Shaun Newman Podcast - #755 - Matt Ehret & Cynthia Chung

Episode Date: December 3, 2024

Cynthia Chung serves as the Editor-in-Chief and co-founder of the Rising Tide Foundation. She is also the author of "The Empire on Which the Black Sun Never Set: The Birth of International Fascism and Anglo-American Foreign Policy." Matt Ehret is a journalist and co-founder of the Rising Tide Foundation. He holds the position of Editor-in-Chief at the Canadian Patriot Review and has contributed significantly to historical literature with his book series "The Untold History of Canada" and the four-volume set "Clash of the Two Americas." We discuss Operation Condor, Green Berets in world affairs and whether China is our enemy. Cornerstone Forum ‘25 https://www.showpass.com/cornerstone25/ Clothing Link: ⁠⁠⁠https://snp-8.creator-spring.com/listing/the-mashup-collection⁠⁠ Text Shaun 587-217-8500 Substack:https://open.substack.com/pub/shaunnewmanpodcast E-transfer here: [e-mail] Silver Gold Bull Links: Website: https://silvergoldbull.ca/ Email: [e-mail] Text Grahame: [phone]

This is Brett Olin. I'm Dr. Peter McCullough. This is Tom Lomago. This is Chuck Prodnick. This is Alex Krenner. Hey, this is Brad Wall. You're listening to the Sean Duman podcast. Welcome to the podcast, folks.

Happy Tuesday. I'm feeling a lot better today. I listened to my intro yesterday. I'm like, holy man, I sound tired. A little bit confused at times and everything else. I'm like, well, that's what you get when you do back to back. Dueling piano, sold those shows here in Lloyd Minster. So thanks again to everybody who came out.

And if you missed it, no worries. We're going to be back next year with a new Christmas. party for all you lovely companies sitting here in Lloydminster. We've already got our, well, tentative dates booked. I've got to confirm a few things before I do that. But that's Christmas 25, uh, 2025. We're talking about way, way out there. It's December.

New intro to the start. Brad Wall's intro on us off. This is, hey, welcome to December. We're like, let's talk about the kids. We're, we're so close to Christmas. I'm like, when did that happen, you know? And, uh, one of my favorite days of the year, December 21st, the shortest day of the year, and I don't like that.

What I like is, after that day, the days start getting longer, and I like that. I know we're going into the dark part of winter, you know, January, February. Oh, boy, she's cold out there. But happy Tuesday to you, fine, folks. Okay, precious metals, they can be thought of as the ultimate insurance policy against economic uncertainty and government incompetence with deficit spending and fiscal irresponsibility unlikely to end anytime soon. Now is the time to protect a portion of your harder and safe.

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And my hats off to all you loyal, lovely people, listeners who keep supporting me and are, you know, obviously working with Graham. Sounds like Graham's a fantastic dude. I've talked to Graham. But I'm like, the amount of people who came up to me over the last week, we're talking about Graham, I'm like, are we talking Graham from Silver Gold Bowl? Yeah. Like, oh, okay. Well, shout out to you, Graham, on this Tuesday. of December.

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they're driving through Lloyd, and they're not the first people to say this. It's kind of become a landmark of Lloyd Minster, Rectech, because I talk about it so much. And they were talking about it. You know, the border markers are something, but I never talk about the border markers. I talk about Rectek. They hit Rectek.

Oh, there's Rectek. Well, make sure next time you're stopping through, you stop in and say hello to Ryan, that's the manager, or Alan, that's the owner, and just let them know. They've become a bit of a fixture. on the Sean Newman podcast. And when you're driving through Lloyd Minster,

everybody texts me and say, hey, there's Rectek, there's Pover River, you know, on and on it goes. They're open Monday through Saturday, and if you're looking for information online, go to Rectepower Products.com. You know who was in the building Friday night? Shane Stafford and his group

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weekend weekend week in review not weekend week in review and it's free super easy and then there's also paid portion we've been dropping some things I'm not spoiling on here you want to go find out what it is you become a paid member I tell you what, we got some things going on in the background of the podcast for 2025. Super freaking cool. There, there's my teaser for you. And looking forward to all of that. Cornerstone Forum 2025 is heading to Calgary, May 10th, 2025.

I don't know why I said 2025 so many times. And you got early bird tickets on until the end of December. December 31st, price is going up. January 1st, all the tables. You want to sit with Tom Longo, Alex Craner, Chuck Prague, Kalen Ford, Matt, Erritt, Chase Barber, Chris Sims, Tom Bodrovic? Be ready.

Because January 1st, we're dropping those tables, and you can go on and get, well, by the table that's going to have those fine folks sitting at it. I guess if you want to sit with yours truly, you can buy my table too, whatever. I don't know. That might be punishment for certain people. Either way, looking forward to it.

Cornerstone Forum, back May 10th. Now I've got Christmas parties in the rear view mirror. I tell you what, folks, we're going to be talking a lot about the Cornerstone Forum as we get closer and closer. You can expect healthy conversations about the real events happening real time, and we're going to try and find some solutions to benefit our families, our businesses, and our communities. It's going to be a fun, fun event. We're going to have lots of details coming out over probably the next, roughly next month. And New Year's Eve, pay attention.

Now that it's December, I'm starting to compile the list of the top of the top of, 25 episodes of 2024. That's going to be really, really interesting. I always love doing that. I've done it now the last couple of years. And New Year's Eve, going to be doing it again. If you're listening or watching on Spotify, Apple, YouTube, Rumble, Facebook, make sure to subscribe.

Make sure to leave a review. Make sure to put five stars on this sucker. Make sure to share with a friend. If you're watching on Twitter this morning, retweet this sucker. Let's get this thing out there. Yeah, that's what I got for you. Let's get on to the tale of the tape. The first is the editor-in-chief and co-founder of the Rising Tide Foundation.

She is the author of the Empire on which the Black Sun never set, the birth of international fascism and Anglo-American foreign policy. The second is a journalist and co-founder of the Rising Tide Foundation. He is the editor-in-chief of the Canadian Patriot Review. He also authored the book series The Untold History of Canada and the Four- Volume, Clash of the Two Americas. I'm talking about Cynthia Chung and Matt Aaron. So buckle up, here we go.

Welcome to the Sean Newman podcast. Today I'm joined by Cynthia Chung and Matthew Erritt. So thanks for joining. Thanks for having us on. You know, we were just chatting folks about reading versus listening to books. I feel like there's the person who can listen to books. And then there's the person who's like, you can't, that's not a thing. You have to read the book.

You need the physical copy. I look at the back of what Matt's got sitting there. And I'm like, I got stone walls here. I'm listening to a lot. You know, I guess that's the difference here between us. I don't know. Well, I mean, it also, I think, depends on the book as well, right? There are some books that I think are really great by audio.

And it's like you have a really great narrator. It's, it's you will get something out of hearing someone reading it really well that you wouldn't get like, you know, for instance, even like a Shakespeare type writing, right? not necessarily a play when someone can read really well and they know how to stress certain things and it's like it's very poetic it certainly helps with the understanding then there's like books that are just jam packed with information that's almost like a briefing you know an intelligence briefing basically and those are i think really hard to take in all uh in one as an audio unless like unless you have it a fantastic memory but you have to have like a really good memory

Yeah. No, I found myself like listening in traffic to an audiobook. And I, it was a, it was an, yeah, it was actually JFK, the CIA and the plot to kill, uh, JFK Vietnam and the plot to kill Kennedy. That one right there. Yeah, I was listening to that as an audio book in traffic a few years ago. And, uh, by, by, um, Colonel Fletcher Prouty. Um, and I remember feeling frustrated because I, I'm thinking that from the standpoint of a writer who's like trying to like, all. make sense of things that I'm researching that I'm going to try to package together in the form of an article or something. And every two seconds, I was just cursing because I wanted to have my notebook. I want to take notes of bombshells that I know I'm going to forget when I get home in an hour, hour and a half. It won't be there in my mind anymore or fragmentary. So yeah, like Cynthia was saying, it's for heavy duty research, like dense info, dead stuff. Yeah, I got to like underline right into the book. And yeah.

It's funny because I do voice notes to myself. So I like literally, I'm like, oh man, he just referenced a name I've never even heard of, right? And one of them was, I think it's Operation Phoenix. I don't, am I butchering that? It's a Project Phoenix. Is it Operation Phoenix? I get all these terms screwed up all the time. And I hear things and I'm like, what did you just say?

And I find myself when I get stuck in a book, I rewind it over and over and over again. And the funny one, folks, is I tell this story from time to time. I read Jurassic Park once upon a time in the middle of COVID. I was in a book club, and they were reading these books, and I was like Jurassic Park, really? And then I filled my phone full of, like, things that were said in it and how they were said in it, and I was like, this is fantastic.

Anyways, I, it's funny. Every once in a while, I'm in the mood for a paperback book or a hardcover, and I can't get enough of it, and you sit and you read. But there's times when an audio book, you're doing the dishes, you know, I got three young kids, you're running this way, you're running that way, and you just flick it on,

and you find a way to chew through information you normally wouldn't get to because I the reason this whole started this whole conversation was chaos by by and I'm gonna Tom O'Neill and Dan oh man Peeb you know Cynthia I was joking around with her last name making sure I'm pronounce it right here I'm gonna butcher one Pibben bring that is not how you say that name but regardless um it it reads like it the audio book reads like a true crime novel or documentary documentary. Sorry, I can't even spit that out. That, you know, it takes like, I don't know, is it 12 hours to get through? And it just, just when you think you get to it, you're like, I still got five hours of this thing left. Like, how much worse is it going to get?

Oh, wait, it's probably going to get worse, you know? And some books, I find fascinating like that when you just want to go on a ride and realize how destructive some three-letter agencies have been to not only the United States, but every other country probably under the sun. Yeah, I would add to, I guess just like a kind of geeky comment, but back in the day when they didn't have television, you know, and because we're like heavily pumped with visuals in our time, right? And the visuals just get better and better. And like with AI coming in as well, it's getting easier for it to be something.

that not just like a big movie studio is doing anymore, but the expectation of visuals is so high that, of course, we can only receive so much information that you are probably going to compromise a bit on your ability to listen and to hear. And so I was thinking about it. And actually, you know, back in the day, they probably were way better with receiving information audio-wise. And like even during ancient Greece, right, they were, uh, during the dark age and things like this, they were, they were passing down information through word of mouth or like the Irish stories and stuff like that too. Like so much of the stories from back in the day, that's how they were, that's how they were

passed down for like centuries. And so obviously we have dropped our capabilities in that sort of receiving of information greatly and it's true like the ear is not tuned so much to receive that information so um i i agree with you i think some people still um have honed that because everything is a muscle in the mind that you have to work on so you've you've worked on that muscle and you can receive that information probably better than than me who i think i am too like visual uh centered i wonder if doing a podcast has helped right i listen to listen to people like and you get the different cadences of voice and and everything else right like you know because you're you're right once upon a time they pass down information

through speech and and song and a whole bunch of different things yeah and the visual thing it's you know uh well the visuals are getting pretty insane just go back and watch the matrix and then skip to i mean i just saw gladiator two the other day you know and the visuals in there are quite like insane you know when you think about it yeah like we're we're we just finished watching uh a netflix show called arcane and it's uh it's like an animated 3d hybrid animation kind of like with a painted style but the story the story is good it's a high quality story it's it's some very severe social engineering a lot of subliminal messaging in there. It's very, very high quality brainwashing, but very entertaining.

And I got to say, like, the visuals were just explosively interesting. But the thing I think with like CGI and our current multimedia level of technology is, yeah, like you guys are saying, there's not a lot left to the imagination for the mind to create, like to close the eyes and just create a construction of what this world would look like, which is what most of human civilization is had as a storytelling civilization. You know, we would, we would tell stories. We would read books, you know, even as groups as families. They all gather around, you know, a book, somebody in the family who would read a book and everybody's imaginations would be on hyperdrive. And so I think, yeah, it's beautiful to be able to have the visual stimulation. That's why we also love making

documentaries. We love making these videos. But at the same time, it could be like a two-edged sword where people become they start using it like a crutch and they stop using that part of their their mind that would normally blossom through the the powers of the imagination by by relying too much on literal they allow the the creators of the content to shape what that image would look like instead of them doing it internally so that does create a weakening skill or weakening process in the minds well good a good doc you guys make documentaries i mean right like i i watched your latest cynthia and off of it i wrote down the book you you uh show and you could show it again if you want because I'm like,

oh, that's, that's fascinating, right? The Phoenix program, I'm like, that's interesting. I'm like,

you know, I find a good documentary. You already know they're trying to shape, their viewers, like thought process, right? You're trying to get across a point. And what I find out of a good documentary is I'm like,

I hadn't seen that before. I don't know. Great. Now I got my, my, my mind is like, do I want to watch a documentary? Because I know it's going to open up like 18 top.

that I have not looked into that I got to go look into now. And yet, that's what a good documentary should do, I think. Because any documentary you watch, no one is perfect. But in fairness, I'm talking to two people who make documentary films. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, obviously, with anything, even with a documentary that's supposed to be the most objective, typically, right, as a style of telling a story, it's still all storytelling. And in the case of like what we do, which is documentary slash, I would say film, because we do try to have like, we really do try to emphasize the storytelling element, the imagination and a certain amount of artistry.

Because these topics are so big as well, right? It's not like a matter of just saying this is a fact, this is a fact, this is a fact, and thus conclusion. our world is just not that simplistic and there's a lot of complexity. And for instance, like Shakespeare's Julius Caesar, in my opinion, is one of the best historical accounts of like what the hell happened for the Roman Republic to turn into the Roman Empire. And there are people like Gibbons who've like, I think, written over a thousand pages on the Roman history. And there's many other, like, you know, big historians back in the day. But, you know, Shakespeare's play is like maybe 70 pages. And there's so much loaded content in there because it's a lot of metaphor.

And that's where we get into the domain of being able to say a lot on several layers even that the mind can receive. And that's also what poetry overlaps with as well. And when you're talking about things that have shaped processes over a long time, because we're not born in a bubble, you know, the world we live in today has had is largely an outcome from a centuries-long process. You know, we have to be aware of those types of machinations and behind the scene for better and for worse. Like it's not all bad news and there's a lot of good news in that. But that's the thing about storytelling. You can't do anything perfectly. Even, you know, if I were a witness or I was like saying for a crime case, right?

