Shaun Newman Podcast - Replay Brian Burke

Episode Date: July 31, 2025

Throwback Thursday to episode #92 with Brian Burke.He never started playing hockey until he was 13 years old, but that didn't stop him. By 18 he was playing Division 1 for Lou Lamoriello and the Providence Friars.  He was convinced to take the LSAT and ends up graduated from the Harvard School of Business. He spent 5 years working for the NHL & Gary Bettman in the department of player safety. He was GM for Hartford Whalers, Vancouver Canucks, Anaheim Ducks & Toronto Mapleleafs. To watch the Full Cornerstone Forum: https://open.substack.com/pub/shaunnewmanpodcastGet your voice heard: Text Shaun 587-217-8500Silver Gold Bull Links:Website: https://silvergoldbull.ca/Email: [e-mail] Grahame: [phone]Bow Valley Credit UnionWebsite: www.BowValleycu.comEmail: [e-mail] Use the code “SNP” on all ordersProphet River Links:Website: store.prophetriver.com/Email: [e-mail]

This is Viva Fry. I'm Dr. Peter McCulloch. This is Tom Lomago. This is Chuck Pradnik. This is Alex Krenner. Hey, this is Brad Wall. This is J.P. Sears. Hi, this is Frank Paredi.

This is Tammy Peterson. This is Danielle Smith. This is James Lindsay. Hey, this is Brett Kessel, and you're listening to the Sean Newman podcast. Welcome to the podcast, folks. Happy Thursday. Happy throwback Thursday. Yeah, we're going back in the Way Back Machine,

grabbing a couple episodes from, you know, a little ways back in the old SMP, history. But before we get there, how about we talk a little silver and gold, shall we? The number of ounces of silver needed to buy an ounce of gold now at near 30-year highs. Silver is now, silver is now a bargain price when compared to gold. It's a perfect time to protect a portion of your savings with silver, and silver gold bowl has a wide variety of best value silver for every budget. Simply text or email Graham for details, whether you're a seasoned investor or new to precious metals, Graham will work with you to answer your questions and recommend the best products to meet your investing goals. Whether you're on silvergoldbill.com or dotCA, just

make sure to reference the Sean Newman podcast. Well, when it comes to plumbing and heating, these guys have been keeping homes, farms, and businesses running smoothly since 2010. I'm talking about Guardian, plumbing, and heating. And one of the things that really sets them apart is how they make life easier for their customers. They've got technicians on shift from 8 a.m. to 8 p.m. every single day, including weekends, and they don't charge you anything extra for evening or weekend service. That means you can get the help you need on your schedule without worrying about surprise costs.

All you got to do is go to Guardianplumbing.ca and find out all you can and more about Guardian plumbing and heating. They're protecting their customers from the unexpected through innovative solutions. Look no further than Guardian. Rec tech power products. For the past 20 years, they've been committed to excellence in the power sports industry. Summer is upon us, which means if you're in the mood for fishing boats, oh yeah, they got those lund fishing boats.

You want a little pontoon? Yeah, they got those two. And maybe you're into the bush and you want a side by side. You're getting the point here, folks. You should stop in on the west side of Lloyd Minster, see their showroom, tell Ryan I sent you, and take a look at all the things they offer. They got a wide selection of top-end brands there.

You will not be disappointed with rec tech. I'm telling you. They're open Monday through Saturday. Their showroom is almost second to none, I would say. And whether you're on the golf course or at the lake, anywhere in between, they can help get the right machine for you. go to rectech powerproducts.com and everything is there. You can see everything they're working with.

I really suggest if you're driving through Lloyd Minster, though, you stop in and say hello. Planetcom, when you're busy running a growing business trying to stay on top of the ever-changing world of information tech, well, it can be overwhelming to say it at least. Yeah, you're telling me. And they want to take care of that for you, leaving you to do your thing while they do theirs.

For the past 22 years, Planetcom has been there to boost your productivity by proactively managing every aspect of your IT infrastructure, are both in cloud and in the house, and it ensures you're not too tangled up in technology to get anything done. If you want to see one of their products, just go to the shan Newmanpodcast.com, my original website. That's a long story. Regardless, PlanetCom has helped build the new one,

and you can check it out. And if you want to check them out, go to planetcom.com. For all your tech needs. Ignite Distribution is a high-service supply company based in Wainerate, Alberta specializing in automotive parts and a wider range of additional products, including safety equipment, welding, supplies, fasteners, and janitorial items. They're operating as a Napa Auto Parts retailer.

And I'm telling you, Shane Stafford is the guy you want to get a hold of. 780842-3433. They don't come much higher. I was talking about Caleb Taves on the other episodes. Shane Stafford's another one of those guys that if you want to make sure your business is running smoothly, look no further than Shane Stafford and his team. at Ignite Distribution. We have the Cornerstone Forum.

I'm just keeping it in your brain. It is coming back in 2026. As we get more information, we will make sure to keep you guys up to date. We have the new studio here, hopefully coming sooner than later, as soon as I get back from holidays. We'll be hammering some things out.

Really excited to unveil that, to, you know, to be in there, be honest. And we're doing a cleanup in August. I don't know how much I'm checking my phone right now, but if you're interested in being a part of cutting down some trees and that type of thing, and you're wanting help, you know, you can get your name on the value for value while. Come lend a chainsaw. Just shoot me a text and I'll probably have the date by now figured out of when that is going to be. As you're noticing today is a throwback Thursday. And for the month of July, we're going in the way, way back machine and picking out some episodes that have caught my attention,

maybe yours as well. And, well, make sure to stick around at the end of the episode. I've re-listened to all these and I jot it down some notes because, you know, some of these I haven't listened to, well, probably none of us have listened to in a long time. But lots of times I, you know, an episode sticks out to me. Maybe I really listened to it. Maybe I don't. I made sure to go back and we listen to this. And so at the end of these episodes, I have a couple extra thoughts. So make sure to stick around for that. If you're listening or watching on Spotify, Apple, YouTube Rumble, X, make sure to subscribe, make sure to leave a review, make sure to share with a friend, make sure to hit retweet, make sure to do all the things. You're all wonderful. And I appreciate

you hanging out on a throwback Thursday. Now, let's get on to that tale of the tape. Born in Providence, he considers a Dina, Minnesota, his hometown after he moved there at age 12. He started playing hockey at age 13. By 18, he was playing Division 1 with the Providence Friars. He was undrafted but signed with the Philadelphia Flyers. Wanted a Calder Cup with the Maine Mariners? Then went on to Harvard Business School, where he graduated from. He spent five years under Gary Bettman as the league's chief disciplinarian in the Department of Player Safety. He's been the GM of the Hartford Whalers, Anaheim Ducks, Toronto Maple Leafs. While with Anaheim, he won a Stanley Cup.

2007. I think most oiler fans remember the Chris Pronger deal. He was instrumental in the USA and continues to be instrumental in the USA hockey development program and was a GM for the 2010 Olympics. Of course, now you can find him on SportsNet as an analyst. Of course, I'm talking about Brian Burke. So buckle up because here we go. Well, welcome to the Sean Newman podcast. Today I'm joined by the one and only Brian Burke. So thank you, sir, for hopping on. My pleasure, Sean. And your birthday, nonetheless. So it should be happy birthday you, but it certainly feels like happy birthday me.

