Should I Delete That? - Life with alopecia- “I was 13 when I started losing my hair”

Episode Date: March 13, 2023

This week, the girls chat to Laura Mathias. Laura was 13 when she started losing her hair. No one could help her – not her mum, her friends or even her doctor. She was told, as a teenager, that stress was contributing to her development of alopecia. Stress management wasn’t easy, how could it be at that age? And as Laura’s hair continued to fall out, she finally plucked up the courage to ask for a wig. Now, almost two decades later, Laura has found herself finally ready to accept herself and her baldness. She’s starred in photoshoots, appeared on national television and even walked a runway, all without her wig. Laura wants other women and young girls with alopecia to not feel the helplessness that she did. Laura’s confidence #journey is incredible, and Em and Alex are so proud to share her story.Follow Laura on Instagram @relightalopeciaFollow us on Instagram @shouldideletethatEmail us at [e-mail] Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

I called my mum and I said I think it's time I get a wig and she said thank God I've been waiting for you to ask me and then I was fuming because I was like what do you mean you've been waiting I you're the adult you tell me yeah I didn't know I was allowed to ask for a wig hello and welcome back to shall I delete that I'm Alex Light and I'm M Clarkson and how professional sound. I believe that's over. I'm actually, I'm not going to make a habit of it, but I'm going to acknowledge that I do have a baby, a baby, um, adorn my breast. I didn't know that

my son. Adorned my breast. I like it. A baby adorned my breast. I'm really sorry. I haven't quite, I haven't quite got the hang of this working mothership, but we're on, we, I would have got the hang of it if we'd have started recording 45 minutes ago when we joined the Zoom call, but we got distracted, so now she's hungry. She's making the cutest noises, so we don't forgive her. A little bit of ASMR, but for weirdos, probably. Yeah, baby ASMR, I don't know if that's a thing. I don't know, I don't want to delve into that.

How are you? I'm good. I'm so excited to be back doing the GBAs. I know. I know. That's my good. Is it? Yeah.

Oh, I feel bad for my good now. Oh, you bitch. That can be my good. It's fine. a baby. You have a considerably... No, that's not my good. That's not my good. Okay, okay, okay. I forget that one then. Go back. Right, so I'm, like, a terrible person. It's not that I'm back on the podcast.

It's not that I've had an adorable baby. My uggs arrived. Oh my God. Shame on you. I'm in my ugg era. You're officially in your hug era. I'm actually about to be in my ugs era, plural, because I bought myself after our conversation before my maternity leave I went and bought myself someugs online but you know they were sold out fucking everywhere

so I pre-ordered them on flannels and I did it when I was with you and Daisy because I was desperate for them now they were supposed to arrive on Valentine's Day a little treat for myself they are still not here and they are now expected on April the 7th I'm like oh my God what

so disappointed that at 2 in the morning during one of my random shopping splurges I bought another pair different colour and they've arrived so I've still got that pair on the way and I'll have to send them back when they get here although knowing me and my aversion to the post office I probably won't yeah I was going to say you have previous yeah but what colour did you order then wait what colour have you got I've got oh I don't know what the tones are I've got I want to pick them up but then I'll be able to come out and it'll be a whole thing I've got like the palest

sand colour like the colour of my jumper which is not helpful for for listeners of the podcast and then I've ordered the chestnut ones like the classic ones are on the way and then I've got a kind of like very pale like oatmeal sand colour I can see it I'm googling it I actually prefer yeah love Are they the ultra lows

Yes ultra menis Okay there you go And I feel adorable when I wear them Do you? Absolutely adorable I'm wearing them with my baggy jeans And I feel adorable I feel like a real little gen Zia Honestly

I am too old to do do that. I can't do that. No, try it. They, I love ogs because of the most comfortable things in the world to wear. Oh, what size your feet? Six. Do you want my other ogs? Oh my God. When they arrive? Maybe you do. Have my other ogs. But I can't, I can't, like I, I, I, I, I wore them. You know, on the day of the live show when it was snowing, I wore them. And you don't wear them in the snow. I wore them. You have to wear them on a lovely sunny day. Obviously, why wouldn't you wear the woolen the hot, hot shoes in the sunny days.

Yeah. What? That makes zero sense, but I wore them with a track suit and I felt weird the whole day, something felt unright, like not right about my body.

Did it feel like 2007 again? Yeah, and I felt like people were looking at me funny. I didn't really, no one cared. Wear them with jeans. I think Molly May does it. Me and Moles. Molly May is 23. Hollow has no.

Arlo has no idea that she exists. Like, she's being so heavily influenced by another baby. Like, Bambi's a week older than Arlo, and I'm like, I am following Molly's journey so closely. And when Arlo's got something that Bambi has, like they have the same blanket, I was like, oh my God, I screen grabbed it, it's sent her to Ellie. I was like, what's wrong with me?

Why do I care? But apparently I do. Lo, well, well. I just love that she has absolutely zero idea. She might do What Molly makes, she does not I please don't I'll fan girl with my little odd boots

and my baby with a matching blanket She's the reason No she doesn't Were you going to say she's the reason I got pregnant I wasn't not going to say that But she wasn't I've thoroughly enjoyed watching

The Tommy Fury fight And all of that I was quite invested in that And for the first time in my life I was awake for a boxing fight Because I was up doing a night feed Well done thanks I didn't watch it but I was following it live like on lot I couldn't work out how to watch it so anyway

I say boxers probably don't realise how many of their um viewership is just young mother it's just new mothers yeah it's not the demographic they thought they were getting just people up in the middle of the night I did enjoy I did I did very much enjoy that whole thing although I was I was a little bit confused but I don't want to bash Tommy Fiore but I was a little bit confused as to why he wouldn't win given he's a professional box so, but anyway, we don't. I agree. Yeah, I was like, but what do we know? This was in the bag, no, surely, but. Maybe we should start this, you know, like the YouTuber's got really into their, like, boxing. Oh my God. Maybe, maybe we should get the podcasters into something, like javelin. Javelin. What the fuck. I bet you'd be, I bet you'd be brilliant at that.

Do you know what? I was so unexpectedly strong. I was actually thinking I'd be so good at javelin. I don't you would. As long as you could rep us that I'm a 100% team javelin. Shopput, I'd be good at, I think. Better at Shopping. Don't doubt it. I don't doubt it.

Terrible at fencing. I think one of the worst things I can imagine doing would be catching a shot put. Like imagine someone's thrown it. Imagine having to catch it. I mean, I don't think people typically catch shot puts, did they? No, I know exactly. It would be good reason for that as well. I just wouldn't want to.

