode was fucking fantastic. Exactly what I needed. I'm like, oh, God, all right. Well, and if you take that thought process into any conversation you're going to have, maybe there's something there to learn. I haven't been steered wrong with that. I've had to bite my tongue a lot.

I've had to adjust. You don't think it's perpetuating hate? What's that? Like some of the conversations where people are like, you know, not being kind to others, let's just say. Like giving a platform to a person who, who in general are you talking about? Someone who's just like, you know, attacking a certain establishment or something. And they're saying these things and you're just like, you don't think that's perpetuating hate in a way.

So I think that people are really smart. I think my audience is really, really smart. There's a reason why I don't edit anything. So I don't cut out anything. They get to hear it all. Right. Because I want to hear it. And that's the understanding.

Like you're honest about that. If I brought on, well, Jeremy McKenzie is probably one of the most scalding hot people in all of Canada. It doesn't mean you have to know who he is. But, you know, like he's been under attack for a long time. When he comes on the show, if people like what he says, then they're going to go follow him and they're going to listen to more. And maybe they're going to find along the way that, oh, maybe this isn't what I want. When you come on and you talk for longer than five minutes, I don't know. You got to expand on your thought process.

And people in this audience smell out bullshit well before I ever do, and I find that really interesting. So propelling hate speech, I don't know. The way I think about it is that I can't release a lot of information about this. But when it comes to, you know, and social media. the dangers of social media, like basically what we're talking about. When when see my algorithm, my algorithm is like positivity, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, because I'm, that's like what kind of person I am. Like let's lift up and inspire people. But if you take a person who is maybe not doing so great and I've been in and don't get me wrong, you guys, I came out of dark places.

I worked really fucking hard to come into positivity and making change. and coming into the person I was meant to be. There were times in my life where I drank a lot to mask what was going on. I've seen dark times. I've gone through some stuff. I don't drink anymore. Like there's things. So if you get this person in this dark, dark time and the algorithm or social media or a podcast or anything,

gets them going in that cycle and they're not mentally well. Like, I feel there's a responsibility to that because I know and you're like, well, that's not going to happen to me. I'm not surrounded by that. Someone in my own neighborhood was collecting guns. We live a block, not even from a school. So someone's in this cycle of hate and what the fuck was he planning on doing? Right? So why was he collecting guns?

In my neighborhood. We don't know. And you know what? He didn't go to jail. Yeah, but the jail's... Not mentally well. Not that jail would have solved anything, but... We got lots of issues in society, right?

That's what I mean. I know we have to talk about them, but like that is the scary flip side that I see of like... But I would argue, I would argue, and I don't know if I'm right in this, but, um, by trying to control a narrative drives people. No, I agree with you there. You can't tell people what to do or what to think. No. No.

But you can empower them and lift them up too. 100% agree. I just, so when it comes back to what I do, it's like, would I stray away from any conversation? No, but Sean also needs to get better at feeling comfortable with, pushing back. I know audience members talk about it all the time. It's hard. But one of the things I've always done is I've allowed people to speak and give them a platform, an opportunity to say their thoughts and, and, you know, if it resonates with somebody, great. And if it doesn't, that's great. People text me all the time about things that bother them and everything else.

But I don't know. I don't distance myself from anyone, mainly because I've been distanced from. And that's a very, you know, and I can say it openly, it was a medical choice. And being distanced from that when all of us now know that, I mean, I think we all know, who knows, that that was an insane time to live. It has put me in this mind frame of like, who else are we doing that to? And why are we doing that? And what's the prerogative behind it? So to have people on to speak from their perspective about what they believe and what they see,

I think it's just like it's really healthy for people to hear things they disagree with, things they really agree with, and trying to not fuel a fire of let's go, I don't know, raid whatever, right? Like to me, it's information. And the more we allow people to hear, the more they can be like, oh, okay, I don't know how many people, probably from your book, how many people have been like, man, I didn't realize other people thought like this, or I didn't realize other people dealt with whether it's, um, don't know. Dark times, kids, parenting, business, entrepreneurship.

For me, it was a lot through COVID. A lot of people felt like, you know, the world was closing in on them, and they had nowhere to escape. And then they found this little thing called the podcast, and it gave them a little bit of just a glimpse of light. And I wasn't doing it for them. I was doing as much for me as anything, because I was like, what are we doing?

Like, where are we going? And so to me, I don't know how we get out of this, like, spiral we're in where we can't sit across from one another and have like a like a conversation where you don't have to agree with everything. But we can treat each other like cordially. Yeah, humans. That's what I mean. That's what I mean.

The human is to it. But there are some people who won't. Yeah, I know. But that's on us in society to find ways to break through that, you know, like. Well, we are not all cut from the same cloth. Right? I just want to. So is it impossible then?

No. I absolutely not. I genuinely feel that there is space for everyone to be their own person. As long as you're not, like I'm not saying, as long as you're not hurting anyone, right? As long as you're hurting yourself or others. And I think this world would be. This is exactly what I didn't want to. to talk about today, Sean? Thank you. But it's on my mind and I had questions for you. So again,

Kurt Price got me and so did you and Brandy. Well, I'll just pull that out of you because I will say what's on my mind and I will tell you my honest answer. And I think when we have more compassion and love and empathy and understanding of one another and when we stop instead of react, you know, I think there's power to that and there's moving forward together and accepting that this person's not going to believe in the same thing that I do. And that is okay, right? Listen, we have how many immigrants coming across the ocean from the south, from everywhere. They come from different cultures, backgrounds, everything. Exactly.

