Shaun Newman Podcast - #858 - Marc Beckman

Episode Date: May 28, 2025

Marc Beckman is the author of Some Future Day, the Host of Some Future Day podcast, and the CEO of the award-winning advertising agency DMA United. He has executed campaigns for the NBA, Pepsi, Sony, Warner Bros. Entertainment, NARS, Washington, DC, Nelson Mandela, Gucci, and MoMA. Beckman embraces emerging technology to augment campaigns, including artificial intelligence (AI), spatial computing, and blockchain.Marc’s book Some Future Day:https://www.amazon.com/Some-Future-Day-Change-Everything/dp/1648210775To watch the Full Cornerstone Forum: https://open.substack.com/pub/shaunnewmanpodcastGet your voice heard: Text Shaun 587-217-8500Silver Gold Bull Links:Website: https://silvergoldbull.ca/Email: [e-mail] Grahame: [phone]Bow Valley Credit UnionWebsite: www.BowValleycu.comEmail: [e-mail] Use the code “SNP” on all ordersProphet River Links:Website: store.prophetriver.com/Email: [e-mail]

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This is Tammy Peterson. This is Danielle Smith. This is James Lindsay. Hey, this is Brett Kessel, and you're listening to the Sean Newman podcast. Welcome to the podcast, folks. How's everybody doing today? Happy Wednesday. The number of ounces of silver need to buy an ounce of gold now in 30-year highs.

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And this week, I just want to highlight Renegade Acres. I don't know if anyone's been needing any cement work done, but, you know, one of the things they do is stamp concrete. They just do pads, too. They do all different sorts of cement work. and I just got all the time in the world for it. Like, what they've done in the new studio is just, it's pretty, pretty impressive, I think is the word I'm looking for.

Like, I was shocked, like, look down, holy crap, like, this is, this is something. And so if you're looking for anything to do with Concrete, Caleb Taves, Renegate Aker, you can shoot me attacks. I gladly put you in touch with them. You're hard pressed to find anyone better than Caleb and his group of guys. and kids, for that matter. He's got his sons that work with them alongside him as well. And it's pretty, pretty cool.

And obviously, if you're looking to Port-Pad or you got some creative stuff that you want to do with stamp concrete, I would point you to Caleb Taves and the work that they do. We got the new studio, of course, coming here in 2025. I was just out there yesterday. Man alive. It looks, I think, phenomenal is the way. ordered I'm going to use. Like, I'm just super impressed. Josh's been doing the finishing work with all the,

you know, all the wood and, um, the, uh, the shiplap and everything. And the room is just coming together. You know, I wish you could push the easy button and boom, it's done and we're in there tomorrow. Uh, you know, there's some things that just take time. And, uh, every time I go walk back in there, I'm like, man, alive, this is, it's going to be so dope. Like, I'm just, ah, so excited. And, um, so that, that's coming. If you want to be a part of the legacy wall, I was just talking to Peter. Shout out to Peter in Manitoba because he's coming to do the brickwork on it. If you want to be on that wall, well, shoot me a text.

We're looking for still lots of things, skills, labor, materials, money. We're trying to do value for value, trying to put your name on the wall. There's a whole list of people now growing companies. And if you want a part of that, just shoot me a text, and we can start a conversation. I'd love to have you a part of it. If you're listening or watching on Spotify, Apple, YouTube Rumble, X, make sure to subscribe. make sure to leave a review, make sure to share. As you're going to hear from our guest today,

the algorithms are designed to, you know, push through different things and not, you know, and not hide, but, you know, give you what you want. So the more you share this, hopefully we hit some new audiences and they can find it as well. And once people are clicking on it, it's only going to go up from there, and it continues to go up.

So I appreciate all your help there. Now, let's get on to that tale of the tape. He's the author of Some Future Day, the host of Some Future Day podcast and the CEO of award-winning advertising agency, DMA United. I'm talking about Mark Beckman. So buckle up. Here we go. Welcome to the Sean Numa podcast. Today I'm joined by Mark Beckman.

Sir, thanks for hopping on. Sean, it's great to see you. Thank you for having me. How are you today? Well, like I was saying before we started, like, where I sit, you know, spring almost feels like a summer day. You know, like, and up here, we, it's been, you know, it's been a long old winter and spring has had its fits. Some days it's, it's, you're like, oh, we're here we go. And the next day it turning, you're like, man, I might snow again. So it is a beautiful day. How's, how's Mark doing there?

Where are you sitting at right now? I'm in New York City. So I feel you with the, uh, cold weather pain. It was Memorial Day weekend here in the United States this week. And we had 40s and rainy weather in Manhattan. So I get it. I get it. Well, it's the first time on the show. So what I want to do is, you know, I give you the floor. Tell the audience a bit about yourself. Like who is Mark and I don't know, start as early or as late as you prefer? Yeah.

So I'll try to keep it very top line, but I am the CEO and founder of an award-winning advertising agency in New York City, which is named DMA United. And our clients are pretty. interesting. They run across fashion art, music, sports and entertainment, and technology, emerging technology like artificial intelligence and blockchain has always provided our clients and our agency with an advantage and underpinning to all of our campaigns. To name drop a little bit, Sean, our clients range from Nelson Mandela and Pepsi to the NBA, Major League Baseball, Sony Music, Warner Brothers, Carl Lagerfeld.

