She's On The Money - Troy Benjamin On How Backing Yourself And Asking For Help Can Really Pay Off

Episode Date: July 22, 2025

Ever felt like you’re one ask away from changing your whole life? Well, this episode is inspiration you need to shoot your shot. This week Victoria is sitting down with Troy Benjamin, hot off his big win at the 2025 NAIDOC awards. Troy is the powerhouse behind Blak Brews, a proudly First Nations-owned tea brand that started during COVID and has since grown into a full-blown national success story. But this episode isn’t just about business wins. It’s about what it really takes to back yourself and stop waiting for someone else to give you permission to go after what you want... AKA the pep talk you didn’t know you needed. In this episode:🍵 A better way to ask for help (and actually get a “yes”)🍵 The sneaky ways ego could be messing with your money and momentum🍵 Dealing with imposter sydrome, even when success shows up🍵 The surprisingly simple mindset shift that helps you back yourself🍵 A smarter approach to testing new ideas... without blowing your budgetTry Blak Brews tea and coffee here, follow them on Instagram and Facebook and visit them at the Booln Booln cafe. Join our Facebook Group AKA the ultimate support network for money advice and inspiration. Ask questions, share tips, and celebrate your wins with a like-minded crew of 300,000+.And follow us on Instagram for Q&As, bite-sized tips, daily money inspo... and relatable money memes that just get you.Acknowledgement of Country By Nartarsha Bamblett aka Queen Acknowledgements. The advice shared on She's On The Money is general in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's On The Money exists purely for educational purposes and should not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision. If you do choose to buy a financial product, read the PDS, TMD and obtain appropriate financial advice tailored towards your needs. Victoria Devine and She's On The Money are authorised representatives of Money Sherpa PTY LTD ABN - 321649 27708, AFSL - 451289.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

My name is Natasha Bamblett, I'm a proud First Nations woman, and I'm here to acknowledge country. Tii, gilinyan ganya, nianakaka yao yinbina waka, nianakai nianbina yakarumja, duminyagumiga dumiga ithawaka nirawamundamun imalan, mumibangada boma ininyalan waka, gaunan yakarumja, wutunadana. Hello beautiful friends, we gather on the lands of the Aboriginal people, we thank acknowledge and respect the aboriginal people's land that we're gathering on today take pleasure in all the land and respect all that you see she's on the money podcast acknowledges culture country community and connections bringing you the tools

knowledge and resources for you to thrive she's on the money she's on the money Hello and welcome to She's on the Money, the podcast that helps you get good with money and even better at backing yourself. And today's episode, from my perspective, is a very serious dose of inspiration. Whether you've got a business idea, a side hustle, or just need a reminder that you are allowed to do things differently, my friends, this one is absolutely for you. My name is Victoria Devine and with me is a very special guest, hot off his win at the 50th NAIDOC Awards,

Troy Benjamin, is the powerhouse behind Black Brews, a proudly First Nations-owned tea and coffee brand that started as a kitchen table idea during COVID and has since exploded into a national success. story. It's bold, it's culture led, and it's already caught the attention of Gordon Ramsay, picked up major awards and landed Troy on some pretty impressive stages. Troy, my friend, welcome to the show. Thank you so much, Victoria, for having me. Great to be here. We were just talking off air about how we both feel that sometimes we're in rooms

where we're just kids, like we're not meant to be there. I feel like you and I have a very similar energy when we're just like we're just trying to have a good time well that's it's exactly that's the currency of what I do if I'm not enjoying it I've always been like that too I've always been like that found myself in spots that I'm having fun and the ones that aren't I'm personally not having fun I very rarely find ways to kind of push through and that's why we're here because this is fun I love it I love it and I'm so excited I was trying to get you on the show earlier, but I really wanted to get you in person because content just shines so much better in person. And you since won the NAIDOC award, which we're going to get into. But before we get into

it, some of our community might not have met you yet. So I think it would be a miss to not properly introduce you to my community. In your NAIDOC award speech, you thanked your mom. You said, thanks for raising a rule breaker. So I reckon we should start there, right? Can you tell me a little bit more about your upbringing and how it shaped you into being I don't know so entrepreneurial yeah it was funny I was thinking about that rule-breaking comment that I made in my speech because I'm a parent and I've got a 12 year old son right now and he's breaking the rules so in good ways I hope you know what I mean what am I saying here like am I one of the Some people, you know, don't want to promote to not do school.

You know, I've got to be careful what I promote here and what we mean by rule breaker. And I was a rule breaker and at 12 years old, you know, or 15 or 16, you get in trouble for it. Absolutely. Like I don't want to promote it to go break the rules. I mean, everyone. You've got to not get in trouble.

Like break the rules but like the ones that can be broken, not the ones where you're skipping out on school. Totally, totally, totally, you know. Break the rules, not the law. Yeah, don't break the law. Respect authority, all that jazz. And maybe that comes kind of to a bit of. But question authority too.

I think so. Don't always, yeah, like and my son's in that space and I'm getting a good dose of what I was like as a kid too. And I was an only child with a single parent. Yeah. And the single parent wasn't a father, it was a mother. Yeah. And boys can do some naughty things behind a single mother's back

we're naughty we're trouble we're we're probably a little bit loose in how could we look after my mother right in this situation or we can be selfish and I think sadly and it's the truth little boys can be really selfish and so when I was rule breaking it was fine I didn't really get in too much trouble but mum would often tell me stories about how we used to go along the beach and I was just running off with another family and you know as a as a single scared mum my mum's very holds on tight to me and was, you know, didn't have a lot. But me as a mum, I have a 16-month-old and I swear he just wants to be adopted by every other family.

Like we go to the supermarket and he's like leaning out of the trolley at the other parents and I'm like, all right, they're going to think that you want to leave me. And you think all kids would like to do that, but it's not true. Some kids really like to be near their parents and hold onto the trolley and not leave. And I've just always been. That's a secure attachment though.

