She's On The Money - FRIDAY DRINKS: A Finfluencers Regulation Conversation!

Episode Date: March 24, 2022

This week ASIC have announced that Finfluencers who do the wrong thing will face up to 5 years in jail or a million dollar fine, and we have A LOT TO SAY. We talk about the important and valuable landscape in which responsible Finfluencers operate, the unsolid ground that this whole space now stands on and we attempt to clarify a few points!Here's a link to ASIC's information as discussed on the show: https://asic.gov.au/regulatory-resources/financial-services/giving-financial-product-advice/discussing-financial-products-and-services-online/The advice shared on She’s on The Money is general in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She’s on The Money exists purely for educational purposes and should not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision. Victoria Devine is an Authorised Representative of Infocus Securities Australia Proprietary Limited ABN 47 097 797 049 AFSL - AFSL 236523.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Just before we get started, we'd like to acknowledge and pay respect to Australia's Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples. They're the traditional custodians of the lands, the waterways and the skies all across Australia. We thank you for sharing and for caring for the land on which we are able to learn. We pay our respects to elders past and present and we share our friendship and our kindness. She's on the money. She's on the money. Hello and welcome to She's on the Money, the podcast for millennials who want financial freedom. Welcome back to another one of our Friday drinks episodes where we get to celebrate the money wins from our She's On The Money community. There are obviously so many great

money wins and some confessions shared each and every single week in our Facebook group. And we spend a very big part of our week talking about you all and celebrating you in the office without you being able to see. So it only seems fair that we make a pod to share it with the rest of you. This week, as we are every week, we are celebrating you and this whole episode is for you. Friday is about celebrating the community that surrounds us and having more positive and constructive conversations around money. So let's jump straight into it. Jessica Ricci, we have had a lot of good feedback this week about our money diary. What happened? Well, it made me mad, firstly. Oh, I was like, hold up, hold up, hold up. She was lovely. Why

are you angry? Mad about the situation. Yes, no, she was a delight. But she's currently going through a workers' comp claim because she was injured in the workplace due to something that was not her fault at all. It was actually due to someone else not following procedure. and her workplace doesn't really want to pay her. They don't and they're trying to fire her and they're trying to push her out and it just seems so cooked that this is happening and she's having to take legal action and, like, it's just so much.

She's literally had her back broken. Yep, the poor thing. She's going through so much stress. She's having to pay these legal fees out of her own pocket, not even knowing if she'll be able to recoup them because if, you know, things don't go her way, that's money that she's spent trying to get something that I would argue she absolutely is deserving of. And unfortunately, it's not an uncommon story.

It happens to a lot of people. And I think that's why we got so much good feedback this week is because it's not a unique experience, unfortunately, which is terrible to think of, particularly because those high risk jobs where you're more prone to injury are really essential. Like we couldn't function without those roles. And it's such a shame that those employees aren't being prioritised and their safety doesn't seem to be of importance to these big companies. And it breaks my heart to think that she's, you know, had this career that really worked for her. Like she was telling us how she had this FIFO role where she'd fly in for a couple of weeks and then out. So she got to spend heaps of time with her family and bringing up her kids.

And now that's not going to be the reality because she can't return to that type of work after this injury. But Jess, she did say that this is arguably one of the darkest times in her entire life. And that broke me. Like I remember being like, I'm so like, I wish I could do more. and we're obviously in the background making sure she's supported and we love her and we'll keep you guys updated. I hope that this is a money story where we have a really beautiful update to share with you all, but I think it's a money story worth sharing. But the benefit here, right? This is a very selfish benefit. She went back to uni, she studied financial planning and she wants to be a

planner. So like there's more cool, strong female financial advisors that are going to join the industry. And I'm so excited about that because she was so kind and so intelligent and so We were compassionate and I was just like, oh, you're going to make a great advisor. So, I mean, that's the benefit that I saw. A thousand percent. Really good story. She got a scholarship as well. But listen for all of the details because you don't think it's going to happen to you.

