Should I Delete That? - Sober Awkward

Episode Date: January 8, 2024

As we welcome in the new year, many of you will be dabbling with sobriety through Dry January. It can feel like the perfect antidote to a heavy month of boozing and indulging over the festive period, but how many of us actually consider why we drink? Sober Awkward is a podcast run by sober pals Victoria Vanstone and Hamish Adams-Cairns, and they join Alex and Em to discuss what it really feels like to be sober and why they were both compelled to do it. They share the best things and worst things about being sober, and how to tell people to just f**k off when you need to...You can listen to Sober Awkward here or follow them on Instagram @soberawkwardFollow us on Instagram @shouldideletethatEmail us at [e-mail] by Daisy GrantMusic by Alex Andrew Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

All of these things that I did when I was drunk, I just thought it was hilarious because I ever, I was the funny one. Everybody else thought it was hilarious. I was like, well, this is what you do when you drink. Everybody drinks. Everybody gets pissed and sleeps around and takes drugs and does all these things. So you don't question it. You never question it. Hi everyone and welcome back to should I delete that. It is 2024. and girl Alex is officially on her maternity leave, which means I have a special guest who's just given himself away. I've subbed in the Alexes.

I've got boy Alex here today for the GBA. The better Alex. The one that you've all been waiting for. That's not fair. Not while she's not fair. After the husband's episode. Yeah, it's a full-time feature now. Exactly.

I'm just going to say it's where Arlo's here. So if you hear crunching and giggling and fidgeting, it's probably me, but she's also here to it. kidding. Um, she's also such a mum joke. She's also here as well. Anyway, um, I've been off the hook. As we said before Girl Alex went away, we have batch recorded loads and loads of amazing interviews for you, so it's not going to feel like anything's different and we are sticking with the GBA formula. We are just subbing different versions of people, different versions just different people, okay? Well, Girl Alex, isn't it? I see, I'm not okay without her. I'm not

okay without her. This has gone to shit. Right. Okay. Let's get into. it. Babe, good, bads, awkward. Have you got anything for me? Yes, I do. I have a good, a bad and an awkward, I've decided, yeah. Brace yourself. This is actually really good for boy, Alex, because he is such a perfectionist and he's not normally one to admit fault of any, or like, embarrassment. None of them are actual thoughts about it. Sorry, embarrassment of any fault. So I'm really proud of you for siphoning out and awkward out of your otherwise perfect life. Yeah, yeah, okay. So, um, I'll start with the good. Yeah. Um, so my good, um, so my good, is pretty idyllic. So we went to the Panto on Christmas Eve. Oh, we did. And it's a bit of

a family tradition. And we were sitting pretty near the front and we're very nervous about Arlo being there. It was passed for bedtime and all of that. And she was obsessed with the lights and the entire cast of the Cinderella performance, which was stunning, by the way, they were obsessed with her. They were singing to her, performing to her, and she was clapping and laughing back, and it was the most wholesome, like, wholesome moment.

And I just want every Christmas to be like that going forward. Yeah, I think it was probably the best night of my life. I was like crying. I was like, oh my God. But it was like everyone that loved her was there. Like, it wasn't really about, like, our feelings. It was just everyone watching her, like my family and Alex's mom and everyone was just looking at her and oh it was just

and she was just thriving. It was such a happy night, I agree. That was a really good, good. Yeah, it was amazing. My good, also baby related, but not my baby related is that as of right now, girl Alex is having a baby any fucking second. I'm waiting by my phone. literally I am I'm beside myself

yeah so are you all it but I am I just don't even know what to do myself I'm so excited I'm literally I keep voicing it every five minutes not every five minutes I'm trying to be cool I'm trying to remember what I would have needed and it wouldn't have been that so I'm you would have just needed another book

because you got through a whole book and Dr. Kim was like you ready now so I got one more page who's got to finish um no it's she I'm so excited for any minute and it's just best news in the whole wide world Donale is getting a bestie, so that's going to be epic. Sorry, we don't have child...

Alex is the childcare today, and Alex is with me, so that's what's happening, with the noise. But yeah, it's just amazing, that's all good, good, good, good, baby good, more babies, oh my God. I'm so excited. I'm just, honestly, I feel sick about it with excitement. I do, it's... Okay, I'm so excited. Okay, next week, I can't wait next week because they'll be here and... You're their best friends?

I know, I know, I know, okay, bad, so bring it down. Bring it down. Come the baby, let's go. Okay, so, so... Same night, Christmas Eve, we're in the theatre. Is this so bad? This is my bad, because Arna was having the best time. You're so selfish.

Meanwhile, somebody in the audience... This can't be your bad. You're so selfish. Well, it was bad. It was not, you know, it was bad for the person. Arlo's laughing. The entire performance stopped, and all the lights came on, and a man came to the front and said,

please could everyone step outside and we're wondering what's going on some poor person had collapsed and broken three ribs he'd fallen off his chair he'd fallen off his chair which that is bad for him for him

as long as you're not making it so hard for me having to move 20 minutes of the ban to mine because some poor guy broke his ribs on Christmas Eve I know what a day anyway so

I just say what a dick no I really feel for them and the family and I hope they're all okay and I mean the performance went ahead and we got to The show must go on

and Cinderella got her shoe back which is always a big concern during that performance Yeah So that was my bad What was you? You're such a trash

Um this is like Do you need an ambulance Or can we just wait until we Wait until the curtains That's the theatre kid in you Yeah The show must go on

Yeah You don't need that many ribs just so To be fair, there's not much you can do for broken with. See, the show should have gone on. You're such enough. My bad. Oh, no bads. It's just, I mean, no bads.

It's a bleak enough month. We're not doing bads. I'm just going to keep, I'm just going to keep going with the goods. Well, now I look like a dick. Yes, you do. Yes, you do. Keeping going with the goods. Christmas was mega, but it's also over, which is so good.

Yeah, it could be a lot sometimes as well. We were speaking to loads of our friends and, you know, it's an amazing and magical time a year but also it does come with stresses and everything so I think it's always good to be aware that, you know, if you had a stress on time then it's, like everyone else hasn't had a golden magical time. It's so funny, I was talking to my friend about this other day.

Like, I watched, I did it with two of my friends where I watched their family, like, I saw their Instagram stories, basically. I did it with, yeah, two people, and I was like, God, they look like they're having the calmest, they both had kids, and I was like, God, they're just so calm and so happy and blah, la, la, la. And then I spoke to both of them, like, in the festive goch.

And both of them were like, oh, my God, get me away. I'm so, I need to go home. This has been so, I'm so tired. I was like, oh, everything's a lie. So, yeah, I just go back to Festive Gooch. Is that a known expression? It is now. It's what we called the, it's what we called the Christmas episode.

Festive Goch. Well, it is. It's the Peronium. It's the festive Peronium. Anyway, I actually really love January They're like fresh start vibes And so I just feel really good That we're, well, that we go back into our routine

But only for a minute Because we are going, boy Alex and I Obviously girl Alex is hella busy We're going on an adventure next week A big adventure Literally the biggest adventure of our lives We're going as a family, the three of us I am so nervous

Maybe that's my bad It's that we don't speak the language Of the country that we're going to And that's not great I don't read the language. It's such a big adventure and we're going with a baby. So I feel that we're a bit mad for that.

