Shaun Newman Podcast - #766 - Blue Collar Roundtable #8

Episode Date: December 24, 2024

On the 8th edition of the Guardian Plumbing & Heating Blue Collar Roundtable I am joined by business owner’s Steve Newman (T - 1 Transport), Dave Schneider (Cliff Rose for Clothes) and Ryley Parchoma (Keep on Trucking Mechanical Services). We discuss the ups and downs of working for yourself, what it takes to “make it”, the importance of community, and dealing with stress. Guardian Plumbing & Heating: https://www.guardianplumbing.ca/ Cornerstone Forum ‘25 https://www.showpass.com/cornerstone25/ Clothing Link: ⁠⁠⁠https://snp-8.creator-spring.com/listing/the-mashup-collection⁠⁠ Text Shaun 587-217-8500 Substack:https://open.substack.com/pub/shaunnewmanpodcast E-transfer here: [e-mail] Silver Gold Bull Links: Website: https://silvergoldbull.ca/ Email: [e-mail] Text Grahame: [phone]

This is Brett Olin. I'm Dr. Peter McCullough. This is Tom Lomago. This is Chuck Brodnick. This is Alex Krenner. Hey, this is Bradwell. You're listening to the Sean Newman podcast. Welcome to the podcast, folks.

Happy, well, happy Christmas Eve, I guess. Happy Tuesday. Christmas Eve, I think for a lot of different families, certainly ours, has turned into essentially part of Christmas. Today, we're out at the Newman Farm, enjoying some time with family. and we get the ice booked. So we go chase each other around. But it's getting funer.

Like every year that goes on, you know, it was fun when you were the 20-year-old going 100 miles an hour. But now that we got the kids coming out, that has been, well, last year was the first time that I think the focus was more on the kids than the uncles. And, yeah, tons of fun.

Well, Merry Christmas to everybody. I'm going to keep saying it all week. I hope wherever you're at, You know, we've had some strange weather this way, lots of fog, lots of accidents. So wherever you're driving, if you are driving, make sure you're safe. If you're having a couple celebratories here at holidays, make sure you're just smart. Get a safe ride home. We don't need any heartbreak over the holidays.

It should be a time filled with laughter and all the good stuff. So, yeah, just Merry Christmas to you all. Here, precious metals they can be thought of as the ultimate insurance policy against economic and certainty and government incompetence. We won't, with deficit spending and fiscal irresponsibility, unlikely to end anytime soon. Now is the time to protect a portion of your hard-earned savings with the form money that has been recognized for thousands of years, silver and gold. And I was saying, you know, the lead up to this, you know, I know Christmas is tomorrow, but I was wondering if there is anybody out there, anybody getting silver, or if you're really splurgeon and you got maybe deep pockets, maybe some gold for the stocking. Anybody do that?

I did it last year. Tossed a couple one-ounce coins, and I don't know if the kids got it. They were excited. It didn't compare it to the toys, but anybody else slide it into the stockings? Well, if you're late to the game and you want to get some silver ore gold

or other precious metals, text or email Graham down in the show notes for some details, if he doesn't get back to you today, I'm sure in the coming week, he will. Silvergold bowl. or Silvergoldbill.com, depending on what side of the border you're in. Rec tech power products for over 20 years. They've been committed to excellence in the power sports industry.

Just head to the west side of Lloyd Minster. They got a great showroom with a plethora of options. From lawnmores to golf carts to boats, to skadoos, to quads, to motorbikes. Well, Rikers. I don't know. Is that a, to you motorbiker, Connor Sewers? Is that a motorbike? I don't know.

You get to pull. They also got aluminum-built trailers from Lethbridge, Alberta, utility trailers, dump trailers, gooseknacks. The aluminum gives you lighter pull, but the ability to haul large payloads. They're open Monday through Saturday. Just head to rectech power products.com for all your, well, for all of the information. And like I say, west side of Lloydminster. In Knight Distribution out of Wainwright, Alberta, they can supply industrial, safety, welding, automotive parts. They got on-site inventory management, specifically.

for this time of year when you're like i'm getting out of here it's it is the 24th christmas is on a wednesday i want out of this place but i got to make sure that i got all my eyes dotted tees crossed that's what chain does he helps you uh ensure that to everything that makes you run is there when you need it 780 842 3 433 give chain staffer to call sub stack we just announced martin freaking armstrong is back but this time folks he's in person yes so that is going to be excited we also just announced rod giltaka from ccfr is going to be there as well so now uh if you i guess a if you haven't subscribed to substack you really should comes out once a week on sundays over this holidays we probably going to have a messed up schedule

i'm not going to lie to everybody i don't know if i'm putting out a week and review this coming week maybe i am i don't know i'm taking some time off um but uh we do have a couple announcements that will be coming out through Substack. So it's free to subscribe to. Go down on the show notes and subscribe. Usually once a week, that's all we're looking for. It's the one way you can help support. You can become a paid subscriber as well.

Other keynote speakers coming to the Cornerstone Forum that are going to be joining Martin Armstrong and Rod Giltecca on May 10th in Calgary, Alberta include Tom Luongo, Alice Cranner, Chuck Praudent, Kaelin Ford, Matt Erritt, Chase Barber, Ben Perrin, Chris Sims, Tom Bodervix. Man, there is going to be a ton. May 10th. A ton going on, I was going to say.

May 10th in Alberta. You got early bird tickets on for a few more days until December 31st and then the prices go up. So don't wait any longer. If you're listening or watching on Spotify, Apple, YouTube, Rumble, make sure to subscribe and leave a review to you watching on X or Facebook. Give it a share. Pass it out.

share it to your friends. Let's get out of some of these echo chambers. All right, let's get on to that tale of the tape. The first is the owner of Cliff Rose for Clothes, the second, the owner of T-Bar-1 Transport, and the third, the owner of Keep-on-Trucking Mechanical Services. I'm talking about Dave Schneider, Steve Newman, and Riley Parkoma. It's another edition of the Guardian plumbing and heating blue-collar roundtable.

So buckle up, here we go. Welcome to the Charlene Newman podcast today. I'm joined by Riley Parkoma, Steve Newman, and Dave Schneider. So, jents, thanks for hopping in the studio. No problem. We're going to go one by one. I just want you to introduce yourself

what you do for a living, your business, and I don't know if there's anything else in your story that you want people to know how many years you've probably been running it. As a blue-collar roundtable, we bring in different people from different areas of the workforce and we

kind of highlight kind of their different spots they're at. So Riley, we'll start with you. I'm Riley Percoma, owner of Keypon Truck and Mechanical. Been in business since 2007, so 18 years now, and have a couple oil trucks as well, running on the road, Holly Oil. Daddy O'Neum.

