She's On The Money - Brooke’s FIRE Plan: How She’s Investing to Retire at 35

Episode Date: October 7, 2025

Retiring early is the ultimate dream... so when Brooke casually dropped that she’s on track to do it by 35 (without the Bank of Mum and Dad), you all screamed a collective “HOW?!” So of course, Victoria had to get her back in the studio to spill everything... and more importantly, share what the rest of us can steal from her strategy without living on two-minute noodles. Turns out, it’s not magic, she started on a $50K salary and built it dollar by dollar with smart habits, steady investing, and a money plan that’s more about options than obsession. Think of this as your crash course in Financial Independence, Retire Early (FIRE) for people who still love a little bit of fun money. Because the real flex isn’t retiring early, it’s having the kind of financial independence that lets you choose what your dream life looks like.Inside this ep:📈 What a “FIRE number” actually is (and how to figure out yours)📈 Why “Barista FIRE” could be the soft-life version of early retirement📈 Super vs shares: how to choose the smarter move for your future📈 Mindset shifts that totally changed the game for her📈 The small money systems Brooke swears by (and how to copy them)📈 Why even a 1% change in your savings rate can shift your whole future LEARN TO INVEST CONFIDENTLY: Our Investing Masterclass is open, enroll here. Join our Facebook Group AKA the ultimate support network for money advice and inspiration. Ask questions, share tips, and celebrate your wins with a like-minded crew of 300,000+.And follow us on Instagram for Q&As, bite-sized tips, daily money inspo... and relatable money memes that just get you.Acknowledgement of Country By Nartarsha Bamblett aka Queen Acknowledgements. The advice shared on She's On The Money is general in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's On The Money exists purely for educational purposes and should not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision. If you do choose to buy a financial product, read the PDS, TMD and obtain appropriate financial advice tailored towards your needs. Victoria Devine and She's On The Money are authorised representatives of Money Sherpa PTY LTD ABN - 321649 27708, AFSL - 451289.  See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

My name is Natasha Bamblett, I'm a proud First Nations woman, and I'm here to acknowledge country. Tii, gulinyan ganya, nianakaka yao yinbina waka, nianakai nianbina yakarumja, duminyagumiga dumiga ithawaka nirawamundamun imalan. Mumu bangada boma ininyalan waka, gaunan yakarumja, wutunarana. Hello beautiful friends. We gather on the lands of the Aboriginal people. we thank acknowledge and respect the aboriginal people's land that we're gathering on today take pleasure in all the land and respect all that you see she's on the money podcast acknowledges culture country community and connections bringing you the tools

knowledge and resources for you to thrive she's on the money she's on the money Hello and welcome to She's On The Money, the podcast that's here to show you that investing isn't just for the rich, it is for you too. When we aired She's On The Money team member Brooke's investing diary, something she said basically broke the internet or our DMs at least. Um, she revealed that her investing strategy has her on track to retire at the age of 35. Yes. 35. Um, she doesn't have that long until 35. You are. I have heaps of time. What do you mean? I'm very young. I'm 27. That's recent. That's new. So she was 26. Happy birthday. Happy birthday. Um, she didn't win the lottery though. Uh, which is kind of low key crazy given

you're still playing. Actually, we don't know yet because I bought a ticket for last night, so we don't know. All right, well, TBC, if she does, we'll let you know. You didn't have a secret inheritance. You didn't grow up rich. Sadly. Brooke has built her portfolio step by step following really clear rules and making smart money moves consistently over a long period of time. There's been no massive investment. There's been no big lump sum of money. It's been dollar for dollar. I'm Victoria Devine. I'm a retired financial advisor who is wildly passionate about getting more women just like you to start building wealth through investing. And after the response we got from her last episode, I thought it was only the right thing to get Brooke back in the

studio and back on the show. Brooke, welcome back. Hello, friends. Are you excited to be here? Yeah, it does feel a bit random. Usually I edit the videos of this podcast, so it's weird to edit videos of myself. I was about to say, do you enjoy editing the videos? It's gross. It's actually way more fun to edit you guys because I don't know what you're going to say. Whereas like when I'm editing myself, I know what I said and I'm like, Oh, did I sound stupid? So if I did just don't worry. Ignore it. I can't edit videos of myself. I can't even listen back to the podcast. Cause I'm like, Oh, who is that? I can actually like do your voice in my head. Stop it. You don't want that. You don't want that. Look, we need to rewind to the moment in your investing diary that I guess

everyone was like wait what the hell you said very casually I might add oh yeah like if I keep investing the way that I am um I'll just be able to retire by the age of 35 yeah and like I already kind of knew that so that wasn't shocking to me but like god that is kind of shocking yes um and now for anyone who's maybe listening to this and heard that and thought sorry what Brooke are you just like manifesting this like you're just like hoping to retire by 35 like what's the actual investing strategy behind this. Can you tell us a little bit more about why that number and how that's actually going to work? Yep. So it's this concept called financial independence, retire early or the fire movement. And I probably discovered this 2017 and I found it on Reddit

