Sibling Revelry with Kate Hudson and Oliver Hudson - Kourtney Kardashian and Kendall Jenner

Episode Date: September 10, 2020

Kourtney Kardashian and Kendall Jenner join Kate and Oliver on this week's episode of "Sibling Revelry." They open up about "Keeping Up With the Kardashians" and how their lives have changed over the past 14 years. They also predict what each sibling would be doing now if the show didn't exist, share funny childhood stories, and talk about the importance of family. (This was recorded back in January.) Executive Producers: Kate Hudson and Oliver HudsonProduced by Allison BresnickMusic by Mark HudsonThis show is powered by Simplecast.This episode is sponsored by Article, DoorDash (Promo Code: SIBLING), Babbel (Promo Code: SIBLING), ButcherBox, and ThirdLove.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. September is a great time to travel, especially because it's my birthday in September, especially internationally. Because in the past, we've stayed in some pretty awesome Airbnbs in Europe. Did we've one in France, we've one in Greece, we've actually won in Italy a couple of years ago. Anyway, it just made our trip feel extra special.

So if you're heading out this month, consider hosting your home on Airbnb with the co-host feature. You can hire someone local to help manage everything. Find a co-host at Airbnb.ca slash host. Hi, I'm Jennifer Lopez, and in the new season of the Overcomfit Podcast, I'm even more honest, more vulnerable, and more real than ever. Am I ready to enter this new part of my life? Like, am I ready to be in a relationship?

Am I ready to have kids and to really just devote myself and my time? Join me for conversations about healing and growth, all from one of my favorite spaces, The Kitchen. Listen to the new season of the Overcombered podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever. where you get your podcast. Your entire identity has been fabricated. Your beloved brother goes missing without a trace.

You discover the depths of your mother's illness. I'm Danny Shapiro, and these are just a few of the powerful stories I'll be mining on our upcoming 12th season of Family Secrets. We continue to be moved and inspired by our guests and their courageously told stories. Listen to Family Secrets Season 12 on the IHeart Reefs. Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Kate Hudson. And my name is Oliver Hudson.

We wanted to do something that highlighted our relationship. And what it's like to be siblings. We are a sibling rivalry. No, no. Sibling rivalry. Don't do that. with your mouth. Sibling, revelry.

That's good. Hi. What up? It was your birthday. It was my birthday. And you went out. I was 44, 44 years old. We, you know, I bought a 33-foot trailer.

trailer and this was the maiden voyage and we went to this place called bogan flats and had my birthday and it was really really fun that's so i know it was great kids had fun we camped with another family there so the kids got to hang we swam in the in the in the river and yeah the whole experience is just so much fun good it's what i'm going to do from now on i'm just leaving Isn't it like a million degrees were you all right now? Oh, yeah. It's crazy hot. And then snowed here on September 8th.

How about that? But I almost died the other day on my mountain bike. You mean after I told you to be careful? Yeah, that day. That's so funny. I knew it. Not because of a fall, a fall, but it was so hot. And I got dizzy and had to, like, go under a tree and rest.

And then I was like, got nervous because I was like, ooh, I can't get my heart right down. And then I finally was able to. But I had that moment of panic, you know, and it's like, I'm going to die up here. I'm going to fucking die up here. I'm like, Oliver, like, relax. You're not going to die. Just take some deep breaths. I'm like, but I can't cool down.

I can't cool down. This is the conversation I'm having with myself. And all the while, my adrenaline is spiking and then it's making everything worse. So you had a panic attack in like a hundred degree heat on a mountain where no one was around. Well, let me just set this up for everyone listening. I was on the phone with Oliver, we were FaceTiming, and he was up, and he was weird, because it was sort of flat kind of plateauy land. He's like, yeah, I'm going to go for a ride.

And it was really quiet. And I could kind of see, you know, when you're FaceTiming someone, I could see the back. I could see that, like, there was nothing around people, there was no other cars. And Ollie was going, I found this spot, you know. I don't know. I was just driving and I found this spot. I'm going to go for. ride. I'm like, well, don't die

because you don't know what this is. There's nobody around. It's not like there's going to be anybody on the trail. Yeah. You know, me and I'm pretty psychic. I felt weird. I was like, this is not great. I don't like the way this feels. Well, I thought of you when I was dying under the tree.

I mean, I was like, I was like, fucking Kate knew. I know. When you would have died thinking, God, I'm so mad that she was right. Oh, God, like, how did she know? Oh, man. Well, everything's good here.

It's the same, same. Kids are, the schooling is actually better than I thought I was going to be. I feel like, you know what? I figured it out. Couldn't agree more. It's like weirdly good. I mean, not, I would much rather the kids be in school, especially for Wilder. I know.

He was going into seventh grade. New kids. He was very excited to go. with his friend to see rider everyone being is there everyone's there and he was pumped you know and uh yeah you know it didn't happen but yeah when we go to hybrid maybe if it's like a hybrid they do a hybrid sort of yeah but but you're right the remote learning isn't so bad yeah i think that you know i think as long as here's one thing i was saying i heard this story about a teacher who said, the teacher said that she was trying to teach,

and everybody's videos were off. And it was like this really sad thing of this teacher and like none of the kids were engaged, you know, when you get older in high school. Yeah. And I was like, well, wait, hold on. If I was a teacher, if your video's not on, you're going to fail the class. Yeah. I mean, that that should immediately be like.

Yes. You need to set up your Zoom so that you can be accountable to being attentive, right? So at least the teacher can gallery view the class and make sure that, you know, because that's what you would be doing in the classroom anyway. You'd be, you know, calling out, you know, John. John, is there something more interesting happening in your room? You know? I know.

You should not be able to turn your cameras off. They're not. I mean, I'm shouting out to all. teachers that should be just like the very first rule of thumb it's like no we don't do my thing is with wilder is is that you know i'm trusting him right i'm trying to put trust into him so far so good but he goes into the room which is your room actually your childhood room here at the guesthouse and that's where he works from and then he just started goes and i poked my head in and i'm like hey but like everything good are you are you doing anything in here and and he's like dad

like can you just leave like you're on camera you know i'm like i know but are you what are you doing are you fucking around in here or i guess i just trust that you're listening you know i love mess i love messing with the kids in their classes by the way so funny yeah um anyway so well happy birthday brother um thank you 44, you know what I was going to say, yeah. Oh, she did, I didn't see anything. I've been off the grid. I haven't seen it.

I sang you a very sweet song on Instagram. I got to see it. And I responded, I responded, and... Hey, what did you say? You should just look. First look at mine, maybe. Okay. First look at my post, and then you can look at my post.

I'm going to say one thing about, about, my birthday and then we can talk about our guests coming up but you know i'm 44 years old and i've never felt age it never mattered to me much and it still doesn't but i think when i'm 50 i think when i'm starting to hit around 50 it's gonna i might have like a a problem with it you know maybe not already if you're already thinking about it then then it's probably going to happen like sooner than 50. No, because I just keep turning, I just keep getting older every year

and I'm 43, 44, and I never really think about it. You know what I mean? It's just another day. I'm not a birthday guy. But I feel like when I'm approaching 50, I'm like, oh my God. I need to read the Tibetan Book of Living and Dying again.

You know what? You know what I think? I think that no matter what decades, you hit that you're always going if you think about age like that that when you're 60 you're going to go why did I do that when I was 50 right you're 70 you're going to go why did I go there when I was 60 I think you know and then and then I think you're right I think you should read that book I think it's like it's like honest I don't mean to like bring this down but I'll let's why not let's bring this down why not just to bring it back up because that's what life is take it down yeah we're all gonna die yeah yes that's where I was going and you know the thing is is that we are in the middle of experiencing so much death I've lost many friends and I know that lately I don't know what's going on and then COVID I know so many people who are losing people

and, you know, it feels like it's this crazy thing. It just feels like one piece of news you don't want to hear after another. Another friend just got diagnosed with lung cancer and we're getting, you know, getting through it. We're going to fight it and all that. But it just almost feels like it just comes at you so like hard and heavy right now. And I thought of, you know, with the passing of Chadwick, who I had a, an opportunity to know and work with, I just went to this place. Like, he really inspired me

to really live moment to moment. I mean, if there's anyone that could show how, like, what a noble life he lived, because he just stayed so present. And you would have never known. And And I think that for a lot of us that knew him, it's sort of like all of a sudden it made so much sense. Like, oh, wow. Like that's why Chadwick was the way he was. And you just have to, I mean, I honestly believe, and I think about him now when I'm my friend. And then right after that, a friend gets diagnosed. And then I just think, you know what?