Like I was a part of something that happened. I say my objective point in all of the things that happened to me in a court case, it's still not going to be perfect because it's still not to say that you're lying or that you didn't remember properly, but it's still from your perception, and you might not have accounted for other things within that perception. So even in a court case, which I would argue is probably the most objective we could expect as a standard, you can't be, you can't be perfect. You know, it's at this time, I'm like, I'm, I'm many minutes in. And I'm like, Cynthia, you've never been on the podcast before. Matt, we're going to, we're going to silence Matt for two minutes.

because what I want to allow you to do is tell the audience who the heck you are and how you get to the point where you're going to mesmerize us with talking about, you know, you just got me thinking I'm like, man, yeah, we talk about the last, you know, like last week and people forget. I'm like, imagine trying to wrap your head around the last century shaping who you are and the propaganda that's been in there and on and on and on before we get into any of that. maybe just a little bit about yourself and how on earth you get to be where you're sitting here um well i'm the wife of matthew erritt that's that's one big point of how i got here but um we co-founded the the rising tide foundation so that's a non-profit that we uh we started in montreal

canada which is where we are based and um you know it's a it's a foundation to promote cultural historical science blending also not blending but learning from both western and eastern aspects on these very broad subjects that spend centuries long and so it's it's a very good educational tool and that's primarily where we want to go in in terms of building that so rising tide has its own films and documentaries it's still a relatively new process for us so we only have like one documentary series for Rising Tide, which is escaping Calypso's Island. People can go on our rising tide foundation.net. And then the other one that I help in is Canadian Patriot, which is Matt's baby. And we also have like a whole process of films and documentaries with that. In terms of how

I got here, I always dread that question because it's like there's no sexy response. Like sometimes people say like, oh, 9-11 happened and then like the world just opened up for me. And, and, And, you know, I have a, I don't have a great story for 9-11. I was, like, still a teenager, and I found out about it during soccer practice. Like, I was, like, really detached from, like, what was going on politically for the longest time. And as a younger person, I didn't want to have anything to do with politics. I was already quite jaded, saying, like, everything is corrupt in that world. and I always liked reading literature.

I like to be in my own little bubble, and I felt that reading literature especially was kind of like my therapy, because I really was getting pretty cynical about the world. I can only imagine what younger people are going through now because it's like so much worse, the kind of negativity that's pumped into them, without, like, when you're born,

into something and you're not given any ability to understand what you've been born into and you have to only rely on what you can see and who you can talk to in your immediacy. That's one of the benefits of technology is like we can all talk to each other right now and it's like it's super easy, it's super accessible or until more recently with the archive.org scrub where they, I'm pretty sure, removed some of the books they had in their archive. You know, you're don't have to travel to a library. It used to be that you had to travel to a library for certain research documents even because like only that library had it. And now, you know, you should theoretically have access to some of these things, although they are being removed off of the

internet to reduce our memory of things. These are massive benefits. But when you, when you are born into something that you don't have any way of understanding how you got here for good or for bad and especially for good, right? Like you don't know the fight, the history of the fight, and you just think, oh, the bad guys have already won or something, right? And you were born into the world where, oh, the bad guys already, like, run everything and are the victors. That's a really, that's probably one of the most disempowering things, right, that you could have as a concept as a young person. So literature was really a way for, me to realize that was my opening up of like, wait a minute, things are not exactly how I've

been told in the matrix. And just having access to these minds that lived in different periods, I realized that, you know, even the nature of humanity or how the mind works and things like this, it's not what you get through the education process, which is like, in my opinion, spiritually suffocating. So that was my eye-opener, but it's been a long process of just learning and

thinking about things. But I would say for me, that was like the biggest, most important thing that I've had to work through over time. When you say you get, and forgive me, I'm about to butcher this, but

I just want to you said, you said, when you enter this world and you have the feeling like the bad guys have already won. I was just curious. When you say bad guys and they've already won, who are you thinking of? What do you mean? Yeah, just curious on that.

So when I'm using that framing, I'm still talking about the framing from when I was like, you know, a teenager and I'm starting to become an adult and I'm starting to, you know, have to map out the world somewhat. And so from my perception back then, which again, I was not really paying attention to politics. And I have to say that from my perception, again, like I grew up in pretty much just Montreal, Canada,

and then British Columbia, and then it came back to Montreal, Canada. That politics was just a bunch of old white men. I unfortunately, you know, that was a perception of mine that were only, you know, interested in money. And, you know, you had things like Africa that were happening. And like I had come across a book about the apartheid. in South Africa. And so like I knew about, I started to realize at a young age that there were these like huge problems with like how justice was being enforced or even regarded in terms of even within Canada, United States. I always felt like the United States was kind of just, you know,

an extension. Like I don't differentiate too much because our culture does overlap quite a bit. but what also troubled me largely was internationally and like how our our governments were involved in those things and so I again didn't understand very much and it was an incredibly hard thing for me and Africa was like a huge deal and I was like I couldn't see myself playing a positive role in society like even though I eventually wanted to go into science and and engineering which that ended very quickly because they really try to suck the soul out of you in engineering. And it's just about number crunching and memorizing. But I thought I was going to just work in Africa and like whatever happens, happens kind of thing.

But at least I can work on something that I know is important, even if it's going to ultimately be an impotent thing. You know, like it's still coming from a very disempowered place as a young person. But my concept of bad guys was not really well formed. It was just that the world that I saw was clearly not based off of justice and fairness. And there was a ton of corruption. And so I knew that I myself wasn't that. So I didn't think that everybody was necessarily that.

But at the same time, I did feel very isolated in the sense that nobody around in my direct vicinity seemed to care, care all that much either. And of course, that makes you feel even more isolated. And, you know, depression is like a very common thing amongst young people because, like, you're forming your identity. So it's, it's normal that it's going to be a rough, a rough ride. And it was, it was certainly a rough ride for me. I had, like, you know, depression for a while. Because, and part of it, like, really essentially what it was. And it's not that you have to take a pill or something, to cure you. It's that I had to map my surrounding in a way where I could have an empowered outlook.

And if you can't map out your surroundings in a way where you have an empowered outlook, obviously you're going to feel depressed and disempowered from that. Matt, I feel like you were chomping at the bit to hop in there. No, I mean, I'm, I was trying to abide by my. I'm teasing. I'm teasing. I'm teasing. I'm teasing. I'm, I've got a married, like, when was the last time I had a married couple on the podcast? It has happened. It's been a bit. Um, no, feel free. I didn't mean to tease. Feel free to hop in whenever you want. This is a, this is a nice roundtable discussion and feel free like, I didn't, you know, it's, it's great to have Cynthia on. Matt's been on multiple times. So the audience already knows a lot about Matt and to hear a story of, you know, like, of how you go through.

through the journey is interesting. And some people, it's 9-11, some people who's COVID, some people was JFK, some people, it's all these different things. Others, it's just a culmination of maybe tiny cuts or I don't know, simple additions, whatever we're gonna call it. And I appreciate you sharing. That's, I guess, where my brain goes. I just wanna hear how people tick and how they get to where,

you know, they're doing documentaries trying to decipher or illuminate some of the toughest issues our world faces. today. Yeah. No, just to add, I guess, like my own little experience, similar to that of Cynthia's, is like I didn't have an identity politically, but for most of my childhood in teenage years. And when I kind of went from zero to it's all corrupt as well. Like I started looking into it and I got right into, you know, I read Noam Chomsky, started getting a sense of just how bad things were, how much corporations had more power than I ever realized, how much of the political process is a giant illusion.

So I kind of went kind of a bit blackpilled in that sense. And I remember also as he, that was one thing when I was younger. I donated, I got my mom to donate like a buck a day or something to, uh, world vision. I was, I was doing my, my chores when I was like 11 years old to try to raise money to, to give this kid, uh, a dollar a day. Because, you know, you watch the tele, the, the, the infomercials and stuff. And it's terrible. like little emaciated children in Africa with like bugs on their eyes and you're like,

how is this happening? When I as a kid have all of this food and light like electricity and I remember asking my teachers in elementary school. Like why is this, why does that even happen? And I didn't get any answers. Like there was the sort of answers were just like, well, that's just the way the world works, you know, and same thing for different family members. And I couldn't get a good answer. So that was the best that I could come up with. And, and it really bothered me. that was always in the back of my mind as well, just like Cynthia, like that, that's not right, that in this day and age, that that should be the fate of over a billion people and like 15,000 kids dying of starvation every day. Like, that's not right. But I didn't know what to do

with that information. So, um, the, I, when I began to like look into the more conspiratorial aspect that you don't get from the pop, you know, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, Chomsky sort of analysis, which kind of stops short. It's just like very, everything is reduced to systemic evolutionary descriptions of like why corporations run the world and it's corruption. Chomsky doesn't believe in intentions. Noam Shomsky. He doesn't believe in that as a, as a Darwinian materialist, you know, social scientist. But, but that's incompetent because as I began to grow in my understanding, I was like, no, intentions. conspiracies do in fact shape all of history. And I think Cynthia and I have a somewhat similar

experience. We're like, okay, there's really evil, intelligible intentions transcending many generations to bring about bad things, including things like 9-11 or anything bad in my current life, which is tied to things that happened a very long time ago. And then you're like, well, what are the solutions? Maybe the consequences of what happened in Africa, that poverty, that that injustice, maybe that's not just some sociological phenomenon poverty or terrorism. Maybe all of these things are artificially orchestrated. And we are told that these are just naturally occurring things. Drug epidemics is a naturally occurring thing or terrorism, poverty.

Just they're just, that's the way things are. And it's like, no, there does seem to be intelligence agencies creating these things artificially as part of a broader objective for global control. And then the question is, well, what are the solutions? Are there solutions? What do you do about that sort of intention? So that's where I think both Cynthia and I, we began to get along when we met each other. And we were both hungry for like, what can be done? And we were both like part of a, she left this out, but there was like a philosophy group in Montreal that we both were going to, that was trying to like chew on big ideas like that.

and and so we became friends that way in our our collaboration and relationship grew out of that process can just imagine how many people would love to sit at your dinner table and just listen back and forth you know it's funny when you when you read as you're talking matt you know when you when you both of you are listening off you know I think you know what I'm getting is well read right the more you read especially different people from different times you start to say realize, man, this has been going on in different shapes and forms. You know, it's not like the CIA was a thing back in Roman times. But you start to see like a common threat, oh, man, this is not new.

You know, the Bible says there's nothing new under the sun, something like that. Forgive me, folks, I'm terrible at quoting scripture. But like, you go, huh. And then, you know, you start to read different things. And you've brought up different books. And certainly I have mine on my side. But one of the things that starts to happen as you read more is you're going to start that, that doesn't make any sense.

And then it's going to bring you to all the questions you just rattled off. I'm like, oh, yeah, this is interesting, which leads us to our conversation today around, you know, whether you want to talk Green Berets, whether you want to talk Operation Condor, whether you want to talk at all. I'll let you guys, you know, it started with an interview I did last week with Michael Yon. And I would say that that's a bigger discussion than just Michael Young because that the Darien Gap as a whole. And forgive me if I'm skipping over things. I'll let you two take the helm. But the Darian gap, the immigration or migration, you know, whatever we're calling it, that has been a talking point, you know, to the Elon Musk's of the world and Trump and et cetera, et cetera, for more than just a few months.

This has been years in the making. So curious, curious your thoughts on it. And curious, you know, because it was Matt, you reached out after I'd done the interview, you know, laid on me. Well, I would defer to Cynthia as as the main, my education on this topic largely came about through Cynthia's deep dive into this when she had herself been very provoked by some of the claims being made by my, Michael Yan, that we're painting a certain interpretation about how to understand the immigration, the mass migration crisis and the weaponization of immigration, which is a fact. That's a fact. There is a weaponization of immigration to undermine sovereign nation states and especially undermine Western traditional social fabric that is at the heart also of the nation state process.

George Soros has been pushing on that complete open border policy now for many, many decades. So that's a fact. But there was a particular spin that Michael Yon began putting in and getting a lot of airtime all over the place on that issue. And Cynthia did a bit of a dive on that. And because of her work on Operation Gladiow, which is essentially another name for NATO's secret armies, the unreconstructed fascist and Nazis that were never punished in Nuremberg, but were given new assignments and new jobs. under the CIA Allen Dulles, MI6 to organize a new Anglo-American world empire that would utilize capitalism as a cover for a new reconstructed global fascist structure that manifested in these types of Bilderberger group, you know, a multi, multinational finance corporate powers that would take over control of nation states and also utilize paramilitary groups and other things in the Middle East and Africa and South America. So Cynthia had written a book on this. She started doing a lot of work on Latin America to map it out, how this thing manifested there.

So she had a lot of alarm bells that started going off. And so what I shared with you were a couple of articles that she wrote in consequence of Michael Leone's presentations. And so I'll just defer back to Cynthia. I mean, that's a thing is that it just coincided with research that I had already been. working on that was focused around the first World War of World War II period, but obviously with heavy implications for all of the Korean War, the Vietnam War that happened afterwards and so forth, the whole Cold War policy, what was that all about? So I have not followed Michael Yon very closely, right?

It's hard to not know about Michael Yon though, because I mean he's everywhere. It's really the Brett Weinstein and Tucker Carlson interview where I like were really came to my attention because I found that that that also became like, you know, that spread quite a bit at the time. And there was a lot of weirdness, especially because I had studied Operation Phoenix. And I was still piecing things together. I didn't quite know directly how these things were connected. As Matt was saying, you know, when you know about these things, all of a sudden, certain things start to become more clear how they're linked up. But Operation Gladiio.

Just to be quick, Cynthia, because Brett has given many interviews with Tucker, you're referring to the one where Brett had returned from. Yeah, where he talks about going with Darien Gap with, yeah, with Michael Yon. Yeah. So, what was I saying? Yeah, Bladio. forgive me is gladio before operation pho or is operation phoenix before gladio so gladio is something that was off of operation unthinkable that is like a churchill thing so what happened was

world war two is the very end of world war two and um you know i know that there are a lot of people who don't like uh franklin roosevelt um but from what i've done in my research uh especially on i'm not going to expect everyone to follow exactly what I'm saying, but I have to still name things to get to a point is the League of Nations. The only time I'm going to interject because I can hear the audience go, Sean, shut up, is please take as much time to start from the beginning to the end because I like hearing the, I want to hear the research. This is why I do long form podcast. So don't skip over things. If Gladio, if it's Churchill, I just want to hear the story of how we get to where, you know, you're, you know,

you're looking at Green Brays and Darien Gap and Michael Yon and all these different things. I want to hear what your research has shown because if that's what you've spent your time doing, let's hear it. Wow. Okay. Well, in that case, I'm going to start even earlier. The thing about the First World War is that I would think that any honest person would be like, why the fuck did that happen? Sorry, I swore. I don't know that that's a bad thing. but for your podcast. Why did it happen, right? It doesn't make sense that a world war was fought

and nobody can really explain why this occurred. And from my research and Matt's research also validates this, the American system had become a huge, you know, world success in terms of what it represented as, political philosophy as economic philosophy, and it was bearing a lot of fruit, which was showcasing that it wasn't just words that was coming out. It was an actual outcome. So the American system, from how we look at it, you know, Benjamin Franklin is a major player in this. Alexander Hamilton's a major player in this Henry C. Carey, with Lincoln is a major player in this economic process,

which is basically that the American system was the first thing to stand up against empire in such an effective way. That empire really, you know, the British Empire was going bankrupt, trying to like contain this in a bottle. And it was clear that it wasn't going to be able to be contained. And it's a clash of viewpoints that is older than the British Empire and American system conflict. But, you know, the American system basically said that we don't. We don't regard the individual as a slave. We regard the individual as something that can contribute to society and as a form of wealth. So that was already a revolutionary concept.

