Shaun Newman Podcast - #902 - Ben Trudeau

Episode Date: August 27, 2025

Ben Trudeau is a Canadian entrepreneur and energy sector innovator from a Montreal-based entrepreneurial family, with significant ties to Alberta’s energy industry. He moved to Alberta in 2008 where he co-founded Alberta Free Energy Corp. (ABFE) which specializes in advancing alternative energy production and geothermal engineering. He has authored a paper titled “Albertans, let’s put Canada First” which lays out a brief history of Canada and how Quebec has used the current system to better their province. He argues Alberta should follow in Quebec’s footsteps and pull back the purse strings that the province has given to the federal government. To watch the Full Cornerstone Forum: https://open.substack.com/pub/shaunnewmanpodcastGet your voice heard: Text Shaun 587-217-8500Silver Gold Bull Links:Website: https://silvergoldbull.ca/Email: [e-mail] Grahame: [phone]Bow Valley Credit UnionBitcoin: www.bowvalleycu.com/en/personal/investing-wealth/bitcoin-gatewayEmail: [e-mail] Use the code “SNP” on all ordersProphet River Links:Website: store.prophetriver.com/Email: [e-mail] Money SummitWebsite: ExpatMoneySummit.com

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titled, Albertans, let's put Canada first. I'm talking about Ben Trudeau. So buckle up. Here we go. Well, welcome to the Sean Newman podcast today. I'm joined by Ben Trudeau. Ben, thanks for hopping back in the studio. Well, thanks for having me again, Sean. It's always a pleasure to chat with you. Well, we're going to do this right off the hop because that way I don't have to think about it. Guess who come all the way to the bustling metropolis, metropolis of Lloydminster. Get a one ounce silver coin. Yeah. So. Thank you.

Oh, nice one. Oh, with the queen. Thank you. I don't like the king. Well, I, I, uh, the, um, well, show it to silver gold bowl, right? Like, I mean, the, one of the, you know, I was just saying to you this morning as we were hanging out, you know, like, um, if you reverse time to 2019, there's a whole bunch of things that are going on in Canada and had been going on for hundreds of years. and I just was like inept or had my head in the sand

or just didn't care and then the more I start to read and learn about Canadian history I used to say it was boring I'm like oh man Canada history sucks I don't want to like teach me about Rome and then the more I you know like you got your paper which we're going to get into today

and you start to learn you're like holy crap like we have a pretty wild history and it's pretty intriguing henceforth you know when you wrote your your short paper like the first, I don't even know what it is, 15 pages maybe, something like that,

just walking through the history of Quebec and Canada as a whole, I found very intriguing. And anyways, you know, along the path, you know, gold and silver, I would have given zero thought to other than in passing. And then also having different men on and women on talking about, you know, the importance of sound money, precious metals, you know,

that's extrapolated in a whole different myriad of conversations now. It's been pretty cool. You know, I think it's, I'm like, man, it's so cool now that I get to give out a one-ounce silver coin to guests that come here. And I got to give a ton of credit to Silver Gold Bowl for being a part of that. Yes. Well, thank you for that as well. And knowing that, but it makes my son has a friend that collects coins.

And I always have a competition that will bring the coolest coins. and because of these ounce of silver, my son usually win each time I come here because then he brings the silver coin that I receive from your show coming to Landminster and then he always win the competition to have the coolest coins among the kids. That's...

You get a story and you win a championship or a competition. That's correct. Yeah, yeah. Okay, well, to your paper, okay? Like, I don't know if I spurred this on. I like to think I had a small little part because I was asking you about the history of the FLQ.

Yes. And in reading this, and maybe you can walk me through it again because, you know, like when you and Danny Hosak and Grant Abraham are on, I had a ton of people who listened to the podcast quite religiously. Like, they're involved in, you know, I would think nine out of ten episodes

or something like that, say that was a fascinating interview. And part of what was fascinating was hearing about the history of Quebec and parts of the FLQ and the referendum questions and everything else. If we go before that, one of the, before you get to the referendums in Quebec, I mean, the rise of Pierre Elliott Trudeau, I didn't, like, I guess I didn't until you wrote it. Yeah. Like you talked about it, but my brain didn't like understand. And it's funny what reading.

something versus listening to something, seeing something, all these, they can add in different pieces to the puzzle. And I forgive me the magazine that he ran. You can rattle that off. I didn't realize that he was basically media before he became one of the most prominent Canadian politicians of all time. You can love or hate that statement. But I mean, like, when you look back over the course of 50 years, Pierre Elliott Trudeau

sits among one of the most hated and probably beloved leaders on certain parts of the sides of the country. That's correct. Everybody knows who he is. Yes. You know, you go Kim Campbell, people go, who?

Pierre Elliott Trudeau, it's pretty wild. Like he gives, and maybe I read it wrong, so just walk me through it maybe. When he does his magazine, he gives rise to the FLQ, doesn't he? That's correct. So after the Second World War, when the French Canaan come back to a war that they didn't want to participate in for linguistic reason, mainly. The Second World War was easier in the first, because at the First World War, where the French-Canadian were forced to join by conscription, they didn't have the right to speak French in the Canadian Army.

So they were coming from countryside like you come from, always spoke French in their life, and suddenly they are on a battlefield, receiving order in English, a language that they don't know, they don't read, they never heard it. And only that, but they don't have the right to speak French amongst them because their commanding officer don't want them to conspire behind their back. So it was quite traumatic.

So when the construction came for the Second World War, the Kansas Army created some French battalion, the Royal of Indusiem and the Chaudier and a couple of battalion that were French only, that were, by the way, the most fierce battalion on the day. They are the one that they've done crazy stuff.

You know what I find fascinating about that? Is if Jamie Sinclair was sitting here, he would argue with you that the Western Canadians were the most fierce on the battlefield. And I just go, couldn't we just all agree that we had a bunch of Canadians,

different groups, whether you were the Prairie boy, or the French-speaking element, or I would think the aboriginals would have their thoughts on how important they were. As a group, when we allowed people, and maybe I'm wrong in this, and somebody can definitely,

you can tell me wrong, when we allowed them to be who they were and just go do the objective and work together, We had a bunch of different groups who were insanely difficult to fight against. Yes, and I do agree. I agree. This, I believe, one of Canadian trade because of the climate we live in and the wild beasts you have all around.

I believe we're a breed overall that knows how to survive. And the difference with the French-Canadian is that most of them were sent before the day. Scott, I have a very, very good anecdotal story. I have a good friend who have a house in Bayou. Bayou was the first town freed on D-Day. It's a village right on these escarpments of Normandy. And I was visiting him, and there was his old neighbors next door when he heard my accent. He said, oh, you're a Canadian.

I said, yes. And the guy was like 88, and he hugged me. And he said, I will never forget the first time I met a Canadian. He said I was working for the German who were forcing me to bring, you know, a horse and carriage to bring water. And he said, I was in a farm not far from here the day before the day, like the night before. And he said, I was waiting to receive my stuff. I just received some stock. And there's a guy that jumped on my carriage.

Tell me not to speak at all. And he said, he said to me, I'm Canadian. We're here to free you up. and he said there was six German that were surveilling that spot and he said after telling me that he went off the carriage and killed them all within like two minutes you said then he came back and said okay go and give me instruction but he said that was my first encounter with Canadians so I really respect Canadians so all that and yeah and that's because they could speak French by the way this is there's no other reason why they were sent first

because they could speak French, you know, to have. You think, like, though, it's always interesting to hear the stories of a different part of the world being liberated by us from tyrannical control. Yep. But when you look at, like, Quebec specifically, and it's history in Canada, let's say, I don't know, France or somebody'd come over and liberated them from the English, they would probably have a similar story

because there's stuff going on in Quebec that the more I read the more, you know, one of the things we were talking about way back when when I asked you about the FLQ is there's so much of Quebec's history only written in French. So I can't speak French. I certainly can't read it.

So how do I actually understand what has gone on there? Right? And so like when you talk about in the first World War they wouldn't let you speak French, you know, I'm like that's so insane to me because like the worried They're enforcing conscripts come and they might side with the other side. I'm like, what did it happen if somebody'd come over and liberated Quebec from Canada?

Or now the United States had come and, you know, like, you know, there's an independence movement in Alberta. Yeah. What if the U.S. just rolled in, said, no, we're just repatriating this place as the 51st state? Yeah. You know, what would the stories be told 100 years from now about Americans coming up here and getting us out of a bad relationship with Ottawa? Let's say I'm not. I'm not, folks, I'm not suggesting that. I'm just, you know, it's interesting to me, right?

Because, you know, that's the stories that are told back to us from people over on the other side of the pond. That's correct. And yet in Quebec specifically, what gives rise to Pierre Elliott Trudeau? Yes. Speaking out against the establishment that was Quebec at the time, correct? Yeah, well, it was again, so the system has been built to keep, keep French English divided, separated, and to the benefit of the English.

So the English Empire always did that. They always, they love keeping, no, divided. No, they cannot know. United were strong, divided, they can conquer. Well, they can ferment, ferment. Yes, ferment, foment, anyway, one of them. The two sides against each other. And then come in and be the mediator.

This is a big thing with Matt Erritt and Tom and Alex. When they come on, they talk about putting borders in between two groups. Yeah. And then working with both sides so that they go against each other and then coming in and being the mediator. That's correct. That's correct. And the problem we have even more in Canada is that we are a monarchy. And in a monarchy, it is by default, segregate.

regime because the king becomes king because his mother was queen, no. There's no other reason why he's king. Well, once you allow that, well, then you understand that the baron become barren because his father was a baron and the count remained count because father was a count. And the aboriginal remained aboriginal because his father was aboriginal and the French remain French because the father was French. So once you allow these type of division, in the inception of a program,

well, then, we're not surprised that these, after 150 years of applying that or 200 years of applying that, like the cleavage becomes almost irremediable, like cannot be reconciled, no? And even more when in Quebec, when the English saw that they couldn't win by number because French were like rabbits and like 16 kids' families and all that.