That you just have to live every day in the moment. It's a really hard thing to do. Yeah. But we just don't know. No. We don't know. We don't know what our existence. No, we don't know.

We have no idea. But. Yeah. But that can be a beautiful thing too. I mean, if you look at it the right way, you know, the fact that we don't know, there's something wonderful about that and freeing if you can spin it. I mean, or if you can think that. Yeah.

Well, I read an article in The Guardian about this young man who has terminal cancer. he's 31 years old and he was talking about what the things to remember to live by and it was it's not a sad article it feels like it could be like you read the headline you're like oof i'm going to lose it you know but i actually read it and felt inspired because you can tell that he felt like good and loved and that he lived well. And I mean, this man is really special. And he, but one of the things he said is he said, be vulnerable. Because when he got diagnosed, he finally allowed himself to live vulnerably from a place

of love and just pure. vulnerability and that his life in those two years have been more beautiful than anything because he allowed himself to open up like that to people yeah and i just that really again another thing where you went you know that's so like what a gift to give like think like i feel grateful that he passed that onto me through his words through the guardian it's like so it's like that um so look you're you want no when you're 50 oliver i'm going to send you um lots of books and articles about living in the moment and then when i'm 50 when i'm 50 it'll be my first panic attack and then i say all this and when i turn 50 i'm like not no to do it no just kidding um

so speaking of ageless wonders Oliver. I just went, we had Courtney Kardashian and Kendall Jenner on that. Yeah, great segue by the way. On the podcast. Solid, solid segue. Thank you. Beautiful. You're a pro. And I was super excited about this because they're sort of, you know,

Courtney is sort of going through that time right now and in the last year of like wanting to be more private. I've always felt Kendall kind of, even though they're all, you know, available, but I always thought Kendall kind of did her own thing a little bit too. Yeah, yeah. It was a great pairing, actually. You know, it was fun to get those two together. Yeah, for sure.

I really want to get, I mean, it would be fun to get all of them. Like, I want to talk to all of them, you know. Oh, for sure, but the pairings were great. You know, you got to get them right. Yeah. But it was, they were cool, man. They were super fun. Kendall, you've known as well, obviously, through just social circles.

It was a fashion world. Mm-hmm. But they were awesome. They were just very obviously down to earth and cool and open and Kendall especially, you know. I don't know. I didn't know much about her. I'm speaking from the outside. You know, you knew these girls a little bit better.

I only knew Courtney from basically watching the show. And then Kendall, you know, again, like you said, she's sort of her own thing. She's got her own sort of thing going on. So I didn't really, I wasn't, I didn't know what to expect. It's, it's interesting when you, you know, these are, their family. It's really, they're cultural icons. Like, they changed the game in such a unprecedented way, like, not definitely not what was expected. They came on the scene and they became, you know, the Kardashians, honestly, really did change the direction of which,

and how people see celebrity and um and influence you know as as much as i think when you get to know them on keeping up the Kardashians like you really do fall in love with them they're very outspoken they're really honest about they're they're very um they're i mean talk about being open and sharing your life i mean i i don't know i know i could never do that and um just i mean just because But what we didn't know, which was announced today, was that it's going to be 2021 will be the end of breaking news, breaking news on sibling revelry. That's right. Actually, we didn't break it. It wasn't. It wasn't. But we just... I know. That's it. Oh, my God. How many seasons? I mean, like, 500. It's been going on forever. I think it was around 500. Yeah. The ageless wonders. I mean, no, but seriously, I, I mean, they've been doing this for 14 years. Wow.

20 seasons. That's, wait, Alison, what, 20? 14 years, 20 seasons. Oh, my God. That's crazy. That's half their life. That is. Half their life.

There's got to be some liberation. There has to be some. I don't know. a little bit. You're just projecting maybe your own feelings on what that is. Or it will be really sad. I guess, but they're still family. I know.

It's not like they're going to be leaving each other, you know. Maybe they're going to be like, remember when we used to like sitting here our makeup together before we were like going to do the show? Right. Like go over to each other's house. You know, like there are certain things that's fun. Remember when we used to do our like style meetings together and we were, you know,

I don't know. I mean, I now are protecting. Of course, there's nostalgia there. Remember when Chloe? Chloe, remember when you and I, like, took on Miami? And we were in Miami trying to open the shop. You know, there's like nostalgic moments. Ollie just did Smoke a J and watch your keeping up with the Kardashians.

I could actually see you getting into one of those marathons for sure. Oh, for sure. That was my jam. You know, I just want to know what they're going to do next. You would just switch between the deadliest catch and keeping him with the Kardashians. yeah balance is the key to a good life yeah i hear you anyway it was nice to be able to connect with courtney like that i hadn't done that for for many years yeah and kentel um i love how open kendal is about things that she knows are important i i actually have a little premonition

about Kendall. I think she's going to do some really interesting things as she gets older. And I think she's going to be quite a powerful force in a different way than people would expect her to be. That's what I was. Well, I mean, again, what a professional segue. Perfect. Let's move into the episode. Move into the episode. All right. Enjoy our episode with Courtney and Kendall. I'm really excited you guys are here. Thank you for coming. Thank you.

Okay, so little history. Courtney and Kim are around the same grade as me in high school. So in the L.A. kind of... You're the oldest, right? Yeah. And Kate and I are the same age. And we have... Our birthdays are one day apart.

Oh, that's right. Yeah. So Courtney and Kim, we were... all in the same grade. Girls, they went to Marymount. I went to Crossroads. And they were like the girls that the guys talked about all the time. No way. Yes. Oh my God. I love it. And I remember being in high school going, who the fuck is like Courtney and Kim Kardashian? This is crazy. Because the guys, they'd be like, you know, talking about how they saw the girls, whatever. And it was like, you know, the mysterious Kardashians. And then I remember we were at a part

I forget which one at what. Ashley Crane's house. I remember seeing you once at Ashley Crane's birthday party. I think I saw you guys at Victor Aaronberg's house. Yeah, maybe. Definitely. You guys, this stuff, I love these stories. Do you know, Ilya, Aaronberg was my first boyfriend.

Yes, exactly. Okay, so Ilya was my best friend in high school. So this is sort of, oh, yeah. Ilya was a stud. He was a stud. But Kim broke up with him for me on a waist month. She left him. voice message on his home answering machine. We only were dating for two weeks. We never saw each

other because he had bronchitis. So there was no making out. There was nothing. So here we are and I remember the first time I saw the girls, you were in your uniforms, like about five inches shorter than they were supposed to be, I'm sure. And I remember the initial reaction to seeing like, oh, I'm finally meeting the girls that the guys are all talking about all the time. time. And I was like, oh yeah, like, I get it. They're really hot. And I remember the dynamic then, which was like, you were always the one that the guys felt like they could talk to. Kim was always the one that was like, okay, Kim is like a little bit, you can't really get close enough to her, but like Courtney was the best friend. So that was my perception of what they were in high school.

That's pretty accurate. I think that's more of how our personalities even are now. I'm definitely more social. But that's even like me and Kylie. Like I feel like I'm the more the more Kim type. Like I kind of have like a little bit of a wall. And Kylie's super like always, even when we were growing up, she had so many friends and like everyone, like she was just easy to get along with. And I was always like, I don't know about you.

Even when Kim's friends would come over, they would end up hanging out with me. That's what happened to me. And Kylie, I swear. Oh, really? I would get so mad. All my friends would go hang out with Kylie. Real quick. You're the oldest.

How did this break down? Me, then Kim, then Chloe, then Rob, then Kendall, then Kylie. Oh, my God. Poor Rob. Holy shit. A boy. That's not even throwing the Jenner's in there. No, I know.

There's a whole other. I know. Rob with all the girls. And then Bert and Casey. That's right. Bert and Casey. Wait, so is Bert older than you? Yes, he's a year older than me.

And Casey is the same age. I wasn't in this whole. I'm three years older. Because you're ancient. You're like super. No, I know. That's okay. I still look pretty good.

No, I was three years older. I was, I was at like, bar one. I was at bar one. Dublin. We're at Opium Denk. Opium Den. These were the spots that we used to go to. That's where I saw you guys sometimes at like opium den.

Dublin. Remember Dublin? Where were all of these? Granville was the best. These were all L.A. clubs. Like in West Hollywood, Hollywood area? West Hollywood. The days of L.A. clubbing was actually pretty fun back then.

