Shaun Newman Podcast - #482 - Margaret-Granny Mackay

Episode Date: August 23, 2023

Mom, Grandma and unofficial voice of the Coutts 4. Give Send Go for the Coutts 4: https://www.givesendgo.com/G9HX4 Let me know what you think Text me 587-217-8500 Substack:https://open.substack.com/pub/shaunnewmanpodcast Patreon: www.patreon.com/ShaunNewmanPodcast

This is Matt Osborne. This is Pat King. My name is Martin Armstrong. This is Alex Kraner. This is Franco Tarzano, and you're listening to the Sean Newman podcast. Welcome to the podcast, folks. Happy Wednesday before we get to today's show. Let's talk about today's episode sponsors, Joy, and Blaine, Stefan from Guardian,

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story Caleb taves renegade acres I was talking to him actually earlier earlier today and we did between uh... Caleb and Renegate Acres opening up a spot for community uh... you know just community events community things to try and like hey bring on this is going on in the town uh... and then Tuesday mashup doing the same thing uh... we started uh... well and I'll bring it up again uh... slim in the in the area of Marwayne has a fundraising coming up with a new looking for a new ice plant boards and new pipes under the arena floor and they're having a concert

on September 8th with Gord Banford and DeWain Steele. And so the story goes, Slim then reaches out and says, man, I can't believe you keep talking about this. And I'm like, well, I'm literally two different spots where this is exactly what we want to do. And so they've given us a table for the event. And so right now, we're like, okay, do we auction off the table? Do we all go support them? What do we do here? And so we're going to figure that out. We got a couple of weeks to figure out September 8th, whether we're going to auction off, have some fun with it, actually go there. If you're listening to this and you're like, man, I got an idea for you.

By all means, hit me up in the text line. Either way, September 8th, Gord Banford, Dwayne Steele, going to be out in Marwain, raising money for their arena. All right. The deer and steer butchery, I was talking to Brian today, and in a couple weeks, I'm going to be out helping, you know, I talk about this lots. And it has been, you know, sometimes I feel like, oh, yeah, I got this all planned out right, and then it never comes to fruition.

I talk about it for like six months. But I'm going to be getting my hands. one of the cool things that deer and steer is you can go out and help as you butcher the animal and you know just cutting up the meat and I found it fascinating the last year when I did it so I'm heading that way here in September. I'm going to be getting my hands in there and seeing you know all the different cuts and just and it's it's super cool what they do anyways for the deer and steer they're a fast growing custom cutting and wrapping butchery located near Lloydminster they focus on high quality locally sourced meats with unparalleled customer service who are proud to be from

this community. They are currently seeking a dedicated and experienced butcher to join us not just as an employee but as a partner. If that is you, reach out to them. Give me a call 780870-8700. Next up is Erickson Agro Incorporated. That's Kent and Tasha Erickson at Irma, Alberta. Their family farm raising four kids, growing food for our community and this great

country. They've teamed up with the SMP. They enjoyed the message and some of the content on here. They wanted to make sure I was supported. And I'm just encouraging other, you know, small family-run companies. If that's you, we can probably make something work here with the SMP. And certainly as we're over halfway through the year, prices are slowly going down for the rest, you know, the remainder of the year. So if you're wanting to get on one of the days and help support the SMP, we'd love to hear from you in the show notes there is the phone number shoot me a text reach out and three trees tap and kitchen what do we get to talk about live music but they got local beers on tap and twos would always say man you got to pump up the food all right we'll pump up the food they got a trifecta folks

and all you do follow them on social media you're going to see when their next concert or not concert it isn't a concert their next in-person you know kind of open mic night if you would in the in the restaurant. I always, you know, the selection of local craft brewer's is pretty cool, you know. I love it when a place supports local. Three-Tee certainly does. And if you're taking the misses out or mist her, of course they got great food. So call book reservations at 780-874-7625.

Now, let's get on to that tale of the tape brought to you by Hancock Petroleum for the past 80 years. they've been an industry leader in bulk fuels, lubricants, methanol, and chemicals delivering to your farm commercial or oil field location. For more information, visit them at Hancock, Petroleum.com. She's a mother, grandma, and freedom fighter, who's become the unofficial spokesperson for the Coots 4. I'm talking about Margaret Granny Mackay. So buckle up, here we go.

This is Granny Mackay, and you're listening to the Sean Newman podcast. Well, welcome to the Sean Newman. podcast today. I'm joined by Margaret Mackay, but I would, you know, it's funny, wherever I seem to run into things that you're a part of, or, you know, it always comes with Granny at the start. So I'm sure a lot of people know you as Granny Mackey,

Granny Margaret Mackay, Granny. Either way, thanks for making the trip to Lloyd Minster to do this in person. I don't know about you, but for me sitting here, I always appreciate when I can do in person rather than virtually, virtually, you know,

is a nice fix to a lot distance problems but it's always better when we can sit across from one another well thank you for having me here like I said I take every opportunity that's handed to me to speak for the foreman I'm an extension of them I've been doing this for some time so thank you well you gotta tell me you know I want to know there's so much here so I we were talking just before we got in the studio when we're sitting there having coffee you'd ask if I went to Cout or Ottawa, and I said, yeah, I went to Ottawa.

But by going to Ottawa, doesn't mean I know a whole heck of a lot about Coots. And I've certainly interviewed a few people around the Coots protest, but other than that, you know, it's funny what, I know not to believe, 99. Whatever percent of mainstream media, but what they blasted was the guns and everything else, right? And so that is what it became.

It became this, you know, they were about to, I don't know, you can put out the thought there further on, but that's what it became. Before we get to all of that, I was just curious, who is Margaret Mackay? And how does she get the granny acronym? And how does she become to where she's sitting, you know, touring Alberta, trying to get the word out for these four men? I was just curious. Like, who are you?

I know. Many people do ask who I am. Like, nobody really knows anything about me. Three years ago, or guess over three years now, the craziness started in 2020. I woke up quickly. they took down the doctor's video of the frontline doctors, and that was quite a moment. I thought, okay, what just happened? I saw a video with millions of views, and it's gone.

So I woke up. Then I moved to Fort Saskatchewan in 2020, and I started going to rallies. I'd never been to a rally before in my life. In fact, my daughter and I went to the first one. She ran away. She went back to the car, and I thought, nope, I'm going to keep going. So I started rallying in Edmonton. and then in the fall, Mark Friesen started a convoy going out to Vancouver.

I thought, well, here I go. I'm going to Vancouver now. So off to Vancouver, I went, and that was my first convoy. Then Pastor Coates. And sorry, what convoy to Vancouver? What year is that? 2020. Interesting.

October 2020. Well, I've heard about the 2019 before COVID ever happened, the convoy that went out from, I think Wayne Peters is the first ever. put that on my plate of the first one that went to Ottawa, and I believe that was 2019. So just piecing it together here as we go. Yeah, so in 2020, and I really didn't know who Mark Friesen was either. I just knew he was somebody from Saskatoon. I'm from Saskatchewan originally, so. And I'm going to ask, what part of Saskatchewan?

Just outside of Kindersley. Oh, really? Okay. Small town? A farm. A farm. Just outside of flax scone. Okay.

You would say, you would say kindersly then. It's funny, because I'm not originally from Lloyd Minster. Well, I am. but it's Hillmond, right? So a small town Saskatch, and you know, gas. Exactly. Exactly. So obviously I started following Mark because he's from Saskatoon and that's kind of my back door, right? So I started following him and then ended up in Vancouver, my first convoy and rally in Saskatoon, or in Vancouver. Then Pastor Coates got arrested and I decided I need to stand up for this man. And me and my flags started marching my 12,000 steps. I was a walker back then. So I started walking 12,000 steps in front of the remand.

