She's On The Money - The Last Victim with Tracy Hall

Episode Date: August 2, 2024

In this bonus episode, Victoria sits down with special guest Tracy Hall, who shares her gripping story of finding love, facing deception, and rebuilding her life. After separating from her husband, Tracy joined a dating app and met Max Tavita—a man who seemed perfect. But what started as a hopeful new beginning quickly turned into a nightmare when Tracy discovered 'Max' was actually Hamish McLaren, a notorious conman who swindled her out of $317,000. Join us as Tracy recounts her journey of resilience, offering invaluable lessons on trust and the importance of financial awareness.  Check out Tracy's work here, as well her resource with tips and tricks of avoiding scams, and recommended reading list here. Acknowledgement of Country By Natarsha Bamblett aka Queen Acknowledgements. The advice shared on She's On The Money is general in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's On The Money exists purely for educational purposes and should not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision. If you do choose to buy a financial product, read the PDS, TMD and obtain appropriate financial advice tailored towards your needs.  Victoria Devine and She's On The Money are authorised representatives of Money Sherpa PTY LTD ABN - 321649 27708,  AFSL - 451289.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hello, my name is Natasha Nabanunga-Bamblett. I'm a proud Yorta Yorta, Kernai, Wolperi and Awadjeri woman. And before we get started on She's on the Money podcast, I would like to acknowledge the traditional custodians of the land of which this podcast is recorded on Awadjeri country, acknowledging the elders, the ancestors and the next generation coming through. As this podcast is about connecting, empowering, knowledge sharing and the storytelling of you to make a difference for today and lasting impact for tomorrow. Let's get into it. She's on the money. She's on the money.

Hello and welcome to a very different episode of She's on the Money. I'm Victoria Devine and I usually bring you all the info, tips and tricks to educate you and set you on your journey towards financial independence. But sometimes, even with all the knowledge in the world and the know-how and the emergency fund and the investment portfolio, things just don't go to plan. This is exactly what happened to Tracey Hall. In 2016, Tracey signed up to a little dating app after separating from her husband. This is where she met Max Tevita. Max was a great listener, adventurous, and came into her life at exactly the right time. That was until one day in 2017.

She missed a call from Max. When she called back, no answer. The pair usually spoke several times a day. And when she didn't hear from him, she grew really worried and called the police to do a welfare check on him. After she placed the call, she received a message from a friend telling her to check out a link to a video and call her straight away. That moment is when Tracey's life turned upside down. Tracey, hello.

Hi, Vic. Tracey's joined us in the studio to share her story. Welcome to She's On The Money. Thank you for having me. I am low-key very excited about this story because it's a little bit of a different twist on She's On The Money, but let's start at the very start. How'd you meet Max? Like you said, I had separated from my husband about a year before and I decided that I was ready to meet someone. I wanted some companionship in my life, someone to do the things that I like doing with similar interests and values and morals. And so I decided to go on the dating apps.

I met my husband on a dating app. So like there are some good stories on that where you're a bit nerdy, like coming out of a marriage and going on a dating app. Yeah, because when I met my husband, dating apps didn't exist. No, it would have been a new world. Yeah, it was a whole new world. And obviously I was in my early 40s. So it was just a bit... You don't look like you're in your early 40s. Well, I'm in my late 40s now. You on a dating app. You would have been hot property, I reckon. Did you go on a few dates

before meeting Max? A few. Yeah, a few. It was fun. I mean, it was slim pickings and it's a bit of a jungle. It's wild out there. It is pretty crazy. And my friends and I had, you know, we got some great content. We had a few laughs and, you know, they were following along my journey. But I guess I knew that. Yeah, I did. You know, I knew that I wasn't going to meet some great guy, you know, if I was sitting in front of my TV on a Monday night. So it was the only way I was going to meet someone and I swiped right on Max and he looked pretty normal compared to some of the other men out there. Good looking guy, go out for a little drink. Yeah, he had a beautiful smile and blue eyes and his photos were just things he liked doing like surfing and running and paddleboarding and things

