Sibling Revelry with Kate Hudson and Oliver Hudson - Paris Hilton and Nicky Hilton Rothschild

Episode Date: January 13, 2021

This week, Kate and Oliver talk to Paris and Nicky Hilton. They discuss "This Is Paris” and how opening up about Paris' past has led to healing. They also talk about their sister bond, which Paris describes as "close as f*ck”, the extensive list of pets they had growing up, and much more.Executive Producers: Kate Hudson and Oliver HudsonProduced by Allison BresnickEdited by Josh WindischMusic by Mark HudsonThis show is powered by Simplecast.This episode is sponsored by Super Coffee, Article, and Helix.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an IHeart podcast. September is a great time to travel, especially because it's my birthday in September, especially internationally. Because in the past, we've stayed in some pretty awesome Airbnbs in Europe. Did we've one in France, we've one in Greece,

we've actually won in Italy a couple of years ago. Anyway, it just made our trip feel extra special. So if you're heading out this month, consider hosting your home on Airbnb with the co-host feature you can hire someone local to help manage everything. Find a co-host at Airbnb.ca slash host. I'm Jorge Ramos. And I'm Paola Ramos.

Together we're launching The Moment, a new podcast about what it means to live through a time, as uncertain as this one. We sit down with politicians, artists, and activists to bring you death and analysis from a unique Latino perspective. The Moment is a space for the conversations we've been having us father and daughter for years. Listen to The Moment with Jorge Ramos and Paola Ramos

on the IHeart Radio app, podcast or wherever you get your podcasts. Introducing IVF Disrupted, the Kind Body Story, a podcast about a company that promised to revolutionize fertility care. It grew like a tech startup. While Kind Body did help women start families, it also left behind a stream of disillusioned and angry patients. You think you're finally like in the right hands.

You're just not. Listen to IVF Disrupted, the Kind Body Story on the IHeart Radio app, Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Kate Hudson. And my name is Oliver Hudson. We wanted to do something that highlighted our relationship. And what it's like to be siblings. We are a sibling rivalry.

No, no. Sibling rivalry. Don't do that with your mouth. Sibling, Reveory. That's good. Oliver. This is a fun episode. Enjoy.

No? We both literally watched the Paris Hilton documentary before we did this interview. Yeah. So right off the heels of doing that. fresh it's crazy we interview them and i was really i was sort of like paris it's like like a woman she's like an adult i mean something shifted for sure no i mean when you watch it you definitely get a different perspective you do 100% and then even talking to her today you can feel a shift yeah she's just chilled out yeah she's chilled out

and then we've known them for a long time i used to live next door to nays And it was just fun to sort of connect and catch up. You still talk to Paris. Yeah, I see them. I went to Abisa a couple years back and spent some time. You know, of course, she spends summers there. She has like a standing gig. And I remember I went to Abis.

It's actually kind of what's happening. It's Joey. Tell Joey, we're busy. This is, Joey. Joey. Joey, we're busy. We're trying to do our podcast. Joey. Yeah. We're doing the podcast right now.

Are you okay? I love you. I miss you, Joey. I know, but dude, you text me, you're a with eggplants, you know? Could you always write. Call me back immediately. What the fuck is wrong with you? Oh, so you do that to Joey. No, I don't. No, he called me last night. I didn't answer the phone. I was having a romantic night with my wife. and then now today he says you know sends me saying that I'm a shit

well you are a and I had the same romantic night with your wife a few months ago I'll call you later I love him so much okay enjoy no no

enjoy like a question mark at the end Was that 2015? No, 2014? No. There's nothing else I need to say. What do you mean? Meaning we've just said a lot in this intro. It was a great interview.

You're going to hear it in about 38 seconds. Paris and Nikki Hilton. Enjoy. That's it. I loved having the conversation with them after... Oh, okay. After... hold on we did it year was was it 17 that's good 2000 right 15 when did I meet

Danny let it speak for itself 2014 we can't tell everyone everything yeah just 2014 you know they basically say everything was it Jim I think the interview oh look there's so why do we need to do an intro look there's me look at Look at this. We just introduced them quickly, three, four minutes, and then boom, they're in. Wait, that's Christmas. Kay just wants to do our intro. Okay, let's do the ads while I'm trying to find these pictures.

