Shaun Newman Podcast - #805 - Ontario Election Livestream

Episode Date: March 3, 2025

222 Minutes and I hosted a livestream for the Ontario Election which aired on Thursday February 27th. This is the full recording where we are joined by a whole host of guests from Ontario. Cornerstone Forum ‘25https://www.showpass.com/cornerstone25/Get your voice heard: Text Shaun 587-217-8500Substack:https://open.substack.com/pub/shaunnewmanpodcastSilver Gold Bull Links:Website: https://silvergoldbull.ca/Email: [e-mail] Grahame: [phone]Bow Valley Credit UnionWebsite: www.BowValleycu.comEmail: [e-mail] Use the code “SNP” on all ordersProphet River Links:Website: store.prophetriver.com/Email: [e-mail]

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Whether we're talking mantles, decks, windows, doors, sheds, podcast studio tables. Stop into Windsor Plywood here in Lloyd Minster and tell them that Sean Newman sent you. All right, we are closing in on Cornerstone Forum, folks. It's in Calgary this year, May 10th. You know all the details. If you want more down on the show notes, click on the link. It'll give you all the details on the hotel and the trade show and all. the speakers from Martin Armstrong, Tom Longo, Alex Craneer, to Chuck Prondick and Vince

Lanchi and Cahlin Ford and Chase Barber, Matt Air, Ben Perrin, Rodgat, and you get the point. Chris Sims, Tom, Bob Brodravix, there is a whole lot going on, and we want you there. That's May 10th. If you're listening or watching on Spotify, Apple, YouTube, Rumble, make sure to subscribe and leave a review X, give it a retweet. And finally, today's episode is a replay of our live on. Ontario election coverage. I know I'd talk to people while back when we did it in Saskatchewan, etc., etc.

I would have hoped to have released it, you know, a little sooner. But this conversation on the Ontario election is so little on the Ontario election and so much more on the federal and a whole bunch of other things. So, you know, I actually don't, it doesn't bother me that it's a few days after. There's different parts of this conversation that has nothing to do with the Ontario election whatsoever. And that's what made this one stand out compared to other election coverage that we've done. It's a lot of fun. It is a tall task.

It's close to five hours, but got lots of great feedback when we did it. So here is the entirety of it for you. So let's, well, let's get on with it. Here is the Ontario live election coverage from this past Thursday. Oh, we're back. Oh, we're back. Hey, John, how are you doing? Who's supposed to be sitting right here, folks?

You know, writing a John Deer letter this morning. He's like, I'm not coming. No? Life gets in the way. Mash up election coverage, Ontario. I was just saying to twos, you know, never let my inner B back us out of an election coverage. We missed Halifax, Nova Scotia. You're in what?

You heard me. Nova Scotia. What's the B stand for? I don't know. Do you mean like a queen bee? Yeah, that's right. that's how we're going to start this anyways

we didn't do Nova Scotia we missed one and it was because we couldn't find anyone we just like anyways it doesn't matter long story short this has been a bit of a scramble but we're here and I tell you what we got a pretty solid lineup coming on tonight I think I think it's going to be a lot of fun so if you're watching

and you're like Ontario election who cares I'm going to be honest one of the things that shocked me none of us nobody shocked me they got the largest population in all of Canada And you, like, reach out to talk to people. I don't really, I don't really got much to say. You don't got much to say. You're from Ontario.

You're having an election. What is it? What? Not much to say. Ontario, a couple of Alberta, yeah, who's are coming for you. And we're going to,

I don't know, we're going to have a little bit of fun tonight. A little news coverage that doesn't suck. So here we are. Two's how are you doing today? I'm doing good, Sean. How about you? Yeah.

Well, I mean, we found a way. and you know what is this this has got a we did BC Alberta Saskatchewan so is this our fourth US

US US this is our fifth crack at it so you know as you're watching along okay well a couple things two probably has some fancy slogan here but we want you to share if you're on X we want you to retweet I didn't think of doing that we got a ton of guests

coming on tonight and if you're enjoying the program if you're like oh hey my Ontario friends might enjoy this. I mean, at some point, we're open here, we'll pull up the old map. We got map extraordinaire. We have the map. Right. Those of you who don't know, we talk about this every time, because we do

it every time. It's true. We are the only people other than CBC, CTV and Global in Canada to ever have the live map. So if you want to go, if you want to get a live map, you have literally four options. CBC, CTV, Global.

in us. Yes. So, you know, obviously there's nothing to point at right now. And honestly, I was saying it too as I'm like, you know, when we did BC, if you go back to that, I'm like, everyone's like, hey, can you find this little riding? And I'm, you know, I'm going to pull up the map so you can see. And I'm like, trying to see. You can, as we scroll across, they all come up and you're, you're like, can you get in? And it's like, I don't, I don't even freaking know where I'm going.

Sorry, Ontario. Tonight is going to be a crapshoot from Sean's perspective. we're going to have a lot of fun. And yeah, here's Joe Mama. This is what we were here for tonight. Hey, boys, let's have some fun. Exactly. We're going to have some fun tonight.

And Solis Knox. I don't know. Did you get the hat yet? You got the tracking info. I don't know if you got the hat yet or not. But looking forward to finding out that you received the hat. Yeah. Those of you don't know what he's talking about, we did a giveaway a couple weeks ago.

We gave way two of these. And they're a goddamn beautiful hat. Um, tonight we get, we got an interesting cast joining us tonight. We got Franco Tarzano from the CTF, Candice Malcolm from True North and now Juno News. I was like, is it one or the other? Is it both? Doesn't matter. Regina with Teal's coming. It probably is, isn't it? Regina with Teals coming on, author of Fisman's fraud. You'll recall her from the podcast. Greg Wycliffe, he's co-host to mash up here once upon a time when Tews was gone, Harrison Faulkner, Alexander Kitty, Tracy Wilson, Darshan, Maharasia, Lisa Myron, April Hodgson, Simon Esler, and we'll see if we can't

squeak a few more on as we get later into the night. We'll see how late we go to everyone. I don't know. We'll see how this goes. Should we call it already? Yeah, well, probably. Yeah, so I guess we'll call it first. Yeah, it's obviously the independence are going to win. And I'm never wrong. Campfire girl. says, what do you guys think the percentage of voter will turn out? Oh, my goodness. Can I read this today? What do you guys think the percentage of voter will turn out to vote today?

I'm guessing less than 45%. I would say less than 45%. The last election in Ontario was 43%. And I feel as though people are giving far fewer fucks about this one than any previous election. this is the epitome of the giant douche and the turd sandwich from South Park. I don't think there's an option that anybody likes. But I can be wrong. I'm probably going to ask every guest we have on tonight this.

When it was Saskatchewan election, both of our hometown provinces at one point in time, we had this lineup on. It was amazing. And I felt like everybody was really invested in how the election was going to turn off. When we did Alberta, everybody was really invested. Now, in fairness, the show is based out of Alberta. So we, you know, when we did BC, we thought the same thing, US, same thing. I flipped to you, the Ontario election.

And every person I text, every single one's like, I don't really have much to say. I'm like, what? So we found some guests that are going to say some things. But I've been texting on people from Ontario all day long. I'm like, how is it that it's going to be less than 45%? Is it? What's going on in Ontario? two's.

Well, I think it's just a lot of voter apathy due to a lack of great options. If only there was somebody who lives there that would maybe be able to shed some light on it that we could talk to. Why don't we bring in, well, here, I'm going to get them in here, but it's the federal director of the Canadian Taxpayers Federation Franco Tarasano. How you doing, big fellow? Hey, guys, I'm doing great. Yeah, great to be on with you tonight.

Well, here's the thing for people who don't know. I was going to pull out all the episodes. You've been on the podcast. And then I'm like, well, that's too many. That's the long. But you're a regular on the mashup. You know, like the CTF in general is. We got a lot of time for the work you do, Franco.

And when we come to election coverage, we always look to the CTF to come on and break down some interesting things from an election perspective. But my first question, before we get to any money, am I wrong in thinking that Ontario do you have two craps about the provincial election or is that just my own weird conversations I'm having? Well, I mean, yes. I mean, you started off the top saying you're in Alberta and it is a little bit different there. You know, I live in Ottawa now.

So maybe my perception is a little bit skewed. But I also lived in Calgary for a very long time. And I do remember that at least while I was in Calgary versus now being in Ontario, there was much more focused day to day on what the provincial government was doing compared to federal. rule. I mean, here in Ottawa, I mean, we're in the nation's capital. Parliament is literally a couple blocks down from the office that I'm filming out of. But I mean, all the attention really is on what's going on in Ottawa, the liberal leadership race. And, you know, what Trump might be talking about with respect to like the looming tariff threat over our head in a potential trade war. Right.

So I mean, here in Ontario, I do think you're right to an extent, right? Like, but think about everything that's going on. There's going to be a new prime minister in a couple of weeks. So that's taking up a huge amount of oxygen. Also, the polls from day one in the provincial election showed a landslide victory for Doug Ford and the progressive conservatives here in Ontario. So that could also be leading to a little bit of voter turnout. But then also, too, like remember what's sucking up all the oxygen right now. And that's what's going on with the United States and this potential trade war.

One question before Tews gets into probably tax and money and all the things. Are you saying in Ontario is, and we wouldn't have this problem in Alberta, because we get treated like the ugly stepchild on the federal kind of landscape. Yeah, like an ATM machine. Are you saying? Yeah, but like one that isn't a booth that homeless people defecate in. Are you saying that provincial politics isn't the biggest show in the ring for that area? And what I mean by that is, you know, you go to, you go, forgive me, folks, always come back to hockey, but, you know, you go to a town that's got the NHL and the HL.

You never want to have that in the same town because you got the NHL. Why the heck would you have the HL? Nobody's going to go watch the HL because they can go watch the NHL. And what you're saying is, in Ontario specifically, having the nation's capital and all the federal stuff going on there, the provincial election kind of gets overshadowed at all times. I don't know about all times. And remember, like, I'm kind of biased to just given the fact that I'm in

Ontario and my job is to cover the federal government, not the provincial government. But like in Alberta, right, there was a lot more focus at least when I was in Calgary on what was going on in Alberta. And really the only time the federal government came into play was when they were like stepping on Alberta's throats. Right. Like that that was the whole thing. Like when the federal policy really comes into play in Alberta was more like, oh, here, the Trudeau government rejected the Northern Gateway pipeline or oh, look, another carbon. tax coming from Ottawa, like step off. You know what I mean? Now, I mean, look, provincial services directly impact people's lives, right? Healthcare education, stuff like that. But, you know,

especially just being so close to where Parliament Hill is, a huge amount of oxygen, especially right now, especially with like, who's going to be the new prime minister. That's just sucking so much oxygen right out of the air or out of the room, I should say. Okay. Now, that's enough on Sean's thoughts. Two's fire away. I've had this thought a few times. The first time it ever occurred to me was in 2015 in Alberta, was that elections aren't cheap to run.

You know, when you look at, so I ask Grock and the 2022 Ontario election cost $145 million. And the conservatives called it a year early. So essentially, they're throwing out one quarter of that cost. because that that was the cost to figure out the governance for the next four years. And if you're throwing out the final year of that, they basically just wiped their butt with 36 and a quarter million. Wouldn't it be cool?

Wouldn't it be cool if you could call an election as early as you wanted, but you had to pay the prorated cost of the previous election? You mean the party would have to do that? Yes. Yeah, well then elections would be a few, and farther in between. I mean, like, you are right. I believe, like, the last federal election back in 2021 was the most expensive one in

Canadian history. If I, if I can recall, it was like hundreds of millions of dollars. Like that being said, at least people get a chance at democratic accountability every now and then, right? Like, at least someone gets a chance to actually try to hold. I'm glad we can make Franco laugh. He comes on and he's expecting a serious conversation. He probably isn't with us to do.

I'm used to be in the rain cloud. I'm used to be in the rain cloud. I'm just going on the shows and being like, no, this government's idea is probably the dumbest thing I've ever heard. And then the next day I'm on the show again saying, oh, well, no, this is the dumbest idea I've ever heard. So it's just nice to be able to laugh a little bit and not be the rain cloud. Well, let's talk. Can we talk provincial elections just for a quick second? You know, like, right Frank Audie's like, what do you?

You know, anyways, it doesn't matter. You got a multiple multitude of parties. When you're sitting there as the Canadian Taxpayers Federation, you're staring at money, you're staring at what their platforms look like. Is there anything you look at and you go, well, you know, because I know the CTF doesn't care who does it. They just want to see taxpayers' money spent the correct way. Is there anything you see that go, people should know about this?

Yeah. I mean, okay, for starters, let's just move the NDP to the side here. Because like I tried to look for something good. I don't know if I'm going to give you much, right? like massive new spending like $70 billion of new spending over a number of years. They're increasing capital gains taxes, hiking income taxes at the top level, imposing a luxury residence tax, whatever, whatever that is. So let's just shove the NDP to the side here because like there's really not much good news for taxpayers in Ontario from from that party, at least in this election. Now, both the progressive conservatives and the liberals, the good news, there's good news and there's bad news, right?

The good news is that both parties are offering tax relief. There are no new taxes or new increases in costs to the taxpayer from either of the parties from what I saw. So that's the good news. I mean, the bad news is like, look, it's just going to be more debt, right? More deficit spending, more borrowing of money, more put on the backs of Canadians, kids and grandkids. So that's really the bad news.

But look, like, I do have to make this point off the top. I don't know that there's going to be that many of Ontario. who've done a deep dive into the platforms like I did. Really, if we want to be honest with ourselves and with your listeners and with your audience, I think this election is really just going to come down on who people think is best able to deal with this looming threat with the United States, right? Like we keep hearing Trump saying he's going to impose tariffs. He might not impose tariffs.

He might delay tariffs. And I really do think the entire election is going to come down to who people think is better to, I don't know, retaliate or, you know, just how to deal with the U.S. tariff threat. I don't really see any good options there. Personally, I mean, you've got, like, I look at it and I say that when it comes to the tariff thing, I think there's two ways you could handle it. The best, the best, I'll start, the second best way would be like, okay, Trump, you want to do 25% tariffs?

we're going to do 5,000% tariffs. And then when he's like, what, he'd be like 10,000. And then just be absolutely ridiculous. Just point out how absurd the whole thing is. And then the other thing, the best thing to do, I think, though, be to say, okay, well, you know what? We're really disappointed that Donald Trump feels that way. We're going to do what's best for Canadians.

And that is to impose 0% tariffs. And if he wants to escalate this, we will double them to 0% percent. percent and we will triple them to zero percent and we will quadruple them and we will keep going as long as it takes. You know, the best response to tariffs in any situation, like just take the emotion out of this because I know like emotions are flying high right now all across Canada. I think that's probably the understatement of the century. But the best way to approach any type of tariff is like, oh yeah, you want to impose taxes on your own citizens. We're going to cut taxes on our citizens. That is the best way.

Yeah. Like a tariff is a tax on your own citizens, right? So when Donald Trump imposes tariffs, those are largely, like they do impact Canadian businesses. I don't want to downplay that. They do. But when the U.S. imposes tariffs, that's largely a tax paid for by American businesses who import goods from Canada and then passed on to American consumers. Right. When Donald Trump imposes a tariff, that is essentially a tax on Americans.

Now, what is going to resolve that issue, if ever, if anything, is going to be backlash from American consumers and American industry. Right. So like to your point, the best way to respond is to do what Canada should have already been doing. Cutting taxes, cutting regulations, cutting the government's massive wasteful spending that we couldn't afford before this and we certainly can't afford now. Right. Like when you ask about tariffs, like here's my thoughts on the tariffs.

Number one, cut taxes regulations. Number two, cut the massively bloated government. that we have in Ottawa that is a massive drain on all Canadian taxpayers. Number three, and I think this is the crucial point here, is like, look, I don't think tariffs are going to work. In fact, I think they could escalate the situation. But I am sure that need-jerk retaliatory tariffs from the Canadian government will make life more expensive for Canadians who can't afford it.

But it's also good for their polling. Well, you know what? Like, here's a thing, though. I don't think Canadians want any higher taxes or any higher cost of living. So if somebody can explain to Canadians, right, like what we're trying to do right now, that a tariff is just a tax on yourself, I think that would shed some light on this. I just saw some polling today.

I tweeted about it earlier this morning. So if you want to go look at the poll at Franco underscoreomics, I forget who the polling company is. And that's why I'm saying go check out my Twitter feed. But the polling showed that like the number one top concern, among Canadians right now is still the is still the cost of living and by a wide margin. I can even go on my own Twitter, but I believe it was about 61% said that the number one concern facing them is still the cost of living.

By a wide margin, the number two top concern was Trump in the U.S. Okay. So by a wide margin, the number one issue is still the cost of living. And it was 61%. 61% said the number one issue is cost of living. 22% or 22 points behind that, far second place, was responding to Trump and the U.S. tariff threat at 39%. So look at the polls right there, right?

You brought up the political calculation. The number one issue is that people still can't afford groceries. People still can't afford gas. People are worried about their heating bills that are coming in the mail. If you put a tariff on the states. you're making life more expensive for Canada Absolutely You mentioned the political calculation

There it is right there It's a lot easier You're absolutely right But I feel like I feel as though Doug Ford's strategy in this Is the same as the federal governments And it's that if you can have a discernible enemy Rather than something a little bit

Not vaporous I mean it's it's easy to track the points where it makes it, the places where it makes it more expensive and it's easy to point out solutions. But when you've got a lot of different things moving towards making the cost of living high, it's not quite as sexy as saying that guy over there is evil and we need to gather together and fight him. And I think it's a lot easier to, it's a lot easier to blame someone else than it is for you to actually do the hard work and do your job right.

Now, I don't want to minimize the threat of tariffs. I don't want to minimize it. That's not what I'm trying to do. Because look, if and when Donald Trump hits us with the tariffs, that will cause harm for Canada. So I don't want to minimize that. That's not my, that's not what my intention. However, let's talk about the federal government for a second, right? We continue to hear Trump, muse, talk, whatever, about 25% tariffs.

Okay. The liberals, all the liberal frontrunners, right, Freeland, Carney, they've all, you know, seen the light. and now they want to get rid of the consumer carbon tax. Not all carbon taxes, just the consumer facing carbon tax. But guess what? The carbon tax on the books is still scheduled to go up April 1. So while we're hearing Trump talk about 25% tariffs and, you know, I do think that's a real threat.

Our government is about to hike the carbon tax on us 19% in a couple of weeks. But it's a lot easier to say, hey, look, those people are bad than to actually do what you should do, which is cut spending, cut taxes, and do your job. You're absolutely right. That's one of the frustrating things about having the Canadian Taxpayers Federation on here. I've got to be honest with you, Franco, is that we don't disagree on much of anything. Yeah, well, yeah, you know, I don't know what to say. Look, I've been the rain cloud a lot here.

I will point out a couple good things, like for your audience of what some of the parties are doing. So I do want to, you know, Doug Ford and the PCs, they said they're going to permanently cut the gas tax, which is good, which is good. I mean, especially with the federal carbon tax has been driving up the cost of living, permanently cutting the gas tax tax is a good thing. Let me also point out that there's a lot of tax relief in the liberal platform as well. Now, again, I make no bones about pretending like this election is about tax relief. It's not, as I said, unfortunately, as I said at the top, I think this election is people are just going to vote. vote in Ontario about who they think is best to respond to the U.S. tariff threat.

But look, the liberals, they say they're going to cut income taxes, the tax bracket around $50,000 to $75,000 by like 22%. So that's some pretty significant income tax savings there. They're going to eliminate the HST on home heating bills, hydro bills. They're going to expand income tax relief for lower income earners. They're even talking about finding savings to billions of dollars a year. The Liberals, which is, you know, which is fantastic. I actually saw this deep down buried in the platform, which I can't believe they buried it so far deep in the platform.

I don't know why. It's almost like they're bearing the lead. Let me just read this because I actually wrote it down. Okay. The liberals would amend the Taxpayer Protection Act to require political parties to disclose to the chief electoral officer, all plans that they have for tax reduction before an election and impose consequences on governments who do not keep these commitments when in office. So look, like, they were probably embarrassed about that. They're like, that's not going to play well with their voter base.

I saw that. I'm like, wow, like, why is this buried so far deep in the platform like that? Because they're a shame. Like lead with that. It's great. It's great though. So it really is. I mean, like look, it looks like Ford's going to win in a landslide.

Kudos to him for permanent gas tax cuts. Like that's, that's very good. There are some stuff, though, in the liberal platform that I think even, that I think, people who are voting for Doug Ford would like Ford to look at and mimic like income tax cuts like some sales tax relief he's like like business tax cuts for small businesses and this extra protections for taxpayers. Franco, before before I see a Canis Hayden in the background and I go, if you got extra time, we'll bring Candace in. If you, if you're like, boys, I got to hop out. No, I'm good. I'm good. Yeah, bring her in. Yeah. Well, then why don't we bring on the founder of

True North and now Juno knows. I hope I got that right. Candice. I was, I was, I was here, I'll bring her in. And then I can just ask her directly. She appeared folks on, just recently on the podcast, episode 797. So just back in February. Is it,

is it both? Is it just one now? Or is it both true? I don't know. Is it too? Yeah. I start, oops,

am I muted? No, I'm not. No, I founded both. I'm no longer at True North, but True North is still doing its thing. And Juno is the new company.

Thank you. Thank you for clearing that up. Because I asked two before we started. I'm like, well, she found it both, I think. But I'm like, I don't know what to say here. So Juno knows. Thank you. Okay.

So Candace Malcolm, Juno knows. Thanks for hopping on. When we get looking at the Ontario election, we've been chatting with Franco, you know, you've been staring at this. You live in the problem. I don't know. You bring us up to speed. You tell these two Yahoo's from Alberta.

Or we should know about the fact that every Ontario and I reach out to, they're like, yeah, there's a whole lot going on. Is there an election going on tonight? They're right. Isn't that right? Yeah, I actually learned more about. about the Ontario PCs from listening to Franco backstage there. So look, I think that that everybody in Ontario is in agreement. This election was just a total waste of time. The entire thing was

shrewd, callous, partisan politics. Doug Ford wanted his third majority. That's it. The whole thing was about Donald Trump and Ford's going to get his wish. He's going to win in a landslide. And, you know, I think that most people in Ontario don't want an election. We don't care. We're focus more on federal stuff, but, you know, we don't really have another option, right? Like, I would like to not have to vote for the PCs. I don't like them very much, but I don't really see a good alternative. And I know you have Randy Hillier coming on next. I had him on my podcast as well. I think he's a great guy, but they don't have the organization. There's no way that they're even going to win. I don't think they're even going to win a single seat.

So there isn't really an alternative on the political right. I would say that the PCs are more of a centrist party, more like a liberal party in a different province. And, you know, they kind of just govern from the center. For myself, someone who cares a lot about education and the school systems, I'm not happy with the PC government. I don't like how woke our schools have become. There's just so many stories pouring out of schools that just absolutely horrify me. So I'm not happy about it, but I don't think that there's really an alternative to the PCs here in Ontario right now.

I just, just before anyone chimes in, Randy Hillier now has been pushed to, it sounds like a couple hours from now. Okay. If we're lucky, I'm hoping he comes on because I'd love to hear his thoughts. Obviously, he's been on the podcast as well. Now, I got Franco, I got twos, I got Canis, you find folks fire away because I'm just, it just shocks me that nobody gets, it's just like, oh, whatever. Just give him his majority.

We don't like them, but let's just move on. I'm like, this is so strange. Well, it's so strange. I mean, it's not super strange. It's, it's an opportunistic politician, which, is redundant, doing exactly what he can to stay in charge for as long as possible. Now, it's interesting. Pardon me, guys.

I'm just getting over a cold. I was sick as hell for a few days. There's a couple interesting threads dangling around here that I want to pick up on. Franco, you were talking about the individual piecemeal tax breaks. And I was wondering, purely from an economics background, which is your wheelhouse, does it ever make sense to just do blanket ones? And is it just because the niche ones pull better? Oh, it's way better to just cut taxes across the board.

Way better. You know what's harder though? You know why they don't do it? Because it's a lot easier to provide people with a little bit of freaking beef jerky rather than some actual steak, right? Because then they don't have to cut spending as much. Then they don't have to worry about the debt ballooning as much. Like that's why you see it, right?

You see these targeted niche tax credits. They're trying to go after specific blocks of voters. on the one hand, so there's a political incentive to do that. But on the other hand, if you're just going to cut income taxes across the board permanently, cut HST, GST, PST and provinces across the board, well, then you actually have to go out and find some savings or the deficit, the debt increases faster. So, I mean, from a purely economic standpoint, yeah,

cut taxes across the board permanently. Unfortunately, though, we see all too often a lot of political parties try to go for these niche little tax credits, these niche little tax incentives, what they should be doing is just cutting taxes across the board. That's particularly true given the context we're facing right now. Because as I mentioned, the number one priority for every government in Canada and every politician is how do we make Canada more competitive? And that means massive tax cuts, right? No more like small little temporary GST holidays.

We need real tax cuts. And so, I mean, Franco, I want to ask you, like, Doug Ford is really popular personally, right? And I see his campaign. I see like the images. He's pretty good. He's no Donald Trump, but he's pretty good with the branding like his Canada Not for Sale hats kept selling out. And he's kind of just like this talented retail politician who comes across like a normal nice guy. So to me, that would give him an historic opportunity to bring in reforms to show what conservative politics can do, what conservative policies can do, to kind of like unleash the free market and do all these things that conservatives have been telling conservative governments to do for so long. But usually, you know, like at least federally, Harper was only in power. He only had one majority. You could argue that he had to be cautious because a lot of times he was propping a minority. It's not the case, Ontario. We're looking at three straight conservative majority governments. So like, why don't we see more bold policies? Why don't we see

big tax cuts? Why don't we see huge efforts to deregulate and to have like a prosperous free market example. And Ken, I just, I don't, I don't understand. I want to hear your thoughts on that. Yeah, why don't we see an end to the party with taxpayers money? Yeah, great, great question, right? Like when, when Ford was first running, Candace, you'll remember this. That was one of the key planks, right? The party with taxpayers money is over. But we're still seeing multi-billion dollar deficits. We're still seeing massive spending. Like even in this platform from the PCs, I saw like it's up to, what, up to $40 billion in new spending. Yet some of the spending and announcements, some of the big ticket items aren't even costed. Like we don't even know exactly how

much it's going to cost. Right. So I mean, the party with taxpayers money like two, chew, two, all aboard. You know what I mean? Like it's still going on right now. Look, I'm not going to pretend to be a political analyst. You know, I've never worked on a political campaign. So I don't know exactly the strategy behind it politically. But Candace, I will pick up on your point is I do think this would have been the perfect opportunity for Ford and the progressive conservatives to go all on cutting taxes and regulation, right? Because the way that they framed this election was, as you put it, Candace, who is best to go toe to toe with Ford, right? So equally with that, or sorry, with Trump, exactly. So equally, they could have set this up as how do we make Ontario

the most competitive place in Canada, the most competitive, you know, province or state in the world. And they could have gone side by side with tax cuts and massive deregulation. Now, as I mentioned, there were some tax cuts, right? The permanent gas tax relief that has been going on for a couple years now. But as I mentioned, like, there's actually a number of tax cuts in the liberal platform that I would hope that Doug Ford would implement when and if he wins this landslide election, right? Like the liberals, for example, permanent tax cuts, 22% tax cut from about 9% to 7% for middle

income taxpayers. The liberals also talking about cutting small business taxes by 50%. I also saw, as I mentioned earlier, buried in the liberal platform, is this promise to find billions of dollars in savings. Now, who knows if that would ever materialize if they form government, right? It's a lot easier to make these promises if you don't really have a chance of winning government than it is to actually do it when you're in government. But Candace, to your point and to your question, I thought now would be a perfect time in the face of this tariff threat coming from the United States and President Trump for Ford to run all in on growth. And that means cutting taxes deregulation. Well, and he was the guy that was, you know, respect the taxpayer.

