She's On The Money - FRIDAY DRINKS: Live On Tour - Sydney

Episode Date: October 6, 2022

Victoria and Jess have hit the road to launch V's brand new book Investing with She’s on the Money, so today we bring you the show...LIVE ON TOUR from Sydney!Join us for a special Friday Drinks where we celebrate your money wins and losses, catch up on what's been happening AND in the second half bring you a super special conversation with April Hélène-Horton. April is a writer, public speaker, actor and model; you might know her as The Bodzilla. She champions racial equity, LGBTQ inclusion, sex positivity and fat liberation and we can't wait for you to meet her. So kick back and enjoy this very special, very live episode!Acknowledgement of Country By Natarsha Bamblett aka Queen Acknowledgements.The advice shared on She’s on The Money is general in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She’s on The Money exists purely for educational purposes and should not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision. Victoria Devine and She's On The Money are Authorised Representatives of Infocus Securities Australia Proprietary Limited ABN 47 097 797 049 AFSL - AFSL 236523. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hello, my name is Natasha Nabanunga-Bamblett. I'm a proud Yorta Yorta, Kernai, Wolperi and Awadjeri woman. And before we get started on She's on the Money podcast, I would like to acknowledge the traditional custodians of the land of which this podcast is recorded on Awadjeri country, acknowledging the elders, the ancestors and the next generation coming through. As this podcast is about connecting, empowering, knowledge sharing and the storytelling of you to make a difference for today and lasting impact for tomorrow. Let's get into it. She's on the money.

She's on the money. Hello and welcome to She's On The Money, the podcast for millennials who want financial freedom. My loves, it is Friday, which as we all know, it's time to sit back with a bev in hand to chat about the week that was and of course, to celebrate our incredible She's On The Money community and mainly all of the people that have come to see us in the audience. Jessica! So many people. I am shaking. Wild. The audio quality, I don't know if it's good. It'll make it to the podcast,

regardless of whether it's good or not. But I am so thrilled. This is one of our very first book, or it is our first book tour live recordings. As we know, we're going to talk about the highs, we're going to talk about the lows, we're going to go through everything that we usually do on a Friday Drinks. Just to give you guys a little bit of background, we're going to do our money wins and confessions. I've picked some this week too, because I wanted to be included. it. And then we actually are going to talk a bit about the book because obviously, then we're going to go to a 20 minute break so you guys can grab a drink and regroup yourselves. I'm going to get in trouble at the back for going rogue. And then we're going to come back with, do you guys know

Bodzilla? Oh my gosh, she's epic. We're going to talk to her. She promises, I was out the back, she's like, I'm really funny. So it's all right. So that's going to be really good. But Jess, do you want to just get into it? What do you want to do first? I think so. I feel like we normally start with a little catch up with the gal? Should we talk about? I already told them all about how I wrote a book. I mean, have you been doing anything else? Okay. So what have we been doing? Wedding planning. Oh, I don't really want to talk about that because I blew all my budgets. We, yeah, we're getting a lot of requests from people saying, oh, we'd really like some wedding content about how to stay on track with your budget. And I'm like, you are talking to

the wrong lady. Do you guys know why it hasn't come out yet? Read between the lines. So I guess we can talk about wedding planning yeah it's really hard um and it's also really expensive so I thought I was a genius Jess as you know I've got a few tickets on myself when it comes to budget and cash flow and as a financial advisor who had advised a lot of clients during the process of creating wedding budgets and watched them go over and go guys come on we talked about this now I'm like oh I could see how it feels like I get it it just it sucks but it's genuinely so much more expensive than I had anticipated I mean does it make it better if I tell you it aligns to my values is that better I feel like that's your get out of jail free card it's everyone's get out of

jail free card but look it's been really fun and we are actually five and a half weeks away from my wedding which is very exciting yeah round of applause for that I didn't do it yet you also didn't do anything he proposed to you and you're getting a round of applause thank you thank you I am that good but no it's it's been really fun it's been pretty hectic the planning side of things I obviously have a gorgeous team who have been helping pick things and organize things and remind me that you need things like matching pajamas not need but like Jess is like you're want to be upset if you were in that t-shirt that you wore yesterday. But we've been pretty busy. Jess, we just got back from America. Oh my gosh, yes. We went to FinCon, which is FinanceCon.

That sounds so boring. As someone who did not study finance, was not super thrilled to hear we would be attending at first. I did lure her in though. I was like, all right, we're going to go to FinCon. She's like, oh, maybe just to save budget, like you just go. I was like, I'll take you to Disney World? Sold. So we took Jess to Disney World before we did FinCon, but did you enjoy it? It was actually very fun. I think I forget because we spend so much time in this community and we talk, like I talk about money every day, which is someone who, like I said, I don't have a finance-y background. I'm just a normal gal that at first was very strange for me it became very normal and I didn't realize how much that adds to my life like in the community

every day in the Facebook group or on Instagram or wherever we're kind of hanging out with you guys we're having these conversations about our journeys about my house about your wedding about your journeys about paying off your debt or your buy now pay later or reaching a goal getting a raise and I didn't realize I think because I took it a little bit for granted how much I enjoy that. And so we spent some time with some other podcasters, the My Millennial Money team and the Girls That Invest team who we adore, as well as a whole heap of other people from the US and from all over the world who work kind of in the same space as us. And I was just, I left with a very full cup because it was really nice to be around people who care about what we care about.

I actually felt like it was one of those things where I was really hyping this up, guys. I was like, oh, Finkon, this is sick. I've never been because I've never been able to afford it. It's a content creators hub right and we create finance content and as you guys probably already know there's not that many people in Australia who do that in fact when I started it it was like not cool it was so not cool that I created a fake Facebook to comment on the Facebook group posts so that I didn't look like nobody was commenting on my Facebook group posts I'd be like hey guys hot tip about superannuation. And then some girl called Ella would be like, wow, I love this. Thanks, Ella. So when I started, it really wasn't a thing. And like, I genuinely felt like people

needed that information. But I was also like, I don't know how to make this approachable. And like, let's be honest, we see safety in numbers. Like you see that she's on the money community now, and you're like, okay, cool. Like it must be okay. Like there are so many people following it. So she must know something about something but when there were 17 people in my group and I'm trying to convince them to publicly comment on a post about super like it wasn't going to happen Ella needed to pull some some things in so it's an interesting I guess journey especially because looking at America everything's bigger there right like you expect you're going to go and you're going to see bigger better communities you're going to see content that is absolutely

mind-blowing and ideas that I'm going to come home with and be able to nourish our community with and we definitely have come back with that but I think the thing that I didn't realize I knew all along that our community was incredibly special as I said before we're basically best friends but what I didn't find at Fincom was anything like that and I was like what like oh so you've got followers on TikTok they're like yeah I'm like like how often do you talk to them they're like oh no they don't dm me like oh my best friends dm me all the time like they dm me when there is cheap oat milk they dm me when they see coffee shop drama on the internet they dm me literally all the time like you guys interact with me in the best way and if you've ever messaged me

