Shaun Newman Podcast - #991 - Doomberg

Episode Date: January 28, 2026

Doomberg is a highly influential, pseudonymous Substack newsletter renowned for its sharp, contrarian, and lateral-thinking analysis of energy markets, finance, geopolitics, and the broader economy, often delivered with a signature green cartoon chicken mascot that adds humor and mystique to its data-driven insights. Launched around 2021 by a small team with deep expertise in heavy industry, commodities, private equity, and hard sciences, it has grown into one of Substack's top finance publications, boasting over 349,000 subscribers.Doomberg Substack https://newsletter.doomberg.comTickets to Cornerstone Forum 26’: https://www.showpass.com/cornerstone26/Tickets to the Mashspiel:https://www.showpass.com/mashspiel/Silver Gold Bull Links:Website: https://silvergoldbull.ca/Email: [e-mail] Grahame: [phone]Bow Valley Credit UnionBitcoin: www.bowvalleycu.com/en/personal/investing-wealth/bitcoin-gatewayEmail: [e-mail] Prophet River Links:Website: store.prophetriver.com/Email: [e-mail] the code “SNP” on all ordersGet your voice heard: Text Shaun 587-217-8500

This is Viva Fry. I'm Dr. Peter McCullough. This is Tom Lomago. This is Chuck Pradnik. This is Alex Krenner. Hey, this is Brad Wall. This is J.P. Sears. Hi, this is Frank Paredi.

This is Tammy Peterson. This is Danielle Smith. This is James Lindsay. Hey, this is Brett Kessel, and you're listening to the Sean Newman podcast. Welcome to the podcast. Folks, happy Wednesday. How's everybody doing today? Shall we check out the old silver gold bowl?

The silver charts before we get started today. We probably should $1.47.99. That's silver today. And, you know, we're keeping a steady eye on the old silver wagon that continues to roll on. How about we get started here as well? Silver Gold Bull. The RSP deadline this year, March 2nd. And if you're looking to unlock the potential of your RRSP, TFS8, RRIF, or Kids, RESP by adding physical gold and silver to your account, of course, Silver Gold Bowl can help you with Alder Inn House. solutions, whether buying selling or storing precious metals, you can text or email

Graham for details or with any other questions you have around investing precious metals or for feature silver deals closely offered for you, the SMP listener. You can hit them up down in the show notes. Once again, everything's down there or you can go to silver gold bull.com. Bow Valley Credit Union, they had big news here in January. On January 19th, they opened up in Red Deer. Yes, a Bow Valley lending, I should say a Bow Valley credit. credit union lending and advice center opened up on January 19th. They're working towards opening

a full service branch. It's all about lending deposits and real financial advice. You can open bank accounts, talk through lending options and get help with all banking, all in a space designed for conversations, not transactions. If you want smarter banking with gold, silver, Bitcoin, sound money and personal freedom, BVCU is opening or has opened in Red Deer. And you can find out more at Bow Valley, CU.com. Diamond 7 meets. Here in Lloyd Minster is a family run business with over 26 years of service, offering more than just retail cuts. They provide livestock processing for farmers and ranchers in Saskatchewan in Alberta,

including custom sauce, just making for both domestic and wild game. If you don't have your own animals, their retail sales connect you with, can connect you, oh boy, can connect you directly with producers offering signs or quarters of beef, pork, and lamb.

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306 825-971-8 Caleb Taves Renegade Acres the community spotlight I tell you what for the kids' sake has some events coming up and they're going to have signers at the event we've all been watching I think the videos of I don't know the latest one has been Calgary

with the thousands upon thousands of people there And if you're in this neck of the woods, you've got some dates coming up. Tomorrow night in Wainwright, yes, Thursday, January 29th, open from 4 to 8 p.m., the Prairie Rose Seniors Activity Center. That's 731 Second Ave, Wainwright, Alberta. And Tanner Nadee and Dustin Newman are going to be on to speak on the topic of Alberta Independence. That's for the kids' sake event. And then, of course, later on into February here in Lloyd Minster,

February 12th, more details to follow, and then a couple weeks later in Vermilion, Tuesday, February 24th. They're going to be having, for the kids' sake, is going to be putting on some events, and they're going to have the ability to sign the Alberta Independence petition. If you're listening,

ooh, I should pause myself. I'm jumping ahead. We got one other thing. The Cornerstone Forum, of course. March 28th. And how about this? Okay? I don't know when this snuck up on me.

It snuck up on me, though. I was like, you know pushing pushing everything's going here and all of a sudden we're on the downward slope you're sitting there and you're yeah i got to check my i got to check my schedule i'll think about it well folks don't wait too long it's under 150 tickets remain now and uh that number just to put that in perspective we sold 150 tickets in one week just before christmas so i was like you know you think oh you got plenty of space plenty of space you know and all of a sudden i'm looking at number and I'm like I want to start checking this daily and keep all you find folks up to date

on how many tickets remain because we are slowly trucking towards a sold out event and of course I want you all there and I don't want you to miss it but now I'm looking at the number and I'm going you know at once start oh oh we've got 50 tickets sold all we got 62 oh it's 78 oh wow we're at 150 now it's the other side we only have 150 tickets under 150 tickets remaining and so I want you to be there. So don't wait. Go grab a ticket before they are sold out. We've got essentially two months. Actually, I think it's January 28th today. So yes, we have two months until this event is underway in Calgary and less than 150 tickets remain. So don't wait. Go grab your ticket today. If you're watching on Spotify, Apple, YouTube, Rumble, X, Facebook, substack, all the things. Make sure to subscribe.

Make sure to leave a review. And if you're enjoying the show, share with a friend. and consider becoming a paid member on Substack. That's how you support the show, folks. All right, let's get on that tale of the tape. Today's guests are popular anonymous Substack newsletter and brand known for its sharp lateral thinking analysis on energy, finance, geopolitics, and the economy. I'm talking about Duneberg.

So buckle up, here we go. Welcome to the Sean Newman podcast today. I'm joined by Duneberg, sir. Thanks for hopping on. Sean, I've been waiting a thousand episodes for this invite. Well, I tell you what, it's funny. I didn't, I don't know who I sent an email to, but I did send an email somewhere and I thought,

I'll never get this. And then, you know, I use chat GPT of all things to try and figure out how to get a hold of you. And it turned out it was a heck of a lot easier than I'd made it out. And, yeah, it happened relatively quick once I just used something a little smarter than me most days. We, you passed our very basic screen for, uh, suitability for our audience. But I know, seriously, it's great to be here. And congrats on a thousand episodes. I mean, that's persistence, if nothing else.