and it's all these people that are buying index funds and ETFs and they're increasing their savings rate, which is really important. We'll touch on it later, but they're increasing their savings rate to be well above the amount they're spending and investing the rest. So they're trying to live on as little money as possible so they can invest pretty much all of their income early on and then slowly as they get older some people increase how much they spend but who cares they can retire really early because their living expenses are low and they've got an investment portfolio that's going to produce more money than they're going to spend. I feel like this takes significant sacrifice but I also feel like you don't sacrifice your life that much. Do you

really resonate with that financial independence early save every single dollar or are you a little a bit more lax with it than most? Well, in the beginning I did, I literally had this like fear that tomorrow I'll be homeless. I just never think that I will have enough money to survive. And I always worry about that. So when I first started investing, I did try to save heaps and heaps and heaps of money and definitely sacrifice a lot. And then now as I've got older and I've got a second income, I sacrificed less because I put my entire second income into investing. So now I feel like I can spend a little bit more and stress less but I still keep my savings rate really really really high yeah I feel like you're also to give people a little bit more context

I wouldn't say that you're an impulsive shopper no like that's not something have is that something you've ever experienced no I like definitely like spend money like I'm not silly but like my goal for this year was to buy one item like one item of clothing or like beauty or anything a month so that was like I could only buy one item 12 things 12 things for the year and I've kept on track except I did buy I think one or two extra things but they were my birthday gifts to myself which is like I feel like that's fine that's fine and like you know you could reframe this and be like well I wasn't born today but I could have been I'm not buying them new like I'm a depop addict I spend every day on depop even for my little friend Georgia I find Georgia depop finds too

so it's like I'm not like I bought this jumper off depop this is my item for July and originally $130 and I got a brand new with tax for 40. So that is a money win. I feel like I love talking about this side of things because I think a lot of people just assume that this type of lifestyle involves serious sacrifice and you feel like you're missing out. Yeah. But I think it's about really reframing. Yeah, it's not missing out because I'm helping future me. No. And we laugh a lot because it's kind of like peak consumerism. Like we laugh about the laboo boo. Like we think it's a like cost of living crisis indicator yeah have you bought a labubu no i do think about all the time i wanted to get a labubu on the work card because i couldn't justify it on my own

card you're just gonna put on my card no no i was gonna do it for a video for the she's my money tiktok but they have not become available so unless we find a supplier we won't be getting a labubu but i thought they would want a labubu we're not investing in labubus we are investing in etfs yes when you found this on reddit yeah what made you go far out that's for me and i guess how did it shift the way that you think about money and investing? Like what were you doing before you discovered FIRE? Well, I wasn't really investing. Like that was part of the beginning of my investing journey. The first time I found out about investing was through someone at work. And then I went home and Googled a bunch of stuff and then found the FIRE subreddit. And

the reason it stuck out to me was because there were very average people. At this time, I was earning $50,000 a year. So I wasn't earning good money and I didn't think I could work forever because no one does and they were all average people investing most of their income and then retiring at like an earlier age than normal some people in their 30s some people in their 40s some people in their 50s and I thought oh my god these are normal people doing this why can't I and a lot of them were American and I could and the good thing is a lot of these people were explaining how they did it and I looked at that and I thought surely that's a one-off and then I read some more and it wasn't a one-off and I was like it's actually a legitimate strategy it's a legitimate

thing. And I thought, okay, well, if the kind of idea that I found was you need to increase your savings rate. So lower your fixed expenses, right? And how much you're spending every week and increase the savings rate as much as possible so that you can be like investing more than your earnings. So my original goal was to get my savings rate up to 30%. And then once I did that, I was like, okay, well now what can I do? And I notoriously don't really drink. I stopped drinking like five years ago and I didn't drink for five years. So I saved so much money than the average person because everyone's spending $2 to $3 a week going out drinking and I wasn't. So that money I was investing. So then I was like, okay, well my saving rate is going to go from 30% to

40% and then 40% to 50% and so on to try and get as high as possible. What do you reckon your saving rate is now? I have the exact figure. I did the maths for you guys last night. I think I was going to ask you about this a little bit later in the show, but like you're getting it now. So my savings rate, well, my essential spending. So like my rent, my, I give myself six years fund money. I give myself money to go out for dinner with my boyfriend and we love eating so that's that eating is like central that's our sport it's not just like you guys though I feel like everybody in the she's on the money team loves eating except for Jess in Georgia who I would say yeah but like they're chicken nugget kids and we kind of love them because then we can go out for

something fancy and no one's stealing our food you know I'm getting the scallops and I'm also getting the scallops and everyone else is not but that's okay we love them they love the bread My essential expenses come to 31% of my income, 31.88. And my savings rate at the moment, as of last night, is 68.12%. That's hectic. And that's fully automated. So none of the money I can touch. Like I get paid monthly.