But no real bad. Everything's so good. I feel really positive. Mostly I'm just in Alex having... Girl, Alex, having a baby bubble. But, awkward. There was something that happened to me on the 23rd of December

and it has every single day of my life since then made me want to eat myself from the outside of it. I can't think what it was. Alex, it was the worst thing that happened to me. So we were at a Christmas event and there were loads

people there and loads people that I didn't know and I went to the loo and I sat down on the loo and I had a wee finished my wee I stood up pulled up my knickers and as I pulled up my knickers the loo door opened

it gets so much worse there's a man there and I laugh but we are our faces are five inches apart and he goes Oh, sorry. Was he very short?

No, no, okay, fine, he was, he was tall. But, like, no, I was stood up. I was stood up. Okay. No, I was, I was in that kind of, like, hunched position, like, you know, and you're pulling up. And he was quite tall, but, like, he was there, bearing down on me, actually. And thankfully, he wasn't short, because they'd have just had... You just kissed him.

No, he'd have had fanny, like, it'd been too low. Anyway, I was pulling up my pants, and he went, oh, sorry, sorry and I went oh don't worry and then he kept coming in and was like oh my god no what the fuck so then I was like oh my god he's coming in so I was like well I've got to get the leggings up too so I then went like put my hands like from my knickers to my leggings to get them up and then he looked down and I think it was only then that he clocked that I was like on the loop I think it was the fact you said don't worry because that's like an invitation to keep on coming in a don't worry don't worry come on come on come on just stand by the basin

when you say it like that I meant don't worry isn't like yeah this is utterly humiliating but don't worry I'll forget you know the next move is you leaving you want to leave and I'm not going to make a big deal out of it no no but he kept coming in and then he looked down he went oh my god

I'm so I was like that's a huge reaction oh my god I'm so sorry and then he still it was like I'd frozen him it was like he was petrified I was like just leave buddy because I had my butt cheeks to the wind anyway and then he did leave and I never

I saw him again, but it was, it went on for about 10 seconds. I'm like, ooh, oh, oh, you know when you do the pavement dance for somebody? It was that, except I have my trousers around my ankles. Well, he didn't beckon him in. Don't worry, don't worry. You go on in. More than merrier at this point. More than merrier, indeed.

My awkward is Christmas Eve. Sorry, that's Arnish. If you heard that, Arno, I just did a fart. It's really pushing them, so. My awkward is, um, so I'm a... Christmas Eve was a big night for you. A big night for me. Oh.

So I'm a parent. I'm age 30. I have my own business. Um, you know, we have a lovely house. We go for park walks with our child and our dog. And yet I still managed to be sick on New Year's Eve. Oh, New Year's Eve. Yeah. I thought about Christmas Eve.

So I think it was a... I haven't been drinking for a while. And then possibly drank too. much, Em, would you say? Alex, I'm so proud of you for admitting that you did this. He got too drunk. He just got too drunk. You just over-cooked it.

I overcooked it. I celebrated too hard. Yeah, you was... I lived too hard as what I did, actually. I was mortified. I was like, you are a parent. Yeah, exactly. Banished.

I was like, get out. We didn't even want to look. We are... Shame. Shame, shame. Because one of us is still breastfeeding, so I had to... Spoiler, guys, it's me. I haven't.

tried. So I had to play it cool. So I think that makes it even worse. It's just that I was just like, mm-hmm, okay. So that wasn't good. That was very awkward. We had our friends over,

and there was family in the house, and that was very embarrassing. But, you know what? You've told thousands of people, but you don't know. That's okay. Are you sure? I'm sure.

Well, actually, that's tease us up. I didn't think you were going to tell us that, but that teases up quite well for this week's interview. Full disclosure, we actually did this interview a couple of months ago, and we decided to wait until January to up, it just because the contents of what we were saying felt that it would be really relevant at this time of year. I didn't even know at that point that Alex would do that on New Year's Eve,

which makes this episode even more apt. But we interviewed the hosts of the Sober Awkward podcast and we talked to them about like this kind of crazy pressure to drink and about basically deciding to give up drinking. And on the back of this interview, I actually decided to stop drinking. And I think it was something at one point, someone said I said oh I never know what excuse to give as to why I don't want to drink and someone said just say you want to be a really good parent

and I was like oh my god but it did feel like I don't know it felt like a real like light bulb moment for me and I actually then didn't drink from I'm gonna say like September through September October November I think and then I drank again at Christmas but I've decided to stop drinking again now

and just just because I really enjoyed it. I enjoyed having the energy. I'm actually too tired and I think I'm better at regulating my emotions when I'm not drinking. So we just thought with dry January, this was quite a good time to do it. And also given that I ended up stopping drinking on the back of this interview, I felt that it was really, really powerful and I'm really excited for you guys to hear it. Obviously, I need Boy Alex to listen to it, Pronto, because he's a hot mess. So without further ado, let's get on with the interview. Let's all keep Girl Alex very much

in our thoughts. She's having the most exciting week of her life and we can't wait to welcome her back. Without further ado, enjoy the interview. Hi guys. Thank you so much for joining us all the way from Australia today. How are you doing? Well, I've spent the afternoon in A&E actually. Oh, God. Oh. Yeah, I spend a lot of time. I do spend a lot of time in A&E. So I've got three young kids. So there's usually something weird going on. But one of them fell off his studio and had like grit in his knee. so I had to go and get in what, watch him get it picked out with tweezers. Oh, no. Not time in AA, A.E with, A.A.A. and it.

A.A. A.A. and A.A. And E. So you guys host a podcast called Soba Awkward. Can you tell us about the origins of Sober Awkward? Like, how did the podcast come to be? Yes, that's, that's Vick's story. I was a massive boozer. So I've always been a bit of a party girl. I grew up in a family that liked to drink. It was always very normal drinking, very frivolous drinking. There was no alone drinking or problem drinking.

And I just wanted to join in. So I grew up wanting to be this party girl, became my persona, my identity. It was how I made friends. It was how I kept friends. And I just loved to drink. That was all I knew. And I could never ever, in a billion years, imagined that someone like me, who was the life and soul of every party and had the key to every lock-in,

could ever, ever not drink because it was totally ingrained in every pore of me. But I started to get massive anxiety after I had my first kid. There was a sort of consequence to my actions for the first time ever, which was that I had a crying baby

in the room next to mine. And I had to confront my drinking problem, I guess it was then, and get help for over-drinking or mid-range binge drinking. and I started writing about it the day that I gave up and I got therapy and I got help to understand this very, very normal, socially acceptable level of alcohol consumption

and I got help and I got sober and I started writing about it and then I started the podcast. I met a girl called Lucy who wanted to get sober and so she was very, very newly sober when she started to record the podcast. Luckily she's really funny and we made it a comedy podcast about two party girls giving up booze. But then she left and I had to find another sort of poor lost soul on the streets to try and drag in with me to join me on the podcast. And I managed to force Hamish to go sober as well.

And I think I've kind of ruined his life, haven't I? Well, Vic didn't ask me to be on the podcast. Vic was like, let's go for a walk. I said, OK, I listened to the podcast. I wasn't sober at the time. And she was like, hey, you're going to be sober now and you're going to be on the podcast. Which we joke was the end of my social life and my sex life in one conversation. And I was like, I was at the normal drinker.