I'm just saying, okay, have you got anything bad? Wait, what's your, oh, you've given, I forgot you're good because it was so shit and so unmemorable. Fine, fine, my good, I've got a baby and I'm back on the podcast. Is that what you want to hear? All these cliches. Um, my bad, well, my good's about the podcast. My bad's also about the podcast. I, as you know, I have never listened to an episode back. Not because I'm lazy or disinterested, but because I physically cannot bear myself. Stand. I can't. I can't. can't bear myself. Anyway, when you were off, we had three different guests, helped me with the GBA. Dave was one of them. And so when the episode came out, I was drive, Dave and I were

driving in the car. I can't remember why you're where. And he was like, can we listen to our episode. And my blood went hot and then cold. And I said, no, absolutely not. I said, you can, but do it in your own time. And he was like, Al, you've done how, like, how many episodes have you done at this point like how much recording you should be able to listen to yourself back so i was like oh yeah i should it'll be fine it was not fine spoiler alert it was not fine we listened to the first like 10 minutes and i can't bear it i hate my laugh i hate how loud i am hate it all i know this is not like positive and uplifting and inspiring as don't tell them that because then they'll start being like yeah she is really loud and the love is and then they'll leave too don't blame them don't blame them

I hate how I like giggle oh I just hate it all I love how you giggle I love listening to you oh thanks okay that thanks I don't like listening to myself but I think that's pretty standard I just feel like a massive brute I'm like oh a brute yeah I feel very like oh what you're really overthinking aren't you I know I just giggled and then like vomiting did a little gag The trick is not to overthink it or start drinking before we record

That's a good point No the anxiety No no no no don't don't don't don't don't don't don't The fear the absolute fear you'd have on a Monday morning My God Absolutely not I had really bad anxiety after a live show Yeah I'll bet

I'm not surprised the way you were like No I'm kidding It's the worst I think like I mean Anxiety already is the worst but it's like when you've been when you when you have got drunk with people that you love it's kind of like fine but when you've been drunk in front of strangers it's or like not strangers but people who you you slightly know that's the that's the terrifying bit and then obviously you were

drunk and you were a bit you weren't drunk but you were drinking in front of people who knew you which is of course you were like it's a recipe for a horrible horrible next day I was like it'll be great it all like relax my my nerves. It'll, you know, loosen me up a bit. But I really did my future self a disservice. And I will not be drinking. I mean, I will have like one glass at our next live show, maybe two. But I had quite a few and never again. Fair enough. I tried drinking the day for the first time since I was born and I was like, oh no. Like literally I had half a glass of champagne for my friend's birthday. And I was like, can't. Really? Really. Yeah. I was just too

anxious. But I mean, it was pretty early after she was born and I was just like, my God, like, I have to go home and look after her. And, like, what if I just, I really feel like I need all my wits about me. Yeah, that makes sense. And I have very few wits as it is at the moment. So I was like, I can't kill off any others. My bad, I don't really have many bads, but I'm just, I'm going to give you some generic bads about newborn life.

Well, I'm a bit tired. Are you serious? You're tired. I'm a bit tired. No, that's fine. That's not bad. I'll tell you what isn't good. My neighbours have decided to do a full extension of their kitchen

and they're building onto our house and I'm really, really happy for them. And it's going on until August. Well, she said it goes on until the end of June and I don't believe that. And I feel really sorry for them. They're so nice. It's obviously not their fault.

But it's terrible time. The whole kitchen got ripped out. last week, which is literally the loudest thing that could possibly be happening. And obviously we're just in the house the whole time with a baby that we need to sleep and we need to sleep and not lose our minds. That is terrible, terrible timing. It's horrible, yeah, I feel like I'm in a sitcom. I feel like there should be, I feel like there's like a whole audience of people like laughing at me. Do you know what I mean? But you know what they say? What does it kill you? Yes. Famously, famously unreliable quote. Because, like,

I mean, being hit by a lorry might not kill you, but I'm, I will pledge a bet that it won't necessarily make you stronger. It's all your bones turn to like mush. You have a very good point. You like, yeah. Actually. All the time, it's like, most things. It's a terrible phase. Terrible.

It's a terrible phrase. Most things that nearly kill you, they're not going to, they're not going to make you much. better. Like, nobody got better from something by being nearly killed. Do you know what I mean? I'm thinking of it more in a mental sense. Like, what doesn't kill you emotionally or mentally makes you stronger. But I don't necessarily know that's always the case either. No, it's not. That's what everybody, there's that meme that goes around that I've never related to more. And it's just like, um, your trauma makes you stronger. And it's like, it absolutely doesn't, but it does make me funnier. I'm like, yeah, that's about right.

yeah i don't know if it does make you stronger in fact yeah it's such an unreliable okay i'm not going to say it again no thank you for helping me think critically about it you are you are welcome my awkward is a is a is a leftover an old awkward that i can't believe i didn't tell you but i think it's because i think it's post arlo anyway i haven't told you and i haven't said up on the podcast i mean wait don't get excited and it's really like, it's not that big. But it stayed with me, let's just say. So when, like, as you know, Betty is always on me, always.

And what I do is she kind of leans into me and I put my arm all the way under her, all the way around her and, like, under her bottom. If this is going where I, if this is going where I think it's going, you need an apology? No, no, no, no, not quite. You didn't put your finger up her before. No, I didn't put my finger up before.

Okay, never mind, as you were. Because her tail's always covering it, right? So, I go under the tail. And I hold her tail. So I've got her whole body, like, in my arm, and my hand is holding her tail. Am I, like, illustrating this well? Yeah, it's like the handbrake. I don't understand that, but yes, okay.

So I hold my hand in her tail. I like that. I don't know. I'm always like, I always say today, like, I can't believe we live in the same. house or something that's got a tail that always amazes me anyway i say that at least twice a week that's so stupid so stupid to the point now where i say i love it oh my god i can't believe Dave goes that we live in the same house as something has got a tail i'm like yeah oh i love that so much i can't believe we live in the house with a tail like i can't believe that i can't wait to tell out to Alex as well geez so that's that's how we sit i like it

Holotail blah blah so I went to my friend's house and um up north went to visit her up north with all my old school friends um it was brilliant I hadn't seen them all in ages and she's got two dogs she's got one girl one boy I'm not used to boy dogs yeah so so the boy dog is super affectionate and I love him he's so cute so I sat on the sofa he came up to me and leaned in to me for a cuddle so I scoop my hand around him under his bum and I hold his tail so I'm sitting there with him in my arms holding his tail and then my friend just looked up looked at me and she was like her eyes widened her whole body language changed she looked horrified and I was genuinely like I don't understand and she was like why are you holding Wilf's willie?

No. I thought you're a perfect. That's super bad. I don't. You could get us cancelled for that. That's illegal. I thought his really was his tale. We know what you thought. Oh my God.

That's so fun. See, Betty's horrified. Can you hear it? Yeah. Betty's like, oh my God. Mom! Oh my God. That's a lot, ow.

Oh my God. How disgusting is that? Yeah. My mom had to. do deliberately when Dodger, I think I told you this, when Dodger got his foreskin all stuck round his Willie and she had to put gloves on. Yeah. But at least she had to do it for medical reasons. You were just doing it for fun. To be clear, I didn't whack the dog off. I held his Willie. Oh God, that sounds awful as well. And I got a gentle, a gentle caress. Fucking weirdo.

Fucking weirdo. So, don't let me near your male dogs. No, Christ I don't want any hard time For putting my finger up with bum hole Ever again now You're awkward Okay, my awkward My awkward actually happened with you here the other day

I'm not socialising much But when you and Daisy came here The other day to record Yeah This is something that I have silently cringed about Since you guys left So you came here to record Like the Meet the Me Aalo episode and stuff

and Daisy, producer Daisy knitted Arlo a hat which is like the most gorgeous thing and it's so sweet like she literally adorable I can't even tell you and so you were holding Arlo and we put the hat on Arlo and you looked down at Arlo and you said I can't believe you made this now you were talking about the hat

and Daisy went on to be like yeah all these stitches and I learnt all this and I didn't know but I thought you talking about, are there? So I was like, I know, it's bad, isn't it? And then I realized really quickly when you were like, yeah, how did you get the rib stitch here? And I was like, oh, no, okay. So I just, like, tailed off really quietly. I was like, I was going to hate the no one's notice. I didn't notice that, but I really wish I had. Oh, I wish I hadn't brought it up now. I literally After this, I was like, I thought it's so embarrassing.