like that. So I just thought he looked pretty normal. Sounds like a dream boat. So that's what drew you to him? Like you went on a date. How did it go after that? Well, it took us a while to go on a date because I sort of was on a limited schedule because I was a single mom and we went on a date. we went for dinner and it was pretty low key. It was not a very long dinner. He didn't really drink. I was working really long hours at the time and I was quite tired. I think I yawned at one point. Oh my God. Which is awful. No, it is what it is. Awful behavior. But he said, oh, you look really tired. I'll get you home. And he was just really caring and he was a great listener. He was very engaging. He was funny, kind of like an Aussie larrikin in a way. We

had a similar upbringing in Australia, so we had a lot in common. It sounds like a dream so far. like it was pretty I mean as far as first dates went it was pretty good yeah no good he got you home you were tired amazing yeah were there any red flags at all I mean throughout the time we dated yes of course but no like in the initial because I feel like I'm the kind of girl like I went on a few dates before meeting Steve and like there'd be red flags that weren't even real red flags I just think they were because I you know you're being quite picky at the very start yeah you're watching out for those things like he came to pick me up in the city and he didn't want to double park or park in a no parking zone and come in and meet the friend I was having a drink with

after work because of the parking situation but when we got to the restaurant he parked in a no parking zone and he was like it doesn't matter I'll just pay the fine I was like yeah but 10 minutes ago like this in my head I'm like 10 minutes ago you didn't even want to come in and meet my friend oh that's really weird so it was just weird but at the time you know things move on really quickly and you're just kind of like people do weird things anyway like I would do things on a first date that people might think is strange and sometimes I'm just weird like you've got to balance it up everyone's got their own quirks right 100% so you go all right moving on and I was like it's your car it's your license it's your money that's really if you want to

see if it's okay sir like it must be nice yeah so all of it was going really well you were dating for a while obviously you know there are some red flags but nothing to kind of like draw so much attention that you need to like get a private investigator on your new boyfriend. I didn't suspect anything, no. No, of course not. And then you got a missed call. You'd flown back from a trip to Byron Bay and he was driving back down. But after you received the missed call from him, you didn't hear from him again. What happened that day? Well, this was nearly 18 months after we first started going out and I spent the whole day trying to get in touch with him and there was no answer. And I started to get really worried and spent the night

looking for people he knew, his family, trying to get in touch with him. And I woke up super early the next morning and I called Bondi police because I hadn't heard from him. And I asked him to do a wellness. Yeah, I would have too. It's 18 months. I know that if you're like 20, 18 months feels like forever. But when you're a single mum as well, that's a serious relationship. It was a serious relationship. We were very close. We were very intimate and we'd just been away for a weekend. It was just very, very unusual. We spoke multiple times a day, like either text or WhatsApp or whatever. And I didn't hear from him. So I asked Bondi police to do a wellness check on him, gave them all the details of him. And in the meantime, I received

a call from a girlfriend of mine and she said, how are you? And I said, haven't slept a wink. Something's happened to Max. I'm really worried. I don't know what's happened. I haven't heard from him. And she said, I'm going to send you a link. And I said, oh my God, he's dead. There's been an accident. He's died. He's a car accident link or something like that, right? Yeah, or like a attack or he's been like something's happened while he's been surfing. Oh my God, I would have felt so sick. I felt ill and she said, he's not dead. Just open the link and call me straight back. And I opened the link and it was the video of him being arrested outside of his apartment and his face was all blurred out. But of course I knew it was his body. Yeah. And you know his

apartment, you've been there. I knew it was him. And that's when the world turned upside down for me. That's insane. So when you saw that video and you finally saw a Crime Stoppers video and realized that was your boyfriend, were you like, what the hell? Obviously you had no idea. What's he being arrested for? Like what conclusions did you jump to at that point? Well, the headlines were, you know, Bondi businessman, 47 superannuation fraud with these types of broad headlines. And I was like, but that it's, this must be something wrong because Max is 42. You You know, these were the weird things that were going on in my head because I was like, well, he's –

They're wrong. Like they'll release him at some point. How dramatic. Yeah, just so bizarre. And I called back Bondi Police and I said, you don't need to do a wellness check. The man that lives at that address has been arrested. And they said, yes, we know.