Yeah, showing up every day. Now, before we get going, I was sitting at the breakfast table with my kids this morning. And they were in a grumpy mood. And I thought I'd live in the conversation. I asked them, you know, who do you think I'm interviewing today? And they had a bunch of different guesses. And so I pulled up a recent interview of yours and I showed them. And they were laughing.

And my six-year-old was like, what is that? that? And I'm like, well, why don't I ask? Where did the chicken come from? Yeah, well, that's the embodiment of our brand ambition right there now, isn't it? The chicken, the chicken was born in the early days of Duneberg. We launched Dumberg five years ago, almost, if you can believe that, talk about showing up every day. You know, research, write, edit, published, promote a piece every four days for five consecutive years. You'll, you'll gain some habits. And, you know, we, we thought about how to market it. In the content world, as you know,

if you create great stuff and nobody sees it, then you've not really done anything meaningful. And so marketing is the part of the business that people who are good at everything else hate. And marketing is also the part of the business that those who aren't good at it tend to think less of those who are, that somehow being good at marketing diminishes the underlying quality of your work.

And we decided the best way to market Duneberg in the early days was to gain a following on Twitter. Back then, it was still called Twitter, and you could still build a following on Twitter and port your audience off the platform. And, you know, we had sort of two choices. My pasty white face and a tie. And Lord knows there were plenty of those on Twitter. or before it was sort of popular to do an inanimate object that might stick out. A couple of reasons why we didn't go with my pasty face.

First of all, again, it's not very memorable, but also we're a team and to put one person's face forward as the brand didn't seem right. And we did some digging around, and our ideal client was somebody who had sort of assembled some wealth and love their Bloomberg terminal. And anybody who knows a Bloomberg keyboard knows that color green is quite prominent. And so, you know, a brand is nothing more than the gut-feeling you induce

and your ideal client when they interact with your product. And our ideal client probably had a Bloomberg terminal at work and missed it if they've retired or still have one. And, you know, they're probably doom scrolling around looking for things to worry about because they've assembled some wealth and they're afraid of losing it.

And so the editor-in-chief of Doomberg, and co-founder and the founder of Classics Red Aloud, our fantastic sister publication on Substack, came up with the concept of Doomberg, you know, doom scrolling on your Bloomberg terminal. And, you know, when you're scrolling on Twitter or now YouTube and you see the green chicken, you stop. And that's a very strong impression.

And the customer journey is impression engagement, email paid premium. It's a very old business model. And if you start with very strong impressions, so somebody's scrolling YouTube and they see that Sean Newman has talked, talking to a green chicken and they stop. Then they press click.

That's an engagement. And then if they like what they hear, that's a very strong engagement. And they might come over to Doomburg.com and give us their email. And if they do that and they start reading our previews to the pieces like the ones we published this morning, they might eventually pay us. And that's the sort of the gold mining dirt to pay dirt to sluice box to carpet on Friday to paying your bills on Saturday customer journey. probably a longer answer than your children were expecting, but that's the truth.

And probably not as, um, they're, I'm sure they're hoping for a different story, right? I'm, I'm sure my six year old, all that just went over his head, but someday he'll appreciate that. I know, um, when I showed him this morning, uh, it works, right? Because he's grumpy. He's sitting there and he's just angry at the world. I had to pull him out of bed. And then I show him this. And he's like, yeah, big, smile and he's what, what's that? That's who I'm interviewing today. Let me give you a little inside baseball.

The brand is the eyes. That stunned, quizzical look of disbelief, captures a smirk in people. You know, a brand is a gut feeling. As I said earlier, it's not a logo,

it's not a chicken, it's not a set of colors. It's a gut feeling. And the gut feeling we wish to induce in our ideal clients is the following. When an email hits their inbox, us they say to themselves, oh, I get to read that.

And everything else is just oriented around earning that gut feeling, inducing that gut feeling, repeating that gut feeling, piece after piece after piece. And that's what we do. And I think that's why we've been successful. You know, we just crossed 350,000 total subscribers, if you can believe that. It's just truly remarkable. This was a throw it at the wall and see what happens project when we first started. And it's just blown up. And so it's great. We're grateful. Of course, not all of them pay us. I wish more of them did.

If you're listening and you subscribe and you've not yet upgraded, please do. We sing for our supper. We don't accept brands. We don't accept, you know, advertising. Not that there's anything wrong with those business models. It's just not what we do. And so anyway, that's a little inside baseball for you. So we know it's the eyes because we sold some mugs early in the day. And three pretty good mugs, great copy. And the one that's sold by far the most was the one with the biggest version of the chicken's eyes. Thank you for answering that. I know my kids are going to be absolutely, well, I don't know. I have too.

I think it's awesome. I can't stop. I'm like, this is the strangest, coolest thing. And then to know what you guys talk about, I'm like, you know, it kind of hits all the right thing. So I marketing advice from a chicken, but what you're doing is fantastic. And I thoroughly enjoy this. So, okay, let's get to the meat and potatoes.

Okay. There is a lot of things going on in Canada. Anytime you write about Canada, I find it very, very interesting. So here in Alberta, you've got lineups going everywhere for the independence petition, right? We're not to a referendum yet. That's, you know, further out. But right now, the next, it's not, I think it's just under 100 days now, folks. It goes till May 2nd, albeit that's a Saturday.

So they've talked about, you know, the end of April essentially. So you've got less than 100 days until the petition has to reach 177,000 signatures. And in that time, you're seeing town halls all across Alberta from, you know, Calgary last night to the smallest little hamlets and people just lined up out the door. And if anybody checked the weather in Alberta, Saskatchewan, I sit right on the border, Duneberg, you would see that like it was like minus 36 a couple days ago. And right now, you know, it's a nice balmy minus. 14 and that's Celsius and you know and and people are lined up in their parkas they're ready

to sign this thing there's thousands of people all over the place your thoughts yeah um so the duper team has a fair bit of Canadian expertise um and it's rare that an American base newsletter would have such expertise and we occasionally write about Canada as an energy-focused newsletter, the hook for us, of course, is Alberta, and to a lesser extent, British Columbia and Saskatchewan, although growing.

And we have a fair number of Canadian subscribers, which we're super happy about. And Canadians have a, this love-hate relationship with the U.S., of course, and cultural overburiance is a key aspect of Canadian culture, but they just love it when American content creators create content about Canada in a way that is fair and interesting and unbiased, and we try to do that. So, to your question, we have a slightly different view of what's going on in Alberta. It could

be wrong. So we operate in what we call mental models, which is nothing more than a series of axioms that you don't know whether they're true, but they work for predicting the news flow, and they don't even have to be true. They just have to be right. And one of our operating mental models is that the leaders that be in Canada and the U.S. are conspiring to unstick Alberta's energy, and we rolled this out all the way back in December of 2024 in a piece that we called Alberta Clipper, which foreshadowed Carney's selection to replace Trudeau before the election and warned our many conservative Canadian subscribers that Carney would be a far more formidable candidate to defeat the conservatives in the election that was coming.