It's not that the American system came up of that concept, but it did come up with a new science of politics and economics that the world had really ever seen and executed with such success. And that was the point, right? empire from the standpoint of a British empire, an imperialistic empire like that, views the individual as a cog as a slave and ultimately as a burden, because you have to also have controls, because at the end of the day, we are still thinking creatures. You have to have controls over how to maintain a slave status because guess what? It's not natural. That's why you have to put so much resources into containing someone in a slave state. And so the American system was blowing that out of the water.

And the British Empire was going bankrupt. And so there were several things that happened. The first World War, because the American system was starting to spread. The Russians were starting to adopt it. The Germans under Friedrich List with the, what's it called again? Zolvary. So Germany. So Germany wasn't a country, right?

Like it only kind of became a country at the very end of the 1800s. So it was also a disempowered situation with different provinces. And their situation is very similar to the Americans, where you had 13 colonies who had to figure out how to come together, unified against an empire. You couldn't all be sovereign 13 colonies. You were going to have much more wealth and much more ability to defend your country. yourself on all levels if you had a system that could organize an economic process of manufacturing. Again, not through exploitation and looting, but actually producing actual wealth.

And so the Germans started to look at that model and that was becoming massive for the Germans. And that's basically what turned Germany into the powerhouse that it became. in Europe. And that's one of the major reasons why the First World War happened was to contain Germany because Germany was becoming a massive power. So the British Empire, which is it's not just the British Empire. There are other, you know, the Habsburgs are involved in this process. There's other like things, but it was always primarily the British Empire's like net worldwide network that this was like threatening. And then you also had Russia. Russia was also starting to bring in American system economists, engineers, railroad builders into Russia to

start that process. You had the Meiji restoration in Japan. You had in China, Sun Yat Sen, the first president of China, who was also directly referencing Lincoln. He went to Hawaii. He was trained by American system people. And he identified as a Christian and a Confucian. That was the first president. And that was like in the like 1920s period. Well, 1911 was the revolution. Yeah. Yeah. Against the Chinese dynasties.

But that wasn't a communist revolution for people to be clear. Sunyetsan was not a communist. So you had this process that was spreading everywhere. And so the first world war was basically to break things apart because Germany and Russia always had like a natural friendship as well so you can imagine if germany's becoming this powerhouse russia's becoming and japan is also becoming this powerhouse you could see clearly this like unified front um that was going to like there's just no way you're going to put that genie back in the bottle and so it already still became quite large uh but the first world war confused people quite a bit

and it was meant to divide people. So Germany was pitted against Russia. Japan was pitted against Russia. The United States was pitted against Germany, which was to attack something that was naturally going to be a process of collaboration against this sort of imperialistic viewpoint. And then out of the First World War,

there's all of the cynicism, like that's where the lost generation comes in existentialism. And people are like, what's the point of anything we only destroy? And it's like it was never a natural thing. It was totally organized. But they were like, now we need the League of Nations, that we need the world center command.

And the League of Nations construct was always that you're going to have like a few empires, like the Habsburg Empire, the American Empire, the Japanese Empire, the Russian Empire, if they were to collaborate. And if not then, you know, because Russia was always kind of in between up until a certain point. which way they were going to go. You're going to have a German empire, but then you would also have satrapy. So Africa was always considered a satrapy. Arabia was largely considered as well, like a satrapy, which meant, you know, you were going to be, uh, the empires were going to use you as basically palm large plantations or whatever. But under this construct of empires,

you were going to have the British Empire always as the ultimate head. And it was always made very clear. And I write about this in my book, The Empire in which the Black Sun never set. So it was very clear who was going to be directing this whole process where the, you know, it was all of the republics were uniting under an American system concept. You know, the French Revolution was another fight on this, right?

And the Jacobins, there is clear connections to the Jacobins having been created by British intelligence, which I go over in some of the papers on my subsect through Glass Dark but that that was also used to sabotage what was going to be an American system entry point for France. But yeah, so you have that kind of League of Nations concept. But in order to, again, Germany wasn't fully playing ball. They also did the Valsai Treaty, so they completely purposely ruined Germany economically. They were taking, they were even claiming, you know, certain industrial hubs.

of Germany. So Germany was asked to pay a massive debt, but then they're also like, and we're going to take your industry away from you. So there's no way you can even pay this crazy amount of debt. It was really criminal. And people have to realize like when you fight a war, sure, that's one form of a warfare and sure there should be war crimes, you know, and people should be subject. But economic warfare is often way more brutal than physical war that people realize and you like we have day to day economic warfare and people are constantly dying and nobody bats an eye but then you know you talk about this one war going on um you know in Yemen or something right which was a very glad that it seems to be contained now

that was horrific but it's like people kept talking about Yemen Yemen it's like it's going on everywhere people are dying constantly through economic warfare. Africa has been attacked with economic warfare. There's like capital flight, there's looting. There's all of, there's debt that is criminal forms of debt use on them, which I'm not referencing to China. I'm saying IMF World Bank policies that existed well before the discussion of what is China's role in Africa.

The West was clearly already like subjecting them. The railroads were built to go from mines to the coast, and they were built so that they couldn't be connected. They were different gauges. That was a colonial policy that started with the British, the Dutch, and so forth. So you had that process. So then Germany was put in an extremely desperate situation, and that's where the radicalization started with the Nazis and so forth.

But again, that was like something that didn't just like happen organically. It was orchestrated. And even Kalergi, who Kutonov Kalergi, who's a Habsburg player, Habsburg Empire player, he is the spiritual father of the European Union, which was always supposed to be what is part of the League of Nations construct. That's why countries in the European Union don't have control over their military. They don't have control over their politics. They don't have control over their banking system. they're all like that when they signed on to the European Union they all became colonies they didn't

became they removed their sovereign nation state status and they became effectively colonies so anyway cholergy who was really pushing this and and lying it saying like oh you're going to become a united states of america but united states of europe and it's like well that's a reversal because the united states was 13 colonies who became a sovereign nation you're talking about sovereign nations in Europe who were kind of become colonies within Europe. Like it was the reversal. But a lot of people didn't seem to catch on to that. But Kalergi himself was saying that the Nazi system in Germany would never have been

possible if it wasn't for the economic warfare that happened more than once. The Belfside treaty was one way, but there was another wave that happened afterwards. So to be fair to the German people, you know, they were put through quite a bit. It was horrifying. So then the thing about World War II is that the Nazis were not just in Germany, unfortunately. It's an outlook that was shared in many countries within Britain and, unfortunately, the United States, because the United States was never perfect. You had always people who were against the American system within the United States who were pro-British. That's what the Civil War was effectively fought over in the United States, was whether it was.

was going to go along with a British idea or a truly American idea. And then with Operation Unthinkable with Churchill, so Franklin Roosevelt was not agreeing with Churchill on this. We view that he was always clearly against the League of Nations concept. And Churchill was very much pro-League of Nations. When Franklin Roosevelt dies months before World War II ends, Churchill puts in place Operation Unthinkable, which is basically,

When we win the war, World War II, we will still have armies. But they're known as Churchill's secret armies. And later on, they became known as Gladiou and NATO's secret armies when NATO came into play. And it was justified based off of the hypothesis that Stalin would invade Europe. But then when Stalin never invaded Western Europe, they still justified it because they said, oh, well, there's a political fight and so forth. And so they have literal secret armies placed in various countries within the European Union. We now have had declassified pages.

I think it's the largest declassification of 8.6 million pages that happened in the late 1990s, exposing that Operation Gladiot really did exist. And they basically were guilty of committing terrorist acts on democratic governments and blaming it on the communists. And this is, there are many books on this, Daniela, Daniela, against there's, you know, Secret Armies is one of them, but it's, it's well documented. I know it's hard to maybe hear, but it's a thing at this point that has been well documented for the last like, oh, 20 years that it's been worked on. Yeah, people can just Google, if they're confused about this, they can Google the Red Brigades,

Gladiow and just see that all of these, these terrorist activities that were like bombing civilian centers, schools, malls in the 60s, 70s across Europe, in Italy, and Germany. We even had a version of it in Canada and Quebec called the FLQ, which was, again, a Maoist Leninist group filled with a lot of useful idiots, but a lot of intelligence agencies that were tied to, as you and I have discussed in the past, Sean, purely at Trudeau's networks that took over control of our government, that were tied to this broader Anglo-American intelligence complex that had repurposed all of these Nazis and it wasn't just paramilitary they were brought into Germany running Germany's intelligence uh west german intelligence right Cynthia in your book you go

through uh reinhard galen and his whole network as well of like hitler's top working for allandulles of the CIA like their power was contingent on so CIA became still the head um you know they could not operate independent of alan delis those uh first uh view. But so Operation Unthinkable becomes Gladio. And so Gladiio carries out for all of the Cold War. And we have to just really keep in mind. I want to pause for a second. I just want to make sure I got this right. Operation Unthinkable is we're going to keep standing armies. And this is Churchill. Yeah, we're going to keep the standby armies exactly. So after the war, because the way things used to be regarded is you're not like warfare the concept of warfare changed after World War II but before that you're

supposed to just have like civilian armies right like you weren't supposed to during peacetime you weren't supposed to have army activity the way that we now are used to it which is like it's constant it never ends and you had civilian armies and that's what Eisenhower was talking about in his farewell address was that we need to return back to that concept that's when he's talking about the military industrial complex one of the major reasons that that was occurring is because we were moving away from a civilian army concept and we were talking now not about just constant army activity but adding onto it which was new it was new for the united states there was not a legal uh precedent for this before all and dallas started to to bring that about for clandestine armies

for paramilitary type warfare. And that's also what Kennedy, John F. Kennedy, talks about in his speech on, what's the name of the speech again, that? I don't know. You're talking about the secret society speech? Yeah, I think it's in secret societies. He's, again, criticizing the secret armies and the clandestine warfare, because that's the thing is that the average, you know,

obviously the American citizens should be held a certain amount accountable for what the government is doing if you view yourself as a democracy, right? And if you view yourself as having some kind of say in things, otherwise you shouldn't be promoting yourself as that, for one thing. But at the same time, you can't expect the better politicians or the better citizens to be able to talk about things if they're kept secret. And that was the problem was that things were happening so secretly that even members of government, even members within military,

certain military departments didn't know what was going on. You had a CIA branch that went completely wild west. And they were just doing whatever they wanted to do. It's called the OPC under Frank Weisner. And that's how it started, but it eventually started to incorporate aspects of the military increasingly. And the green berets, unfortunately, are that.

So the green berets are not something that is of, because I agree, like you should have a proper military structure. and you should have a well-trained military. But the green berets were something that had experienced during World War II. They were modeled off of the British SAS, and their berets are a tipping off of the hat to the British SAS. It's Daniela Ganser also talks about this,

who's a very well-respected writer on NATO secret armies, aka Gladiou. He even, you know, makes the point of this. of this so there is a there's no secret to this kind of connection and the green berets were really being brought into gladio type work which the cia was basically the one in charge of it it was not the u.s military and colonel fletcher proudy who we were talking about in this book which actually oliver stone he used colonel fletcher proudy too as an advisor for the movie jfk um but he was a was a liaison between the Pentagon and the CIA.

And he wrote this book on JFK, the CIA Vietnam, and the plot to assassinate John F. Kennedy. But he wrote before that secret team, which is really a ballsy book. It was like, I think published in 1974, 76, but like the Vietnam War was still going. It was in 73, he published it. 73? Okay.

You're much better at dates. I suck it. Exactly. But so he published this while, the Vietnam War was going on and it basically goes over how the US military was taken over by the CIA. And there was a new military doctrine that was put in place that was it was never something that the military had as a doctrine before that. So, you know, the, a proper, you know, military concept is that, you know, first of all, it should be last resort. And when you go when you're going into another country, it's to be as efficient as possible and like you come out kind of thing.

But part of the the new doctrine was clandestine warfare. That was also something that the military was never supposed to be a part of when this started to come about. But gradually the military was being brought in. But also that the certain departments of the military would be involved in policing activity, economic activity, political activity. So it became something a lot bigger of a purview that you could say is very Orwellian. And you can see this very clearly, this new form of, you know, this new identity of the U.S. military in Vietnam with Operation Phoenix, especially, where you had now the military. Before we get to Operation Phoenix, I just, I'm going to unload some thoughts here because I want to, I'm in my brain.