One day saw that they couldn't overcome it by a number. They said, okay, we'll get them by attrition. So we'll make them poor and we'll prevent them to get in high ranks and high position and rich so that we will keep controlling them. And this is what they've done until roughly very effective until Second World War. What happened after Second World War? Well, there was a demographic boom. baby boomers that that happened uh and then the second thing is that now that the french fought

equally with the english and they they they they they they freed up france which is the bastion of the french canadian well now the game was different because the second world war was no more just the english war the first world war even though fought in france france was not conquered at the time no like like hitler walk in paris like freak like this is this is this is bad. And in Quebec we see Paris has the headquarters. This is the headquarter, the, you know, the, the, you know, the, the, you know, the nest of French culture around the world. So, so basically, our headquarters has been captured, you know, by, by tyrannical regime. So after a Second World War, I think there was that kind of movement of saying, okay, we all went there together, including

the Americans and we won a regime that nobody wanted. And I believe that created the opportunity to bring back equality in that monarchist divided regime and create the narrative that we have right now as Canadian, that we are a free country, which we never been because we're still a monarchist. No, I mean, I mean, the king is still the king. No, and it's crazy how they move the narrative to the extent of the governor general when the king came to Ottawa last May said that called him the English king. Well, it's not the English king. He's the king of Canada. It's not the English king. So anyway, so all that to say that they're trying to tame that, but it's very, very deep rooted in our system.

And after a Second World War, because of that kind of unity, so the French can say, okay, we, we're trying to tame that, we're very deep rooted in our system. And after a second world war, the French, because of that kind of unity, okay, we're fought together, we're equal, so then treat us as is, as equal. No, like, like, even after the war, they were still, no, restaurant for the French, restaurant for the English, there were still a big division of wealth as well, mainly in Quebec. Like, like, if you were English, you were rich, if you were French, you were poor. And when you were French, the only way to get out of poverty, you have two solutions. Either you become a priest because the Catholic Catholic Church was giving you a status. above the rest or you go work for the mafia because the Italian would speak French and English

and would accept French and you can get promotion. The mafia can get like good money, no? So these were the two main when you were... Power structures. Yeah, well, when you were living in urban Montreal. Okay, I'm talking mainly about Montreal where where half of the province lives. It was very different in the countries. It's a bit like even Alberta right now. No end mountains were different than the rest of the province. So, so, uh, uh, uh, So there was that willingness after the war, and then there's a premier Maurice DuP.S.C. that came in power, and that wasn't power during the war.

But after the war, decided, well, let's take that movement that want that equality to achieve equality. So the first thing that he did, he got rid of the Yunnan Jack, of the Quebec flag, provincial flag, and created the Florida DZE, the flight that they have right now. So that was the first move. Let's have a flag that tie us to France, which was then acceptable because we just freed up France.

So it was kind of acceptable for the Canadian that, you know what, we just freed them up. So they want to reconnect with these routes. And then second move that he did. If I may, the other thing about changing it, what year did they change the flag? In their late 30s, like 9, sorry, the late 40s, 90s, 9040, I don't remember. It doesn't matter.

All I'm drawing the comparison to is, you know, like, it's hard for my brain to think about a time where Quebec would have had the Union Jack. Yes. But in saying that, I have distant family now. Obviously, they've since passed who fought in World War II who were upset when Canada changed their flag to the current flag away from the red enzyme. And I was like, the red enzyme. What the heck is that? Well, it's essentially homage to Britain, right?

Like, I mean, and you can imagine going everywhere. We go everywhere now with the Maple Leaf. And that's been my life. But there was a time where that would have been, you know, there was people very upset about changing the Canadian flag. Yeah. And that happened in the 60s. Right.

It's quite recent. Yeah. And so I guess in a 20 year span, you see Quebec change their flag. Yeah. see Canada change their flag, which is interesting because, you know, you can just see at the time what was acceptable or what was happening in society. That's correct. That's correct.

People wanted to change. They would say, well, we need to, what we, the way we were doing stuff led to that fascist regime in Europe. We don't want to go there anymore. So that led to everything was acceptable. In 1957, there are a big move that, well, and even before that, in the early 50s, Duplice, they were putting electricity all across the province, building roads and all that. And Dupli wanted to put some French-Canadian family on the map,

saying that we don't want the English to build all these infrastructures. So he purposely choose two families in Quebec, the Miron in Montreal and the Dizordi from the Eastern Township. And basically he starts splitting all provincial contract between these two companies to build all the roads, all the social. So the Zildi got to build the seaway, the St. Lawrence Seaway. The Miron got to build two of the five bridge in Montreal. The Zuzzi built two others.

Everything was roughly 50-50 between the two, you know. And that was the first move. And then he started developing that concept of Quebec Inc. So the Quebec Inc. was company made in Quebec by French-Canadian and to keep the wealth in Quebec. So that concept was first push associated with the flag. It was all kind of a let's gather under that banner, which is the Quebec flag. And then in 57, he said, okay, the feds are not removing the tax that they put on in 1917 for the war.

The income tax was still there. So he said, well, we will collect ours. So we start collecting Quebec taxes because he knew that first thing you do, if you lead to war being more sovereign, well, you remove the wallet to the one who controls it, no? So 1937, Quebec started collecting his own provincial tax. And then he had all these, and then he started enforcing as well the Quebec police, and the Quebec provincial police that already existed before.

Kind of became a semi-militia. Like in the constitution, it's written that it's forbidden for a provincial government to build a militia, but they don't limit what the provincial police can have as equipment. And if you look at the Sautil Quebec today, I believe they're way better equipped than the Canadian Army. So they... I don't know if that's saying, my sorry Canadian Army,

but I mean, still a point to recognize. Yes. So then all these moves were done, and then in 53 in the same movements of that, Quebec was totally under the control of the Catholic Church, and even more during Duplice. Duplice used the Catholic Church and the cooperative, the credit unions to base. So there's a creation that was started in 1900 by a guy named Alphonse Desjardin, Dejardin. And today is the largest creation in the world.

Desjardin has 7.8 million members out of 8 million population. and DeGerdin has their own laws at the provincial government. It's a powerful create union. They control half a billion in asset in Quebec, you know. So if you take... In your paper, you write that they built the cross-iron mills

and the outlet mall at Eminton Airport. Yeah, yeah, they still own them. So these two shopping center and the bar are owned by Quebec. By Quebec. But that they are owned by the Pets. pension plan. So there's too big financial power in Quebec. There's the Credit Union who do Desjardin, who do all the retail banking. And there's the Kesea Depot who was started at the same time as the CPP. So CPP was started in 1965. When it was started, Jean de Sage, who was the premier at the time,

decided not to join the CPP. Say, okay, Canada, do your pension plan, but we're going to do our own stuff on our side. And right of the bat, the Quebec never subscribed in the CPP, never gave a penny to the CPP and start their own. And when you look today, the CPP, the CPP is worth $600 billion right now. Well, the Kansas Pension Plan with 25% of the population is worth $500 billion. No? So. I want to make sure I heard that right. How much is the Canadian pension plan at? $600 billion. And then the Quebec version is at what? 500 billion.

So one province's pension plan is at 500 billion and a full country minus Quebec is at 600 billion. That's correct. And no only that, but within the 500 billion of Quebec, when Jean de Sash started it, he said at least one third

of all that money has to remain in the province. So the pension plan of Quebec owns their light rail systems. They owns shares in many Quebec companies. They own just in Canada and then so one third Quebec and another like 20% Canada strictly. So they own they own over 70 billion of real estate across Canada, including the cross-iron mill, including the outlet malls. And so, so they are the largest retail outlet owners in Canada. So as a Quebecer coming to Albertan, and I know you call yourself an

Albertan now. Yeah, yeah, I do. And you know, if you go back to the first one when I had them on, I even wrote in the summary of the interview, it's not that, Trudeau. But, you know, you come to Alberta and we don't have our own pension plan, right? And the fact that it's even an argument and it hasn't been taken back, right? Yeah, yeah. It's pretty wild to you then. It's sad. I, I, it's, that's the part that's sadden me the most about Alberta is how little Albertan cares about Alberta. Because coming from Quebec, where everything is Quebec first, and you come here, and as long as it, like in this province, we only have one company that manufacture insurance product,

in Quebec they have six companies, seven companies, they are the largest insurance provider in the country in Quebec with private companies. and so that means that for every time you write a check for your car insurance, your home insurance, your business insurance and all that, the money doesn't stay in Alberta. It goes to Quebec or Toronto or the only one we have here is Peace Hills, which owned by Aboriginal their headquarters in Edmonton, and they are the only one manufacturing insurance product. All the rest of our insurance is intact, AXA, Desjardin, Industry All the end, all the end, all that is, companies so so so for every premium that we pay we send our checks to Quebec so so

all that money benefit no workers in Quebec so the hockey players in Quebec kids in Quebec because that that's the end result the trickling of that money is that is that when I keep my insurance in Alberta well I'm helping the local hockey league because the parents work for them and pay so so no people don't realize that in Quebec we've been since the early 60s, we've been drilled to take back. In 1984, Desjardins started their general insurance company named Desjardin-en-San General Desjardin,

so car insurance and all that, was started in 1984. And when they started it, 80% of all the premium of Quebec was going to European companies, insurance companies. Well, as we speak in 2025, 45 years later, 98% of all Quebec premium stays in Quebec. And this is huge because insurance companies are investors. They're investors in companies.

And this is why people don't realize, but even if there was a shift in the country in Quebec stopped receiving that $13 billion that everybody cries about, which is, by the way, midway per capita, it's not even the one that cost us the most as Canadians. even that just between their retail banking and their pension plan

they have one trillion aside like they can weather a storm it's funny some of my fascination and I'll bring it back to Pierre Liotrudeau because I find him starting as a magazine I don't know is the owner the right yeah yeah he was he started it

he was publishing it he founded it It was his business. So he started in 1953, started a publication named Cite d'Ebre, which means like free town, basically. And before that, so Pierre Otrudeau is a guy that never worked and never had a job. His grandfather on his mother's side was the biggest law firm in Montreal, which at the time at the turn of century was 98% of all the wealth of Canada, by the way. So when you were the biggest law firm in the 100, almost like 100% capital, money capital place in Canada, I mean, you have a lot of power.

So that was his grandfather Eliat, so on his mom's side. And his dad was the French Canadian that basically after his wedding, his father-in-law helped him invest in a new venture that was. very new at the time and and and and and where it would go it was called gas stations and and he started opening gas stations on on the south shore Montreal and and and he sold in 1915 I believe he sold his 10 gas station for 1.5 million at the time and then and then start buying land and and and created a yeah an amusement park a bit like a Callaway park sure on the north of Montreal uh that's his now a full neighborhood, so invests in real estate.

But he passed away when Trudeau was five years old. He had a heart attack. They had a house on the beach in Florida, and they were spending, the Trudeau was spending all their winter in Florida, which was very unusual at that time as well. They're going down by train, and his dad

passed away when he was five, but he had, so then he inherited of that money and that amusement park and that land. managed by his mom and the trustee from his grandpa. And his grandpa was a mentor to him, and he became a lawyer under his grandpa.