Then they were currently modeling at the time. Polymarket had the conservatives at 93%, and you couldn't bet on Carney as a contract when we made that call. Now, it happens to be one of the better calls we've ever made, and it played out largely as we predicted. Why did we come to that prediction?

First of all, Carney and Trump have a very long history together. And when Trump says American energy dominance, we hear North American energy dominance. And the only way to unstick Alberta was to stare down the climate nonsense in Canada, which the Liberal Party had allowed to grow beyond their control. And the only way to do that would not be to allow the conservatives to win,

but to have a dyed-in-the-wall climate radical, really, like party, to win and then pivot in the same way that only Nixon could open China. If a Democrat had tried to open China in the 1970s, who was soft on communism, you know, it would not have flown. But because Nixon, this arch anti-communist, was the one who flew to China and opened it, it was palatable to the anti-communist wing

of the American political scene. And we counterintuitively think that only Carney could stare down the Ontario climate change crowd in a way that you could sign this MOU with Alberta without causing riots in the street. And that's what's happened. And so as part of Alberta Clipper, and in a subsequent piece we wrote in April of 25 called The Fixes In, we thought that a fake constitutional crisis would ultimately be necessary because what you need to implement societal change on the order of

going from climate change is catastrophic and existential to climate change can be set aside because Orange Man Bad and the country's borders depend on it. And so the big question now in our operative, mental model is, is the ongoing constitutional crisis just the next evolution of that prediction set that we made? Or is there a real chance that Alberta will separate? Our current view is still that you need this worse outcome to convince the left part of Canada that unsticking Alberta's energy is a necessary compromise to make. We could be wrong. We've been right enough for long enough that even if we are wrong now, it's been a very good mental model. But that's still our view.

You know, one of the big things about our American readers is they're genuinely interested in Canada. Nobody ever writes about it. And so to learn about the history, the Quebec referendums and, you know, the ever-changing borders of Canada and just how new and relatively unstable Canada is as a country, just how American Alberta is, actually. It's far more like Montana and Idaho than it is like. Ontario and Quebec, let alone New Brunswick or Newfoundland. And so, yeah, that's a bit of a long answer, but that's our holistic view.

We think about Canada a lot. We're fascinated by it, especially sort of Canada being a derivative of Britain and the whole British propaganda being the worst of the propaganda in the world. So there's all kinds of ways we can go, but that's our view. And so our current ponder is how real is what we're seeing and might this fake crisis that has been initiated by the powers that be evolved into something that reaches escape velocity beyond their control and a real threat to Canada's sovereignty. I will see. When you say how real is what we're seeing, what do you mean by that?

Well, if you go all the way back, again, to the original piece, you need to generate a crisis in order to affect major change. And look, there will be people listening to this who think we're pretty conspiratorial and all that jazz. But it works. Again, the hallmark of a good mental model is the axioms that underpin it need not be true. They just need to be useful for explaining the past

and predicting the future. It's been a very useful mental model for us. So now the question is, is this sovereignty push cooked up by the powers that be and they wanted to go so far but not too far? they wanted to go far enough to justify the climb down on climate change, but not so far as to risk actually changing borders and Canada breaking up. That assumes that there is the hidden hand behind the scenes,

and in Canada there almost certainly is. And so that's why we're comfortable saying it in public and not sounding like we're wearing tinfoil on our otherwise handsome red-feathered head here. Well, anyone certainly listening to this show, I don't think he's, you know, like we watched the polls flip when Trump elbows up everything in the middle of our federal election. It was it was just like night and day over the course of 24 hours. And I might be shortchanging that. It might be a week.

And you go, you know, I don't mean to sound conspiratorial. I'm like, you don't sound like we're all witnessing it. We're all watching this play out in front of us. I don't care what they talk about with conspiracies anymore. It's like we're talking about what's actually happening in front of us. The one thing I just find interesting is how real is what we're seeing. And to me, living here, it's pretty real. Sure.

But I understand exactly what you're saying. Is it to unlock Alberta's oil? That's an interesting way to kind of position it because, you know, what is gridlocked Canada over the last 10 years, albeit incompetent leadership? but certainly the bureaucracy and the rules at play to get anything done is evident for anyone who looks at it for even a short period of time. It's like the MOU. It's like, that's great. What is it actually doing?

And where are we going? Yeah, all great questions. So one of the things we like to say around here is the best way to prove that something was predictable is to have predicted it. And so, you know, conspiratorial or not, again, And if a highly functional mental model seems conspiratorial to those who aren't familiar with lateral thinking, there's not much we can do about that. So to your question about how real it is, it is a real reflection of decades of local frustration at the exploitative nature of the leaders in Eastern Canada and how they perceive the residents of Western Canada, it is a, it is an authentic expression of frustration of political minimization of the rights of the people who live in Western Canada.

The leaders of Eastern Canada that dominate Canadian politics aren't unaware of this grievance and have allowed it, if our mental model is correct, to be expressed in ways that are familiar to history, but to a much greater extent. And so you have to ask yourself why. And under the grand incompetence hypothesis, you would just say they don't know what they're doing, and this is just the natural outcome. But this possibility has been there since, you know, the first Trudeau was in office. And so why now?

And it just happens to coincide with our ability to see it coming. So I think for you, for Sean, and for your listeners, it is viscerally real. And the question is whether there's a puppet master pulling the string on your emotions is the one we're discussing. And I think history teaches us that there's always such people. Canada is, as we joked in, the fix is in. And if you think that you live in a representative democracy in Canada, well, I mean, I'm sorry. But, you know, anyway, I digress. Well, then I'm kind of curious in your mental models, right?

You're looking at the future. If you predict it, you know, you're basically explaining like, well, then, you know, it's like, it's kind of confidence to kind of look at where we're going. And you can call it conspiracy. But when we start predicting things, you know, it's a proven track record. What are you predicting in the future then? Like what are your mental models when you look at Canada, specifically the West? What do you see, Duneberg?