And then I got told that I could be harming pastor coats. I was devastated. I thought I would never want to hurt anybody. So just so I'm clear here, this is what the best of being in person is so I can stop and start when I, you know, you get on digital and you're like, I'll just wait. I'll write it all down and then you forget. You go to remand and start walking 12,000 steps out front of it in protest of Pastor Coats being locked up. Yeah, with my Canadian flag and my Alberta flag and my winter clothes because it's cold. It's wintertime. Some people came out and started walking with me and I kind of got to be known as that

Granny walking out in front of, because I started Granny Mackay a long time ago. I just like the sound of it. I'm Scottish, so Granny Mackay. And then, so I started pounding the pavement in front of the Reman Center, standing up for Pastor Coats. and I was upset. I would say things like, where is everybody? What did you have for breakfast this morning? You know, I wonder what Pastor Coates has had for breakfast this morning, you know, trying to get people engaged. Nobody wanted to get engaged. It was weird. And a lot of stuff happened, you know, there were the three fences around the church.

There was lots of things going on back then. Then I got told I could have been hurting Pastor Coates. I was devastated. I went home. I thought, oh my gosh, I would never want to hurt. to anybody. They told me I could be getting him locked down and everybody else locked down. So I stopped marching. I went home. I was absolutely devastated. I was in a dark place. I thought, oh my gosh, I hurt this man. And I went into my room, and this is a weird story. I went into my room. I shut the lights off. I laid on my bed. And I was really going into a dark place. And my phone dinged. And I turned the light on and I looked at my phone. It was a stranger. I'd never met her before. She was from Red Deer. And she says, why are you going to stop? You're doing good work. Why are you

stopping? And I thought, why am I stopping? And so I sat up. She took me out of this dark place. A stranger reached out to me. And I thought, oh my gosh. And we got to remember, we're back in 2021. The start of 2021, 21, everybody's locked down. I have a good family. I live with my daughter, and my son-in-law and my grandchildren. I'm not alone. I was never alone. And I started worrying about the people that were alone. I started weanerose for mental health.

I figured we're outside. We can gather. We can come together as a group. So I started weiner roast of March of 2021 for mental health. And so I kind of walked away from Pastor Coates because I thought I was hurting them. And I still supported them. I just wasn't marching.

Before, why did they think you were hurting Pastor Coates by marching outside? That seems, in my mind, this is what I find so confusing when people are like, oh, we can't do that because it might hurt him. It's like, he's literally in jail. How can I hurt him anymore by bringing light to the fact we've got a pastor in prison? I think it was by design. I think it was to make me stop. That was my first lesson on not to believe everything you always hear. It was somebody I thought I should trust, but it was bad advice.

And because I don't understand remands and I'm a grandma that was trying to bring light. And I won't even know why I was doing what I was doing. I was just doing something, right? And there's so much, like I said, I've slept in my Jeep at the whistle stop. I've done a lot of stuff. And, oh, there's two o'clock, Tony. Do you want to talk to Tony? I'm sorry.

Just as heck, he'll love. He'll just want to be on here with us. I'm sorry. For the listener, Tony is one of the men who's being charged, who's been locked up for 500-plus days. This call is subject to recording and monitoring. It's funny. I told Tony he should come on. This is a way.

Hi, 2 o'clock, Tony. How are you doing, Grety? You're not going to believe what I'm doing right now. Say hello to Sean Newman. Well, hello, Tony. You may have recalled we chatted once upon a moment. a time. Can he hear you with the headsets? He can't hear me with the headsets, but I'm yelling loud enough. Hopefully you can hear. Yeah, so you're on the Sean Newman show right now. Well,

you could tell us about your health. How are you feeling? Like, how are you doing today? Forgive me. Forgive me, Tony. Forgive me, Tony. I feel like I'm interrupting a longstanding friendship with you and Granny here. When you talk about your guts, maybe you could let the listener in and what exactly you mean? Like what is it about the food or your health that maybe you'd like the listener to understand of what's been going on for your stay there? How long did it take you to cure it on the outside

with good products and good food and good water? Do you feel like you're back to where you began back in 2015, 2016 when you were so sick? Do you feel your... No, not just yet. How many days now has it been, Tony, since you've been locked away? How long have you been in the rebound?

555 days. Well, I mean, well, you have an opportunity, Tony, and I'm not sure what you're at liberty to say or not or whatever, but you've got an audience to talk to. Is there something you want to talk to the people of Alberta, Saskatchewan, Canada that are all tuning in? What do you want to say to them? How much does it cost you to date? Do you have a guesstimate on, I know how much is cost to keep you in there that you've paid? Yeah. Yeah.

It's probably close to 20. thousand dollars for you to have an iPad and uh canteen and phone packages what was i shocked what was i shock that you had to buy do you remember the little packets you used to put in the water yeah salt they got to buy salt yeah you get free sugar get free sugar but you have to buy the salt so um so are you is he running a tap is that is that what happens when he eventually gets out he has to pay off this twenty thousand dollars or he's got to be constantly that's constantly they pay $700 to $1,000 a month. Right now it's probably $1,000 a month

to have iPad, phone, and any canteen. So is Tony paying that from outside in? Yes. So there's been $60,000 probably paid into the remands from these four men. And if that dries up, it all goes away, they just say, oh, you didn't pay your bill and take away the iPad, take away this.

It's a credit. You can't have any salt? No. Yeah. What did you hear at cost to keep you in remand for a year? And how many people in a cell? Yeah. Where's the third guy sleep? Next to what? Absolutely shameful. I agree. Talking to the other inmates, Tony, one thing between talking to a few different people were held for a long period of time. Are the other inmates shocked that you're still sitting there? Or are they kind of like, oh, no, you've seen this with tad. over there and you just got to go talk to Ted and this is something Ken is known for. What kind of record do you have, Tony?

Well, we're going to lose you, Tony. We got our one-minute warning. So love you. And maybe give Sean a call one day here again. Thanks, Tony. Stay strong in there. Okay. Love you. Talk to you soon.

Love you. Bye-bye. Well, what does a person say after that? I'd love to tell you the listener that I plan that, that that was I mean obviously he calls it two o'clock for you but I mean that was kind of um I know I know it was just like I said we timed it and I I could have blocked the call I could have stopped it but it's pretty hard not to um take the call as you saw there was another 1866 number which means one of the other prisoners is calling you right yeah it's it's hard when I I try to spread them out

I tried to get them to call at different times because when you can't answer for one you know they're they're not taking a call right at that minute um I try to talk to all four of them daily. I talk anywhere from an hour and 20 minutes to sometimes they call twice, so it'll be 40 minutes. You just got to be there for them, and they're phoning a lot of people. But they're my family now. Like I didn't know them when I found them, but I definitely would have any one of them is my family now. And I am family. They're mine. Do you get to, like, are they allowed to have, like, in-person?

Can you go to the place and actually see them and talk to them? You can see through the glass. You can go in there and you can have a visit. And you could, but you. By the phone kind of thing? Yes. Yes, you're on a phone and they're on a phone through the glass. And you can have a visit.

But no human contact as far as like barriers go. No. Jacqueline hasn't seen Jerry. She got to see him in a courtroom. Jacqueline is Jerry's wife. And she's been banned from seeing him since what was June. July of last year. She can talk to him on the phone, but the Calgary remand has banned her. And what is their reasoning?

They're saying because she's got charges, she's not allowed to come in. But she was seeing him, and then the remand blocked her. The judge even said, I will not stand between a husband and his wife. So the judge said she can go visit him, but the remand says, no, you cannot see him. and so she gets to talk to him on the phone, but she did sneak into the courtroom and she got to see him that way. Yeah, well, I was just, I was just away, you know, I was in Kelowna and then flights canceled and whatever because of the fire. And I was away from my family for like five days, folks.

And Sean was starting to go a little bit squirly. We're talking 550 days. Yeah. Like that's, I mean, that's a lifetime in one sense, right? Seven children. There's seven children in this scenario. Two single fathers were raising their children. It's hard.