Well, when you get to a certain age, birthdays aren't as enjoyable as they were when you were younger. So let's move on, my friend. Sounds good, sir. Well, I thought we'd start in the beginning. I know you're one of ten kids. What was that like? I'm a, I'm a, from a big, I thought was a big family, five kids in the Newman family. But 10, I'm sure, had a lot of fun in there.

Well, I enjoyed it. It was there's always somebody to play with or fight with or read a book with or play a board game with. And there were six squirrels and four boys that had two older brothers who I idolized. And I enjoyed it. I thrived in that environment. But it made you a little tough for two. I'm and two older brothers. So I loved it. I wouldn't trade my childhood experiences for anything. I have three older brothers and I finally got to play with a few of old men senior hockey. Did you

ever get to play with your older brothers? My oldest brother was a football star and he went to Stanford and he played freshman football there, but then he had a knee injury and ended his career. But he played freshman football at Stanford. Started on an undefeated high school football championship team. And then my next brother was a football player and a wrestler, and he wrestled at Dartmouth. And then so they weren't hockey, I'd skate with them on the pond once in a while, but not very much. But I played high school football and then hockey and then went on to play college hockey at Providence. So having older brothers that played football, how did you get into hockey then? I would assume that, you know, having older brothers, admiring them, as you say,

I'm surprised you weren't playing football more. Well, I did. I played through, I played up until my senior year in high school, and that's, one thing about playing high school football is, when you walk off the field your last year, except for one or two guys on the team, you've played your last football game. You're never gonna, it's not like you and your buddies

a couple years later to say, hey, let's all put on full gear and go out and play football at high school. I remember walking off the field, talking to two of my teammates, and I'll ever put this stuff on again. But I did play high school football. It's funny, I was telling my kids last night. I loved high school football.

I wish I'd have been better at football. But I was too small. I love the planning and the preparation, the detail that went into it. So we'd play Friday nights under the lights. Saturday we'd go over the film of the team we were playing the following Friday night. And we'd study, they'd say, okay, he's a five-man line. So I was a left guard. So Berk, we got a defensive tackle.

He was number 74. he's really big but he's slow and he moves poorly to his left the detail that went all week and then Friday night play and then switch completely and start game blinding for the next the next game all the offensive plays we were running against that defense any special plays would use on special teams I loved the detail and the planning and the meticulous nature of it that's probably why you were so good at what you did in the NHL then with the meticulous

planning and details and everything else. I mean, your career is a GM and everything else you've done. There's a lot of work that goes into that. Well, one thing, young people ask me all the time how they can get into sports. And I said, well, I'll tell you, the first rule is be the hardest worker.

Like, I remember when I was the president of hockey operations with the Calgary Flames a couple years ago. And we didn't have assigned parking spaces. And my daughters, who were at the time probably 10 and 12, maybe 11 and 13. We pulled in on a Saturday. There's no one there. We pulled into the parking garage outside the saddle dome.

And my daughter's laugh. They were like, you don't have a parking spot. Because like in Vancouver, I had this Brian Burke, General Manager, 24 hours, and Toronto, same thing. And they said, Dad, you don't have a parking spot. I said, yes, I do. I can park anywhere I want, as long as I'm the first one here, which I typically was.

So I had a parking spot. They could park anywhere I wanted. So, yeah, hard work is a key to being successful, but that's true in any field. Well, and going off hard work, I know, like, from listening to your story, you didn't start playing hockey until you're 13. Essentially, when you moved to Minnesota, I mean, the hockey state, you start playing hockey. And then, what, four short years? All of a sudden, you're at Providence playing Division I hockey.

that in itself you must have put in a ton of work I assume well yes I did what happened was we moved to Minnesota when I was 12 and we got stuck there's a blizzard so the moving trucks got stuck like in Ohio or Pennsylvania somewhere so we were stuck at Howard Johnson's in Bloomington Minnesota for three days but the state high school hockey tournament was on and they packed the old Met Center in fact where we were stuck in the hotel was only a few miles from the Met Center I grew up only a few miles from the Met Center. And they get 18,000 people on Thursday night, Friday, like they had two sessions, the afternoon session, 17,000 people, whatever it was. They'd make them leave. Then they'd bring in a whole new crowd for the evening games and so on Friday and Saturday. And I felt well,

I watched every game. I fell in love with it. And I thought, what a beautiful sport. I had been to a couple of Bruins games. We lived in Boston before that. I'd skated half dozen times on a pond, but I'd never played organized hockey. I couldn't skate. And I started that next year, so I played Baddam House, Adam House, Midget B, Midget A, high school. So like my 50 year of organized hockey was playing Minnesota State High School hockey. My sixth year of organized hockey was playing in Providence College. So it was a pretty amazing assent. And I had four rules that I followed that I would advise any young athlete to take into account.

So my four rules were one is be the hardest worker, practice and games. I don't respect guys who just work hard in games. Number two is be a coach's dream. Always be in position, always do the right thing, pay attention in film sessions. My coach never had to say, look, you're 10 feet out of position. I was never out of position because I listened. I got the highest grade in high school football. We had to take a test at the end of training camp on the playbook.

I always get the highest grade of the lineman. Be a coach's dream. Number three is be an indispensable. team mate. Like be compassionate, be empathetic, be a leader when it's your turn, be a follower till then, but fit into your team. You know, go sit over, walk across from them and sit next to the guy, talk to them. Know all 20 guys. If there's guys on your team, you're not going to like. You never like 20 guys. But I got along with all of them, but I'd make it work. I'd stay out and work on stuff with freshmen. And the last one was play tough. If you bring ferocity,

if you bring an element of crudeness to the game, that always has value. Now, if you're willing to block a shot with your face, if you're willing to run a guy that's tough for the Newark, if you're willing to fight for a teammate, that has value. So those are only four rules. And I followed them. Having outdoor ice was the big equalizer, right? Before global warming and climate change, we could skate as much or as low as we wanted, and that's where I made up the distance.

Do you ever look back at that and go, if a snowstorm hadn't to happen, maybe you don't fall into hockey? Yeah, I have thought of that. And then I think it would have done something else. Like I, I didn't, I've never liked sports that weren't team sports. Like, I never could have been a figure skater or a tennis player. Like to me, what I valued most about sports was having teammates around me that I could be friends with and hang around with and do stuff with. So I played rugby when I went to law school. I started playing rugby for the Harvard Business School, rugby football team and played for them for four and a half years. I always like team sports and being around the guys and having a peer group. You know, when I was a freshman, I flew to Providence

College in the fall of 1973 and I was homesick, but the night I landed, I had a family. I had 25 guys, right? We had a team meeting on Sunday night. Right away, I had 25 buddies. And there were a couple guys that I had played with in high school that had gone there. So I didn't have a normal college experience where you leave and go away from home and don't know a soul. I had a family as soon as I got there. I love that about sports. Yeah, it makes going away from home super easy, well, not super easy, but adjustable because I lived away from home a lot of years. And when you get to places and have people that are in the same predicament as yourself, there's camaraderie in that. And you find you make good friends quick if you're just a little

bit outgoing enough to sit around and talk with those folks. Yeah, I agree. In Providence, were you a walk-on? Yes. So did you fly out there not knowing you were going to be on the team? Yes. I flew out with John McMorrell, who was a linemate of mine in high school, and I played with him at Providence, and he was a full ride. He was a high pick with the New York Rangers back when now everyone's a high pick, but back then college kids weren't high picks and Americans weren't high picks. He was the third or fourth round with the New York Rangers back in 1973. And Mac should have been a great hockey player. He was, he worked hard.