And so they're going to see the world in a different way. all of us who came here had the exact same thing. I mean, our ancestors, you get the point. I don't know. The thing is, the thing is, we have limited time. We actually, we're on this earth. We don't own anything. We're going to be gone.

We're going to be dust, right? Well, depending on what you believe. And you want to spend it fighting? You want to spend it over, this is my, land or this is my like there's some terrible people in the world who are killing others on this earth because they're fighting over something that doesn't really belong to anybody because we're that's one thing we innately all have in common is we're all going to die right so what are you going to choose to do with your time and i mean that's a different answer for everyone so well time is an

interesting thing because I certainly agree it's the the number one commodity you know it's more important than anything else and for me time with family and my kids like you know I'm don't have to be a rocket scientist when you when you listen to all the uh you know your elders talking about like you'd stop in the grocery store and they're like yeah like you're gonna miss this and you're Like, really I'm going to miss being trapped in an airport where my kids are like screaming and everybody's looking at us and you know, like you're having to discipline in the security line and you're like, I don't know. But yes, you will. At some point you will. Right. Sean, we're going to miss it so hard. I'm already missing so many things. And like even yesterday I made up a game. And that was my favorite advice from children's author. It's called Happiest Toddler on the Block. Harvey, something. wrote this book, you'll find it. Google's pretty great like that. And he's like, the number one thing you need to do,

he probably didn't say that either. I'm paraphrasing. I'm using your quote from my, I'm paraphrasing here, from our podcast because I edited it so many times. I'm paraphrasing here. Play the boob because it's just more fun than like the yelling and then the feeling bad. And I yell, it happens.

And then I feel bad. And then I'm like, don't try not to do it. that all in the same day. And I made up a game where I would just like randomly, I can't move because I'm on a mic, but I just randomly fall asleep. Like I'll be running down the hallway and I'll fall asleep. And just like, whatever. And they are like in pure bliss and glee. And the only way that they can wake me back up is from a kiss. And like we were reading books last night and was the most hilarious thing they have ever seen or been a part of is like the wheels on the bus go rattle and shake rattle. I'm like they were so into it. I'm going to remember that day for the rest of

my life. So yeah, I mean, I'm going to miss it. I mean, absolutely. When it comes to your family kids, it's a big proponent of men getting a part of men's groups. Honestly, that's why I talk about lots because it was very impactful. You talk about impacts in your life, starting that down the road of, you know, and somewhere and now there's people chuckling to themselves because Sean said it again on our podcast. Anyways, is, you know, like we need more models of that behavior, right? But community working together. Yeah.

Empathy. Yeah. But the problem we have is, you know, we just lived it. Like we just literally lived how fear can take over everyone's life and how everybody's at each other as well because there's people who have really been affected in the last two years. And it's tough because everybody wants to move on, but some people are having a real tough time. It's hard to move on from that. I'm just feeling better.

Well, I posted about that the other day. Imagine you're one of the percentage that had a vaccine injury and your life will never be the same. How do you move on from that? Maybe you lost a loved one. Maybe you didn't. How do you move on from that? How do you move on when Daniel Smith gets on stage and says, you know, what we've just done to our population is one of the worst things. And then she gets attacked because she's not uplifting every part of the population.

It's like, we can't even talk about it. And so to move on from it, a lot of people are going to fight that tooth and nail. I don't have the answer. And certainly, I just go, like, I want to do everything I can to be around my family. but we also have to understand at some point what we almost fell into, which we did fall into, was leading us down a very dark path,

like a very, very, very dark path because we weren't talking about the things that matter. And so I go, we have to talk about it. We have to talk about every uncomfortable situation, and Sean seems to get themselves into those an awful lot of where he does not want to talk about it. He's like, this is going to be awful. I get as nervous as anyone, folks,

to talk about the most mundane thing. Because Sean wants to go to the, I don't know, the company softball game, and not that I've been to one of those, but you get the point, and like have everybody come over and say hi and how's it going and it's just niceties. The problem is, is like,

that's not the way the world works, maybe for your lifetime it will, but eventually things are going to come to roost, and we have to talk about them. We can pull so many examples from the past. I just had a Harold, Harold, Gerald Grownon, on 97-year-old who grew up in Holland, born in 25, lived through World War II. Right. And he talks about being part of the underground.

And what he comes, like his quote, and I'm going to read it because I'm not going to butcher Gerald. It was literally just before you came on. It was, uh, um, we'll pull it up, folks. Actually, it's on my phone. We're both on our phones. He said, You know, I came to the conclusion after all these years that there's a hell of a lot more good people than bad ones.

The Germans aren't all bad. Remember, this is a guy who got sent off to a farm to work as a laborer, and they pulled the priest out on the cattle car, and he was never seen or heard from again, okay? So, you know, I came to the conclusion after all these years that there's a hell of a lot more good people than bad ones. The Germans aren't all that bad.

