Should I Delete That? - Just Us: The brilliance of Lily Allen, Nelly Furtado’s retirement and Al’s melancholy playlist

Episode Date: October 30, 2025

We’ve had a busy week being completely and utterly obsessed with Lily Allen’s new album - West End Girl - and we mean TRULY OBSESSED. We unpack Lily’s radical honesty on the album which narrates the breakdown of her marriage. We dive into her cultural trailblazer status - and just how brave she is to put her relationship under the microscope...Our pop-culture chat continues - as we discuss Nelly Furtado’s retirement from music and the way people have tied her decision to leave music to recent body-shaming headlines. Is it taking the narrative away from her? And why is the music industry so toxic for “older” women? Do you have thoughts on Lily or Nelly? We want to hear from you - email us on [e-mail] us on Instagram:@shouldideletethat@em_clarkson@alexlight_ldnShould I Delete That is produced by Faye LawrenceStudio Manager: Elliott MckayVideo Editor: Celia GomezSocial Media Manager: Sarah EnglishMusic: Alex Andrew Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello, MacArthur to delete that. I'm Alex Light. And I'm in Clarkson. How are you? I'm good. I'm good. David Harper's not good. David Harper's not good. I think I'm much better than David Harper. I'm obsessed. Are you? Well since you told me. I'm so, I am so excited to hear you say that. You know me? I'm quite good at letting a pop culture moment. passed me by. Yeah, I do know that. But you told me to get involved. So reluctantly, I was like, oh, fine, I will. And now I'm like, oh my God, this is like groundbreaking stuff. I am so relieved. For listeners who don't have a clue what we're talking about, Lily Allen released a actually, oh my God, I could talk about this forever. She's released a new album, West End Girl. It is so fantastic. It is an in-depth, beautiful piece of narration explaining in minute detail how David Harbour is a knob. I was expecting like symbolism. I was expecting like I think that's what

how Taylor Swift does it right, like symbolism like X. That is not Lily Allen style. No it is not. She's just full on giving the, she's just giving it all away. And it's brilliant. everything. This is why I'm obsessed with her. And whether or not you like her music, you have got to respect the storytelling. Like, it is. If you listen to that album, track by track, she tells such an extraordinary story of a marriage breakdown. And of her, she's so self-well, I could literally, how long have you got? Because I could just talk about it. I could talk about it. As you know, I adore Lily Allen. But I could do this. I could do this for day. I've never been so excited by an album in my life ever. It's amazing.

Should you know what? And I didn't think I was going to get excited either. And I am genuinely excited. When she says, who the fuck is Madeleine? My job. Next track is Madeline. Yeah. That line when she goes, we can talk about Madeline in a minute.

But when she says in that in the song Madeline, genuinely it's like the first time it's happened. The last time this happened to me was when I listened to Charmaine by Plan B. And the last line of that was the last time I audibly gasped while listening to music. But listening to this album. listening to this track and she says, you know, we had an arrangement, there had to be payment, they had to be strangers. Pause, but you're not a stranger, Madeline. My jaw, I was like, what? I was so excited by the charade of it all. Is it just me being very pop culture

unaware in this sense? Or has this come out of nowhere? Out of nowhere. Did we know that she was releasing new music, that she had a new album? I feel like I had no. I know she was doing a podcast a while back with Makita Oliver. She's been doing Miss Me, the podcast. I mean, I follow Lily Allen. Yeah. I'm not, I've got two babies. I can't, you know, I'm not like following,

but I follow her with relative interest and I had no idea this was coming. So, you know that time where she was a couple years ago? She was in a play in London. Yeah, yeah. And she was pictured at the stage door in all of these incredible outfits. Do you remember? At what point do you think that was in their relationship? And do you think that? Because I always remember thinking like she, it's not, it's unusual for