He was built, like my mom called him Popeye. Had the hardest shot of any guy really I've ever played with, but he got hurt every year. It's serious injuries every year. Knee, broken hand, got a bad skate cut when we were seniors. He could never get on track. scratch golf or two, but we're flying out. He's on a four-year full ride. I'm a walk-on.

And so you got to make the team. So I made the team. You know, follow the four roles. It was the hardest worker, every practice. Did everything right, coach's dream, fit in with my teammates and played tough. Remember our first scrimand we weren't allowed to fight. So Lou Lamarillo was our coach,

no fighting in the drills. So we had drills for like a month. Back then, there was no limit on when you could start. So we would start out Monday after Labor Day. Weight Room, two at eight, running on the baseball field and then finally went on the ice the new rink was being built the Snyder arena was new then was being built while we were going through the fall so we skated at uh north smithfield and uh what's one something abbey uh portsmouth abbey we skated at these different

rinks we skated at the civic center we skated at brown uh but then we went to we're at the providence service there i never forget and kevin gaffney was a tough defenseman from uh from uh North Island and in fact his nephews both played his brother played a Providence college and his nephews young nephews were stars of Providence college after me and Kevin was getting on my nerves I weighed 176 pounds when I was a freshman same height I am now six two I was just a bone rack and Kevin was getting on my nerves I said as soon as we can as soon as we scrimmits we're going so remember the first time I was on the ice them we dropped the puck and I just charged across the ice the other side and fought him and now it was a statement and I was a statement

Like I weighed 176 pounds. He was 195. I was a freshman. He was a junior. It was just a statement to everyone that's sitting on the bench. I'm making this team. And the fight went fine. No clear winner or loser.

But I remember guys looking at me different after that. So I did what I had to do to make the team. I didn't play very much my first year. I mostly killed penalties. Next year, go back and Lou put me on a half scholarship. And I went from killing penalties to play in a little bit, third, fourth line. and then I kept working in the gym. So I came back my second year instead of 176, I was 185.

And I mind you, my height never changed in four years, six two. Gained nine pounds that first summer. Gained an extra one hour, I came back at one 85. The next year I came back at 195. Now I was a big hitter, and all those hits are starting to hurt. And he put out 10 extra pounds, and now you finish the defenseman, and he sometimes doesn't leave the ice. Sometimes he crumbles up on the ice.

then senior I came back I camp at 205 and played at 200 so I went to camp with the flyers four years after I went to Providence College it was exactly 30 pounds heavier than I was without any height gain that's just all filling out you kind of

nonchalantly mention your coach is Lou Lamarrel and for any hockey fan I mean he's royalty now in the NHL how I think you know I'd read a an article on you that said that was, you know, at that age, it's a formative years of any person.

But to have Lou the guy overseeing you for four years, how impactful was that on your life? Well, I owe Lou a lot. I love the man. Those were the four most important years of my life. And, you know, I've had that annoys both of my ex-wives when I say that, so I used to say they're the best four years of my life. Now I just say they're foremost important. No, I was fortunate. Lou asked me to go there, recruited me, and put me on scholarship and kept me there. So I went half scholarship, second year, full ride, full ride.

And I was a very serious student, too. I went to Harvard Law School, I figured out I was a road scholarship finalist. But Lou was a tremendous influence on me, hockey-wise, and as a person. Like, Lou taught you how to act. Like we had to go to class. It wasn't optional. We had to have good manners.

Like we were very popular on campus among the athletes because we all went to class. And we all dressed properly and we all had good manners. We all had short hair back. And so there are things that Lou did that were annoying and you had too many rules. But I think what would surprise people is he was very progressive. As for an old school guy, because we were old school the way we played and practiced and everything and you know he liked it tough and but old school guy with great progressive ideas like we stretched back then as part of a workout we stretched and young guys we look and it and

it's going yeah that's real progressive nobody stretched back then you just went out on the ice and and we stretched and we stretched in between weight workouts for flexibility we did some early plyometric work we did circuit training back then guys were going to try and do as many on the bench and say, they could with 275, well, he put 200 on the bar and say,

do 30 or do 20. And so we did circuit training and stretching in between. And I remember telling guys the training camp with the flyers four years later and they're like,

wow, we just started doing that now. We did, we used video, which a lot of teams back then, he won't believe it. No one used video. When I first started playing hockey, it didn't exist.

What did the video session look like back then? Well, it was Super 8 film. Like it was like the whole movies. There was no VHS or VCRs or any of like stuff that kids would laugh at now. It wasn't even that. I mean, remember, I didn't get my first cell phone until 1983. I sent my first email when I worked for the NHL in 1994, 1995. So again, this has all been rapid, but for guys your age, all the stuff you take for granted the stuff that just came in my first cell phone was the old Maxwell smart you know it was about this big it was about 14 minutes of small need the briefcase to carry it around yeah and it was honestly got then it was um no uh we used fax machines back now i remember one even when i was a

lawyer so when i worked at the law firm the most memory that my secretary had she had a select ibn selected typewriter with 40 pages of memory. And I was routinely doing documents, bond documents, and corporate documents, two and 300 pages long. She could only do 40 pages. So anything longer than that, you had to take it down to word processing and leave it. And if you're a young associate, you're a low priority, right? And then sometimes wait for it until three or four in the morning, if it had to go in the next day, you'd have to stay and sleep at your desk and wait to work processing could get to this doctor.

Like, no, I mean, the last, but it was very primitive then. And now, you know, like,

I still have a facts machine here and my kids tease me about it all the time. Does it ever bother you then? I mean, those are the romanticized days

of the hockey world. Now, I mean, a goal goes in, you got 18 different directions to look at anything. Do you ever think we've gone maybe a little too far? No, I think the people that complain about the, or reminisce about the good old days,

forget that what we did have them was some privacy and some peace. Like if you can't track me down on my cell phone, the whole pace of life slows down. You know that until I check my messages, when I used to go to training camp for the guys that are representing, I would drive down the Jersey Turnpike and stop at every other service closet and phone and checked my message. Like there were no cell phones then. There's old answering machines, and he entered the code and, you know, like,

but what that did give you was peace. So when I was driving in the car, I had peace. I could dictate memos to my assistant. I could listen to music. Now, you've got X-Dem radio, so you're listening to hockey all the time. You're interrupted by phone calls all the time. You're way more efficient,

but there is truly no peace. There's no downtime from the job. So, but I would trade the efficiency for the old days. The old days weren't efficient. We were very poor use of time. The St. Louis Blues, when I first started working for teams in 1987, and other guys who talked to will remember this if they're my age or older. They used to close for the month of July.

They used to get a fax from the St. Louis Blues on June 30th, that the St. Louis Blues will be closing tomorrow for the month of July. Any emergencies called Susie Matthew and here's the number. They closed for the month of July. I'm not making this up. Lots of other teams closed for two weeks in July. And there was mandatory staff holiday at that time. So it's very different now.

Like no one closes for two weeks. That ain't going to happen ever again. And no one will ever close for a month again. The St. Louis Blues used to close for the month of July. Now, you think their lives weren't simpler back then? No, 100% they were simpler. Can you imagine these days if the Toronto Maple Leafs just sent out a memo and we'll talk to you guys August 1st after the long week.