So let's start, seriously, because you guys are very, how many years apart are you? 16. Do you feel like you had very different upbringings? Yes. What would you say the dynamic was in the house? It was you and it was Kim. And then Chloe and Rob. We would go to church.

every Sunday and it was very like family and my mom's big on celebrating everything, you know, any little excuse for a celebration. My mom was very involved, like, you know, would make our lunches, would make dinner every night, would make us breakfast. I don't know if she was, I think she was working more with you guys. She was working more, but in the big, like, in our really much younger years, she always made us dinner and breakfast and lunch and everything. And my dad would too a lot. And I think when we were like, when we moved to the house that now Rob lives in, she was still kind of doing it. And that's when it started to die off and it became more my dad cooking for us. But yeah, I mean, you would, yeah, they made great food. I mean, it was the same.

Remember you told me about the picket fence protest that you guys did for the spaghetti? Oh, yeah. My mom used to make spaghetti every single night. And so I made picket signs and I would walk around the house with a sign and say, no more spaghetti. Like, I'm not eating your dinners anymore. But yeah, they were kind of repetitive. What's really interesting to me when I think about just our age gap is like there was a time in life where we were like, I mean, I'm still the little sister, but we were like really the little sisters. Like you could probably never imagine like hanging out with us on like a like a friendship. personal level and then it just like it's I wonder like what age was it that it flipped where we actually like started hanging out and like they hang out with my friends now sometimes and we go out together and we go to like we actually go on trips together do you remember the moment when it was like okay she's of age like let's go get a beer let's go get a drink let's go hang as friends when did we start probably when I was like 18 19 like when it really started to

And Kendall also was became, what age did you become like this model? And you know what I remember is when I had rain. And so I was, I don't know, I can't even add right now. I think I was 35. Then how old were you at that time? 21. 31. 31. 35 minus 16. 10. 19. 20. 25. How old do you? 23? 24. 24. So I remember we started. Wait a minute, Matt. Guys, guys. It's okay. Everyone's successful here. We don't need to know how to add that well. There's eight people in this room. 19. I think she was 19.

It would be 19. We were 16 years apart. But I remember at that time going with you to that, the roast, the comedy central roast. And then I feel like we would start. Or if we'd have a barbecue at the house, you would come and bring your friends. Totally. And like also our birthdays, like when Kylie. Kylie's 18th birthday. It was like everyone was, I feel like that's when it was really starting.

It was like when Kylie turned 18 and I was like 19, 20. Yeah. How old were you when your dad passed away? 24. Wow, you were my age. That's crazy. Yeah. Your mom at that time was with your dad. Mm-hmm. They weren't together for, yeah, for a while. Yeah. And so did you ever have a moment where Mama was like dating guys? Yes, when I was 11 And my parents got a divorce when I was 11

My mom had First she had a boyfriend Then they broke up And then she was, I just remember her going to bar one No way She would go to bar one all the time That was her spot What year?

That's so funny You weren't there Okay, good It's like 16 You were like, no, you were like 14 Okay, no, yeah You weren't there yet And

But she would go to bar one and she would wear these tight, like a lia dresses. What year was this in the sort of early 90s? Yes. Yeah. Like late 80s, early 90s? Yes. And she wore like hot pink lipstick.

And I just remember she was such a vibe. She had like this sailor hat that she would wear sometimes out. She was super 90s. Oh, so funny. And she had a boyfriend. She had a boyfriend, but not for very long. And then she was just out having fun with her friends. and who knows what she was doing.

And then she started dating Bruce. And I remember he came over for their first date to pick her up at the house. And I was there with my friend. And we were actually trying on her tight dresses and doing a fashion show. And I have all these photos. I think we put one on my brother,

a fluorescent yellow one. Of course. And we had photos of Rob in this fluorescent yellow dress with your dad. That's so funny. What did you think? of him like do you remember you know was there a moment where it was like okay this is real and were you always accepting of sort of your mom dating other guys and having her own life you were

not definitely not yeah but also you like hated my dad for a second right I did but not in the beginning I liked him in the beginning and then they were we had all of the kid the I had now four step siblings so we thought that was super fun and we would go on to trips together. Bruce had a house in Lake Tahoe so we would always go and we thought it was so much fun. And then just when he would tell me what to do, you know, or... I think it's one of the hardest positions to have to be in because, I mean, there's four of you guys. And then you're walking into this dynamic that's been going on for quite a while. And it's just hard. My dad had a fiance who lived with us for maybe five years. Oh, wow. And I loved her and we got along

extremely well. Denise. Denise. Where's Denise? And we're still friendly. We're still close. She came over on Christmas actually to our party. And her and I always had, you know, there was probably a few little things. But I think, you know, she, I think she wasn't strict with us. That's the difference. She would try to teach us a lot. She's the person who taught Kim and I about makeup. She gave us these makeup lessons and had someone video us doing makeup and we learned she bought us all, you know, makeup. And she would just try to give us all these lessons about being, you know, a woman and just teach us all these tricks and things like that. Was the divorce? Was the divorce? Was it a good divorce? Meaning, like, was it, was it amicable?

Or was it was contentious? Yeah. But they ended up with that too. My mom and Uncle Robert ended up being like cool. Yeah. Then they ended up being close friends and getting along. And like my dad and Uncle Robert were, I call him Uncle Robert, were really cool, right? After a while.

And then once he was cool with Bruce, then I felt like I could be nice. Yeah. To Bruce. Yeah. Oh, that's so interesting. You're protective. Do you have moments where you're like, I can't stand this sibling right now? And I don't get, I don't, I'm not, I'm not backing you up.

I'm not protecting you. I'm, you, you fend for yourself. I mean, I think like any sibling relationship, there's always like you get in these crazy fights and you can hate them for five minutes, but then like 20 minutes later you're like, all right, you want to go get lunch? Like, it's like kind of that relationship. But also, if you're talking about like, you know, publicly, when we always say like when we're like a group we're like a package deal yeah do you know what I mean

so it's like when one of us does something it kind of reflects on all of us so there's not that like you know what screw you you go deal with it it's your problem did it because it's kind of anything that we all do it's like all of our problems I mean we joke about like when you when you when you date one of us you date all of us like it's like kind of that thing of like but I think there are moments that must be so intimidated I know. Sounds so scary. Well, everyone kind of then gets in your business, you know, with the dating thing.

But I think as far as, like, if one of us says something publicly, like Kendall recently said something that I wasn't happy about, she went on James Corden. And they said, rate your siblings in order of worst parent, no, best parent to worst parent. And she, and I saw her right after at a party. And she ran up to me and was like, oh, my God, I said this thing. and I said you was the last parent and ha-ha, like it was a joke. I didn't mean it, blah, blah, blah.

And I was like, okay. That's first of all. That is not what I said to you. I went up to you because I was like, I was like, I'm going to put Rob first. And then the rest I'm just not even going to like, I just was like, I'm just going to throw them out there. And Courtney, I swear to God, this is how it played. She happened to be the last one. So then I was like, okay, that sounds kind of bad.

But before I was like, they're all amazing, whatever. They are all incredible parents. And I don't have a kid. We were just talking about this. I can't really speak for anyone because I don't have a child, but I know just visually how amazing they are. Usually someone would be like,

I'm not can't answer to that. But isn't your scenario with your kids and your family always the source of most of like the conversation? There's always something happening. Everybody saying something about me. Right. I was just like, I'm the least one that needs to be, have more said. Why are you get, why do you get picked on so?

I don't know. I don't know if I'm like an easy target. or they think I'm not going to say anything or it's like if she would have said that about Kim or Kylie and then me or Chloe would have been the easiest ones to say it about so I feel like forget it if you said it about Kim or Kylie yeah let me let me ask Kendall this question because you are an outside perspective you do not have kids and this is not a rating or a judging but do you see those who do have the children do you see how they parent do they parent differently Do they all parent a little differently?

Or is there a common thread between all of them? Like the way they discipline their kids maybe? Yeah, there's like traveling all over the world. No, no, yeah. No, she's not wrong. Like I don't see everything. I'm going to Milan. I'll see you later.

No, I literally don't. I don't see a lot. Like, I see them as often as I could. So she's not wrong. But I mean, yeah, I think there's. I do. And I see a lot of it. I get a very personal.

feel of all of it. Whose kids do you see the most? Probably yours. I see courts the most because I travel with her and the kids a lot more than I travel with the rest of them. But no, I mean, I think naturally there's definitely differences in discipline in all those things. And not to say any of them are wrong or bad or, you know, like I said, I can't really speak. I don't have a kid of my own. Who's the most lenient parent? From your perspective. Court. And who's the strictest, like, Yeah, no, don't do that type of vibe. It's between Kim and Chloe. Well, I don't mean, maybe it's Kim.

I think it's Chloe. Really? I would assume it would be Chloe, just based on her personality. Yeah. That she's like, I feel like it's Chloe. But her daughter's also not even two years old. Right. I mean, that's tough.