I think so. That's a good thing. i'm trying to tell myself yeah and it's a scary thing i'm sure as a parent but i just couldn't that's just the way i was and my mum often would be working or attending to all the things in life that a single mother has to in her own world and for her family and for a community so often i was getting put into situations where i was um not being attended to or i was in other families setups and yeah there's no continuity at all so it was kind of like at all times i felt like it doesn't really matter because this is not the way I do things anyway. But there was never really

any kind of solid rules. Aside from my mother, she's an authority. She taught me to put the toilet seat down. You know, she would go back and tell me to turn the lights off. That costs money and you can't leave the heater on for longer than two minutes. And come on, it's quarter to eight. She sounds like an icon, honestly. She had rules and told me off if I broke them. So whilst I was a rule breaker, it wasn't like I was left alone to my own devices. I was in a very structured home and I had the great privilege of having a stepdad come into my life as a six-year-old. But, you know, as I grew up in many families' homes and there was some really solid typical, I don't know what typical is these

days, but you know, the traditional family, I grew up mostly in those family setups. And so I'd come back and kind of try and implement some of the things that I met, but I'd go to some family's houses and I was going there so often that I would be on the dishes roster. Yeah, you're on the roster. I'm on the roster. But if you're going to come here, you are going to be doing the dishes. And if I went in there on Saturday and my mate, I would rock over to kind of go play basketball in the driveway and they're like, no, I've got flute and I've got to mow the

lawns. I'll be like far out. Well, I've already here now. Yes, we've got to mow the lawns. I'll help you mow the lawns. So I'm thankful that I had really good families around that brought me up who I am today. And I always credit my mother in trusting and finding her mother instinct to be reliable in letting me be in the right situations that were going to add value where she couldn't.

I love that. And that turns you into a very entrepreneurial spirit. Yeah, often I talk about the key things that kind of get me to where I am. And the first thing I think of is, and it relates to exactly what I'm talking about, is asking for help. I got brought up in a family that my mother had to ask for help in the most kind of maybe even humbling and embarrassing things as a 20 year old mother having a child and many of her community members said you're probably too young to have a child and you're not set up. Oh do I just

return it? Well you know what I mean. Like why why are you saying stuff like that like I just can't comprehend that. Cool so she's had a kid young what additional support could we give her? Totally. Is that not the conversation we're having? You know exactly right and you know what are we trying to produce just perfect world like it just doesn't work and my mother obviously was pregnant so she was the person that was going to be best suited to think how can I do this and she got brought up in and out of orphanages she had a super super rough life super rough as rough as you can you get back in the 60s you know fending off the social norms having to go find food she was in and out of foster care and orphanages and her family of nine were all in kind of abusive

situations through the orphanage system. And sadly, it was really tough. And for her to sit there and probably hear those words and go, maybe they're right, but I'm still going to have this kid anyway. That's a strong woman. But then also, sorry, can we just backtrack? How proud would she be? You've just said, oh, I grew up with the best mum. She had the best rules. Like I grew up with all these supportive families around me. You don't just get supportive families. Your mum would have cultivated that for you and given you absolutely everything. So to come from that, having had that upbringing, which as we know, unfortunately can be generational. Like we often see these things carry on. Like if you grow up in a certain way, well, a lot of us just come to terms with that

idea. And they're like, I talk about money day in, day out. And the same thing is with wealth. You go, well, we were poor. I'm just going to live my life in that way. And with these rules and these systems and, like, you don't break out of that. It sounds like your mum was like, absolutely not. We are breaking the mold. Maybe she just didn't bring up a rule breaker. Maybe she was, like, the original rule breaker and it was maybe, like, stole a little bit of her personality.

Well, totally, yeah. And, I mean, the question has to be how did she know if she didn't get brought up this way, how did she know what to do? Wise beyond her years. How did she know? How did she know to go find food at the right times, where to go? I mean, I remember going to, I don't remember. A resourceful queen.

that's super resourceful I can really remember going through Geelong and thinking we had an account with the butcher but we didn't have an account we would go there and I should put me up on the little sit where you put your handbags and put your purse to ask the butcher to cut your meat and she would ask for free off cuts of meat and I used to think I love sliced ham in Strasbourg I love it yeah but I can remember growing up on it I used to go out on Saturdays and go down the store into the market square I can't remember what it was back then but a little deli in Geelong and And, like, I thought we were paying for it, but we were just getting little – I was the sample kid.

She made it an enjoyable process. Totally. I saw it as a little excursion and we're having fun today. And my mum – you know that movie, The Pursuit of Happiness? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I can relate to that so much. And just my mother telling me stories and playing tapes about Noah's Ark and little elephants.

And I can remember just life being so adventurous and like a real-life Disneyland. I love her. And then my mother tells me that's the house where you grew up in and it's a little shed. I'm like. Sorry, no, that's not what I remember. I remember a mansion.

I remember elephants going into the windows and having Strasbourg ham and she's like, no, no. She's like, no, so that's not what happened. But I'm glad that your memories are telling you that it was really positive. I feel like that. You know, why not have a child in a tough situation because your imagination can make you survive.

It looks like just from learning a bit more about your mum, she clearly had that entrepreneurial spirit herself. Like maybe she's not out there starting businesses, but to be an entrepreneur, you need to be incredibly resourceful. You need to be able to have that level of grit where if you get knocked down, you're like, cool, I'll just get back up and I'll work out a different way. Or I need this resource, but I don't have access to it. I'm going to find a way I'm going to make a pathway. And that's clear from me doing a lot of research on you that you have that because black brews, which I'm going to talk about in a hot minute. That's not your first business. I would say that you're a bit of a serial

entrepreneur. Like, can you take me back and can we talk about the first business that you started? Yeah. T-Roy Browns. It came originally from, I wanted to put a, one of these Danish cargo bikes with a coffee machine and ride it around Edinburgh Gardens. And I asked a friend of mine to come up with a name and a guy and my barista at the time, I was working at the cafe in front of the art centre back in 2007 and he used to be this Irish guy that thought he was, he always loved hip-hop. It was the strangest mix but he'd always go, Leroy Brown, oh, T-Roy Brown, call me T-Roy Brown, the baddest man in town.

And I never knew the song Bad, Bad Leroy Brown. I had no reference to any old history. And so I started this coffee cart and called it T-Roy Brown's and then whilst I was kind of developing that coffee cart or that little bike, I had a little side job delivering coffee for Atomica, the great iconic cafe on Fitzroy Street. I don't know if it's still there anymore. And I've stumbled across this little bolt hole.