I was like not the biggest piss head in my group. I was not the smallest. I'd just become a dad. And I just wanted to give up sort of to give it a go, like to give it a try for health reasons. The podcast was already a success. So I was like, I'm not turning down that. And I enjoyed it. I was, you know, a listener despite being a drinker.

And it was funny. So I was like, okay, I definitely want to hop on. My background was all in comedy. And I guess our belief is that alcoholism and addiction are like, very serious topics that should be treated that way. But sobriety really doesn't have to be. Like sobriety can be funny. It can be awkward.

And so we're trying to shine like a more familiar everyday light on quite a heavy topic. Yeah. And we're trying to sort of adhere it to people who anyone who's ever woken up with a hangover and then found themselves, we say in the intro, then found themselves waving 50 quid at a barman by happy hour. So as anyone in the world who's ever got up felt like, like shit and then go, oh God, I'm never drinking again. And then they're back on it on the Thursday night with their mates because that's all they know. It's the only way they know

how to socialise. So it's all about, we call it sober awkward basically because that's what it feels. Early sobriety is the most awkward thing you could ever imagine. You have to learn how to be a completely different person socially and you have to completely reframe your social life. So it's all, our podcast is all about that, about going back into society and the impact that alcohol has on all of our lives. Hamish, you weren't a problem drinker. You just stopped drinking to do the podcast, which is, like, great. How do you feel, like, living, well, I don't know.

Do you feel like you aren't going to drink again because it's your brand? Or do you feel that you, in yourself, you feel better for it? Like, and you've realised that you are happier doing that? Like, how do you feel about sobriety long term? now? Do I feel better in myself 100%. It's in every way I feel better. There's been no downsides to sobriety that I'm yet to find. Apart from the no social life and sex life, you mentioned do good ways to give up alcohol. Move somewhere you have no social life, like Northern Queensland in Australia, then have child. It's like infinitely easier to not drink when you have zero

friends except for a little pooing baby. So that was a good move. Would I, go back to drinking is literally like a thought that I have, I flip-flop with constantly. At the moment, like, probably in the last month is the first time I thought I actually might never drink again. Based on, like, I don't know what would be the thing that I go back to now. In my head, it's such a big thing, but I'll never drink again. I'll never sit on a beach in my retirement and, like, toast my wife, you know. At the same time, I don't know what the thing would be. You know, I've done weddings, I've done public speaking, I've done all the things that are meant to be hard sober I've now done. So I feel like I'd be so disappointed myself if I'm like, oh, it was just

you know, Easter 2026. I thought, oh, screw it. Why not? So I think I will be sober forever, but I'm not going to put that kind of pressure on myself at this stage. Well, A.A. teaches you not to do that anyway, doesn't it? So I guess that's the kind of attitude that everybody should take to not drinking, right? It's one day at a time. For me, I find it very reassuring to not put a label on it forever, whereas Vic found complete freedom and being like, I know it's forever. That is not a jar like a door open, that moderation is not an option like this is forever. So it depends what went at the scale you come to it from. Yeah, it was an utter relief for me to give up drinking.

I didn't know it was possible for someone like me to be a non-drinker, as I said. So actually coming out of my last session of therapy and just realizing, oh my God, I don't have to do this anymore, was just absolutely liberating. I couldn't believe it. So from then on, I've just kind of carried on that feeling within because I can't go back because I don't feel like, what would I gain from it? And I also have got to the point in sobriety now where I don't see the point in drinking

because I so look forward to socialising now. It's taken five and a half years to get to that point, but I can go into a situation, be my best self, be authentic, enjoy myself, and not have any regrets or shame or, you know, have my knickers on backwards or have a traffic cone on my head the next day. You know, all of these things that I used to do when I was drunk, I've done them all.

I've done it. I've been there. And I just think, well, what would be? be the point now. I don't know if this is like a bad question to ask, but it's what is like coming into my head is like, do you miss it? Do you ever miss it? Are you sometimes like, God, I would just love to, you know, I'm having dinner with my mate and I'd love to have a drink or, you know, do you ever miss it? I do sometimes occasionally have a fleeting moment. If I've had a really long day and the kids are just being assholes, which is quite a lot,

quite a lot often. If I was to see a really cold beer on a tray, like with a waiter carrying it in my eyeline, there's a part of me that there's my drinking brain that is still wired to go, I need to grab that and drink it. I'm not thinking, oh, I'd like to have a little bit of a sip of that. I'm thinking I would like to swallow it like Popeye spinach

down my neck in one go. Because that was a sort of drinker I was. I was a massive downer, like a pint downer, a classic sort of laddette culture. survivor. And I just think, you know, I do want to drink occasionally, but I know that I can't. And the moment is very, very fleeting. And it's this sort of sitting with it and learning how to process these emotions when I do feel like that. I know that it's not good for me. I can play the tape forward and go, this is what alcohol does to you. This is why you don't drink. And this is

why you feel amazing now. And I can sort of talk myself out of it. And that gets shorter and shorter the longer that you're sober. In the beginning, it was me sitting in a chair looking really grumpy, trying to sort of squeeze the thought out of my head. But now it's like a split second where I go, oh yeah, I used to do that. There's a cold beer.

I used to want one of those, and now I don't. I think those, like the hardest days now end up being the most rewarding. So I can pick very clearly four times in the last 15 months, which would be like, I really wanted to drink that day. One of which was, I was in Rome and I rented a car, I've never driven on the wrong side of the road. I hate rental cars anyway. Within five minutes, I crash the car.

Okay? And I, like, well, I smashed the wing mirror. So I had like two more hours of driving. I could kind of get away with it. I'm just riddled with stress. Like, what's the bill for this going to be? And that day, I remember eventually getting to my Airbnb and be like, I would love a drink right now.

And then not giving, you know, that lasts for me 20 minutes. And then you go inside, you drink something else. And you sit down and run a bath, like there's a billion things you can do to get rid of that. that isn't turning to the bottle. And now that day turns out to be, like, one of the most rewarding or one of the most, like, cementing of my strength and sobriety. I'm like, what, I survived that day when I crashed a freaking car will be sweet,

but I can do the little things. I've done the big things. Can I ask, Victoria, about, like, you said you grew up in a house that, like a drinking house, like, me too. It was fun. And like, and it was just, it was always around. And I think I actually probably grew up on the other side. where I was like, I was quite serious because of it.

Like, I was like, my mum always joked that I was Safi, like from absolutely fabulous, because I was like the serious kid. And I just, you know, I've had my own like ups and downs with where I'm at with alcohol and how I feel about it. But I grew up around it and it was really fun and it is really fun. And in so many ways I can still see that it is really fun. And I wonder how you feel now raising your own kids around alcohol. Because we, I do think the culture, particularly in Britain, I don't know Australia,

but around alcohol is nuts. and the pressure to drink is so much, teen drinking is so crazy. And, you know, I think our upbringings around alcohol probably quite normal, but it doesn't necessarily make them good. So how do you feel now parenting kids? Like, what do you think, how will you, like, approach it with your own kids now? It's a really hard one that, because obviously I had to go through that to get where I am now. I had to go through questioning my drinking.

