Shawn Ryan Show - #196 Joshua Broome - "Rocco Reed," Inside The Adult Film Industry

Episode Date: May 1, 2025

Joshua Broome is a former adult film star turned pastor, speaker, and advocate for redemption. Born in Charlotte, North Carolina, he entered the porn industry in his early 20s, earning accolades like “Porn Star of the Year” and appearing in over 1,000 films before walking away in 2013. After hitting rock bottom—struggling with identity, shame, and a life unraveling—he found faith, left the industry, and rebuilt from scratch. Now married with four children, Broome shares his raw journey of transformation, warning about the destructive ripple effects of porn on marriages, mental health, and society. Shawn Ryan Show Sponsors: ⁠⁠⁠https://www.roka.com⁠⁠⁠ - USE CODE SRS ⁠⁠https://www.americanfinancing.net/SRS⁠⁠ NMLS 182334, nmlsconsumeraccess.org ⁠⁠https://www.expressvpn.com/SRS⁠⁠ ⁠⁠https://www.shawnlikesgold.com⁠⁠ ⁠⁠https://www.hillsdale.edu/SRS⁠⁠ ⁠⁠https://www.shopify.com/SRS⁠⁠ ⁠⁠https://trueclassic.com/SRS⁠⁠ ⁠⁠https://www.ziprecruiter.com/SRS⁠ Joshua Broome Links: X - ⁠https://x.com/iamJoshuaBroome⁠  Instagram - ⁠https://www.instagram.com/iamjoshuabroome⁠ Book - ⁠https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/154600565X⁠ Book me to speak - ⁠https://www.joshuabroome.me/speaking-requests⁠ Resources for unwanted sexual behavior - ⁠https://ignitemen.net/the-p51-project Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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I didn't realize that that scene was for the most popular website in America at that time. When I heard the pain in her voice, when she said, why did you do that? Satan said to me, see, you're exactly who you thought you were. Joshua Broom, welcome to the show, man. Man, so glad to be here, what an honor. I'm pumped to have you. So we got a mutual friend, Victor Marks, huh?

What a guy. Victor shot me a text this morning and I love your Victor. You never know what you're gonna hear. But you never know. It could be a four minute voice memo of just chaos. Yeah, yeah, but I'm pumped that you know him and and That's just reinforces, you know, you're good people to be around if Victor's hanging out with you. So so once again thank you for coming man and

So we're gonna talk about a little bit of your life story and little bit of your life story and inside into the adult film industry what got you out of it and being a pastor now so so and I'm sure we'll go down a handful of rabbit holes you know throughout the interview but I'm really curious you know it's I mean the adult film industry is huge. What's that girl's name? This is the girl that's, she's like. She slept with a thousand guys in 24 hours or something like that.

And I. And now like, now it seems like all these other girls are like trying to top it. You just keep hearing this stuff. Like there was some other girl, I think it was in Miami, she was shooting a film set or like some kind of a gang bang or something on a balcony and like fell off the balcony to her death.

Yeah. I mean, I think what we're seeing is, you know, content creation became a legitimized career and then because we live in an over sexualized culture, and then you see the birth and rise up of OnlyFans. Those worlds kind of intermeshed, and it really happened during COVID. During COVID, OnlyFans production, people who are participating in OnlyFans went up by 1600%. 1600%? 1600%.

And then porn consumption went up 400%. Wow. And but what you would see is essentially they were using social media like a funnel in that, you know, I've met with many girls who used to be in OnlyFans or girls that worked on the marketing arm of OnlyFans and the way they would work is you know once a girl became popular once they became you know the top 10% they would grab that girl and they would say hey we're gonna represent you we're gonna take great care of you and they would bring them

into a studio and they would shoot all this stock footage and they're say hey we're gonna 10x you know youx the way that you're being monetized because we're going to shoot all this footage. And then we're going to have 30 random guys in a basement in the Philippines or whatever. They're going to be chatting with the people. So they're going to have your password. You're not going to have to be on OnlyFans anymore.

We're just going to shoot all this stock content. and it's like catfishing 2.0, where you pay per message, per video, per picture, and then you got a guy sitting there pretending to be her and you're talking with these people and they're saying whatever in the comments and they're just plugging, playing stuff from stock footage. So once a month, they just go and shoot all this footage now you got this You know this stuff to work with and you're just plugging and playing so now they can be talking to 30 people at once

But they're talking to no one at all and then you know they're getting you know 75 80 percent of that revenue damn so you're not even so to the person that is you know addicted to onlyfans So you're not even so to the person that is you know addicted to only fans if you're talking to a popular creator I can almost guarantee you you're not talking to that person. No kidding Why do you think why do you think that I mean we're gonna get way more in depth on this stuff later on but I mean what Where does this shit end? Yeah, I mean, it's, it's just, I mean it's like anything else you see right, but it's just they're constantly one-upping each other like oh how, how, you know, how disgusting can I make it? You know, a thousand, a thousand dudes in

24 hours? Yeah, I mean. What does that even look like? I mean, how do you even recruit that? Yeah, I mean, unfortunately, it's pretty easy. Because I was in the porn industry for almost seven years. When girls would do gang bangs, because guys that were professionally in the industry, for the most part, didn't do gangbanks because a director's not paying you know top You know because you have a day rate you have an individual rate that you you make per day So you're not paying that per guy You know so you're finding anyone off the street that's willing to go get an SED and AIDS test

So you're probably you might not be paying them at all. So, you know, and these girls, again, they got all these fans, all you gotta do is post a story in the comments saying, hey, anyone in this vicinity that follows me, do you wanna be part of this? Go get a test, bring the test here, and you get to have sex with me.

And it works. And as I wear like social media is working like a funnel now where the girls, they're supposed to be provocative on TikTok and in the TikTok it says go to my IG and on IG there's a little link in their pledge and here's my link tree and on my link tree is my OnlyFans. And it's just a big funnel to sell porn.

Geez. Geez, isn't Kanye West getting back into the, not back into, is he getting into it? Or he just had his girlfriend pretty much naked at whatever awards show that was. I don't follow any of this. Yeah, it's wild, man, because like. And kids were around.

Yeah. It's like little kids looking at this. Yeah. Like you see little kids looking at this. Yeah. You see Kanye go from someone who was having these church things and had pretty decent Christian rap come out and then really go on this bender. But I would say, man, the guy that experienced significant brokenness in his life, and I think to the person who's saying, man, how could this person actually

know Jesus? I think he liked the idea of Jesus. But for Jesus to invade and to help you, to invade your heart, you have to surrender and submit. And that's not a natural thing. Especially to the guy who has millions upon millions of dollars and everyone around him saying, like, you're the guy, you're the guy, you're the guy. For you to say, I'm not the guy, and the way to find healing and wholeness is for me to bend my knee to the Lordship of Jesus Christ. That's very different than acknowledging that something exists. So I would just say, I think he liked the idea of Jesus, and then he experienced some brokenness, and he was trying really hard to be okay, and he just wasn't.

Yeah. Because he just kind of been up down up down up down But I saw like he he got kicked off of Twitter cuz he just went on this like rampage He posted like porn like for you know two or three hours like non-stop just posting like hardcore pornography Right after that happened like right after he showed up to the award show with this with the girl is it his wife I don't know or who I don't follow any of this stuff You know, it's like he was he was married to a Kardashian and they got you know, yeah, I mean, I Don't know what I don't know exactly what happened, but it's sad. It's sad

Yeah, you know, well I got your I got your whole life's outline right here, but I don't really want to go down the outline I'm I just I think this is gonna be a very fascinating conversation and And so I just want a brief. Yeah, I hope you're okay with that. But you know, I really want to talk about you know in a lot of my interviews we talk about like the effects of war and and and and Extreme trauma and how to get over it and what that does and the rabble, you know, the downward spiral that sends you on. And I just have this feeling that this is going to be very similar to that. And to be honest with you, I tried to get Jenna Jamison to come on here to talk about

this. I've been trying to get her for years, but I think she's got some health stuff going on but yeah, but yeah it's just always been a subject that I'm I've been really interested to dive into and and especially like I don't are you familiar with like Them the the effects that it you know that it has on kids Absolutely, and in the addictions and all that kinda, I mean, this stuff is like really bad. Yeah, I mean, you look at, you know,

look at research, average age of exposure three years ago was 11, it's trending towards eight years old now. And- Eight? Eight years old. And what's interesting is so 84% of first time exposure to pornography for kids is secondhand exposure, meaning that they weren't looking for it.

They were either on an unprotected device and it was looking for them because this is the world that we live in, because of streaming and things like that. Everything has porn on it to the extent, depend on what your definition of porn would be. And then just being at school or someone else's home and then it was shown to them. But it's crazy, man. Not to come out swinging, but I would say probably the most dramatic thing I would share with you

is that, so a really good friend of mine, she once was a critical care nurse in Kansas City, Missouri. About six months ago, she started a nonprofit and she's just speaking on this full time. But she started seeing a reoccurring theme and it was that, so she was an examiner for sexual abuse cases of children and she was noticing over and over again that two things were happening, that the abuser of the child was between 10 to 14 years old and it was a sibling. And she was like, well, and it was a lot of cases like that in Kansas City.

And she was like, is there just something weird going on here? And she started asking her peers in different places. Her name's Heidi Olson. I know where you're going with this. I think I know where you're going with this. I interviewed somebody a while ago where I was talking with somebody

and we were talking about, like before the show was we were talking about like before the show we're Talking about the sexual exploitation of kids and yeah Are you going into? He told me that the the number one Most searched type of porn is incest. Yes. Is that where you're going with this? Yeah, well, I mean just just the reality that so in around 60% of the sexual assault cases that happen to children in the United States, the perpetrator is A, between 10 to 14 years old, and B, it's a sibling. So that's, it's in the 60% in the US, it's higher in Europe, highest in Australia, around 73%.

And then fastest growing niche of pornography is incestual, the stepbrother, step sister stuff. And the reality is, 100% of the cases, the kids are addicted to porn. They're watching porn, they're developing fantasies, and then they're superimposing these fictitious desires, they're imposing them on their sibling. They're tying up their brother and sister and raping them because they've developed an appetite for something that they don't know what to do with and the porn doesn't. Again, like we were talking earlier, this belief that you can consume something and

it not have a real impact on your output. Like in what world does that make sense? You can't like whatever you ingest, once it metabolizes, there has to be somewhere for it to go. Wow. So to the person thinking, you know, porn's harmless, who can it hurt? Kids. There you go. and at a significant rate. We'll get more into that real quick Let me everybody starts out with an intro Joshua broom

You're a guy who went from a small town, South Carolina to the bright lights of Hollywood Chasing the acting dream only to fall into the adult film industry You became Rocco Reed starring in over 1,000 films and raking in over a million dollars as one of the top male performers on the planet. You're a man who hit rock bottom, staring down depression and suicidal thoughts until God stepped in. You're a voice behind the Counterfeit Culture podcast and the Unmentionable Docky series, the Counterfeit Culture podcast and the Unmentionable Docky series, taking the fight to the very industry you once ruled, you're now a pastor, a husband, and a father of four. And something else I want to jive into is spiritual warfare.

Yeah. As you know, we got a Patreon account. They're our top supporters. They've been with us since the beginning when I was doing this in the attic of my house and their supports brought us here and now we're building a new studio. I've got an amazing team who you've met. And so one of the things I do is I offer them each and every guest that comes on, they get the opportunity to ask a question.

And so this one's from Stephen Casey. What would you recommend to parents of children so that they could set up their family's habits to prevent their children from being lured either passively or actively into the environment that caused you so much grief and pain in this hurting others, the porn industry? Yeah, I mean, you know, this as someone who was in the military, and, you know, anyone that's been around athletics, I mean, you know this as someone who was in the military and anyone that's been around athletics, I have to have good self-awareness before I can have discipline. So for us, as

parents, we can't believe that we can just protect our kids from the world. The Bible tells us that bad things will happen. The world is not a safe place. You can't protect your kids from everything. So I would say the way to protect them is you inform them. So talk about sex in an age-appropriate way that is real and that is helpful. There's a there's a book called a good book Thanks good book bad pictures and So it's I think it's been around for about 20 years, but there's a there's a theme in it that's helpful for even adults there are Bad pictures in the world that you probably will see but if you see those pictures that doesn't make you bad So if you see them if you're hungry run to mom and dad scared run to mom and dad see something you shouldn't see

Come tell mom and dad so that we can process it with you because if you don't create a space to have that conversation What you don't talk about says something. So I would say that's the biggest problem with porn, sex, in the church, where it's not talked about in the way that gives people a comfortability of talking about it. Because anytime that you would say porn or sex and you cringe, you probably have an unhealthy relationship with it. So say, hey, sex is this beautiful thing, this is how you got here, to your son, to your daughter, and explain it in a way that makes sense. And also, we need to protect ourselves from the world.