And it's why he took the name Elliot. It was very prestigious to be a Elliot in Montreal. So the firm still exists. It's Ilyat Stern, maybe not without the merger, but it was still existing when I was young. Elliot Stern. In fact, Brian Maroney worked from Elliot Stern after, anyway, that's a story.

And if I draw it to when he starts the magazine, specifically, because I find this very interesting. You know, we were talking about it being a version of a podcast. Yes, that's correct. You know, what did you say it stands for free? So Citi, like Free World, the magazine of the free world. City Lib. So it's a bit more local because Citi, it's a city.

Now it's a, so Cite d'Ib, it's the free, so, but, but it, the image it brings in, in French is, is, it was very, very attached to, uh, the, the freeing up France. And now it was, it was, it was like the new liberation. So, so he started a magazine like a bit like the liberation movement of Quebec and start, it was a political magazine that would specifically target, uh, the Catholic Church to, to diminish the power of Catholic Church. and put up new ideas like communism, socialism, social program. And then he would hire all these young guys that were Valier, who was the founder of DeFelcu, was one of his most prolific journalist. And he has all this bunch, René Lévaik was one of the other journalists that he was hiring. And so he would spot all the crap disturbers and hire them as journalists to write about what they were doing.

No? Well, isn't that kind of what's happening right now in Canada? Like, the reason I find it so fascinating is, you know, I have this vision or like, I guess, this idea of Pierre Elliott Trudeau is the guy giving the finger to the West of trying to bring in the National Energy Program, all these things that out here in the West were like, that is, we don't want any of this, right? And then, of course, in my lifetime, it culminates in his son doing all. the awful things and then COVID and just on and on and on and being a horrific leader, in my opinion. Yes, absolutely. But I do find it interesting.

He gets his, not his start, but I guess in my eyes, when I read what you wrote, he gets his start doing something in his time similar to what's happening right here. That's correct. Which is talking out about, you know, traditional values which a Catholic church was imposing upon all of Quebec. That's correct. I think I, you know, like at one point, you know, the Catholic Church, I think, correct me if I'm wrong here in my memory of reading, that, you know, they imposed laws that you

weren't allowed to use birth control. Yeah. And that families were basically pushed to have a kid every year if they could. Yes. And things like that. And, you know, like, there's a ton of things I love about Christianity. A ton. Yeah.

But at the same token, would have... here in the West we get frustrated with being told what to do. So Pierre Elliott Trudeau's magazine goes and finds all the crap disturbers. Yes. Gets them to come on and talk and report. That's correct. On what's going on in Quebec at the time and Canada, I guess, at large. And starts to stir that up.

And I watch what's happening. Probably people laugh as they're hearing this because I'm not trying to draw a comparison between me and Pierre Elliott Trudeau. But when I read it, I'm like, oh my goodness. That's exactly what he did. He got to know all the people who weren't afraid to speak out and talk about all the wrongs going in Quebec. Yep.

And then galvanized him into a force, and it became this popular magazine, which then he launched into a political career. Am I oversimplifying that or not? No, that's exactly what he did. And what he's done, he had his own plan, his own strategy built in that and his own vision. So Pierre Trudeau being a rich guy not having to work,

was able to jump on any plane, any time. He traveled the world. And he was a playboy, not married, bachelor, and got married strictly for political reasons with the right girl that the party told him to marry to win the West. So, I mean, the guy life was strictly and uniquely political goals. So what he's done, he started building his own concept of what he wanted Canada to be. He ran his publication for 15 years, identify all the troubleshooters, all the troublemakers.

Then put them in contact, start jumping on planes, as the planes know. Then he became friends with all the crap disturbers in the world. There was the in 1962 Revolution, Nigeria, like a thousand people. died there and he was good friend with the revolution here there he became good friend with yasser arrafat from from palestine and he became good friend with fidel castro and the reason for that is that then he would direct valia guy and all that why don't you go get training no there's a revolution which he gave a right and all that in cuba why don't get training from them and then he would tell them go get training from arrafat and go get training from algeria and you get training and then he would

go see these same guys castor and all that saying, you know what, if you train them, if you do not train them, if you, you know, I will give you money once I become prime minister. That's exactly what he did. He created an alliance to squash, to squash the movement in Quebec and to control the narrative, to control the future of the country to according to his plan. And his plan was motivated by who we don't know. No, I mean, I mean, he's one of the first.

founder of the club of Rome. He was an international guy. His vision of Canada was to become the international country. He wanted to become the Brussels of the world. That's what his vision of Canada. And he makes sure that that's what happened.

He took 15 years of writing in a magazine to build his plan. And then when he was elected first as MP, it was him, the chief editor of his magazine. and his main editorial guy, he said, no, let's go run the three of us

and for one of us to be elected. Well, all three were elected. They were called the three doves at the time. And he became Minister of Justice of Canada under Pearson. And then became leader of the party when Pearson left and became Prime Minister in 68. But when he became Prime Minister of 68, he had this plan like to the T.

He knew exactly what to do when, how. And he just like, he just like, execute very, very meticulously. Starting by, within two weeks of being elected, he moved the headquarters of the Canadian Army from Ottawa to Montreal, knowing that he had all... The shit disturbers.

Exactly, ready to pounds and to attack. And he already encouraged them to do bombing and all that that they learned with the Black Panthers in New York and all that. No, he put them in contact with all these people, basically. And then you'll... exactly what would be their murder separandy and just just just

just nip them at the roots and then he end up imprisoning them and he ended up and some of them end up killing each other and that's why it was a real that's probably where the similar

really end right? Because like when I hear about it I'm like it's probably why I'm so interested in you know okay so right now there's a ton of Albertans Yeah.

Right? It's not a small number. Yes. That won out of the relationship of Canada. That's correct. Yeah. And when I hear the story of Pierre, I'm like, you know, you think you're just going to snap your fingers and things you're going to happen and out we go and everything's going to be better. And I read it and I'm like, okay, what we do now will really echo into our kids' lifetime, right?

like it's or even more than echo it's going to really transform the direction we're heading hopefully and and so you you got to make sure we're getting right and i i can safely sit here and say folks i'm not i don't come from this rich background of like you know never having to work in my life and and everybody knows i i've got a family beautiful family beautiful wife um and i really uh think strong families is in the family the values that come with that or what we need to champion. But like in order to move ahead with wherever Alberta goes or wherever Canada goes, we have to get it right or we got to get it very close to right because, you know,

like you just think of what Pierre L. Eliot Trudeau did in his time, 15 years, then he goes on to be prime minister. He has this thing just calculated out to the T starts, you know, club of Rome and like, you're just like all these awful things. Oh, like, you know, that have really set up to where we are today. Yes. It's like, okay, here in Alberta,

we have people that want to get out. Well, Quebec had people that wanted to get out. Yeah. You know, to the point, they had the FLQ and they, like, bombings and, like, kidnappings and, like, some pretty crazy stuff that I think most of us are like, whoa, whoa, that's a little far. We don't need to do that.

Can't we just have a vote and just, hey, see you later? What happened? you're you're against a referendum question correct okay so let's sure let's jump to that okay so so so i'm i i i'm a sovereignist so i i'm for alberta to start taking care of alberta i'm for alberton trying to think albertan trying to think that when they cut a check to industrial alliance they're sending that check to quebec city i'm an albertan that people pissed to see $440 million a week going in the bank account of Toronto to our royalties because we do collect our royalties in a CIBBC account. And that pissed me off.

No, so we need to think for ourselves. We need to think to keep our stuff here. We need to start protecting our finance first. No, we need to start. You know what? I'm helping a lady, a friend of mine, her husband passed away. I go with her. I'm helping her of the estate. I go 30 the RBC, 3.30 in the afternoon to solve the estate stuff. And then the guy told us to come back the next morning at 10 because the RBC estate department is in Toronto. So what? We're too stupid to control our own estates here? I need some guys from Toronto to tell me how to deal with my bank account in this province.

These are stuff that we need to wake up to way before separation because I don't believe you can claim. for separation without getting that first. Like as long as daddy pays for the car and at the university and whatever, I mean, I'm sorry, but you're not in your own body, even though you live in your own apartment in Toronto. So this is how I see Alberta. We're not on our own.

We're still sending our pension to Ottawa. We have no problems sending our $23 billion to $50 billion a year in a Toronto bank account and have all these bank charge serve the local gay club in Toronto. We have no problem with that, no. I mean, well, we want to be separated and we're tired of all the, well, start by taking your own stuff in hand.

Like, I'm giving you my wallet and say, give me my card. Well, sorry, but you gave me your wallet. So I'll give you, I'll give it back to you, yes, but under my terms. Well, it starts there. It started by saying we're collecting your own stuff. That's step one.

wouldn't just leaving bring that all back? Well, the problem of that is that Quebec already tried that and other ones shut the door and shut the door with a policy that is claimed like the Clarity Act which is a travesty of even democracy. I mean, you have a law that says

that I will decide what is majority. I mean, I don't like to swear but I'm tempted to swarmed this one. Like, majority in democracy around the world it's 50 plus one. It's not for you to tell me that's something else. This is ridiculous. It's no like, and in fact,

the day after Canada passed the Clarity Act, the day after Quebec passed a local law removing the effect of the clarity act in Quebec. And that law never been fought by the federal. So, and that's the thing. That's the thing that, I hear a lot of Albertan talking about Westminster 1931, no, it's illegitimate government. Well, no, it's legitimate as long as you observed its law.

No, but if you're right, start not doing what they want to do. And if you're right, they won't be able to do anything. This is exactly what Quebec does. There's no society in the world that knows better the Westminster system than Quebec. And they use it to their advantage. So your suggestion to Albertans then is let's start using everything to our advantage. Exactly. Let's start saying no, let's pull back the pension plan tomorrow.

Yes. Let's start controlling our destiny instead of asking permission to do so. Exactly. Let's start collecting our own tax. Let's start banking our royalties at the ATB. We own the ATB. We're the only province that have a provincially run no retail banking. And if we're not happy with ATB, we'll shut it down and do something else with it.

Like in Quebec, they have their case in Depot. But we need to start first taking care of our finance and stopping, putting money in the Bank of Canada through the CIBC, through all that, and keeping the money here. Well, you know, I'm a big believer in Bow Valley Credit Union. I've had Brett Olin on a lot. Yes. And when it comes to, you know, Eve Chippeke just recently with her. trying to get Bitcoin and then them shutting her down and calling her risky. And now she's moved over to BVCU.