You don't think it's going to happen to someone you know. And unfortunately, the stats tell us that it, in fact, potentially could. And as an advisor, the worst part about this story is she just assumed she had income protection and she didn't. Thanks. Oh, let's move away from that. G King on tour. are. Hello, ladies. Nice to see you both in the flesh. You're looking extra radiant today. I love

the yellow against your tan. It's very bright. Your vision. Your vision. Thanks, girl. I guess we're talking about the Wednesday deep dive. Yeah, we had a good deep dive. Well, I wasn't on it. It was Glenny James, I believe. Yeah, that's why it was so good. I haven't listened to it. Whoops, rude. Not because you weren't there, because it was Glen and we love him. So Glen and I sat down and we had a big chat about all the things that we thought were important. Does get a little bit ranty, does get a little bit fun, does at some point get a little bit spicy, but that is okay. And that is a Glen James podcast. And I'm really grateful to have like finance friends, but also podcast friends where we can jump on and vibe because we weren't able to record an ep together,

George. So Glen pulled one out of the hat for us. What a legend. What did you talk about? Everything and nothing. We did a whole heap of listener questions and just like ranting about mainly buy now, pay later. For anyone who doesn't know, Glen is of course from My Millennial Money. So Glenn is the host of My Millennial Money. He's an ex-financial advisor and all-round legend. I hope he's this complimentary about me on his podcast. We're just setting the expectation up there. But do you know, Georgia King, who else is a legend? The She's On The Money community, which is why we're here today. And you're going to share their money wins with us this week. What have you brought in?

Some corkers as per, when are they not corkers? Let's be real. They're always really good. Absolutely. Our first win of the day, ladies, is from Sarah. Money win. I was running low on my everyday foundation and needed to buy a replacement. Then I saw that the brand I used was part of the Afterpay day sales, but I didn't want to have anything to do with supporting an Afterpay collaboration if I could help it. So I did a little research. What a queen. I love her. I'll buy a foundation for her. One of our own extra money win. Peace, shout. So I did a little extra research and found an influencer code that got me the same 20% off. Oh my God, what a legend.

She's like, I'm not having this. All right. The next win here comes from Jenny. Money win. I was offered a promotion at work, but was incredibly nervous to have the salary conversation. To my surprise, I was offered a salary bump without even asking, but because I had already hyped myself up and had been practicing, I decided to ask if there was any wiggle room for a higher number anyway. And to my surprise, they agreed. Oh my God, what? It's true what they say. The worst that can happen when you ask for a salary increase is that they say no. Don't ask, don't get cheeky. Precisely. Good on her though. I love that. Would you guys do that? If they offered you an increase, would you ask for a little bit more? It's a bit cheeky. I would. I've got a lot of

audacity though. Yeah. Depends on if they like, if they've already asked your expectations. Like if I set my expectations and they met them, I probably wouldn't. But if they hadn't had that conversation, which like now having worked here, I'm more, if they ask me, I've set all of you up for failure. Sorry for anyone who ever interviewed me. That you're screwed. Like they are in a lot of trouble. I mean, it's probably a good sign that Jess didn't ask for more money when I gave her a pay rise last year. Should have bargained her up. We can take this offline. What else you got, G? Moving on, our next one is from Amanda. Not sure if this is something I should be proud of or ashamed of. I signed up for binge and watched the whole of the Euphoria series before

the end of the trial period and cancelled my subscription before being billed. Very stoked with that money win. I think she's a genius, but do you know what else she needs to do? She needs to get another email, sign up for another free trial period and watch that below deck show that I'm obsessed with. It's trash. George, you like it too though. I know, it's really opened my eyes up to the world of superyachts. That's my financial dream. I can't say I have much to do with the world of superyachts personally. When I buy the one you can come for sale. Have you ever been on a superyacht? Do I look like I've ever been on a superyacht? You look like somebody would want to take you on their superyacht. Sugar daddy, where you at? What is the next win, Georgie? The next one is

from Di. Money win. After listening to She's on the Money, I was inspired and felt confident enough to ring my bank and ask for a better rate on our home loan. Yes. We then visited a mortgage broker who found us a much better deal. By his calculations, we will be saving about $2,000 a year. A year? And now that I see how easy it is to ask and check for better rates, we will definitely be doing this more in the future. I love this. On your dime. Take note, everybody listening. It is easier than you think it is. There's a template on our website. Go download it. It's free. Easy peasy. The next win is from Brooke. I scored $1,000 worth of accommodation at a five-star hotel for $200. What? Absolute win. Little medal emoji. That's so expensive. Oh my gosh. Sometimes

when I'm feeling really bougie, I go on the internet and look how much it would be to stay in an overwater bungalow in Bora Bora. Oh my God, the dream. No, I can't do it. Can't do it. Especially $4,000 a day. It's like I can choose to eat for the rest of my life or I can pay for that bundle. Yes, we're going on holiday. The next thing, guys, comes from Caitlin. Money loss. I cut a tendon in my hand. So I had emergency surgery today, which means eight weeks off work. Oh, no. That's sad, obviously. Hope you're okay. Hope you're okay, Caitlin. That sounds painful and horrible. But the money win, the positive side, we're all about glass half full here at She's On The Money. I'm not allowed to drive, so I won't be paying for fuel for the

next eight weeks like us suckers. Kind of helpful. With petrol prices the way they are. Exactly. That is huge. A good time to cut your hands open. Nobody wants to pay for fuel for the next eight weeks. No. I drove past my local servo on the way here. Servo is such an Australian word. Tell us.