I dropped off one kilo of coffee to this guy sitting on a crate at the front of the Banana Alley Vault in Vault 1. And he looked down and out. I could see it in his eyes. He was like, I was dropping off one kilo per week. Anyone in coffee, that's bad news. Yeah, that's terrible. That's like 30 cups of coffee.

For the week. Yeah. And I'd see him next week and go, what's going on, man? Like you need some help with kind of how to make coffees. And he had come from a successful cafe. He just goes, no, man, I want to start like my plastering apprenticeship. I want out. Do you know anyone wants to buy this little, it was two meters by two meters wide.

It's a little mop room at the front of vault one in the Benelli vault. And I went back and thought about it and thought maybe this is my shot. This is my shot to have my own business. I went and got two grand, which I had $2,017 in my bank account at the time and tried to wheel and do. I said, bro, I'll give, I'll lay down two grand right now. Absolutely wheel and deal with that in your account. I'll come back with the rest and it was he was like oh no anyway he's like cool I'll give you

seven days for the rest otherwise you lose your deposit I went it's all good man I've got way more than two grand make some calls move some money I thought that's what people do move money anyway I told a friend of mine at the time you're giving me anxiety it was stupid but my heart was too I knew this would be brilliant I told a good friend at the time I said hey man I just bought to cafe he's like we gotta go celebrate let's go get some champagne we'll go to a little bar with your 17 dollars that you had left i said um i said but there's a catch i just need another 17 000 but that's okay because i did pay the two thousand dollar deposit so i'm basically 90 i'm in i'm in yeah get the business cards out let's go yeah you've got a black mx now don't

you yes that's how it works i sprayed my bendigo bank card he could read between the lines i needed some more money and I was going to lose my 2000, everything I had. Yeah. He believed in me, rang another mutual friend of ours and said, let's tip in the 5k each with another friend of ours. He said, you go back to the person that you've paid two grand to and you tell them you've only got 10k and you're going to pay the other seven remaining over time. Cause I don't want to give you, cause this guy could have given me all the money. He said, I want to give you all the money and you needed to learn how to pay someone back. Yep. I'm not too sure whether you've learned that yet. So I did it. I went back to the owner and said, here's my other 10K. Can I please pay you

seven grand over as the money rolls in? He said, no problem. That was my first in. We built a cafe from literally no one used to walk past there other than, it was a pretty derelict area, Banana Alley Vaults back then. Still is, but there's such little thriving businesses. But I put out an A-frame saying, it's my first day of business. Come and have a coffee and a chat for free. And we just had, it was like kindling. It was just a few people came in and a few more your coffee. Exactly right. We went through kilos for that first week because it was free coffee in a chat. And very quickly, I just built friendships and relationships. And to be honest, today, before coming here, a guy came into the cafe down in Geelong that I just started. He's one of my

first customers in the first few days. And we built over seven years. The beauty of that was it was so small. The rent was cheap. It shouldn't have worked. And it worked. And we made some really good coin for the first four years and I learned how to do more than just be a front barista person I learned the basics about finances I learned finances very quick yeah you've called this your tiny MBA and I've listened to you before and I think that that's a perfect way to put it because an MBA is expensive and what you did was a massive investment but honestly like I feel like you probably learnt a lot more than you going to uni and doing an MBA and doing like managerial finance.

You're actually doing the grit. Like you're like, okay, cool, what am I doing? How much does it cost to open the doors? How much does it cost? How do we get customers? It would have been fun. What do you think were the biggest lessons that experience taught you? Because as much as you made some good coin,

I'm sure that there were times where you were like, whoops. Well, walking out of a cafe on a Tuesday with $1,800 of cash in your left-hand pocket. That's a nice day. Is like, but it's dangerous too. So I had to learn very quickly how to save for the rain, put away some coin because the coffee machine might break or I've got to go away for three weeks because my mate's getting married in the UK and I want to go and I'm the best or something like that. And I had to put staff in. That was something that I had not learned or been taught

because my mum never had money. So we never really had time to save. We had constantly, it was always catch up mode. So I taught myself very quickly and the hard way. I mean, I had to make some hard conversations, get them over the line with the landlord and the landlord, I don't know. Because we don't just move money, it turns out. These guys are, you know, Tony Doherty is a tough man. You don't want to mess around with the Doherty's boys and they're my landlord.

No, no, thank you. But they were so kind. They were so kind to me. I'd tell them, hey, look, I'm down this month and I can't pay rent. I think the beauty of being able to own up to your mistakes and admit them real quickly usually is met with a lot of compassion and empathy. I think dealing with things honestly and as quickly as possible

instead of ignoring your problems. And you see it in quite a lot of those. Look, you're going to bring up Gordon at some stage, but a lot of his situations on TV, he's dealing with people that can't admit they've got a problem. And that's why it's good television. It's the best. Like, how can this guy?

But we can see it. He can see it. They can't see it. But, right, his ego's in the way. These guys' ego's in the way. And I think that goes back to, you know, my mother, again, it really is the stem or the roots of who I am. I like to believe I've never had an ego that has gotten me

into deep, deep, deep trouble where I've, you know, Simon Beard, owner of Culture Kings, has famously, you know, I follow him for the last few years, he said ego gets you into business but also it kills your business as well. And a lot of entrepreneurs and business owners get themselves into business because of their ego. You've got to have some guts. You've got to have a little bit of ego.

You've got to believe in yourself a little bit. I am going to nail this. We're sick at it. But also let's keep our feet on the ground because it might have worked one time but like we also still don't know how. That's right and so he puts a lot of value in how much he paid for his board because they can help his ego be in check. I learned that very early on to keep seeking help and don't think you know it all because you don't. Yeah no absolutely. So after that you had your little cafe, took off, you got 1800 bucks quite

often in your pocket on a Tuesday afternoon, felt like a big dog. You then launched your next business which was like a mobile barista hire business i believe called backup barista backup barista genius like smart man you obviously or i think spotted a gap in the market and you were like okay i could solve some people's problems here i feel like so many successful businesses start that way from being able to like spot a gap in the market or a problem that people are having tell me about what gave you you obviously had this successful cafe great but like what gave you the confidence to go and start another business in a gap that you could see and what would you say to somebody else who maybe has spotted a gap but they're not sure what to do or whether they

could service that niche yeah it's a good question is I missed making coffee so I sold the cafe and I missed it I just feel like I've never been into one of your cafes I just know that you're one of the best baristas like people come every morning into your cafe don't they just to see you and have a little bit of a yap go oh how are you doing Troy like what's going on you know everyone by name don't you yeah it's the super weapon I think and it's the one thing that you know every barista really should have and would benefit if they're the business owner or the cafe if you can talk and yap and oh I go to my favorite cafe because of the barista right Zara, who you met before, we always talk about her favourite barista.