I've been starting to I've never been I don't know have I been a year-and-date guy folks I don't know But I've been but I've been having all these different people come on and they're starting to piece together a puzzle It's take a long time and it'll probably take a lot more time But roughly I just want to make sure that I'm walking through this at a snail's pace so that I'm not missing anything At the end of World War II you have operation unthinkable which changes the way warfare is done essentially correct Also at the end of World War II, you have the formation of the CIA. Correct? I mean, they have their starts earlier than that, but for all intensive purposes,

you have the CIA is formed. And in their charter document, it says basically, and I'm paraphrasing here, but basically they can do pretty much anything, as long as it gives plausible deniability to the White House, and it isn't against American people, correct? Well, it's the CIA, I'm not saying that the first CIA director, Hill and Coteur, that's also a name I struggle with, pronouncing properly, if he was aware of it or not. But legally speaking, you know, the Alan Dulles, I think when he became director, that's when the OPC department within the CIA happened. So again, like you had good CIA people. So like not everyone of the CIA knew what was. happening and it's the same thing with OSS right so that was what existed before the CIA during World War II was the OSS and there was you could argue the Dulles branch which was

also the British infiltration within American intelligence was that and then you had like better players in that which it's not really clear how well organized they were I don't think they were very well organized but definitely there were good people in that too so it's not like they could just come out and and say something even within their department, this was a quiet takeover within American intelligence so that a lot of CIA people didn't know. And a lot of CIA people over the decades were flushed over, you know, excuses. Henry Kissinger was responsible for one of these big purges within the CIA of a better intelligence people. So anyway, the OPC was the department that had the Wild West.

so that even a lot of people within the CIA didn't know what the OPC was doing. And that was a Frank Wisner, Ellen Dullo's baby. Well, yeah, to me, what I hope by slowing it down just a smidge, it's like, you know, you too get rattling off operation this, this, that, and everything. And I'm like, I got to just slow it down so my brain can start to see that this took not a year after World War II and snap your fingers, it all happens. right it's like little things incrementally add up to really big things the CIA's formation September 18th 1947 um you get things that start to happen over the course of a decade or two

that lead into bigger things and and you know that's where you start to see like you start to have head scratchers and probably people in the CIA are they all bad no but it's like you know it's like COVID. Was everybody bad? No. But you start to see how over time things were put in play and they had control over other things and people are pretty simple creatures at times. And it all played out in a certain way that were a bunch of others were like, what the heck is going on, right? Except when you walk back through it, you can start to see how putting certain people in certain positions and doing certain things and putting certain pressure on it. It all just went along with a, we're going to go this way and that's where we're going and we'll up the press. pressure. And even though it's insane, the pressure getting up, certain things started to play out, well, as we all saw it, I guess. Yeah, a lot of this stuff, as far as the technique that was utilized after World War II especially, to organize this type of expansive, multifaceted, machinery of empire without most people participating in it, having an understanding of what it was

that they were participating in, was this highly structured system of organized, compartmentalization under it's a term that that people can Google if they want to called cybernetics it was developed by a follower of bertrand russell named norbert viener in 1943 and it was developed and funded by the rockefeller foundation the macy foundation and for the macy conferences and this was like a science of control and the idea was it was immediately brought into the oec the organization of economic cooperation and development NATO was brought this in the CIA was organized organized around this as well, which was that you have one nerve center, a small executive

that has the ability to see what the whole is doing with all of its departments and sub-departments. But everybody within the sub-departments and what have you are all going to be highly specialized operators who will be myopically wired to just be hyperconditioned to whatever their little localized field of expertise is. And they won't know what the other department next to them is doing this grew out of the Manhattan project that generated the atomic bomb out of the need during World War II for absolute secrecy and that that's the thing like 95% of the scientists operating within the Manhattan project had no clue they were told you develop a fuse this very specialist specialized fuse within a thing and you don't know what the thing is right

you develop the shell of a thing and you don't know what the thing is and everybody was put to work so again only an initiated grouping of executives who were brought into the inner clubs were like vetted, had an authorization to see what the whole was. And then a very few were able to have the ability to nudge with a command and control that was quite distinct around in this case, Alan Dulles and his, you know, Frank Wisner that Cynthia mentioned at the organization of policy coordination, which was the psychological warfare department of the CIA. Only a few like that would be able to then get the whole machinery to move in a certain direction. So people could work with a bunch of unreconstructed fascists that were, you know, being brought into

corporate boards of directorships that were being brought into intelligence that were even organizing paramilitary organizations. And they wouldn't even understand what that was. They wouldn't, because their minds were increasingly brought into a hyper, again, compartmentalized modality, which is, again, why they focused on the organization of economic cooperation and development, which was the thing that set the tone of what education was going to be in the 1950s, the 1960s. So they wanted to, they had to condition people, kind of like as if human beings were machines or computers, to lose the ability to think in a natural, you know, integrated fashion. And that was part of what makes this whole thing work.

It's kind of a pygmalion effect. You break the people, you make the people dysfunctional, and then you create a dysfunctional system. And then you say, well, this solution is there's too many people. because we can't manage ourselves because we're too dysfunctional. But it's like you already broke it. You artificially broke it. And then you're making the argument that because it's broken, we need to create some transhumanist thing or whatever.

We need to eliminate a big chunk of the world population or whatever. So it's dis- The medical system, right? They're purposefully breaking. Like here in Montreal, our medical system is not something that can continue the way it's continuing. It's already bankrupt, but it's going to like, collapse upon itself and all of the policies you know they're they're putting people in in positions

of power within the hospital administration that don't even have any experience as like doctors or nurses or anything right that's the whole problem with bureaucracy is when you're putting people in charge of things that they don't actually have any concept it's like putting some kind of uh you know accountant in charge of engineers who have to create a drama teacher as a leader of a country per se? Just throwing that out there. That sort of thing.

Low-hanging fruit. Like you think, like, are we insane? And it's like, well, the people who think that there's a logical reason for that, yes, they're, they're partaking an absurdity. But the people who ultimately put that into play know that it was created to break. And they want it to break. They want it to run itself underground, into the ground. I mean, because then people are going to be all, you know, morally, like, you know, affected by that and thinking like, oh, that's a proof that we can't actually have medical care for everybody.

We just can't have it. It's just too much. Well, when you talk artificial things, I'm going to pull you back to you. I kept interrupting because I wanted to make sure that I was getting my dates and kind of time frame. right and all these different operations it comes to Operation Phoenix which is artificially done again by the Americans I believe right I think I understand this enough but I interrupted you at Operation Phoenix we shift gears you know you got the end of the World War II you got the CIA Cup becomes a thing you

got NATO becomes a thing you got all these different things become a thing you got over the course of is it a decade is it two decades they start to purge some of the people or or they just you know the the uh bureaucracy of an organization starts to form and um some people are better than others at bureaucracy and you know and it leads up and then you got operation from phoenix which i was shocked the reason you know like when i was watching your documentary i'll go back to it you know the chaos book talks about it and i had to stop because i'm like what did he just say because i you know like one of the things you know in our I'm a history major for Pete's sake, you know?

And I think of times, I'm like, I remember thinking Canadian history is so boring. American history is so boring. And then you read things like chaos. You're like, now if they'd started with that book, I'd tell you what, we'd all be history majors. There's way too much to it, right? I mean, you got to take your time.

But he says things and you're like, I got to go, what is he talking about? Then you go do like five minutes of research. Thank you, internet. And you're like, oh, man, I didn't know anything about this, right? I didn't or you know and the book before that was an eye opener and people want to go read is Annie Jacobson's project paper paper clip and Operation Paperclip man Operation Project all these stinking titles doesn't really matter but what matters is the content in it and you're like

holy crap there's so much that we don't understand so Cynthia back to it Operation Phoenix um yeah so that is a lot like Vietnam I also was approaching first Vietnam as like not something that would be really interesting to look into it was something that I mean I was a I'm a I used to be a big movie buff I've I've spent so many hours watching movies that at this point it's kind of lost a lot of magic because the formulas are becoming more obvious for me and are repetitive but you know movies like platoon apocalypse now that really sat heavy with me um growing up i watched other vietnam movies too and they were like they're they're so horrifying

because it was like what the hell happened like people just lost their minds in vietnam like and it was just a mess and i think it was a very similar to what matt was just bringing up to in terms of the cybernetics issue i think that cybernetics was applied in vietnam and that's why also so many people didn't know what the hell was going on there's never a military objective oftentimes they were told that the objective of the day was an absurdity claimed this hill and it was like a meat grinder of like trying to like you know just claim an area that didn't you know ultimately mean anything so nobody could really understand like what's going on and then on top of it the enemy which is like vietnam war is notorious for this the enemy was very blurred of like was it is this really

just a villager in a village or is this some you know spy from like the hoochie men government And maybe I'm justified to torture this person to figure that out. And obviously, you know, that's just like not a great situation to be applying broadly to like a whole area. But then as I started, it's only been recently that I realized how much Vietnam was a laboratory. It was a Tabistock MK Ultra laboratory. and I'm not even being overly dramatic when I say that. And another thing, people, I actually didn't appreciate this enough. But again, with the Phoenix program, sorry, my angle of my camera, it's her for me too.

Yeah, for people listening, it's the Phoenix program. Who wrote it? Douglas Valentine. So this is, again, Douglas Valentine, he's very respected. And he, his father actually, I'm not sure if his father was a green beret, but he was, like, involved, it seems. on a significant level in terms of leadership within the Vietnam War. And there was always a lot of mystery around it. So he had dedicated a huge chunk of his life to trying to get down to the bottom of like,

what the heck was the Vietnam War about? So it's very heavily documented, like a heavy. And, you know, he says himself, a lot of this is coming from interviewing people and you have to always be careful with that. But even though people can lie in interviews, there's a certain amount of information you can start piecing the puzzle with if you know how to do it. So I think he's done a good job. But what really struck me with the beginning of his book was he was talking about what Vietnam was before this whole thing, which obviously this is essential if you're going to understand a situation. And like the Jesuits played a huge role in Vietnam during the 18.

hundreds. And so you have like the Jesuits who were coming into many countries, you know, the Jesuits were really focusing on Asia, especially during the 1800s. And so Vietnam was not an exception to this. And according to Douglas Valentine, there was one particular Jesuit who created a situation that allowed for the pretext of the French military to come in to Vietnam. And it was kind of like that was it at that point. And France had established like a real hold in Vietnam with a banking system as well. But that was what started with the Vietnamese resistance. So there was a Vietnamese resistance to the French imperialists in Vietnam with heavy Jesuit.

Because the Jesuits were also businessmen. We're not just like, you know, priests. Do you want to say something that? Yeah, just so people have this in their mind because they may not know. I didn't know, actually, for the longest time, that before the war in Vietnam, Vietnam was suffering under colonialism. It was first, as you mentioned, the French. But the French had been, and before that it was the Japanese during World War II, that the Vietnamese were fighting against Japanese fascists that were trying to use all of Asia. And then after that, it was the French that came in.

But before that, the French had been there already since the 19th century, right? Yeah. And that, okay. That 19th century was like a bloodbath. The French were like iron fist. they were again making it what made it all possible was the role as cynthia said of these various multifaceted jesuit operators that would integrate themselves into community level groupings within vietnam but also we're we're interfacing with the higher uh level government

officials too but it was it was a multifaceted thing but but the the vietnamese were we're not like we've been told that they were the communists that's why we had to go there was to fight the communist and it's like no there was already a very long multiscentennial resistance movement that had that had organized itself over generations in vietnam and vietnamese under ho chie min i'll end it with that just to make this point just very clear because it was a mindblower for me was that under ho chie min he was an admirer of the american system and organized in 1946 the first Vietnamese constitution to be modeled word for word on the u.s. Declaration of Independence. And he had great hopes in the anti-colonial heritage of the U.S.

that would assist Vietnam to liberate itself of empire. And he was backstabbed when Roosevelt died by all of those around Churchill. Yeah, he was an ally of the United States during World War II. And so he said in the independence, because it was expected by many countries, right, especially the countries who really did fight on the ally side, that colonialism was one of the understood things that should not exist anymore after World War II. And if the allies were to win, it would also mean the exit of colonialism. So the French had exited during World War II and the Vietnamese were fighting the Japanese fascists. And they have in their new, you know, Republican declaration that a people who have fought, you know, the French imperialism and the

Japanese fascists, I don't, I don't remember the exact word. but it's that should be a free people. And so it's like it's made very explicit and that this is totally along the lines of the American Revolution idea, right? That this kind of people they deserve to be free because they are willing to also fight against the enemies of the American system ideology, like the people who are opposed to the concept of the individual's place. in society. So anyway, the Jesuits played a huge role so that by the time we get to the Vietnam war, you already have like this Catholicism in Vietnam in certain sectors that have been totally influenced by the Jesuits. And it's again, it's Proudy, Colonel Fletcher Prouty, who brought up in

his book where he was finding out that a lot of these villages that were being visited who were being told you know certain kinds of Orwellian type you know situations which totally like game theory type situations as well but that they were always being visited by a military person a CIA guys in the guise of a military person Catholic priest and then like a Vietnamese translator and he said that that was the three the that we're always going to be visiting I'm not seeing necessarily the same three people but it was always a CIA and a Catholic person you know, coming to these villages and overseeing what these villages were told to do in terms of organizing themselves. In terms of, so that was, that's where we get to the whole like artificial

migration crisis, immigration crisis of Vietnam, which seems to have a lot of parallels to what's going on right now in Central and South America. Yeah. Well, did you want to define Operation Phoenix a little bit more like what was what was somebody asked just oh I'm not you but I the the immigration thing happened before operation Phoenix um so you know you had ho Chi men was mostly in the northern part but you know basically the CIA under edward landsdale and the sagon military mission did cy war tactics to make life very uncomfortable for people in the north and these are people who have been living there for centuries these these are people that it was never a country in the sense of like a government with a tax system and a police system and an education.

They didn't have that. So it was still mostly like a centuries long process of fishermen and rice paddy farmers, like the sort of way of existing. And it was still like that when the Vietnam War hit Vietnam. And so these people, when you had a huge amount of these people who wanted to leave northern Vietnam, there is now a lot of evidence. And again, Colonel Fletcher Prouty is someone that I I heavily rely upon for my research and my understanding of the Vietnam process. These people were forced to leave northern Vietnam through cyber tactics. And then the US military was facilitating this. Geneva also had ruled that Vietnam should be split in north and south.

And a southern government was created in Vietnam that like overnight. But they didn't have the infrastructure for this government. So it was not a stable situation. And they had transported over a million people to southern Vietnam with the promise that they were going to be. And this is again what Colonel Fletcher Prouty documents in his book, JFK, CIA Vietnam in the plot to assassinate John F. Kennedy. These people were promised to be taken care of once they reached South Vietnam. And they were not. A lot of people who were within that group and who were Catholics, they were given now positions within the DM government, which was Southern Vietnam, because DM was a Catholic.

And it seems he was staying at a Benedictine monastery in Belgium. Like there's all this like weirdness of, he's like, I mean, it's almost definitely like a Jesuit influence in his training before he's brought back to Vietnam. and is effectively, you know, chosen as president by the Americans, pretty much in a rigged election. But these people were promised that they were gonna be taken care of. And for the most part, they were just like let loose. And they had to- Can I ask, I must have missed it.