Tell us this is an Australian podcast without telling us. You want to go to the servo? Do you want me to pick you up a bevvy? And it was like $2.20 for petrol. $2.25 on the highway right now. I threw up in my mouth a little bit as I drove past. It makes me sick. Knowing I was going to stop there on the way home.

Oh, no. Oh, no, I have to stop too. I just realised I got the ding line. Yes, I'm sucked in. Did you guys see the meme in the group last week? And it was inventing Anna's Anna Delphi. I've saved it to put on the Instagram. Yes.

I wired you the money. I will wire you the money tomorrow. Don't you know who my dad is? Why are you so poor? Why are you both so good at that? I don't have time for you. I don't have time for your bullshit. And the Delphi Foundation.

Oh, my God. All right, should we move on? We really need to move on. I feel like we've lost it. All right, the final win of the day, guys. This one is super uplifting. It is from Ness. Money win.

After six years, two months and 14 days, I have finally paid off every cent of the $120,000 credit debt that my abuser left me with. I am done. And I am now officially and completely debt-free. And, oh, my God, does it feel good. Oh, that gives me goosebumps. Oh, my God, honey, that's so special.

Celebrate yourself, queen. That's incredible. And I'm really sorry that that happened to you. That is the worst. So trash. But if you can pull yourself out of that, you can pretty damn well be able to pull yourself out of anything. We can do anything. Oh, my gosh, George, that was such a good way to end that.

Yeah. Ugh. Now we get to go to a break. And when we return, we're going to be talking about how ASIC now want financial influencers to have financial services licences. Don't go anywhere. Gals, I got a little spicy topic for us this week. Oh, I know what this is.

I have been ranting about it all week. You know, we like... I have not been publicising this. Well, you know, we like to get a little loose on a Friday. But ASIC, who for anyone who doesn't know, is the regulator of the financial services industry here in Australia, recently released a very comprehensive outline of what they do and do not approve of within the Finfluencer space. So Finfluencer, again, for anyone not following, financial influencer. Up until this point, there hasn't been a lot of clarity around

what these people can and cannot do. She's on the money. As you guys know, we play by a certain set of rules because Victoria is a licensed advisor. And that means that we have to be very careful because advisors are regulated very heavily as they should be. As they should be, but also we then overlay on top of that a set of ethics that I think we hold as a team, right? We just want to do the right thing by our community and she's on the money is always about the community, not about the bottom line profits. And obviously that's quite bias coming from me and you don't have to believe that, but hopefully through all of the actions we've shown you, we don't prioritize. Bottom line, we always prioritize the community. A thousand percent, but a lot of people

in the finance space, and it is a really growing space, which we love to see because we want more people talking about money and making it accessible. The problem is a lot of the time these people aren't regulated. They can say whatever they want and there is no way for you as a consumer to know whether it's accurate, whether it's good. There's just, there's no way of knowing, right? You've got to take a punt, do your research, hope for the best. And it's wild. So ASIC is the Australian Securities and Investment Commission. So they are the guys that make sure that I, as a financial advisor, am doing the right thing. And they also are kind of like the corporate watchdog over all of the financial services industry and anything that's going on with

money. So like, you know, when crypto started becoming a thing, they were doing heaps of research into that to make sure that the community is safe and the community is looked after. Like their job is to make sure that the consumer is in the right position. A thousand percent. And their new guidelines are warning people that if they do the wrong thing, they could get slapped with five years in prison or a million dollar fine. And Victoria, I just know that you're going to have opinions. George, you're the same. We love to talk about this stuff. And I think it's really interesting because it's not going to impact us as a business. No, it's not going to change a thing that we do. And how good is that? We're like, not one thing changes about our

business. I've actually been contacted by a few media outlets this week asking for my opinion on it. And I've said, no, thank you. Just because like, I think that Finfluences have their place. I think that there is a lot of value that they bring because up until now, finance has been such an overwhelming topic of conversation, right? Like we, we feel uncomfortable with it. Yes, I'm a financial advisor and hopefully I'm like one of the hip, cool ones that you guys listen to. But this Finfluences space from my perspective is really filling the void between the unknown and financial services. Like it's like there's never been this gray area where we can have conversations. And there are some really beautiful people that I would categorize as influencers who