Daddy O' Newman. T-Bar-1 trucking. We've been since 2002, so I guess coming up to 23 years. too stupid to quit and Dave my name is Dave Schneider Cliff Rose for Clothes the store has been open since 1986

and I've been there 35 years so kind of just took it over from Cliff now the reason one of the things I've been doing with the blue color roundtables is you know like I hear plenty of years of running a business

and one of the things the current economic situation but maybe it doesn't matter maybe it's the ups and downs, the flows of business at any given time in life or in history. There's going to be ebbs and flows to running a business. One of the things I ran into, it was kind of weird over the course of like a week or two. I kept running into these men specifically business owners who seem pretty down, depressed, if you would, because of some of the things going on economically. So we did our first roundtable kind of discussing that, just like the ups and downs of them.

what's going on and and because obviously it isn't unique to have ups and downs and business so henceforth I walked into Cliff Rose me and Dave started talking he wanted you you wanted him and I thought okay well let's bring three business owners in and let's let's talk about some of the ups and downs because I certainly know T-Barr's ups and downs and I tell the story about COVID an awful lot but I mean fire away I I don't know. At this point, if Dad's been in here enough, for Riley and Dave, it doesn't have to come back to me. This is a roundtable.

I mean, as Dad would point out, it's not a roundtable. But feel free to just discuss that you don't have to come back to me every step of the way. Yeah, I think in our business, we've had a great year and we get great support from not just Lloyd Minster, but the surrounding community, this is their hub they come to. in our business, you know, we talk to each other, and everyone about the last four or five weeks have been down. I mean, we're still good, but not what we were two years ago, 10 years ago. It's just a quiet year, and I think anyone looking when you go buy groceries

or go by anything, you kind of see where some of the extra money is going right now. So it's, you know, it's a little tougher than other years, but this community still helps everybody out. So you know, you said something to me though the other day though when it was raining, right? There's like two weeks ago and I walked in a day when I'm like, you know, I want to talk about like the ups and downs running a business. You're like you mean like the downs of buying winter jackets and you look outside and it's raining? It's like how you're going to sell anything that way? Clothing, I assume, has its real peculiarities, if you would, when it comes to consumer, you know, like weather would be for certain one, right?

but like some weird times, you know, over the course. So how many years have you owned it now? Probably 18, 19, when Cliffsons and some gone. I mean, a lot of it is, like last year, we really had no winter. So I said one thing about men's is, you know, if it's a wool jacket, I can bring that wool jacket out again next year. But we have people now, like, we usually have a boxing day sales. We have people phoning right now and saying what's going to be on sale and what, you know,

So people are, you know, they'll maybe buy a gift card or they'll just come in that day. That's when they do their shopping. So, you know, no different than us or anyone else. Everyone likes to have a sale. So it's just different buying habits and what they were. Well, it doesn't help that the price of groceries and everything else has gone through the roof. And spending bigger dollars on clothing is a less thing. You got to worry about putting food on the table for your family and all that, right?

So, but let's put a GST hold on liquor. Yeah. Like, not as if we don't have a problem already with substance abuses and all that. So we're putting a GST hold down on liquor. Like, maybe we should do a GST, no carbon tax or GST off something else. But that's the way I look at. And even for your business or, you know, the T-Barr, your input costs have gone up a lot too. Oh, big time.

carbon tax. So I mean, that's taking extra money. Like I laugh how some of these guys are going, man, I wish I'd sell my cattle because the cattle price is so good. But they also got to realize their input costs are way more now than when they, when they were a cheaper price for the cattle. So everyone's price has gone up with this carbon tax and everything else that, you know, their margin gets a little smaller too. Yeah. Well, I just looked at today. We're rebuilding a couple motors in the shop in a can of Cummins spray paint was $44 just for a can of spray paint. So I kind of whined and moaned a little bit. I got down to $41 even.

And we don't even charge a customer for that. It's just when we're done rebuilding the motor, we want to paint it. So it looks good. Right? $41 for a can of paint. I was like, what is wrong with this world? How many years, Raleigh, you've been now keep on trucking? 2007.

2007. When you first started, out on your own, keep on trucking is, is, you know, officially on its own. What are some of the misconceptions you had about running a business that you know, now you know? What is that for? Oh, that would be all. Get it all up and run. Yeah.

Yeah. Well, 18 coming on. Coming on 18. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just the fact that, okay, well, you know, you have to put your grid in for 10 years or whatever. or else and after that it should get established should be a lot easier. I think it's actually got harder because I times my staff by big time. I got 14 guys on the floor now compared to I think it was easier when there was one or two.

So yeah, okay, you're putting an aim open. Now it's too late to go back. You turn back you must keep striding forward bigger and bigger and bigger. But at the end of the day, it's just more zeros on the end. It's on the top end, not on the bottom end. you don't make any more money being bigger and bigger and bigger but

it is what it is and then plus right you get in you diversify right I started selling tires well through COVID or whatever right because the oil price was in negative and nobody was really supposed spending money so

no trucks returning down the road very much so you had to do something to keep your business operating that's so yeah that's the struggles I've had what's what's the hardest day or month or year i don't know the time frame i'll just spread it out so that you guys get a feel that you've had running a business where you're like why am i doing this i think you could say that sometimes just every day if you wanted you know

i think the covid years were hard and not only you know we we weren't changing commerce too much but it took to catch up again. Like you, we, you know, before it started, we had inventory that we didn't have all paid for, so all of a sudden you're back going now and now. You got new stuff coming in. Plus, you stole money in the old stuff, and it took a long time to climb back out of that.

Oh, for sure. And it's not like COVID is over, so everyone's in the store, everyone's trucking, or everyone's doing, they just, right now, let's go full bore again. Like, everyone was very cautious, you know, so it's taking a toll on, everyone.

I guess I think of... Pull that mic towards you, Daddy. When I... You can... First started... There you go. Yeah. Thinking about...

Well, I'd always drove a truck, but thinking about owning your own. I went to... At the time, I was driving for Wilms, and I went to the main guy in Eminton, and he said, you want to do that. And I...

