Sibling Revelry with Kate Hudson and Oliver Hudson - Back on the Chariot with Gavin DeGraw

Episode Date: September 9, 2024

Hit maker Gavin DeGraw joins Kate and Oliver to talk about prison life, but it's not what you think!  Plus, he reveals his musical muse, his biggest fear as an artist, and the family secret that no one saw coming!  See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an IHeart podcast. September is a great time to travel, especially because it's my birthday in September, especially internationally. Because in the past, we've stayed in some pretty awesome Airbnbs in Europe. Did we've one in France, we've one in Greece,

we've actually won in Italy a couple of years ago. Anyway, it just made our trip feel extra special. So if you're heading out this month, consider hosting your home on Airbnb. With the co-host feature, you can hire someone local to help manage everything, Find a co-host at Airbnb.ca slash host.

Hey, it's your favorite jersey girl, Gia Judice. Welcome to Casual Chaos, where I share my story. This week, I'm sitting down with Vanderpump Rural Star, Sheena Shea. I don't really talk to either of them, if I'm being honest. There will be an occasional text, one way or the other, from me to Ariana. Maybe a happy birthday from Ariana to me. I think the last time I talked to Tom, it was like, congrats on America's Got Talent. This is a combo you don't want to miss.

Listen to Casual Chaos on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. It may look different, but Native Culture is alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. Somewhere along the way, it turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop. That's Dr. Lee Francis IV, who opened the first Native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other Native stories on the show, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The internet is something we make, not just something that happens to us.

I'm Bridget Todd, host of the tech and culture podcast, there are no girls on the internet. In our new season, I'm talking to people like Anil Dash, an OG entrepreneur and writer who refuses to be cynical about the internet. I love tech. You know, I've been a nerd my whole life, but it does have to be for something. Like, it's not just for its own sake. It's an inspiring story that focuses on people as the core. building blocks of the internet. Listen to there are no girls on the internet

on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. We're siblings. Like, you fight, you disagree. It's really hard to be in a partnership. You judge. Yeah, you judge each other. You lead differently.

And we've gotten to that edge. Hey, I'm Simone Boyce, host of the Bright Side. And this week, I'm joined by Hollywood Power Sisters, Aaron and Sarah Foster. They're getting real about boundaries, rejection. Plus, what's next for their hit Netflix series, nobody wants this.

Listen to the Bright Side on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Kate Hudson. And my name is Oliver Hudson. We wanted to do something that highlighted our relationship. And what it's like to be siblings. We are a sibling rivalry. No, no. Sibling Ravelry.

Don't do that with your mouth. Sibling Reveory. That's good. I'm sitting here all by myself because Oliver is late. Apparently he had to get gas. So I am going to be a good sister.

And I'm going to start this. early so we're on time so we don't leave the wonderful Gavin de Grau waiting for too long and I can't wait to talk to him so you know fuck Ollie let's go Gavin hi hi it's so nice to see you see you you and I were at a party apparently at the same time but we did not meet at that time which party oh at the at the Christmas party gohan Carl At the, yes. So we have a very close mutual friend, Johan Carlson, who is a wonderful writer and music producer. That's right.

And you've, have you worked with Johan? You've. Many times. Yeah. And you weren't at his 40th. We had a wild 40th. I saw you on the, on the birthday message. Oh, yeah.

Oh, yeah. I'm sorry, I missed the party. It was, it was so much fun. You missed a really good party. I really wanted to. I had work that landed right on the day of the party day. I know. You know, it's sometimes, sometimes people don't align.

It wasn't really like a normal party. I mean, we were talking a south of France bash. Yeah, I know. It's not fair. Yeah, you really like. Oh, God, those are the ones you try to make, you know. I'm telling you, I'm telling you, no, there's a few that I've missed. I missed another one, you know, because you always hear about some amazing, like, you know, you get invited to weird stuff, you know, this didn't used to happen to me when I was living in a prison town. But when I got out of my prison town, I got invited to cool stuff. Well, we're going to unpack that, Gavin.

We should. Yes. There's a lot. So I got invited to this party last year. And again, I had work on the exact day this. party and here was the party okay so here was the part here's a party that i'm still upset that i missed this particular event it was a i think it was a halloween party at the original castle grounds of glad the impaler count dracula stop it yes wait and i was like i can't believe i'm going to miss this thing Wait, in, like, Transylvania? Yes. Yeah.

It was like the most outrageous. Wow. Who threw that party? I can't say. I mean, clearly. Yes. And so, of course, the guy who invited me, you know, I won't say whose party. I can't say who's party it was, but I can say, I think what makes it even more interesting

and more mysterious is that the guy who invited me, of course, is, a magician like the kind of guy who stands in front of you who you know you've never met before yeah and and you know what he did to me and here's how I knew he was real uh-oh never met the man this is a few years ago I was at another really interesting uh really interesting invite and it's the first time I met him and I said how do I know if your magic is real and he goes well have we ever met before I said no And he said, do I have any ear pieces in or anything like that? And I was like, can I look?

He said, yeah, have a look. You don't have a look. And he said, do you need proof that my magic is real? I said, I need proof that your magic is really. Yeah, of course. And he then proceeded to tell me number by number, my phone number, to me. What? He balked me up.

Well, he could have like known people that know you and then like memorized everybody's phone. I don't know. There was only one person there who knew me. Yeah, that's weird. Like knew me, knew me. But did he guess it through a series of yes or knows or he just flat out knew your number? He did not give me a yes or no other than not if this is the right number. And he went and picked the exact number one at a time. and I was

that's crazy mesmerized and terrified I always want to know like what what is that really like there's something there's some calculation it can't just be like I by the way and I love psychics like I'm all for psychics I'm all for people who are like

listen your next five years are going to be amazing you're going to make a ton of money your family's super healthy yeah give me some more money and I love those I love those size okay and I and I choose to believe in it. But, oh, there he is. I started without you.

Here's Oliver. Say hi. Oh. Hello, Oliver. How are you, my man? How are you? How are you? Sorry.

I almost ran out of gas, so I had to, like, get gas. Speaking of which, that's a whole other thing about Oliver's truck. Ollie is a truck that broke down on the way to, on the way to Colorado. this summer we were just we just got back oh wait so did you break down because you also ran out of gas then too no but i run out of gas twice in my life no in your life well so i was working in um albuquerque okay and i had to get to set and it was early in the morning i was like fuck dude like i'm not gonna make it but i think i can i'm gonna be late i'm gonna go not gonna make it on the freeway i run out of gas and now i pull over the shoulder on the right hand

side. And it was, I thought I was going to die. There's like a thousand cars. I don't know what I'm doing. I'm calling production. All of a sudden, this car pulls up behind me. And he's like, what do you need? I'm like, gas? He's like, all right. Hold on. No way. Talk about magic. My car. I said, totally. Did he know your phone number? No, yeah. I mean, I was like, who are you? And apparently, it was like George Burns. And apparently they have this, like, Good Samaritan cars that roll around and see if people need shit. Yeah. Oh, that's so nice.