Enjoy. We've known each other a really long time. Well, we were just saying Nikki and I used to live on Norma Place. We were neighbors. We were neighbors. Yeah. The wrecked next store. Back when L.A. was fun.

I know. Back when L.A. was fun. We were talking about how, like, what would it feel like to be in a club after a year and a half? But you haven't even been in a club forever. No, I'm like 80 children. You know, I'm far from a club. But I want to go, though. But we started saying, like, we forgot what it's like to actually have fun in somewhere,

which I would think Paris, for you, especially right now, for this whole year. year has actually been either refreshing or bizarre. It's definitely been a change of pace for sure, but I'm actually over the club scene, which I'm so happy because I would have been having the worst FOMO and like been dying usually big to like this things. But now that there's been nothing, I like realize like I don't need to be everywhere and like I'm actually sick of going out and I'm an amazing relationship. So I don't really want to go out to the clubs anymore.

so it's actually the perfect timing for this. Nikki, what has it been like for you? I mean, you have, how many kids do you have now? Two? I have two little girls. Two girls. And how old are they? Three and four.

Three, oh my gosh. So you went one, two, like right away. Was that planned or was? No, it wasn't planned, but I'm happy. I did it that way. Like just to get banged two out fast. It's been good. I mean, both of my girls are full time back in school,

which I am so great for. Do you guys get to see each other? Not as much as we used to, but we were, we got to hang out for Christmas, which was fun. But we used to see each other every few weeks. And with the world coming to a halt and traveling coming to a halt, it's not as much as I'd like. How many years apart are you guys, two? Two. Yeah, two and a half years.

How many siblings are there? There's four boys. Two boys, two girls. I'm two younger brothers. What was that? How were the boys? I mean, was it... Where are the boys? Where are they? Where are the boys? The boys are in L.A. Yeah.

My brother, Barron, just had a baby, and he's working with my dad's real estate company. And then I have a younger brother, and he's working in tech and on some apps. Yeah, the boys kind of, like, sort of skirted the spotlight a bit. I think you guys were definitely took that position. We'd be both just recently watched the documentary. So the thing that I really appreciated was that you didn't hold back, especially Paris you talking about, mom wanted you to be a Hilton and not necessarily Paris.

And Nikki, the one thing we didn't get in that was what your relationship to that was when you were little. Did you feel similarly growing up? A little bit, but maybe not as much as Harris did, clearly. What was it like growing up? I mean, just as far as Nikki, the boys, you, just from the beginning. Amazing home life. We're all very close. Our parents have been together since my mom was 15.

Yes, we had a wonderful, wonderful childhood, all super, super close. My mom and her sisters and their children, our cousins, we were like, Our cousins are like our sisters. We were all best friends, amazing childhood, close. And then we moved to New York. And that's where it all started to change. Before that, living in L.A., was very sheltered, not allowed to do anything, not allowed to go anywhere, not allowed to go on a date, wear makeup, nothing.

They were super strict. Very strict. And then moving to New York, it was like this whole new world opened up. And I was like, my sister and I invited to all these parties. I was going to clubs. I was sneaking out, and my parents just got so scared, and that's why they sent me away. It wasn't like I was having problems or anything like that. It was just...

It was their own fear, essentially. It was their own fear, right? I mean, they were almost projecting their own insecurities and fears onto you and saying, oh, fuck, she needs to go away, when in reality, yeah, you were going out and partying like we all were, but you weren't really causing trouble. You were sneaking out. You were being a little naughty. Let's not...

No, I know, but sneaking, I was going to say. But sneaking out, everyone sneaks out, you know? Everyone, but maybe I snuck out once, and I was so scared that I snuck back in immediately. Well, Nikki, when this was going on, though, were you a part, when Paris was going out in New York, when you went from shelter to freedom, were you a part of that, or did you, were you hesitant? I was hesitant, and I was also really young. Paris was... That's true. 16, I'm like 13.