I think I can say that safely. And I've had my own dealings with ATB directly on Bitcoin specifically. And so, you know, you just see the things that BVCU is doing. And you know when you talk about Quebec having the largest credit union, that's correct? That's correct. It's like, so. In the world. What you're pointing out is start putting your money where your mouth is.

That's correct. There's two options, I guess, right? ATB, provincially ran bank. And the other one would be any credit union. BVCU, of course, I'm going champion on this show. But at the same token, there's probably others sitting in Alberta. Yeah, well, I'll say that BVCU is very distinct from all the others in the way that first I'm working with them very, very much.

So I know them very intimately. And I believe the biggest distinction is that they have, have a board, they have a president that do understand the danger that are luring with our fiat currency and that is trying all the way he can to protect its member from the collapse of the dollar that is imminent. We don't know when, maybe imminent five years. No, it's often, I like to say it's like the suddenly of God, no. I mean, when it happens, I've been fast, but you don't know when. And speak about BVCU, I mean, they're genius. They just bid that email account now that you can transfer from your fiat currency.

You can send your screen, your U.S. dollar currency, kinsundar currency, gold, silver, and now Bitcoin. And now Bitcoin. And then transfer from one to the other, just the same as you would transfer. It's absolutely brilliant, no, and no other creation offers that. I was thinking this today before we got on, I'm like, you know, sitting in Alberta. And it's funny because, you know, like on this show, I advertise for a bunch of them, right? So silver gold bull, headquartered in Calgary.

Yes. Right? So if you're doing any precious metals, you know, a company that you should be looking at is silver gold bull. Yeah. They're literally sitting in Calgary. You got their start at a Rocky Mountain House. Yeah, there's two vault in Alberta for precious metal, physical pressure metal in Calgary.

They are both in Calgary, but one is known by the brinks and the other one by Albertans. Well, get your freaking stuff out of the brinks. It doesn't make sense. It's controlled by American stuff. And this is where we need to bring people. Like stop encouraging outside of the province, even if it's a bit more expensive. No, I rather pay like, no, I have, all my insurance are with P-sills. And some premium, I pay more than the second quote, but I still pay P-sill because

I rather paying like 50 bucks more a month knowing that I'm encouraging like a young guy playing hockey, banking, baseball, the local league, the APP through their members, no,

doing stuff. I'd rather do that than sending my check for 50 bucks less to Toronto. I agree with you. And the other ones I was going to say,

so Silver Gold Bull, Bull Valley Credit Union, yes. Alberta-based, right, for Albertans. Yes. And then I always think

of firearms. It's a Lloyd Minster company, but Profit River goes all across Canada, has all the abilities of all these different store, but it's literally locally owned, sitting right here. And it has the ability to go anywhere else. So show to the profit river too. So if you're getting, you know, when it comes to

money. Yeah. Right. Yeah. When it comes to precious metals. You know, there's a Bitcoin company speaking, another guy that I recently interviewed, I think just before I went on holidays, was Adam O'Brien. Yeah. Right? That's Eminton. You know, like there's all these companies where you can start to push back into Alberta. But you know, the largest contributor, the one that has the most bankroll would be the Alberta government. Yes. Right? When we're talking about, I sent my 50 bucks, that's cool. Yeah. You know, like I'm all for it. But, you know,

the Alberta government's got to do things, you know, like when you talk about the pension plan, well, who can do that? Yeah. Not not Sean. No. Right? That's right. That's Daniel Smith and her team. That's right. Am I wrong on that? That's right. Absolutely. And the thing that drives me nuts, it's to do what Quebec does. We don't need a referendum. We don't need to ask permission to other way we don't need to change constitution we don't need anything of that we just need to legislation at the ledge that that put together a pension plan that put together uh that expand the work of the revenue agency of albera to to more than just a corporation

we know like like it's all it's all uh legislations uh based by the only thing you need it's a majority government which i believe we have so so so And that's the point that I found very difficult in that situation to see all these movements and all that. Oh, no, we. And now the UCP is fearing that that separatist movement. I mean, it's possible that next AGM that the UCP becomes a separatist party because there are some stuff that are pushed as policies that are for sure separatists that's coming on.

And they don't know how to deal with it. Well, how to deal with it is start acting on your own stuff. and start showing people that you're taking seriously Albertan future and you're taking seriously like blocking Al-Awa and that starts by removing the wallet from their hand. And we're not doing that. So, and this is what Quebec did. And it's what Quebec's still doing.

More than that, Quebec, after the 95 referendum, there's a war of narrative that started between the Canadian government and the Quebec government, between Kretzien and the Quebec government. And basically, Canada started funding some flags. Anyway, it turns out to be a huge scandal like liberals are. But by the way, I'm saying that. But the most scandals at the time were under the Monroe government. 1993, the conservative went from 170-something-something-seat to two.

And the liberal took power with the Block Quebecois as official opposition. and and Christian pushed by that threat of referendum wanted to show everybody that he could manage the country correctly and Paul Martin as Minister of Finance these guys cut close to half a million jobs in the federal system during their power. They did an awesome job. They were way more conservative than a lot of conservative that I know today.

No, they did the job. They cleaned up the federal government. They reduced the bureaucracy about half a million people. But they cut like 100,000 jobs within the first year of mandate. And meanwhile, here in Alberta, you had Ralph Klein at the same period that was doing the same thing, just cleaning up shop. I believe we're there again. This is what needs to be.

The conservative always screamed like, oh, the NDP was terrible and all that. Well, the NDP during their four years, they double the provincial worker. How many were fired under the UCP? zero. So how conservative is that? I'm just going a bit. The same, oh, the NDP overspend and all that. How much did we cut from the NDP budget?

None. We increased it. So we need to start doing action to show that we're willing to change stuff. And it's always the same way that that government has a way to stall stuff. So when they don't want to do something, stall it. So now they started these meetings across the province to know what Albertan wants with all these super directed

like totally slanted videos and poll that is exactly what I'm saying that we should take control of a police and well why do you do that? Just do it. If you're a fearful, no leader a leader don't do what people wants him to do. A leader leads So that's what I have to say on that

Well, where we sit today You know The APP's question is in court Yeah Right And I don't fully I was trying to understand The whole thing there

And I'm just like I don't know It's probably not as confusing As I probably make it out to be But the same time when I had Jeff Rath On the mashup Him talking about I'm like man this is like talking in a circle

I don't get all the Constitution ramification of what's going on. Mm-hmm. But, you know, when I go back to when you first gave me your paper. Yeah. At courage to listen, sorry. And I showed out to Daryl Comic and his group, you know, of Calgary, Lawheed. They're awesome.

Eric Bouchard. Eric Bouchard, yeah. Like, I mean, like they, they, I made a lot of jokes that night. And I'm not a comedian, folks. Everybody knows that. But I found it very interesting because you had, you had yourself, then Matt Erit, Yeah. Two Quebecers.

Yeah. I know what you call. Forgive me. I'm okay with that. But I'm like talking about Alberta freedom essentially. Yes. Followed by Bruce Party, who's an Ontario professor. And I'm like, how is this, how is this the event that is talking and garnering millions of people viewing it?

Yeah. You know, it's not like 10 Albertans. And I thought what you guys talked about that night, very interesting, right? Yes. but you have been warning of the trap set with the Clarity Act with all these things why do you and maybe you've already said it and I'm just rehashing it for the third time why do you look and want Albertans to understand that if we go down the route of a referendum in 2026, 27 whenever you ever get there yeah of like we have a question and we want to leave

Let's say we got 57%. I don't even care. 62%, 51%. Why do you think that is not a good route? Yeah. Well, it's not good route for a different reason. And the first being that you don't have any leader pushing that question. Separation needs a running the bike to run with it, no?

First off. Secondly, the government power is not for it. Obviously, they don't want a reference. and when you don't want something the best way to do it without showing it is to to make it lost among other things so so I believe the end result what it will be the question would be asked but I believe it would be asked within seven or eight other questions and then that gives the freedom to any MLA to reject the entire thing for one of the other questions.

That gives them the freedom to do what, no, pay lip service and not doing anything in action. And I believe that if the government power is not actively behind it, it won't fly. And then the other thing that I believe, why I believe a referendum is a bad idea is that because of a clarity act. So the clarity act frame a bunch of conditions that I believe if we do, we do. get, even if we get a 50 plus one, I think that we were heading in probably 10, 20 years of negotiation with the federal, just go through the process. And they will repeal, oh, no, it wasn't a real majority. And then they will bring all kinds of stupid law like the undripe and all that.

Oh, no, it didn't fly towards the First Nation. And I don't like to call them that way, but towards the Aboriginal people. I would tell you, no, First Nation. No, First, the tribes that were living on here were tribals there were not nations first of all okay so what's the difference between nation and tribal tribal uh tribal is is is is a blood relationship and and and doesn't doesn't imply a structured uh functioning operation a nation implies structure function operation that's the distinction i i learned and that i that do between a tribe and a nation a nation will will will will build um infrastructure will will will set stuff uh for multiple generation a tribe it's a family no you might you might sell at one place

but but but but you you structure for your family not not not not not for um uh yeah so so so so so So again, no, I'm getting a very, no, you might be debased, I guess, for that type of discord in Canada, but it is what it is. And so I believe that the first true nation, Canada, are the French. Because there are the ones that put settlement. The other one that build roads. And only that, but they did it without worrying with the Indians. They used the Indians to help them establish themselves, and the Indian used the French to defend themselves from the other.

Indians because it was it was it it was not like all rows and no like it's not it's not it's not the white man that learned the engine how to scalp somebody no like let's get real no it was tribal wars all the time no tribes and that's a friend with a nation a nation because you're not so so close on your family stuff you're able to negotiate outside of that of that context um where a tribe you will you will you will will do tribal things. So whatever the other don't believe like you, you kill and you you dismissed. And this is why even now I don't believe that we have First Nations.

I believe that we have a bunch of tribes that we call nations that don't even agree together. You see controversial stuff like just happened in Vancouver, where they rename that street with a word that nobody can spell or say. And even the other First Nation around are not in agreement with that, because it's not trouble. No, like, oh, it shouldn't be your family

that has that in my family. It's got a family feud, no. So, so, so, so, so,

so, so, so, so, so, there's a difference. There was, um, when I was at the Freedom Compoi,

uh, there was a bunch of different flags there. It was really cool because he had the Albertan flag and the flirtily like side by side, which is, you know, those two things shouldn't go together is what we're told. But there was,

I was trying to remember, I'm trying to remember what it was. I thought it was a first, well, Aboriginal flag, but that had been done with the French that had like parallel lines. Do you know what I'm talking about?

