She's On The Money - The Truth About HECs Debt: Is It Time to Stop Stressing About It?

Episode Date: January 2, 2025

Is HECs debt the ultimate financial ball and chain, or is it not as bad as it seems? We’re unpacking why some people never pay it off (and why that might be okay), plus tackling a wild money dilemma involving a broken TV and a very awkward friendship moment. This episode has the drama and the money smarts, plus all the usual Friday Drinks fun—don’t miss it! Want to kick off 2025 with your best financial foot forward? Victoria’s Financial Foundations Workshop is packed with all the practical tips and tools you need to take control of your money—without the stress. Head here to save your spot! Acknowledgement of Country By Natarsha Bamblett aka Queen Acknowledgements. The advice shared on She's On The Money is general in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's On The Money exists purely for educational purposes and should not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision. If you do choose to buy a financial product, read the PDS, TMD and obtain appropriate financial advice tailored towards your needs.  Victoria Devine and She's On The Money are authorised representatives of Money Sherpa PTY LTD ABN - 321649 27708,  AFSL - 451289.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hello, my name is Natasha Nabanunga-Bamblett. I'm a proud Yorta Yorta, Kernai, Wolperi and Awadjeri woman. And before we get started on She's on the Money podcast, I would like to acknowledge the traditional custodians of the land of which this podcast is recorded on Awadjeri country, acknowledging the elders, the ancestors and the next generation coming through. As this podcast is about connecting, empowering, knowledge sharing and the storytelling of you to make a difference for today and lasting impact for tomorrow. Let's get into it. She's on the money. She's on the money.

hello and welcome to she's on the money the podcast that makes personal finance fun especially on fridays it is our favorite day of the week because we get our little team together to celebrate you, the incredible She's On The Money community. Miss Jessica Reed, she is going to be sharing her favorite money, wins and confessions from the community. Miss Bex Syed is going to be sharing her broke tips. We're going to be helping to answer a juicy money dilemma, which this week is all about how to work out if you'll have your hex debt forever. And something that you slid into our DMs about, whether you should pay for an accident that happened while you were helping a friend out with something they maybe should have been paying a professional for.

But before we get there, happy new year, new year, new me. Wow, happy new year, guys. How are we feeling? Yeah, it's 2020 Thrive, which is kind of funny because it's only good in audio. So we're going to be using it on the podcast a lot. But if you write it down, it looks like 202 Thrive. And then people are quite confused. Yes.

Just not giving the same vibe. Yeah, just too hard. Too hard. Anyway, how are we? Yeah, really good. I feel like there's something about starting afresh that is like it doesn't mean anything like it's the same it's just like you know it's the same week like it's like Tuesday's last year it's new it's fresh it feels like there's an actual line in the sand and that's the most

annoying thing in the world right like because you could start new anytime and we always say like there's no time like the present well that's like just do it when you're ready if you're like oh my gosh I really want to get my money life together or I really want to change like just do it just get it done but like oh the motivation levels right now much higher like imagine starting something at 4 30 on a Tuesday oh weird weird and I get it and we should we should like do you know what I also see it as the me that I want to become she doesn't wait totally the me that I want to become she doesn't wait for things the me that I currently am she does so I need the new year And she is welcome here.

Exactly. I love this. You might as well harness the New Year energy. I love it. Have you done your vision board, Jessica? I've done my vision board. I've reviewed. I write my goals in my phone, like my resolutions, goals,

whatever you want to call them for the year, on my phone every year. So I've reviewed last year's, made this year's. I spring cleaned my house. Like we're feeling fresh. Hold on, hold on. Good question. Is the Christmas tree down? Of course it is.

Of course. Oh, my God. That is so depressing, Jessica. I have to leave mine down until I have an argument with my husband about it being up in February. So what are you excited about right now? For the new year? Yeah.

She's on the money. Obviously. Obviously. I'm excited to just, what am I excited about? I'm sorry. Careful. The next holiday is Valentine's Day. So right now I'm thinking about Valentine's Day,

Valentine's baking, Valentine's decorating. You know, we operate on a cycle in my house. Do you know what? Now is the time to book in your Valentine's dinner. Like, Bec, you're a romantic. It is so hard to get a Valentine's Day dinner booking. So, like, now's the time to shine. 100%.

Ain't no way someone else is cooking on Valentine's Day. Are you not cooking for somebody on Valentine's Day? I'm cooking. I'm not getting the booking anywhere. You know what I mean? Oh, okay, okay. It's park, it's sun, it's grass. It's sweet romance.

It's sweet romance. I love that. Oh, no, I need a fancy dinner. Like, I want to be wine and I want to be diet. And I don't ask for that any other time of the year. I just don't, I simply don't care. But I want to go out for Valentine's Day. I want to be treated like a pretty princess.

Oh, is that? Like, that's really lame. Bonita. Yeah, like, all of my feminist goals go out the window. I need flowers. I need to go out for dinner. I need to be told that I'm the prettiest princess that ever walked this planet on Valentine's Day.

And I think that's valid. I don't even care if it's tacky. No. I am a commercial dream. You truly are. Marketers everywhere are rejoicing. Yeah, they're like, oh, more Victoria Devines in this world. But let's get into it because new year, new me,

but we are still harping on about our five-star reviews because they are so fun. This week I have one for you and I feel like it sets the tone well. Are you ready? It's from Natalie. Hi, Nat. This is the mood we're taking into 2025 or 2023. Are you ready?