Yeah. I didn't join her until a few years later. But I was the typical little sister, and I was listening on the phone, and I was telling on her. You were a tattletale? Eating her diary. You were a tattel. The biggest tattletale ever. Oh, my God.

But you're the reason I got sent away. Thank you. How old were you when you went to New York? I'm going to say 12.13-ish. And we, for whatever reason, started in our later teens getting a lot of attention. And keep in mind, this is not attention we were asking for. There was no publicist. There was no manager. There was no agent. It just sort of happened. We were these two girls. People knew we were living at the Waldorf Towers. And invites started coming and racks of clothes and we were just sort of invited to all these fun parties and places and meeting people and sort of became the Hilton sisters without even knowing it. Why do you think your mom was so strict in L.A.? I think she was so strict with Paris. Paris was her first born. You know, it's the first born, I feel like a sort of trial and error. You don't know what. you're doing and 19 when she had me she was a kid herself so i think yeah yeah i mean 19 years old oh i know do you think that because she was so strict it was it made you sort of rebel a little bit more meaning if she opened the world up to you in l.a a little bit and was like yeah look you're you're

a young girl and you know go experience a few things and you can wear a little makeup here and there i mean do you think that things would be different i do believe that i think that things would be different i do believe that. I think when you are very strict like my mother was, it just makes you want to rebel. And that's why when I have a daughter one day, I'm going to want to be very strict, because I'm going to be very scared, but I'm going to know that I can't be because then the same thing can happen. I mean, it's human nature. You want what you can't have. Yes. Keep being told, no, no, no. We always had the earliest curfew. In Paris didn't like that. Yeah. So she would sneak out. I talk about it in the film. It was. It was.

one point when we were at the wall door, Paris was so out of control. Like, she just would not listen that my mother resorted to locking her in her bedroom with the key, and she would call the hotel to shut the phone lines off. Because if you locked her in the room, then she would be on the phone all night. Then she started stealing my dad's cell phone. And this is when cell phones were like $2 a minute. Yeah. He started getting these phone bills for thousands of dollars a week. Harris was just ringing up the phone.

And then I found a key and made a copy and had my friends get me out at night. Then the sicko started breaking out of getting locked in. I remember the key was in that long cabinet outside your door in the top drawer. And you would give people the hotel key. who god knows who and they would come in they would get the key but blah blah lock it up and go out and then come back in see that's that's that's resourceful that is why paris you're probably even as successful as you are

it's figuring shit out right we i talk about this all the time yeah it's like okay how do i get out of this situation and not get caught the problem with you was that you always got caught no only a couple No, like pretty much every time. No. I'm surprised our parents never sent you to like outward bound or something. I got threatened with military school. So many of the kids we grew up with and that our parents are friends with, their kids were at these places with Paris. Yeah.

Really? I'm surprised Ollie wasn't there. Yeah. So, but let me ask you a question. Why? First of all, do you, why do you think that you were even sent there? Was it was it that bad? or do you think that mom and dad just couldn't deal with it anymore?

It wasn't. They had no idea what type of place it was. Somebody had recommended it. And my parents just thought it was a normal boarding school. They just wanted me out of New York City. They wanted me like in Utah or just somewhere far away from New York. And, you know, that was the options that they were given. But they had no idea just how abusive these places are.

And, you know, just how it was like a living nightmare every single day. And they didn't know until my documentary when I talked about it Because I just never spoke about it to anyone ever Didn't you ever have any resentment you know Towards your mother you know just being like holy shit I mean do you realize what I've been through or what I went through I did when I was there But I knew that they had no idea what was happening inside

And if I said it no one would believe me And I think that happens with a lot of kids who have been in these places that no one is going to believe them. But this idea, when you described getting pulled out of your bedroom in the middle of the night and your parents are there crying, watching that happen, that's so fucking gnarly. Because I imagined, I have three kids, I imagined myself, you know, in that position. I don't even know how I could ever do that. I mean, that's so crazy.