before this is gonna be so lame but if you've ever messaged me before you'd know like if you genuinely sent a message not just like a love her eyes reply to a story like let's just get that straight I reply and I'm like yeah sick like let's do this and I think that takes people off guard because I'm in your community I am you because I I'm I'm here literally beside you and I think that I came home with a newfound not understanding but really deep appreciation because I don't think I realized what we'd created and when I came home I was like Jess this is pretty flippin special I don't actually want it to grow anymore like all you guys just day like let's not tell anybody else because I'm I'm genuinely scared that we'd lose that

and you know the bigger we grow the more worried I get that we're gonna lose that specialness or lose that ability to be best friends but we haven't lost it yet so keep an eye out on that it's coming it's because everyone's I think each other's best friends like a post goes up sometimes and I see it and I'm like someone will ask a question and I say oh I have a good answer to that and I go to the comments and there's 10 comments from people who have beat me to it because they know exactly what to say or they know exactly the right thing and I think yeah I would like to believe that no matter how many people join us or how many new friends we make it's always going to feel a little bit special and I really love that I think it's my favorite thing literally in the

entire world let's stop doing this though we want to talk about the book so let's do money wins and confessions from our community I think it's time to get into that guys this is sponsored so it is time for our budget direct money wins and confessions Jessica Ricci what have you got for us I'm really pumped up my first win is from Erin who said I asked my eight-year-old daughter to help her brother clean his mess and I said I would give her one dollar cheap labor because he should be doing it by himself she said to me mum just put it in my bank account so I can save it finally a win for teaching her how to save I thought that was really cute I think that's really sweet but i have one for country road so 10 out of 10 one up in here so this one is from a girl called jessica

great name great name probably stunning honestly she says money win i found a brand new country road jumper with the tag still on for five dollars at the salvos the tag on it said 120 bucks that is a money win five dollars five bucks i love an op shop still a note like she couldn't buy a coffee at my local coffee shop. Oh, please don't start. We're going to get in trouble. We are going to get in trouble. My next money win. Lauren says money win $1,675 in my pocket. Thanks to a weekend of Facebook marketplace selling. And I'm just astounded that she had $1,600 worth of stuff in her house that she wasn't using. And I also probably also have $1,600 worth of stuff that I'm not using that I should list. Did you know that it was like research by Gumtree, not sponsored

Discord? I feel like I have to disclaimer that because so many people message me like, is this a sponsored post? I'm like, no, I'm so transparent. I'm proud when I get sponsors. I'm gonna tell you like, I will literally be like sponsored. Look at this. Someone paid for this. But Gumtree, they said that everybody, like most Australians have five grand worth of stuff lying around their house that you could sell. And you just don't do it because you're lazy. Well, I don't do it. I I'm really lazy you guys aren't lazy I'm lazy and I should sell it because I'm poor you've done that before though like you've gone on a rampage of selling things to make your goals my partner came home once and I had sold our dining chairs and he went to sit down for dinner and he was like

babe where'd the chairs go and I was like oh a lady picked them up about 40 minutes ago and he said to me so where are we having dinner and I said well you can sit at your computer in your desk chair and I'll sit on the floor next to you but I made a lot of money so I'm not even going to question that I'm going to tell you my next money win I think that's a good idea it is a money win it comes from Stephanie and she says I bought some Libra period underwear using the discount code mentioned on the podcast a few weeks ago and my local government authority also offers up to a $50 rebate for reusable sanitary products I really like that double money win saving the environment and my pocket at exactly the same time when I read that when I read

the script approximately two minutes before I got on this stage you literally made this you cut and paste yours in I cut and paste mine in I kept putting mine above yours yeah because it's sad for me but that's okay when I read that I was like I should check my local government and see if they do rebates for that kind of stuff I didn't even know that was a thing do you think that's common not that we're working right now I mean we technically are but if you could just put on you two lists to do that and then share it on story so that'd be great all right let me tell you my next money win that didn't get shoved to the bottom of the pile it comes from Jen and Jen said money win my housemate bought Victoria's new book but she gave it to me

because I read quicker and she put it in quotation marks so I don't think she actually does read quicker but that's a definite win for you Jen because you can share it between the two of you Oh my gosh. All right. Next money win from me is from Amy. She says money win. I never have these. This is the best. I'm a bit of a crazy dog mom. Same girlfriend, same. Always trying to show people photos of my dog that no one ever wants to see. Same girlfriend, same. People do want to see that. So I entered a photo of one of my dogs into an agricultural hemmed calendar competition and won first place he will now be the cover photo for a 2023 calendar and she won 500 bucks needless to say her entire family are getting that calendar for Christmas

how good is that I just really like when they say the cover photo the first thing that comes to my head is like the centerfold which is not what you'd think about when you think about a dog obviously and I just I'm like do you think it's prestigious not in that you guys get your mind out of the gutter like I meant you know how it's prestigious to be the center for do you think it's like I think it was yeah well maybe not anymore but if you're the dog on the cover like do you have bragging rights with the other dogs Lucy would want to be the dog on the cover of course she would she takes after her mother I'm not gonna yeah yeah we both really like attention um you know what I think of when we think of calendars firemen

yeah like you're thinking playboy I'm like the fireman calendar the local charity calendar they always get me at like they'll stand in my local shopping center in the middle bit and they always do the thing where they're shirtless with just like the geniuses the little um suspenders with their yellow pants or whatever and they always go but ma'am it's for charity and I go well I suppose you're right and I get they get me every time and it's about that time of year and I actively avoid my local shopping centre because I can't say no that's unrelatable to the fireman I've literally never walked through a shopping centre and seen a topless fireman really where is that come to the west side asking for a friend um yeah all right

Well, moving on from dogs, firemen and money wins about Facebook, it has, as always, been a great celebrating some of your Budget Direct money wins of the week. Budget Direct, winner of CanStar's Insurer of the Year Award 2022, Budget Direct insurance solved. Isn't bad that I know that like this now. I don't think so. I think that you're just committed. Can't remember my number, but can remember the Budget Direct ad.