actors to come out of the stage door like that. They've just done this like ruling play that's like taken two hours or two and a half hours, whatever. Usually they're tired. They come out. They slip straight into their taxi. But she, I remember her coming out in these incredible outfits. Like, I think she ended up in Vogue. Let's chat. Because of them. Okay. So I'm like, did that coincide with something? So yes, the first song on the album is called West End Girl and it's about because Lily Allen is literally allergic to subtlety like she's just got to tell you exactly how it happened which is why I adore her West End Girl is she gets the call she gets cast in a play okay she eludes there at the end of the song to him starting to neg him putting her down a bit for that right that's

half of that there is then a photograph now people have found it obviously sleuths on the internet have found a photograph of him at the play I think it was opening night. And I can't remember exactly what the sign said. Do you mind finding it? He sent her flowers of a note on saying, my ambitious wife, these are bad luck flowers. Because if you get reviewed well in this play, you will get all kinds of awards and I will be miserable, your loving husband. Well, that's very, I liked that a lot. Can we do that? I liked that a lot. What's a horrible. Well, quite. That is horrible. Quite. So with the, take your flowers. I'd rather not have any flowers. That's horrible. And I think people do this, you know, at the time where they go,

obviously just their humor, that's their love language. That's just who he is. Ha, ha, ha, ha, quirky. Obviously, we go all this information. Now we look at that and go, oh, God, he was awful. Anyway, she then goes, I mean, going through the tracks,

we go through them quickly. In West End Girl, she's doing that play. She gets a call from him, basically saying he slept with somebody else. And she needs to be fine with it. That's kind of how, you don't hear his side of the call.

You hear her side of the call. And it's him saying, I've slept with someone else. We then go through. We've got ruminating. sleepwalking and it's about this and it's and there are lyrics in these songs along the lines of if it has to happen do you want to know him saying that to her and now she's sober so she talks about how this affects her sobriety how she internalizes a lot of it sleepwalking maybe my favorite song on the other night there's so many possibles but love sleepwalking and so this bit is kind of the

initial, like he's just started sleeping with other women. Then there's tennis, another amazing song. Then there's Madeleine, right? And it's clear that he had been sleeping with other women as part of an arrangement. He'd sort of said, our marriage is open. I'm going to be with sex workers, whatever. And then he starts having an affair, an affair affair. And it's clearly he's in love with Madeline. From what I've seen online, from lyrics in this album, maybe they had a baby together. She has a child, apparently. Madeline? Apparently.

A recent child? A two and a half year old. This is just what I've seen online though, so I don't know. Again, I'm following it like in the context of I've got two kids and a job. So I'm just picking up on stuff, you know. But listening to the lyrics as an insinuation in one of the songs, he's talking about vasectomies. She's questioning, have you got someone pregnant? She's obviously wondering who Madeline is.

She then talks, I mean, what a title. She's got non-monogamami as one of the albums. Talking about getting on the dating. at how he's sort of pushing her to have this over relationship she's then got she went by dallas major on the apps and she's talking about being nearly 40 and she's a mum of teenagers and she's now got to go out looking for men because her husband wants her too i just the woman it's just unbelievable oh my god so the album like it's incredible i was like god this is a lot of this is this is a lot and then i've now can't stop listening to

it and i feel like i'm listening to just the most incredible story in the world. This is such a bad time for David Harbour. Except, except, and this is what I want to talk to you about. So Lily Allen shots fired, right? Yeah. The woman, she just says it. It's just so cool.

The Daily Mail yesterday, and this is not an accident, he's been papped. Right. With her kids somewhere. I don't know. Oh, wow. There is, and I mean, he has been stepdad to them. We don't want to complicate, you know, I don't want to. stick my nose in too much and involve her children.

Okay. But I think that's probably a very deliberate thing on the part of his PR team. She's off promoting an album and here he is being doting dad. Yeah. And there's so much dirt being dug on her, so much pro him being. There will be. I mean, obviously just adjusted in the Daily Mail. But I think that's quite interesting.