The Americans aren't all that bad. We are not all that bad, but there's a lot of bad people among us. And so you go, what is, you come back and you go, what is like hate speech? What is, what is all these things? It's like, well, I don't want to incite. I think we can both agree. I don't want to incite violence on any population. I think that's like, but we have to have open discussion dialogue to talk about what's going

on in our society. Otherwise, we will find ourselves back to where we're, you know, not allowing certain people into restaurants, not allowing certain people to leave the country. Or the wrong people in charge. Right. And that can go, I'm not sitting here saying the right people are... We're sitting back and going and looking at history. Right.

Right? Someone can, like, gather groups with, you know, based on fear and hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate... Well, listen, you have... God, I hate talking about politics. But on one side you have... Like, even there's an... example in our country, in our own country of that.

Who? And so what happened with residential schools and what happened with children being taken away and people thinking, oh, that's good. Yeah, no, they need. And if you, okay, there's this documentary on Netflix. It's called, and that's what I was looking for, for love. For love. And it just like, it just grazes the surface.

It's not even, there's still places without clean drinking water. Like there's, and I mean, you know, and your partner saw, you know, systemic racism firsthand at work, what she, she worked in schools where, you know. Mel worked on the reserve when she first came here. Right. So she got to see life from a reserve standpoint being on a school, certainly. And so anyways, they have this guy literally in for love. and I wish I was better with names, but I forget his name. And that's like, let's take the, like, he wanted to eliminate indigenous culture,

and he was a high power player in the government eliminating a culture. 18-year-old Sean said this. Okay, I can't believe we're going to say this out loud, because I think it's a really dumb thought. But I also think it's a thought a lot of us had because we don't understand the complexities to us. We weren't educated about it. So my thought is, at a.

18, maybe 20, somewhere in there. So why don't we just write a blank check, not like a blank check, but here's an exorbitant amount of money, break it up above all the population, now they're all millionaires. How can we move on from this? Right? It was a pretty naive thought of Sean not exploring the topic and understanding how long this has been going on and different complexities that go on. Well, what trauma looks like and why. And Matricia said, she said the rat thing. I found that very interesting. Seven generations to heal from trauma. First Nations have talked about that.

Right. But then, you know, like, so this is, me and Mel, I get in this argument a lot, folks, of, of the First Nations, or just people experiencing trauma. And then you hear the story of the British home children. But because they're white, all of a sudden it gets whitewashed. And I'm like, but literally like 100,000 kids anywhere. from two to 15 came across from Britain because they were homeless or they lost their parents or whatever. They were at an orphanage sent across the sea by themselves to be put as hired help,

but not hired obviously because they're child labor. And they're part of our population too. That's trauma too. I can't imagine that. And so I go like the problem I have with this entire discussion is there's so many hardship stories. First Nations, we systemically went after them. And I think the more digging and reading you do on it, it's like whether or not there's kid bodies everywhere, which there are bodies, I'm not arguing this, is we tried to eliminate their culture by assimilation.

We just tried to bring them over to our way of life thinking it would be better for them. But we didn't understand the ramifications of that. That's what Patricia Bauer is talking about, right? I didn't understand my place in this world because of the 60s scoop. And so now I've been trying to find... Which I didn't know about. Which I didn't know about, which you've been trying to find your way back to. And so that's one part of this.

Then the next part is you got all these different cultures that we go to war with and then we treat them like shit. And then you got the 100,000 kids that came over and I assume a lot of them had great homes. Got to assume some of them didn't have great homes. And then that bleeds into our society. And then the government sits there and says they're going to fix all the clean drinking water. And then you get, oh, and I'm Jocelyn Berziac on from Manitoba. And she talks about how big of a shit show it is. And it's like, so I always come back to if our family unit started taking care of the family unit.

And this is a Jordan Peterson thing, right? Take care of yourself because maybe you can take care of your family. If you can take care of your family, maybe you can help your community. I talk about that all the time. And if you can't pour from an empty cup. It starts with you. Right. And so, like, I don't know the, I don't even want to begin to act like Sean knows the answers to the First Nation.

But acknowledge, we're not going to solve it here today, folks. But acknowledging that, like, listen, guys, they're not just, like, whining. Like, there's some stuff going on there. This is a real big, giant thing. And I think. But it's complex. It's, it's acknowledgement. Acknowledgement that it happened.

That's, I think, the very first step. That's all. let's not all anyone's looking for and I can't speak to that I can't speak to that but I can tell you what we are doing in our community yes and somehow we're getting there yeah I've probably turned off half of the the listeners by this long anyways um no it's okay uh so um oh gosh so this starts almost two years ago which and I had to keep a secret which I'm not good at uh at all And I'll tell a story here first. And when we're transitioning from what went on in our country,

so my mom had cancer, she didn't talk about how much time she had. She never told us, like at all. Like, I have six weeks, six months, a year. Like, she just didn't, like, talking about it. And that was not fun. And I will never, I kind of, But it's, it's the way she was. And she, it was her way of protecting us.

And we were driving. She, gosh, she takes me on lanes. Like, she made me go fishing with her, like, north of the Beaver River every summer, like, twice. Which I'm grateful for now as an older human. And, um, we'd just go fishing and be quiet, you know, hanging out north of Meadow Lake. And, and my grandpa lived up up there. and we're on one of these like really long, long drives. And she didn't ever like to say much.