Yeah, so if our current operating mental model is still valid, and by the way, we will quickly discard one that stops working. We have no emotional attachment to it. Our objective is to explain and predict. Then the closer this gets to the end, the quicker the MOU gets translated into real durable approvals that are impervious to legal and political interference of the major projects, pipelines, LG export terminals, etc. And so if we don't see the rapid conversion of the MOU into shovels in the ground,

then our model is probably broken and separatism is real and the Americans will swoop in I don't think that Trump is actually interested in annexing Canadian territory. And I don't think Albertans are actually interested in joining the U.S. I think Albertans are playing with the concept of becoming an independent country and renegotiating the deal with Ontario and renegotiating the deal with the U.S. And perhaps even welcoming Saskatchewan on board. but I don't think it's going to get to that. I think what we're going to see is Danielle Smith,

who I know you've had on your show, playing her, you know, as we said in the piece The Fixes In, Best Actress in a Drama. This separatist event will be released just long enough to get the big projects approved. The environmental progressive wing of Eastern Canadian politics will be suppressed and the projects will get built.

Donald Trump will come and go, and Alberta's energy will be unstuck. We wrote a piece about British Columbia and the need to fix the NDP there. There's also the big question of Chinese influence in all of this, which I'm sure we could get into. But I digress. We still believe that the emotions you're feeling are being used as evidence to convince the equally emotional climate alarmists that they need to pause on their concerns to placate Sean and his listeners, to unstick Alberta energy, to maybe renegotiate the transfer payment situation,

and to treat Alberta more as a peer to Ontario than a colony to be exploited. It's interesting. I find the way you're looking at it and breaking it down, find it very interesting, right? It's easier to do when you're not right in the middle of it. If that makes sense, it probably does. We do this all the time on the show with different parts of the world, right? When you're not there, it's like you can easily remove some of the emotion from it because you can just stare at it and go, oh, what's actually happening here? In Canada, I find it, there's a growing frustration for a lot of different reasons, not just energy. I mean,

you look to BC and see what's happening with Fee Simple Title. Now, in a, in, in, in, in, in, in five years, can they come down and just swat that down and move on with life? Maybe, but people's property being in question, that's beyond concerning, I would say. The fact that, you know, you have all these different things starting to happen in Canada, do you guys just add that all into the same boat as we need to get people's emotions riled up so that we can change things and move things along and it comes back to energy and and unlocking the potential of, you know, honestly, the West, but there's a lot of different spots across Canada

that have deep holes of untapped resources. Yeah, so let's pull on that threat. Again, when you play such games like this, you can go a little too far, especially if a model's working. So one of the big risks is working, you can overplay it. But we wrote about British Columbia. So the big barrier to unsticking Alberta,

I mean, there's no challenge with building more pipelines to the south. I mean, there are, of course, but you don't say. There's no geological challenge just like the mountains. And so you've got to get BC on board. And BC is a NDP stronghold. And ask yourself a question. Does the whole title issue cause British Columbian voters to skew more conservative or more liberal? Definitely more conservative.

Okay. And so now we on stick the last barrier to the Pacific Ocean. By the way, look, this relationship between what amounts to British and American settlers and the First Peoples of Canada is a long and sordid one and we're in no way diminishing anything about that. But that situation in British Columbia, we would characterize that as nothing a fine can't cure. right i mean you solve that with money and they had not yet solved it with money why there's no shortage of money to print um and it's a relatively small number of people um that you could buy off

to solve this problem and so that it's allowed to fester is another clue you got to get bc a little more conservative so that China could buy your oil. And so viewed through that lens, I mean, it's, again, like, I see how the British Columbia title story is played in the U.S. It's fed to the mega movement like red meat on a bone. My God, you know, it is incredibly effective at galvanizing conservative thinking in British Columbia. And so when you have an obvious solution that has not yet been triggered, write a big check, make the problem go away, then there's probably another explanation. And so it's at least consistent with our operating mental model. And so that's how we view the current situation in British Columbia. I see I'm making

you laugh. I'm sorry. Well, no, it's just funny to me. There's no shortage of money to print. That just made me chuckle. I'm like, no, you're not wrong there. You're not wrong at all there, right? That just made me chuckle. You know, if I had on my bingo card for 2026, having a chicken tell me, there's no shortage of money to print yet. What's the percentage of Dumeberg in society that haven't figured that out yet? Well, look, Sean, there's no shortage of money to print, especially when you have the backing of the world's second largest hydrocarbon accumulation behind it.

I mean, Canada's dollar is money good because it's got the BTOs to back it up. So yeah, there's no shortage of money to print. There's an obvious solution to the problem in British Columbia. Whenever obvious solutions aren't being implemented, you have to ask, what's the non-obvious thing that's actually going on? So again, it's all consistent with bringing those BTUs from market. By the way, we could expand this. We've been writing about the Western Hemisphere for a couple of years.

I mean, the whole Venezuela situation fits with this. We wrote a piece all the way back in December of 2023 called the New World's Oil. And I believe the social preview for that was something along the lines of, you know, if the Western Hemisphere can give us act together, it could wildly outproduce the Middle East in oil. And we had that on our radar all the way back then. And so unsticking Alberta, fixing Venezuela, developing Vacamerta in Argentina, all of this is part of a grand geopolitical chess game that the U.S. has decided to revive the Monroe Doctrine. And look, there's 10 million extra barrels a day of oil

in the Western Hemisphere that can be readily developed. That's a big prize. And so Alberta's part of that mix. It's a bit elaborate. But look, I mean, the Canadian political establishment had conditioned so much of Canada to fear climate change for so long that undoing that. By the way, all of this is driven by NATO's defeat in Ukraine,

which people don't like to hear, but that's what's driving all of this. the, oh, you know, what moment of, while we need to have a plan B, and plan B is to regroup in the Western Hemisphere, so suddenly we have to unstick Alberta's energy. So not to, like, open up too many balls of wax for you, but that's sort of our view. And so, you know, that's what we think is going on. So all the way back to, is this real? It feels very real when you're in it, as you correctly said.

This unstick voters, I've heard it different ways, but for some reason that I've circled that because to me, I think that's something to watch. Where else currently are you watching them try and unstick voters? In Canada? No, it can be the U.S. or Canada. You know, one of the things we talk a lot about American politics, lots of the things happening with Trump, NATO. I guess I'm just curious what Duneberg is circled on the old like, oh, here's one

that they're trying to unstick something that has been, you know, built up. You bring up climate change in Canada and how long they've been positioning that to the Canadian voter. And then to try and change their mind on it, they have to go to some extreme lengths to try and shock them out of, you know, that way of thinking, I guess. Yeah, so here's where we can veer into stuff that we've not yet written about, at least not directly, but we're thinking about. And that's the fact that the U.S. is actually in the middle of a pretty significant civil war. And there are lots of ways to model that civil war. The current situation in Minnesota is about one of them. And Trump has far less domestic political flexibility than I think those in the mega movement believe, just perusing Twitter.