He's sitting in this big, luxurious leather chair with... with the big desk, like table like this, you know, it looked great and I'm wondering, why would he say that? And he said, oh, it's just issues, people, repairs, everything. So then I came away and went, ugh. So then when I came back here, I talked to Freddie North. He's sitting in the big leather chair and the big wooden desk. And I asked Fred. And Fred said, you don't want to do that like he says you're going to work

every day all day and I said yeah but you've made it he said it takes a long time so I came away from that and went so then I talked to Ed Hardy

I go into his when he was high west I go in there he's sitting in a big leather chair a big wooden desk and I you know I picked his brain and I said how long do you think He said, well, 10 years.

Didn't even think about it. 10 years, he said. I said, 10 years. He said, you've got to build a customer base. They got to be reliant on you. They got to trust you. And he said, you can lose it all overnight. And I went, do we really want to do this?

And so we've been 23 years, and I know exactly what they're talking about. It's not that easy. And it's getting, like Riley says, it's getting worse. Well, it's manpower, too. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. It's work of it. And that goodness. Thank goodness we have. I think we're sitting here is because of our manpower. Yeah. Because our men and women behind us have been loyal. And like for me,

I'm fortunate that way. Yeah. That my people have been loyal and working together and staying with me. Yeah. Through the tough times as well, right? And yeah, every day is, isn't peachy. keen or whatever, but it is what it is, right?

Yep. You guys, I look up to you guys because I got two boys that work with me, eh? So we each take turns, phoning each other and just ripping a strip. And Sean knows what it, because he was there at one time, too, eh? And just, you need somebody to blast at me. And you guys don't really have anybody. Well, I got my daughter there, and it's a blessing that she's there. But I got a couple other gals, but I mean, I heard a young gal and a lovely little thing, but

the other day she brought a book to work. You know, I'm like, you're 18 years old, and then there's always something you can fold or dust, but she was sitting behind the counter reading a book, and I'm like, I can imagine when I started and if I took a book and did that when Cliff was there, you know? Yeah. He would have been bounced out about 10 minutes later, so.

Oh, yeah, I hear you on that, but at least she wasn't on her phone, though, and saying that, right? In his day and age, if she's reading a book, it's like, well, good for you, but you should be maybe dusting, you need your book on your coffee or something. Exactly, yeah.

But that's his struggles, his phones and all that nowadays. Social media, right? Yeah, we like social media for some parts, but... It can be a pain. Yeah. Takes a lot of people over. But good people.

Yep. We hired just about everybody near the start, and it caused ruination. Because it don't take many to cause problems, and you're going backwards. Yeah. And then you go home. Repair bills, repair bills, repair bills.

And you go home and kick the dog, well, the dog gets tired of that after a while. The repair bills are good for me, but not good for you. Well, I understand that part, yeah. I've seen your repair bills. I didn't realize you worked for Cliff. Yeah. Beforehand. Oh, yeah.

He's, to my kids, I'm like my kids are older now, but they're, he's like grampa to him. Yeah. You know, he's been there for just about their whole life, so. So were you a closed person? Nope. He phoned me one day and says, come see me, so I wasn't seeing him. And I told my wife, I'll get to do this job until I find something I want to do. And I haven't quite left yet.

So, but it's a, it's been a good, you know, you meet a lot of friends and a lot of, you know. But you got a good name and a good name goes along with. Yeah, you know, that's part of it. You know, we try to get back the community as much as we can. And like when you're talking about expenses, the famous line I always get, well, if you sponsor this, you can write it off. That's always the line we get. We try to explain, well, you got to have it first before you can write it off, you know? Like so.

Yeah. But yeah, it's. Well, that's a constant too. You're always getting asked sponsor, sponsor, right? And you try to say yes to everybody, but it's hard. It's easier when we're locally owned. That's the ones that come hit, right? You know.

It's the Walmart. are the other ones that they just say, well, send it to head office. Yeah. Because, I mean, I've been on the end of that a lot of time with DeHarton MacArthur and those kind of charities that we're doing. It's tough to get some of the big guys to get in.

I mean, Kent had found tires, another one that's, you know, his name was on just about everything, right? Well, exactly, yeah. Yeah, so. And that's the thing, too, is us living in Loyalminster. Loisminster is a pretty tight community or whatever else. So I think it's helped us out quite a bit just living where we are. Yeah, for sure.

I can safely say sitting in this chair, it's helped me out being in a tight community. People from afar that listen to this show and go, who the heck are all these people? Or, you know, how is it that Sean's doing something that others can't seem to do in different parts of the world? I just look at the Lloyd Minister of Community. And I mean, like, Cliff, or Cliff, Dave, you know, I walk into Dave and I'm going, I got a live show and goes, well, we'd like to put a shirt on you, you know? And I'm like, well, sure. That's the first time he's been well, Drash. Mom wouldn't like to hear that, because mom's taken him in the club.

She gets your clothes and all the rest of them from Dave. For sure, she does. From Dave. But what about you, Sean? What about when you started? Was there the odd day where you went, retarded? There's still days like that. But different, like, I don't know a clothing store.

I certainly know trucking. You know this, Dad. me and trucking just didn't get along. I didn't want to get my class one because as soon as you have it, I felt like you're going to have to use it. You're going to be out in the truck. And I've watched you all my life when I went, I want nothing to do with that life.

Not that it's not a bad life. It's not. I've met wonderful people who truck. Heck, you're a wonderful person. And then, Riley, I don't know about, I've worked in a mechanic shop. I'm not very good at it. So you can imagine that.

From the podcast standpoint, the thing that I always say is, in my brain when I went full time, I thought I'd have my foot up on the desk just a smidge more. You know, you talk about the nice chair and everything that had to have been done to get that nice chair and the desk and everything.

You get to look the part, but as soon as you walked out of the door, I bet you were up and they were moving again because as soon as you stopped moving in this chair, well, nobody else is pushing the SMP anywhere. It's only me. I mean, I got a ton of fantastic loyal listeners. You're all wonderful.

But like, if I don't go record something, you know, I want to take a week off at Christmas. In the oil field, I remember just putting in a time request and, you know, making sure a couple of things are squared away and I just left brain off. And somebody said to me, what happens if some big news breaks between Christmas and New Year's? I'm like, well, I'll be back in.