So we get. You're welcome. I get paid monthly, but I pay myself weekly. So I'm one month ahead in my budget at all times. So we get paid on the 15th, but every Friday I pay myself. So I do Thursday. Why do you pick Friday? Because we typically, well, I give myself Friday so that on the weekend I have money

because then I won't dip into my savings. So on Friday, it's my coffee day. So my boyfriend and I take turns. He on a Thursday goes and gets coffee. On a Friday, I get paid, get up in the morning, go get us coffee. And then I have on Saturday and Sunday, just spend my money. And then really, if I spend all my money on those days, I've got to suffer till Friday because I cannot touch my savings. I have, I try to spend my house deposit. See, that's my mentality. But I think a lot of people are listening to this and they're like, that feels really restrictive. For me, it feels really freeing. Cause I'm kind of like, I don't have to think about the big picture. I'm not thinking about whether my bills are paid or whatnot. It's automated. If I've blown all my money on a Sunday

brunch and it means that I can't have, you know, a cheeky croissant or something that I might go, Oh, I deserve a sweet treat. Sorry. You can't afford a sweet treat, Victoria. Like it's not in the budget. Yeah. And I think a lot of people just go and please don't get me wrong. I do clearly have a good income, but the way that I manage my money is on such a week to week basis that I've allocated that amount. You pay yourself first. Yeah, I'm kind of low-key in my head. I'm like, I can't afford that.

Like that's not in my budget. I try to do my grocery shopping on the Saturday and Sunday so that then- So that you can get the good stuff. I've already got all of my groceries sorted. And then Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, I work from home. So-

Yeah, that's a good deal for saving money too. I cook dinner and like I cook dinner two nights a week. My boyfriend will cook dinner two nights a week and then we'll cook lunches. But we typically won't go out those days. We might go out for a lunch on a Friday. We'll go out for a lunch or a dinner on a Saturday or a Sunday.

But the midweek, I'm not really spending any money. I don't pay for money to commute because I work from home. And then I have, I splurge a little bit with my Pilates membership, but that is for the mental health. But my savings rate is pretty high, but I don't feel like I'd go without. But that's purposeful as well. And I feel like if you're sitting there and you're listening to Brooke's story and you're like, holy hell, like I earn $150,000 a year and there's no way I could do that I think for Brooke it works because you started from a low base and so I'm not saying I haven't changed my spending habits from that first income yeah and I think that that for me because like I think I've shared enough about my journey where I got into a whole heap of personal debt

and then I had to get out of it and I had to change my whole mindset around money and that was a struggle yeah you've kind of gone yeah you've gone from low income and like I can survive off this amount to every single time like Brooke is in the perfect position I would say every single time you've gotten a pay rise or a pay increase that has not gone towards lifestyle creep no literally I'm so jealous I cannot do it to myself like in my head I tomorrow if I got knocked back down to my first salary my savings rate would differ but my living expenses and stuff wouldn't change I'm not changing of that I don't have a new car I drive a 2011 Hyundai i30 with custom number plates um but I custom number plates I do they're pretty bougie I hate to brag um but I'm

I'm scared of custom number plates because I genuinely don't want people to like spot my car and be like, oh, that's Victoria, she can't drive. Oh, I know that I can't drive, but it's fine. But like, I don't, I don't have a new car. I don't have a designer bag. Every new item of clothing I buy. You do own a designer bag.

What do I own? You own a Chanel. Oh, no, that's not a designer bag. It was a thousand dollars. Sorry, that's a designer bag. Okay, everybody, for the record. You have a Chanel bag and I can guarantee it's in your car room right now. It's from my carry-on.

It's my carry-on. Oh, sorry, that justifies it? Okay. No, this is making me sound out of touch. I saved for that. It was a vintage Karl Lagerfeld. Let me tell you. But it's like, no, I don't go and buy anything new. Everything I buy is thrifted. But everything you do is thrifted or I'm not throwing her under the bus for owning a shell bag. But like, sorry, a girl's got to live as well. And if that has been on your like wishlist. And I saved for that. Like that was my birthday present to myself three years ago. And it's my carry on every single time I travel. And because it's my laptop. It was three years ago. And

because it's my laptop bag as well, I could have claimed it on tax. I don't think I did, but I should have. I kind of low-key love it. All right. Let's move back from Chanel bags over to the fire concept. If you listen to our episode on how much super you actually need, you'll know that there's like actually no magic number when it comes to creating your perfect retirement, because your lifestyle and your needs and your values are completely unique. And, you know, If Brooke and I swapped lifestyles, we'd have to absolutely recat it on our budget. I'd have to increase my budget. Well, it's interesting as well, because since becoming a mom, I have-

Your priorities shift. Well, yeah. And I've decreased how many days I'm present in the office. So I now have Mondays off and I spend them with my son. And that is expensive, not because we're going out heaps, but like I end up going to lunch and I go, oh, I'm stuck in the house. You know, I've done, I've like killed it as a mom this morning. It's your true yourself mental health moment. Yeah. And like, sorry, what do you mean a kid's toasty is $12? So most of the time I pack his little lunch because he loves a lunchbox at this age. But I'm still going out going, do you know

what? I've been at home. I've done all this stuff. I'm going to go out. And that's a self-care activity. Yeah. And like, I've had to reshift my budget, not just in terms of what I originally had budgeted for baby. Cause like I'd done all the maths, right? Like I'd worked out on average, this is what nappies are going to cost this is what you know my god it's so because you can only make so many calculations because until you're in that situation you can't like my budget would change too if I was in that situation the lifestyle stuff so like I find the budgeting for the stuff that I can anticipate that's maybe not lifestyle so like I knew that every season he's going to go up a size so like you know I did so much research and so much talking to chat gpt and looking at