Tom Ford. So like I said, we're really like sitting at the center of fashion art, music, sports and entertainment. And, you know, I was fortunate. We've had some good success stories there. And I've been fortunate enough to, I was asked to teach an MBA class at NYU Stern in marketing. So I've been doing that for about seven years. And as a result of all of those experiences, I wrote a couple of bestselling books. The current one is, best selling on Amazon for artificial intelligence. It's called Some Future Day, How AI is Going to Change Everything. Actually, I have it sitting here. Here's what it looks like, kind of cool. And because of the books going to number one in emerging technologies, NYU named me Senior Fellow of Emerging Technology. Excuse me. So I have kind of like a different lens. than most I see the world through, let's say, the lifestyle categories, but I'm using technology in real time to the benefit of my clients. So my book that I, the current book, for example, it's written really to provide individuals who are beginners in artificial intelligence

with the tools that they could use to make their careers better, to enhance their families, and even to improve their communities. And in the book, what I do show on is I lay out every single chapter with tools that curious beginners, not techies, like real beginners, normal people, small business owners, probably a lot of people in your audience, if they want to know, how do I stand up an ad campaign using AI or write a memorandum or, you know, kick off that boring email. That's what I provide them with my book. So that's kind of who I am and what I do.

Um, curious. You know, you've rattled off some like monstrous, uh, groups, right? Like the NBA, uh, you know, isn't my favorite sport, but at the same time, it's, it's one of the big ones, right? So like, I'm like, that's, you know, that that's no small fry, I guess is what I'm, uh, pointing out. Well, how did you get your start? Like, I'm just curious. Like, were you, were you always interested in this? Did you, did, you know, did you find this path from a very early age? Or did you, you know, like, I don't know, did it fall in your lap or did it, what, did it take a considerable amount of effort to get to working with groups like that? We never stop working, Sean, and we never stop learning. I think a big edge to the agency is the fact that we see the seriousness of

leveraging artificial intelligence, for example. But it's a cross-discipline practice. My background is actually law. I was admitted to the bar in New York, New Jersey, and D.C. So what we'll do for a lot of our clients is stand up these programs at the intersection of content and commerce. So did you say you like basketball or you don't like basketball? I'm a hockey guy. Is that surprising coming from the Canadian? It's middle of the NHL playoffs. I don't know what's NBA playoffs too.

It's good. I don't know. Are you a Knicks fan? I'm a Knicks fan. Yeah, we're doing well. We're doing well. But I grew up being a massive New York Islanders fan, which you might remember. Islanders fan?

Come on. We had those four years. Remember we had those four years. I was at all of those Stanley Cup years with Mike Bossy, Brian Trottier, John Tenelli. So that was amazing. That was an amazing time period in New York. Best team, right? Best hockey team in New York. Believe me, the Oilers, the Oilers ran into that a couple times. Correct. Correct. We beat all those guys. Gratsky, Messier, Yari Curry, all of those guys. But what we'll do is just by way of example. So in basketball, for example, like Russell Westbrook when he was MVP of the NBA was our client. So our strategy was to go out and get him deals. So he did like his retail deal, his a lot of commercial endorsements like Subway. And then once we lock in the deal, we roll up the advertising and communications all across that. So that's the uniqueness of the agency.

So we live at this intersection of content and commerce. And then the cross-disciplined approach of being experts with communications, business development and law are real for our clients. You talk about AI. I take it you're very pro-AI, right? There's like two sides of this coin. One is like, oh, man, look at all the things AI is going to do for it. It's going to be amazing.

And then there's the other side of like, I don't know, take any, not horror film, but, you know, where they depict AI as both kill us. And as it gets smarter, you know, it's going to wipe us off the face of the earth. as being a small business guy running a podcast, I see a lot of cool things about AI. And I'm like, as you talk about a book that's for beginners, I'm like, oh, yeah, that's probably this guy right here, among other people probably listening.

But when it comes to AI, let's, what are you, because you've, you've obviously seen it growing and accelerating at an exceptional rate. Your thoughts on AI. I am a true tech optimist. which you alluded to. In fact, I believe that our society will be fundamentally changed for the better because of artificial intelligence within the next three to five years. It's going to serve as an underpinning across all the different business sectors, from finance and government to the creative industries, fashion, art, music, sports, entertainment, education. It's going to really

roll across the board. And it's going to improve our society by developing a lot of wealth, coupled with other areas that will rise through the creation of wealth, such as better science, better medicine, better hospitals, improved access to food, food supply, et cetera. I feel that we're going to start to see this impact in a significant way in three to five years, however, we're already feeling it now. And I believe that in the United States, the two biggest growth sectors are tied together percentage-wise during this next three to five years.

Think in terms of both cryptocurrency and artificial intelligence. So we're going to see a lot of growth coming through that, and I'm very optimistic about it. And in my book, I break down all of these areas from advances in medicine to military to media and the small business owners and beyond. You say three to five years, the next three to five years, is that like you can see something coming or just hedging your bet on the, you know, on the growth of it and, you know, people starting to use it, adoption, I guess, of AI.

Like is, what do you see in the next three to five? years. Yeah. So if I could put my finger on it, I can use the last week's meetings of President Trump in the GCC with Qatar, the UAE, and the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia as a great example. The first piece of it is a ton of investment. There's already been a significant amount of investment, and that's helped develop some of the AI systems that are impacting your world and your family's world and your audiences world, but you might not realize it. So that money has already been placed. But walking out of this trip to the GCC, $2 trillion was committed just from these three small nations in the Gulf region

towards building up a significant AI vertical. So the first thing, as an example, to answer your question, Sean, is that there's a ton of investment coming into AI. And it's across all industries. It's across, like I said, medicine to sports to, you know, education, to, you know, health and wellness. It's really across all industries. The second thing that I see is talent. People are starting to realize that there's great opportunity with regards to jobs being created from AI. And as a result, they're learning not just what jobs they could, new jobs, new job descriptions,

they could get or get involved in in the future, but they're figuring out how to leverage AI now at the base level as engineers, programmers, data analytics, and beyond. So those two elements, and again, I'm pointing to this recent meeting in the GCC because it was $2 trillion worth of investment in mostly hyperscale data centers, which is going to develop, you know, real estate, development, jobs, et cetera, but money and talent is coming through already.