She just kind of like asht her cigarette out the window. And she once told me, I like traveling with you because you don't make me talk. Great. But when she did say things, I usually slept because I was working so hard that I would just like pass out on these things. And she told me this story. I actually, I haven't told anyone this. The beginning of the story, I kind of cover it in, and when we announce this project, I lightly brushed on it because it's a really long story,

longer than I have in a seven-minute speech. And I was like, Mom, you gave me the old albums, because my mom's on desk doorstep. I don't know when she's going. I don't know if she does. And I'm like, I found this picture of this, child and and I can't say a lot about it because it's not our personal family. Well, it's in our family, but and is that like a dead child?

And she's like, oh, yeah, so we had some people in our family lose children. And she went on to say that she was grateful that she was, leaving before because she never could take that pain of losing a child that she had played witness to in our family. And it was just one of those conversations that I'll always remember and will always stay with me. So what it comes back to is the greatest pain, the greatest pain. Could you ever imagine losing a child? No. that would change the course of your life forever.

That would impact your whole entire life. That would, you know, a lot of people don't stay together or anything after that. Like, it's hard to function. Imagine that pain. And so we have to understand. We have to take a look at this from a point of view of perspective, understanding, and love. Because I couldn't imagine that as a parent. And so we got to think about like a people are in.

pain and they have been for a long, long time. And they had cultures stripped away. So what do you turn to when you're in pain? Drugs, alcohol. Yeah, not the great things. Not the great things. Yeah. It gives you momentary bliss to forget about your life. And I grew up here. I saw it. I played witness to a lot of things and I didn't know what to do. I didn't know how I could be a part of it. And it comes back to that quote by Jim Carrey, how can you serve the world? What do they need that your talent can provide? And so this has, yeah, I approached when Malcolm was at the Lloyd Region Health Foundation. I was like, I would love, I'd love to fix up your building with a mural.

And he's like, great. We're really looking for a truth and reconciliation piece. I was like, truth and reconciliation. I, and I'm being 100% honest here, I'm telling you the whole story. I was like, I don't know if that's appropriate for me to paint something about truth and reconciliation as a non-indigenous artist. And I sat on that for a really long time. And so did they. And so they, and then I spoke to Randy Noble.

And she is an indigenous photographer. And she said, Brandy, I want you to think about it this way. It's about creating conversation and building bridges between our two communities. Come to a heart of treaty six meeting. And I was like, okay, I'll, I'm open to listening and learning because it's not my position to, you know, I only can say what I know in my experience of life and where I came from and what I've witnessed. And I went to that meeting and I had told Clint Chokin, who you've had on. Yeah, Clint's a wonderful man.

Yeah. So great. So I work for with LPSD in Art Academy and I work with Tricia and I work with Clint. And I didn't know Clint that well yet. and I had shared something in confidence with Tricia. I had shared that, you know, the things that I have seen and heard and feeling this, feeling like I couldn't do anything, feeling, what's the word I'm looking for? Paralyzed?

Not paralyzed. Anyway, I don't know how it could help, but I always knew it, it just, just didn't ever sit right with me. Truth and reconciliation, like the painting or the entire truth? Growing up with, growing up with separatism. Okay. The separatism of communities and racism.

And I had shared that with her. I was like, I always felt helpless. That's the word I was looking for. Like, I always felt like I wanted to help, but I didn't know how. And my journey and path led to, you know, having the ability and the wherewithal to handle conversations because you can't please everyone. And it would be ignorant to not be afraid because there are people out there who don't believe in what I believe in and can, you know, get to the point where they might take it out on, hopefully it doesn't come to that. But to outweigh the good and the bad.

So I went to this heart of 236 meeting and I was blessed in. It was the most beautiful thing I've ever been a part of, but Clint stands up. And he says, Brandy, can you share with me what you shared with Trish, Trisha, Trish? People call her both names, which really confuses me because I'm uncomfortable with saying names in the first place. And then people call her two names. And I'm like, what is it anyway? So I stand up in this meeting not ready to talk about anything because I was there to listen and learn. And I said what I had to say.

I said I grew up here not knowing what to do or what to say and this is what I want to do to help. I will take my creative gift and help in any way I can and and have it be. be a pillar of hope and recognition, acknowledgement. And I went on this mural tour with these students last spring, and this was before that meeting. And there are a lot of things represented downtown, if anyone's seen like the Bar Colonnists are represented, a lot of things are represented, but the indigenous are not one of them. And they are a part of our community. And through many conversations and a lot of work from some are committee and conversations and conversations,

with Randy and learning, and I don't know everything, and I'm the first to admit that. I'm still learning so much. And Randy, that's all she said. It's about building bridges. And you are allowed, you're allowed to help. You're allowed to be here. You are allowed to be here with us and do these things. And ultimately it came down to if I don't, you know, go to all these meetings if I don't bring these people together, if I don't provide the installation of the imagery and help with my skills and design, this project won't move forward at all. So do you want it to not move forward and think that you're and and let fear control like I can't be a part of something like this? Or do you want to help in any way you can and create something absolutely inspiring and beautiful

and meaningful, artwork has power. And I would be, again, ignorant not to believe that it does have certain power. So after that was the spring before last, or last spring, yeah, last spring. And we've had another meeting since and we announced the approval. Because again, like I said no, right? I said no up first. I was like, I don't think, you know, but Trisha said, Brandy, why don't you come at it? Like, everyone had faith in you that you were, like, they thought you could. Isn't that saying something? They thought that you could do this.