There's an 80-year-old mother out there. Tony is an only child. His father passed away about six years ago. His mother celebrated her 80th birthday here just a couple months ago. 80 years old. This is not on the spring chicken side of the life cycle. He's missed a year and a half with his mother right now. And they did everything.

and that this is, I watched the interrogation in the courtroom. And when Tony was interrogated, I saw the video, the first thing he says, can somebody let my mother know that I'm okay? This is the man that spent 555 days in a remand. He's worried about his mom. Like, it's, it's sick, it's twisted. And, but we're on the outside and we have to put. push through this and help them. Well, I hate to rewind the story, but I'm going to try.

Because you were talking about walking out front of Pastor Coates, the remand there, and being told you might be harming them, so you stop. And then now you're going to have to, whether you start the story back up or you know exactly where we left off. Well, like I said, that lady sent me a text. And pulled you out of the darkness. It was, and I won't lie. I felt like, like, I honestly believe there was a, there was a hand in here that that helped pull me out of that darkness because I literally felt myself sinking. And when that phone dinged and this stranger, and I've met her since then, I got to meet her.

And then I sat up and I thought, what can I do now? And then I worried about people that were alone in the lockdowns because I had my family. So I started, and I don't understand why things happen. It's been a journey of three years. I could go back through how this is all played out through me following all kinds of pastors, reverence. I'm not a Christian. I don't even have a religious background. I understand nothing about God.

I understand nothing. But I have been led since 2020, the start of all of this, through following pastors and reverence, stomping out in front of a remand center for a pastor. I've got so many Christians in my life right now, and I'll proudly say I'm starting Bible study tomorrow night. Good for you. So it's been a journey. It's been a true journey.

I'll tell you this. I grew up in a Christian household and everybody, you know, I don't need to explain this to the listener, but we'll do it one more time. What the heck? And it was going to Ottawa and being smacked right across the face

with a whole bunch of just like, oh man, I've been reading the Bible now. What am I at, folks? Mark, Matthew, no, Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Romans, Acts. Acts, Romans, First Current sins. Does that sound about right?

I don't know. Something like that. I'll get it here one of these days. But in saying that, it's been fast acting, you know, because one of the craziest things about doing it was how quickly peace found me. And I've talked about that a lot. But I was, I would, you know, when you said that, I was like, yeah, tell me about it. Right?

Like, I mean. It's a journey. And it has been a journey and there's been a hand helping us through it. And you listen to that inside voice. And when it tells you to keep going, you keep going. It tells you to turn left, you turn left. But you got to listen. And you've got to have enough quiet time to hear it.

And when you get a message, you follow through on it. And so we'll go back to... This is... I got to say, you know, one of the things that has been really... And I don't mean to say there was no Christians that stood up. but it doesn't shock me. You're like, I literally, I got no background with God, I don't, but something is pulling me all the way to keep doing it.

Like, I chuckle about it because I'm like, how is it I didn't know who you were until, I don't know, maybe two months ago? When did we first start talking? Two months ago? Yeah, it was June. It was right before the pretrial. It was right before the pretrial. That's right.

And somebody said, you got to have granny on them. I'm like, well, who's that? You know? Like, it's interesting to me, I guess, how we can all be in our certain ways pushing and doing these different things, but all have a similar story to craning. And it's like, listen, I don't know anything about God.

I don't know anything about that. I wasn't in the faith thing. I wasn't doing that. But all of a sudden, when nobody's doing it, you're marching out front of Pastor Coates remand and taking a stand of like, this is wrong. That's like, I admire the crap out of you, just for that story alone.

And I don't even understand it myself. Like I said, it's just been a journey, and everybody keeps saying, you need to write this down. You probably do. And it's, like I said, there's so much. And my daughter said to me one day, and I'll never forget these words

because it kind of stabbed me in the heart. She says, Mom, what do you really think one person can do? And I looked at her, and I thought, I don't know, but I guess we're going to find out. because I just kept going. And I think she was more in wanting to protect me.

Like, what are you doing? You're going to embarrass yourself, you know, which I just kept going. And now I'm sitting here talking to you. So you just, you don't know where it's going to lead you. Yeah. Or for what reason it leads you here. And like I said, I've never followed fathers and priests and preachers and reverends. And I've got a list of them.

They just keep appearing. and I've got people now sending me scripture and the guys are sending me me scripture and I don't understand it all like I said they're sending me all kinds of stuff and I love it. I find it very heartwarming and very it's protective. Recently people have been sending me prayers. They're sending me scripture. They're saying I don't know if they feel I need protection right now, but it's good and I'm accepting it. Right now we probably all need it. Well, I've been talking a lot about this. I think the world is broken into two things,

and I could butcher this a little bit for, and certain people will text me different things. One of the lovely things about the podcast, how I found out about you is people can, the show notes have my phone number on it. People just text me all the time and different suggestions and everything. But one of the things that I think I've come to terms with,

there's two worlds. One is definitely physical. It's like if I reach over and punch you in the, the arm it's going to hurt or vice versa right a bullet hurts and etc so that's the that's the body that's the flash that's physical but then there's the other thing that ottawa just showed me visibly i remember being in ottawa i've talking about this a few different people that the heck is going on like what am i missing right now that's that's the thing that can't be seen it's it's spiritual warfare it's you're hearing more and more about it more people are talking about

it because more people are being like what is going on right now yeah like something and I remember thinking something crazy is going on right now. Like what is going on? You guys are praying? I feel like I maybe need to do that because I don't know what the heck is going on with people's water or their oatmeal or whatever, right? And since then, I've just come to terms.

There's a physical and there's the thing that can't be seen, which for a lot of people put as the word spiritual, spiritual warfare, et cetera. And it's played out. So, you know, the people who understand, Granny, I would say are like you're doing very good work and you probably do need protection and they're probably thinking not the physical sense like somebody's going to come terrorize you more in the sense that well you're messing in the world of very high powers and I mean with the right

one on your side nothing can touch you and that's probably why you're getting the prayers and the scriptures and everything else that'd be my guess and this is big like I said um you know when I started with marching in front of the remand. Then I started the mental health support groups, and I had police chasing me around at weaner roast. And what did they say when they're like, I got a wiener roast? They would walk up and pretty much threaten me to stop.

And I would start my driving to the wiener roast, and I knew they were following me. Like I was pretty sure they were watching my videos, as weird as that sounds. I'm a grandma having a wiener roast. And I said, if you show up at my wiener roast, It'll be on your hands if something happens to one of these people. And an officer, I had about 30 people in Beaumont.

And there's two officers walked up, masked up, and there's three of us left. And he says, I paid attention. I waited. And I thought, you are watching my videos. And that's when I knew I was being watched for mental health support groups outside. And I thought, okay, that's fine. I'm just going to keep doing what I'm going to do in. They would circle intimidation.

Yeah. And I would talk to them. I would say, you know, I sympathize with you too. I know there's mental health issues within your industry. And he would just, they would just listen. And one guy tried to intimidate me, but one of the ladies pulled her phone out to video. And he stepped back and he let the other guy come forward. And I said, okay, I'll divide, I'll divide the wienerose up into groups of five, you know, like you don't want five people together or more than five together. He says, no, you're organizing then. You're organizing groups. And I'm going, so what do you want me to do?

Who would you like me to say can't come? I said, I'm not stopping. I will not let these, I won't do it. People need to come together. This is saving people's lives. Like, I had one lady drive two hours to find me at the whistle stop. She knew I was there, and she drove two hours to come and find me, to stand in front of me and burst into tears.

I'm a grandma having weiner rose. And this lady drove, she's still a friend today. She comes to the coffee dates and the wiener roast still today. And so how do you stop? And again, the journey keeps going on. And now, and there's been, like I said, there's so much. Let's go to January 2022. Sure.

There's a convoy going. I can't afford to go. I honestly, financially cannot afford to do this. And my daughter's got my Jeep because her car is in the, the garage. So I'm trying to, you know, politely say, can you borrow somebody else's vehicle so I can have my Jeep back? And two of the people I met at a weena roast, one said, we'll take my truck. The other lady has met me once and has never met the driver. Three of us jump in a truck. We're doing this. I can't afford to do it. I thought, okay, here we go. We're going on a wing

and a prayer. Or is that how you say it? Yeah. I'm a prayer and wing. I don't know. I love it. So anyhow, away we go. The roads are just horrible. I put a video out. I said, can people help us go down the road? Can they give us a bad? Because we can't even afford to do hotel rooms.

