She's On The Money - The Cost Of Comparison Culture

Episode Date: April 16, 2024

Do you ever feel like everyone else is way ahead of you when it comes to money? How often do you find yourself thinking that others just have it better off? We ALL experience these feelings in life, but when does comparison culture stop being a motivation for good, and start costing us dearly? The cost of comparison culture is high on both our mental health, and also our finances. So today we talk about why it has such a hold over us, and how we can identify it, and combat it! Acknowledgement of Country By Natarsha Bamblett aka Queen Acknowledgements. The advice shared on She's On The Money is general in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's On The Money exists purely for educational purposes and should not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision. If you do choose to buy a financial product, read the PDS, TMD and obtain appropriate financial advice tailored towards your needs.  Victoria Devine and She's On The Money are authorised representatives of Money Sherpa PTY LTD ABN - 321649 27708,  AFSL - 451289.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hello, my name is Natasha Nabanunga-Bamblett. I'm a proud Yorta Yorta, Kernai, Wolperi and Awadjeri woman. And before we get started on She's on the Money podcast, I would like to acknowledge the traditional custodians of the land of which this podcast is recorded on Awadjeri country, acknowledging the elders, the ancestors and the next generation coming through. As this podcast is about connecting, empowering, knowledge sharing and the storytelling of you to make a difference for today and lasting impact for tomorrow. Let's get into it. She's on the money.

She's on the money. Hello and welcome to She's on the Money, the podcast for millennials who want financial freedom. Do you ever feel like everyone is just way ahead of you when it comes to money? I don't know if you can relate to this so much, but certainly like maybe the people listening, it kind of just feels like no matter how far you go, it feels like you still aren't where you want to be, but also where everyone else is, it's like so much further ahead. Like it just always feels like you're running this rat race. We all do at points, which is why we're talking today about the cost of comparison culture on today's episode. My name is Bex Hyde and with me as always is

Victoria Devine. Hello my friend. I'm excited to talk about this because we have talked about comparison culture on the podcast before. It was honestly like terrifyingly a couple of years ago Bex. We've been around a while but you're right like I do go through things and feel like I'm behind and I think if I had admitted that publicly to you you'd be like V pull your head in. It's Like when the pretty girl goes, oh, I'm so ugly today. And you're like, absolutely you are not. Sit down. Like, what the heck?

Like, you're the prettiest thing I've seen in my life. Totally. You know when someone says something and it feels unhinged, you're like, oh, they can't believe that. Like, absolutely not. What do you mean you got up on the wrong side of the bed? You're basically a supermodel. Like, that's what it feels like when someone like me goes, oh, yeah, the cost of comparison,

like everyone's doing better than me because it's public knowledge. They're like, I know money and I'm pretty good at it. And I've bought property. And, you know, I'm good at investing. And I think lots of people look at me and go, she's got it together. Thank you for that. I would like to keep that aura up that I'm really good at money. But there's always someone doing better, right?

Like it doesn't matter what good position you get into. There's always going to be someone doing better, someone doing more, someone that you can compare yourself with. So I think we need to contextualize it in that way because it's ridiculous. Totally. Why aren't we just comparing ourselves to past us? like, hey, Bec, you know what? 12 months ago, past you wouldn't have even been comfortable having this conversation. And you go, oh, yeah, actually. Like, if we think back to when you started on the podcast, you were like, oh, I've never invested. And now you're like, yeah, so my

goal this year, probably going to invest. Like, I've been looking at this and this. And, you know, you're talking about ETFs, like, you know what they are now. Like, do you know what I mean? So let's compare to past us, not future us or, you know, what we could have been or the missed opportunities. And I think, you know, everybody to some degree goes through this. And that's why we obviously have to talk about it in more depth today, because to me, the cost of comparison culture links so closely to our mental health, but also our finances. And to me, those two things are incredibly important to talk about. So we're here now. I completely agree. That's a really good way to look at it actually compare yourself to your past self unless your past self was thriving

then compare yourself to i don't know but also look at that you did it like even if they were thriving like beck you've done it before you can do it again we can get back there like everyone falls off the bandwagon at some point with something totally that's so true like our community are gritty it means they get back up and try again yeah okay so a little bit later in the episode, we will give you some tips to help combat comparison culture. But before that, let's talk about what it is and why it holds such a power over us. Why are we like this V? I mean, firstly, let's talk about it from an evolutionary standpoint, right? Like innately, we're social little creatures, some more than others, like you and I. But you and I and everyone