Okay. First, if people want your book, Amazon's the easiest way, correct? Yeah, so it's actually a really good time, Sean. Like, if you don't mind, I'll hold it up again. No, no, yeah, give her. It's a great tool. It's called Some Future Day, how AI is going to change everything. And it's a great time to buy it on Amazon because it's sold, it literally sold out.

The book sold out and my publisher just restocked it. So I would highly recommend if people are interested. It's for beginners. This is not a techie book. It's going to literally say, if you want to start a fashion business, here's how AI can help you. If you are running a small construction company, here's how you could use AI to create an ad campaign to compete against your competition. If you're in the, you know, the warfare world and you want to see the evolution post-eastern,

nuclear into like drones and autonomous vehicles, it covers it all. And again, I show the reader what tools he or she could use today to implement these changes into their lives. Well, I tell you, from my standpoint, I'm like, I'm probably going to just go pick up a copy after we're done here because I do an annual forum, a conference, so one day, and one of the things that I've struggled with is a good ag campaign for it. And you're already speaking. in my language. I'm like, oh, that sounds right up my alley because I look at AI and I understand parts of it. But I'm probably, you know, as green as it gets, well, maybe not as it gets, but certainly in the adoption, the use of it, I'm started, I think most people are starting to use it a bit more and start and interact with it and not taking the fear out of the equation and starting to just play around with it, if you would. I guess when you, and I, I apologize if I'm going to spoil some of the things in your book, you know.

But like, so when you rattle off, you know, there's going to be growth and I hear the two trillion. My brain can't even fathom that amount of money. I just hear capital. Just three nations, three small Gulf states, two trillion. Well, when I hear that, I just go, capital is flowing to this. They see the opportunity in it. When you'd say you're going to, it's going to like one of the, one of the. things I've heard professors specifically in education talk about is how much it's influenced

kids in school because they're using it not to use their and I guess I'm curious your thoughts I'm probably going to butcher this thought but yeah using it to write for them instead of writing out their own thoughts if you would yep and so I've I've heard only the the drawbacks of AI for for education for for proceeding through through your, you know, you mentioned you're a lawyer, right? You went through that program. Like, how does it improve that and not make kids rely on something to do the work for them? Sure. So to start, what you're describing is a situation that is growing. It's AI search. And it's remarkable. I'm sure most of your audience would agree that Google has become

substandard. They're pushing advertising in your face. then you've got to like kind of go through all the links, find the link you want, read the article, it takes time. It's time consuming the article. It might not be right. You got to go back advertising your face again. It's not great. 10% of the population in North America has already started using AI search. And this is what you are alluding to. So think in terms of chat GPT, perplexity, even the Chinese built deep seek. These are AI search mechanisms where a simple text prompt, for example, I'd like to learn about the United States Constitution, freedom of religion in this context, can then kick off an answer, a detailed answer in real time.

If you say to the AI, then if you direct the AI in a text prompt to draft a memorandum surrounding that legal issue, it will kick it off literally in a matter of seconds. So the search tool for AI is super advanced. And honestly, at this point, I would say for your audience, for those of you who are listening and you're a little fearful of like getting involved in AI, this is a great place to start. Again, I include all of the links in my book, but for the sake of our conversation, chat GPT and perplexity are dynamite places to start with this.

Now, to answer your question, Sean, We are at risk, your concern or if I understand where you're going with this, like we're at risk of creating a like a divide between the intellectual halves and the intellectual have not because of artificial intelligence. Because as you probably or might agree, like people are inherently lazy. So they could rely on this really superpower. It's like a rocket ship of knowledge to find out anything from recipes to how to build a piece of architecture to how to stand up an advertising campaign. And they might not, as lazy people, do the work. But then there's also another side to it. It's the other side, which is those individuals who might not afford to go to a great Western type.

of university where it's $100,000 a year and they can't afford it, but they want access to knowledge. Well, now everybody can use their phone. Most people have one, right? Whether you're a farmer in the outskirts in some remote area of India or you're living up in, you know, the Bronx in New York City, everybody has a phone. And in real time, if they're curious, they could access information and learn. And I do believe we're going to have this. dividing of the population between the intellectual haves and the intellectual have-nots. And I also think it's going to become generational because I find that if you are Gen Z or Gen Alpha, the convenience of letting the algorithm do the work for you is just, it's evident, right?

Look at the success of TikTok, Reels, and beyond. And as a result of that type of mentality, we don't want to do the work. it's just there for us. It could hurt the next generation. Yeah, you're like, I guess, you know, I always, you know, when I listen to, and I stick to education for a second, I always hear like, well, they're going to, you know, you need a paper on Napoleon. Type in the chat, write me a paper on Napoleon.

And I'm probably being, you know, being a little too simple, but you get the point. It rattles off a thing. And then you take that and you say, hey, well, here's my paper. and whatever. On the flip side of that, where I sit is someone who's already doing a ton of work, AI just becomes another little tool so I can do just a bit more. And it speeds up the process. Instead of having to go read 17 books, I can actually get it to direct me and then I read, you know, different things. I'm like, oh, that's interesting. Now I've got to go find that book. And then I pick up the book and then I go read. And so it's actually speeding up the process.