Like they are characters in our lives that are genuinely like it's that wholesome connection, right? It's beautiful, isn't it? It's the first usually point of your morning. It's just before you've had to put your business day face on. Yeah. It's your last little snapshot. And why are you guys so happy?

We know you got out of bed at four. What are you doing? It's bloody cold. That's probably why we're happy because we've woken up three hours earlier. You had the first coffee off that machine, didn't you? You know, yeah, yeah, yeah. But that's where it came from was I miss making coffees for people. I might hire myself out and I just kind of jacked up the price

a little bit per hour and I said, look, you don't have to hire me but maybe just hire me for when you're busy and you want to put your baristas on break. I can rock it at all machines, most machines. I'll just cover your breaks and charge you X amount of dollars per hour. So I was going into cafes 7 till 10, having the rest of the day off and maybe going back at another cafe two hours away in another suburb and doing 11 till 2 or I wouldn't do it at all.

I just wouldn't be available. And then I got plenty of work and then started calling on other baristas. And my whole premise on the barista agency was you had to be a premium barista to get on the agency, on the database. But that meant that most likely they wouldn't be available because they would have a job. So I just went crazy and tapped on every good baristas I know and said, look, you don't have to say yes to these jobs, but if you were able to do it, could you please step in? So sometimes we had world barista champions rocking up to fruit shops in Footscray. Because they needed a cover.

Well, they needed a cover. And they were like, yeah, cool, I'll do it. Because most baristas, we like to turn it on. We want to get paid too. You get a bit of coin. It's for a short time. It's probably half a day's work, but you're doing it in two or three hours. You feel great.

Again, ego. You get your ego stroke because you're rocking up and you're helping a cafe out really, really quickly. But the second thing you said, the advice, you can start with nothing. And I would advise like making as much of a move on the industry or the position without money. A lot of people sit there and say, cool, I need to start a cafe. So I may need the best coffee machine on the planet. I've asked for so much help, even machine hiring, or can I please borrow your grinder for the next month in my coffee van? Like there's so many ways that you can not spend

money. Yeah. Another person I met on the show, Janine Ellis, she's great. She comes up with heaps of tips and tricks on her Instagram and YouTube channels. Like why is everyone, to go all in on an idea is to not spend money on it and I need the best gear. No, you don't. You don't. I started a podcast through COVID with 200 bucks worth of microphone and headphones and worked out a laptop and sat in my shivering room in Grovedale. And the money I spent was on high bandwidth on my internet because I had to do live conversations and bring in feeds. Yeah, that was really hard during COVID. I started with a podcast and with a sock over it on the floor

with a moving blanket because, like, the moving blanket, I couldn't afford the, like, foam. You know how, like, all the fancy podcast studios have, like, foam and stuff? No, moving blanket from Bunnings. Right. It can work. She's thick.

She absorbs the sound. It can work and it's such a good way of just finding out if you actually love doing it anyway without the, you don't need the gear. The gear's great but, I mean, I teach my son also. Like he always wants, kids always want the best shoes and the Jordans and the Steph Currys. I don't get it.

You just go running around your ASICS school shoes for a minute because, one, you're going to grow out of your shoes in a year's time anyway but you don't have to have the good gear. Like let's just see if you love basketball first. Yeah, absolutely. And then we'll invest the money. I think that's a really good lesson in you don't have to buy the best cups and, you know, I just started a cafe down in Geelong

and I went straight to IKEA. What's it called? What's it called? Bullen Bullen Cafe. It's right on the Torquay Highway. Oh, nice. It's in the old Narana Cultural Centre. Everyone, if you'd driven from Geelong to Torquay, would have gone past this big kind of cultural centre. But now we're stopping for coffee.

You better stop because it's banging. But yeah, don't have to spend money to get an idea off the ground. And there's so many good people out there that will lend you money, especially friends and family always first, because they're the ones that believe in you and usually don't charge interest. Hopefully they don't charge interest, fingers crossed. Maybe they might have something hanging over you, but, you know, generally speaking, they're good people to stay with. A hundred percent. And then COVID came and I feel like everything just kind

of hit a standstill for you and everybody else, right, including unfortunately your space of like events and hospitality. So I'm assuming this mobile barista business was probably copying it. It died. That pause became the starting point for Black Bruce, didn't it? So tell me how the idea came about and what made you believe in this idea? Like it's a tea brand grounded in culture. How did you know that was worth going all in on?

How do you know? Because I think it's a beautiful idea. But just because it's a beautiful idea doesn't mean it's going to get legs and run, right? No, that's right. It did though. Hindsight's helpful, isn't it? You're like, that's such a good idea.

How obvious is this? How obvious? It wasn't obvious at the start. My wife wanted to start an essential oils business in Native Ingredients. Gorge, yeah. And I was really excited because she doesn't think the same way as me with business ideas. She was missing.

She's a nine to five. She likes being told when to start and finish and doesn't like too much turbulence in the air and would prefer just to have a lunch break in between 12 and 1 and tell me to come back and we'll work our head off and goes away and thankfully forgets to let go of her work. But she had this idea and I said, let's go. You would be brilliant at being behind this brand and essential oils. I know exactly the person to talk to. And we went in to see my roaster who I had at the cafe for seven, eight

years down in Geelong. His mother was a tea, is a tea sommelier and world-renowned tea master, globally. Wow. Known her forever. I thought she'd be a great person to start with. She also said she spent a lot of time up in NT and back in the mid nineties and learned a lot about botanicals and native ingredients, indigenous plants and fruits. It was just a good timely little conversation so I handed my wife over to her and they were sitting in this beautiful tea shop in Geelong and I kind of let them talk and was wandering around and looking at all the kind of tea range she's got oolong stuff from China she's got Madagascan tea this thing's like a little mini Willy Wonka factory it's so small just smelling I was about to say it smelled good

unbelievable smells of you've never smelt before tea being presented the way I knew coffee was being presented for so long. It was beautiful and finesse-y and a bit snobby and colourful and vibrant and loud and exciting. It was, I never thought tea would be exciting. I never thought tea is exciting. Just a cuppa, isn't it? Boring. English breakfast, Aussie or grey. Put your pots in. Very British. I don't like it. It's not strong enough. No caffeine. Herbals, hippies. Nah, I'm not doing it. You can't get, you cannot get me to like matcha no matter how hard you try. Tasted matcha at the moment, you know, like... No, sorry.