You girls are guaranteed to light up my day no matter my mood, particularly if i've been feeling down your cheery voices always make me feel better not only do you come up with the facts and the helpful tips and tricks you come with a whole lot of empathy and genuine support as well and that really shines through this is so nice but victoria you are a ray of sunshine in human form and such a great role model for women not to mention of course your fabulous co-host s's beck and jess together you guys make an amazing team perfectly curated to make us feel uplifted, seen, heard, and educated. Love you all and so grateful for what you do.

Oh, that's so nice. We love you too. Two heart emojis. They're so sweet. Thanks, Nat. Thank you, Natalie. Isn't that the sweetest thing ever? Yeah.

That makes me feel warm and fuzzy. Oh, my God, totally. And, like, honestly, feeling seen and heard are two of, I feel like, the most important things. I agree. And I feel like our community does that for us as well. Totally. Like, all of that, the second I read that, I was like,

Like, oh, that's how I feel about our community. Yeah. I feel like I go there and anything that we're struggling with or like wanting to chat about, everyone's like, yeah, girl, what is it? Isn't that the best? Yeah, I really like that. It's so nice. It's beautiful.

It's like when you call a friend and you're like, what should I wear? I don't know. And they're like, I don't care. Come with you. And you're like, oh, it's so nice. Yeah. Exactly. But I love this and I feel like we're going to carry this energy past January.

Absolutely. I think so. I think we have been equipped with all the tools. We have been. and we will continue to equip you with even more tools this year. You just wait. There's so much in store. I didn't call it 2020 Thrive for nothing.

But, Ms. Desgrici, community money wins and confessions. What do you bring into the table this fancy new year? Alrighty. Firstly, I've got a lot on theme with, you know, refreshing, reviewing. Yeah, we're on brand. Correct. All the things we should be doing at the moment. So, firstly, from Kendall, she said she realised that the RSPCA

was advertising a reduced rate on pet insurance that was lower than what she's currently being charged. She called up to query it and she's been given the reduced rate and three months for free. I love it. How good's that? Great. Next, I've got a money win from Audrey, who's flying with Virgin to Brisbane next year. It's a round trip and she's used points from her flybys and credit card to adults and a

10-year-old flying totally for free. Whoa. How good's that? Yeah. Next, I've got a money win from April. She said money win. She managed to score a free school uniform. she sold her previous uniform second hand it was in really good condition and then she managed to

find an equally awesome condition uniform at the school shop okay but why are uniforms so expensive crazy expensive I now understand why parents are like buy this blazer that's 10 sizes too big okay so confession new year confession um apologies to my mum this happened in grade seven actually it would have been grade six when I was picking my grade seven blazer the tantrum I had in the uniform shop because I didn't want the blazer you wanted me to have and I wanted the well-fitted one I'm really sorry yeah we get it you guys go to Lowe's and just get like the same color no logo no ours had to be oh had to be the branded like logoed whatever they were very particular at our school yeah like I say very privileged I went to a catholic school so like

the blazer was like the thing beck if we were seen outside of our school so like after school we're down the shops not wearing our blazer immediate detention it's so crazy really yeah i went to public school and they had the same rule it's ridiculous yeah if you were seen outside of school and you were wearing your school dress without a blazer done you were done seems so arbitrary you get written up and people would like dibba dob as well that's me so like you would get called to the office and then be like oh mr so-and-so from such and such's class saw you at the the coals and you weren't wearing your blazer well you were just wearing your jumper oh well how very stitches yeah seriously yeah you know not by us but someone will give you a stick

and it won't be jess but she'll threaten it yeah i'll just look at you really angrily no our legacy was we had a winter and a summer uniform and so the girls winter and summer uniforms were both skirts like you couldn't wear pants or shorts and so our friend group legacy was we petitioned and girls at the school can now wear pants really i love that i remember that was the biggest drama in the entire world when one of the girls was like i'm not comfortable in a skirt and wanted to wear the pants that the boys had so she just bought them and started wearing them riot yeah actually insane also the time and this is probably not what my ex school wants to be perpetuated the time that they suspended a kid from my class because he came to school

with a shaved head and you weren't allowed a shaved head at our school because like part of the uniform was like your hair had to be a minimum of two centimeters long or something for the boys right wild but he had a shaved head because he'd raised money for cancer oh my god are you for real do they know that oh yeah of course they like and even if they didn't know that and they called him to the office like what is he gonna sit there and not say anything he would have been like dude i shaved my head on the weekend to raise money for leukemia like be for real and they still did it and it made the news so good that's crazy oh not to mention the time that one of the ex-teachers married one of the students oh yeah that was good i'll send you the links oh my god this is

the catholic school was catholic king thoughts and prayers to everyone going back to school Well, honestly, we need you to elaborate after. I will. It's juicy. I'll let you know. Jessica, what else have you got? Next, I've got a money win from Samantha who said money balanced. She had a money loss.

She bought a Costco membership, which some would argue is a future money win. That's not a money loss. That's an investment in your, like, that's an activity. Well, she then said money counterbalanced. Like, she only left with a pizza and a hot chook. Hot chook? Do you know the hot chooks? They're like $4.99 at Costco.