Did they ever apologize to you ever? we talked about it recently like after the film came out yeah they just in shock and just so upset and couldn't believe what had happened so they said I'm so sorry like if we had ever known this there's no way we would ever send you there

but they just they had no idea so I don't blame them because it's not their fault it's these places and I think they try to make the children who go there be ashamed but the only people that should be ashamed are them and that's why I've really

and working hard and putting together just this whole force of people and to shut down this industry and really change it. And Nikki, when this was, when Paris was gone, what were you doing? What were your feelings about it? You know, how did you respond or react to all of it? Like I said before, I was always like listening and eavesdropping. I was like a little detective in my house. So I was listening and outside my parents' door and I knew something was going down.

and it was going down soon. And I remember that night. And I remember the screaming coming from her room and getting ready for school the next day and she was not there. And I said, where is she? And they're like she went to boarding school. But I knew something was up.

And that's the story that we went with. When at school, my classmates would say, where's Paris? Blah, blah, blah. Oh, she went to boarding school. Yeah, but being dragged out of your room in the middle of the night is not going to boarding school. I mean, that's really traumatizing. I mean, no wonder you've had nightmares like this your whole life.

I mean, that's like, I don't even know. By the way, how are those nightmares now? I don't have them anymore, but I used to have them literally every single night since I was a teenager. But I think after talking about it and releasing it. that helped heal me in some way. So, you know, I wasn't planning on even ever telling anyone this in the film. That was never supposed to be the premise of the film whatsoever.

But I'm so grateful that I did because I feel like this has been the most healing, therapeutic experience I've ever went through in my life. I put a weight off your shoulders. Oh, God. Well, you can feel it. It's always been this dirty secret of yours. And now, because I remember anonymous people

would reach out to me, or even you on social media and be like I was with Paris at Cascade or these other at Provo Canyon and I'm going to sell a story and now that you've put it out there it's like no one no one can threaten you and who were these people like they need to be held accountable for these things is this place still in operation yeah there's still an operation that the abuse is still happening and the people who work there are not qualified, like nobody really has a license, they're not trained therapist. It just really attracts very sadistic people who have power trips, who are pedophiles, who are abusive, and who really get off on abusing children and that power that they can have

over someone. So it's just the people who work there are, it's unregulated, there's no rules. You have, there's no laws, especially in Utah for children. They have no human. They have no human rights so you know it's it's it's really fucked up how how you would think that after this doc came out and there's been a bit of an outpouring and there's been some exposure that they wouldn't be invest they would not be investigated or shut down i mean obviously have they made a statement coming back at you guys they made a statement saying that there's new management since since i left and that that that doesn't happen anymore. But I've spoken to people who just got pulled out of there

as recently as the parents watching my film. And there's been so many kids who have been pulled out of there and they all said the abuse there is even worse now. And they're even letting children in as young as seven years old. And now it's started an entire movement. And they are being investigated and a lot of things are happening. So I'm going to be going to Washington, D.C. in the next few months and we're pushing legislation and working senators.

So they are being held accountable. and they're going to be going down. What an amazing outcome for you. It's like the healing aspect of it is that you're going to be, you know, just you talking about it is going to save so many kids what you and many others have gone through.

Isn't it amazing though what happens when you just tell yourself the truth and you really go through that shit? You know, I mean, obviously I can't have no comparison to what you went through, but we all hold things in. And once we expose them and let them out.

First of all, we realize it's not that bad to let it out. And then just the healing process and how it begins is pretty fucking amazing. Especially women. When you start thinking about the statistics, like women, we hide a lot, you know, because you're sort of like there is a lot of shame. For some reason, you end up feeling shame. Like you did something to deserve that or that, you know, it was your fault. in some way.