Exactly. Exactly. And even if the team said, okay, we get it, the media would kill you. It'd be like, you can't shut down for a month. So, no, I think it's much. There are things about the old days I like better. It was simpler with fewer teams. With 21 teams, it was much easier. You knew everybody.

You knew all the players. There weren't as many teams to follow. Now you've got 32 teams once data comes in. They're all going to have their own. team. So you got to know if you're a GM, you have a pretty good working knowledge of 64 teams, but you've got to know the farm teams as well, or at least the key guys on those farm teams. So just to scout, if you say, okay, my goal this year is to see every NHL team and see every minor league team, that's 60 nights out of year. That's pretty well all anyone scouts.

Even the guys that scout a lot like Bob Murray and Steve Eisenman, they're not going to see more than 64 games of teams involving other than their own team. So that would use up your whole scouting budget, including amateurs and stuff. So it ain't going to happen. So my last few years, I didn't see all of the farm teams. In fact, my years in Gallagher, I didn't see most of them, I didn't see even half of them. And back when I was in the system, GM, I saw every farm team at least twice. But again, they're only 21 teams, and that's pretty easy.

You've been out in Milwaukee and stay for the weekend, and they play three different teams, and now you knocked off, you know, well, Rockford wasn't in the league, but then I knocked out Peoria, you knocked out whatever, you know. So it was much simpler and easier with 21 teams. I assume when you take over the helm as GM of a hockey club, then, especially now, one of the things you got to do is you got to get staff in there, you can trust every single word they say because it's impossible to see every player and have your finger on the pulse of every possible person that plays and, you know,

and the constant changing of every situation. So as a GM, I guess, what was your first, when you went into a new team looking at it, what was the thing you're like, I got to do this on every single team so I can set the pass straight and pointed in the right direction? Well, first off, most teams have a lot of really dedicated, talented personnel working for. We're fortunate in our league that we're surrounded by honest. people that mean well and want to get it right. So I never cleaned house in all my years, you know, 30 years working for teams. So five times I went in and took over a team, never cleaned

house. Might make one or two changes, but basically instead of the people there, just show me what you can do. We'll make a determination at the end of the year. Show me what you can do. And then I might make one or two changes. But so for example, what just happened in Buffalo, the red wedding in Buffalo, I, I, that's unfathomable to me that you're going to make that judgment in room 22 people's lives in one day. I just, I never did it, never would. And I'd be embarrassed if I hadn't. That's something that would embarrass me until I died. Um, but going to give, uh, bringing Dave known us, most places I work with Dave Nones, brought in with Toronto, brought in Dave Pooleone and cold vice hell. Uh, but I kept Jimmy Hughes around, kept Dallas Eakins around. Like I think there's

enough talented people there, you just got to reset them to the type of hockey you want to play. So in my case, usually I'd be getting a guy to say, look, I like it a little cruder than most people do. So you got to start looking for kind of players to play my kind of stop. Yeah, the red wedding, geez, that's the first time I've heard it called that, which is completely apt to what happened in Buffalo. I think that's shocked every fan, every person everywhere. I want to go back quickly to Lou Lamarillo. I listened to a story that he was the one that convinced you to take the LSAT. And if it wasn't because of him, you won't want to be a history teacher and a coach. Did you ever think about becoming a coach after that? Because that's one job. I'm pretty sure

you never did. I never did other than hockey schools. And I think I would have been a of a coach. That's what I really wanted to do when I was 22 when I graduated. So after my, after my third year, I was elected captain of the team along with Ronnie Wilson. And playing with Ronnie Wilson for four years was a great kid, what a great player he was. What a great guy. But I was planning, I didn't think the flyers would sign me, but they had claimed my pro rights after my third year. So back in the day, if you didn't draft a kid, you could claim him later. So there's none of these undrafted college free agents, none of these Tyler Bozac's.

A team would just list you. So I remember I was going home after my third year's school. I went back to Minnesota every summer. And Lou said, just, you know, the flyers might be right. So what does that mean? It means you have to sign them with them if they sign with anybody. I remember laughing as I was walking away, like sign with the flyers. Why would they sign me?

So, going to senior year, go to the year. and in the fall I'm walking down to the rink and Alana Mooney was Lou's secretary, a really neat lady. And she goes out and says, coach wants to see it. So I'm like, oh, Christ, that's never good, right? So I went and I'm like, I had a girlfriend back in Minnesota all through school. I didn't go out much. I didn't screw around. The only time I broke curfew in four years was to study.

I had a big exam. I get up after curfew and study with Mike Cutty. Mike Cuddy was a history major like me who was a star on the baseball team pitcher and we would stay up together after Perkins study so pretty sure it wasn't about me so I thought one of the freshmen must be in her jam so I went to lose got the LSAT and you shoves it across the application to take the LSAT philosophy of admission test and he shoves across the desk and says you're taking this exam you're writing this exam was exact words I think your professors tell me if you do well and you'll be into Harvard or Yale. I look at it. Law school admissions test, I shoved it back. I said, coach, I have no interest in going to law school. And he shoved it back. He said, you don't understand. That was not a request. You're writing a sleeping exam. And so I argue with him. I said, I don't want to go to law school. I don't like lawyers. I don't want to be a lawyer.

And he said, you're writing the exam. He said, it could change your life. Just do it. And I knew how important it was to Lou, because he let me be late for practice to write the L set. And you were never, ever late for practice in Providence College. Never. So I wrote the exam the night before the exam. You know, you can take a course to study to take the L-Sat for three months, right? So the night before, Friday night, it comes with a booklet, like 22 pages along, sample questions.

So I read the booklet, cover to cover, put it down, did something else, came back, read it, cover to cover, drank a cold beer, went to bed, took the last. exam the next day, 9 o'clock in the morning and Saturday. I don't know how I did. So I got on practice. I throw on my stuff, get out there as fast I can. The worst headache I've ever had my life. And I skied out on the ice and Lou said how to go? I said, I have no idea. I might have done well. I might have bonded. I said, all I know is I have the worst headache I've ever had in my life. And Lou said, I don't care about your headache, get in line for the next drill. So anyway, I get a back. They get a 704. Like 98 percentile on the old score. And like,

Even now, I'm showing my age. Now I think it's based on a score of 35. Back then, it was based on 800. So I got a 704, which is in the 98th percent of time. Now Harvard's a realistic possibility, Georgetown. I get into Harvard and Georgetown. And that's why I went. Everyone said, go.

I didn't even know. I remember my first day of law school. A guy said to me, I want to be a litigator when I get out. What do you want to be in? I didn't even know what a litigator was. I didn't know. I had no idea. So I'm like I just want to graduate I remember telling them I just want to graduate

It's like I had no idea like people plan their lives and think ahead and plan stuff and when I speak at law schools and business schools I tell a professor right away I apologize But I'm the worst guy to have here because I never planned a day on my life I never knew what I was gonna do I just my theory was have as many good options as you can If you got good options you'll always make good choices so the average 21-year-old turning 22 graduated from Providence College trying to get a job waiting to hear from grad school whatever I've got an offer from the flyers and I've got an acceptance to Harvard Law School two pretty good options

two great options thanks to Lou thanks to Lou that's it's unbelievable that you didn't want to go and you think of where you're at now and that's a you know Luke could I mean kudos to Luke because he could see maybe a some writing on the wall. The tea leaves what was shown there if you got into law of school and where that would take you. Yeah. It was all because Lou cared about a kid from Minnesota.