They get a million people to go from the north part of Vietnam to the south, correct? Mm-hmm. What the heck were they telling them to get the, like what was income? that they're like, you've got to go to the south. The south is where you need to be. Well, again, it seems that because the Saigon military mission started in 1954,

I believe is the exact date. And so they were doing side war tactics. So Edward Lansdale, to give people an idea of like what kind of side war tactics, for instance, Lansdale had already done work in the Philippines. And there was like a myth of a vampire in the Philippines. I forgot the name that they have for it in the Philippines. And so he would do things like they would kill a guy. They would put like little indentations in his neck,

hang him upside down, drain him of blood. And then they would just then leave him like, you know, to be found somewhere. And like the people that they were fighting in the Philippines, when they would see this, they thought that like, holy shit, that's like there's a vampire running loose. and uh they you know they they left or he he's known also for like uh you know it's a uh what is it fun in games tactics which again proudy also talks about where you go to a village

and you basically play act where um you know these these uh kinds of um bandits are attacking a village and then you have a force that comes in and they kill all of the bandits in this like spectacular scene. They load up the bodies onto a wagon. They travel a few miles from the village. And then the bodies miraculously get up and they all have drinks together. And then they go on to the next village. The villagers are consciously traumatized by what they think are these massive attacks of bandits, communist bandits. So they're like, we have to get out of communist northern Vietnamese territory. Now this is in the Philippines, though. This is in the Philippines. Oh, sorry, then the Philippines. Okay. But it's still a communist issue in the Philippines. But

That's what I thought Ramon Maksayse, sorry, elected. Again, according to Colonel Fletcher Proudy, was using fun-in-games tactics. These were also brought into Vietnam and a lot of the Filipinos who were trained. So again, the green berets, you had the green berets, but you also had the green berets training, the native population in certain tactics that they had.

And so you would have a kind of special forces, like a Vietnamese special forces, a Filipino special forces. So they were like native Filipino, native Vietnamese people who were trained in US special forces tactics, which are more along the lines of CIA clandestine, not normal military way of dealing with things. And so a lot of these Filipino people

who had been trained by Landstale were brought into Vietnam. So some of the stories that, again, Proudy had talked about was, you know, you have like the sound of a sphere, spirits, you know, in the forest and like they really played on superstition, but other things were just, I'm sure, like much more brutal and there were threats that were made. But there's, and you know, if you affect certain things economically and such, that can also help the situation. But again, Proudy, I think makes a really good case in his book for why this was not a migration that was caused by a fear of Ho Chi men's government. And, you know, I would say there's no evidence in Vietnam even today that there was like a real issue with Ho Chi Min or the the apparatus of Ho Chi men.

And so when these people are brought in to the South, because like this, you know, Vietnam was not connected, right? There wasn't, everyone was very isolated. And the way that the economy worked was that you had like Chinese merchants for centuries. that were coming in and doing trade. Like for instance, water, for rice paddy farmers, they don't have access to drinking water. They had their water come in through Chinese merchants and they kept them in these big clay pots.

And that's one of the forms of warfare that was happening is that these DM type structures under Lansdale will come into the villages, they would shoot the pots. So the people wouldn't have enough water And of course, you're going to go a little bit nuts with no water. And they started to ban to the Chinese merchants from coming in. Again, this is like a process that was pretty static for like centuries. And then they also had removed the French system.

So the French, you know, for all of their problems, the French were the ones who had been supplying the police. The French were the ones who had the banking system. When the French left, there was like nothing. So it was really obviously a situation to just create a massive amount of instability. So anyway, most of the people who were brought from the north were let loose and they had to live in the forest. And of course, what are you going to do? You're going to have to either ask the villagers, hey, can we have some water? Hey, can we have some food if you have some to spare?

Or you're going to want to attack the villages for those things. And, you know, we should really, as Prouty says, like the biggest enemy during the Vietnam War was general hunger. As in, like, people were just starving and they were losing their minds over like, where do I get water and food? And, you know, it's hard for us, I think, in the West to realize how so much chaos can come from something that basic. But, you know, we should we should really try to put ourselves in the shoes of, like, such a desperate situation like that. But so and then the villagers were told and the chiefs of these villages were told that you cannot help these people because they're the communist enemy. So it was a recipe for death disaster. On top of that, though, you had Catholics from the north.

I don't know why they were predominantly from the north. Prouty didn't explain this, but they were brought into the DM government. And there was a lot of Orwellian type stuff that was being implemented very clearly under Edward Landstales. Edward Lansdell was the advisor of DM. He was basically the manager of the DM government. And you have things like the Brotherhood, re-education camps, like these types of things were happening under Operation Phoenix.

And so this is where Operation Phoenix starts to occur. The migration of these northerners to South was the pretext for the US military to enter Vietnam. It gave the excuse. And also that's where it became this large laboratory, which was basically known as Operation Phoenix. So now the DM government was playing mind games. A lot of this was like game theory, mind games where and people being put in really desperate situations and seeing how people are going to react and that sort of thing. But they would come to the villages and this whole thing of like you could take anyone from a village and you could interrogate them.

You can put them in prison and there's nothing you don't have to justify. why you're doing it because, you know, we're fighting a war with the communists. And so a lot of information ended up getting leaked about Operation Phoenix and it was finally exposed to the American public. But again, there wasn't, I think, an ability for the American public, I think, to this day, to fully understand, like, how destructive Operation Phoenix was. and this concept of burn the village to save the village. These sorts of things came out of pacification programs in terms of Operation Phoenix. And again, it was a new form of warfare that Vietnam was like a massive experiment for psychologically. Then on top of it, we have the Tabastock connection to Operation Phoenix.

So most certainly there's a Jesuit connection. And Proudy, you know, makes it clear in terms of the witness testimonies of Catholic priests coming in. to these villages with CIA agents. But Tavostok also was the first to coin Operation Phoenix. I don't think that's a coincidence that we see clearly Orwellian psychological warfare happening in Vietnam that is very Tavistakian as well. That was a lot.

Well, I'm like, okay. So. I'm sorry. basically i i i apologize i make things way too simple right i'm hearing and i'm like i'm trying to boil this down to where i'm like so they take a million people from the north of the south how do they get them to do that they get them to do that by playing off their fears and um relationships they've built with with uh you're pointing out the jesuits among multiple other things correct and and i would say fear is a big thing whether that's through like terrorizing them

through bandits and different things like that. That gets the U.S. military to come in to move the million? Yes. So after Geneva said that they will recognize that the Vietnam should be split in north and south, then you had like cat transport systems and another transport system, again probably mentions the two major ones. I can probably find out very quickly as I'm talking to.

Why you're thinking that, I'm just, okay, so what is going on in Vietnam at this time that this is a big deal on the world stage? Like I'm like, I get the tie, like once this is all going and the US is in there and they start messing around and doing things like as messed up as that is, I'm like, I think my brain understands that, not why you would do it, just that they were there and that's what they want to do. But why Vietnam? Like what was going on after World War II or the lead up to this that made Vietnam

the place like, that's the spot? Like I thought, I thought between the two of you, you'd pointed out, like, they were allies of the United States. Like they wanted to adopt the U.S. government style and all that. So wouldn't that make them friends of the U.S.? Like, why would the, why would CIA or whatever agency, go in and absolutely disrupt everything going on there. That's a good question.

I want to say just a line met and then I'll give it to you. This is going to be very controversial for people. But again, reading books like a Whiteout or the Phoenix program or even like Douglas Valentine has done other books like Strength of Wolf and he's gone into the DEA, you know, drugs situation, Daniela, Ganser. like many writers or Peter Dale Scott is a big one too, Heinrich Kruger. So all of these researchers that I've been reading, they have said that the heroin situation in Asia was not communist. And I know that that's a loaded statement to make. However, if you look at

what these researchers were writing even in the 80s and later on, they are also documenting that, the situation was that the communists were often not like fidel castro is a good example of this right but al castero kicked out mayor lansky the whole drug apparatus that was in cuba with the the dictator batista that was in place put in place by the the united states that was a clear casino no drug economy that was being built up. And Fidel Castro kicked that out. I'm not saying that Fidel Castro was a, you know, like did everything right, but it, that happened.

And you know, that has to be acknowledged that that happened. And in Vietnam, I think what the fear was is that if Ho Chi Minh was to have control over Vietnam, because there was already a heroin trade. There was already a heroin business. heroin business that existed in Vietnam already. So Pochuman was given, that's one of them big reasons. I don't think that's the only reason, but because again, it's a Jesuit hub too.

They probably, you know, had certain things in place that they also wanted to keep. That was going to come under threat. If you're going to allow a government that didn't see eye to eye with that, that would have the power to scrub these things. That's a good point. Yeah, that was known as the golden triangle. as far as the production centers of the majority of opium that would become the heroin for the world drug trade it was vietnam southeast Asia was so Vietnam Laos Cambodia but Vietnam was a

major production hub so that that's a factor I'm sure it's a factor and it it does go there's a book as well that's really useful I don't know how easy it is to get a hard copy these days but you can get it online in archive.org as a PDF called Dope Incorporated, published by EIR back in 1978. There's been some readditions of it, and they map out very eloquently how the British Empire of the 19th century, which managed the world opium trades as part of the empire. It's just like it wasn't like something outside of the empire. It was if you wanted to maintain a world empire with a tiny little island of Britain, the as, the part that involved creating black economies, and I don't mean Africa here, I just mean like, you know, the entire

organized crime networks in local various countries that you need to interface with to manage your system of corruption and control, required the drug, the drug economy. And that was done. We saw it. We know the effects of that with the opium wars, where the Chinese tried to say no at a certain point and they were brought to heal by British gunboats, basically forcing opium down their throats. So there's a twofold aspect of it.

that, which was number one, or threefold. Number one, you, you destroy a target population's living vitality by getting a drug epidemic. So that's number one. You can't have a viable nation state if you've got a population that's spiritually being drained by their addictions. Number two, you create a nice organized crime structure, which would have a very hierarchical system of control with different aspects with the, you know, Sicilian, Italian mafia, Jewish mafia. There's different mafia, there's the Chinese mafia, the triads, the green gangs. You got the, you got different, the Indian, you know, there'd be tantric, you know, collie worshipping secret societies that would, again, have a hierarchy, which at the top,

was still managed by the same British intelligence network that was tied to the city of London. So that's on the, on that hand, and then you'd have compromised political leaders within the courts within, you know, who would be taking bribes. They would be part of that. So that's, again, a benefit. Number two is you create a lot of revenue. That's off the books. And as we know, even today, through the discoveries of HSBC, the Hongshang Bank of Commerce that's been sent its center is London. They were found guilty for laundering hundreds of billions of dollars worth of drug money, of heroin. For decades and decades, they were caught, found guilty by Senator Carl Levin back in 2012. And his report was quite useful at demonstrating how a big

chunk of the world economy of these banks, London and Wall Street especially, exist by vast infusions of laundered drug money, which is just another aspect of it. So you've got these different aspects. So somebody could look at a place that looks politically negligible like a Vietnam from one level and think like why. And it's true. Until you just ask that question, Sean, I've not quite, I don't have a full answer. Neither does Cynthia. But I, but when you look at it from or maybe you have a she has a better idea than I do, but it's, still like a very vague idea like why why was it vietnam so much but i but you can't answer it if you don't take these considerations into account and and especially ho chieman's leaning towards like a

real industrial nationalism um was a big danger to lose that he would kick he would probably do what what castro had done in 49 or whatever it was 49 i guess no 50 59 58 um which was again shut down the drug trade which is such a big part of the the global complex So they can't allow that sort of thing to happen. It's too much of a risk. Well, and it was known, right? Like, again, there were good people in the DEA, but it was known that as soon as you were getting too close to a guy that was on top,

you were told, drop it. And this has been well documented. But it is, heroin is very directly involved in the Vietnam War because, again, Heinrich Kruger did a book, The Great Heroin Coup. There's other books to Peter Dale Scott did the, the introduction to this to this book that was written in the 80s but lucien conan who was a french legionaire so again you know France started a war with vietnam pretty much right after world war two because they're like okay now we're not going to give that up we're going to go in and they were not doing well in that and that was

one of the reasons why the americans more on the clandestine side at the beginning came in so that France could go into Algeria, which is also, you know, I think most people would recognize that that was a bad thing, what they did in Algeria and to the Algerian people there. But Lucien Conan was a French legionaire. So he was part of the French establishment. And you had the Corsican mafia. So it was really the Corsican mafia first who was like the top dog in heroin trade. Heroin Manoran. manufacturing and heroin trade. And they had bases, very important bases in Vietnam. Lysen was very buddy buddies with the Corsican mafia. And for whatever reason, he betrayed them. And he told Edward Lansdale all of the intelligence. And so during this whole chaos period, where the Americans were supposedly helping to defend French imperial interests in Vietnam, they actually seized it. So they actually took over a lot of those

possessions and it's again well known by the the writers who focus on these kinds of subjects like hinder kreckiq kruger that um you know edward lansdale had very close you know near-death experiences because the corsican mafia wanted to kill him when he was in vietnam because he was no friend to the interests of the corsican mafia so that was one of the big victories again like people are like why the hell would the u.s go into a war where they had no military military objective. They did have an objective, but the objective was they were war crimes, so they couldn't announce what their objectives were. And one of them was the acquisition of the heroin monopoly so that by the end of Vietnam, the Americans are now through Anglo-American

relationship or the top dogs. The French are consistently screwed over, by the way, by the British historically. Seix Pico is a very very. good example of that the carving up of the middle east but the french for whatever reason keep thinking that the british aren't going to backstab them and they continuously do but anyway um the americans came out of that through an anglo-american uh partnership as the top dogs in the heroin trade question uh number one uh the flying tigers and like air america the whole cia front that grew out of World War II? Yeah.

Is that also playing a role in your research in Vietnam as far as, or the Golden Triangle? Are they playing a big role there too? Or were they just big in the drug trade during World War II in Taiwan and stuff? And number two is Conan, this French, I guess he's like a Vichy fascist. Guy, is he part of the organization of the Secret Army that was trying to kill De Gaul? Is he part of that network? I don't know for certain, but probably. At the same time, you know, maybe not so clear.

Because I mean, that's the thing is French intelligence, they had several different intelligence agencies who were battling it out. So it's very complex and messy. But he did screw over, you know, French interests. So I don't know exactly where he stands because I would imagine the French intelligence still wanted, they still viewed themselves as having, you know, a powerful footing in things. And Lucien Conan totally, you know, I think sabotaged that greatly with the heroin situation. But yeah, Claudeau-Cheneau, Paul Heliwell is a really big person as well. Again, this is not new news.

This is like been documented. The researchers that you find like Douglas Valentine, Peter Dale Scotch, who have done a ton of work on this research for decades, like since the 80s, have all been coming to the same conclusions and points. There really isn't disagreement when I read these writers that it was coming out of, you know, these Paul Halliwell, too, and the cat, the cat system, the American Airlines, like this was. you know, largely for the drug facilitating the drug trade. And you know, Claire Cheneau, if I understand correctly, he was the husband of Anna Chenot, who her original name was Anna, oh, I forgot her Chinese name, but she was ahead of the Chinese Kuomintang lobby. So people have to know like China had, you know, the communists under Mao Zedong, and you had the, you could argue, imperialist under a Shanghai Czech.