Why is I going to make everything about me? So embarrassing. Like, Jesus, Abe, you're not the only one we can make something. What do you think you are? Some sort of craft experts, for fuck's sake. Don't have the monopoly on handmade things. Oh, I wish we'd recorded that bit, honestly. I'm such an narcissism.

It's all about me and my produce. I'm also amazed by that. also amazed by that but I was just in the moment like you were more amazed by the hat and honestly I get hit the hat was incredibly by this piece of craftsmanship it was incredible I agree I agree on both counts I agree yeah good good hustle everybody we made some good shit it's just really embarrassing you're literally crying oh my god I know I was really embarrassed anyway we have a guest we've got a good guest today We do.

So we have the lovely Laura Mathias on today who I first saw a clip of Laura on Trinny Woodall's show. And it was all about Laura embracing her alopecia. And Trinny was helping her to do that through fashion. And then I saw her on this morning and I just thought she was so amazing that we had to get her on. So Laura came on to talk to us about her alopecia diagnosis, which she got in primary school. And she talked us through how she's navigating it. life since then, which has definitely had its fair shares of ups and downs and how she's ended up ultimately in a place where she feels very comfortable with her alopecia and with

being bald. Super cool that episode. Laura was amazing and we're going to leave her Instagram in the show notes if you want to go find her. Enjoy. Hello. Hello. Thank you so much for coming on the podcast. Thank you. Thank you for having me. I am already totally fan-gurling even though I promised myself I wouldn't. Oh, thank you.

Go on then. Oh, my God, you guys are so great. I can't believe I'm here. Oh, my God. Okay, it's out. It's out. I've got it. God, I'm so really blowed my mind.

I'm all flustered now. I'm going to blut. No, I'm fine. You are also pregnant, though, so maybe you could just be. I'm a mess. Honestly, if you tell me anything emotional today, you've gone, buckle up. But thank you so much for being here.

You've had a kind of bonkers time recently. You hung out with Trinney Woodall. Yep, best mate now. Best friends. What is it like being best friends with Trinny Woodall? Exhausting. She, you know, I thought I was a lot. She is a lot, but in the best way.

She is just what she's like on TV, just frantic, full of energy, does not hold back, tells you exactly what she thinks. And so I just kind of thought, I'm going to have to pull my big girl pants up and just go with this. and let her dress me however she wants, even if at times I may have said,

yes, I think I look like a pimp right now. I did challenge her, but she was like, own it. That's it, own it. So, yeah, it's been great. So you're a pimp now. I am a pimp now, thanks to Trinny Woodall. Nice. I'm going to call the Daily Mail immediately.

After you went on Trinney's show, you sent in a Feel Good Friday to me that you had gone to work for the first time without your wig on. And when I shared it on my stories, I got so many DMs to people being like, Oh my God, I saw her on this morning. And she's amazing.

And she's like, well, we've got to talk to you for the podcast about not just everything you've been through in the last few weeks, but everything you've gone through in the last few years about your life of Alopecia and the awareness that you want to raise. So would you tell us a little bit about yourself and your story? Yeah, of course. I mean, that's why I'm here. Yeah, let's do it. So, yeah, no, I, it's all pretty new to me, you know, rocking up here today, Bould. I was wearing a bandana because it's freezing outside.

but I was 13 when I started losing my hair little board patch at the back of my head that my hairdresser first spotted and she told me to go to the doctors and get it checked out but it probably wasn't anything to worry about but I could see that she and my mum looked quite worried and that's my first kind of memory of the journey I know how you feel about that word

but it is a word that I need to use and I do use it we embrace it okay good that's our 2023 it's the word of the year okay great we're on a journey Yeah, well, you know, aren't we all? So, yeah, I remember going to the doctors. Obviously, I was about, I was only 13. So my mum was with me and the doctor saying, oh, is there something stressful going on in your life at the moment?

And I was like, well, you know, it's a bit awkward, but my parents are going through a really messy divorce. My mum's sitting right here. So I don't really want to bitch about it. And yeah, he was like, that might have triggered, you know, I've got eczema as well, which is another autoimmune condition. So they kind of go hand in hand. so I'm more likely to get something like alopecia. But yeah, it was just a kind of case of even the doctor didn't give me an answer. He gave me a name, which is alopecia, for what that little board patch was.

But the prescription was basically try and calm down and your hair will probably come back. Oh. And as a 13-year-old, like I was not emotionally able to deal with that. I was like, so hang on, I'm in control. Am I able to? And yeah, so that was the start of the hair loss journey. And that kind of summarises how it really was for a good few years. Just, I'd say, feeling completely out of control, helpless.

And like nobody around me, including the adults, knew what to do with me and my ever thinning hair. Yeah. I wonder how many men versus women get the helpful prescription of just calm down and see what happens. That's a 13-year-old who has no idea how to manage how to manage. emotions that she probably can't even label, up you late, yeah. No, not at all. I mean, and I'm sure people can relate to that

feeling when you're 13. Up until that point, I'd been a chubby, outgoing, didn't give a crap kind of girl because my value wasn't based on how I looked at all, but getting it to that age, all of a sudden, boys and girls, hormones flying everywhere, all of a sudden it seemed to change my ranking

anyway, just whether I was attractive or not. And so I thought, I'd literally just got some GHD straighteners that Christmas because it was that so I'm 31 now and it was the trend where we all had the poker straight hair I coveted those straightness I swear to God how many did you break that's the question I never I never I wasn't allowed my own until I was like 16 it was crushing my mom was like you will ruin your hair and sure enough I did so who knew it's gorgeous now thank you very much is that the hormones your hormones now oh no my

hair's my well I'm very my eye's been very low so my hair's been a bit falling out but I feel It's not really relevant. You can moan about hair loss and hair thinning to me. I will always, if you make it as a joke like you did when I came in, you said, you look like an egg. I was like, do not even. It was a bad joke considering present. But I love it because then I get to come out on top and do a little bit of alopecia awareness.

