She's On The Money - She works hard for the money

Episode Date: February 4, 2020

HELLO SOTM-ERS! This week on the pod we discuss PAY RISES, including how to broach the topic with your boss and how to muster the confidence and ask for what your worth PLUS what we're meant to do if they maybe say no... Get ready gang, it's gonna be a good one. Do you love the podcast SICK and want more SOTM? Of course you do! Join our Facebook page to share your money wins and money confessions, follow us on Insta for daily inspo to keep you on track and DEFINITELY subscribe to our newsletter, the written recap of the pod's key takeaways, including some bonus bits you won't want to miss... Finally, if you're in a money mess and need help untangling the muddle, simply record your qualm and send it through to us at [e-mail] and you may end up on the podcast! Your hosts are Georgia King and Victoria Devine. The advice shared on She's on The Money is general in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's on The Money exists purely for educational purposes only and should not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision. Victoria Devine is an Authorised Representative of Consultum Financial Advisers Proprietary Limited ABN 65 006 373 995 I AFSL 230323.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

She's on the money. She's on the money. Hello and welcome to She's on the money, the podcast for millennials who want financial freedom. This episode of She's on the money has been proudly brought to you by our friends at 86400, Australia's first ever smart bank, but more on them later. My name is Georgia King, a copywriter and TV assistant who has a stack to learn about money. And as always, joining me today is the brilliant, the wise, the wonderful finance wizard,

Miss Victoria Devine. Hi, V. Honestly, you need to calm down on these introductions. I'll let you have an inch and you run a mile. Okay. Today on the show, we are going to be immersing ourselves in the awkward but necessary subject of pay rises, helping you figure out when to ask for one and how exactly to have the nerve-wracking chat with your boss. Plus, we'll delve into how you can make sure you actually deserve one before going ahead and asking for it. But before we get there, V, money wins and confessions. How did you go this week, mate? All right. I am this season, honestly, it's just money win after money win. I'm here for it. I'm sorry if anyone wants to hear my money confessions. I've hidden them all. Only showing

my best self in 2020. So I told you on another podcast that Morgan and I swapped gyms, right? so this year we have been so committed and we've been going very often so cost per wear of our membership pretty high pretty good but to add to that morgan and i used to go for a sneaky eggs on toast maybe once a week to scandalous yeah but like smashed out though no no we definitely want houses yeah but we are in this position where we used to sneak a breakfast maybe like on a thursday or a Friday morning before work, treat yourself, but that's easily $45. Bit sneaky, treat yourself, whatever.

I was going through a supermarket the other day and I saw a microwave egg poacher. Interesting. On sale at Woolworths. Here for it. Purchased it. Now Morgan and I have eggs every morning at work. And they taste cafe quality?

They are cafe quality. Gee, you act like you don't know about this egg poacher. I'm actually surprised. But what did you have for breakfast? The girls whipped me up some googies this morning and they were flawless. Yes, thank you. It was delicious.

So now every day we're having poached eggs on toast in the office and we can afford houses. Yeah, amazing. Well done, girls. Proud of you. Please tell me you've got a better money win than being able to afford a house. Look, it's not better than that, but mine this week is a win as well. Was it getting eggs this morning?

Well, that is a win. I saved like $20. So one of my New Year's resolutions this year was to do a little bit more yoga, get a little bit more zen. So I found this. Working with me, she needs it. I do. So I found this beautiful yoga studio on the Mornington Peninsula.

And admittedly, it's quite expensive to go to just for one-off classes. But I was scrolling on the app and found that they have this 10 class pass deal, saving you $10 per session. So I've actually saved myself like $100 because I literally love it. And I do go quite regularly. So I think that's a win. Good work. It's treating myself, but it's still a win.