And that's what now Taiwan, you know, became. But they were having a civil war as long during the World War II period. But you have the Taiwanese who are largely the ones being brought in to manage the Golden Triangle stuff too. So Anna Cheneau, who was the wife of Claire Cheneau of the Flying Tigers, American, you know, Claire Cheneau is a man, even though his name is Claire. It's confusing. But they were very much at the center of the sort of stuff. So it's definitely a big part of it. But it's like the ultimate goal is not like money. Because as Matt was saying, like drugs allow for a certain kind of, I guess,

I would say economic and societal warfare. So you're making a lot of money off of black market things, but the ultimate goal, I think, is to weaken the value system and the better concepts of like what is sovereignty and stuff with these kinds of tactics. That's also what terrorism is about, right? Like the drug money funds terrorism. HSBC, which is the Hong Kong-Shanghai Bank, which is a city of London bank that came out of the opium wars,

which is stationed, you know, in Shanghai and Hong Kong. But in Hong Kong, to this day, even though the Chinese government has HSBC on a blacklist, the HSBC, along with another city of London Bank, standard charter, I believe, are responsible for printing two-thirds of Hong Kong money, which is different from the mainland Chinese government money. So it again shows you that, like, Hong Kong was another hub for, like, the drugs. but Hong Kong was under as a British colony for 99 years and what only came back into, you know, in name back to the Chinese government in the late 1990s. So, you know,

during all of the 70s and the 80s and, and you know, it's not like China could just come in and remove a lot of the British institutions there, you see that the Chinese factors in the drug trade were Taiwan and Hong Kong. You are going to be very hard to find something outside in Macau, which is a Portuguese, a Portuguese colony. So, yeah, I know it's a lot for people to take in, but can. I mean, when it comes to opium, I guess, or drugs in general, I don't think it's shock anyone.

There's an insane amount of money there. and if you can get other populations addicted to that, you're not only going to weaken said country, but you're going to have a whole bunch of other ripple effects through that country while getting insanely rich off of it, which then can fund, you know, I don't know how many other things. What's interesting to me, you know, about where we're at, you know, like if I, I don't know what I want to jump things,

but, you know, like, where this started out with us talking about Michael Yon and the Darien Gap, And all the drug money and all, you know, and all these different things is like, it looks like, man, once again, I could be completely wrong on this. And I'm quite okay with that. If I was, I don't know, Canada first, and I'm not saying you go to this nefariousness, folks, but like, and you go to Vietnam, you take over the drug trade and use the drug trade to go after, let's just pick on Russia for today.

and you're going to funnel in there because you don't want Russia messing in your country and your Canada first and rah, rah, rah, rah. To me, logically, that makes sense just from the fact of your Canada first and you're trying to protect your nation and whatever. What I see in the United States or in North America is the drugs all come back to North America.

We have a huge problem there. You have a huge open border problem where it's just like, let's just funnel as many people in here and it's great and we're all going to live kumbaya yet that's not. And so it's like, the problem is, none of it makes logical sense,

even in a nefarious way of where you're your nation first, which is probably why I can't get my head wrapped around it. So when you come back to the Daring Gap and you go through the fact that you lead through all these different things that have happened over the course of the last hundred years, and you get to the Darying Gap and Michael Yon,

what is it about it that, I guess, I don't know, puts a bird, in your saddle for lack of a better term and you go we need to talk about this yeah i think that's a a terrific point yeah like if it was done as a uh a military form strategy to weaken your enemy you know um sun su's name is really bastardized now in the art of war he would not uh go along with something like that but you know a sun sue type you know a strategy play why would those things come why would they be brought into your own country. And that is the question, right? Because it turns out

it's not just the so-called communist enemy. It seems that there's something within the United States that is considered an enemy. Well, that's very interesting now. What exactly it is about the United States or, you know, the better aspects of, you know, a Canadian society that you would view as something that you have to attack and ultimately weaken so that something else can be brought in. And, you know, Paul Helly Wall, who again is a big player in the OSS and massive for what allowed the heroin situation to explode the way it did into the United States as well. And they first again justified the entry of the heroin into the United States that they were saying, we're going to give it to the black ghettos we're going to bring it into harlem harlum was the first place

one of the biggest places that they started to bring in the heroin and it was and you know even in godfather right they have this like scene where they're like oh um uh you know some people are are like there's this moment right and i think marlin brando is still yeah he's still alive and he's like arguing with sunny because sonny wants to get into the business of the drugs and he's like no no no we don't we don't touch drugs and they're like, whatever, they're just going to give it to the black people anyway. So it was considered that it wasn't going to be a threat to the ultimate values and fabric of the country. And that was done as an excuse, basically, right, to just expand and expand and heroin is incredibly addictive. So again, I don't view that as, oh, we didn't realize that, hey,

if we bring it into the black ghettos that it's going to somehow trickle out. And now we have like white upper class suburbia now having being hit by heroin addiction. That was predictable. Crack cocaine too, right? Like crack cocaine was flooded into the black ghettos by design in the 80s as well, right? But under George Bush, senior and company. Yeah. So I would say these people are not.

not friends of the American constitution. And it was the same thing with like the green berets in terms of like, there's a lot of crusader symbolism. You know, Knights of Malta, a lot of CIA people, including Allen Dulles are like members of the Knights of Malta. That's a crusader militant organization. And it's not like just by name or like, you know, it's an ideology that they still think that we're like fighting for

this like kingdom of Jerusalem stuff and all that kind of stuff. But finally to to michael yon. So I am not going to say anything and I haven't even listened to michael yon so much, right? I've heard about what michael yon has been talking about. I've heard how eric weinstein had or brett weinstein has talked about it on the tucker carlson show in terms of his experience with michael yon and for me the red flags are um because he's former. green beret, it's hard for me to think that he's not aware of the massive presence that the green berets had and continue to have in Panama, but especially is well documented in the 70s period and I would say even into the 80s through Operation Condor. And again, Operation Condor is one of those more

recent revelations like Gladio was declassified in the late 1990s. I think Operation Condor, it's like it's more recent because you know it came into play in the 70s. That's part of like the whole Pinochet, Chile situation, you know, where you hear like a football stadium people were executed like crazy stuff like that. That was coming out of Operation Condor. So Gladio would have Operation Phoenix in Vietnam. It would have Operation Condor coming into South America that was also affecting Central America. You know, there's been some, Oliver Stone actually did, yeah, a movie on the El Salvador situation. There was another movie too on like Oscar Romero, you know, who was assassinated.

But you hear all of these crazy stories that were much more in the news, you know, a few decades ago of like, what the hell is going on in Central and South America? And it was a bloodbath in especially Chile and Argentina. In Argentina, there are very clear ties to Nazis and Jesuits. Actually, the guy who's the Pope now, Pope Francis, is directly tied to some suspect situations in terms of the kind of death camps or interrogation centers where it was like the stories that you hear like Patrice McSherry in predatory states, it like makes you want to throw up. Like, it's, babies were bashed against the wall, that kind of stuff.

And so in chatting with Michael Yon, I don't know, was it a week ago, I can't remember folks, regardless, doesn't matter. He's raising concerns about, I would say, oligarchy elites and their plan for the world. I may be paraphrasing, and at times I oversimplify things. and he's pointing two problems that he's seeing. And one of the big ones has been the Darien Gap, right? Lots of talk about it and how they're bringing across migrants and they're coming up through Mexico and into the United States. Do you have issue with that? Like, do you, do is, and if so, what, I guess?

I'm kind of curious because like, yeah, no, no, I'll just leave with that. So Operation Condor is totally connected to Panama. So you had, and Panama has been a colony of the United States. The United States invaded Panama. Panama used to be a part of Columbia. And the United States invaded Panama in about 1908, somewhere like that. Again, I'm not great with specific dates, but under Theodore Roosevelt. And that's when military bases started to be a thing in Panama.

And they are not so over now, more recently, but it's still there. And you can still see it with the presence of US Southcom. The thing is during Operation Condor, you had, you know, training American military training schools in Panama with Green Berets training. Again, you know, like you had Green Berets training Vietnamese and Filipino native populations on Cy war tactics. That was also happening in Panama by Green Berets. Again, Patrice McSherry's predatory states goes over this in a lot of detail. And that's where I primarily am getting my information from. And she was making the point that there was also a computer system that they had to communicate with all of these different sections across Central and South America.

So again, this was something that started with Gladiou. They would have travel agencies to give you fake passports to make it. easy for you to cross borders. And like a lot of people who would go missing, for instance, in Chile and be found in Argentina, there were two different, you could say, records. There was the official record where people within the government up until a certain point you could argue were not aware of what was happening secretly, just like the Alendaleza, Frank Weisner OPC department. So it's not like everybody was in on it. And that's what's so scary too.

Like you had separate police stations. You have like the black to mark vehicles, you know, the secret cemeteries, the secret interrogation centers. Like, again, Patrice McSherry documents this in great detail. But you also had a computer system to organize this whole crossing of borders, which, you know, is clearly they still wanted to keep track of what was happening. That was Condor Tell, right? Condor tell. Yeah. And then Copacami, C-O-P-E-M-I was a broader branching of this.

But they had those things in place. And like U.S. Southcom still exists and still has as their purview the defense of the Panama Canal zone. So for me, like there hasn't been any evidence that that apparatus disappeared. Okay. Okay. So you're saying, you're saying that the military, the United States military still has a presence in Panama, correct? Yeah, they do officially with US Southcom. It's official on their website. They have it and they have a 2024, you know, Congress mission statement stating it. It's made very clear. And again, you know, they can say, oh, we don't have this in place anymore, but there isn't, you know, I'm sorry, but they're very clear. been a lot of lies that have been told there's no evidence to suggest that they would have given up

that sort of power. And so for me, I don't know if Michael Young is aware of that or not, but him being a green beret and seemingly being a higher level green beret, I find it hard to believe that he doesn't know about this, that he hasn't talked about this at all. And that's going to obviously come into play if you have a migration, you know, this whole apparatus. that's happening. So where... Sorry to interrupt. I'm like, my understanding, and forgive me if I'm wrong here, folks,

Michael Young was a Green Beret or in the U.S. military for less than 10 years. I think I want to say it was five to seven. Don't quote me on that. That's my memory. And I'm like, you know, and then after that, he goes on to be an author and a journalist and goes to the front lines as a journalist all over the place. Right? And he spent decades outside of the United States of America.

looking at different things. So when you say he's a higher level of Green Beret, do you just mean that he was special forces and that's Green Beret? Or do you think he's like, I'm just, because like when I listen to him talk, I guess like,

what stuck out to me about the interview and forgive me, maybe I'm wrong on this, but I'm like, he's talking about the border crisis, he's talking about the Darien Gap. When I hear Brett Weinstein talk about it, I feel like he's talking about the Darying Gap, And just the fact that migrants are coming across.

They link it to military age men. At times they say China. At times they say just military age men. Which is a weird statement because you can say any adult is a military age person, right? I think with people with backgrounds in military, you probably defer to what, because I've wondered about that exact. I agree with you. I've wondered exactly about that. It's like, what does a military age man look like?

And actually, I would even go one step further. I was in my kids play hockey. And I have to get a criminal record check in order to be around children. It's, you know, I'm actually quite for, you know, that, you know, it's like, let's not have a something bad in there. Anyways, it doesn't matter. The whole point of the story is I'm in the cop station. And I was actually thinking about that. I'm like, what is a military?

What does a cop look like? You know, I'm like, I'm trying to like, you know, and seeing them walk back and forth. I'm like, so are they saying there's men of physical fitness and they're all, and I guess we just defer naturally to military men to spot that, right? Isn't that what? I would say in this case. Or am I wrong in this? I would, I would just chime in here. Sure.

No, you feel free. It smells like a, like a, like a hypnotic induction, like a choice to use a certain language. a label to induce a certain inference in people's minds collectively who are consuming a common narrative story or way to speak about certain things that's agreed upon so that you have a number of people at the same time who are influencers being set out to shape the zeitgeist and infuse a narrative utilizing the word military age men instead of just saying adults or men in order to get people to within the context of a broader story that's being it's all about stories right so that people are then going to make the associations on themselves.

They'll think it comes from them internally from themselves as media consumers that, okay, there must be a Chinese military secret army being built up inside of our country to, like look in Canada right now, that CIS has been grooming for the last like a year and a two years, a narrative. CIS, like high level CIS directors have been overseeing, highly covered stories in global TV, global news, global and mail, the biggest news agencies around the exposure of China's infiltration of agents into our government, especially Justin Trudeau being like the key Chinese CPC agent.

Same thing has been going on inside of the U.S. Fox News and other things have been saying for a number of years now that. Biden is a CPC stooge. He's inserted there as a puppet of the CPC. So they've been preparing the groundwork already for quite some time in people's minds to now hear military age men within that story of weaponized migration. And they're going to make their own conclusions, which are already predetermined for them, which ignores the CIA Nazi unreconstructed. Or like this this whole British Empire agency that's actually been there trying to destroy America. and destroy Canada.

That's what's interesting. This was interesting about like the first two hours of this conversation. You're trying to put together a long, complex, and oftentimes very messy story of how we get to where we are. Right. And then we sit here and you go, okay, a lot has been said about Russia, Ukraine. A lot has been said about not being able to talk about Israel was.

Right. We're not allowed to talk about that one. That one comes with a lot of strings and a lot of. emotion and then the big one is you two point out that china's being talked about a lot but what people on this side will say is china actually doesn't get talks about that much which is interesting and that's looking at me like i'm crazy from from uh from a national point of view it does what i mean is in our realm the podcasting world um when you have on the tom loango the alix trainer the and i'm you know the michael yawn i guess i don't know i guess i guess i guess i guess i guess i

China gets talked about, but I would say the last time I had Tom and Alex on, not the last time, a few times ago, folks, we brought up China and they were talking about being, that's just a, that's just a, I don't know, a distraction. I think it was the word. We got to, we got to stare at the thing here. Okay. I'm staring at the thing. When I hear military age men, I don't think China. I think they're bringing in people who can be triggered with many multiple of these territorial conflicts to set off problems in that state. No different than if I was the guy thinking this through with the drugs, I would position it so that they get all the drugs in there and eventually somebody's going to find it and they're going to, ooh, that tastes pretty good. And oh, it's highly

addictive. And pretty soon your population's hooked on drugs. Now, if it's China, if it's, if it's Hamas, if it's any one of these, they're just, they're setting the kindling. So when it goes up, it's a fire and there's nothing you can do about it. But in, fairness to both you when you say military-aged men is setting the direction, you're absolutely right. I have something quick to say on that, Matt, and if you have something afterwards. Again, like, I think for me, it's like, you know, it's built, you know, sometimes writers like David Talbot who wrote The Devil's Chess Board, which is a very pro-Canady and very anti-Aland Della's, you know, book, but I think just a Bible.

with what he brings up in his research or Daniel Ganser as well with his NATO secret armies and all this. Like oftentimes like one of the critiques that's like, oh, you're so biased. Like you clearly are a Russian shell or something because it's like, why are you only talking about what the West does that's bad? And why are you not talking about what the other side is doing? That's bad. But you will find, and that's why I'm trying to make a point with like a lot of the researchers that were mentioned today, which are not even like all of them, that there is a consensus when you're looking at the archive records, like when you're trying to look at the evidence to showcase, you know, and it's not just a claim,

that there is a huge amount of evidence to define, even though it's not a perfect definition, a structure under this gladio apparatus, which has Alan Dulles, American intelligence facilitating it and had a taking over of the U.S. military. There is a lot to define and validate that structure. And there isn't really a lot to define an equally, you know, I would say influential structure that has been even justifying that structure. As you said, Sean, right, is a really good point. If these were made as defensive maneuverings, why are they coming back? Because that's the thing is like the techniques that are now being used as weaponizations

against Americans are the tactics that we have a good documentation on that were used by our very own Western networks on other parts of the world before they started to come in on a very clear level at this point. And it's not that they have just come into play. I would argue that the most vulnerable people in the United States have been preyed upon. And M.K. Ultra was one of those things, right? They prayed upon the easiest people first before they started to try to do like things on a more mass scale. Like you could argue COVID was one kind of laboratory in terms of seeing how people are going to react psychologically to things.