His PR team will be scrambling. Scrambling. They've got a very big job to do. We all know about the bot plugs. They've got a big hill. to climb, I saw that. Yeah. Luben blobs and loads of Trojans.

Oh, yeah. We know what's in his bedside draw. Fuck. We know too much, except for Lily Allen's in such thing. You could argue that we do know a bit too much. Do you think you're trying to sue her? No. No.

No. But it begs me, and it begs an important question I'd like to put to you. What right have we, as artists, we aren't artists, but what right have artists in general got to their stories in this context? Was she right to use Madeleine's name? Was she right to err all with this? Did she owe him anything? Did she owe Madeline anything?

Should she have done this differently? Or is this just fair fucks? What do you think? Okay, well that was a lot of questions. We go one by one. I think she has every right to, of course she has every right to tell her story. And I think it's entirely up to her whether she feels like she owes those people or not. I don't think we can answer that for her.

Do you think it's unkind? Again, I think only she can work that out. Because only she's experienced what she's experienced with him and with Madeleine. Because I've unpicked, unpucked a lot of this in my head. And I was like, right, am I a hypocrite? That two weeks ago, I'm sitting in this room saying, Taylor's West shouldn't have done a disc track, right? Like, don't involve other girls.

Don't involve other women. There's just, am I a hypocrite for saying that, and I didn't really say it like that, but I sort of questioned whether there's place on an album for a track dissing another woman. Different context though, because Charlie XX, I believe, didn't actually do anything like tangible to Taylor Swift rather than like maybe not like her very much. But whereas it sounds like Madeline has had a little bit more involvement. Yeah. So I think Lillian has more of a right to that than Taylor Swift maybe with Charlie XX feeling like, oh, she doesn't like me kind of thing.

Yeah. It feels deeper. Yeah, yeah. I feel like Madeline deserves it a bit more. Yeah, it's interesting then because then I start thinking, do we, are we judging the other woman? Should this not be all on him? All at his feet.

Yeah. I'd argue this quite a lot at his feet. Yeah. He can probably share the load a bit. Can't walk that far as that much at his feet for a minute, yeah. Yeah, see, I want to know the full story on Madeline because. Well, she, I mean. Madeline, Lily's friend.

Is that what, is that what she's getting at when she's like, Madeline, we weren't a stranger? You aren't a stranger? You weren't a stranger. I think that, I think it's saying it's not a stranger to him. Madeline is someone to him. So she thought the open relationship initially was just about sex with other people. Maybe she could have changed her name. But I feel like Lily Allen isn't the kind of person to change names. She may have done. You know, Madeline may not be Madeline. Yeah. The Daily Mail did a behind their paywall yesterday saying, I'm Madeleine, here's an exclusive. Oh, really? So, I mean, the internet will be on the,

the internet and the, the, the tabloids will be, like, they won't have slept. They will be no rest in Fleet Street. Yeah. Who Madlin is. Yeah, no, they will be, they will be, they will be working hard. They'll be working around the clock. I do feel sorry, unless we're missing something,

I do feel a bit sorry for Madeline, because it probably should just be about him, about David Arbor, because arguably Madeline didn't know, Lily Allen, anything. I mean, I think she knew she was married, so. that, you know, that, sorry, she did know she was married. She did know he was married.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, we're dealing with a very famous. But David Harbour might have said to Madeline, we're in an open relationship. That's what she says in one of the songs. She's reading out texts from Madeline, whether or not they're paraphrase, whether or not the direct.

She's saying in it, you know, that I... You're very familiar with this album. I love it. Yes. No, I don't think I can tell you. I, I, if Spotify Rapp came out tomorrow, I think this would probably be my number one already. The kids have listened to it.

There's one called Pussy Palace, which I find myself singing so much. And I argue that... It's so earwormy. It's so good. And I argue with that, I'm like, it's great. Honest is going to think it's like a house full of cats.

But then there's a few of them that I have one in the kitchen. And then I'm like, I've got to turn that off. Like, I'll have Arla going around going, what's a Trojan? It's so good. It's so good. I cannot stop listening to it. I love your enthusiasm for it, which I have definitely picked up on. It is really good.