People started reaching out. They were putting us up in their B&Bs. I spent $90 in rooms, $40 one night, $50 in that. Because we piled in, you know, five and four in a room. and down the road we got. We just got rooms. And then I ended up, when we got to Manitoba, I ended up with a lady from Colonna.

I jumped in with her, and I met her at a convoy somewhere in a way. We went. And that's Sarah. That Sarah, yep. Her and I became buds real quick. So now we're off to Ottawa. What a journey.

Oh my gosh, the tens of thousands of people on the side of the road at minus 26. I had to put mitts on just to wait. out the window at people because it was so cold. So now we get to Ottawa. I have no idea what's going on. Like honestly, it was just, it was surreal, surreal, the miles on miles of traffic, right? Now we're in Ottawa and I feel like I'm at the Calgary Stampede at minus 26. There's so many people. And I videotaped every square inch of that journey and Wellington and, everything. I found trucks in places. I didn't even know trucks were. I wanted to show everybody that a

grandma of 60 years old did not need to be afraid to be out there. And I was never afraid when I was on the hill. It was when I walked off the hill that got a little scary. You know, men would come up to me because I didn't quite stand, I didn't blend in. I had a safety suit on with writing all over. You know, grandma is essential and my grandchildren's names on it and truckers. or heroes. I mean, I stood out. It was neon yellow. I did not blend in, nor did I want to blend in. But it was a bit of a safety issue when you left the hill. So spent the entire time. I left on January 24th. I got home March 13th. And my bank account changed by $30. People helped me. They kept me going. they filled our tank. I didn't have to buy food because there was so much food down at the hill.

The reason I stayed a little bit longer, I'm somehow attracted to the remands. I stood outside of George and Pat's remand also. I was waiting for George. Oh, I'm going to cry. Didn't want to leave George behind, but I had to leave him. And that was hard because I like, I adore George. He's a good man. I don't know Pat. I'm sure he's a good man, too. I just know George. So, Sarah and I left and I cried

because I didn't want to leave him. So on the way home, I hear about some arrests. I didn't know it was four men at that time. I just heard about arrests. Do you have a Kleenex by any chance? Probably not. It's okay.

I'll use my sleeve. It's funny, folks. I probably should have a box of Kleenex in here. Oh, my gosh. I actually don't have a box of Kleenex. Oh my gosh, that's okay. The wife's going to hear that and she's going to be like, you dork, get a box of Kleenex in there. You'll have a box today.

I'll have a box today, that's right. So now we're traveling home and we're dropping home alone. There's no more convoy. People aren't as nice when you try to use a washroom in a gas station now, but there's not a thousand people standing with you. We found out, you know, Safeway won't let you buy a sandwich, because you're not going to put that mask on, and you're not going to comply.

But we got home. We got home okay. Like I said, there was outhouses out in the country, and we were fine. So we get home. Now I'm searching for men, and I don't know who they are. I keep asking.

It's crickets. Nobody's talking about these guys. Nobody. And all of us. And you're talking about the, Coots, boys. Yeah, yeah. I don't even know how many are in jail. I don't know. I just know there were arrests. And I don't know for sure if anybody's actually in jail. And then I saw a TikTok, and I don't even know how to use TikTok. I don't even know why I was on TikTok. To be honest,

I don't even know if it was in TikTok, but it was a TikTok video. And I see this guy. And his name is Clayton. I got to know him since then. I didn't know who he was at the time, but I know him now. And he says, okay, everybody's out of jail. now, can we focus on the Cootsman that are in jail? And I went, aha, there's four men. Now I'm trying to find their names. And I'm searching and crickets again. Nobody's talking. It was beyond eerie and weird. And you've got to remember, I don't follow mainstream news. I have not had TV since, oh, probably 20 years. So I know nothing. I won't even listen to the radio. So I know nothing. I have not seen an article. I never saw that nasty picture of weapons. I've never seen anything. So I find out there's four guys.

So I started Googling or searching in Facebook and I found some kind of Coots site. And I went in there. I said, does anybody know who these people are that are sitting in jail? Back then I called it a jail. I now call it a remand because there's a big difference. And I got their names. and I started, I had an Alberta political prisoners page with 100 people on it. I must have started it maybe with Pastor Coates or maybe Pastor Artor. I don't know, I don't remember. So I started sharing. I found those ugly, ugly CBC pictures, which I refuse to use now.

I found nicer pictures of the guys. And I started sharing. Now I start getting some friends reaching out to me of these guys. some of the family trying to find out, who are you? What are you doing? And they're leery, and they should be leery. When I finally found the friends and the family, they were scared, they're exhausted, they're confused why their loved ones are in jail. They don't know what's going on, but it's bad. Their men are in trouble. And then I started getting educated by the family and friends who they are because I said who are they so I started sharing there are two single

fathers it's a husband and a father and a single or an only child started sharing who are they then I started finding out they don't even have criminal records and then I started hearing chatter in the background they're not necessarily innocent and then that's when I started innocent until proven guilty. And I repeated that consistently. I said it over and over and over. I said, it's not my story to tell. These are four men inside a remand center.

It's their stories. They deserve to tell their story. It's their story. It's not my story. It's their story. I don't know back then, I'm saying, I don't know if they're innocent or guilty, but they deserve to tell their story. It's their story. It's not up to me to talk about evidence. It's not up to me to talk about rumors. It's for men that

deserve the chance to tell their story. And I got kind of upset at a few people when they would say those words, not necessarily innocent. Again, it's not your story to tell. And I started. I it up against a few people and I got into a little bit of trouble over that because I kind of thought one of them was a bad guy and we've come to terms over that now. I've just recently spoke with the man and I explained to him why I thought he was a danger. I was actually kind of scared of him because I thought he was going to hurt the four men and he admitted that at first he really didn't know what was what but we've come to a truce him and I and that's all I'm going to say about that because that's between him and me. So now we get back to where are we now? We'll be back.

We're probably around the start of 20, 23 now. So they've been in jail now. You're talking for like nine months, kind of thing. Yeah. And at this point, sorry, Granny, at this point, you've, now the family knows who you are. Now the guys that certainly know who you are. And you've probably, you know, I, you know, it's funny. I was just talking about this, you know, I remember, you can imagine, driving to Ottawa, as you did, and being around it, everybody was like, don't talk to the media. And then there's Sean running around with, like, this little recorder saying, can I talk to you? I'd really like to know why you're here. And then I get in the, I get up to some semi, or truck drivers, they'd be like, no, we don't talk to media. I'm like, well, let me just tell you who I am and what I'm trying to do just so people can hear your voice and everything else.

And some were like, no, no, no, you're not getting in this vehicle. And, you know, probably for very good reasons. And others are like, oh, all right, well, let's hear a bit about yourself. So then you get in and you start talking and you'd be like, this is why I'm here. This is what I was doing before. This is what I'm trying to do. And you kind of forget, you know, I mean, for the listener, kind of comes into Lloyd, sits down and has a table with a group of people for coffee and you just roll in and you kind of say,

hey, how's it going? Oh, you're shot. Oh, you're right. Okay. And it's kind of like the guards are a bit down, if you would. because I think if you're going to come out for coffee on 11 o'clock on a random day, you're probably not in Tifa, but heck, what do I know anymore? Oh, I hear you.

But at the end of the day, back then, the guards would have been real up. And if you were one of the family members of this, I could imagine how long it took and probably just, hey, like, listen, this is who I am. And I don't know why I'm being told I got a voucher or try and get the word out about your guys. But I tell you what, one of the things I told you. Tony, I remember being on the phone with them. I've only talked to him once, other than today. And I remember just being like, nobody knows your story. Like, I don't know your story. I literally podcast for a living, and I don't know your story.