treating yourself while saving i love it good work g and as always it's been a perler of a week for so many in the shoes on the money at facebook community victoria did anyone stick out to you this week i have a money win from rose i think you had a money win from a rose last week i think i did too yeah rose is the name of the month in the facebook group she said money win i started my first full-time job after uni and went and saw an accountant and financial planner this week to discuss my money goals and plan. Feeling so much more educated after listening to the podcast series, told my accountant all about it and she was super impressed. Amazing. Well done. I liked that one. I love that she's prioritizing getting financial advice from the very beginning of her

journey instead of waiting until further down the track because you can start now. Very sensible. What have you got, G? So my money win is from Rachel who says, money win, two smiley face emojis with the love hearts on the eyes i run my own business so usually the only letters i get in the mail are notices to say it's time to pay my insurance or tax or gst but today i got a letter to say i've paid off my car loan which now gives me 660 a month more and it's perfect timing because she leaves to go to canada for three weeks on saturday where she will try not to spend all of her savings try hard rachel i also love that you've been literally describing the emoji that the people are using. I feel like that's really essential. It's crucial. I should add, she did

add a crying face laughing emoji at the end of that as well. Okay, good. Good description. Thank you, Jane. And now into the juicy main chat for today, pay rises. Research indicates that millennials are more optimistic and confident than generations before them in the area of pay rises with higher levels of assertiveness and self-esteem. But there definitely seems to be a perception out there that millennials are entitled within this space. V, do you think that this perception holds any truth to it? I think that this is actually a little bit twofold. There is definitely more of a sense of me, me, me and taking care of ourselves, which I actually really like and think it's putting our mental and physical health first and as a priority. But I can also

see why previous generations see us as being more entitled and more flexible and have more expectations on our employers or our family or our friends because we don't work in the same way that they used to. If we think about it, they didn't have access to the internet. And whilst I'm not talking about a lack of education here, I'm talking about a lack of freedom. So we have so much freedom nowadays to work from wherever we want. We have access to information that previously we would have had to travel to a library to access or, you know, get the encyclopedia out. Whereas now I ask Siri every single morning, what's the weather? What's this? What's the traffic like how's that going to work and the internet is enabling us to be far more productive

but also see the opportunity so employers are seeing this and being more flexible and allowing us to work more flexible but the more this is happening the more people are expecting it I feel like entitlement is a really harsh word and something that is quite negatively connotated which is completely undeserving but yes I do expect better from my employers yes I do expect better from my peers and family and friends and it's not because I'm an entitled person it's because I want equality for everybody and I want people to be treated exactly the same I want people to be treated well I don't want people to be in a situation where they are changed to their desk Monday to Friday nine to five and feel as though they are a cog in the bigger wheel I want people

to contribute I want them to be a part of the bigger journey and I feel like we can expect that from our employers? I was going to say Vy as well. The nine to five culture I think has completely shifted. We no longer go home, shut off, have dinner, go to bed. Now we've got emails on our phones. We're looking at them all night long. Like there's kind of more expected of us now because we're never really removed from the workplace, if that makes any kind of sense. Yeah, absolutely. And I think that plays into what work-life balance is and how that works and what that looks like. Because work-life balance used to look like you put your pen down, you get up from your desk and you walk out and you actually can't do any work. Whereas I take my

work home with me and I'm probably a really bad example of someone who has a terrible work-life balance, as you would know, G. But I'm someone who also loves the flexibility that having access to my emails and my work and my team on my phone is so empowering. Like I know that I can step away for a coffee or I can not come to work that day and work from home while still having the same level of access to my team and my workplace as I did previously being in the office. So I think it has shifted, but our work-life balances have changed and now work is seeping into life and life is seeping into work. So I don't actually believe in this idea of having a professional you versus a personal you. I'm very much a believer of it is a holistic you and you are you at work

and you are you at home and it is one person fronting up and we need to take that into consideration. I think talking about things at work is really important. I think being on the same page as your employees and your employers is essential for a successful business relationship. All right, Evie. So we've done some research and according to the Human Rights Commission, the average Australian woman, just like you and I, has to work an extra 56 days a year in order to earn as much as a man doing the exact same thing. Yes, I have heard this. terrible one factor contributing to this issue is that women are less likely than men to ask for a

pay rise they are and there's also a stat that i don't love but i love to talk about and that's that men apply for a job when they feel like they meet 60 of the qualifications but women only ever apply for that job if they meet 100 of that qualification ridiculous yeah i read that in a book called lean in yeah a little while ago and i have been obsessed with it since then it actually really frustrates me because I feel like that plays into confidence as well. Like that is telling me that men are more confident about their ability at 60% than a lot of women are when they feel like they're at 100%. And to me, that's too much. And it tells me that we as women, and I know there are a number of men that listen to this podcast, but this is more, I guess, this is more female