She's a hard worker. should we move along from the ad though and talk a little bit more about your favorite thing in the entire world apart from apart from lucy i was literally just about to say about wedding content and pinterest boards also no oh investing oh that is actually my favorite thing the thing that you wrote an entire book about yeah i was bullied into it by you guys cheers no genuinely i'm really excited about this because i feel like one it wasn't hard to sell like hey guys you literally asked for this take it but also I'm just I feel like it's so special that we have literally I mean there are a few men and there are a few people in this room that you know might go why

am I here my partner dragged me along I can see a couple in the front row looking not super yeah I'm looking at you yeah we see you yeah but I also had a few dms from people they're like ha bringing my partner, or ha ha ha. So as a present, I bought tickets for my friend, low key because she needed to come and she won't listen to the podcast. Who was that? It you. Okay, so talking about the book, though, I just feel like it's really powerful to have a literal room of people who not only want to learn about investing, but are probably discovering it for one of the first times in a way that you don't feel turned off. You feel like, oh this maybe is for me this maybe is my space this maybe is the thing that is going to help me

create the financial stability and freedom that I deserve and you all deserve it and it's kind of like this gift that I haven't been able to get into your hands prior to now it is really hard absorbing audio content and remembering it and writing it down there is a marketing term not that it's related to my book, but you need to be exposed to marketing advertising a minimum of seven times before you actually buy that product. And if you look at that in the same way that you would look at investing content, that means I have to tell you the same thing seven different times before you genuinely understand that concept. And it's not because you're silly. It's not because you don't get it. It's just because that's how human brains work. We are really linear. We are

actually fight or flight creatures and if you absorb some information that your brain's like that's not important I'm just going to chuck it out for now why would you keep it because it hasn't been made a priority so this exposure of seven times really makes sense but it's hard in an audio context to give that to you and I genuinely feel like it's a gift to be like here it is like you can see it you can touch it you can you know put the book on your bedside table because we made it super aesthetic so they look really nice thanks Izzy for making me choose that cover but it's it's one of those things that I just feel so grateful to be able to give that to you because it puts you in a position of power it puts you in a position where you are able to be the narrator

of your life instead of somebody else telling you how it's going to unfold instead of somebody else telling you no that's not really for you or no like you need to buy property for it to be important or you need to do this or that or the other like I genuinely feel like a book like this takes it to the next level someone asked me maybe I'm answering the questions that you've got don't get ahead of yourself sorry but someone asked me like oh do I have to read the first book and then the second book and no you don't I've written it in a way where you can read one in isolation but I genuinely believe that the pink book the first book is like that foundation it's the budget it's the cash flow it's understanding the concepts it's master that

and you'll want the next book and you'll want to take it to the next level and you'll feel genuinely like you can take control of your life and you can take control of your investing journey and I think my favorite thing about it is you could have no money and you're just excited about the concept and you're not ready to invest and read it and hopefully absorb some content that really helps you. Or you could have a million dollar inheritance that you need to invest and both ends of those spectrum are met. So for me, I love it. I'm really proud of it. And I'm really excited that I get to like give it to you. It's really special. I think the big thing for me is, you know, if I think back five years ago, if I had said to myself, you're going to be really

excited about this finance book, I would have been like, who are you? And can you leave me alone? because there's just no way that's not who I am and it's really cool that for people like me and for all of the people in this room who have so much of their lives ahead of them learning these things and consuming this knowledge has the power to put you in a position where when you're older and you want to retire and maybe that's earlier than the normal retirement age of what is it 63 or has it gone up to 65 65 65 wow that's so far away but like maybe if it's you know sooner than tell everybody how young you are go on but you know when you get to that point you have the opportunity to live life the way that you want it and you know that's I think the thing that

this community is all about is about saying you have the power and you deserve to have the knowledge and you deserve to have the choice to live your dream life and you know not to be real like girl boss yeah make money because that's where that sounds like it's going but we can't sling that term but that do you know what I mean the the thing to get you there is education and for so long so many of us have been kept out of that conversation either because we didn't have easy access to it or because you know it wasn't something that we were interested in like me and we kind of kept ourselves out of it and you know I think you can look back in hindsight it's 2020 and I look back and I go I wish I'd started sooner but to see so many people in the community

learning and sharing and teaching and doing all of those things ago there's gonna be some real rich people in you know 20 to 30 years that I want it to be because of me yeah they can pay for my oat lattes those seven dollar lattes they'll get you I think it comes from two places though right like it comes from one investing in 2022 has never been more accessible like these days there are apps for everything there are apps to remind you when to brush your teeth and there are apps that let you invest for as little as one cent right there has never been that ability to access investing before so I think we're in a really special position where we can you know take charge of that we no longer have these minimum investment requirements like I remember when I

started in financial advice there were so many managed funds and ETFs or exchange traded funds that had entry points of $20,000. And at that point in time, I was writing advice for clients, literally, that I couldn't afford. Like I couldn't sit down and be like, oh, like I really love this, you know, this particular fund, which I'm not allowed to mention right now because I might lose my license. I recommend it. It's great. I love it for you. I wish I could invest in it, but I don't have enough money. Like, isn't that gross? Like, hey, this is reserved for you because you're kind of rich, but I'm not. So I'll write the advice and put you in the best position. It's the one I wish I was in though.

Like that's gross. So it's never been more accessible because now through platforms, like we're able to access these things, which is to me really special. But I also think we are now as, especially women breaking down this barrier of mediocre middle-aged white men

telling us that an acronym means they're really smart. And I think that for so long, these people in the investing world would use acronyms in terms of reference and phrases that you know they'd throw compound interest around and talk about it as if it was really like exciting and then never explain it in a way that made sense it would take them you know six paragraphs to get to the point where it's like hey guys it's the money that your money makes full stop it's so simple like it's the money that your money makes when it's invested

like you put it there and it'll make money for you like okay no worries and I just think it's crazy to think that you know on ETFs it's actually quite complicated now babe it's actually a basket like it's a basket of shares and they put all the shares in there and then you put your money in there and buy it like I just feel like we no longer accept the gatekeeping of the information and we want it broken down and I think that that is you know very 2022 I think we see through it in plethoras of ways like you see it with people rebelling against influencers and people rebelling against marketing and people rebelling against different products and you totally get it but like I'm glad it's in the investment world because they need to be held responsible but also

break it down or it's not going to resonate with anybody no one's going to want to work with you so I'm excited about that I'm really excited about that too and I feel like everybody who's here is excited about investing as well which is very fun because we have some questions that you guys submitted that we're going to go through and answer all right Victoria the first question that I have for you is should you start investing when you're on a tight budget and if yes how should you do that that is look it's a really good question because it guys get this it's really in line with your values so you've got to work out what is more valuable to you I think it's and I've said this before it's so ridiculous to expect that if you have a really tight budget or

you're going through what I call a season in life like you might be a university student and putting too much pressure on yourself and more money is coming at some point in the future. I feel like I'm a staunch advocate for respecting the lifestyle that you currently have so that you're not, you know, living the life that you wish you had later. So investing now, it's really important to understand it, to absorb the information, to educate yourself, to put yourself in the best possible position to get the best head start. But that doesn't necessarily mean that you have to do it today but I also really want to reiterate that you don't have to have a lot of money to invest like I have people that talk to me in the she's on the money community and they're like yeah I

just invest five dollars a month and I think that that's epic like you are on the road to success because yeah like let's be really brutally honest five bucks is not going to help you retire like you are not going to be in a yacht in the Bahamas because you invested five dollars a month but what you are going to be is super financially literate so once you graduate out of uni or change jobs or the kids are no longer at home and you're funding their life like you already know how to invest you've been watching the market for maybe years at that point and you're really confident with it you're really excited about it putting more money in that investment portfolio doesn't feel overwhelming I think there's this very big idea that to invest you must have really high cash flow