She's great. She is great. I never had an appreciation of her earlier music. until you talked about it. I think in our body image series you talked about it. I was like, oh my God. She really was ahead of her time.

She is. She was saying. And so bold and outspoken in an industry. Well, at a time where women really, really weren't allowed to be. Yeah, I will always stand in her corner as, I genuinely, I think she's a trailblazer. I think she's extraordinary. I love her. And I, it's really interesting watching some of the dialogue because she gave away

I mean, Lillianna is a flawed woman. I think she'd be the first to say it, you know, like her, you know, and people really do try and come for her for her things. And they come for her for, you know, she's been open about having had a number of abortions. She's been, she's talked about how she gave up a puppy or gave up a dog. Like, she's obviously had high profile fights with women. You know, she did a whole disc track on one of her first albums about Cheryl Tweedy. But then she, her apology.

Oh, I forgot about that. Yeah, but her apology. She came out and she went, sorry, I hadn't come yet. And that was her apology. She said, like, sorry I was a shitty person. I hadn't, like, and that's what I just fucking love about her. She doesn't care. She'll say the bad thing first, and she'll just, she's so unapologetic.

And she's like, yes, I'm flawed, but I'm also who I am. And she manages to capture the industry, the world. I just think she's amazing. And I read her autobiography, and it was just extraordinary. It was genuinely the best autobiography I've ever read. and she lost a baby, she lost her son in childbirth and she writes about that in the most horrendously honest and beautiful and heartbreaking way

and I just, there's something I admire so much about a woman who is so vulnerable and messy and strong and weak and broken and tired and powerful and complicated. And she lays bare all of it. All of it. Yeah. I just think she's amazing. is she your dream podcast guest your ultimate dream podcast guest i would i simply wouldn't be able to

speak can we make it happen probably not probably not no i think i've made it too weird fay i think i could get her i don't know i think i've made it too weird no i think i could get her do you not after she listens to this she'd be like that one fucking she's weird she likes me too much okay right let's manifest it let's manifest it she's the reason that i haven't worn high heels ever that i wear trainers with everything she made trainers with dresses work. I feel like you're about to stop crying. I probably could. Should we get there? Should we push it? Oh, I don't think it would take much. I could tell you all the songs and all I need to me. Get Lily Allen on the podcast. If anyone's listening who's gotten in with her, although it looks like fame might have a little in with her.

This is where the potential for pain is quite high there because if we've gotten in and then she says no, it's like, it's not that we didn't have an in. It's just didn't want to. She just doesn't want to. So there's an argument there for not letting me be involved in this process because it would hurt too much to be rejected. Let's keep this away from M. Yeah. We'll organise this play ourselves. As far as I'm concerned, no one's reaching out. Okay, so Lily Allen has to come on the podcast.

Okay. I do think she's just, I don't know. I, like, and I... She's fucking brave. That's a really good word for what she is. She's so brave. She's also so fucking talented. She really is, isn't she?

Yeah, she really is. She's such a good writer. So much criticism has been leveled at her Nepo baby and that she's, you know, got no dad. Why is she a nepo baby? Her dad is Keith Allen, an actor. Oh, I didn't know that. Her mum was in the industry, but I'm not sure what she did. And then her brother, Alfie Allen, is in Game of Thrones.

Is he? Did not know this. What rock do you live under? She wrote Alfie, that song on the first album. Yeah, like my little brother was in his bedroom smoking weed, like just talking about how he's just basically whanking and gaming all the time. And then bless him, he went and got the biggest role in the biggest fucking. He's the one that is Willie Locked off in Game of Thrones.

I didn't watch Game of Thrones, so I don't know. I don't know why you, I don't know why you bother. you miss all the good stuff you've got it all on a plate and just pass it by having a podcast no no no no not a podcast just a life just a life you've got all this free will which you could use for this amazing music and this amazing TV and you just missed it all it begs the question what do I do it does beg a question I was going to ask for your Spotify details because I wanted to try and understand you better well I have found a fantastic mix called melancholy mix 101 and it is It's stunning.