And of course, I'm like, you know, you get uncomfortable and people acknowledge you and you're like, you can do, like, you're great, you can do this. And I'm just like, I don't think so. So sometimes it takes some growing and reflecting and it did take that amount of time. to come into this whole thing and it's it's called choose of and join hands and truth and reconciliation we have that first north side because it has a lot of meeting the north meaning and we talked about that that at the heart of treaty six meaning there was a just a north of fast gas there there was a point in in our history here in this community and

Clint talked about it there's like an invisible line there and it's where the indigenous people had to come set up camp, come into town, get their goods and just leave and go back to camp and then pack up camp and go. They weren't they weren't allowed to stay here. They weren't allowed to interact. They weren't allowed. That's separatism. That's, that's, so there's this invisible line where they want to build a bridge basically.

We, we want to build a bridge together. and I feel so honored and lucky to be for people to have faith that I can pull this off because it's like a big job. It's 130 by 20 feet. And the biggest project I will ever do to date, but it's not really about me. So I will do anything. And Steph said, so we're raising money right now. And she said, Brandy, I know we'll do this.

I know we'll raise the money because our community is spectacular. But what if we don't? What if we don't raise this? And I was like, I honestly, it's at the point where this is not about that money. With the learning and the people I've met and the stories I've heard, all you have to do is like, volunteer not a lot. Because I haven't volunteered a lot. I volunteered a little.

and to see what's going on and in our own community, to have a conversation with a family who's lost their daughter, to hear a story about their cousin in school who got stabbed in the face by a nun for running around the corner too fast. Just sitting, like we're talking about this whole podcast, giving people space and time to tell their story. And then you get to choose how you're going to move forward from that story. And I'm choosing to come at it with all my effort and my creativity to do good in the world and have purpose.

And so my artist fee for this project, if and when, and we will raise the money, because our community is amazing. I'm giving $25,000 back into trauma programming, creative trauma programming. So that doesn't mean I'm teaching it because, oh, there is the snotting boogers. That doesn't mean I'm teaching it because when I'm learning, like if we're going back into indigenous culture, they want to learn from their own culture and they want to connect back to that.

But I do get to choose and help in any way I can with not just there, but like at our sexual assault services, learning in schools, stuff like that. So I just, yeah, I feel pretty grateful that my creative gift has grown into something that is so impactful and meaningful. But yeah, we're raising money. And the way we did it was anyone can donate. anyone can donate any amount because it's a community project and you are part of it and we have a point in the mural where there's a ceremony and we'll all place our hands on the mural and trace lines around them. Can I ask a really dumb question?

Yeah. It's probably an okay question. It doesn't have to be a dumb question. Well, no, I ask them questions all the time. My question is, how long have you been talking about this idea? How long have they known about, well, not how long have they known? And that's that right there. This line where they weren't allowed to come across.

I think it's the 40s or something. In my opinion, I could be wrong about this. And certainly coming on here and talking about it will help, right? Is there's a portion of the population. Maybe there's a huge chunk of the population. It doesn't being told like being told what to think. and so they have to come to it you have to find different ways to certainly a podcast is one of them certainly other different ways are music art there's a thousand different ways probably to slowly

build a bridge across to two different cultures two different areas that are a part of the same community um i'm wondering how do people find out more about it uh now you may laugh at that but You go, even with yourself, two years ago, you didn't know, you were basically a no to the, I ain't touching this. This is way too tough or everything else. And then you talk about going to the meetings. It was like a hard one. I was like, I'm not sure. True.

I'm listening to this. And I go like, I can't speak to anything. I'm fine. The longer I podcast, the more closer I get to like trying to draw back into the community and trying to help sort out things here instead of. talking, you know, I still do talk about things that are happening in Toronto or, you know, New York, wherever else. But it's funny because I'm like, Sean ain't going to fix anything in Toronto. Sean may not even be able to fix anything in Lloyd Minster, right? If it does even need Sean's help. You used your podcast as a platform and you raised a buttload of money for

bike for breakfast and that was one of the first big, big projects you did, right? Well, and then there was the health foundation. And the health foundation. So that's something. Yes. Just some little. Well, I just, I come back to this one. I'm really intrigued by this, right? Because I'm like, oh, that's interesting. I love history. And the more you dig into history, whether you're talking about what's going on with residential schools, you just start reading some of them stories.

And every parent, your skin will crawl. And then, you know, you go back and you listen to Albert Jimmy on here or Clint Chokin, or you go through a bunch of the different names, Matricia Bauer, Jocelyn Berziak is another one, you know, like, there's these different stories and you just hear them from a person and like, holy man, okay, how do we move forward? And I, one of the things I think it was Albert Jimmy said is you have to come, you have to come to us. You need to come out. You need to experience some of our culture instead of us always coming to you. And now you're talking about building a bridge. I'm like, oh, that's

actually okay. So how do, or how are you going about trying to help? Because you know, like, does everybody in Lloyd listen to the podcast? No. Like that, that's, laughable so how do you try and get it to the widest audience so that when you do the hands on a wall that you were just about to talk about and I'm going to cut you off and I apologize it isn't just the 15 people or the 100 people or the 200 people that know I don't know how many people are in the meetings I certainly sound kind of like a jackass right now but how do you get it so where it is the community that comes out in sports and it is a community movement so that it actually is an all branch instead of just another mural on the wall.