So, yeah, 13. I mean, like, that's like the worst age to have something that is aesthetic. Yes. wrong with you i suppose yeah and how did it happen from 30 how was the rest of your teenage years did you keep how such a horrible question how are your teenage amazing that was so great i love being a teenager no it was horrible um and i i mean you've told me you're hormonal and and you're just alex so you might cry so yeah i know so well reputation i told you fango um everything stopped like after that because the hair lost the ball patches started spreading and they started joining up

so I was rocking this weird kind of like almost like an undercut but not being able to disguise it anymore so I started taking more days off school and then I just kind of stopped going to school because that fear of like the wind blowing or like I just didn't know how to disguise it I didn't know what to do like and no one was telling me what to do and I was like they told me if I calm down it would come back so obviously I'm doing something. wrong because it's getting worse. And my parents were still not good and we were all in the household and it was just really messy but I always talk about how I remember my parents coming together and standing at the

end of my bunk bed because I was a child, you know, and begging me to go back to school because I think it had been like two weeks by that point. And at first obviously they were like, look, you know, she's going through a tough time. She just needs to chill at home, whatever. but then they clearly realised I wasn't leaving the house I wasn't picking up the phone to friends it was a proper full-on like afraid to go outside situation

all stemmed from this change in my physical appearance which of course is going to make you more stressed exactly because it's a horribly stressful thing that you're going through exactly vicious cycle and it's such a vulnerable it's a horrible I mean it's horrible whenever it happens

for your body to change physically that lies outside of your control but especially at the age of 13 when I mean kids aren't nice yeah they aren't the most tactful and you know at that age

you start to become valued based on how you look based on how attractive you are to men right well to boys well hopefully tragically probably

yeah yeah so a terrible time like I totally understand where you wouldn't want to go to school, that makes sense. Yeah, and it's weird because I can't remember having a rational thought in my head about it. I just remember I just could not do it. I could not leave the house. I just, I didn't know what to do.

And I think people, and maybe even me now, I struggle to get my head around that because I get up and have to do work and do things now every day, regardless. But at that age, it was too much for my brain to handle. It was just too much all of it. Yeah. So how long did you to take off school in the end? So I was off for over two terms of year nine. Wow. Yeah. So a long time. And then some holidays came.

I'd got a personal tutor or something at the end of year nine. Because I remember having to walk to the library in the little village I lived in to meet. I think that was clearly part of their plan to get me like getting out. Right. And I remember learning about World War I. You know, as you do, in the library. I didn't do my sats and I remember thinking well this is going to be an issue you know but basically at the end of summer I was like I can't continue like this like it's not okay and the other thing I should mention is all I did all day apart from that maybe weekly or two weekly session with the personal tutor was sit on an exercise bike all day and it's no coincidence to think that I couldn't control my hair loss so clearly was developing something else with my body there, and I lost so much weight in those six, seven months.

So I decided, right, I've got to go back to school. It's a new academic year. I just have no choice. And I was like, right, game plan. And this is where my personality clearly started really badly forming, which was like, right, I need to go out of my way to try and do this, this and this and this so that this can happen. And that included saying to my hairdresser,

do you want to open the salon half an hour early every day to wash and blow dry my hair? so I can go to school. And bless her, she was the woman that found my first bald patch. And they were all really clearly emotionally invested in this. And so she was like, I mean, I don't know how sustainable it is long term, but we want to do whatever we can to help, you know, whatever you think. So that was the plan that I was going to go to the hairdressers each day. Oh, my God.

Which, if anything, looking now, I'd be like, that's just rubbing salt in the wound. I don't really want to go to the scene of the crime. You're so stunningly bougie. like I'm just going to get going to blow out every morning before school yeah but me having a blow out at that stage was so what was your hair like at this point it was like full on like worse than what I was explaining so like nothing I mean this is a podcast you can't

but you can see what I'm doing yeah yeah so Laura is touching like above your ears like a strap around the back of your head yeah exactly all those bald patches had basically started connecting and started from the bottom up yeah right Right, exactly that. And so I could just about try and blow dry to try and thicken what was on top. But a slight move of the head, and it was so obvious. So I went back to school, and I remember my mum dropping me off,

and my friends had clearly been briefed, and they all came running up to me down the street and gave me big hugs. And it was really lovely, although I would have been terrified for them hugging me, because, again, don't touch my hair. going into classes wasn't great I remember one boy was like did you have a baby and you've come back because obviously I'd lost so much weight

and I was like no funnily enough that's not what's happened but thanks good guess and I had I think my parents had brief teachers I'd said I wanted to sit at the back of classes so no one could see the back of my head

great in theory but of course didn't seem to reach all the teachers so it was like every classroom I went into I had to negotiate oh actually I'd need to sit at the back and they'll be like, why? They'd be like, because I'm bald, okay? Let me have it. Exactly.

But it's funny. The one thing I'm kind of, considering like how self-conscious I was, that was still clearly a part of the old Laura that remained, as in like that chubby, go-lucky, whatever, confident girl, because they tried to put me in bottom set for everything because I'd missed like a year of school. And I was just like, no, do not put me in bottom set. I know I'm smart.

I know I've missed a year of school, but it will be okay. I will be okay. And they were like, right, you're sure you want to go into top set French? And I was like, yes, we, we do. It was a mistake, the French class, believe me. But yeah, no, so, yeah, went back not wearing a wig, but that lasted a week. Did it? What changed?

I went to a school trip, and we had to, it was some kind of Catholic experience. and we had to all go down and I feel like we had to kiss the feet of a statue. I really don't think that's... Some Catholic experience. A Catholic experience. I went to a Catholic school. I don't really, yeah. I don't align with that now, but I remember...

Were you in top set for Catholic Catholic Catholicism as well? Can you not tell? Some kind of Catholic experience around kissing. I kiss some feet. I just remember going downstairs and for all the other kids, like, looking over and watching each kid. one by one as we went down and either prayed at the statue or kissed the statue and then went back up again. And obviously in a church you're asked to remove any headwear. So I'd been wearing a beanie hat and I had to take it off and then I had to put my head down to do whatever this and all the kids were above me. And I was like, oh my God, I don't know how to say in a Catholic

church, no, I don't want to do this. I'm not the Antichrist, but you know, it would have gone down like a sack of shit if I'd refuse. So on the coach home, I called my mum, and I said, I think it's time I get a wig. And she said, thank God, I've been waiting for you to ask me. And then I was fuming because I was like, what do you mean? You've been waiting.

You're the adult. You tell me. I didn't know I was allowed to ask for a wig. Oh, bless you. So had you spoken about wigs prior to that? I think she was so scared of upsetting me or triggering me or, I bless my mum I love her to pieces

but she just did not know what to do she was probably lost completely and like back then so this is 2004 2004 2005 nothing was out there in the media about alopecia about a year after

Gail Porter actually started using her yeah I was about to say that she was the I think that was the first time I'd ever heard of Alipisha when she told her story okay so you ran your mum and you said it's time for a wig and your mum said

yes, let's do it how did you go about getting a wig? Did you shave the rest of your hair? Did you? Mm-hmm. Sorry. I didn't know. Well, the process all kind of came at once so I didn't want to shave my head until I'd lined up what I was going to be putting

on it to replace that Gollum left hair, which I can say again, no one I can say, but it was shocking and people, especially like journalists, they always like, oh, they're photos. Unsurprisingly, I didn't take selfies because one selfies one thing and two no why would I want to chronicle this you weren't up for photos at that point yeah I didn't know that I'd get to this point ever where I'd want to be

raising awareness and talking about it so yeah it would be kind of handy down yeah yeah so I I was really lucky my local town Ipswich has a little wig shop um so the GP even seemed to know about it or someone recommended us you know okay shut your eyes and picture a wig shop. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Okay. Do you imagine quite a small space, large space?

What are you picturing? I'm picturing like a really small space with like crammed in. Yes. Boxes and boxes of wigs piled up. Literally threatening to tumble on top of you. Yes. And the only private spaces are curtains that don't quite cover the full like doorway. Right.