The world is a dangerous place trying to come at us. So B.A.R.K. is a really great piece of technology where you, you know, bark.org is the website and you get to control everything that your children has access to, if they're gonna use any kind of smart technology. And what I love about it is you get a report of everything that they see and everything that they're sent. So if you're allowing them to use text messages, emails, things like that, you will get a notification

if someone's, you know, there's bullying, there's any kind of conversation around self-harm, either by them or someone else, anything pornographic, any key words, and then you can have a healthy conversation where instead of being accusatory of, hey, I know that I saw this, you know that I saw this, so you know, fess up. You can say, hey, is there anything that was said to you or you saw today that you want to talk about with me? So I would say that's how we have to navigate

that conversation because what we don't say is not helpful, but it also says something. Yeah. Because, you know, Romans 12, either you're being conformed by the world or being transformed by the renewing of your mind. So the world is going to teach you, but the prince of the air, the devil, wants to teach you something that's drastically different than what God wants to teach you. Yeah, you know, I mean, with the phone stuff, we were just talking about Ryan Montgomery,

my friend before the podcast, and he had an interesting quote that made a hell of a lot of sense to me. He said, when you give your kid a phone, you're not giving your kid access to the world. You're giving the world access to your kid. And that's resonated with me ever since. But you had mentioned age appropriate had mentioned it age appropriate. When, what is age appropriate now? I mean, you just mentioned earlier that eight years old is eight year olds.

How old are your kids? So my kids, so Cannon is almost seven, but so six, four, three, and one. So, I mean, for example, Cannon, last year when he was still 6, there's this apologetics camp that I always speak at and I teach sexual ethic. And he comes with me because I'm not saying anything that's inappropriate. I'm saying everything that's true and everything that I'm saying is biblically accurate. So he's heard me, he sits up on stage and he's probably drawing Paw Patrol or something like that, but he's hearing me, he's listening. So I would say there's no line in the sand with kids, just pay attention to them and just know your kids. I mean, how do you bring it up?

Yeah. Have you had any one-on-ones yet? Yeah. I mean, just the fact that we've got four kids, like mommy's pregnant, where is this baby coming from? Mommy's parts are different than ours. She's outmanned in our house significantly. But they're just asking questions.

You know, like, why do I have something different than mom? Where do babies come from? Stuff like that. They're just kind of naturally inquisitive. So we just tell them the truth. You know, and I think, but like, you know, we don't get, you know, over, we don't over explain ourselves. We just say it, you know, matter of fact, and it is what it is. And I think like when you make, when you make it a bigger deal than it should be, it becomes a big deal. You know?

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think about this stuff all the time, you know, I got a little one little ones. Yeah, and and it just Man, the shit that's out there now just is terrifying. Yeah, and I I can see how it will Be it can destroy your mind, yeah in those certain aspects of destroy your mind in those certain aspects of, in just so many ways. You all know what speed dating is, right? Well, if you're the owner of a growing business,

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Well, another thing I was sharing with you around the whole incest thing regarding the niche and pornography and all the stuff that's happening with sexual assault. But in addition to that, image-based sexual exploitation, you know, that's a new thing that's on the rise, especially with young men. But the importance of kids not watching porn is this. There's a new scam that's on the rise. And I think so far this year, this has happened, I think around 170,000 times it's been documented where a kid was approached by a scammer and they have a fictitious profile, looks like a cute girl, and they have an interaction

with a guy and they send them a fake naked picture and they said, you send me one back and once they send one got you okay I want you to send me $500 or I've hacked your account I'm gonna send this photo to everyone at your school all of your family you got 24 hours and I think around 150 of those kids committed suicide. Because as a teenage boy, you're like, my whole life is ruined. Yeah, or a girl. Yeah.

Wow. Yeah, and it's wild, because around 90% of those cases are guys. But yeah, I mean, it's everywhere. That's why it's so important to have those conversations because you don't send a naked photo to someone you don't know online unless you've been watching pornography. That's not a rational thought unless your mind has been corrupted and perverted in a

way that maybe there's exceptions to this, but for the most part, that thinking comes from pornography. Yeah, I mean, I was talking to somebody else and they were talking about how this, it starts with regular, it starts with, I don't know, sports illustrator. And then it's Playboy, and then it's softcore porn, and then it's hardcore porn, and then it's gang bangs, and then it's, you know, it just gets, and then it goes into the incest

stuff. And they were talking about how young men, boys get addicted to this, and it just keeps getting more perverted and more perverted and more perverted. And at the same time, the kids that are the same age, the girls are online and they're getting exploited and they're only talking to older men online because, or they get trapped like you were just saying, but it's, hey, do you want this Louis Vuitton bag? Cool. Send me this. Then they're blackmailed. Or they're not, and they're only interested in older men because they shoot some pictures

or take some videos of themselves for the new iPhone, a new purse, whatever the latest fad is. And so that takes the interest away from the boys, so then the boys don't even have anybody to go date, and it's like this fucked up. Yeah, I mean, that's why, I mean, we're living in a post-Christian United States. I mean, luckily, there's been some, you know, progress in the right direction. I saw Bible cells are up 22%, you know. But for the most part, it's like the world is looking dark and bleak in some ways.

But yeah, it's nuts, man. Yeah, yeah. Well, everybody gets a gift on the show. This is Vigilance 3 Gummy Bears. Thank you so much. Made in the USA, no funny business. Very cool. This is candy. They're horrible for it, but they taste great. Awesome, thank you so much. Made in the USA. No funny business. Very handy. Awesome. Horrible for it. But they taste great. Awesome. Thank you so much.

Yeah, you're welcome. I have something for you. Oh, nice. So I have a copy of my book. Copy of my book. And what I love to do to that book. So Seven Lives that'll ruin your life. So really, it's like, hey, here's seven lies from culture that negatively impacted my life, and then here's seven truths from God's Word that kind of eradicated that lie and gave me a new foundation to stand on. Kind of like a progressive overloading workout plan. If you do, you know, 10 sets of two for 10 weeks, you will get stronger in the same way. If you apply God's word to your life, your life will change. But man, my life, like just me being in this room, you know, how, you

know, like got out of plan, you know, but I would say my life has been made up of people inviting me into places that I don't have any business being into because they saw something in me and people that gave me time that they didn't have. And so this is my friend Jonathan Percluta's new book. It says it's called Your Story Has a Villain, and he just did like a two or three year deep dive into spiritual warfare. Grew up Catholic, kind of, you know, threw it by the wayside and kind of lived for the world and, you know, was very successful in the marketplace and then came to faith later in life.

And, you know, he's been part of, you know, some of those college revivals that you've seen, like baptizing thousands of people at college campuses and stuff. But he was a part of that? Yeah. So he's one of the people that had been part of each event, him and Jenny Allen, along with Tanya. But yeah, so he's there preaching at every event and baptizing those kids. Very cool. those kids. But it's wild because he poured into this guy, Andrew, that poured into me and just kind of a neat discipleship circle. But I wanted to give you that. I love giving people, you know, literature that was, it's

simple, it's clear, and you know, it was a game-ch changer for me. But he's somebody that, you know, Proverbs 27.6 talks about the wounds of a friend, and while sometimes you need to hear encouragement, but everyone's wanting to kick in the butt. Pete Slauson Yeah. Thank you. I can't wait to dive in. We've been tracking this guy. Jared Slauson Yeah. Pete Slauson We've been tracking this guy. Jared Slauson Yeah, he's a good, good friend of mine. So,

he lives in Waco. So, he pastors a church, good friend of mine. So he lives in Waco. So he pastors a church in Waco, so a little bit north of me in Dallas. Interesting. But phenomenal dude. Phenomenal dude. He's the biggest, tallest person that I know that does not play basketball. Off right on. Well, I love the spiritual warfare topic.

It's fascinating. So we'll... Oh yeah. He's got, you have to ask him about Victor also. I will. I will. Yeah. But let's, so I know you grew up in South Carolina, correct?

And I mean, how old were you when you got into the porn industry? Yeah. If I could take what you said and just back up a little bit, I think it's so important. So I grew up in South Carolina. Mom got pregnant with me when she was 15, had me at 16, in a super small town, one gas station, one grocery store. And my dad was in that town, but never in my life.

And my mom worked at this like flounder and fried chicken, you know, like restaurant. And it had like big glass windows and the windows I would sit there and I'd eat pretty much the same thing. I pretty much eat the same thing after school every day. This is what I was earlier. But I would look out that window and it was called, Rogers was called the convenience store and Rogers is my grandfather. And also, my father was Roger Dell Jr. and he was Roger Dell Sr. and I saw the convenience store and I saw the green Z71 like pull up every once in a while and so I saw him.

You mean your dad? It was my dad and I saw him. So he was in close enough proximity for me to see him often, but never know him. And I was confronted with, so I was confronted with, you know, over and over again, not being chosen. And, you know, just the way that attachment theory works, you know, neurologically, just how we develop an understanding of our emotions. It's like, man, I had this conflict and this chaos that I didn't understand. And the way that I made sense of it must be on me.

You know, there must be something wrong with me that he's not choosing me. So the best I can do is try to overcome. How young were you when you started seeing that? I mean, nine, ten. I mean, when I started like comprehending it. But my whole life. Yeah, my whole life.

Up until I graduated high school. No interaction at all, just looking at him through a window? Yeah, I mean, there was probably like a few times where there was some fumbled awkward attempt for us to have a conversation. There was never any malice involved, but it was just strange. And in retrospect, at a place now, I can have an understanding of, man, what stays in the dark grows. And today is the easiest day to apologize for the thing that you did today. Tomorrow is going to be even harder. And the next day, and the next day, and the next day, it's just going to compound over

time, especially with our shame involved. So I don't think he's like, man, I don't want to be this kid's dad. Maybe he didn't know what to say. And then so much time passed by, he just became crippled by it. But either way, it impacted me. And so then I go to college, study theater, I was in a fraternity, all the stuff. And I was sharing earlier with someone, one of your team members, I was sharing how my fraternity brother was the one who taught me how to tie a tie for the first time. Because our fraternity, we wore suit and tie on Tuesdays

in a pin. And they were like, man, you can't be wearing a clip on. You'll get a smack down for that. And I was like, man, I can't be wearing a clip on, you know, you'll get a smack down for that. And I was like, man, I don't know how to tie a tie. And I remember my big brother like teaching me how to tie this like single Windsor tie. And, you know, stuck with me forever, you know? And just like moments like that, it was,

it's this like duality of, I'll always be this like kid that his daddy didn't want, but also like, man, I need guys in my life to teach me something. But kind of like with that foundation, I believed at my core, my being is like, man, if I earn enough, if I become enough, if I do enough, maybe I'll feel as if I'm enough. And what I really wanted to hear was, son, I'm proud of you. And because I never heard that, I thought I could earn it from the world. Yeah.

And, you know, I was just kind of one of those guys where like everything I did, I found success in, like I was a good, I was a good ball player, I was good at acting, I had a lot of success in modeling. So kind of took that to Hollywood and I had an agent and I was having more success in modeling than acting but everything was great. I was living in Hollywood, had a great place to stay, had a good friend group, had a great agent, had opportunities. But I just want to backtrack real quick. I think that affects a lot of people.

Oh, yeah. And with my kids, I've made it a point, I make it a point to make sure I tell my kids I'm proud of them every day, multiple times a day. Tell them why I'm proud of them, not just, hey, I'm proud of you. I tell them why I'm proud of them. And even if they don't understand, you know, it's in there. Yeah. I think what you said is so important, that added layer.

Because it's one thing to say, I'm proud of you, or you did a good job, or whatever that might be. But when you make it intentional and explain why, I feel like that would be even more meaningful and allow them to understand. But yeah, I mean, kind of all that foundation led me to that moment of being in Hollywood and still acting like an idiot, like living like an absolute fool. But kind of with all that factored in, I saw porn for the first time when I was 13. Never saw my mom in a healthy relationship.

She was married for a very short period of time to someone who was very abusive, drug addict. So, outside of that, I never saw her in a healthy dynamic. My grandmother and grandfather, they didn't sleep in the same bed. My grandfather was fishing every day, bad back or whatever, they didn't share a bed. I just had no foundation of what is a healthy relationship? What is love? What is intimacy?