That's unbelievable. Well, Brian, it's been half an hour. I just, I want to know, I don't want to keep you too long. I got you for five more minutes. If we can keep going, you just let me schedule. We started a little late. Do 10 more minutes and then we'll go. Okay. Well, if I got 10 more minutes with you, I want to get to a couple of stories or a couple of questions for

I'd love to keep talking about your career because I find it extremely fascinating. I find the fact that you weren't a hockey guy and a snowstorm bottles you up and you start watching it from there. You can make Providence and all that. Lou stop you and making you write the LSAT when you argue with them is almost unbelievable, to be honest. But I told my father, he is not a spitting chicklets listener. And I heard the story about Kevin B. Exa. My father was not a Brian Burke fan.

and tell he heard an iteration of that story. So I told him I'd ask you to tell it on here about BXN Federoff in the bar and the fight that ensued and what happened. Well, tell your dad, I said, hi. Now, this will show you how an anxious I am. Whenever I speak, do a lot of public speaking, or I did when I work for teens. Someone always comes out from my absence and said, you know, I've never liked you, but you seem like a good guy. And my ex-wife used to be like, you have a chance to make a friend there. Just make a friend and say thank you.

You know what I say to him? I said, do you think I care what you think about me before you got here today or after? I could care less what you think of Brian Berg yesterday, today or tomorrow. I could care less. And I used to drive my ex-wife and she said, just stop the guy. Now you've made a friend. And now you say that to him. And now your dad's going to be like, I was right.

He is a jerk. So I do it half kidding. On that, were you always like that? Or was that something you learned somewhere along the way to not worry about what other people said? Because, I mean, you went into some hot spots in Canada and media is tough. Is that something you always had? The number of people whose opinion I truly value, you can count on my two hands. I mean that. And I felt that way all my life.

I've never been upset about being along on an issue. but Pat Quinn really reinforced that. Packclan could have cared less what people thought of him. I remember my first year, Tony Gallagher wrote something that really bothered me, really got under my skin, and Pat called me in and he said, look, we're not having this talk again. He said, you got to ignore this stuff. He said, I'm not going to tell you to not let it get to you. You've got to ignore it.

Don't read any of it. He said, why are you reading the paper anyway? So I was new in Canada, right? I was a new American trying to get my Canadian citizenship. I read both newspapers cover to cover. I knew which high school girls' teams were competitive. I knew who my MLA was. I knew about the traffic patterns.

I knew the neighborhoods. Because it's your job to fit in. When you go to a different country, it's your job to fit it. Canada didn't have to embrace Brian. I had to embrace Canada. So I'm reading the paper cover to cover, including the sports. And Pat says, why are you reading the paper? I said, because I want to fit in.

I want to know what's going on. He said, we'll skip the sports page. So I did. I learned a great lesson. He said, I'm going to save you lots of heartburn and lots of aggravation. Don't pay any attention to it. So that really helped with that. But I felt that way.

I really don't care. Anyway, tell your dad I said, I said, I said, I said, I'm glad. He played up Bowling Green. He was a really good college player, but you're limited to 50 contracts. So every NHL team can only sign 50 contracts. you're not just signing people randomly. You're not just giving every guy you draft the contract. So after his team was eliminated in the NCAA tournament, we brought Kevin to Manitoba, which is where our firm team is. So that night we played, he did not dress, and I don't think he

dressed, I'm pretty sure he didn't anyway. If we did, all players went to Earls, which used to be near the old arena. Great Bar, by the way. And he got in a fight with, with, uh, Fedor Fetterov. What was happened was he was sitting by the bar and he took a little like cocktail straw out of his drinking, threw it over his shoulder, not thinking. And it landed on the table behind him and Federer Federer was sitting there with Kiro Koltzov, this little Russian defenseman him. So in Federer, Kevin's a tough kid, but Federer was a big man. Federer was like 6-4-2-30, way bigger than his brother, Sergey. And a good kid. Federer Federer was a good kid. I thought he, you know, He's just screwed up too much on the Iceland practice.

He just could never get it right, but nice kid anyway. He challenges Kevin to a fight. So Kevin says to Dallas Ekins, who's our captain, I'm here on an ATO, an Amherman Sir Trout agree with. He said, I can't fight him. And Dallas said, go outside and fight him, beat the crap on him. So he did. And he comes back in.

He won punch better, caught him wide open and knocked them out, left him in the parking lot of girls. He comes back in, and he says, oh, Christ, they're going to send me home in my. and Dallas said, you don't know our boss. He said, they're going to sign you now. So the next morning, Steve Tamoulini called me and said, we had a problem last night in Manitoba.

I'm like, I looked at the game sheet. They're two hours ahead of Vancouver. I get the game sheet faxed in my house. No game misconducts. A couple of fighting majors, but I said, well, what happened? Did a player get in the trouble with a player? He said, no.

I said, the player would go down the runway. So sometimes back then, they used to charge down the runway to the other dressing room and fight. He said, no. So I said, you get involved with one of the officials? Nope. You get involved with one of the fans? Nope.

Better than that. And I'm like, well, I'm running out of suggestions, family. He said, two of our guys got in the fight at Earls. I said, two of our own guys? Because sometimes the visiting team would go to Earl's out there staying over. And there were fights in the parking lot between the opposing team and home team, but never teammates. And so what happens?

So he told me. And I said, I said, signed the exit. So that's a true story. That's what he was got that. That's awesome. Well, that's that turned, dad heard that story and he's like, yeah, that Brian Burke, he's got to be a good guy because that's a great story. That's a great story. That's a true story. Every word of it. And I embarrasses Kevin sometimes, but it's true. How about, I was thinking, you know, you're working for Pat Quinn when August 9th, 1988 happens, the Gerexky trade. Were you guys at all in on Wayne Gerexie?

Yeah, you know what? Edmonton offered them to us. We couldn't afford it. It was like 15 million U.S. in Canada, or maybe even more than that, maybe it was 25 million. I think L.A. ended up paying 15 million. I think to us it was, I want to say 25. And like Kirk McLean and, you know, Adam so like it would a couple of three first like the price was way too high and it was out there that he might end up in in Vancouver so I remember we were very nervous that so I went home Pats said go home and see if we can justify this we can recover the money we only had like 11 monetary suites in the old Pacific Coliseum I think our top ticket price that year was $30. How are we going to recover $25 million or $15 or 20 or whatever it was? There's no way we could.

So I came back and said, Pat, we can't do it. And so Pat said, we'll get it out there. We don't need our season ticket holders thinking that Gretzky could be here. So I leaked it to a reporter on Pat's instructions that he was going to L.A. And that ended to the discussion. Yeah, to this day, I've dreamed about that. What would that have been like that, Wayne Gretzky on your team? Well, and just to see that, like, I assume when you're sitting in the office and that comes across, Wayne Gerexky's available. You must have had to sit down for a couple minutes. Like, can we even?

Well, we never thought, and we're in the same division. We never thought that they were serious. We're not going to go back in a Northlands Coliseum six times a year with Wayne Gretzky. But it was like trading goalies and goons back in the day. You never trade them in your division. You can trade a tough guy to the Rangers, but you're not going to trade a tough guy. out of the oilers and might come into your building and beat the snout of somebody. So goalies and goons was a rule back then. You don't trade in your division.