That's, yeah, spot on. That's what it was. And weirdly, the private curtain rooms were by the windows. Oh, so... Like a peep show Yeah Like I'm like great So nobody in this shop

Because there's no one else in here Can see me But all of the high street Can see me trying on my first ever wig Oh my God, bless you As if the whole thing isn't traumatising enough I'm imagining that the lighting's terrible as well Oh yeah

Maybe that's why they chose the windows Because you get a bit of natural light But yeah And it was two very lovely But older women And every single wig Seemed to be designed for older women and everything that was on show

on, you know, the things that weren't hidden away in boxes were very much like grey, curly wigs like just all the stereotypes. Very coiffed. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Not like, I'm just going to school. Yes. I just need a simple do. Literally, I, you know, I had obviously very thin, brown mid-length hair. Yeah. I just wanted to match that as closely as possible.

But yeah, I must have found something. They obviously were used to dealing with teenagers because I wasn't the first to have alopecia in the area. But yeah, so not a boogey experience, that one. Pretty horrible. And then I got the wig. It was way too big for me. Went back to my trusty hairdresser who literally had been with me for the whole experience.

She opened the salon after hours. See, I'm so demanding. I love it. Which was great in theory because obviously I didn't want other people in the shop because it was a moment having my headdard. shaved um but it was wind like i feel like what wasn't winter but it was the evening so when the lights run in the salon again there's just a massive window in the hairdress so everyone could see um i'm sure people weren't queuing up to watch this you know the switch window displays yeah oh look at this girl

having a head shaved oh delightful did you see her earlier in the picture i mean i do have stalkers it's only about you tell me you your big names i am your stalkers um But yeah, so shave my head, put that wig on, she styled it on my head. I left that hairdressers, and I never, ever went out in public again without a wig until two years ago. Wow. So that's like 17, 18 years. Yeah, okay. That experience of shaving your head and putting the wig on was it, I'm guessing mixed emotions, but it was like relief,

but now I don't have to cover and hide myself and also sadness of that. it now I feel like that's it with my own hair yeah I think lots of people talk about that moment it was so long ago yeah it's really hard to put myself back there and I think maybe without sounding too dramatic there's a lot of things I think I have genuinely like repressed or like blocked out yeah unsurprisingly yeah I think it's really common as teenage I had something traumatising happened to me as a teenager and when I went back to try and talk about it years later because you know, very different situation but I had a, I don't know what you call

them, store, probably actually a real life stalker but like a... Well, now I feel like a dick for making a joke. It's okay. I thought I looked like a boiled at boll there earlier. That's true, we are even. Tushay. Nice.

No, I had, I guess that's what you call it. I was groomed when I was younger by someone online and I completely blanked it out and I was amazed at coming back to it 15 years later and I was trying to talk to my mum about it And she was having to try and prompt me and remind me because I'd completely blanked out all this stuff, which I do think is a self-preservation thing for an unformed brain.

Yeah, no offence to my 13-year-old self. Your brain is unformed. No, I think that's a really good description of a 13-year-old brain. Yeah, and I think it's a protection thing. And you didn't know that at one point you're going to have to go back, well, you didn't have to, but you didn't know that at one point you might want to go back to this and explore empowerment or whatever. Because it's just, you've just got to get through it.

Yeah. And for me at the time, so, you know, I'm going to say up front, I'm not anti-wigs at all. And I still think wigs can be vital for many people. They have been for me for years, nearly two decades. I just realized that looking back then, I felt I had no other choice but to put that wig on. And then that was the new me.

That was how I needed to present. That was public-facing Laura. so that's that's too intense a relationship to have with that hat of hair you know yeah um so that's what i'm trying to move away from and that's what's kind of inspired me to start kind of questioning is it healthy to literally not be able to step outside my front door without my wig on when that's who i that's how i exist most of the time at home how that i was going to ask that you don't wear the wig you're off for the not looking for the last two years but like for that period of time where you weren't going outside in public without the wig on were you

at home you were not wearing it so uh obviously life continued like i went to uni i was in halls i'd ask for an onsuit because i was a wig wearer but like when the fire alarm went off in the middle of the night i would put on my wig and quickly draw on my eyebrows before leaving in case of a fire so that's kind of where my priorities were out yeah which is so fucked up God, that's so hard, isn't it? It's like, no, it sounds crazy, but you can't explain that feeling and how strong that phobia is, you know?

And also, I suppose if you didn't really have anyone around you saying like, oh, you know, maybe you could just go out without your wig on and without drawing in your eye, like maybe you just could, like maybe you're okay like that. You know, I guess you wouldn't think any different. You think you just feel like compelled to. I have to. I have to show up with my wig and my, it makes sense.

Yeah. I thought, well, I have to present and look, air quotes, normal. Yeah. Because I've never seen any other bald person. Maybe at most the depiction of someone going through chemotherapy in some kind of media I will have seen. Yeah. And then, yes, Gail Porter, but the narrative that surrounded Gail Porter was just awful. Right.

And I wonder if you can remind us of that, because I, I, I, I, remember it vaguely and I don't remember it being positive no so they very much aligned her hair loss as being a result of poor mental health right homelessness and basically a breakdown and I just think that's so limiting on what actually was happening um I mean obviously I'm not going to speak for gal I am I mean I fangirled her as well and uh it's not exclusive to you too I'm sorry but I did a bit crushing I felt special but no you're my My favourite hairy people. But yeah.

I will take it. I met her at a changing faces event, who are the charity I campaign with. And she is amazing and just so unapologetically herself. But yeah, she totally calls out the media for the fact that they just, they just get it so wrong. It's very interesting what you actually just said around the same time, I suspect was when Brittany shaved her head. Yeah. Which obviously wasn't alopecia related. But it was indicative, well, it might have been now a piece for age, I don't know,

but it wasn't, that was so synonymous with her mental health and her mental breakdown. And it's actually really interesting that rhetoric, like the context for your waiting for a fire alarm to put your wig on, like obviously look at the background and the context for the world you were living in in 2007 or whatever it was. People would either think I was physically ill, mentally ill, and I genuinely thought the only other thing was like horror film. Like people are going to think I'm some kind of, you do, you just, you pull together in my unformed brain, even at the age of 18 at uni, all these kind of half formed stereotypes of when you've seen bald people or things and it's always negative.

It was always negative back then. Which is why it's so cool, and we'll get onto this, and I am jumping forward, but it's why it's so cool what you're doing now and showing like little girls who are, you know, being diagnosed with alopecia and realise. that they're going to be bored, like seeing people like you saying, actually, it's okay. And I'm like normalising this now. It's really cool. But going back, did you, did all of your friends know, like in uni and everything? Did you tell people or did you keep it quite quiet? So at school, it was the worst kept secret ever because they clearly been briefed. But it seems like not everyone had either been at that assembly or like some people clearly missed the memo. One guy in particular, I remember.

yes but no my friends knew but they knew I didn't want to talk about it okay so we just didn't which is looking back probably a lot of the burden came with that at university I was terrified because I'd obviously had hair and then not had hair with all these school friends so it was going to a brand new place starting my whole new life I put off going to uni for a year and I look back and I wonder was some of that to do with not being ready. I did also have adult braces. I mean, my God, I mean, I really had it going for me.