When you started the doc, what was the point of it? If this is what came out of it and it was unexpected, was it just to sort of say, look, there's been a misperception of me all my life. And now I want people to know who I am for real, you know? And then this is just a byproduct of it. Yeah, basically, I just was, you know, sick of the way people were speaking about me. I thought that there was so many misconceptions. I didn't want that to be the way I was remember,

or my legacy to my whole life. I wanted just to show who I am and my business and what I've achieved. And then after like seven months of shooting, that's when it just like, I just started becoming so close with the director and finally like started talking about it and she kept pushing me.

Like I'm saying, I don't want this to be public and she said it needs to be and basically made me talk about it. Wow. So it was hard. She had to push me a lot. Yeah. Good for her.

It must have been really, and it must be challenging to hold something up for so long like that. You know, I remember sitting with you in a B-Set dinner one time and we were talking and you were talking like you normally talk and we were having a conversation and then someone came over and you went, hi, and you put on your voice and I was like, it was the first time it hit me like, oh my God, she,

it's like instinct. It's like it's like ingrained in you to turn on, you know. And I remember walking away from that, you know, that trip. And I'm like, wow, there's so much, there's so much misconception about you. I wonder if you take any, how much responsibility you take for that. I've always been in on the joke. I've known exactly what I was doing. And I think that all stemmed just from the childhood trauma where I didn't want to think about it at all.

so I kind of invented this like fantasy character so I could just live in that bubble in that world and not have to think about anything bad. And then after, you know, then getting the simple life and having to play that character and then, you know, for years and years, and then I just kind of got stuck with it

where it was almost like a mask where when I would be shy or uncomfortable, I would just put on this voice and be this other person and then I would not have to think about anything else. And then I just got kind of used to it. But now I speak in my normal, normal voice. Sometimes it is ingrained in me, so I will go a little bit higher. Like I'm

around some I don't know or if I'm feeling a little bit uncomfortable. But for the most part, I'm like myself now. You know, as funny is even watching the documentary, you can see, and I know you cut around and stuff. It's not perfectly linear, but for the most part it is, but in the beginning, you can see how you have even transformed through the documentary with a camera being on you, that first shot where you're walking in, you know, and you're like, wait a minute, like, you know, what the fuck? Am I on a runway here? You're like, I don't know how to act myself when there's a camera, but then you see that totally disappear. It feels like, Nikki, you're very grounding and hold her kind of, try to hold her truthful,

right? Paris doesn't trust anyone in the world. Paris is beyond paranoid, thinks everyone is lying and out to get her and stealing from her. And I think I definitely am a voice of reason for her sometimes. I kind of tell her how it is. Like I said in the film, Paris does have a lot of yes people around her and kiss asses. And I tell her the truth. That's so great about siblings. And I'm sure you guys can attest to that, that you have a built-in best friend.

There's no bond like a sibling. And it always bums me out when I see siblings who aren't super tight because I don't know anything different. I'm so close with my sister and my brothers. And that's just how we were raised. Blood is thicker than water. And you trust your sister to tell you the truth, Paris. Yes. Yes.

I trust Nikki more than anything. I feel so grateful to have her in my life. I don't know where I would be without her. and she's just, oh, I could tell her anything. She's always there for me, gives me advice. She's protective of me. She tells me, you know, when certain friends or boyfriends, like, I shouldn't be with them or, like, I should get rid of them.

She just always knows. And even though she's my little sister, I've always thought of her and, like, looked up to her, like, a big sister. Even though you can tell on me, I still love you. She still says it to this day. If she tells me something she doesn't want my mom knowing, she's like, don't tell. Mom. We have to promise you won't tell Mom. Oh, I think that happens all the time in all, in families. It's like, just let, let, let

Kate tell you. I'm like, okay. I'll let her tell you. I'm like, I'll let her tell me. And then you just say, did Mom, did Mom? No, then Kate calls me and she goes, did Mom tell you that this happened? I'm like, uh, no. I know these guys. You do? Yeah. They're three brothers. Okay.

They were on Shark Tank. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I watch Shark Tank religiously. Yes. And I remember their episode. You do? Yes, I remember their episode. I remember them getting their deal and the whole shebangle.