I had to grow up in this family and I had to learn and I had to be a massive drinker to be a non-drinker. So my kids are going to grow up. My husband stopped drinking about a year ago as well. So they're actually going to grow up in a house where nobody drinks, which is really weird. And also there's a part of me that feels guilty about that because my parents, my house was like, you know, the shining disco ball on the dark streets. There was always something going on. Everyone was always happy. There was always people falling out the front door. And it was fun. I did enjoy it growing up. I think there was a part of me that probably thought,

oh, I wish my parents would not have a party tonight. But it was a fun place to live. And there's part of me that feels guilty that my kids are not having that sort of rioters household, which is weird. But I think me trying to break this generational cycle will hopefully ripple through to them and they will understand that they are enough without alcohol.

But when it comes to me talking to them about it, It is a difficult situation, you know, a difficult conversation to have because I'm not sure whether to tell them everything. We've had this conversation before, haven't we, Hamish? With teens, you've got to keep these lines of communications open and you've got to be honest, but how honest do you be? Do I tell them that are, you know, overdosed on ecstasy? They know I all blew my finger off with a firework on the Millennium Night. They don't know I slept around with, you know, half of the southern hemisphere. Like there's certain things that they probably don't need to know, but where do you,

draw the line. Yeah. It's a hard one because I want to be honest with them, but also I think there's being too honest and then just going, well, my mum did it, so therefore I'm going to do it too. And just, sorry, while we're on that, and I do want to, like, move on for it, because it is heavy. And like you say, I actually love that you guys do, do the light and sobriety and stuff. But I wonder as well, how you feel just, this is something we've talked about before, Al, whether it is, do you think it's exposure or do you feel like it might be a generational thing? Did you have any thoughts on that? Just because I'm interested in this anyway,

I've just become a mum, and I'm really interested in how I want to approach alcohol with my own daughter. We think that the way that we were brought up is different to the way it's happening now in terms of kids' approach to it. I feel like our kids will know more than we did. We naively went into drinking loads

because that's what we saw and that was what was cool. Like we've seen the stats. There's more 18 to 20-year-olds giving up alcohol now than ever before. We had a thing, it's like schoolies here in Australia, which is like when 16, 17, 18-year-olds, finish school and go on holiday. Like, there were masses of them on the beach

drinking smoothies. Like, people are not getting pissed like we got pissed in the 80s, 90s and 2000s. So I hope that that is just going to carry on. But, yeah, it's a difficult thing to wrap your head around. What I'm scared of with Vic's kids is that Vic is like Mrs. Sobrati. So either they will go sober or they will react against them,

like, fuck you, I'm going for it. Or they will hide it. you know, like it's one of those three things is going to happen and it's bloody hard parent that. Yeah. I think my reason why giving up alcohol has to be my kids, but it doesn't necessarily mean that they won't drink, but that is my hope.

I think the easiest way to describe it, like whether it's generation or not on nature or nurture and all of these things, like if you imagine a pie chart and parenting being on that pie chart, you have environment, culture, trauma, all of these things that have happened to you, these little 25% going around, 50% of that is generational.

So alcohol does, if you stop drinking, my hope is that I will take off that 50% of generational alcoholism that's run through my family for years and they're left with those other things. And then that's up to them to work it out whether they're going to drink or not. But I think by me giving up, at least I'm giving them a chance to say no, whereas I felt like I never really had a chance. I never had the opportunity or a choice to go, do I drink or don't I? I just thought I have to drink because I have to join in with my family because that's what we do. And I hope that I'm reversing that now a little bit.

I think it's so cool that you have that. I don't know if it's like willpower or just determination. Like I'm finding it hard listening because like I'm a proper people pleaser. And I'm like I also don't like to not fit in. I like to fit in. I don't want to stand out. And I find it so hard to not drink. You know, drinking definitely is bad for my mental health.

My mental health isn't great anyway. I know that it really affects my mental health. But whenever I'm in a situation, I guess, with my family or my friends, where it's just, it's so normal. It just feels so normal. And to go against the grain feels really difficult and feels very statement-making. And it almost feels like you're just like you're singling yourself out. And it's hard, right?

that is really difficult and then there's the pressure of like do they think i'm boring are they going to think i'm boring if i'm if i'm not drinking you know it's so hard we're nodding we are sitting here nodding like nodding dogs i mean it is hard it's a massive thing because it is so normalized within our culture everybody drinks so going against that you do feel like the sore thumb when you go out you do feel like a weirdo but it takes practice and once you really hamish describes it as this like wall of Lego. The first time you go out, it's really awkward. It's really, you feel really self-aware. You feel like you can hear your own voice. And then you keep going. So you go for five minutes the first time and it's awful. Then the next time you go for 10 minutes and you build up

this little wall of sort of confidence each time you go out. And in the end, you can go out for half an hour or an hour and you can build it up to a whole night. And you can own your sobriety and go into a situation and say, look, I've decided I don't drink. It's not working for you. It's not working for me anymore. It's affecting my mental health and I want to try not drinking. And I think you'll find now it's what we've both found definitely, isn't it, Hayne, that people are getting a bit more used to people that don't drink now. It's not like, oh my God, you don't drink. What's wrong with you? Isn't it boring? People know how massively it's affecting our mental health and our anxiety and people are understanding rather than just judging you. And that's a huge shift in our

society is to see this change of some people that are going sober being more accepted. I think I was in the same headspace as you. You know, I was, my first fear was my friends are going to give me stick or peer pressure me into it. Actually, I gave my friends nowhere near enough credit than they deserve. Like, not one person has given me stick. And I think, you know, our society today, if someone wants to go vegan, you can go vegan. You want to change your gender. You can change your gender. Like someone decided to go sober. It's really not a big deal and no one really cares at all. But you touched on people pleasing and you touched on boring, which are like two of the biggest topics within sobriety. We are both enormous people

pleases. Drinking was part of our people pleasing. It's like we'll make everyone's night fantastic. We'll take on the responsibility of everyone because we'll just be the life and soul. And now it's our like drive to prove that sober is not boring. That is our passion. We're going to do everything that we can to prove that boring is not sober. Because, you know, a lot of people hide. They're like when I am drunk, I become an extrovert. I become the most fun version of myself. I'm better at talking to someone I'm attracted to. I'm better at dancing. I have better conversation topics. I'm funnier. All of these things are insecurities that we just sort of quiet in town by drinking. And so coming out of that and actually discovering all this

confidence without the insecurities and proving to yourself over and over again, I can dance, I can go on a date, I can chat to people, I can meet strangers, sober, is really rewarding for me and like really I feel like I always say the least interesting thing about going sober is giving up alcohol. Me choosing that drink when the rest of you choose that drink is not interesting at all. There is nothing to that. But growing as a person and finding out what your insecurities were and testing yourself over and over again, can I do this thing that I always used to do piss sober? That's the goal. That's the most interesting bit. And sometimes that might take a bit of therapy. Like for me, the massive people pleaser, it took some therapy to work out the reasons

why I drank. And I don't think we ever really look at that as humans when we're drinkers. We just go, well, I just drink. That's what we do. That's what everybody does. But actually it is a personal choice at the end of the day. I actually realized it was me putting my hand in the fridge for that cold bottle of chardonnay. It was me waving a tenor at the bar and it was me, you know, paying for an extra round of drinks. It was my responsibility and I had to find out why I was doing that. And it was so weird because like I went to therapy not really realizing I had anything wrong with me. And I came out going, oh my God, I'm actually mental. I had a few like really good realisations. Like all of my friendships were based around me entertaining people and me showing everybody

a good time, which was really sort of destructive to my own self. And I was sort of, yeah, put myself on show and do all these crazy things so that I had a story for everybody the next day. but actually that was really bad for me and it was about learning. Sobrity for me was about learning just to start being kind to my body, kind to my brain and learning who I was before alcohol

and who came after it because you do sort of regress into this sort of childlike state before you drank in early sobriety. You go back and you start to remember who you were at age 13, 14 when the booze came on the scene and it's really interesting to sort of look back and go, well where did all those years go? What was I doing?