That was his whole shtick. I mean, I mean, when he first came to office, remember, he was promising to get rid of Kathleen Wynn's wild inappropriate sex ed program that was implemented in the schools. You could argue that the schools are more woke now, including several of the bills that the PCs put in, including to put in equity, diversity, equity inclusion, basically standards into classrooms and teach young children that the country is systemically racist and that there's something wrong with the history of our country. Aside from what I think has just been an absolute disaster in the schools, you know, you had this guy that used to say that he respected

the taxpayers, he was fighting for the taxpayers. I look at things more like from a federal perspective. I'm focused more on the federal government. And imagine like, wow, how much change could Canada have for the positive if it had three straight majorities with a conservative. Like we could have drastic systemic change in the country reforms, get rid of the CBC, totally restructure the federal government, reduce the size to all the points that you were making, Franco about becoming a competitive, high growth jurisdiction that people actually want to move to and grow businesses. And it's like, imagine how good Canada could be, for instance, if we had three, straight majorities with Pierre Polly of. And it just seems like such a wasted opportunity.

Like, like, my, my guess is that eventually Ford will lose and another liberal government will come and they'll get like three straight majority governments. And like what will even be different between then and now? Like, I don't mean to be too pessimistic. Maybe some of your audience likes the Ontario PC government. But I just, I just don't see anything there to feel optimistic about. In fact, it's like, it's even worse than that. Because if it's a liberal government, you could say, okay, well, hopefully the conservatives will come and clean it up. But this is supposed to be the clean up, right? The Ford government was supposed to come in and clean up after McGinty and Wynn made an absolute mess and disaster of the finances in Ontario.

And I don't really think they've done it at all. I'm inclined to agree with you that they haven't. I see what he's doing to be really similar to what Scott Moe is doing in Saskatchewan, where it's not so much about being a conservative government. It's sure, yeah, we're going to take the name and we're going to claim all of the people who support those sort of things. But when your opposition is so far to the far side of it, you can move right to the middle and pick up all those loose votes.

And, you know, it's, it's more the Austrian way of trying to predict what politicians are going to do. But, you know, if there's all these loose votes in the middle, they just move to the middle because it's not so much about doing a good job of governing as it is about keeping that job governing. And it's a damn shame that the incentives and the consequences of not governing wealth are not born. There's an incentive to do a bad job as a governing party.

And the consequences of that are not born by you until they get really, really bad. Yeah. And who's going to complain it up, right? Like, I think that federally, you know, you have, you have just, Justin Trudeau and his whole idea was that we're going to spend like we've never spent before. We're going to shut down the industrial parts of the country. We're going to have this green revolution.

And if it doesn't work out, you know, then we'll dump that on the conservatives and they can come in and fix it. And I just wonder, like, who's coming to save Ontario? Like, what's next? Like, who's going to finally get our province back on track? I just, I don't think that it's going to be this government and that makes me sad. Forgive me for asking really dumb questions, but that's what I do. What year did Ford come in as Premier? One of you lovely Ontario?

Yeah, I think it was 20. It was around 2018. I believe that's when it was. And if I may, what I'm hearing from Candice and Franco specifically is basically, you know, it's kind of like, you know, nobody wants the election. We all know what he's doing. There's nobody else to vote for because he's the conservative guy, but he's not doing conservative things.

So that kind of just spells out that it should be lower turnout because there's no real option. to come in and just like clean up the big old mess that's happening. Or am I wrong in just summarizing what you guys been talking about? Did I miss something in there? That's my perspective. I think that the sort of like hardcore base of the conservative party will probably stay home. But I think that somehow Ford appeals to like the middle, to centrist voters, to people, maybe even people who vote liberal federally.

I mean, that's the only explanation because he wins. I mean, I think he's going to win with the biggest majority that he's had so far. Obviously, that represents a weakness in the liberal party. They've had a hard time rebuilding. They have a pretty popular, you know, the former mayor of Mississauga running. I think she's better than the last party leader. But really not. She just had a picture with her getting out of a Maserati the other day.

The optics aren't great. That's a liberal way. Dugmeet's thing as well. So I guess they have that in common. Champagne socialists out here. But yeah, I mean, look, I think that there is something appealing about Ford, like on an interpersonal level. I think that he sort of has that every man appeal.

Like he's not snobbing out of touch. He's not like a Mark Carney type. He's not, you know, he had a fairly successful career in the private sector before getting into politics. So I think he has that, that soft touch and people relate to him. So like normal people, people like you, Sean, who aren't like living and breathing politics like Franco and I, I think people like he might be more inclined. I mean, what's your impression of him from the outside?

We probably don't follow him too, too closely. But have you heard him speak and have you heard, like, what's your impression of him? Of who, sorry? Of Doug Ford. It's funny, like sitting on this side, I look at Doug and I see a guy that will do whatever he needs to do to stay in power. That's what I see. I don't know, you know, like, I don't sit and listen to him. I see at times he's the first one to speak over Justin Trudeau when they have, have like, that's what it looks like.

So I always go, like, who's really pulling the shots here? But I'll give Doug Ford this credit. He is no, if it's either him or his team around him, Donald Trump says what he says, and Ford becomes, you know, the overweight Captain Freedom. And we're all going to rally around this guy who is, you know, I don't know. I just like, I'm like, how is that the guy that's representing the largest population in Canada?

That's my thoughts. Now, that's just from a very 10,000 foot or 10,000 feet away view of, of just watching them and being like, I don't know, I just don't get it. Like when I watch Daniel Smith speak, I get it. I don't get Scott Moe, right? Like, we have Scott Moe right next door. And he talks and I don't get that. Doug Ford is in the largest populist place.

He presided through COVID, which you would think people would be just like, get them the heck out, right? Because one of the things that happened in BC was a similar thing. But here's Ontario, there's Quebec. And they're just, oh, cool with everything that went down during COVID. Yeah, right on that. Exactly. Like you finally, you kind of expect there to have been a backlash after COVID, right? I certainly had. I certainly felt it. I wanted to like vote out every politician who had anything to do with COVID, never trust them again. But the thing is the people in Ontario, they actually liked the COVID lockdowns. They were supportive of them. They were the ones encouraging the politicians to do it. So I think that the part of the problem really is that the people of Ontario is really in around Toronto. I couldn't get over it. Like I just, I'm from Western Canada originally board raised in Vancouver. And I have such a hard time complying with things that I think are stupid. Like I hate stupid rules. I hate going through airport security.

I just, I have to like bite my tongue, especially now that I have little kids. It's like, okay, mommy, don't cause a scene here. But like, you know, like I have so little tolerance for people infringing upon my personal freedom. And I was kind of just shocked throughout COVID. Like every little thing, you know, like from the, the little, you know, the cops coming and putting police tape around the playground outside of my house. Like it was like, you know, it's March. It's like negative 10 outside. There's snow all over the playground and they come and they put police tape around it.

And like people comply. And you talk to people and I would complain about the insane COVID restrictions. And I felt like I was like the odd man out. Like everyone else was like, no, you have to stay in. You have to get vaccinated. You have to do this. You have to that. And it was really like maybe a bit of a culture shock or just I'm like a different personality

than everyone else around me in. Toronto, but I think people like the COVID lockdowns. I think they wanted the school closures. They believed in it. They believe what the government tells them. There's a critical mass of people that are not going to backlash against Ford for COVID stuff. They actually like him because of that, which, you know, not. Which doesn't make sense to a Western.

I'm just going to say it. It doesn't make sense to me out here. Yeah. I don't get it. I mean, you do see that where, you know, a conservative policy in Nova Scotia looks like a liberal policy in Alberta or Saskatchewan. Right. I mean, you do see that, that trend coming across. You know, it's interesting, though, when you're talking about the lockdowns and how there's a lot of people who supported it, I feel like, without knowing any numbers, I feel like the public sector is probably largest or at least significantly larger than it would be here because you've got the compounding of the federal and provincial public sectors in, in Ontario. And I mean, sure, in the Maritimes, there's a lot of places where it's the only industry.

But how big of a factor do you think that's going to be? Because if you look at the registered third parties, probably a third, if not half of them, are some type of union, including there was one. It was like retired teachers of Ontario. Yeah, no. I found to be absolutely astounding. That would be like a really interesting study to do to find out like what the correlation overlap between like being a government bureaucrat and being like. really supportive of like COVID lockdown measures. I just think it's like a temperament thing. I think these like Laurentian elites and people, especially in Toronto, these circles, like,

they just really like order, right? Like what I think of like Canada's founding principle of like peace, order and good government. And that is what they care about. And it's like their sensibilities that are like deeply enthrined in like their sort of like waspy Anglican nature. And they just, they want everyone to be orderly. They love enforcing rules. They love like like being a any state. Like all of that stuff is just somehow appealing to people, Ontario. Like I have friends of my husband and mine. The husband is from New York and he's the works of finance. And then the wife is from Ontario. And we were talking to this couple. And he said, you know, like, he's an American who lives in Toronto. He's like, I love Toronto. I never felt like

an outsider in this city. I always just felt completely at home here until the COVID lockdowns happen. And I've never felt more American in my life because I just couldn't agree with these people like I want freedom and they don't they don't want freedom they want laws and order and like people following their roles which I hate yeah let me jump in there because I just want to build off a Candace right like culture or cultural attitudes I'm going to let you build off at Franco but I am going to invite Regina with with TL in because she's been sitting in the background patiently and I'm like I'm getting off on my schedule and then I'm going to let you finish your thought okay right I just want to bring in Regina thank you for being very patient with us in the background

Of course, I'm talking about Ms. She's got her PhD in statistics and author of Fisman's fraud, Regina, Wittiel. So it's been a while, Regina. It's going back to November 8, 2023 that we last spoke. Thanks for hopping on. Well, thanks for inviting me. I'm not sure if I have a lot to say. I'm listening to the banter and you guys are having a good time.

Well, I'm going to let Franco get his thought, but then I actually do want to get your thoughts. Franco, fire away. Well, okay, Sean, after this, you can kick me off. I think I've gotten enough screen time for today. The lovely thing about this, Franco, is I'm like, oh, no, this is, this is, this is election coverage mashup style. We can have a lot of people on here because it's interesting to see you all interact. And the thing about me and twos being on here is we're Albertan. We sit here and we're listening to Ontario talk about their own election and it's freaking fascinating.

So don't feel like you got to get off. Anyways, carry on, Franco. Well, you know, I just want to build off a Candace because I think cultural attitudes, no doubt play a part in this, right? I mean, you just look at cultural attitudes when I lived in Calgary, then I come out here in Ottawa. It's completely different. But you know what else makes a difference too is actual financial incentives, right? We're talking about lockdowns. Well, who were more against the government overreach?

People in the private sector. People far away from government centers. Who are people who are more likely to support it? Well, I mean, look, if your paycheck was coming from the taxpayer because you're employed by the government and you keep getting pay raises or bonuses every single year and you're not losing hours and you're not losing pay. Well, guess what? Sitting at home, sitting at home is pretty cool if you're getting that sweet, sweet taxpayer funded paycheck coming in the door, right? Or even just think of any other type of policy. Like, for example, I mean, I always go back to the carbon tax,

but who tends to support carbon taxes, people who live in urban cities, people who can, you know, walk across the street from their condo to the office building to get to work, the laptop class, right, the taxpayer funded academics, who are the people who are most against the carbon tax? Well, the people who swing a hammer for a living. The people have to fuel up the ram with diesel to get to the shop in the morning. Right? So you have to think about it this way. I mean, the people who are more inclined to support the government overreach that shut some people down, kick some people out of a job, close some people's businesses down.

The people who were supporting it more were the people who weren't financially impacted, who got to keep their government job, who got to work from home. The people who oppose these kind of taxes or regulations are the people who are specifically impacted directly by. them. So culture 100% plays a part, but we also have to remember the financial incentives that are at play here. And let me just kind of my some concluding thoughts here is what Tews was talking about, right? The natural political incentive for parties to try to move to the middle to try to get votes who don't have to worry about competition on their flank. Well, the key there then is to change the middle, right, to change the cultural aspect. because the middle is different in different places, different regions and different times. So yes, leadership in political parties and government matters.

I don't want to pretend that it doesn't. But I do think the key is to also shift the middle in the right direction, right? Of course, of the Canadian Taxpayers Federation, that's to shift the culture towards being more skeptical of government spending, government overreach and of course, higher taxes. So anyways, just my little TED talk there. I see the time is taken away and if you want me to stay, I can but if you want me to get out of here I'm happy to do that as well, Sean.

Well, how about you give us to the top of the hour? We got 12 minutes before Greg hops in and at that point I'll let you go, Franco. If there's, you're welcome to stay till top of the hour. The same goes for you, Candace, if you want to stay to the top of the hour, you're more than welcome to.

But I am going to ask, you know, you're like, I have really nothing to say, you know, it's funny. You're one of the many people I reached out to about this. I don't know. I'm like, you're a brilliant woman. I'm like, you live in the province.

What do you mean you got nothing to say? So if that's it, I'm good with it. It's just interesting coming from the other side of the country where, you know, like right now, as I've told Candace and Franco's probably heard me and twos jabber on a boat. We supposedly have the greatest premier of all time and we're a raucous crowd on the best of days and we can never align on Danielle on the best of times. So I find it interesting when you listen to Candice and Franco and twos go back and forth, about Doug Ford and like, what is he?

Like, we got nothing out anyways. And you kind of get it. So Regina, you're living in. What are your thoughts on everything going on tonight? Well, I mean, I listened to you guys, but, you know, there wasn't a lot of selection here. It's not like there's a lot to choose from. So, I mean, I have real issues obviously with Doug Ford and the way he, he handled the whole pandemic. And because of what he did, there's zero chance I can.

can vote for that. And then you look at the liberals, which just wanted to do even worse things, and then the NDP, which are just laughable. So you don't really have a strong alternative. And so then you're just looking at the new parties that came up and any independence. So that's really, you know, this to be called, you know, we're looking January, February. Everybody's looking at the snow. I mean, I look around, there was, I saw no signs whatsoever in my writing. All right. Now, my husband did see one, he saw one little sign in a snow bank by the 25-year-old liberal, and that was about it.

There hasn't been a lot of discussion. Nobody's really interested, like in who I converse with, nobody's really interested in even talking about this election. I think it was almost a foregone conclusion for a lot of people that Doug Ford would just, you know, keep his majority and go another. four years. So I don't think anybody's expecting much change. No, I don't think they are. And you bring up a good point. There's a lot of upstarts in this. You've got the Alliance, the Canadian Choice Party, the Ontario Centrist Party, the Freedom Party, the, oh, shoot, the, the, the, um, the true blue party,

the Ontario party. The new blue Ontario. That basically looks like the PPC, but they just completed the C into an O. There's there's probably about seven or eight between the centrist, like there's the Ottawa or Ontario moderate party. The Ontario party. There's there's quite a few upstarts. And it seems as though it's it's almost a renaissance, but not a very successful one.

Yeah, but too, as you remember when we were doing, you remember when we were doing the Alberta election coverage and we had didn't we have a Marxist or was it a communist party? I can't remember. They're running. They've got, I mean, like, Alberta's got, I mean, like, when we, when we open it up, you're like, you got new parties everywhere. We couldn't believe that there was a Marxist running in the election.

I mean, it's pretty wild. Here, it's right at the top. They've got, uh, what is it? Um, two, seven, Ottawa Center, Davenport, Hamilton, East Stony Creek, Humber River Black Creek, Windsor, Toomse. I probably butchered that. Parkdale High Park and Scarborough Rouge Park are all ridings that the Communist Party is running in. But the point I was trying to get to is that there's all these options to the Conservative Party that don't seem to be getting any traction.

And they've all got very seemingly minute differences between the two of them. And this is probably one that Candace could probably shine a lot of light on and maybe Regina as well, where what is it that actually helps these upstarts get traction? What's the tipping point and why haven't any of them made a mark? Well, I mean, it doesn't really work. That's the reality. Maxine Bernier is sort of living this. He was a cabinet minister and an established politician, established conservative,

with a huge popularity. I mean, he was almost the leader of the party. He barely lost in that leadership selection against Andrew Shear. In fact, if they had had a different way of calculating the votes, he would have won because he had the most votes on the first ballot. So he went from being a hugely popular figure in the conservative movement federally to running a party that gets, you know, no seats, right? So the odds are stacked against them. Like, it's unfortunate. On the left, they've managed to get some ground with the Green Party, although you could argue it's sort of a cult of personality around Elizabeth May because she keeps leaving and they keep bringing her back.

But, yeah, I think it is a problem. Like we have, I think the two bigger ones, I mean, bigger ones are actually running candidates in just about every rioting Ontario would be the true Blue Party, which is Belinda Calli Annios. I always get that wrong. Apologies. Blinda Kay. Yeah, Belinda Kay. And then the other one is the Ontario Party, which Randy Hillier may or may not be joining the podcast later. and Derek Sloan, who was also a federal candidate, a former federal MP, who was also, you know, had a hugely popular brand within the conservative party.

He ran and lost in that leadership selection against Aaron O'Toole a few years ago. And his party, you know, I like Derek a lot. I have a lot of time for his ideas, but I don't think that he's going to get, and he's not going to even win a seat. So it's kind of like a waste of time. I think that for whatever reason, you know, we have the establishment. parties and those are the parties and that's what people are accustomed to voting for and they're not really willing to take a chance. It's hard. A lot of it is to do with the institutional rules, right? Like Maxine Bernier is not allowed to debate on the stage with the, with the, during the leadership,

during the federal election. And I think it was the same thing. I think they prevented Ontario party MPPs or potential candidates for MPPs from competing. They weren't part of the televised debates that happened. And so if you can't get that minimal, threshold, then no one's going to see you, no one's going to even know you exist, and you don't have any chance of winning. Yeah, if you go back to the federal election, I mean, I always pointed to the Quebec guy, somebody filming it. Who is the guy on the federal national? Yeah, when he, when he, when he, when he said, I don't even, I don't even want to be,

I don't even want to be prime minister. I'm like, like, we're a joke when that's our, our federal election coverage. It's the only person you want as the guy in the job is the guy who does not want it. If somebody says they want that job, they should automatically be disqualified. So if anything, that should have voted well for him. But like, Regina, what do you think about, you know, just the shape of like just first past the post versus some of the other options? Do you think that factors into it much?

Well, I don't really have a lot to say on that. I mean, with what Candace just said, I agree completely. it's really, really difficult to start up a new party. Things are stacked against them. As you probably know, like in the federal election, I actually ran with the PPC because I strongly opposed the mandates and the travel restrictions and everything else. But when I was running, I wasn't, you know,

I wasn't under any delusion that I would actually, you know, win. I mean, I was mostly, it was to, to, to, you know, to voice what I thought was right versus what was wrong and to give people an option. Some people just couldn't stomach voting for the other parties. So I wanted to give people that option. But not until I ran it, I realized just how difficult it was. I knew it would be difficult, but it was, oh my God. Yeah, it was even worse than I thought.

And especially when you come into the financing part, because when you're running to these parties and you have, there's no real money backing them. I mean, that's a lot for the candidates. The candidates have to do everything. And there's not a lot of support. So it really takes its toll. Anyway, I do feel for the new startups. But the reality is that Doug Ford called this election now.

It was good timing for him. It's the middle of winter. Nobody really wanted to go to the polls. They're not really thinking about it. He's pretty safe. He has a huge majority. And it was politically smart for him to do it, I guess. So,

Franco, we're coming up on top of the hour. Any final thoughts before we let you out of here? You know, we covered a ton, right? You know, again, I'm not under any illusion that this election is much more than, you know, who people think is going to be best to stand up to a potential tariff war in the United States. But like, look, there's some stuff in the platform that Ford is doing that's good, like the gas tax cuts permanently. But look, like there's also some stuff that I hope he takes from the liberal

platform. We know we talked about some of the income tax cuts. We talked about some sales tax relief, even just finding some savings in the budget, cutting small business taxes. So, you know, I think a lot of people who are going to be voting for Ford would actually support Ford to take some ideas from some of those tax relief measures. Well, Franco, we appreciate you giving us some extra time today. Always. Oh, my pleasure. It's funny. I literally say, oh, you know, 15 to 20 minutes, the back of my And I'm like, you know, what's going to happen is everybody's going to be enjoying the conversation. I've talked to all you wonderful human beings and everybody can go. And so I'm like, I'm going to let the prize horses out of the box and let them run.

And we appreciate you giving us an hour tonight. And look forward to the next time you're on the mashup or the show and just continue to do great work the CTF is doing. We appreciate it very, very much. You know, when you align on all the things you rattled off with the CTF, I was looking at Tuesday. I'm like, you know, literally this is why you come on the show all the time. We align on so much. Yeah. It's pretty cool.

So we appreciate the CTF a ton and appreciate you giving us time tonight. Oh, thanks, guys. Thanks for all you do. Have a great night, guys. Right, bye, Franco. There's Franco. Candice, you're the other one I'm like, I'm worried about right now. If you got extra time, you can hang out.

Yeah, I'm having a great time and I like this, but my husband is in the next room waiting for me to come back and have dinner with him. So I can't stay much longer. I don't want him to wait for me. No, well, then I tell you what, we got Greg hiding in the back. It's not a big deal whatsoever. We can let you out of here. Any final thoughts, Candace, before we let you out to go enjoy supper with your husband.

That's funny. Shout out to your husband. He's like, what is happening there? Where is she? Yeah, I let him put the older kids to bed, which was actually nice for me. It was a break. Yeah, no, thanks. I haven't ever met you before Regina.

And I appreciate you running for the PPC party. I think that that is, you know, obviously it was a protest for all of us during last election. I think that the election came too close after COVID. It was too new and people couldn't fully process like how brutal it was. I think that even if the election, instead of it being like, what was it in the fall of 2021, if it had been like the spring of 2022, I think the result would have been totally, totally different. And now, of course, we're just like waiting and waiting, waiting for us to finally have a federal election. So I think that that is the more interesting election.

The provincial one is just kind of like nothing. and I think Ford will easily walk away with it. So hopefully you'll have me back and we'll talk about the federal election. Absolutely we will, Candace. We appreciate you coming on. And well, best of luck on the new venture on Juno News. I think, you know, you and Kean, I don't know. Zoltan.

I mean, you guys are getting some big names. Shut up to Zoltan wherever he is. Hey, Zoltan. We've got a lot of time for. When you're watching this, Zoltan is the only, did he come on? I think he's been on multiple election coverages now. He might be only once.

Alex, he was on the P.C. one. And then he happened to be in Seattle. Alex, here's your, here's your call out to come on the Ontario election. We don't allow many people

to come on outside the province because we want it to be all Ontario. But for Alex, he seems to find a way into all of our conversation. So, Zolt, if you're at NDP headquarters right now or something. That's right.

That's right. Candace, thanks again for hopping on. And it won't be the last time. Thanks, Canada. Okay. All right. Okay, sitting in the background, we got the Canadian content creator, former guest host of the mashup, that is. He appeared on episodes 510, 719, and I don't know, a couple of mashups in there.

Greg Weichliff. Oh, man, we got a couple. Is this possible? We got a couple of PPCers on at the same time. Is that what I'm daring out right now? Here we go. Good to be here. Thank you, Sean Tews.

And Regina, I think we actually had a conversation at the PPC conference in last summer, right? Maybe. I don't know. Everything's always fuzzy to me. Uh-oh. It was life-changing for one of you. I said it was only life-changing for one of you, and now this is awkward.

It's all good. Greg, I'm pretty excited to finally be somewhat face-to-face with you. Big fan of your stuff for a long time. Thank you. Thank you. You do great work on the Twitter sphere as well, and when I was the co-host to replace you or to fill in, people were very disappointed. They're like, where's twos? So I'm happy to, you know, kind of learn from the best when it comes to you realize you're the only on my side of things. Because obviously I've been replaced an awful lot. Nobody seems to miss me while I'm gone. But on the flip side when twos is gone, I think that's the only, he's the only person who's ever replaced him. Correct, Tews? I'm not wrong on that. That's correct. Yeah. Yeah. Well, it's an honor. It's an honor. Big shoes to fill. Big shoes to fill. Oh, you're too kind. Now, now, now before I ask anything, I just want to remind if you.

You're just tuning in. We do have an election map. You know, by my estimation, I think the polls were closing at 8 o'clock. Correct. Am I right on that, folks? I know that my local polling station closes at 9. Oh, great. See, me and 2 have been having this argument all night long before we started this.

So we're going to go midnight, folks. This is going to be the longest time. The website said they were closing at 8 Eastern time. And then Mark Carney tweeted that they were closing at 9. And I'm like, well, that's interesting. is he trying to put his thumb on the scale? Or does he know something that elections, Ontario doesn't? And I mean, the guy's just got a sterling record for being on the inside track

when it comes to all this stuff. I mean, guys, we're working with Dominion voting machines. You know that right. It's, uh, yeah, the machines, the people, who knows who who's pulling what strings or what, but. Well, okay, whenever the polls close, we're going to have the map. It's going to start to autopopulate. It's going to be fun. I don't even know how to read said map because I'm not from Ontario.

I don't plan. I don't to talk like I'm from there, anything like that. I'm going to have it up and we're going to talk about it. But all counts from every Ontario. I talked to it. It's a landslide dug forth. That's what I'm hearing. I can explain it for you real quick if you want.

Do you want to bring it back up? Yeah. Sure. Yeah. So if you see, you know, there's a little Lake Ontario at the bottom there and there's where all those like black lines come together, that's the center of the universe right there. that's Toronto.

So the entire world revolves around Toronto down there. That's it. That's the bit. That's basically it. All right. All right. Okay. Fair enough.

Okay. Actually, I heard we're actually going to rename that to Lake Equalization. Yeah. After that half a billion dollars that Ontario is getting this year. Actually, I heard it's going to be called Lake of America, according to Trump. so better watch out there. Yeah, you know, you never know.

You never know. What, oh my goodness. Anyways, folks, at some point, when the polls close and it starts to populate, we'll pull up the map. If you're at all concerned about it, but by this point and you're like, it's going to be a 99% chance. Doug Ford's winning. That's what I guess I'm taking out of this. I mean, we even got Ontario people going, yeah, I'm just going, I didn't even go vote. I literally am like, what's the point?

you're going to have 45% probably in turnout. So that'll be interesting. I think that's optimistic. Greg, what's your thoughts on today in Ontario? I think we might get an all-time low in terms of voter turnout. I barely saw any sort of, aside from Doug Ford texting me to reminding me to vote, that's about as much sort of advertisement and maybe a few kind of like billboards. And it was always Doug Ford.