It's like it was made for me. It was the most beautiful songs on. What's it made for you? Because Spotify does that, you know. Oh, does it? Yeah. Oh. Oh.

Maybe it was. I did type in melancholy music and then it came up with it. Yeah, I think it might have made that for you. But that's nice. Did it? That was thoughtful of it. Because it was like, God, this is just so me. I feel a bit sad now.

I really, yeah, melancholy music pictures for you. Yeah, it was made for me. It was literally made for me. Oh, God. You are one landline call away from being hacked. Honestly, all the titles are so sad as well. Like death with dignity, nothing's going to hurt you, baby. The funeral is a good song.

I'll give you that. Yeah. When do you listen to these? Like in the morning. When I work, I can't work without music. Does it have to be this music? It does, yeah. Do you think it might change the day a bit if the music were different?

Do you think that would have it? You say that, but I just can't connect to it. any other kind of music. I just can't. I don't like it. It doesn't get to me. I need something to get to me. When you're working, do you need to listen to the words? No, no, no, no, no, no. I could happy listen to just instrumental music. I don't need words when I'm working. Yeah. So why choose these miserable, miserable songs? Did you ever watch scandal? Oh my God, the song, it's called The Light by Album Leaf and the song where they're, you know, they almost get together about a million times.

Yes. The president and Kay Washington. I actually gave up watching it because it was annoying that they didn't just get together. Yeah, it's frustrating, isn't it? It's incredibly frustrating. I'm more time for that. Whenever they have those moments of intimacy, they always play this song, The Light, the light by album move.

Are you sure you didn't just watch the same episode over and over again? It's always their songs. It's crazy. And it's, and there's no words and it's just the most beautiful piece of music in the entire world. I love it. Anyway. What are we going back to?

I would love your, I would love your playlist. Oh, that's energy. For the worst day of my life. My ultimate playlist dies, I will ask for it. If I ever have a terrible day, I'll call you. But that's, it is, it's so funny to me because it's like, it doesn't, those sad songs don't make me sad. Do they make you happy?

I think, I think they do. There might be something wrong. I think they do. I mean, we knew that anyway. I didn't need my playlist to tell me that. To your point on the instrumental music, I, have recently started walking quickly to Hans Zimmer to movie soundtracks. I climbed a mountain. I climbed a mountain in the Alamana a few weeks back and I did it to two epic movie soundtracks on

Spotify. That's stunning. It was yes, in part and incredibly stressful at others. Like as the music builds, I'm not allowed to stop. You're not allowed to stop. I'm running up that thing. Yeah, no. Dave and I went to a candlelight concert with Hans Zimmer's best works. Yeah. Really good. An underrated song of Hans Simmers is definitely the Johnny English theme tune that they did with Robbie Williams, Man for All Susan. Played four times at my wedding. Very big Robbyniz fan. Arguably the best song ever written.

Really? No. It's terrible. I love it. Okay. The DJ at my wedding literally, I think it's like the fourth time. He's like, are you fucking getting it. Interstellar songs are my favourite of Hans Zimmer's.

Oh, they're so stunning. Yeah. I don't think they've ever actually watched Interstellar, but I just know all the songs. It was very, very beautiful. I don't think you need to watch a lot of space films to have seen the space films. Do you know what I mean? Apparently interstellar is a bit like Inception as well It's very meta and very confusing and I definitely wouldn't understand

Is that the one with Matthew McConaug? Yes. And Sandra Bullock? Yes. And they come back down. No, isn't that gravity? When they come back down and bear in mind they've been in space like for I mean fucking ages right? The woman is stunning.