And you go back to Google, that, and I assume in the simplest sense, or maybe not even in the simplest sense. So that is a form of AI. You search into it and it spits out all these things. And one of the problems with Google, among other things, is that it directs you to what it wants you to direct do. We've seen that with lots of different things where it's almost censoring the results. And I don't know, you probably know the answer to this. With AI, is there the possibility of that same purpose? where you're looking for something and it won't give you the answer? Or is there safeguards so

that it has to give you, you know, if you keep directing it deeper and deeper into a subject, it has to keep pulling the information. Is there an answer to that? Yeah. So there is. It's actually interesting because this is really just a small nuance. It's interesting to me that you're landing on it because I don't really know anybody that's discussed this yet. There are groups, like, for example, I have a company that I work with in Europe that provides my agency with a white label service effectively that will allow for my brands in my advertising agency's portfolio to benefit from a higher ranking in an AI search. So just whereas Google has people pay, entities paying, most platforms like chat GPT and

perplexity don't have that feature yet. But there are ways to break the algorithm, which, this company that I work with has discovered, and they could prioritize certain messaging, certain brands, et cetera. And I think that's going to be very valuable in the immediate future. Is basically hacking the algorithm so that different brands can be found quicker or easier, or they become the popular thing off keyword search. It's exactly it, Sean. So they're literally hacking the large language model. So the way it works these entities that I mentioned to you, like chat, G.T, and perplexity are large language models,

LLMs, and they are trained with a corpus of information that humanity has created throughout our lives. So I think in terms of newspapers, books, encyclopedias, in some cases, videos, certain videos, and beyond. the corpus of data, the corpus of information is massive. It's remarkable. And what these companies are learning to do now is, what if we want the Sean Newman podcast to be prioritized as the most important podcast on the planet? Well, they're working now to feed that corpus of data

that the LLM is trained on with information so that your brand would be prioritized. So there are ways, there are techniques to essentially hack the LLM, the way the LLM is trained. Does that make sense? It does. And so I guess I go- Well, I'm quite high on the Sean Newman podcast, obviously. So when you put it to me that way, I'm like, oh, yeah, let's, you know, that's great.

But what happens when a nefarious group of people, nefarious country, nefarious, whatever you want to put that little ominous being as, wants to seed something. that isn't so great. And I just think of some of the things going on right now with like DEI and different ideas that I just am like, it's a terrible idea. What happens when a group like that hacks in and seeds that idea? Doesn't that corrupt what is right now a pretty unique tool?

Or is that not going to, because like on one side, you got the possibility of like really good, really upside. But on the other side, the other side, the other group of people are going to be doing the exact same thing, and they're going to be trying to push their ideas, their thoughts, their brands through. And isn't that a way of controlling it all over again? Yes, definitely, Sean. So there are bad actors, but then there are also centralized entities with agendas, think in terms of corporations and governments, right? So you might remember that

Gemini, which is owned by Google, it's actually a fantastic LLM, they had a little bit of an agenda, and it was really leaning to the left when they launched Gemini. And it was highly publicized that if you put a text, if one put a text prompt in surrounding the founders of America and those individuals who drafted the Declaration of Independence, they were sharing images. You mentioned DEI. They were sharing images of people who, with backgrounds that just weren't at those meetings. They were sharing images of women, for example, of people who were black. And, you know, there weren't any women at that moment in time when the Declaration of Independence was created. Another example is I mentioned another AI search

engine called Deep Seek, which is a Chinese platform. And their, what's in their best interest is to train those lazy kids that I told you about in a way that reflects the world perception that they stand behind. It's kind of Confucius. It's CCP. It's communist in a way. So if you go on to Deep Seek, if one goes on to Deep Seek and asks questions about that precious moment at Tiananmen Square where that individual was standing up to the tanks, it's as if that never happened. Or if you ask, If one asks Deep Seek about whether or not there's slavery, if the Uyghurs are slaves in China, Deep Seek will respond with an answer that fits the CCP perfectly. It states simply that there is no such thing as slavery in China.

So this is risky, right? Because when a centralized entity has the ability to impact the perception of the world in such massive ways from historical events to current, you know, current New York, and whatnot, you know, it can have an impact on individuals, on what they believe and what they see. In fact, Sean, like I often talk about this. When I was growing up, I was taught seeing as believing. And that's not the case anymore with artificial intelligence. If you see it or you hear it, you should not believe it. You should verify it. And this comes into play for audio, for written word, for video, and for even photorealistic images that one might see.

That's going to become a new skill, yeah? Like, because seeing is believing. And then everything you just said, I'm like, well, this is the deep fake stuff. This is all the, are the words actually, you know, because you can with AI, and forgive me if I'm wrong on this, obviously you're going to know way more than I do. But like you can recreate voices. You can make images to where they're ridiculously lifelike. And you can put things out there that never actually happened.

And no different than your story of Tiananmen Square, you can also erase history, which has been going on, like that rate there has been going on for the history of time, trying to wipe out things that happen so that, you know, nobody talks. about them or the centralized entity, usually governments, usually trinical governments. But regardless, usually governments try and whitewash parts of their, oh, that didn't happen. And so a new skill then with AI is going to be the verify part, right? Like no matter how great you think AI is, it tells you something. The next thing should be to be, well, we should go verify this and make sure that is in a complete bunch of BS, correct? Deepfakes are real and it's a problem.