I think of the fact that it's it is kind of a harsher winter for us like we've really got dumped on snow wise. It's crazy. No one's paying attention to this election though. Like in general, comparing it to other elections like no one's really paying attention to this election. But all the cool people are watching this stream because they're in the no. Yeah. But no, I, uh, I was I was about to not vote, but I'm like, you know what? I should at least, you know, put in my protest vote because, you know, I'm not a, I'm not a fan of Doug Ford and these fake progress.

of conservatives. And I was hoping there was going to be an Ontario party person or a true blue person to vote for. But unfortunately, there wasn't. So I politely was at the polling station and said, hi, how do I spoil my ballot hypothetically if I wanted to do that? And yeah. And I was, you know, this is kind of a crude joke. But I was, you know, I put no one added an extra thing, added spoiled big letters. And I'm like, you know what? I should have drawn like a hangman like gallows just on the ballot but uh well i mean but there is there is the um one of the interesting things that i didn't mention when we were just before you got on we were talking about all the upstart parties and there's a party that's running in 13 ridings called none of the above

direct democratic party there you go there you go and you know if something like that was on the ballot i'd like yeah maybe i'd swipe that just to kind of be counted as someone who doesn't like the options that we have. You know what I mean? Yep. My writing had a new blue and aitarial party and then independent. So we had a few to choose. We had somebody in, he's left now and I'm going to scroll up and see.

Brad Goodro. Kept saying new blue, new blue, new blue, vote new blue. What was new blue? Can somebody give me the story on what new blue is? I think you guys keep calling it true blue. That's why I looked at my phone. That was Candace. That was Candice.

And I was like, is it a new blue? Anyways, it doesn't matter. True North, New North, True Blue, new. Yeah. I could see where she'd get it confused. So New Blue Party of Ontario was started by Jim Carajalios. And this was during like the pandemic, I think in 2020. I'm pretty sure he got like kicked out of the conservative party.

his wife did. Okay. And then yeah, he started his own provincial party. And yeah, it was people who were more opposed to like lockdowns and that sort of thing. And then this was in like 2020, 2021. Yeah, she was in the Cambridge riding. And she got booted. And the other one who got booted was Randy.

So they both kind of started their own party. So they got booted because of COVID? Is that as well, because they didn't agree with some of the things Ford was doing. So same thing Roman, same. thing that happened to Roman Babbard. Yep. Same thing. Right.

Yeah. And that's kind of, you know, although that's like some years in the past, that is sort of like a defining splinter, I guess, in the right wing in Canada, where certain conservatives spoke out against the establishment party. And now they've kind of been ousted. Of course, there's Derek Sloan as well, who is also running for the Ontario party, which is, you know, was also endorsed and promoted by Randy Hillier. But let's not forget that Derek Sloan is somebody who said way early on. in the pandemic. He made a video saying, who's his Teresa Tam person? Does she work for China? Does he work for Canada? He got he got crapped on so much. A lot of people think that's the reason why he got kicked out of the, of the, um, federal conservative party. But, um, isn't it funny that

he gets kicked out for suggesting that someone might be working for China. And then years later, this big foreign interference thing comes out, uh, talking about at the federal level in the House of Commons. And then all of it's, it's popular now to talk about, yeah, foreign interference. It's just interesting how the timing works. Like when you're ahead of the curb, when you're kind of asking questions that are totally valid,

but it's not popular yet, you get crapped on. You get kicked out of the party. And then once it's, once it's acceptable, now we're allowed, now we're allowed to talk about. Now,

now here's the picture for me with donuts in Ottawa. What's that? Donuts? I said, and here's a picture of me handing out donuts in Ottawa, because I supported you guys the whole time. Vote Paul. he have.

Oh, you don't want to get me started on that, too. So, oh my gosh. Oh, my gosh. Did you guys watch Canada first? Does you watch like his Canada first rebrand sort of thing? Thing? Thing? Yeah.

Does he think, like, I feel like in the past month, he's like taken on Aaron O'Toole's Com's team. I feel like as much as I dislike him and seeing as, see him as being, opportunistic and unprincipled. He's actually done a fairly decent job of his comms for the past several years.

Even in 2021, when he was running when he was running in the federal election, none of his branding was conservative party. It was all Pollyev. Polyev, Pollyev, Pollyev. And I remember saying, I was like, he's just waiting for Aaron O'Toole to screw up so he can come in and be the next guy.

And, and I feel like, like in the past month, basically as soon as the whole everybody got scared of of Orange Man bad again, he's like, no, I'm going to get the stupidest person in this entire country to run my tweets. Am I wrong? Tell me I'm wrong. Well, I think there's like there's, there's so much kind of going on here.

And I think Trump showing up like leadership, leadership happens at a heart level. A lot of people who are in the Canadian right wing, especially more online people who follow politics, we're sort of a minority, folks. Most people don't actually closely follow Canadian politics. And I follow right wing politics online. They don't realize that it's not just about statistics and numbers and all these little policies. There's a thing about leader, like true leadership, true popularity, like the psychology of

being a strong leader. You can't put, you can't quantify that. And something like Trump, like speaks to people and like resonates with people. Like, you know, it comes from the heart, like true leadership. And I think when Trump kind of came after Canada through a big wrench into our politics, he really quickly humiliated all of our leaders and kind of just, you know, when Polyev came up, he's just like, yeah, whatever. What's his name again?

Like, I don't really care what he has to say. And I think it's out of the control now of the Ottawa bubble or the people who are running the conservative party because it's like, oh, man, like this guy. is, you know, so many people in Alberta, like, want to become American now, you know? And like, how do you explain that with the numbers? It's like it's because a masculine, strong leader has showed up and is actually doing conservative things, deporting people, actually going after woke institutions. And if you compare that to Polyev, he looks like a liberal.

So I don't know why. I mean, with this Canada first sort of press conference or sort of rally that they did, They tried to like really be stronger conservatives. But aside from kind of like cynically saying Canada first and cynically kind of mentioning Sir John A. McDonald, I didn't like there wasn't really much of actually fighting against, you know, woke institutions and truly being conservative. Like there's maybe a little bit, but compared to Trump, he said he looks like a liberal. So.

Yeah. I don't know. It's a little unnerving the whole federal politics right now because you have this Trump thing coming in and you know that the liberals thrive on hate and division, right? So this is right up their alley. It's like, oh, this is fantastic. And that's why they've really been pushing that, you know, anti-U.S. And also they've been terrible for Alberta, right? Because Daniel Smith knows her stuff.

She's no, you know, she's the adult in the room. and so you have all the other premieres kind of going against her. It's awful, but the liberals are so, they can really capitalize on that and they have, right? They know how to use hate and division really well. Yeah, I find it sad, but. Well, I mean, it's like you, what movie was it? Not super bad, but knocked up when he's like,

oh, he keeps, he keeps doing the dice. He's doing the dice again. he's doing the dice he's only got the one move it's the dice and that's trudeau and it's let's get everybody fighting against each other yeah and he's just i like how you compared knocked up to canadian politics am i wrong somebody you're not wrong you're not wrong the move works so he's only got one move on doing it he's a dance move right yes yeah everybody's doing the day what happened on uh mashup uh ontario live election coverage. We all did the dance move because it seems to work.

It works every time. That's right. That's right. If it's not broke, then don't fix it. But yeah, I mean, well, while we're on the topic, did you guys talk about how the, you know, federal conservative parties like their numbers have tanked? I'm just, I'm a, I kind of have a chip on my shoulder here because I've tweeted about this like over like a year, like, you know, August 2023 I tweeted if Carney shows up as the as the liberal leader this is in 2023 I said this if he shows up as the liberal leader talks a little bit of game about finances in the economy and he's like more attractive and kind of more charming no offense than pierre polyev like polyev's going to become irrelevant overnight and sure enough that's sort of happened um like

very quickly and uh speaking to kind of what we're trying to said earlier of like you know well the left is divisive. They kind of keep playing that card. I actually think that conservatives need to play their own version of that card. And they're terrified of antagonizing anybody on anything. So now they're actually not, they don't really stand for anything other than, because I mean, let's face it, the success that Polly have had, the success, the success, the success that Polly have had is we're not Trudeau. And also we're going to, you know, save you money because everyone's in a lot of pain right now. And that's like, sure, people want that, but that's not a positive vision. That's not a positive vision for the country. It's just kind of like getting rid of the thing that we don't want.

I use this weird sort of analogy, but, you know, living under the Justin Trudeau government is like, you know, when there's like a hot stove, it's like someone, like we accidentally touch the hot stove and there's this like Ottawa bubble psychopath holding our hand on the stove and we're burning. We can smell our flesh cooking and burning. We want to remove our hand off the stove. And so Pollyev is just the idea of removing our hand off the stove. So obviously we want Pollyev. You know what I mean?

It's like anything to get our hand off the stove. Of course. Like the idea of getting our hand off the stove is obviously attractive to everybody. And before your question, Regina, before your question, I'm just going to invite in to the fray, independent journalist Harrison Faulkner. So for Harrison, thanks. for, thanks for hopping on tonight. We're going to get to you in like one hot second,

but I figure you might as well be in the chat. If you got questions, you want to hop in. But Regina, fire away with your chat. Your question, sorry. I'm just wondering, Greg, how much you trust the polls. Like, I know that they went walkie really fast, like really fast all of a sudden there's a switch. And I was seeing things that I thought I just don't trust.

Like, I know they misuse the polls. And I know the pools are there to sway people's opinion and to make people believe certain things. And at this point, I just really don't trust anything I'm seeing. So I have no idea how things are going because I look at these pools and I'm like, some of the polls I'm looking at and I'm like, nope, there's no way. That's that's illegitimate, right? And other ones I'm like, yeah, I don't know.

So I, that could be true. That could absolutely be true that the polls are fake or they're slanted a certain way. I'm not saying all of them, but some of them certainly are. Sure, sure. However, never underestimate how vast different Canadians are. There's what, 40 million of us now. I remember knocking doors for the PPC and meeting so many people who clearly do not get their news ever off of the internet and they just get it from the CBC. There's millions of Canadians like this.

It can feel like everybody is like us when we're in the online echo chamber. But there's a lot of Canadians who have a completely different perspective on things. than what you might believe. So, and I think some, I forget who said this, but they said, you know, unfortunately the polls are kind of more accurate than you would think. Not to say that they're super accurate, but there probably is some truth to them.

And I guess I kind of wanted to say something a little cheesy, which is, you know, again, us people in the sort of right wing echo chamber, we need to like focusing over analyzing the statistics, like it's the BL end all of politics, I think is really hurting us right now. we really need to like come from the heart and actually say what needs to be said and be brave and like really Well, I think that's what isn't, sorry, isn't that what we're looking for in a leader? Just say it. Right?

Just say it. Absolutely. The media is going to hate you regardless. You ain't winning any boat in downtown, whatever city, pick them. And just carry on with life. Like where does a badge, you out or like the rest of us are doing. And let's just get on with the program. Harrison Faulkner, your thoughts on this.

So on the polling issue. I think that, you know, a lot of conservatives when the odds of a Pierre poly of majority government were basically 99% on 338, conservatives were believing the polls because the polls were giving conservatives what they wanted. And there is one pollster, Frank Graves, who runs Eco's polling, who is, yeah, he's an activist. He's very anti-Polyev. And so I think there are certain polls that you can look at and say, okay, this person

has an agenda. he's not in the pure polling game. He's trying to, he's trying to engineer an outcome with his polling. But the reality is, all the other polling companies are showing the liberals rising and rising quite quickly. So, I mean, I just pulled up 3.38. And for what felt like a year, it literally said, 99% likelihood of the conservatives forming a majority government and having the most seats.

Actually, it was higher than 99%. Now it's down to 83%. And so I think the reality is there is a change in the polls. There is a change that is happening. But is that enough to change the outcome of the election? I think that Canadian voters are pretty much determined to see the Conservatives in office. But it is happening. I think it would be foolish to say all the polling is wrong and not accurate.

There is a change happening. But remember, the polls get it wrong a lot. They got it wrong in the United States. they got it wrong in the UK on Brexit. They can still get it wrong. But to say that there isn't a shift, there really is one. And something needs to be, the conservatives are definitely paying attention to that. I just don't see a reaction just yet that's going to do anything about it.

Well, I would say probably the most telling thing is you look at the people who actually have skin in this game, direct skin. Like obviously we have skin in the game because if we elect Mark Carney, Alberta gets to separate and we're all happy. but but uh anita and nan all the all the all the ontarians are shaking their head down with the idea yeah down with separatism that's okay that's okay all right we don't have to agree on everything we don't have to agree on anything i've just enjoyed the conversation but i would say anita nan saying oh you know what guys i actually changed my mind i think i'm going to run again tells me that

you know, when she announced it two months ago. She saw no hope. She saw no hope. And now the rats are getting back onto the ship. The rats are getting back onto the ship because they think the fire is going to get put out and someone can patch it and they can actually get to port. So it's interesting. And then somebody actually just commented saying polymarket shows P.P. at 66 and Carney at 35.

And I don't know if you guys have been looking at Polly Market much lately. I'm guessing, Regina, you probably have with the PhD in statistics. I find, oh, really? It's fascinating. No. No. There is somebody tell me I'm not making this up. No, no.

It's fun to watch. It's a new element to analyzing, analyzing politics, being able to bet on it and look at, look at what people are saying. Yeah, it's definitely, it's definitely interesting. But I think Polly Market is also, you know, polymarket is very easily manipulated, right? You can foreign, foreigners can get involved in sway results. Okay, but it's they, they have a vested interest. Polly, I would say that Polly market.

I mean, isn't that that's the same as Canadian politics. Foreign can get, foreigners can get involved. Absolutely. That's a fair point. But I would say that they're probably not trying to, influence the outcome of the election. They're trying to get richer off of that directly. It hasn't reached a point where people, where people at CBC are saying, well, let's

go to polly market and see what it has to say about this. Right. Right. It's, it's, I would say, a fairly accurate gauge of where people see things going. And when you get enough data points in them, whether they're international or not, it probably points to towards accurate outcome. And so that's where I find it really interesting. I mean, you know, we talked about it in the, we talked about it actually in the last few election

coverages. We talked about it in the BC one, in the Saskatchewan one, and in the U.S. one. And it was correct on all of those. Regina, I've kept you here for almost an hour. And I don't want to steer you away, but I've been doing the little timing in the back of my brain. And I'm just, I don't want to hold you here all night. I know lots of people give us all the time in the world,

but I guess do you have any final thoughts on the Ontario election that you want to do you want to share or any final thoughts on the conversation we're having? On the Ontario election, I think a lot of people had, you know, it was a foregone conclusion that Ford was going to walk away with this. There was no fanfare, or at least not in my neck of the woods. Nobody was really talking about it around here. I had to convince people to go vote because I think everybody should vote,

you know regardless so yeah not much there in terms of me watching the polls actually i don't i don't really follow them too much because i'm still fighting the um the pandemic war i'm still i'm still trying to take down that narrative and enforce change uh based on what happened in the past so well it's not just the past they actually haven't changed course with a lot of the science stuff so i've just been fighting that battle so that's where my fight is well i appreciate you uh hop it on and giving us, yeah, like really appreciate it. And appreciate if people have never read your book, they really should go out and grab a copy.

Amazon, I assume, right? Amazon? Yeah, it's on Amazon. And I even had to do an update because Phisman's fraud. Yeah, so Fisman's fraud. And I have the accomplices. And the accomplices just the letters that I've written to C.I.H.R. And CMAJ and all the institutions that backed the fraud and continue to do so.

And I've actually had to do an updated version of that because they're still playing the same game. People think it's in the past, but really they're still endorsing these fraudulent studies. They're still writing bogus. You know, there's just, it's nonstop. So I'm going to continue to do this until we see the change. Well, we appreciate you hopping on, Regina.

And well, look forward to the next time we chat. Take care. And then, of course, my fat fingers, folks, I click her out before she can get it out. All right. The next person we're going to add into this sworee here is Alexander Kitty. She's author of the mind under siege mechanisms of war and propaganda. And when journalism was a thing, she appeared, I think she's the, she appeared way back when on the podcast, episodes 263 and 309, May and August of 2022. Alexander, how are you doing?

Good and you? Yeah, we're doing well. We're doing well on this side. Now, you, ma'am, are a propaganda, I don't know, specialist? Is that fair enough? That's fair enough. That's something I've been studying throughout my career. And it's something that is still fascinates me to this day,

watching things grow and change and evolve and spiral all at once. So yes, I would say that's a fair assessment on me. What do you think of the Ontario election, the federal election? I don't even care anymore. You look at how they construct narratives. The narrative on the Ontario election where you like, oh, yeah, everyone just keeps saying it's a throwaway election. It's not a big deal. What do you see?

I see everybody is federally, I think, is just frozen in fear. They don't know. The scripts aren't working anymore. And they haven't been working for a while. So we're seeing what a very, a very, a very. an isolated ecosystem when we're talking about the public sector. And they're used to doing certain things, getting certain publicity. And Justin Trudeau through the years, you know, he gave money to media outlets and all sorts

of things to keep things under control. And then it didn't, it went everywhere haywire and everything that he did worked against him. So here's all these bag of tricks that used to work fantastically, not working anymore. and now you're seeing people they're groping. And yet the Canadian people are not groping. I think it's a very interesting divide between the citizens and the politicians federally.

You think we got any... Just sticking on the federal election for a quick second because we've been talking about the polls switching and everybody going to Kearney. I'm curious. Once again, because the propaganda thing, I find always fascinating. Do you see a Carney out east?

Do you see that narrative changing? Like, everybody's talking about the polls, where the polls are real. not real. Do you see anything where you're like, yeah, the propaganda is working quite well. Like they sent Trudeau down to Trump. He was a lame dunk. Trump dunks on him. And in walks, Doug Ford, I'm going to be captain Canada, calls a snap election. Now you got Carney circling in saying he's going to be the protector of Canada. And everybody's just bra, bra, all this stuff. You see the polls shifting.

What do you see? I say it's too soon to say. Carney is just a, like we say a luxury brand name. Everybody knows him from being the Bank of Canada seems solid. His name's on our money. Basically. And everything else. So he seems like a safe choice.

But right now, safe is probably the absolute worst way to go. That's when you're working from fear and uncertainty. So he's getting, you know, he sort of was the liberal great pumpkin. You know, they were making sure that, you know, they thought. we're hitching everything on his name. And he's coming out and everything's sort of lackluster. Yes, the polls are changing. But this is way too early and things are not going.

We don't have this script. This is totally unprecedented where you have a sitting president saying, well, we're going to annex your country. Oh, yeah, a little bit of economic terrorism here. What works and what doesn't? I think it's almost like as if Ottawa right now is almost irrelevant to what's in the hearts and minds of Canadians. And I would say this was a great awakening for Canada.

This is something totally different where people are going, well, you know what? It's in our hands. So Carney is getting a lift on the one hand, but there's no, let's say, narrative that's really touching people. And in Canadian politics, you need a leader who has a charisma,

a personality and presence. And he's playing it way too safe. So I think he's getting a lift, but it's right now, I wouldn't take that to the bank that he's going to win an election. I think it's a foregone conclusion that the liberals are going to stick by him. He's the safest option. But what's going to happen next will be anybody's guess within the next few months.

Craig, isn't that what we were kind of talking about before? Canadians want somebody with a little bit of, I don't know, personality, a little bit of zing, a little bit of just like, just speak from the heart, man. It's okay. I mean, that's what human beings want. Human beings, you know, human beings don't actually vote for policies. Human beings don't actually, like they don't follow a piece of paper. They follow a strong man.

They follow a person. They like the personality. You know, it transcends all of this stuff, all these numbers that we talk about. They want to follow a strong personality. And what I worry about with this kind of upcoming dialectic between Carney and Pierre is, you know, with Trudeau, they've kind of successfully made us a post-national state. They sort of successfully, you know, we have woke ideology, the far-left ideology that's aligned with like the violent group Antifa, by the way, that's entrenched into so, so, so many of our institutions, it even affects

corporate culture. So that's, that's happened. Trudeau has accomplished that. And unfortunately, Pollyev does not seem to be willing to actually push back against that, push back against the fact that conservatives get vilified. There's a blogger who got fined, what, $380,000 for saying the wrong thing about a drag queen. So the conservative base or conservative-minded Canadians are getting fined for saying the wrong thing about drag queens. And Polyev is not willing to speak about that. And there's countless other examples. And with this happening, I worry it's going to become this weird conversation about who can save us more money. So we have all these woke institutions. And now we have the popular Ottawa bubble mainstream media. And unfortunately, some of the alternative media is kind of

playing into this Carney versus Karni versus Polyev dialectic, which it just makes everything about saving a little bit more money. And the kind of the woke institutions, the deterioration of Canadian identity and just like the acceptance of this multiracial, multicultural reality of Canada is kind of just taken for granted. It's like, yeah, that's just what we are now. And there's no strong opposition to immigration in all of this, which is like kind of the biggest problem, in my opinion. But that's what I worry about the most is that this kind of new dialectic between Carney and Polyev is just going to be all about, you know, just about money stuff and nothing about the sort of social issues that are like so crucial and existential to Canada.

Well, I think you're, you know, when it comes to immigration, the liberal policy has basically been that we are dying of thirst on a life raft. And so let's drink some salt water. Now it's it's basically it's been like, oh, well, our GDP sucks because we've got bad policies. So let's bring in a whole bunch of tiny little things that are going to bring it up nominally and is going to cause a bunch of bigger issues down the road. we're not thirsty for a little while, but there's a day of reckoning that's coming. And the thing that I've been really disappointed with basically everybody but me, if I'm being

honest, when it comes to this whole Carney debate is that they're not talking about the fact that these liberal leaders, these prospective liberal leaders are completely interchangeable. Like, it's, it's okay, do you want to get the person who strongly believes that what they were doing was wrong, but never said a damn word about it for 10 years, or the other person who strongly believes that the direction that the liberals were taking was wrong, and they have new ideas that they didn't voice

for the last 10 years because they went along to get along, or the person who strongly believes that they know the way forward, and they were too chicken shit to say it because it would have been bad for their political career for the past 10 years. If I can jump in, I think the federal election, if Mark Carney is smart, he tries to go in right away and ride this momentum that he's been able to build.

And they're going to frame it mostly on Canada versus the U.S. The same way that this provincial election has been entirely framed on. And that is a very powerful force. Whether people on the call or watching feel the same way, there's no doubt I think it'll be hard to argue that this, this meant. mentality, this Canada versus U.S. mentality is very powerful in this country. And it's proven to move polls. It's proven to be very successful for Doug Ford. And so I think that's going to be the real, the real issue here. And I was thinking about this, Mark Carney, besides, however you feel about Mark Carney, and I'm no, I'm certainly no fan. And I think that he's wrong on the biggest and most

important issues. I was thinking he may be the most, if he becomes prime minister and doesn't just immediately have Trudeau dissolve parliament and go right to an election, he actually becomes prime minister. He may be the most, it's hard to say, maybe the most qualified person to hold that position in a way. And it's, it's, if you think about it, has, has there been a Canadian prime minister who has led the Bank of Canada and the Bank of England, a foreign countries, central bank, and had the, the, the position. that he's had in the private sector. I think that's actually interesting. And if you're Mark Carney, you almost want to try to pin that against Pierre Polyev and say, I have all of this experience

outside of politics. I have all this experience running massive institutions and driving economies. And Pierre Polyev doesn't. He was a minister, a longtime politician, but maybe that's the approach that they take. And if they ride this U.S. debate, it's going to be very close. I think that I think that, I think that that's what we're seeing at the provincial level as well. It's it is the driving force in Canadian politics right now. And all of the other issues are going out the window. Unfortunately, people are forgetting about the fact that millions of Canadians are barely hanging on.

Like people are, people are in really, really bad, really bad positions. I consider, I consider it to be like people are basically dying in a way, barely hanging on by a thread. People can barely put food on their table. their cities are changing rapidly before their eyes. But now this threat of tariffs is dominating everything. And I think that's the real story here. I think it's also very much a negativity.

And you don't want a population that's afraid. And this is what we have right now with a lot of Canadians being, when you're afraid, it's either fight or flight. And you're seeing a lot of that right now. And we can see that one outsider and then, you know, in another country has totally. change the way we think, how we behave. Absolutely. This is what I call Trumpaganda. He has managed to totally take Canadian brains and totally rewire them. And people are starting to panic. They're

looking this. They're looking that. But yet we're seeing Canadians go, okay, I'm not going to shop America anymore. I'm going to remove my dependency on this. So we're having not completely effective propaganda where you've not seen Canadians shake in their boots so much. But they have, our identity has always been, what, for the last 150 years, United States has been, you know, our neighbor that, and everything else. This is like the neighbor you've held, held on to and really cared for for decades, all of a sudden turn on it. And now we're in totally uncharted territory.

So I don't think so much that what we're looking at an election, we're looking at powerful personalities or who can, do better who what who can work on the fly because everything else you know we're in a very much an insulated very much a safe kind of country for decades problems of course we all have but what's interesting now is who of these leaders can think on the fly not get everybody in a panic saying you know what we're going to this is not a negative this is a positive and we can turn this to make this country bigger and stronger this is what people want to hear a neat to here, to kind of slap them out of the fear and terror of what can happen next.

So we're, you know, looking at all the problems. But what I'm not seeing is people talking about what is the future, how can we make it our own, and how we can ignore a threat, you know, a lot of smoke and mirrors from the south right now, and understand that we wouldn't be under attack if we were weak. So we're actually the stronger country here, and the weak prey upon the strong. So how can we get out of this mindset and go in, you know, don't have to be like a soldier, but it can be like a soldier, except we're not going to be, we're not fighting you. We understand that you're in a mess, economic mess. You've over-promised things. It didn't work out. And now, you know, you have all these problems and you're not taking it out on us.

So we have something. We must have something besides our natural resources that we could actually be a much stronger nation, you know, on a, on a, on a little bit. global stage and the smaller stage if we can kind of figure out what that is and not give in to fear. And I'm, you know, my concern is that people are getting very much afraid or getting angry and not, you know, they're getting misdirect. There's misdirection here. There's distraction here. So how do we take this, what we have and make it something even better than what we had before and totally say, you know what, no matter what's thrown at us, we're better than that.

We can move forward and do better even with all these distractions. That's what I think the key question is right now and which a federal leader can do that. I would say though, and I've been confused about some of the reaction that what I'm seeing from many conservatives on social media in this country, I've been confused about the apprehension

towards people trying to encourage Canadians to buy Canadian. I don't understand why that's a bad thing. And I think a lot of this has put us, it's actually, I see some of it as positive. The reaction to all of this in many ways has been positive for us. We're now having a conversation where the possibility of having no interprovincial trade barriers is real and it's in the works and it's happening. That's huge for us.

We're now having a conversation about building partnerships outside of the United States, embracing Kansuk, finding new relationships and trading relationships for this country, which is good. Lessening our reliance on the United States is a good thing. So a lot of the reaction has been, because there are people on the left also saying this, many conservatives are saying, oh, we can't do that.

We can't buy Canadian when Canadian businesses are under attack. I just don't understand that. You know, it doesn't make any sense to me. We should always be trying to support ourselves and buy Canadian products. It doesn't matter if someone you disagree with is also encouraging that idea. I just don't get that. And I've been, I have to say, I've been a little frustrated with that. I just don't see why that's a negative at all.

I'll hop on top of that, which is I think that a lot of Canadians, we're like a younger nation compared to the states, right? And I think because of that, we are still very naive and a little bit childish on how we approach politics. And I think that, you know, right-wing Canadians maybe in general follow more closely because they're more online. But we kind of need to shake off sort of like these old sort of simplified frameworks of things of, you know, Trudeau bad, liberals bad, that's it. And we need to really focus, I think, on being disruptive, being very disruptive. Because, you know, right now I think Canada is at an all time low in terms of how we feel about ourselves as a nation. You know, we just had Trudeau come in and totally obliterate and turn our kind of identity

into, you know, a small pile of rubble. And I'm afraid that one of these new leaders might try to pulverize that rubble into dust. And I think that the solution really is, you know, whether it's Carney or Polyev, there might be some nominal improvements. But as I was saying earlier, in terms of, you know, the woke institutions that we have now, in terms of the foreign interference, the high level corruption, the demographic change through mass immigration, none of this is being addressed. All of this is being swept under the rug. And it's to say that people like us who are in this like, you know, more right wing echo chamber, I think it is our jobs to. be more disruptive and try to force the people in the Ottawa bubble to bring this stuff to the forefront.