We have a current mental model which we've referenced on podcast appearances, but we've not yet written in our masthead. And those are two different bars, by the way, like to be very clear. Like, for us to put something through the newsletter, we have to be extremely sure. And for us to, you know, shoot the breeze about it on a podcast is just a lower bar. Our current mental model on Washington is that there is no such thing as the Republican Party

at the federal level. And that if you had a secret ballot, 80% of Congress, House and Senate would vote to first impeach and then remove Trump. The Senate won't nuke the filibuster because they don't want to see Trump's policies get enacted. He is far weaker politically than his bluster projects. He is an extraordinarily talented retail politician. Nobody can deny that. His largest critics can't deny that.

They could bemoan the means by which he has achieved this effectiveness. He's a liar, he's a fraud, he's uncouth. But I could tell you, having driven around areas where he's having a rally during campaign season, he resonates with blue-collar workers in a way that no politician has in my lifetime. So, but he didn't really bring, he didn't like organize a proper political movement

in the sense that he didn't bring with him an army of like-minded politicians in the House, in the Senate, in the governor's chairs, to effectively convert the energy that he is able to stir up amongst his base into an effective political agenda outside of executive orders, which he's been extraordinarily effective at implementing during his second term, but all of those can be undone when Gavin Newsom wins in 28. And so there's beginning to be significant frustration amongst Trump's hardest supporters in the U.S. at his inability to implement the things that he campaigned on,

he is also paying far more attention to foreign policy than I think his base would like. And so the U.S. is an entirely different situation for us, which is in a civil war. We are seeing in Minnesota, if we just wrote down what has happened in the past month, when you wrote it down before it all happened, you'd say, wow, like the U.S. is in a civil war.

And so whether that, you know, how all that ends remains to be seen. But that's an embodiment of significant resistance that makes, I think, you know, January 6th pale in comparison, just as one example. And so we'll see, but the Trump phenomenon, as we wrote a piece this morning about, you know, Exxon and Darren Woods and that famous confrontation in the East Room of the White House, you know, people. are planning well beyond Trump and I try to tell this to those that get emotional about these things on either side like you have to have to think in in at least five 10 year timeframe like are you going to behave or do or say things today that you will regret in the future just because you know Instagram told you to be mad about something so you know it's a very complex and fluid situation in the US and Trump is is hamstrung

more than perhaps people on both sides of the aisle, I'll imagine him to be. Well, it's one of the realizations I had somewhere along, you know, the first thousand of, when you look at leaders elsewhere in the world, they must stare at the UN, well, obviously, you know, the amount of power or influence that the U.S. exerts on the world. But then to know, you know, Trump, he's around for, you know, eight years in total. But, you know, in the middle, you had Biden. And you go, regardless of what he does and says right now, he's gone soon enough. And then it'll be another person and a different leader.

And to some of the leaders that have power or leadership roles for a lot longer than that, when you talk about you have to look past Trump and what is going to go on. I think here in the West, at least, we're naive on not thinking that far out, but you have tons of countries, lots of the big powers. Sure. That think a lot longer than a couple of years. They're looking further out than that. Yeah. And as we said in the piece this morning, you know, both the amplitude and the frequency of the political cycle are increasing.

So the swing from Joe Cadaver to the Orange Man Bad was quite the about face. So just imagine if you're India. Let's just take one example. Modi. War breaks out in Ukraine. You know, they try to economically destroy Russia with sanctions. Failed. And they realize that, you know, Europe is a flaccid energy vassal.

I mean, Europe consumes 38 exeged. of hydrocarbons and only produces five. And so they need Russian energy, and they don't want to be seen as taking it directly. So quietly behind the scenes, the Biden administration leans on India to buy Russian oil so that Europe can buy diesel from India, sort of molecular laundering.

And India's happy to do that. It's catching a vig, discounted Russian crude. Bit as spread to Europe is a little wider than it used to be. Refiners are running at first. speed. Oh, by the way, the U.S. Northeast runs out of diesel. Guess who supplements it? India, Russian crude. All dirty little secrets that those in the energy industry would know during the Biden administration was actually happening. And then Trump comes around a dozen

180 and demands India, you know, stop buying Russian crude altogether when it has now sort of weaned itself off as previous suppliers, which is largely the Middle East. And India's like WTF. Like, you guys told us to do this. So if you're planning cycle, is two years, you know, it's quite challenging. And so, you know, what do you do if you're Modi? And by the way, is Trump really in charge? Who controls the CIA? But this is the question everyone's asked since JFK.

Talk about conspiracies. You know, how much freedom does he have in foreign policy? So if you're India, who's more stable to you? Putin and Xi, or whoever's in charge of the US? It's a good question. It's a good question. You mentioned, just briefly, Gavin Newsom in 2028. That's what you see as the next leader of the United States?

Let me ask you a question, Sean. So the last election, which Trump loves to characterize as a landslide, and put all the vote counting questions aside. And who's allowed to vote? Paper ballots. Dominion machines. Look, I'm on Twitter. I see all of it.

Trump beat Harris by 1.3% in the popular vote. Do you think Gavin Newsom is 1.3% better than Kamala Harris? As a politician, not from a policy perspective, but as a... As he looks the part, he speaks the part. Great debater. Great debater. 1.3, yes. I'd also say, though, that I think a lot of conservative-minded folk watched way too much

X on Harris and didn't realize she don't get me wrong she wasn't Daniel Smith here in Alberta by any stretch but she also wasn't Joe Biden and they wrote her off as Joe Biden and actually X the videos I saw framed her as Joe Biden or worse and that just wasn't the case when you saw her in debates and everything else now

when you put her up against Gavin News Is she 1.3% better? Or is he, sorry? Yeah, I can see your train of thinking. Yeah, so let me add to it then. So Gavin Newsom is 1.3 points better than Harris as a retail politician. I'm not, you know, forget about how Harris was portrayed. Is whoever runs in Trump's place going to be as good as Trump?

Or perhaps 1.3% less as good as Trump at rallying the blue-collar worker? J.D. Vance is an effective politician, I get it. But is he as good as Trump to 1.3%? So when you improve on Harris and step down from Trump in a wildly divided population where swings of those middle 5% dictate enormous chasms between political outcomes.

Our view is similar to our view that Carney would be far more formidable. Newsom is really effective on TV, man. I think he's a disaster, utter disaster, policy-wise. Don't get me wrong, but he's really effective on TV. So let me ask you a question then. Let's fast forward to 2028.

Gavin Newsom is elected president. Then let's fast forward roughly another year into his term. what does domburg see and I know I'm stretching the limits of probably mental models

and trying to predict what will come in that term but if you're sitting there in Russia, China, India, all these different places staring at that and you've come to the same conclusion.