orientated. It's just we as women need to have more faith in ourselves when applying for jobs and know that we shouldn't be putting ourselves out of the job market because we don't meet 100% of the criteria. Like we can learn things on the job. You are smart, you are independent, and you have the ability to learn. So if you are in a position where you're deciding not to apply for a job because you didn't meet 100% of the qualifications, why didn't you just apply and see what happened? I also recently read a study that was published in Linda Babcock's book, Women Don't Ask, and she found that only 7% of women will actually try and negotiate a salary when applying for a new job, they'll just often just take what is offered thinking it's not

negotiable compared to 57% of men who will go into that and ask for a different salary if they feel like they deserve it. And then once they're working, less than one in five women actually ask for a pay rise without being prompted by their manager or a colleague compared to one in three men. So for me, I don't know if this is just a confidence issue, but I do think the bias comes into play because there was an Australian study that happened recently that found that when women asked for pay rises, they were 25% less likely to get them than men. Really? So I feel like we are actually on the back foot here. We aren't asking for them, but then when we do, we're less likely to get them. So it does feel a little bit unfair and exactly why you and I decided to do a podcast

on exactly how this works. Yeah. So Jay, with all of that in mind and knowing that this is something that I am honestly wildly passionate about, like I say this all the time, I've posted it all over my Instagram, know your worth and then add tax. Where do we start? Like, what do you need to know to be able to be confident

in negotiating your salaries and pay rises? How do we empower ourselves to have those conversations with our bosses? And how do we first know what we're worth? Look, we've talked about entitlement and stuff like that. And I think this is a different conversation. I think we need to pick up entitlement,

put it on the side and start with, well, do your research, work out what your role is actually worth. Don't just walk into your boss's office and be like, I listen to the She's on the Money podcast. I should negotiate my salary. Like do your research and not just what your role is worth. Have a look at your job description. Are you actually meeting all of the KPIs and targets set out in that? Because it's very hard as someone who manages people to say, all right, you can have a salary increase when they are just expecting it. I think that you really need to take this piece of entitlement, put it to the side and say, well, I've got it to the side, but also take it into consideration just because you've

worked somewhere for 12 months does not mean that you deserve a salary increase. You need to prove your worth, like jot down all of the things that you've done to add value that have been above and beyond the role that you're doing. Because in my opinion, if you've got a job description and you're just meeting the criteria of that job description there's absolutely no need for a salary increase beyond cbi because you're doing the job that you're being paid to do like what additional value are you adding yep and how do you articulate that and that takes a little bit of confidence too absolutely so you're saying that there isn't a year-on-year increase in pay i know a few of my friends think that that's a thing and

i kind of thought it was a thing when i'd been in my my job for a year and then it came to 12 months and they were like no salary increase yeah yeah look it's not government enforced to get a salary increase it is quite common for people to write into their contracts that you get a salary increase in line with inflation so you might have your salary increase by like 1.8 to 3 depending on the year but often that is in your contract and predetermined so that's definitely something that you should be talking about when setting your salary in a new role because if you are going to be in that role for 10 years and inflation has gone up by 10% in that period of time, you're actually on the back foot if you're still on the same salary.

Alrighty V, what else do I need to consider? So once you've armed yourself with information and done some research, so you actually understand the industry and you understand what you're asking for. So look into changes in your industry, understand market conditions and even your own workload and qualifications. All of these things come into play. It's really important to not focus on your personal goals. Don't go, oh, well, I had the goal of earning $65,000 by the end of the year. So therefore I would like a pay increase. You really need to focus on outcomes instead of forming your approach around why you want to pay rise. It's more about positioning it in terms of

an argument to say, well, I believe I deserve a pay rise because I've done these things and I've contributed to the business in this way. And I understand that I'm helping you be successful. And therefore I believe this, this, and this. It becomes far more of a pragmatic conversation then I would like a pay rise because that honestly doesn't stand up nearly well enough and I mean there are going to be people who are like well I just asked for a pay rise and I got it yeah and that's fair but I think we really need to do a little bit of self-reflection to understand what that actually means and why we're asking for it so that we can take that entitlement piece off the table to say well actually I'm not entitled about this I'm going above and beyond I'm worth more I

know this. And it becomes a one-sided argument. Like you can't walk into someone's office and say, all right, well, I believe I'm worth more because of these reasons. And you've got really solid facts and then go, no, you haven't done that. Like put them in a position where all of your facts are indisputable. Exactly. So I need to be proving my worth, which is absolutely fair before I'm ready for a pay rise. Yes. If you want more money, do the work. But does that mean that I need to be the first one in the office in the morning and then the last one to leave? No. And I think that that's such a bad example of what's going on. And I'm pretty opinionated on this. I don't know if you guys know, but I do have a couple of opinions I like to throw around.