Like, I really got no choice. And so I guess the biggest shock for me sitting here is how hard you have to work. The days are not long enough anymore. And I never thought I'd say that. But I also jamming family life and everything that's really important to me. And you just try and stretch the days

just to be a smidge longer. Yeah. You know, but most days it doesn't take much to get me out of bed when, you know, in T-Barr days, you used to take cattle prod to get me out of bed for some of those days, right? And even then I get, you know,

you talk about a book coming day. Dad can tell you stories of me getting up, getting in the vehicle, or getting in the semi, right, and hooking up the trailer and crawling in the bunk and going, wake me up when we get to the job site, right? Like, that's, trucking's, one of the few instances where you got a caught at all times. And as a young guy and a hungover young guy,

I probably abused that power an awful lot or abused that situation an awful lot. We've all been there, though. Priorities change as you get older. You got kids. See you at church on Sundays a few times. So that's, you know, it's just our life changes, you know. Sometimes of those things that were so important when we were 20 or 30,

it just doesn't seem the same right now. Do you take time for yourself? I usually take one day, a week off, you know, but it's, you know, I still love going to work. Yeah. You know, we open at 9. I'm usually there by 7.30 in the morning doing something or just putzing around, but I like going, you know. Yeah, that's the same with me. I was there this morning, quarter after five, plowing snow or whatever else.

Yeah. I like being there. Yeah. Right, but. Over time now, eventually you just learn like, well, whatever, it is what it is. Now we're open 7 o'clock in the morning, 10 o'clock, we have 20 minute coffee break, 3 o'clock, we're done. Yep. Yeah, we'll stay a little bit later in weekends, I just said.

You know, everybody's making money, everybody's happy. Three o'clock's done. Guys could, and they love them, ours. Pick up your kids from school, take them to hockey practice, right, all that kind of stuff. Plus, winter's already depressing. You go to work in the dark. if you're an eight to five job or nine to five job. So then that's really depressing for anybody.

Dark, dark, right? At least this way at three o'clock, you got to go shovel the snow in the driveway or whatever you can. That's why I like working late. You don't have shoveling. What's it? If you got a new business owner listening to this, let's say first five years of, because I mean, I'm going to going on to year six. Although I don't know, I kind of stress it.

The podcast's been going six years. I guess this is year three of where I've actually been doing it full time. If you were due to, you know, you got a guy out there or gal who's in their first couple of years of running a business, what's some advice you would have for them out there that are, I don't know, like Christmas can be the best time or it can be if you're struggling, right? You don't have enough pennies in the pocket, so to speak. it could be a very difficult time.

And I've had different business owners talking about like making payroll and different things like that where they're like, you know, they're at their wits end because they've got to try and find a way and then people want time off and on and on and on. If you're, you know, if you were to give advice to a young business owner, what would you say? Don't overspend. Don't overspend it. Don't get yourself in a pile of debt and work hard and keep your nose on the grindstone and eventually they'll pay itself off, right?

I think the biggest thing if you're the owner, especially in our business, they want to see you. A lot of people, they know, they'll come in, they'll come back if I'm not there. So you've got to spend time in your shop. I mean, no different areas. Exactly. Like you said, you're there five this morning.

You got to put the time in. And lots of the stuff gets now, most of my customers even just text. Yeah. Hey, that's what's wrong with my truck. Yeah, it'd be nice to have to pick up the phone, but it's nice text, right? here it is you've got a written down no you know exactly there doesn't miss a step or

anything else right so that's kind of nice and handy the way the world's changed or whatever else when we started we went for a bank loan you know just as a overdraft probably and stuff like that we probably went to five different banks and four of them said well we need five years experience. And, you know, and we're going, we're just starting a bit. How do I get five years and you won't even touch me kind of thing? You know, you don't know me from anybody. But to have five years experience, you know, other than your personal account, you don't

really have it, eh? And it was the one bank that, well, we'll give you a try, eh? And it kind of grew from there. So you kind of, you're loyal to that part because the rest of them were kind of, well, you're not going to make it anyway, so we're not even going to try. Well, then with the experience or whatever else, is look, lots of your insurance companies,

if somebody you want to go get your class one, say for example, you need, you can't, lots of these companies, their insurance companies won't let you hire them because they need to have two years of experience. Yeah. So you go spend 10 grand to get your driver's license. Yeah, there's grants or whatever else out.

But then you can't buy it. job because you can't get they can't get yeah you need experience yeah yeah that makes a lot of sense yeah yeah yeah that the way it's going right now it's almost like a money grab hey oh for sure because uh does it help but perhaps but in the long run you still got a drive and the only way you can learn how to drive is get out there and drive and no matter who you somebody somebody's taught you yeah to do your job or whatever to drive a truck yeah to run a picker to pull a ranch to diagnose motor so sometimes a younger guy with a new class one or whatever else or apprentices you could kind of groom them the way you want and train them or whatever

else rather than having somebody that's got trained by somebody else and has different ways of doing things not saying they're bad ways all of them or whatever else but might not be the right And you're going to make mistakes. Did you ever make a mistake? Oh, yeah. Oh, one or two. Yeah. What's a good mistake? Exactly. Yeah. Like look at, you know, like us, we buy six months ahead of time. So last year, you know, we had winter, like I go in February to buy for next winter. So if you go through a winter like we had last, you know, and you already have stuff ordered and all of some of the stuff shows up at your door, like you're, you know, like for spring, we'll start getting stuff in a couple weeks. You know, so you just don't know. So my only advice, too, is, like, for us for suppliers, I don't lie to them. You know, I'll say, hey, I'm going to pay in a week. I'm going to pay in two weeks.

You've got to have a good relationship with your banker. Yeah. You know, and it'll all work out. But the stress you have the first couple days until you get over that poor me thing, and then you just got to figure, we've got to figure a way to make this work, right? Exactly. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Sure. They remind me when I played hockey afar. I get homesick one day at every three months, roughly.

It would just come on. And I remember calling Jay, oldest brother to the listener. And I was probably like 18, I think, at the time. I was just homesick, you know? And he eventually said, nothing's changed. We all wish we were playing hockey where you are. Oh, and I hung up the phone. But in business, I find those days are, man, those days suck.

Because you're just like, it's almost like being, I don't know, is it quicksand or it's like, man, you get down a pretty dark road real fast because you're like, why did I do that? I was stupid. I just wasted a bunch of money or a bunch of time or you drove, you know, in my case, you drive five hours and then something doesn't go the way you want it to go. You're like, now I've got to turn around and I got to mope all the way back. And I don't know. You guys probably have your own stories of the depressing days. I think the biggest thing is, well, it's a hockey analogy. Just stay level.