Well, there's a meeting nation that have that loop. There's a loop. It was different than that. It was a, oh man, this is terrible. Maybe I should try and Google it. And by the way, by the way, there are some of these tribes

that learn how to be nations. And I believe the one that is the most advanced in that, are the Cree in Quebec. And they were able to do that because of the Quebecers, because they were able to emancipate themselves at the same time as the French were emancipating themselves. Just a parallel note to that.

But again, a nation, like the Cree, build their own airport. They built some roads. They manage some of the dams for hydro-Cubeck there. No, like, this is what a nation does. I can't remember what it was. Forgive me. Somebody's going to text me about it, Because I remember going up and asking people in the Freedom Convoy,

like, what is that? I've never seen that flag before. Or maybe I just never paid attention. Yeah. And it was, I thought it represented Aboriginal people and French. And maybe I'm butchering this. And just that they were equal. And I thought, I'm like, oh, that's it.

You know, and once again, in what you write, they never looked at them, French never looked themselves above ever. They looked at each other as equals. Absolutely. In fact, there was a French. French Indian wars. No, that's what it was called.

When the English start fighting no towards the Mississippi River and all that, all that was French territory. And it was French territory down to New Orleans. I mean, Chicago has been founded by Montrealers and all these cities, St. Louis and all that. And there was the French, before the Louisiana purchased,

Louisiana was a French territory and the French, basically the French lost to the Spanish on one at the south end and to the English or to the north. That's what happened. And that war was fought against the English with the French and Indian together. Because

in 1534 when Jean-Carty came to map the St. Lawrence River, by the way, all the village that it was going to were all empty because there was already a war between the Mooc and the morocque, the winter it didn't well for hunting. So they

came to the Montagnan who were who were farmers and they basically killed everybody to get the food. So when Jacques Cartier came, there was very few people in all the Montagné village along the Central Ranch River and Jacques Cartier brought back with

him two Indians to Paris. And it was like a showcase in the King's court that he has these two Indians. But meanwhile, the Jesuit and the one in charge of education

work with these Indians to develop curriculum how to speak their dialect. And when the French came back to start planting some colonies, there were planting schools to teach First Nation language and not French. So again, we have to know that to know to the relationship. And by the way, the Miti Nation, who calls themselves first-year, nation, well, I'm sorry, but the Miti is a merge between Indian and French. So why can you be first nation if French or not? And again, the division between all these nations, it's from the monarchy.

Only in the monarchist regime, you can accept that somebody is different to you because of his bloodline. Because the king is king only because his mom was queen. And then no like... This is what I liked about Bruce Parties thought on trying to make everyone equals. That's correct. Is because I'm like, I don't know, you know, I don't know if there is, you know, there isn't some utopian vision out there. It's just like, how can you make society better? Yeah.

Treat everybody as equal, I think is a pretty decent start. I agree. And when you have different ways to elevate yourself against a different human being, all of a sudden, basically what you're saying with a monarchy is it automatically does that. It's just, it's there. It's there. Why is he a king? Because he comes from a bloodline. Yeah.

And he go, okay. So then you start putting out the monarchy structure. Yeah. And that just filters across society. All these different families are above others because of bloodlines and appointments, right? One bloodline appointed all these different things. So how do you make it in a theory the best possible version of society, right? Yeah.

Pierre Trudeau would have went communism, or socialism, right? Yeah, socialism. That's what's been playing out. government is basically, for lack of a better way of explaining it, God or the king, right? They know best. Yeah. And if there's something in my lifetime that I'm becoming, I guess, I guess, like, very much against, is that the government controls everything.

I don't like that. And in Pierre's time, it was the Catholic Church, I think, in Quebec, controlled everything. That's what he was rallying against, correct? That's correct. And what they replaced the Catholic Church with was government, which was, was, was, basically people that he had, and not all of them. Most of them. But lots of the people that have worked in his paper went on to be government.

Yes. Right? So they just flipped the script. Yeah. We know best. We've been looking in all the things that are wrong in society. So this is what's going to be next. And so now government is now pushed above relatively the king.

Yes. And that's true. Since Peter, when you look at the power that the prime minister have now, versus what Trudeau had is seven. It's night and day. Just because we have all these structure and these gate that's supposed to be protected by the king, the way the Westminster system works, not there anymore by tradition. So by tradition, no, like for instance, the king is the bus of the army.

That's what we call it the Royal Navy and the Royal Army. Well, by tradition, the king won't intervene to use his army or not. it's the lands in the hand of the prime minister. By tradition, the governor general sign everything that parliament goes. Well, this is not how this is that. It was supposed to be gatekeeping. It's not there anymore. By tradition, there's all of stuff that we do by tradition,

and we're still a monarchy. We're still a democratic monarchy. So now we're in a position where the prime minister is now, and the premier in provinces, they are now in control of all these structures. that were meant to keep us from tyranny. Now they control it all. So they become monarch in view of the monarch

in terms of power, in terms of what they want to do. I mean, I'm sorry, but I did work under the first upper government, and I did work like for government and power. I can tell you that a government in power has a lot of power. Okay, like like as long as you understand how the system works, I mean, you can get a lot done and a lot of damage done, and a lot of stuff shifted. Because in our system, ministers and prime ministers and premiers have almost unlimited power. When the minister says something and write a decree, it has the power of the king.

It's done. And people don't realize that. And most politicians don't use it like that, but it's there to be used. so there are different levels to which you can use it but ultimately it's a very very broken system I just want to clarify this because I found the flag I think that I I'm talking about it's the two and I'm going to butcher this

the two row Wampum flag refers to two row Wampum belt a foundational treaty between I didn't know this the Iroquois and the Dutch in 1613 oh okay and uh it features two parallel Purple rose against a white background symbolizing two distinct paths or vessels, a canoe for indigenous peoples and a ship for Europeans traveling side by side on the River of Life. I saw that flag and I saw the Infinity one as well.

There was a whole bunch of different flags there. I was like, what is it? So that's there. Okay. Just so I can get that thought out of my head and people are not searching and yelling at me and everything else. I thought it was, you know, parallel and, you know, what did I say, the river of life.

But it's the Dutch and the Iroquois. Yes, that's what it was. Sorry. When it comes to a government, you know, I was saying, you know, like we're saying invest or put your money in in an Alberta bank and do these little things. And all that matters, right? If we could snap a finger tomorrow and have 90% of Albertans rush into an Alberta bank, that would be quite a spectacle.

Yes. But you've pointed out a referendum will not be successful. if the current government, which has all the power, doesn't champion it, correct? That's correct. So on that, if Daniel Smith is against separation, or the UCP, maybe I'll just blank it as UCP and not single out one individual, why do they lower the citizen-led referendum? Why do they do things like that if they're against it?

Why not just go, oh, yeah, have better. To me, that would be against it. Because they want it. They want it, they just want the people to do it. Well, they want it. I mean, no, if you can bring a question like that and it fails, now we can shelve it. It's done. It's been dealt with.

No, we can see that. There was that reference. So they want to give the appearance that they want it. Oh, they want it because they know it will fail. So often you want something to fail. It's a bit like your kid that always play with stuff and try to put it. the plug and you always prevent him. Well, one day you will, okay,

don't do it. You want to get electrical? You want to burn your hand, you whatever. Now you know, don't do that. Exactly. So that's what it is. And then the way they will do it to make it palatable to everybody, they will mix it with

their own referendum that she wants to do with all these seven or eight questions. So it will be one of the eight questions or the ballot, which is absolutely atrocious. You don't do referendums like that. It's like like it's no for me it's beyond

even when we did the referendum on the equalization no on the same ballot you had equalization at the time change like what? Why is there too stupid question in a municipal election? Oh to save money well you're not saving money

you're distracting people you're wasting money because all the effort you put in this referendum because there's no campaign because is deluded and all that, it's worthless. Well, nothing's ever come of the, what is it, 63% that wanted out of? And nothing can come out of it

because it's in our constitution since 1982. So we cannot change anything in the constitution. We have to stop wanting, two things we have to stop saying, we have to stop claiming, oh, no, like, Westminster, 1931, it's an illegitimate government. Well, shut up, because you still have a driver's license, admit by your government.

So as long as you, I mean, it is what it is, no. So you might be right legally, but it doesn't make sense. Well, it goes back to if you could have mass adoption of people flooding all their money. Every business, every individual put their money into an Alberta bank. Yes. That would speak volumes. That's correct. And when you go to 1931, if everyone tomorrow, just we're done with it, that would speak volumes.

Yes. The problem is, is getting mass adoption of anything at this point. That's correct. is near impossible. Yes. Especially when the prevailing government doesn't champion it. Exactly. And then the other way to achieve it is to play with the system that we have or that is recognized.

So and we have a troubled child in this country that showed us all the way to play the system. And instead of looking exactly what they're doing and trying to mimic them, including in the attitude. It's not just a question of law. It's a question of attitude. Well, it won't work. Quebec does a bunch of stuff that are anti-constitutional.

They're never challenged on them, ever. Why would Allah was lose time challenging them on petty stuff like keeping the little government or not? What do you think of the current political situation in Quebec? Forgive me the new party, but the Recepardist party, winning all the by-elections and in the polls they're ahead of the current... Well, they're not new. There's the PQ. Yeah. Once again, you can walk me through this.

Yes. So the PQ, Parts-Kébecois was a party founded by Renélez in 1968. That came in power in 76. That made the 1980 referendum and 1995 referendum. This is the party that did all that. This is the party that is coming back. right now. It's a and the comeback is not it's not a new party. And and and and and the comeback is that Quebecer inantiify the pq as a party of change. Like when when Quebec really, really wants to, uh, to take the whip out, they put the PCU in place. They, they, they elect him. And after that, when they get what they, what, what they wanted and they just need to, to, to, to serve the wave, then they bring the liberal back.

That basically how it's been working. So the polls would show they're about ready to get the whip out. Yes. So the poll shows that there's the small group that control the Quebec narrative wants a change. That's what it says. That's what it tells me. And it's probably about 10 guys in Quebec that controls the province. And when these 10 families, 10 guys decided that it's not good for them, they crack the whip and they change the government.