I think that if you have a nine to five job, it's your manager or your business's job to make sure that the workload they are providing you with fits between those hours. And if you are working stupidly long hours that are outside of that, one of two things is happening. They are either giving you too much work and you really need to go back and renegotiate your workload with your employer and talk about what you're doing in addition, or you're fluffing around a little bit at work and not getting the job done within the period of time that is expected to get done in. Whilst I do absolutely well and truly appreciate people going above and beyond, I don't believe that going above and beyond is related to additional work hours and being that

person who's last out of the office and first in in the morning. I think that's a ridiculous expectation. It's about the value that you are adding while you are in the office during work hours. Are you that guy that's hanging out at the coffee machine every day and maybe wearing a pair of jeans when it's actually a corporate office? I'm wearing jeans right now. Yeah, I'm sorry, G. But to flip that, are you showing up present, excited about the work that you're doing, proving that you are wanting to be there, you are showing up confidently, you are handing over concrete data that shows your boss that you are putting in the energy and the time and that you value your job, I feel like effort won't betray you in this situation. And it's not about the

hours, it's actually about the value and having a think about, well, how do I show my boss that I'm more valuable? Is it going, all right, well, I proof checked this a couple more times, like I've got this idea and I'm a very, very big believer in never asking your manager for something without having an answer for them. Always going to a manager like, hey, cool, I would like to do this, this, and this, or I've got a question on A, B, and C, thinking the answer is this, because I've already done the research, but you know, is this right, is really important instead of going, oh, help me. I don't get it. I don't understand. Don't be that person. Be proactive. Go above and beyond. And that's what I mean when I say that. That makes complete sense,

Vee. So it's all about providing as much value as you can, instead of just slogging it out and working 12 hours and thinking that that's the way to getting where you want to go. Absolutely. Yeah. So what if you're in an industry under an enterprise bargaining agreement where you can't earn any more money than you're currently making? Yeah. Sometimes that happens where you're in a job and it has salary bands for that specific role. And, you know, for an example, you do see that a lot in an accounting practice where an accountant has a certain band and then the intermediate accountant has another and the senior accountant has another. And I feel like that's quite hard. sometimes it gives you a really good clear career pathway because you can say all right I've reached

the cap of this my next step is into this role and there's a really clear outline of what that looks like but then sometimes you're in a job and you've absolutely killed it and you've aced it and you're at the top of your game but there isn't anywhere to go above that and to me that's a very frustrating position or I can imagine it to be a very frustrating position for someone to be in because you feel capped out and that to me is not the glass ceiling it's not being held back it's actually just that you've reached the top in that role and you really need to consider where you're going like you might love your job and not need a salary increase you go well this is my job and that's cool and i'm at the top of my game i'm earning as much as i possibly can but if that is

something that is worrying you and you do feel like you want a salary increase i think it's then your turn to think about well how do i re-skill how do i take these skills and transfer them to a different career pathway that i could potentially you know move all of these things into and earn more money. It's really down to your values and what is of value to you. But I don't want people to think that if they've reached the top of their game, that people are valuing them less because they are, you know, at the top of that band and, you know, they're restricted in salary. I think you really need to see it as, well, those are the limitations. What things can I do outside of salary that I could negotiate that become a part of my role? Like, could you negotiate more flexible

working hours? Could you negotiate work from home days? Could you negotiate different leave entitlements or benefits that you have at work that play into that, that you can go above and beyond with there? So I don't think it caps you forever. And I don't think it's a negative thing to be in a role like that, but it is worthy of mentioning. And I'm glad you brought it up because an EBA can feel a little bit restrictive. And that's where if you're doing your research into a new career or a new job, really understand those brackets and understand those metrics because it would be really disappointing getting into a role being like, I'm going to smash this out and I'm going to have a salary increase year on year. Don't expect anything, understand