Everything I see on the news shows the guns. And so there's a reason why, you know, man, Ottawa protests, just the brilliance of, we're not here for violence. You know, like, nobody has a weapon, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Like, the brilliance of that was really, really. evident because they tried and they just kept getting shut down and shut down and shut down. But as soon as all the weapons, you can feel even the most ardent freedoms porter go, whoa, whoa, that isn't what we're for. And so when they blast that photo everywhere, it takes a real confident person, calm,

to be like, well, tell me about it. Listen, can we at least talk about these weapons and where did you get them from and how does this go and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Everybody else is like, nope, they were guilty and on and we go. And so then you talk about the story. It's like I couldn't find, you know, and I talk to different guys, and I don't know, and then you just kind of, and then it just kind of goes off into la-la land. And not that I forget about it, but nobody's talking about it. I know.

And that's the thing. Everybody says, well, why did, like, I felt like I was running towards the fire and anybody else was running away from the fire. And after what I saw in Ottawa, and I saw the government lies, the media lies, and the brutality of the officers, my head told me, why would it be any different accutes? Then that emergency act, like when you started just seeing kind of an overview of everything, something didn't add up. This stinks.

And I thought, we need to know the truth. They have the truth. Whatever that truth is, it's their truth. And if they can't tell their truth, they need the opportunity. they need the opportunity to have the test but they're not being given it 555 days there's no truth coming out right now it's nothing it's the crown doing you know shenanigans all over the place you know 15 dumps of disclosure and it's thousands of pages of not numbered no index and it's repeat of the same stuff with maybe something hidden in there so when you start seeing all this doesn't that make

gas why? Man, we're at 555 days, so it's a bigger why now. So yeah, like I said, I just felt they deserved the right. And it could have something to do when I was 18. I got in trouble, and I had a truth that needed to be heard. And others were saying you could be guilty. And I'm thinking, I'm 18. I have the right to tell my story. These guys had the right to tell their story. And maybe that's where it comes from as I knew I was being accused of something when I was 18. So when you were 18, you were accused? I was, I had said yes to a boyfriend bringing something along. And I didn't, I didn't question what it was, and I should have.

I didn't do anything, but maybe I should have questioned things more. And so I was accused of something. I never did. So I was, I proved my innocence. but I was 18, and I stood up for myself then. So when I see this and I think, okay, there's four men being accused of something, they deserve the right to explain themselves too. Like I was a kid.

They're adults, and they're not getting a chance to speak up. But that makes sense to me. I've been wondering, you know, I don't know. Before you walked in this thing, I'm like, wonder why you're doing what you're doing. And I don't like to go too deep into it because I'm like, at the end of the day, she's going to tell me. Yeah. And honestly, I've asked myself that question too, and I'm thinking, and my daughter always says,

you never hide that story. I said, why would I hide it? It's kind of made me who I am. I said, if I didn't stand up for myself when I was 18, I would have been labeled what I would have been labeled. And I said, no, I went after that newspaper. Yeah, the full page thing on the front, I got a little retraction about that big on, you know, an inch on the back of the page, but you know what? I still got my retraction. I still went after it

and I demanded it. So when I think about what I went through then, okay? Well, I just think at 18 then you saw how the media plays things out. Yep. They see a story. They blast it. And then, you know, we're seeing this with the CBC and a bunch of others right now. If it gets, if it isn't factually bang on, then they go, oh, and by the way that we were wrong. on that and it gets put in and the story's been kind of but the damage has already been yeah exactly and and again I saw that too I saw that with me at 18 I got labeled because the story came out so what my curiosity gonna kill me here what is it that your boyfriend did oh my god I don't even want to ah it's such a bizarre thing um it was to do

with drugs and um I had the mail to me and I got caught with them in my house. A package came for my boyfriend, but it's in my house, and it was mailed by him, but I got caught with it in my house. So I got charged, and I was facing a minimum of seven years in jail at 18 years old. My mom stood beside me through the whole thing. It was crazy. I look back at the time, I think, wow, like I was just a kid, but I stood up for myself

and I fought back. I did have to take somewhat of a plea deal. I was facing seven years in jail. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, you know, so I took a probation. You know, I think I got 18 months, which was nothing. I didn't do anything. So, like, it wasn't hard to do 18 months probation.

I was a pretty good kid. I was a, so it was nothing to work. worry about. But I fought back to clear my name in that newspaper. And I did get a retraction. It might have been small. But it's still a win. It was still a win. And it was still, I would assume, very vindicating of like, I know I didn't do this. And now they're having to say it. Yeah. So if people ever ask, you can say, well, there's the paper. Look at what it says. So I saw what the newspaper did. It embellished what I was going through. Again, accused. How can you write about somebody that's being accused?

Like, these four men are accused. I was accused. And you do a big story on it. Like, you're ruining my reputation. I'm an 18-year-old kid. And so now I look at these men. These men's lives, they're accused, but they're guilty in the eyes of a public opinion right now because of those CBC stories and their pictures.

So I guess I can kind of relate with that with what I went through, because I've questioned myself, where does this come from? where is this fire coming from inside me? They deserve their day. They deserve their truth to be told. Whatever that truth is, that's their truth to be told. And so here we are. And I keep pushing and I'm surprised I haven't taken any hits to this day. I've been pretty, pretty lucky.

I don't know, having Granny and my name helps. I do have some hits coming recently and I'm okay with that because it's not about me. It's about the foreman. And when you say hits, what do you mean? What are recent hits that you've taken? Well, there was a misunderstanding, and somebody decided to make it public. And I'm not going to go into detail because I don't want to give it any fuel. No.

And it should have stayed private, and it did not stay private. And then, and again, I'm surprised have made it this far without being attacked. because I am representing and speaking on the behalf of four men with some pretty serious charges. Yeah, but the funny thing is, is you're not running around going, they're innocent. What you're saying is they need their day in court, and you have right on the thing, the sticker, innocent until proven guilty, which I think everybody in this country would agree with. Yeah. Right?

I mean, yeah. Exactly. So, unfortunately, this personal issue that should have stayed personal, and should have been resolved as adults has now turned into a bit of a Twitter storm or a Facebook storm. You know the funny thing in my humble opinion? This is my humble opinion. When it comes to social media storms,

it's got to be like 80, 90% of the population has no idea what's going on. Maybe it's 99%. Because I have no idea what you're talking about. Nope. And I go, I don't really care to know what you're talking about. It's like, whatever. No, and that's it. I won't give it any fuel.

Because it was put out there public, I've decided that stops right there. There's no more talk. I won't talk about it. I won't defend myself. I won't talk about it. Chris Barber was on, I don't know, a couple weeks ago maybe. And he was talking about a couple different things.

I can't remember if it was on air, off air, it doesn't matter. At the end of the day, it was people attacking them online. And I'm like, Chris, I follow you. and I have no idea what you're talking about, right? Yeah, exactly. So, I mean, like, whatever. People are, you know, like they've built their following up on attacking different people or maybe people find that interesting.

Maybe people agree with them. It doesn't matter. I'm sitting here and I'm, you know, I don't see. I have no idea what you're talking about. I go back to Chris Barber and I've been, you know, Chris goes back to before the convoy started and me and him talking, we've, you know, built this friendship. And I'm like, I see none of what you see. It's all personal attacks and those personal attacks.

And that's the advice I can give is don't engage. Like, I know who I am. The four guys know who I am. Their families know who I am. That's all that counts. Because, again, at the end of the day, it's not about me. Well, they've painted a picture. Like, these getting four guys right here.

You talk about the photos they used and everything else, right? They've painted a picture like it was, what's the word I'm looking right now? It's conspiracy to commit murder is what they keep. And I don't know if there's any. certainly murder folks is a bigger like oh you did it but conspiracy to commit murder you know when it comes to the word conspiracy it doesn't much hold weight anymore but when it's put in that phrase everybody takes a step back you on the other hand have been talking these you've talked all four right continuously yes

have any of them well no I won't start there I'll go what have you learned about the four of them that you think the audience should know because right now I can say I've talked to one of the on the phone for 20 minutes. And done a little bit of digging, but other than that, you know, it's like, I don't know. I don't talk to them every day. You certainly are. What can you tell the audience of both the four men?