alive today are basically descendants of a very long line of people who knew how to fit in with a pack because that's what survival meant and people didn't really survive if you couldn't get into the pack or if you were you know ostracized from the pack so I think it's really important to keep in mind that we are a pack community at heart and now you look at the world and go I don't even know my neighbors like it's a very strange juxtaposition like there's all these quotes about you know it takes a village to raise a child and like you look at it now and be like I'm on the village talking to my child. Like I'm not even going to put them on the internet. Do you know what I mean? Like the world is such a different place, but innately we are pack animals

and we thrive when people around us are thriving. We kind of look to each other to get a sense of ourselves as well and where we should be in life. And so historically, if we're in a pack, everything was kind of like shared. Did you get a piece of the animal that we just killed? Yep. Great. Did you? Great. Like we don't have different collections of stuff when you live in a pack. You don't have a house you don't have you know a car or something more shiny because the idea was always to you know contribute to the greater good and you know essentially like we only just wanted to survive and that's where we've come from but we're not in survival mode anymore and I think it's normal to compare ourselves but it's also something that we have to be really careful of because I

think immediately because of this pack culture mentality you go well if Beck has I probably should have it and immediately like that's that pack culture overshadowing the way that you're feeling when in reality we're now all our own little packs and we're running our own races and we have different things to say and I mean I don't think it's about just ignoring other people right but I do think it's about checking in with our personal values and not trying to keep up with the Joneses next door because you don't know how much debt they're in and just keeping things sustainable for ourselves because yes times have changed and yes you do want to compare yourself but like that doesn't mean it's constructive even though you go oh well you know if I compare

myself to Beck I'll become a better person you go well not really like I'm really sorry but you might manifest yourself into Beck and then realize that Beck had different values than you did completely and you're on a completely different life trajectory than you actually wanted to be right yeah because we are social creatures and it's a good like way to figure out like oh am I am I tracking or am I developing or am I where I should be? Let me have a look at people my own age. And also, where do you want to be? Because like, if you look at people your own age, like, are they doing exactly what you want to do? That's the thing. They're not doing exactly what I want to do. The things that make me happy mean that my life isn't going to look exactly like

that. I agree. All right. So I've gone full hippy dippy a couple of weeks ago. We had our team retreat and I went away and I was like working with our internal team. So you didn't get a Guernsey. I'm really sorry because it turns out you don't work for me full time yet, but I will continue to rally and basically bully you into it at some point. But I want to do a really quick exercise and we were all about exercises on retreat. And I want us to each share three things that we love, that we value really highly, that I guess motivates us to live our best life or our, like, favourite parts of our life and then explain why. Would you prefer if I went first or would you like to go first?

Maybe you go first. I'm shy. You're shy? I'm shy. Okay, so I have three things that I've written down and I'm going to put you more on the spot because I didn't prep you. But mine are, like, lame things, all right? So first things first, we know that I adore my morning coffee

with my husband Steve and my dog. I feel like I wake up in the morning and it's just, like, I'm so happy to get out of bed at 6am. like and on the days that my husband has to go to work early we literally prioritize getting up even earlier so that we don't miss that part of our day together that is very early and I'm impressed it's not lame at all but that's what's of value to me and I'm also mentioning it because I just know I couldn't drag your sorry butt out of bed to go on a 5k walk every morning and get a coffee with the dog you'd be like have fun guys I'll be waiting here for when you get back right

I could think of a million things I'd prefer to do. To me, that sets my day up. And like, I had to be up at like 4.30 this morning, right? I had a whole heap of work to do. I had really early interviews with the US and like, I'm so grateful for that. But that was one thing that I missed because I'm not getting up earlier than 4.30 to go for a walk with my husband. In fact, I think if I'd pitched that to him, he would be like, all right, that's where

I draw the line. Yeah, may as well not go to bed. Yeah, like we're just not doing that, Victoria. Anyway, so I think that's it. I love speaking at events and in front of people. Like I love big crowds of people who are all on the same page. Like I adore our She's On The Money events. I really love connecting with such a big group of people knowing that the content that I'm sharing has an impact. And I kind of know that if I said, hey, Bec, so we're going to do an event, you'd be like, have fun. I'm not coming. And if