Oh, really? That's a good deal. They're very cheap. That's a good deal. They lose money. What is it called? I thought they lose money on it. They lose money on it.

We posted a reel on it at one point. Yeah. But as I say, they like lose money as soon as they leave the, you know. Like a car devalue? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, well, I bought this hot chook and I can't resell it. Yeah. It's already $3.99.

This is like, that's my car. Yeah, what the hell. Costco pizza is so good. If I had a membership, I would just go buy a Costco pizza for dinner because they're so big. Anyway, next I've got a money win. I'm surprised Jessica doesn't have a Costco membership. I'm shocked by that too.

I'm horrified. Our friends have a Costco membership, so we use theirs. Ah, yes. We go as their guest. There was always going to be a lot. No, there's a way. She's getting in there somehow. No, there's a way that Jessica doesn't go to Costco.

Next, I've got a money win from Amy who said she didn't realise there was such a thing as Microsoft points, which I also had never heard of. Sorry, what are those? So apparently you can earn points for doing things like using their native search engine, which is Bing, and then you can then cash them in for gift cards. Sorry, what?

So apparently she's inadvertently earned herself enough points to get $50 off her next Airbnb. Okay. What? So you just have to use Bing. Apparently that's one of the ways. Sorry, I really diluted that. I'm sure there's more to it.

No, no, no. There's more to it, but, like, you have to use Bing. Is it worth $50? I know. That's the thing is that I remember my story one time was like. Sorry, Microsoft. She's a 10, but Bing is her default. So, you know, Bing is the future.

So I'm so sorry to anyone. It's called, I did look it up, it's called Microsoft Rewards. So you can earn rewards by simply doing what you love to do. Guys, I'm just trying to wrap my head around flybys. Like, I can't get this deep. That's incredible, though. If you want to stack on a new point system or if you're already a big user, I'm sure there's people out there, you can be earning points.

Ah, there you go. Show yourselves. And lastly this week, I've got a money win from Meg, who said, money win, she swapped from Telstra to Optus. She's on the exact same plan with the exact same data, but she's saving herself $40 a month. Money win. There you go.

Review all your things. New year, new you, new phone plan. Yes, yes, agreed. Now is the time. Now is the time. New phone plan, new insurances. We are cleaning financial house. We are setting ourselves up for success.

If you got an email the same as me saying Apple took a subscription amount and you don't know what it's for, now is the time. Yes, figure it out. To work out why. Figure it out. Pull your finger. What are you doing? Put your big girl pants on.

Mm-hmm. All right. Well, moving on, Bec. Yes. New year, new broke tip. what have you got? Okay, so I was thinking that when I first started Broke Tips, in my brain, they were going to be unhinged. So I'm thinking... Honestly, they have been. They have been? That's enough. They could be slightly more unhinged. Oh, we're amping it up. I'm thinking...

Broke Tips that nobody's ever going to do. What a good segment. Exactly. But you know what's crazy is that I had always done these things and didn't think that they were weird or whatever. You know what i mean anyway so um is this like when people eat like the skin of the kiwi fruit bizarre or like the tops of the strawberries like the green bit of the strawberries what are you a hamster sometimes i feel like one just on the hamster wheel tops of carrots are we eating the tops of carrots no i couldn't if i tried you couldn't if you tried so it's quite corky what's the word like woody is it i've never tried it's fine yeah that's true well i'll go i'll start i'll start right now. I don't eat that black bit at the end of the banana. If you guys do. Okay. That's

unhinged. You have to pull that out. You have to pull that out. No, no. The black bit at the end of the banana is where I draw my line back. Give me chills. All right. So tell me about your broke tips. All that to say, I can't promise every single week they'll be unhinged, but this week they're a little bit unhinged. So this first one comes from Amanda. This one is not unhinged, of course. I make a wishlist on carted and wait for things to go on sale. What is carted and why haven't ever used it. I'm going to start now. It's a plugin online, I believe. So it's one of those platforms where you can, it's really handy because you can link things you want. So it's great if you have people who go, what do you want for your birthday? You can keep like a running

list. Also very good for putting 24 hours between you and your spending. Yes. But the really good thing is it notifies you when things go on sale. So if you go, oh, I really want to dice and air up, but I don't want to pay full price for it. You'd put it in and then you get a notification if it finds it discounted anywhere, which is pretty cool. That's great. So it's like it doesn't have to be on the website that you saved it. It could be anywhere on the web. Yeah.

That's really cool. Thank you, Amanda. This next one comes from Bea who says, if you sign up at Planet Fitness, you can bring a friend for free anytime during staffing hours, which I think is great. And it doesn't seem like from what I'm reading, Bea says that it's not like – Bea hasn't said this, sorry. I've inferred this.

It's not like a kind of like a promotion or anything like that. It's just like an ongoing thing. You can just bring a friend for free. You could literally share a membership, one membership with a friend. Is there a limit? To how many friends you can bring? The limit does not exist. Well, yeah, because in my mind I'm like, well,

surely people just split a gym membership. Yeah, I know. Yeah, you'd have to be smart about it though because you'd have to go together always. Always together and always during staffed hours. So it's like – I mean, that's worth it. That's possible.