like reddit just because I really wanted to know but essentially your baby will outgrow their clothes every three months. That is crazy. And I would pass away at the thought of having spent that money. And so I worked out, okay, well, if that's the case, how many onesies do you think I'll need every season? I was psychotic. How many, how many outfits? And like, yeah, I've blown the budget on that a few times. Cause I'm like, oh, sorry. Like my husband, this is so lame, but we're going to a wedding in Bali soon. And my husband has this. Bali at the Padma. Yeah. Yeah. Bali at the Padma. Is this going out after that? Yeah. It'll be September. Great. I stayed at the Padma. That's a big contentious topic in our office. If you want to know more,

I'll make a TikTok for us. Actually, Brooke just straight out told me that that's Bali Bogan. But guys, when you have a kid, the Padma as a resort, sorry, it has a petting zoo. It has an ice cream cart. You're selling it to yourself, not to me. I am. And do you know what? I'm not leaving that resort with my nearly two-year-old. Anyway. Can't wait for your Padma review. When we were doing that, I was like, oh, sorry, I do actually need my husband and son for the recovery party of this wedding to have matching outfits. No, I think that that is an expense that I would have to approve to. Yeah, fine. But all of those things, I think you can kind of like sort of foresee, but it was like the mental shift of like, hold on. Like I've realized that on the Monday that

my son and I are at home on our own all day, I actually do want to go out for lunch. I do want to go out and get a toasty. And like, we're not talking like super expensive, but like those budget shifts are different because you're at different life stages. So I think it's important to go oh what's a perfect retirement number well it's going to look different for me and different for you because we also have different lifestyle goals yeah we live in different states like Melbourne's notoriously more expensive you pay for tolls I found out the other day how much tolls were which is crazy but like that's something that's never going in my budget no no and I think that that's where we go back to this concept of financial independence retire

early like your personal fire number isn't just about hitting like a million dollars and being like, okay, well I hit the goal or retiring by a certain age. It's about designing a life that works for you and then building an investment portfolio that can support that version of freedom. And whether that's like, you know, really luxury or really minimalist or like you're like semi-retired or something or anything in between, like it's going to look different and you have to work backwards. So Brooke, what version of FIRE are you currently working towards? Like once you hit 35 sorry I need to know the gritty details yeah what would your lifestyle look like it depends because I know that realistically before the time I hit 35 I'll probably have kids

get married except I would never do a big wedding which why would you do that that's so crazy I would never ever spend lots on there but that doesn't like align to my values I'm a kind of for those of you who don't follow me on social media my money was huge a significant amount of money but to me i could never justify that i would justify eloping and spending 20 can a really sick holiday for me and my partner and their families i would just never have a big wedding it's not my journey i could follow you like can i come to the wedding you can't but that's okay let me set this boundary here you won't be attending my single elopement this is bullshit but for me my fire mentality right now is i would love to get to 2 million by 35

and then be able to have like a full $80,000 a year income, which would be a 4% drawdown rate. But I'm realistic that I'm not going to retire at 35 because I've really enjoyed- No, but you have a number that you want to have the option at. Yeah, which is $2 million. So that's a work optional then. But I would also think about doing something called

coast fire or barista fire, which is where your investing portfolio will give you like a part-time income. So which would be about- I've really never heard of barista fire. This is my favorite concept. George and I talk about this all the time, but she's like, you kind of get to a point where, okay, well, I've experienced the corporate highs

and lows. I've enjoyed doing my career and growing that, but now that doesn't serve me anymore. I want to do passion projects. I want to do this. So you then get a job. I want to be a CEO who then becomes a yoga teacher. Exactly. And you can live on a lower income, but continue to have your lifestyle because your investment portfolio will prop you up. So say my barista fire number would be $1,125,000, which would then get me 45K a year income. Then say I have a 50K a year salary. That means I'm still earning $105,000 a year, but I'm working a fun job that I find, like I feel passionate about it. And then if I wanted to take a little sabbatical and I wanted to go overseas for a couple of years, I'm still earning 45K a year. So you can coast towards your five. Now

you're still increasing your savings rate because of that 45,000, I still spend, like I spend less than that a year. I spend like 30 grand a year or something. I would still be contributing towards my investing fund. So my investments are still growing as I'm getting closer to that main fire number. I love that. And I feel like just knowing your fire number is only one piece of the puzzle. So we're going to take a very quick break. And when we get back, we're going to dive into a little bit more of the juicy stuff, the strategy and the things that you need to think about if you actually want to retire early. So guys don't go anywhere. All right, we are back and it is time to jump into the strategy that you have behind retiring

early. When most people start their plans for retiring early, say around like, I don't know, 65 is what people are like working towards on average. They often work out a drawdown rate of around 5%. You mentioned that your drawdown rate was 4% before just for context. And that's because their investment portfolio only needs to last like 20 or 30 years for them. But when you're planning to retire much earlier, your investments actually have to support you for longer and that money has to stretch further and you need to be a bit more conservative. Brooke, you mentioned that your drawdown rate was 4%. When you calculated your FIRE number, why did that drawdown rate make the most sense for you? I just try to be as conservative as possible because then if I could