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And the reason that that is even possible, they can keep their prices low. Article, they keep their prices low because they cut out the middleman and they sell directly to you. So there's no showrooms, there's no salespeople. There's no markups.

So the quality is there, but the price is just better. Yes. And you save like a, you save over 30% basically. Yeah. From traditional retail prices. Affordable free shipping over $999. That's right.

And that's across the USA. That's across Canada. All in, this is what I love, because I am an Ares and I like it fast. Ooh. Danny? No, not like that. I like things to happen. I'm impatient.

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Where did you go to school again? Did you go to Buckley? Mm-hmm. I was Buckley from, like, kindergarten, which I don't remember when it was, till 6th grade. Yeah. And then I think I got kicked out.

What did you get kicked out for? Your skirt was too short. Yeah, I got in trouble about the skirt, so I would, like, roll it up really short. Harrison McCleach, he would walk around Butley. Buckley with their butts out. I'm going to go back to when you come back to Los Angeles because you went to New York, you went through that process,

and then you went back to L.A., right? And that was like what? You were like 18, 19? 18. From my perspective at that age, you loved a party. You were out every night. You were in the scene. You remember.

Sure. I was there. You're out every night, too. I remember. But it was, I mean, if I look back now, I mean, yes, now it's like I long for those days when there was no cell phones in a club. I mean, it was so fun. Think about how much fun we had. No, I know. I mean. But at the same time, if I was a parent, you know, that would be. I mean, when I was 16.

I'd be worried. I was 16, we don't have to go into my whole story, but like I was out with Melanie and it was crazy. I mean, I was doing crazy, crazy, crazy things. We survived it. This is part of what it is to grow up, I think. You know, I mean, I think at some point you have to put trust in your kids and let them go and hopefully they fucking survive. And by the way, right now, we have cell phones. We have GPS trackers. Back then, we had nothing. So it was like, so. So I was so fun. Yeah. No one could find you. It was amazing. Social media killed the fun, especially no way. Yeah, it killed the nightlife.

It really did, you know? It's brutal. I know. But, I mean, I could understand why a mother would be nervous, you know. But, I mean, were you that bad? This is, because I don't remember you being, I mean, you were a party girl, but were you that crazy? You weren't into drugs and fucking and out of your, out of your mind.

I was just having fun. I think from being locked up, I've missed out on a lot in life. And I just, like, came out and just, like, I just want to have the best time of my life and, like, live it on. And I was addicted to, like, going out and just getting dressed up and just, like, every single night there was something happening. And it was just so much fun that I just couldn't help myself. This was something that you created to protect yourself. You know, you had lived this insane life up to that point. You get out.

You've been fucked up, and now it's like, okay, I need to be somebody else because I can't be me. Me is horrible. Me is damaged. And I'm going to create this persona so I can be happy and live in that bubble, as you explained it, right? Exactly right. Well, that's happening, Nikki. In your mind, are you going, this is destructive? Or are you going, I trust my sister?

Or are you going, this is concerning? Like, what are you feeling is that sort of escalates? to go escalate. Well, at that point, I'm in high school in New York. So we don't have social media and whatever like we do today. So I wouldn't really hear about what was going on in L.A. But I would visit L.A. for Christmas break or spring break. And she would sometimes take me out with her. I remember Paris when you took me out to Dublin's with you. eye liner on me. Pantera Sarah's at the door.

She put all the sidear on me, big sunglasses and a cigarette in my hand. She's like, you have to smoke in line because it'll make you look older. So I got a glimpse of the going out and seeing all the celebrities out and the wild after party.

But no one was doing anything bad. People were just having fun. I never saw. Yeah. the dark stuff. You're crazy. I didn't see the dark stuff. Yeah. Nicky, were you ever envious of Paris's success and fame and celebrity? Ollie loves this question. He loves it. Oh, it's a very, very fair question, having such a famous sibling. I mean, look, I go through it still to this day, so are you, you know. Yeah. No, the answer is no. I was

always very proud of her and we were raised with that whole mentality that a feather in your cap's a feather in mine and no see and it also helps that we had such different goals aspiration taste like we had completely different taste in boys paris liked like pretty male models and I like, God knows what. We always had very different style. Paris was like pink and sparkles and Barbie. And I would say I was a little more like classic and refined. So we didn't fight over boys or clothes, which is what most sisters fight over.