everything. And that's what I mean when I say, go do your research, understand the role you're going into, understand where you can go and what you can actually do in the future as well. So V, we've done our research. We've been working as hard as we can. We know what we're worth now, but we tee up our meeting with our boss and they say no to our requests for a pay rise what do we do at the end of the day if you don't get the salary increase that you want this time around it's this time around so it's not no forever and I think if your boss is in a position where they say no never this isn't going to happen I think you really do need to consider what your options look like but going to your boss is a really big thing presenting a new proposal for a salary is

massive and I think you should be really proud of yourself for taking that step and having that conversation like learning how to negotiate is a really really wonderful skill to have even if you don't get the salary increase this time around if you've presented an amazing proposal and an argument for why you should be getting a raise you're going to be top of mind when the next conversation about salary comes around just be patient if you feel as though you're being told know over and over again, though, keep an eye out for other companies that do actually value you and that do offer the things that you're asking for. Like if you sat down and said, well, actually, now I've done all my research and I'm worth so much more. Don't settle.

What about if you do get a pay rise, but it's not quite the amount you're expecting? So you went in in the hopes of a 10 or 15 grand pay rise and you were only given five grand. Do you just kind of take that and run with it or should you challenge it? I think you should challenge it and be like, thank you so much for considering this pay rise, but that wasn't actually in line with my expectations. Explain why you think that you were deserving of more or go, okay, no problems. Thank you so much. I'm assuming that this means we can review again in another three months and maybe put on the table some KPIs for them to keep an eye on so that, all right, well, no problems, but what do I need to achieve

to have my salary reviewed again? Ask for some specific markers, some clear guidance of saying, well okay no problems if I achieve this amount in sales or if I finish this amount of work can we please renegotiate this again to this level so that they're expecting you to come back for what you think you deserve but sometimes it does take employers a couple of steps because it is really big if you are asking for something like a $15,000 pay rise like that's not small a business does have to pay for it but at the end of the day if you as an employee are worth that they'll be happy with that yes but maybe they'll want to stage it lastly I guess for those listeners who are feeling a little bit queasy or intimidated by actually making the time to have this

conversation with their boss, what words of wisdom would you offer them? The worst thing that they can say is no. Yes. And there's absolutely no harm in asking. So I think it's very valid for you to approach your boss after you have done all your research and you understand the market, you understand the scope of your role and say, hey, I'd like this to be renegotiated. I think you should be approaching it in a very gentle way as well. Don't go in and be like, I've done my research and I'm so deserving of this. But at the end of the day, the worst thing that they can say is no and don't settle for a place that doesn't see your value. Hi there, you've reached the Shoes on the Money mailbox. Do you have a money problem

you want help solving? Do you have a money dilemma you just want to chat about? Victoria is here to help every week we'll be playing your questions to help make sense of a money mess you may have found yourself in make a quick recording on your phone and send it through to podcast at she's on the money.com.au and you might find yourself on the show but for now here's this week's listener question hey guys absolutely love the podcast I was just wondering if you could answer a question for me I'm currently being paid sixty thousand dollars per annum but the new roles that I'm applying for are around $80,000. And I know that I've definitely got the experience and the ability for the higher salary, but the recruiters are asking me what I'm currently

being paid. So I'm just wondering, do you think that I have to tell them? I'm not really comfortable letting them know because obviously that's not my expectation moving forward. But I'm just wondering if you think whether I have to let them know and if I don't, how do I go about that? Thank you. It's a weird one, V. I don't know how I'd tackle that. Do you have any advice or idea? I think that's such a hard one because when recruiters are doing their job, they're just trying to understand the scope of your role and a really good indicator of your performance is your salary. And back to my accounting example, there are different bands that people get paid in this industry. And if you fit within a band, it can be assumed a certain capability. But if

you believe you've been undervalued and you're now going for roles that are above and beyond what you were being paid, I do think it's in your best interest to hold that information pretty close. And when someone says to you, hey, G, what salary are you currently on? Instead of going, oh, this much money, go back and say, well, actually, I was wondering about salary. What's this role worth? And trying to understand the scope of that role because your remuneration is not directly related to the next role. It's your skill set, it's your capability and your competency to do the role and I don't think our listener question is absolutely out of line because your current compensation for recruiters and for future employers often acts as a really