I would encourage you, if you have a minute or your audience, take a look at what the First Lady of the United States launched last week on MelaniaTrump.com. It's her bestselling book in audio format and the entire audio file is done through the use of artificial intelligence. It's remarkably lifelike. Second, about 30 days ago or so, Reuters reported that China, created a propaganda campaign, anti-American, anti-capitalist, anti-democratic, into Taiwan, trying to separate Americans and Taiwanese. And they created video, print, and photos that went into the marketplace in Taiwan to try to separate like the Taiwanese, you know, democratic kind of mindset from the Americans.

So again, it's not just Mark Beckman reporting. It's in Reuters. You can go read it yourself. But it's pretty remarkable. So, yeah, deep fakes are real. And then how you control them, think in terms of financial scams, government scams, and beyond. It's remarkable. And again, I would encourage you to take a look at Melania Trump's audio book on MelaniaTrump.com because the precision is absolutely remarkable.

It's incredible. Well, the idea of propaganda, once again, isn't new. Like, that's as old, it's just a newer, it's just a newer way of doing it, right? Like, it's, it's, it's using the tools of today to do the same thing that's been done to populations for the history of time. I think of like World War II dropping leaflets from planes with information. That was a way of demoralizing the public. And what you're taught, like, when you talk about,

how they're trying to separate. I'm like, warfare is changing rapidly. I do military roundtables in here where they talk about drones and the use of them. And, you know, at the, you know, 9-11, roughly,

rate in that time flame, early 2000s, these guys were all over in Afghanistan in different parts. And they never had to deal with a drone, having a bomb attached to it, or being able to scout or anything. And so in military, it's rapidly changing.

But for the public, one of the things that gets put on us is propaganda from lots of different entities. And that is like, well, I don't, it's, it's so new. It's almost at times the only way to stay away from it is just to remove yourself from the equation, which is don't go on social media, which is, as you pointed out with your phone, I mean, everybody's got a phone. And so the, the propaganda side of this is what probably everyone in this. audience is going to deal with more and more as we move forward, not less. Sure. Your audience probably doesn't even realize that they're already being targeted this way. So, you know, if your audience is someone who might lean a little bit more conservative,

the algorithms for social media, including, by the way, the content that's streaming across YouTube, even into the streamers like Netflix, Prime, Hulu, they're catering to what they believe you should hear if they have their own agenda. Remember the centralized corporation. Or they're going to push content every day with regards to articles and stories and media that they think you should, you know, subscribe to. And it's happening already. you might want to pay attention to like what what's in your feed with Apple news pushing towards you

or you know X or anything like it's tough to get both sides of the news right now like you might prefer a more conservative approach to media but you might be curious also about what the left is saying about a particular thing and you'll see you don't get in your X feed at all New York Times article so it's well you can you can actually you can actually see it real time you just click on you know for today's conversation, click on something Mark has, and then you'll start to see more Mark. Correct. So if you're not seeing somebody, all you got to do is go click on them. No, you won't like that?

Okay, we'll start feeding you more of that. And so the only, it's like a conscious effort to go click into on this side, the CBC or, you know, one of the other mainstream media is. Because if you do that, then they'll start feeding you more. It's actually very simplistic, but it's a conscious effort. to not get sucked into where you just hear what you want to hear. And that's like a human, not a flaw, but it's like, we want to hear what we want to hear. And the algorithm gives it to us all the time. Right. But think about like just now, I know that Canada just went through an election.

Think, and it's my understanding that the older generation had a lot of impact on that generation, on that election, on the election results. Think about, so if you are a centralized media entity, and you want to persuade the older generation to vote in a particular way, you could trigger your algorithm. So it's pushing at that exact demographic profile across social media into their homes on streaming television and beyond. And if after you see it, if you're like, you know, 60 years old, you're sitting at home, you're not thinking about this type of machine learning that you and I are discussing right now, this AI, right? You're just thinking like, this is the news.

And at some point, you're going to be talking to your ability. family members, people in your household, your friends, your colleagues at work, all about what you've been seeing. And you're going to learn your friends are seeing the same thing. And they're going to be talking the same way as you. And as a result of AI, you know, total elections can be moved. You see my point? I totally do. You know, I remember growing up and listening to Chris Cornell, right? Audio slave. I'm acting like you don't know. Soundgarden. Right. Thank you. So one of the, well, one of the things that I always admired about him, and maybe I'm wrong on this because, you know, you, you and you in your realm probably once again have a better idea than I do.

But I remember thinking, man, he's really successful singing a certain type of way. And then the next album would be a completely different type of way. Well, why are he doing that? And some people liked it. Some people hate it. I remember it just caused so much controversy for an artist. If he just, keep playing the hits he would have had you know one track but i've almost adopted that on the podcast and at times um a guy should do more of it but you know like i started out in hockey talking to some of the biggest names in the nchal and then covid came along and i decided to not talk about hockey anymore and so like here you know when you bring up here an islanders fan i'm like oh we could just we could just sit and talk an hour of hockey and i'd be happy and happy. And I lost a lot of people because of that. And maybe I didn't lose as many as I think,

but you can imagine. They're tuning into the Sean Newman podcast. We're talking sports. Some people never going to tune in because they don't like sports. And others are always going to tune in because they love sports. And then right in the middle of that, you do a complete 180. And people kept asking, when are you going back? And then they got mad. You need to go back. And yet when I watch Chris Cornell, he did that with music. And as a person who loved his music, I'm like, why? And I followed it along because, I mean, like, he had some awesome songs as he kept growing in his journey, if you would. But that had to have been a difficult decision for him to make. And I hope I'm making my roundabout way of saying, like, you know, with, whether it's CBC here on this side or