Because it really, I don't know what the feeling is, but it's creepy, it's eerie. I don't like it when it's like, well, who are we going to vote for guys? You know, it's like, I don't like any of these options. I don't like any of these options. And as long as conservatives are afraid of being called names or sort of like going outside of our own sort of echo chamber or getting attacked by the CBC, like nothing is going to change because it's and this has been my main criticism of polyev ever since he he kind of came into power if you're afraid of the cbc then and you're not going to disagree with the

cbc this is the same cbc that kind kind of constantly vilifies uh conservatives like the backhanded constantly towards conservative minded canadians so you're just going to take that and you're kind of encouraging all of the people following you that we're just actually going to take that We're actually not going to fight back against this sort of like liberal zeitgeist here in Canada. We're just going to continually get shit on and somehow still win. That's, I've been, you know, I've been freaking out about this. I've been crashing out over this over two years. But like until Canadians actually start to fight back and risk being called racist,

risk being called homophobic or transphobic or what have you, until we are willing to take that risk, then I don't think much is going to change. We can talk all we want. But like in terms of actually solving the major issues in this country, you know, how do you talk about mass immigration or foreign interference and not get called racist? You can't. Your enemies will constantly,

you know, give you that label and then people will run scared. Oh, I guess we can't talk about that because, you know, Rosemary Barton disagrees with it. You know, there really needs to be a cultivation of courage,

especially for people like us who get it. You know, you know who can talk cultivation of courage. It's a lady sitting in the background, I think. Maybe I'm wrong, Tracy. But I'm going to, you know, let's go to six people.

why not for a couple minutes here before top of the hour. I'll let some people get out. But the VP of Public Relations for the Canadian Coalition for Firearm Rights is going to hop on. Tracy Wilson, thanks for joining us. Hey, thanks for having me. I'm happy to be here. You know, if you're sitting in the background and you're probably listening to you're going, they're talking, are we talking provincial politics and we're stuck in?

Like, we have gone down some rabbit holes here. As I've come to the conclusion, the firm conclusion out here in Alberta, and I can be wrong. Maybe you can steer me a different way. Ford is going to win in a landslide. Nobody cares about the election. And so we have gone to what everybody cares about, which seems to be federal politics. Now, I'm saying all that, I'll give you the floor if you want to talk about the Ontario election and give us some thoughts on that. I think you're right. I don't think anybody actually cares about the Ontario election. He didn't call it as a result of the Trump tariff threat. He called it because at the time that he called it,

it looked like we were heading into a federal conservative majority. And typically, now not every time, but typically in Ontario, people vote one way provincially and the other way federally. And I think he was looking at the possibility of an incoming federal majority conservative government coming in, knowing that in a year from now, when the regular provincial election would be called, he'd have a greater chance of losing. So instead of waiting that year out, he's going to guarantee himself. at least four more years and then we'll go from there.

But yeah, that's pretty much the only feedback I have on that. I think he's, you know, he's in for another majority and it's all very, very boring. There's a couple of local races I'm watching. But other than that, nobody really cares about it. That is the greatest take I think I've heard all night. And that right there has all the sentiment of what I've been feeling from all Ontario and folk. Okay. I've been sitting here and I've been texting.

I've just been texting up a storm with people from out there going, going, okay, what do you think? And everybody's like, yeah, you know, I'm going on holidays. I'm going to go on here. I'm not going to vote. I'm like, what is happening right now? Why is nobody caring? Tracy Wilson sums it up perfectly.

Do you want to chime in on the federal side of things with Carney and the liberals and all that jazz? Well, I think just if I may, before we get to that, I just finish off Greg's point about being willing to be called. called all kinds of bad names. I think you're absolutely right in that, you know, you're going to get called these names because you get called these names anyway. Like just you're getting called these names for not wearing the ribbon, for not doing the thing. Who?

Who does not want to wear the ribbon? Exactly. This guy gets it. You're already called a racist, a misogynist, a homophobe, you know, just everything. You're already being called all this stuff for years, and it's become completely meaningless. And people just need to realize that those words have become completely

meaningless because they're just they're just synonyms for somebody who disagrees with Justin Trudeau or Jagmeet Singh, who congratulations, by the way, if you're watching Jagmeet Singh. I'd just like to say congratulations on your multi-million dollar pension. Well done, sir. He earned it, too. Tews. He earned it.

Yep. I mean, the NDP is not a serious party, folks, but he did earn it. Played the game masterly. Yeah, masterfully, all he had to do was just coward. And for anybody, by the way, thinking that this whole Trump tariff thing is going to go away anytime soon or that the people in Ottawa want it to go away anytime soon, the NDP were already broke as fuck. And they had a few months ago, they had $300,000 worth of liquid assets. assets and they had to give 10th of it to Caitlin Ford because she sued the Alberta NDP for court costs, but the NDP is not a serious party, but also in Alberta, they're technically

not even in existence. And so that ended up having to come out of the federal NDP budget. And then they just spent a half million dollars on Jagmeet Singh doing a boxing commercial showing how tough he is and how he's ready to fight. And so they spent, they had less than $300,000. And they spent half a million dollars on one commercial showing him being a boxer.

This is how invested they are in keeping this going because it's the only hope that they have. So anyway, I'm getting sidetracked. Sean, if I'm Tracy, please. Yeah, Harrison. Well, I was going to, going to just jump on under the provincial angle because there are some things that I think are worth mentioning here. The first is that this shows tonight how Canadian voters, Ontario voters,

but I think it's, you know, symbolic of the country as a whole, how voters are easily swayed and manipulated to react on external issues, on the U.S. issue in particular. You know, the opposition to Doug Ford is very weak. I can't believe how weak it has been. And it does a disservice to all Ontarians to have an opposition that is just not at, not at all able to oppose the government. Whether you agree with them or not, we're supposed to have a system where there is some opposition and there simply is none because they're just so weak until, frankly,

the NDP and the liberals don't even have a full slate of candidates in the election. They're just that, they're that week. They really don't have much money. But if you were to ask most Ontarians, is your life better after seven? or eight years of Doug Ford, the answer would largely be no. It would either be it's been the same or it's gotten worse because the issues in Ontario are serious, right? They are really bad.

Rent affordability is outrageous. Millions of unturns don't have a family doctor. The situation is terrible. I just looked up at the education statistics. And it turns out that students in grade three students are two and a half years behind in math. Right. They're over a half of a year behind. They're going to get in school for three years and they're two and a half years behind. Yeah, that's that's their standard. That's that's that's the standard that they're at. And they're a year and I think a year behind in reading skills. So education has gotten worse. Taxes have not gone down. In fact, the lowest earning Ontarians 50,000 and below have the highest tax rate combined tax rate than any other US state. So it's just a really bad situation. The deficit has gone up in Ontario.

So Ontario voters faced with this reality would likely go and vote in another government. But they're not because you have to just be honest about this. This is clever politics by Doug Ford. You know, what's the old saying? You never let a crisis go to waste. Well, they saw this one coming and they immediately called an election and they're going to capitalize on it. But also that happened with Doug Ford in 2022. He capitalized on COVID and was able to secure another mandate.

He'll win a majority government. most certainly you'll increase his seat town it's looking like and that'll be the first time a provincial leader has done so in 50 years three straight majority governments in Ontario. So it it's remarkable. First time in 50 years. Is that what you said Harrison? First time in 50 years for a government to have three straight majority. Before you go any further, does any person listening to this online or anyone sitting here right now go this is the greatest government of all time?

Like I've listed you at. Is anybody happy with the prospect of a Doug Ford majority? No, but the reality is that the opposition is simply not there. It's just basically non-existent. They're dialing it in. When you look at their platforms, when you look at how they talk, how they dress, how they are. You know, if you don't have resources, you at least have personality, you at least have ideas. You can have younger people come here.

This is the future. Where are we going? How are we going to get them? You would at least expect some push, some, you know, you know, chutzpah, some gravitas, something. And you're having, you know, you have the NDP, you have the Green Party, you have the liberals. And I mean, there's, you know, it's basically the been,

this campaign has been Doug Ford and others. That's how I would sum up the Ontario provincial election. It's, there's, it shouldn't be. No election should be where you're saying, and the other people. And, you know, we in Ontario, we are in Ontario, we're really, we don't have a vision, we don't have a blueprint, we don't have a plan, and it's just flying by our seat of our pants. And yet people are perfectly aware of this problem. The problem is that people are not willing to take a risk. They're not willing to be unpredictable.

And that's, you know, when that happens. And I do believe this will happen soon enough because when things are changing, when, you know, circumstances. chances force you. And there's a nice saying I like, you know, bravery is what happens to you when you've run out of options. And I think we, you know, when Canadians are, their backs are against the wall, it's amazing what they can do. But it's still sort of the slumber where you keep thinking everything's going to be okay. Everything's going to be okay. Sure, it will be okay. But you have to do something. You have to go outside of the patterns. And you can see the liberals and the NDP. They're just following the rulebook. I mean, it's like they have blinders.

they're going on like this, and nothing is actually going to change. But I would say that, you know, Doug Ford is also dialing it in because he has at least a commanding personality. And that's what's going for him. The problem is that we don't have a plan here in Ontario. We're complaining. We've always had the same complaints about education, about health care. I mean, if you look at our, you know, platforms 20 years ago and now,

we still have the same problems now, only worse. So what do we as a people? do and I think this also goes in the federal we never make demands of our politicians we don't say well this what are you going to do with us how many people go to different candidates and go okay here's the election you want my vote what are you going to do what is your plan what is your vision what are your hard numbers people would be mortified to do that and I think those would probably be one of the biggest wake-up calls if we went okay mr. Carney what is it that you're going to do for us specifically why

should we give you our vote? And if people were more engaged just a little bit, you know, even if it's just, I swear, trolling, it's better than what we're, you know, sitting and complaining and not letting the people who want that power to do anything about. The engagement in Canada's has been poor to begin with. I think we're seeing an uptick in that. Now, as we draw in on the top of the hour, I can see Darshan sitting in the back. Alexander Kitty, any final thoughts?

Because what I'm going to do is I'm going to let a couple people out and I'll let Darshan in. but as we come to the top hour, Alexander Kitty, any final thoughts before we let you out? I think we're right at the storm. And we're just going to see what Canada is made of within the next few months with internal problems and external ones. But as I said, we are starting to awaken. And I don't think anything is going to quite unite this country,

quite like a threat from the outside from somebody we always thought was an ally. Alexander, great seeing you again. appreciate you hopping on and while we'll look forward to the next time. Thank you. Thank you. And I keep doing that. My fat fingers keep kicking people out before they're done saying goodbye. Greg Wycliffe, you've been here for an hour.

Good sir. We appreciate you giving us a little extra time. Any final thoughts before we let you out of the show? Yeah, absolutely. Just to kind of jump on the point that people kind of were alluding to, I brought it up earlier as well, which is Canada is a younger nation. And I think that we are very naive and more apolitical. And we're facing the consequences of that.

You know, when you have a populace that is not like to compare to the Americans, it might be easier. Like Americans treat their politics a lot more like a sport. Like it's a lot more involved. They got the, you know, they're much more patriotic in general. And we almost define ourselves in opposition to that. Or at least during my lifetime, that's kind of how anti-Americanism has been. manifested. It's like, well, we're not patriotic. You know, we're not pompous. We're not this.

We're not like, we're on my freedom. We're not patriotic either. We're throwing the baby out with the bathwater. We're throwing the patriotism and the sort of the energy to actually want to hold our officials accountable. That's like seen as American or bad. And maybe that's an oversimplification. But I think we're kind of seeing a sort of lack of wanting to, you know, participate in our politics. And in my experience, the people who, the Canadians who have come forth to actually start participating are super naive to how politics works. I joined the PPC in 2019. And I'm over here. And I was like, hey, I just want to do the right thing. I want to help my country. And oh my God, we were all very naive. The one guy at the... Hold on for a sec, Greg, though. I was going to let you go.

But it's funny. I got Darshan. Darshan, I'm going to bring you in, okay? Because you have a world perspective that I would find very fascinating to what Greg just said. So Darshan has, it's been a while. Good, sir. It's good to see again. He's a chartered accountant turned Canadian political analyst. That's, that's, like you've got to go way back when on the podcast when I was still doing some roundtables for the Western standard. And I had yourself on that's September 2020. So welcome to the show, Darshan Maharaja. I hope I said that right. I think I got it close. Greg just said Canadians are naive and we're a young nation and everything else. You've immigrated this country. What do you see? I'm very curious now to what you, Greg just said. your thoughts on that. Well, thank you, Sean. Thank you for inviting me. And I normally disagree with

Greg on Twitter, but here I agree with you. This is the most lackluster election that I have seen in my life. And that means not just Canada and India, but also Kenya, which was way younger. It is way younger a nation. They got their independence in 1963. So by then, you know, when I was seeing the election in 1994, they had been an independent country for just over 30 years. And the amount of excitement that I saw, I mean, this election is completely lackluster and because of two reasons.

One is that while we knew as far back as six months ago that Premier Ford was going to call an early election, neither of the two main opposition parties was ready. With candidates, with their narrative, what message they wanted to give. Yeah, they were giving interviews here and there and saying the usual things that I have been hearing for 20. plus years in Canada, healthcare is a mess. Yeah, it was a mess when the liberals were in power and it's a bigger mess because so much time has passed. You know, with every government, you will get a bigger mess because nobody is doing anything about it. So they were not prepared, which brings into question their competence in forming a government. If they are in government, let us suppose, how would they perform, in my opinion, abysmally.

Because they were not ready for something that was forcing six months. So they lack the administrative stroke managerial skills required to run the affairs of a province. Number one. Number two, the issues that should have been front and center in this election were shoved aside because of President Trump's threats of tariff and making Canada 51st state. And then Premier Ford was able to step forward saying only I can protect you. And I have seen this movie elsewhere in India as well as in Kenya where, you know, the politician's best line of attack against their opposition is that only I can protect you from name the issue.

So it gave him an unfair advantage. now that is not to be begrudged he is in office and therefore he is able to go to us and talk to all the media and maybe the politicians there etc which ability the opposition leaders lack but then they also lack the creativity to counter that so this has been like almost not an election we'll well that's that's kind of what i'm getting out here i literally just got texted loving the election coverage from an Ontario guy. My wife didn't bother to vote. I voted for a random guy's a way to say F you to Ford. No one cares

here. I'm like, this is, I know Tews told me this is exactly how it was going to go. We had a discussion in the background as we're leading up to this. It's this is the most strange thing. This is the most distilled version of Canadian politics you can imagine. You've got

a do nothing conservative up against a couple complete idiot parties and nobody willing to take a chance on the outliers. This is the most Canadian version of an election you could possibly imagine. Well, and I go to, I go to Greg's point. I'm just that naive guy who got involved in politics and I've been naive. I see you said that, Greg, I'm like, hand up over here, hand up over here. This guy right, right here. Tracy, I invited you in and then you've just been in

this swarm of like so many personalities. And Harrison, I apologize. I told you 15, 20 minutes. you've got to give me a hand up if you're like, it's time to go and I can give you a final point. But Tracy, I'd love to get you back in the conversation. Well, I wanted actually to touch on what Greg was talking about, that we've got this sort of, you know, crisis of courage in the conservative movement. And it's true. Now, there's been a little bit of movement on that. And I'll describe it from my point of view. As you know, I'm with the CCFR, the Canadian Coalition for Firearm Rights.

And it's a tough gig in Canada trying to convince all these normies. that it's perfectly fine for us rednecks to have our A.R. 15s and handguns. So, you know, it's been a terrible uphill battle with this liberal government. But you've seen previous conservative leaders who, you know, and I'll go back to O'Toole, right? He was, you know, you guys are right. This is unfair. You know, I'll overturn the bans. I'll do these things until he got a little bit of pushback.

And then he just, he just waffled, right? He didn't have the courage to stick to his guns, so to speak. And then you see Pollyev, he kind of comes along and he does have some backbone on these issues. He does take a stance on some things, not everything that he should. But this is a perfect example, is that he stuck to his guns about the gun stuff. And with that, he was getting polling in a super majority conservative government. That's what it was looking like we were going to have at the time, right? You know, that's still up in the air what's going on with that.

but he's never wavered on that. So, you know, he didn't O'T O'Toole himself on it. But I do see Greg's point that there's still so much more. But you're right. People are afraid, especially conservatives, are afraid to come forward with some of these ideas and thoughts and just say it straight out. We say it to each other in chat rooms. We say it on the phone. But nobody wants to say it out loud. They're too afraid to get Oduled. Right. And I think I think, But that's, you know, that's O'Toole himself. I like the fact that that's a verb. Yeah. I think that's great. The lasting legacy of that guy is. Did any one of us think at any point O'Toole was a strong leader? I don't remember seeing that guy.

I'm like that guy. I like to his resume. I'm not going to lie. Sure. Before he opened his mouth, you're like, yeah. He was basically just. Then he walked out and you're like, that that's our guy that's good debate. He was Justin Trude.

with no hair. At least Justin Trudeau had the hair. True. Yeah. I remember his speech when he, when he became leader and he was like, conservatives are going to do something about climate change, because that's what Canadian conservatives want. And it's like, what? Where did they find this guy? I'll say a couple things and then to get out of your hair if you want. Yeah, well, at first, before you say a couple things, thanks for hopping on, Greg. We appreciate it. Now, fire off on the thoughts. And if you're if you're in our neighborhood, definitely let us know. If you're, if you next time you're on a cross Canada tour, I, you know what? I'm completing a documentary at the moment and there's going to be some people in

Alberta that I definitely want to talk to. So I may, I may, um, uh, you're, you're in Alberta, right? We both are. Yes, we are. Yeah, yeah. So I may take you up on that. But, um, yeah, just try to tie all this, all this together that we're talking about here. I was talking about the naivete of people in Canada.

We're kind of a younger nation, not as like involved in politics. And even if we are involved in politics, I think we can still kind of be naive. And sort of the big red pill that especially I wish Normies would realize is that, you know, there are powerful international actors. There's different nations. They're warring for money, power, and resources. Like this foreign interference stuff is not a joke. Okay.

And the foreign interference, that's just what we've heard about. That's just the stuff that's actually been caught and recorded. Who knows how much deeper it really is? You know, shoutouts to the World Seek Organization, who has connections to like the NDP, the Liberal Party and the Conservative Party. And I think that in general, like the inefficiencies of your bureaucracy at every level in Canada, especially Ottawa, the foreign interference operations are probably more sophisticated and efficient than like our actual bureaucracy.

You know what I'm saying? Like potentially that could be the case. And bringing it back to Doug Ford, Ford, there's only, and like why this election is such a dud and why it just seems like Ford is like, hey, you're going to vote for me again and that's it and no one's going to show any resistance. You know, there's, it's almost as if there's only so many resources for political campaigning. There's only so many people that are willing to actually like make an impact in Canadian politics. And it's almost like they got all the good guys working for Ford's campaign.

And they may possibly, if you want to go more conspiratorial, maybe the people who are like at the trough are already secure at the trough of like you know getting the kickbacks and getting the benefits of being near the people of power and getting to like you know benefit from the policies that Doug Ford pushes you know like that's kind of secure already so it's like let's just keep our spot at the trough here let's kind of just keep the way things are let's keep the status quo and there's no sort of political faction or political willingness to kind of disrupt those people who are at the trough the swamp whatever you want to call it we we can brainstorm different terms. We could use the swamp term. But it sounds cheesy. But, you know,

and I've said this earlier, but like we, you know, we do need to dig deep as Canadians and be outspoken, you know, constantly censoring ourselves, constantly acting like slaves to the CBC. People need to speak up. And in general, you know, Pollyev needs to be forced to do and say the right thing. This idea that we're all going to sit on the couch and then eventually he's going to become like a real conservative. It's not going to happen. You know, and I don't want to see people sheepishly supporting his new version of what I would call post-nationalism. It doesn't matter if your name is Patel or Polly-Ebb. Doesn't matter if your name is Martin or Mohammed.

A Canadian is a Canadian. Anyone from anywhere can do anything. Okay. So some Sri Lankan refugee is now breaking and entering into a house in the GTA. They can do anything, right? People need to speak up against this and it needs to be disruptive. And that's really, you know, again, it's such a low point right now in Canada, this idea that just voting for one of the people who

is out there, no, no, no, we need to show up, be disruptive. And also, I'm not saying, like, be belligerent either. You know, like, have your talking points, be composed, be professional, and actually oppose mass immigration, actually call for deportations. And if you look around, the only one doing this is Maxine Bernier. People love to criticize this guy. And to be fair, I think there is room for improvement. I actually give them some constructive criticisms myself. But at least he's trying. At least he's out there trying and pushing forth the policies that Canadians actually want. Oh, but he doesn't speak good enough English.

At least he's working on the car. At least he's in the hood. He's in there in the hood trying to like, oh, well, he doesn't have the right tool set. Are you going to help? Are you going to help try to fix the engine of the nation? Or you're just going to criticize the guy who's actually putting himself out there? Anyway, thanks for having me. got a little heated there, but I appreciate you,

uh, have me on guys. Greg, appreciate, appreciate you coming on. Thanks very much. We don't go back at an onion one of these days. There's,

there's very, we could have a really fun conversation about that. There's very few people that have, uh, uh, uh, no filter like twos. And,

um, you, see twos, he finds a way to do it relatively PG, you know, twos has the, the filter where the, anyways,

doesn't matter. This is a shot. I got to jump in because we got it. It's the Ontario election stream. We have to announce the, results, Doug Ford has a majority government already. They just announced it. It's over.

You have time to upload. Just wanted to make sure everyone was aware for that breaking news that Doug Ford has won a majority government. I know, shocking. Sean, I got a bounce, but this is what I was going to say was that this just shows, again, like I was saying, this is about timing.

This is about what Canadian voters are able to do. if you present them with the right time. And if Mark Carney decides to call an immediate election, he's going to have a far better shot at winning the federal election than he would if he was to wait. Because the U.S. issue, the tariff threat, is driving Canadian politics right now. There's really nothing else that it appears.

Voters are really concerned about at the moment, whether we like it or not. And this just shows, I think, how strong this the the U.S. issue is. And also, I will say, I think there wasn't really any other way Doug Ford could have responded to the tariff threat. I think that the approach to try and acquiesce to Trump and to try to find a way to, to play diplomat as Daniel Smith did, didn't really do anything. It's safe to say that what Doug Ford did didn't do anything. The reprie of I think was going to happen no matter what.

But to me, you have to stand up for the country. You have to show that you're not going to take this. It could have resulted in 500,000 Ontarians losing their jobs, a disaster for Canadians. And something had to be, you know, you had to have some response. And so being patriotic, going for this team Canada approach, I know that that's been overused, but it was the only way to do it. And I think that the person who does try to embrace the country the most is going to have the most amount of success in this in this new environment.

It's not really about, you know, liberal versus conservative right now. I think it is who is going to better position the country against the United States. Whether that's good or bad. I think that's obviously not great. But that clearly is where this country is going. There we go. Harrison, appreciate you hopping on and doing this. And then announcing whatever.

Everybody's been kind of just throwing in the background. And it's like, it's going to happen. Don't worry about it. Let's just carry on with life and talk about some things. Harrison, we appreciate you coming on and doing this. And as always, best of luck in whatever you're up to. Thanks, guys. And look forward to the next time you're on.

Appreciate it. Thank you. Take care. Yeah, I'm out of here as well. Yeah, Greg, appreciate it. You just zip it for a second. Greg, appreciate you sticking around and giving us some extra time tonight. It's been a lot of fun.

and appreciate you being unfiltered, as I was trying to point out, like twos. Thank you, sir. That's, that's all I know. That's all I know how to do. So, thanks for having me, guys. Have a good night. All the best. There, my fat fingers aren't knocking everybody out.

Tews, now you may ask. Now I may ask. Or talk. Fucking excuse me? You heard me. All right. So here's what I wanted to point out is that basically the minute this map went live. Because, yes, for those of you turning to it again a little bit into the show, we are the only people in Canada, in the history of Canada, aside from CBCC TV and Global, that have a live map.

This is our live map. And as you can see, it already has the progressive conservatives at 64 seats and they need 61 to have a majority. So the first data that this map populated with basically has the conservatives at a majority already. So thanks for coming out, everybody. We can go home now. I mean, it's kind of sad, isn't it? Like, we sat here for a couple of hours talking to a whole bunch of people. And I was saying, I'm like, it's like, nobody cares.

This is super strange. And then you talk to all the people out in Ontario, and they're like, yeah, it's foregone conclusion. Nobody cares. I'm like, nobody cares. third term government first time in Ontario history. I think if I got that correct from people on here. First time I go 50 years, Harrison. 50 years. 50 years. That's right. 50 years.

And you're like, okay, they must be pretty good. Nope. Nobody thinks that at all, at all. It's really interesting how unlike Doug Ford is and yet how commanding his lead is already. It's because all the other options are so much even worse. That's the problem. People aren't voting for Doug Ford or voting for the conservatives. They're voting against the liberals and the NDP. I feel like the NDP would have a better shot at winning if they brought back Bob Ray.

Well, probably. Yeah. Yeah, and I'm not even sure what the liberals were doing, having Bonnie Cromby as their leader. Could you find a more unlikable woman? well i mean she literally said she's like i don't do brampton events i don't give a shit about brampton yeah brampton has what six seven seats something like that six why would you why would you even say something even if you think that like i don't really give a shit about brampton but that's because it's 2,500 miles away right well if you

watch the debates did you i don't know if you guys watched the debates they were also extremely boring. I think we drank a lot of wine and just played a drinking game. But she wasn't in it to win it and she made that very clear. In fact, her plea to the viewers was if you are a progressive Ontario voter, instead of voting for the NDP, vote for her party. So she was just there to steal seats from Merritt Stiles and not at all to be competitive with Doug Ford. So, yeah, it is literally the most boring, uneventful pre-programmed election ever. Nobody cares. This is the Seinfeld election.

Yep. What was the drinking game? What was the drinking game? Every time Bonnie Cromby would screech, we would drink another gulp of wine. So, yeah, it was rough. Well, at least Chris was interested. He wasn't there. No, it was just calling.

and I. I'm going to add in a fifth here. We got Canadian lawyer. She's got over 20 years legal experience. I know her. I think most people know her as lawyer Lisa on Substack. Lisa Myron. Thanks for hopping on. Nope. Maybe we can't see it. Can anyone see her?

No. I can see her in the bottom. I can see her in the bottom too. She's froze. Well, I guess she's not hopping in. All right. Well, thank you for coming, Lisa. It was great. Next time, if you can speak up a little bit more, we'd appreciate it. Darshand, you've been, like, when it comes to elections, you've seen a lot of different countries do, and you were talking about, like, this election, it's abysmal. Like, it's just sad.

What do you, like, I've been trying to, um, certainly things like this help bring people in to, like, have a little bit of fun with a topic that's, you know, at times, it's a foregone conclusion. Like, we've done nothing tonight, uh, that, that would have changed anything, right? None of this is changing jack squad about the election. We're having a little bit of fun doing it. And you hope you can just build a little bit of following the like to maybe just tune in to some things and try and figure out what's kind of going on in your own country, your own province for Pete's sake. What have you what have you seen in Ontario? I don't know. Like I'm just curious.