Because there's lots of murals on the wall and you go, there's no indigenous there. But I don't even know where all the murals on the wall. I know where yours is because I drive by it all the time and I like to look at it. I think it's, and I look forward to seeing the new one. When you say just a mural, Sean, that mural gets 10,000 people a year. What's that? The one on the one mural. Yeah, on the wall of, what is that place?

Sure. Thank you. Well, it's fantastic too. Yeah. All I'm meaning is... How do you get people to that? Yeah. No. What we're doing right now, one thing. I also have a committee. And they say one person is like, has a branch of 1,000. That's what someone told me. I don't know how true it is. Yeah, I know. I was like, it's insane. What are you talking about? Anyway, they have a branch of 1,000. The more I have the conversations, I spoke about it at the Inspiring Women's Conference. That's where we announced it.

So that was 300 women right there. So then you branch out who they talk to. And then we invite the schools because I feel like the youth and I work with youth, they need to be a part of something like this. And so LCSD, LPSD, they know. And then we go out to Stephanie and we go out to a couple of other people in our community. and then how do we involve surrounding community? Because everyone has to feel a part of it. And again, at the end of the day,

we're not going to please everyone. But there's symbolism and meaning in this mural to acknowledge, like there's like Cree, Dene, Blackfoot, Sultu, like there's so many people you need to represent. And that's where when my partnerships, because Randy Noble is partnering with me on this, my partnerships and learning that fills in the space where I don't know you know learning things from Clint and sometimes Clint says I don't know and you're going to have to ask an elder it's like okay great

and then I go to a meeting and there's two elders and and it's talking to people it's talking to people reaching out hoping that you're seeing and acknowledging them and that they can feel a part of it I know that Lloyd clears out in the summer. So when we install and when we have that day, who knows? Or we save the day for September when everyone's back, you know? But what that part of it is, it's interactive. It's a community feeling part of it, whether you've donated or whether you show up. That's two, you know, good things, good ways to be a part of it. It's to choose love, join hands and choose love moving forward. That's the symbolism behind it. What you're trying to do, I find very inspiring because Clint had told me about it, I think,

when he was on here, about the meetings that go on and trying to solve a very complex problem. Very complex problem. I don't need to look anywhere else in Canada. You can just stare around our area and go, look, it's a complex problem. There's a lot of people that are on all sides of the coin on this one. Yes. Oh, you're going to get some text messages. But here's the thing. I get text messages. I tell people this all the time. I get text messages all the time. You know, it's great to have fluff every time and tell me I'm the greatest human being on the planet.

But the truth of the matter is, I'm just another guy struggling through trying to do as many conversations to try and figure out some problems. This is one that I look at and I go, like, this is maybe one of the most complex it gets. There's certainly ones we started off with, you know, faith. and that's a complex one, you know. But certainly this is complex. And I'm like, I think what you're trying to do is really interesting. But in order to have the most impact, it has to be more than be told to be there because you're hauled there. Oh, no.

And I know that's not. It's not the one day. That's not what this means. It's not about the one day and the one ceremony. And I've learned that there has to be more than just a ceremony. Also, we have to have a feast to commemorate the beginning. So there's things I'm learning that we're going to be doing. Obviously, the city will be involved as well.

But it's not about this one day. It's what this symbolizes for, you know, mural stick around. It's probably going to be there long after I'm gone. What it symbolizes and represents. and Clint actually talked about that specifically. He says, you know, we can talk in these meetings all the time. But this is something that, this is a project, you know, that we're doing. You can see it.

And that's why they're partnering with us all on this, right? It's a partnership between Lloyd Minster Region Health Foundation, Yellowfinch images, heart of treaty six, truth and reconciliation committee, Brownie Hofer Studios, Beyond Border Circle of Change, like the co-op's going to get involved. Like, it's a community project. This, it really has nothing to do with me. I was just, well, I have to do the work. But, but it really has absolutely, like I'm just there, you know, capturing it with, with the only things that I know how to do.

I know how to paint. I know how to get good videos and photos. But the people I'm working with, they know how to get the community behind it. I look forward to seeing how it comes to fruition. I'll leave it there. June 30th, it's happening. June 30th, it's unveiled or it starts. It starts.

10 to 14 day install. 10 to 14 days of painting? 10 to 14 days to install that beast. Yeah. With the team. I go back to painting because. Home hardware is supplying the paint. That's right.

And install, you mean like you were on scaffolding painting, right? A sister lift. Oh, yeah, okay. Yeah, no, we're not hauling around scaffolding. I've done that before. I was very strong. I'm actually training right now. I'm training getting ready physically to do it.

What do you mean? It's very physical. Did you just think about, oh, I'm just going to roll stuff. You're just moving a brush? No, air brushing, spray paint. arms up like this for 12, 16 hours a day. So you're lifting Teddy? That's all it is.