actually draw down more, that is a win. A win is a win. I will take that. I'm always going to like base my calculations on the lowest possible, like obviously it's not the lowest possible, but the most reasonable and lowest amount so that then any extra, it's a bonus. Yeah. It's like a little, this is your annual bonus. Great. But if I factored my like drawdown rate is like 6% and realistically I could only draw down 4% that I would be disappointed. So if I aim low and land tie. Money win. We want to set our expectations to be exceeded. Correct. When I was a financial advisor, I always did that because I'd always be like, I really want to impress you and I'd prefer you to be happy with me. Under promise, over deliver. Exactly. Now you have mentioned

that you want to retire at the age of 35, which means that your superannuation actually can't come into this conversation. Yes, but we will have that when we turn 65 and when we're a little bit older. I want to know that combination because at the moment your fire number, you mentioned $2 million, that would not be including any super because you can't touch that. Just because you decided to retire does not mean that the government says, oh yes, you are retired because it doesn't make sense. Good job, Brooke. Here, have it all early. You've done amazing. Unfortunately, that's not it. And I think that that makes it a little bit trickier than a traditional retirement because as I've said time and time again on the show before, I think superannuation is the sexiest

tax vehicle in existence like at the moment you'd be paying a relatively high marginal tax rate but in superannuation you are paying 15 yes that is hot girl shit for most of us unless like and I don't want people coming at me and being like well my cousin accessed his super early yet you can in really extreme circumstances of illness or injury or like I think I'm eligible yeah no no you're just ill um but we can't access it until we're 60 and then we can actually draw down on it properly tax-free from 65 at this point. I do believe, side note, that that retirement age is going to be reset to probably 70 or 72. And the reason for that is just we are working later and later and the government wants to push off retirement age. Because it saves them money.

Yeah, it would take significant pressure off the pension system because they're basically forcing you to work longer. But anyway, back on track, if you're aiming to stop working in your mid thirties or maybe even closer to 40, you need a way to fund, you know, the next, you know, years between that. And this is where the idea of like bridging buckets comes into it. And I think it's that part of the portfolio that's invested outside of super, and that's designed to cover your lifestyle until super becomes available. But tell me, like, have you actually factored super into the plan? Like, are we talking about that? Cause like I do payroll every month and paying your super. You are. I'm grateful for it. Yeah. But are you watching it? Are you caring

about it? I do definitely watch it. It's definitely in my, I track my net worth every month just because I'm freaking insane. I love this. Also free network. It's not free. It's in the investing masterclass. But the net worth tracker that's in the investing masterclass I made and it is my one that I use. Yeah. There we go. I was like, it's free. Hold on. No, it's not. We put it as a bonus for our investing masterclass. I fill that net worth tracker out every single month because I like to see it grow, but I do factor my super in there, but it is not factored into my fire number at all because obviously the fire you can't access it no and the fire movement side in america they don't have super so i've just always not included it and

i consider that my superannuation is a bonus it's like when i reach 65 it's a thank you here you go do you know like what would your super be sitting at like i'm not it would be in the millions by the time i get to but it's like sitting at a good amount for your age at this point i'm assuming because you've always worked. Yeah, it's more than double what the average is. Okay, but it's just flexing here. No, I've always worked two jobs. You don't make additional contributions.

I don't make any additional contributions because I really like to have control over my investments and because I want to be able to be work optional by 35, I don't factor that into my investing. Obviously, I feel grateful to have super and if my super was lower than the average, I would definitely contribute to it. But right now, it's not part of my fire strategy.

it's a nice to have when I turn 65. And I hope that that money will then just be things I could help with my family. Yeah. And that's kind of my strategy as well, just to flip it. Cause I think people are always like, well, what do you do with your super Victoria? And look, I think we've all heard that there's two phrases that come to mind here. Do as I say, not as I do. And then the other one is the plumber always has the leaky tap. Right. And so I've never heard that. Have you never heard about the plumber? No, I do agree because people that do a job, they don't necessarily do that for themselves. No. And I have always said, if you're a small business owner, like you need to be paying yourself superannuation. And I'm wildly passionate about that, but I also don't

live with the fairies. And like when I first started my business, I'm sorry, I did keep track of it. Like I knew what I should be paying myself in super. But sometimes it's not realistic to what the situation is. Sorry, I didn't have any cashflow. And the decision, like Jess, we've talked about, was my first employee in She's On The Money, completely separate from Zella. But I remember being like well I can't afford to take super if I'm going to then be paying someone else's super and actually getting this support and it was investing in my business yeah and like there were so many like yes you should be paying super as a small business owner but also was I let's be honest no I wasn't but I did keep track of what I should have been paying myself in super and so

when people like oh do you make extra contributions I'm kind of like okay this is complicated because yes but the reason I do is to get back up where I need to be and what I quote in my head owe myself not because I'm trying to bulk up my super yeah because I would love for my husband Steve and I to be in a position ideally by the age of 40 mine's not 35 because that's next year by the age of 40 where we have that financial freedom to go actually let's do some fashion projects yeah and like the way that I have worked that out is same as you like I've gone okay our number is x and thankfully we have a dual income household so we're both contributing to this um no not dinks double income no kids i'm not a dinkless um we're dinkless uh which is really sad i graduated from