No, I know. It was interesting. Just in New Mexico, this was in Albuquerque. I mean, I can imagine. I want to hire a Good Samaritan in my house. Good idea. You know, that's the title. The title is Good Samaritan.

I like that. I think there's something. There's someone who's always there to be like, do you, are you too? Right. What do you need? But then it turns into a horror film, of course. Right. Yeah, but Good Samaritan is supposed to be free. Yeah.

Well, it's like, kind of like, not anymore. Kind of cable guy is we could do. It's called Good Samaritan. That sounds like a horror film. Oh, I like this idea. We're going to work on that after this podcast. Wait, so wait, so you ran out of gas one time there. Was that the first time ever?

No, that was the third time ran on Malibu once. I just, I get, I get cocky, you know what I mean? I get, I get greedy on your way to Aspen was he had his truck. Yeah. And then, and it just like blew up. It was about to blow up. His engine was going to blow up. It's a diesel truck.

I guess something happened. The problem is, is. Yes. Don't do a whole. I'm not getting into politics, but I'm saying the EPA, you know, what they've got to do for small. Are you talking about the death, the death fluid? Yeah, the DEF, yes, the deaf, but the way that the exhaust is created. Now, I learned a ton.

Basically, because of emissions and how the restrictions on emissions and how strict there are, shit has to get done. You know, the diesel trucks are all jacked up now. It's happening all the time. Oh, yeah. That's why you got to buy an older truck. You got to buy an older truck. We could talk about that all day because I think death is a bunch of bullshit.

It is. Oh, there we go. Don't get Gavin in politics started. I can't stand it. You know what it is? I'll tell you what it is. It's another tax, bro. That's all it is.

And anybody who guys a diesel knows exactly what I'm talking about. Yeah, I'm with you. You're going to get an extra 15 or 30 bucks a month out of you. That's what it is. One million percent. I'm thinking about trading my truck in for like a gas truck or... No, just get an older diesel, man. Yeah, I know.

Anyway, I found him like face down in the field and Aspen crying after. he found out how much it was going to be. Holly was like, oh, my God. It was $10,000. The guy cut off. He was so nice. By the way, I loved him. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

His name is a diesel doc. What was the fix? What was the $10,000 fix on this thing? Well, labor was insane. Yeah. And plus, they had to go like a hundred miles. Forget about Aspen. The part that we had to find.

I think it's called the DFC. You know, because there's the, there's the DOC. there's the DFC. The part was on back order till December. So he had to source it in different states, finally found one. And, you know, he had to take the bed of my truck out to get into the gas tank and to take the whole exhaust system out. I don't understand this is a brand new kind of labor. How could that part not be available? I said, I said, is this, do you see this a lot? And he goes, oh, yeah, yeah. With these new diesels, you know, and this guy is the man. He is Durhamax certified. he's the shit.

Isn't it so fucked up that it's easier to get. It's easier for the public to buy a bag of weed than a manufactured part from a Chevy plant. It's insane, dude. Now that's pretty weird, right?

That's insane. It's crazy. That's cool, but my buddy needs a bag of weed. Can we get that? Yeah, bro. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Of course I've got the 8.

There was something that can, like, grow in your backyard. then the problem is i mean you know it's it's all a fuck it's all a racket dude it's all the whole thing absolutely you and i certainly we you and i can certainly wrap on that yeah yeah it was because i because i road trip non-stop man i love it tipping so yeah me too that's that's how i live you know yeah yeah and it's it is it's non-stop there's always a part and there's always a uh depending upon where you are economy is that different.

Mm-hmm. Oh, my God. So true. Yeah, I mean, a lot of people are deleting a lot of their exhaust systems and all that. I can't do that because I live in California and I have to get it because it's diesel, I have to get a small check every two years. And so I can't delete anything to make everything run right and just not have to worry about it anymore. And California.

The diesel doc is like, he goes, he's like, oh, you need to. He goes, there's a $20,000 fix in the next five years. what's going to go on with your injectors and blah, blah, blah. He was giving me the whole rundown. Yeah. Terrible. Yeah. I'm going to buy like a smart car.

I would go to the option way. Please do. I'm going to buy a smart car. Because I have a boat and a trailer. I can tow my boat on my little smart car. Oh, gosh. You know, it's got the torque. Gavin, where do you live?

I kind of float around, which is odd for people to hear. I'd say I'm based at of Nashville, based out of Nashville. But you're everywhere. I like to be mobile, you know. Even when you're not working, just in general. Yeah, even when I'm not working.

I travel, I tend to travel just with a, so, I don't know, it's just so weird for people to understand. I don't know why. But I travel just with a backpack, you know, like a two-day bag, you know. And that's mostly, honestly how I live which is really weird I'm assuming this means you don't have kids or do you have kids that also travel with I have kids I just don't ever want to see them I don't have kids I have I have a dog I have a dog he's my you know that's my my face my family member

so how that's your baby so what's the longest time you've worn the same underwear for like Two weeks. Like washed? No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no wash. It's like you just live in a marinate him for a little bit. Whoever said anything about underwear, bro? Oh, good. No, I have, don't get me wrong.

I have what I need, you know? Dude, I know you've gone at least six days, seven days with wearing the same one. I can almost say, I can, I don't need to have this conversation. No, no, no, we do need to have this conversation. I don't need to be a part of it. I only change my underwear when I shower. That's it after I shower. So sometimes I don't shower for five days.

So, Oliver, let me ask you, when you want to save time, when you want to save time with doing your laundry, do you do with I do and just wear your underwear into the shower and be like, let me just wash everything now? I do that every time I shower. That's a good idea. I actually wear my undies into the shower every time. Yeah, that's the move. I do, you know, do the undies, the socks, and a t-shirt, and you're half there. That's like one extra day. Done.

September always feels like the start of something new, whether it's back to school, new projects, or just a fresh season. It's the perfect time to start dreaming about your next adventure. I love that feeling of possibility, thinking about where to go next, what kind of place. will stay in and how to make it feel like home. I'm already imagining the kind of Airbnb that would make the trip unforgettable somewhere with charm character and a little local flavor. If you're planning to be away this September, why not consider hosting your home on Airbnb while you're gone? Your home could be the highlight of someone else's trip, a cozy place to land, a space that helps them feel like a local. And with Airbnb's co-host feature, you can hire a local co-host to

help with everything from managing bookings to making sure your home is guest ready. Find a co-host at Airbnb.ca slash host. It may look different, but native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for a kind of two years. You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Teller

Ornales, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage Burn Bridges, we explore her story along with other native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Your entire identity has been fabricated. Your beloved brother goes missing without a trace. You discover the depths of your mother's illness the way it has echoed and reverberated throughout your life, impacting your very legacy. Hi, I'm Danny Shapiro. And these are just a few of the profound and powerful stories I'll be mining on our 12th season of Family Secrets.