So there's a big difference. But I think Chloe is going to be like a... Get all that shit off your face. I feel like my friend has this. thing where anytime something's happening in her life, she's like, I'm just, I need to like Courtney Kardashian this. And what that means is

and this is her, what she was saying about it, is that it's like, nothing seems to phase Courtney. Is that you though? I mean, is that who you are? It is. It can be, and it is a lot of times, but I do have my moments of being impatient

or, you know. You know who I think is even more like that that a lot of people don't know is Kylie. Kylie is so la-ida Like everything is just like It'll happen and it's supposed to happen Yeah Kylie is the baby right

She's the baby yeah What was it like for you guys When the new ones came into play You know what I mean? Like was there Was it was it exciting Was it taking attention away from you guys I know you were older

But you know what was that vibe like? I think it was super exciting I remember when we knew that my mom was trying to get pregnant with Kendall. So, you know, we were, that was very exciting for us. We were in the room when Kendall was born. And then with Kylie, when she told us she was pregnant with Kylie, it was a huge shock. So I remember being like, what?

And we were kind of embarrassed, I think. Like our mom was having another kid. It was like, it was more rare, I think, at that time. Well, at that time, now it's, now it's. normal. But at the time, I remember, I think she was 40, she was 41 with Kylie, because she was. By the time she had her, she was 41. But I remember being, just feeling a little embarrassed. Like, should she be having another kid? Are you able to? Like, we just were kind of surprised. And then, you know, by the time, we were really excited. We were in the room also when

Kylie was born. Wow. Like during the birth. Wow. That's awesome. Was it your mom's idea to do the show? Yes, we were actually, Kim, Chloe and I were trying to do a show about this producer came to Kim and we were trying to do a show about our stores dash. They just kind of followed us and that's what they thought was great. And then when we were doing that, they started filming with our family. Like they came to the house once for dinner and started filming some stuff. And then I think they just decided to do a family show. And do you go back and never look at any of the past episodes and go like, oh my God, that's crazy? I just forget a lot. So I'll look and I'll be, I'll just be like, wow, I can't believe we did this or we showed this or, you know. The only time that I'll ever, like if I'm like channel searching or whatever and I see that our show is on, the only episodes I'll ever click on are like the really old ones. Like the first, because those are like low key home videos to us. So it's really cool for me to see those ones, the new ones. And you're such a baby.

I know. I'm so crazy. It's so weird to see how little Kylie and I were. Oh my God. There must be also such a fashion shift. But it is crazy that almost every day of our lives were photographed. So to see these crazy outfits sometimes, the fashion was so awful. So bad.

But at the time. So I always think about this. I'm always like, okay, so whenever anyone looks at an old photo of them, whether it's their face or their clothes or whatever, and they're like, oh, my God, What was I thinking? Like, are we always going to look back and be like, what was I thinking? No, because look at my mom, like, 80s, 70s, 80s, mom is cool to look at it. Yeah, but you guys, look what's happening right now because of the four of us, I'm pretty much the fashion person here.

The 90s has made a major comeback. I don't personally as a guy, I don't like it. It's like I'm not, you love it, but I'm not into the high, high-waisted jeans and these huge white clunky shoes. and yeah hot the high-wasted it's not my thing oh you're wearing these like mom jeans Kate they're not mom jeans they're not they're basically going up

to your breasts I mean they're very they feel great they feel great I think everything look so great no but it doesn't it makes the tushy not look as good what I bet to differ I beg to differ pull up the mom

S&L mom jeans sketch and that's what it is That's not... I mean, that's literally, I just... Here's the thing. Guys don't like the high-wasted gene. They literally... None of them like it.

None of them like it. And I mean, not... And it's... Well, I'm also like... I'm 100 years old. What I love the most is that girls don't care. I was about to ask that question. Do girls dress for girls or do you dress for boys?

I dress for myself. You do. I dress for girls. Oh, for girls. For other girls. Yeah. Oh, yeah. That's what I mean.

Girls for yourself. But I mean, like, do you take into account? what a guy might like or is it depends on the day it depends on what we're it depends on what you're doing yeah it does but is it the specific guy you might be going on a date with or is it just in general no like if you and i are going on a date right like i dress for you well here's the thing you just you just heard you just heard that i i i'm sort of like the high waist thing i'm like so if we go on a date would you not wear those jeans i probably wouldn't if you were like i really don't like high-wasted jeans and then I probably wouldn't come in with a big mom gene on

I just think if you're going to dress for your body and you're going to and you know what looks good on you then other people are going to see that that looks the better you feel and whatever you're wearing that translates on to other people so like you could be in some wild outfit but if you have that like confidence in that outfit people are going to see that and all of a sudden everything looks like great I was I was talking to my wife before we came here I was like should I dress like well I didn't you know she goes well why I was like I don't know I feel like I should like blowdry my hair or something and I and she's like no just like where what you're going to wear I had this this feeling of needing to sort of look semi fashionable like wearing like a blazer yeah

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I think there's times when like you said, like you can't even go out to dinner with the, you know, somebody that you're seeing because you don't know what it is or whatever. But then I'm just like I have to live my life too. But at some point, you realize, like, it just doesn't matter anymore. It's like, someone's going to say that I'm doing something that I'm not doing anyway, and I'm doing this, and I'm this. And everyone forgets about something, like, within a week. So it's kind of just like, if you're going to do it, just do it. It's so true. Everyone says it, is going to say something anyways, and in a week, no one will remember this.

Especially now. Especially now. That's why I've done so many Hallmark movies. Because I think everyone just forgets. I get to collect a paycheck and then move on to maybe something cooler. Do you know everything that's out there? Do you get to a certain point where you just don't even, like someone can say something to you and you'd no idea that that was out there as like some rumor?

I think we usually know on some level just because everything, you know, I don't know. You don't even have to like look for it sometimes. It's just like we were talking about our Instagram popular page earlier. Like sometimes it just like pops up and you're like, wait, what? Like how did people? And what is this? Do you ruminate over it? No, if something's intense enough or, you know, whatever, you can definitely.

I think it depends on the subject matter, especially, like stuff with me about my kids, like when Kendall said that, even though I know it was not intentional and she didn't mean it, but that, like, got to me. And I apologized for. Yes, which she did. And I wrote her and said that it hurt my feelings and then she apologized and it was fine. but stuff like that where it's about like a serious you know like a topic and then you're like oh god now everyone thinks I'm the worst parent and the and then it's like who cares I know that I'm

not we have different parenting styles you know is your mom the center like is she the great mediator of the family or are there moments where there's still individuation happening I think we're super independent and individual but our mom is like I'd say like home base captain whatever you want to call it. Like, if I'm ever having an issue, whether it be personal life or work life, I'm running to my mom. Like, I'm going to call my mom just probably like, like anyone would. But it's a plus that she also like, you know, helps us out with our work stuff.

Being so young, actually, did your parents ever talk to you when the show was happening? Like, look, this is what life is like right now. This isn't necessarily, this is your life, but there's a, this isn't real life in a sense, even though it is. You know what I mean? Was there a bigger talk? Or was it just, this is what we're doing? Because at 11 years old, your brain is still forming.

Yeah. And your cognition is still forming. Right. And I wonder this, I wonder stuff like this a lot. And I, it's hard to say, like, I know the exact reason or whatever, why Kylie and I ended up, for the most part, pretty, like, chilled and, like, normal about the whole situation. Because we actually lived it. So I can't tell you, like, what's different from, like, how we did it to, like, how someone else was raised. because I, that's the kind of the only thing I know. I mean, I can tell you surface level what I think I see.

But it's so interesting because I think about it all the time and like how they raised us, what was different and why did, how did we, how did everything turn out this way? And sometimes I'm just like it was a slow build and it was gradual and they made us feel so, like we never had like, we weren't just given everything. We were spoiled for sure. We were very blessed and we had a great upbringing and I have no complaints whatsoever. but like it wasn't I don't know correct me if you think I'm wrong but I just think Kylie and I grew up for the most part pretty normal and I know I've said that a minute ago but

like it was just what do you attribute that to because you guys all seem very down to earth well-rounded grounded people who are appreciative you know I mean is that the is that parenting I mean do you think yeah I mean I mean I don't have like an like in a direct answer for you because I just, I haven't been able to, like, put my finger on the exact thing that it is, but I could generalize it to, yeah, I think it's amazing parenting, but beyond amazing parenting, I think it's, it is, like, you are a product of what you're, like, it is just the lifestyle we lived. Like, we lived, like, just, we went to normal school. And, like, that's what I was concerned about.