being a dink what 18 months ago great 10 out of 10 can recommend to the graduation um but not for the financial benefits because as such there are none i have a tiny freeloader who um basically he doesn't even do chores no chores and all he does is snack honestly if i lifted your house i'd also snack you've got an ice machine too it's fantastic but when when i did my baby budgeting i didn't budget for the amount of snacks this tiny gremlin demands yeah i know that's like what do you mean and that's a money loss he's a bottomless pit anyway so it's an interesting concept but we've worked out okay cool well this amount of money we won't be debt free at that point but this amount of money that's why you have mortgages i don't own a home yeah so for us it won't it'll

quite different. Yeah. We'll have a financial independent number, but built into that is our mortgage repayments and like our living costs. And that still works. Yeah. And I just, I look at it and I go, well, I don't know what life will look like. I don't know if like podcasting is going to be successful forever. Like, honestly, that's why I have two separate businesses. I feel like this is like my fun, shiny one that hopefully will last for ages. And like, you know, I love financial literacy, but you'd never know. And then I have my more legitimate mortgage broking business, which basically every piece of income that goes into that gets reinvested into that because it's the long-term business yeah so we then have our like investing like or our retirement number that

we could retire at but we won't be debt-free and I think that's an important thing to add because I think a lot of people think that you'll have to get to your retirement number and you'll have to be debt-free I'm sorry there's no way I would have a mortgage by the time like obviously I'm looking to buy a house in the next few years and by the time I would reach my fire number I wouldn't be using that money to pay down my mortgage. I would be factoring those mortgage repayments into. They're my cost. They're my cost. They're my fixed expenses. Yeah. And I think that that's an important call out. Cause I think a lot of people, especially in the fire community, that can be quite aggressive about this. Like they want to be at their retirement number,

but also debt free. That's because in America, housing is heaps cheaper. Like if I was to go move to Missouri right now, I could buy a five bedroom mansion for $200,000 and I could pay all cash, you know, but you can't, it's not realistic. And I think that that's why. It's different market and that's why it's really hard with the fire subreddits because most of them are American and that's why I was like I really want to point out that like while I'm also working towards this I think it would be a miss to not mention that I'm actually going to be in debt I'm going to still be in a lot of debt for our mortgage yeah um but I'm actually low-key fine with that because like it's in your plan it's in the plan it's just it's our housing cost and even if we didn't have

a primary principal place of residence yeah whatever we call it PPOR so there are lots of different strategies, both internationally and in Australia that people are using to reach their fire number. I think some of them really focus on capital growth. And if you've listened to other episodes with Brooke and I, we both love Warren Buffett and like kind of subscribe to his investing methodologies, but we also differ a little bit in that my, yeah, my priorities when picking my investments are more dividend yield and like, you know, balanced with performance. Whereas you're like just shoot lights out. I want more performance. I don't give two rats about your dividends. So everybody has a different strategy, which means building a portfolio

in a different way. And that's okay. But the idea is that every single one of us are building a portfolio that increases in value over time so that we can eventually live off either the dividends from our investments or for some people start selling off our investments and living off that. Without drawdown, right? Yeah. And I think some other people, like as we're saying, they really focus on like income producing assets like me, but I'm not an income producing assets girly in the investment property space. Like I think a lot of people go, oh, I could buy a rental property. That's fine. That could be part of your strategy, but that's actually not my circus nor my monkeys.

I don't want to be someone's landlord. Um, I, I don't think I've shared a lot about that, but like over time I've just realized that's not my journey. I just feel like that's not for me and that's okay, but it is for other people. Brooke, I want to talk a little bit about when you're building your portfolio with this fire methodology in mind, are you like, we've talked about it a little bit in that you're just after growth shares at this point in time, But like, how does that strategy impact the ETFs or the investments that you ultimately pick? I think because when I first started investing, I was like really young.

Yeah. I was in my early twenties and my, when you read all of these things and I have read literally every investing book on the market. I literally just like backtrack. I literally paid her to do that to make sure that we did. Oh my God, it was so fun. We did not miss a bloody beat in our investing masterclass. Sorry.

I spent like three months working on that. I was like, Brooke. Day in, day out. Brooke, we can't have all these other investments. What if we miss something that they have? Yeah, it needed to be perfect. And I think I learned a lot in that. And even in my early 20s that I-

You're welcome. So I basically paid you to get a financial education. I know, I would love to get a degree. So if you want to pay for that, true, keep that. I'll just draw like a little certificate. Draw one out for me. We'll get George and make one in Adobe. Yeah.

I learned that I have so much time for risk. So my strategy when I first started investing was high growth, high risk, because I have time for the market to go up. I have time for the market to go down. And I want to buy at every stage of that. I want to buy it when it's at its highest. I want to buy it when it's at its lowest. I want to be buying it every single week. So my strategy from the beginning was to buy, I didn't care about dividends, high growth investments and ETFs that were just high risk. I was happy with the risk.