Don't get too high. Don't get too low. Every time we went high and we were clapping ourselves on the back and going, we are fantastic. The next day we blow motor and there's 50,000 gone and you go, we're idiots. We just got to keep a level keel and just keep pushing. The other thing is good people.

Oh, for sure. When we had probably three or four trucks, I wouldn't let anybody go out because I was scared. They wouldn't do as good a job. you know because you felt that you took more care and all that kind of stuff and you're wearing yourself out

and now they don't let me go out unless they have to because you know the guys do a better job and I do so but yeah good people makes a world difference I even find it ours like I've been volunteering all my life

but I find when I got about 10 years ago things got pretty slow so I started with the olive tree and you go there and serve for a night You know, and you think you walk in there, they're going, man, my life is bad today, you know, we're slow in the store. But you get there and see that these people, you know,

you walk out and you're going, you know, my life's not that bad. You feed these guys a meal, and it's like you give them $1,000 there. So appreciative of what you do. Yeah. You know, so no matter how bad we think our life is, there's people that would change our lives in a heartbeat, take what we're doing, you know. Everyone's got struggles.

You know, it doesn't matter who you are. Oh, for sure, yeah. What walk of life you are. someone behind that closed door there's a struggle somewhere. Yeah. You're right. Exactly.

Well, and that's what I've always said or whatever else. Like, with having quite a few more employees, right? You got, well, not getting along with the old lady or this or that or somebody's dog died or cat died. Well, yes, but just keep your nose to the grindstone. Don't let, don't fall in the dark hole. Exactly.

alcohol or drugs or whatever else, right? Just whatever. I'm not saying whatever you want to do, do, but just keep it narrow and just, hey, man, there's always worse people. And you don't think I'm stressed out too and all that, right? Well, you become a counselor or babysitter, really. Counselor, babysitter, banker, there's all.

Exactly. Well, you know, from an employee standpoint, I remember thinking I see the group of men I work with, more than I see my family, right? You're sleeping for, I don't know, some people five hours, upwards of, let's say nine hours. You get up, you make breakfast, you get the kids out the door, and then you're off to work.

And then for the next eight hours, all you're around is people you work with, then you come home, you have a couple hours, and then you go back to bed and on and on. I actually never really, you know, sitting where I sit, you know, you're in the realm now, a 12 by 12 square box with no windows, you know. This is home.

In your guys' world, you would actually be an interesting thought process on the other side because you would see all these guys come in and you could probably tell when they're having an off day like immediately or when you're starting to see a trend of maybe bad choices right like i just think a shan's come in hung over 10 days in a row maybe there's something up i assume you have some insight into that oh for sure you could you could feel the energy right it's you could look at somebody and weeks you spend so much with them hey what's going on do you need do you want to talk or whatever else like yeah you're a counselor for sure yeah which whatever i i have no problem with that i i actually enjoy that stuff is if you got a problem any one of you three other people have a problem hey man i'm here to

right because everybody needs somebody to talk yeah whether whoever they need definitely need someone and obviously your your work's good that they can count on you and they're not keeping it inside right yeah i mean that's when we get our mental issue our health problems you know and not to say they're always going to talk but 50 50 right or maybe even more i'm not sure exactly on the numbers but like i said everybody needs somebody to talk to and sometimes it helps you too oh for sure yeah because who do you talk to when things are going south probably probably the main one would be core on my bookkeeper because she's worked for me ever since I started right yeah yeah yeah what about you do yeah I'll go home either wife or you know I got a couple older like to call my old

girls but the older ones that you can talk to because we're on the same they understand level right we're at the same you know we have the same kind of interest and but like when you say your employees minds kind of go sometimes into customers because we have a lot to come in for funerals and they're raw like they're just happened like a couple days ago and they're you know like I had one the other day where lady come in her two sons and they had to be in their 20s and the one they live in Emington she come the kid come home and his wife was our girlfriend was passed away in the house like for no reason they don't know what it was if it's but you know so we got to deal with and when I started 30 you'd be almost panicky to talk to these

but most of them want to talk. They, you know, they got a story. They want to, you know, explain to you or not explain, but tell you how this person fit into their life. And, you know, so it's the younger ones like that are tougher, you know. Yeah. Well, and then also, too, is I talk to go home and talk to my girlfriend or I'll even pick up the phone, hey, Lana, this is what's going on or whatever else.

And it's a saving grace, that's for sure, right? Because everybody needs somebody to talk to. after your employees pour their hearts out to you. Sometimes you don't want to give them your troubles, right? So then you go and talk to somebody else. Well, isn't it in saving private Ryan? Tom Hanks is, they're complaining to him, and they ask him why he never complains because he goes,

you complaints go upwards, not downwards. I'm paraphrasing, but that's saving Private Ryan when they're out in the middle, going off to save Private Ryan as it is. And they're asking why he doesn't never complain, right? Yeah. And you guys are all in the same, a similar position, right? Where nobody wants to show up to work and have the boss complained to them. Yeah, that's the last thing you need. That's a tough work environment. But we also grew up in that age where it's suck it up, you know? Oh, yeah. Throw your broken leg in a pale. Let's go.

Like we talk about mental health. I don't know how much there was when we were younger, but you never, you know, no one really mentioned it, right? It was, you hit it away, you know. So I think that's, it's, it's, it's, the, It's a good part is get people out and talk. Yep. Before, you know, something bad happens to someone, you know. Well, on Sunday we were coming home. We're in South, too, in a rush game. We're coming home on Sunday. And we stopped my hometown, Blaine Lake.

And stuff is my grandma. My aunt and uncle were there. And she's in her 90s. I want to say 94, 95. Widow live by yourself. So a conversation and come up. Well, why don't you go to a home? I don't want to go to a home.

I've been doing this forever. And she's in great shape, like great shape and good. Who does she have to talk to? Yeah, her family will pick her up and take her to the casino, and she likes going to casinos, and PA or Dakota Dunes. And one time I actually saw her in Lloyd, I'll come around the corner of me be there, hey, what do you do it here? You didn't even call me.

And she's like, I don't want to go home. Why? Well, then you'd have people to go play cards with and stuff like that. oh, I'm good. I like doing my own thing. Leave her be. Yeah. Leave her be.