That's completely possible. What if you're in a relationship? Perfect. Perfect. You could conceivably be spending half price on a gym membership forever. I think that's a very good tip. Yeah, that is really good. That's good.

So obviously this next one is mine, but my friend who I work with reminded me that this is something I actually used to do a lot. And I'm sure a lot of people do this. I feel like it was a trend back in the day, i.e. literally four days ago in 2024. Yeah, that was last year. So wiry sandwich bag ties can hold a sandal together for years, genuinely. And I know that sounds dumb because, like, you just buy new sandals. Some people can't.

It's metal. It's metal. Exactly, and also – Also, they're changing all the sandwich ties to being cardboard, so this is going to be like a – Yes, well, that's very true actually. Brick tip that doesn't work out, but yes. Yes, but also I was thinking like when I first read his message,

I was like, why are you – and then I thought of like when you get like a sandwich bag, those Ziploc ones, and I was like, oh, yeah, I guess you could do that. No, you were talking about the like little wire zip ties. Like little twist ties. Twist tie and also the clippy – Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yes.

All I'm trying to say is just forget about what people say. don't worry about social rules they're arbitrary if there's a way to fix something whether it's duct tape oh fixing stuff that is a good broke tip though because how many of us just go oh i could never do that but then you don't even try yeah yeah you can do it there's a youtube tutorial for anything you've got a broken shoe you can probably fix it totally and i know i've said this before but anytime i would get like i actually did wear stockings in high school and sometimes they'd rip i would literally color my leg in black oh my gosh i feel like we all did that yeah totally I still do that I'm doing that with my runners currently my runners are like

they're that mesh and they started to tear really soon after I got them and I was like well I'm not buying new ones oh my gosh mine did that too but I sewed them back up oh my it was very like holey so I couldn't and then I just left it and now there's literally like 10 holes on my shoes and everyone looks at them they're like why why also do you know what I love about this instead of white because the shoes are black so instead of wearing white socks and you could see than three I just started wearing black socks yeah this is a story of values honestly this is a story of values because Miss Jessica Ricci I know what you earn I know what's in your savings account and I know what your disposable income looks like you can afford new shoes but you're

like that is not worth it and I think that is iconic totally your motto is if it ain't broke don't fix it and if it is broke don't don't fix it just use it just use it just use it you know don't worry you know what broke actually sorry i'm getting so off topic but personal anecdote my we spoke about this in the podcast my beloved tupperware rice microwave thing what happened jessica and tupperware's left i know so there's like it has the lid and there's two handles that clip down to secure the lid so the steam doesn't push the lid off one of the handles broke no i'm still using it i don't care i love this oh yeah but like it would still work right yeah one side's little bit loose but does that matter does the rice cook well so far yes not broken that's what

I totally you chuck a heavy thing of water on top I tried looking to find one I found it on ebay it was a hundred dollars oh absolutely not no sir no so what is this is this just like a little shameless call out if anyone has an old Tupperware rice cooker I'll buy it slide into Jessica's dms with a fair price okay and she's she's probably going to invest in that but she won't invest in her shoes. No, God, no. But I fully agree. If it works, it works. Totally, totally. And if you have new shoes that you want to give Jess, don't tell her because she doesn't want them. But the rice cooker, definitely. Can you just put something heavy on top? No. There's holes for the stain to come out. You know what? I'll look into it.

Look into it. We'll workshop it. Look into it. Sorry, that's me. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. If it is broke, don't fix it. Completely. So let's go to a really quick break. And on the flip side, we're going to be talking about what happens to your hex debt if you're not going to be able to pay it off? Like, are you going to be in heck step forever? And something that you slid into our DMs about, should you be paying for an accident that happened while you're helping a friend out with something that they maybe should have just been paying a professional for? Don't go anywhere. Welcome back, everyone. Let's take a listen to the first money dilemma

of the year. Hi there. Have you got a money dilemma you just can't solve? The She's on the money team is here to help. Every week we tackle your dilemmas, both big and small, to answer your most burning money, career and life questions. To get involved, simply head to our website and leave us a short voice recording and you might just find yourself on the show. Now let's take a listen to this week's money dilemma. Victoria, you recently said on the podcast that there are some people who will just never pay off their HECS. How do you work out if you're one of those people. I earn around $60,000 a year working part-time and I have a HECS debt of $30,000. I'm wondering if I'm one of those people. Thanks. I did say that on the show, didn't I?

You did. I did. I back it up. There are definitely some people who will never pay off their HECS debts. And that sounds terrifying, but I think we need to contextualize it a little bit as well. because in Australia, our HECS slash HELP loan scheme, while it doesn't have interest that gets added to it, it does have indexation. And if obviously there's been a lot of talk, like last year, we were talking about how ridiculous the indexation was. It was at like 7.1%, which was unhinged. But on average, over the last 30 years, the average HELP slash HECS debt indexation sits at about 2.7%. So like we can spread that across our lifetimes and use that as kind of like the average indexation rate, which could be interchanged if you really wanted to with

an interest rate. And in this situation, when it comes to debt repayment, we're just going to look at it as that's the interest rate that it's going to grow by. Now, this community member has written in and said, hey, V, I'm one of these people like I have a $60,000 income. I work part time and I have a $30,000 hex. Now, I'm going to assume that you earn that full $60,000 a year. That's like your part-time income. It's not like pro rata, just taking it as base value. $30,000 hex debt means that you are probably paying back each and every single year about $600 worth of your hex debt, which I'm really sorry means you will have your hex debt for life. I'm going to open it up to you two before I give the solution or the conversation. How does that make you feel

thinking that there are people in our community that are never going to pay off their hex debt or that are always going to have this, quote, debt looming over them? Thankful that I didn't go to university, quite frankly. You're like, it pays to be uneducated by. I mean, I think that it would annoy me knowing that the debt was there and knowing that, like, every year for the rest of your life you're contributing whatever amount.