Same with Wayne. We didn't think they were serious, but I think LA paid $15 million and Jimmy Carson and all the other player assets. I think they asked for 25 from us. We couldn't do it. We just couldn't justify it. Like even with Wayne filling the building, even if we doubled our ticket prices, which we never could have done, we couldn't have got the money back. Even if we filled every seat at double price for 10 years, we couldn't have got the money back. I thought I'd bring up to with it being Pride Month, you can play. I think that's something very close to your heart. And I think if people in my area haven't heard about it or don't know anything about it,

maybe just as long as you want to go, Brian, maybe a little bit of something about you can play. just maybe what it's about and if people want to get involved how they can well i want uh i went down sunday when which would have been the pride parade but they'd cancel it obviously i went down sunday and walked the parade route in honor of my son just like i've done it i first went to pride with him and then i marched for him after he passed away uh my son brendan that uh was a student manager at Miami University in Ohio. Rico Blasey was a coach. Tommy Wingles was there. I mean, the list of players that were good to him was amazing. But he came out to the team as openly gay and it was a big story. The general manager of Toronto, Mike Luce has a gay son, which was a

non-event to me. Like I could have cared less. But then he died in a car accident in 2010. And so pride's very important to us. We started You Can Play, which is to encourage athletes, to stay in team sports, even if they're gay, even if they see evidence of homophobia. We think it's saved a lot of young men's lives and women's, more so men than women. Gay women do not have the same problem of acceptance in sports that gay men do, but we think it's been a big cool. So if you want to look, you can play. We're online.

This is the charity starter in Brendan's murderers. If you can play, if you can play well enough to help our team, we've got a uniform. for you. You're welcome in our dressing room if you can help us win. So it's a message of hope. It's much broader than sports that basically you're welcome here. It's been parted with the NFL and the NFL and NBA. They've done great work and like I say, Sunday I went down and marched the parade route. So in Toronto, the pride parade goes down young, but the village, the gay village is Church Street and we walked the same route, parallel route, Rick Mercer and I, the famous Canadian comic and author and actor.

We walked in my daughter and my ex. We walked the parade route one street over right to the heart of the village in honor of Brendan. So we remembered him this year of Pride. But yeah, there's lots of ways you can support Pride too. There's P-flag, which is parents and friends of lesbian and gays. They're great. You can be a gay straight ally. You can do you can play.

We'd love to have it. Cool. Appreciate you sharing that. We'll go into the final segment here, just nice and quick. The Crude Master Final Five, five quick questions. As long and short, does you want to go, Brian? And then I'll let you go. I know you're a busy, busy guy.

So a huge shout out to Heath and Tracy McDonald, huge supporters of the podcast since the very beginning. First one, if you could sit down with a beverage and pick the brain of anyone, who would you want to sit down with? Well, I'll stick to hockey. I mean, I have much bigger interest in hockey. If it were, I'd like to meet Doris Goodwin-Kirn, the famous historian. Doris Curran Goodwin, I get her name backwards.

She's written, she's a Harvard professor of history, and I'd love to talk history with her. I've read all of her books, and I know people say, yeah, you love her books, can't remember her name, but that's who I would. Hockey-wise, probably Sam Pollock. I knew Sam Pollock. I was fortunate up to meet him in his official capacity when he worked for baseball can. He was a great baseball mind, too. People forget that. Same with Lou.

How many people know, Lou Monroe was a great baseball mind too. Manorough's in the Cape Cod League. I was on the board of the Yankees for years. Still maybe, for all I know. But I'd like to probably Sam Pollock. I knew him, but never got to really pick his brain. I have to ask. I was a history major as well in college. Enjoy history. Is there a specific book that you've read that sticks out to you?

I like Shelby's foot, his three-volume work on the Civil War. Shelby Foot passed away a few years ago, but he wrote a three-volume, over a thousand pages each. It's a history of the Civil War, and the detail is phenomenal. And I've read it three times. Three times? Yeah. And then I'm trying to think the one-volume work that I recommend it's a Mac something. It's an Irish or Scottish name.

There's a one volume work in the Civil War that I think I tell people start with that and then go to Shelby put. I'm drawn in blank. McKinley or McNally, but I'm drawn a blank kind of right now. You're known for your word choice. I was laughing. I'd listen to one of the Spit and Chicklets episodes, and you got talking about different words you used to kind of mess with media. Is there a word that you never got to use that you still have sitting in the repertoire,

they're waiting to be used? I don't think I've, I don't think I ever used Pucilanimus, which is one of my favorite words. Puselanamus kind of fell out of favor. It was a common use of word until the Civil War in the U.S. And it kind of fell out of favor. And it means cowardly. And I remember when my daughter, Gracie, was in grade four,

the teacher said, look, none of you know a word that I can't spell. And Gracie said, I do. And she said, what words that? And she said, Puselanum. And of course the teacher hadn't heard it hasn't been used in a hundred and something years But that's one of my favorite words I might have used it once in Vancouver But I've wanted to trotted out a number of times

And I think I have not used it and that people will look it up it's a great word piece of landm I'm trying I'm sitting here going pucos a Puseladamus can you imagine seeing that written in the paper? Everybody would like get another day what what is that mean? They'd have to write they'd have to have the definition underneath it probably Yeah, I might have tried that out once. I don't remember, but I always wanted to. If you were a commissioner for a day, would there be any rule changes you'd make? I would trade two, change two things.

And I've told Gary both of these, and he's sick of hearing it, because I have really heart done. One, I would change the draft lottery, which I detest, what just happened this past week is a disgrace. And I would change the schedule and do team travel more sensitively. The way the teams travel now is unnecessarily burdensome and expensive and hiring. I have no idea why we don't do it better because you can do it better.

Is it true that when the Oilers offer sheeted Dustin Penner, at some point you challenged Kevin Loto a fight? Yeah, so they sent him Dustin Penner and I went off on Kevin. And later in the summer, he'd had enough of Brian Birx who's doing an interview. said Ryan Burke, I'm sick of them, tell them anywhere anytime. And I'm like, so I called on Sater the next day. I didn't hear any of this that happened in Edmonton. Someone called me right. So I called on Sater and I was a Newport Beach at my house and I went in the backyard

because my cell phone reception was a little bit better. And I thought my wife was upstairs, but she was standing right there at the kitchen sink. And I was right below the kitchen sink and I called Sater. I said, your buddy just challenged me to a fight. anywhere, anytime. That's not how you challenge someone to a fight. Here's how you challenge someone to a fight. You tell that jerk I'll be in Lake Placid on August, 1st, 2nd, and 3rd. This is true. USA hockey used to have a tournament here with the Swedes and Fins first week of August. I said, I'll be there the first, second and third. I'm staying at the holiday end in Lake Placid. You tell them to get up there. I'll run a barn, I'll kick the crap out of them, and then I'll drive them to the hospital. So I have hung up and next thing I know my wife is three feet behind me heard the whole thing he's goes have you lost your mind and I'm like he challenged me to a fight I'm fighting it like that's that's still right now if you challenge me to a fight

we're fighting that's just one of my roles so she said you know I don't know if Sater called Batman or if my ex-wife felt that but someone called Batman so he called me about ten minutes later he said if I got this right you just challenged Kevin Lottow to a fight and I'm like yeah he said you guys fight him I will suspend you for longer than your contracts if you ought to work for a year or two like Gary he started he said I don't care he started you're not fighting so that was the end and Kevin and I have mended that fence since then it's not a problem he's a great guy but it was just he challenged me to a fight and I'm like I can't have that I can't allow that

well heck you just put them in the Hall of Fame you're one of the guys who votes on who goes in the Hall of Fame and Kevin Lowe just got in. I mean, that's, I mean, you talk about many of fences. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, he's, he's probably, you've probably been asked about that a thousand times in the last week about Kevin Lowe. So the one I want to ask is the final question is I'd read, you know, the Hartford Whalers in all their storied history, the one thing that fans remember is the brass pananza song when they scored. Is it true?