About this election? Yeah. See, in the normal course of things, the, issues that would have been at the forefront. First of all, the international student mess in which Ontario has played a major part. In fact, I think the lion's share of the blame goes to Ontario, certifying all sorts of shady colleges,

you know, colleges that are in strip malls and small plazas and even an office building with probably 500 square, a rate of space of an office unit. And that is at the crux of a lot of issues. In fact, most of the issues like housing affordability, availability of jobs, extra stress on the healthcare system, the cohesion in society. There is a whole spectrum of issues where this is the cause. and Ontario allowed it to grow into a monster.

That would have been an issue. Then the reckless licensing of truck drivers, CBC did an investigative piece on that. That's Canada wide, though. That's not just an Ontario thing. But it's also in Ontario. Right? So that would have been an issue.

It's creating carnage on the highways. I'm seeing on Twitter every day, right? These are the issues that would have been at the forefront. But fortunately for Premier Ford, President Trump threw in a wild card and now the whole game became his. And, you know, this is something that I have written about maybe two or three articles. The entire system of the intake in the political structure is such that. that you are only going to get duds. Anybody with a spark of fire or an iota of ability will be automatically excluded.

Because the whole game is about signing up new members of the party who will then vote for that candidate in the nomination meeting. I have never understood why someone who signed yesterday as a member. of the party gets a right to vote for a candidate today. Like I came to Canada, I was a permanent resident. I wasn't allowed to vote. I had to establish my credentials and then gain citizenship and then I got the right to vote. This is a friend of mine said that your primaries have been hacked. Then you get these special interest groups in immigrant communities, especially now I'm

I'm talking about the Greater Toronto area, where religious or ethnic communities will organize in their place of worship, decide on one candidate that we are pushing this guy or this lady. And then they become candidates. The parties are not the least bothered. They are not looking for talent. They are looking for votes and for money, especially donations. to the party. So what happens is the person who can deliver the votes and bring donation funds to the party automatically gets projected. And then that person with absolutely no skill to bring to the

table is now your lawmaker. And they are only going to follow what the party says. As a voter, I don't have a voice in either Twin Park or in Ottawa. Because whoever is supposedly representing me is not representing. They are either representing a special interest group or they are too timid to say anything against what the party wants to do. Have you seen any dissidents like you see in the UK, for example? No, they get kicked out. It's like we were talking about the 2021 federal election before with Aaron O'Toole

where he specifically said that if anybody doesn't support a carbon tax, they're not going to be able to run in their writing. He flatly said, regardless of what the people in your community want, if you're not personally supporting a carbon tax, you're not on the ballot. Now, even before that, in 2019, when Andrew Shear was the party leader, Dr. Salim Mansour was got disqualified.

He wanted to run, I think, from London or thereabouts. And I met him. He is a fantastic gentleman. But because he had written and expressed views against Islamism, as a Muslim, the party said that your views are Islamophobic. So he was... He was a Muslim guy who had some critical things to say

about his own religion. Yes. And he got kicked out because of it. I didn't... I hadn't heard this. And then he ran for PPC. You know, Maxim Beny had just formed the party and Dr. Salim Mansour thought that he can make some headway here.

Maxim was looking for good candidates. So he became a candidate. and the voters didn't elect him. So now the rot is on both sides. If I'm the voter, I would vote for him. Regardless of the party, he is representing. Because I know that this guy has, number one, the courage of his convictions, number two, opinions and views worth respecting.

And that he will represent me in Ottawa, rather than representing Ottawa in my riding. But he didn't get enough votes. So if someone like Dr. Mansour can fail to get elected just because he's not from one of the three main parties, then there is something fundamentally wrong with our politics and the way we think about our democracy. So, you know, this is, I mean, as I said, I have written maybe two or three articles on this. I call it nominal representation. We are nominally represented. We are not in reality represented.

Then you get people like even today I was seeing on Twitter saying I have not received my voter card. I said, dude, you are born here. I came here 20 years ago. I know that I don't need a voter card to go and vote. I just have to show up there with an ID. How come you don't know? So the knowledge of politics is very poor. the functioning of politics is even poorer than that on both sides, both the parties and the electors.

So we are in a bad place. I'm sorry to say this. Tracy, I got multiple guests sitting in the background before I bring any of them in. You've been in here for some time. I want to give you some final thoughts before I let you let you out. And I appreciate you hop on tonight. Yeah, I appreciate the opportunity. Look, I mean, I think, you. You know, it's an old saying that politics shouldn't be a spectator sport. Unfortunately, in this country, for most people it is. You know, we're grounded in politics.

We talk about it all the time. We're tweeting about it. But for the average Canadian, they're not affected by it. They'd have no idea what's going on. So, you know, my advice to everybody listening is talk to people, especially before the next federal election. Because that could be the one that really makes a difference for people. So get out, talk to people, and just spread the word because, yeah, all these

normies sitting at home have absolutely no idea what's going on. Ideally, you should be able to just live your life and not be focused on it, but that's not the reality that we live with in this country. So, yeah, get involved. Tracy, thanks again for hopping on tonight. Really, really appreciate it. Thanks, guys. Good night. All right. Dar Shan, now, I, I, I, I, I, I don't know how much time you got tonight, but we got multiple guests in the back. You got to tell me right now, do you want to hang in for a few more minutes or do you have to leave as well? Because here's your, here's your opportunity to hop off and, and, or you're in for a bit of a ride. Yeah, I'll hop off now.

Okay, any final, any final thoughts then, Darshan? Yeah, I think what is needed is, uh, uh, you know, effort at the community level to educate more Canadians about politics, including the division of jurisdictions where I have seen friends of mine who ran for a municipal office, let's say school board trustee or councillor or something. And when they go campaigning, people are asking about issues that relate to either provincial or federal. And this is very common, which is why I'm putting it forward. Otherwise, you know, it would have been one odd case here or there. But this is absolutely universal to the point that when Jagmi Singh was campaigning in federal election in 2019 and 2021 in Brampton, he promised the hospital in Brampton. Like, okay, this is provincial jurisdiction.

You are campaigning in a federal election. Why are you confused about jurisdiction? So, you know, as I said, the rot is all over. And the only solution is to educate people for which there needs to be some kind of a community effort by concerned people. Like having a provincial election and then talking about a federal election the entire time? I'm sure we're confusing a lot of people tonight. Well, I mean, there's that. But I think you're absolutely right when it comes to just the civics knowledge in this country is abysmal. and I blame our union ran education system.

Darshan, appreciate you hopping on tonight and good seeing you. It's been a few years and I do mean that. Thank you so much. Great to finally chat with you. Oh, and then my fat fingers, of course. You must have switched. Did you switch over to your phone?

Is that what it is? Why you're delayed all the time? Yes, you. No, no. But I think there's, I think there's a lot of people doing a lot of streaming in the neighborhood because this is, you know, peak internet usage time. Fair enough.

There probably aren't a lot of people tuning into the Ontario election in, in Alberta. Well, I see three people. I'm going to bring you all in at the same time. Okay. So I had mentioned Lisa Myron at the start. That's lawyer Lisa. And then we got three-time Canadian power lifter, North American deadlift record holder April Hutchinson,

uh, thrown in. And then I, a curveball here, because I'm pretty sure. How did this happen? And I'm pretty sure I see Vesper. We got a Quebecwa coming in on the Ontario election. Now, before, I'm going to start with Lisa because she's been sitting here on and off, getting frozen and out. And I'm going to try and work you all in, and then away we go.

But we're off on hour two and a half after, you know, the election's already been called. But regardless, Lisa, your thoughts on the day's events. Oh, and you're muted. And you're muted, Lisa. You're muted. Hey, everybody. Sorry about that. I have always a lot of thoughts about these things.

You know, when you think about the levels of government, you've got to add that next one. We talked about municipal. We talked about, you know, when Bonnie Kambi came from the municipal, we talked about provincial and we're going to get into that. Talked a little bit about federal. Don't forget the globalist.

The globalist, agenda and the globalist infiltration in all of our governments. And so Bonnie Cromby was the mayor of Mississauga. And my specialty is the municipal deep state and globalism on a lot of different levels. And so there was, and I should say, we dodged a bullet that we dodged Bonnie Cromby. But Bonnie Cromby, in complete streets for Canada.ca, had the most advanced goals set for 15-minute cities, for smart cities, for complete streets, and that whole agenda that she, you know, was gung-ho on. But did we know about that? Did she campaign on that? And so what would she have done to the entire province if she's, you know, this close to the globalist agenda?

So we dodged a bullet on that. And then look at the NDP. Look at the NDP. Their campaign promise literally was our economy is going to suck so much that you're going to need the government to buy you groceries. Right? At least they're being honest. for the NDP was, you know, work. Yeah.

Your economy is going to suck so much that the NDP will promise you food stamps. Food stamps was, yeah, was the NDP. You know, surprisingly, the green had some tax cuts. But we're so tired of Woke and we're so worried about Woke. And I know you're in Alberta and you think we're, you know, completely non-conservative. but I think at this point, there was just no sliding further left than Doug Ford. There was just no possible sliding further left than Doug Ford. So I'm kind of happy with the results. I really am.

Okay. Hey, I'm going to slide to April next. April, thanks for hopping in. I know you got friends over and stuff. So I'm like, if you've got to be a quick blast and get the heck out, we completely understand. But appreciate you giving us some time tonight. Your thoughts on the night's events. So yeah, so I'm basically here to talk about, well, I think I talked to you earlier about in my writing here, I have a gentleman, well, I mean, I live in London, Ontario. It's always been an NDP stronghold. There's a candidate here by the name of Terrence Kernigan. And, you know, I had a conversation with him about a year ago. And I basically asked,

him, you know, what is a woman, Terrence? And he basically stated, you know, anyone who identifies as a woman and he supports men in women's sports and in spaces, basically. So I was very much looking for a conservative woman. Sorry, my cats are fighting. And that didn't happen tonight. So I have met Doug Ford. I met him two years ago. And I asked Doug what his stance was about. men and women's sports and he actually said that he he supported me and he supported my stance and he said that men should not be in women's sports um fast forward two years later he's been very silent on the issue um you know call it strategy call it whatever you want but um um i do believe um you know that dug um you know going forward um you know let's let's admit um we can call him flip flop

Doug, flip up Doug Ford. I do believe, you know, if Pierre does get in power that he will follow the Conservative League on that, we do know that the Conservatives do have policy 102, which is keep men out of women's sports and spaces. I do believe that they will put that in place. I'm very happy that the conservatives, you know, have a majority. I do believe that they will protect women in sports and in space. cases. You know, I just, I'm not happy about my writing the sleeping. This is kind of why I'm here to talk about that. But, you know, I don't know, I don't really know what to say about that. I'm just, I'm here to talk about the sports issue, right? As far as Doug Ford, I don't know as far as this year if he's going to say anything about that much. But I do think with the federal election coming up, I do think this year, I do think this year.

there will be some changes for sure going forward. I'm going to let Vesper hop into here. I just want to ask you one quick question so I know where to pay attention to on you, April. How much time do you have first night? Do I have to worry about you or do you have only a few minutes? Because when I was talking to you earlier, my idea was you only had about 10 minutes and then I had to let you get out. Am I wrong on that? No, I have time.

I'm just trying to separate my cats here. So I'm sorry. Yeah, that's why I'm a little bit stressed here. surprise guest Esper from Quebec. Quebec, oh, you're muted right now. Oh, there you go. Besper. Bonjour, you bastards.

How are you today? Welcome to the show. I can see you lighten up the chat. I'm like, oh, we got the Quebec just fired up. He stayed up until midnight. I will come down on the twos in a second, but I want to thank you really quickly for having me on. I'm kidding, by the way, that's not how it really sounds.

Thanks for having me on. And thank you, Tews, for having me. Just FYI, the camera I'm using is off my. phone and us Quebecers yeah us Quebecers will teach you how to do this out there in the West we have all the real gravy here well done I was I was just I just texted them and I said what camera do you have because you look sharp as hell listen there's a reason why it says suplexing twos uh all right thank you for having me on I would just like to say that you know listening to the to the ladies that we're just speaking now I'm in full agreement

with how they feel about the social issues. A lot of things were said before by a lot of the people that I just have a different perspective on. And I think you know that about me, Sean and twos that I try to come at this from an oblique way. And I'm sorry, a part of me just, and I've said this over and over on your streams, which I love, by the way, on the mashup. But it's just it always comes off like it's a little too simplistic. Now, one person kind of touched on it. I think Greg and Tracy, mad props to Tracy on what she brought up concerning provincial and federal dynamics.

As a Quebecer under Legault, we don't, we didn't really have a vote the last time when our Premier got in. He basically paid 500 bucks to every Quebecer right before the election. And he won basically a majority of the vote. So in Quebec, it's not like we have what you guys have and quite, frankly, I'm not really paying attention to Ontario politics because, yeah, it's a shit show here in Quebec. So there's not really a whole lot that we could do focusing on other provinces. But I just wanted to say that right up the, off the bat.

Were you covering anything federal? Because I had some things to share about the federal thing. Or is it just we were just basically just shooting the ship with the federal stuff. We were riffing, but right at the start, we realized real fast talking to all the Ontario guests. that Doug Ford was going to get a super majority or whatever you want to call it. And that there was no need to talk about it. And that's the text line,

literally lighting up. They're like, nobody cares. I didn't vote. I voted for somebody else because the candidates all suck on and on and on and on it went. And literally in the chat, somebody's like in the last election, two minutes in it was Doug Ford

at one in a majority. And that's basically what happened tonight. So it's like it's the most bizarre feeling on this side. But once again, I put my hand up to Greg as a naive guy when it comes to election coverage. This is my first time covering Ontario. I don't follow it.

And so we've branched into a whole bunch of different conversations to have your stay on federal. So I like Greg, but we completely disagree strategically on this whole thing. And there's a reason why. Every single ecosystem that you're going to play with is going to be different. If you're going to go from a provincial ecosystem to a federal ecosystem, even just between provinces, Trump winning is making all these changes in America. But don't forget, they have governors, right? And these governors have a say.

It's not like the guys is going to be able to walk in. You know what he gets to do now that he's in power? He gets to execute a lot of what he's wanted. And he's already a Hollywood guy, so he knows how to market himself amazingly. He loves to be the anti-hero. We know that about Trump. In Canada, we need to also be aware, right? The apparatus that we've all been experiencing over the last decade is that it's not just the liberal part

and the NDP party, what's becoming more and more clear is that there's a whole lot more that's behind these parties, such as the EU and China, that's funding this, right? So you have literally two different views on this. Like it's simplistic, and then there's elaborate. The conservatives, if I was a conservative leader right now, I wouldn't be worried at all about the polls. I mean, like I said in the chat before you invited me, everybody, my uncle in the states in New York and the other one in New Jersey.

You think Kamala has a chance? How could you even say that? Don't you understand the psyche of the individual? And I've said this before to you, Tews. Man, we fired Harper just because we were bored. That's what candidate did, just because they were bored. Ten years of scandals, RiveCan, SDTC, lockdowns, COVID.

And now suddenly everyone's worried Carney's going to win? Dude, I'm going to share one thing just about statistics. and if everyone wants to understand and make a correlation, and I make it brief. So I was looking into HIV cases since 1979 in Statscan. And I was looking over, I have between 1979 to 1998, the preponderance of HIV cases were in the homosexual community, not in the heterosexual community, okay? Like 80%, 80, 85%.

The other 10% was intravenuous drug users. That's what Statistics Canada was showing. Fast forward to today, they're now saying that the heterosexual community is matching up with the homosexual community in HIV. I'm like, hmm, that's fascinating. How did that happen in two decades? I went through their numbers and statistics to see how they arrived at these polls. Turns out that the transgender category was not there. It's not there.

Why is it not there? Because you have a man, you know, who'll say, I identify as women and all the power to you, but there's no category that they would identify as just homosexual or transgender. They would see themselves as a woman, which makes them ergo heterosexual. And the numbers were skewed and they lumped them all in. I demonstrated this also through the Tim Calfield video that I did when he said that 96% of Canadians were seeing disinformation kind of on the daily in COVID. I opened up all the stats can numbers, broke down all the, every five,

out of all the 5,000 people, the CSV file and calculated it, and it's still on my timeline if everyone wants to see it. You can go to Vespa Digital. You'll see that video where I break it down and even give you the files. They lump things together. That means that in some of the questionnaires, if somebody would say, would you vote liberal? If somebody says, like they'll give them five options, like probably,

they will take that probably and put it in with most likely. Yeah, well, it's, it's, um, aggregate data doesn't actually break anything down and bad science gets hidden behind aggregate data. Pretty much. This is why I, I don't understand. If you want to win in anything, I mean, I don't know, have you ever, I don't know about the ladies, but have you ever been in a street fight? So I'd be, growing up, I used to get into street fights all the time.

One or two guys, you couldn't imagine it. Okay. So one or two guys, there's a, there's a, like, you're fighting like this. right and maybe he'll get behind you five guys you need to find something where your back is completely covered and you need to be able to either run away or get your back on a wall so strategies change based on how many opponents you have the conservatives right now the smartest thing for them to do is to let the liberals completely hang themselves with their stupidity every every time that pier gave them something they took it for their platform have you guys noticed that yes but to

To be totally fair, he hasn't really proposed anything groundbreaking. He's not going to. And you know why? Because the entire sentiment, and I'll land it here, we want a Trump in Canada. That's not going to work. The Canadian mindset or ethos is not the American in your face. I don't care. F the crown.

This is how they were bred for four or five hundred years like this. If you just go to America, you'll know that. All my family's in the States. But you come here, we've kind of been living off of an honor code for a very long time. I'd say even up until Harper, okay? It's only in the last decade where it's gotten really dirty. And now we're fighting with vipers. And I'm sorry, I'm not going to go out of my way.

And this is to kind of go back to the whole Maxim Bernier argument. There's a reason why Maxim is polling so low. I actually like what Maxim has to say, but there's a reason why. people have been primed with a bunch of BS and gaslit for about a decade. And I'd say more aptly in the last four or five years to use and Sean. What do you expect? Do you really expect that if you're going to give them a flip narrative that people just receive that wholeheartedly?

Maybe a subset would, but most people would be terrified of a quick change like this. And that's what I understand about the Canadian politics versus the American politics. Canadians will not just immediately flip, partly because we're very stuck to our ideologies and our beliefs, for you to just suddenly come in and not care if people call you a race. It's a moral thing. You've got to come to terms.

And the thing for a lot of us sitting on this group is through COVID, you had to come to a head with a bunch of things. So when you talk about Canada, just team Canada, that's a moral conundrum for most Canadians. But for some of us, whatever part of the, the population that is. I got cut from that team years ago. Well, no, it's just, it's just a quicker, it's a quicker adjustment.

But for some, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, existential crisis of all time. I mean, I don't know. I know Lisa had something to say. I just want to drop this last thing. Think about it. Maxim, one of his platforms, sorry Lisa, just, I need to say this, was talking about the concept of abortion, right?

Like making abortion illegal. Now, I don't have, personally as a, what my belief is is irrelevant here, but most Canadians don't believe in that. Do you see how the messaging from one person's ideology which is disruptive is just going to make them unpopular? There's a way to get people to where you want them to be and it's not that way. You don't just... You bring up

abortion. You watch everybody scatter. I don't get it. I don't get it. See, here's the thing is that the people, the people who want to have the abortions? Are the people who I don't really want populated the future generation?

anyway. So let them have all the abortions. They can have as many abortions as they want. I'm going to bring in one other person here. Simon Esler sitting in the background documentary. And then we've got to go to Lisa too. Yes, yes, Lisa, I'm going to get you. I'm going to get you. Welcome to the show, folks. This is

how it goes. But anyway, Simon, thanks for giving us some time tonight. Thanks for hopping on. Do you have any quick thoughts before I go to Lisa about the I don't know, man? We started out talking provincial politics for like a hot two minutes. And since then, it has been a wild ride. A, thanks for joining us. Two, do you have any thoughts? Yeah, I mean, my view of all this is really that we're less in political battles and we're more incognitive battles. And I think, you know,

something was just brought up that's really, really important is that Canadians have been conditioned. And it's our conditioning that we're up against to great extent. And I think if people understood the way that conditioning worked and the way that this was more cognitive than political, we might better understand what's really going on. You know, I look at what Trump's up to. And from my view, Trump is always engaged in narrative warfare. So he's always waging narratives that disrupt and it, you know, they draw fire and they create these disruptive events in the cognitive battlefield and then people are forced to reconcile. I don't know. That's the rabbit hole that I would take things into personally. And that's where I've been sort of writing

from. And I would say that there's a lot going on in every level of Canadian politics that is deeply conditioned by the globalist agenda because we're like a poster boy nation for that that post-national state that the globalist entity has been seeking. And so we really have to look at what conditioning is deeply entrenched in the Canadian psyche because conditioning occurs in little bits over long periods of time. And, you know, What we're undoing conditioning-wise, I think, is, uh, it goes back very far in our nation's history, I guess I would say. Um, some things coming out in the Ontario election.

I think I've been getting texts about it, uh, that an independent wins, but then I also got scratched the independent. So I don't know if they ended up winning. So that's it. Bobby and Brady. And she's actually the incumbent. She won in the last election as well. And right now she's got 63.67%.

of the vote and the next after that is Amy Martin for the PCs with less than 25%. Sorry. We are doing an election show. We probably should, you know, let people know that maybe an independent one. Lisa, you've been, you've been tromping at the bit to get on. Lisa, can you hear us? Lisa is there, but I don't know if she can hear us. Welcome to live streaming.

Hey, Lisa, can you hear us? Lisa, it's your birthday. Well, it looks like, so my perspective, Fawn, we're going to let Lisa grab a better internet connection because we can't hear her. And hopefully she can do that. And in just in what Simon had said, Vesper, you were not in your head. I assume you agree. 100%. 100,000%.

If there's a number beyond, you are completely correct, Simon. this is the problem, right? We're dealing with simplistic constructs thinking this is how these things work. No, a personality does not get built in one year. You can hijack a personality and turn it cultic within a year, but you're working off a preexisting conditioning. Canadians, I heard of none of you mofos before Harper, after Harper. Like as soon as not even Trudeau, five years into Trudeau, I didn't know any of you. all 13,000 followers that I have, I didn't know. I barely was on X.

I didn't care about, I was watching how to do things on YouTube, how to make honey and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Things like this. Then suddenly Trudeau, flip-flops. COVID happens. Everybody's locked in at home and we're all paying attention. And they can either the waking up or the brainwashing is beginning to happen incrementally day by day.

Today I dropped a video. I don't know if you guys know this. Fauci admitted in January, six feet distancing was just, they don't even know where it came from. Yeah, we covered that on the mashup. We covered it on that. So the whole thing, the whole thing is a programming thing. And we're dealing with cognitive issues, not political.

And at the end of the day, if, like I said, when people, the real thing that matters is when we get to that voting booth. Let the prerogation end. Let's get to the election. And let's see what people. do. And then what's going to happen? What happens when, and assuming Pierre keeps his word on at least 60% of what he said, I wonder how much relevance a lot of people are going to have with their outrage when Canada slowly starts to get back to a mature common sense way of thinking, where Alberta is

becoming stronger, right, where the West is being allowed to work off its energy sector and all these things. Is he going to do everything he says? No, no politician does. But it's certainly better than having a sock puppet and a clown running this country. True. All right. April. No, no, no. Wait, wait one second. April's been trying to hop in. April, what do you got to say? I'm just going to say before I go here, that it's a little bit late here. I have to go to work tomorrow. But I just saw that Neil Lomson just got reelected. He's our sports minister here in Ontario. So I'm just going to say that I hope that just going on what you said here, Vesper, that let's make 2025 the year that political leaders, especially

the men, because, you know, this has been my little bit of a pet peeve here, let's hope that the men can step up and start saying, and stepping up and protecting women in sports and spaces, because I get to see any men except for John Rustad out in British Columbia. He's a male. You know, we know that Danielle Smith has stepped up and made legislation, but let's see some men actually stick their neck out and start saying that men do not belong in sports and spaces because I've yet to see this. And I don't know why, you know, Trump signed these orders, but let's get Canada on board with this because, you know, this has got to be the year because I'm hoping that Pierre will

actually put, you know, policy 102 in place because, you know what, I'm going to keep pounding on this. I'm going to keep holding forward accountable. This is going to be the year. I completely, I completely, can I just say one thing? I completely agree with you, April. It's normal. I would not make any policies or share my agenda until I get into power.

I have a viewpoint on this. Sorry, go ahead, Lisa. You had cut up before. Yeah. Go ahead, Lisa. Yeah. So my view point is that D.E.I. right now using those regular. personal status, you know,

it's basically a Chinese Communist Party type social credit agenda. And what we have to say is DEI is a mandatory religion. No, Natala. It's a mandatory religion and it's a state

sponsored religion. And that's what it is. It's also fascism because I apologize, Lisa, the problem is on this side is we keep getting you kicked out, kicked in, and we can't hear anything. And we're all waiting for you to hop in.

And I want to keep having you in, but we keep losing the flow of the conversation. And I apologize. Yeah, the audio is not coming through, which is a damn shame because I really want to know what you have to say. Yeah. Yeah. It's just for the sports issue alone, it's a slam dunk issue. You know, I mean, take the spaces thing out of it, but to keep men out of women's sports, it's a slam dunk issue. You take the convention two years ago in Quebec.

I mean, I think it was 90% voted in favor to keep the men out of women's sports, you know. It's across the board, right? So, I mean, it's just unfortunate you don't seem political figures, especially men stepping up and saying more about it. I mean, if you take anyone, even Ford himself, if, if, you know, even in this election, if he just came out and said something, I mean, I mean, he won by a landslide, but even if he just came up and spoke up about it, anyone would win even more seats, you know, so it's unfortunate. That's all I have to say about that, but I just want to try him in one thing, April, as you say, even if he doesn't worry about the spaces, it's like, no, let's, like, let's just get right, right?

Just get it right. Yeah. It's time. I mean, we don't have to continue to wait on this. It's like it's already there. I don't know. Maybe the other three gentlemen on here will try and tell me different, but it's like, oh, this is a dead issue.

I don't think the population wants anything to do with it. They really don't. It's just that there's been a very vocal group of people. And maybe it's their Madam's Apple helping them speak up louder. But there's just this very small vocal group of people that have been making a lot of noise. And everybody else is too scared. It's what Greg was talking about before where, oh, I don't want to sound like a bigot.

I'm not a bigot. I'm not a bigot. Sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Go change with my daughter. And people are starting to move away from that in the States. I mean, Donald Trump's pushing against it. It looks like they're going to scrap everything to do with that.

And especially in the last decade, everything in Canada seems to move a little bit downstream of American. And so I would be pretty optimistic for you on that front April for this year. Well, you know, and I haven't been canceled and you know what, we're going to keep speaking up.

I'm part of Kaspar, which is, you know, a wonderful group of women across Canada, 200 members and we're going to keep applying the pressure and, you know, so we just have to keep speaking up and keep fighting because our, you know, little girls depend on us and our safety.

So just going to keep speaking up. So thank you, gentlemen, thank you everyone that listened, and thank you, Sean, for having me tonight. God bless you all. As always, thanks for answering the call. We've got a time free on this side and appreciate you hopping on and talk with us tonight. Yeah. Thank you so much.

Ah, my fat fingers again. I cut her off, folks. You know what? Once is, what, okay, this is gold figure. It's been like six times tonight. It's been six times. Once is the happenstance, twice as coincidence, three times his enemy action. Okay.