What is, never had a sex talk, saw porn when I was 13, and I thought, man, maybe if I act out what I'm seeing in this magazine, maybe I'll feel what I don't. And that was kind of the start of me living a very promiscuous lifestyle in addition to that. Did you ever, did your dad ever come into the picture? Still to this day? Well, I mean, I have a really great story about forgiveness. Because at the end of the day, it's like, I'd say I love that I get to share. Thank you for asking that. And I love that I have the platform that I do today with the maturity that I do because when I used to talk about him, when I used to talk about him, I think I did it in a way that I was still a little bit angry with him. But I forgave him and it was a big moment for me because, you know, when like, forgiveness

is easy or easier when you know that reconciliation is on the other side. But when reconciliation doesn't meet your expectations, are you still willing to forgive? Meaning that, why would I forgive my dad if he's not gonna become my dad and become a grandfather to my kids? Why would I forgive him? Why would I forgive the person that's not gonna change? Why would I forgive the person that did wrong

and is not gonna be sorry for it or pay a price for that? I understand that God is a God of justice and justice will be served in the end, but we often find ourselves saying, I want to play God in some way. I want to control the outcome. I want to have some kind of autonomy and I'll forgive if, not in God's economy, not in God's kingdom, we forgive because we've been forgiven. And when you don't forgive, the person who pays the price is you. And for a long time, I was dealing with, man, it was on the other side of me conquering

all these other things, like all these addictions and traumas and lust and all that stuff, but I was still wrestling with a little bit of anger issues. And it was because I would, like in my heart of hearts, I would say, man, the messed up say about me or say about me to my wife or say about my kids or whatever. There was a little part of me that said, Dad, if you would have been there, I wouldn't have done those things and this wouldn't have been happening. So it's kind of your fault. And I had to come to grips with that's not true. Like my trauma impacted the way that I saw the world, yes.

But upon my own volition, I made those decisions. I have free will. So I had to take ownership of my mistakes and I had to let go of that with him. I speak about him very differently. I speak about him with more empathy today than I have in the past. We don't have the relationship that I wish we did, but... Pete Where'd you learn forgiveness from? Jared Victor. Pete Me too. Me too.

Me too. Really? Yeah, no bullshit. After hearing his story, and he forgave his dad, and what he did, I was like, whoa. And he called me one day and told me I needed to forgive somebody for something they did that is a friend of his and I Was like are you fucking asking me to forgive this asshole and he's he's like yes. I am and I was like I Was like

Man after what you've been through it's really hard to say no to you, but Ben, after what you've been through, it's really hard to say no to you, but... I'll figure out how to do it. And you know what I realized? For me, at least. Forgiveness isn't for the other person. Forgiveness is for yourself. Because you imprison yourself in that fucking resentment, in that anger... And it just never leaves, and every time, you know time the name comes up, it's like, but if you

can, and it's hard. It is hard, man, to just let it go. You pull yourself out of that prison. But I learned that from Victor, too. And I tell people that. I don't know if it resonates or not, but I learned that from Victor too. And I tell people that and I thought, you know, I don't, I don't know if it resonates or not, but you have to think of that's how, that's how I have to think of it. If I don't forgive this person, it's going to eat me alive.

Yeah. And, uh, and it will eat you alive. Yeah. And, uh, and when I was able to do it, like it, man, it's like having a 10,000 pound rucksack lifted off your back. Oh yeah. But so you forgave your dad. Yeah. Did you tell him that? Yeah. How did that go? I mean it was super emotional. I mean I was I was so like I'd made up my mind what I was going to say before it got too far.

So as soon as I got him on the phone, I said it soon. He apologized. What did he say? I don't remember much about it. It was more, it wasn't this like, he's not an it was like It wasn't like I conjured up in my head. I thought it was gonna be this Yeah, I great this groundbreaking moment where you know, I thought was gonna be like, you know Rocky and Apollo like, you know Dappen up on the beach But yeah, I mean what did you say I said I said I'm sorry that I blamed you for every bad thing that I've ever done.

And I've been holding a lot of resentment for you not being there. And I missed you a lot. I needed you. But the frustration that I have in my life and the unforgiveness that I have in my heart, I want to let it go. And he pretty much said, me too, you know, he said he was sorry for not being there. That was kind of it and I think you know my my prayer is that My life in the way that I pursue him is

Healing for him in some way because I can't imagine Like what goes on in his head and his heart internal? Yeah that's what I was just gonna say to another thing that kind of it helps me is knowing like We have to be able to like I guess you don't have to but to put yourself in their shoes and To have to carry the guilt of never being around Had a massive Part and how things turned out or how they didn't turn out.

Yeah. And I mean, they're going to carry that shit for the rest of their life. They think about this stuff unless they're a total narcissist, you know, which most people aren't. I mean, that's every day of their life that's haunting them. Yeah. You know, which most people aren't. I mean that's every day of their life that's haunting them. Yeah. You know, and... And that impacts everyone they touch.

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And these three girls walk up to me and they were head hunters for the porn industry. They worked with a porn agent and they asked me straight up, like, hey, would you be interested in being in a porn? And I was like, not really, you know, but maybe. I didn't have a, I think it's like when you don't have a good reason to say no, sometimes you say yes to something, you should say no to, you know? But they, you know, like some people ask me like, was it, is there a correlation between sex trafficking and the porn industry.

And think about trafficking, you know, generally involves force, fraud, and coercion. And, you know, people ask me, well, you know, is that, does some of that exist in the porn industry? It doesn't exist. It is completely dependent on it. It's manipulation is, you know, at the quarterstone of the porn industry in that the girls were trained to use language where they're in a place where a lot of people are trying to make it, and

they're using, meet with our agent and you'll do an interview, he'll help you with your career and all that stuff. And it's almost like, you know, when we say things or when we call things different than what they are, it creates this unrealistic barrier. And that, you know, we say, we don't want to say porn, we say adult film industry, yet porn is a word that is from the Greek New Testament, so pornea. But we want to say adult film industry, but when we say that, trying not to be abrasive, what are we saying?

We're insinuating that that's adult behavior, that's how adults act. So it's just so interesting that they would use specific language of saying agent, this and that. And then essentially they're like, hey, if you want to do this, you'll meet with our agent. And I was like, I've been watching porn for a long time. I've been acting like an idiot forever. If I get paid for what I'm already doing, maybe you know that would be cool how old are you at this

point 22 you're only 22 yeah and I could be I mean just being totally honest if I was 22 and got approached with that I probably been yes yeah you're gonna pay me to bang hot women. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Let's do it. That's pretty much what I heard. We're gonna sign. Yeah.

And I go and I meet with this guy and... And it's three attractive women. Yeah, three smoking hot girls. Yeah. And yeah, so I'm like, sure, I'll meet with the guy. And I thought, so I had in my head, I'm like, if it's weird, I'll just, if I go to the place and it's like at a hostel or at like a some sketchy motel, and he's like a guy like picking lint out of his belly button, you know, I'm just gonna get out of there but it was at you know, a

like a business complex And in studio city adjacent to Universal Studios walk in, you know they brought me in through like the like underground like parking garages and they're just like, you know, the Bentley's and Beamers everywhere and I go up and Walk through this hallway and he like, you know, the Bentley's and Beamer's everywhere. And I go up and walk through this hallway and he's got, you know, almost like if you were a sport agent, how you would have all, you know, any players you represent. So there were, you know, anyone that was on the cover of Penthouse,

Playboy, Hustler, whatever. And I'm walking through and sit there reception. It's like, you know, his name is Derek and like Derek will be right with you. And I'm waiting and there's like porn on the, you know, his name is Derek, and like, Derek will be right with you. And I'm waiting and there's like porn on the, you know, the coffee table in the, you know, waiting area. He calls me into his office and sits me down. He's like, so tell me, um, how did you grow up? What are you doing in LA and, um, what do you hope to accomplish?

How did you grow up? I know. But like, in retrospect, I didn't think about it. But looking for broken homes. Yeah, well yeah. Did you grow up not having something that I can use to manipulate you to do what I want so I can extract value from you? 100% yes.

That's what he was saying, but I was too naive to hear it. How'd you grow up? Just me and my mom, perfect. It should have been a red flag, it was a green flag for him. What are you doing in LA? Modeling, acting, doing what most people around here are doing, trying to make it, trying to live out my dream, whatever. What year is this?

This is 2006. 2006. 2006. And then he was like, well, what do you hope to accomplish? And I was like, yes, be famous. And what's sad about that is famous is objective. It's fictitious Because you know if you think You know if if enough people know you know how many people need to know who I am to equate to being famous Like how many followers you need to have you know like what's what's the mark?

And if there's no mark there's no measure if there's no measure There's no reality you know and if you if you get to the place that you thought if you would get to That you would feel some sort of way and you don't, you just increase the measure. Being rich is the same way. If I had this, I would feel that over and over again. We know the deal. It doesn't work. But I thought, man, if I become somebody, I will feel like I'm somebody. And again, what I was trying to do is I was trying to stack the scale in my favor enough where the kid that didn't have the dad would feel like I was wanted, seen, heard, known. He kind of spoke into all that.

He's like, man, he's like, you've got acting experience. The porn industry is shifting. We're parroting all these movies. They're doing big films. Like you can be the lead in all these. You can make a ton of money. Like you can do like by doing the films and you can do, you know, marketing with this.

I've got deals with clubs in Vegas. They'll bring you out. you'll sit in the VIP and they'll pay you $10,000 just to be there, all this stuff. And my career was going okay, but I was having more success modeling than I was acting. I really wanted to act, that was my passion. But there was a part of me, again, I couldn't shake, that like, man, maybe I'm just not

good enough to make it. At 22, your modeling career is not peaked out, but most people have their best years modeling like 16 to 21. That's not definitively true across the board, but a lot of people do. Acting has this big, a lot longer range. And I just thought, man, I just don't have the capability of being successful, because what was that based on?

Well, me comparing myself on my peers. And a lot of people that were in the same network as me or even had the same agent as me, they had booked their first lead role or they've done this and they've done that, and I hadn't quite done as much as they've done, so I must not be good enough. And I thought, man, maybe this is just a counterfeit version of the dream that I have, and I should hop on this boat before it leaves, because maybe this is as good as it's going to get for me. Did he tell you that as well during the meeting?

Did he destroy your dreams of what you wanted to do to get what you wanted? I did that myself. You did that to yourself? He threw all this money and everything on you, right? Yeah. Right at the get go? Yeah, and I said, okay, well, where do we start? And it's so interesting because-

You were already in before you were in. Yeah. Well, at least I was like, well, I'll do one. I'll do one. We'll see. You know? And he's like, okay, well, you got to go get a full STD test and AIDS test. And when that panel comes back, it generally takes 24 hours. When that panel comes back, you know, I'll set up a shoot for you.

And I was like, you know, great, sounds good. I was thinking like, all right, I'm gonna get paid to like, you know, take a camcorder and go like hook up with this hot girl and then I'm gonna get a check. I do the test, I go there and it's full blown like any other, like, you know, the biggest project I've done. Yeah, I walk in as a receptionist and it's full blown like any other, like, you know, the biggest project I've done.

I walk in as a receptionist and it's so interesting. I'd love to dig into this, come back to it. So they give me paperwork to sign. This is how you get paid. Sign here, sign here, sign here. So so many people. They own the IP. Oh yeah.

Yeah, all of it. Yeah, all of it. Yeah, all of it. It's over. A hundred percent. So many people ask, you know, they just like, especially when they see that I am a Christian and specifically see that I do ministry vocationally, they're like, well, did you give the money back and what are you doing with the residuals? What are you doing with the royalties?

Royalties and residuals don't exist in porn. You're a day-rate employee and you give away everything. But not only do you sign away everything, what you're signing, the last thing you sign is saying that they reserve the right to disperse and to sell to as many third parties for an forever time limit. So what happens is you do a porn and all of a sudden my pictures are on dating sites, my pictures are on sex toys, my pictures are on billboards. Am I compensated for any of that? No. You know?

But anyway, I sign all that paperwork and I walk in and there's girls in a makeup chair and you know, like a big studio, there's catering, there's all this stuff. And then there's this like daybed and there's this like sea of lights around this girl. And you know, the PA that's with me is like that's the girl you're going to be working with. She's taking some photos. She's taking some photos and it'll need you about 30, 40 minutes. We understand this is your first time so here's a Viagra.

Put it in my hand. It's like if you've never taken it before, I'd buy it in half. I was like, oh my gosh, what have I gotten myself into? And I'm in the bathroom, still pretty much a kid, and I'm talking to myself in the mirror, like, what are you going to do? And I felt like I'd gone too far to turn back. But again, everything's so intentional. You knew it wasn't the right thing, right?

Oh, yeah. I mean, I'm just waiting on my mom to jump out and judo chop me in the throat. But so intentional. I got picked up in a town car. I was not told the address that I was going to. So what did I have to do if I wanted to leave? I'd have to call the agent and say, hey, you know, like a kid that went to a sleepover that changed her mind. Like, hey, you know, I'm scared I want to come home. So I felt like I couldn't make that call. I think so many of us will do something and we believe the lie that's from Satan,

we'll believe the lie that's from Satan, that you've gone too far to turn back, so your only choice is to keep going. And that's kind of what I did. So I popped the whole thing, what I did. So I popped the whole thing, drank a bottle of water, walked out there and waited a few minutes. And you know, when you take Vagra, you start to feel like feel blotchy like in your chest. And I was like, I was like, am I gonna pass out? Like what's going on? And they kind of waved me over. And I never had any kind of interaction with the girl. I never talked to her. I didn't even know what her stage name was, her real name was. I wasn't sure.