You know, mixing paint. It's very physical. I have, I kid. I have professional muralists. I haven't released them yet because I'm doing a mural class. I recorded a mural class for artists to get into murals. So I have muralists coming coming. who travel the world doing murals. Kevin Lito, really cool guy. But he's like, it's just the,

like the install time. It's just like the physically, mentally, just taxing. It's, and I've done it. I've installed a 50-foot mural, and it is. It's very, it's way harder than you think it is every time. You never can prepare for the challenge. I'm also, though, during that time mentoring, there's a mentorship program that we're doing for two indigenous creatives to help learn and install, so learn about mural process and hopefully that can empower them and give them the skills. They also will receive an honorarium for professional development, so then they can go on and take this skill and do something with it and spread more creativity or have not only that, I've been approached by some people who are like,

I know someone who really needs this. So I was talk about creativity and art and whatever way you express yourself through music, that's your safe space, poetry, writing. Again, what do we all turn to? You know, besides, besides, like, if you're turned to in a healthy way, it's we turn to, we turn to each other, we turn to movies, music, you know, art is really powerful. And so I've already had people be like, I know who could apply for this. I think it would help them greatly.

So I'm taking on two mentors to teach the whole process to you. So that's going to be a big process. It's a big learning curve. Randy's never installed a mural. So. And you may ask. And maybe you never thought of this. But why didn't we just like get someone from somewhere else?

I don't know. If anyone did think of that, it's because it is a community project. I'm living, breathing from here. It means more. Instead of flying in someone to paint something, like, this is meaningful. This conversation is an important conversation. If anyone likes Netflix, everyone likes Netflix, why would I say that? Chelsea Handler.

she just did special and on Black Lives Matter and what needs to happen so I urge you to go so she comes in like my white privilege how I got to this mansion and whatever and and the appropriate how she wrote this book and it was called Uganda Be Kidney me and now that she's you know done learning but she said it's conversations between people. That's basically what I took away from that special was the conversation between everyone. It's not just one culture telling the other culture that they're wrong and fighting about it, right? It's an understanding and conversations for people to maybe like, okay, maybe my point of view

could look different. And what would that mean to me? what kind of self-learning can I do? Because if you don't know something, there is the world at your fingertips and you can learn more about it. And I hope that people do. Maybe people who didn't disagree

or who are disagreeing with what I'm saying here today. Just do a little bit. Well, this is why having conversations all the time you're asking me about, you know, if we go back to the hate speech thing, what happens if you bring somebody on who has like really extreme views.

If you artificially remove all those algorithms, so they just feed you the same thing, you can have holes in your argument, holes in your perception or belief system in the world, that type of thing. And so giving people the opportunity to come in and speak, I think is, for me, it's how I learn, like listening to people talk and like really starting to like, do I want to have arguments? No, like, I think there's, but at the same time, I also avoid those conflict like the plague. But at the same time, when something is said that I disagree with, which happens a lot across all forms of guess, it's something I chew on. And then I go out from here and I talk about

it over and over and over again, and chances are I'll get in a couple arguments about it and I'll keep thinking and maybe I'll do some reading. And you continue to grow and evolve and learn and hopefully in, you know, another five years, whatever it is, another four years, I guess, we're at four years of the podcast coming up here April 1st month, month today, I think. And the thing is, is like, but at the same time, everybody's got to be able to do that, right? If you're coming at it from one angle, you have to start to understand the opposite and why they're so against it so that you can bridge the gap with them too, because it doesn't work if all we do is build something for a small segment of the population.

I don't, that is, like, this is a, this is why this is so difficult because, you You're trying to bring in two sides of a coin that disagree with each other. Maybe. Maybe, but maybe. Because, you know, if we focus on some of the things that we agree on, we could probably get a lot of stuff done. You know, like, I mean, you're proving that. At times, I've proved it as well.

It'll just be interesting to watch. I wish you nothing but the best of luck with this. How do people, if they want to reach out in sport, where do they go? I'll put it in the show notes that way. Just the LRHF link. It's on the Lloyd Minister Region Health Foundation. I'll just send you the link. The link can be in the notes.

Sure. And that way people, if they want to donate, they can. They can donate or if you know someone who'd like to apply to the mentorship program, too. Oh, okay. Yeah. Right under the donation page is that application page for that program. So anyone looking to follow under your footsteps for the mirror. building process? Yeah, yeah, learn about what we're doing community work because, oh my gosh,

the business of art is just, it's a challenge in itself. It's community relations, contracts, like there's a professionalism that takes years to learn. So when you think about coaching and mentorship, like coaches and mentors take you, you know, they in one hour, two years, right, or two hours or whatever. So, yeah, I aim to hopefully lift a couple people up and they can keep doing this and keep making a difference creatively. But also, and it's in the application, they have to know that this is hard work, really hard work.

As I teased about what's hard about painting, hey? Oh, my gosh, it's so hard. It's so hard. like I still yeah well I mean you you choose your heart you know like and what I mean by that is is like for I think podcasting is maybe the easiest thing under the sun in saying that how many people get into podcasting and go holy shit I didn't realize how much work is it's super time consuming I bet if John went and painted for an hour let alone a mural folks that uh I'd be like man I didn't realize my hands would hurt so much or you know I'm sure there's like 10 different things in there

Or how do you paint a 50-foot face up close? You're this far from the mural. Where are you at? Is this an ear? I don't know. That's how hard. In my brain, all you do is you create a grid. Is that what you do or you don't do that?