She takes her trousers off when she lands probably because she doesn't need a space suit anymore and in it she's got the most adorable pair of little briefs on And I'm like, how long have you been up there? And you just came through the fucking atmosphere and you didn't shake yourself. Are you kidding me? Like, look at the state of your wonderful body.

Definitely hums. Yeah. Hums. Oh, hongs. Homs, yeah. Homs. I thought you meant like, hmm. I was like, well, stop you shitting yourself.

Hmm. Can I talk to you briefly about, we don't need to deep it, really, just a little bit. Yeah. Nellie Fittardo. Yes. She's quit music. She's retired. She put her.

up an Instagram post saying that she's retired. And everyone is saying that she retired because of body shaming. And I really take issue with it. Do you? I do. Because she's not said that. She has not said that. She said that she was retiring to move up.

And she's 46. I mean, women are allowed to keep going as long as they want. But famously in this industry, it's a tough industry. And especially as you get older, less visibility and it's harder to stay visible, blah, blah. But anyway, she said she's moving on to different projects. And everyone has said that she is moving. They're implying heavily that she is leaving music because of body shaming. And I feel cross on her behalf because I feel like it's stripped her of agency.

It's like she's been pushed to leave rather than she's choosing to leave. And it's kind of more than just twisting her words. It's just, I think it also gives power to the body shaming, right? It gives power to what people said. It's this insinuation that maybe they tapped into something they were right. Maybe she is insecure. Maybe it all is too much. Yeah, it gives them a lot of power where they didn't actually have any.

And that women who don't fit the beauty standard can't be visible in this. Or that would be the only reason. It's a deal breaker. Oh, yeah. So she's bigger now. And that's got to be it. There's no other reason why she'd want to leave. It couldn't possibly be that she'd,

this is a choice. It's got to be because she couldn't hack this industry because she's not fitting the standard anymore. That's the thing. That's the irony of it as well is that they're like oh, you know, this is how cruel body shaming is, which it is. It's very cruel and it's caused a lot of bad things to a lot of people. But like look how cruel it is, poor Nelly. Whereas actually it's just, I feel like it's just like feeding into or like reinforcing the trope that like women only make you know make choices because of how they look or how their bodies are seen I don't know am I deeping it too much no I don't think so there is there is

obviously the the possibility that coming back and I imagine if you leave music age 20 or whatever when it was like the sort of mid-naughties and then you come back into a completely different world where everyone's online it's probably a very different industry there is a chance that she came back looking different into a different world and it probably or maybe, I don't know, maybe it was too much. Maybe it is... Quite possibly.

The noise in general is too much. You know, it's not... Hear hooves, think horses or whatever. Not separas, whatever that expression is. Never heard that. If you hear, if you hear, I would say hoofs wrong, so I'm going to ruin the expression anyway, but if you hear hooves, think horses.

Like, you don't think zebras, like, why are we leaping? No, it's like, if you're hearing hooves, assume it's horses. Don't assume it's zebra's. Like, don't jump to conclusions. It's probably just a horse. Do you know what I mean? Got it.

Yeah. Got it. Yeah. I've butchered it. No, I like it. I like it. I like it. We got there.

You'd have liked it more if I'd have done it right, but I don't know how to do that. So on that, there is a possibility that one plus one equals to. And that like, yeah, it was a really shit summer for her because of the noise that was online. It would be enough for me to stop. Oh, absolutely. But you're right. It does remove any of it. I actually don't know the reason that she left.

I didn't even know there was a statement on Instagram. I completely saw those headlines and thought, oh, well, that's an inevitability then. But reading how it's all been reported on, I would have thought, yeah, she just left. Of course, you would. Because the headline... We couldn't get the page six headline up, could you say, sorry.