You got rid of that? Yeah. The players asked me to, like, I got rid of Brass Bonanza, and it's a catchy tune. I know I get grief for this. First off, Hartford has a very large place in history in the league. Wherever you go, you see Hartford Whaler's sweaters and hats. Like, it's amazing. People love that team.

And it turned out to be a coach's incubator. Look at the guys that play there that are coaching Dean Aveson, Ewell, Kevin and Eve. Look at the guys that come out of there to turn into coaches. It's amazing. John Anderson, like it turned into a coaching incubator kind of like Miami University was in football. All those football coaches that started at Miami. So Pat Furbique was our captain. He came to me and said, look, it sounds like a college fight song.

The guys don't like it. Can you get rid of it? So I did. Players first, right? Doesn't matter with the fans. Your players come to you and ask for something. You do it. So I did it.

Well, the backlash was severe. Like, people love that song. So as soon as they got rid of me, the following summer, they brought the song back in, initially as a goal song, and then as an end of the rink song, like a regular, you know, like a school song or that college football thing. But yeah, I did it at the player's request, but I got agreed for it. And I still, every once in a while, someone will stop me and say something about it.

I can't believe you got rid of brass band and so I'm like, yeah, whatever. Do you remember what song you guys put in place of Brass Bonanza? No, but I let the players pick that too. Like this is all about, I'm trying to win hockey games. And if you go back, the owner there and I parted ways after a year. Good guy, probably shouldn't have been involved in ownership of a pro team, not suited for it. But good enough gun. We parted ways after a year.

I really think we had a chance if they'd left us alone there, we could have put that team together in a short notice. Because I brought in Sean Birx, and we had the stud goalie. That's the toughest team I ever had. Like everyone talks about how tough Anaheim was, the Hartford Whalers in 92, 93 would have kicked the snot out of my team at Andrew. We had a tough, tough team. And we had really good players, Jeff Sanderson, had 48 goals.

Like that, Popper Beak was a great captain. We would have been fine if we could have kept that progression alive, but it didn't work out. So, no, it was, the song would have come back, but that's, I really enjoyed working there, and that team would have been fine if they left me alone, but that's the story of my life. I've only, the longest I've lasted in one city is six years. I was in Vancouver.

So that's, you're not going to get a chance to win many places if you only last six years. Fair. Well, I appreciate you coming on and making some time for me, staying on a little longer than we discussed. It's been a real treat to have you on and I'd love to get you again at some point, Brian, but thanks again. My pleasure. Thanks. Nice to see it. Well, another throwback Thursday. And I guess to start, I'm contemplating doing one more at the beginning of August. I kind of planned on five and I didn't do my math correct obviously because tomorrow I will be back on the mashup, which I'm looking forward to, but I still might do one more throwback Thursday.

I've been enjoying kind of going back through some old episodes, as you guys all know. We've been listening along. We had Judy Reeves, then Murray McDonnell, Julie Panessie, and now Brian Bernice, and now Brian Burke, and maybe a few of you were wondering about Brian Burke. and, you know, I guess my first thought was I ended on, well, not ended on, obviously we were doing the Coordmaster Final 5, but brought up you can play and basically pride. And I just, it's so interesting to go back and listen to early interviews, right? I just wasn't thinking about any of, you know, what has come to pass or maybe I just wasn't paying attention. Probably wasn't paying attention, if I'm being honest.

I don't mind what Brian was talking about, you know, making sports a safe place and all that other thing. But that's funny. I've ran into lots of people from probably the NHL, if I'm looking at my track record of who I brought on, who have sons who've gotten into drugs and suicide and all a bunch of different things. And, you know, listening to them, you probably start to understand how. long they're gone from their house. Even Brian kind of joking about playing in Providence being the most important four years of his life while his two ex-wives would be pissed about that. And you, you know, everybody by now knows how important family is to me. And, you know, Mel told me a long time ago,

I bring this up for every once in a while. When I went to play hockey in Finland, She basically told me if I made the NHL, she wasn't coming along. And I remember being so perplexed by that. I'm like, what are you talking about? If I make the NHL, for sure you're coming along. I'm going to be a millionaire. And, you know, we've since chatted about that lots. And she just told me she didn't want to be at home alone while I was gone all over the place.

And I didn't understand that back then. And as I get a little older, I guess I'm beginning to understand that more and more of just how much those guys are gone. Does that mean you can't be an NHL player and have a successful merit? No, that's a ridiculous thing to say. Just that, you know, where I sit in life, I want my family to come along with me all the time. And, you know, family first type mindset. So I guess, interesting. I'm coming to the end of July.

And July is, you know, the month I take off from the podcast, we've enjoyed a very good month. It has been enjoyable to get away. I would say I'm itching to get back to podcasting tomorrow. I guess as you're listening to this, I'm sitting down for my first podcast in a while. I guess Kerry Lutz, I recorded one podcast all of July. That was Carrie Lutz. I shouldn't even say that. Rob Schneider kind of came out of the blue.

But tomorrow is, you know, at the start of beginning August, where I'm back full time and I'll be recording lots. Now, that's going all over the place. This throwback Thursday, why did I pick Brian Burke? Brian Burke was the first guest I had that I can recall, at least, where he talks about the snowstorm. And before that, he'd never played organized hockey. Now, they get stranded in a snowstorm,

and he ends up going and watching some high-level hockey and falling in love with the game. and from there he starts playing organized hockey the next year and he goes badham house badham house midget b midget a high school playing in his fifth year of organized hockey he was playing minnesota high school hockey his sixth year he goes on to play a providence college where lou lamerello was coaching nonetheless and he flies out there as a walk on not knowing if he's going to make it he makes it, you know, and the story goes on. And it's funny, listening back to it, I still remember this moment. I'm like, so you're telling me, a snowstorm is the reason you start playing hockey and

then you go on to have this like miraculous career. And he's yeah, you ever think about that? Yeah, I think about that. And I remember back then being like, what is that? Because I have a similar story. I was playing hockey in Dryden. And I had two colleges I was going to. look at. So I took a trip down to Minnesota and Wisconsin. And the first place I went to was St. Scalaska. And at the time, they were rated top five in the United States and Division three hockey. So very good. And an hour away was Northland College, which that season, they didn't win a game. So if you're a hockey player, what place are you taking? I'll add on to it. Scalaska had like every facility under the sun was top notch.

Northland College, to this date, probably has the worst arena I've ever played in. Even the only one I, when I got to interview Paul Bissinette, the only rink that came comparable was where ASU played. Their rink until they got their new one was, was, it wasn't as bad as Ashlands, but in fairness, they were D1. So it was pretty bad. Anyways. So, I go down for this trip. and stay the first night in Scalaska, and I felt like a bit of an outsider. It was a tough group of guys, now very, very high-end hockey players, et cetera, et cetera.