But the person who lives there, his age, everything about that man is not the man who lives at that address. And I said, but it is because – It's not who you're looking for, Tracy. Yeah, and he said – the policeman said, it's not that person. It's a different person. I said, well, who is it? what's it's you know what's his name and they said you need to deal with the investigators that

are on the case and they couldn't tell you any information so you've just found out that your boyfriend isn't who you thought he was and you're on the phone to someone who's like yeah also Tracy I'm not telling you you can go find out from someone else yeah I mean it's kind of a legal case at that point so you know you understand but at the same time you're shell-shocked yeah my brain was just going crazy and then not long after I received a text from his brother-in-law who I'd been trying to get in touch with. And it said in the text, Tracy called me on this number urgently, Chris, and in brackets, he wrote Hamish's brother-in-law. And I called him immediately and I said, Chris, who the fuck is Hamish? And he said, Hamish McLaren. And I said,

well, who is Max Tevita? What is going on? I've never heard of Hamish. No. And of course, armed with his real name, I could look on the internet and find out everything about him. Oh my God. This is wild. And I know it actually gets juicier. So let's go to a really quick break. And on the flip side, we're going to hear more about Tracey's gut-wrenching story. Welcome back to today's very special and very different episode of She's On The Money with our very special guest, Tracey Hall. Now, Tracey, after a call to the police asking for a welfare check on your boyfriend, finding out that he wasn't who he said he was, you've got this video of your boyfriend being arrested, you got a text message from a brother-in-law stating that your

boyfriend's name was actually Hamish and not Max. Where's your head at? I don't know. It was doing circles. And I then had a conversation with the investigators who were working on the case who could confirm that Max DeVito was in fact Hamish McLaren. And he had defrauded multiple people out of a lot of money and that I needed to get to the police station immediately. Now, if somebody called me and said, Victoria, your husband has defrauded multiple people, I would deny till I die. Like, I'd immediately be like, absolutely not. Like, that is not the person I know.

That is not what happened. Like, I would die on that hill. Like, I just unequivocally know that I would immediately go, I don't know. Faced with some proof, I think I'd just be in a whirlwind of confusion. What did you do next? I was in a cafe with a girlfriend, my head was spinning, and I was looking up who Hamish McLaren was on the internet. And prior to even this case and this arrest, there was a lot of misconduct over a long period of time. And there had been a lot written about him. And so armed

with his name, I could look at these articles on the internet and start to realize pretty quickly that I was dealing with something way worse than what I originally thought and so that's when I just went straight to the detectives and I sat down with them and they explained things to me very broadly like I didn't know how many victims there were I didn't know how much money but they asked me to gather all of my information and I literally had to put together nearly 18 months of my life that had happened every statement every email every whatsapp message Yeah, every memory, every document he'd ever provided me, everything. And I had to work with them over the next ensuing weeks to kind of put together that puzzle and explain to them how

Hamish had sort of deceived me. And that's when I started to realize that he had stolen my life savings. He'd stolen $317,000 of your money. Is that right? Yeah, everything. Absolutely everything. how was your mental health throughout this because I can just imagine being told as I said before I'd be denied till I die but then you get like confronted with some facts yeah and I feel like you have to flip the narrative and go hold on I think these guys are correct did you hear from Hamish slash Max yeah I did he had called me from jail a few times and then he sent me some letters that was in sort of the two to six months after he was arrested so that went on for quite a while, but I pretty quickly realized that I was never going to get the truth from him. It was all