strong anchor when they're trying to make decisions so often they'll go oh well she was on 60 so that's her expectation maybe she's expecting that or we could comfortably offer her 65 that's more than what she was on before she'll be happy with that she'll be happy with that and they make decisions for you instead of saying well actually my expectation for this role is eighty thousand dollars when they say hey gee what's your current salary maybe go back straight away with well actually my expectation for this role would be this yes it's not essential that you disclose your salary when discussing things with recruiters but I can absolutely understand why she's justifiably reluctant to disclose that number because it sounds like her salary is much lower

than the role that she was actually completing so be you can turn it straight back onto the employer or the recruiter and say my expectation for this role is this dollar amount rather than disclosing yeah yeah absolutely and if you feel pressured to continue that and you know you've been trying to dodge the question by being like all right well what's this role worth and having that conversation there is so so so much power in just saying no like no I don't particularly want to disclose that i don't believe that it is helpful in us finding a new role at the end of the day headhunters and recruiters make a lot of money based on putting you into the right role and you're helping them in a way put you into the right role by them understanding your expectations

the right role for you isn't the one where people are just going to pay you it's one where you feel valued and you feel as though they respect you and a recruiter should see that at the end of the day they get paid more based on how much you are earning as well. So it's in their best interest to get you the best possible salary package, but there's so much power in saying no. Saying no to employers that you don't feel like are treating you right. Saying no to salary packages that aren't the right fit for you and saying no to people who are asking questions that you don't want to answer. So at the end of the day, I've said it a million times, but know your worth and then add tax. It's time for Money Diary. Let's get into it. My relationship with money is getting

better. For a long time, it wasn't that great. Most of the time, it was paycheck to paycheck and trying to just make sure that everything was covered. My partner and I are getting married halfway through this year, which is really exciting. So organizing a wedding and planning some overseas trips, a honeymoon. So that's sort of the big plans at the moment and potentially buying a house but that's further down today's money diary is from 28 and getting better who recently made the big decision to leave a job she loved but that wasn't paying her appropriately so i've been teaching for about six years this is my sixth year and so i've had a quite a bit of differences during that time i love the students and i really love the people i worked

with but yeah the pay was a big factor so while i was working as a casual worker i would get paid for the hours i taught and then for every hour taught i'd get half an hour planning time so if I taught for two hours I'd have essentially I'd be paid for three hours which was in theory great but that hour was basically me uploading all of the resources to an online portal checking the role emailing students that didn't cover any planning didn't cover any marking and because it was a VCE program there's a lot of additional work I remember working it out once that I would be paid for 25 hours a week and on average I was working 60 hours a week so it just didn't match my partner and I at the time we were just talking about actually sitting down and talking about

marriage and and by about maybe getting a house and looking at it and going we there's no way we're going to ever own we're never going to be able to travel again we're not in a position where we can actually have the life that we deserve or that we have set out for ourselves moving schools and moving to a different environment was definitely the best decision both financially and mentally definitely needed that change and far less stress now okay so now we know what she does, let's get into the juicy stuff. How much does she earn and how much is sitting in her bank account right now? So in my previous job, I was earning about $48,000 a year. Now I'm earning about $60,000, but I know that that will increase by halfway through the year. Bank accounts,

at the moment, I've got about five grand in my high interest savings. And what exactly happens to that money after it's deposited into her account? So it goes straight into my account And then the next day, an amount goes, so $800 goes into the billing account. I get paid fortnightly. So that covers our rent, which is about $2,000 a month. And then our phone bills and all of that. So $800 a fortnight goes straight in. That way it's always covered.

$600 goes into my savings. And then I end up with about $450. Okay, then. So how does 28andGettingbetter feel about investing? Does she invest? And if so, how? So I've always had the goal to invest. I do have a Raise account and so there's sort of that micro investing. Somehow it's not working

particularly well for me. I think I've set up something wrong. So that's something I need to fix. My partner also does invest through Raise and he's doing far better than I am, which is fine. It means that we always, we have some money being invested. I think the goal though is we want to get rid of the credit card completely and then we will actually sit down and we'll go and see a broker and make the decision to of where and what and how much and all of that. But until that debt is gone. We don't want to stretch our money more than it is at the moment. Even though I know that it will bring us more money, it will just give me more anxiety than I would like to deal with right now. What about debts like credit cards or personal loans? I technically have only got one