Sean Newman podcast or any other thing, it's, you know, if I just talked, conspiracies the rest of my life, there's a certain portion of the audience that would just love that. They just love if you would just stick in that realm. And one of the things I think I'm conscious of is I want to explore different perspectives because every time I think I even get close

to understanding one thing, then I bring on someone like Mark and they shatter my thought and I go, oh, I've got to rethink that and I've got to start down these ways. But it's a conscious effort. Because if I look at the, you know, like if I just look analytically at things, you can see what hits. And if you just kept playing the hits, you'd probably be on a track of getting to where you want to be faster. Correct. So, Sean, the other thing that's interesting that you're touching on is that the algorithms, for example, on Rumble or YouTube, they like narrowly focused content creators.

So if you're going to be more generalized and talk sports and politics, sports and conspiracy, sports and technology, you're not going to get as much traction as you would hope. And that's an issue with the algorithm too. But the guy who put me on to this realm of doing podcasts, I don't think I'm unique in saying this is Joe Rogan. And when I watch him, I go, he doesn't do any of that. Don't get me wrong. He has his specific relative topics, comedians.

really interesting people and UFC, right? Like those are roughly the three. I mean, the interesting people goes a huge breadth of like topics, right? Everything. Would you disagree with that? No, I agree with you. But I think I think Rogan's already at the top of the hill. So because he's got an audience that's built in massive amount of subscribers,

they want to hear every episode, that doesn't matter. The algorithm doesn't impact him as much as it might with an emerging brand. It's hard. So many podcasts exist, and it's hard to break through the boundary. So typically that narrow focus is just as a matter of fact. The algorithms take better to it. They like it better. That's what these companies like.

Yeah, I don't know. I just, the narrow focus, I don't know if I could be healthy in that realm. Just knowing who I am, right? Like, I like exploring topics. I like having a very healthy to see. discussion in whichever way it pulls same totally i mean i i'm i'm figuring out that you're a canadian's fan and um am i right are you a canadian's fan oilers fan oh we got the best time we got the best times right now mac david dry sidle you oh man it is fun to watch i was i was born i'm jealous i'll

tell you like fucking macday am i allowed to curse on your show sorry um mac david is just like that's not natural i mean he is just so super human. He's just incredible. He's incredible what that guy does. Well, once again, you look at a guy who hyper-focused on something to see where he's at. And it's just every game, he does something where you're like, that was wild. And I don't know how many teams have this. The Islanders certainly do not have this right now. But like, we can be down for nothing. And as a fan for the first, you know, not the first time in my life, but watching this Oilers team, at no point do you ever feel like you're out of a game.

We don't have one athlete on the Islanders that could carry the team ever. So I'm one of these guys that's right now calling for the whole team to be broken up. We need to like rebuild from the start. I think there's a algorithm in the NHL for success. And I think you guys got it. Like you need to have a team right now. You need an elite goaltender, which I think you would agree the Islanders have that. Do you agree?

I think they have a very, very good goalie. Yes. But you need to have, I really believe this now, at least five elite offensive players, if you're going to go to where like the Oilers are right now, where you can compete at that Stanley Cup level year after year. We're not even close. Matt Barzel, I could never look at Matt Barzell and be like, oh, don't worry about it. We're down 3-1 going into the third.

Barzell is going to take the whole team and put him on his back. There's not one Islander that could do that. We just are not built like that. I think if you look at the NHL teams and think in terms of like, this formula. I know defense is important. I'm leaving them out, though, for a purpose. If you really look at the teams that are like competing at that Stanley Cup level, they all have like five elite front guys on offense that are are there. And the goaltender piece of it is critical. But, you know, their goal tending is like there's a right now the NHL has incredible goalies,

right? So it's, you need to have that next level of offense as far as I'm concerned. That's funny because on this side, I grew up playing defense. I think it's the most important spot on the ice. You know, you watch Kail McCar for Colorado. Yeah. And he's, yeah, they got Nathan McKinnon, who's next world, you know, he's in the realm of McDavid. Like when that guy gets going, you're like, holy crap, nothing stopping this.

I think, I'm sorry. No disrespect, but. No disrespect. Take it. But when I look at it, like as good as McDavid is, if a D-Man can't hit him with a pass, it doesn't matter when Skinner is playing awful you you look at their current run when when he is when when Pickard came in because Skinner can't beat the LA Kings for whatever reason they just need a little goaltending and and when you don't have the goal tending

you need goaltending and when you don't have the star forward you need the star forward and it's it's more than one star forward though I'm telling you like really look at the teams like look at the guys that Edmonton has it's insane how good those well no We don't even come close. There's not one player. I'm a dire at Islanders fan. My entire life, I went to add season tickets. They were created in 1970.

My family had season tickets from 1970 on. I went to every Stanley Cup. I saw it all. I'm telling you, we're not even in the same. We're like in the minors compared to the Oilers right now. Well, I mean, when you go back to the Islanders in their heyday, though, did they have one star forward? No, but that was a different time period. No, but the current NHL.

We had several, we had several stars. I mean, come on. I know. That's what I mean. One thing about the hockey compared to a lot of sports, and maybe I'm wrong on this. But when I look at the NBA, you got like two star players, man, you're going deep. It's like nobody can stop them. They play 90% of the game. It's a bit insane how much one guy can control everything.