Because all you do is you sign that so they have photocopies of her ID and then a printout of her STD and AIDS test. And you have to see that the test is current. So it has to be 27 days or newer. And her ID has to be valid and not expired. So I had to look at that and match the names and I had to sign that I saw it. And that was the only interaction I had with her.

Walk over to the scene and pretty much this is still, this is somewhat back in the day, so like bigger cameras. So the director has this camera and the videographer has this big camera and he's kind of like over my shoulder and the girl is not looking at me looking at the camera so it's like you know the the fantasy that you you you become to believe when you watch porn is there's this like intense connection between the girl and the guy it's a hundred percent disconnection no kidding well because the director is telling you what to do and telling you how to do it

And you're not having sex for pleasure you're having sex for show so it literally has to show So you're strategically doing it in a way that is visible so it's very uncomfortable and Your it's it's performance art at best. It's certainly not sex regarding what we would know it to be. So that happens and I was like, man, I felt pretty disgusting afterwards. How long does it take? I mean, you know, it just depends on like what's going on, what it is. How many people are in the room?

Probably 20 20 people. Yeah Here's it was wild. I mean like again like there's a boom mic over my head Someone literally like holding a sea light like underneath my junk Holy you know camera a camera B someone shooting BTS, you know Holy shit. You know, camera A, camera B, someone shooting BTS, you know, most of the girls, they either have someone that's there with them. They would call them a boyfriend more often than not, a pimp that's there watching. You know, sometimes-

How many women had you slept with before this, approximately? I mean, probably hundreds. Hundreds at 22? Hmm. Maybe not hundred but probably a hundred. Man. And but I did that and I was like I felt and that was and I just I can't I just always remember it so on my way home I'm in this town car going home and it's like like what about afterwards hold on what about afterwards is there any interaction with the other what the woman with the talent no like as soon as you finish like you move because like as soon as you orgasm like they want to take pictures of that and then you get you just like you're you're like you're done. They shuffled out

Oh, yeah, and then they want to take photos and stuff Yeah, so you're out of there but it was like it was so interesting so there was like showers on set But I remember there was like there was not body wash in the shower. There was just like dial hand soap. And I was just like trying to wash myself with that. And then I'm in the town car and I'm on my way home and I was like, I can still feel the like lube in the hair of my legs. I just felt gross.

And then I got home and I like took this like shower. Have you seen Redeeming Love? Pete No. Jared It's just, it's a faith-based film. But essentially, there's a girl that works in a brothel. She meets a guy that has a faith. They connect and he's kind of like trying to get her. Pete A what? A faith? Jared A faith, yeah. And he's trying to lead her to the Lord and also wanting to be with her, but for us to be together, I want you to follow the Lord. And there's this point where she's, and I can just relate to this so much, where there's something inside her that was craving the only thing that she knew which was chaos.

Because like you know he's in a cottage on a farm, they're eating good food but that's it they're on a farm it's just him and her this is like you know this is pre you know television and internet you you know, that's just them It was like she was going crazy Not experiencing chaos and she ended up going back to the brothel and she you know turned a trick and It didn't feel the same and she felt so dirty and so disgusting she couldn't believe that she went back to The thing that she wanted to be rescued from and there's this scene Where she's in this like river and she's got a rock and she's Scrubbing her body, but what she's trying to scrub off is not on a surface level

And man I've took many of those showers damn Man, I've took many of those showers. Damn. And but I was like, never gonna do it again. It hits you right off the bat. Oh, it was great. Or you didn't even happen it. And I got paid like 500 bucks. And I was like, man, I got paid 500 bucks to do that. And like, I mean, it was not sexy.

The girl is not super attractive. There was there was nothing there was no positive Experience like I mean I could make five hundred dollars like bartending at a bar in Hollywood I mean there's like 500 bucks for that. I'm like What a mistake that was, you know, I'm out but You know 2006 different world so that I didn't realize that that scene was for the most popular website

the most popular porn website in America at that time and they They shoot like three to five scenes a day and they post every day. So the turnaround was pretty quick. So it was up the next week. What was the website? It was like naughty America or something like that. And it was like, so all of a sudden like a few of my fraternity brothers and then a few other people was like, dude, I saw you on this website. I saw you on this website.

I saw you on this website. And then, you know, you know, being from a small town, the thing about a small town, it only takes one person to know one thing about your life for everyone to know everything about your life and someone told my uncle at work and then my uncle told my mom and then I get a phone call from my mom and you know growing up in the south like how much of your name is used is how much trouble you're in and I heard you know when I answered the phone like Joshua Luke broom. Did you do a porn?

You know, did you do a did you a porno film? But I was like. I was like, I did, mom. And like in that moment, like Satan just put his foot on my throat because I already believe there was something wrong with me. But I can remember it so clearly because when I heard the pain in her voice, when she said, why did you do that?

Satan said to me, see, you're exactly who you thought you were. You're not a kid that does bad things. You are bad. And then I begin to shrink, and I begin to believe, man, I hurt the only person that never hurt me. Maybe I'm not even good enough to be her son. And then a few days go by and then my manager calls me. Normally when they want me to come by the agency to have an in-person meeting, it's a good thing. It's's like hey, here's an offer on the table and you know

Let's assess it. Do you want to accept it? now your names attached to a Pornography website, that's a big problem for us. I Think a lot of you, but we're gonna have to end our professional relationship fired So now I'm like, now what? I blew up my whole life.

Bam. On the very first one. So then, like, well, what do I do? And then I begin to believe the lie that the only thing that I could do as a 22-year-old is continuing to do the very thing that I could do as a 22 year old is continuing to do the very thing that created so much turmoil in my life because that was the only viable option. And in perfect timing, agent calls me, porn agent calls me, hey man, that scene went viral, I'd love to offer you a contract.

That scene went viral. I'd love to offer you a contract. Hold on. What did your mom say after you told her yes? She was hurt, disappointed. Told me that I probably needed to move back home. Damn. And if I'm honest, I didn't know what to say. I didn't say anything because I didn't know what to say. I didn't say anything because I didn't know what to say. I didn't say I was sorry. I just kind of, yeah, I did it. I didn't know what to do.

So I didn't say anything. How's your relationship with your mom today? Oh, so good. It is? Yeah. Good. I'm happy to hear that. Yeah. But yeah, I mean that, um, that the porn agent calls me and like,

hey, you know, want to sign you to a contract. And so I doubled down. I was like, well, you know, I'd found some way to, for the most part, everything that I've done in life, I'm relatively successful at. And I thought, well, I have good work ethic. I have good communication and people skills, so I feel like I can really figure out this industry.

So I feel like I can become the guy. And I did. Over seven years, I did over a thousand films, won around 20 different awards, directed for some big companies, wrote some movies, starred in some of the biggest grossing movies that they've ever put out in the porn industry. They did crazy stuff. Like we did like, we did a Star Wars movie

and I played Han Solo and like it was thinking, like most people just thinking, oh, they had sex. Like, well, it was shot over several months. Like they built a replica, like Millennial Falcon. Like we had like actual actual replicas of guns and stuff and costumes and grew my hair out and stuff. But, you know, and then as I'm doing that, a little part of me was like,

oh, this is art in a way, but it's still porn. But doubled down and had a lot of success and got nominated for Performer of the Year four times. And I didn't win it until 2012. Won it in 2012. And I thought, man, if I ever won that award, that would solidify for me, you know, my worth.

If I just won that award, like, I just believe that something would happen, like something supernatural would happen in me, like the feeling of, you know, worthlessness or inadequacy or whatever I wrestle with on the pillow at night, it'll just go away if I won that award. And then I won it, and nothing happened. And when nothing happened, everything got worse.

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You won the award. Yeah. Male performer of the award. Yeah. Male performer of the year. And so I mean, it sounds like you got, I mean, just a household name in the industry. Yeah. And so, you know, we want, I really want to get a snapshot of what that lifestyle is like. And so a thousand plus films in how many years? So a thousand plus films in how many years? Six and a half six and a half years So how much are you on camera?

Performing yeah, I mean I was doing every day well because like the industry so the the award show is in January and Everyone's trying to get stuff turned in for the year to submit for that. So to make it because if something wins an award, then it has notoriety, you can push it, et cetera. So kind of the industry doesn't shut down but slows down significantly in December and January. So really like 10 month increments, I was doing 20 scenes a month minimum. And then during the summer sometimes, I was shooting two, three times a day.

I think I've done like 40 something in a month, um, was the most I did, but. Well, I mean, what constitutes an award? Well, I mean, you know, uh, is it view counts? What is it? So, I mean, there's, it used to be on Showtime, you know, it was voted by fans and the studios. Okay. Yeah.

And then, you know, you had mentioned on the first, on the first shoot, there was no interaction between you and the woman, at least verbally. And so as you grew in that industry, I mean, there had to be more human interaction other than sexual interaction. Right? Yeah.

And so who are your, like, what's the lifestyle? Who are your friends? What do you do? I mean, what is it like? Yeah, I mean, for the most part, like, you were friends with and if you dated you dated from inside the pool of the people who are in that industry. Like your friend group wasn't exclusive to people who were just in that industry, but dating it would be really hard to, maybe not in today's age, but it was hard to kind

of say what are you, you know, you're meeting someone, you know, at the gym or wherever you might meet someone and you get to talking about what you do for a living. It's like, well, I'm a porn star, you know? Um, that's probably not going to be someone you, you know, see yourself compatible with, um, maybe for a fling, but not a relationship, you know? Um, so people would date, um, from within the industry and that I think was a large part of my mental and emotional demise in that I was dating someone for a while in the industry for almost two years and she was already popular, became even more popular. Who was it?

like her also Akira is Her you know her name, so she was she's like the face of Pornhub now She's a spokesperson for Pornhub She's you know gone viral for multiple things like crazy things she said but she was you know she was my person at that time and but the guys still interact no no I mean I haven't I haven't spoke to her you know since like well over 10 years Like, well over 10 years. But the thing was, you know, if all my friends are in that industry and my girlfriend is in that industry, you live in this suppression of reality in that we would say that we were

in a monogamous relationship while having sex with other people, just calling the work in which we did, or calling us having sex with other people at work, we would just call that work. It wasn't sex, it was just work. So that didn't count, and we suppressed that as reality, but what we claimed as reality is that we were in a monogamous relationship because off camera and on camera were two different realities. But then you're faced with, I'm sitting at Mastro's in Beverly Hills with a friend of mine, and he's there with his girlfriend. My friend had had sex with my girlfriend on Monday, and I had sex with his girlfriend

that day. We're pretending as if that's not real, and it's not problematic to the atmosphere. When you suppress reality Chaos is a promise. Is it an outward appearance or is I mean is it always in your head? I Don't do you actually do you actually trick your mind into oh, yeah I mean I was in a place where I mean I could have sex, you know and I would I would do them it's like I would have sex have sex in a theater in front of hundreds of thousands of people, and especially in Europe, and not think twice about it.

Wait, what? Yeah, they would have live sex shows. Used to be a thing. Like now, you know how people are taking... Hundreds of thousands of people? Yeah. Or, you know, how now it's become popular to take your podcast on the road, to have that live element. Well, instead of watching a porn on a screen, you would watch

it happen live. That was a thing for a while. But I could do that, drop the hat, no problem at all, And that, I could do that and drop the hat, like no problem at all, like, you know, not face me. But you look me in the eye and shake my hand, tears would stream down my face because that was real. It was terrifying. Geez. Like, that's how much I had suppressed reality. When's the first time you did it live in front of a live audience? I think it was in probably two years in.

But it was either in Vegas or it was one of the first times. And then stuff like that happens a lot, like in Europe or like Barcelona. Just to- Do you remember the first time. I don't know. Everything just became so like there was no interaction that was more special than the others. The only thing that like, like, um, I have like real memories around is like. The roles I played where there was like significant, you know, there was

a script to learn, a character to play, things that were outside of, you know, the sex aspect. Because in a porn, you know, because like Star Wars, we filmed, you know, over three or four months. There's five sex scenes, you know, which takes, you know, a few hours to film. So like there was a lot of the movie that wasn't sex. So I just like that, like that whole thing, that whole experience was very memorable to me. But yeah, I mean, the sex, it just, the sex and the people, it just... So everybody had convinced themselves that it was in a monogamous relationship inside that industry. Everybody had convinced themselves mentally that this is on screen, doesn't matter.

Or even... This is off screen. This is on screen, doesn't matter. This is off screen, this is real. Or even, yeah, or either that or the polar opposite of like they're all in and they're swingers 24 seven and like sex is just, you know, sex and high fiving someone is all the same. Let's just have a party, have fun. Because some people could work as a director and someone be having sex with their significant other and they would just film it and it would just be whatever.