I said, hey, Bec, do you want to go on stage? Like there's 600 people at this event. Like, what would you say? Look, it depends what we're talking about. I don't mind a bit of, I don't mind being the center of attention, but in these kinds of situations, probably not. I'd probably say I will sit in the crowd. I'm just remembering back to when we won like the podcast of the year award. And I was like, come up Beck. And you just stood there frozen and you were like, no. I got so scared. Which is so fine, but like we're so different. And then third, I like just hanging out on my own on the couch with my husband sometimes if he's allowed I always want my pets there sometimes I even want my husband to bug off and leave me alone so I can watch maths or like

the Real Housewives of Salt Lake City and not be interrupted and I enjoy that but I prefer that time sometimes above and beyond going out and socializing with my friends yeah like I will literally say to them sorry I don't have the social battery like I don't want to come out and they respect it. That's fine. It's not a bad thing. But I also know that's something you would never do. Like if I said to you, hey, Bec, do you want to go out? Do you want to sit home on your own and watch a TV series? You'd be like, why would I sit home on my own? Exactly. You know me too well. I've picked these strategically, but now I want you to share three things that you maybe thought about while I was talking about that, that, you know, you love and you highly

value. What do you reckon they are? I did absorb all of that and just so happened to think of my own three at the same time. I promise I was listening. I promise I was listening. Okay. So obviously, as you know, I love rolling the grass. I love being in the elements. You love rolling in the grass. That's what you got from it. Yeah, basically. And I know it's going to sound very different. But not at 6am. Not at 6am ideally, but I like rolling in the grass. I like listening to, I guess it's like kind of like a meditation, being in the grass, feeling the grass, listening to the sounds around me and just being ever present. You know, I like to be present. I've got to do that several times a week. Otherwise, where am I? Where's my head at? You know, I always

want to be where I am. That's one thing that I really value. The second one is, I know this might come as a surprise, but I do like an early morning gym session. Oh, absolutely not. That sounds terrible to me. I mean, obviously in the moment, I hate it. What's an early morning gym session to you though? Is it like 6.30? No. Is it 4am? It's like 7. Oh, that's good. But that's still early morning to a lot of people. Still early morning to a lot of people. But I just feel like I need get out of the way so I can then enjoy what is to come and we never know what that is and that's exciting. Which gives me such anxiety. We were talking about this the other day and I can't remember if it was on mic or off mic but basically Bec said oh no I never know what I'm doing after

work and I was like sorry what? Like you don't know what you're doing after work? You're like nah like I'll just see what my friends text me what they're up to and I was like oh no like after work. I know like my plan and I will be going home and I will be cooking dinner because I have an avocado that is going to go off. And if I don't use that, that will give me anxiety. And you're like, what? Let the avo go off. Yeah. Let the avo be. She wants to go off. Let her go off. But that is so true. And this is where we differ. That is actually surprisingly going to be my third one. So not making plans, but always just going with the flow and having something to do is what brings me so much joy you know I get it I feel like your phone is consistently going off

with like hey Beck what are you up to after work and you'll be like oh not much and then you're like at the pub straight after work with someone different every night or like catching up for Pete so like you have the best social life when I sit back I'm envious of it because I'm like that's so wholesome like that's so nice like how nice would it be to have this consistent group of friends who just want your attention like do you know what I mean I know what you mean but then I know if I put myself in your shoes I'd be like why are you guys so obsessed with me leave me alone it's a work day on work days we don't do socializing I do want you know I don't have that many friends it's just the same few that we're always going out they're close friends but you

know it is the case it like I live it's just me and live actually but you think like oh that kind of life looks fun but then if you were to live it even for a few days a few weeks you'd be like ah this actually is not bringing me any joy and so sometimes it is just we're kind of like gravitating toward we actually love doing you know what I mean yeah I absolutely do and I feel like that's actually a really cute list which is like completely juxtaposing my list which is like go on a walk in the morning with my dog and you're like get in the bin I really like speaking at events and you're like absolutely not and then I'm like oh my gosh I also really just love being by myself and you're like, ew, David, get out.