With over 37 million downloads, we continue to be moved and inspired by our guests and their courageously told stories. I can't wait to share 10 powerful new episodes with you, stories of tangled up identities, concealed truths, and the way in which family secrets almost always need to be told. I hope you'll join me and my extraordinary guests for this new season of Family Secrets. Listen to Family Secrets Season 12 on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hey, sis, what if I could promise you you never had to listen to a condescending finance bro? Tell you how to manage your money again. Welcome to Brown Ambition. This is the hard part when you pay down those credit cards. If you haven't gotten to the bottom of why you were racking up credit or turning to credit cards, you may just recreate the same problem a year from now. When you do feel like you are bleeding from these high interest rates, I would start shopping for a debt consolidation loan,

starting with your local credit union, shopping around online, looking for some online lenders because they tend to have fewer fees and be more affordable. Listen, I am not here to judge. It is so expensive in these streets. I 100% can see how in just a few months you can have this much credit card debt when it weighs on you.

It's really easy to just like stick your head in the sand. that's nice and dark in the sand. Even if it's scary, it's not going to go away just because you're avoiding it. And in fact, it may get even worse. For more judgment-free money advice, listen to Brown Ambition on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hi, I'm Janica Lopez. And in the new season of the Overcover podcast, I'm taking you on an exciting journey of self-reflection. Am I ready to enter this new part of my life?

Like, am I ready to be in a relationship? Am I ready to have kids and to really just devote myself and my time? I wanted to be successful on my own, not just because of who my mom is. Like, I felt like I needed to be better or work twice as hard as she did. Join me for conversations about healing and growth. Life is freaking hard. And growth doesn't happen in comfort. It happens in motion, even when you're hurting.

All from one of my favorite spaces, The Kitchen. Honestly, these are going to come out so freaking amazing. Be a part of my new chapter and listen to the new season of the Overcomper podcast as part of the MyCultura podcast network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. So I'm going to add on to this. You know, I just recently did this thing where I was like, actually, to Johann's birthday. We went to Europe for eight, nine, eight days, nine days.

And I was like, I'm not packing. I'm not checking shit. I can't handle it anymore. ever want to do it again. Yeah. What can I get into two carry-ons? And it was, why bother with it? The best. Oh, yes. I'm like that. So did you end up with two carry-ons? Yeah. It was awesome. I was so happy. And Dan and I, like, were like, why have we, why do we ever pack it back? I'm into it. You know, the, the, uh, when you first start touring, like, like music touring, you think, I got to bring an outfit. I for this day. I should have

have another wardrobe for that day and this day and that day. And then over the years, you realize, at least I didn't, I didn't have the discipline to end up getting to the bottom of my bags anyway. I'd end up wearing like the same pair of jeans for a week. And, you know, and over the years, finally, like my last European run, I had my backpack and I had another small duffel, and that was my clothes for a group for the month. But you had stage clothes. No, that was my stage clothes.

That was the old thing. I was like, you know, people aren't coming to my, my audience doesn't come to my show for a light show or costumes. You know? Right. So, so they're coming to hear a songwriter, right? So, and I realized that. And, you know, I just thought it was more freeing, normal and trying to be like, hey, let me try to dress cool and shit. yeah yeah yeah well it's also it's the nature of you and your music like you are all you need to be

authentic you need to be authentic yourself i like outfits yeah but it's authentic to you if gavin comes out and like rhinestone fucking like studded boots he'd look great yeah yeah well yeah yeah the costumes got to be careful you know because it's okay to wear a belt buckle that shaped like a dick do you do that have you done no Who is it? Who on the scene? Who in your world and your genre of music is actually like the most outfits? You know what I mean? Are there people? Oh, yeah. There's so many outfits. Even like fedora or like one of those Nashville kind of hats. I did that a little while. And then it was too much luggage for me because I wasn't going to get a hat box. Yeah. I wear one of those big fucking hats on the plane. Yeah. That guy.

Then where you bring your your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, right? Yeah, you just like, you know, all hat and no cattle and you're, and it just looks silly, you know, like, what are you doing? You're sitting on a Southwest flight with a giant hat on. You know, yeah, showtime, bro. You know, it's not showtime. You're just, I'll never forget walking. I was 21 and went onto the Concord, which was like, I guess like a month before they went away. Yeah. And I, or maybe I was 20. I wore a hat just because I was so excited. Like a celebratory concord hat? I wore a... What kind of hat was it?

You know what? It was a vintage, like, 70s hat that I looked. That was like, you know, at least three feet. Right. Oh, my God. You look like the pimp from, I'm going to get you. I was literally like the biggest thing. Choosing on there like this.

Fucking green rash. First of all, I was on the same concord. Bowie was on the. on the Concord with I'mon I'll never forget walking by him with my big hat on he liked it he liked it but everyone else hated it and I remember it was so embarrassing by the time I got to my seat I didn't realize how small it was so I was just hitting everybody within my hat so I was that asshole just so you know I was where are you right now I know I'm in New York I've got a we're doing a video shoot tomorrow for

for this tune for the 20th anniversary of my first record. Let's back up. We got right into these, but let's... Okay, let's the backup. I'm the back. I always back up. I don't back up. And when I say that, I mean, actually, literally.

Like, if we're driving down a road trip and the kids want McDonald's, and we pass on it, I don't make the exit or whatever. My wife's like, well, just turn around. I'm like, no, no, I always move forward. I cannot go backward. Forward motion. I'm actually the same. I only go forward.

until I run out of gas. I'm not going to turn around and get off and go back. Like, we'll find the next one even if it's 60 miles down the road. Well, not if you're in that long stretch between like... Well, yeah, that's going to call it. Yeah, no, no, that's 75-mile stretch. Yeah, I don't like going back. But Kate's...

I want to go back. Where did you grow up? I'm from a town in the Catskill Mountains in upstate New York. It's a prison town called Fallsburg, New York. So it's like one of those... One of those towns you're trying to get out of, you know, when you're a kid, you're like, I got to get out of here, you know. How far from the city? It's about an hour and 45 minutes from New York City.