Well, I'm going to bring in the next guest so that we can just keep this going on. Tom Marzzo, a late addition to the record or to the roster, I should say. Hey, Tom. Yeah, thanks for coming on. Thanks for having me. Yeah, you can hear me good. You can hear you good. You can see you good.

Awesome. Awesome. Thanks. I know I'm a little flushed. You're hopping into, well, for election coverage on this side, I'll reiterate it, I guess to every guess it comes on. We started out talking provincial, but we took a hard right turn in the first 10 minutes. And we've been talking about just about everything, a lot of federal politics, et cetera. I guess your thoughts on today's events, Doug Ford winning a majority government, you know,

if there's other thoughts on your mind, by all means, and then we can just hop back into the conversation. Yeah, like I'm looking at the election results like everybody else. I was trying to get some information earlier on today. But it was really difficult to get it. because here in Ontario, you know, the polls closed at 9 p.m. Eastern time. And it looks like, as it stands, Ford lost a few seats, but he still has his third majority government in a row, which people are saying is something that's rarely, if ever been done in Ontario. And I'll be honest with you. And I think this is a safe audience to say that with, I'm a little bit,

I'm slightly disappointed in the voters. I'm not surprised because of the death grip that the legacy media has over politics and your access to politicians in alternative parties, you know, as the media. So it's a little frustrating for me because the media shuts out anybody who's not part of the Uniparty. So they're very disrespectful to the voters in the sense that the media doesn't want you to ever have access to an alternative choice, right? There are several different political parties within the province of Ontario. I'm the president of the Ontario Party. Derek Sloan is the leader.

There are other alternative parties out there, but yet you, the voter, don't get to have any exposure in the tax-paid, tax-funded, subsidized legacy media. you don't get to hear about them. And the other thing is, you don't hear the Unip Party ever stand up and say, hey, you know what? This is kind of disrespectful to the voters. The fact that the voters don't get to hear about people that want to elect them or be elected to represent them. So this is another thing where the public should look at it and say,

you know what, guys, you are taking an advantage. You actively don't want me to know about an alternative choice to be elected in this province. I think that's maybe a moral and an ethical issue, right? So I absolutely is. Yeah. Yeah. And I don't mean to sound like sour grapes. I don't.

But I'd like to know when the voters are going to be true to the word and actually say, you know what? We do want change here. Because after, go ahead. Sorry. Oh, sorry. Yeah. I was just going to say, I completely agree with you.

And if there's one thing that has pissed me off about this election the most, by far. It's the fact that the conservatives had all of their local candidates bow out of the local debates. Because they just head to coast. You just got to, you just got to just stay at home. Don't do anything stupid. Don't say anything dumb. Do the Joe Biden 2020 election campaign. Don't, don't, don't speak in front of more than seven people. Keep it as safe as possible. And as long as you're not a complete goddamn idiot, you're going to win. And the thing that pisses me off the most about this election is not how bad the parties are. Um, that won. It's how bad the voters are because you like not you, but you, the people in Ontario,

went and voted on mass for people who couldn't even be bothered to show up to talk about your local needs in your local community. And that's who you are sending. provincially to represent you? I don't care what party is on the ballot. You should never be voting for somebody who is unwilling to even speak to what you want to have locally. And that's exactly what they did.

And I am incredibly disappointed with everybody in Ontario, present company excluded. Yeah, I think, And there's a lot of discussions. I'm in a lot of parent groups where, you know, with the woke stuff going in the schools is really problematic. And, of course, there was just the discussion was, we don't want to divide the vote and have a liberal, God forbid, or an NDP, slide up and take this party even further or this province further. left than it is now. And my view in respect to this, you know, what's going on in schools is that the unions get

to use the bargaining process and bypass politics, bypass the vote. And through the collective bargaining process, take the activity further left, right? So policies are embedded through education in that fashion. So and if we want to break into federal stuff, I have a couple Carney comments. So this is our, yeah, what are we seeing here? Go ahead, Sean. I think you had the map about it. Maybe you guys want to.

Well, we just had an update on the map, like from a background technical. And I just wanted to show it as we go along. One of the things I try to remind myself is we're an election coverage live stream tonight. So we got the live election coverage map. We got to show what anyone cares. We got to sprinkle it in every once in a while. I actually, I want to bring up something. With the map?

Vital. Not it's a little bit bigger than the map. Sorry, no offense to Ontarians. Okay. I'm in Quebec. Have mercy on us. Okay. So the whole point that I'm trying to make here is, and I want to hear what Simon has to say.

And I take issue, I think, because we, me, and Tom, I love Tom, but we disagree on this whole unit party thing because maybe just the way we come at things strategically. That's it. Okay. Uri Besmanov, you guys have heard of him. Oh, yeah. Okay. So I'm going to read this. The highest art of warfare is not the fight at all, but to subvert anything of value in the country of your enemy until such time that the perception of reality of your enemy is screwed up to such an extent that he does not perceive you as an enemy. This has been what has been hijacking Canada to the point where the trust and government and so many Canadians has gone that the liberal apparatus funded by the Chinese state from behind

the scenes and maybe even European Union has been helping funnel all this kind of marketing. And you know what I do for a living. It's all about PR and messaging and on and on and on. If I keep pummeling you with this for five straight years and show you there is no consequence, there is no justice. It's not that we don't have laws. Guys, guys were walking around with their penises out in a parade and the cops were walking behind them. There is a law in Canada that says that that's illegal.

That's illegal. And nobody did anything about it. And when you asked them, the problem is not that. the laws aren't there. Messaging has been hammering everybody to such an extent that it's made everyone cynical. That's my opinion. I want to hear what Simon and Tom have to say about this. That's just my view from my experience, from my profession.

This is what I'm perceiving. I mean, I've written about this a lot. We are definitely looking at a very large-scale form of communist ideological subversion. And that has, you know, different phases to it. But one of the big parts of that is demoralization. And Canada, I think, is start. with a form of demoralization in a lot of ways. That's why you're seeing lawlessness in some of these situations. And, you know, it is very, very tricky because what Yuri Besmanoff was describing,

you know, that's like back in the day that there wasn't the kind of technology there is now. Now we're dealing with, you know, what's known as fifth generation warfare, where the majority of warfare is cognitive and, you know, warfare moved from being about taking over a nation's land and leadership. And now it's more about gaining access to the minds of citizens and whoever can get into the cognitive space of the citizens. And it's not about controlling them. It's about defining the battle space itself so that they're in the battle that's been defined for them.

And this is the nature of fifth generation warfare now. And so for looking at it from Yuri Besenov's perspective, you know, this was about engineering people slowly over time over multiple generations. Bezboeuf said that if you can get two to three generations deep, the people who are ideologically subverted by that third generation, it won't matter. matter what facts you give them because they will be, you know, entrenched. They'll be cognitively entrenched. And so we have a struggle with that now where we, we have to sort of reconcile the extent of that. And I think about this often in Canada because there isn't an understanding

that's sophisticated enough to like say that to a lot of people. I've been to these, you know, I've been to protests and things like that in Toronto. You know, I went to the one million March, you know, for children and things like that. And I speak to some of the people that are deeply entrenched in this ideological subversion. I met a mom. I think she had three kids and all her kids were trans. And she had no idea. She wasn't able to even question that, that that was even a strange thing at all.

I will say, though, that the one thing that I've seen, and this is a little bit out there in terms of what we're talking about, but it's an example of, I think, hope to an extent, is that, you know, when you look at the ideological subversion, in the way that it's affecting the children, right? Especially in the schools, and it's affecting, you know, girls primarily in terms of transitioning to another gender and all the gender affirmative surgeries and all the things that they've installed in Canada. You know, one of the things you are having right now is this push from detransitioners.

And I always bring up the detransitioners when I talk about Besmanoff because I think they are this incredible exception to what he's talking about because they were so ideologically subverted that they went and they, you know, they got testosterone injections and they cut off their breasts and they sterilize themselves, but there are a lot of them that have woken up and are actually able to see through the ideological capture that they were in and are now sharing the actual empirical experience of waking up out of this actual neo-Marxist ideological condition. So you're saying they went so full retard that they broke out into intelligence.

I guess, yeah. Yeah, they kind of just accidentally did a lap. Like they went over the hill of stupidity and realized, oh, You never go full retard, Besper. I never go full retarded. I do. Probably what really happened was, was that, you know, what Yuri Besanov was talking about. And it's interesting how incredibly right this guy has been decades later.

I don't think anybody's looked at anything you said and been like, oh, that was wrong. Like, you're just like, oh, shit, he nailed it. He nailed it. He nailed it. Yep, that's right. That's right. And the thing about the whole trans, um, ideological capital. is that the ultimate,

the ultimate compliance with it, the going full retard with it is such a bad experience that when you actually get to the end of it, you're just, you're unmistakably faced with an, oh, shit, what have I done moment? I mean,

there's no going that dick back on. Yeah. I've got a friend. She's the nurse who is intake. Okay. And she used to do intake for surgeries, and then she got to become intake for trans surgeries. And she's up north in northern Ontario, Sudbury. And she says, okay, you don't see any minors, you know, like minors as in going under the ground to take out nickel.

You don't see any minors kids, any bus driver's kids, you know, come, any, you know, any check girls. at the pharmacy, stop their kids that are lining up for their surgeries. It's the doctors. It's the lawyers. It's the CFAs. Right. It's all the professionals, right? And I've just got to say, like, it's like, I'm like, it's the ultimate Darwin moment.

Right? You know, they're, you know, they're not even procreating, right? You're, you're, you're not even, your DNA is just not going to pass on to the next, like, this is a whole huge. Darwinism movement. And then the piece I was trying to get before is that DEI is a mandatory, it's a mandatory religion. So it's a religion that has been forced onto the population by the state, but not just any state, the corporate fascist state. And what do I mean by that? It's the corporate fascist state because it's integrated into your banks, right? It's integrated. It's integrated. It's integrated into your big stakeholder corporations.

It's integrated, so it's corporate, quasi-judicial through your regulatory bodies, and then finally government. So it's a total capture, enforcement of state religion. And if you, you know, when you go back and you say, okay, the pilgrims came and, you know, the Catholics came because of persecution in Europe and they couldn't, you know, have their own religion over there and they wanted freedom. And so the one thing about freedom of religion is not so much that, you know, state secularization in the public square, which is where we're going and come back with this. But it is supposed to be the freedom to choose and the freedom to be free from a state religion.

And so what we have and we have to articulate this is this is state fascist stakeholder religion enforced on the population. And if you don't defer to it, what happens is that the communist aspect rags into it. And you cannot earn a living. You cannot earn a living if you disagree with the state religion. And so right now you have a whole bunch of people who think, hey, this is a great idea or, you know, they're on that left. Right. And I say to them, well, first you, first you erect the system. Right.

And it seems to favor. Who does it favor? it favors the people who were historically disadvantages. So it seems like the evolution of perhaps a human rights. It seems like the evolution of human rights. But it isn't, right? It's the erection of power. And everything is topped down, right?

It's not everything is top down. That's why it's flying at the UN. It's going through the big corporations. It's going through all a regulatory. bodies. It's top down and it's system-wide and it's it's you know universally and it's globalism. You know, I want to agree with you Lisa. I just, I watched a W.E.F where Mark Carney, if you guys could look this up on YouTube, type WF, Mark Carney, Larry Fink from Black Rock. They were on the same panel. This was 10 years ago. Larry Fink had a black rock said, get ready for disrupt.

because we feel that monetary policy is not a good thing because it's slowing things down. There's going to be massive disruptions and that he verbatim said that that are coming. This was a decade ago, I would say. It was 2013, I think. Klaus Schwab wasn't on the panel, but Carney was there. And Larry Fink was sitting maybe two, three seats away from him. This is not, this is where I think ideology is not really the, at that, That's the boogeyman and all this.

They will pander to anything if it'll get them into power. They don't care if it's trans, if it's ESG. I mean, they're making money off the green thing. But they're fluid, right? Most religions are not fluid with their doctrine. What we're seeing is a fluidity of change like a serpent moving from one topic to another topic in pandering to stay in power and make money. So the problem is that most citizens just want to go.

about their day living, but this is Gotham. I'm sorry, I've said this a million times. We're living in a world, not Canada, the world is like run by people that just want money. Very few organizations, including the United States, I wish Tuesday was here. Senator Rand Paul called the United States more a monarchy than a constitutional, it operates more like a monarchy rather than a constitutional republic because of so much unchecked power in the Oval Office. So there are many things, like, for example, they have an Emergencies Act. I don't know if you guys know that. The U.S. has an Emergencies Act. And if you read through their version of the Emergencies Act, it is psycho. The president can shut down all media, all cell phones, all everything. I'm so glad

to do his back. Everything. He could shut down everything. He doesn't need no governor. He doesn't need nothing. Okay. So let's not pretend that a system is going to be perfectly protecting humans. What humans need to just know is that it's not mainly about ideology. It's about people staying in power. It's kind of like this whole Epstein thing. Everybody's been hyped up about today. What did we get? We got a flight log, right? Where are the names? Where's the whatever? I thought we were supposed to be super transparent. This is the problem, guys. I don't think it has anything to do with any kind of ideology. It's about staying in power and making money.

I'll tell you why I think... Go ahead. I'll tell you why I think it's an ideology and what the ideology actually is. The ideology is the transnational tropes. I call them the transnational tropes. They are the things that are the pillar, pillars of the global estate.

And so it's big climate, big gender, right? Big disease, big war, and big migration. And if you speak against any of those things, then the DEI agenda religion force will silencing you on all of those things. And they have their methods to silence, whether it's called hate speech through Bill 63, or whether if, you know, you have Professor Sukrit Bakke, who was charged with hate speech for comparing a criminal. He's charged in Germany for comparing the COVID policies to. Germany in 1940. And so they said that's minimizing the Holocaust and then

that is straight to jail for you. And he was facing two years jail for a speech. They lost and now they're appealing that so that they can actually send the guide at jail. So we in Canada have an act that's coming through. It's called Bill 293

and it was a private members bill and during prerogation, Bill 293 as a private member's bill will pick up exactly where it left off on March 24th when it comes through. It's a perpetual emergency act, just like you were saying, Vesper. You walk into this emergency act and powers immediately vests centrally and it involves total control over the economy and surveillance systems and what have you. And so when Carney signals two things, He says, oh, I'm going to need emergency powers in order to deal with tariffs. Well, that's really dangerous.

And then he says, I want to centralize power. That's both features of Bill C-293. And Bill C-293, you walk into that bill and you can't walk off. There's no off-boarding. So I actually have a site called Kill Bill, Kill Bill, 293.com. And we have people who go around municipalities dropping off flyers. about the bill, door knocking campaigns, and we're trying to raise awareness.

But, you know, you say, okay, well, Pollyab's going to win the election. I actually think the intent will be for Carney to be, you know, king or anointed at the Liberal Party and to have Bill C-293 go live and then use it. It's a totalitarian regime. I've been on a lot of podcasts. probably with you, Sean, trying to explain that, Phil.

A couple things here before. I just want to, for all the people watching, I forget to remind people this, and we're three and a half hours almost into the sucker. If you're watching on X and you're enjoying it, just hit the retweet button. I'm like, I shouldn't have to explain that, but here we are three and a half hours in.

And I'm like, you know the algorithms and all the good stuff. I'm sure Vesper can go off on that. And I'm just like, just literally click the button. retweet the sucker. Like we should just see this number go through the roof. Or if you want to piss Sean off, don't do it. Yeah. Well, right.

I love pissing Sean off. Everybody log off and just like whatever. Tom, Tom, you've been eerily silent on this. Now, I love a good listener, but I got Tom on here. And I'm like, Tom, you're smiling. You're not in your head. Tom, your thoughts on this. Yeah.

So, you know, I've been familiar with Besmanoff. So I want to go back to the early thing. Because the most to me, one of the most important things, and it ties into what you were saying to, Lisa, one of the most important phases of this, which is the first one, it's demoralization. A lot of people when they say, oh, how are you doing today? I'm a little demoralized. No, that's not what he meant. He meant moralization, meaning demoralization. Take away your morals.

And the way we do that is to divide everybody up into. is many tiny little boxes as we can put them in. And once we isolate people, and we all learn that from COVID, obviously, the more you isolate, the weaker people are. You can't be in a strong, solid group

because then you can't be demoralized because you have mutual support from people that have the same moral, ethical, and value base that you have. So really, you know, he was right. he was absolutely right in the way they did it. And he also said it was one of the most critical things.

And it takes the longest. And we're going through that super long phase. Now, he, I think in the interview did make a statement that, look, this part has been ongoing. And each subsequent phase gets a little bit shorter. But I would say that we're still in some sort of a quasi demoralization phase. And I think we're on the back end of it post-COVID where everything else is a little bit easier. And I would say that to be true because look at what just happened an hour and 25 minutes ago in the Ontario election. Look how easy it was for Ontario's domestic abuser to get a third majority government.

That's a great way of his private. Yeah, the very people that he abused and bragged about abusing. And by the way, he still has five and a half million dollars of the convoys money. Doug Ford took it. Nobody took it, but Doug Ford and his attorney general. and they still have it three years later. Now, I want to add something in there because it was related to what Lisa said. And I've been, you know, Lisa and I talk on the phone every once in a while.

And I read all of Lisa's stuff on her substack. But, you know, yes, I'm the president of the Ontario Party, and I'm not done with them. By far, I'm not done with the Ontario Party. But I want to tell you guys all about a project that I've been working on since last June. I've been actually developing with a team, an online program called Toto. And if you want to look it up, it's Toto.com. Oh, before I forget, sorry, Lisa McKay, I saw your note where she says Tom for PM. She hits me up on that all the time.

I love you, Lisa. But I don't speak French. I will never speak French, so I will never be the Prime Minister of Canada. And I don't think that I want that job. Chef's Kiss, right? And I probably speak about as well as Mark Carney anyway. Anyway, the reason I'm talking about Toto is because this is an idea that I've been working on with the team. And Jonathan Baha'i is my boss.

He's the visionary behind the idea of Toto. It is a civic engagement online platform to help people like Lisa with Bill C-293. like Greg Wycliffe who are trying to raise awareness for Bill C-69. Stuff like that. In total, we would call that a focus in all of our content. Everything you want to talk about with that specific cause would be inside your focus. And that's where you want to go and get all the engagement. We're going to be building tools for referendums, for polls, for surveys, for public officials

or representative report cards. So if you have a large body of people that are on total and they don't want to participate because they're an elected official from one of the legacy parties, at the end of the year, you're going to be getting a report card from the public. And it's going to be objective, quantifiable,

you know, evidence that you really don't give a crap about the public based on your interaction with the public on our platform. Because one of the things that we can do right now is we're using AI tools and we're using blockchain technology. We're now on total able to create a focus that is important to us and have the AI tools help us write a letter. We will even mail the letter directly to that elected official, deliver it right to their office. And if they don't respond, well, guess what? The world's going to know about that because the results will be post.

it on a blockchain and it won't be it's tamper proof and the world will see it you want to ignore it that's at your own peril anyway that i've been working this the same day i got hired to do to work on total was the same day i i got hired officially on the management side of the ontario party and one of the things that we were doing was bouncing you know ontario party stuff off off of Toto and Toto off Ontario Party stuff in politics, trying to create a platform for people to directly engage with elected officials inside the political arena in a meaningful way. And it's really hard to do.

I'm not going to lie. It's hard to do. And we have, I don't know how many millions of meetings, it seems like, in a day to discuss how to bring the public to the politicians so the politicians become accountable to us. And, you know, I've been fighting back since I got fired from my teaching job. I went to the convoy. I ran in the last election.

I did things with James Top. I've been involved in the Ontario Party. I've written a book. I'm writing a second book. I'm active. I'm active. I write on substact. And I'm trying to fight back and make this province and this country better.

And the best way that I know right now is to build a relationship using technology between the public, the voters. elected officials in a way that's justifiable, quantifiable, and, you know, objective and not emotional. And anyway, sorry, I was quiet and then I went on, I went on a rant. I popped off. Everybody's had their, had their, their, their, their opportunities to hop in. I can see Vesper and two is both just like, I just, no, go, go, go, go, go. Okay, yeah, it's my show.

Of course, I'm going to go. Go. All right. I just, you know, we're talking about engagement with Tom and then Sean saying, you know, we need some help sharing it out. We appreciate it. I just want to point out that if you go look at our numbers compared to the other people who are doing live coverage right now, we're blowing CHCHH and BN out of the water.

We've got more people watching us than global right now. Almost we are just barely behind CP 24. We've got a lot more than CBC, the National who's doing live coverage of it. the only people beating us is CBC's main. And like I said, just barely, CP 24 and CTV. That's it. So we are the number... A billion dollar propaganda machine.

That's good stuff. We're the number four coverage of this election on the entire internet right now. One of the things is just to hop in on what Tuesday is talk about. And it goes to the people who answered the call today. even Vesper going, I have no idea what happened between surprise appearance. Fantastic, right? I mean, it's interesting because, like, have we even really talked about the election? But if you go on CBC, have they really, you know, what are they actually talking about at this point?

Everybody looks at it and goes, it's a joke. Nobody wants to talk about it. They want to hear, they want to, like, every time I try and steer it a little bit back towards provincial politics, within 10 seconds, they say they're 10 second little piece, folks, and they draw it back into what we've been, this, this larger conversation. And so I appreciate you pointing that out to, because I think it's important. That's,

that's what happens on our election coverages, is we start out talking about it. And at times we get focused on it. And usually there's a guest. We haven't had one here in Ontario, which I find hilarious. It's like, aren't we going to talk about the election?

And it was like, oh, yeah, sure. And then we pull up the map. And then we put it away. And then we start talking about what actually is happening here in Canada. Carry on to it. Well, that was basically it. I just wanted to point out that,

that, you know, and it's, it's, I think it was Simon who said it. I couldn't quite tell who was who's speaking, but I think it was Simon who said it is that, you know, we're just, we're just bootstrapping this and we're beaten billion dollar organizations at it because we're actually having conversations, or at least I like to think that we're having conversations that people want to hear, and we're doing a better job of covering what's happening than a bunch of cheese dick suits. Now, Vesper, Vesper doesn't know if he wants to hop in after cheese, Dix suits. But, uh, speaking of cheese dick suits, let's go to Vesper and Quebec. Let's go to

Vesper and Quebec. Come on, Vesper and go back. Listen, you little Putin. If you say that to me to my face, I promise you. I will not make it fun. Okay. Listen. Oh, you're going to surrender at me. Listen, listen, this is, I, I just want to say one last thing. And I know I'm going to bounce for you guys, but so I'm going to say this at Tom. And I'm going to go to Tom and it. And it's kind of a question and a comment. And I'm going to wrap it up. Uh, So Tom, on every metric, and this is not me kissing your ass, Tom. This is just me seeing everything I've talked to you. I've seen you in action.

In every metric, you hold a standard of integrity that I deeply respect. Agreed. Like in every metric. I'm not kidding. Intelligence, personal morality, all these things. The question that I have is when there is a clear choice of, This person who panders and this person who stands for what he believes and he's standing for the rights of people. And it comes off like this man would stand even if he had nothing to gain.

Why would someone like you not blow all the competition out of the water in terms of election or getting into a position of major prominence, let's say, in Ontario, for example, or wherever it is that you're running? have you ever wondered why that is? If I made just real quick, just real quick before you get to yours. I'd say it's because the people running the parties aren't interested in people like that. Tom, what do you think? Yeah, like. Because I have a hypothesis, but I want to hear what you have to say. Yeah.

I'm, I often wonder about that. And I've written a couple of substacks even where I talk about where I talk about where I get my morals from. Where do I get my ethics? Where do I get, where does Tom Marazo come from? And I'm looking around this whole province and I'm saying, I know thousands of people out there are just like me because we have proof of that. They line the highways. They went to Ottawa. After that, they ran for different offices and alternative parties. There are people like that out there for me. But there's no way. There's no way the legacy parties are ever going to allow somebody like me who's going to walk in and tell them absolutely not. The way you're conducting

business is probably illegal. It is certainly immoral. It is dishonest. It is of low integrity. And nobody like Doug Ford is ever going to let me join his party. But I'm not talking about you joining a party. I'm talking about you leading a party. Yeah. So I'm looking at, you know, right now, the leader of the Ontario party right now is Derek Sloan. And let me tell you about Derek. I'm sure people know who Derek is. But Derek is a guy who, while being an elected official, pushed back against the federal mandates, he was kicked out of his party. And here's a funny thing. Derek Sloan was kicked out of the federal conservative party and he was accused of being a racist by his own party

who didn't defend him and actually wanted him to apologize to the public even though he's in a mixed race mixed race marriage this is the this was under O'Toole right not under Paul yeah it was under O'Toole okay it was before Polly of under O'Toole and the other guy before him sheer it was all, it was that sort of cohort, right? Because Derek dared to run to try to become the leader of the federal conservative party. And that's how they sunk them. They accused him of being a racist. Derek went out all throughout the mandates, got seven COVID-19 tickets, been fined, had to appear

for summons. He went to the convoy. He traveled all across Ontario and he fought for Canadians for their rights. Derek's a lawyer, right? Derek is the one who, became the leader of the Ontario Party before I did before I was even part of it. The reason I joined the Ontario Party was because Derek was the leader, was the first thing. And then the second thing is because the Ontario Party will not whip votes. The representatives are free to vote what their constituents want. So my, my belief was, look, I don't subscribe to being famous. I acknowledge I have some notoriety. Famous people get paid. Tom has some notoriety, okay? And I say that jokingly, but yes, I have a little bit of notoriety,

but I wanted to put my weight, my support behind another person that I believed in, who had the moral courage and the integrity to lead the party. And Derek has more experience as a federal, you know, he was a federal elected member of parliament. And, you know, there's other people in the party. There's other people in the Ontario party who are doctors and lawyers and veterinarians. You know, we have a great lineup of people. But at the end of the day, it doesn't matter what Tom Maraz or Derek Sloan or Randy Hillier or whatever.

If the voters don't reward integrity, and I'll give you a great example of this, even Belinda Kara Halios, she's part of the new blue, she pushed back against the mandates with Doug Ford. They kicked her out of the party. You had Rick Nichols, who was in Doug Ford. party and he pushed back against the mandates ejected from the party. Both of those people, Roman Babber, right? All three of those people push back against the mandates.

They defended people's rights and informed consent. And you know what they were rewarded with? The unemployment line by their voters, by their constituents. So you made my point. And I guess this is what I'm ending on. Is it conceivable that in a world where you look at things as white in this postmodern era, that everything's actually black and that you believe that people are interested in things like integrity when everything's become very relative.

Some people still hold on to absolutes. I'm a Christian, and I've said that to you and I've said this to everybody. Christ himself, my God, said, behold, I send you out a sheep amongst the wolves. Be there for as wise as serpents and as innocent as doves. I am not dumb. to think that if I'm going to be in a government, by the way, go to my pinned message, Tom. Derek is pinned and it's going to stay there that that whole thing that he did. You'll see it. Okay. So I'm completely with you.

But it's making the assumption that people are interested in things like integrity from the get-go in the nation where we glorify immorality, daily, movies, music, everything. There has been a slow drip and erosion of morality in not just Canada, but America. quite frankly. And nowhere more so than Quebec, if you come to Quebec. You will see we have the lowest, what, age for entering into clubs and stuff like that. Like everything here is like, hey, you can drink as much as you want. This is okay. No problem. The police don't do nothing. They let you go. What I'm trying to say is, is it conceivable maybe that in order to get into power when facing off against snakes that you must think like a snake. But if you refuse to do this, guess what there is a lot of money behind these snakes and you're not going anywhere

i think that's fair i think we saw evidence of that am i wrong about that i'm just wondering is this do you see what i'm trying to say i i don't think you're wrong at all and i i guess my only response that is yes i do fundamentally agree with your premise because we we see constant evidence of that but i have to look myself in the mirror every day and i have to i have to i have to look my kids in the eye when my kids were born, I was one of those people that said, yes, I will make this world a better place for you. And I meant it. I didn't do it lightly. I wasn't flipping about it.