It's looking like if we do, you know, we're looking at where it's going to go this is what's going to happen. What is this going to do to the world stage? In many ways,

Gavin Newsom is more predictable and manageable than Trump because he's the embodiment of the big democratic machine and the big democratic machine has been an office you know depends if you count George W. Bush is part of that machine for most of the past quarter century and the world understands it. They might not like it but they understand it.

is unpredictable. And so, you know, what it means domestically is a whole different question, but I don't think the Chinese are all that uncomfortable with Gavin Newsom. And I think the Russians understand the big blue machine of the American cities quite well. And so Newsom is, in many ways, relative to Trump's chaotic style, a stabilization. And I know that's like probably blasphemy for some of your audience to hear, but I'm just giving you their perspective. Like we we jokingly refer to Biden as Joe Cadaver.

Joe Biden wasn't president. The big blue machine was president. And the world is familiar with how to do business with the big blue machine. By the way, in the U.S. for your Canadian listeners, blue is the liberal side. Yeah, you know, it's funny. I don't know if you need to explain that to a Canadian at all. I think Canadians know more about American politics than we do about Canadian politics, if I was to be honest.

Yeah, no doubt about it. It's funny. Curious, you know, like on the blue is more predictable. In my short time, now, Duneberg, we don't know each other. You know, like I've read a bunch of your articles. I don't know how much at all. you know about anything on my side. So I'll just briefly explain. You know, I, I, I didn't stare at politics or, you know, I grew up on a farm in the middle of the energy sector. So, you know,

around me all the time. But as far as a podcast goes, you know, I didn't start looking, I don't know, focusing on some of these topics until maybe, is it four years ago now, folks? It, you know, like there was a time where, where I wasn't even paying attention to, you know, the most mundane of things in politics. But when I started watching the Democratic Party of the United States when Joe Biden was in lead, and as you so eloquently pointed out, he wasn't the leader, to me, everything that was going on through them was steering us closer and closer and closer and closer to World War 3.

Like, full on, we're going to antagonize Russia and others, and we're going to have it out. And my hope, at least as Trump had tried to signal, he's going to end more than one day. And I think any rational person thought, well, that isn't going to happen. But at least he's going to lead us closer to peace than not. Now, here we sit how many months and days into his second term. apologies. When you say they understand Team Blue, that would mean they understand that war is coming, because that's what the Democrats and a whole group of countries have all signaled that they're gearing up for. Am I wrong in that train of thinking? Remember, there's no such thing as Democrat

and Republican. Our mental model in D.C. is that there's the sort of the mega group, the far left group and then the uniparty in between, the pro-war unit party in between. And you were correct in that that they were hurtling towards World War III. We have a pro-tier at Duneberg, not just our articles. We do a monthly webinar for people who can afford to buy a bit more of Duneberg. And we did one, I believe in March of 2025, called Sleepwalking into the Abyss, where we pointed out that structurally the war in Ukraine was lost. and that as we continue to sort of escalate,

as the West continues to escalate, my editor always reminds me that we is me, as the West continue to escalate with Russia at risk nuclear war in a way that few in the West were articulating, and we actually agree with that, and we did a whole 50-minute presentation on it. And so to your question then, if Trump does falter, Look, Trump, again, because of his limited political maneuverability, has tried to end the war in Ukraine,

but the neocon wing holds significant power, that's the best interpretation of Trump. There's the worst interpretation, which is a neocon in sheep's clothing. But the thing that I keep coming back to that tells me that he probably isn't is that he cut off funding for Ukraine. And we wrote a piece a couple of months ago called Forcing Function. And the money drying up will end the war in Ukraine. And that will happen in a way that Trump doesn't have to do anything proactive for it to happen. And we're seeing that happen now with the blatant war crimes that Russia is committing by knocking out the electricity and thermal water grids of the large Ukrainian cities,

which are attacks on citizens and prohibited under international law. I'd like to point that out before people accuses of being pro-Russian puppets. And so the lack of funding is driving everything. That's driving the attempted seizure of the Russian foreign assets. It's driving the fanatical demands of a ceasefire on the current lines, which the Russians are never going to agree to you. It's driving political unrest in Europe. It's cracking the European Union because they just don't have the money to keep the war going.

And they don't have the weapons to keep the war going. And so that war will end. But, you know, if the big blue machine comes back into power, all bets are off, I suppose. Yes, all bets are off. That's... It's scary. Look, I mean, I think we titled that sleepwalk into the abyss for a reason. Like, we read everybody's propaganda, right?

And so if your objective is to understand the truth to the best of your ability, it's becoming very, very hard to do in the AI. infiltrated world of content. One of the things we do is we read everybody's propaganda. So if a big news event happens, as an experiment, your listeners can do this. So Maduro gets snatched. That is what we call a world beating event. Every headline in the world is going to lead with that, right?

So pick eight different countries and read how they describe that one event, and your mind will be blown. Because this is like two different, like different universes. So read how the Chinese are describing that event and the Russians are describing that event and how the Ukrainians are describing that event and how Brussels is describing that event and how London is describing that event

and how the Globe and Mail and the CBC and the New York Times and the Washington Post are describing that event. And you will get incredibly different viewpoints and you will become closer to the truth by doing so. If you just read the Globe and Mail and watch the national, you're not getting what the Chinese are telling themselves

what the Russians are telling themselves, what the Iranians are telling themselves, and what the Israelis are telling themselves. And so, you know, the rest of the world is telling their citizens that they've been in World War III for many years. And we say sleepwalking into the US, because the Western media has portrayed this

as something that's going on over there. Don't worry about it. I can tell you, with certainty, the war in Ukraine is viewed as the next escalation World War III in an existential threat within Russia. And the mental model of most Western observers is that Putin is a dictator or has iron control over Russia, yada, yada, yada.

Boy, for a dictator with iron control over Russia, there's an awful lot of negative things written about him in the Russian propaganda from the right where they claim that he is far too cautious is going way too slow in Ukraine, cares too much about the West, lots of calls for nuking European capitals. awful weird for a dictator with an iron grip on his society to allow such things into the zeitgeist,

but they're there. You can go read them. I've read them. And so, you know, how things are portrayed over here versus how they're portrayed over there is very, very interesting. And by the way, Russia has the largest and most technologically sophisticated nuclear weapons arsenal in the world. The Chinese are climbing that ladder awfully quickly. The Chinese are telling them, during World War III. And they're happy to help Russia keep the front over there for as long as possible and to tire out NATO and learn everything they can about NATO advanced weapons systems

that they have learned and shared on the battlefield in exchange for drone technology and all the other ways that China is helping Russia and vice versa. And so once you see the world through the lens of how other people are seeing it, it opens your eyes to the puff propaganda that's being fed to Western observers,

average citizens going to work every day and not spending as much time on these things as you and I do, I'll just give you one small example. Whenever we say the war is lost in Ukraine, I mean, it's an objective statement. There's a difference between the war being lost and defeat having been exerted. That's coming, but we define a lost war

as one that can't be wanted for which the outcome is no longer in doubt to the losing side. We get some angry, angry hate now. Almost all of it comes from Britain. Why? British propaganda is the worst. I mean, absolute, abject nonsense, total BS, made up out of whole cloth,

day after day after day, fed to this population of people that only read the British tabloids. We have many happy subscribers from Britain who probably enjoy seeing how the rest of the world views things. man, we get some angry letters from people from Britain. And we usually try to respond by saying, thank you for occasionally reading things that you, for occasionally reading things that you disagree with.