They're definitely men of faith. Tony always wanted to read the Bible. Didn't have the time. He's a workaholic. He's read the Bible, probably maybe more than once. He's got a lot of time. He's a man of faith. and I do believe that's what's pulling all four of them through.

Jerry's a wee bit more spiritual, but the other three are definitely men of faith, and that's what's pulling them through. The public is pulling them through, the good energy, the prayers, the letters, that's what's pulling them through. They're good men. Like, you'd be able to tell, like just the way they talk and the way they phrase things. And, you know, when you hear them belly laugh over something, like when you're in a remand, and you're on a phone and you start giggling about something.

And you can hear like Chris Carver's got the giggle of all giggles. Like I'm telling you, he's got a belly laugh. And I'd never met them before. So I did go and see each one of them because I thought they should see a face versus a voice because they just knew my voice. They didn't even know what I looked like. So I went around and saw each one of them, which was hard to see them through. I'd never been in a remand like that before.

And where are they all at them when you say that I, for some, reason in my brain I went there all at the same place. They're not all the same place. Tony's in Medicine Hat. Chris and Chris are in Lethbridge in two different areas of the remand and Jerry's in Calgary in a gang unit, which is a little creepy. Okay. It's all creepy. And you said you would have not realized the remand was different from a jail. You would have thought they were the same things, maybe completely, anyways. What have you learned since then? I have learned that when you're incarcerated, you've got way more rights than you do when you are just an accused person. The man have not touched dirt or grass or been outside of concrete walls in 555 days.

They have, they're in purgatory. They, they don't have anything. Like they're just, it's dead time. They can't tell when things are going to end. They don't know what's the future, what lies in the future. They're just there. And they're not allowed outside. If they are outside, it's a concrete wall with a concrete path.

pad. Chris was telling me his concrete pad area, it's covered in plexiglass. Like, that's his outdoor time. Tony's lucky he's got a window. Jerry, he can get out. It's a concrete thing. Jerry and I think, is it Chris Lysig, have varicus veins now. It's got to be from being on concrete all the time. Is he got what? Vericus veins. It's poor circulation in the bottom of your calves. You get these spidery veins up your legs. it can be very painful. It's a, it's not good. Jerry's now wearing compression socks because of them. It's not good. Another symptom of being locked up on concrete all the time. Like, why can't they, like, the incarcerated in the Lathbridge are out playing basketball, baseball, horseshoes, they get to

sit on the grass. These guys don't get to go outside into the last bridge. that area. I've seen the courtyards fenced off. Why can't they go out in that area? It's because it's a remand. A remand's meant you cycle in, you cycle out. Nobody's meant to be there for 555 days. And we're finding out there's a lot more than just these guys that are stuck there. Stuck there. In purgatory. And when you say we find out other guys, what are the other guys there for? Like, why are they stuck there? I'm not sure. One guy, Chris Lysick told me there's a guy in his area and he's waiting sentencing and he's been in there longer than Chris. This is the stuff.

We're finding out stuff because these guys have been in there for 555 days. Why would you and I know anything about this? I don't know anybody in remand or jail. Well, I don't even know why I would think about it. That's what I mean. Because, you know, like where I sit, three young kids, certainly trying to enlighten myself, if not the listener as well, the area, et cetera.

And there's just a rainfall, a downpouring of different stories that need to get on air and need to be told. And, you know, you got different, you got this place that gets like billions of dollars as a media agency, not doing jack squat with it. And then you have a bunch of us independents trying to, you know, race as hard as we can, but in my, where I sit, but still be a great, you know, I want to be a great father and be around my kids and everything else. and it just never ends.

You know, like it's, it's, you're busy. It's, um, with the last couple years has really taught me, it is not a race. It is, this is a marathon. And if it's always been a marathon, it wasn't just the last couple of years. Life, uh, history is a marathon of, you know, good versus evil. And, you know, it's, we just, we woke up to that. Now, that doesn't help the boys out who are in there for 555 days. Like, um, you know, I, I don't have to, I don't think I,

me to explain to the audience, like, if they tune in the Tuesday Mastrop and hear some of the stories on guys getting out of jail, like, right now, the fact they aren't convicted, and they still haven't got out, there's guys who get bail for horrendous things that are, I mean, we just listen to Tony talk about that, but like, there's guys who get convicted and horrendous things that are, you know, days later. And so, you know, I'd, I'd love to pick their brain, and I guess the best I can do is pick your brain, you know, is like, Like, you mentioned their men of faith. It's like, how do you keep, like, how do you keep your, you know, up from down, if you would,

when it's that locked away from human contact and everything else? You help others. Help others? Yeah. Chris, like, or Chris Carbert wants to hide in his cell, he told me. He says, I just don't want to come out. But he's got the longest standing Bible study in Lethbridge remand. He comes out to help others.

and by him helping others, he's helping himself. Jerry, he makes hacky sacks and does yoga with guys in the gang unit. They just gave him the nicest birthday card. I think he's ever received a gang unit. Like they drew a card for him, signed it, gave him well wishes. And Jerry is like doing yoga and building hacky sacks out of dry rice and old socks. It's just who he is, right? There's Tony.

You know, he's out there talking with everybody. then you got the gentle giant of Chris Lysick. Like, he's got the hands of baseball mitts, and he does beadwork. He's done so many land years. Right now he's working on a 22,000... Forgive me. Okay. Tony?

Yes. Chris Carbert, Jerry Moran, Chris Lysick. Okay. Sorry, for the people listening, I got a picture of them all right in front of me, and I knew who Tony was, but the other ones, I didn't. So that's... Thank you. Yeah.

So, like I said, they've all got their uniqueness. like I said, they're just wonderful men. I've talked to them for how many hours, on hours, on hours, and I've got to know their family. I've stayed at Tony's mom's house many, many times. I know Betty well. I know Jacqueline well. Jacqueline's Jerry's wife, she's like a daughter to me now.

Chris Lysick's father is an absolutely wonderful man. I've sat at his kitchen table and looked at pictures of Chris and his girls, and I've gotten to know them all, like personally. And these aren't bad people. They're just caught up in a horrible, horrible situation right now. And they're in the eye of the storm. And there's a lot happening behind the scenes. Like I said, we've got hashtag what's what is in the envelope,

and we need this envelope opened. And I hope the judge opens it soon. because whatever's in that envelope maybe it can free these men I hope it can I don't know if you know anything about the envelope nope nope nope no deer in the headlights look okay let's back up to June 2023 welcome to the Sean Newman podcast folks where we bring people on to inform us yes I'm I was going to get to the court case there's a lot we can't talk about obviously on publication bands and I don't know I'm clueless to know what you can't talk about what you can't talk about you can't talk about.

Like I said, and again, there's a hashtag out there that's running around. What is in the envelope? I'm not even sure how much I can talk about that myself. Well, you can nod your head to me. You're saying that they have a sealed envelope with a ton of good information and they're not allowed to open or they're not allowed to talk about openly. The judge has the envelope and the defense gave them the envelope. and there's something in the envelope

that has to do with the Crown RCMP and the Law Society has been brought in. So hashtag what's in the envelope. Yeah, you know, if this story had been four years ago, would any of us have been, they're all guilty and we would have walked away. And when I was in Ottawa, maybe you saw this too,

one of the things that really, one of the things that really stood out to me was like day one, all the cops, masks on arms crossed I remember talking to one guy who'd been on the force for what was it I think it was 30 years

and he was saying yeah you're just another protest whatever and I was like I don't know you know and he's at the end of it he goes but I'll tell you what his first protest I've ever seen him clean up after him that was day one day two the arms weren't crossed anymore day three the masks

were down you could see cops smiling you know I I buy this was Sean and his stupidity but they had a number on their shoulder and this is like day two I'm like hey what does that number mean and I almost got myself tackled all I was just like I wasn't thinking right what's the number mean and it was like their unit number or something and the reason I did it twosel get a kick out of this it was because it was 22 and so I was like oh what's the number of me anyways it was stupid and by day four I was high five in cops downtown Ottawa right right like you could see it and then what do they do took all those cops out brought new ones in and started all over again and once you see that it's like in my head i rationalize it oh as day one you're going down there and be known different than than myself these people have come to destroy Ottawa okay masks on let's go

this game time we're going to win this thing and then you get in there and you're like the heck are they talking about i haven't seen so many bouncy houses smiles people crying i'm like i'm looking for You know, I'm trying to stay on guard, but they keep smiling at me and they're doing it. And then you go home and one of the group, for sure, watches the news because I watched it once. And once you see the news and what you actually saw your brain almost breaks, it's like, what the heck is going on? And then the next day they come and they talk and then you see it go through the entire unit, but then they change them out. And the next unit starts off where the other one else because all they've been watching is the news. This is the worst thing ever.