She's in good shape. She can do that at 94 years old. Yeah. Yeah, we'll probably be in a chair. Yeah. Riley, 17 years ago, did you want to be a business, like at what point did you realize you wanted to be a business owner? Dad kind of shared his journey into business owning.

Dave had Cliff, who basically, I said come work here and eventually you took it over from Cliff. Did you always want to be a business owner? Well, I was running a service truck for Cook's Mobile Leonard Cook at the time and it's like, yeah,

I was kind of just doing my own thing in the service truck and working Monday to Monday I worked all the time but in big hours and all that and And I had the opportunity from a buddy that says, hey, why don't you just go on your own and do this? And so that's a great idea. So it's people that you look up to that you say, hey, like, I think I could do this.

I could match this. And anybody that ever goes and goes on business on their own or whatever else and tries it, kudos to them. Right? because if you got the drive and you want to do it, go right ahead of it. You never know until you try it. Exactly. He used to ride to hockey with Dwayne Bexon. Bexon construction.

So I gripe all the way down to Lone Rock, eh? And he had, he'd worked. I forget where he worked at. But he started Bexon because the guy said, you know, you're always griping all the time. Why don't you just do it yourself, eh? And so that's what you're always griping. what Dwayne fed me on the way down there.

Thanks a lot. And so, so, and, but the other thing is kids, my kids, two of them that have worked with me are pushers. I'm not a pusher. Four trucks was enough for me.

And between Jay and Harley, well, we need this, we need this, we need this, we need this, we need this, we need this. And every time they add something, then you got to learn it, right? Because they don't drive. So then you got to go out there

and you don't know what you're doing, but you're learning it so that you can teach the other guys how to, and so that's the, I probably would have been a two-truck company if it wasn't for kids, but. It was funny, one of the greatest things dads taught, I think, I don't know, I think all of his boys, and his daughter for that matter,

I could be wrong on this, but like some of my earliest memories is like, getting in the situation, this is not ideal, and it's like, well, we've got to figure how to get out of this, right? One was getting the truck stuck in the middle and nowhere in the pasture. It's like, well, you're, I don't know how many miles from home, four or five miles. It's like, well, we could walk that way.

That'd be a waste of time. And his brain would start going. And all of a sudden, well, there's a tractor somewhere over there. I'm like, great, my brain, what are you? Well, great, dad. What are we going to do with a tractor? Push it up against it. Well, no, we'll create a rope.

Oh, we're going to create a rope, are we? How are we going to do that? And anyways, I say this story because dad's the ultimate. at McGiver. So that time, we took a bunch of old wire, braided it, so that we could pull the truck out. It was like, it was like, huh, that was brilliant, you know? And those little skills, I actually wonder how many young men you've ran into over your

time having different swamperes all the time, or even guys on the job site where they've watching me like, oh, smart, right? Because, like, play new-in-hour hockey with a bunch of business owners. and the skill level varies, but over time, the weaker levels guys start to do things the top level guys do. Because they're watching it every day. Every day they're going, huh, that was smart. And in business, it's kind of the same thing. It's kind of the whole purpose of hopefully doing these things so that people can hear others go,

oh, that's actually, hmm, hadn't thought of it that way. And dad's the ultimate McGuiver, right? We get stuck in the middle of BC as a kid. This is probably why to this day I'm terrified of the mountains. It probably wasn't as bad as what I remember. We get up to the top of a mountain in my brain, and we have a trailer but no brakes. You remember this? And you're like, oh, Sean, it's not so bad.

We're probably going to get me a ticket here. We've got to figure a couple things out. Safe to you guys coming to see you. We've got to figure a few things out and we go down the hill. And I remember just like holding on to the holy shit handle for the first time ever my life where I'm like, I actually understand what this means because we're going straight down the mountain, which we probably weren't folks, but that as a kid,

that's what it felt like. And at all times, you probably had it all in control, I think. I was hanging on to the other one. You had to figure a way to get the air brakes on or off or whatever, right?

And you didn't have all the tools. And I just remember watching you, and instead of getting paralyzed by fear, you just started picking away at it and pretty soon we had a thing and off we went again. I've taken that with my kids to this day, you know?

And I wonder, you know, when you sit around, with different business guys, you all have probably that skill because whether you realize it or not, when you started in business, the first day you probably got asked a question or got given a job and you're like, I have no idea. But what am I going to do? Sit here and wallowing it or I'm going to figure it out so that in a couple days I know the answer and then I know the next answer. And then you become an absolute wealth of information. Well, yeah, for sure, just like anything. And we've taken on lots of jobs like, yeah, no, I've never done that before.

But hey, why not? Work is work, money's money, right? Yeah, you might, it might take you 40 hours to do the job where it's like, I can't charge 40 hours to that job. Anybody else would have been 20, so you charge 20? Yeah, it costs you some money, but you're still making your payments, keeping the guys busy, and they're happy too because it's new stuff. Every day is new.

And that's the difference with me. I'm not, and compared to some other people or whatever else, is every day is different. My guys come in, you don't know if we work on a quad, snowville, skidsteer, loader, picker, you don't know. Every day is different. And I'm sure your job, everybody wants it yesterday. Yeah, for the most part, yeah.

They don't want to wait. They want it now, so. But you probably grew up the same way that if the, you give, what's the old saying, you give the hard job to the lazy guy and he'll figure out an easy way to do it. My dad... Yeah. That's pretty much... Yeah.

My dad was the guy that... He worked a co-op and he stole carpets all day. There was four brothers that we all played hockey, so he would moonlight each sport every night, come home for supper and say, you know, who needs a new stick or who needs this? I got a job tonight. And that's the work ethic we found.

Because if you wanted something, you went and worked for it. Yeah. You know? So you'd be some guy's basement somewhere doing something and grumbling the whole time. carrying up the old carpet and the old, you know. Well, that's what.

That's the way I look at, too, is anybody that ever comes to me and says, hey, like I'm broke, I can't help you. Like, how can I help you? Man, just say, hey, like I'm broke, I'll work extra hours or whatever else, right? Oh, gladly, I don't really care about it over time. I've never charged any of my customers over time. And just do it. Let's get it done.