I want to ask now, have you ever been scrolling through Instagram and felt like a little bit jealous or a little bit envious or even like a little bit insecure, like you're not enough at that moment when you see someone that you follow showing off something? It could be like a friend or more obviously like an influencer, so it could be like them being on a trip or an outfit or whatever it is. Like I feel like, is that a thing? It pains me to say, but yes, absolutely.

And I think it's more so not so much influencers going on big trips, but it's like if I see friends going out to big things, like doing stuff, I'm like, I want to be friends with you and I feel sad that we're not friends. How do I make this happen? Anyway. You message them and you just go, hey, pal, want to be friends? Because, like, you're real cool.

If you slid into my DMs, I'd be like, Bec wants to be my friend. Yes, queen. I'll try that. All right. Well, we can be friends now. Okay. Winner. Sick.

But I guess I do this as well. I feel like TikTok's worse for me because it's like, video content I feel like it's more interactive and also I'm really impulsive but I see people with things and I go oh I'd love that handbag or I'd love that top or I'd do this or I'd do that and I find myself either clicking their like link in bios and finding out where it's from and you know putting it on a wish list or even worse like actually purchasing it immediately without putting 24 hours between me and my spending or I just get this idea in my head that that's something I need yeah and it's like it's not and I just look at it and go even this influencer they probably don't

even care about that product it could have just been sent to them and I find myself consistently comparing but also just feeling really overwhelmed by it and going well why do I want that like and sometimes it'll be like late at night and I've made this little wish list and then the next day I'm at work and I'm like oh I better open my notes app and you know just drop something down really quickly and I see something and I go why is that in there like why did I have in my head in that moment, that that was something I absolutely needed. And I think, you know, obviously we are really different and what motivates us and excites us and how we get our energy is going to be really different. Let's say that you and I are both on the journey to buying a new car, but our path to

that or what makes that look likely for us is going to be really different. Like your values to begin with about what car and your savings patterns and your plans and, you know, what you're going to use your car for are going to be very, very different to mine. And I think that our obsession with social media makes us feel this more acutely. Like the danger of comparing ourselves to others is that I guess comparisons are never fair. You never see the full picture, right? Like the amount of times I have been sent posts by my girlfriends being like, oh my God, this bag is so cute that that influencer has. And I will reply and be like, yep, they probably got sent it or it was probably free. Like there's no way that they would pay

$5,000 for that. They are just promoting it or, oh, this car's really cool. I can't believe she achieved that. And I'm like, yep, that's a brand new car with a big red bow on it and looks fantastic. But like, I'm pretty sure that would be all financed. Like that's going to be on debt. There's no way that she's buying a $60,000 car in cash. Like, you know, you think back at 12 months. And I go, no, that doesn't make sense for their financial situation. But we don't have that light in those moments. You only see like the highlights reel, I suppose. And while every single one of us is unique and, you know, things happen and it might not be true, I think by comparing ourselves to the journey of others, we're really negating our own road and we're

demanding that the past be different to what it actually is instead of honoring who we were and honoring past us and, you know, stepping up and being that human being that past us needs us to be. We're just putting ourselves behind and the demand we place on ourselves to be like those people that we actually compare ourselves to might actually be motivation for change. And that could be a good thing, but like, why are you changing? Is this actually leading to more feelings of like diminished self-worth when you're trying to be somebody else instead of just who you were meant to be yes so true like oh it makes me very angry yeah that's fair especially when I see people and they're comparing themselves it's less about me and more about like I hate that other people go

through this because I know what that looks like yeah like I still do it don't get me wrong but I feel like I might have stepped a little bit beyond that but then I can also really see that happening to my friends or that happening to other people around me or people in our community and I go, stop it. Like you're perfect the way that you are. Yes. We're all where we're meant to be right here. Isn't that so true? Oh my gosh, look at my phone case. What does it say? You're exactly where you need to be. I love that. Yeah. And I think it's really important to consistently remind yourself of that because you are exactly where you need to be, whether it feels that way or not. Like, you know how many times you felt, oh, I'm not meant to be here. Like this is the

worst ever. And then something around the corner happens and you go, that makes sense as to why in that position or that mental space or whatever it was. So I could appreciate this. Totally. I do also just want to say that this is a very privileged way to think. Sometimes we are not always in a really good or safe or healthy place. And to say like we are where we need to be doesn't necessarily fit every single mold. But however, still, I feel like the entire message of this episode is still relevant to those people as well. I think embracing it for change is important. Yeah, I agree.