I didn't care, like, who was coming over for dinner. There is like a surprising groundedness that you guys have that I don't know if it's represented in your show, but you have a very centered. And that does, it comes from your, it has to come from your parents. And you guys, no matter what's happening, are always so close.

I think that's a huge testament to your mama. Right. Now, your brothers, are you close with Brody and Brandon? Yeah. We are obviously not as close as. my sisters, and even just growing up, I grew up, they lived in the same house with me at one point. So we just had, like, I just wasn't ever as close with them growing up. But we were always, like, I saw them all the time. And we go, I go in and out of, like, phases with them.

Like, there will be times where I'm home a lot. And, like, I'll go over to Malibu and I'll see my dad and my brother. So it's not that we're not close. It's just not as close. And then do you go in and out of being close? with one sibling. Totally. How does it happen, though? I mean, just because you're, it just happens. I think it kind of shifts, doesn't it?

Yeah. Like, I'm all, I could be closest with Courtney right now, but Kylie and I will always have some special, certain bond. And maybe that's because her and I are full blood. Of course. Kylie was my per, like Kylie was my pair. So there were things that I experienced with her mostly because of an age difference that I didn't experience with Courtney.

Like we, we were, I mean, we're very close. We're 21 months apart. So we're like pretty much twins at a certain point. So, like, we just did all these things. things together. We grew up together. Who is the most Instagram followers? Kim.

Is it Kim? Are you guys mad about that? Kim and Kylie are pretty much like Yeah, they're very close. And there were, how many Instagram followers? Is that? I don't know. Hundreds of millions. Does it, does anyone care? I mean, does it kid? Do you guys, is there any,

is there, you've got more than I do? Not at all. You do that with me. What about the competitive nature? You know what I mean? Is there, is there is literally none? None. I don't feel any. Do you?

I don't feel any. And any envy or jealousy of like, oh fuck, you know, I want that. I swear to God, I don't feel any. I mean, personally at least, and I don't feel it towards me. But I also think that's because we all just are so different when you really think about it. And we all do such different things.

And that's something that I like really, the reason I got so excited when you said that is because it's something that I'm so just like thankful for. Like, because it's so easy. There's so many girls. And like, it's so just like could be. so catty and it's not at all at least in my opinion. I think Kim and I had

it growing up. Yeah, Kylie and I were the worst growing up. But now I think there's none. Oh, but growing up there was that sort of budding heads. Or like stealing each other's clothes. Right, but that's so... Stealing each other's friends, boyfriends. I have a question. You guys have put yourselves out there

for basically your entire lives. There's a probably at this point I can say a societal perspective on who you guys are or a perception, right? What is bullshit about that? Are there things that the society probably thinks about you just based on what they've seen, which honestly is based on editing?

Because let's be honest, they can edit you guys in ways that where you're like, wait a minute, that's bullshit. That's not who I am. It's frustrating. It's got to be frustrating, especially because you can't micromanage all that. You have to just let it roll. What do you think the one thing that society might get wrong about you guys? one thing. There's so many things. Give me a couple big ones. I'm like trying to think of things

that like I talk about that frustrate me. It's more of like a like a very like a tunnel of like who I feel like I'm edited to be like very like gluten free, dairy free like just like won't eat sugar. But you are gluten free and dairy free. No but it's like but the way no but the way it is like first of all yes I am at my house. But like, then, I don't know. I'm not crazy. That's pretty cute, but those things are cute. You're like, no, when I go to a restaurant, though, I am not gluten-free and I want everyone to know. I eat butter and cheese and croissants. No, but you're saying that they kind of, there's this idea that you're like so regimented. Exactly. Yeah. That I'm super rigid. And like when we had the girls' birthday party, it was a Candy Land theme. And so there was this big fight between me and Kim about I didn't

want as much junk food at the party, and she did. And so it was this whole thing. And then it's like me and Ollie. That would be an argument. The whole way that it was portrayed, though, it looked like, I don't know. It looks like you were no fun. Right. Yeah. Exactly. So that's the character that they've sort of made you know it to be. Right. Right. So it's bothersome when I'm like, I'm the most fun. Right. And what about you, Kendall? Is there anything specific? I know there's a lot, but one or two where it's like, this is kind of bullshit because this is, isn't really who I am. Well, it's not even...

I mean, I'm not even talking personally. I'm talking about, like, like, the whole just Kardashian-Gener, like, label, I guess. I just... I get... I'm super loyal and I'm super defensive over, like, the people that I love. So, especially when it's, like, a whole group...

Like, when we're talking about our entire family... I don't know. I think it's a lot of the time when people are just like, oh, like that we manipulate situations or that we do this or that we do that or like even people are like they call the paparazzi and they do this and I'm like why would first of all first of all I don't have the time second of all like why I don't you're the one that's just none of it makes sense to me sometimes and that gets super frustrating because I'm like there I know people I know like people that I would never name

who actually do that stuff that you guys would never think do that and like I couldn't even tell you who to who to call who to tell who to you know what I mean like It's things like, that's just one random example and that's kind of a very general one. But like there are so many things like that where people don't actually realize how like, I mean, like, we're actually pretty like, I don't know. Do you get what I'm trying to say? I know what you're trying to. Sometimes I have a hard time saying things when I get really hyped up. You're sitting next to the right person.

No, I know exactly what you're trying to say. What you're basically saying is everybody will always try to make you guys look like your. attempting to make it happen and it's not just something that's actually organically what it is. Your mom is sitting there with the puppet strings calling paparazzi to take pictures of you walking down the street

and do it. What is it? There's that meme that's like the devil works hard but Chris Jenner works harder or something like that. It's like people really think we sit here and like play out, calculate all these things and all like but it's genuinely it's literally why we have a show is because we're actually

we just are there's craziness all the time. And it's just not even planned. And that's just why our show became so successful. Do you guys ever think about where you'd be if the show didn't exist? I mean, what would your life be like? Oh, yeah. We have to go, we want to do this. We want to go through each person in your family and what you think they would be doing. They would be doing if you weren't keeping up. What is it? KU. W.T. It's Ku K-K-K-U-K-K-K-U-K-K-K-K. What would your mom be doing right now? We're going to start with mom. Yeah, what would she be doing? Well, my mom and I have. had, at the time when our show started, we had a kids' clothing store called Smooch.

Okay. And then two years later, we opened, my sisters and I opened Dash, which was our store, two doors down. And I pretty much ran the Smooch one, and Chloe pretty much ran Dash. But I don't know. I don't know if we'd still be doing the stores. You'd probably be in fashion going and buying, and you'd open probably like your version of Dover Street Market or something.

Exactly. So we were doing these buying trips, Kim, Chloe and I in New York, and we had the best time we would go to all these lunches and buying trips and go out. It was really fun. So maybe the three of you would be in business together, probably, right? You'd be in fashion. Okay, but specifically, mom would be what? The accountant? Like, what would mom be accounting? She would maybe still do the store. My grandmother mother, my mom's mom, had a kid's clothing store in La Jolla until maybe four years ago. So she- No, I think it was a little, like maybe two years ago. Oh, really? Yeah. So she had the store forever. We would go there growing up. So maybe my mom

would still do the kids store. Her thing at the store, she could sell anything to anybody. She was the number one, like, ultimate salesperson. If anyone walked in, no matter how much money they had. mom. She would convince them that they just needed everything. She would make the biggest sales. And then she, her thing was also doing the windows. She just would make the windows look so magical. And I did all the buying and paid the bills and did. Okay. Kim. Kim would, at her role, like at the store was more like styling like people. She would go to people's houses, bring them a bunch of clothes. She would like help people, like, clean out their clothes. closet and sell all their clothes. She would say, like, this is what you don't need.

This is what you need. She would clean out their whole closet and say, get all this stuff from Dash and then. All right. So I'm going to say Kim would end up being like a stylist and a, and then Chloe. Chloe really ran Dash. Like she was the one, you know, who. The operator. Yeah, the operator.

So, so. So, so. C-O. She's the C-O-O. I was the CEO. I'll just make that clear And then Kylie

I have no Like I'm trying to think What she would be doing I mean she really created Kylie cosmetics No she really did That's why I'm saying

It's so hard to think of her doing anything else Like she really did that So she'd still be doing that Right She just wouldn't have the same platform It would just be able to she'd be right She'd do something in cosmetics I'm sure And you?

Maybe she would still be... No, I feel like I would have like gone to the Olympics for the courseback riding, yeah. I still would love to go, but I just haven't. I don't have the time. Let's make it happen. But you can make that time. How fucking cool would that be, by the way? I would love to be the second Olympian, Jenner.