Yeah. now if the states passes this or whatever else that it's a boat that Trump's try to do no taxing on the overtime my guys were talking about the other day the shop one guy said I'll work all the time if there's not taxed hard so hardcore on overtime hours so like in this day and age and the way the where we live the community that we live is you shouldn't be broke, right? There's jobs out there all the time. If you need to go get a second job,

I had some other guys that, well, they'll work for me, and then they'll go and pump gas at Co-op. Yeah. Couple Filipino guys, I'm not sure if they still do it, but yeah, they did it for quite some time. Well, actually, the show-out to Jennifer from the casino. I've done now, like, I don't know,

seven or eight events at the casino, and she's actually got promoted, so she doesn't have to work, I think at one point she was working two or three jobs. is the lady who is there the manager of the event center at the casino you can believe this was from newfoundland and typical new fee comes in work that job and then on her days off is working another job and sometimes working nights at another job and i'm like holy crap like we're you know like that's pretty impressive she's like well i i i i you know it's expensive to deliver i don't get paid you know

oil filled money i got to make sure this and this and this and she goes i'm i don't want to go back to new fly. Like there's nothing, not nothing there. I don't mean to the new fees out there that are listening. I don't mean that there's nothing there. Just the work is different, right? And certainly the opportunities are different. And now she's like been promoted multiple times. I'm pretty sure. I'm actually kind of sad to not have her running the events because she did such a good job. The first time, this is why I loved working with her. And once again, I come back to business people are the best ones, are problem solvers. I walked in, the casino holds that event center when I was started,

hold it, 230 people. That's all they said they could get in there. And I'm like, I can't find a way to get a few more people. And they're like,

well, you could rent it up top. And I'm like, okay, so then, you know, we got it up to 270. This is back in March of 2020. Mandates have just ended.

All the regulations have just ended. Anyways, I show up for the day of the event. I'm very excited, nervous in my own right. And I get talking to her. Here, the,

the casino wanted her to pull back on the number of the day before because they didn't have enough staff. And she looked. at them was like, I can't tell Sean we're not doing this. So she started pulling blackjack dealers and stuff to come work the event so that they had enough servers and waiters and on and on. I'm like, I can work with you any day of the week because you look at a problem and don't go, nope, nothing, throw your hands up and there can't be anything done to it. Because there's

always something that can be, you know, learned or twisted, changed, moved around, different lens looked at for any problem that businesses, for the most part face, I think. Yeah, for sure. There's always, like I said, like I said before, you get past the poor me stuff and now, now we've got to figure out how we're going to fix this. You know, there's always a solution that somewhere down the line, we're going to make it work. Well, and then one ad on or whatever else about the people when they say they're broke or whatever else, like, well, okay, is your mortgage paid for, is your vehicle paid for? Can you forthput gas in it? And you're taking your kids to hockey and doing this stuff or whatever else? Yeah, you might be a little bit money.

not broke, just tight or whatever else. But really, you're not broke because you're paying all that stuff and your family rich or whatever else, right? Because everybody needs a life outside of work. Otherwise, we'd all go crazy. Everybody would go nuts, right? So whether it's taking their kids to hockey or visiting or playing cards or whatever, right?

Dan, would you, I mean, in the middle of COVID, T-Barr burns down. You know, I've told this story off and on a bit of, you know, because I think of the Chinese farmer proverb or Chinese farmer parable maybe is what it is. Anyways, it doesn't matter. Just that,

you know, like you think you're in a dire situation and I think of T-Barr and burning down in the middle of COVID and on and on and on. And the Chinese farmer would say maybe, right? And certainly I can,

well, I'll share it. So there's a Chinese farmer. His horse has run away. And all the townspeople come and they say, oh, isn't that terrible? And he says, maybe. And then the next day his horses come back and they bring a bunch of wild ones with them. And all the townspeople come in, isn't that great fortune?

You're so lucky. And he says, maybe. And then his son goes to break the wild horses, gets bucked off, breaks his leg and they all come back. And he says, isn't that terrible? He says, maybe. And the next day, the Chinese army shows up to take any able-bodied man off to war. And his son's got a broken leg and can't go. And all the townspeople come back and go, isn't that amazing?

And he goes, maybe. And, you know, like, T-Barr in the middle of COVID, you know, in the dead of winter, as I recall. Yeah, I was playing hockey in Helmont when I got the call. And you go, what? So you race in there. Yeah, it's burning. And so you take a long walk in the snow, eh? I feel like Trudeau.

I was just, okay, what do we do? You know, because it, first CNR. Alv is very good to us. Also we had three lazy truck drivers because we told everybody to park inside because it was getting cold and the three of them got home late didn't feel like parking their trucks parked them outside those three made it. The rest of them could put but the one thing that it was bad for The oil patch was in a bad way. And so we ended up, insurance never comes fast, but we ended up getting a whole bunch of very cheap trucks because everybody was selling everything.

And so we lucked out that way that we got units for, you know, just pennies on the dime kind of thing like. and it got us through. But at the time, you're looking for a dog to kick or you're looking, you know, I always say, well, I went to the bridge to drop off, you know, to jump off, but there was a lineup and I'm going home. But, well, I mean, if there was not, you know,

if there was ever a time to give up, I mean, that would probably was it. I mean, I would have said I'm done, you know, like we're good now, you know. And the reason, The reason, you know, that I bring you guys in is I've ran into a couple of those guys that are like, I'm done. I just can't. And it doesn't mean that you have to fight through it.

I just, Dad's story of the, you know, well, T-Barr's story, I shouldn't just say Dad's, T-Barr's story of perseverance and coming out the other side. I think there's a lot of businesses like that that have that story to share. And for others to hear it is really important. I think it's coming from the farm, too. I don't think you want to give up because you also have, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're. You got everyone else's family that works for you. It's not just you walking away and I'm done. You know, like you, you're affecting every person that works for you.

You said you got 24 guys, whatever is T-bar. I mean, those families, when you say I'm done, they're relying on you. They're relying on you. Exactly, yeah. One final one for you guys. Shorter as long as you want to go. Don't act like I'm pushing you out. Community.