Is it one prison or is this a place where there's a multiple? Three prisons. Yeah. I know this. But it was all those towns like it had beautiful, you know, the landscape was beautiful. rolling hills very very green um but no jobs you know no jobs so it was it was uh just economically really really really really uh tough tough place and uh what the weird part of the story though of that town is that it used to be have you seen dirty dancing yeah so it used to be of course that area

that's the area dirty dancing's based off of oh but the hotel industry died up there who knows what reasons and then the state you know to provide jobs built prisons in the in the town and that's the the main economy in the area so so it was it was an odd environment i still go up there and see you know see friends of mine and i still love you know my my core group of friends i like there there's a community of people i still really like up there and and i love the area itself visually. But it's just a tough, tough place. How big of a place is it? Is it small? Like population-wise? I graduated with 80 people. Right. Oh. And your father was a prison guard. Yeah. My dad was a guard. My uncle was a guard. My other uncle did prison psych. And yeah,

it's just a, that's the economy, you know. Were you ever set to do that or was it ever just part of what you needed to do now that never never would have crossed my mind you know um and so i wasn't i wasn't steered that direction how did your father end how did the all the brothers end up there was just you know they didn't leave the area because there was family in the area so you don't want to leave your family to go chase money it's better off and the thinking is you know we had a very tribal sort of our family is really tribal and that we had a lot of a lot of family members we all spent a lot of time together family reunions you know and it's very familiar so it wasn't about going and chasing money in a new town it was more about family's going to stay together regardless yeah sure you know we're

everybody has money problems but it's more important that the family be together um and that was the that was the driver family meaning even like aunts uncles cousins like oh yeah yeah because his brother right right as i'm saying like big extended families are going to stay together oh yeah yeah and And I've got family in other parts of the country, but, you know, there's a lot of family in upstate. And what about your siblings? How many siblings? I have two. My sister lives in Nashville. My brother lives in Nashville. That's, I mean, that's where we're all based out of. Oh, great. Sister's the oldest. I'm the baby, if you could tell by my diaper. But, yeah.

Are you all super close? Oh, yeah. Yeah, we're close. And your mom, what did your mom? What did your mom? mom do? My mom was a nurse and she, she was a, well, she was an RN and then she was a nurse practitioner. Her last job was she was a nurse practitioner for a drug and alcohol detox. So I guess there was a good part of all of this, which was no matter what I did, it wasn't quite as bad as what my parents were around at all times. No, as my dad was watching, I don't know if you've ever son of Sam. Dad watched son of Sam every day

and Willie Boscott and Ronnie DeFay. Oh, my God. The guy was in the prison, you know. That was his day job. He'd clock out and he'd come home and I didn't have a curfew. You know, they were pretty loose in that regard because it was just compared to what they were seeing, nothing was a big deal.

Right. Well, he's not the son of Sam. Right, he's not killing anybody. Right. And, you know, and we don't think he's doing heroin. So, you know, and that was really this, that was pretty much the, you know, the, the, the, the, the comparison. And, you know, I was only told, all I was told when I was go out, all I was told when I want to go out as a teenager was, uh, don't make me sorry. That was it, you know, it wasn't, it wasn't, it wasn't, it wasn't, you know, don't drugs.

It was, don't make me sorry. That was it. That was the whole thing. So they're pretty loose in that regard. And they love music. And they both really fundamentally were artistic and artists. You know, they were at Woodstock together. My dad played in bands for, you know, 20 years.

Oh, really? What instrument did he play? He played guitar and he sang. But he could sit down and play the piano. I mean, he was just good at stuff. And my granddad played everything, you know. We just a lot of music in the family. and my mom would play church and write songs and play piano and guitar and sing and and so I came

from this family of people who love the arts you know on both sides my great granddad was the dance instructor at a hotel in the Catskills wow oh my God and he'd make his kids give dance lessons to the guests you know he's like Patrick Swayze he was Patrick yeah yeah right exactly we all wish right so so yeah that was his uh that was his gig and uh and and i always and i was told that there was a really funny story as to how that side of the family um ended up in upstate new york from the city because they were they were brooklynites you know they were from brayton uh from brighton beach and uh and all my grandmother told me was um i don't know why but for whatever reason when I was 13 years old

my father came home in the middle of the night and said you have five minutes everybody to pack your shit and we're leaving oh they fled Brooklyn and moved to the cat skills in the middle of the night and she said he never

talked about it and we didn't ask questions and that's how you Italian no Irish that side of the family was Russian Jews and yeah and And, uh, wait, wait, wait, what? Still to this day, no one knows.

We got to, yeah, we need to know why. I don't know. I don't know. I knew that his brother was a, was a professional fighter, and, uh, his name was Bobby Burns, and I think he would, yeah, I don't know. He may have been doing something. And whatever, whatever it was, someone got mixed up in some serious, something. And they were like, we're out.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And that, that side of the family ended up in upstate New York and, and, and, but I don't know, you know. Wow. Don't you love family like the lore like we have so much of that in our Yeah sure yeah we we just found out that another thing I know you don't want to talk about it But Edgar Allan Poe that's not even real it's no typical not even our hud our dad apparently now Says we're related to edgar there's no which i think he's got to be kidding it's got to be dad's sense of humor because yeah our father has a very like

That's kind of his sense of me. Well, but maybe he's not a lot. Maybe he's been holding back on that. I guess. I mean, we do all right. Well, yes. We are all very intense. We also are supposedly related to

Tony Salerno. I think that's right. I think that's seemingly real. Head of the Genovisi crime family. You know what I mean? That's definitely. I mean, I had someone who just came out of jail one time. This guy, he was a mob.

a mafia guy and he sort had to serve like eight years or something he came out and i ran into him at a restaurant he goes i know you he goes i know your family and i was like what he's like yeah i know your family from jail or somewhere Italy jail yeah we're like that's nice bye enjoy your we were at crossroads at the vegan place yeah man hey man hey hey hey hey hey hey hey the dynamics are there. You know, it reminds you, and it's likely that there is some truth to all of it because the world is small.

We're all related a little bit. September always feels like the start of something new, whether it's back to school, new projects, or just a fresh season. It's the perfect time to start dreaming about your next adventure. I love that feeling of possibility. thinking about where to go next, what kind of place we'll stay in, and how to make it feel like home.

I'm already imagining the kind of Airbnb that would make the trip unforgettable, somewhere with charm character and a little local flavor. If you're planning to be away this September, why not consider hosting your home on Airbnb while you're gone? Your home could be the highlight of someone else's trip, a cozy place to land, a space that helps them feel like a local. And with Airbnb's co-host feature,

you can hire a local co-host to help with everything from managing bookings to making sure your home is guest ready. Find a co-host at Airbnb.ca slash host. It may look different, but native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional.

It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for hundreds of years, you carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Taylor Ornellis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other Native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream.

Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, sis, what if I could promise you you never had to listen to a condescending finance, bro, tell you how to manage your money again. Welcome to Brown Ambition. This is the hard part when you pay down those credit cards. If you haven't gotten to the bottom of why you were racking up credit. or turning to credit cards, you may just recreate the same problem a year from now.

When you do feel like you are bleeding from these high interest rates, I would start shopping for a debt consolidation loan, starting with your local credit union, shopping around online, looking for some online lenders because they tend to have fewer fees and be more affordable. Listen, I am not here to judge. It is so expensive in these streets. I 100% can see how in just a few months you can have this much credit card debt when it weighs on you. It's really easy to just, like, stick your head in the sand. It's nice and dark in the sand.