I think are doing a really good job. Like Emma from The Broke Generation is gorgeous and so ethical and does the right thing always and really knows her lane. She talks about budget and cash flow and money values, but you hardly ever see her talking about shares and investments because that's not her power spot. Like that's not where she's thriving. And I really respect seeing financial influencers kind of staying within the bounds of their knowledge and staying within the bounds of what is fair and reasonable for the community. But over the last 12 months, I've just seen it get murkier and murkier with influencers promoting different products, saying this is how I invest, this is how you should invest. And at the end of the day, an influencer is somebody who

carries significant weight such that if you saw their content, you are probably going to be influenced by their opinion. And when you get to that position, I believe that there's a lot of responsibility. There's a lot of responsibility to make sure that your community is safe and cared for and looked after. And how do you do that if one, you don't actually have a deep understanding of the products you're promoting, but two, you are being paid a commission for every single person who converts. So you are being individually financially motivated by the volume of people that sign up. And Jess, you and I were talking about this before and we said we need to cover this referral idea in this segment when we talk about it because as much as she's on the money

as a business, yes, we generate a profit. If you ever, ever, ever hear an advertiser on our podcast, they have paid our advertising fee. It is a flat fee that they pay to be on our podcast and it has nothing to do with the conversion of people onto their platforms. If you ever see a discount code or the, you know, the Sharesies SOTM code, we make nothing from that except for bringing value to our community. You guys went wild when we gave you the $10 UpBank code. And the reason our $10 UpBank code was $10 instead of the usual five is because we said to UpBank, please don't give us the referral. Doesn't feel right. How about whenever someone from our community signs up, you just give them double, give them both. So I think it's really important

for you guys to understand where she's on the money stands on this issue, because as much as we agree that there needs to be more regulation, I think that this is probably going to scare a lot of people away from creating really necessary finance content. Yeah, to put it, I guess, into layman's terms, for anyone who doesn't work in the marketing space, because we don't expect you to know things that aren't your area of expertise, who would? And this is a question that we do get from time to time. And it's fair. You guys can ask us anything. We're an open book. We absolutely are. And I guess the way that I would say to think about it is referrals you're paying per person, as you said, V, per conversion. It's like if I send one person, I get $10. If I

send two people, I get $20. So people are incentivized to send as many people as possible to that platform. And to post more regularly and to look more into that platform than maybe they are because there's obviously financial remuneration. Whereas the advertising fee that you're talking about, as you said, it's a flat rate. It doesn't change. And I would say to people listening, think of that as like a radio advertisement or a TV advertisement where they're paying for that slot. Yeah. They're paying for that position on, you know, that platform and whether one person goes across or 10,000 people go across, it actually doesn't make a difference. So that's just how I would kind of break it down if you're not as familiar with those kinds of

things. And it's important to understand. And the other thing I want people to know, and I guess this isn't necessarily important when it comes to the topic at hand, but Jess, you run our partnerships and you talk to our clients all the time. And I think we have really good relationships with our clients. Like I adore the team at Shopback. Like I cannot tell you how highly I speak of the team at Sharesies and everybody else we talk to. They literally become like friends. But that doesn't mean that everybody who knocks on our door just gets an advertising slot. So Jess, the reason I'm bringing up your role is you literally end up saying no to far more than we say yes to. And we would much prefer to have less relationships, but some really good

solid ones with companies that we know you know and love compared to consistently promoting a new product each and every single week that might not make sense for you and doesn't potentially put you in the best possible position that you could be in. So yes, they are buying advertising. That's the thing that pays Jess's salary. It pays George's salary. It makes sure that our producer can put a roof over her head. Like those things are really important. And the importance of us being paid for the work we do means we can continue to create free content that benefits the community. Can I ask guys, what do you make of the penalty? So five years imprisonment or a $1 million fine, that's hefty it's hefty I'm not surprised by it like it sounds like a lot of money and I know that

you know before I was like a million like that's already applicable to me like those things are part of my responsibility as a financial advisor it's why I'm so specific about the difference between personal and general advice it's why whenever you guys have slipped into my dms and said hey V I just have a quick question I'm changing super funds like which one do you like I can't answer that. It's not only unethical, but it's not the right thing to do. I could quite literally end up in jail for that. And financial advisors have ended up in jail for that. It's not just this empty threat where they're like, oh, if you get caught, people get caught, they go to jail, they do their time and they come back out. And it's terrifying. I would also assume that there

is a sliding scale of, you know, depending on the severity of your offense. Not just you do one wrong post. Yeah, there would probably be some level of transition where they go. People are going to have to use their new footing. Anyone who's big in the financial space, my personal opinion is get some legal advice if you're not sure. Obviously, we have a team that we work with that we always use to make sure that we're above board. And if you're an influencer listening to this and you want a hand negotiating this, please just pick up the phone, text me. I will sit down with you. I want this industry to be safe. I want it to be secure. Like she's on the money as much as we're licensed we don't think we're better than anybody else like we are one team all working