They've occupied Ottawa for four days. This is terrible. They're not leaving. they're threatening people and then they come down and the same thing happened and then they and then they chan and so when it comes to these four one of the things you know they they they pushed was diagonal like I had been interviewing I interviewed Jeremy McKenzie before I left and I'm like I saw his video when we were driving and do you remember his video where he's laughing he is laughing hysterical I didn't know who Jeremy McKenzie was I had no clue there's some guy in this video and I'm going

and say, oh my God, Sarah, look at this video. The guy is laughing. And he says, he was talking to J.T. there. And he says, what are you going to do? How are you going to stop them? They're coming. You can't stop them. And he's laughing.

I had no clue who this guy was until later. I thought he was hilarious, and he still is hilarious. Like, he laughs a lot. And then when they brought this diagonal thing in, I didn't know what it was. I had no clue. A fictitious country with a goat who snorts cocaine. But what I learned is their group, online group, is like a mental health group. It helped a lot of people through some pretty dark times.

So to me, it was a mental health group is the way I took it, right? With a goat and a flag. But at the end of the day, it was people helping people. And they're just trying to make this bigger. And they're trying to drag just ridiculous things into things. And again, ask why. it's just a question. There's always a why.

And it's to embellish and to make things bigger and to make things dirty. And again, it's just like pictures. It's all propaganda. It's to plant seeds into people's heads. It's to get to the jury, potential jury. Like it's by design. Like you just got to do a 30,000 foot view. Yeah.

So when this trial comes, three weeks, right? Three weeks they're in court talking. Yeah. talking about this, does anything come out of that that you're like, oh, here we go. At least we got some clarification or anything. Or it's just what's in that bloody envelope. And we got wait now to figure that out. Oh. I got to, I got Jason Levine coming on here, here tomorrow or the next day, folks. Anyways, it's funny how it times things time out on the podcast. Some days, it's like all you're going to talk about is X. And the next week, it's going to be the complete,

not the opposite, but it's almost like guests just lined perfectly up. Because I mean, I was trying to have Tony and yourself on well before the trial and it just never happened. So here it sits. So now, I mean, what did we learn in the trial? Did anything, anything come out of it? Exactly. And I, you can be sitting there and you can be, listen, I'm not a legalese type person. All I saw was a lot of stalling, a lot of dragging stuff out. It was painful to watch. Like, we watched how many hours of interrogation video. But again, the defense, have to, I think there's something like 54, what do you call it, like applications to do with the disclosure, like of evidence. Like they got a file like 54 different applications. And trust me,

I don't know if they got through two or three in these three, like it was painful to, to listen to and to watch and drag it out. Like it's, it's like watching a snail move, you know, crawling backwards. It was just painful. And nothing really came out of it. until the envelope. And now we sit here and we wait. So when do they have to wait till or do you know? Well, the judge did say he says, because he has to put something on record, right? And he just said, we'll have this done before, like the next court is November 1st.

And he says, we'll make sure this is, is that how he said it done by the, or actually, I think he might have even went right to the trial, like, you know, before the first day of the trial. But he has to just say something right. But November 1st is the next court date for more applications to be filed. Pray that it's going to happen before then. Like, you got to do something. It's public. Everybody knows about the envelope. And Stephen Johnson was asked not to attend court, him and his sidekick the next day when they talked about it. A secondary crown had to come in. Like, it's serious. Whatever it is, it's serious. For the audience, Who is Stephen Johnson?

He's the Crown Prosecutor, lead Crown Prosecutor. And again, I don't know his sidekick's name. I can never remember him. I saw him lots, but I can't remember his name. Were you, you know, certainly with Tamara Leach's court case coming up here, Chris Barber at the same time, Pat King the month after, I would think there would be a lot of attention out that way. what did the June court case attention-wise Garner was CBC CTV News global

I saw Ezra Levine there so rebel true north Western standard I'm trying to like spit off as many as I can rattle off but I can't think of all of them the media there was a like they've got seats slated off for media yeah the first couple days media was there because they were talking about the media ban that's all they didn't even stay for the rest of the court they all left like nobody was there the seats were empty after the second day nobody was over there so ezra levant didn't stick around esra levant wasn't there until um just recently the last one that was just on there there was a a week here what date was at in um was it in august here all my days are running together it was the end of july august and um he only showed up then he wasn't there the first time i thought he was there for the june trial i don't think so i don't think so

i don't remember seeing him no he was there at the second one i don't think he was there at the what was the second one the second one was just recently it just ended all my days are blurring together here um so wait there was three there was three weeks three weeks started june 12th that was supposed to be the trial june 12th was supposed to be the trial and just prior to to the trial, the defense had to postpone because more disclosure got dumped on them, more applications needed to be filed. They could not be ready for June 12th because of the way the crown has dragged everything. So then they postpone, then July. Yeah. So in June 12th, they've got... Nobody's there. No, June 12th, they had three weeks of pretrial applications.

The first day and the second day was about media bans. It was talking about publication bans, media bans. What can they talk about? What can't they talk about? And it was the weirdest thing. So the start of June 12th, we saw some media, and then they all disappeared.

And then there was nobody. And yeah, and then they did, we watched interrogation videos, we listened to some officers, and then one officer was up on the stand and there were some notes that were not in the disclosure. They were discovered by the defense. They had asked an officer, you've got your scribe notes, your type notes, and then your written notes, and there's three, and they only had two.

So they had to give the third one. And that's where the contents of the envelope came from. Something was not redacted. and the defense found it. And Stephen Johnson and his sidekick. We're asked not to come back the next day. A second crown had to come in. And the encrypted talk by Tony Rolston was,

this is an anomaly. It's unprecedented. There's no case history on this from the way it sounds. This is the first time in Canadian history. happened. So what is it? It's the first time in Canadian history that something has happened that nobody wants to not allowed to talk about because it's in an envelope and it's like what's in the envelope. What's in the envelope? There's four men that really want to know what's in the envelope that have been sitting in a remand for 555 days. And again, publication pans.

I don't understand legalese. I just... And again, so the Crown then wanted a publication ban on what's in the envelope. So they have a publication ban on that envelope. So when it does come forward, there's a publication ban on it.

The Crown wanted. The Crown wanted, you know, no publication... Did they get that? Yeah, they did. So whatever comes out of the envelope, will not be able to be discussed with media. Now, if I'm sitting in the courtroom, unless it's specifically said to the courtroom

that I cannot talk about it, I'm sure I can walk out, and if I see somebody on the street, I can talk about it, just like... I really need to get a lawyer back in just to explain that to me, how they're going to stop us from talking about that. Now, that's a publication ban.

That's not a pedestrian. Well, I mean, true. Exactly. But what happens if it comes up on the Sean Newman podcast and we just start talking about the envelope? I don't know. What happens? Are you accredited media? I don't know.