So for me, there is this whole apparatus that if you are not going to even talk about that apparatus, and you're just going to make claims that you have not, you know, you can't just travel to a place. And, you know, people should also keep in mind when you're a journalist, there are, there's a lot of espionage that's done under the name of journalism. I'm not seeing Michael Jan is a spy. However, it is known historically that journalism is one. of the things that you can be you can you can have as a as a easy way to justify espionage activity but uh you can't just like go and say I see this thing you have to have more to it than that but I know that the average person that's

what they they really respond to as like Brett has Brett Weinstein has said about Michael Yon he's the eyes of David against Goliath but it's like well why what I've rely on Michael Jan's eyes, I want to see more documentation because I do agree there are Cy war tactics that are being used right now against Americans and more broadly the Western people. But we have to know exactly where that's coming from. And right now, there's a whole structure that is not being talked about, which I find hard to believe that certain people are not aware of this sort of thing. And then, you know, Johnny Vedmore has more recently come out with a paper on Eric Weinstein's role within the United Nations in actually working to bring about migration into countries, despite knowing, like, in the paper that Eric Weinstein has written that Johnny Vedmore has reference to in his paper, Eric R. Weinstein's great replacement is the name of the paper.

they can go on to Johnny Vedmore's website to view it and you can access Eric's old resume through the wayback machine where he's he's he's really trying to recruit people to help him out with this project in his own paper he documents how this is not going to benefit native populations so it's not it was not a mystery as to the intention of these things and so again I'm not seeing that Brett is aware I mean, it's kind of hard for him, I would say, to think that Brett is not aware that Eric wrote that paper. But anyway, I'm not seeing that Brett is, is like leading, like the leader of. You're looking, you're looking at tea leaves and going, listen, Green Berets, they come from a very atrocious part of history.

You look at Operation Phoenix and then Gladiot and what they stand, or maybe Gladio and then Operation Phoenix, sorry, and then what they stand for and where they're going. And the thing I struggle with Brett Weinstein, right, is like, I've interviewed his wife, which is very unique. I obviously haven't interviewed Brett, but like the evergreen story and how he comes to prominence and COVID and how he comes to, you know, like he started out being, uh, mask wearing, you know, like on and on it goes, right? And his dark horse podcast and, and how. him and his wife like there's just there's things in there that don't make sense to me right like

i i just i don't even know what to make sense of you know it's almost like it's confusing which means i'm going to have to go sit and and you know do what i do on this end right that's that's that's exactly what we do all right well there's some confusion so let's have some more conversations because you write a paper on the u.n about mass migration and you go well that ain't good. Like, I don't care who you are. You go, does his brother know? I don't know. Like, maybe you wrote 10,000 papers. Maybe you wrote one. The fact that the UN gives us all pause, I think, right? I don't think anyone's going, no, that's good. No, that's at this point in the game, that's not very good. Um, I don't know. I come back to the Darien Gap and I'm like,

so is, is that a thing or not a thing? Oh, I just had one little addition on top of that question of the daring gap is that I one of the things I noticed in is that and you were telling me this and I don't think you mentioned this Cynthia is that a similar lie was told to the target populations that were expected to be used as weaponized migration in the case of North Vietnamese brought down to South Vietnamese

they were told that they would be supported there would be opportunities living standards economic opportunities all these promises were given to them on top of very similar to what's going on right now yeah exactly I think that that It's a very important part of the magic trick on top of artificially destroying them economically, giving them sciops that would destroy all the things, the fun and games operations that Cynthia was talking about, that would traumatize them and make them want to leave.

That was done in tandem with the promise of economic opportunities in the South, in the freedom-loving South. The same thing is being given in various Soros-affiliated. And I mean, it's a big network of narrative managers that are sending messages to people in nations that we've destroyed, like whether it's Libya that we bomb back to the Stone Age or the Middle East that we've been bombing back to the Stone Age since 9-11 or South America that we've destroyed through Operation Condor, conscious destructions of their economy under the IMF. But we've resulted in creating an unlivable system of like situation, organized crime

networks like the Sinaloa cartels, the fart guerrillas in Colombia. All of these things only exist because they get top-down support from Wall Street banks. You even have the picture of Raul Reyes, the former second in command of the FARCs, embracing the president of NASDAQ because that's where they put all of their money. And that's part of the thing. It's a top-down control. So that makes people's lives on the local level, miserable, desperate, crime-ridden, and they want to leave. And they're given messaging saying, oh, you want, the land of milk and honey is waiting for you. And, you know, we've got special routes.

Just, you know, sign up to this thing and you'll get into the United States or some. you know or europe uh is another one you know like and then they get there and they discover oh there's actually nothing they're they're in the one hand in some cases they have money being given to them by the government they're being set up in in five-star hotels with no but there's no economic opportunities in in in that sense there's nothing for them to do that was that measures up so is that like is that uh is that uh the the democratic side the the the the the the of the United States that's facilitating that and pushing for those type of things, you know, open border policy, you know, like, I mean, here in Canada, like, you know, we all know it,

you know, like BC pushed for and has had, you know, like open supply and, uh, and all these different ideas that are like insane. And so you, when you look at what's going on, North American wise, you see the Darying Gap and I'm just, I'm trying to like the Daring Gap is happening, right? Like we're not, we're not like there's migrants coming from all over the place. They're being promised something. And what you're pointing out is we go to the most extreme level, which ties into Operation Phoenix, I think, which is they say military age men to foment this idea that eventually, we're going to, you know, take to the extremes of what Cynthia was talking about, which is like torture and burning down the village and all these crazy things.

And how does that get started by bringing a million people down to the bottom and then causing all this turmoil so that really bad things can continue to happen or maybe even happen? I want to make a quick point. I know you want to say something badly met. People should know that when you have these operations like Operation Gladiol, Operation Condor, it's setting up a parallel state, right? So it's a parallel state is something that starts off underground. So like I was saying, like you have a secret police station,

you have another cemetery, another interrogation center, and like just this whole other apparatus that is not allowing the democratic structures of Western countries to be made aware of what's going on. And those structures stay in place. So it's like, you know, the argument is, oh gladio oh it did exist and we did lie about it to you for like several decades but now it doesn't exist and it's like no it didn't it set up parallel states that are now arguably the like fucking sorry the official state right um and in condor that's exactly what happened as well the parallel

states became the official uh states for a lot of these countries especially you know chile and argentina are really up there that didn't go away it's set up a whole whole structure. So that's the other thing people have to keep in mind is, okay, if that structure is still in place, because there's no evidence to showcase that it wasn't, that it was actually removed, then this whole migration crisis, again, looks fishy because those are the areas of control in South America that were put in place from Operation Condor, which is a continuation of Belladio. And Central America also has their things, you know, Honduras is constantly, you know, being attacked, you know, is one of the things that they really like to put through the ringer.

So if those structures are in place, you could easily see a coordination of something happening. I'm not saying that the people who are migrating are in on it. Certainly there are bad eggs within that grouping. I would think that the majority of people in that grouping are innocent. And they are, I think even Brett Weinstein is making this point that their, their economic refugees. I would say that's probably more than that.

There probably is, you know, you know, because there is economic warfare, right? It's not like that an economic refugee is like. Once again, you're driving in a huge population that we all sit here and go like, just once again in Canada, you go like, we can't like, look at what's happening.

Yeah. It's not healthy for society. And it doesn't mean you shouldn't have immigrants. I come from immigrants, right? Like I mean, all of, well, majority of Canada does. Right. But there's healthy ways to do it in unhealthy ways. And right now it feels like it's unhealthy.

And if you go, okay, so then who's the nefarious actor behind there? If you're not allowed to say China, if you're not allowed to say different countries, then who is it? And I want to clarify this, Matt, one thing before, because I saw Matt give me the eyes. The China thing is interesting in the sense that it does get a ton of time from mainstream media, the 11 MPs who got China connections and the training of them in the wintertime and the police stations and all those different things. Paint a picture, Dr. Phil talking, I believe, if I remember this, correct, about them owning all the land near strategic U.S. sites, military sites. if I remember correctly, right?

And so there is a nefarious long-term view of the Chinese that gets put out there. But if not, if we're not going to, I mean, if we can all agree there's a migration problem going on, and we can look at what happened in Vietnam, as you've, I think, pointed out very, very succinctly. We're going to move these people here. We're going to put them there. We're going to do it with these all different ways. It's going to cause a whole crap of, you know, my own swear here, a shitstorm. You know, you look at the United States right now and some of the things happening in the population that's happened there.

You look at Canada. It's happening here. So where do you get to when you see all that? Michael Leon says it's the Chinese. Well, I don't know. I guess I put the Chinese on it. So maybe I guess that's how I interpret it. The Chinese, the Darien Gap, they're facilitating them and then pushing them all up.

That's what they're doing. Where do you two go? Okay, can I? I just would say I just pulled up a website here on U.S. military operations in Latin America. And a lot of people don't know this. It's not too familiar. It might be known that there's over 800 U.S. military bases around the world and approximately 300 bio labs outside of the U.S. border around the world.

And this is outside of the U.S. border. It's huge. Inside, in Latin America and the Caribbean, there are currently 17,000, U.S. military bases that are known in Latin America and Caribbean. 12 U.S. military bases, that's a massive amount of infrastructure, are in Panama alone, currently, currently. There's 12 in Puerto Rico, nine in Colombia, eight in Peru. It's a huge, huge complex of top-down military controls that's been there for a long time.

China's you could people could look into this. China has officially one military base outside of its borders in a country that asked it to come in to protect Belt and Road Initiative infrastructure in Ethiopia, where you actually have a program of building rail and infrastructure and water systems right now by the Chinese that are helping out Ethiopia that's just joined the BRICS plus nations. The Grand Renaissance. The Grand Renaissance. The Grand Renaissance Dam, which is sort of the, it's the biggest dam hydroelectric power dam ever built in Africa's history, which the only one bigger, or almost as big was the one that John F. Kennedy tried to, or did build in Ghana. But then the policy was to stop it. So China has one foreign military base. The U.S. is over 800. 800. Yeah. So it's just the proportions. And I'm not. And then the, again, biolabs, most of it is. is actually on the black budget.

The Pentagon failed every single audit, just as another data point, every single audit that has been done on the Pentagon, they failed with over $2 trillion of unaccounted for money, that they just couldn't account for the first of these audits took place or was announced on September 10th, 2001. And people were talking about it for one day until something else happened,

where we forgot to talk about this $2 trillion. $9. I was going to say it was at 9-11? Maybe. Yeah. Something, yeah, something convenient happened that changed the topic, changed the conversation. So when I look at the types of discourses that Michael Yon and Brett have been pushing consistently in every podcast that I've watched them perform on, and especially Michael Yon, Brett, it's really just very very much specific to his experience working in the Darien Gap as a researcher

working on a U.S. military base as well as he pointed out he would go on a military base that he was with the Smithsonian Institute which he said himself on the Tucker Carlson interview was the reason why the Smithsonian Institute could exist in Panama is because of the U.S. military bringing it in and The Smithsonian Institute has always had a special relationship with the U.S. War Department and military. But he wasn't on. He visited. Yeah, he visited the base, but he wasn't based on a U.S. Yeah.

So there's that. And he's, his discourse is very much specific to the, the migration and his direct experience looking at camps, workers camps in the Daryan that were part of the, the flows of people. But I'm here thinking more about the military is what I was talking about. So Michael Yon is what I had in mind. I've never heard him once talking about the U.S. The CIA role in creating in doing 9-11 in the first place that justified this entirely insane war of destruction in the Middle East. I've never heard him like do a proper criticism of the agency that was working to do that as an inside job. but I did hear him talking about like so there's this effort to keep the narrative of life

of terrorism as an international phenomenon that just is an emergent problem without a proper I think he's in a position I would imagine to understand how terrorism gets its funding and how it was al-Qaeda was created by the as an outgrowth of what the CIA had done in funding radical jihadi groups and schools and madrasas under Zimbabia. Brasinski and the neocons back in the 70s. And they continue to do that as far as just weaponizing these radicalized Islamists that continue to get funding to topple governments that we don't like in Libya or Iraq or Syria or Boko Haram in Africa.

So I think he has enough information as a frontier journalist to know that, but he never brings that up. So I'm always looking at like what are people avoiding in their narrative if these are the experts? what are they not saying? And then what are they saying? Because he is acknowledging that there is a globalist agenda to kill off a big chunk of the world population utilizing vaccines. He does say that. I agree with a part of his discourse. A big part of it is it resonates with a lot of people because it speaks the the truths you're not supposed to say in public. But then after getting your trust because you're saying the truth that you're not supposed to say, then the details,

the devils in the details, as they say. Then all of a sudden, I hear him describing, you know, his defense of the neocon narrative to militarily support Taiwan, which is going to be possibly like possibly invaded by China. And Taiwan is, you know, a sovereign nation that wants its independence and freedom just like America. And we should militarily go and defend them at all costs. He says that. that when I look at it the U.S. has 150,000 troops and bases all over the Pacific around China's perimeter waiting to go to war. And Taiwan is legally in the Canadian government, the U.S. government.