towards better levels of financial literacy and if you're part of that journey like you're on our team so reach out and have a conversation with us and we'll just point you in the right direction I can't give you advice I can't help in any way but I do have the right connections well you guys know that I'm not down with the instagrams that much are they like specific people or influences that they're targeting look they haven't called that out I'm super pervy so I would love to know that information, but I very much doubt they'll ever make that information publicly available. But from what I understand, there are actually some Finfluencers that are under very close watch from ASIC because they've disclosed online that they're making even five or

even six-figure salaries from promotional deals that are with licensed brokerages or with licensed financial advice firms like share market and foreign exchange brokers and even investing platforms or fees that their subscribers are paying to follow them. This is to me a bit wild because I have looked at it and like, wow, like a subscription model. That seems crazy. You're not even an advisor. So I think it would be interesting to see how this falls out. But from my perspective, this is a very good step in the right direction. As much as I'm saying, look, I think that there's a really good place for them. I also think that the community needs to be looked after and there needs to be regulation in this space and we need to be talking about it more because at the end of

the day they're giving you advice on your financial life and that could make or break your future like if you got the wrong advice and just joined up to a platform because you're like oh well this particular influencer was promoting it so it must be good I trust their opinion and then a few years from now you realize that wasn't the right decision like you've missed out on a whole heap of compound interest you've missed out on making the right decisions early like it's just there's such a cost involved. It's not like influencers promoting skincare where you buy a cleanser and you're like, yeah, I don't like the smell. Like it's you and your financial future and you're investing for the future. And there's such significant ramifications if it's not done

properly. It's like unqualified people on the socials talking about how to get slim and like all of that. Yeah. And it's like, leave that to the professionals, guys. Exactly. And it ends up being quite toxic and I feel like the community after seeing this is going to be a little bit more apprehensive, as they should be, because they haven't really been exposed to the fact that maybe these guys don't know what they're talking about. I personally am really interested to see, because obviously we're all in the finance space, we all see other people, we have a lot of friends. I'm really interested to see, there are certain platforms that you see being recommended really regularly. And I personally know that this is because these platforms have particularly high

referral fees. And it's why we haven't worked with them. Yeah, they've knocked on our door and we've said no. They only want to work with us on a referral basis. And no matter what the referral fee is, we've always said, no, thank you. Yeah. So I'm a little bit just nosy and want to see how many people are going to stop recommending certain services. It's going to come to a grinding hold. They're not getting paid for it. Now that they're not getting a tip back. Correct. I think that's really interesting. It's something I would encourage people to watch out for and see, you know, if you've been thinking about certain platforms, if you notice them slowly dissipating over the coming months, that may be why. And it's just something to factor into your consideration

and it's why we always say, even with us, do your own research. Just because someone tells you the benefits of a product doesn't mean that it's right for you. And I'm personally really stoked to see this space becoming more tightly regulated because I truly think that it needs to be. Agreed. Agreed. I just, I feel so passionate about it. And as I said before, you know, I'm sure not that many influencers listen to our podcast, or maybe you do. I'd be so interested. But if you want to reach out, please do. Like, I'm all support. I'm all ears. I just don't think that, you know, as a small time content creator, I think you never intended to give the wrong advice, not that you are, but you never intended to do harm. And I think it's a really important

conversation to be having if there is the potential of harm. Let's make sure that that's not a thing. And I mean, we're better together, right? We always say on the podcast, a rising tide lifts all ships, like it's going to make she's on the money better. Even though we're already regulated, even though I'm already a financial advisor with a license, I just think that, you know, there's more pressure on us to make sure a thousand trillion percent that you guys are always in the best possible position. And if you are a person who might be impacted by this, we'll have a link in the show notes to the ASIC fact sheet where you can go and read it straight from the horse's mouth. Food for thought, ladies. Very interesting chat there. As you guys

both said, though, we're always here to support anyone impacted by this. We'll link that article in the show notes or that website. Of course we will. But for now, let's do a little disclaimer because we're legitimate. Am I right? This feels a bit weird. The advice shared on She's On The money is general in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's on the money exists purely for educational purposes and should not be relied upon to make an investment or a financial decision. And we promise Victoria Devine is an authorized representative of InFocus Securities Australia, Proprietary Limited, ABN 47097797049, AFSL 236523. See you next week. See you next week because it's Friday.

Happy weekend, friends. Bye. Bye.