I'm going to read her statement, if I may. I have decided to step away from performance for the foreseeable future and pursue some other creative and personal endeavours that I feel would better suit this next phase of my life. I have enjoyed my career immensely and I still love writing music as I've always seen it as a hobby

I was lucky enough to make into a career I'll identify as a songwriter forever I'm grateful, endless gratitude and deeply thank everyone I wish to the new generations of artists years of fruitful and passionate performance thank you and good night Nellie and I just feel like

we're not even letting her leave on her own terms like let her leave on her own terms why are we tying it to how her body looks and I think possibly that's not what people were expecting me to say and probably what do you think people were expecting you to say

that it was because of the body shaming? Well we share the reshare all the headlines like the page six headline which I think was the page six headline is Nellie Fittado quitting music after facing rash of attacks by body shamers they're not wrong

they're not yeah I mean that's technically what's happened it's technically correct but I just I just I just think it's Welcome to Tabloid Journalism well yeah I just think it's I just think it's sad Here are some facts, let me stick them together. Yeah, that we can't just let her, like, leave on her own accord. She's had a huge career in music.

This has been, like, so many years of her life. I mean, if it is, if it is the case that she is leaving because of that, it is such a shame. And I think this all the time about bands, I mean, to looking at Lily Allen, she has transcended eras so seamlessly, except she hasn't because she, and she'll say it herself, album that she did before this one did not land very well. And she talks in her music hard out here, the single that she released hard out here, basically saying it's hard out here for a

bitch and how much easy the music industry is for men. And that's, you know, like a running theme in her music. But she does talk about it in her autobiography. And I've heard to talk a lot about like this album, the sort of last one, not doing very, the one before this, not doing very well. And it is really interesting looking at this industry for, I say, older with my tongue firmly in my cheek but like for you can't do it as long whereas we're watching McFly come back take that

I mean take that everywhere like to take they unbelievable they're down to three now right but they're still going who even care at this point like they're there can be holograms and people will still be going

as long as they take that my guy I will follow them anywhere but they can just keep going and there obviously are a lot of bands that go I don't know loads that will go and have babies for example, go and have families do the family thing for a bit

and then come back and it's no biggie. You know, we're watching I mean, who are still bloody performing but you see, you know, blur will go and do big performances. Oasis are back.

Men can just slip right back in and people put the banties on and here we go. And if anything, they've got more gravitas. Oh yeah. Whereas with women, it's like, I'm a little bit embarrassed watching

they're over the hill, this is desperate. And what, genuinely picture it with me, what would they wear? Like, what would say, satiate our, our, like what would satisfy us as fans. Right. There's, if you wear, let's say, a tunic, let's say a, I don't know, a little middy,

I don't know, like a, you know, like a, like a, like an age appropriate number, right? If we're in the over 25s category on the X factor. Let's say you're wearing, you're wearing something age appropriate, right? Yeah. You're in a mid, that's frumpy. Like over the, that's not what, that's not what who you want to see. I'm boring and exciting. We listen to that music. If I'm thinking Nelly Fittado, I'm thinking man eater. I don't want to watch a woman in a smock dressing in that, right? Because that makes me feel like I should be in one. You know what I mean? Like, what am I? Because that's all they are to us, right? Artists at that level, in that

environment, then we're mirrors. We're all just looking and seeing what we love in ourselves and in that era and there's nostalgia and there's identity. And it's, you know, it's a kind of like beautiful and powerful thing. So what do they wear to get it right? There's nothing a woman can wear. Nothing. Past an age. I mean, at any age, but like past, for a comeback, they can't just wear jeans in a t-shirt. And that's what I actually thought Nellie Furtado has done really well, at least in my eyes, because I feel like she, the impression that I get is she is just like, everyone, fuck off, fuck you all, I'm going to wear what I want, I'm going to do what I want, I'm owning this stage, like my music is incredible and I, you know, she's been wearing things

that you wouldn't deem quote unquote age appropriate. And I love it. I think she's looked great. I think she's, you can see when she's performing, she's having a good. great time and all the fans just fucking love it. It's a really interesting thing because if I think about this a lot, I'm like, right, who else is doing sort of who can do well in that space? Kylie Minogue, I would say, but Kylie Minogue's following, obviously she's like such a, like, gay icon and she's so revered there. And I think there's a level of respect and, and maybe it's because she didn't disappear.