Or you know, for me, like again, single parent, you know, like my mom was young, she's beautiful woman, like I remember like throwing cans of like corn like at a guy like, like trying to talk to my mom, like get away from my mom, I'm going to protect my mom. So like jealous kid turning a jealous boyfriend, which turned into, even though I was in that industry, I was like, that was my girl. I didn't want anyone to touch her, which is how I felt. But I had to suppress that feeling because of what I said. And I think that would bring up an interesting point where people say, you know, I love what I do. Well, if you love what you do, let's go back to that moment

where I said yes to being in the porn industry. Well, I'm gonna make you famous. Okay, Derek, you're gonna make me famous. What's the first thing I do? What's next? You know, okay, well, we gotta pick you a name to go by. Sorry, I'm going to pick you a name to go by. You go by Sudenu. Because if I can get you to detach yourself from who you are, you will do things that are outside of and different than things that you would ever do.

Like you think about social media, you know, the antagonist on the other side that's, you know, talking trash to everyone online. What are two things that are always common of that person? They have an obscure username and they have, you know know a meme or a random photo as their photo because if I can detach Who I am from what I do that I'm not held accountable from what I do So it's not me doing the things in the porn industry very same thing I'm gonna get you to go by a pseudonym because I can get you to detach yourself from your humanity That's interesting So that was that was the first thing I did. So, kind of,

you know, with that, you know, that thought, like in our mind, you know, who I am, it began to matter less and less. So – Pete Slauson Is there drugs and alcohol? Is there a lot of that involved? I mean, it's interesting. It's really interesting because like drugs and that before me, like there was, you know, there was always like times or if it was like, if it was like a live shoot, kind of like everything's kind of out the window, no rules, you know? But for the most part-

What do you mean a live shoot? Like what I was, live shoot, like a live show. Yeah, where it's like, we're filming something happening live and it's streaming or someone's watching. So we're not creating, you know, a curated and, you know, crafted and edited product. Like if we're creating that, then they want a more controlled environment.

So if you showed up to set Drunk or High, you would get set home because more often than not, like in LA, like you would have to get a permit to film porn and a lot of times, you know, they would come by and check for your permit and when they would check for the permit, they're, you know, trying to get a peek. But I didn't see a lot of that onset, but is it part of the industry?

A hundred percent, but it's more so to deal with the consequence of what you did in contrast of being able to do what you did, you know, the people aren't getting drunk and high on set to do the scene, they're getting drunk and high because they did the scene. Pete Slauson Interesting. Jared Slauson And then once addiction sets in, those things start to bleed into each other. I mean, there were certainly like times where people came to set drunk high, you know, all the things. Um, I mean, I've seen it all.

I mean, part, part of the reason that I'm so passionate about talking about it is as of today, it's over 40 people have committed suicide or died of overdose. Every roommate I've ever had except one dead. And these are people not just like total in the industry, like these are people I knew personally, like friends of mine, you know, people we had meals with, like traveled places together, like people I knew. And when they would die, the porn industry would make a compilation film of their best ofs, why to monetize on the thing in which caused their demise. Geez.

Wow. What should I be asking you? Yeah, I mean. About the industry. I mean, just paint a picture of how fictitious it is. I mean, the girls are using numbing cream. All the guys are using erectile dysfunction medication. There were some directors that would require you to use caverjack. So caverjack is for paraplegic people where you would inject something into the cavern

of your penis and you would have an erection for three or four hours. Doesn't matter if you're reading the newspaper or You know whatever and then the danger is if you use too much then you've got to go to the hospital get lanced Because it's not gonna subside, you know Or you use it for long enough, then you become dependent on it. I Mean with sex even enjoyable? No. You know, like real sex with your, with your,

whoever you're in a monogamous relationship with. Yeah, I mean... Is that, how, I mean... Well, I mean, for the most part, like even if you did that, you would, like, because I worked so much I would like not finish because I was like, you know, you'd want to save your orgasm, you know, because the the quantity Mm-hmm was important Because if that wasn't there and they couldn't capture what they needed then, you know, they would

Be upset. Holy shit. Yeah, so when you had sex it was like Yeah Holy shit. Yeah. So when you had sex, it was like, yeah, not that often. Not unless you had a big break and you went on a vacation or something like that. Wow. It was almost like if you worked at Krispy Kreme and you loved donuts, the last thing that you would want to do is eat donuts. Yeah. But yeah. And I think, like, just like the, like, when, so the agent that I had, when,

the agent that I had, when girls would come into the industry, they'd ask them their no list. Right? So things you don't want to do, anal, stuff like that. What do you not want to do? So it's on your no list. And then if a director would ask, well, does this girl do this? No, it's on the no list. But the way that worked was, in the industry, your no doesn't really mean no, it means how

much. I remember. Yeah. So the way that the poignant agents would work is there would be things that girls wouldn't do. be things that girls wouldn't do and after a period of time, if their popularity would start to subside, you know, they're not getting as many requests, they would go to a few studios and say, hey, how much would you pay for such and such to do anal? Like, you know, 15k, 20k, 30k, 30k, okay, high spitter.

Then he would go back to the girl, it's like hey, outta nowhere, this studio just said that they would give you $30,000 if you would be willing to do Anal. And I know you said you didn't wanna do it, but you're not getting any request as you had been in the past. And you do that, they'll make a big deal of

it, you'll become relevant again, and then your career's just going to start to skyrocket. She does it, but what happens? What she never wanted to do and she did one time becomes something that she does all the time because once she does it, it loses its whatever. They would just do that with girls over and over and over again. At the same time, they would convince them to do escorting. They would spend weekends or go on trips with guys. It's like, well, there's a check and there's a test.

As long as there's a check and a test, it's all the same. It's the way they would present it to them. We're making the client get the same STD and AIDS panel, so they're clean and you're getting paid. So they just convinced them that they were trafficking them. Wow. Because it wasn't on like a public site. It wasn't quite on the dark web, but it wasn't far from it. Or not, you know, that guy Derek, like he ended up serving time for sex trafficking because he was extorting girls. He would bring girls in from different countries get them fake IDs have them paid in cash living in his own house Charging them rent to pay in their house taking some of their money that they were getting paid as their agent and you know

They're a landlord And making the the the the the people who paid them paid them in cash So he would take the money and he decided how much they got Shit I'm gonna go to some I'm gonna go somewhere pretty dark So I So with with guys, you know So, with guys, they would ask, do you want to do VIP parties? Do you want to bartend or whatever? You would bartend shirtless and you would make 10, 20,000 bucks.

I would do stuff like that sometimes. It was almost like, it's kind of what we're talking about. How do you ever get to, you know, this place? Like, how do you go from here to here? How do you go from, you know, me personally, the first magazine that I ever saw that I created a sexual thought in my head. It was like it was I think it was like Matt, no, like GQ, like or the

I don't know, like swimsuit version of like Maxim or something like that. But it was just like a see-through bathing suit. Like how did I go from there to like watching hardcore porn, you know? So doing porn, getting paid for sex, then doing these marketing stuff. And then there was a high profile company in the fashion industry that would have these parties and they would bring out guys and girls to do these parties. And you know, girls would walk around naked, guys would walk around, you know, in boxers, whatever,

serve everyone drinks. And I went there. It was in Paris. And, I mean, long story short, I went there and got drugged and raped by the owner of a very well-known fashion, what used to be the CEO of a very well-known fashion organization. When that happened to me, I thought it was my fault. This is what I signed up for. This is who I am. Then I started trying to sabotage myself and

Started making a pretty clear plan to take my life and You kind of looked up like I had this pretty strong pain medication. You know like how many pills would do the trick? Okay, well take that number maybe add. And I'd put them on the counter and I'd separate them. It's like I took, you know, old school vitamins. I used to take like the like Vita pack, like an animal pack or whatever. I'd take like 40 vitamins at once. So I'm like, I knew like I take a lot of pills at once. So I separated them so I could make sure I'd get them down, swallow them, wouldn't chicken

out. And I set them up like that, time after time after time. I just could never do it. And then this one day, I was filming in Atlanta, and it was like, it was just a disgusting shoot. Like people were like urinating on each other, spitting on my face, in my mouth, stuff like that. I'm just like, what have I become? I was like, I want to die. Can't undo what I've done.

Got more money than I thought I would ever see. Growing up, food stamps, trailer, government housing, got a, Breitling collection and nice home. Do all the stuff. But I'm miserable. And this is what I've made in my life. There's no hope. There's no hope. There's no way out.

But I needed someone to agree with me. So I got paid from that scene and the directors on the memo of the checks, they would always write something grotesque. Like if the title of the movie wasn't sexually explicit enough, they would write something being antagonistic knowing that you're gonna have to give that check to someone and I normally wouldn't do that I would just ATM dropbox you know anything other than handed to a person but on this day that was gonna be my formula. I put the water on the counter, I lined up the pills.

The Wachovia that I banked at was across the street from the place that I lived. And I walked over there, had the check, waited in line, handed the check to the teller, and I waited. What did it say on the check waited a line handed the check to the teller And I waited What did it say on the check? It's like some kind of gangbang or like something like that and I Wanted that person to You know person to some look of disgust.

Best case scenario, say like, how sick are you or something. She said nothing. Deposited the check, handed me the receipt. I got tears streaming down my face, pale, shaking. And I defeated because I didn't get what I wanted. I didn't know what to do. And then I look up and she had walked around the counter and she put her hand on my shoulder and she said, Joshua, are you okay?

Joshua, can I get you some help?" And Sean, that was the first time I had heard my real name in 18 months. Wow. And it just like woke me up. And I beelined it to my place and I called my mom. My mom had been calling and texting me, didn't respond. I thought, she's just reaching out to me because she feels like she has to, but I lost the right of being her son. I've disqualified myself.

I think it was my pride, my shame, but I called her. And when she answered the phone, she lit me up. She, you know, good southern mama, she cussed me out, you know, for, she was worried about me. But then she said everything that I didn't think she would. She said, I will always love you and you will always be my son. And you're so much better than the way you're living. Please come home.

So right then and there, I called everybody I needed to call. I quit, I quit, I quit. And I subleased my place pretty quickly and left LA. But when I left, I didn't think I could change. It wasn't any kind of spiritual awakening, but I do think that was the Holy Spirit in that bank. But very quickly I thought, okay, what do I have? What do I have that I can use? Okay, well, I've been doing CrossFit for a while. I got a Level 1 certification.

Maybe I can coach CrossFit. I got an exercise science background a little bit, strength conditioning, understand that. Maybe I can get into that. And then I did the formula that I knew that worked. Find a good mentor, double down, work really hard, get some credentials, build a kingdom for myself. And I was working with this guy, Jason Davidson. He was the strength conditioning coach

for the Carolina Hurricanes. He was leading the Thor program at Fort Bragg, plugged me into some right circles, bowed for me. And all of a sudden, what I like to say is I put enough good dirt on my bad dirt so I didn't look dirty. Because I couldn't change. I didn't believe I could. But what I thought I could do is I could manage people's perception of me.

And if I did enough good, it would outweigh the bad that was impossible for me to run from. And I spent about two years doing that. I mean, when you were, before you left the industry, I mean, was it a buildup of misery or was it literally that one scene? Or was that one shoot the last straw? That one shoot, that last shoot was the Last Straw, but it was the relationship. So that relationship got more toxic. It went from us being at dinner where we had sex with the other person across the table

to her wanting to talk about stuff that was happening on set, like, you know, in our home. And I was—it was interesting because I was like, man, I need to man up. It shouldn't bother me. But it does. And I think, you know, we look at men in today's society, it's like we're struggling with a mental health crisis because we pretend like we're okay when we're not. And the inevitable fact of pretending like you're okay when you're not, the thing that's not okay

is not gonna get better, it's gonna get worse. So I allowed that to be part of our relationship So I allowed that to be part of our relationship or her to tell me stuff that she was doing with other people and pretending like that was arousing to me. And I think, again, just like further and further compromising myself as an individual and suppressing reality led to combustion internally. Yeah, you're trying to convince yourself to change what you know is right and wrong. Yeah. I mean, again, like the jealous kid, you know, in the grocery store is still the jealous

kid that I don't want anyone to look at my girlfriend. Now I'm saying that I'm okay with people having sex with her. But yeah, so I mean that that progression and just the reality of like me having sex with as many people as I did and just becoming the most arbitrary thing in the world is incredibly dangerous for your mental and emotional health. For me to walk into this studio and a girl to be sitting there and for me not to talk to her or anything and I just walk up to her and start having sex with her and then there's a

bunch of cameras around and I'm doing it for these cameras and then I orgasm and then leave and that's my job that's what I do for my career that's what I do you know four or five days a week and I I do that for, you know, short of a decade. Like that's, I mean, that's going to damage you significantly. Was there any talk within the industry on your way out about, or just anytime at all in there about things that other people were struggling with? Or... Oh yeah. I mean, there I mean there was, yeah.

I mean, suicide is rampant. In the, suicide and overd, like people are dying of overdose. Probably five, I think last time I looked, around 500 people have died of overdose, suicide and murder over the last 20, 25 years. And murder, because if you believe little of yourself, you're going to end up in a relationship where that person

thinks little of you, and there's abuse. And that abuse turns into you losing your life. And the amount that happening, it's documented, is pretty astronomical. And then just, I mean, we were talking about, not to change the topic, but we were talking about guardian angels. It's like, man, there was HIV outbreaks in the industry. There were people I had unprotected sex with that had HIV that they died.