If you're in a really shitty position right now, let's be honest, I don't want you to be there. You know, if we can reframe it and go, all right, well, we want to get you out of that, this is going to be a pivotal point in your life that I know at some point you're not going to say, I really wish that that never happened. You're going to go, that was really shitty. It was never a nice time, but it's made me who I am today.

Like, and I think that we need to pivot our mindset as well and go, you know what, people say there's so many awful things that happen in the world, right? And like, I would never say that blanket about everything, but I think if you can even change your mindset, that is going to help you get to a better place faster. Completely agree, V. I remember last year we were talking about keeping up with the Joneses and we had some stats on what privilege looks like on a global stage. So this is good.

I know where you're going with this. Yes. Do you mind if I rattle off a couple? You're just going to like humble us. Go. Yeah. I mean, basically, we found that if you have a roof over your head, three meals a day, access to running water, and you make more than $40,000 a year, you are in the top 1%

of the world in terms of the median annual household income. Isn't that insane? It is. And so many times we're like, oh, I'm broke. I'm this, I'm that. No, you're not. I hate when people use those terms of reference when they're not. If you're actually broke, you can talk about it.

I want to hear it. I want to help you. I want to be on that journey. I do not want to hear people saying I'm broke, knowing full well they have $10,000 in their savings account for an emergency fund. Like that just makes me so frustrated because it takes away from the gravity of that situation. Like if you are broke, that's really frigging hard. Like Beck, you've been there. It's overwhelming. It must be frustrating when other people come along and go, yeah, me too. And you're like, it's a bit different though, isn't it? It is a bit funny when I'm like, oh, I've got literally $7 till payday and people are like, oh, same. I don't want to dip into my savings. I'm

like, ah. See, that's where we differ, my friends. Yes, exactly. What are savings? Exactly. What does that mean? Oh, yeah. So we found during that research that the world median household income was $9,733. Wow. Okay. Okay. So like that's, I mean, good and bad. It just puts in context as well that when we're talking about this, oh my God, did you see on social media such and such got a handbag or I've been thinking about a new car and you know, haha, I'm broke. I have $7 in my account, but like, I just really don't want to dip into my savings. Like that is so privileged and it's okay. I'm not calling you out. Keep doing it. It's fine. But I think we also need to step back and go, how flipping lucky are we to live in a country where, you know, at the end of

the day, Beck, if you broke your leg, we could fix it for free. That's not going to financially impact you. Like you are in a world that supports you and that's not a privilege that is extended to the entire population of this world. I think we're really lucky. Totally agree V. We were like discussing before how different we kind of all are. Would be fair to say too that we'd all have different levels of comfort when it comes to like being in debt. A hundred percent. And I think it really plays into your education levels as well, right? Like you've been in debt, I have been in debt. And at the time that I got in debt, I had no idea what that really meant. I feel like I had some blinkers on and I was kind of like, well, this will be fine. I was paid off. Right. I'm

sure that when you were doing it, you're like, this is fine. Like I'll work it out later. Right. Like you just don't go into it going, this could impact my entire life. Cause if I had sat you down and said at the time, Hey Beck, so the decisions that you're making, they're really going to F you up. Yeah, totally. It's going to put you in a really shitty position. I don't think you would have consented I think you would have been like hold up hold up hold up no I don't want whatever you're talking about no thank you no thank you like and I mean sometimes it's completely unavoidable right like I know you've shared a lot of your debt journey on here and it's not as though you were just frivolous and went and spent a whole heap of money on designer shit that you didn't

need that wasn't your story like yours was out of genuine need but even out of genuine need you didn't have the level of financial literacy to go, well, actually, how could I structure this? Maybe I could X, Y, and Z. Like you just didn't have that. So I think you never really know what's going on for somebody. So you cannot judge their situation. And when we say, oh, what's your risk to taking on debt? Like I am at current in more debt than I have ever been in my entire life, Bec. And I am so grateful I am because it is good debt. Like it's for mortgages, for the properties that I own. And I am so grateful for that. But that is a very different, very educated decision. And I remember getting those mortgages and being so scared of getting them because it was so much