I didn't even care. I didn't even care. That is like drinking agriculture. Remember grass shots back in the 90s? I mean, we've gone through phases. No, sorry, you mentioned Janine Ellis before. She had me convinced I needed wheatgrass. Like, sorry, this...

Right. No, you're all deliberate. And, yeah, exactly. Sharon, she had this little, just a small little section of teas that's had pictures of Ayers Rock or a kangaroo tail on it. I'm like, it's odd. It's a bit odd. I picked it up and it was like hibiscus, lemon myrtle.

I asked her what was going on. Hey, just, you know, can I interrupt your little essential oils in my life over here? What are you doing? But I've got. What's this? You're like the kid in the tea shop, literally. It's still down the left-hand corner.

Like, what is this? Yeah. And she's like, oh, it's native ingredients. Like, we get a lot of international clients coming through asking for something truly Australian. Yeah. And so she developed this range and very small range and I went away and thought about it for a day or two and rang her back the next day

and just said, hey, about that tea range that you got down there, would you be up for developing some more? How much money do I need? What would that look like? What do I have to do? And she said, don't worry, we'll lend you the blends. I'll develop some stuff for you. You can come in and taste it and try it and you just come up

with a brand name and, Troy, I think you'd be absolutely spectacular in this space with your coffee networks, she saw something in me doing that and just the style of brands or businesses that I've ran and the energy behind tea. I think she saw the pairing of me being my energetic, vibrant self, lending it to a native Australian tea business. She called me two days later. She goes, how's that brand going?

Have you got it? Because I've got the blends. I'm like, you're joking me. We went in there to try these blends. They were red. They were green with finger lime. There was all these things. ago, this is incredible. I'm going to try and get this off the ground. I contacted Nara Millie,

a great organization down in Geelong that supports First Nations entrepreneurs to get off the ground. I had already a base skillset, which was helpful, but I still didn't know how to develop a product. We took maybe 5,000 teabags up to the Gringy Freedom Festival, which is where my wife's country is up in just south of Darwin. That was our first run of teabags. And this was a the No Power campground with, it was an anniversary, Paul Kelly was up there and it was that From Little Things, Big Things Grow song by Paul Kelly. I say that so often on the show, so often.

That's about my wife's uncle. I sing it all the time. It's actually. Vincent Lingari. Oh, my God. Vincent Lingari is my wife's family. So we're up at this festival with 5,000 teabags, Aussie Brekkie, Kakadu Sunset, Desert Sunrise, popping them in.

You are selling this, by the way. You are so good at this. I'm in. I'm in. I want whatever you've got to sell right now. We're popping it in campfires. Billy Cans, there's all Winnebago's, because it's all no power. So everyone's got all the gear, all the pots,

they've got kettles and stuff, and there's campfires. I said, this is my new tea company. It's called Black Brews. And I was emceeing that festival as well. So I was getting up there. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, smart man. I was the guy. Who wants a free packet of Aussie breakfast?

We had all the camp vans coming up asking for more tea, knocking on our van going, we want some more tea. No joke, no joke. That's so cute though. The product worked. With no brand, the product worked. I went back to Shaz and said, I think we're going to go all in on this. Yeah.

That's how Black Brews was born. I stole it off my wife. I don't know if you stole it. It was adjacent. It was wife adjacent. We were in the same room. Hey, look, it's free for all out there in the entrepreneurial world. You said nothing about tea and everything about essential oils.

Sorry. By the way, I did go ahead and invest in her and bought her one of these ridiculous distillers from the Ukraine that took three months to get here and it has not been used. All right, all right, all right. Sorry, I've got to have her back for a hot second. She's busy supporting her husband. Well, exactly right.

This is where the life went. So we'll get there one day. I love it. All right, let's take a really quick break. And guys, stick around because when we come back, we're going to unpack, hopefully, some of the secrets behind Black Brew's success. You mentioned before that Gordon Ramsay entered the chat

and the advice that I think you guys are going to want to write down. So don't go anywhere. All right. We are back with very special guest, Troy Benjamin. And honestly, we've just heard how Black Bruce came to life and it's a lot more magical than, oh, I just thought I'd start a tea brand. I'm sorry. You're saying like a Kakadu sunset. Like I'm there. I'm there. But I think let's go a little bit further behind the scenes. You've had some incredible mentors. You mentioned before this incredible tea sommelier, Sharon, I believe that's Sharon Johnson to all the way through to, and I don't want to focus on this because I don't think it makes it, but like

pretty cool. Gordon Ramsay enters the chat at some point, right? How important do you think that mentorship genuinely is and what does collaboration in these spaces look like for business? Like what did that support actually look like behind the scenes? Cause like the shiny stuff of oh my god like Gordon Ramsay and your tea brand great but like what's happening in the background is that stuff actually really helpful it's been my life you know we talked about it at the start there from a family survival mode collaboration was happening this is what it looks like absolutely what it looks like identifying that you don't know what to do admitting it making it slightly public so going outside of just I'm embarrassed to talk about this can I

please ask for help to actually going, look, this is where I need help because most people out there, what I've learnt, the Sharons and the Gordons and the many great families that we've been around most of my life who I call my family friends, they're so willing to help. They wish you asked earlier. Do you notice that when you ask for help? They go, I wish you told me this earlier.

I would have been all in. I could have helped you. Why do you struggle? Why did you put up with that? Why do we struggle to ask for help? Because we think it's a reflection. of our inability to do something when it's not. Like, sorry, everyone says it takes a village

until it comes to asking the village. Right. The village isn't meant to be asking you all the time, what about now? And we've all got to be villagers as well. And I think we all want to be villagers, right? Like we all want to help each other, but I can't help you if I don't know what you want to help with.