And really, I've come alive since going sober. Like, I didn't know that I could write or podcast. I've never really, me and Hamas had never really had proper jobs, haven't we? We still never really had proper jobs. We're just slackers. So now we're like, we've got proper jobs and everything, haven't we? Do we? Is it a podcast a proper job?

Really? Yes. Definitely. I have a question from my own people pleading. Okay, so a couple of weeks ago, but I've given up drinking before. I gave up in 2019 for like probably a year I think and it was really good for me I was really anxious I didn't have great like physical health and drinking definitely exacerbated that and my mental health wasn't good I was so anxious stop drinking started running completely got on top of my

anxiety and then since then I've been able to drink fairly very healthily you know I've got I have an occasional horrendous hangover and that's about it. The anxiety's gone I don't drink loads and I've just had a kid so I didn't drink when I was pregnant and she's now seven months so I can't like she takes everything I can't have a hangover. So

that's that so I'm not really drinking a lot but this summer like I became a bit of a wine mom at the end of the day I was like I'm just going to have one glass like I'm breastfeeding so I can't drink loads but I'm just going to have a glass like I've earned it and I kept making these jokes to myself like I understand why people drink now parents like all the stupid cliched shit that you just hit all the time that's so annoying and I became

it and then when I got home in September me and my husband were both like we're not going to drink for a bit we're just going to have a bit of time just like we're really tired like I don't think it's helping we need the sleep like we're just you know we were having a glass of wine every now and then we're just not going to do it anymore and I found it so hard I'm finding it so much harder this time than last time and I don't know why I think maybe I don't know why but like Producer Jay's on the call and it's going to kill her because she's going to have to just listen

about a story about her but like the other day she was like she was like do you want to go for a drink and I was like yeah yeah yeah I'll come and then I was like I'm not drinking but I can't tell her because she's asked me to go for a drink so we got there and I just ordered a wine

even though I'm not drinking and then I just had like two sits and I did it and then I went to a christening and my friend was like glass of razor and I was like yeah didn't drink it I'm just holding it because I couldn't say no because I didn't want to make it a thing

Last night, my friend came over for a drink, and then she's like, oh, I don't want to drink alone. I was like, okay, I'll have one to then. So three times in the last week. I don't know what's happening to me. I'm finding it so, because I've given up drinking three times this week. I've been like, yeah, I'll have a glass of wine, and then I've just held it awkwardly. So can someone just help with that? Why am I doing that?

It's so annoying. Dick held beer for the first 18 months of sobriety. 18 months. not drinking it, which is about the taste that I used to drink it. I used to drink it at the pace of like evaporation. That was how quick I wasn't drinking beer. That's where you were sitting out. So yeah, that is not uncommon.

The only trick to that is just literally telling everyone. If I tell someone, I feel so accountable to it. I feel so bad if I break it, then at least the question's off the table. But then I feel bad for like for Daisy. If she's invited me out for a drink and then I say I'm not drinking and she'll go, oh, I won't drink then. And then you're like, no, but now I've ruined your thing. So you're, I'll drink, so you're happy.

And it's so annoying. You've got to own it. You've just got to own it and just say, look, I don't, I've decided to give myself a break from it. And I think it's very, very likely that they would just go, cool, no worries. Do you mind if I have one? And you go, no. I think we, you know, these ask people pleasers, we make up these scenarios in our heads that never ever actually happen. I'm thinking years in advance about these situations.

When I gave up, I was like, I cannot give up drinking because everybody is going to hate me. I'm never going to get invited anywhere. Everyone's going to think I'm the most boring person in the world and I'm never going to have any friends. But of course, that doesn't happen. If you're mates of your good mates, they're always going to stand by you. And that's actually one of the most satisfying things in sobrieties is how accepting everybody is of it. And I think if you are going to give up drinking and the conversation is out there now, so many alcohol-free drinks and everything out there is so much more acceptable.

I think your friends will surprise you actually. But we do have to get better at finding things to do that aren't going for a drink. You've been asked there twice in 24 hours, hey, let's meet for a drink. We just try and fill the days rather than nights. We're all about coffees rather than cocktails. Or like walks or runs or like an activity that isn't just sitting in a bar or pub drinking and talk. We're not good. I think particularly men, you know, we're not good at talking one-on-one eye-to-to-eye.

we're much more comfortable shoulders to shoulder on a walk, on a run in a stand, or a sporting fiction. But that is how we communicate. And I guess, you know, we've got to find more ways of doing that. That's not just go to a pub, have a chat. Also, I think people get disappointed. Like, I know a lot of my mates, they'd lost their reliable drinking buddy. So, of course, they want to carry on because they enjoy that time with you.

And also, when you give up drinking and you've got mates, they're all massive bin to drinkers. still. You giving up is like holding a mirror up to them and saying your drinking is probably needing a dressing as well because I'm addressing mine. Maybe you need to address yours. Even if you don't say it, it does come across like that because you've probably got a very similar drinking habit as your mates. So it can be really, really hard. And it is about reframing that social life and meeting for coffees instead of, you know, instead of drinks at night. I went to an adult glee club the other night. That's the sort of thing you do when you're sober. You find these weird little groups.

I go to writing group, pottery group, all these kind of weird little niche groups that you go to. Yeah. Yes, it's actually quite entertaining. This is why you alienate your friends. Yeah. As you're sober, you're holding a mirror up to them. You're like, oh, I've gotten really into meditation recently.