to undertake. But on the flip side, I was not fearful at all when I took on 40 plus thousand dollars worth of personal debt, which was actually even more detrimental to my financial well-being. So like, I just didn't know what I didn't know. And you wouldn't either. And I guess you've got no idea what somebody else's financial situation or financial literacy levels are. Maybe they're in epic amounts of debt, but that's like really normal to them. And they actually grew up in a debt cycle. So they actually feel really comfy with that. And they're just happy with what's going on. Does that mean that's going to be okay for you? Well, maybe it is, but likely it's not. And I think that that's where you need to go. Well, your journey is not my journey. And that's

actually a really beautiful thing. Yeah, I completely agree. This kind of reminds me, Yeah. Do you remember that old saying, money doesn't buy happiness? Yeah, I want to put that in the bin. I mean, yes, I completely agree. But you know what money does do? It brings some level of financial security. And you know what? It also can take it away. So I guess being in debt because you've bought too much stuff or made a decision that compromises yourself is not great. But I think that we need to remember that the saying money doesn't buy happiness. I've never heard someone who's broke or in debt say that. 100%.

Like I've literally never heard it come out of the mouth of somebody who's financially struggling. Yes. Oh, V, don't worry. Money doesn't buy happiness. Do you know what it can buy? Dinner. Do you know what it can buy?

Electricity. It can pay your water bill. It can do so much. And do you know what that does? It takes stress off and people who are less stressed are happier. Yeah. So like I agree, the old saying money doesn't buy happiness because it's not about the fancy things.

It's about basic needs. There's a level, I reckon, where we need to all earn X. and I mean, this is scientifically proven. It's a household income of about $85,000 total. And if you meet that, more money doesn't contribute to higher levels of happiness. That makes sense. If you are broke or in debt or financially struggling, I'd be pretty happy to find 50 bucks on the ground. Yeah, I completely agree. At the very least, it will take away your anxiety leaving space for happiness. Exactly. But V, I think this is a really good time to go to a really quick break. And on the flip side, we're going to give you some tips to help combat comparison

culture. I love this. Don't go anywhere. Okay, we are back. And V, what can we do if comparison culture is breaking us and sending us broke? There's heaps you can do. And I bet right now you're thinking, no, there's not V. But there is. I've made a whole list. We know how much I love a list. Believe it when I see it. All right. Well, take my little notes off me and I can have you read it out. All right. So first thing I've written down is we really need to remind ourselves that our self-worth is not based on our behaviors or what we have or don't have. Though it's quite all right to admire, you know, your colleague's wardrobe or like Beck's brand new shoes or a friend's job. Our admiration should stop there. Like, oh wow, they're nice,

Beck. Congrats. You must love them. Full stop, end of story. Once we cross into comparing our own wardrobe or our job to their job, we kind of enter a really dangerous zone that might actually result in us feeling like trash about ourselves. Yeah. Like Beck has such nice shoes. Oh, my shoes are not so good. I'm distilling it down really simply. And you might go, V, that's such a stereotypical example, but I know, you know what I mean? I know. Like it could be anything. I've then written down, we need to use those feelings of insecurity, anxiety, or jealousy to center into ourselves and see what it is that we actually want. Like why Beck, are you feeling like that often those feelings are there as triggers that make us want to change

something in ourselves deeply it might be you're actually not very happy with your job and you need to look for a new job it's not Beck's job that you want in fact like you probably won't even like it like you have such different values like if I am unhappy in my job I might look at you Beck and go far out she loves her job maybe I should do what Beck does like she just looks so happy what you need to do is spend a little bit more time with yourself and work out what that is. Like whatever it is, have a think about it because I promise you spending money to get into the same position as somebody else because you see their happiness, it's not going to change anything, sadly. Next, you're not going to be surprised with number three. I've written down celebrate your achievements.

I think it's really important, Bec, to take time to appreciate your milestones, like not through social media not through like posting a cute post or spending money but like in a meaningful way and doing something that nourishes you and you go wow I'm really proud of that it could be as silly as writing yourself a letter like write past you a letter of how proud you are of how far you've gotten I promise when you sit down you feel like a bit of a nafty doing it you'll be like this is so lame at the end of it you'll be like I'm so proud of me like you don't even have to show anyone. You could rip it up or burn it, like hide it. Yeah, that's a really sweet idea. The next is practice mindfulness. I think this is really important. You are really

good at this. So maybe you've got some hot tips and tricks at some point for us on how to be more mindful. I mean, your version of mindfulness is literally rolling around in grass, listening to meditations, but like I will take your tips because you're hella happy. And then I've written down implement healthier behaviors and boundaries around social media. I genuinely believe that you should be unfollowing and muting things that make you feel bad or that you see and you just get a pang of anxiety or guilt. Yeah. This is probably not something I want to say publicly,

but I'm going to do it anyway. Okay, I'm scared. I have heaps of people that I follow that I have muted. Yeah. I don't want to unfollow you. I'm not rude. Like, I like you as a human being. Don't want to see your stuff.