$600 a year at this point. Yeah, which, like, is not a small amount of money. Like, I understand, especially when it's not or I imagine it would feel like you're not putting a dent in what you owe. you're like, oh, well, what am I just going to pay $600 and it's going to increase as it's indexed, you know, every year for the rest of my life. That seems really annoying to me. I mean, I guess on the flip side, is it the cost of your education? Like you could make extra contribution. I don't like it, but we know that I don't love, like debt makes me feel a little bit icky just generally,

like because of my past experience with it. I don't love having it if I can avoid it, but it's like one of those things at the same time where at least it doesn't pass on to somebody else which I think you're in it's not like you're gonna saddle somebody you know if I pass away it's it's not gonna become someone else's burden yeah but I mean like unless you want to make extra contributions what can you do you know it's kind of like one of those things it's like well you're stuck between a rock and a hard place it feels like oh my god totally I did go to uni I didn't ever actually finish anything as you guys know but um so I do have like random bits of units yes uh sorry I you know what actually it's crazy I've never finished a unit never finished a module

and I've never got a degree, but I've paid for them and I checked my HECS LDA. Do you ever write in and dispute that? I didn't think it was a possibility. I checked the LDA. Do you know what, even now I would definitely write in and say, hey, I just want to have a chat with somebody or like raise it because I actually never finished any of this.

Is there a way that I can write it? Because like I'm not saying that they will waive it, but there is a census date where you are meant to pull out by And if you pull out of a unit before then, you can, you know, not pay for the course. Yes. And I'm not saying that they'll honour it, but I have heard of people being able to write in and say,

hey, I never finished XYZ and I'm never going to be able to pay this off. Is there a way to? And it's been honoured. So, like, I mean, if you don't ask, you don't get, right? Totally. That's true. Okay, that's something I'll think about. Honestly, it doesn't bother me too much.

It would be really nice though. It's at $30,000 somehow and I don't know what the hell I've been doing. I'm just like it's not that much if you're not really seeing it like I don't I feel like if at the end of the year unless like your employee employer's doing something right you don't have to like get to tax time and be like oh I owe this much in hex like you don't really see it so I'm like and also if you're making a certain amount then you start paying a little bit it just feels like nothing to me personally like I've no concern even if it was a million dollars if I had a million dollars in Hex debt I'd be like I don't care is that because the debt repayments aren't

crippling to your financial life yeah like what what's it about because obviously a million dollars saying oh I wouldn't care if it's million like I get I get where you're coming from but also there are people like Jess if that was looming over her she would yeah totally even though you're right it's not of a lot of consequence totally and that's why I've been bankrupt and Jess has been no but I think everyone has different feelings yeah yeah and and and like honestly like I'm at a point where I just I don't think not at a point like I feel like I've always been like this like education and learning is never a waste of time or money and I'm like I even though I didn't finish anything just because it got to like exam time I was like I don't like this but yeah I I learned

so much I think from all these things and I I don't regret that at all but yeah I think just because it's like, I'm not seeing if it was like money I had to pay and I had to remember to pay it after tax and after the money came in, different story, but I'm not seeing it. It's very out of mind. It's very easy feeling. Exactly. Yeah. And like, I can completely see where you're coming from. Jess, you mentioned something before, like about the debt not continuing. I have said on this podcast before, hex slash help debt is the only debt that dies with you. And when I say that, I mean, it is the only debt that is cancelled out when you die. It's a little bit morbid,

but I think it's important for you to understand that because I think a lot of us get stressed about the idea of passing on debt to our kids or our family or our friends or whatever that looks like. I mean, you do have to wrap up your tax return. So, say you die. Let's just be real morbid here. Let's say I died in February. Next month, that means I'm still going to my state. will have to submit a tax return in June. So June 30 comes, I need to do my tax return and whatever hex debt I had owing for that period, I need to pay, but the rest of the debt would get wiped because I'm now deceased. And I think that's important to understand because it doesn't make up part of your estate. So let's say you have a $30,000 hex debt and $100,000 in savings.