There was an HIV outbreak that was big enough in the industry that it shut down for, you know, not a long time, but around two months. Yeah, I mean, were there ever any open discussions about it? I mean, did you have any friends in the industry where you would have these talks with about leaving or about things that were affecting you or anything like that? Or was everybody wearing a mask? Yeah, I mean, I call it a first date mask, you know, where you don't know who you are, but you pretend to be whoever you think the person across from you wants you to be so that you can,

you know, appease them or so that they would like you because you don't really know who you are, or you believe who you are doesn't have any value. But I would say there's this like, doesn't have any value. But I would say there's this like, there's this, generally across the board there was this belief that, you know, doing something outside of the industry the longer that you stayed in the industry was impossible. So the only like, the best possible outcome is that you have a good long-standing career in the industry and then one of the studios that you worked for a lot you get hired on as a director and then you work as a director you know that that was the the next hopeful progression because not being in the porn industry wasn't an option because being in the porn industry meant you couldn't do anything else. At least that's what I wanted

you to believe. I mean, for example, Cagney Lynn Carter, she was a great friend of mine. She got in a little bit after me, stayed in much longer than me, much later than me. And I think it was last year. She had left the industry, opened a dance studio. She was like a ballet dancer, like in her teens, something she still was passionate about and she opened up a place. But everyone around her was like,

you can do whatever you want. You can say that your name is whatever, but I know who you are. You'll never escape from that. You'll always be that person. She tried really hard. It's so sad, bro, because she took her life. And the day that she took her life, she posted a photo of herself on the beach saying, I'm free. But what's true is she was in prison. I wanted to leave the industry. I wanted to do something else.

But you begin to believe that you can't. And it's not something you do, it's who you are. And if the only thing in which you can do is to sell yourself for sex, then your no loses its volition. It loses its validity. Your no loses its validity because if the only thing that you can say yes to is selling yourself for sex, then you can't say no to anything. So you say yes to everything. And it's just so sad, man. Yeah.

I mean, just to think it, you know, I was sharing with someone, you know, there's, you know, 40, 40 of my friends, suicide, overdose, those porn's are still there. You know, it's like, man, if I could encourage someone that's watching that now, it's like, man, you know, there's this like, there's all these things that are true, while you don't know if there was force fraud or coercion, you know, regarding the scene that you're watching. You don't know how old that person is. You don't know if they gave consent. And then in this situation, what I'm saying is you don't know if the thing in which they did cause them so much pain and hurt that it led to their death, and you're partaking

in the thing in which caused their demise and you're extracting pleasure from it. And that person is dead because of what they did and they're still making money off of it. I mean, it's crazy. I mean, right before November 4th, last big push from the Harris-Walls campaign, they ran ads on Pornhub in seven different states. Why?

120 million viewers a day. They ran an ad saying it was someone that, a character that somewhat resembled Trump walking in and this, it was so gross. It was so gross. There was this guy masturbating underneath a blanket and he was looking at his phone and someone that looks like Trump comes in and takes the phone away and says, if you don't want to lose your right to watch porn, you better vote in the same way that you want, you know, to consume that.

Are you shitting me? No. Seven states ran those ads. What states? I'm not sure. Geez. I mean, I would assume very left states, but we're about to get to a point in the story that's pretty cool.

Yeah. Yeah. Man, they really trap you. Oh yeah. Had you known anybody that had made it out? I know one girl. I don't know one guy. Well, I know guys that have made it out.

I don't know guys who are whole and healthy. For example, a good friend of mine, his name's Greg. His poor name is Randy Spears. He even had a character on Family Guy. He lives in San Antonio and he still goes by Randy Spears. He's got a normal job. He's not in the porn industry anymore. He's about 10 years older than me. But I talked to him,

and it's like he called me Rocco. I called him and left him a voice memo or a voice message because he didn't answer. When he called me back, he called me Rocco. He said that he was Randy, and he sent me his social media and Randy Spears. I think it's this belief that who I am can never supersede that persona. that persona. So I'm going to cling on to that because my worth is so much less than this. So, yeah, I know one person named Brittany, she lives in Santa Barbara with her husband Richard. They're actually both in ministry. They do. They actually help girls that are in trafficking or like prostitution. They kind of help them get back on their feet. But yeah, like she's the only person that I know.

Are any of them reaching out to you? Anybody like, like, like, how do we get out of this? Tons. Every day. And it's like, some people are very frustrated with me. I mean, there's still people who are in the industry that are very successful that either I mentored or were good friends to me because a lot of the guys who were younger, when I was in the industry, they were like, how do I do this? How do I do this right? How do I make a career out of this? Because the thing that I was best at was, well, I understood, well, if you get relational equity with a director,

then he's going to hire you often. He's going to recommend you to other people. I understood networking, I understood relationships. I was a good actor, but I cared about people and I remembered people's names. Simple stuff was the things that allowed me to be very successful in that industry. I was just teaching them simple things that worked well for them. But I've had conversations as of recently, as recent as a month ago, of people who are very, very successful in the industry today that have been in the industry now approaching

15, 20 years, saying, man, I thought we were friends. And I was like, what do you mean by that? He's like, you say all this stuff about the industry. I'm like, yeah, man, I detest the industry with every fiber of my being. And I think it's vile and evil, but I love you. evil, but I love you. I don't have to agree with what you're doing. I understand you find identity in that, so I understand why that feels offensive to you, but I don't have any animosity towards you. I wish you would do something different with your life.

Because the reality is, bro, if you are a, girls also, if you're in the top 3 to 5% of any industry, you have the capacity of being excellent at another trade and being more successful. That you have charisma and gifts and talents that you are misappropriating, but if you surrender and you submit to your life, to the person of Jesus Christ, and allow him to take the things that he put in you and point them in the right direction, guess what? You're going to 10x your success. And it's going to be something that you're doing that is fulfilling because it's going to be the thing that you're made to do.

So yeah, I don't hate you. I hate the choices that you're making, but I don't hate you. And they just don't get it. So there has been a lot of like situations that I wish that I could have had the conversation in person. Yeah. So you leave the industry, come across Fed Trainer. So you leave the industry, come across the trainer. I mean, how many people are coming up to you that recognize you? So day one, I'm living now in Raleigh, North Carolina. And first thing I do, I'm like, you know what?

I've got a Celtic cross tattoo on my shoulder that it for some reason in my mind like I'm not walking around my shirt off But I'm like I know that is on a hundred, you know Covers a porn, you know I'm gonna get that covered up. So I get it covered up. I got like a I Got a fish like I'm not a water like, you know freaking cool, you know but I got that fish coming out of water, and like, ugh, you know, freaking cool. But I got that covered up and shaved my head, deleted my social media, and it's like, Rocko Reed, gone, dead.

New life, walking to Whole Foods. Like literally, I haven't even moved into my place yet and Guy in the meat section is like Rock a read Are you kidding me And then it just continued to happen over and over again And then I'm just kind of like, I was kind of found out, but I just kind of deflect from it.

I was just trying to build like, I'm a trainer, I'm a trainer, I'm a trainer, I'm a good trainer, I'm a good trainer. I got a lot of personal training clients making money, I'm doing good, I'm helping people, I'm a good trainer, I'm a good trainer. I got a lot of personal training clients, you know, making money, I'm doing good, I'm helping people, I'm doing good. And two years of that, and two years in, this girl comes into the gym, she's wearing like all Iowa Hawkeye cheerleading stuff. So she had obviously, you she obviously was an alum. Was very proud that she had cheered at Iowa.

Gorgeous. Best athlete in the gym. But she was different in that she worked really hard. She would kick everybody's butt in the workout. She was a gymnast. So she could, you know, all this like old school crossfit. Like if you could walk with your hands and like do stuff like that. Like if you were good at that, like you already had a you know an edge

over ever everybody else. But she was just better than everybody and I was just fascinated about you know with her and she was gorgeous. So I asked her on a date and she was like I'm good. I'm in love. You know, rejection. So I asked her out a bunch of times and she was finally like, well, I'll go for a long run before church on Sunday mornings. If you want to meet me at this park, we can go for a run. And I was like, all right, you right, I'll take whatever I can get. I get there, and I'm there early, and I'm waiting.

I started thinking, I'm like, man, Christmas party and a few other parties we have, she didn't really hang out that much. She's always at the gym, but after the workout, if she's not doing extra work or whatever, she's not hanging out and mingling. She's not like... She's not looking for friends. Yeah. So AKA, she doesn't know my story. She doesn't.

No. And I'm like, man, if she knew who I was, she would not agree to this. And there was just some conviction that I had. I'm like, man, I need to be forthcoming with this, not something I had done in the past. And when she got there, the run never made its way to a run. It was maybe a brisk walk. And I was like, hey, I want to share something with you. It's going to be a little heavy. She was like, okay, what's up? And I was like, kind of like, laid out my guts. I was like, man, I'm the kid that his daddy didn't want, and I did all this porn, and it's still all over the internet, and every bad thing I've ever done that creates shame

in my life, it's on the internet forever, and this is who I am. And she was just like, holy crap, super taken back. And she didn't say anything. We just continued to walk. She didn't say a word. I didn't know if she was mad or she was gonna slap me or you know I don't know am I gonna get fired? You know I was just thinking like all these... then she

stopped and she looked at me like you know she's an elementary teacher. There's a look that like a mom or a teacher has and she just looked at me with this like, she's like, hey, I don't want to minimize the pain that you've experienced in your life and I don't want to negate the real problems that your decisions have made for you. But I want you to know that you're not defined by the worst thing you've ever done. And you won't be defined by the greatest thing you ever do. Because there's one author of you and it's not you. It's God. Do you know who that is?

Do you know God? And I was like, maybe. I went to church a little bit when I was a kid because my grandmother, my grandfather, they went to church. They had a faith. I was like, I know of God. I certainly don't know God. She was like, well, I've been following Jesus since I was in the seventh grade and I'm not perfect by any means but my foundation that I live from Is from my relationship with him like the way I live my life is contingent on my relationship with him So what kind of food do you like like

So what kind of food do you like? I was like, what? Are you like an alien or something? Like what? Like what are you talking about? You don't want me to leave? Like she's asking me about SMART goals. I'm like, dude, I don't know what an acronym is. Like what are you talking about? Like I

Like I had the worst of intentions with you like I My plan a B and C is to hook up with you, you know, I I don't I have no idea, you know And then we just walked and talked and she asked me questions that I didn't think of for a long time. You know, like, what do I want to like, in the gym industry, would you ever want to own a gym? You know, what's your relationship like with your family? Like, do you, would you ever want to have kids? You know, just asking me things that I, like I honestly, I feel like it had been so long of me thinking

like that. I was reaching for humanity I didn't know if I still had. That went on for, we walked and talked for probably two hours. And then we went separate ways and text like high school idiots for a week. And then on Saturday, she was like, hey, I would love for you to come with me to church. And I was like, wherever you're going, yes, I'll be there. Wherever the pretty girl's going, yes. And she had been catalytic for some curiosity. I'm like, what in you allowed you to respond to me like that? allowed you to respond to me like that.

You know, like, there's this really great book I love, Master Plan of Evangelism. Robert E. Coleman wrote it, and he talks about how it's good to tell people, you know, something, but it's better to show that people are often not looking for an explanation, they're looking for a demonstration. I think Colossians 4, like Paul's talking about, hey, I'm in prison for preaching the gospel, but I'm praying for opportunities to preach the gospel, and I'm praying to do it with clarity, and I'm praying to do it with tact. You know, I want to be wise towards outsiders.

And most importantly, man, allow my speech to be gracious and seasoned with salt so I might know how I ought to answer each person. Because how I respond matters. How I respond to the individual in front of me, not a blanket statement, the person in front of me, how and we went there and I thought, you know, am I going to like set into... Am I going to catch on fire when I walk in. I certainly have no business here is what I was thinking. And then my only ...

I think a lot of people can relate to that. Yeah. I mean, I thought... I thought the same thing when I walked in. Totally different reasons. Maybe not so different, but I get it. Yeah. I mean, I thought if you had tattoos on your arm and wrinkles on your shirt, like you're going to hell. That's what I thought. And then I saw a man with tattoos and a t-shirt and jeans get up on stage preaching. And he told the story of 2 Samuel chapter 9, and just to provide a little bit of context, so 2 Samuel chapter 9, it's King David. David had just rebuilt the temple,

and now he's kind of at the pinnacle of his reign as king. And he just rebuilt the temple and he had done something for God. And then he was asking himself introspectively, Lord, what can I do for your people to show your loving kindness to me? How can I reciprocate the love that I've experienced from you to your people?" And then he's like, oh yeah, I made this promise to my friend Jonathan. So Jonathan was the son of Saul. Saul, his kingdom was stripped from him when he sinned, and then David was chosen and anointed to be king.