and I mean you guys have heard me before I've said that you don't but I think we also still put that pressure on ourselves to go oh yeah but like it's just not enough and in reality that's not the case at all like there's no such thing as not enough because even that five dollars like you know I remember someone talking to me they're like oh I don't invest much I'm just on raise and like they're at that point in time their fees were like two dollars fifty a month she's like I feel like my like returns are definitely being eaten away by the fees so it's not worth it I was like yeah like let's reframe it though like that's $2.50 a month that you can claim on tax that is an investment in your financial literacy and like I went to uni I did a lot of uni if you've listened

to the podcast you know I'm still in six figures of hex debt then I don't really want to talk about that today because it still gives me anxiety but it's one of those things where like I get it but the most I've ever learned is when I was on the job and investing is exactly the same like just start the damn job go get your little internship I don't care what it is if it's five bucks a month if it's two dollars a month if it's just a dollar share that you bought on shares because you can invest that much on shares and just you watch it over time like to me that is more than good enough you are in the market you are an investor and yeah I think it's about your values yes if you're on a tight budget, investing is important, but it doesn't necessarily mean that you invest your

life savings because to be honest, that could be a really terrible idea and put you in a sticky position in the long term. And if you are in a position where even $5 a month is something that you just can't find, that is okay. Because I think there's a lot of pressure that we put on ourselves to be doing everything that we want to be doing. And we see other people doing things and we go, oh, I want to be like them. I need to be preparing for my future. I need to be buying a house. I need to be getting married. I need to buy a dog and I need to do all of these things because that's what makes me a successful human. And if you can't do that, if that room in your budget simply is not there, that's okay. And I feel like you can still learn and you can still

listen and you can still watch so that once you are in a slightly better financial position and it is an option that's on the table for you, that's something that you can pursue and you feel ready to jump two feet in as soon as you can. I want to know, how do we deal with fear around investing because that's something that held me personally back. And I think it's something that holds a lot of other people back a lot is just being really anxious about it or being afraid because we've heard that, you know, back in the GFC, everyone lost all of their money and investing is so risky. Oh, is it? Yeah. So we don't do it? No. Okay. Well, that's the answer. If you're scared, don't do it. I actually, I think it's, let's go back to psychology, right? Like fear, it doesn't

come from us actually being scared of something like I have a like a really irrational fear of clowns and one time my ex-boyfriend long story short took me to a theater show about clowns and he didn't know and he worked in theater and so the clowns came down during the intermission which we're going to have soon to say hello to us and be kind and they were like being clowns and I fainted because I was so scared um and they thought I was faking it and then anyway we got an ambulance it it was a whole thing um that was genuine fear guys like if you're not scared of clowns we don't have to be scared of investing investing is the fear of the unknown like there's irrational fears and then there's fears because we haven't taken that next step so that next step is scary because we

don't know what it's made up of right like we can't see it like it's we're going in blind so how do we become not blind how do we you know look to the future in a way where we can clearly see that next stepping stone. And I think it's genuinely about education. Like if you're scared about anything, we can educate you into going, all right, well, the clowns aren't that scary, Victoria. Like they're just people wearing masks. Would you like to touch them up? No, I would not. I get it. But I think it's really important to break down that goal. If it seems too scary to invest, like my answer is genuinely don't yet. It's not don't do it at all. It's don't do it yet. Take the pressure off and put yourself in a position where you go, all right, well,

I'm not ready why am I scared I'm scared because I think that I have to invest my life savings no I don't okay I can invest five dollars all right well if I can invest five dollars what would I want to invest in like let's start exploring that let's start consuming media that is aligned to creating the life we want like there are a million podcasts out there obviously there's she's on the money but then there's also you know my millennial money and girls that invest and equity mates and all of our friends in the industry that create content so you can be more comfortable with this step and I would say that fear comes from the unknown and if we can create the unknown known we're not scared of it so I would just say research create but also don't put yourself

in a position where you think you need to know every single thing to take the next step once maybe there's a little bit of fog and you can see the next step maybe know that you're going to be safe to take that step and go from there and then let's look for the next one and if those steps are genuinely feeling too big and too out of control let's talk about how we can bring it back how we can actually create them into smaller steps that are more palatable and that aren't scary and one of the best things ever well let's let's be biased is the she's on the money community because there are people experiencing what you're experiencing jump to the facebook group comment on things read people's experiences talk to a girlfriend go out

for a coffee go over to their house for a cup of tea and be like oh my gosh sorry this concept weird right investing but like chat to them about these things blame me be like oh this girl victoria she's crazy but she talks about this thing what do you think of it like i want to be the reason that you guys get to take that next step and get to put yourselves in the best possible financial position. And I genuinely believe that it's just because we don't know. If we can create the known, we will be okay. I really, really like that. I have one more question before we let everybody go for a quick break. And that is, for people who don't have children, because it's 2022 and not every person who can have a child wants to anymore, where does their wealth go when they're

no longer around? Because when we talk about investing, a lot of the time we talk about passing that along building a future that's better for the people who come after us but if you don't have children you know that concept how do we still apply it is there any point in investing should we just spend all of our money and live our best lives and be like peace out thanks so much guys like what do you what's the point that's very deep what's the point you say that too confidently is that your plan like is that what's gonna happen I'm gonna go hard and then I'll have kids one day and Jess will be like ill why um all right cool deep question that wasn't on the script I love that from Jess I think it actually goes back to legacy right and like what

do you want to create what impact do you want to have on the world having had the experience of investing for people worth tens of millions of dollars because that's where I started right so when I first got my financial advice career I was lucky enough to slip into a business that only worked with people that are classified as ultra high net wealth and that sounds kind of bougie right but the definition of that in the business that I worked in so not across the board but in the business that I worked in was that they had to have a minimum of 10 million dollars to invest so I was dealing with people while I was in like 40,000 dollars worth of credit card debt like I don't know why they weren't taking my advice but they were while I was doing that I think I learned

a lot about legacy because even if people do have kids it doesn't necessarily mean they want that wealth to pass on to them a lot of the time they'd be like look Jess is my child I think she's really intelligent I actually want to find like have her find her own way and a lot of I guess the wealthy people in the world who have tens of millions of dollars struggle with exactly the same questions that we have and that's why what happens after I'm not here anymore and what legacy do I want to leave behind and I think obviously the stereotypical answer of work with a estate planning lawyer to work out what that is but actually think about your life because I don't think it's what happens after we die that's important I also think it's about the legacy

that we leave in our living life if we want to get really deep but what are we putting our money towards what are we funding what are we not funding are we going to talk about fast fashion and we're not going to talk about fast fashion. And, you know, when you pass on, do you want that money to be left to a child or to my child, Jessica, or do we want that money to be passed on to a cause that's really close to our heart or establishing something that, you know, means something, something really cool, actually, I know you're probably trying to wrap me up, but good luck, um, is we would create a lot of trusts for super wealthy people. And you can actually do it now where you invest your future wealth that you don't need anymore because on the off chance