Everything was diversified and risky, but I wanted to make sure that I was getting at least 10% return every year. Obviously that's averaged out over 10 years. But now I look at my portfolio and I've been investing consistently since 2018, 2019 and my strategy really hasn't changed. Obviously I've added in more ETFs and more index funds and some direct shares, but I really don't factor them in. My average return since 2018, 2019, which was like six or seven years, is I'm up 13.79%. Yeah, see that's good. Which is really good. So like my strategy is currently working for me and I'm still picking shares and ETFs that align in that sort of space. But as I get older, as I near closer to that like fire number, obviously I will probably change the way that

I invest because I don't want as risky options when I am actually beginning to draw down. I only want, I'm not caring as much about the returns. And like going back to my financial advisor career, that was very true of all of our clients. So like the clients that I had that were your age, they were very, very risky. And the older you get, the more capital stable you're looking for, because you just don't have the time ahead of you. Like if you're like 60 and you're like, Victoria, I'm here. I've got my super, I've got my investments. I'm ready to start like gearing up to retire in five years. I'm not looking at, you know, high growth, high yield funds. I'm looking at capital stable investments to really stabilize what you have built and

essentially lock it in. Like I want to lock and load what you have got because I don't want you to feel those ebbs and flows so much once you are retired because once you're retired you want consistency you want consistency and you want to know that you can trust it and I would prefer you to at that stage switch and not everything and like this is probably a little bit dramatic but we're switching to going okay cool we've got our five percent or our four percent drawdown rate I actually just want to be able to lock that in for you so that every single year you can go no I know I will have an income of $80,000 or 50 or whatever. It's less about growing that capital.

Yeah, it's less about the capital increasing. It's more about having a consistent income. Because right now, if your portfolio is performing one year, 13%, the next year it could do negative five. And that's okay because it doesn't matter for you now. But imagine if you don't work. Imagine if you were like, okay, cool, I'm banking on this 80 grand coming in. And then the year after, it's like, sorry, your portfolio.

We're down 20% and you get nothing. You lost something. you also can't afford to draw down on that like then your life's out of fix yeah and I feel like we just want stability at that point so when you are a bit younger and you can ride that risk ride great let's do that but it's never going to be and that's why I'm like oh it's not one strategy forever it's not set and forget it's a you need a free check like we can set and forget for 12 months we can set and forget for 24 months but not for 30 years I think that's one thing that's really interesting that I found when I was researching for the investing masterclass

something that america does really well we don't really have it here but i feel like in the next few years we might have it is target date funds yes so target date funds basically it might be a fund that's called year 2050 and it's based on the year that you would like to retire and you invest in that and then as you get closer to that age so say the portfolio right now for a target date fund for year 50 might be 70 really high risk but as you age and you progress they do it they do the set and forget part. You just set and forget. It's a managed fund.

They wind down your risk. Yeah, they slowly change it and rebalance the portfolio to suit where you're at in your life stage. And I think that's such an interesting way of investing. And it's like,

we don't have access to that in Australia, but I think for like Americans, that's so good because if you don't feel edgy headed enough to make all of those decisions about your risk,

well, okay, what are they doing? What could I look at and think, okay, well, let's do that. So when I was researching for the investing mask, I remember looking at that

and thinking that's such an interesting way to invest and I think in Australia we might see something like that in the future yeah um they're coming they're absolutely coming they're coming and I'm seeing a lot of people like I'm still on all of the EDMs for all of the financial advice houses because like I haven't left them yet um they're definitely being looked into if we pivot a little bit I feel like fire feels heavy like for me I'm investing but I definitely wouldn't subscribe to saying that I am a fire person like yes I want to retire early yes I want to have financial freedom but like I also I probably

love my lifestyle a little bit more than you I'm like I'm happy to sacrifice eaves yeah and like I'm kind of just in that like honestly before kids Steve and I were very good at being a little bit more frugal and getting stuff done and like I was very aggressive getting out of debt and whatnot and now we're kind of in the I can't even breathe sometimes like life is really stressful work is really stressful and like, it's okay. That's definitely not a complaint. Like what a bloody privilege to be stressed by something I created. Like that's good. There's no complaints, but like that does mean I am a little bit more convenient with my spending. Like I am probably spending more on Uber Eats than I would like to, but I'm telling you right now, like for me in this

part of my life, I'm so happy to do that. But I want to know, is there like a specific habit or an investing rule or something you've put on yourself that has made getting closer to fire easier without feeling like you're compromising your entire lifestyle? Well, because I pay myself weekly, my investments come out first. So every Friday I pay myself a spending money.