It doesn't mean you don't need good players around them. You do. In the NHL, you can have one amazing line. and you come up against a deep team and you just can't win. Like the Oilers watch this play out over and over and over again for a long team, a long time. When you have the complete set, look at the Florida Panthers right now.

Man, it is insane. And you look from their goaltender to their defense to their front end. It's just so much depth. It's insane to watch. And yet, you know, don't get me wrong.

Game breakers, you got to have them. But hockey to me is such a one player can control a lot, but you need everything. And when you're missing one thing, you always go, well, that's what we need. But you need the star goal. Oilers have been, you know, look at the Leafs. The Leafs are this great, studded, star talent, goaltending. It always comes back to goaltending.

And if you, if it. Let me ask a question about the NHL. What do you think the NHL is missing? Why is it not as popular as other sports? It's like for me, the NHL is the single best sport, period. Yes. How is it not as popular as like bad? Like you talk about basketball, those guys, even the playoffs,

they're not playing at that level that the NHL is playing in the playoffs. It's not, you know, from the second the puck drops until, you know, the end of the game. And in the NBA, they're like going slow in the first half as far as I'm concerned. Well, this is probably a better question for you. You know, I pulled this on to hockey for for some time. I like to think you see to this part of the conference. conversation, but I'll take it. One of the things that the NHL world, the hockey world, doesn't like, is they don't like

personality. So they want everybody to, they want to, and don't get me wrong. I'm a hockey player. And sometimes I hear us, why would you say that? Don't say that. Just, you know, I got a, you know, it's very vanilla. And what do people? And so, so then the next thing you'd say, well, it used to be the gladiators.

You used to go to the, the, see the fights and everything. Well, they've taken that out. It used to be the big hits. Well, and they've kind of taken that out. So now it's a super skilled game. But the, even McDavid, and, you know, one of my favorites all the time, Sidney Crosby, before that Steve Eisenman, they didn't get up and talk about me and pat myself on the back and oh, yeah, and I, you know, Bovetchkin, greatest goal score possibly of all

time now, right? He's got the record. And they used to harass him when he'd put a stick down, right? It's too hot, right? You do all these celebrate, they beat that out of the game. They don't want any of that. And so when you look at the NBA, what does it got? It's got a bunch of personalities.

No helmets over their face, right? Sure. Right? Like they just, they, they know who they are. They just, I don't know, right? Like you go to Europe. What do they do with their leading goal scores of every team? Yeah.

Right? They wear the gold helmet. I agree. And it's such a strange thing, but then you see it and you're like, oh, there's a leading score. Like I've watched it. It's like, well, that's a unique thing. I don't know if it would ever sell in the NHL. I don't know if you want that. No.

Because it's such a team, no person is bigger than the team. And when you go to the NBA in particular, like, is it the LA Linkers or is it LeBron? Now, the Lakers might be because they're one of the pinnacle franchises. But when he was in Cleveland, it was LeBron's team. Heck, at times, I felt like he was telling the GM every movie he's going to make. Can you imagine an NHEL are doing that? And you know what they're into, right? You see their faces.

You see what they're wearing, going into the game, coming out of the game. You know their personalities off court as it relates to. other cultural interests, whether it's music or film, the NHL just doesn't allow these personalities to shine. I totally agree with you, Sean. I think the NHL needs to bring it back. And it's funny, I was a kid like growing up in those days where the fights would start before the puck would drop. I mean, literally that would happen. Like they'd come into like NASA Coliseum and they were bloody. The Philadelphia Flyers, the Broad Street Bullies or, you know, the Boston Bruins, those guys would come in.

Terry O'Reilly was like him versus Clark Gillies. They were incredible. These personalities rise to the top. But I don't know if you'll ever see that again while Gary Bettman is in charge. But part of it is hockey mirrors society. And society has been told we don't like that.

And yet, US, Canada, before the pucks even drop, you know, there's how many fights? And did people like that? Oh, they liked it. All right. I had U.S. people yelling at me telling how good they are and they're bullying Canada. And I laughed. They said, it's the round robin.

Let's wait and see what happens in the finals. Yeah. Right? And yet, people love that. And you can't, I mean, there's a reason why you go back in history to the Coliseum. Why did people, I mean, that was at the extreme side of it, killing people. But why do people, they want the blood and gold, they want to see the rough stuff. And the NHL has gone to see.

such a skilled game now where the the rough stuff is disappearing more and more and more to where to where I could see it turning closer to soccer where there's very little hitting and there's just all about puck control and everything else and don't get me wrong McDavid watching him handle the puck is insane but even with soccer you still have the personalities flourishing right like my eight-year-old daughter is telling me she doesn't want to buy a pair of messy sambas because Ronaldo is the goat I mean, that's all marketing. That's all about you see their face. You're bringing them to life.

She doesn't watch a football game here in the house, a soccer game here in the house, ever. She's getting that all of TikTok. If you were talking to an up-and-coming, I don't know if a podcaster can be the same to an athlete, to a business person or I don't know. I don't know if they can all put in the same category mark. Maybe they can. What is your advice to them then? Yep. So to create a personal brand, we do this a lot and we love it and we do it, I think, best in class. And I think the beginning starts with the foundation. What is an honest assessment

of that individual's core values? And then how could you stand that up and pull it through different commercial endeavors, through philanthropic endeavors? And then also with word selection, communications, not just with long form content in the way that you're thinking as far as podcast goes, but every single social media communication, each word needs to come to life with a personality. But when we do deals for our clients, I mentioned like Russell Westberg in the NBA, you might remember and you might agree with me. He was probably the most fashionable NBA guy at the time. That was our goal. Our strategy was to take this guy and make him the fashion guy. That was it. So we were constantly applying him to luxury brands like Barneys and by Rito Fragrance.