There's a couple of ways you can do it. You can use a projector. You can use a traditional grid. But if you use a traditional grid, you'll get lost, right? So there's these things called doodle grids. and if you just Google or YouTube Google or doodle grid, it's just like this, it's just like random shapes that you spray paint on and then you get an aerial shot and then you have like you can have an iPad or a printout

of your doodle grid of where you're at on the wall and what you should be painting. I have not done a doodle grid yet. So this is going to be exciting. But last project, I used a projector. And I did talk to Kevin. Because if you don't know something, you talk to someone who does. And I have installed a 50 foot, but not 120. That's almost double the size of the last one I did.

That's double the size of the faces. So he's like, you don't know until you show up that day. So you try to project it. The projector doesn't work. Then you do this. And he's done like, in Montreal, he did, who's that really famous singer from Montreal, who lived in Montreal? Big face.

Oh my gosh. Leonard Cohen. Sorry anyone who I insulted with. I just have a hard time remembering names. And so Leonard Cohen, he did his face on this, like, 200-foot building. So he's like on a crane, you know. And he's like, I did it brick by brick because I couldn't project it. Because how do you project that?

You can't. What an adventure you're in for. You know, we're closing in on letting you out of here. But I am curious, you know, has this given you your love for art back or painting? Because, you know, like once upon a time, not that long ago, you had the post saying you gave up painting because you were basically burnt out of a whole bunch of different things. Yeah, I had a lot of meetings. I had a lot of, and I've, and, you know, there's a season for everything and an understanding for tiredness, burnout and not wanting to do something. Definitely after those 130 faces in one year,

I didn't want to paint a face or pay, have someone pay me to do it, that's for sure. I did it anyway, but I slowed it down. And the more that I do something outside of art and and serve with my creative gift and having purpose. I love meeting with people. I don't need to sit in my little corner anymore. I'm ready to go out into the world. I was excited to come here to talk to you today. I was so jazzed when I got to go to all those meetings.

I love people. I love speaking. I love writing. And I've found like a better balance. And so now I get to paint when I want to. paint not all the time because that's just not a realistic thing but I get to choose and and so that magic has come back into it and and magic and purpose and that's really all what we can ask of this life is is having that in what you're the this the way I'm

supporting myself and my family and I it's it's going it's pretty cool it's cool There's nothing wrong with being a multifaceted creative and not just being a painter because that's what I know how to do. I kind of know how to do other things. So I'm doing those. But yeah, I wasn't painting. That's when I made that post. I was like, I'm miserable.

It is therapy. It is a way of you got to show up for it too. You got to make the space. And that is like consistently. Like you show up. if you didn't show up, the magic wouldn't happen. And sometimes that's what it takes, showing up every day. Although I have three kids, so showing up periodically as much as I can in our routine.

Well, who knows when we sit down again? I've been joking about this a lot lately, but, you know, I don't know when our paths cross again. Certainly in Lloyd, our paths will cross again. But as far as the podcast world goes, you know, I assume I'm pretty darn sure that eventually you will be back here again. discussing some things. Yeah, after this we have to write down like some stuff. That's right. We got to, like, what is going to happen before our next podcast?

I, uh, what is in store for us? I appreciate you coming and doing this. And, um, uh, well, I look forward to seeing what you build here in, in a few months' time. And, uh, me too. I'm super scared, by the way. If I'm being honest, uh, I get, I'm sweating about it. I got a show on March 18th. That's 18 days away.

By the time this airs, it'll be whatever, 16 days away, I'm fucking terrified of it. Not just because I don't have this switch where you can sell out a show. It doesn't work like that. And it's in Emmington this time. Well, anyways, that's for a different day and a different story. But you got to do things that's scary. Well, you learn a lot. You learn a lot.

You got to push outside yourself in any way. And actually, let's just like round it up. That is what my book is about. See your everyday ordinary is extraordinary. So having that beautiful balance in your day filled with love, quality time, self-care, but also pushing beyond the fear. And it's giving you permission to do that and do what you love. I'll end with a quote from the Hobbit then.

Sure. I remember actually when you told me when we're on that Europe trip that I kind of out of my podcast, the long-going inside joke. And I was like, this is another side I'm getting to know Sean. He's an avid reader. And like, to be fair, we didn't have a lot of, I'm not going to say anything. But like, you don't mean a lot of young people who are like, I love, you know, reading and stuff like that when you're 16 or 15. Shoot, I had, I brought you pictures, Sean. I found pictures of you in high school in my living room and one from our lockers in school, and I left it by the door.

I'm sure I'll get it. I have a full set of teeth in that. You had a full facial hair in high school, which was also impressive. Yes, I think I got voted most hairiest grad or something like that. I was quite proud of that. You look like teen wolf. Well, here's Hobbit. It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out of your door.

You step into the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there is no knowing. where you might be swept off to. And that's obviously, if you've read The Hobbit, he ends up on a whirlwind journey, right, that takes him across the land. You know, every day, if you approach it that way, you never know where you might end up. There's a lot of beauty in that.

Yeah. Either way, that's always what I find interesting about the podcast, because every time I come and sit in here, I don't know what you said, we weren't going to talk about this. A lot of things I try to avoid at all costs. And I've found,

I've found when it's pulling, you just, you just, you know, I thought we're going to talk about a mural for an hour, you know, honestly. That's what I thought, which we kind of did. But at the same time, it's like, I just came to be pulling this way. Well, I was genuinely curious about some stuff. So, and I said it. I asked. Yeah. It's all good. Well, thanks for coming in and doing this. No, thank you for having me. It was great.