I don't know, but it feels different. Maybe because Nelly Fetado was kind of more male gazee. Yeah. more kind of traditional pop star in that sense. I don't know. Although she went and did like, you know, stuff with James Morrison and she did so much slower

and more serious music. So I don't know. Like, but there is, there's no world in which she was going to get this right where this was going to be an easy thing to do. And I think only because I went to a festival this year where Nellifthado was playing.

And Sophia Lest Bexter was playing too. And maybe I'd put them in a similar category, kind of age-wise, perhaps. And I thought it was really interesting the difference, because I think Sophie has kind of done that, um, quote unquote age appropriate. I hate myself even saying it. But like she, she's kind of evolved with, with the, with, I don't know, she's, she's changed a bit. Um, but I think there are so many factors that allowed that for her. She's, she's remained. kind of high profile, she's been, I don't know, she's done some radio stuff. Yeah, some reality. Solburn.

Celebrity show. Yeah. Saltburn? She was murdering the dance for, had a huge resurgence because of Saltburn. Of course. Which kind of launched her kind of as she wants, right? Like she didn't have to fight.

And I'm not saying she hasn't worked very hard, but she didn't have to fight for the resurgence, right? Because it just happened. And I sometimes think like that where it's like a spotlight just caught her where she was. So she was sitting in her living room or she was at a party wearing whatever she was wearing and in that moment she was captured

and that's where she was launched back into the spotlight, right? So if you're sitting at the kitchen table and that song comes on and then we're on Instagram and it's like, there's Sophia Lus Bex's that that's what she is now. Welcome back. Like here she is. Whereas if you're having to graft at it after time away like Nelly had to or is having to or did have to or whatever

after you've disappeared for a while, it's not as simple as being found. You've got to make yourself findable, right? You've got to make yourself, you've got to identify yourself again. She's a very daunting thing to do because then you have to re-identify. It's so daunting. And re-brand. And I just think she did a fantastic job of it.

So I've been sad to see all of this and I just, I feel like, like, let her go out as she wants to go out. Let's just listen to her. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's interesting, isn't it? But then there's also, you know, I don't hate that there are those headlines because I do want to, I want people to reflect on what they're doing. Because we keep playing with women. We keep playing with the, you know, like, what are we doing here?

there are real life consequences. Yeah. Like, just because this might not be the set of consequences in this situation. Yeah. Like, don't be fooled. There are, like, very real life consequences of being body shamed. And this is the reason that female pop stars have a shelf life. This is the reason that the industry is completely skewed.

Like, whether or not that's why she left, it's that they are still facts, right? Man. Oh, man. What a, what I do. What I do. I could talk about the music industry. I'm fascinated. I'm pleased I got my lily chat.

Please think we can get a music industry insider in to talk to us. or like an ex-music industry insider, that would be really cool. On the, on what? On all of it, I want to, I want to know so much. I want to talk costumes. I want to understand costumes. Maybe like a whistleblower from Psycho. Oh, I love that.

Oh, Slay, you need one of those X-Factor exposos. I do. I really do. I think we should all just sit with ourselves for the rest of the day and really feel a kind of way about the over 25s category. Because I don't think we think nearly enough about that. I know, it's a horrific over 25. The way I used to think those people had libraries.

cards and bus passes and Zimmer frames. Literally. It's like, well, that's it. When I hit 25, I felt so over the hill. Well, I'm not surprised. You had to go in a whole category, and Louis Walsh was going to look after you for a little bit. It was always Louis Walsh.

Of course it was. He had great hair. He was also over 25. Extraordinary. Guys, we're going to love and leave you, but this has been really fun. You know where I'm going to go? You know what I'm going to listen to you now? What, Lily Allen?

Duh. Obviously. Or you could listen to Mel. Unclawly Mix, model one, I'll send it to you. Okay, we got to go. See you guys next week. All right, love you. Bye.

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