just a, I don't know, like a $317,000 carrot that he was dangling in front of my face to get me to go and see him. And I was never going to see that money again. I was never going to get the truth from him. So I decided never to do that. Yeah. And I think you sound so level-headed, like you sound so well-rounded talking about this. Cause I think I would have gone into a spin. like if you've got $317,000 of my money, I'll go see you. I'll work it out. Like how did you work out what to do? And it sounds like you've done absolutely everything right. I'd be the person that did it wrong. Like I would be going to jail and being like, what did you do? Please tell me. And like probably believing parts of it. I was so tempted because of course I was thinking

that maybe there's just a way that I can get a piece of information or he can tell me how to get my money back. It was so tempting, of course. But I mean, I just had to look at the facts and look at the past 16 months of my life and my relationship with him and know very quickly that everything was just a lie, that why would he suddenly start telling me the truth? And I just had to work with what I had. I had to face the facts. I was kind of dealing with this sort of dual thing. So there was like all of the very practical things that I had to do, working with the police, untangling a non-compliant superannuation fund, looking at a tax refund that may or may not have been fraudulent, you know, pulling together all

of this information. And then of course I had all of the very emotional things to deal with, which was essentially this man that I'd been in love with. I had to fall out of love with him in, in like a hot minute, like less than 24 hours. And it was like a death. So I was grieving a relationship, but then I felt bad for grieving a relationship because he was a con man and it wasn't a real relationship. And then of course I had my daughter to like life just had to carry on and I had a job and I thank my lucky stars that I had that job because it is what pulled me out. And I thank my lucky stars I had my daughter because she's what pulled me out as well. My God. So you're $317,000 down. I'm an ex-financial advisor and this just sends me

into a spin. I know that Hamish McLaren is responsible for stealing millions of dollars from people, but even to get your hands on $317,000, how did that eventuate? Because you are a smart woman. You've clearly got your head screwed on. And to be honest, you're dealing with this at this point way better than I ever would have. So how does he get his dirty little mitts on your money? It was the way I explain it. It's like he created a movie. So he created this life over a period of 18 months or nearly 18 months where there were sets, there were scenes, there were characters that he created to present himself as a chief financial investment officer for a family office. I overheard conversations. There were the Bloomberg monitors. There were

the fake reports. There were the investment accounts. He set this whole world up for me to believe that he was who he actually was. And this is what coercive control and grooming looks like in this situation? And by the time it got to sort of a year down the track and he was asking me about my superannuation and what I was doing and how much I was paying in fees, everything that he had said to me previously was lining up. And I thought he was the perfect person to help me invest my money. Why wouldn't he be? Exactly. And it's kind of like, if someone says to me, I've worked in marketing for 25 years. Someone says to me, they've got a small business and they go, you know, I need a bit of help with this or what would you do here? People would listen to

me because, you know, the difference is I don't have an ill intent, but he presented himself as someone who wanted to help me be more financially independent. This was his line of work. I'd overheard countless conversations. So by the time we got to that point, there was not a shadow of a doubt in my mind that he was the right person to do that. So he convinced me to set up a self-managed super fund and he groomed me through that whole process. And I took my 22 year career super annuation savings and funds into out of my fund and into a self-managed super fund. And then there were some other things like shares and I'd worked for tech for a long time, US tech companies. And he had every commentary about, you know, Trump's antics and how that was going to impact the US

economy. And that's why I should take my shares out right now and do this. So he just groomed me through the whole process really. And I trusted him. I loved him. I thought we're building a future together. Why wouldn't I? I didn't suspect anything. And that's how, in the end, how he got my life savings. And it's one of those things where so many people will think that could never happen to me. Like they get on their high horses and say, nah, like that's so dumb. Like how could she believe that? But I'm not saying it's easy, but those things make sense. Like if you've got a couple of hundred thousand dollars, even if you Google it, you go, what should I do with a self-managed super fund. Basically, everything he would have been telling you, you could have