If that was like credit card debt, or if that was a home loan, or if that was any other type of personal loan, what would happen with your estate? And estate is a fancy word for saying all your stuff in one bucket that you owned when you die. Your estate would pay for that. So say you've got your debt, all of that would be, you know, organized and you'd get $70,000 out of that to distribute to your friends and family when you pass away in your will. However, HEX doesn't come into your little bucket of your estate. It doesn't come in and say, hey, just so you know, you still to the government 30 grand. They'll just go, you died. Don't worry about it. That was bad enough. So they don't take it from you. And I think that that is a really important point because a lot of

people are making the decision to just not care about their Hexter anymore. They're like, I see it's indexed at 2.7%. I see that that means that, you know, if I have a $60,000 income and I've got $30,000 owing, I'm going to be paying 600 bucks a year on that for forever more. I just don't care. Like that's what a lot of people are deciding because they look at it and they go, even if I extinguished that amount of money. So even if I saved up $30,000 and paid off that entire hex debt, it doesn't actually put me even in a better borrowing situation. Like getting rid of that hex debt doesn't mean that I'm going to increase my borrowing capacity. I'd actually prefer to have that $30,000 in my savings account or invested or in property or somewhere else. So

a lot of people are deprioritizing paying off their HECS. Is that the right thing to do? Who knows? It's just an experience that's happening in our community. But yes, there are definitely people who are going to have their HECS debts forever. And do I think that's a negative thing? Honestly, no, because you were able to get the education that you consented to. You knew how much it was going to be and what the repayments would look like and how that worked. And maybe it just doesn't work out that you pay it off forever. I'm just glad that we don't have a education financing system like the US where it becomes completely crippling to get into student debt. And I also love that our system means that if you lose your income or you don't have, you

know, the income needed to pay it back, you don't have to. So I think there's a lot, like there's pros and cons. Nobody wants to die in debt, but I think we also need to remember that we're getting a lot from that. And even if you are earning a $60,000 part-time income, yes, you're paying back your debt, but you got this massive degree and maybe part-time, like part-time 60 grand, that's a good income. That's why you're able to earn it maybe because you went to uni, you were able to get this good job with the degree that you had. And now that's just like paying the way of being able to do that so true so I just think there's a lot to it and I think people put a lot of importance on smashing down their hex debt without talking about the bigger repercussions and there

have been when I was a financial advisor a lot of people that I sat down with that would be like oh my god V I'm so glad I'm here I've got you know all of these savings and all of this hex debt and we need to get rid of the hex debt and then next we'll do and then we do their financial advice and paying more of the hex debt was never part of the plan. So I think it's just take it with a grain of salt. Debt can be scary, but that's one of the debts that's not good or bad debt just sits in the middle. She's grey. Yeah, she's grey. Should we get into the juicy dilemma? Was hex debt and you dying not juicy enough? A little bit morbid, a little bit sad. I'm ready for the good stuff. I'm always ready for the good stuff. Are you ready? We got a DM. DM said, hey, she's on the

money, I am in an awkward situation. My friend wanted to save some money on renos before their baby arrived. So they asked me to help paint their house. Great. Cool. We've all done that. Checks out so far. Of course. I said, yes, how could I not? But while I was moving the ladder, it slipped and I accidentally knocked over their brand new TV that was propped up waiting to be mounted. Now they're asking me to pay for it and I feel awful. But I kind of feel like it wouldn't have happened if they hadn't asked me for help in the first place i was doing them a favor to save some money and now i'm the one out of pocket am i being unreasonable for thinking i shouldn't have to pay i would love to hear the team's thoughts it's so that is actually really hard this is

really i'm like i'm biting my tongue so hard right now i just think like maybe go hard i just That is a really, really good one because I'm like, if your friends were going to pay you, like, so I don't know how much a painter costs, but let's say $2,000 for a painter. Yeah, you go about that because I am currently having my house repainted. Oh, okay. Yep, yep.

We've got some quotes. There you go. About two grand, yep. It is an accident. It really does. I get it. Like it feels so crappy when you're not doing, I don't know if our listener is doing really well financially

or not doing well financially, whatever it is, but like when you're in a situation where you're like, Irrespective. It's about the blame game. It's not about how much money you've got in your account. Totally. Whose responsibility is this broken television? Exactly.

And it's like when you accidentally do something, you have no intention of anything and all of a sudden you're in the whole like 5K. I don't know. I'm assuming it's like 5K if it's like a big one that's going to be mounted. $5,000 on a TV. How much are they these days?

I don't know, but there's no way I'd spend $5,000. Really? It's like on a big like, I don't know, that's a blue drop in our house. the big oleg we got one it was all my boyfriend like just tell me how much to pay if it's not on sale i'm not buying it totally i think my last tv was maybe 1500 bucks i didn't get the bigger one because i was like i'm not spending that well yeah i mean you can get it really depends on how small how big sure sure sure sure yeah i've always just had one i have no idea how much they

cost but anyway um so this you know it really sucks when that happens i understand that you're kind of like think of it from their side if they're like oh this brand new tv we've saved up for this and we're so excited to use it my friend accidentally broke it totally totally not their fault they're here to help me maybe let's try and find a way where we can go halves or or something I just don't know that it's either one's responsibility completely I think but you You guys look like you definitely don't agree, so I'm going to. Like, Bec, if you came to my, no, you know what? I want Jess's opinion.

I want Jess's opinion. Jess, what are your thoughts? To me, it's not a grey area. Like, if you damage something. Jess is like, no. I just think if you damage something that is not yours, your responsibility is to fix it or pay for it to be fixed. Right.