that something happened to us yesterday because we always talk about yesterday we never talk about tomorrow on the off chance that something happened to me yesterday maybe I want to create a trust that you know the investment money in that in perpetuity pays for a scholarship or a fee for somebody and you know let's be super deep in my will I've got that set up like I have all my superannuation money going to a trust that will create financial literacy like courses in other countries sorry guys I feel like you guys have it covered in other countries for women who are not able to access financial literacy and I think that you can do literally anything you want to but the really important thing here is that we actually establish that before we pass away

and we actually document that really well and put ourselves in a position where it's actually possible. So what are people who don't have children do? They do the same thing because you'd be surprised about how many parents pass away and they don't have anything left for their children. So I think it's about legacy. What do you want people to remember you for? Or what do you want to create? And how do we create that? Because we're not talking about tens of millions of dollars here. Like we... Okay, I will go. I hope you're okay, whoever just fell over. I think they threw a drink no it's not about tens of millions of dollars like every dollar literally counts and you can create whatever you want to create with that you just have to be

purposeful and put a plan in place is that okay I really like that I'm also getting slightly triggered by you calling me your child because when we went to FinCon this is so this is I'm getting very off topic here but when we went to FinCon we went to a party and it was tacky tourist themed did you guys see this this is so good and so glenn and victoria i went and bought glenn from my millennial money which is like our partner podcast if you don't know my millennial money we love them his community not our community his community call him the dad of finance so when i was introduced to his community they were like she's clearly the mom in the u.s everyone who goes to disneyland buys family t-shirts and they say like so tacky the rick is 22 or something

fun like that. So I went and got one that said mom because it's an O with Disney ears and then one that said dad and Glenn and Victoria wore those and I had like the kids one. So I was like their little child. But then we went to the event and they wouldn't give me a drinks band because they thought I was underage because I was their kid. I'm more offended that they actually thought you could be my child. Really good. But I think on that note, we should send all of these overage people off to get a drink of their own on a nice little break. There's books out there as well if you'd like to purchase one because I hear someone will be signing them later on. I will. I have like five Sharpies. She came prepared. Don't let her down. She wants to work through at least three

of those or she'll feel disappointed. And we've got Bodzilla coming up, which I promise is so much better than the first half of this show. So we'll see you guys all back very soon at 8.30. hello again did we enjoy intermission what do people actually do on intermission post selfies tagging us a lot of people want to win the master class i saw that i spent my entire time back in that room like replying to dms one of you told me how much you got out of debt really exciting someone told me about their tax debt not so exciting um and a couple of you were like oh i just posted my b reel babe that's not that real like if you waited for your b reel to be posted here. That's not the point. Just do an Insta story. Anyway, I think it's time to bring out

our special guest for the night, which I'm very excited about. We have April Ellen Horton, who is a writer, public speaker, actor, and model. You probably know her as the Bodzilla. April is all about fat joy. She's a passionate advocate for intersectional experiences. She's a noted emcee and keynote speaker who gives people confidence to take up the space that they deserve. Her sense of fun translates to her fun sense of fashion where she is a literal rainbow of fabulousness and she's wearing pink oh my gosh we didn't even brief her she just turned up in pink she just she came on brand she just she knew and we didn't even have to say anything in 2021 she actually led the way as Australia's first truly plus sized model to appear in a bikini on a billboard and

she was part of a national three-part tv series asking Australia what they really think about disability old people and obesity she champions racial equality lgbtq plus inclusion sex positivity and fat liberation a full-time communications gig keeps her busy and in the past she's had her finger in a number of pies across advertising social media and production of music videos as well as commercial shoots and film in 2022 her mission is to continue bringing conversations about authentic diversity, inclusion and privilege into everyday life. Amazing.

Let's give a round of applause for April. April! Yay! Hello, my baby. Hello. And she's the funny one. I told you guys, she said she was really funny. So high expectations.

A bit of physical humor to get the funny side of it. Are you excited to be here? No, I'm having a terrible time. Look, same. We made her sit out the back for the entire first half of this show. Sorry about it. But Tish, one of our community members, she literally brought us champagne. Oh, my gosh, yes.

We were complaining about out the back. We were like, oh, water, of course. Someone brought us champagne. So during the break, we were like, find us glasses. We are going to drink this. 10 out of 10, Tish. We love you. Cheers to Tish.

Cheers. I wish they had their drink. Yeah, all right. all right i'm very excited because this is a live podcast recording april wild you ever done that before maybe it's all right it's all right we'll edit this bit out it's not really that live because once it gets to the real see we were talking about you out the back but april i want to kick this conversation off with a recent money win or a confession whatever you're up to you got something fun for us a recent money win i finally did my tax that was overdue

and they gave me some money back. That is a win. That's a good win. Like that's when you also, but like you didn't learn a lesson because you think you're going to go, oh, now I owe you money. And they're like, no, no. You're going to do it again, aren't you? Yeah.

Yep. Whoops. I will sit down after this. Here's your dinner. Now we need to have a talk. Apply you. Yeah, all right. Okay.

Rude not to. I'll just pick up my drink. Rude not to. well april i went through your very impressive and very well written bio might i add written by her and i'd love for us to tell us a little bit in your own words about what you do for work and what you do in your day-to-day life so it has bubbles in it so uh thanks tish yeah geez i am as you say i work full-time in internal communication actually no part-time now i've just gone part-time. Yes, Queen Behead, yes. We love a bit of work-life balance. I had a mentee

bee and I was like, this is not going to work. It didn't suit you. Seriously, like, but also. Our poor interpreter having to sign mentee bee. Sorry. Sorry. So I work in communications as a public servant, actually. And then I also have a child and I also do online activism and then i also fly to sydney and do live with us and i drink wine yeah that's pretty much running theme so i guess i mean in my own words you read them out but if i was to say like what i what do i do i'm just trying to make things a little bit better for everyone which i

think is what you're doing as well do you know what i mean so far so good that's why we're getting along so well also we didn't coordinate our outfits but like look i just i came in we were like oh oh oh so exciting that's actually what it sounded like it was louder than that but I wasn't going to do it into the microphone that seems to me I want to know you are a lot of things a lot of very impressive things but let's be really pervy this is she's on the money after the way how many different ways do you make money oh well I have a job and then I own a business and then no i don't have only fans you do so well on there though i would actually kill it i'm all about that i'm like get the bag honey no that's yeah i think i would call myself a business owner

and i also have a payg i love it i love it what a sexy acronym that is i mean you've been using that mentee b like i had to i had to actually think it'd be that one day what is that we're having one right now help me um I want to know though yes you transitioned from full-time work you just told us yes to part-time work and I think that's the dream of a lot of people how'd you do that though well I decided that I really wanted to be able to actually focus on the thing I was doing when I was doing it and then and you know in both cases and so working part-time is a way that I can balance it and I decided that I actually could not afford not financially but could not afford to overdo it as much as I was and so I think there has definitely been for me a bit of