We took them all the way to the top. I would bring him to Paris, to Milan. We took him all the way to the top so he could own that lane. In fact, the NBA hired my agency to create fashion deals for the NBA with brands like the Coupils, Zadigan Voltaire, Mesaun Kitsune, because they required that type of prestige, that positive halo effect that we created for Russell. So for us, we look at a personal brand as the foundation,

built on true core values, got to be honest. And then from there, we pull those core values into business deals, commercial deals, philanthropy, and marketing and communications. And we do it for people in the political realm, for people in biotech, for people in sports, and beyond. And guess what? AI is giving a big advantage in those categories, too. When you look at the population and we're, you know, and we're talking about Russell

Westbrook, but you know, you mentioned politicians, you mentioned, you know, like there's a whole bunch of different avenues for different people. How much of a perception of a person does like immediately a population just gravitate to? Like, does that, did I make that make sense? Yeah. People, people are more connected. They like to press the flesh. So their emotions connect with somebody that they could relate to. Their emotions connect with somebody that is familiar in a certain way. So you might not like a person's, let's say, policy, but if you feel like it reminds you of someone you trust, a family relative, a close old friend of yours, one of your teammates, like think about the way that hockey guys, there's no one like hockey, like the way hockey athletes are, the bond between

hockey players. It's unlike that anywhere else. If you could create that, dealing with an actor, with a politician, with a musician, you're going to connect with that person emotionally and want to buy more product than even whether or not you like that person's policy. Does that make sense? Yeah, it does. So, Mike, I've always said, well, my favorite player of all time was Steve Eisenman. I just loved how he presented himself on the ice, how he, you know, he changed his game. So fast.

And just a true leader. And why? Number 91. Why is it? Number 19. Oh, I thought he was 91. Didn't he start? He was better off.

Oh, I don't think so. You got to check that. I don't, I don't think he's number 19. He's always been number 19. Is that right? I mean, at least. I defied to you.

It's your show. I'm checking. Why, you ask me why the NHL is different than, different sports. Why is it that athletes, some of the most iconic leaders, don't go into politics. Don't go into...

Like, I just feel like, can you imagine if Canada was governed by the stars of the NHL in their former life? They always go into being GMs or presidents of the hockey operations world. But they have to take more heat and stand in front of a mic

more than any politician. I'm like, That's exactly what the type of leadership you need at a country level. Why don't they do that? First of all, as you're talking, I did a quick check, and I want to let you know that I respect you and love you. You're 100% right. Eiserman is number 19.

I know you knew it and you were being respectful because I'm your guest, but I got to give you that. You're 100% correct. I was inspired to go to law school because of Ken Dryden, the famous Canadians goalie. I thought it was the coolest thing. I was like, what? This guy is a lawyer. So I went to law school because of Ken Dryden.

Can you imagine? I think that politics is messy and ugly, and I don't believe that politicians today care about you, me, or the audience watching this show right now. I think it's really few and far between. Do you have any friends or relatives who are like, you know, I got out of bed today, and that local politician or that state or federal politician really inspired me to be a better person. I'm going to work harder. I'm going to do better for my community. I'm to do this pro-social initiative. There really are no longer these inspirational types of politicians out there. They're not

inspiring our younger generation. People aren't looking to get into it. It's very little money and you get abused at the end of the day. And what they look for is to create fame. They get their moment of fame and capitalize on it cash out later on. Right. So American politicians become these multi. I mean, look at President an Obama's deal with like Netflix into the hundreds of millions of dollars. He went in not a very wealthy man. Now it's like unparalleled. But, you know, I think that people just don't care as much as they used to. I think politicians for our parents' generation were truly in it to help their their constituency to help the people. But I don't believe it's the same anymore. I think unfortunately, at least here in America, I don't want to talk about Canada because

I'm American and I don't I don't think it's right to talk about your country. I respect you know, I respect Canada. But I think here in America, we're in a different moment in time right now. And sadly, you know, most politicians aren't inspiring the younger generation to be better and do better. I apologize because we just crossed the top of the hour. Do I have a few extra minutes or do you, forgive me, because we can always do a second go around, Mark. I don't want to keep you past your time. Would you, would you mind if we?

Like, I would love to, I'm loving you right now. Like, I feel like we have so much in common. But would you mind if we wrap it up, Sean? No, no. I got like people coming. No, no, no. Just one final thought on politics because I'm like, I'm going to have people so angry at me.

I didn't pick your brain more on AI. I would say go to Amazon, pick up your book. Because if people want to really dig into your thoughts, that's the simplest thing to do. When you talk politicians not inspiring, Donald Trump has inspired a lot. lot of people. Would you agree or disagree? I mean, he's obviously created a ton of enemies, too. Don't get me, don't get me wrong. But an inspiring person usually is kind of divisive in, in its sense, because he has to set a foundation of like, no, we're not doing this. This is where we stop with these crazy ideas. I agree. Well, I tell you what, Mark, we're going to do this

again because I'm like, I had an idea, but the thing about a podcast is, is, you know, I take it where it leads and talking the NHL doesn't hurt my feelings any any anyway Sean it's been so enjoyable getting to know you today I appreciate it really so much and well if I'm ever in the New York area I'm going to come harass you and we'll do it in person how's that I would love it I would welcome okay Mark thanks again