I know you're not living in Quebec. but when you look at it, what would be upsetting Quebec? What is upsetting Quebec the most right now is the immigration situation, is that Quebec has been controlling their immigration since 1976, and since the liberal start flooding us with immigrants, Quebec are not happy because they're not controlling the immigration anymore. So they're seeing the same thing in Quebec as every other, major city, everything is seeing

Which they shouldn't. Toronto should see it but not Quebec. Because it's legitimate for all the other province to see it because it's not Quebec's problem because Quebec control its immigration. But now the federal government is overlapping the right that Quebec gained since

1976 according to immigration and they don't like it. And they say, you know what? We don't mind if you make Toronto a mess of Toronto, we don't care, we could care less. It's outside of Quebec, but you don't do that here. And so it's starting to bleed into, well, I mean, we're seeing, you know, like, my wife just said to me, this is, this was interesting, right? We go back to Minneapolis, Minnesota.

Yeah. And don't get me wrong. I'm sure you go downtown Minnesota, Minneapolis, forgive me. And there's homeless probably all over the place. Like I remember years ago when I was in college being down there and, and, you know, and, noticing like, man, there's a ton of homeless here. Yeah. But like with our kids at our in-laws and everything walking around,

you hardly see a single homeless person. Yeah. We get back to Lloyd, you know, and if I was going to be homeless, this would not be my choice. No. And within two minutes, maybe 30 seconds, you just see homeless everywhere. Wow.

Like walking everywhere. We go to, we stopped at North Battleford to grab gas. Yeah. And I think a little bit of lunch. And there was like 15 just chilling out behind the one building. In North Belford. Yeah, I was like, holy crap. That's tragic.

And that's in, you know, the first day and a half of being back in Canada. It's just evident. So when you say, well, Quebec is going to crack the whip, they're upset about immigration. Yes. Yes. That's the number one. And then, of course, there's the Trump factor. And they don't like at all all Carney is managing the Trump thing, no.

because 80% of Quebec economy is manufacturing sent down the East Coast so so so there are heavily heavily heavily hit by the tariff when is Quebec's next provincial election I should know this Tuesday is going to be yelling at me

I don't even know I think it's coming I think it's 2026 yeah I believe it's 2026 but no one in Quebec does there a thing is that is that when when they shift, they all shift together. Like, like...

October 5th, 2026. Okay. So, so Quebec is very particular because you have to know that I checked recently. There are still 78% of the population of Quebec that do not speak, no right, nor read English.

There are unilingual French. You will show them like, like, there are at last on their milk cartels. as you are when you read the French. And what was percentage, did you say? 78% of Quebecers couldn't read English on a mouth.

Couldn't read, could understand, couldn't speak, cannot deal in English. So when you have that type of percentage, that means that their access to information is very limited. Yeah, they're not tuned in the SMP. No. Although I do have some Quebecers who do so shout out to them. Yeah, well. that can understand, and most likely Christian, and there's not a lot of Christian in Quebec,

no, 70,000 out of a million population, born again Christian Quebec. Really? Yes. Because of what the Catholic church did there? Everybody calls themselves Catholic, but nobody goes to church, no? So, so everybody's Catholic. That's something.

That was a, sorry, I keep pulling us off, you know, like once again, for your paper, how do people, I've been having, and I know people are going to ask me, how do they find it? Well, so. Or can we find a way to share it so people can read it?

Well, so, so I'm debating right now to put it in the book, to publish a small book. And I would love to do that. I would love to do that very quickly, like within the next two months. But as it sits right now, there's no way to access the paper. Well, not really. I gave it to people that I know you. You have a PDF copy and all that. So if people want, I can share the PDF.

Well, either that you put, if you put a link, to a PDF on your on that podcast i'd be i would be okay for that for that okay yeah yeah but but i will probably convert it in a book no well when you have the book done yes you're gonna give me a copy so i can read it and then we can talk about it again that's great what i was going to say was you know like it was almost overnight you had i forget the percentages you can tell them uh to me but it was like i don't know 90% going to church every sunday and within a year it had flipped to like two percent going to church yeah yeah it went it went from 96 to four percent in a year from

1967 to 1968. And what happened in the year? The World Exhibition, Expo 67 in Montreal. Why the heck would that have any? Because it's the most successful

world exhibition of the 20th century, 54 million visitors. And Quebec was kind of closed. It was a close community. Only French you have to put yourself Even myself, I start being fluent in English. I was about 19, and my dad always proud himself

to be a successful businessman without speaking English. That's a pride in Quebec. When you succeed in life and don't speak English, man, people applaud you, no, because the English always controlled everything. So what happened is that Quebec was a very close society. and when the Montreal Expo happened in 1967 with all these visitors from across Canada

from across the world, with all these baby boomers, all the young people that were like my dad was 19, 20 at a time, they opened their eyes to the world. They didn't realize that there's something else that does exist that they don't need. I mean, until 1966, the Cardinal of Montreal would read the road. over the radio and and 80% of the kitchen and and living room in Quebec people

will go on their knees do their rosary after dinner at seven so everybody will open their radio go on their knees and do the rosary every every day I mean you couldn't buy meat on Fridays in Quebec it was illegal it was fish only on Fridays like that that was that was and then and then suddenly you have all these 60 countries represented with all their own culture and all these people coming from there and then and then like my dad at the time was in charge of a of a shelter and they were hosting a group of of well they end up being gangster but from new york that but they were dancer or rapper something like that it was like a new stuff and and and one of the

guy had had a semi-OD and kept my my dad hostage for for two days it was a big big story at the time and then when my dad was freed up he was invited to go and spend a weekend protected by that gang in New York so for all these kids it was like what? Like that does exist so what do you think they did

and they stopped going to church? They stopped like like what are we doing? So from 67 to 68 90-something percent of Quebecers their eyes open to the world for the first time they saw stuff I never saw before they were in contact with dope that they never had before. They were in contact with the,

it was all the love and peace and all that freedom movement from that super constraining Calvac Church. I mean, if you were in the 50s, if you were a girl getting pregnant, not married, the Catholic Church will take the baby from you and send it to send your baby to an orphanage. And then because the government was paying twice for psychiatric hospital and for orphanages,

your baby would end up in a psychiatric hospital. and it was a big scandal that blew up in the 90s. It's what called the Duplessis orphans. And there was over 25,000 of these kids that ended up in psychiatric hospitals. Because they paid more. Because the Catholic Church was receiving twice the money in an orphanage and in a psychiatric.

Yeah. Then an orphanage. Okay, I mean, the Catholic Church ran orphanages and psychiatric hospitals. And all hospitals. So after, and all hospitals. And all hospitals, Quebec were all Catholic. And if a person landed in an orphanage, they got X.

And if they landed in a psychiatric hospital, they got two X. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. How the hell does that make any sense? And then, well, Judge Kudk has for more treatment and all that. So most babies ended up in these psychiatric hospitals. How could you make the case that a newborn needs psychiatric help? Yeah.

And then the worst case in that is that the only, when you were a bit of an outcast in society in Quebec, there was two ways together of poverty, again, Mafia or the church. And when is the church, you couldn't get married. So the church was attracting all the homosexual and all that because then nobody would ask you a question, why are you not married? And then when the priest had a problem of fallout in the parish,

it would be transferred in one of these hospitals. So if you're a deviant, Yeah. Then you got put in a place with a bunch of orphans. Yeah, that's right. So am I? And by the way, this is why I have a lot of difficulties with the residential schools. I mean, the residential schools made way more good than bad compared to that.

I mean, this is not even at the same level. So please give me a break. Okay. I'm not going to get in that debate. No. I am I right in thinking? And I can't believe I even draw this comparison, but the Expo in 1967, correct?

Yes. Rang a bell so loud to Quebecers. Yes. It shook their foundation. And in a year's time, they were all going to church. Yes. They all stopped going to church. That's correct.

Would it be comparable to what the Freedom Convoy did to Canada, down waking people up. At a different scale, I believe so. I mean, obviously different scale, but that's the way my brain, you know, like after the freedom convoy, you know, like politicians can't move fast. Yeah. Freedom convoy happens and it's like days, weeks, everything's changing. Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, everything's falling off.

I wouldn't, like, I don't think of the Expo as a civil disobedience at all. It's a celebration of the culture of the world. But a celebration of culture shook Quebecer. That's correct. That's correct. Transformed Quebec. Totally like shifted everything. And it's in that context that Trudeau came in power the year after in 68.

Who brought in the Expo? Who is the mass? Jean Drapeau was the mayor of Montreal since before the war. Jean-Drepoe was mayor of Montreal. Do you think that they knew that that would shake the foundation? No, no. They didn't knew that that would have that effect. Otherwise, they would have been shut down by the Catholic Church.

That is. It was a surprise. But that's a really good parallel with the trucker and vote because it was a surprise. Nobody was expecting that. What happened in 68. That's hard to wrap one's brain around. I don't know. Maybe everyone's, oh, no, Sean, that seems totally.

normal. I'm like, no, that's right. And that's something that never, you know, like one of the things that I find fascinating about talking to you and reading your, your thoughts and, you know, when I was asking you before about the FLQ, like well before, this is months ago, folks, I'm like, I just, you know, I don't remember any of this in Canadian history class, right? Like, I just, I don't remember any of this stuff, you know, and it's so fascinating, you know? Yes. What is the narrative today? lots on the residential schools. And I'm not about to get into the debate because, you know, there's been lots done in those schools.

I've had people on here. It wasn't great. Now, was it all bad? No, I've also talked to other people. But, like, one of the things that I never heard about was this stuff going on in Quebec. But 25 babies in psychiatric hospital, that's all bad. 25,000.

Yeah, there's no good in there. Yeah, it doesn't even make sense to me. All it is is money. Yeah, it's only money. That's correct. So that's why I'm saying, you know what? So Quebec, it's why Quebec don't even like going there with their First Nations. So it's like, give us a break.

No, like, please. Not like, let's live together. Let's build something great. The Cree Nation in Quebec are doing marvelous stuff. They became a nation because Quebec became a nation. And they are their own airport. They are their own stuff. I mean, they are a real nation.

But they are the only one of the Aboriginal that I know, that are a real nation. That are building things. They're building things. They are the construction company. They are competitive. They are taking care of their land, like in the westerner way. They make sure that their people have good water and they have roads and that they maintain.

And they, no, they don't expect anybody to maintain their stuff for them. And yeah. So when you're looking at Quebec and then you look to where Alberta sits today, right? I don't know if we can argue this. but, you know, like we're kind of where Quebec was in the 90s. There's this, there's this fever pitch, growing percentage of people that want out, which is okay.