I think that's spot on, you know. There's also a case for saying you're asking for too much help. Now, that sounds really bad, but are you doing anything by yourself? You know, you can ask for help without trying. I say this often, but to be part of the village and benefit from the village, you need to be a villager as well. I think so. It needs to go back and forth.

It's not like you just went out to your community and took, because I can almost guarantee that that would have shut down really quickly. Yeah, I think so. Like people would have stopped extending help and been like, oh, we really believe in you, Troy, to Troy's at it again. Yeah. Do you know what I mean?

Totally. It's reciprocal and it didn't have to be financial. It could have been like even just in you emotionally supporting people And caring, like it's so much more than just like, oh, I lent 10 bucks from him so if he ever came to me, we could definitely give him a hand. Like it's not like that. That's not community or I don't think it's community.

Yeah, I agree. You can take too much, you know. You can. It is a such thing. Yeah, and, you know, I've been through life where I could see that people stopped answering my calls or maybe I lost some friendships or relationships going, I think it was a bit too selfish and I wasn't doing enough in my own capacity.

But either way, the people that you mentioned, the Sharons and the Gordons, and there's many other people to talk about actually on that journey, but they're definitely the key roles. I talk about it in my speech at the NAIDOC thing. It's probably the first time I've really made an effort to use a platform and I'm going to talk about it again today. I'm glad you brought it up.

It's collaboration, working with someone, asking for help. Who can start something or live without it? I don't know many people even if you had a trillion dollars I mean you still don't know everything and money and if you think you do you're about to run into a very large brick wall I think so and you know I don't know what it's like to be the rich and famous like you know but I don't particularly love the thought of it to be honest like if I could pay for something I probably I might I might I might go well pay someone to do that I like the idea of the you You know, how often do you speak to entrepreneurs and go,

you've got to love the process. Gary Vee talks about it all the time. The process. It's about the journey, not just the destination. If you don't enjoy the process, it's not going to work. Like you're just pleasing other people and you might not please the end consumer. It's a pretty dangerous road to play.

So if you don't enjoy doing it, like if you don't enjoy the process, if you don't enjoy the grind, having meetings without getting paid and going and asking tea blenders, can you lend me $70,000 worth of tea because I'm about to be on a TV show I've got no idea about. Can we get up to the Freedom Festival and take 5,000 teas? Because I've got no idea if even anyone likes this tea. That wouldn't have ever, ever, ever happened without someone else, first of all agreeing, but without me asking.

I wouldn't be here. No, but that has led you to this part of the journey, right, where you've just won the Innovation Award at this year's NAIDOC Awards, which massive congrats. Like that's just so cool. We were talking about it before and I was like, did you think you'd win? You're like, on one hand, yes.

On the other hand, no. Like I think that every successful business owner and continuously successful business owner always has that level of imposter syndrome. Oh, probably true. We always feel like we're maybe like not meant to be in the room. Like you're in the wrong room or like the people that you're surrounded by are doing better or being better or smarter or whatever.

and I think that that is literally what you are encompassing you're like oh I don't know and I'm like dude you won like yeah what is that like because the presenters of that award said we hear the word innovation and we just think of tech and apps and big business and for the NAIDOC awards it actually really refers to cultural innovation and not being afraid to do things differently so when we look at black brews what do you think makes that stand out as being innovative yeah it's a great question because tea is not new it's the second most drank beverage in the world behind water above coffee I don't know if many people know that but I'm capped out I'm sorry I can only drink two coffees a day before I'm a shivering mess and I love my coffees um so

I do have teas to fill the gap um and I love it but I get it I see it the pot of tea like if I go to my nan's house first thing she'll ask do you want a cup oh it's beautiful isn't it it's beautiful so cute well that's the whole point of why I thought black brews would work but how was I going to make it different because we've got origin of the last 230 years the kettle being on the benchtop with a Tetley's or a whatever tea you're getting a hold of you weren't going down and looking at the varietals of the herbal teas. We're just grabbing the red twining spots, yeah? Yoink, seven bucks, 100 teabags, I'm set, you know.

Money win, that's a good deal. It's really good. Aldi's got so ridiculous teas. But then I thought about, we just came off the referendum around the same time as this tea, our tea brand was kind of becoming something and I hadn't really made up my mind yet about why are we different and, you know, I knew the product was great because we went through putting it in campfires.

I knew I had the backing of Shaz. I knew I had the product but what was our our why and you know when someone asked me things like this I had to work out something and very quickly I because it was on the back of the referendum and I was just getting really sad about just people not getting along it was just a provocative time where for whatever reason the reason wasn't good enough by the way but we just weren't getting along it just weren't getting along we weren't listening we weren't talking to each other Even non-Indigenous people, they would disagree. It was just all kind of a mess and I thought what's truly Australian?

What is Australian? Like you put on your Facebook or something at the end of this thing, what is truly Australian? It's crazy. People are crazy though. We are all over the shot. We're a mess. I don't know if it's the same in other countries but, oh,

well, it's mateship. Well, I don't know. What's that even mean to you? Does that define, are we? Are we the leader? You know, what is truly proudly Australian? and like something exclusive, a hill's hoist, you know, I know that. A jar of Vegemite.

Vegemite, yeah. At least we're on the same thought pattern here. It's limited, you know. Yeah, absolutely. Like we're going to say the same thing probably in the first five items. And it's stereotypical. Isn't it? You go overseas and, you know, you travel over Indonesia and Aussie, Aussie, Aussie.

You rode kangaroos to school, yeah? Yeah, of course, of course, of course, of course. Yeah, I rode one here down the highway. That's how you got to the pod studio today. It's just average. I just felt like that was maybe a potential missed opportunity in our society. So what unifies us?

And we talk about that. What can be unified? And I just felt a bit lost about it. Maybe it's this tea brand. Let's talk about this tea. It's Australian. It's from this land. We all share this land.

You can love it if you want because you've had a humble cup of tea with your grandma before. Cups of tea, there's nothing new about it. It's got a fantasy, old, rich history with your mum. My mum used to get calls on the phone all the time when the old landline was around and, yeah, munchie here, C and 5, kettle on, someone's on the front porch for 30 minutes. Why doesn't that happen anymore?