looked up and been like, okay, well, that seems like a logical step, like a self-managed super fund. Yep, I get a little bit more control. I get to do A, B, C, and D. All right, no worries. What are you doing with my shares? Okay. The dude has a Bloomberg monitor up and you're seeing this. I think that the best description that you've given it is like that movie. You're setting all these scenes so that you remember them historically and that just plays into that level of trust you have for this individual it's manipulative it's gaslighting but on steroids yes like to me this definitely could happen to you can you tell me before we get into I guess how to avoid it can you talk me through what that fallout has been like for you because your life savings are gone

yeah so of course I lost all of my life savings I ended up in a position in my early 40s where I just had my monthly income I'm on my own I'm a single mom I had no backstop at home so I just had to double down and it's not lost on me that I had an incredible job and I'm so grateful for that and I always say to women especially in all the seasons of our lives just try and have your own income try and hold on to work try and work you know and that gives you choices it gives you options it gives you some freedoms and and thank god I had that so you know obviously the financial piece was one thing so I had to work out really quickly how I was going to rebuild financially and my future is going to look very different to what it otherwise would have.

But I worked with a financial advisor, a registered financial advisor. One you could look up on ASIC and actually say. And I did. I did all my due diligence around the person I chose and she's wonderful. And we essentially visioned my life and she said, what do you want your life to look like in two, five and ten years time? And we wrote it up on a whiteboard and she, you know, figuratively held my hand and she said, you're going to be okay.

What an angel. also what a step for you to make I feel like so many people would have buried their heads in the sand and like not trusted a thing that this woman was saying yeah but I had to because my brain was not working because I was in grief I was in shock I was in shame and embarrassment and guilt and all of those things and I was working really hard because I couldn't lose my job so all of these things coupled together I knew I had to get some support and she was one of the people that that helped me through that. And she's still my financial advisor today. I love that. A lifetime relationship moving forward. I love her. And she's just, you know, my right hand person when it comes

to rebuilding my finances and asking any questions and dotting all the I's and crossing all the T's. I'm pretty disciplined. I'm pretty rigorous. And I just do what we say we're going to do. I know she just says that to me. I wish we'd met when I was a financial advisor. Yeah. So that was the fallout financially. But I do believe that if you have the right mindset, the right work ethic you know just the right energy about you you can always make money I love this I do believe that you've like not only rebuilt but you're like hey I started from scratch again in my 40s yeah I was on the starting line what an inspiring story yeah in isolation it's possible also to have been completely screwed over like well there was the emotional side that

was there's a lot of therapy that I think that you're going to need to be in for for a little while yet. There's a lot. The emotional side is hardest because money you can make, but learning to trust yourself and building your own self-confidence back and thinking about the world in a different way to what you always have, having that within you again, and that's been the hardest. Can we talk a little bit more about red flags? So at the start, you didn't really have any. And I mean, we trust people implicitly. Like I know I've got girlfriends who write people off when they're dating them because, you know, they walk funny or they said something funny or they held their fork the wrong way.

Like as women, we do some pretty rogue things while dating and red flags can often be really red, like full crimson, or we might categorise them as red flags when they're really just us getting the ick. Beige. Yeah, they're beige flags. But were there red flags along the way that in hindsight you look at and go, I wish that I had delved a bit deeper into that?

Yeah. I think it's funny, the conversation around red flags, because it makes you feel like you should have seen them. No, you shouldn't have. They're actually invisible flags, right? At the time they're invisible and it's not until you're in retrospect that you can look at them. But the red flags, I mean, definitely he was quirky. Like the stories, when you put them all together, even though they came in drips and jabs throughout the whole relationship, when I recount those stories in full, they're crazy. Like, oh my god like I can't believe I believe them but that's the way grooming and coercive control works things come it's like death by a thousand cuts right but the big things were around you know

when he presented me with these ideas about you know investments and things like that I'm not ashamed to admit that I didn't think critically enough I trusted him I believed he had my best interests at heart but what I've realized is that you know your money and your heart are the most important things you can protect. And I probably didn't have as much agency as I do now around my money. And what I like to encourage in telling this story is like, especially for women, just lean in harder because it's not always easy. It's not always accessible. Sometimes it is hard, but it's harder losing your life savings and having to start again at 40. So learn it. And this is why I love what you do, Vee, is like educating people around financial wellness,