Even if it's scary, it's not going to go away just because you're avoiding it. And in fact, it may get even worse. For more judgment-free money advice, listen to Brown Ambition on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hi, I'm Jenna Lopez. And in the new season of the Overcomfit podcast, I'm taking you on an exciting journey of self-reflection. Am I ready to enter this new part of my life? Like, am I ready to be in a relationship? Am I ready to have kids and to really just devote myself and my time?

I wanted to be successful on my own, not just because of who my mom is. Like, I felt like I needed to be better or work twice as hard as she did. Join me for conversations about healing and growth. Life is freaking hard. And growth doesn't happen in comfort. It happens in motion, even when you're hurting. All from one of my favorite spaces, The Kitchen. Honestly, these are going to come out so freaking amazing.

Be a part of my new chapter and listen to the new season of the Overcumper podcast as part of the MyCultura podcast network on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Your entire identity has been fabricated. Your beloved brother goes missing without a trace. You discover the depths of your mother's illness, the way it has echoed and reverberated throughout your life, impacting your very legacy. Hi, I'm Danny Shapiro, and these are just a few of the profound and powerful stories I'll be mining on our 12th season of Family Secrets. With over 37 million downloads, we continue to be moved and inspired by our guests

and their courageously told stories. I can't wait to share 10 powerful new episodes with you, stories of tangled up identities, concealed truths, and the way in which family secrets almost always need to be told. I hope you'll join me and my extraordinary guests for this new season of Family Secrets. Listen to Family Secrets Season 12 on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. So does your sister, I know your brother plays music. Does your sister play?

No, she doesn't play music. she was she was primarily a visual artist like you know that was her passion that's not what she's like doing doing but that was her her skill set you know really her thing was being the visual artist which she was really gifted at he wasn't a singer but for whatever reason she couldn't help it sing in thirds perfect thirds oh my god that's so funny it was always a perfect third we're like fuck are you doing this is you know it's naturally that was her thing that was her thing you know that's so interesting yeah and she uh and her her stories you know this family story is all it's all kind of wild stuff too because we found out you know that her father her biological father was different than mine though my father adopted her my father mother were high school sweethearts he got drafted for vietnam my mother went off to to boston college and then met another guy you know my dad was in the arms army and then uh had my sister but but my father married her uh when my sister was six months old

so that's the only father my my sister knew and uh in later life um just a couple years back you know she she really found out more about the biological father and he was uh he had recently passed and she found like she found another sibling a sister you know half sister and uh found out the guy was in a biker gang you know he was like you know he died like you know 70 years old as a as a biker you know yeah and uh crazy yeah it's just like all this this stuff you know wait when when your dad went to vietnam was your mom no my dad was drafted for vietnam ended up ended up fortunately ended up stationed in germany and my by the way father so um why my father would tell me, hey, Gavin, you know, you're a really good singer.

I say, thanks, dad. He goes, you know, I got good singers all over Germany. Sounds like our father. Did they break, did they break up, like when he went to Germany? No, they, yeah, they got, yeah, they were separated. They were separated, but then got back to- I guess, though, you know, my assumption is, you know. Right, right, and then your mom met someone and whatever, and then they got back to

together when he got home she was being a hippie and you know he was carrying an m16 you know so that you know yeah that was very of the time my father-in-law there was a lot of guys in the ms with her carrying those that were hippies too right yeah exactly yeah that's right my father-in-law was in germany got drafted went to germany was an MP well there you go yeah and and and it's only is the best father-in-law ever oh really oh that's cool the bad I got lucky that's cool And what's funny is both my folks really were hippies. In fact, my dad told me, he said, I was at Woodstock with your mother, and I had my draft card in my back pocket for Vietnam, and I was leaving after the weekend.

And so, because I grew up only 20, 20, 25 minutes from the original Woodstock site, from Bethel, that's where we would, you know, as teenagers, we'd go out there and have drum circles and you know and fuck off and uh you know have fun you know i got i lost my cherry on that field myself so you know it's just the nature of you know the area at the time you know and uh but my dad told me this fucking great story about uh about being uh at at woodstock festival at the woodstock festival at the time he said you know he was no businessman he said so i i went there and i had I had driven my my family's dump truck to the property. I had carpeted the back of it because they had a small construction business,

which was always in failure, right? And so I like carpeted the back of this dump truck. So I was like, well, we'll fucking hang out there, you know, me and my friends and we'll party. But I had brought a bunch of records to sell it, Woodstock. Terrible idea. Like, I should have sold watermelons like Charlie Weiner. That was a good idea.

So anyway, he said, pop a tent and me and my buddy I think his name is Rubenstein were standing out there and we got these records and he said I got my back to the to the to the tables and apparently this guy went up to my companion and he was a biker and he said oh this looks good I think I'll take this and he was staring at a you know kind of a record a biker would never buy it was like a Joan Baez record right and he goes oh this looks good i think i'll take this and he's being like really brawny you know and he goes oh okay but you know it's it's it's six dollars or whatever you know he goes no i think i'll just take it so he goes over so the guy who is with my father

walks over to my dad he says hey wayne uh wayne uh and my dad had a great name was john wayne to grow of course and his he went by way amazing amazing name and he goes wayne way this guy he really he he he he's being threatening and he he wants the record he wants to take this record i don't think he wants to pay for it he said well he's got to pay like everybody else he goes but wayne wayne he's a biker he's a biker tell him he's got to pay like everybody fucking else he but wayne he's in the gang he's in the gang he said i don't give a fuck what he said tell him he's going to pay like everybody else my dad had a terrible terribly hot temp and um so he goes but wayne he

She don't even know the name of the gang. And he goes, what's the name of the gang? And he goes, Wayne, they're called the motherfuckers. My dad goes, the what? He goes, motherfuckers, Wayne, the motherfuckers. And my dad said, he goes, I turned around. I went, you're going to love that record? Oh, my God.

That's funny, dude. The motherfuckers. And you could have been, I mean, 1969, that language is that much more like, whoa. Yeah. Oh, my goodness. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You're called the motherfuckers in 1969.

Just step away. Exactly. The motherfuckers here, you know? I'm going to start a gang all the motherfuckers. Oh, God. Jesus. What do you do?

You're like nothing. Here's the record, exactly. Yeah. It's like your fantasy football. Oh, you're going to love that record. Right. Give my regards. Give my regards to the motherfuckers.