You know, we come out of our views authentically. Sorry that you're a victim of propaganda. Look, we're victims of propaganda. We all are. It's all a matter of how self-aware you are about it. Go back to your mental models. How often, I assume this is a daily occurrence where you're constantly revising

or I don't know the full spectrum of how you, change and develop and shift and everything else. I was just curious. You know, when you talk about these mental models and looking at the events that are shaping our world, how often are you guys interacting and constant, or I guess I'm just trying to frame the question,

Duneberg, is how often are you changing your inputs to the mental model of like, well, something's changed here? You know, like I think of, you know, if I go back to 20, whatever it is, 2019, 2020, somewhere in that time frame, although there were shows like this, the rise and popularity of podcasts was just starting.

It was just in its infancy. And then it has gone to a different realm these days. And if you were trying to predict that, you probably could have saw it coming, But I mean, as a government trying to control its population and what they hear and see, it was relatively, I think, easy at the time. Maybe I'm oversimplifying that. But now these days to gain access to information, although it takes a little bit of effort to go read eight different editorials or views on, let's say, Maduro. I mean, not only can you do that, but you can go listen to 10 different podcasts and have 10 different views shaped.

And, you know, if you go back, go back further, 10 years, 20 years, sure. That wasn't there. And so for a government to adjust, I don't know how, I highly doubt they saw that coming, but maybe they did. With Doomburg, how often are you changing the mental model or adding inputs into it to be like, ooh, something's changed here? Yeah, so like two different questions there. As for mental models go, we keep them until they stop working.

And when a mental model spits out a prediction that doesn't materialize, you begin to question, you know, how valid it is on a go-forward basis. It's just that simple. One of the, so we pride ourselves on lateral thinking, and people might not know what lateral thinking is. We have a very simple definition of lateral thinking, which is you have zero emotional attachment to the correctness of an axi. whether or not the underlying axioms of Alberta Clipper, which have worked so well, are actually true, are all that relevant. I mean, I'd be interested to see what the actual truth is. But as long as the model is working, I'm going to keep iterating. And so that's a very easy question-and-answer, which is when predictions fail, the model has failed, and it either needs to be discarded or revised.

and one of the things we try to guard against is revising things that should be discarded because you can sort of slip into a form of bias, an anchor bias to having been correct before and this is just a slightly different way that you're still correct. So that, you know, we have a pretty disciplined approach.

But as long as the mental model is still working, we keep at it. Now, to your question about the pursuit of truth for the average citizen, you are correct in your sense, assessment that A, the legacy media has utterly failed because they are basically propaganda outlets for the powers that be. And the pace of technological innovation is outpacing the government's ability to keep up with it. So, Substack, for example, were full disclosure,

reasonably large investors in Substack when they did that offer-led ground, given their critical role as our channel partner, we felt it important to support the company when they needed it. Substack is a revolution. Because it is a subscriber-driven model, you don't have that advertising vector to attack. You know, we own our audience. There's a few other vectors they could attack,

which they haven't done yet, and I won't name them because why make it easy for people. But, you know, when we have thousands and thousands of subscribers who pay us, and when we get things right, more pay us, and when we get things wrong, less pay us. So we are incentivized by the crowd to get things correct. And so we pride, as I said earlier, there's a difference between putting it through the masthead and talking about it on the podcast. Our audience, one of our brand ambitions is they know that we believe what we said when we press send.

And let me contrast that with the legacy media. More and more of the legacy media is sources said. The story is the source said something, not whether the thing the source said is actually true. even though it used to be that you had to believe it internally, and I see far less discipline in that regard now in the legacy media outlets. The source said that the crew of Gilgans Island blew up North Stream. I mean, it's just nonsense. But I saw that article in the Wall Street Journal.

According to sources, familiar with the matter, I mean, nobody believes that. But the story is the source has said it. We would never publish something a source told us if we didn't believe the underlying thing wasn't true. And I think once you cross that Rubicon, there's no going back. And for many, many, many people,

that Rubicon has been crossed with respect to the legacy media. Now, I do see the rise of AI on Substack, on YouTube, on other platforms. It's getting harder to distinguish what's AI and what's real. And that's where pre-existing long-term brand relationships, like hopefully the one we've built, will be super valuable in the post-human world, where that which is authentically improbably human is skyrocketing value, but not too far down another philosophical rabbit

hole. But, yeah. I have two things before I let you out. I wrote them down and I'm like, if I don't ask, then I'm going to sit and stew on it. One of them is you mentioned Carney and Trump's relationship. I'd be very curious for you to expand on that. Sure. In one of Kearney's many roles, he is, as we described in Alberta Clipper, a globalist delight, after all, Harvard, Goldman Sachs, Bank of England, Bank of Canada. He was chair of the

board of Brookfield Asset Management, which has to the nearest trillion, one trillion under management, and does an awful lot of real estate. Who do you know, based in New York, that does an awful lot of real estate. How is it that Mark Carney, chair of the board of Brookfield asset management, doesn't know and hasn't done business with the Trump Empire. They'd be foolish not to. And so, yeah, they know each other. And there's all kinds of, you know, stories and this deal, and Brookfield helped Trump here or Trump helped them there. But it's just impossible that Trump and Carney didn't overlap in social circles of billionaire New York, pretty small crowd. And then silver.

Yeah. I'd circle this right at the start. I always pull it up the charts. Forgive me, I'm going to do it in Canadian dollars, obviously a Canadian on this side. As I sit here talking to you, 147 and 32 cents, Canadian for an ounce of silver. The chart is straight up, and it has been a wild ride. I call Silver a wagon. I showed out to Nick for Silver Gold Bull.