That would be amazing. Yes, let's do it, Kendall. I know. I know. No, I think about it all the time. I really do. No, I have two horses. But you also have the resources. Like, you can travel and ride anywhere you go. Right. And you don't have to be modest. Do you have the talent? Yeah. No, I mean, I literally did it for 12 years straight. Like my whole life didn't stop. I'd like would go from 8 a.m. to 8 p.m. I'd ride I'd ride my horses and then I'd ride all my trainer's horses and like get him out all day.

So what do you, what would you do? What would you do? What would be your? Unlike hunter jumper. Like I would do probably like Grand Prix and stuff. So no modeling. No, I don't think I would have modeled. I think I would have like the reason I stopped. about five years ago. She would have been a gold medalist and then a model. Model. Right. Maybe. I modeled.

But now she's going to be a model and then a gold. I did. I modeled. I got one job. Yeah, I got one job. I went to college for two years and then I was like, okay, I'm home. I PA'd found movies for a while.

And then I was like, I need to make some money. And I was like, maybe I'll try modeling. And I weighed like 130 pounds. I was so skinny. And I'd go on these castings with all these like buff dudes and they did polaroids of me and I'd be like look like a weird little like alien man and I it was horrible and I finally got a Levi's gig and then I quit. Bonjour. What's you do you know what I just said? Oliver, it's so easy. You basically just

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Okay, so what have been the highlights so far? You're 40 years old of your working life. Kids aren't, you can't say kids because kids are always highlights. So that's not allowed to that. But like what have been the highlights? Just say right now. Right now doing this interview. That's right.

Our family did an interview with Oprah, which was really cool. She came and interviewed each family member. Even thinking back to moments that at the time I didn't think were a thing, like even just like doing David Letterman or, you know, things like I get really nervous to do shows like that now. And I think, like, I don't even know if I could do that. But I would go with no, I had no care. I had so much confidence. I would just like walk out and just, I didn't even really get it. Everything was moving so quickly that I feel like we just did things all the time. Like I did a soap opera, like an acting thing as, which I'm the worst actress of all time.

but I did that just kind of for fun. We were in New York and filming our show and they asked me to do that. So there's been so many different things that I've tried. And I think to all these random jobs that me and my sisters had that I think are just so cool

that we had the opportunity to try so many different things. What about travel? Do you like to travel? I love to travel. What's your favorite place? I mean, Bali was really special.

It was really different, I think, than anywhere I had been and just, you know, but I really love going to Japan. I think the time change and just it feels like you're in a different world, like you're on a different planet, for some reason to me. It's my favorite. I love Japan. You know, I've never been. Really?

Never. I got to go. I got to go. I know. I got to go. So you're next. So what about you? 24. So far, like, what? 20 years? It's my whole life. What has been a seminal moment for you in these last, I'd say, five, six years?

I mean, kind of just what we were saying. Like, I think overall, I would have never imagined that it would have been, even just at this level or that I would have been in the place that I am at today. And I always say, and I don't know how it could be the corneous thing, but I always say, like, some of the most special things that I find that come out of my job are the people that I meet, the places that I get to go. And just the experiences that I get to experience, because I know that not everyone is able to do a lot of the things that I could do. And I try not to ever take it for granted. And everyone always says, like, grasp the moment or whatever. And it's like, how do you, like, I sit there sometimes and I'm like, how do I grasp this right now? Like, it's just all going to keep going. So I like to sit and think about things and just be like, I really am so fortunate and so blessed, even if it is just at the end of the day or whatever. but like certain things

I'd say like I got I did September Vogue which was really big for me a couple years ago I've done like I mean the reason I started modeling was the Victoria's Secret Fashion show and I know that's very like stereotypical but like I did that and that was super cool for me and just like a bunch of I mean for a model I would think that growing up

you see those girls you're always like oh yeah it's so much those were like my superheroes yeah I think it's just the overall like I really didn't ever. And I had a lot of, you know, doubters. Like, there was a lot of people that were like, I'm a very, like, competitive person when it comes to myself and, like, proving people wrong almost. So I really took that. I really was like, I'm going to work even harder now. Like, keep the, keep the haters coming because I swear to God, it, like, makes, it, like, fuels me. I'm like, okay, let's keep it pushing. So I had, like, a lot of, I didn't know where I would end up. And I was, you know, I started

doing it because I wanted to be an example for little girls like myself that when I would look at supermodels, I thought of them as superheroes. So I'm like, I want to be that example to other little girls or boys. And so I felt like I had, I just, I had this drive that I like didn't even realize I had in the moment. I was just like loving and having so much fun. And I was like, I want to do more. I want to do more. I want to keep going. Other than the Victoria Secret Show, what was the moment for you where you were like, I can't believe I'm doing this? So with the Victoria's Secret Show being said, coming into it, that's what I, you know, thought that I wanted. And I didn't, I didn't do a lot of my research. I knew what models that I loved and I knew a bit about fashion, but I wasn't like super

into it like, because I was kind of focused on my horses. So once I got into it and I was like, you know what? I want to do this for real. I want to do this big. I went to my agency. I got signed and they basically were like, you're not going to do the Victoria Secret Fashion show right now. Like, we're going to show you this whole other world of like high fashion and just these amazing shows. And my first season, I was. walk Chanel. So, I mean, I did a bunch of other shows, but that was, like, really big for me. I never even imagined that was where I would be. I literally was like, like, I don't care. Like, I want to do, like, whatever's cool. Like, just send me, send me wherever I got to go.

Like, I'll go do it and I'll put my hard work and do it. So getting Chanel, I was like, what the hell? I was like, holy moly. Like, this is really happening. So I walk Mark Jacobs my first season. And so those moments were like really cool for me. I don't think people really, but I mean, I guess now they do because they can see. see more of it, but the energy that's happening in the shows and when you're backstage and it's just like constantly moving and girls are constantly going and the travel is insane. I remember being about 19 years old and I had flown all over. I was flying from Ireland to London to New York to L.A. and back and forth and I had to audition for almost famous. It was like one of those

moments in my life for I just didn't stop and I remember being on a plane and I was taxiing and I just like burst into tears because I didn't know my head from my feet and at this point I now can look back and go oh my god I was I just finished high school I mean that's a lot it's a lot when you're that young and you're kind of you think you're ready for it but then you're just living out of a suitcase and I remember calling my mom I was like mom I don't I'm like losing my mind I don't I don't know where I am anymore and she talked me kind of down and made me realize that that's not that's not that normal for a 19-year-old girl to be traveling like that, like right out of the house. And anyway, I'm just wondering if you ever had moments like that where you were...

I had a lot of crazy moments. I've always had like, you know, some anxiety, and I didn't even really know what it was when I was really young. But I think all of this kind of really ignited it in me. So I really had... Okay, so that's sorry to interrupt, but I was going to say I want to touch on that because I was reading about your debilitating anxiety. Yeah. Because I think it's important, especially for a lot of people, you know, you have however hundreds of millions of people who follow you. These are the things that can really, you know, touch people

and people can relate to. I went through it in my 20s. And I just wanted to sort of ask about that and what that was for you and how it manifested. Yeah. I think, like I said, I've always had it. And I didn't know what it was because no one really talked about it when I was really young. And I remember going to my mom when I was super little and being like, mom, I can't breathe. Like, I'm really short of breath. I feel like I can't get a deep breath. And she was like, I don't know. So I went to a doctor. My lungs checked. My lungs were fine. Whatever. No one ever told me what it was. Not even my mom really knew what was going on. She couldn't be like, okay, you're having a panic attack or you're having anxiety or whatever. So it was slight growing up. And then, like I said, going into my job and just traveling

nonstop. I mean, I would be on eight to 11 to 12 hour flights almost every single day for seven years. like I was like not there was no stopping like I was losing my mind even like missing the smallest holiday like fourth of July I would like lose my mind I'd be hysterical in my bedroom like but I felt I almost felt like I was like I knew I wanted to be there because I knew that the outcome is what I wanted like I wanted to do that job and I want it but in reality I was like what am I doing this for I'm I'm 19 years old I'm 18 years old and I should be having fun with my friends like why am I what am I doing like I'm whatever so I would just have these breakdowns and my anxiety got really, really bad. And I think that everyone uses the word anxiety really lightly these days,

because it is a real thing. And I would go into the deepest panic attacks where I'd have people like rush me to the hospital. I'd be like, I'm going to die. Like, things are not going, right? I got my heart checked. I got my brain checked. I got my lungs checked. I did all of that. Everything checked to make sure that I was okay. I would have these really bad attacks where I would someone, my Chinese medicine doctor guy told me that they kind of call it Cave Woman Syndrome, basically where you go to bed and you think every, you feel fine. You're like, I'm going to bed. I'm good. Whatever. I don't feel anxious. And you basically wake up in the middle of the night with like complete like just anxiety. In the middle of your

sleep, you're waking up. I was screaming. I was couldn't stop like I felt like I couldn't breathe. My heart was going crazy. I would just have these like frights, whatever you want to call in the middle of the night. I'd call someone. Usually it was Shelly is off and I would like, I'd be like, I need to come over. She was so nice. She would answer the phone every. night at like three in the morning, I would go there, and all of a sudden I would feel fine. And it's basically when I got robbed a few times in my last house and like stalkers and all these things. And it's basically when you go to bed and subconsciously, you're not even aware that you don't feel safe. So it's like when the cave men would go out to hunt and the women

would have to stay back with the babies, they would have that too because they wouldn't feel safe anymore. It's a primal. How did you get through it? It's funny because I would only get it in that house. She realized that she needed to wake up and be like, I'll kill a motherfucker. So it would only happen in that house and sometimes on airplanes. I would have these weird things where I would fall asleep on an airplane and I would wake up like every five to ten minutes with like full anxiety really bad. So I had to like, I started meditating and that was helping a lot. I started doing like a lot of acupuncture and like all these other things.