Yeah, I'm a smug wanker. I'm just thinking, oh God, I've got so many questions, but I wanted to ask you on friendships and relationships, When drinking, and specifically like binge drinking is a pillar of that relationship, have either of your journeys to sobriety compromise any of those relationships at all? Are there any that have suffered as a result or even ones that you've had to ultimately let go of? Have you? I've been quite lucky so far. You've lost one or two? I've lost a few along the road and it hasn't bothered me too much just because, you know,

they've got their own stuff going on. And I don't feel upset about it. you know, I'm one of those people that has some solid mates and I used to be a person who had a lot of acquaintances. I used to have a lot of people that I knew and I thought that made me popular because I was a people pleased and I could entertain them. So I thought I had more mates than I actually did and sobriety will truly show you who your solid columns of strength are, I think. And they're the ones that stick around. It is quite testing. I didn't get invited to a birthday party last week by a girl

who was a big drinker and I did feel a little bit gutted because I've invited her to my party and I just thought it was a bit odd I feel like an 11 year old

I feel it though that would hurt me too I get that yeah no I did feel a bit weird about it but then I just think well I wouldn't have wanted someone sober

at my birthday party I hated sober people sober people were the most boring, wanky, smug righteous bastards that I just didn't want anything to

do with. So I understand it. I know why people don't invite me out. I know I'm brilliant though, Hamish. Yeah, well, keep telling yourself that. I'll just throw a party just for you. I'll throw a party on her birthday next year. I feel like my biggest pisshead friends and Vic is like my only sober friend, every single person that I know is a drinker. The ones that I thought like the biggest pissheads who I was most nervous about socialising again with have actually surprised me the most. Like they've been the ones. I had one who came up here recently and he got here and he landed off the plane and like, right, let's go for a run. And the next day was like, let's do an ice bath. And he's like, let's climb a mountain. And then he was happy to drink non-alcoholic beers with me. And then

when he left, he goes, I love that non-acolic beer. I'm going to start drinking that during the week. And I was like, you know, it's very easy, like you said, like you, to project the worst case scenario. I'm going to be the outcast from all of my best friends because I don't do this thing, which we have done together for 20 years. And I don't think it's ever as bad as it is in your head. No. And I think often your mates have had enough of drinking as well, very often actually, and I think they'll be up for doing other stuff. People get bored of drinking and everyone's in their own little world. They all have their own intricate relationship with it. And I think sometimes people, when you say, right, I'm going to give this a go, they'll probably

say, okay, I'll do it with you. And that can happen a lot. And that is a really, really nice way to start off something with a sober mate. So you're both moving forward in the same direction. You might drink again at some point, but to have a sober mate that someone used to be a pisshead with, those relationships get so solid when you have those sober times together. You know, we talk about bonding when we're pissed, but I never used to remember, you know, my bonding sessions with my mates. All I remember was them sort of like holding my ponytail while I was sick in a toilet or peaking on someone's shoes.

Like, I never had really good bonding times with my mates because I was too busy gallivanting and just being this crazy party girl. So actually the relationships that I have now in sobriety, are much more authentic and much more rewarding. So I do think it all levels out in the end. You might lose a few mates, but actually you might make some really great ones. So I'm thinking now, right,

so if you go to a wedding, say, which is obviously like a big occasion for drinking, like that's all people do. And a lot of people, especially in British culture, I'm not sure I don't know about Australian culture, but especially in British culture, like we go to a wedding to get pissed. Like, that is the objective of the wedding.

like that's what that's how it feels right so when you go to those those kind of occasions now and everyone is really drunk how do you find that like do you enjoy that is that nice when everyone else around you is drunk and you're not can you still have fun and like engage and join in or are you a bit like i just want to go home good question okay so i've done six weddings so that's england twice and they're like three weddings very close to each other both times it was the number one thing i was most nervous about vick said hey you're going to be sober now, and I was about to go to England. I hadn't been England in four years, and I was going to see everyone for the first time. The weddings were like the first thing

that I thought about. And I was terrified. I thought, are they still going to be fun? A few things change when you go to wedding sober. Firstly, your favourite bit of the night is very different. For me, it was always the dance floor, like when some twat's got a tie around his head and all the buttons are undone and there's like a drunk godfather doing the worm. That was always my favourite bit, we're all there, and I'm like, why at your wedding night? Now, the service is my favourite bit. I've got no shame in saying that, watching the rings being put on on the first kiss, favourite bit. Oh, I love that. And then, um, I had, I had to make a rule for myself. So I was like, the dance floor is going to be a stumbling block for me. I am all enthusiasm, no talent on a

dance floor. Drinking seemed to help that. So I made a rule that I would be the first person on the dance floor. I would let the bride and groom go and then I would be first off after then. No, still that moment. They can do that thing, but then I'm going to be right in the middle of them. Elbowing them out of the way. My turn. Yeah. Yeah. So I, so I have to be first one on. Otherwise, I'm going to think about it all night. I'm going to think about it. And it's going to become too big a thing. I'm going to feel too self-conscious. And I'll just like, go find a pregnant woman and talk at the back of the room. So just like making yourself go on the dance floor. And like, what it is sober is you go for less long. So, you know,

I dance for like 25 minutes and then I'm out to have a chat with someone rather than it's like two hours of pressing and screaming. What happens and it wasn't something I was conscious of with regards to, you know, it gets to 10, 11 o'clock and everyone's wasted is I find myself somehow like a magnet being drawn to other sober people.

And I'm not just saying like they're pregnant, they're clearly sober. There's always like two other sober people who were not pregnant. And you'd find yourself outside and happen to be speaking to them. And I quite enjoy that. I quite enjoy that my night ends at midnight rather than two.

And it usually ends meeting someone sober and having like a really interesting conversation, which I've never had any wedding ever before after like 6pm. You know, it's always just bullshit conversations. So it doesn't, like it phases me when you got to the stage of the night when everyone's repeating themselves and you're getting a little bit spat on. Everyone's a little bit too drunk. But we just talk about having like a get out, like organizing, your exit well. We're experts at leaving a party without saying goodbye.

Yeah, backdooring. Is that a French exit? French exit? Italian exit? Irish exit. Irish goodbye. I wish goodbye. Oh, that's it. Yeah. Driving yourself to a wedding or a party and not being the designated drive for others so you can leave when you want. Fantastic tip. Yeah. Designated driving is so annoying. I found being a designated driver, honestly the hardest part of being sober for anything. And that's often not talked about because, again, I've just been

pregnant. But I honestly, I was so angry. I went to a bonfire at night party and I said designated driver. And people are just horrible to you. Like the people that you're driving home are so horrible to you. Just think, why the fuck have I done this then? Never do it. It's hard price. Never do it. Because yeah, you just end up hanging around

for hours for really drunk people who don't really care that you want to go home five hours earlier. and they're just horrible in your car and talking. And you feel boring. Yeah, it's the worst. They make you feel boring, which is so annoying because actually it's empowering when you just leave on your own.

But if you're with them, you don't really get a thanks. You just get like a, ugh, you're dragging me away. And it's like, get yourself home then. The worst thing about weddings for me, I've actually avoided them ever since because I think I've got PTSD about weddings, quite honestly, because I used to get so drunk the night before, and then I'd have to wake up and go to the wedding

because there's sometimes these weekend things, weren't they? And you'd have like the Friday night where everyone you hadn't seen for ages would go to the pub and we'd get... It's a bit like Christmas, actually. Christmas Eve, always to go to the pub and see all your mates from uni, didn't you? And then you get massively pissed

and wake up on Christmas Day or on the wedding day and have pure anxiety all morning and then have to start, and all I could think of was, right, how am I going to start drinking again? I've got to get the bloody Mary's in. I've got to get back on track and to try and fit in with what everybody else wanted from me

and what everyone else was doing. And then I used to get even more pissed than before because I'd be downing the booze faster than ever to try and get rid of my awful anxiety and my hangover. And it started this awful sort of cycle of me trying to drink away my anxiety. And that would go on probably for the whole of the week after the wedding as well

because I'd feel so shit about my behaviour and not remembering anything. And then waking up going, oh my God, what did I do? Did I offend the bride and groom? all of this other stuff are the relief of not having to do that at weddings now is actually unbelievable. But I think deep down I've actually avoided weddings because of that trauma when I was a drinker. I do think there is probably such a thing as like trauma based on

alcoholism or just like your behaviour when you were a drinker. All of those things that you forgot as a boozer, it still sort creeps up on me and taps me on the shoulder sometimes. So I haven't actually been to hardly any weddings. In fact, I can't believe you've been to six. He's got a lot of mate, he's popular. Well, she's got novelty, the guy that comes over. I think I get invited because he's in Australia, he'll never come. And you do. All of them.