I don't know. I don't know what they're. And again, that's where the line is fuzzy. You know, because it was brought up about podcasters and it was brought up about media and all that, social media and stuff. So is that part of the publication ban? And how are they going to stop that? Like, I mean, honest. And again

And why would you? I mean, obviously there's something in there They really don't want the public to know Which makes me even more interested, Granny, to have you back on when that finally gets out And if we're not allowed to talk about it Or you're not allowed to talk about it, I can do a lot of fishing that isn't talking about it

Because that would be, well, I mean, it's just now we've just teased everybody with the biggest cliffhanger If they hadn't heard about the envelope, Now they've heard about the envelope and everybody's going to be waiting to hear what's in the envelope. Well, there's a lady by the name of Aaron, and she's taken the four men's pictures, and you'll have to find it on Alberta Political Prisoners page on Facebook,

and she started, hashtag, what is in the envelope, and she's got all these guys in their picture, and they're hanging on to an envelope, and these four guys want to know what is in the envelope, and that hashtag is starting to circulate. People want to know what is in the envelope. Share. You know, apparently you could share everything about these guys,

guys at the start, but the crown does not want this to come out. So will it be public? Will it be private? What's going to happen? Like that application was filed. It was a CC1 or something like that application with this envelope. Was that envelope open the moment we walked out of the courtroom? Who will know? I was the judge. I'd want to open it. So when is the next court date? November 1st. November 1st. November 1st, they're back in court? Yes, for pretrial applications. And where is that at? It'll be in Lethbridge.

Okay. And are they expecting any big bombshells to come down there? Maybe the envelope, probably not. Nobody knows. Nobody knows anything. We don't know. If people want to support the foremen, what can they do? Other than sharing and making sure that, you know, as many people hear this podcast

and other podcasts, because certainly I'm not the only one. Sharing is very important. You know, financial is important, but sharing is important. We need public, we need the public to know what's going on with these four men. Like the two waitresses where we met today, they knew nothing about this. We need as many people to know about this and to know about the envelope. You know, we need the public to be talking. Like with Tony's health, you know, we're getting the public to make some phone calls and to send some emails. And it's more like not hold the line but jam the line. When you need attention and all you've got is a digital convoy,

that's what we need to do because nobody's listening to us. But they listen when they can't answer the phone or send an email because the emails keep coming in. You've got to do what you've got to do. And it's not what we want to do. Just do what you're supposed to do and then your phones won't ring and your emails won't get stuck. So right now, financial aid for the guys.

guys, there's a give, send go, and you just search my name, Margaret McKay, and the campaign pops up. Well, what I will do, I'm going to put this in the notes right now. Sorry, just type in it out so I don't forget, folks. What I'll do is I'll put the link for it in the show notes. That way, all you got to do is scroll down and bada, bing, bada, boom, you click on the way you go. And then there's a separate account for the guys, and it's Operation Rescue at protonmail.com,

and that's an e-transfer. And once again, I will put said email in the show notes. That way, if you want to give directly to the guys, they can go there. And then the give saying go one more time, sorry, is for... You just search Margaret McCoy. The email, if you want to e-transfer directly to the guys, you go to the email, what's the give-sand-go for? Oh, it's for both for the guys.

Yes, it all goes to the guys. What happens is it gets divided by four. it goes to the families the families do canteen phone packages iPad packages and lawyer bills yeah um so we give it to the family and then the for the four man like them this is still their lives you know it's not up to us to decide like so if you want to and everybody wants to help all four that's what i find is so it's the easiest place to go and you divide it by four and and it's it's equal all the way across and it goes to Like, you know, mom, mom, dad, and wife is where it goes to. Well, before I let you out of here, like, is there anything else you want to let people know about it?

You know, I don't know. Like, I'm thankful to finally get to run in you and in person and to have you come this way because that certainly makes my life, A, a lot easier. Plus, I just, you know, you don't spend money on a studio to just have it sit here blank, you know. So to have somebody sit in the chair and actually get to enjoy a conversation across from one another, even about such a tough subject. Not that the guys are, you know, not that you're a tough subject, just in general. The situation.

Thank you. Is there anything else you want to make sure that people, the public knows about the foreman or about the situation, court dates, anything? When you want to learn more, you just go to the Alberta Political Prisoners page on Facebook. I try to share everything there, all the campaigns we're doing. You know, if we need phone calls or emails going out, there's where you can help. I try to share as much about the guys. They share their stories.

Tony writes letters. I think Chris Carverett's going to start writing letters. I post them on Facebook for people to read. I'm trying to do Twitter as much as I can. I'm not a real Twitter person, but I'm trying. I try to send it out. Facebook's just easier. But I am trying to post as much as I can over to Twitter.

I do go on Instagram. We do have a bumper sticker campaign. Because we can't get social media, or not social media, we can't get mainstream media to help us. We had to go old school. We've got bumper stickers from East Coast to West Coast, and they are working. People are asking people about them.

People are taking pictures of them. Well, it's funny. You know, of all the campaigns I've seen, I didn't realize that's what it is, but I'm like, that's genius, you know? it's um well i like i said i'm old school i'm over 60 years old so i know bumper stickers are my world old school old school is like putting things in people's mailboxes and it goes right in the trash this rides around behind how many vehicles and and people see it like you know yeah i've had

people going when i go through tim horton's drive-thru the ladies will ask me about it people it does work they want to know who these four guys are and they're shocked absolutely shocked when they find out they can't believe it. You can't tell me those are those same four guys. Yeah, those are those same four guys. And again, I guess I should plug, we've got a poker rally coming up. It's on September 16th. It's, again, on Alberta Political Prisoners page. One leg starts from Fort Saskatch. One goes through the whistle stop, down to bicycar. And then... And what is it? It's a poker rally, a fundraiser for the guys. Poker rally? Like... Motorcycles. Yeah, you get cards. You get cards. You get cards that you're going to do a blind hand, I think it's called. Again, this is. So again, just a fun

ride. There's going to be food. There's going to be all kinds of fun. And you can, like I said, you go to Operation Rescue, or not Operation Rescue, to the Alberta Political Prisoners page, and it tells you how to find out about this and what you can do. And that's September 16th. And try and raise some money for their legal funds. It's a big bill. Well, one final question before I let you out of here. It's a crude master final question. What's one thing granny stands behind?

You know, it's off of he's words. He's the owner of Crudemaster, him and his wife Tracy. And he used to say, well, still says, if you're going to stand behind something, then stand behind it. Absolutely. What's one thing you stand behind? What do I stand behind? just being a really good person and doing what you think is right.

And just keep standing up and standing up and walking forward. Like I've got two grandsons. I want them to have a future. And these four men have seven children. It's all about the children, like I said. And I just, what do I stand behind? I just stand behind being a good person and just doing what's right. Everybody says I'm brave.

I don't see it that way. Like they said, you're so brave. and I'm going, just doing what's right. Just, I don't, like I said, I don't see that. I just see four men. And so I just stand up and do what's right. And keep talking. Well, I appreciate you coming in today and doing this and giving us some information on the fore.

And certainly, hopefully it isn't the last time we run into one another. But either way, safe travels. on your way back home and, well, as you know, frequent across the country, but either way, thanks again for coming in. Well, thank you for doing this. And on behalf of Chris, Jerry, Tony, and Chris, they thank you for being a voice also. Every one of us, I compare us all to a puzzle and every piece counts. You may not think you're important, but if you take one piece out of the puzzle, what do you stare at?

The missing piece. Yeah. What's in the envelope? There you go. Hashtag. What is in the envelope. There's our next bumper sticker. I tell you what, that would be a clip.

What's in the envelope? What are all these what's in the envelope things? What is that about? Yeah, well, it's got some pretty powerful information, and I understand it's four sentences. Four sentences. Four sentences. Man.

Mm-hmm. Well, here's to hope and what's in the envelope. We finally get to hear it because now you got me curious as Ellen. I only just found out, folks. Well, if I find out, I'll put you on my list. There's going to be some people. Because it's going to have to get out there when we find out. Well, thanks again.

Well, thank you. Hey, thanks for tuning in today, guys. I hope you enjoyed it. Today's episode has been brought to by Calrock Industries. With new, used, and refurbished oil and gas equipment in stock, Cal Rock is your best bet when it comes to finding equipment that fits your needs is within your budget and is ready as soon as you need it. They can even custom manufacture tanks and other equipment for your specific

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