a sacrifice knowing that I go well I probably won't have as much spending money but this this is one of those things that you kind of just have to do because as I was saying earlier when it goes from being a side hustle to like a at least halfway into your real life hustle you kind of have to find that balance so I think it isn't glamorous to go part-time from your day job to do you focus on your side hustle it's a lot of hard work and it's worth it if it's worth it to you and you shouldn't let anybody tell you that it's not you know or try to talk you out of doing something that's not stable because if what you're doing brings you joy what like why would you want to be stable I really like I really like financial stability though that's what we're here to talk

about yes let's yeah yes yeah she didn't mean that we do want stability no I think the idea of having financial stability and the idea of being able to be glamorous all the time perhaps not realistic sometimes you have to work really hard and spend a lot of time being like hmm I need a spreadsheet to figure out what exactly is going on with all this money and what's a GST because what's a GST I feel like who got her here why is she here because I'm funny you are we literally flew you to a different state we're like no one in Sydney is as good as Godzilla but we've spoken about this backstage and I was gonna ask you you know tell me a little bit about your current relationship with money but like let's go full money diary for a second

and ask which is usually the first question in our actual money diary is like tell us a little bit about your money story because I feel like you know you know all of this stuff and it's great to be up here going all right well we want work-life balance and we want to put these things first but like you know from experience you don't just say that and go I had a mentee bee and it was just random it came from somewhere right so I mean when I was younger I worked part-time in shift work and I understood the value of penalty rates and how you make money so I think I've been learning this lesson around what you get out is what you put in kind of for a long time I think when I got my first career job I was 23 4 5 I don't know something was ages ago and I know you can't tell and I think for

me it was the idea that I was heading into this career with stability and a regular income and that I could work during the day and sleep at night time which was very different from working in a hospitality industry that kind of was very opposite to that and I think that if I look back the way that I looked at money coming into my bank account every week is like what can I waste this on how many stupid things can I buy somebody asked me the other week like what's your biggest regret of anything you've ever purchased and I was like literally everything I bought in my 20s it was just a waste of money just crap constantly and I think now being someone who has to balance that you know, and also taking care of other people, have a child, having to make considered decisions

about what's a good use of money. Does it mean that I don't buy things that I don't need? No, but I buy way less of them. And I think really hard about whether I need them as much. I love that. And I feel like this is an ongoing theme of my week. You guys aren't going to be able to, you know, reiterate with this yet because the money diary hasn't come out yet, but I was talking to a money diarist yesterday, as were you, Miss Jessica Ricci. And she was saying when I first started you know having my own full-time job if I earn $850 a week instead of seeing all your bills you were like I've got $850 to spend and I was like oh that's actually a mentality that I had and we talked about the cost of living and how we kind of buried our

head in the sand like floor cleaner you have to pay for that paper towels we have to buy that that comes out of that $850 and it's kind of a joke so if anyone knows how to like skip that part that would be great live in the bush oh that's the end that's the only answer i can think of apparently no paper towel needed can i tell you a funny conversation that i overheard in the break room i was like oh what happened in the break room stays in the break room except this girl said it in front of me now i'm gonna say it to all of you was it jess no it was at work and this girl I heard her say I just can't believe that the electricity and the water's not included in the rent that's bullshit and I was like girl you're right that's that's balls I hate that for

you like oh my god I was like when my sister asked me if the Titanic was real I was like anyway I just kind of loved the fact that she clearly left home to be like you know this independent young thing and then got a rude ass shock my mate were like so the electricity bill she's like no no i transferred it to the account already no babe that's the the roof over your head in this probably rat infested share house the trucks are extra and so yeah i think that it's kind of fun slash sad to be like oh shit you have so much to learn you also have to pay to get rid of the rats it is so rude seriously it's bad well let's fast forward though let's fast forward let's move past the ratty share house I'm not mad about it what's your current relationship with money

look like because obviously you're not in a rat infested share house or maybe she is no judgment no I don't feel like I am living the financially secure dreams that my mother had in mind when She used to be like, put this 50 cents in that piggy bank. I think that, also because like 50 cents is worth not a lot really. Like when I think about what I could get for 50 cents when I was five. You can't even buy a Macca's 50 cent cone anymore. They don't exist. Inflation.

We've had this conversation. How much are they now? A dollar. A dollar 20. Oh, a dollar 20. What? I'm pretty sure it's a dollar 20. And everyone's shocked to hear it.

I actually am. That has gone up by 400%. Is that maths? It used to be 30 cents. No one's going to argue with you. You're up here. 100%. Somebody who knows maths, agree with me, please.

Yeah. I beg you. It's gone up. It's times four. Yes. Oh, yes. 400%. Wait till they find out about the electricity.

So I think my current relationship with money is still fraught with a lot of I'm carrying a lot of baggage, you know, TW financial abuse, but like was in a relationship with someone who was real shady. I came out of that relationship with no money and no super. Look at her face. I'll kill him. You're acting like I judge you for that. No, you're like, where is he?

What's his number? I just want to talk. We are riding at midnight. I'll pick you up. And so it was, what the, honestly. And I do go, oh, my God, that's so cringe. It's not because it happens to so many of us because we don't understand what we need to know.

And what I was saying actually to Gabby backstage, Gabby's the beautiful EA of Victoria, incredible and great pants. I wonder how much you paid for them. Hear that, Gabby? You got good pants. Good pants. Good pants, Gabby. That's funny.

I was saying to her that this podcast and your books, if I had been her age when this was around, that probably would not have happened to me because I would have had some financial literacy. I would have understood that that's a bad idea. you shouldn't let anybody talk you into doing those things with your money because that's a bad plan and so I really think that the value for me of being engaged in a conversation about money about investment is to understand that it's never too late to start I think as well like I'm old

compared to you but I'm young compared to some other people so like yay it's all relative and I think if I can get a handle on what I want to do it doesn't have to have a time limit I don't have to decide it's going to be by new year's eve or the time I'm 40 both of which are coming then I think that that feels really reassuring do you think I'm in my 20s because yeah I'll take that I am I'm Jesse I'm young Jesse's me winning I mean I don't know everybody everybody in the world seems younger than me I am the Botox and I love that for you thank you here's to that can I ask you about and obviously feel free to brush over this if you want to but what she said if she doesn't want to answer a question she's just gonna make a joke and then ask Jess a question

and I'm fine with that she does that I feel like you might have taken the steam out from never mind anyway yeah how did you get to the place in that relationship when you know you were in a place where you thought oh like this is fine this is normal this is a relationship because you didn't know differently how did you get to the point where you're like actually that's not acceptable I deserve better so I think everything that had happened in that four years four and a half years was kind of a terrible trajectory of terribleness and then you just get to the end of the roller coaster it's not finished being built you just fall off that's how I think it felt emotionally essentially we we split and when I reflected and we it was

messy and whatever and and it made for like good Instagram posts which I've now deleted because that's cringe um but I think that the idea that all of that could happen and then I could walk away and be like what the beep were you thinking really hurt my head um you know that's made a medal yeah yeah not my head though um I think it was just a real wake-up and I think any person who's ever experienced a scenario where they're in a relationship and I don't mean that necessarily romantically when we talk about relationship you mean an energy exchange between two people where you've both agreed to some terms and conditions that perhaps one of you skimmed over and then decided read it I think you just kind of look back and go that was a pretty shit choice not