No, I like that. I think those tips are good. And I like what you said about earlier, Victoria, about finding, like, the comfort in sobriety is like a gradual thing because I'm pregnant and I've done two wedding sober. And I've found it hard, but I think I've gone into it very much with the wrong. attitude of like, oh, everyone else gets the drink and I don't. And yeah, and also I'm the designated driver. And I think I saw it as like, well, if I don't enjoy it now, then I never will, you know, whereas actually it's like, oh, it's something that you have to build up. And it's

something that's like more of a gradual thing that you can like increase your comfort with. Because I guess it's all you ever know is like going to a wedding and getting absolutely smashed, then it's quite, it's difficult to then suddenly go completely sober. Of course it's easier to carry on the thing that you know. That would have been much easier. But for me, it reached a point where that wasn't going to be possible anymore because it was affecting my mental health. But I can understand for someone like Hamish, who's a very normal drinker, how you just carry on with these behaviours, even though they are having impact, you just carry on because it's not got that bad. And that's what's really interesting about this kind of sober curious scene that's happening

now. There's a place being recognised between the pub and an AA meeting where people are saying, look, alcohol isn't working for me anymore. I might not be extreme. I might not be on a park bench, you know, holding onto a bottle of Jack Daniels for dear life. But alcohol is having a negative impact on me in some way. And it doesn't mean you have to be like drinking every day or even drinking every weekend. I chat to people all the time that are not happy with that one glass of wine a month and they don't know why they do it. So it's really interesting, this kind of new sort of revolution with alcohol that's happening, which is people are understanding that even just one drink could raise your anxiety. I think it was on the Huberman Lab podcast recently.

They did one on alcohol and it was one glass of wine a week raises your anxiety 25% all the time. So that's the kind of stress it's having on your body and an amount of impact it has on you is quite incredible. So it's really nice now that there's this kind of little place where everybody fits in. That sober curious term is a bit like a warm hug, you know, saying, look, you don't have to be that bad, but you are worthy of support and professional help and you are worthy of healing. And perhaps this is something you could look into as a way of life. Because actually it is better. I know, I know we sound like smug idiots, but like we've both tried it out. And there are some really amazing benefits of sober life. And it is that

authenticity and, you know, genuine relationships and being able to. socialised without getting fucking wasted. It's brilliant. It's such a short-term gain. I think that's like what I find really fascinating with like British culture, but drinking culture is it's like you're chasing this like elusive thing for like what is actually such a short space of time. My mum always says with a word like if you don't want to overcook it.

And again, this is all very like colloquial and chill. But if you don't want to overcook it, you either start drinking at 11 or stop drinking at 11 because if you stop drinking at 11 you're not going to overdo it if you start drinking at 11 you'll never catch up but it's like it's actually mad that you've got that as like the kind of bar because it's so normalized that you are that we are all rushing towards getting so drunk and you touched on it earlier about this like insecurity thing and I feel like that's a really big part of it Al you were saying about not liking that wedding because you're pregnant and I didn't like sober weddings when I was pregnant.

because I felt really awkward in my body because it's like you can't throw shapes when you like are the shape like you feel so weird in yourself so I feel like that's a big part of it but I just I at its base level it does feel like we are chasing the moment when we lose our inhibitions yeah and actually that's mad because then the price we pay for it the next morning is horrific yeah and I can't actually understand how we've got to this point where we well, we're all, it's actually kind of sad if you think about it like that. We're like, oh God, we're all just, we're all just chasing the moment that we stop hating ourselves. It's marketing, really. It's really clever marketing.

You know, they're selling us with, we're living for, with long term repercussions from a short term high is really what it is. So we're sort of thought, we're sort of programmed from everything that's ever been shown to us that alcohol is fun. and it's really, really hard to backtrack from that because it's been part of our culture and our society for hundreds and thousands of years, not hundreds and thousands. But yeah, it's just so ingrained in us that you just can't, it's really hard to move away from that.

And it's funny that short-term high, we, you know, when you were talking about a minute ago about those glasses of wines after a long day, you know, with a baby, those reward wines. I can sort of do that with a cup of tea now, which has been a really kind of interesting learning curve for me because I know that when I used to take that first sip of wine after a long day with my baby,

I used to be like, ah, there you go, I feel better now. But of course the alcohol hadn't hit my system yet. It was 20 minutes. So it was all psychological. Actually, I wasn't feeling any of the benefits of the alcohol. I was just having the benefits of me mentally, psychologically, subliminally absorbing the alcohol into my system and my brain.

But of course, it hadn't really happened. So it's really interesting that you can change your frame of mind around a glass of wine and change it to a cup of tea, but still have the same euphoria looking forward to it, but then not, I know it doesn't sound exciting and I sound very boring when I say that, but you can have the same level of euphoria without those long-term repercussions is what I'm trying to say. I was going to say, and this is not a popular thing to say with two mums and a pregnant lady, I think it's a bit like childbirth I understand by the man

but we wipe the bad bit very quickly and then you're like bow yeah I'll go again and screw it and forget like whoa I was hungover and anxious and made a tit of myself and slept with someone I shouldn't have forget all of that stuff very quick and then you hit the bar and go again

yeah our swimming are still traumatised by our birth hares I know you might not figure out of I understand with a shower head I don't have to do much but yeah I understand I actually I get that Like you do make it funny very quickly Like I was literally laughing the other day My friend came over and Al do you remember

We went on a night out like last March When my husband was on his dad do And we got so drunk And the next morning I was vomiting Like it was bad And that day has become like And it was a horrible day

And that day's become so funny now We're like ha ha ha Do you remember that day when I was like So hungover And it's like how have I done that It was horrible traumatising for my physical and mental state and we're like, loll, it's so weird. You know what I'm really good at erasing is the, like, I don't really get a bad hangover

physically. Like, I'm fine. I just like eat loads and I'm fine. But what I erase is then the, like, it takes me a good, from a proper hangover, it takes me a good week to get my head back mentally to a good place. And I feel like I erase that because I'm like, oh, you know, I'm not really bad with hangovers. It's like, I'll never be sick. I don't really get headaches, like I might just feel a bit more, but actually, like, it has, it does have such a profound effect mentally as well. And it's, you're, you're so right. It's like, we erase that so easily. Yeah. I spoke to someone the other day who was like, I only just realized that 99% of the most shameful things I've ever done in my life or when I was drunk, but it's taking me until, like, he was in his mid 30s or 40 to be like, oh, I should just give up alcohol and the shameful things you're sort of happening. You know, like, You sort of ignore the evidence over years and years and years and years and years. We're like, oh, there is an easy solution to this, which is just not doing the thing that makes me a twat.