How important is community? You know, I tell us, you know, I was just in Calgary and I come back and one of the things, I don't know, I sing the tales of, they joke that we're two hours east of the edge of the world. I've kind of taken it as a badge of honor, you know, and certainly the stuff going on with Chris King and seeing how the community is rallied around that. But, you know, I'm very proud of where I come from, even though it is a cold, desolate place that Mel was saying to me last night, you know, she's huddled on the country. the couch and a blanket she's like why did you drag you know she's from Minnesota yeah why did you drag me here and I'm like ah ha and you love it she's like uh and I'm like but I truly do love this area and it's business owner it's it's I don't know I'm just curious the community how important has it been to you well for us it's it's everything I mean if it's not community come to support us we don't

have doors open and it's not just Lloydminster but it's provost it's Coal Lake it's made stone it's everywhere they come to Loyal I mean, look at Onion Lake, you know, probably 80% of what they, you know, their wage or their money comes and spent in Lloyd. Like it's, you know, so we try to get back to the community, same as you guys, you know, volunteer wherever we can, help out financially whenever we can. And, you know, it's, but you like you said, you see someone in little like Chris King, the whole community is rally behind him, you know. There's different things that happen. When my daughter passed away, this community was unreal, you know. So it's special here.

Oh, yeah. Well, tonight I'm going to rolling greens for a silent auction fundraiser. I think we're watching the Oilers game there tonight and drinks and stuff for buddy that got hit on a head-on collision or whatever else. He spent 16 hours in a deuce coma surgery, Lance Hush. Hush. Like he's in rough shape. I just learned about it today. I was like, well, obviously I'm going.

So a friend come over and grabbed a bunch of hoodies and stuff like that to give away. And I'll be there. I already phone girlfriend, Lina. I said, we're going. And just like that kind of stuff with the community, it seems like a lot of people help everybody out. No matter what, yes, okay. Other mechanic shops or whatever else, like in my business, you always have competition, right?

You have competition with these big box store companies, bootleg or whatever else, right? You have competition. We all have lots of competition. But we don't, nobody really generally, in my thought, has a hate on for the other person or whatever else. Well, I think that's a very young business way to look at it, like you're against the world. But as you get more established, I think you start to look as everybody like complimentary, don't you? Well, let's try work together. Yeah.

Yeah. Right? And I think that's what's getting are. Like our store, if we don't have it, I tell them, go see Jason and hot peppers. Yeah. I mean, if we don't, they're looking for our kids, first time we do is send them to Jason. I mean, that's part of our world. We keep the business here and, you know, but like you say, the young man there or Lannon there, or the hush.

I mean, that's a guy just driving and all of a sudden, you know, car comes, I think it caught some ice, kind of twisted that guy's car around the old fella and, you know, like, it's a tremendous. I mean for him it's not just the physical but it's the mental part of getting over to you know and such a nice guy too like it's yeah I was oh yeah it's here rolling down my eye yeah but then you look at the the elderly guy I mean 92 I think he's been married like 70 years I mean his wife still lives at home like I mean look at the traumatic effect on her too you know he passed away yeah then because I'll hear about tonight I didn't really know I don't yeah yeah I don't yeah I don't yeah I don't yeah I don't yeah I don't yeah I don't yeah I mean I So, yeah. Community is a comfort. Like you two guys, anytime I see you, it's a comfort, eh? Yeah. And if you're having a bad day, both of you pick you, you know, pick you up.

Community, like Hillmont community, first thing I think of is Thompson's. I talk to Kirk, not every day, but he'll say, hey, how's it going? Oh, just getting home. You need your lane plowed out. Yeah. What? And he'll show up and it's just community, eh? Like everybody's looking out for everybody else.

Well, it's even this weekend at Hillmont, they're playing the bandits for that. Yeah, charity game. I mean, and it's going to help people that need help in their community. I mean, like, who does that? You know, like it's just, but I understand the tie-in because a lot of those players

finish their career, a junior career playing with the bandits and now they're playing in Hillmond. Well, look at what a good. great event. Look at one of the biggest ones, Lori Craven ball tournaments. I mean,

it's not just the ball tournament anymore. I've been playing that forever. That's a huge, that's massive. Yeah. Massive that Lori Craven ball tournament. For where it started to what, you know, it's not just the ball term anymore. There's other events that they do that,

you know, that all make their donations to the Lori Craven. So they've touched a lot of people's that group too. Yeah. You know, so. Any final thoughts, fellas? Merry Christmas, everyone.

Yes, Mary Christmas, yeah. Dave, you got a, we should point out, you got a big old sale coming on it because I'm like, you know, a little Black Friday sale. I don't know if T-Barr or Keep on Truck and has a Black Friday sale, I could be wrong. Certainly the shot. Ours will be boxing day. Or Boxing Day, sorry, Black Day. Yeah, it'll be, we open at 8, we do a one-day sale, and it's a tradition for a lot of families come in.

I got one family that are knocking on a door at 7.30 waiting to come in, And then they've been to this community a long time. You know, it's their, it's part of their Christmas tradition. Yeah, that's what it is now, right? So, yeah, so yeah, we'll be there eight to four on Boxing Day. But it's, yeah, it's always something going on. Riley, what do you look forward to the holidays the most? Do you guys take some time off?

Yeah, we're taking some time off, yep. I'm hoping to go do some ice fishing. I heard it's supposed to be minus two. I don't know if that's true or not, but I'm like minus two sounds off. Yeah. And there's 12 inches ice on the lake. I'm not quite sure yet. It's still building with this cold weather.

Might have to just screw on, but lots of years you don't go. There's any ice before Christmas or Christmas time. So time off just kind of a recharge. Yeah, recharge. Exactly. 100%. Yeah. Daniel.

We'll slowly slow down here, which is good. Like you say, just recharge everybody. and and I was going to say to both of you like you're doing good jobs guys thank you you got both you got good businesses and a good name and well you as well you as well too right yeah but a good name is worth a lot worth more than what people realize yep exactly probably what I'm looking for most actually is for everybody to have recharge I had some guys like my calendar is quite full right and uh core of my bookkeeper, she's like, you know, there's not going to be too many people here, uh,

between Christmas, New Year's, because we're open that couple days there or whatever, right? And, uh, I was like, so what, so what? So what? Who cares? Everybody just recharge, right? If we're running out of a skeleton crew, that's fine. The boys need to recharge. Everybody needs to recharge. Just go. And everyone comes back with a better, better. Yeah. Yeah. You know, you get, like, you guys are retail really, too. at the end of the day, but yeah, you get, you know,

because our customers are getting a little anxious two nugs. There's three or four days left, so they're all, so everyone needs that. Just sit back, enjoy your family and, you know. Even this podcaster needs a return. There you go, yes, yes. Jens, thanks for hopping in and give me some time, I'm sure, in a busy stretch before the Christmas break.

Merry Christmas, everyone, happy holidays. Thanks again, guys, for hopping in. Thanks for having us, yes.