Because I think if you, like, broaden it. Oh, Victoria does not agree. No, I don't. I don't. I don't. Because I think that, like, if you take, I think helping them paint their house, you have to take that out of it. Like, why you were there is irrelevant to me. Yeah, okay.

Like, if I'm at anyone's house for any reason, it's like if you hit somebody's car. Like, it doesn't matter if I was doing a good deed and stopping so the ducklings could cross. Like, I hit someone's car, I have to fix it. Absolutely not. But do you know what I mean? Like, I just think the reason you're there is not, like, I understand that maybe in our listeners' minds, they're like, oh, I was doing a nice thing and that nice thing. and I totally get that that's a shitty feeling but like you've broken like I just I I think I know what VD is gonna say but my opinion is like you are responsible for your actions in this world

and be they accidental or be they intentional it's not fair to expect somebody else to foot the bill for something that you've done right I was sorry VD's dead desperate to talk desperate but also I do agree and it's also like if you're doing good deed there shouldn't be any like things yeah like oh then that means that I can either get away with this or you'll do this for me or whatever it's just like you're just doing a nice thing for a friend yeah yeah that is separate I see what you're saying anyway sorry it's probably the first time we've all had completely different opinions I was gonna say this is I don't think this has ever happened before you knew us wow Jess what is my opinion what do you think my opinion is I know that you're gonna

to say that when you invited somebody to your house, you took on the risk or whatever. No, you should have house insurance and your house insurance should pay for it. Why was your TV out while you were painting? I mean, totally fair. It wasn't mounted yet. Okay. All right. It's on the floor.

Why is the TV in a room where you've got a massive ladder? I see. So you're telling me you've got a ladder that could potentially fall over, like a dodgy one at that. and there's a massive TV that is a hazard in this. Like are we not clearing the room to paint the room? Like are we not getting rid of all of the expensive things while getting paint on a television to begin with,

terrible outcome, ladder. Like literally you've got amateurs climbing up a ladder and you thought leaving the TV on the ground is a good idea. It's a good point. It is a good point. Now, I really want to know how it happened. I need to know so much about this situation. But also, say Jess comes to my house.

I know, like, Jess is the sweetest person ever. If I said, Jess, I need help painting my house, what's she going to say? Oh, I'll be there at 10. Yeah, sounds fun. She's not getting up early to do it. She'll be there at 10. But she'll be there with bells on. And then she climbs up a ladder to help me paint.

I know she's an amateur. I know she's never done this. She falls off the ladder and breaks her leg. Whose fault's that? I still put that on me. Like I'm the one who's fallen off the ladder. Yeah, but like you're in my house on my dodgy ladder that I should have, you know, been like, Sue, Jess, be really careful.

But like I just, I think that that is your fault for leaving the TV out in a space where you were doing amateur DIY. Like you've left a TV out. Like I know it's really shitty. I know that you don't want to have to buy another TV and I know that you're trying to save money, but I think that was a cost where you go, oh, I'm so sorry you fell off the ladder, Jess.

Yeah. Like that's a safety issue that you didn't, like Jess came to my house, she fell off my ladder because I didn't protect her to do, like, yeah, we're doing something that she's never done before, but like she didn't sign up to fall off a ladder. No. She didn't, like she signed up to paint some walls. That should be relatively inconsequential.

it might be dodgy there might be runs all over the walls who knows but that's the risk I'm taking would you then sue Jess or be mad if like Jess did a really shitty job of painting the wall so like flip it around we're going to talk about another financial impact Jess comes to my house she paints my walls but she wasn't clean about the brush she like kept putting it on the ground there's dirt in the brush white walls she's just kept painting the walls whatever there's runs all over the walls there's bits of dirt in the walls, she's gone home, it's dried. Dried hairs. I have to then pay someone to come back and fix that

because she's messed it up. Who's paying for that? I see what you're saying. Okay. Ah, but. Yeah, Jess did that. Like, I mean, I'm making Jess pay for it if she got frustrated at the paintbrush, threw it across the room and kicked my TV,

breaking it. Different story. What a great visual. What if you were frustrated? Jess didn't mean to break the TV and I left it in a spot where it could be broken when it definitely shouldn't have been there in the first place and what. Now I'm going to financially impact my friend who was doing a good deed

coming to my house to help me. Absolutely not. I would say ask them if they have contents insurance and can you pay their excess payment. That would be my solution. It's probably worth a TV. Yeah. Oh, you reckon?

Jess. Jess. I don't know if I'm going to have to make a contents claim. I wouldn't know. Yeah. I come to your house, like flip it. you've had issues with your walls you've had it like I come and help I'm standing on your bedside table I'm trying to help you patch up the wall and the roof like we're sticking Marley

spoon recipes over it right you know you know yeah yeah you know you know but like that's what I'm doing for you I trip I fall I break your bedside lamp am I buying you a new lamp I wouldn't ask you to know okay why wouldn't you ask me to well I feel like I would be like well you've done I get what you're saying, but I still also, like, I don't know, maybe it's just me, but if I had fallen and broken the lamp, I do think I would still say I'll replace the lamp. Yeah, I know you would because you're a kind person. Would I let you?

No, you wouldn't. Exactly. Interesting. And it's because it was like I should have moved the lamp, yeah? This really is a moral dilemma. Should the lamp have been on the bedside table when I was climbing up there? No. Should I have thought about moving it myself?