Tell the rest of those motherfuckers. Tell the rest of those motherfuckers. If there's any Simon and Garfunful records that they want to hear, they're willing. dude that's so funny so you get into music your brother like how when was the moment that you were like oh this is just what I want to do always and forever um this is it when did I make the decision to yeah like I can't see myself wanting to do anything other than music yeah well I loved it of course you know since I was a kid I was my dad's my dad put it he was like man you were singing

in the cradle gab and before he could talk you were saying and um My brother thought I had a singing disease. He actually asked my uncle Richie if he thought there was possible to have a disease of singing because I wouldn't shut the fuck up. Right? So, so we had a, for Christmas one year, we had a, our gift as a family was we'd all go to a concert. And that concert was a Billy Joel concert. And of course, I was already, you know, playing music. And I already took music seriously.

and I was enjoying myself. But I thought playing music was a selfish way to make a living. And part of that is probably because we grew up in the church so heavily. I mean, really, really deep in the church, almost like a cultish level. Like we went to church at the American Legion every Sunday. So it was like heavy, you know. It was post-Hippie chapter life church, right? And the church was, so like Christian, like, born again, born again, born again.

And by the way, I'm happy I did all that stuff because it was, it's actually pretty interesting, you know, it's where you're coming from. So, and I still have a, I still have a degree of faith and I, and I still have the same struggles with faith, just like everybody else. And it's all a jumping off point. And so anyway, but I did think playing music for a living may have been a selfish path, right? And it probably had a lot to do with the constant church teachings, you know, like, you know, service and Jesus and, you know, helping people and things like that. So I thought maybe playing music wasn't going to help enough people, right? So, you know what? I want to make the blind see.

I want to be an ophthalmologist. I want to be a surgeon. I want to be an eye doctor, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. A child's desire to, you know, fulfill this wish list, right? But when I saw Billy Joel play a show and I saw the reaction of people around me who I'd never met before. And I saw what was happening to them, you know. It was so emotional watching them receive joy in a group setting. it's the first time it dawned on me that music really helps people in a very particular way.

It's not going to heal people, but I thought, wow, this is actually, this is a, this is a service. And he, he obviously loves doing it. I love doing it. This is what I can, I can do this. Like this actually, this would be a good life choice, right? And you're what, 15? You were 15? I was 15, yeah.

And we got in the car, the family got in the car. And as soon as we got in the car, I said, I know what I want to do now. I know what I want to do for living. And I said, my dad says, what do you want to do? I said, I'm going to do that. I'm going to do what he does. I want to do it just like that. And he said, it looks like fun, doesn't it?

I said, yes. And he said, then that's what you'll do, right? And it was that simple. It was very, there was no, it wasn't combative. Very rare for, you know, I mean, I guess because he's musical, your father understands the connection. 100%. A lot of times, when one doesn't understand the connection to an art, you know, a parent, it can be hard to understand.

And knowing how competitive the field is can be a hard thing to say. Had you written any songs at that point at 15? Yeah. Yeah. I've written a couple really shitty songs for sure. A couple of little bingers, you know. So, but, and I only did that. I mean, I was writing songs when I was.

like a little kid, you know, like just music all the time, just music ideas constantly. And then I hung that up and I started learning cover songs. And then my brother, who's four grades above me, three and a half years older, who was also a musician, he goes, why don't you write some songs? And I said, well, the great ones already were written, you know. And he goes, yeah, but if you don't write the songs, why should anybody remember you? And I said, all right, well, good point. And I, you know, immediately, you know, of course, that day, it's a challenge.

from your older brother you have to do it right um and uh so he was also uh the instrumental in that too because he he challenged me a lot um and he was also kind of a natural born authority hater and you know just uh just anti structure you know in life you know which i like how many years older is he three and a half years three and a half yeah so four grades and did you play together yeah we played music together in fact he got me my first uh regular type of gig at a bar which was you know the drinking age is 21 so when you're 16 you start drinking in bars right so and and or 15 and so you know how it was so you know and uh and so my brother was was out at the bars you know we're in high school and he was going to a bar on the next town over and um there was a guy doing a

Tuesday night open mic sort of thing jam kind of thing and he got to know the bartender pretty good because that's what you do when you're in high school you get to know the bartender pretty good and uh and he said hey uh my brother plays music and he's good can we you think you'd be able to get him into the bar and play some music you know and he was like yeah hell yeah why not yeah fuck it and so so he good my brother came home he goes yeah they got his permission to go in let's go and we'll play some songs and whatever so so we started doing that the best part about it was it was it was right across the street from the police station and you know and uh and and you know i guess i guess doing breaking the law is just fun when you're young just in general and uh you know

it's kind of like what you do you know it's just fun rebellion is good right you know That's the whole thing about being young. So how long did you do that? I would do it every week and I quit sports and because it's kind of like, what do I want to do I want to hang out after school with people with kids or like, do I want to like work on this skill set and meet women, you know, and like you're in high school. So it's a very big deal. You're like 15.

You're hanging out with adults. it was just better for me and uh you know i was already sleeping in school anyway so so you know it was just you know i can never sleep at night so it was better off if i was out working at night playing bars you know during the weekdays even though i was in high school september always feels like the start of something new whether it's back to school new projects are just a fresh season. It's the perfect time to start dreaming about your next adventure. I love that feeling of possibility, thinking about where to go next, what kind of place will stay in, and how to make it feel like home. I'm already imagining the kind of Airbnb that

would make the trip unforgettable, somewhere with charm, character, and a little local flavor. If you're planning to be away this September, why not consider hosting your home on Airbnb while you're gone. Your home could be the highlight of someone else's trip, a cozy place to land, a space that helps them feel like a local. And with Airbnb's co-host feature, you can hire a local co-host to help with everything

from managing bookings to making sure your home is guest ready. Find a co-host at Airbnb. ca slash host. It may look different, but Native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to

explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for a kind of two years. You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Taylor Ornelis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world,

influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sageburn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, sis, what if I could promise you you never had to listen to a condescending finance, bro, tell you how to manage your money again. Welcome to Brown Ambition. This is the hard part when you pay down those credit cards. If you haven't gotten to the bottom of why you were racking up credit or turning to credit cards, you may just recreate the same problem a year from now. When you do feel like you are bleeding from these high interest rates,

I would start shopping for a debt consolidation loan, starting with your local credit union, shopping around online, looking for some online lenders because they tend to have fewer fees and be more affordable. Listen, I am not here to judge. It is so expensive in these streets. I 100% can see how in just a few months you can have this much credit card debt and it weighs on you.

It's really easy to just like stick your head in the sand. It's nice and dark in the sand. Even if it's scary, it's not going to go away just because you're avoiding it. And in fact, it may get even worse. For more judgment-free money advice, listen to Brown Ambition on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.

The Super Secret Festi Club podcast season four is here. And we're locked in. That means more juicy cheesement. Terrible love advice. Evil spells to cast on your ex. No, no, no, no, no, we're not doing that this season. Oh, well, this season, we're leveling up. Each episode will feature a special bestie, and you're not going to want to miss it.

Get in here! Today we have a very special guest with us. Our new super secret bestie is The divo of the people. The diva of the people. I'm just like, text your ex. My theory is that if you need to figure out that the stove is hot, go and touch it. Go and figure it out for yourself. Okay.