I actually meant it. And I've been trying to do that since they've both been born. And it doesn't mean I have to be at the top of the mountain. It doesn't mean that I have to be the most famous person in the world. I just have to make their life just a better place to be in, a place where, a place where, they're loved, that they're respected. You know. I got to say something to Tuse because I got to go, but

Tews tell me that Tom doesn't sound like Rorschach. Tell me he doesn't sound exactly like Rorschach. And that that's what he stands on. I will stand and die on this. Yeah. And he's, he's Rorshack. He's an optimistic Rorschach.

Like if the Rorschach mask was the smiley button, this is honestly, I'm sad to see even say you're going. going anywhere. I'm like, I don't care what time it is. This has been... Well, I don't want to get up space. You might have other people. No, no, no, no, no, no.

We're winding up because there's nothing really to talk about. I just want to say this to two. Tom, you must have watched, I hope you've watched the movie The Watchman. Lisa, I don't know if you've ever watched it. I've read it. I've read it. I haven't in my closet. I know.

We've talked about this, but it's the best graphic novel ever written. I want, I don't know if you guys have seen it. Simon, if you've ever read it or watched it. I've seen the movie, yeah. Lisa, I hope you've watched the movie. I haven't seen it, but now it's on my list. You got to watch it. Watch the ultimate edition.

Watch the ultimate edition. It's worth the three and a half hours. The last time, the last time Tuesday and I spoke, we talked about this topic. And I told him, this is the problem. And he and I just went through it. I don't know. Can I ask you Tuesday? I want to stick to hear how Tuesday.

Because he did it beautifully when he explained it. Can you explain when we talked about that final scene between Dr. Manhattan, Osamandias, and Rorschach. Well, technically the final scene, Ozymandius is already out of it. The final scene is with Dr. Manhattan and Rorschach outside of the compound in Antarctica,

not to get super nerdy or anything like that. But Rochak, he's looking, he's looking death in the face. And he's like, I do not care. I know exactly what you're going to do. Just give the context. What was the context between Manhattan and Rorschach? that they needed to create a fictional devastation

so that everybody could get together and pin it on Dr. Manhattan and that way all the world would come together to fight off this person. So the overarching theme throughout the series is that the doomsday clock keeps getting closer and closer and Ozy Manda's figures

the only way he can avoid it is if he gets all of humanity to unite against somebody. Um, you know, it's in, in the, in the, in the, in the comics, it's Dr. Manhattan who's blue. And in Canada right now, it's Donald Trump who's orange. But it's the same idea. And so he basically fakes and gets everybody to go behind this bullshit theme. And then Rorschach, uh, uncovers, you know, he, he's got the evidence. He's got, he's got the evidence of the fact that this is all bullshit.

and he says he's going to go forward with it and he's going to tell everybody and it's going to do everything that's been done. And Dr. Manhattan, who's the bad guy that everybody's rallying behind, sees that Ossimanius was right or he feels that Osemaneus was right. And so even though he's going to be the bad guy, he feels as though he needs to stop Rorschach. And so you've got this guy who could just with a thought, destroy you into your component Adams. And Rochak's like, you know what? I don't care.

I'm doing what's right. Yeah, I'm going to tell everybody that you guys are going to lie to them. And I don't care if you kill me. I'm going to go and tell everybody this lie that you guys are perpetrating on everyone. Right? So that comes right back to Yuri Besmanov. And I went through this like phase where I had to watch it again and again and again. and see what my world was, what was happening to my world.

And at one point, because there's just, you know, different videos of him, at one point, someone says, well, what, what's the cure? And he's like, oh, oh, it's morality. It's a return to morality. It all undoes itself. It all undoes itself. It's a return to morality. Like it's its integrity.

It's like speak truth. Right. So there's two things that I've noticed is that censorship is so very important. Control of the narrative is so very important. Why? Because our speech matters. And speech does become the interrupter and the cognitive distance. And the second thing that I notice is that they're working very, very, very hard to dismantle our trust in our institutions. Right. They're working hard for us to hate our history, reject what it is that we have because they fear. They fear, like you would not believe I feel their fear.

They fear the return of the morality of our institutions. And who brings that? Who brings that? We bring that. And that happens. Once we've institutionalized the function of the community, right? everything's done by an NGO or a government organization or some level of government. It's all done by that.

We no longer have our links. You know what? How it all stops? Oh, you start having those conversations with your neighbors. Politics. We were taught that religious, you know, religion was dumb. I'm Christian too. Thank you, God.

And religion was dumb and that you don't talk politics. Now, guess what? Religion's not dumb and you do talk politics, right? and you do get back in there and you do talk to your neighbors. And that's where it's at. And that if I may, and that if I may, because I'm living proof of it,

takes time and you feel stupid over and over again. Pretty much everybody on this cast has made me feel stupid at some point in time. And I don't mean like where you're actually making me feel like a moron. Vesper, you're going, what? I'm like, go back to our first conversation. I got some choice words by like, go back to the last time you Clyde and Tuesday. were sitting there and I was arguing with you and I go back to that conversation. I'm like, man, alive, that wasn't that long ago.

And I'm just like there's so much to grapple with. And the world instead of moving slow and we're having to grapple with a lot of stuff that for a long time, we didn't talk about politics, at least on this side. We didn't talk about faith on this side. And, you know, it takes, we need, we're asking everybody to do it at light speed. Hey, we got to change things at light speed. Let's do it. And that's uncomfortable. We're asking people to be very, very, very uncomfortable.

You know, as we close in on the 9 o'clock hour on this side, the 11 o'clock hour out east, Simon, I want to give you a final word before I let you out of here. And I'm going to slowly do this for everybody as we close off. We could talk this until 2 in the morning. I've really enjoyed this has been the strangest live election coverage to date. You say that every time. No, no. Wow, it's true.

We had glory holes in B.C. We had a guy snoring at the end of Saskatchewan. And here we are having a very philosophical top conversation that I find very fascinating. Simon, your final thoughts before I let you out of here. You know, it's been interesting watch us sort of scale from the global to the local. And I think this is a, you know, it's a struggle that a lot of people have because we go and we plug into this sort of online outrage machine. And so much of that is about globalism and the globalist and the global narrative and the global stage. And it can be really easy to get caught up in that.

But it does have really, really deep relevance because these institutions are reaching directly into our neighborhoods, directly into our schools. You know, like the United Nations Agenda 2030 is in the public schools. Like I wanted to find this out. I'm big about figuring out how is this war manifest in your community? Like, yes, there's these big entities and these big players. But if you only tune in to the internet outrage machine, then you may be. become outraged about something that's not quite manifest that way in your community. And you have to mind the way in which you're conditioned by your time online to be cognizant

of what's really going on in your community. I personally checked, you know, the curricula in the Toronto District School Board and my local schools to see. And I found the through line from the United Nations documents right into the classroom because, you know, I wanted to know, like, what should I be outraged about? Because somebody just doesn't match up. So I think that's a really important part of this to understand that there is a big connection, but we can get caught up, I think, to a certain extent in that. That being said, with everything that we've talked about tonight, I really feel like a big part of this is Canadians figuring out how they can have a say in the Overton window. You know, the Overton window is the pool of concepts that we're allowed

to talk about. This is a big part of what is micromanaged in Canada. And I think, Tom, what you're working on, I think really can impact that. I think this total project, to me, that was the first thing I thought of. I was like, oh, Edo give people the power to put different things in the Overton window, which is currently what is so aggressively controlled. And that, you know, I think that that's where we want to look strategically. And that's how we inject some of the morals, the remoralization, right? It's gone so far in the demoralization.

You know, I'm writing a film right now that's looking at how we're looking at total moral inversion in a lot of places in our society, even with the children. So that's gone really far. But I think the point is that we want to have a balance as citizens who are constantly consuming this content of aware of our local situation, but understanding that global narrative. And to me, it was really great. Like this conversation was great for that because I think people want to connect that higher and lower level. And, you know, I think it's really great. I was really glad to be a part of it. Simon, it's been a while. And, you know, I, I, I got to go back to June 9th,

2020, is when we last chat. I appreciate you hop on today. And, well, I appreciate to, hopefully we can do it again. I'm trying to do, you know, Vesper has been a part of it. Tews is now been a part of it.

Trying to do more of these roundtables to discuss things and get some of these ideas percolating a little broader audience. Regardless, I appreciate you hopping on tonight and we'll let you out of here. Thanks for your time and stick around for a little extra. after hours, if you would. My pleasure. Take care of one. Thanks very much, Simon.

Nice. Lisa. Any final thoughts before we let you out of here? It's been great talking and meeting all your guests and to everybody out there. I have a book coming out. Can I mention that? It's called World on Mute. Yeah, it's World on Mute.

And I'd love it if you take a look at it. And it does address the idea of what we're seeing. And I name it instead of fight it. Name it instead of fight it. So big climate is your carbon footprint. And big gender is transhumanism, right? And big migration is getting rid of the larger borders and making it your 15-minute city border.

And big disease, right? It's about your vaccines and it's about emergency governing through emergencies. So I hope that people found this interesting. I'm interested now in what my province is going to look like with this Doug Ford. If Doug Ford really wants as Premier to push back on tariffs, how about pushing back on carbon tax because that more than eats up? I have a $35 gas bill and after

carbon tax and HST and other charges it's $325. Let that sit there. Right. And that's on every layer. Let's get rid of that carbon tax. That's where he like, oh, Trump's not giving him any airtime.

Well, how about the liberal party then? Give them some air time. Let's get out of the who. Right? How much money are we spending through global affairs? That'll help us. Let's get out of the UN. those are kind of my thoughts on saving some money in our budget and thanks for having me

thanks again Lisa pleasure talking to you and Zane says lawyer Lisa thank you enjoying the substack post so you also have a substack so there you go Lisa thanks again for hopping on Tom I'm leaving Vesper he said he's leaving now I'm like you know what I'm going to give I'm going to leave the last I'm going to leave the last I'm That's exactly right. We'll leave in Quebec. Yeah. We'll leave Vesper to give the final sign.

Yeah. Tom, your final thoughts. So I want to go back to something you talked about with speed, right, is sort of the velocity of change. And, you know, let's go back, say, 40 years ago. I mean, I grew up in the 80s. I'll be 52 in a couple months. So I grew up in the, you know, the time of HIV, right?

where men my age back in the 80s were gay bashing, said some pretty awful stuff about homosexual men because of that thing. And it took decades and decades to normalize to the point where nobody cares if you're gay anymore. Nobody cares. Like as time went on, it normalized over a significant amount of years. But we look at all these rapid changes that are happening now. And I want to say this, by the way, there was activists that were involved in those causes. And society changed over many, many decades to get to a point where they were.

What we're seeing now is the political class not being servants of the public in facilitating the direction that the public is trying to go. what we're seeing is the exact opposite where politicians in this country at every level are pushing the direction where they want the herd to go and they're doing it in a very, very rapid amount of time. Like, you know, I was out in the East Coast in August. You know, I drove across, it was a great trip.

The people were really friendly. I got home and I posted, I said, great time in the East Coast in Nova Scotia. I was a little put off by all of the pride flags that were everywhere. Everywhere. They were on churches, sidewalks, schools, businesses, you name it. Wow. The Rainbow Brigade came out in full force.

Did not actually read the thing that I said. It didn't digest what the message was. But it was just a full-on outright attempt. right and who leads this behavior who leads this behavior it's the politicians that allow it they actually facilitate it they create division they go on post they attend pride for like they do all these things to lead the herd over the cliff and get the herd over the cliff as human as fast as humanly possible we're not seeing politicians letting just through natural osmosis in societal pressures evolve to the place where the society wants to go.

We're being led around by the nose. Then we get pushed back on things like the Million Man March, which I think Simon mentioned. I also went to that when they had it. I was in the Niagara region. I marched in that. When people like us push back and say, wait, hold on, you've gone way beyond the, the, the pale here. This is too much, too fast. I'm not comfortable.

I don't like it. All of a sudden, you get viciously attacked. And you get attacked by the political class just as much as you do by the people that follow them. And so I think it's really important the point that you made Sean earlier about how fast things are happening to people. And I don't think it's just naturally because of technology. I think it's the fact that we as a society are being controlled and led over a technology. cliff very, very quickly by the political class, the NGOs, the WEF and all that stuff. And we don't have a time to adjust.

We just don't have the time to adjust. And that is one of the reasons when we don't put the brakes on and we don't say, hey, wait, slow down. Everybody get in here. Let's have a huddle and talk about what's going on. When we're divided, we can't come together and put the breaks on that unless you have an extraordinary occasion like the million march for the kids or the convoy or it was a worldwide rally one through 12 you know this is the thing when you force the public to respond when the

actions of the government in interest groups force the the public to respond that response is the one the public gets attacked and that's something we have to be aware of the more we're divided and then you go on social media and I'll say this to conservative minded people. Okay. Conservative minded people. All right. Go ahead. No, no, I'm just one of them. Okay. Go ahead. Yeah. No, but you say this to conservative minded people, conservatives cannot unify. And also, you know, if you if you don't believe me, I'll go on here in, in five minutes and I'll post something nice about the PPC. And then five minutes later, I'll post something nice about the CPC. and you will see both groups viciously.

And listen, the PPC is no better than the CPC and vice versa. They're both terrible. Conservatives are individuals and they don't want to be told what to do. They don't want to be told what to do. So they will disagree and fight and they viciously attack and they make it personal. Liberals with the hide mind will unify under an idiot. They're the morgue. They will be like the board.

They will be like the board. And this is where seriously conservative-minded people who want to put the brakes on things in this country and take back control of the institutions in this country need to grow up, learn how to work together, remember the concept of respectful discourse, stop attacking each other. You can disagree on some issues, but fundamentally we should be coming together unify. But this is literally, this is literally, oh my God, we're supposed to be shut this down, but this is literally the conversation we had on the podcast earlier, well, yesterday, but it aired today with David Parker and Tanner today and Michael Wagner.

Yes. Does a movement need a leader or can it have decentralization where, where, and Vesper's already shaking his head? And I'm like, so one of the things that you see about, it's got to crack the establishment. not one of the things about the the conservative movement that i find fascinating you got all these wonderful people i just i mean we just have i've seen them and then if you go across country you see all these wonderful minds but man do they have a hard time working together why because my way is the right way yes and and an awning on they clash and yet if they would just find a way to have somebody just oh i don't even know the word oversee is the right thing and i'm sure vespers just

going to go off here. But I'm like, I watch Team Canada, the hockey team. I'm going to say this again and maybe people will be like, John, it doesn't work the same way. I go, who's the leader of the team? Is it, Sydney Crosby or is it John Cooper? And I go, John Cooper is the manager of all these personalities. It's Wayne Griskey. It's the best, it's the best team out there, right? I'm like, isn't conservatism the same way? Can't we just have somebody be the coach and just manage all the personalities and all the personalities still get to go up and be the personalities or is that not possible? Let me let me say this because I think that's a really good point.

And I saw your poster. It's very kind. Let me say this. Every single group that I belong to just be, you know, when the COVID BS started to today, every single group I'm no longer with. Almost every single group is imploded. And I'll tell you why. never did any of those groups have a very clear, single-minded mission statement about what they

were trying to fight against. They never had a measure of success that if they achieved what they wanted, what would that look like? They never defined, when do we end this? When did we dissolve this organization? When do we dissolve this group? And here's the other thing. This is the most important piece.

nobody ever created a clear code of conduct for their members. And I'm not talking about whipping people and I'm not talking about censorship. What I'm saying is defining who we are as an organization, you know, an activist group, you know, somebody like Ickley or Kikli, people fighting against Bill C-69, is that you get into a couple of problems. mission creep and individualism, where everybody has a new good idea and constantly chasing squirrels and the next thing. And they're never focused on why your group started to begin with.

And so I would, listen, I spent 25 years in the Army. I understand leadership and as sort of a hierarchy. And I do believe, I do believe that every organization does need some sort of a clear leadership structure. Okay. It's, it's, it's, it has to be done through, through influence. Okay. Like, I'll give you a great example. I went to the convoy. Okay. I took the skills that I learned in my experiences from the army. In the army, I had command authority. I had legal authority to tell people what to do. I went to the convoy. I didn't have the right to tell anyone where the bathroom was. But Tom, you walked in the room and everybody felt it.

I mean, everybody just knew. That's the guy. Yeah. And I had to use all of every available soft skill and every ounce of logic and wisdom that I could muster to try to keep people marching in this in one sort of a direction. Can I just say something, Tom? Yeah.

I keep trying to wrap this up. The very same government, an army, military that you served was used against you yes and so here's the problem right where there's a dissonance here here's a good guy here's the apparatus he worked for yeah and here's the apparatus turning on him why is that because the power was never really about ethics i'm sorry tom this is where we're just disagree and everyone i'm not cynical i agree with you i don't think we're disagreeing i don't think we're just saying flat out yeah there is an idealism that some Canadians have that I don't have.

I don't look at the world binarily as in there's like a good and a bad. Most people shift where they want to go and very few people stand their ground through all seasons. So in my mind, whenever we're looking for this ideal, I start to worry about that group or person because that means that they're unaware. the people who probably started out honest ended up becoming corrupted with power. Right? Not all, not all, but they're rare. I'm sure you would agree with me. It's rare for someone to get to a very high level. Dude,

Trump's entire military apparatus was against him in his first term. Where's the honor there? Where's the honor in the FBI? Where's the honor in the CIA? His major generals one after the other were all lying to him. So this notion of honor, it is real. I believe in honor and integrity. But to say that we live in a world where the masses hold on to this,

I'm sorry. I don't think that that's real at all. This is not realistic. It's like we're playing the old Atari game and now we're like in PlayStation 7. The game has completely changed and everything has become so relative and the erosion of morality has happened to such an extent that when a guy like you comes up and says something like the truth and stands for the right thing like Derek Sloan did.

You're a pariah. Yeah. Do you, are you familiar with the broken glass theory or broken window theory? Have you heard this? Yes. It's in a great book, The Tipping Point. Really good book. They talk about this.

And the theory is that if people live in a good neighborhood, everybody follows the rules. They get along, follow the rule of law. Then there's a broken window in a building that everybody walks by every day. And nobody ever does anything about it. As time goes up. on, people accept that low quality, that low standard. And they just see that as this is the way things are going.

This broken glass theory was applied in the New York City subway station years ago where the new chief of police and the new mayor came in and they said, we are not going to accept this anymore. And one of the things that they did, they went into the subway station. They got an old subway, just one car. They turned it into a mobile processing station for the subway. police, the transit cops. And every single person that jumped the turnstile and they caught them, they literally handcuffed them to a railing in front of this car. And until they got 10 people

in a row, standing there handcuffed to the rail, then they would take them all in and process them as a group. But everybody walked by and saw all these cheaters stand in their handcuffed to a rail in the public shaming. The second thing they did is every single night at the end of the night, all the cars that were graffitied or tagged were then cleaned. They were cleaned. All the paint was removed because they didn't want to accept that standard. They refused to say that's now the new norm, the new status quo, and we are not going to be like that. And so without somebody coming in, to your point, Vesper, and saying, hey, there's not enough people with ethics coming in and saying, forget the broken window. We're going to fix that window. We're never going to, you know, accept that

as the standard. Cash Patel is trying to do that now with the new Attorney General. Trump is trying to do that now. And maybe that brings back the courage. And this is the problem. People typically with a herd mentality are, I think inherently weak, weak-minded, they don't want to stand out, stand a ground, don't want to be different. They don't want to face opposition. It's uncomfortable for most people. Some people have a different module in their head for that. But I think at the end of the day, leadership always has to start by example. It's unequivocal. You know, in the military, there's a saying it's leaders eat last.

And I've experienced this. If there's not enough food, even though you're the highest rank, you don't eat. But your lowest ranking people eat first. Yeah, but we got to delineate between your integrity and your strategy. You do. You do. Because when I used to go out and do like, I mean, I used to be in the cadets and we'd run. like strategy mock-ups.

It didn't matter what my integrity was. The point was, I was supposed to get the flag on the other side of the team, and I needed to be more perceptive than my opponent and understand that they're using underhanded tactics to deceive me. Yes, but let's talk about your morale. Yeah, forget my morale. No, hang on, hang on, hang out, because the maintenance of morale is actually a principle of war. It is one of the fundamental principles of war is to make sure that your people have high morale.

They believe in the mission. They believe in the leadership. They believe in the people left and right of them. They will go through hell if they believe in everybody around them. But they will frag their, you know, senior leadership. If they don't believe in them and they think they're a loser, they think they're a risk to their own life, they don't believe in the mission.

They don't believe in what they're doing. And if you set the conditions for people to not believe in what you're doing and have apathy take over against confidence and pride in what you're doing, then you can no longer maintain the morale of your side in the people around you. And leadership starts at the top. If you exemplify certain qualities that gravitate people towards you, you succeed. If you exemplify corruption, you demoralize people and they don't participate. Two, Sean, can I just drop one thing to add to that?

So Michael Jordan is a complete asshole if you played with Michael Jordan. He is by far, in my opinion, the greatest leader that has ever led anyone. I mean, his record speaks for itself, but he was a complete a-hole. People, he would punch people. He was, but one thing they did was they won. Everybody wanted to be on Jordan's team. And he didn't, he was cutthroat. He just did everything as a leader.

that way he would be first to practice. He would bully everybody into being their best, raise the, I'm looking at it like a question of personal integrity. Of course, I'd respect you. Me, I'm telling everybody here, I respect Tom Arazo unbelievably. And I mean that. I'm not pandering. Everyone knows that I tell them to their face what I think.

But the way we're dealing in Canada and the politics and the policies, I'm leery of people that think that morality and all that stuff has any part in this because you're dealing with people that are intrinsically, amoral. The system is built in an amoral way. It's meant to shield everybody and demify them of anything they did. Who does that? Does a moral person do that? No. The whole system is structured in such a way that it's immoral. And if you're going to compete against or within this system, you need to start thinking like, what is my opponent doing? Because they have weighted gloves. They're putting glistin everywhere.

So this is where I fail when people look at these things like this is what we need to bring Canada back to. The problem is not that politics shouldn't go back to that. Is Canada even there? Has the citizenry not shifted morally? Certainly we have

the Brank Dassel argument. Bam! But bam. Bam, bam. That's it. I'm sorry. It's the truth. I'm not. I hate that. to say it. It sounds ugly.

No, it doesn't. But it doesn't. But it's the truth. What do you tell you sounds ugly? For my entire life, I've never heard conversations like this. What the fuck are we talking about tonight? The reality that I'm drunk, maybe because Tuse has to, has to, twos is a consummate

comment. I understand what I'm saying. The fact that you said that. No, no, but, but, but, but I understand what you're saying. But it, that doesn't shock me. No, it is ugly. Because nobody wants to live in that reality. You know what people want to live in? That we can restore life to a place where there is honor, integrity, respect for the most part. Yeah, I don't see that happening anymore.

No, okay, I'll give you a great example because let's go back to what your original question was probably 15 minutes ago. Let's talk about Derek Sloan. Okay. Derek Sloan stood for his integrity and he got swallowed up, chewed and spit out by the federal conservative party. And now who do we have in there? Somebody who was willing to set aside virtue for power.

And they will all right around. Sorry, I've met Pierre Pahliav and I've talked to the senators. They have virtue. They just may not have what you want as virtue. They also are probably quiet on their plans. Maybe I don't want to give out all my plans so that my enemies or foes don't obfuscate my plans. How do you know that when I get in, almost everything, you want, I'm probably going to do.

Listen, I'll say this about Pierre Pauliev. He's a brilliant guy. He's extremely articulate. He's a smart guy. He's been in politics for half of his life. I don't have anything personal against the guy bad. I don't. In fact, I would probably enjoy quite a bit having a personal one-on-one conversation.

Although I asked, I never got one. That's a separate issue. but my issue with a guy like Pierre Poliov isn't so much about Pierre Polyev is that it's Pierre Poliiev is a guy who's trapped inside a system he he benefits from that system greatly obviously because he's now the leader of the party but I think he's he's a good he's I'm going to say this I think he's probably a good person a good Canadian trapped inside a really vicious disgusting system and he's doing the best he can with what he's got.

You just described every single Canadian. Yeah. Right. And I'm sure. But if I may, if I may, like, okay, so what I was trying to say is for 30 some odd years, I haven't heard conversations like this. Now, can you go back to the early 90s and maybe they were happening on CBC and CBC Radio? It's possible.

It's possible, right? I know at one point, Preston Manning's father used to have a, a radio show where he'd, he, uh, it was a gospel show or forgive me, Albertans, you can say it better. So at one point that world existed like that, where, where politicians were very open and et cetera. But like in the last, is it two decades? I got Vesper, you're older than me. Two's were roughly the same age. Vesper, I apologize. I feel like you're older than me. Yes, but I could be. Yeah. Vesper significantly older than us. Okay. Sure. And, and all I'm saying is,

I didn't say that in, in the last. four years, for sure four, because I'm sitting here and continue to unearth conversations like this, is you want to go back to morality. You want to go back to these things. It's like, well, for the last two decades, we've been told by everyone, barrage, you're not going back. Just take the simplest of things, you know, we talked about HIV and gay marriage and how everybody's accepted it. it's like there's probably people that haven't accepted it or or have opened up the Pandora's box of where we get to with you can marry a cat or you can be a cat and they'll never talk about it because they're scared right because of the the media buyoff that all the things of it but you want to get back to any sort of morality it's things like this that are happening and starting to happen more and more and more and more and more that I think actually could start a conversation of maybe getting back to some framework of morality or am i wrong in that like i just i think of this conversation where we're talking about i'm like i don't want to shut this off you know in an ideal world tom is completely correct

twos and tom are completely correct in an ideal world this is where maybe we're going to disagree my respect for both all of you here is i i truly respect all of you you know i mean it i'll say to your face if i don't but the whole problem is is that we just share two different points of views on what I think it's going to take to bring that morality. Most of it is usually involving self, laying down one's worldview. But looking at the, I don't know what you want to call it, the complete invasion of postmodernism. I know you want to say something.

Say it, man. Oh, I was just going to say, you know, you got Michael Keaton saying, we don't live in a perfect world. And then Kim Basker saying it doesn't have to be a perfect world. Right. And see, it's not that there's not that there isn't light in this darkness, but we have to accept that we are in the darkness. Right. Where I struggle is with people who think, no, we're going to light up the world.

It's all going to be light. No, it's never going to be all light. We are beacons of light. Yes. And when we conglomerate together, we can make larger lights. But we're never going to be able to light up the whole world, like as if there's no more darkness. That's fantasy. And I have to deal with.

I think we're dealing with fencing. This is why volcanization is a good thing. The whole thing is, if you know this, if every single Canadian listening to me knows this, it's not that the world is hopeless, but let's face it, the systems we've erected and the people, no matter what party,

and Tom, any party, any human can be corrupted. I've said it on the show before. We literally see every person going to politics, Fesper, and something happens. Dude, I might get corrupted. If you put me in power, or a Lebanese, Quebecwa, New York accent, kind of a guy that has kind of nice hair,

you know, some salt and pepper. That has to use, that has to use. And do all this stuff. I might get corrupted. It might get to my head. And I might start thinking that I'm something that I'm not. And then I'll see all these new networks that are available to me, you know, through the different.