I mean, I genuinely maintain now that the way we look shouldn't hold so much value. But I am also very, very aware with the work that I do that, unfortunately, it does. And I really had it stacked against me. But yeah, no, I went to uni and I was living in halls. And I think maybe by the end of the first term, I told. told three people. It was a massive secret. It was a secret, yeah, wow.

And in the privacy of your own halls or home, was there anybody that you would be happily bald or without your eyebrows in front of? At that stage, no, 100% not. And again, talking about maybe the theme of this will be windows. I actually made friends with someone off my course who I could see into his room

and he could see into mine from our window. This sounds way creepier than it was. I think she has a fetish. I am such a voyeur What's the voyee? You're just being viewed Yeah but maybe I like both ways I don't know I don't know if you make babe crack on

Cheers Yeah no so like I felt like Unless I literally was Again lurking in the shadows That I never felt I had a private space And then obviously I was sharing a house with friends And those friends I did tell before They were the people that I chose to live with

So I was like, well, I'll tell them I wear a wig. But I literally think probably a handful of times they saw me in a bandana because our bathroom was downstairs. Right. But even things like choosing rooms, I remember pulling the whole, but I've got alopecia card. Yeah. So I really can't have that downstairs room.

But genuinely, it would have made my life hell. Yeah. So whenever you, so if you did have to go to the bathroom, you put your bandana on to go to the bathroom. Yeah, if not my wig. If not your wig. And if we're going to get personal and I feel like this is a safe space. Yeah.

I, when I first went all the way with a guy, I don't know I'm from the 1950s. Oh, way. And it was not. No. I used to get very confused. Oh, it's so confusing. Oh, yeah, no.

All I know is all the way. I think, yeah. I think, yeah. There was penetration, okay? Okay. Please we got to the P-word. I think they used to say that fourth base was like penetrative sex, but then they would talk about fifth base, and I'm like,

I mean. I love how much you just. over the microphone. I know. That's so gross. Penitrative sex. Penetitive sex. Which maybe the fifth base was anal. So just for clarification,

fourth base? Yeah. But then. Why am I oversharing? This is not the safe space. Anyway. I kept my wig on and that person who was my first did not know.

Really? Yeah. Although I've seen him looking at my stories in recent years. So that's a treat. Surprise. Although once we were kissing at a club and he did say to me,

you know, a club on campus and said, your hair's really weird and I pulled away from kissing him and I ran out of the club and I went home and I kissed someone else instead. Oh my God. So I had issues.

No, fair enough. What a fucking weird thing to say. Well, yeah, he clearly like, but that's what I mean. People, because I was so secretive about it, I don't think people knew how to broach the issue with me. Right. And I was at like a friend,

you know, I've still got some best friends from uni. and Lily was getting married last year and we were talking to a fellow one of her friends who I didn't know she was like oh yeah at uni we all knew Laura was wearing a wig but she just didn't want to talk about it and I was like I'm sorry what

this is news to me what was the point if I'd have known we could have just yeah I mean now as soon as you brought in you were like joking about it you probably if you could go back that's how you'd imagine yeah imagine this overshare having to keep the secret My God, I was like nearly close to combusting every day.

Oh my God. So they knew. Yeah. It was just kind of unspoken. I mean, some people are clueless. I've got to admit, like I know when someone's wearing a wig or has drawn on their eyebrows like three miles away. Because I am aware that that's a possibility that there will be young people that have alopecia or hair loss. But I think until you are even thinking about that, especially like middle-aged men didn't ever seem to cotton on.

I mean your eyebrows I can't believe they're not yeah so these are eyebrow transfers they're basically like the stickers you had at school where you'd get like the fake tattoos and put them down with some watered tissue paper but they're unbelievable are they permanent? No

these will like if anything because it's so cold outside I was worried they'd start flaking but oh my god so you just put them on every day yeah I really really want to do a moustache one day but I don't know for what purpose if you'd have come in here with a moustache I would have died died who would have in the course

I'd ever seen they're amazing I assumed that they were like microbladed no so I've had that done quite a lot in my part of the whole journey even at high school

that was one of the things that I had to get used to having to and the costs associated with that God I would just say this one thing everyone's always like oh at least you don't have to pay to go to the hairdressers

and it's like do you know how expensive wigs are do you know how expensive the upkeepers do you know what it's like getting your eyelids tattooed when you're like 17 it's not nice

what did you have tattooed on your eyelids? Like just a line because my lashes fell out and that's the other thing. It wasn't just the hair on my head. By the time I got to uni, well, I was kind of pretty much rocking a mohawk under the wig, which looking back now

I'm like, that was awesome. That was sick, yeah, David Beck and meet a heart at all. I know. But again now, you know, whatever. But yeah, it was, my lashes started falling out as well. My left eyebrow had fallen out. So any photos of me from uni, I always have my wig like clipped. like a proper emo even though it was years too late to be an emo

like over this eyebrow what year was that because I was doing that for no reason so that would have been 2010 yeah so way too late to be cool it must have been a huge relief when you could just go to your room by yourself at the end of the day take your wig off take your eyebrows off and not have to think about covering up or you know just stressing about people seeing or it must have just been like find a big sigh of relief. So you know that feeling when you get home and you take your bar off.

Yeah. It's that. But I didn't have that for over three years at uni because I didn't have a private space. So I literally, I'm already pretty uptight as a person, maybe why I'm prone to like, you know, the trigger of stress. But I really can't believe I survived that. And how did you feel, how was your relationship with your appearance at that time?

was it a sort of I mean teenage relationships with your appearance is just fucking brutal anyway I didn't like to look at myself because I didn't like much you know it's not like I couldn't see anything and be like oh I like that so like I mean

that's and that's that's the kind of teenage standard yes yes we don't like much so were you able to make any peace with yourself or find anything that you were loving or was it what was your relationship like

with I mean no I literally I think it would go as far to say I hated how I looked and and therefore kind of who I was to an extent because they were so closely bound because of that value piece that we were talking about and but I had this weird dichotomy where like washing hands on a night out like with other girls in the mirror and they'd be touching up their makeup I remember hating that so much hating it and even later in the workplace like if we were going for drinks and all the like media team would come in and they'd be doing their makeup and I just couldn't even look at myself but then the dichotomy is I need to look at myself I need to check has my wig slipped back has my eyebrows smudged like so it's really difficult when you do need to kind of be maintaining the disguise and obviously that's an extreme way to talk about it but that's what I felt like I was doing so what was the shift then because obviously now like you've come in today well wearing your bandana because it was cold, but you're here without a wig.

It sounds like worlds apart from where you were. When was the shift and what caused the shift? So the pandemic. Okay. Obviously, all our lives were disrupted. I didn't have to go into the office anymore. And so I wasn't having to get up every day, put my makeup on in the same way, and then put my wig on and get out of the door.

So literally disrupted kind of my routine. and then from there I was enjoying not wearing my wig in between Zoom calls and I was thinking God this is nice isn't it my scalp can breathe because the thing I should know

is that I mentioned I've got exma as well and that's you know a comorbidity or it's another autoimmune condition wearing a wig when you have exma for 12 hour plus days I would have open cuts on my head

my wig is actually stuck to my scalp on numerous occasions And I'm not saying this lightly because I hate the stereotype surrounding wig wearing and, you know, just watch the film The Witches, either new or old. And that depiction of removing the wig is grotesque. And I hate that. So I want to get rid of that. So I do lots of videos where I now can take it off and show that transition.