financial advocacy and you know resilience all of those things that that you're encouraging the female community that you have to to lean into I probably didn't think critically enough about them you know and I don't think I could have critically thought my way out of the fact the man that was spooning me at night was also plotting to destroy me but and I think that's the wildest thing I think we assume that we'd be able to see these things coming and like when I asked you about red flags, I actually assumed you'd be like, no, not really. Cause like, you know, it was so choreographed that when it came up, well, why would that be an issue? Well, he had an answer for everything too, because of course he'd been doing this.

He's a professional. He'd be doing it for 30 years and you do anything for 30 years and you get really good at it. Yeah. You know, and throughout the book, I do use the red flag as a, you know, just as a pullout in real time to go, you know what, if I had really thought about this, I probably would have done a side eye on it or something like that, you know, but of course that's so easy to do in retrospect, but hopefully my lessons can be someone else's lessons in advance. And that's why we're bringing you on the pod and sharing this story. And I think

there is this juxtaposition at play when people are in these circumstances, right? Because unfortunately you're not the first person I've spoken to who has had a partner steal their life savings. Honestly, not to the level of Hamish McLaren. That's very extreme and it is a wild story. Sadly true. But people go through these things and this juxtaposition is at play because you've got the logical and then you've got the emotional. And I am grasping at straws or claiming here that I'm assuming your emotional relationship with him was great. Like you're spooning this man at night like how great is this I've come out of a divorce I've got a child I'm just I'm so happy yeah and when you're in that bubble like why would things look red no and we were planning

on our future together we're looking at property in Byron Bay like he and I were very very close and intimate talking about our future so it didn't feel I didn't suspect anything and it didn't feel like that but of course you know he's working away in the background yeah so I know from our community sadly that most women going through situations of coercive control and grooming they don't realize and then when they come out the other side or someone brings it up or they've realized themselves there's a lot of guilt and shame that they carry around this and it actually has nothing to do with you in a way like these are the actions of somebody else it's got nothing to do with your intelligence or your emotional intelligence or being able to read a situation

like it makes you second guess yourself when you're in these circumstances you're like am I actually the worst judge of character in the entire world like am I cooked like what's going on here but speaking to our community what would you like other victims to know and to feel after hearing your story I think in telling my story I want people to know that doesn't matter how well educated you are, what family you come from, how well traveled you are, how great you think your intuition is. These things can happen to anyone. There's not one thing that someone could say to me about this experience that I haven't already said to myself in the worst possible, most disgusting, degrading way. And that is, I think, a natural reaction. But another part of telling

this story is to release people from their shame. Because if I can tell this story, and what I've realized is a lot of people have come forward to me and said that happened to me or that happened to my parents or I haven't told anyone about this situation an older woman came to me she's 75 she hadn't told anybody that she'd lost her divorce settlement when she was 40 not even her children barely knew she sat across the table crying and you know she said I haven't told anybody and I'm like this poor woman 35 years she's held on to that's a lot and I know that feeling, I held onto mine for just over a year before I started talking about the situation on the podcast, Who the Hell is Hamish? And it wasn't until that moment that I released the shame

because did I want the story to own me or did I want to own the story? And for me, it was important to own the story. And I do know that there were things that I could have done differently, but to be ashamed and embarrassed about that when this is somebody who has clearly taken advantage of your kindness and your empathy and your compassion and your love, then there is nothing to be ashamed about. And I hope that just in telling my story, if anyone else has felt anything similar to this, that they can realize that as well. It's to me, wild that people could abuse that level of trust. Like it makes me feel sick. But the best thing that's come out of this is you are now an advocate for women in situations like this. Like this is now your life's work.