But then it becomes, so how do you do that to get the most benefit for the people? And minus like an armed conflict where every citizen or leader creates an Alberta militia. Let me just say no more. Yeah. then you have to use the system to pull back the most. And that's why so many of my elders talk about an Alberta pension plan, a police force.

That's right. You mentioned the insurance. Yeah, yeah. Push on your insurance company to create our own programs. Everything that costs us. Like, freak, we import $3 billion of diesel from BC. How in the world is that possible? Wake up.

Like, it's ridiculous. You mentioned immigration that Quebec's controlled their own immigration. So I feel like I should know this. But federal government then controls the immigration policy for all provinces, minus Quebec? Yes, yes, yes, that's right. And Quebec, there's two things that that is joint control, immigration and EI. So by constitutionally speaking, immigration in EIA and EI is is is a, is, uh, is a, uh, federal territory, not even immigration.

Immigration is provincial territory. So on immigration, what Quebec does, they choose their immigrant. And that's the right they have to do. They say, okay, you bring somebody, but I will choose who stays here. And when you immigrate to Quebec from another country, before they give you a driver's license, social stuff, your health care, you'll have to go to a class where we're going to teach you what is Quebec culture. where we come from

and how we think in this province. And then secondly, you're going to sign a contract that you're going to pledge to learn French and to send your kids to French school. And if you don't want that, we're not giving you social covering, driver license, health care,

go in Ontario. One other question, then. I don't know. I'm like, I don't even, so, like, we've done the gamut today, I feel like. Why did the group, Quebec have probably the darkest laws in COVID. Like, is it because they treat the government knows best?

Because they know the best. So of all the great things Quebec has going for them, the one problem they got is they trust too much in their government? That's correct. Very dark. Very, very left. But know what? They're freaking 4,000 kilometers away.

I knew because I drove it a couple of times. You see my family. I'm the only one down west. Let there be. Yeah. Like if this is how they want to manage their nation, so be it. But don't throw anything that goes with it. They do a lot of good stuff.

We can do a lot of these structures and operate them as Albertan think. No, we are conservative, so we won't have all these social programs, but we can still control our money. We won't, we know, we won't believe, no, we won't have all these structures, but we'll still control our money. let's let's think differently no instead of even our pension plan instead of forcing no certain investment well then then let's let's be more free thinker but think Alberta first still no instead of investing in in a light trade system for Calgary for instance well we can we can decide to create the Alberta index. That would be great.

If we could have like index of the 125 top trading companies in Alberta, and then the government in Alberta help creating that index that then we sell for pension plans, no. So that would be great because then we can have born members on CNRL, on Enbridge, on all these public companies to bring the Alberta flavors because they're operating on our land. And this is exactly what Quebec does with the Kaiser Depot. Keseeepo has these controlling

and control for public sometimes like 10%, 7%, 14% of the shares of the company. But they have Quebec people sitting on their board. If you operate on my territory, I will have somebody sitting from here on your board to make sure that

you're just not exploiting us and bringing them when you have. You know, when I had Dennis Modri on here, I don't know, in the last year, I remember having the discussion over Canada first versus Alberta first. And my mind has really, you know, that was something I had to wrestle with once upon a time. And when I hear your stories of Quebec, they have been Quebec first for a very long time. It doesn't mean they go and treat Ontario bad and people bad.

It's just that when it comes to dealing with government structures, they understand the game very well because they were under the thumb for how many years. Yeah, over 100 years. Right? So they just went, no, we're Quebec first when it comes to the government side of things. That's correct. You know, it doesn't mean Quebec first all of a sudden you treat your fellow man.

Badly. Badly. It just means government to government. You have to do what is in your people's best interest. That's correct. And you protect your infrastructure. In 1999, Rogers, communication from Toronto, made an offer to buy Videootron in Quebec.

Videotron was controlling the entire cable network of the province. And when Bernard Landry was premier at the time, heard that Rogers made an offer to buy Videotron, he stopped the transaction. He chose a Quebec company, Quebec. And he told them, we're going to give you the money to buy it. It's not true that our cable system will be controlled by Ontarians. It's the infrastructure.

You think you want to attract the best and the best ideas and you want to keep all the money in. You know, like, folks probably listened to Chase Barber last week on Edison Motors. And I'm like, he's a million dollars away, even if it's $2 million away, from having this hybrid diesel EV. Sorry, Chase, I'm butchering it. I'm like, anyone from the Alberta government should hear that? Yes.

And be like. And jump on it. What if we brought you to Alberta and you built it here? Yeah. And we'll get you through the regulatory. But the problem of our government is that we don't have that tool. Quebec, when they created the Kesee Depot at the same time, they created it under.

And so Quebec are very blunt about knowing that politicians just want to give money away. So instead of creating the Kaysa Depot and saying, we will protect it for, make sure that no political influence will. What they're done, they create the KZPO, and they created the SGAF, the Society General de Finanement. and so it's the General de Finansement. It's another fund that the corporate government have. They change in the name.

Right now I think it's called Investment, Quebec, whatever. But what they've done, they created that structure. They put $10 billion in it. And this is the slush money of the politicians. One day a politician wants to intervene, they have that structure that they can't do. No, instead of say, oh, they should. No, no, let them do that. No, let them give them a little thing that they won't put their hand in the bigger pot, no.

And then the SJF, the Premier has control of that and can decide to to offer 5 million to chase to come here on a whim, like wake up by morning, we're going to help them. And this is what Quebec does to attract companies. They have the SGF that's been functioning since the 60s and they brought a lot of industries. Quebec is now the number one pharmacistical in the country

because of the SGF. No, each time, like, I was part of an industry named Multimedia in the early 90s. I was saying website in Cidrom is in 1990 when Mosaic appeared, which was the first. No HTTP, it's hypertext transfer protocol. I wasn't the internet with the TP, the internet transfer protocol. And when the HTTP appeared, I saw like, oh, wow, that's great. We can now have images on top of the text. And then I started saying website at the time.

So I was very involved in the very early multimedia movement in Quebec. And in 98 under Paris, no, under Landry, the Premier, the Quebec government pledged to make of Montreal multimedia capital in the world. And then we have soft image at the time. There were the first 3D animation. Soft image became the first, the first Jurassic Park was made on Soft Image. Well, Soft Image was birthed at Montreal University in 1980.

And the COVID government said, okay, we want to be. And you look like, I look at what I've done as a lobby in their mid-90s. And you look today, Montreal is one of the capital for 3D animation, for AI now, for, I mean, the computer central that we created a monster. We create like about, there was intention and money linked to that. So it's good. Like Alberto said, oh, we want to diversify. Okay, which tool do we have to really accelerate

that there's this effortification? We don't have any. We don't have a SGF. We don't have a slush fund of 10 billion that politically, and nobody knows that it's a political decision. But they need to happen. If you want to shift stuff, they need to happen. It's a lot of power to give politicians.

Well, they have it anyway. But now they do it on there because they have to find a way to, no, no, no, it's clear. That slash fund is for political stuff to help the province. As long as you can justify, I do that for the province, because I want to create that industry here, everybody's good. Yeah, well, you're having the ability, I just, you know, I go back to Chase's story, and I'm like, it's wild to me.

Yeah. Right? Like, to me, he's so close. Yeah. And I've thought, you should be in Alberta since I first met him, and he started to change my mind on that, a whole EV, thought process. This guy, this is interesting, right?

Yeah, yeah. Like we should be bringing those ideas to Alberta. Yeah. But, you know, on a larger thing when you go, you know, do we vote on a referendum question to get us out? You go, your answer would be, well, if you do that, you're into 20 years of litigation where they will find a way to not let you go.

And if not, if you lose, well, then that question won't come back until the next generation it's done. These are the two scenario. So you're stuck in a dead end one way or the other. So let's play with what we have right now. And pull back the pension plan.

Pull back the... Everything we can. And have an attitude like, oh, like right now, last week, I think that Premier Smith did something very courageous. She starts signing MOUs. So MOUs, every province,

have the right to sign MOUs memorandum of understanding with other provinces and territories. What we don't have the right to do is to transform them in treaties with countries. But we have the right to do MOUs. And what Quebec does, Quebec do is MOUs with everybody and then impose these MOUs in Canadian treaties. So what they say to the Canadian government is that we have all these agreements. The day you want to deal something with California, here's what we have already, we're going to sit at the table. That's what Quebec

does. Quebec sits always at a table for any negotiation of any treaties in the country. Because they have all their MOUs that they want to shift in treaties. So Daniel Smith has started doing NAMSmith is doing that. She's starting to do that, but now

on top of that, you need enough courage to stand on it. And when the government will say, oh, no, no, no, no, no, no. Constitutionally speaking, I do have the right to sign the MOU. So F off. That's the attitude we need to have. This memorandum of understanding, can you just elaborate on what she's doing? Okay, so last week she did a deal with a couple of companies, I think, in the States,

for the oil to sell our oil and for a new pipeline to sell them the oil. Well, a province has the right. So a province has control on his culture, has control on his economy, has control and his natural resources and has the right to sign contractual engagement with any companies, states, province, other entities. And this is what Quebec has been doing proficiently. And then the only thing we don't have the right, Daniel Smith don't have the right to go to Donald Trump and sign a treaty with him. It needs to be Mark Carney that does that.

Sure. Okay. But leading to that treaty that they're going to sign together, we have the right to tell the other ones, these are. or MOUs. Here's the pile of contract that we sign. That would be part of your treaty. And that allows you to sit at the bargaining table

when they... Absolutely. And other words, we'll never sit at any bargaining table without Quebec. It's constitutional. They kind of do that. So why wouldn't we...

I don't know if we can do this. Why wouldn't we sign one with Quebec? maybe Quebec doesn't want it in fairness or any other province for that matter the territories saying we will get you oil and gas well she just did it she did it with Doug Ford

and mentored this is what she's doing right now and that I salute her for that but what I'm saying is that on top of doing that now now you need to plant your heels and you need to show your teeth because I don't like that but and again the problem

problem we have is that because we're not controlling or financing, they have leaders they can pull. Yes, you know what? If you keep on doing that, we're going to keep $40 billion for your health care until you do that. But in the game of chess or the game of politics, if I'm Daniel Smith, I would know that. And the only way I'm going to get my population to go to controlling more of what we want is you have to make them a bit uncomfortable. And the only way to do that is to force Ottawa to pull a lever.

So you sign the MOU with Ontario and they don't like it. They go, you do that. We're holding $40 billion. You go, that's fine. Fleak it to the press. Go talk to the press. That's correct. And now the population becomes upset.