And then there was this conflict between Saul and David and Saul had a son, Jonathan. And Jonathan and David were great friends. And Jonathan even was like, hey, I know my dad's like trying to like throw spears at you and like trying to kill you and like he's, you know, kind of lost it. If he's plotting on you, I'm going to have your back. I'm going to let you know. And then David said, hey, I'm going to make this covenantal promise with you that I'm going to let you know." And then David said, hey, I'm going to make this covenantal promise with you that I'm going to show you love and affection, not only to you forever, but to your family as well. Now, fast forward, he's remembering this,

and he's saying, man, how can I show this to God's people? And he said, oh, I wonder if there's anyone left out of the house of Saul. And he finds a guard, Zeba is the guard's name, and he served under Saul and he's like, hey, is there anyone left? And he's like, yeah, Mephalashef. Mephalashef was the son of Jonathan, but he's in this place called Lodobar. It means place of no pastures and hiding. Because when he was around five or six years old, when his dad and his grandfather, when Jonathan and Saul were killing battle, there was this hierarchy where he was next in line to be

king, but David was chosen anointed to be king. So if David had his right place on the throne, historically, if there was an opposing person that could potentially cause an upheaval, they were identified and eradicated. That was the plan. So he was in hiding because he thought his head was on the chopping block. David goes, finds him, brings him in front of him, and my family chef is like, you know, doomsday, today's the day. I'm going to die. I've been found. And David says, actually, I'm going to give to you, I'm going to restore back to you your grandfather's land, which is part of Canaan, so the promised land. I'm going to give you access back to your land. I'm going to invite you into my kingdom, and I want you to have a seat at my table, not

for a day, not for a week, but forever. You are now part of this family." And I was like, wow, this is amazing. It's a beautiful picture of grace. But 2 Samuel chapter 9 verse 8, my fabulous chef, how does he respond to this? Does he's like, wow, God is so good. Wow, this is amazing.

No. He refers to himself as a dead dog. He says, what would you want to do with a dead dog like me? I was like, yeah, that's it. Because before he was talking about, man, you know, Romans 3.23 says that we've all sinned and fall short of the glory of God, so everybody's guilty. Romans 6.23, you know, the wages of sin is death, so if we're all guilty and that guilt equates to death, eternal separation from God, if that's true for everyone, then okay, I'm on the same

playing field. But then you're talking about this grace of God. I'm like, okay, Romans 10, 9, whoever confesses with their mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe that he was raised on the third day will be saved. I'm like, this is amazing. But then I still find myself, don't you know who I am? Don't you know what I've done? Don't you know who my daddy is? Don't you know even he didn't want me? And then he read Hebrews 12, too. It talks about how Jesus went to the cross with joy in his heart set before him,

scorning our shame before he sat down at the right hand of God. And like, joy. You're talking about that, okay, Jesus was fully God, fully manned, so fully perfect. He's omniscient. he's all-knowing. So an all-powerful, all-knowing God went to the cross. Okay, he was obedient to his father, so that makes sense. But why would he have joy in his heart and then it hit me because he loves me. Because he loves me.

God loves me. And I just kept saying it to myself over and over and over again. And I fell to my knees, and I started to cry. I'm not sure what happened that day, but when I stood up, I gave my life to Jesus the best I knew how. What I felt when I stood up was the rock was off my back. And I understood that the father that I always wanted, he gave me pictures of shielding me and protecting me and walking with me and fighting for me and believing the best about

me. That's why Romans 5-8 is so powerful. While knowing the worst thing you've ever done, Jesus went to the cross and died for you. It talks about how you wouldn't do that for a bad person, maybe for a righteous person, but not someone that had done the things that we did that put him on the cross. No way. While knowing the worst thing you've ever done, the thing that you would not want to say out loud, he knows that and he chooses you.

Why? Because he chooses you. Why? Because he loves you. And that love, it changed me that day. It didn't fix all my problems. I was still very much a knucklehead. But man, if there was something that I was sure of, it was that God loved loved me and I wanted to be different. The thing that I didn't think was possible just came true, is that I had a father who adored me. And that girl, her name is Hope, which is pretty cool. And I'm not the smartest person in the world, but I married her. And we've been married for nine years.

And we've got four boys. And I've just seen so much beauty come from the ashes of my life and from that moment of being discipled and going to Liberty and getting a theological education to preaching at Liberty at Convocation last month and having conversations with incredible people like yourself. Like, I didn't have the guts. How did you immediately start implementing this stuff into your life after that hour at church? Yeah, I mean, for me, it's like, you know, so thinking about like fighting, like I wasn't the best fighter,

but I was a good counter puncher. Basketball, I was quick, but I wasn't fast. So I was a shooter, so I could create separation so I could get my shot off. All these things were technique driven, but I understood that it would yield results. So I believed, man, if I take inventory of the things in my life that don't line up with where I wanna go, and I implement a regimen

of things that will set me on the trajectory for me to go, then it will work. Okay, so where do I start? I need a mentor. So first thing I did, it was so crazy. I go to this church. It was a pretty big church in Raleigh. And I was like, there's a pastor I can talk to. Like, sure, you know, executive pastor. He was, you know, around the corner. Just happened to be in there. His name's Gary Vette, and I walked in there and I was like, can I tell you a story? Because I feel like God wants

me to build a boat. But I shared with him my story, and I was like, man, I feel like I need to build a foundation because I think there's people that God's going to use my story to rescue, to point to Himself. And that's the boat that I feel like I need to build. What am I supposed to do? And He's like, wow, you know? And then He grabs this guy, Andrew, and Andrew just graduated from DTS Dallas Theological Seminary, moved to Raleigh to help open another campus. And discipleship was something that he was passionate

about and gifted in, like very gifted teacher. And you know, if I, you know, it's funny, I used to tell a story, it was like, man, he was a new guy on staff, he had all this free time, you know, knowing what I know now in ministry, the new guy on staff does not have free time, you know, you're doing all the stuff. But he's like, I didn't have time. And honestly, you know, my plan was to give you a Bible, tell you, you know, what to read, and tell you to get plugged into a small group. He was like, man, just the Holy Spirit just fell on me and convicted me. Like when you walked into my office, and I was like, man, I've got to pour out every bit of me into I've got to pour out every bit of me into him. And I don't know why. And he didn't know what he was getting himself into. He's like, man, I just want you to open up my office to you.

I want to spend as much time discipling you as you want to spend. So I was like, okay. I've got a little bit of a crazy work ethic where I was like, all right So I was like doing everything I could to like I was like giving away personal training clients and I was showing up at his office and I was spending 10 to 15 hours a week with Andrew and You know, we started in the book of John where the book of John, you know Anyone asked me what's the first book of the Bible I need to read?

The book of John book of John is an eyewitness account of the life of Jesus. John walked with Jesus, and John wants you to know, hey, this is who Jesus is, this is what Jesus did, and this is how it matters to all that believe. And it's like John specifically has written to not specifically like a Greek audience, not specifically a Jewish audience, it's an overarching audience, so it uses language that's not confusing, it's very clear.

So we dug into that and it like, I wasn't like a scholarly dude, but like I could read and and regurgitate stuff, but it wouldn't always conceptualize. It's true that the Bible says that the Bible is, the Word of God is alive and active, sharper than any two-edged sword divides bold and narrow, where if you are allowing the Holy Spirit to lead you, I think it's important that we pray before we read our Bible. I was reading this text and it was like, it wasn't just words on a page. It was like, coming into my heart and undoing things. And it was like I was like receiving, you know, it's, you know, I think it's appropriate

that we talk about Jesus is the bread of life, you know, it's the water that will never leave you thirsty because once you experience like true sustenance Like, if you've ever been starving and then you find sustenance, like you're satisfied in a way that is almost like you can't fully articulate, it was that. And I experienced a peace that came with that, that I became very hungry for, and I couldn't get enough. And for me, it used to be, man, if you come to my house, or my grandma's house, her buttermilk biscuits are ridiculous, and she's such a great grandma

that I get out of school at 3.37, she's taking them out of the oven at 3.40, they're hitting a plate and you can bite them, they're still crispy on the top and they're soft in the middle. If she times it perfect, you've got to try this. The gospel became that for me. I was like, man, this really works. This really is changing my life and it's beautiful and interesting and captivating and it's the best story ever told and that story it's about a God that is personal and

wants to get to know you and man I can't wait to tell you about him and that just became all I ever wanted to do and that's you know if I'm honest like I get to do some really cool stuff but at the end of the day, that's the thing that fires me up most. So it started there. But I think if you're to teach anyone anything, talking about Victor, Victor's going to show me how to do something with a knife, and then he was going to give me the knife, and then I need to show him what he showed me. Because if I can't replicate what you

just taught me, I didn't catch it, you know? And you have to apply it to truly learn it. And I think when we reciprocate our faith in that, we share things that God has implanted on us to others, there's something that's solidified. You think there's something beautiful that happens when there's a physical and practical response to something that's prompted in us spiritually. And that just has been natural for me. How long did it take you to learn forgiveness? A lot longer. A lot longer. I think the first step of that was when our first son was born, I remember, I remember, I'm like, my wife is a germaphobe

and she's always like, have you washed your hands? Have you washed your hands? Our kids, we will be somewhere and wash our hands and get in our car. If we pick up takeout and we're going to eat it on the way home and they're in the back watching a movie or whatever, they know you got to get the hand sanitizer also, you know. But so when our son's born, you know, I'm like, she's already instilled the fear in me. But by that point, my hands clean enough, you know, to touch our son, you know, because he the nurses had him and, you know, he's all like slimy and cold

headed and got the little bonnet like hanging off his head. And I'm freaked out because like, so she was in the middle of a CrossFit workout when her water broke. And like she like we went home, we like we had just bought our first house, been married for about two years. And just like, she was like, I'm going to do my makeup and then we'll go to the hospital. Your water broke. I'm freaking out. I thought I needed to have like, but we get there and her water broke, but she wasn't dilated enough.

And then almost 24 hours later he's born. So I like a crackhead by that point. And he's born, I'm like emotional and hungry and tired and all the things. And the nurse has him and he's looking all alien like and she's like, do you want to touch him? You you want to see him?" And I walk over and I'm like, and as I'm reaching in his direction, his little hand reaches up and grabs my finger and I started weeping. And like not audibly, but in my spirit I heard God say, I love you Like not audibly, but in my spirit, I heard God say, I love you more than that. And I said, man, I don't deserve that. I don't deserve to be a dad.

I don't know how to be a dad. I'm scared. I don't know how to do it right. I've never seen it done. I'm a, you know, I'm a screw up. You know, I started just thinking all these things. I was thinking, man, I was 30, you know, 33 at that time. And I was like, man, my dad was 16. And I think like that moment, it was the beginning of me feeling some empathy for him.

And some time passed and God started opening up some cool opportunities. I was on staff at Life.Church for a while as an associate pastor and then took a teaching position in Iowa. And then kind of thing after thing started happening. I did Tucker and Candace Owens and a few other things and started getting a lot of momentum, a lot of opportunities, and God was just moving. And kind of in the middle of that, I was in Dallas actually before we lived there, and I was staying in the Omni, and I'd woken up around like 2 a.m., and it's often, not super often, but often that God will wake me up, and I felt prompted to pray in the middle of the night. And I was lazy. So I was like, I'm just going to lay here. And I began to think like,

hey, what am I doing? And I just felt like super distracted. And then I started to think, it's almost like the Holy Spirit kind of brought to the forefoot of my mind, like, do you fear me? Do you revere me? Like the fear of the Lord rightly understood is reverence, not human fear. Like, do you revere me as Lord? Get on my face and begin to pray. And then I started to see, almost like if you would go glass, like looking for my dad, is my dad as a kid looking for me. And how it just got harder over time. And while I was feeling empathy, I was also feeling this like bubble of rage

at the same time. These like two conflicting emotions. And I was just like, man, cause I've like screamed into my pillow before, like when, especially when it was like the day that we found out we were pregnant for the first time. Someone hacked my wife's Facebook and sent every single person, family, friends, grandma, my pornography.

We announced we're pregnant five minutes later. Damn. It's like we announced we're pregnant five minutes later. There's so like in moments like that, I was like, I don't know why. I like, obviously I'm like, man, I'd love to grab that IT, that IP address and go like carb kick that person, but also like something in me, like, it was almost like the first thing I would think was like, man, dad, if you would have been there, this stuff wouldn't have happened. I wouldn't be experiencing that. It's your fault.

And it would go from like, it's your fault, to like, dad, it's your fault. Why couldn't you just be there? You were down the street. Like, why do you hate me?" And then just my heart broke and I'm just like, I have to forgive him. I don't know what that looks like, but I have to figure out a way. And then I tell my wife, my wife be my wife. She like messages.