I have a spending account where my money goes into. My investments come out of my pay account. So I never see it. I don't touch it and I never change it. So at a minimum, every single week, $650 gets put in that account. and if I get paid a bit more or my side hustle pays off a little bit more I put a little bit extra in but I never invest less than $650 every week and that's insane to me it's crazy I know but

I think it's because I started just investing that little extra bit so like when I first started average investing like I was investing $25 a week and then when I got a better paying job it was $150 a week and then it was $250 but I literally haven't changed my fixed expenses at all and then I was lucky for a period of time when I moved back to Perth I wasn't paying rent so I had that rental income that rental income that I had thanks Desley I invested that rental income into the share market so I was investing an extra $250 a week now that I am paying rent again obviously I'm investing less because I have to pay rent but I had that little extra so every time I can give myself a little bit of a boost because compound interest is and time in the market is going to

make more difference than how much I'm investing over the long term so the earlier I can get the money in the better. So if I can sacrifice a little bit now in the future, I won't have to sacrifice as much. I like it. We're just girls. So on the flip side, what are you not willing to sacrifice? Travel. If you know me, I've been to like over 40 countries. I think I'll get to like 47 this year because I'm going to Europe for three months. God bless. But I always save for travel every week. I save like $200 a week for travel. I know it probably sounds like I save a lot of money and then spend a lot on weird things, but my value is travel. So people drink. I don't drink. So that money goes into travel funds.

I will always have money to travel and do fun things like that. But that means if I want to travel, I need to be savvy with it. So I points hack. I just booked flights literally yesterday with points to go to Tasmania. I get so excited about it. Tasmania, you didn't tell me about that. I literally only booked this literally yesterday. We're in Tasmania.

We're going to Hobart, but then Connor and I are doing, just gave him a shout out. We're going to visit Harriet. We could. We're doing a road trip. I've never been to Tasmania. It'll be my last date I have to visit. so I we're going to do a road trip in like early late December I am going to give you my laundry

list I want all the recommendations I have all the good coffee spots I have all the good restaurants I have all the good hikes um there's a hike that I will specifically send you to on the east coast that is just it's wombat central that's what I want you'll just see all the animals I want a little square poop yeah so I won't ever sacrifice and travel but I'll just be savvy with it I'll be using shop back I'll be using like points I'm making sure that I can still do the things I want to do but just in a savvy way I don't care about a five-star hotel I've got no no rules about that I'll just make sure I can still live my life but I'm not spending money on things I don't value I feel like a lot of people are listening to this episode and they would absolutely love to retire

early like they they would love this but they're like this is just not feasible for me and that's fine because I think some of us are too far down our financial journeys and our financial commitments take a step back to take a step back and that step back would be you know someone might listen to this and be like holy guacamole I am so inspired by this I'm going to change my entire mindset but that's a lot to ask for because you're not just changing the way you think about money you're changing the way that you would act with it how you would live the like decisions lifestyle sacrifice yes exactly but as I said earlier like fire does seem relatively extreme for a lot of people, what would be your investing advice to somebody who's maybe gotten a little bit further

down that track of like, you know, let's pretend I don't invest. And I go, well, Brooke, actually that sounds slay. I have a mortgage. I have a husband. I have a kid. Like I actually have these financial commitments. What's your advice? Where can you cut corners that isn't going to make a big difference? So like you said, you like Uber Eatsing. I really don't Uber Eats because I could just walk there or I could you know or maybe I'm changing my shopping from shopping at Woolworths every day to shopping at Aldi once a week or just making those little sacrifices so that I could slowly increase my savings rate what like could you change your savings rate by one percent because that one percent you're saving right now do not make me look at my budget literally but if you

could save that extra one percent or that extra five percent and invest that that's really going to pay off like those small amounts if you use a compound interest calculator and you change how much you're investing by five dollars or twenty dollars so significant in the long term if you invest a hundred dollars from the ages of 20 to 30 and then stop investing at 30 and reach 50 the person that starts investing at 30 and invest consistently from 30 to 50 will never catch up even though you stopped investing after 10 years yeah like i'll make it real for our instagram to explain that when this goes we will but like all of that stuff is already in our master class that We worked very, very hard on together.

And you just have to make tiny little sacrifices to increase your savings rate. What ways could you increase your savings rate? Are you calling your phone provider to say, hey, I currently pay $90 a month for my phone. Could you get it down to 40? Because I got my phone bill down to $39 a month. So that extra bit, okay, great.

I'm investing that. Every little cent that you can using roundups. What can, yeah, what little changes could you make to increase that savings rate just a little bit? That's what I would tell you. Agreed. Brooke, we have run out of time very quickly. thank you so much for coming back on the show and letting us be very pervy about your investing

journey you're welcome I know this episode I don't know I feel like yes I can do so many educational episodes but the best thing is to learn from example and see what other people are actually doing so you can go oh that would work or that wouldn't work because theory is theory yeah and I think that this will shift a lot of perspectives not just around fire but more around what's actually possible when you start investing with intention. So thank you for coming on the show. And I'm sorry we've run out of time. Guys, if you have loved this chat, please make sure you hit subscribe so that you never miss an episode with us. And if you've got a friend who's been maybe flirting with the idea of investing or retiring early, please send this their way.

We love a group glow up. So that is all from us today, but we'll be back in your ears on Friday. See you then, guys. Bye. the advice shared on she's on the money is general in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances she's on the money exists purely for educational purposes and should not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision if you do choose to buy a financial product read the pds tmd and obtain appropriate financial advice tailored towards your needs. Victoria Devine and She's On The Money are authorised representatives of Money Sherpa PTY LTD ABN 321 649 27708 AFSL 451 289.