And I mean, it's cost you $317,000. So it was actually a lot more expensive than just going to uni and getting a degree and like going down the career route. So I mean, dramatic from you, but you're in this position where you're kind of releasing these women from these situations. If we have been through this and we're still holding a lot of guilt and shame, or we're just not sure if we're in that situation because financially abusive relationships are really hard to identify and often when I speak to people and you know research tells us they're very hard to identify ourselves because we don't know that that's abuse we don't know that that's somebody grooming us we don't know that we're in a situation where someone's using coercive control

because often it actually looks like them quote trying to look after you caring caring for you It's so nice of him to have come in and, like, set you up and put you in the best possible position. What a great guy. Even when friends and family might identify it and say, Hey, Tracy, did you realize you are going to deny what is going on? Because at the end of the day, you know him, you trust him. They're not the ones that go home with him at night.

They're not the ones that, you know, roll over at 3 a.m. to this, you know, gorgeous man in your bed. Like, what is going on? Yeah. But this is your life's work now. and honestly, I'm glad to have you on my team. But talk to me about what resources exist out there for people who might suspect that they're a victim to a scammer. There are so many resources. So there's scamwatch.gov.au. You can go and research.

The banks are putting out a lot of information at the moment, not only just on scams and fraud, but on financial abuse and coercive control in this space. ASIC have incredible resources on their website where you can look up the financial advisor that you're working with and checking their AFSL. You can tell or you can check whether they are actually qualified to advise you on what they're advising you on. You can see if they've got any red flags against their names. These are all very, very quick lookups. You can do a reverse image search. So, you can put a photo. I love the internet. I love 2024. In some ways, it's fantastic. So, you can check. If I had have done that, then Hamish McLaren would

have shown up on my, it wouldn't have been Max Tavita. But at the same time, why would you be looking up your partner? I know. That's that side of romance fraud. But I mean, there are just so many resources that you can, you know, look at. There are domain URL lookups. So if you get what you think might be a dodgy email about a BSB account number or something, you can look at the extension of the domain, put it in and see when that domain has been set up. You can see what country that domain is registered in. If it's a Caribbean country, you know, somewhere where there's no tax, you could probably assume that it's a bit dodgy. And these are some really easy things you

can do. I've got them all listed on my website. We will be putting your website in our show notes and people can go straight there with you because it's also a fantastic website learning more about your story, about what's going on. I mean, Tracey, at the end of the day, I am grateful to have you on the podcast. But the reason you've come on the podcast is because you're doing the media rounds. Yes. Because you have written a book. Yes. Tell us about that. Well, the book is called The Last Victim. And I think as we've sort of had in this conversation, it's such a nuanced story. It's so detailed. And I felt that I needed 80,000 words to describe the insidious nature of this type of fraud so that people could really understand

and try and learn from it. So I wrote a book. It's called The Last Victim. It's about my time before, during and after my relationship with Hamish. You know, it is not just a sad Sally story. It's juicy. It's juicy. It's got humor. And the final part of the book is really about how do you rebuild your life after something really traumatic happens? And you don't have to lose your life savings to a con man in the way that I did, but we're all going to go through things. We're all going to have our challenges and that's where the human spirit really has to lift and we have to kind of find a way through. So I talk about how I did that as well. I am obsessed with this book. Everyone on my podcast already knows I'm a true crime girl.

like I don't want to tell people this but like they know that I go to bed at night listening to crime podcasts right I feel like that is a reflection of my instability but we can have that conversation another day my favorite thing is true crime so when this who the hell is Hamish podcast started coming out I was obsessed and I remember hearing you and being like she's so well spoken like obviously I never met you I didn't know your story at that time like that was the first piece of content that you existed in and I just remember going wow like as a finance at the time I was an advisor I was like this guy took her for a ride like how did it feel having content like that come out and you being a part of it but it not being your story like I just love that