It's still legally recognized as a part of China. It's an autonomous province. And he says that that's not true, but it is true. It's an autonomous province of China. It's not an independent sovereign nation state. And it's recognized that way by most of the world, like most countries, except for the Vatican and like a few other countries. And the United States was until the last I checked was also one of the countries who were officially recognized that. The other thing people have to realize is that Taiwan's recognized airspace.

If you look at it on a map, it's ridiculous because their airspace goes over mainland China. Because, you know, Taiwan's pretty close to China, right? you have like Taiwan and China here and their airspace is the square and it's going over not only China a part of China but also the Taiwan Strait is actually again it's legally part of Chinese waters and that's a big trade route so like there's there's been like ridiculous arguments of like China somehow militarily posturing and it's like China it has to exist and like there are trade routes there are there are boats that are going through here and guess who has been going through those Taiwan Straits U.S. military warships and Canadian warships and Canadian ships too

warships as well. Chinese official waters like right by China between Taiwan if that's military posturing you know if anything right so it's it's very ridiculous but the average person doesn't even realize that Taiwan is officially part of of China at this point, they were even back in the day when you had officially like two different, you could say, governments. You know, it was always recognized under the United Nations that they had to, because the Taiwanese took it to the international community to decide.

But the reason why Taiwan lost that, it's not that China said, oh, no, we're going to be in charge of you. and they're like, no, we want to be in charge of ourselves. They wanted to, under Shanghai Czech, who always saw himself as the supreme leader of China, they wanted on their island to be the government of China, of all of China. So they were arguing that they should be the government of mainland China. And that's why it was ruled. And that's why most of the world, except for a few countries, have recognized that the mainland Chinese government is the government of China and then eventually the Taiwanese government they did at this point you know it's it's a

lot more unified it's still there are still problems in fully unifying just like Hong Kong is legally part of China but because it was under Britain for 99 years and you know Britain has always said oh one country two systems why do you think that they want two systems because they want their system in there sabotaging things that they're not friendly yeah Yeah, and Green Berets have been brought into Taiwan to train the Taiwanese military in preparation for the oncoming war with China. Like, already, that's an official thing. Green Berets specifically have been brought in to prepare the groundwork for this oncoming conflict, which they want to use Taiwan just like the Ukraine. So if people get confused about what this is, the way we used Ukraine, we never cared about Ukraine's freedom and independence the way we've been saying.

It was always a way to score tons of military contracts for the military industrial complex to, poor, you know, money or contracts into utilizing Ukrainians as cannon fodder in a proxy war against Russia to weaken Russia and also expand NATO's presence around Russia. Same thing for Taiwan. It's being used in the same way. They want to kill most of the Taiwanese living there, but use them for the time being to get more military contracts and to prepare the groundwork for what's called NATO of the Pacific. Use them as cannon fodder.

Yeah, cannon fodder. a military entry onto the island. Yeah, yeah. That's that's the battle plan. And again, there's 58,000 U.S. troops in Japan with a massive military presence geared up. 28,000 troops with a massive, a lot of bases in South Korea. They never left Japan or South Korea. They're still there.

They're fake countries in that sense. And it's their military bases of the U.S. military industrial complex. The same thing that killed Kennedy. It's still there with more power today all over Latin America. all over Asia. They're talking about bringing in a new expanded NATO into the Pacific. But that's the real, I think that that's for me at least. What I get out of Cynthia's research and a lot of these considerations is that the real thing we should,

as patriots, be talking about is dealing with this thing that killed Kennedy, that rewarded all of the highest-level Nazis with new assignments to manage the Cold War, which ran, you know, the worst of the social engineering. mk ultra that the stuff you're reading about in chaos that that was run and advised by high level nazi psychiatrists you know that did so much damage to ourselves to our culture and that are part of this real enemy that wants to destroy us we should be talking about that and bring our focus to that but instead we're being like misdirected to bring over and over again exactly Russia Russia China Iran whatever those have to be our enemies but not the actual thing the Eisenhower speech

again warning about the military industrial complex again i think sean your question was really front and center in this conversation is why would you see these tactics coming into the country and during you know isanhauer's period which i'm not claiming that isenhower was was terrific but i don't think he was also you know wanting to see his country turn into what happened i don't think he was just he He himself thought that these cold war clandestine, like more dirty war, basically tactics were necessary in order to make sure that a World War III wasn't going to happen. I believe that he probably really thought that. But the problem is, is that as soon as you start to get into the dirty war tactics, you're actually losing control because the people who we see now in Russia, who were in charge of those dirty war tactics,

we're actually not friends to the American sovereign nation state. And that's why, you know, right now the American economy is largely built to supply the military industrial complex. Are we going to also say that that's a Russia-Chinese conspiracy, right? Is that the American economy is tanking and all of the money that we do have is going into, sorry, I say we, even though I'm a Canadian, but I clearly identify as being part of my outcome is tied to the American outcome. Why would Americans be pouring all of the money that they have into military industrial complex since Eisenhower? Okay. It's not a newer thing. When China was clearly like there wasn't a justification for that. It was a form of corruption. And so now all levels of society are tied into the military

industrial complex, even like the best scientists, right? Like people have become very demoralized over like, can we actually have scientific progress that's like optimistic and good? And the reason why a lot of people feel that way is because the best scientists, as soon as they come up with something, the military industrial complex knocks on their door and they're like, you're not going to be able to get funding from anyone except for us. And as soon as you agree to that, they own your work and they own you because you won't be allowed to talk about. about your work. And that's been also a massive fight that I think a lot of people have not been aware of.

But like, why would if Americans are clearly not doing well economically? And then you have drugs that have come in, which there is massive evidence came from their own hands, started with Harlem. Why would they have done these things if they actually cared for American welfare? And why at this point, you have to understand that, part of a strong sovereign nation is that people have to you know they have to be prosperous economically so it doesn't make sense to put all of your money and stretching yourself up to all of these military bases you know it's not even like oh we're just going to be stationed in a ukraine type

area or like around russia or around china there are u.s military bases everywhere um it's not even being focused on like specific countries and then you have like Proudy talking again back in 1973 saying we have now an overthrow of the classical proper U.S. military philosophy into permanent warfare, Trotskyist neo-conservative permanent warfare. War will never end. War on terror was that same kind of thing. And we have green berets. Proudy is talking about this.

Green berets are going into these countries just like the world. on terror with Iraq they came in on all levels the military thought it was their role to reform the country top down that's the most that's part of the the outcome of these sorts of things can i add one thing just on that point this this can be confusing if people think that the u.s is a sovereign nation state and and i think that the point made like in in our research um it really became clearer and clearer when you look at the murder of the american presidents or even Martin Luther King, who had presidential qualities and was an ally of Bobby Kennedy, senior, that there's a foreign entity which wants to destroy the United States and has never

left the United States since 1776. And that thing has been incubating, building up what's known as a fifth column inside of the U.S., but that after World War II, as Churchill said, the post-war world will be ruled by American brawn and British brains. So the brains of the outfit have been tied to British intelligence, the same, you know, institutions that are locked into the maintenance of these ancient hereditary families and bloodlines, which see themselves as like human gods with the divine right to rule the earth as masters over slaves. That type of like messed up culture is very perverse is baked into the ruling families of Europe that could train. their lineages back in some cases to a very long ways of like we're talking here millennial and they have agents like institutions built up around these these things to advance those or to yeah to advance that um that right to rule the earth and in america america was a resistance

against it for a long time it broke away from it but it's been recaptured and it's and it took a lot of presidents dying to recapture america to bring it to that place um where we're at today where i think there's a very small window to get back the authentic america it's been really weakened it's possible but it's weakened a lot um so that that's part of the the discussion we're trying to bring to people when when we write and we make videos we want them to expand their considerations well otherwise it makes no offense otherwise i tell you what i mean like the the conversation here today i'm like i got to go sit and think you know like i know people get annoyed I have had people tell me all the time like you can't sit and chew on things I'm like

yeah I go sit and chew on things okay folks leave me alone I'm like this has been like you know like this has been you know because like if if you go the the common thread of I don't know is it my side of the argument it's just this this common thread of this side of the the political spectrum especially in the podcasting world you bring up Tucker Carlson you bring up Sean Ryan you bring up Joe Rogan, you bring up all these names, the Darien Gap has a common thread to it and and on and on and on. And what you're reminding folks is like, that doesn't make any sense because of some of these different extenuating circumstances other than it does make sense because it goes back to some things like that, you know, has the United States been captured?

And I think a lot of these folks are pointing that out. The thing I wrestle with, you know, he's not like you go Michael young is he a part of the the captured state or is he the guy exposing the captioned state now i'm i'm sitting here i'm sitting here scratch my head and i'm going i want to argue he is exposing along with you know like uh you know i don't i don't know what name you want to throw in there but you know like you you look i'll go to the about the big name don't trump right is he going to actually do anything and then you know it's like I don't know, but a cherry I just got appointed. Like, geez, got to like that. Every name that I've ever liked is getting appointed.

And like, there has to be some hope here. We can't undermine all the hope, can we? No, absolutely. No, there's, we like Donald Trump. Like, we think that he's an authentic person who really wants, who recognizes that World War III is bad for business. But you can also criticize him that he won't talk about Operation Warp Speed in a bad light.

That's not his job, though. His job isn't a frontier journalist saying what you're not allowed to say in polite political society. He's in political society. I see what you're pointing out there. And also he's very popular internationally because, again, he's viewed as someone who wants to genuinely end the never-ending wars. Yeah, like the Chinese, like Trump a lot. Because he's been very consistent and clear on that. That's one of the main reasons why, you know, I like him.

him as well and that he wants to actually focus on building back the American economy. I'm going to pull you into my final thought of the day, just because you two lovely minds are staring at this, writing about this, like looking at all the tea leaves, trying to construct and figure out. You know, before we get to January 20th, do you look at false flags and go, we're in a possibility of a lot of dangerous things happening? Matt's nodding his head for people again. Can't see. Oh, yeah.

Yeah, I think it's a heightened period of, of danger right now. And the likelihood, it's like, it smells like September 10th, 2001, like, and the Pentagon's being exposed for not being able to account for two trillion dollars all over again, but it's bigger. And I think the likelihood of, of, like, we're at a systemic change. It's a phase shift. It's, it's not like another day. It's not a gradual extension of past trends into the future.

It's not that. We're going into a new phase space of breakdown, of an overbloded banking system that was set up as a time bomb to blow decades ago. And it's getting, it's there. And we have a fight over what the new system is going to look like. There's some better ideas and some terrible anti-human ideas at play. And I think, yeah, the potential to just blow things up or to kick over the chessboard and to try to like bring order out of chaos is also extremely.

extremely high right now. And there's a whole bunch of things they've brought online that who knows what they're going to play, right? Is it going to be a bioterror attack? Is it going to be cyber attacks? Is it going to be some combination? Is it going to be, you know, there's so many things. They kind of want to have a civil war that never went away as a desire. Are they going to just amplify that utilizing, you know, proxies or provocateurs on both sides, right and left to to light some stuff up? There's so many ways. So the danger is very, very high that we don't lose our shit and we keep our heads on because it's going to it's it's it could be very wild ride yeah just keep your head on folks that's basically that that's

basically the message here today right keep your any any final thoughts Cynthia oh um Matt how about you say your final thoughts and then I'll think you know your head on no no you want to buy some time for you I can buy time but I I know I said my final thought But I would all say, look, we do have hope. I'll throw this out. We do have a lot of hope. We are very optimistic. And again, I do see a lot of good coming out of the discussions around the restoration of a protective tariff, the extraction from these dangerous wars, especially against Russia. These types of things are all really good, the bringing back of jobs and manufacturing that Trump has been talking about. Whether or not he has the capability of doing it, I don't know. But I think that he's authentic in the desire. And he's got some good people around him, as well as some. some crappy people, but there's, there's a fight. And that gives me a lot of hope that we can participate in that positive thing against the vipers and deep state operatives that otherwise would like to sabotage it. So yeah, that's my my actually and that's good that you said that and now that I was thinking about what are my final thoughts. But yeah, the fact that they've tried to

kind of escalate a bit, a Ukraine-Russian confrontation within this like, you know, dangerous period of transition of presidents, I think also showcases that Trump does have a certain amount of power in actually, again, he was the only president in, I don't remember how long, who didn't start a new war during his presidency and was actually pulling back on the things that the Americans were involved in abroad militarily. That's a phenomenal accomplishment with everything else that was coming at him during that period. It's really something. And, you know, the council on foreign relations was criticizing Trump because they're saying like, oh, he talks a big talk about Russia or China. But when you look at his actions, he's not really willing to go the mile.

And of course, like, what is the mile? The mile is war. And yeah, Trump is America first, but that doesn't mean that you have to say everyone else is subject to American hegemony, right? Like, I think that people have gotten confused along the way, of what it means to put your country first and it doesn't mean that you have to go to war with another country that's the whole zero game bullshit that we've been fed by game theory to justify the never-ending wars and i guess i would on the on the note of optimism i think that economically there are actually a lot of really optimistic things happening in the world right now very similar to you know when the american system again was like was spreading i think that those concepts

are returning. These concepts partake in that philosophy of the American system. And if Trump is going to be successful in actually making the United States prosper as, again, a manufacturing leader and industrial leader, this is also an anti-war policy because it's been known that the more wealth that you do have, you know, people I think are going to feel a lot less threatened because that can be that can be abused right when people feel vulnerable and they don't quite understand where it comes from so I feel that this is also a prosperous thing and and China has been on the record by the way of being really pro America first you know in the in the case of Trump's leadership because they understand it's actually a stabilizing factor which is what they want this idea of win-win cooperation. It's in your best interest to have your neighbor do well.

Think of it as you're living in a neighborhood, right? Don't you want to live in a neighborhood where everyone is doing kind of well? Or do you want to be the only one in the neighborhood that's doing well and everyone's doing poorly? Guess what's going to happen? You're going to feel. Or do you want to live by the crack house with the guy who thinks he's a woman? And I don't know. What other crazy things can I slide in there?

Thanks you. Thanks for hopping on phone. folks. Well, I have to do this again. I said, oh, yeah, hour and a half, not a problem. And I'm like, I don't know. I'm like left to so many more questions now. I think that's a good thing. But I appreciate it. As soon as you said to Cynthia, I like context. And that was, that was it. Well, I do. I do. No, no, it was great. It was a lot. No, no. It was wonderful. It was good. It's just, it's like, it's like, it's like asking a historian to distill a giant book into 20 minutes and I'm like oh yeah all right fair enough I I asked for it that's fair

you know so how did America become an empire well let me tell you about Cyrus the great is paying fealty to the cult of of of Marduk at Babylon thanks guys we'll do it again sometime but thank you