He said it and I'm like, I like that. Silver is a wagon. And to me, just, you know, watching this play out, I mean, it has been interesting to just see it climbing almost on the hour. But certainly week after week, it's going up and up and up. Duneberg's thoughts on silver. So my first thought is that Duneberg is the wrong person to ask. about silver and that the correct person within my network to ask about silver is a fellow by the name of sir jj that's what his friends call him he is the author of a substack called a market

vibes jj745.substack.com i like to give other creators a shout out when they teach me things he has been long silver trading silver writing about silver since the 30s in american dollars and he does the best coverage of it it's great substack He's got 50 years of trading in the pits, silver, oil, gold, old school guy, great writer, and really like his work. Our view on silver is silver is an industrial metal, not a monetary metal. I don't own it. And happy for people that do own it, like to see my friends make money. A lot of my friends own it.

I'm the type of person when somebody that I know and makes money, I don't feel jealous. I feel happy for them, as I just said to somebody this morning. nobody gets poorer when a genuine friend gets richer and that's a great line by the way yeah so i'll give you well we'll talk about that let's put a pin on that and then we'll finish the silver answer silver has reached meme escape velocity that's dangerous is exciting

um it can go to 300 from here i mean it could go back to 50 in a heartbeat two things I would caution. Look, I'm a huge gold investor. Well, I'm not investor. I use gold as a savings vehicle, and I've been saving a lot because Dumberg's been successful. Thank you. And yesterday I sold a big chunk of my gold.

I still own a meaningful portion. I would certainly bend over to pick up how much gold I own. But I sold some. Why did I sell some? Because I've got another good friend who's a great content creator, Tony Greer, TG Macro. Who likes to say, high five with one hand and make a sale with the other. And he also likes to say, if you don't sell into strength, when will you sell?

And when I look at the chart of silver, it has a sort of an icrous print vibe to it, right? There's an awful lot of junk silver in the world that will come in from the sidelines when the price is right. And one wonders whether the price isn't right now. Again, not to say it can't go to 250 and don't take any investment advice from me. but if you're not selling when it's strong, when are you selling? And don't get ahead of your skis. There's an awful lot of mean vibes to Silver right now.

Just go on Twitter and search for it. You'll see it. One wonders how much of that is organic versus hedge fund driven. I don't know. It reminds me of GME and AMC and all that jazz. So I don't like to play such situations. It's just inconsistent with my relatively conservative personality. I much prefer steady, boring,

you know, upward sloping lines. And so when I look at the chart of gold, same thing. Maybe I should sell some. Nobody ever went for booking a very handsome profit. I've owned gold for a long time. And look, sort of our view, I was talking to, you know, the co-founder of Duneberg yesterday. In a world where the world is falling apart,

I mean, I don't own enough gold to matter. And in a world where, you know, it's not falling apart, proceeds of my sale of gold will be very handy come retirement. So let's go ahead and book a little bit of that. Because in a way, if the world's coming to an end and gold goes to 50,000 or whatever, we still have Duneberg, which we can reprice in whatever new monetary regime, emerges from it. And so we were hedged as well as anybody could be for that sort of catastrophic scenario. The amount of gold we all is not really going to make a material difference in that regard.

So can I go back to the Pian on nobody gets, or did you have to follow up? No, no, no. Please do. Yeah, I enjoyed that thought. And I think your thoughts on silver and gold are welcomed on this side. But yeah, you're the friend getting richer, I thought was a beautiful thought. Yeah, let's close on this. I'll tell you a story. So we've worked our tails off to Bill Dundberg, yeah, five years every day. Research, write, edit, published promote a piece every four days, 100 podcast appearances a year, live and die by every publication. Today's publication day, when I get off with you, I'm going to go get caught up on the comments. I was up at 1 a.m. last night fixing a few typos that our fact checker found and was struggling with the substack editor because

it wouldn't change the things I was changing and I was panicked about publishing something with a typo, 430 pieces into this thing. I'm still up at one in the morning, worried about a typo. Right? Why? Duneberg's the work of my life. It's the work of our lives. Now, Michael Burry starts a substack in November and 21 days later passes Duneberg on the finance leaderboard. Okay? There's two ways to view that. One is, oh, can't believe. how easy it was for him. That's not fair. That's bad. That's one way. That's how perhaps many people would look at it. There's another way to look at it, which is, I'm an investor in substack. Does Michael Burry's appearance on substack and his wild success? Is that bullish for substack or

bearish for substack? I think that's quite bullish for substack. As 10, 20, 50, 100, or 1,000 other Michael Burry say, wow, I can go make a huge fortune just by announcing I'm on substack and collecting all the money that pours in. Then secondly, does Michael Burry bringing a whole bunch of new eyeballs to the finance category of substack, help her hurt Dumber? Probably helps, Dumber. So thank you, Michael Berry. And I'm thrilled for your success, Michael Berry. And that's because I personally have long held the view, and one of our team ethos is that confidence is an absolute measure and arrogance is a relative one. I don't measure. our business against Michael Burry's for internal fulfillment, I want to push our number

up as high as possible, as ethically and quickly as possible, because that's actually the only number that accrues to my bank account. And by the way, on the day Michael Barry passed us, I know exactly how much Michael Burry was making, which is a sort of a privacy flaw of the sub-stack leaderboards because it's all based on your annualized gross revenue. And congratulations to Michael Burry. I mean, great for him. That it took us five. years and took Michael Burry 21 days is actually a compliment to us because we're nobody and Michael Burry's Michael Burry there's a movie about him it's called the big short you know and so if you walk through life comparing yourself to other people as the basis of your own

internal representation of what you've accomplished that's that's a sad way to live I much prefer to compare my current situation to pre-Dunberg and through that lens I'm blessed, extraordinarily blessed. I get to do this all day. And it's been great. But I'm one of the luckiest people in the world. I found what I was meant to do. My plan is to just keep doing it.

And heartfelt congratulations to Michael Burry. And I hope 50 Michael Burry has come to substack. I'd love nothing more than to slip from number three on the finance leaderboard to number 50 while still growing, because that means the platform has emerged. And as investors in the platform, we win that way too. And so anyway, that's, you know, I think a superior way to live. I'm far from perfect.

But, you know, reminding myself that confidence is an absolute measure and arrogance is a relative one, I think, is a very healthy, healthy way to start the day. Duneberg, appreciate you hopping on and give me some time. You know, of all the things we talked about, I think that's, I'm going to yeah there's lots of things to chew on uh through our conversation today but uh I do enjoy the parting thought thanks again for for doing this and I hope you know in the future out of your hundred appearances uh you'll appear again uh on the Sean Newman podcast it's been a

pleasure to finally get you on and look forward to read more of uh your thoughts here in in the weeks to come thanks Sean and let's not wait till 2000 to have a second of course fair enough Thanks, Duneberg.