But the reality for me is someone with Exma and Alopecia was wearing my wig was exacerbating another condition of mine. So that's been a key moment for me and was during the pandemic of thinking, my scalp went from having a red raw ring all around it to starting to heal and it was just like wow I've really been kind of putting myself through the ringer here so that's how it started and then a lot more time on social media during the pandemic

of course because what else could we do started following people with alopecia and I thought oh my god they're amazing look at them wow they go out bald I'd never do that and so I'd slip into their DMs like the stalker I am and you know say I think you're amazing I think you're beautiful I don't know how you got to this stage

I'm you know I've had alopecia for nearly two decades but I'm just nowhere near where you are in the confidence journey but thank you for showing up because social media wasn't a big thing when I was 13 and I just can't help but think what if and then from there slowly slowly I don't know what happened but by summer

so I think it was June 2020 I posted my first bald selfie and I literally posted it and put my phone on the other side of the room and then had to run away and do something else to not think about it and I had the most incredible response not just from the hair loss community

that I'd kind of tapped into but just people who knew me from school and stuff and yeah that was the kind of the start of it all I guess and did that first bald selfie come before your first bald outing right so that's so okay sorry nodding yes

Okay, so that was another huge moment, right? Yeah, that whole thing about actually it's been interesting the social media version of me versus the real me, air quotes. And I know it's interesting because so many of us talk about that in terms of like editing our images or, you know, filters. But for me, it was almost like the other way round. I'm determined to show up no filter. Not saying I've never used filters, of course, especially there were so many things.

It was my first bald selfie. You know, I'm sure I heightened the colour. Crack on me. Yeah, exactly. But, yeah, it was like I could do that online, but I was nowhere near ready to do it outside my front door. No. Right.

Okay. How much longer was it between bald online and bald in the street? Boulding in the streets. I was not saying. I was like, this is like a really bad hip-hop song. So my first time I was. outside ball was at my friend's farm because it was outside and public but there's not many people on a farm just the cows and chickens to look at me and I made it a photo shoot because I thought if

I'm going to do this I'm going to chronicle it and again so it was closely related to my Instagram page and like challenging myself so basically I started making that page all about setting myself challenges that I had to complete and for me that just that mindset worked clearly competitive with myself or whatever but otherwise it just wasn't going to happen there wasn't going to be a reason for me to go out at that stage that I could see oh you know it would just be good for my soul I was like no no I need a photo shoot my soul I want Instagram content exactly that so yeah I you know climbed up some haybells whipped my wig off got my friend to take a photo whilst my other friend best friend of years

was like holding some light reflector and I was screaming at her don't look at me she was like I thought the whole point was I was meant to be looking at you so yeah that was a moment and I'd say from there there's even something on my stories like my page is a mess I'm not very good at highlights and stuff but I remembered the other day when I first had to do the walk in my bandana

from my front door to my car and literally my heart palpitating and doing a story about how like yay I just made it and now I'm like that is insane that I had so much adrenaline running through my body

even when wearing a bandana to walk from my front door to my car my heart My happy place is still my bandana at the moment, I'd say. Even though I actually weirdly feel more powerful and confident without it. But that's what this year is all about. That's the next step is really going into the warmer weather, hopefully. What did it feel like when you first went out without the bandana?

Like your very first outing in, what did you say, 18 years? Yeah, no, very... I was distracted by my own baldness. Like when I go out bald, it's getting easier now. Yeah. And I've done a few things on my own walking. Like obviously now I, as a campaigner, I want to, I want to be the version of me that is setting that example to 13 year olds going through the diagnosis. So if I go to a changing faces event, of course I have to go bald.

I just see that like, I have to. And then I'm like, well, then I'll get the tube back on my own board and I'll get the train back of my own board. and I notice people do look and some days like anyone else I have more confidence than others some days I feel untouchable and I think this is an education moment look away you know like

you will see a happy healthy bald woman and it's all great and then other days you know my ex-ma might be a bit bad or I'm just not feeling it or you know time of the month and I'm just feeling crap and that day I'm like

I really can't be asked with anyone to day giving me a funny look or god forbid which has happened someone coming up to me and saying oh how's your treatment going i had the big sea last year it's such an uncomfortable conversation because you feel like you're almost letting that person down because you can't empathise with them that's difficult i was going to ask what the reaction is if any when people speak to you and you are and not at the charity events because obviously there's context for that but just when you're out and about do people say things beyond make well do people make assumptions and say things to you i think

people definitely make assumptions when they see a bald woman the worst thing i ever had like did do a whole post about this um was when i was at a wedding and meeting a drunk girl and i mean i'm sure i was drunk as well but not drunk enough to think this was okay um and she was like yes can i i i was wearing a wig but i mentioned my alopecia and she was like So there is one, there's just one more question I want to ask. I was like, yeah, okay, sure, go ahead. That's why I mentioned it. Great.

So, because you're not slim, when you go out bald, people must obviously know that you're not going through chemotherapy. And I was like, I don't even know where to start with how many levels are wrong and the assumptions you've just made. Wow. So I just walked away because I was like, I actually can't. That question doesn't deserve an answer. It was so much worse than I thought it was going to be as well. I was like, God, that's awful on every single run. Yeah, but remember, it could have been Alex shitting in the shower, so.

You can always embarrass yourself more. I like that can spread, by the way. I know. That's, honestly, that will, that's, it's in here. It's a mental image forever. Don't say that. Pass it on, Alex shits in the shower. Waffle stop, wop.

Oh, God, I forgot that term, though. Yeah, that was gross. You're a real treat. You're the real gross one. She had to Google it, to be fair. She didn't just have it floating in her head ready to say. Awful, stomp, awful, stomp. Also, is like, am I the bad person for labelling what you're doing?

No. So to go back to, what, the show you do with Trinny, you talked about your bandana, well, she was kind of brutal about your bandana in that. Because obviously hearing you now, like, it is a, and I completely get it. It's like, you can be the most body confident person, but then some days you're just like, can't be fucked today. Like, I'm just going to put on a hoodie and whatever. And that's so fine.

But, so completely get it with your bandana and with that context. But she, there was a clip in it where she was like, she said it was kind of old. Did she say like fuddy duddy? She said something along those lines. Whatever the terminology was. I remember being like, well, that's pretty old school too. So she was trying to empower you to take it off. Yes.

Which, and I'm, and you said, I think just a minute ago that you feel more confident kind of without it and I feel like that like you feel very powerful and comfortable and confident in here as you are so maybe she did sense it but it did seem a bit brutal

I mean brutal is the word of the day but she gets away with it I don't know how but you know because she's right yeah you did look so good when you took it off yeah I don't know that whole experience was it was empowering and I know that's a word you know inspiring empowering

and words that get chucked around when talking about living with any kind of difference or illness but actually they are they I felt like that process they fit we did have only a couple of comments though but some people

like oh it would have been great to see more in the wig and you know I really still like wearing wigs so please don't say that wearing wigs is shameful and I was really clear to say I am 100% with you like for instance I've never yet attended a wedding as a guest I'm also not married

not done that I've never attended a wedding without wearing a wig because I feel like for me that completes the outfit and I like to use a different colour wig depending on the dress or whatever it's not to say I never will go bald

but I always I always say the line there is no right way to live with alopecia there is no right way to show that you accept or embrace your alopecia and it shouldn't be performative it's just what you want to do but for me the trini process

I had specifically said, I'm starting a new job. I want to be able to go into the office ball, but find an outfit that works with that. Today is not a good example of that because... You look happy. You look great. Comfortable is the word, yeah. You look great.