That's us. That's us. My name is Curley. And I'm Maya. In each episode, we'll talk about love, friendship, heart breaks, men, and, of course, our favorite secrets. Listen to the Super Secret Bestie Club as a part of the My Cultura podcast network available on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Your entire identity has been fabricated. Your beloved brother goes missing.

without a trace. You discover the depths of your mother's illness the way it has echoed and reverberated throughout your life, impacting your very legacy. Hi, I'm Danny Shapiro, and these are just a few of the profound and powerful stories I'll be mining on our 12th season of Family Secrets. With over 37 million downloads, we continue to be moved and inspired by our guests and their courageously told stories. I can't wait to share ten powerful new episodes with you, stories of tangled up identities, concealed truths, and the way in which family secrets almost always need to be told. I hope you'll join me and my extraordinary guests for this new season of family secrets. Listen to Family Secrets Season 12 on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your

podcasts. Now, do you remember a moment when you wrote your first song that you were like, I think I'm good at this? I think I'm actually really good at this. Well, when you're writing songs and you're 15, you think you're good at everything anyway, and you suck. And so, God, if I was to go back and dig up some of the material, I would have such a laugh right now.

But you had the confidence then is what you're saying. Like, you felt confident. Oh, God. Yeah. I mean, yeah. Yeah. Are you kidding? You know, you're young and you have a, you're doing something that is unusual in the, the small environment that you're in, the small pond that you're in.

So therefore, it's already, you're already getting five points out of 10 just for being different, right? And so, and so, you know, you're only like one or two points away from walking on water. as far as you're concerned because it's because you really think what you're doing is really good even if you suck at it like you know so so if i go back and listen to myself right now at 15 i would i'm telling you i guarantee you i would not be able to get through 15 seconds of it so but you know you have neighbors and friends and family and they're being supportive and they want to help you and they want they want you to get out of there too right so they're they're championing you and they're believers and they're and they're and they're they're they're trying to help you you know

they're trying to be a springboard for you and they were they were tremendous help and they're then the part of that and and i think what they're giving you is something that's better than money which is confidence right yeah because uh because confidence is totally invaluable you can't put a number on on confidence it is absolutely the against all odds mathematics is confidence right I really, I really, I feel that. So I, I really understand that because it took even for me with music, even a couple people who really gave me even more confidence to feel like I could do it, you know. Absolutely.

Meaning like just not doubt myself, you know. Yes. To have a stronger belief in the art, you know, and my writing and everything. Oh, yeah. When did it happen? Yeah, what was your, that was going to be my next? I know, like, when did it break? When we were like, holy shit, like.

Well, making money, I was making money from a pretty early age, you know, just playing bars. I was making big money. And then I, and then, you know, I would often play songs I was working on to my family, right? Because I respect the taste. And I played my music for friends of mine that I was working on. And if they're like, man, you know, sings. you sing it good you know then you're like a song sucks right um but but i would always play it for them and um one day i wrote this song and i was playing it for my brother

and uh he would always be like yeah that's pretty good yeah that's pretty good that's pretty good but one day uh i was playing this song at the apartment we were living together in an apartment in hell's kitchen in new york around 49th and uh and ninth and it was the end of the 90s and we were living together and I played him the chorus I finished the song I played the last chorus and I never saw him react before like this and he goes that's your fucking hit you finally got one you finally got a fucking hit song you fucking did it and I said really he goes yes that's a hit song and it was and it became my first hit song single you know it was i don't want to be and uh that was that was that was that when you and that

that was enormous i mean that came out and it must have just completely yeah changed my life now were you signed at the time not when i played him that song uh i mean prior prior to that i was you know i've been doing the grind since i was a teenager so i had uh i'm trying not to tell the longest version of the story but i had initially uh been giving it a a record deal offer from RCA in 1997. And I was like 20 at the time because I played one gig in New York City. They had heard a demo I had sent in through a manager that I had met in upstate New York. And they were great people.

And the Prats. And they had sent this recording and the head of A&R at RCA had heard it. And she goes, I want to meet the guy. you know i think there's some good stuff here so i did a showcase it made me an offer and it wasn't really a good offer and uh and and and and they're they're telling oh you're the next paul simon you're this you're that and i said that's great but it didn't the contract didn't read that way so i said and i'm 20 i said uh it doesn't read that way so that it tells me i'm not ready it's more reflection on me than you and uh and i'm happy to you know come back at another time and at the time i was

working like at a lumberyard you know in upstate new york and uh and uh you know no harm no foul and i had a little bit of relationship with these these people they were very nice um but i didn't think it was i wasn't upset with them i saw it as i just still suck you know and i need to get better i need to write better songs and and uh but i hadn't written that song by then and there were a lot of songs i hadn't written by then but made me one or two of those songs i had written by then um but then i i did a publishing deal with warner so i was writing for warner and i was 22 and then um yeah i was 22 or 23 uh with the guy who brought me in named randy sabbiston who i liked a lot um and then nile rogers was coming out to the gigs he was like a big producer writer guy and

And then he and I started, he wanted to produce me, right? So we made a record together like a half a record. But I didn't like the terms of the deal that were being offered at that time. So I was like, I don't want to do the deal. And then years went by. And then I signed a deal. Once I developed a following in New York playing live, then the deal started just coming from other record companies.

and then the contract started reading a lot better, right? And Chariot 20 is the album that had, I don't want to be on it, right? I mean, yeah, and that was your big. Yeah, that opened a lot of doors for me. Well, I got a phone call from a guy. His name was Joe DeVola. And I was walking around the East Village at the time. At that point, I was living in kind of at the edge alphabet city in like 2003.

And I got a phone, 2000, yeah, 2003, I got a phone call from this guy. And he goes, hey, my name's Joe DeVola. You know, I own these, I run these TV shows. I own them. I create them. I created a lot of shows for MTV. I created the first non-music show at MTV called Remote Control. He took me down his whole thing, you know.

And I love them. I love this whole, he had this whole great persona and delivery. And he seemed so sincere. yeah and and he said i want to um i want to put the song of yours in this uh show and i said uh what kind of show he said it's a tv i don't do tv i don't do tv i'm i'm cool like that i'm i'm too cool for fucking tv i don't do tv i don't do movies i want to be famous without anyone never knowing who i am so he was like what are you talking about like, no, no, I don't do TV. I don't do ads. I don't do movies. I don't want anyone

to know what I look like. And he was like, all right, let me put it to you like this. You have to help me help you. If you want your music to be heard, I have a platform to do it. You got to let me do it. I said, no, absolutely not. TV is lame. No interest. What was the TV? I had issues with it. I have no idea why I was so. Oh, you would, well, Well, no, what was the show, though? It was a show called One Tree Hill. And so he goes, so I think it was all based on growing up in this hippie area were being related with anything corporate.