Probably, but it's not my house. like I know but I'm like I'm really thinking about like both parties and I do think they should maybe split the difference I think you should have a conversation but I don't pay by install or something but I just know that when I bought my new phone for example it's like a thousand dollars and I saved up for a long time for that it was a whole thing if one of my friends was like oh my god let me see your phone and then dropped it and broke it I'd be like I'd be like oh that's okay and then inside you'd be like I will never financially recover and and I would be like I want them to pay because they broke it and so I can understand both I gotta know what

everyone else okay okay so I am feeling validated just so you guys know we asked the community we said if you were the homeowner would you ask your friend to help pay 71% of you said no I asked them for help 29% said yeah they broke it yeah I don't think I'd ask them to pay but I would hope that they would offer or i would oh yeah then i asked if you were the friend who broke the tv would you pay for it 40 of you which is the highest percentage says yes i broke it so it's giving jess energy yes it's giving jess energy so she's like oh i'd offer but then i'm like but i wouldn't make you pay like yeah right 37 of you said yes but only to stop the drama and 23 of you said no I'd tell them I wasn't paying.

Awkward. We did then say, all right, we need your two cents. Yeah, tell us more. First person said, were they getting paid to paint? No, then no. Yes, then okay to contribute. Oh, that's an interesting distinction. Someone else said, I would have moved it to a safer place

before opening a ladder in that room. Well, hindsight's forming up to my own heart. Someone else said, this is just Jess coded. At this point, I just think our community and us, we share one brain cell. It used to just be Jess and I. Now it's everybody. It's communal brain cell. They said they should have had insurance if not hiring professionals

and not set up carefully for you. Their fault. I'm not getting insurance if I am not paying a professional painter. Like, low key. Well, a professional painter would come with insurance, you'd hope. Yeah, but like, if I'm asking Jess to come over and help me paint. It's a hey, I'll pay you in pizza kind of deal. Yeah, like we're ordering a pizzeria at the end of the day

and hopefully it's a nice day. We're going to eat it outside with an Aperol. Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah. Someone else said, you break it, you buy it. I mean, that's, yeah. It's a good sign, but also.

Not at Christmas. I don't want to start Christmas anymore, but you can still ride the wave. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Someone else said, I can't imagine asking my friend to pay, but I would pay if I was the friend. Yeah, that's kind of ideal. That's why I suggested all the comments. Yeah.

Someone else said, seems they value the TV more than their friend and their time if they're asking for money but won't pay their friend for their late night. Do you reckon the painter would have to pay? Oh, my God, imagine. A painter should be insured. But imagine. So Jess comes to my house.

She breaks my TV because she's fallen off my dodgy ladder. And I say, Jess, you need to pay for the telly. Jess goes, no worries, here's an invoice for my time. Yeah, right. To dodge that off the – to take it off the top. That is my hourly painting rate then. Oh, my gosh. Someone else said, I would pay for it to stop the drama

and then never be friends with them again. Oh. That's hard. What? Imagine, like, guys, because we're not saying that you're fighting or that there's any animosity, I suppose. We're saying you broke the TV. We just want to know whose fault it is.

You're going to cut a friend out? You guys are ruthless. If my friendship is so fragile that a broken TV is going to fracture it, Keep it. Keep the broken TV. I don't need you as my friend. I mean, because there are valid points on both sides. So you can't really chuck it out.

Someone else said, doing a favor doesn't mean you're exempt from righting wrongs, even if accidental. That's so dramatic. Someone else said, if they wanted to save money by having someone that's not a professional with insurance that's on them, they also shouldn't have left their brand new TV in the room where the work was being done. How'd up? Why was the TV there? That's a great point. Anyway, you know, there's always context missing from a lot of these DMs,

which is fine. That makes it fun. That makes it spicy. But I think this, guys, is the first. I think it is. Yeah, it's the first. What is it, Jess? The first what?

Disagreement. No. Yes. Maybe. Same. But I was going to say this is the first DM where we haven't said the answer is communication. Oh, true.

Hey, it's not too late. New you, new us. There you go. New you, new us. All right. With that, we are off. Thank you for tuning into our first Friday episode of the year. We are hoping to ride this motivation wave. I want to remind you as well, if you are feeling incredibly motivated, I am running a financial foundations workshop on January 8th, which I know is going to be pivotal for a lot of people. I ran it last year as kind of like a test because I knew

it would be good, but I was like, let's just do it late last year, see how it goes so that I could set everybody up for success in the new year. And I think it is going to be the perfect way to start your year on a financial high. So that is running on the 8th of January. And I'll put all the information in the show notes. It's also going to be spammed all over our Instagram, all over my Instagram. It's probably a new newsletter. If you miss it, that's on you, not on me. I promise. All right. Have a good day, guys. And we will see you bright and early on Monday for a money diary. Bye, guys. Happy New Year. The advice shared on She's On The Money is general in nature and does not consider your

individual circumstances. She's on the Money exists purely for educational purposes and should not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision. If you do choose to buy a financial product, read the PDS, TMD and obtain appropriate financial advice tailored towards your needs. Victoria Devine and She's on the Money are authorised representatives of Money Sherpa PTY LTD ABN 321 649 27708 AFSL 451 289.