big debt, which is my hex debt. So it's about $31,000. My partner has a $7,000 debt with a credit card. Whilst technically it's his, we're getting married. My money is his money. His money is my money. Our goal is to have that eradicated by our wedding. Does 28 and getting better have any good money habits that she's especially proud of? I always go for sales or op shop finds when it comes to clothes. Not really a big fan on buying brand new. I mean, I even bought my wedding dress on a huge sale and it was a little bit damaged and I thought, you know what, a little bit damaged, I can fix that. And what about her worst money habit? Probably if I'm catching up with friends for drinks, I ignore a budget I may have set myself for that night and kind of go

overboard. So what's today's money diarist actually saving for? What's her big money goal? so we've kind of got multiple big money goals all running concurrently at the moment it's our wedding our friend's wedding in Germany and our honeymoon so those sort of this year alone big money goals but we do want to buy a house in the next two or three years so how would 28 and getting there rate herself if we forced her to give herself a grade I would rate myself probably at a b plus mostly because of ignoring the credit card for as long as I have even though it's not technically mine so it's out of sight out of mind for me and it has been for a long time and also taking as long as I have to make a good set of financial decisions so if the credit card wasn't

there I would rate myself an A. 28 and getting better Victoria this very interesting one. I loved it I thought it was really good it wasn't your typical money diary where you know they've saved up and achieved all their dreams already but I feel like this was such a good story to share and when we sat down with her it really was obvious that she knew her worth and what she was doing yeah and I think to me that's really important especially she had all these goals she was saying that she's wanting to get married or she is getting married really soon she wants to go overseas for a friend's wedding she's got all of these other goals and she just knew that that job wasn't going to give it to her she had a heap of loyalty to her previous employer because

it was her first employer and I think it's really important to actually highlight that you know sometimes when you do ask for a pay rise it doesn't mean you're going to get it yeah but it means that you are committed to understanding your value and what you bring to the table and sometimes the best thing to do is to actually walk away yeah and that's that's really hard to hear for some people well didn't you say as well she was meant to be working 25 hours or so but was dedicating 60 hours a week to that and getting paid just for the 25 like that's outrageous it was a lot and I think that that story is actually going to resonate with a lot of people who are listening, especially in that field, because I think that teachers and nurses and these service

industries are actually really undervalued. So more often than not, we see them as people who don't work in that industry and go, oh, teachers get 12 weeks of annual leave each year. That's amazing. It's like they absolutely do not. They have so much work above and beyond what the average employee has and a heap of responsibilities that we just don't see. So I think it's really important that she's actually brought her hand up and said, well, actually, I need to be remunerated for this, especially so early on, because this is important to me and this is my career. And it was evident that she was really passionate about that. And I loved that. And what did you think of her rating? I thought it was appropriate. I thought it was quite in line with where she's at. She did mention

she had a small amount or they had a small amount of credit card debt still, and that they were getting through that. However, it sounds like she's completely flipped her money habits. And what more can you ask and was there anything you think she could improve upon victoria i think it would just be around planning so she had a whole heap of goals that she said and i want to go on overseas trip and i want to do this and i want to do that and she said that she had five thousand dollars in savings but she's also got her own wedding at the end of this year i think it would be really important to sit down and put together some really tangible goals that you can say all right well this is how much i need for this goal this is how much i need for my wedding yeah and

the best way to actually approach those things is just be really pragmatic and have a goal and organize what that looks like up front so that you, one, know what to expect, but two, know when you've achieved those things. Exactly. Alrighty. Thanks so much for sharing, 28 and Getting Better. And that is all we have time for today on our Pay Your Eyes pod. But just before we head off, let's quickly wrap the boring but important stuff. The advice shared on Shoes on the Money is general in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's on the Money exists purely for educational purposes and should not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision.

And yes, don't worry, we promise Victoria Devine is an authorised representative of Consultant Financial Advisors Propriety Limited, ABN 65006 373 995, AFSL 230 323. We would love it if you joined our Facebook group where our community shares money, tips and tricks every single day free of judgment. Search She's On The Money on Facebook and join us. If Facebook's not your thing, find us on Instagram. We're at She's On The Money AUS.

See you next week, guys. See you.