I guess that. It's so normalised. Yeah, because you just think, well, all of these things that I did when I was drunk, I just thought it was hilarious because I was the funny one. Everybody else thought it was hilarious. There was no one telling me that, you know, sleeping with strangers every weekend was wrong. I was like, well, this is what you do when you drink. Everybody drinks.

Everybody gets pissed and sleeps around and takes drugs and does all these things. so you don't question it. You never question it. And it takes maybe either a rock bottom or a baby, which could be both. Those two can be combined. It takes something to happen for you to go, oh, actually, I'm going to start questioning this and I'm going to start seeking out the answers. Because that's what I had to do. You have to go, oh, why do I do this? Why have I got anxiety? Why am I feeling like shit all the time? Why can't I look after my baby when I'm hung over? and I had to start questioning. And I used to question when I was hungover a lot,

but I never had that consequence crying in the other room. But these questions got too much, and I had to go and find professional help and to find someone to help me answer those questions. And that's a really interesting journey, isn't it? I love that your hangovers were anxiety and a million questions and like, what's the world and what am I to do? Mine were just like pizza, dominoes, Coca-Cola.

I'm like three thoughts on a hangover. You had a billion firing questions. I'm like that anyway, Hamish. Imagine what I was like with a hangover. I'm wondering for people who are listening who are interested in sobriety, interested in giving it a go, and they're wondering like how to position it

to their friends and family and people who they normally drink around because I guess it's, I imagine it's kind of almost more acceptable to be like I have an addiction to alcohol and it's a serious problem for me and people kind of go like oh okay back off yeah totally get it I'm done whereas if it's more like oh I'm like curious about being sober I'm interested in being sober that's a bit more of a gray area where people can I guess try and persuade you or or you know try and tempt you into having a drink

what do you recommend that they say like how they position it to get people to leave them alone, you know, and just like allow them to try being sober and like get them off their back. Cool. Okay. So firstly, you're absolutely right. I do think it's harder to go on like a 30 day sobriety challenge than it is to go sober because of the friends saying like, come on, 30 days, who cares? Give up a week early. We've got this wedding on the 23rd. Like, it's for sure from someone who didn't have a problem with drinking, harder to do a little throwaway challenge than it is to go sober we have got a few answers to the question why are you sober which seem to do the job yeah should we go through i start mine yeah yours uh fuck off is my first one if someone asked me

why are you sober because and that is also my answer to most things isn't it hamish that is on the tip of my tongue most days but really it's no one else's business what you put in your body and if that's something you're doing people need to respect it so i don't actually say fuck off you can probably just say i'm sober and leave it at that that's probably good answer. Yeah, but we've got why are you so obsessed with me. Yeah. We've got drinking, I completed it, mate.

Yep. We've got, um, when I, when I drink, I'm a serial killer and I might tell you why I hid all the bodies. When I drink, I slept with your mother. That was another one. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I don't, I would, I would drink, but I don't think you've got enough here. Yeah. There's a lot of, you can, you know, those are all semi-jokes, but, and you can just give someone a joke and that might make them go away. But I think honestly, just saying I'm so and then not saying anything has been the most effective one for me. I have a question about that.

If you say I'm sober, my thing is if someone says to me like, what's your favourite film? We talked about this the other day out. I don't want to say what my favourite film is because what if someone checks it and makes me prove it? Or like, I can't commit to things.

I don't like to publicly commit to things ever. So if I went to like something and I'm going to party on Friday, be like, are you so? And then I've said I'm sober. And then the next time I saw those people, I had a drink in my hand, then they'd be like, thought you were sober. I thought you, and I can't handle that.

And I get very panicked. So how do you deal with that? But why, I've got a question for you. So why do you care? Why do you care that what? Yeah. Because of a people bleaser and it's chronic. Yeah.

That's got to be looked into. That's a therapy session right there. I know. It's weird. I actually had loads of therapy about all of this. And I'm very boundyed in lots and lots of areas. but when it comes to other people's fun, I think I'm so scared of people.

It's so bad. Yeah. And it's because you're almost giving yourself an excuse to drink even before you've given up by saying, look, if you said I'm sober, that means that everyone knows and you're going to be accountable. But if you don't say it, it's okay if you start again. So there's no commitment there, is there?

Yeah. I'm not very good at say this is a married mother, but I'm not very much of commitment. But you also hold the ultimate Trump card and that you have a seven-month-old child. Like you've got, I'm not a good parent while I'm drunk or home over. You've got, I want to be the best parent I can be. And being sober makes me 1% better. Like you've got.

That's what I want. That's what I want. I want to be the best parent. That's actually the truth of why I don't want to be drinking at the moment. That's my go-to. That's my go. So the way that I describe it was that when I grew up, I want to be a footballer, right? And I said, if I was going to be a footballer, I'd be the first one to train.

I'd be the last one to leave. I'll be sober. I'll be eating the right diet. I'd be doing all the extras. I'd be like the model footballer. I'm shit at football. Okay. I don't make it as a football. And then you don't put those same expectations on yourself in whatever job you do next because you just cruise because we all just cruise because it's easier. And then you become a parent. I was like, okay, well, parenting, I want to be elite at. I want to be my absolute best at being a dad. And I think that going sober helps at least one percent, like never being hung over, always being present, always having the time and the money and energy to spend on that child. And if a disaster happens, I can drive the car, you know, like we're good, we're good in that respect. So I think

parenting is like a good, obviously a good motivation on doing everything for my kids. It's sort of a boring thing to hear. But like, it's a good excuse, you know, anyone who wants to give you any kind of pressure. I'm like, what are you fucking talking about? I'm a parent. I need to be awesome for this child and drinking is not helping that at all. Love that. I'm going to use that next Friday. Thank you. I've got a dog. I'm going to use that. I want to be the best dog owner I can be. I'm a dog mom. I'm not drinking because I'm a dog mom. It's perfect. It's so weird. Then they'll think you're absolutely insane. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, guys, this has been so good. like so, so, so interesting

and it's given like me at least so much food for thought and it's just, yeah, it's been really fascinating. Thank you so much for coming on and sharing all of that with us. Yeah, we're going to be checking in on you, aren't we? We want to hear.

I was about saying, we're not here to guilt to give you and to drinking. You've got my checking in. Yeah, I'm going to be texting you. You know, you had a drink yet. How's those kids? Every Saturday morning. You're not hang over, are you?

Yeah. No, that's great. Thank you so much, guys. Where can everyone go and find you? So, yeah, we've got our website, which is Soberawquid.com. Yes, our Instagram is at Sober Awkward. And I've got my comedy memoir is out in, I think it's the 30th of January, a thousand wasted Sundays.

That's all about my people pleasing, probably pretty much. That is basically. People pleasing and piss ups could be the other. Yeah, that's the other title. People pleasing and piss up. It says a heartfelt memoir about, partying, parenting and sobriety. So I think you girls will probably like it. Yeah. Congratulations. Thank you. We will put all the links in the show notes. And yeah, thank you so much for joining us.

Thank you guys. Thanks. I'm lovely to meet you. See ya. Should I delete that is part of the A-Class Creator Network.