And the next day I drive to Asheville, and I told him where I was going, and I said, I'll be back tonight. Sounds good. My junior roommate was who I was staying with in Scalaska. So I go to Northland. Love the campus. Love the people. Loved everything about it, except they sucked. and the coach walked me through the rink and I was like, oh my God, this is horrific.

And then he walked me through the wait room. The wait room was like going, I can't even describe the weight room. I've never seen anything quite like it. Going to the basement into like an old dungeon that the newest piece of equipment was from the 1970s. Like it was bad. And so the coach goes to you all. want to spend the night. No, I got to get back. My call. Yeah, fair enough. Not a big deal.

And so I was driving a Mustang back then. And so anyways, I get in the car and I'm like, well, love this college campus, love, you know, even the guys just seemed super friendly. And I got my car and I started driving. And I didn't get even outside of Ashland. And there was a miserable snowstorm going on. And so I stopped filled up with gas. And as I'm doing that, two ambulances go flying down this road.

And this road, if you've ever been to northern Ontario where it's single lane, 90 kilometers an hour, you know, it's a long hour. It's not a nice, it is in the summer, but in the wintertime, it wasn't a nice little drive. And so I sat there and I went, oh, man, are you really going to do this? And the coach had written his number on the back of his card. So I went to a pay phone and pulled out a couple quarters, I assume, and called. called him and he said hey and i said uh you still got a place for me to stay tonight he goes yeah for sure so i went back and um yeah i ended up partying that night with a guy who stood up in his wedding and uh the girl he got married to was mel's best friend and you know and then of course the first

girl i meet on campus when i go to northland uh is is uh becomes my wife and you know i i think back to that snowstorm. I'm like, what was that? You know? And so Brian Burke telling this story, I'm like, what is that? And I chased what is that for a long time? Because Glenn Sather has a similar story where he meets his wife on a overpass, if memory serves me correct, in New York City. You think of all the millions of people and he pulls over to help a lady who becomes his wife. I'm like, what is that? And, you know, Glenn Sater, it said, oh, there's just some things you don't need to understand. I've never been happy with that

answer. And so Brian Burke was one of the first that I heard the story and I'm like, that is weird. What is that? And that what is that has led me down the path that I'm on, you know? And so it was a really cool interview to go back and listen to. I think Brian Burke has a lot of interesting stories and good feedback for, you know, like when I first started the podcast, it was exactly what I was looking for. I wanted really successful people to explain to younger kids how you get to the next level. And I mean, you know, this is a guy who hadn't played organized hockey and then goes from Bannam House to, you know, the Philadelphia Flyers like not that long after being like, yeah, we want you to come play. And he had four rules. Hardest worker, be the hardest worker, be the coach's dream. and the indispensable teammate, get to know all the guys, and play tough.

I'm like, that's not every kid can do that. And even now, you know, so many of those things have served me well in podcasting. Either way, it was a cool throwback for me to go back to. And one other thing that stuck out was technology. You know, this phone that I'm talking into right now as I sit at the lake, you know, and one of the things I try and take a break from in July is the phone because, you know, it's constantly dinging and things going on and, you know, you get a great episode and all of a sudden it just lights up and goes crazy. You have a, you know, like the 12-hour live stream and over a thousand texts come in and, I mean, that's hard to get back through and I try my best. but you know like and then you know you just hit different things where where things go pretty wild anyways him talking about how the st louis blues used to close for a month and the month was

july they said yep after this time nobody's going to be in the office uh to me that just seems healthy but in today's world we have to be connected all the time and that's wild to me because you know like uh part of what i think makes me decent at podcasting is I love it. But even things you love, you just need to take a little break from. And if you're done with it, you know, like a month then I would would not want to be podcasting. Today I started working the phone because I'm like, okay, it's time to get on this. I want to get some guests back lined up. And like, I can't wait to get back podcasting. And a month away, it only took a week and I was twitchy. I was like, it's, I go. But then I remind myself, this is a month. You have stuff

coming out, you do this so you can be with your wife and kids and then and then let's go after it. And I'm really glad I took the month of July off and I'm really excited for August and for the rest of the year for that matter. I think there's a lot of possibilities out there. But yeah, the Brian Burke interview was super cool. I guess my final thought on it, you know, I had written two things down. Have as many. good options as you can. If you got good options, you'll always make good choices. I thought, huh, that's a pretty good thought process for anyone. And I liked, he said, you know, Canada didn't have to embrace Brian Burke. Brian Burke had to embrace Canada. He read the newspaper and knew who his

MLA was. The fact he said MLA, I laughed. I'm like, that's a guy who knows more politics than how many Canadians these days. And I would have been one of them. I didn't certainly want to caught it back then, folks. I'm not here to judge anyone. You know, like, I wouldn't even know who my MLA was if I would have known to even catch MLA. So I thought there was, there was a lot in that interview. And that's one of the things I've enjoyed about going back, you know, picking one out and being like this, yeah, this was a good interview. I really enjoyed this. But there was a really. But there reason why was Brian Burke had the story of the snowstorm and I've thought lots about that since I'm as there's these moments in time where God's like nope you're supposed to be going this way and I'm going to put a

snowstorm in your way you still have the choice you could drive through it you can get it how much you know but if you pay attention those little moments you know I look at I'm sitting I'm sitting at my my wife's families cabin on a lake in northern Minnesota and uh you know we just we're just about to celebrate our 11th anniversary we just went back to ashwam where we went to college and had a really wonderful time together and and uh i was saying to vesper who's coming back on the mashup spoiler but since you're listening this long the spoiler uh vesper did well last week we got tons of good feedback so he's going to come back on with me and me and two is we're going to have a three-way for a mash-up see how it goes but i's telling vespore you know like it's pretty crazy to me 11 years in

to our marriage 17 years together almost 18 i guess how much i enjoy spending time with my wife you know like what uh and i told him i like it sounds corny it's like no you're just a romantic you just and that's okay i'm like oh yeah fair enough so i guess uh If you're married, give your wife a hug. Because on this side, they're the, I mean, they make the world go around. It's been pretty cool ride. And I appreciate you guys. Well, you know, I don't know, sticking in while I take a month off and enjoying some time away.

I'm excited to get back rolling. I've got a list of guest suggestions that people have been sending me through the month of July. And I've been keeping a tally on some of the names and certainly been trying to track down a few of them and I'm going to do my best here as we get back into Canada. We'll be back early next week. We get back on either Monday night or Tuesday and there's going to be hopefully in the next month or two a lot of cool things going down as far as the new studio and Cornerstone forum and the list goes on and I'm excited for that.

Hope your guys is July has been great as well and well I look forward to hearing and and seeing all the techs come flying in as the new guests start to roll. And we get back to, you know, Monday through Thursdays where we got new guests coming on and the mashup and everything else. I think there's, you know, we can stare at the abyss and see what Cannes be coming. And certainly there's a lot to be worried about. But I think there's a lot of positive of sitting there too. And you folks, this community is a big chunk of that.

Like there's a lot of positive in this community and I'm happy to be a part of it. I'm happy at times to be able to facilitate it. And, well, I'm looking forward to what the last part of this, half of this year brings. And we're going to try and push it as hard as we can go. So that's another throwback Thursday. There might be one more. I'm really thinking about doing next Thursday as a throwback. So don't be surprised if there's one there.

but I've enjoyed the throwbacks through the month of July and I hope you have too and that's all I got for you. 17 minutes. I think that's long enough. We'll catch up to you on the mashup on Friday.