unlike signing up for a credit card when you're 18 been that she loses no but legit I think that's we don't know no but but it's legit right you don't know what you don't know and the older you get the more reflection time you have and you said something interesting you were like oh if this was around when I was younger I wouldn't have gotten in that circumstance on the flip side if this was around when I was younger I wouldn't have listened because I absolutely knew better like I was really smart um yeah like maybe it did exist back then I'm pretending I've found this. How long has the Australian Financial Review been around do you think? She's on the money's three so probably like two years. Paul Greenwood's somewhere being like

sorry um I'm right here. Let's talk about investing because that's what we are here to talk about today. You wrote a whole book about it. I did it's crazy. I want to know like you've invested before how did you make decisions like that how do you know what you wanted to invest in and what aligned to your values especially as someone who is like so clear about their value system I think the clearness about my value system is probably a new thing but my aversion to risk that goes all the way back to 1985 and that's how old I am uh and so I think about investments I want to do something that feels safe because I even though I made a joke about being unstable actually I'm all about being stable I want something that I'm like I know exactly what's going to happen and what

happens if this happens what about if this and I think in the context of my current life situation and relationship and that kind of thing I feel really confident that I'm the decision maker in terms of that kind of stuff and so I'm like I'm not going to do anything that's going to put our current comfort at risk so when I think about investing now or in the future I definitely feel like it's one of those things where I'm like I want to be able to able to be as well informed as possible but by people that I trust and people that I think actually care about what I want not what my husband wants because there's nothing I hate more than being like oh yes just get your husband to give me a call about if my in the bin you go absolutely not he's not allowed to have any

money it's all mine um he owns his own business so I have some and he has none oh sorry Michael I'm looking up there like he's dead. He's not. He's like, yeah, you're dead to me though. So same, same but different. I think also when we talk about investing, we know that every second person on our Facebook or our whatever social media is like, I want to tell you about it.

I was like, just let me stop you literally right there because I don't care about your made-up currency. Oh, we were talking about this. Go, Chad, crypto bros, and just go and just keep going forever. Goodbye. Yeah, if anybody works in tech and knows how to get rid of those bots that are on every single Instagram post of She's On The Money, that comments, like, we're like, hey, financial literacy education.

They're like, I have an opportunity for you. First person to reply struggling gets 5,000 shekels. Legit. They're like, I found financial freedom by following this. Capital letters, Brenda, because obviously they're using a spreadsheet to do it and it doesn't have a lowercase. It just says it all in caps. No, but how do they afford these bots?

Literally. Seriously, spend that money and put it elsewhere. I was going to make a recommendation that I'm not going to do that because I am not qualified to provide financial advice. But. I am, but I can't hear. I'm not here. Later.

For legal reasons, that was a joke. And so I think the idea that you would spend all your money on something like that it feels like cheap shoes it feels like cheap handbags it feels like wastefulness the 20 year old me would have thought it was a great idea to buy bots or followers or something and I'm like terrible plan terrible plan you should just buy a gold bullion rent a safe and put it in there that is also terrible advice again for legal reasons that was a joke oh my gosh I just I just can't I'm not I'm not horrified do you know what gold is a good investment for people who want to buy gold there you go yeah I agree with that

let's move to non-monetary let's move away from all of that non-monetary maybe I will refill my drink I feel like I can only make I can do it I can do it for you while you answer this question And I want to know, investing in yourself is a theme that I see consistently in your content, which I am obviously very, very behind. But what is the best thing you have invested in that is not financial? When I bought my MacBook, it's going to sound naff now, but anyway, here we are. I've said all of this other stuff. I'm going to be worried about this part.

I felt like that was, I was backing myself, which I think is a part of that, you know, when you're taking a risk. And that for me felt risky to spend a couple of grand on this device. that I was like, do I really need that? But I'm going to write a book. I haven't written that. Well, I have done a shitload of emails, I tell you. No, but I think that was the beginning of spending money that I wasn't sure. I was like, oh, I don't know if I will ever get anything back for this because I feel like that's what an investment is, right? A return on investment is value that you get. But the value and the joy that I got from knowing that I had spent that money

with the self-belief that one day I'll write a book that I typey-tap-typed on that little MacBook and that I could run a business and own a business because I could do that now because I had a computer and started doing it all on my phone and being like, oh, my eyes. I, seriously, so bad. I think that was probably one of the biggest investments

and I stand by that. Like, I really feel like that moment when I bought it, I made my husband take a picture of me with the box. I was like, look what I did. because I was really super proud of being able to do it and have money which like I don't always to do that and make a big purchase that felt like well this could be a real waste but it wasn't I love that for me how do we see value the way you see value so you just said before I was really proud of myself you said you know I've made this investment in my future career I feel like

something that, you know, I've struggled with historically and a lot of people in our community have struggled with is just being able to be proud of ourselves. Like there's this underlying feeling that maybe it's not enough. How do you get through that? Because I feel like you, you know, exude positivity and you're like, I'm so proud of myself. I've done this. Like, this is sick. Like you took a photo with the MacBook box. How do I be that proud of myself? How do we be that proud of ourselves for, like, taking a step that we weren't entirely sure of? I mean, I think the reason that we don't feel that way

is probably internalised capitalism because we never feel like we're enough and that's why people like Jeff Bezos exist. And so he exists. It's a fact. There's nothing I can do about it. Or is there? A joke. I want to say and I want to say this without sounding like I'm trying to turn it into a

witticism I'm not lower your standards around what you think is worthwhile and valuable around what you think is worth your time lower the expectations that you have that were probably given to you as a child and some of us would say we could talk more about it in therapy about the reasons that we assign value to the things that we do that are so beyond day-to-day life this is a huge achievement you wrote a book you're on tour fabulous shoes thanks babe all achievements but also mainly the shoes right especially the shoes i mean they are chef's kiss they do get a little bit foggy i don't know if you can see my shoes she's really alive that she's not a botch

and so I told you I was funny and you'll get your check at the end so I think being able to fully comprehend that your joy has value your time has value what you care about is important if it's important to you it's important the fact that other people will be like oh yeah but do you have 10 million No, and neither does the guy that hacked Optus, so. Maybe soon, though. He might, though. Although, isn't it weird?

He lowballed himself. That's what I said. Are we going to see an issue of a statement from some kid where his mum's holding his ear? He's like, Johnny. Anyone in this room seen the movie Hackers? Anyone? Yeah, right.

I feel like that guy watched Austin Powers and then Hackers back to back Because he was like, one million dollars. And he's like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I was joking. Here you go. Hey, don't joke about it. Our team are literally, I'm not, I'm not with Optus. No, me either.