Yeah. It just doesn't help me live my best life. I always feel not amazing about seeing it or it annoys me or something. The mute functionality is great. Don't have to tell you I unfollowed you. no one knows. Now people that I follow are going to be like, is that me? Probably. But people are monetizing your attention, Bec. That is worth something, whether it's on social media or if it's on TV. So I think that we really need to make sure that they're working hard for your money and

making you feel good, inspired and super motivated. And then I guess the last thing I do want to add in there, Bec, we touched on it before as privilege, obviously, but if you're in financial trouble speak to someone like raise your hand like it is not embarrassing you are not behind your financial position does not dictate whether you are a good or a bad human being some of my favorite people in this entire world are broke as hell and some of the people that I have met through my journey as an ex-financial advisor to ultra wealthy people give me the biggest dick in the entire world. Your personality and who you are as a human being is not made up by money, is not made up by how wealthy you are, how much money you've got in the bank or how good

you are with it. It's actually who you are as a human being. And I think so often we tie our self-worth to our net worth. Yes. And that makes no sense. Like, have you ever looked at someone and been like, they earn $50,000. They look like they've got 15K in the bank. I want to be their friend. Yeah, no one does that, right? Like, I want to be friends with you because you're cool and you're kind and you're nice and you're kind of funny. Like, that's what I want to surround myself with. And I think that if you're in financial trouble, it is so easy to bury your head in the sand because you feel like it's a reflection of you. And it's not. It's just a situation you've found yourself in. Like, you're not debt. You're just someone experiencing it and

you can get out of it. That's cool. Like, let's work on that. So speak to your banks, consolidate your debts, call the National Debt Helpline, who we talk about all the time and we adore. But I think it's just, it's so important to remember that is not a reflection of who you are. And Bec, this has been you before. Would you recommend reaching out for help? Yeah, definitely. And it's like a good thing to remember that the person you're speaking to, the people that you're reaching out to have probably seen this before, if not worse situations than what you're in. It's just whatever, isn't it? It's just money at the end of the day. It's so easy to get into debt, so easy to get out of debt. It's not so easy to get out of debt, but

it's easy to start making a change. Exactly. And I think that you raise a really good point. I think sometimes when we're like, oh my God, I have to call the National Debt Helpline. No, I'm not picking up the phone. Like most of those people work at the National Debt Helpline because they've been impacted by that before. So they like get it properly. You're not calling the CEO of the bank and being like, hi, you're a millionaire. And like, I just don't understand. You're calling someone who's wildly passionate about getting people out of debt. Yeah, exactly. Let them do it. Let them help you. But V, any last points to end the show? I guess something else and is a stereotypical Victoria Devine quote is just, babes, you do you. Like there is nobody quite like you

with your background and your experience and your hopes and your dreams. Just have a think back about our Monday episodes. Like everyone is so different and that's what makes it so beautiful. Like if we're all cookie cutter in the same, like, oh, I'm not going to learn from your experience like our money diarist section of the podcast I'm sorry today's episode that's my favorite because you get to know people on this deep level and they share their experiences so that we can be richer for it physically and like mentally but I think really understanding that your journey is uniquely yours and it doesn't matter what the heck anybody else is doing completely agree there's something really sexy about somebody who just knows who they are yeah

If they're like, I don't need that, you go, wow, I wish I had that conviction. Yeah, I completely agree. I aspire to be like that. That's the only comparison I'll be doing today. But I think this is a really good place to leave it for now. Let's go have a little tea. I love a little tea. Sit in the grass.

Sit in the grass. Teach me how to meditate. Yes, I'll teach you how to meditate. I don't know if I can do that, but, like, I'm willing to try. Everyone can. Have a good week, guys. We will see you on Friday. Bye, guys.

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