Yes. Then you go talk to them and say, well, let's pull it back. And you have to, it's almost sinking like six moves ahead. Yeah. So you go, while you want to get the pension plan back. Yeah. My brain goes, you should just have a campaign on it. It's a no brain or just go do.

it they're going to say and I think the last time I listened to the Premier talk about it is like well we did our analysis of it and we're waiting on Ottawa yeah we're waiting and and you go okay so Ottawa could take 10 years to get back to you because there's no like they have to have it back by this time as far as I understand so the only way to force them to do more moves that are going to upset your population is with like the memorandum of understanding essentially what you're saying is that's going to upset It's going to force them to have to do something.

And when they do that, then it gives you the ability to do the next move. And so slowly we could assume that Daniel Smith and the UCP are going to start pulling back. Yes. The AP Alberta pension plan or create the Alberta pension plan and other things like that. Well, the problem is the timing. Is that right now the problem with the UCP is that it's a good strategy that she's doing. The problem is time. She don't have the time to roll that strategy.

I believe that the real strategy would be to educate people, to start like a tour, provincial tour, talking about that, about what can we do with our constitution. And that's what I'm promoting. That's the strategy that I pray that would be adopted by the province. I would love just to start touring the province and all these committee hall and just presenting, just telling people what we can do.

so that way Premier has the the backup and the comfort to know that she's doing what people that she won't get any backlash that people understand what she's doing exactly people understand what she's doing

and that's the part I think that's missing or missing a connection here between people think that we need to get away to do it where we can do it without getting away and and and and I believe that

that the disconnect, that there's a void there. Possibly. But I also think by having the conversation of getting away, it's forced a lot of people to go, well, what does that actually mean? I mean, it's for, in my humble opinion, it forced some conversations. You wrote that.

Now people have been reading it. I've been getting texts about it. And I was laughing because it was sitting on my desk. And I'm like, yeah, I got to actually sitting right beside me. And I've been meaning to talk to Ben because after the courage to listen, I left like four days later on holidays, maybe even lies. And it's kind of been in the back of my brain that we need to continue to talk about this.

Yeah. Because I agree. I think people need to hear different conversations, start to understand what the options are. You know, like when a referendum was even an idea, there was like four of us in law that were meeting together. And we just started looking at it. Like, how possible is this? Well, it was like it was almost impossible. Yeah.

Right? The number of people you would need to sign to get a referendum through, and I think it was 58 districts had to have a certain percentage, and you start doing that. You're like, man, this is a giant undertaking. Yes. Like, I mean giant. So my hats are off to the APP for pushing forward and going around the province. And then you sit and listen, you go, well, you're starting to understand how bad relationship with the government in Ottawa is. Yeah. And then that spurs on more conversations like this. So I actually think it's naturally happening because people are starting to talk about it. Yeah. And for some, it's just like, let's just get out. Yeah.

But what does that mean? So then more conversations happen. Henceforth, you're sitting across from me. Now people are going to be like, huh, I hadn't thought of that. Or how do we push to get that? And you hope you're opening the doors or the conversation to continue to be where the government will feel more comfortable. and I wish it was just like they'd just go, we're going to put a bunch of money into Alberta first.

And maybe they are. I'm probably going to get some UCP people texting me going, we're already doing half of this. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But, you know, like from where I sit, I'm like, I just want the pace. You know, like the pension plan, we've been talking about it for how long.

Yes, brunch of police. Shane Getson had been on here in 2021 talking about energy corridors. Yeah. And I joke with them all the time now. Like, when is that? happening. You know, like it's a great idea, but we're four years past it now. And I still, like, do I see anything?

And in fairness, there will be political people that go on. You have no idea the conversations that are happening. Yeah. Okay. It's great. So what is needed out of the population to just walk and say, we want this? So, so, so, so there's the PR between that, that missing. And, and, and, and, and that's something, it's funny, since I moved here, I'm all

said 20 years ago. My dad is a PR magician in Quebec. Like he's at the top of his game and has been since the 70s. And my dad always told me, like coming here and looking even, he said, why are the oil companies let themselves trash themselves like that down east? Why don't we, they have the money. Why don't they just start a big PR campaign to shift the perception of dirty oil? because it's not the case.

I think Sincruid, Sincruid restore one of his own mine in a better state than when they start mining it. Like they reintegrate like species in that territory that has disappeared. I mean, it's amazing what they've done. Nobody knows about it. Like, hello.

Well, and, you know, as I've had my eyes open to a whole bunch of different things, you go, it can't be that easy. and then I watched Mark Carney elbows up and we can all laugh about it but I thought him and Mike Myers commercial you can you make fun all you want it was clever and I'm like

you can see what a PR campaign did for him it made him the prime minister of a country that's correct that's correct right like it was a land and I'm like so when you say oil companies should be spending I don't know is it is it 2% of their profits is it 5% I don't know

Not even PR, but not doing it. Yeah. Has demonized them to the point where the world is shutting them down. That's right. To save the planet. Yeah, exactly. And you're like, well, not spending money on it. Look at where it's gone.

Yeah. You know, and I sometimes, you know, on this side, you know, as like a little independent podcaster sitting in this lovely room, I got to tour you the new studio that we're slowly piecing together. Yeah. You know? Amazing. And I'm like.

You know, if people really want change. Yes. They should be like, it's no different than the oil companies. Yeah. It's even myself. I go back to a conversation. I have a quick dick, McDick out of Saskatchewan, right? Yeah.

Yeah. Where he's like, you know, we've got to start buying all Canadian. I'm, I don't know, you know, and I kind of him and hot. And I want to go back and punch Sean in the face because I'm like, he was right. Yeah. Like, we have to, if you want change, you can't expect it to just naturally have. happen. You got to realize that you have to put inertia, your energy towards it, in order to get it to change. Well, you want the narrative to change. We need a whole bunch of people that aren't

CBC, global, CTV that get all these billions of dollars and are pushed to push a narrative. That's right. You need, you know, like it's, it's like a billion dollar industry competing against, I don't know, like what is, what is, I know what I make on this side. Like it's, it's a drop in that bucket. Yeah. You know, all the podcast are in Canada,

I guess the successful one, maybe 50 million altogether. And I don't even know if that's a high, that number seems high to me. Yeah. You know,

like I look at Chase Barber. Here's a brilliant idea. It's absolutely, you know what? He's changed my mind on an EV. I can't believe I've, I've said that lots.

And he is doing crazy stuff to make jump through the hoops. Yeah. And we can't find a way to, like, That's a Canadian company, Canadian built, would actually be net benefit to an economy, to the country.

And he's struggling. I'm like, that doesn't make any sense to me. If we're actually going to take back things. Yeah. And I'm not talking to, well, it's certainly individuals, but like we're talking, there's got to be a shift. And I look at the government because I'm like, maybe it can be a group of 200 companies. I don't know if you go back to the Pierre Elliott Trudeau days, if it was just the 10 families and they were just that freaking rich and off they went.

Yeah. But like how can you compete? It is truly like David and Goliath, isn't it? Yes, but at the same time, and I don't know how that can happen, but there's a mind shift with money that needs to happen as well. Like all these, I'm really, really happy to see APP succeeding the way they do, but they're still struggling financially. I remember my day in Quebec,

late 90s, my brother and I were minority shareholders, but we had the largest event production company in Quebec. 80% of all press conferences in Quebec were organized by us, you know. So I was working with all these PR companies and all that for the top 500 companies in Canada. And I remember some meetings. I told you that I worked for the Catholic Church,

know, or late 90s. And the Cardinal had a program that I proposed to him, and we need $25 million to run that program. It was for the Pope coming in 2001, no, for the World Youth Days, whatever. And the Cardinal said, well, no, what, Ben, said, I'm doing like a fundraising. I want you to come sit at my table,

no, next Thursday. So I could say at this table. And around the table, no, there's Boduin, the owner of Bombardier, Dutton, Rona, owner of Rona. S.NC. Lavalin. They're all there. Like, I hate guys seeing around the table.

And I have a little, like, two-pagers. This is what we want to do. And by the way, on top of that, we need to repair the stairs of the cathedral here. We need another half a million for that. So I pass, I give my little two-beder to everybody. Well, within 10 minutes, I had my 25 million. Yeah.

So, and that's a different, it's a cultural difference. no so Westerners don't don't Westerners have money are not like that because they work hard for their money no they often wear their hands

and they know I've heard a lot of them telling me well the easiest money to spend always the one you didn't earn well yes but at the same time doing PR and doing

campaign all that it's work as well no I understand that when you drill a well you have oil coming out of it you know you can justify how much it's worked. Well, running in a trader

and in the back of a Yukon from one hotel to the other touring the province is also work. You're just at a different level. And both need funding if you want to see soft change. And a lot of these rich guys don't

appreciate the political side of it. Or the salesmanship needs to get better. Yeah. I don't know what. But something needs to happened there because in Quebec when I needed something I would go see these guys and the money was always there never never and ever once question about money doing politics in Quebec it was always there here like man it's tough Ben I appreciate you coming and doing this uh I don't you know be curious what people think I'm sure I'll I'll find out very very quickly but you know like um

I'm all in on Alberta first. I'm born and raised Saskatchewan. I want the best for Saskatchewan. I want the best for everyone, right? I'm saying India, I'm like, I don't even, like, I know, you know, in my brain, it's almost an unreal utopia. But I'm like, well, actually I don't, you know, what do I want? I want government not to interfere.

Interfere. I want a certain set of values that, you know, I was telling you about McKell Thorough. Yeah. And him talking about South America and different things down there. And I'm like, man, all those values sound very fascinating. I think it's what a lot of Westerners believe in. And they just want to see represented here. Yeah.

And so, you know, I think we, today's conversation is just, I'll be very curious to hear what people have to say. Because I know they want Alberta to be better off. I think a ton of us want Alberta to get out of. of a bad relationship. Yes. But I also think we need to discuss that more and more and try and get to what does that actually mean and what does that look like and what's worked and what hasn't. Yes.

And then just go do it what's worked and push that, you know? Yes. And there's a lot of lessons to be learned from Quebec. So I appreciate you coming in and sharing some of that. Well, thank you very much for inviting me and let the people learn about that. And I pray that I will be able to, I don't know, or anybody. I don't wait on the government to do anything. my prayer is to be able to teach more about it and to open the eyes of people about it.

I don't know which format, which formats can be, but I would love just to tour the province and tell that to people. Let's just take what we can within our constitution, and let's use the Westminster system as efficiently for our own sovereignty as Quebec does, without the socialist angle that Clemock has and I believe that we can do it out west. Thanks again. Thanks.