Right. It was also, that was very of the time, too. It was, yeah, nobody, everybody was too cool to do anything other than what they did. And it wasn't the right thing. And if you did that, then your sellout. I mean, that was like. And you're in the East Village, man. you know like you know yeah by you know Ryan Adams is walking by there with a couple

of coffee and it's like by the way we were there too we were in Chelsea yeah Chris and I were living in Chelsea at the time in like a four-story walk-up right I said I don't want to be affiliated with TV TV has no cred you know I'm cred and and he goes let me ask you question Gavin how much money do you have in the bank right now and I go you man and we started laughing you know he goes no seriously how much i said not a lot joe not a lot he goes would you like a lot more uh-huh sounds pretty good actually so he goes i'm not going to touch your music all i'm going to do is player music you don't even have to be in the ads no one's going to see you none of it i was like okay cool so then the phone

rang again and it was another creator and they go hey we want to use another one of your songs a different song for another show and by that point joe had already convinced me what to do you know i was like use it use it for that too you know like another so you know you change your mind and there's reality checks there you know where you're going yeah you started to like open up and yeah you i need to make a living yeah you you got to grow up and yeah what am i what am i doing you Right. You decided to go in the studio and reimagine your first, the first big album, yeah? Cheerios, 20.

Yeah. And what was the impetus for this? Well, it was 20 years. It was a great excuse to revisit this old material that initially had like changed my life, right? My lifestyle and like my personal world. And I had, I, I, there's improvements that have happened for me personally as. as an artist so I've personally improved

at my job and I wanted to you know perform these songs better than I had on my first record sometimes felt like I didn't do do the first record

service I was very proud of the first record but after living with the songs and performing these songs another 20 years thousand times you know exactly I just feel like the performances are better and I wanted to document it, you know, a record is a, you know, is a document.

So are you re-recording? You re-recorded the whole thing. Yeah, re-recorded the whole thing and I had gone in the studio with a guy I had worked with on my last record and I really love the sonics and the performances of the last record, which is called Face the River. And I love the way it sounded. It sounded, it sounded, just sounded real, sounded authentic and there's no real fixing on the record. It's just sort of, you know, it's not auto-tuned and it's not copy-pasted. And it's just very, it breathes and it's very organic. And so, and it's a producer I really, really respect for this type of projects. Name is Dave Cobb, of course, I'm sure you heard Dave.

I love Dave. I'm such a big fan of his. Yeah, yeah, me too. He's amazing. He is. He is amazing. And Dave, Dave likes to make music live. you know and uh which is which is my really my wheelhouse which is every time i hear like a

Nashville artist or someone and i hear it and i'm like god i love this song yeah i'll go it's like like maybe nine out of ten times it's yeah it's yeah he he he gets great you know great sounds and great performances out of people and um and and the recordings just sound authentic they sound honest and they the arrangements are the same or do you change it up they're They're not the same. They're simplified, really. And it's stripped down more. Yeah, it's really just four or five guys playing at the same time.

And that's the record. That's so fun. Yeah. I can't wait to hear it. I hope you like it. I hope you like it. And it really reminds me of what those performances, how they, how they sort of come to be in a live setting in a bar room or at somebody's house when you're hanging out and you're, you're happening. to be hanging out with some great musicians and

and you go yeah man you want to work something up and you know there's people coming over let's work up a couple songs for these guys and we'll just hang out and play some music time yeah fuck yeah let's do it and and that was really the process for cutting the record and it reminded me of just playing in a bar

was there any song that like actually surprised you when you got back into it when you that you kind of went wow you know I actually like this this song even better.

I mean, honestly, I like, maybe it's just because I'm older and my taste has become more specific. This is the type of record that I, these sort of sonics are the types of records I like to listen to. You know, at the house, you know, there's a kind of records I like to hear. They're more, just more basic. You think it's basic.

It's just simple. I can hear, I know exactly what the guitar player is doing. I know exactly what the base prayer is doing. I'm not over. I'm not inundated with information and notes and counter melodies and and bells and whistles. I'm not really a bells and whistles guy. Well, I'm so excited to hear. When is it coming out?

September 27. Yeah, September 27th. I didn't initially choose this date, but when they told me the date, it happens to be my dad's, what would have been my dad's birthday. No. Isn't that amazing? It's a, your dad was a Libra.

It's a Libra album. I like it. Oh, is that what that means? Yeah, you know what? I mean, I'm just making this up. I'm pulling this right out of my honey. Doesn't mean, it's a balancing, it's a balance.

It's the scales. It's like Chariot 20. It's like you're like balance, it's two. You're balancing it out. Nope. I like it. It's just a release date.

I like balance. It's just. Just a release. Ollie, nope. That's it. Just your. Gavin, you're the best. This was so much fun.

I hope to actually like see you. You're laying in L.A. Yeah, look us up for sure. I'll bug you. We'll do dinner. Yeah. I'd love to, man. Gavin.

See you later. Have the best fun. Later, brother. See ya. Hey, it's your favorite Jersey girl, Giajude Ice. Welcome to Casual Chaos, where I share my story. week, I'm sitting down with Vanderpump Rural star, Sheena Shea. I don't really talk

to either of them, if I'm being honest. There will be an occasional text one way or the other from me to Ariana, maybe a happy birthday from Ariana to me. I think the last time I talked to Tom, it was like, congrats on America's Got Talent. This is a combo you don't

want to miss. Listen to casual chaos on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. It may look different, but Native culture is alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. Somewhere along the way, it turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop. That's Dr. Lee Francis IV, who opened the first Native comic bookshop.

Explore his story along with many other native stories on the show, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The internet is something we make, not just something that happens to our. I'm Bridget Todd, host of the Tech and Culture Podcast There are No Girls on the Internet. In our new season, I'm talking to people like Aneal Dash, an OG entrepreneur and writer who refuses to be cynical about the Internet.

I love tech. You know, I've been a nerd my whole life, but it does have to be for something. Like, it's not just for its own sake. It's an inspiring story that focuses on people as the core building blocks of the Internet. Listen to There Are No Girls on the Internet on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. We're siblings.

You fight, you disagree. It's really hard to be in a partnership. You judge. Yeah, you judge each other. You lead differently. And we've gotten to that edge. Hey, I'm Simone Boyce, host of the Bright Side. And this week, I'm joined by Hollywood Power Sisters, Aaron and Sarah Foster.

They're getting real about boundaries, rejection. Plus, what's next for their hit Netflix series, nobody wants this. Listen to The Bright Side on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hey, guys, it's Stephanie Beatriz. And Melissa Fumero, and this is more better. We are jumping right in and ready to hear from you. Your thoughts, your questions, your feelings about socks with sandals. And we're ready to share some possibly questionable advice and hot takes.

God, that sucks so hard, though. I'm so sorry. Can you out petty them? Can you match their pettiness for funsies? Yeah. All the things. Because aren't we all trying to get a little more better? Listen to more better on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your

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