Flex, I went with a cheaper carrier. Oh, no. I went with the most expensive one because I'm a dickhead who likes to waste money. Don't tell Victoria. But some of our team are genuinely concerned about this. Is anyone else with Optus? Like, I'm, yeah, okay, everyone's nodding.

oh i mean sorry about that sorry about your data terrible news don't worry don't worry we're going to do a bonus podcast really soon about like how to protect your data because that's actually cool with four quick tips on how to protect the fit right thank you that was miss jesse grigio good and and i think it's really brilliant that they're like here have access to your credit file and most people like what's a credit file and i love that because hey bring it to the mainstream babes awareness of your credit score come on down but I think it's really important to talk about this stuff and you know our team are impacted by it as well as our community and I guess that's the summary of it like you're cool you're way cooler than I ever thought I could be

which I can't be are you talking about me just you just you you guys are really cool too but no but it's one of those things like we share common problems like we share experiences and I think sometimes when you see three people on a stage with some microphones you go oh they must have their shit together I probably wouldn't have thought that until Tish gave us the fancy champagne yeah I'm like oh okay rich bitches would you say that you're someone who has their stuff together like I feel like socially like we look at social media and you look like you have your stuff together she doesn't watch my stories I do I'm a creep chaos demon a chaos demon but with an attitude I think that I don't have my stuff together but who does people who say they've

got it all sorted do you know because I feel like most of those people are men and they don't carry the mental load oh yeah everything's under control oh really is that because like your wife took care of it brother um clap you're not wrong i saw a meme the other day the people listening to the podcast will not understand the second laugh i looked up as if i was looking at my omnipotent husband you're pointing to people in the crowd this is going to be the worst recording honestly we'll have to do a like full image description of the entire that's all right i'm about it we'll do it accessibility is the tits yeah describe that

i can't wait you came for because i'm sorry and you're welcome if you came for genuine financial literacy i feel like just read the book um because that's this isn't what's in the book I haven't I've definitely read it before we let you go I just wanted to talk a little bit more about kind of a place where your passion comes from about visibility and diversity and accessibility and inclusivity because I think like the big reason that we're talking about investing is so much is because we want that to be accessible but there are so many other facets of life where that's not the case and we were having a really good conversation about it backstage and I thought just before we

wrap up I would really like to share that with everybody because I think it really leans into having those open conversations regularly and normalizing it and I think you have a really hot take to share with us so I want to do it on stage if that's all right sure so I think what you're referring to is what we discussed about the fact that people who live in bigger bodies or in my case fat people because I'm not scared of the word fat are often excluded from financial opportunities in the workplace. Almost 50% of employers have admitted that they hold a level of subconscious bias around hiring people who are in their eyes overweight so there's a higher likelihood that people who are fat will get less employment opportunities, less promotion

opportunities will be considered less intelligent by their peers and superiors and so I think when we're talking about investment and we're talking about money the idea that we at the very core of even getting money how do you get money to invest you don't always have an inheritance or a lotto win or some other made-up thing that you dream about when you're a kid that gives you instant bank account Mario coins that's right that noise when the Mario you know I'm not gonna do it it's fun and I think that the idea that we are already disadvantaged in that way and I know that I'm thinking very about this particular niche of people because it's where I hang out being a fat brown person and a woman a non-man like the trifecta I mean oh there's a lot intersections

of like it's like a cobweb there are as many intersections as there are people and there are also in that same vein as many opportunities for someone to choose to I mean if we're going to talk red pill blue pill I guess that choice of will I give this person a chance because they're the best person for the job or will I lean into my unconscious bias and just do what feels right or what I've been influenced to do by other people because people are like not all of them but lots of them are terrible then I think we know that the opportunities for someone like me to become an investor at an age where I feel like I have a long future of stable financial confidence in what I've invested in is lowered instantly for me because of that simple factor. And it's not

something that has any real effect on my ability to be a good employee or be someone worthwhile of earning the same amount of money as someone else. But in other people's eyes, potentially it could be. So I think it's important for us to recognise that conversations about investment start with money and money starts with how you get money and that affects people differently. So I think that's something to keep in mind and I think the also the idea of our wealth what we perceive to be wealth when we have a slightly different view on that as well what makes us wealthy I think investing so that you have financial security is a key part of that a cornerstone of that because that allows you to be able to be more flexible with the other ways that you spend money and

spend time and effort and energy yeah and you're so right like we talk about how women are behind the eight ball financially and we know that the statistics show us that but we don't talk about enough how women of color are two steps behind again and we don't even have as much data to back that up because when we do the research to find that out the data doesn't break it down that deeply and it becomes even harder to then identify these nuances within society where people are not receiving the same advantages and they can't get as far ahead and then it feeds into a narrative of oh well maybe it's your fault maybe it's something that you did or a choice that you made and I think that it's really hard to overcome that I don't have an answer and I wish that I

did and as I'm speaking I'm like well where's the nice bow on the end of this where you say well this is how we fix that and I don't think that there is one but I think people like April who are talking about it so vocally and people like us who continue to have those conversations and shine the spotlight on them I think it's really important because in a dream world we'd all have everything that we want and that bias wouldn't impact those decisions and the employer would hire the best person for the job and it sucks that some people have to fight harder and longer for less and I don't know what the answer to that is but I like to think that everyone being here and everyone talking about it is helping at least a little bit. Absolutely and I think that being

able to have a thought that you couldn't have before because you didn't have any knowledge understanding or experience you know when we when we think about like we talked just briefly about accessibility when that's something that comes into your mind because it's part of how you live that's better that's better than it was and that like miles to go before we sleep but still when we're thinking about the ways that we can ensure that we are doing the most we will do more and when you know better you do better I love that I feel like this is arguably a perfect place to leave this because from my perspective same as you Jess like there is no like golden egg an answer to this but I think small steps are still steps in the right direction

and if we all I guess commit to doing the best we possibly can that's all we can really ask of people because you again you just don't know what you don't know when it comes to accessibility like I have learned so much in the last 12 months just even introducing events to our community where you know I have these beautiful community members that need different accessibility and I want to provide it but the idea that that's not stock standard blows my mind so yeah I think let's wrap it up here you know how at the end of every single podcast we like wrap the boring but important stuff. Do you guys want us to do it now or do you want us to like wait until after we do it now? Do it now. Jess. I'm excited. She thought she was like, oh, we'll just record that

later and drop it in. I was like, yeah, all right. All right. Wrap the boring but important stuff. All right, everybody. Please don't forget the advice shared on She's on the Money is generally nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's on the Money exists purely for educational purposes and should not be relied upon to make an investment or a financial decision and we promise victoria divine is an authorized representative of in focus securities australia proprietary limited avn 34 132 463 057 oh i knew there was a seven on the end and that was it they really did me in by not putting that on there i helped i helped guys i cannot believe that all my best friends came to hang out with us in sydney

like stop laughing it's not funny but I'm genuinely so grateful that you all came to come to an investing book launch like how lame are you oh my god nothing else are you all right and on that note thank you so much for joining us we hope to see a bunch of you outside thank you April and thank you you