I remember my parents would just have people drop by. The drop-in's gone. The drop-in doesn't exist anymore and, you know what, I feel like it offends people somehow. They're like, why would you drop into my house? And I'm like, you're like, I grew up with people dropping in your mum being like, oh, don't worry, there's more than enough dinner to go around because my mum did not have the capacity

to cook for only four. Like that was not a thing. Don't worry. You want to come over for dinner? There's shitloads of curried sausages. Pots and pots. I just felt like, you know, all these kind of things about who we were as a country at that time was stirring up a need for,

again, and usually entrepreneurs can say that they find a spot in the market that needs to be fixed. And I think from a very personal experience at that time going through those situations and growing up as an Aboriginal man in Geelong and throughout Australia and travelling over the world, Australian culture is missing a certain part of it to be talked about in a super positive way, super positive. I'm not, I'm personally just not interested in highlighting negative stuff

just as my own personal choice. It's a good way to live, I think. But, you know, there's people out there talking about everything that's wrong. Let's talk about what's right. and I thought this tea could be really unique in captivating palates. Let's talk about the tea first and then we'll talk about why do you love the tea. Well, did you know that's like Australian, a super herb called lemon myrtle? What?

And these people that own it, they're Aboriginal. You know, like that was what I thought would be a really good leading presentation to becoming something special that all Australians would like. Yeah, I adore it. I just feel like having researched you, having researched the brand, the authenticity from you oozes out of that brand. Like the innovation came from that idea. You can feel it in you being like, no, I want to focus on the good.

And I think that I'm not, I don't know, I've publicly said before that I think the concept of manifestation is bullshit, but I also think that when you surround yourself by something and you focus on the good, you start to see more good and it starts to compound and then all of a sudden when you do see bad, you're like, I'm not here for that. I'm here for this. And it does change your perspective and it does change the way

you approach things and how you cultivate these relationships and connect and collaborate and grow and innovate. Like, well, honestly, it just makes sense that you won. To me, that makes absolute sense. And to talk about kind of, yeah, about the positive stuff, people blame social media. Well, go to your feed right now and double tap three or four feeds that are positive and it will change your algorithm. Unfollow the ones that are negative. Unfollow or don't like them or don't spend time commenting on something because that's channeling your

algorithm to be all this kind of stuff. If you don't want to see stuff about war and you don't want to see stuff about stuff that's happening in schools or the news told this and I heard like just don't follow those things and you can very quickly change you feel different doesn't mean you're being ignorant of what's around you but we need more champions and innovative creative thinkers like you're doing in the positive space because people are don't know where to find it they're looking for it and they just need a good just a pivot away from it because um I need more cat videos, you know? I know.

More videos of cats doing dumb stuff. If you've got room for a rescue dog, go start there. It changed my life, by the way, rescuing my dog. It changed my life. What's your dog's name? My dog's, the one that I rescued. You've got two, don't you? I've got two.

Derek's the OG. Oh, Derek is a good dog name. Derek's a good name. Everyone goes, yeah, he's a human. He's a Derek. He's a Derek. Sorry, it's a whippet, isn't he? He's a whippet.

Looks like, sorry, that is whippet through and through. He got rescued. Dude, he got captured up from a pound and his leg was hanging off. His right leg was hanging off. He got put down an anonymous shoot out in rural Victoria and one of the people that worked there saw that he was not meant to be. He was very well trained. And so I looked after him for a month while his leg was healing

from hip dysplasia surgery. And I mean this truly. It changed my life because I was just a bit selfish at that time. I just sold my cafe, thought I was just like get out of my way. I don't want to speak to you. cutting people off too quickly like you're annoying or you're negative out you know I was just I was too ruthless you can get a bit too ruthless in sometimes your pursuit of what you want and uh it's something I've kind of grown to learn a bit more about but my dog made me love

something that to be honest like I don't think I'd I don't know what pooch loves they don't pay rent they're never gonna pay their bills they live in your house so badly and you need to go for a walk it got me out walking to the park I started getting to know my community I was meeting great people that other people had rescued dogs and essentially it put me on this kind of loving journey which I sadly. My husband and I say that you actually just can't trust people who don't like dogs. I think I agree. If my dog doesn't like you by the way there's something off with you not with my dog. Yeah it's I totally get that. But I'm a very big dog person in fact my dog is best friends with our barista and our barista has trained our dog to like him the most. What do

you mean you're going to give my dog ham most of the time that she comes to your window? Treats, treats. He is a genius. We've got a lady in the park I rode at the moment that I can't throw the ball anymore because she's got little smackos in her pocket. So I've got to look out the window. She knows she's game.

Yeah, cool. Well, we're not going to the park because otherwise my dog won't run. My dog won't run. Treat lady's going to ruin the game and my dog needs an actual run, not a snack. Yeah. I low-key love that. It's beautiful.

Troy, you've run so many different types of businesses. You've been doing e-com and hospitality and events and hire. What would be your biggest piece of business advice for our community? And is there any specific advice you would give to our First Nations listeners and our First Nations community? I can only speak, again, from experience. You know, I've got to be really careful at times because quite often you get asked, what do Aboriginals think about this?

And for my First Nations listeners, that's not what I'm trying to say here. I'm not saying all Aboriginal people should be doing this. Troy. my experience has been asking for help. And I know it's, we talk about in community, shame job, you know, that's how we call it, shame job. The word shame, shame's on so many standard living pathways in Aboriginal communities because we don't have,

and I think this has got to do with it and maybe I'll be corrected, but we don't have an uncle to go to that's in a better position than your mum and dad. We don't have a grandfather with inheritance that is going to give you a home. You know what I mean? Like our economic power is really, really low. No, you are at a financial disadvantage because of the way colonisation happens.

It's just the way it is. It is the way it is and it's really shit and it's something that we wish we could change but we can't change generational wealth. No. But what we can do is look into the future. Exactly right. So it's cool to say cool where I have to ask probably a stranger then. I have to.