Anything I could figure out would help me just calm down. And then I was like, you know what? I think I got to get out of this house. I don't think this house is good for me, something about the energy and just everything that's happened. don't feel safe here. Do you still have anxiety? I mean, now and again. Yeah, no, for sure.

I mean, I got, this is just one example like something really gnarly that would happen to me. So I ended up getting out of that house and I don't have those episodes anymore, but I do, and I haven't had a panic attack

in a really long time just because I've gotten, I think anxiety, you can't, once you're having it, they say you just have to ride the wave. So it's not about getting rid of it when you have it,

it's about preventing it. Yep. So for me, it was just about finding, even if it was the littlest things. Like, I have so many apps in here. I couldn't even, like, I have a whole, like, folder in my phone. Just like the apps or the aromatherapy or the acupuncture or getting a massage once a week or meditating.

You were little. Yeah, but I didn't know what it was. I mean, now it's definitely way, way worse than it ever was. Well, when I was 23 years old, this happened to me and it hit me hard. Yeah. I was on the street and I felt like my heart was going to explode. I went down to a knee. I thought I was dying.

Same thing. I got tests, heart. everything, realized it was acute anxiety for eight, nine months. I was throwing up on the street. I was getting nauseous. And I would try to fight through it. And meditation was massive for me. Meditation and journaling, you know.

I literally, I started journaling last year, like beginning of the year. I also started reading, like physically reading books, which helps me a lot. But journaling helped a lot. Just to even, even if I just write down, like, little thoughts. Like, it's not even about, like, writing a whole story. But, yeah, a lot of that helped me. So many people are dealing with anxiety, and you're right. I think it's used lightly nowadays.

The term is used so lightly. It is a horrible, horrible feeling. You know what I mean? I think we are living in an anxious world right now. I even see it with my kids. My oldest is going through it right now. He's going, he's 12. He's going through this anxiety.

Yeah, the phones don't help. I think we've got to put our phones down. We do. And I think we all fall victim to being on our phones a lot. And I don't think you should feel bad about it if you are. But I think that you just, it's about being aware. Did you ever get to the root of your anxieties, you know, or really sort of think on it and be like, I wonder where this is stemming from? Because it all does come from something. I think a lot of it, like I was kind of saying before, was triggered mainly by like being overworked. And I didn't really have a moment for myself. So I realized that when I consciously kind of went to my agents and my mom and I was like, listen, guys, I love working. I'm not going to stop working. I still want to do it, but I want to be a little more selective. And I want to start saying no and being smart about my travel. travel schedule and just like really planning things out properly. Once I started doing that

and taking time for myself, I mean, even just like the little trips that Courtney and I go on or like, or just being like, you know what, I'm going to book, I'm going to book this holiday out and I'm going to be in LA for this or I want to be here or whatever. Just taking back control of my life help me so much. Third love, third love. Third love. Third love makes bras. I've talked about this before. I love my third love. I love what they do to give back.

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So right now, they're offering our listeners 15% off your first order. So go to thirdlove.com slash sibling now to find your perfect fitting bra and get 15% off your first purchase. That's thirdlove.com slash sibling for 15% off today. So your parents, you guys always had to have jobs, right? That was, like, one of the big things. Kylie and I were always motivated because we grew up around so many, like, you know, our older siblings and our parents, like, everyone always had a job. So I think naturally we were really motivated.

So they didn't even really have to push us into having jobs. We kind of just loved doing it. Right, but except you were clever, right? There's something about a dog walker and you were supposed to walk the dog, but you hired somebody to all. Genius. Well, here, you want to talk about having jobs, and then I could say my story. Sure. One summer, I was a production assistant on a movie.

Okay. It was like a TV movie. My dad was friends with the director. My mom was friends with the owners of guests, so I had to work at the guest store on Rodeo. Okay. I usually worked upstairs in the men section, but I am an expert t-shirt folder now. I worked for both my parents as their personal assistants on different summers. which honestly was probably where I learned the most in life

because I feel like just watching them like what I was saying, like role modeling and just hearing my mom on the phone or my dad on the phone and how they would talk to people and get things done or I was in charge of my mom's Rolodex. I had to typewrite. She was obsessed with a typewriter. I had to use her typewriter and make her Rolodex cards when she got someone's contact.

I loved our Rolodex. Remember the family Rolodex? And so just seeing how she organized, I had to do all of her filing, her filing systems and how she organized everything and how she got her errands. And I had to run all of her errands. Go with her to Costco. Do all this stuff. Like just, I don't know. It just taught me so much about how to keep a household. And especially my dad's, I was in charge during the OJ trial of organizing. the mail into OJ's mail and it was into boxes I had to do ones with money, ones with that had a lead, ones that, I don't know, there was like four categories, hate mail and fan mail. I think it also like we all, we were just talking about how you haven't really been to any of our houses, but we all like, you know, we just run our households a certain way and you can like,

you can see it. It's like literally a product of like what my mom has just instilled in all of us and how we like run our lives and how organized we are and we're just like we were adults at such a young age thanks to our mom and I consider it a really good thing like we just you know we know how to like run shit right yeah okay and then so your dog your dog story real quick yeah so we used to Kylie and I used to walk dogs in our community all the time we would literally just like make poster like flyers and like go to our neighbor's houses and just be like, do you need a dog walk? Do you need a dog walk? And so it became like a little bit of a thing. And then there was this man in our community that ended up,

he was doing the same thing as us. And we didn't even really know about him and we found out about him. So we were like, oh, like here. Like you could start taking the dogs, whatever. And we would still kind of get paid for it. And then they ended up like they caught me doing it on the show at one point. Oh, it was on the show. It was on the show. Oh, that's so funny. I like got paid for walking my dog, but then I would just go give her to the dog walker and just like go to my thing.

If that was my kid, like I guess I go, but I would be really. Well, it's entrepreneurial. Well, I would like the, I would like the spirit of it, which is I've got other things I want to be doing. I'm going to figure out how to make money and not have to do the work. Oh, I was genius at that. Well, I mean, I mean, sort of. Oh, what do you mean? Now, no, but when I was a kid, fake IDs, all the stuff.

Let's talk about push. Where did this come from? How long have you been doing it now? And then what are your dreams for it? It is a lifestyle website that I don't know. I just felt like when you think of, even like the stereotype what we were talking about, how I feel like I'm, you know, edited or portrayed on my show, that I feel like if you're, if you care about what you're eating and you want to eat organic and be healthy and take care

of yourself and, like, wellness is important to you. It was almost to me like you couldn't be all so sexy or cool. This lifestyle was kind of missing, I felt. So we've been having so much fun with it. I do it with two of my best friends from high school. And it's been really fulfilling. and I think there's a lot we could do with it. So we have a bunch of plans. And is the platform, is it an email, is it a newsletter? Is it a newsletter? We do have a newsletter that goes out.

It's a free site, which I had an application before. We all did all my sisters, but it was like you had to pay to get the content. So this is all free content. We've done some collabs last year with products that we were selling. on it. So it does have a shopping element. But it's mostly the content is what I'm

finding the most fulfilling. Fun. Ready? Let's do a speed round. One word to describe the other. Cool. You or me? You. Oh, okay. Okay. I was going to say kind. Kind and cool.

Funny. Which sibling do you fight with the most? Kim. Kendall. Do I like, I feel like I don't fight with anyone really. Maybe I'd say Kylie. For sure, Kylie. Okay. That makes fun. Yeah. Who has the better closet to raid? Probably Kendall. I'd say me too. What about everybody? Well, I can't really raid her stuff because her shoes are too small. Also, I do have a great vintage.