How everybody, almost everybody who wins the lottery ends up broke a few years later. And now that they change. They completely change. And so I wonder sometimes, do people empathize with those that do get into high power that there are going to be compromises that you're probably going to make very few and far between people have I ever met that have had over a six figure salary that have not changed very few so I'm not saying Tom you will I mean given what I've seen I would bet my money you wouldn't okay but very very few and far

between Vespers what you're pointing out yeah and I'm sorry I I think if you're going to fight fire you fight it with fire you don't come and say, well, you know what, these guys have been playing like snakes and we need to do a better example. They're running the gear and the apparatus. If you're going to, I'm not saying lie and cheat and steal, but man, let's go back to Sun Su. His whole thing, his warfare is based on deception. I'm not saying go out and lie to your own people, but you got to be tactical. And you worked in tactical when you were in the military. I've heard you talk about that. Strategic advantage requires part of the, part of the, part of the,

the game theory is what part of this is to deceive my foe or enemy that I'm not going to be at this location. I need to make them think I'm going to be at this location or not at this time. And anyone that talks to me in a very simplistic, idealistic way that we need to do this, we need to do this. Canadians need to remember you're facing snakes that are funded by China, the EU, what do you call them, NGOs, S&C Labelans, Libyans, Libyans, Lebanese, a bunch of people that have a ton of money. They don't care about ideologies.

Anyone thinks that these people care about green. Anybody thinks that they care about the environment or pride. They need to wake up. These guys care about money, money and power. And if they can use this to wedge and make more room for themselves to get power, they'll do it. They don't care about anything. They care about money. That's it.

And as long as people just remember that that's who we're facing, then we need to work accordingly. That's my opinion. Right. I'd love a world, Tom, that you're saying, this is how we need to be. I just don't see it happening. At this point, I'm just as skeptical. I mean, yes, I will fully acknowledge, yes, this is an idealistic perspective on the world. Absolutely true.

Are we really going to get there? I'm not seeing any evidence from the Ontario voters. That's the direction they want to go. you know, when I look at Trump, his second presidency, like this, this whole election, and in both cases, you know, I kind of struggle with this idea of, is the public, in an idealistic term, is the public the ones who are supposed to lead the politicians in the direction society wants to go because elected officials are calling themselves representatives, right? They're not saying, hey, I'm the leader.

I'm getting elected leader. I'm getting elected to be a representative. And in fact, a congressperson, congressman in the U.S. is called a representative. They get elected to the House of Representatives, right? That's the theory that they do the bidding of what the public wants as a representative. What Trump did was a little, well, no, what Trump did was drastically different. What Trump did is he said, this is my vision for America. and I am going to do this, this, this, this, this and this.

And yeah, a lot of people said he was crazy. You know, the Democrats went ballistic. He got vilified by the media. Everybody knows the whole story. But what he said is this is my vision. If you elect me, you're giving me the authority, not to be the representative, but to be the leader. And that's a distinctive difference. And I know it's very subtle.

but to think about it. You get a lot of people that, you know, finger put it up in the air, which way is the wind blowing? What is Twitter saying I have to pay attention to today? What does the, what's trending on Twitter so I can make a comment about it? Who can I go and follow?

Where's the herd that I can follow? Trump never said that. He said, this is what I'm, this is how I'm going to remake America in its original image. But these are the things I have. to do to get there. And if I have to drain the swamp, I'll drain the swamp. And he was bold. And he was very, the best word for him is incredibly bold and incredibly brave, even despite

a couple assassination attempts, regardless if you believe them to be real or not, he still stood his ground and he said, this is who I am, this is what I want for America. And Americans said, I agree. And here's my vote. You go and do what you said, you're going to do what you said, you're going to do. I don't see anyone doing that in Canada. At any level of government. Nobody's doing it to that level. Now, listen, I don't want to open up the PPC-C-C-PC fight.

I don't want to do that. We're not going to fight. By the way, we're not going to fight. There's a lot of things in the PPC I like. I'm just strategic in the way that I'm thinking, and I'm seeing, and I'm sorry, the reason you're not going to win is not because you guys are not the right party. The reason you're not going to win is because most people are not ready for the PPC. And I agree.

I agree. Like, I had lunch with Maxine Bernier last Friday. Okay, it was something planned for months and it finally came up. It was just for lunch. Like I've said many times, I'm not going to join as a candidate in the federal election. You know, I like their platform. The reason also is some of the Ontario Party candidates that we ran in this election today are also PPC candidates federally. I love many PPC people.

Like on every party, there's a fringe, you know, a group of people. But I'm just saying, like, I have no problem with this, what you guys, the PPC stands for. The issue is there's a reason why you can't even get a seat, PPC. It's not because you don't stand for the right thing. It's because maybe you're not calculating the population does not share those values. Well, and they've been brainwashed and primed over decades to not believe in those things that you believe in. And this is what, this is what concerns me. because, you know, Bernier is going out there.

He's got the freedom to say, hey, my party's never been elected. I don't have a track record that you can beat me up with, right? Where all the other parties have track records that you can hang around their head like a big heavy yoke. But so it affords him the opportunity to be bold because he's got nothing to lose by being bold. He can outline his plan and say, you want this, you want that. You want all these things. You vote for the PPC. That's what I'm going to give you.

Right? But the public has proven so far that they're not even willing to entertain that. Why? Because it goes back to what you said earlier. People like a winner. They're looking at Pierre Polly of as Michael Jordan. They want a winner. And they don't want to take a chance.

They don't want to be left out of the herd. And so I hear this argument all the time. Well, I'm going to vote for the conservatives because the PPC doesn't have a chance. And the reason the PPC doesn't have a chance is because you, the voter, are voting with the herd and you won't take the chance. And you got to. I got to ask Sean and to something. And please chime in. If you had to stake the country's future twos or Sean on a fight between Floyd.

No, no, hold on. Floyd moneymaker weather. Mr. I have zero morality. Yeah. And Manny Pachial, who is like, ultra-Christian, ultra-conservative, very integrity. If those two were getting into a ring, who would you put your money on?

Assuming that they suddenly, assuming that they suddenly weighed the same? Yeah, yeah. Let's say many versus because they fought already. Floyd Money, Mayweather. He has no morality, though. We're talking about a guy that says, you didn't ask me who has morality. You asked me who's going to win the fight. I'm just showing you something, right?

Why would you take? He was crazy, dude. No, no, hold on. You're going to pick Pacquiao over Floyd, money Mayweather. If they're suddenly the same size? Same size, same weight, same everything. Pound for pound. It's a grizzly bear versus a

Wolverine and the Wolverine wins. Need I remind you, right? Like, Manny Pacquiao, you put him in the same ring? What happens with Floyd made money? He won't even able to touch him. But the point that I'm trying to make is this. He's a guy with no morality. Here's a guy with morality. I would put my money on Floyd, who has no morality. if my country's at stake.

I hope that makes sense. You're asking, yeah. So, like, you're asking me to pick who I think would win in the fight, not who I think I want around my kids. But no, exactly. You're asking me a very simple question, Bessper. Yeah. I want the winner.

And to me, the guy who wins fights, and I realize they're both, like, you're, we're splitting hairs because they're both winners, but you're asking me in a winner take all, it's Floyd Money and Mayweather. Yeah. I mean, if you're, if you wanted him for your for Alberta, for example, okay, you needed somebody to win for Alberta, but he had a track rate of immoral behavior, but you knew he would win. I don't know, Donald Trump. Let's, I'm just using an example. No, but I'm, I am using the example. Donald Trump is right there. I know. I know. That's my point. That is the point. This is the point. People want to win. They're not so interested anymore. Unfortunately. in integrity and morality. Now, if it comes with it, bonus.

But most of the time, they don't, they want to just live comfortable lives. They want to know how you're going to make me live comfortably. That's it. Unfortunately. When people have skin in the game, they're motivated. And maybe, maybe I'm wrong on this with the PPC for a second. Yeah.

And maybe Tom can add into this. I remember asking a guy who introduced me to Derek Sloan in Ottawa. while I'm roaming around, flag on me, everything. This is amazing. Derek Sloat, picture right on, cool. And I remember after that asking him why Derek Sloan wasn't in the PPC. Now, I don't remember his answer, but I remember asking him, why don't I bring Derek Sloan and Maxine Bernier on the same podcast?

There is a window of opportunity because I agree with what Vesper's saying, but there was a window of opportunity when Aaron O'Toole was the guy that everybody was hanging and there was this void of like leadership and everything and I know my my math is off because it wasn't at that exact time maybe it was but I remember thinking if sloan and bernier and all the characters all came together and showed unity under ppc there might be a window instead they couldn't and I don't understand that Vesper probably has a thought I remember just thinking come on like Derek Sloan's the outspoken guy Roman Babers the outspoken guy all these guys are old sports. They're getting booted out anyways.

Go rally under. But is it because they all want power that bad? They can't. Conservatives just can't find a way to work together. When our country is literally burning, the boat is sinking and we won't all come together under PBC. So now you ask me who we need

as the leader to win against Mark Carney. It is not a question, which is sad to say. And I'll probably get, well, actually, I don't care what PPC says. I just don't care. I don't go online to see it either. so have ater. But like the answer is simple. It's the best opportunity to get out of the current situation is Pierpolia. I mean, we're at the 12th hour.

An election should be, you know, in theory could be called for April. Do you really get out of the situation, Sean? I mean, you've got a guy who said he's not going to do anything with the dairy cartel. He's not going to do anything with equalization. Are you getting out of the situation or are you just paddling a little bit towards the water? Hold on. I got to answer that. First of all, two, is no disrespect.

Actually, full disrespect. Nice. Okay. You need to quit it on that because you and I both know that before I get into power, I'm definitely going to keep all my plans secret, and I'm not going to tell you what I'm going to do. All right. Okay.

Hold on. Hold on. I'm not done. I'm not done. Quebec talking here. Let me finish. Okay. Let me finish.

All right. You get 60% of the talking time. Well, you invite the Quebec. We never get invited anywhere. So what I'm trying to say is this. Trump made some things public. Let's use him as an example. Many other things he kept under wraps.

And he did those things the second he got an office under executive order. Am I wrong? Anyone? You're not wrong. And pretty much every politician does it. But I would argue, I would argue Vesper, that to pin the hopes of a continued slugging along in this lame excuse for confederation that we have that we call a country, on one guy slow playing his hand.

Like I just, I'm going to vote for him because I feel like if he wins, he's going to pull the mask off and say, surprise, cockfags. Hey, you know, and actually turn things around. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I have family in New Jersey.

You know what they told me in New Jersey? We have it worse than you in Quebec. And I thought we had it bad. That's in the United States under our constitutional republic. They couldn't go to no gyms. They couldn't leave their houses. they couldn't even drive their cars that this is in Oakland, New Jersey. This is like a ritziest place.

Is that because they're Lebanese, though? No, no, no, no, maybe. But that's not really the reason. It's because where people are forgetting, the president of the United States doesn't run the whole country. Governors of each state tell their people what to do, and there's some federal intervention unless he launches an emergency order. But until it's at time, this is why the governor of Florida didn't have to follow every edict

that came from the White House. So let's get something straight. So let's get something straight. You want a constitutional republic. In my estimation, I don't know about you, Tom, if I had to go to any kind of a politician in the U.S., it would not be Trump when I think of ethics. It would be someone like Ron or Rand Paul.

Yeah. Rand Paul, you could look it up on YouTube, said, we operate more like a monarchy than a constitutional republic. So what's this veneer? it is a constitutional republic. But when money's involved, when special interests are involved, there is no democracy. There is no constitutional republic.

And so you're pushing this 51st state BS. I'm not buying it because you know why? Americans don't buy it. I think Martin Armstrong said the worst type of government is a republic. I could be wrong on his wording of it. And the reason why is he talked about how eventually everybody can be bribed, right? Everybody can be bought. Yeah.

Dude, didn't you see those Black Rock interviews? You know, so I want to sort of touch on something you said Vesper because you're a couple of times I think you've alluded to the fact that, you know, Paulie of is keeping his cars close to his chest, right? He's not announcing to the world. I'm not sure. But I'm saying it's a possibility. Yeah. And I would argue that it is a possibility, a strong possibility because I've kind of gone around looking for their platform.

And I'm not really seeing what their platform is, but you can go to the PPC. and anyone else's and see what their platforms are, but they're keeping theirs close to their chest. What that tells me is, you know, we're all upset because we're about to have an unelected, Mark Carney, an unelected prime minister of Canada

that nobody voted for. The general public didn't, okay, but yet we're going to have Pierre Paulya get elected Prime Minister of Canada in October, but keep his cards close to his chest and not really tell us exactly. what he's about either. And we're just going to have to fall for acts to tax and bring it home and whatever slogan he can hammer into us 20 times a day. Now, listen, I'm not here to convince

anybody to vote one party or another. That's not what I'm about. I'm just here to talk about the way I see it, the way I analyze it, and where I'm putting my weight behind people that do certain things. Okay. And I'll tell you right now, I will spoil my ballot before I vote for any single person in this country who is going to warmonger with Russia and get involved in other people's countries and other people's conflicts and other people's bullshit and not put Canada first and ignore the plight of the Canadian people in this country. We should be, literally the Saudi Arabia of North America. We really should.

We've got Quebec. We've got Saskatchewan. We've got Alberta. We've got B.C., we've got Ontario. We are so disgustingly resource rich. There's no excuse why. We aren't the wealthiest country in probably the world. We have more oil than anyone else.

The Americans get more oil from us than they do from the Middle East, by the way. That's not where the resources stop either, Tom. I mean, there are stories of when people landed in New Brunswick. they could literally just poke the ground and light the gas coming out on fire. The first several oil wells dug in Canada were around Sarnia. Yeah, but what I'm not going to do is I refuse to reward one political party for all of the work that another political party and their supporters have been doing for the last four years. I will not support. I will not give my reward that was earned by this group of people to,

to another group over here. I will not do that. Yeah, but that's principle. See, all that's just your principle. And like I said, we have to delineate between people of principle and people that want to win. I want this clown show out. Yes. I'm not really interested.

I'm not interested in the morality of it all. I want this clown show out once they're out, then I'll address the morality. Yeah, but you want to trade them for a guy with slightly smaller shoes. No, you're saying that. That's your opinion. The reason why that's your argument. The reason why that's your opinion. And by the way, I'm not funded no way.

I've talked to senators and I've called them out. I went to their rallies and to their face, shake their hands and look at them in the eyes and say to them, listen to me. I know you're not going to be lying to me. I recorded you and you said all these things. So a lot of people are making arguments out of silence, ex nilio. You cannot do that. You cannot conjecture and speculate. You're allowed.

We're all allowed. But you can't come to a conclusionary conclusion. What a dummy. A conclusion on something that you cannot prove, whether you like it or not, that's your gut. Fine, that's fine. I respect that. We're all entitled to our gut.

But at the end of the day, we don't know. And all I've ever said from the very beginning, from the people that known me, from Clyde, from Northern perspective, from everybody, is let's give them a chance to see. If everything that they've said, they would follow through, because in the first six months, if they don't follow through, I am politically homeless.

I don't want to go to anyone anymore. at that point. And I'm not saying I'm banking all my hope on them like they're the savior, Tom. What I'm saying is, and twos, I'm saying is you guys are coming to conclusions prematurely, not knowing that these guys know that they're dealing with vipers. Okay. Let me, let me say this, though. I'm sorry, for real quick, what Tom said before about they've got their records that, that hang around them, that you can hang around them like a yoke. You've got the conservative record. Polyev's been in Ottawa almost as long as that.

damn bridge so what trump has funded the hillary and bill clinton campaign he's given money to multiple people that are oligarchs within the democratic party that weaponize the same government that attacked him hey have people forgotten like trump is basically the poster child for everybody that's just been completely red-pilled like like are we all pretending like oh just because these people were like this this is how it's going to be how do you know that can you tell the future because Tuesday if you do send me that crystal ball I'll give you anything well I'm telling you all I'm telling you is you're you're saying that there's a complete dearth of evidence and I'm saying there's some evidence and all of it is their past actions you're saying okay you're saying

there's a little bit of no no you're don't and it's all what they've done previous don't put that in my mouth I'm not saying that I've I've even said that the conservatives have been flawed they've been flawed me and you talked about this with Harper with the China deals and the and the 400 million dollar scandal with harbord i've said this i've never said that they were perfect my aim and mo is we need to get clownsicle out of whatever power they're in right now and then let's deal with instead of a level level six boss sitting at the top let's bring him down and let's start dealing with at least calling these people out because man this is some irrational shit that we've been seeing for the last four years you understand we're talking about completely irrational and i'm sorry aeronotool if you're

F you. You might as well be a liberal. Okay. As far as I'm concerned, you went door knocking for for them in in B.C. I don't want to hear your CAF bullshit. I don't want to hear any of this stuff from Aaron O'Toole. As far as I'm concerned, you are a tool and it's perfect and aptly named after you because everything that you did has been counter every policy. All they targeted me. Dude, even if they targeted you, you were useless. You didn't stand up for no truckers. You didn't stand up for nothing that was civil rights. You hidden coward. I have Pierre. video standing up yelling in the House of Commons for the truckers that they're suffering and

we're not helping them and all you guys are doing on the other side and Aaron O'Too, what's you doing? Trying to pacify everybody. This is the problem, right? You and your morality will not win here. You're dealing with people that have there are amoral. They have no morality. Okay, let me let me. I'm not going to go back to the convoy thing with Pierre Paul. Well, how about how about this? Final comments. I wanted to, I'm like, you know what, Tuesday? We need, we have, we literally have a live show in like, I don't even know how long,

I'm going to get a little bit of sleep. I've been going since like 4.30 this morning on my side and I got to be up and I'm going to deal with two's bullshit tomorrow best friend. I know you feel me. He's going to give me this laundry list to stop the read. Then I'm going to show up and he's going to be like, oh, you didn't read it. And he's going to be on me. I can only feel it.

I'll be up three hours before you putting that list together. Final comments. We're going to wrap this up. This has been something. This has been, you know, I want to continue this conversation on another day. That's totally fine. That's totally fine.

You kick in, Tom. Are you giving me, okay. No, no, no. Goodness gracious, Tom. Finish your thought. Okay. 33% of the entire country lives in southern Ontario.

If you look at the provincial election, every single one of the, the major legacy political parties, every single one of them acknowledged, We don't have enough doctors, nurses, schools. And all of their platforms were very similar. The way they were addressing health care in the province of Ontario. 16 million people in Ontario.

Lots of them are immigrants on their way into Canada before they branch out. If you took all of Quebec and all of Alberta, combined their populations, you still be millions of people short of what we have here in Ontario. Here we have a federal issue. We have sent 9 million rounds of ammunition to Ukraine. We have sent four leopard tanks. We're about to send a whole bunch of lavatory armored fighting vehicles. We've sent soldiers over to Poland to train Ukrainian people.

We have dedicated $15 billion of taxpayers' money to a former Cold War enemy. Okay. And here's my issue. During the Cold War, I trained, I joined the Army. 1990. I was a 16-year-old reservist, and I was fighting the Cold War, even though it was officially over. Okay. Our mortal enemy under the Warsaw Pact was Ukraine, Russia, Poland, and I've been to Poland a couple of times, my fiancés from there originally, and I love it. Lithuania, Latvia, Czechoslovakia, you name it, okay, Serbia, Bosnia, all of that stuff.

part of the Warsaw Pact, which was the counter to NATO. We spent the whole entire Cold War, the NATO getting ready to fight, Warsaw, the Warsaw Pact. Now, all of a sudden, all of a sudden, because, and by the way, Ukraine was never part of the Warsaw Pact, you know why? Because it was so closely linked to Russia that it was actually considered really the Liability. The red-headed stepchild of Russia, but it was still the child of Russia.

And it wasn't formally part of the Warsaw Pact. That's how close they were combined. Now you're saying we're going to risk World War III to go and defend the virtue and the freedom of a former mortal enemy that I trained as a young soldier to kill their soldiers. We're giving them $15 billion while all of them are sitting there going, well, we need more hospitals. We need more doctors. We have a fentanyl crisis. We have CBSA that's under man. So don't tell me that we have all these federal political parties,

because every single one of them except one, every single one except one party is pro-Ukraine, anti-Russia. They want to get into a world war with Russia and more monger. Russia's cyber warfare capability will destroy Canada with a flick of a switch. We have no means. I have no comprehension why any federal, provincial or sorry, any federal political party would be poking the bear in war mongering in the affairs. Listen, you know what happens if Russia takes over Ukraine completely or vice versa?

You know what happens in the life of Ontarians? Nothing. Nothing. Nothing happens. Why are we sending all of our resources there when we have major problems at home? Fifteen billion dollars might have gone a long way to combat maybe tariffs, right? Where's the health care? What about securing the border? Look at the state of our military right now. This is my bailiwick. I can tell you right now, the state of the Canadian armed forces is, it's worse than the decade of darkness that the cod used to talk about. It is in the worst shape it's ever been in its entire history. We cannot defend ourselves. We have no national defense. We can't even put ships to sea. We can't even put ships to sea. We

can't put a brigade into Europe. We have four brigades and across Canada, or sorry, we have three regular force brigades. And now we're trying to build one in Latvia and Lithuania because of the Russian threat. Seriously. Like, I don't understand federally why our political parties are talking about this nonsense. The rest of the world's problems are not our problems. They're not our problem. Canada's our problems, our problem right now. And we need to build a strong relationship with our neighbor, who we've always had great relations with. 9-11, we took in Americans. We fought in World War I, World War II, Korea.

A lot of Canadians went to Vietnam, global war on terror. Our economies are so integrated, it's ridiculous. And yet, we're spending time talking about what Russia is doing to their little brother, when we should be focusing on building a strong relationship with the Americans. And that's where we should be doing. And we've got to get into immigration under control, right? We're not talking about the things that we need to do. We're talking about the things that other political or the political class want to do.

Not what we need to do. And that's my rant. And that's my last word. And I feel for your Vesper because I know you're like, but. I tell you what if you want to respond Vesper, you can. What the heck of my doing here? You know, shut this. you know, like, I mean, I've had to pee for an hour.

And I'm just sitting here the whole time. I'm thinking, you know what? Next time we have Tom on a show. We have them on at the start where I haven't been drinking beer and Red Bull for five hours. Because if it was anybody else, I would have been like, yeah, I'm going to be back in a couple minutes. But with Tom, and definitely not Besper, but definitely Tom, I've been like, I'm not going to miss a second of this. I've, uh, boys, I, I, um, Like I say, we could carry this on for a long time.

I have, I'm sure I have thoughts. I'm sure Vesper does. I'm sure too does. I'm sure, you know, like the audience has been really interesting. Wonderful. Yeah, and I've been getting texts all night long too as well. So it's been a really interesting thing. We appreciate Vesper, the surprise appearance, never disappoints. And Tom appreciate, you know what's funny about this?

Tom wasn't confirmed until like, what, an hour before you came on, maybe. So both of this right here is, is, wasn't in the, the cards and then all of a sudden it came out of nowhere. So one of those. I just want to say one thing. If you want more of my insanity, I am on X. I don't respond to everything, but you could look up Vesper digital and you'll find me.

But listen, come at your own risk. Okay. Vesper, thanks for hopping on, Tom. All right. You as well. Thank you. Quick shout out. Joe Mama was like one of the first people to comment when we came live.

And she's still here. still watching. Yeah. So thanks for that. That's pretty cool. Yeah. All right. We'll let the two of them out.

Two's, uh, you know, um, as we wrap this up, closing on on five hours. Wrap it up faster. I've got to pee. Do you want to, do you want to go pee quick? No, no. Just, just step it up. Okay. Well, I was going to say is, you know, like when we did the, the, the, the first one,

Alberta, we had our, our technical issues, right? Remember we had 7,000 people watching in the first, like, hour. It was insane, folks. And, um, you. you know, we're sitting doing Ontario live election coverage, which really hasn't been that. And by the account here, it's over 6,600. So it's been, it's been really cool to, drop it off a bit, but yeah.

But it's been, it's been really cool to see, you know, the interaction and everything else. And like a typical live election coverage when you come with us two on it, um, you plan for something to talk about an election. And it took a giant, giant 180, not 181, I don't know, left turn, I don't know, maybe 180, it doesn't matter. It was a fantastic, interesting conversation.

I have to give a shout out to every single guest that came on here and answered the bell to come in. Lots of them said they had got nothing to talk about with Ontario. There's nothing to talk about. I'm like, that is something to talk about. And we saw that through and through tonight. I don't know, too, is your thoughts before we get out of here. Well, I'm the one who said that to you like eight hours ago. so so there's that once again once again so there's that two's doing the old you know

you're you're literally bogart i'm so right on our show i'm so right of course i'm so right i'm so right oh you know folks he's so right twos any other final thoughts other than pointing out you're so right uh uh just thanks to everybody for tuning and and thanks to everybody who came on uh we're really lucky to have some awesome people watching and and some awesome people that are willing to come on and share their thoughts. And I definitely don't have enough interesting things to say to fill up five hours. But we've got to constantly be kicking people out because there's so many of them with so many cool things to bring to the table. And you think we had a bunch that couldn't make it tonight, right?

Like, and I'm almost thankful they did now because I'm like, I don't. know where I would have squeezed them in. I was, I was like, do I go up to seven people or the people even in, anyways, it doesn't matter. What I'm going to do is I'm going to play the Cornerstone Forum trailer. There's 6,600 people watching. I've got an event coming up May 10th in Calgary. If you're liking these conversations, this is exactly what's going to happen. In Calgary, Alberta, the Cornerstone Forum. I'm going to play that. Then I'm going to play the song as we exit out. Tuesday can go pee. If you make it back in time, maybe we can say a couple more words. But, uh, no, I'm good. You start playing that trailer and I'm

on. Thanks again folks for hopping in. And if you enjoy this, we try and cover every election in Canada. We did the U.S. We're going to do the federal election when it comes. And believe me, if you like this appetizer, you just wait for the federal election to, is that going to be something or am I wrong there? Not exaggerating. We're going to have the best damn election coverage you've ever seen. And it's probably going to be talked about internationally. There you go. All right. Here's the Cornerstone Forum trailer. If you're interested in tickets, well, they're online. Go to my Twitter.

Real quick. Real quick. If you're unfamiliar with the mashup, tune in in 12 hours because we're going to be covering the weeks of that. We're live at 10 a.m. every Friday Mountain Standard time. We do have a full lineup tomorrow. We got Corey Morgan from the Western Standard. We have, I actually don't know.

I hope we have Eric. Yeah. Yeah. Talking somebody who. is facing charges for taking down a fence around a church in 2021. And I believe we have Eric Bouchard, although I got to confirm that. I didn't follow up with that and it is now 10 o'clock at night. We should have somebody coming on to talk,

an injection of truth. It's going to be in Calgary as well Monday. So that's going to be interesting. Either way, folks, here is the Cornerstone Forum trailer. If you're in Calgary, May 10th, we'd love to see you there. Tickets online. You can find them if you go to my ex profile.

It's pinned at the top. uh two's tell uh tomorrow morning i guess yeah we'll see you around sometime in a world falling into chaos war in world war three fear corruption i intend to resign and division reign propaganda and censorship cloud the truth labeling people is extreme right-winged leaving us confused alone. No more. Cornerstone Forum is coming back for a second year. No longer are we conforming to the pattern of this world.

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