I've had to ask complete strangers, people that I've only maybe just met six months earlier for money or can I lend 50 bucks to put food on my table this week because I'm investing all my money in this idea or something and business isn't for everyone by the way my wife looks at me sometimes she said I do not know how you do this she's not that type of my husband thinks I'm a delusional you're a nutter like it's a right old nutters world it's very yin and yang though remember yeah totally totally I would not be here without my supportive wife like the team the team's the best having a team's the best but I definitely think if you've got a thirst for doing making a difference and you lose sleep at night over something or you

want to do something about it I reckon go for it if there's something that really churns you and you you're like I've got to do something about this because I'm sick of watching it just no one doing anything then you might be the next person in line yeah and you don't know until you have a crack. And if you don't ask, you don't get. And I always talk about this concept of grit. You don't have to be the smartest. You don't have to be the richest. You don't have to be any of that. You just have to be the person that's willing to get up after the first person says no and go, all right, well, that's not a reflection on me. That's a reflection on them. I'm going to try again and again and again. Cause if you believe in your idea, it can grow. And like, I always say this

to our community, like if you cannot find a resource, ask me, come to the She's on the money community group source it like we have 300 000 people in our facebook group post in there like you'll get a lot of unsolicited advice but some of it is gold the amount of times i've written grant applications for people because i'm like do you know what i don't even know who can do it and please don't message me to write your application because like i've opened up a wormhole but like you know when you're just like give it to me i don't know like i don't know who else can help you with this but i know that i'm pretty good with words and i reckon we could get this across the line but like yeah find people who are in your corner yeah because me having done that for

random people on the internet that i go i've seen your instagram and stuff that looks like you do you should get that five thousand dollar grant i'm not saying i can do that for everybody but like if you don't start reaching out to your community how are you gonna know that it's a possibility and the reject like be okay rejection hurts i won't lie it hurts it starts and every time you think it's a reflection of you and it's not. It's okay. That's okay. It just means that person wasn't helpful. Also, they might not have seen your value. And if they can't see your light and they can't see your value, maybe we didn't want to work with them in the first place. Yeah, that's okay. There's another, how many other billion people on the earth? Like you're going

to hit gold one day, one person, it might be a hundred down the track or a thousand. It could be people are there. The right person's around the corner. There's too much resources and empathy and love and sharing in this world. You just haven't asked the right person yet. I would just keep asking and get comfortable with asking and don't be embarrassed. And also take your time, take your time, take your time. Just because you got a few no's and someone else went out and started,

like there's other tea companies out there now, like there's other tea companies out there. It doesn't bother me. I love it. Good on them. There's enough for everyone. This is a wild, wild world. Tea might not be popular in a minute.

Like you said, matcha. where did matcha come from all of us it's been around forever and it was really popular when i started a cafe in 2010 and now it's raging on signature drink like sorry you're gonna have your turn again you guys just like drinking agriculture and i find it weird you know i'm drinking grass powder yeah i just drunk at it it's not good tea it's funny isn't it and when people are like oh but have you had this specific matcha from this specific place and then i'm like well that you like that because it's with strawberry milk like you don't like you don't like matcha you like strawberry jam babe it's grammable it's all this kind of stuff it's got color in it and stuff but

genuinely like I hate kind of thought of me thinking that I've got the position to give advice but I truly truly truly did come from nothing not like nothing and just the ability to ask for help that is my superpower I love it I think anyone can you'd be amazed if you asked your best mate who maybe you've never told before that you've got this wild idea and it's embarrassing but maybe your best mate might laugh at you or they might love it but either way if they don't laugh at you a little bit though they're probably not your best mate and you might you know what you might get something your mate that goes I don't think you really should be doing that I think you need to kind of save up more money you don't have to agree with them no you can go well cool good

idea. Maybe ask another five. I've got so many more people in my corner that say, go for it, go for it. And I'm still, I'm asking, you talk about grant writing. We've had to do a lot of grant writing or award application stuff like this. People don't knock on the door. It's a pain in the butt and I hate it and I hate it so much. So I ask people to do it and I don't pay them, but I give them something they love because they love helping, but they might come into my coffee shop and get free kangaroo sausage rolls and macarons and native brownies all of a sudden. Oh, sorry, I would have done it for a coffee.

Like, sorry, that's an upgrade. There's ways you can do business. So you're saying I shouldn't have just done it for free and be like, no, babe, like I knew what I was doing. Vouchers. Okay, okay, okay, I'm negotiating. I don't know. I hope people take this really seriously what we're saying.

I think they will. Because we've been told this before, haven't we? Ask for help. We still don't do it. No, no. but it's nice to hear from other successful business owners that that's the advice and unfortunately we are very quickly running out of time with you which I'm so frustrated about because I'm like this could go on for ages yeah but I feel like you've achieved so much and like

you were saying before like you know I've literally come from nothing and I've built all of this and you've done all of that in a relatively short period of time the fact that Black Brews came out of COVID that wasn't that long ago but I have a sneaky suspicion like you've got a lot more in your tank like you aren't the type of guy you just don't come across as the type of person you're like well guess I've been successful I'm just gonna step back now what's next for you what's next for Black Bruce we want to become the most drinkable tea on the planet no you know that's okay just like small goals that's all good it's our north star I want to keep I adore it I really do you know we took north stars are important but the most drinkable tea on the entire planet

That means get it, guzzle it. I'm obsessed. Match up, not drinkable. Pinky down. Pinky down when you drink our tea. It's nothing fancy. We're wild. We're outback.

You're probably going to get your... My 16-month-old holds his drink bottle like this. I get it's about balance and stuff. He's not your target demographic. We just want to dominate the world and make all of Australians proud when they travel overseas that they can say something other than Vegemite and Hell's Hoist. They can say Black Bruise.

That's us. That's me. That's us. That's me. I'm obsessed. Troy, thank you so much for joining She's On The Money and sharing your story and being so authentic. I have, I'm obsessed.

I love this and I know that my community is going to love it just as much as I have. So thank you so much. You're more than welcome. Thanks for having me. The advice shared on She's On The Money is general in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's On The Money exists purely for educational purposes

and should not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision. If you do choose to buy a financial product, read the PDS, TMD and obtain appropriate financial advice tailored towards your needs. Victoria Devine and She's On The Money are authorised representatives of MoneySherpa PTY LTD ABN 321 649 27708 AFSL 451 289. you