You do. You have really good vintage. I do have really good. You do? I want to come see both of your closets. Anytime. Who's more bossy? Me? Courtney. Maybe not anymore. Yeah. I get kind of bossy too. But I'm just a control freak. I just like. I think Kendall is.

I'm going to change my answer. Really? I'll take it. Which sister would you call to bail you out of jail? It doesn't have to be you guys. Chloe. Kim. Oh, good one.

Interesting. I would trust either of them though. But I think Kim right now. Really? I don't know. Chloe would, I feel like. I was going to say. And Cam is more like legal.

Professional. I was going to say, Chloe would probably find any way she could to be able to. Chloe would break you out of jail and Kim would go through the system. Chloe would dig a hole. Yeah.

Okay. Who is best at giving advice? It depends on what the advice is for. Guy advice, I think Chloe. But Chloe's this harsh, harsh advice. Chloe's super harsh when it comes to

relationship advice. Like there's no tolerance. If you want that harsh advice, if you want the kind of on your same level, I would talk to Kendall and then if I want like fashion advice I usually ask Kendall

or like if you really want to like what photo to post maybe a Kylie this is so funny she's pretty on point with it though Is it the same as you? Yeah I mean I think

relationship advice I'd say it does depend on what I'm going through because sometimes you're like okay this person I feel like could relate to this situation. But, like, I wouldn't go to Kim for relationship advice. I go to her sometimes if I need to be, like, an investigator. And she's the only one who's married, so we probably should. Well, now we need to have Kim and Chloe on so that we...

Kim's, like, the investigator, though. Like, I could call Kim if it's, like, the T, like, drama. Like, I'm like, ooh, I need to call Kim because she'll just, like, she'll vibe with me on the drama, because she just loves the tea. Um, but then, yeah, Chloe's super harsh, but I could call her to be like, what the fuck do I do? And she's like, okay, here's what you do. What about career advice? I would ask Kim. I go to Kim, yeah. Who's the worst at keeping secrets of all the guys?

Kim. Oh, really? Who's the most laid back? Kylie's pretty laid back. Because Kylie, like I said earlier, she's just kind of like, whatever's going to have, I'm going to have it. Kylie's very non-judgmental. If there was a stoner, who would it be? Kendall.

Kendall? I am a stoner. Really? Yeah, no one knows that. That's the first time I've ever really said anything out there. Who is better at making decisions? It's definitely not me. I was going to say, if you say yourself.

No, I'm super indecisive too. Probably. But I'm the worst. Chloe? Yeah, you're really indecisive. Chloe's probably like, we're going here. No, because Chloe doesn't really travel and stuff. Kim is, I would say, maybe the most.

Decisive, yeah. You guys should do, well, a show. Yeah, no, you guys should do a show. What? We should have a show. On Friday, I was packed with my passport in my hand. Suitcases in my trunk. I was going to drive to the airport to go with Kim and Kanye de Cabo for one night.

Walking out the door to my car, I saw Mason in the hallway. And I was like, okay, Mace, I'm leaving. Mommy's leaving. He's like, Mommy, don't go. And then I was like, you know what? I don't know it to anyone. I'm going to stay home. Like, I'm the worst.

Oh, my God. That's kind of how I am. cancel. I love that though. I hate plans. I hate making plans. I cannot commit to a plan. I am the biggest planner and I'm such a committer. But like this past New Year's, I had a real big just dilemma. And I was like, I was like losing my shit. I was like I am so indecisive right now. I'm losing my mind. I just need, like I can't even do this. And I have this. That was this. That was me this New Year's. That I was trying to teach Kendall where you kind of rock back and forth in your body and you say yes, yes, yes, no, no. And then you ask. And then you. ask the question. And then it either pushes you to yes or no. And so I do that when I can't decide. I did that for Cabo. Really? Let your body decide. Yeah. Who's the messiest if it's of you too? Of all you guys, who's the most rebellious? Chloe was. Yeah, Chloe was. It's so funny because

Katie Perry calls me the Patty Hurst of our family. So maybe. Maybe. Maybe it's me, I don't know. That's so funny. Fuck the Kardashian. Who's the funniest of all you guys? Who would you say? Kylie and Rob. Really?

I think Kylie and Rob. Oh, Rob. I think Rob is the funniest. I know. Rob's 100% the funniest. I think Chloe's the funniest sister. I definitely would not say Kylie. Really?

I think Kylie's so funny. But I guess it's, But I think she's funny just as a person, but I don't think she's trying to be funny. I think she's super witty. So is Kim, though. Kim's really witty. Who wins in a fight? Us two.

Physical? No. Oh, I don't know. Like, like, fight. Like, how are you, like, you're fighting. Like, who usually gets the last word? Who's like. Between us or amongst everyone?

Well, between you guys and then everybody. I don't know. Maybe me. I'm pretty stubborn. Yeah, but you also, like, you also kind of, at a certain point, you're like, why are we having this conversation? I got to go. You know what I mean? Like, you kind of, like, bow out. Aries are like pit bulls. We just, we like, I like to win. Yeah. When we, when we, when our jaw like clenches down, it's really hard to release.

Oh, yeah. Okay. Childhood crush. Did you have a childhood when you were a little like, oh my God. Leonardo DiCaprio. Leo? Is that still your crush? Because he's still hot. I think. Mine was Benny the Jet Rodriguez from the sandlot. Oh, my God. I swear to God, I had the biggest crush on him. That's amazing.

So we do this with everyone. So we'll start with Courtney. If you could have something that Kendall possesses, meaning about who she is, a quality of hers that you could take for your own, what would it be? I think her, like I'm getting there. but like her privacy, her real lack of not caring to share to, like, validate the moment. And then, I like that. And to alleviate from Kendall.

I think her, like, worry, her, like, she worries about things that, you know, ultimately probably aren't important. It's very true. I'm a huge stressor. I stress about everything. Okay. And no. So one thing I would. thing you would take from her that you wish you possessed a quality of some sort.

I think you're like cool and calm. Because like even if you do stress out about something, you're still just cool and calm. And I can't, I can't do that. I just like, I spiral. I think I'm going to record myself in a freak out so all of you guys can see that I really do freak out. Well, then I wish I could be as like, you know, like put it aside for like, because I can't put things aside. I'm very like if I'm freaking out I need to like stay home and freak out

I can't just like move on and then something I would alleviate from her maybe some of your insecurities I wish I could like a leave from you because you're a bad bitch thank you

I love that you're a bad bitch you're a bad bitch okay but then the last thing I would say is advice to people out there who have the patchwork families like ours like yours and you know

what's the glue? What would you say to people who sometimes struggle in those relationships? The glue is the love and just like... I was going to say the unconditional love.

Like it's, there's no... You know, we love each other no matter what, even if we fight, we would always have each other's backs. I think it's also just like understanding each other and knowing

that everyone has their own shit. Sorry, I don't know. No. That's true. But... It's being compassionate. Yeah, it is. And just like, you know.

And forgiveness. Totally. I think all of that just. Yay. Yay. Thank you guys so much. Thank you for having us. Sibling Revelry is executive produced by Kate Hudson and Oliver Hudson.

Producer is Alison Bresnik. Editor is Josh Windish. Music by Mark Hudson, aka Uncle Mark. It's important that we just reassure people that they're not alone, and there is help out there. The Good Stuff podcast, Season 2, takes a deep look into One Tribe Foundation, a non-profit fighting suicide in the veteran community. September is National Suicide Prevention Month, so join host Jacob and Ashley Schick as they bring you to the front lines of One Tribe's mission. One Tribe saved my life twice. Welcome to Season 2 of The Good Stuff.

Listen to the Good Stuff podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. The Super Secret Bestie Club podcast season four is here. And we're locked in. That means more juicy chisement. Terrible love advice. Evil spells to cast on your ex. No, no, no, we're not doing that this season. Oh.

Well, this season, we're leveling up. Each episode will feature a special bestie, and you're not going to want to miss it. My name is Curley. And I'm Maya. Get in here. Listen to the Super Secret Bestie Club on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Do we really need another podcast with a condescending finance brof trying to tell us how to spend our own money? No thank you.

Instead, check out Brown Ambition. Each week, I, your host, Mandy Money, gives you real talk, real advice with a heavy dose of I feel uses. Like on Fridays when I take your questions for the BAQA. Whether you're trying to invest for your future, navigate a toxic workplace, I got you. Listen to Brown Ambition on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. This is an IHeart podcast.