You're not in a cream jumper, which is sad. I'm sorry. But that cobble blue suit that she put me in. So, and you did a shoot with Alex Cameron in that afterwards. Yeah, you looked amazing. That's from fangirling you because I saw that your phone. I was like, oh, I've got to get that. Isn't she the best?

She's amazing. She's amazing. You haven't done one without anything. No, I haven't. Natural lighting photography. Wow. Yeah, she's amazing. Yeah, everyone does look amazing afterwards.

Not afterwards. That was a really weird thing, say. You all look gross in the flesh, but how have you been to be her? Am I a disappointment to you say? Cameron treatment, wow. It's just natural light. We just need a bigger window in here. And then you'll look.

She's obsessed with windows. I know. Jesus. I was like, put me on display. You're basically, you're a mannequin at this point. Well, again. Yeah, well. Manikins are bald, love it.

On Prinny's show as well, I mean, that's effectively what you sign up to be for a little bit. You've got to put a lot of trust in that address you. I mean, I've got to admit, though, and I think it comes across even in the edit. There were some other things I said, but, you know, like some of the outfits are so out there. And I'm saying to her, like, this is great if I'm like, that's why at the end I was like, I look like I should be co-presenting this show. with you because that's the level she dressed me to like TV personality glamour and I'm like but I live in the smallest town in England so how am I going to walk down the street with these

sunglasses this like yeah yeah a bit less conspicuous yes talking about being inconspicuous down the street obviously a big campaign I was doing last year with the charity changing faces was all around stopping the stair so that's for anyone with any kind of condition that makes them look different And alopecia counts as that. And in fact, so does eczema. So do lots of things. Anything that makes you look not normal. And I hate that word so much.

But it's interesting how often that word comes up. So the whole campaign was around. There's a difference between looking and staring. And I have been on the end of very hostile staring, like where they just won't break eye contact. Middle-aged man on the train. It's always a middle-aged fucking man on the train. Always a middle-aged man, yeah.

That's so arrogant. What do you do? Do you say something? I stared back. Oh, tempting to put my finger up, yeah. Yeah. I've tried to stare back and then just do that kind of like angelic smile in a kind of like, you can't touch me. Sometimes even that doesn't seem to do anything.

And then I'm just like, I just have to block it out. But yeah, that shift from kind of like what Trinney was trying to get me to do was say, why not let people look? Why not let people think she's bald by choice? Because if you dress it in a certain way, it will look like it's a choice. Yeah. And then, yeah, the other part of me is still, though, very much like, I would much rather you smile, be curious and have a chat with me if you want to.

Always happy for that. But do not stare in silence at me because it's just rude. It's so rude. I guess, is that what you'd say? I'm just if there's any parents listening. I think this is something that I see, like, have a conversation that I see online from time to time is people saying how can they teach their kids to treat other kids or other adults? with differences, with visible differences,

how's best to approach that topic with kids? How do you feel is best to have this conversation with kids and with young people? I'd say definitely never silence your kids or reprimand them for approaching and asking the question because the brilliant thing about kids is they are curious and they're also not malicious. It's not coming from a bad place.

It's often just because it's new and they want to make sense of it and actually what we're going to do is if we tell kids off and silence them they're going to associate fear or badness or secrecy with those visible differences which as the person with a visible difference

that's something I've already had to overcome so I don't ever want to feel like a kid couldn't come up to me I love kids it's fine we can have a chat whatever but you know obviously even if a kid says something like a kid's not going to probably say all right baldy teenager might

bloody teenagers I'm so scared of them yours is going to be one one day I know she's going to hate me first though so it's fine yeah I'd just say encourage kids to be curious

but in a kind way which I know is easier said than done but I think that is naturally where they want to go it's only us that put all that kind of shame attached to oh no don't ask them about that yeah

and how has it been at work like on so 2023 you started it as you wanted to like coming in and unapologetically yourself to work how was that what does the rest of the year and the rest of your life oh wait are we not seeing each other oh god what does the rest of the year look like for you like what's your hope and like what do you want to keep what do you want to do this year so for me 2023 is about the every day of the every day of being bald. So it's great that I'm able to do kind of like a photo shoot where I celebrate being bald or I go to an event and or I go on this morning. But you know, my makeup was done

there and it was amazing and it was an experience. But again, it's about bridging that gap between the messages that I'm sharing, which I really believe, but then matching my everyday level of confidence with that message because some days it really does feel like a million miles away. And then other days I feel like, no, I've got this. And I think that. that's okay and I think that's normal as well like I always say confidence is not a linear journey we all have ups and downs for various reasons um but for me I just want to be more of a an ambassador for alopecia in everyday life because I am at a stage now where I am confident to be asked questions I am at a stage where you can look at me kindly and whatever and I'd

rather someone ask me than somebody who is wearing their wig and terrible to be asked about it I'd rather take that attention and be that person because it's taken me two decades to get here and I'm a big gob so I may as well start using it oh

third base nice callback that was good that was good I guess to finish this off can I ask if anybody is listening to this who is still in the wig and terrified

that someone's going to find out or who is 13 and losing their hair for the first time what would you say to them so to anyone feeling that way I would say that is exactly how I felt and did feel for a long time but it will get better it is a conscious choice you have to make every day to learn to kind of like yourself and I still think that's the most rebellious act especially we as women can do just like ourselves um but also don't feel like there's an end goal. Don't feel like by wearing a wig you're hiding your alopecia because some of the best alopecia advocates I know love and embrace wigs and that's part of

their daily outfit. And that's great. It's not about what you put on your head or not. It's not about if you even choose to talk about your alopecia or not. It's about feeling okay with yourself and not letting that shame shadow everything in your life and stop you doing things. For me, the reason it was important to start moving away from the wig was because I was hiding behind it and I wasn't doing things. I wasn't going to theme parks. I wasn't sleeping over friends' houses. I wasn't entering relationships in a healthy way. So that's why I knew I needed to make the shift. So I would say if you feel like you're in that space, do reach out to people in the hair loss community because for me

it's only been two years since I started chatting to people on social media and look at me now. I'm meeting these two dream boats you know so favourite hairy people I don't regret saying that it's true that's what I want this episode to be cool, great, that's all I want on my

gravestone. Laura's favourite hairy person, one of two you're so cool you're so great I can't wait to see you this summer just Is the head getting bigger? Rocking it.

Yeah. To call back to those words that are thrown around a lot, but I, like, inspiring and empowering. Like, you're just really cool. Yeah, so cool. Thank you so much for telling your... An inspiring an empowering journey. Thank you so much for sharing a journey.

Thank you for having me. And, yeah, I felt like I kept them cool. You wait until I go out the front door, I'll be like, and you'll be watching from the window. brought it back. Thank you. Thanks so much, Laura. Should I delete that is part of the ACAS creator network.