He's got, you know, I have a half brother and sister that I don't know very well, but she reaches out to Justin, and then she gets his number, and then I end up with his number. And she was like, you know, very quickly, she's like, here you go. Do what you need to do. I called him and we had that phone call and it was like, man, when I had that conversation with him, it didn't go exactly like I thought it would, but a million pounds came off of me. But what's really wild is in between that dream and that phone call the weekend I had with Victor Marx was nuts. So we know Victor,

and it was, I think maybe it was like the third or fourth time I'd hung out with him. And we were filming a spiritual warfare documentary, and he had interviewed me for that, and he's got this prayer, this retooling prayer where you identify, like, is there any demonic oppression on you, calls them out? Pete We did it on here. Pete Yeah. Pete Yep. Pete But he did that with me and I was just like, you know, I'm saying like, bad to costal, you know, I'm like, Baptist in my theology and Pentecostal in my expression. But like the demonic, you know, like wasn't super familiar

with, you know. Definitely experienced a lot of evil, but regarding stuff like that, not, you know, not super in tune with. And, I think your whole life's been spiritual warfare, man. Absolutely Absolutely But I think that the demonic is sorry, no, no, please It's traps It's these fucking traps. Yeah It's vices. It's addiction. It's lust

sex It's temptation, it's lust, sex, it's temptation. Money. Yep. Jealousy, resentment. Those are, I think that, I think how that, I think about this shit all the time. I think that's how it works. Different traps work for different people.

Oh sure. Yours was, it doesn't sound like yours was even really lust. It was more fame and money. Yeah, and affirmation. Yeah, and your whole life has been acceptance. Where can I get accepted? First one that came along, or at least the first one you noticed, you know, was... so there was three traps, acceptance, fame, money. Yeah. Absolutely. You know, and so I think it's... if you if you display what you really... I don't know how to say this if you're if you display what you're really craving

Or want whether it's you know sex Power Bane money Those things will come Yeah They might not be good. Yeah, I mean, I would say... It's easy to fall into this shit. Oh, yeah.

I see it all the time. I mean, I think you're really tapping into something important because the reality is that most people that struggle with porn, like, porn is problematic in their life, but porn's not their problem. Like porn is the bandaid that they've covered, the wound, the lack, the need with and now that the porn has become problematic in their life. Where you started watching porn because of whatever,

You started watching porn because of whatever, but it's covering something that's so much deeper. That's why helping people stop watching it, it's not, you shouldn't do that. We do stuff that I do all the time. It's so much deeper than that. It's like, why? Why do I do what I do? In contrast of, why do I do stuff that I don't want to do? Paul talks about that.

Why do I have this desire to do things I ought not do? Why do I find myself doing these things? Why do I find myself doing these things? Yeah But I mean it doesn't even necessarily appear like a trap it doesn't look like a trap at the time That's a good trap there right and then and then you're in well good a good You know a good trap would have camouflage mm-hmm I think you know that's why you why John 1010 talks about the enemy wants to kill, steal, and destroy. And you're thinking about if he's going to put you in

change, he's not going to show you the full picture of the chain that you will be in. He's just going to show you a link and how that link's not a big deal. I love this Dallas Willard quote. I believe it's Dallas Willard, but it just talks about how, repentant seems easy at first, and then after you sit, it seems impossible. I mean, how, like, there's a demonic assignment on each person. And you know, I think the, I would say the biggest problem, especially like in Protestant is this negligence or this disbelief that evil can tangibly impact your life as a follower of Christ. Because are we without sin? No. And when we sin, what do we do? We essentially invite opportunity for deception you know so it's yeah I mean I love the way that JP just like lays it out there he spent two years just talking about man we're digging into the fact that you know there's that the devil like you're not interested you know that you're not interesting to the devil per se, but he's got legions

of demons that, you know, they know the wounds, you know, in your family history. They know the things in which you have a proclivity, like towards, he knows, you know, what kind of trap to set for you. He can't make you take the bait. They can make it seem enticing. And even more so, once you take it, he can make you believe that it's not a big deal. But yeah, man, back to that moment with Victor, we were doing that retooling prayer and I was pretty dismissive of it. And then we did it.

And then as soon as he started talking, it was like I was a kid and I was in a room where it took me to a moment that I had suppressed as a kid. I was seven and a half years old and I heard my mom being hit by this guy that she was married to. The dresser was pressed up against the door and I was pressing with my forearm against the door and I got it open just enough where I could see through it and I saw him hitting her and I was screaming at him and I felt so weak and so useless because I couldn't open that door.

And then I cried until I fell asleep. And I woke up and he was just like, man. It was like, so how do you undo something like that? How do you replace a lie? You have to replace it with a truth. Thomas Kempis talks about habit. It has to be replaced with habit. A lie has to be replaced with truth.

So I'm like, man, how do I fix this? How do I undo this? How do I, you know, what do I do with this? What do I do with this new unearthed trauma? I've already been to counseling for two years. It was something I didn't deal with, I never even thought of. I didn't even know it happened, really. And the first thing I could think of was again that dream when I was praying, that moment I was praying, it was like, man, the reason I don't believe that I'm enough, it came from another lie.

That my dad wasn't there for me because I'm not good enough. I'm not good enough to be his son So I'm gonna choose to forgive him in spite of an outcome and I did and I think the enemy like Like I thought in my head like man God had orchestrated this incredible moment You know that I was gonna like when When I called him, there was going to be fireworks shooting off, and then we were going to grab some shotguns and go bunting or something. But it was just not the case. I was talking with a buddy of mine recently, Matt Chandler. He was telling me this story of him and his dad reconnecting later in life.

He was like, I was like, well, how did that happen? He was like, man, just randomly one day, I just got this inkling to say, hey, Dad, I've got access to this cabin. I'm going out there for three days, hunt, fish, do all the stuff you love to do. Why don't you come with me? It's all on me. It's all taken care of. Why don't you come with me? It's all on me. It's all taken care of. Why don't you come hang out with me?" And he did and ended up professing Jesus as Lord, ended

up having a great relationship, even moved closer to him. And I was just like, my dad My dad has a, you know, my dad's office looks like this if it was deer and boar. You know? I was like, he'll be all over that. I sent out a text, look at it, show it to my wife, head sent, 30 seconds go by. I don't think that's going to work. There was so much in me that wanted to like take 10 steps back, you know? It's like, man, like what do I have to do? But at the end of the day, it's like, man, I can't control his decisions and I can't control his response to dictate how I perceive reality and live my life. All I can do is be the best father I can be, and the best husband I can be, and be the

best Christ father I can be, and be the best leader in the organization that I'm part of. It's not you, it's him. Yeah. I mean, it sucked. It sucked. I thought for sure that was it. But I think a better way to think about it as I'm sitting here, it's like maybe it was a seed. When was that? I've been thinking about it as I'm sitting here. It's like maybe it was a seed. When was that? Three months ago. It's a lot of pain.

Yeah. And it's wild. It's like, I spent a lot of time talking about porn and but when I do meds of it, And, but when I do meds events, like I know 90% or more of the guys there have or are struggling with porn. The thing that I get to minister to people about is that there's some kind of father wound and there's levels of fatherlessness. You know, there's guys, you know, fathers that they weren't there at all.

There are fathers that, you know, divorce or death or... It would be easy for me to become the father that's absent in that I'm there but I'm trying to overcompensate so hard that I'm not present. So, so many guys with a similar wound. How do you keep that balance? How do I keep the balance? I mean for for me, it's like, again, my wife is just the best. Where we were doing pre-marital counseling and, you know, looking, we were looking at the five love languages, and she was saying her top love language is quality time. And naturally, the way that we are naturally inclined to love people is the way in which

we most naturally receive love, which often is not the same as our spouse. And with hope, she wanted quality time. She was never not seen as a... Her family, it's like if they fell out of the Hallmark Channel. It's like not real life, you know. It's like she talks to her mom and her sister multiple times a day and, you know, they're on like, you know, her sister just had a baby and they're like, you know, it's wild. It's nothing like I've ever seen. It's almost, it's not uncomfortable, but it's like, it's so normal, it's weird to me.

But she was like, quality time. So when I hear quality time, I'm like, quality date, quality dinner, quality, like something really good. She's like, yeah, I want to sit on the end of a pier where the water is completely placid and just sit there, you know, no phones, nothing, just unattached from everything, just me and you. The greatest gift that you can give me, the greatest present that you can give me is your presence. And that's hard for somebody that doesn't think a lot of themselves. So it was almost like the way that she required me to love

her well allowed me to heal. It was like, man, how could you see that in me? And there's just been so many times where she has just did things and said things that have been so healing to me. She reminds me that, like Cannon especially, that's my dude, he likes presents, likes stuff. At the end of the day, he wants me to sit on the ground and play tic-tac-toe with him. Yeah. Tick-tack toe with it. Yeah And it's like we Overcomplicate simple things that distracts us from the most meaningful things It's good boy to put it So it's that it's you know The way that she loves me. Well, she

Lovingly course corrects me from time to time sometimes it's you know a She lovingly course corrects me from time to time. Sometimes it's a bony elbow and sometimes it's a kiss on the cheek, but she's never afraid to tell me the truth. I appreciate that so much about her. Sounds like a great woman. Oh yeah. It is wild. I mean, like, we were, we were, you know, we were sitting with a group of people and

someone asked her like, well, you know, in good faith, they were asking her like, like, gosh, I admire you so much. Like, how do you not have animosity towards him? Slept with thousands of girls, you know, stuff, it's all over the internet. And how do you not have something in you that causes you to compare yourself? How do you not have animosity and how do you not have that in you? And she was like, well, I knew him for five days before he gave his life to Christ, so I'm not going to hold his past against him. And I don't believe that when you Google him,

you will find the thing that's most true about him. The thing that's most true about him the thing that's most true about him. The thing that's most true about him is that he is a son of the King of Kings. So I'm going to speak to him and think of him the way that God does, not the way that Satan does. Because Satan would like me to hold on to his past. But God says, that is my son whom I'm well pleased. That's been forgiven and cleansed by his blood. Like the prodigal son, like the prodigal son took one step toward his father. The father ran towards him and put a ring on his finger, sandals on his feet, a robe on his back and threw a party because he said, this is my son who's come home. And I think man, it's like, if we can just understand like who God is,

He would seem not only more attractive, but irresistible. Wow, man. That is a hell of a story. Yeah. What a strong woman. Well, you want to end it in a prayer? Yeah, let's do it. Alright, you want to end it in a prayer? Yeah, let's do it. All right, you lead it. Father, we thank you that we get to look at you and say,

Abba, Father, we thank you for our time together. And Lord, we just pray that the conversation that we had, it is both convicting and comforting, in that it doesn't matter what you've done, it doesn't matter what's happened to you, it doesn't matter how far you've gone, you cannot outrun or out-sin what Jesus has done for you on the cross. And to the person that is wrestling with and struggling with pornography addiction, God, I pray that you lovingly correct them, that you do not condemn them for their sin, that if they are a follower of you, that they are someone that would say, hey, I call myself a follower of Jesus. Your Word says that,

Romans 8.1, that there is no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. So I pray that they don't feel condemned in shame, but they do feel corrected in their spirit in that this is not a good thing. This is not something that they should hide. This is something they need to tell someone that's close to them, and that they pursue freedom and healing. And God, I just pray that to the person that doesn't know you, that we understand that we were created to live forever and where we spend forever is up to us,

that you sent your son into this world to die the death that we deserved. He paid our debt on the cross. And God, I just pray that to the person that doesn't know you, that they, right now in this moment, that you draw them close to yourself and they say, hey, I'm a sinner that needs saving. I don't know how to do it on my own, but Jesus, I pray that you come to my life, that I turn from my sin and I turn to you and I give you my life and I trust you. and I pray that you fill them with

the Holy Spirit so they can follow you with all their life for the rest of their life. We pray this all in Jesus' mighty name. Amen. Amen. Well, Josh, thank you, man. Thank you. I just hope that, and I know you will, I wish you the best of success with what you're doing now and spreading the message. And I just hope that this conversation, you know, just a lot of people out there are caught in a vice, a trap, a prison, and they don't think they can find their way out of it.

I've been in one multiple times, I know. I mean, it's a big part of what we do. And I just hope people take this and realize there's always a way out. There is always a way out. Yeah, and yeah, just the reality that wherever you are today, you're not stuck. You know, you're not stuck. You can change.

It doesn't have to always be this way. That's the gospel, that God loves us enough to meet us where we are, no matter what our situation is. But he also loves us enough to not leave us as we are. God bless, brother. The Mayor keeps hitting it out of the park. Take my 30 years of experience. Take the wisdom and knowledge I've learned from the failures when I got sent down my rookie year, all the injuries I had to overcome. Your mind is the most important tool you have in life.

Be relentless, keep charging. It matters how you talk to yourself, how you look at the world. That matters, we talk about that. I don't know, I'm fired up, baseball's back, and it's gonna be incredible, I love it. The Mayor's office with Sean Casey from Believe. Follow and listen on your favorite platform.