you've taken it and made it positive yeah because how did it feel having stuff like that come out because it's obviously not the positive story about you that your book is no and that's why I wanted to write the book as well because the podcast was about Hamish and uncovering the life of Hamish and all of the things he'd done that were both included in the case that was investigated in Australia, but as well as his global shenanigans, should we say. Yeah. Because this guy didn't just like defraud a couple of people here in Australia. No. This guy went global. There's a lot that has been said about that. So in essence, the podcast was about Hamish and what he had done and uncovering all of that and being a part of that I was really probably scared to do in the beginning because I

was so ashamed and embarrassed about what had happened but then realized that if in telling my story I could help someone else or uncover more of what had happened then that was going to be positive and then of course it took off like no tomorrow and then you know the book off the back of that is really my story and yes Hamish is a part of my story he's not the only thing that's ever happened to me. It won't be the last tricky thing that I go through in my life. So it's just a part of it. But I really wanted to use the opportunity to educate women, especially about this type of fraud and scams and fraud more generally, because it's everywhere right now. And I think we work so hard for our money and we've got to hold on to it.

We're already behind. As women, we're already behind. I think my favorite thing about your book is like it's awesome it's inspiring but obviously this was so significant and to be allowed to delve into your life like to know what life was like before what life was like during and now how you've rebuilt yourself I think that we can all take a leaf out of that book and just go wow if she can do it anyone can and I think you were saying at the start of this episode like we can all make money like we can all put ourselves in the best possible position like we just have to pull our fingers out. And we talk a lot on this podcast about people having their heads in the sand about finance because it is overwhelming. It is really scary. This stuff is going to stay

scary until you become educated. Tracey, what's life like today? You've started to rebuild. How's your daughter? She's great because she's 14. So that's good times. But she's fantastic. and yeah, life is busy. There's a lot of sport. There's a lot of activities. I am doing this full time. So I'm working with corporates and writing workshops for retirees to help protect them against scams and fraud when it comes to technology. So I am just delving deep into this world and working with banks and government on advocacy. Yeah, I'm loving it. So life is busy. Someone could have just come along and helped you sweep it under a rug and rebuild again. and you're like, I see that. It doesn't define me, but I found a purpose and I'm going to put

so many people in a better position because of my, like, I'm obsessed. Yeah. And it is, it's very purposeful. And I think sometimes we strive our whole lives to find our purpose. And when you've worked in corporate a long time, that doesn't always kind of correlate. And now I'm in a place where I can use all the skills I've built over my 25 your career and put it to good use and hopefully help people and help make sure this doesn't happen to anyone else. I'm obsessed. I have so much gratitude for you and the work that you're doing in this space because it is so essential. I know that I'm really quickly running out of time with you. I have one last question. It's a little bit pervy. Oh, okay. Will you ever get back on the

dating apps? Never back on the dating apps. No. You're like, absolutely not. That didn't work out for me the first time. Scarred for life. Scarred for life. I think there are, you know, some things I am happy to try again, but definitely not that. But no, I do have a beautiful man in my life. He's amazing. I've known him for 24 years. Oh, I love this. We could do a proper ID check, police check, get through all of that. 100 points of ID. Yeah. No, I've known him for a long time and we were sort of besties when all of this happened. Oh my gosh. Yeah. But anyway, so yes. Isn't it funny how the world works out? It's just the universe is just finally delivering.

I love this. Thank you, universe. And thank you, Tracy. This story is honestly so trash, but you have changed it into something that is awe-inspiring. And I'm just so proud to get to say that I know you and we are backing absolutely everything that you do. Guys, if you haven't read it yet, The Last Victim is out now and I have got my hands on a few copies.

So we will be announcing on socials how we're going to give those away. but if you want to go and pick one up we will link to tracy's website and where you can purchase it online in the show notes tracy again thank you so much for sharing your story thanks for having me the advice shared on she's on the money is general in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances she's on the money exists purely for educational purposes and should not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision. If you do choose to buy a financial product, read the PDS, TMD and obtain appropriate financial advice tailored towards your needs. Victoria Devine and She's On The Money are authorised representatives of Money

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