So what would you fight? What did you fight over? Like what were your big fight? What is your, what is your, what are your disagreements? If you were to pinpoint that thing, you're like, oh, God. well back then or today oh both Paris is one of the most

tardy unresponsive rude people I've ever mad I'm not rude or I'm like a flake lazy she's so flaky she will not reply and people

like important people or business people like I'm trying to do this huge deal with Paris and she won't return my email or call And she just, she's the worst with communication. So that's a big fight. Still to this day. Keep them wanting more.

You keep them wanting more. They're always going to want you. That's what Kurt says. Let them want more. Don't even tell her that. That's so funny. But what else do we fight over? It's mostly me being late.

Like if we're supposed to meet somewhere and I'm late, which I always like to be fucking mental. It's just, I think it's so. rude. How late are we talking? Like, how late? Oh, so let's say, like, Christmas dinner is at 8 o'clock. Okay. We all know to lie to her and tell her 6.30 or 6. Okay? Two hours. Well, it's like your wife. She'll walk in it at 9.30. She's just so rude. So wait, I want to get into this. I know it's such minutious stuff, but like, why, because my wife is late, right? And I always, like, well, I don't know, get it.

Like, do you just, and I'm asking you this, Paris, like, do you know that it's 630 and you look at the clock and you're like, yeah, fuck it, I'm still doing my thing? Like, what, what is it? I think because I have very bad ADD, so I just get distracted or if like something's happening, like, I'll start doing something else. And then I won't look at the clock and then I'm like getting ready and then I just, I'm getting distracted again. So it's just like that.

So you're actually, it's not your fault. I totally get that. Yeah. So you basically... I'm not the same way, by the way. She'll also be two hours late. They cannot be on time. You know what?

I'm not diso. I'm not two hours, but like I'm always... My thing, I feel like it's karma because I could be 30 minutes early and somehow still end up being 30 minutes late. Like, I don't know how I can be ready to go, but then I'm leaving. And then it's like, I forgot my key. And then I forgot to do this. And then I go back in and I'm like, oh, look at this.

Whatever. There's always something. So I kind of understand. So basically you're saying... I'm a 10 minute early. I just, I can't. I'm allergic to being late. I find it such a sign of disrespect.

Even today with Paris, I texted her before. I said, we cannot be late. These are two working people. They have children. They have shit to do. Don't be late. I talk to her like she's my daughter. But it's not Paris's fault because she just loses track of time.

That's all. Not late. She's not doing it on purpose. You understand me. Um, I actually have a question going back to the documentary really quick because when I was watching it, this is what I thought. You said that you got out of this place and it kind of lit a fire under you, meaning you're like, I'm going to prove my worth. I'm, I'm setting off on this path. With that in mind, would you change anything in your life? Because essentially that is what led you to where you are right now. Yeah, I think about that a lot. Because I'm like, if I did not go through that hell, like, I don't know if I would be the businesswoman I am today or have that drive because who knows. But being in there, I literally was like, I'm going to just be worked so hard, become so successful. No one will ever control me again.

And I've also felt like it was a big fuck you to all the people who work there who just always were talking down on me. I was like, I want to prove them wrong. And I just gave me that drive. So I don't know where I would be today if I hadn't went through that. I wouldn't wish that upon anyone who is hell. But I feel that everything does happen in life for a reason and the fact that I'm taking that pain and now making a difference and using it to really help other children.

Maybe I was meant to go there so I could be the one to put an end to it. I don't know. Mom, always says all of the good, all of the bad, you know, brings you exactly where you are today, where you're meant to be. Yeah. And what's your relationship like with your dad? I mean, do you guys still, you have a good, good relationship with your father, both you girls?

Yeah, very good. Yeah. Yeah, very good. For you guys, what has his point of view on everything, like life choices in terms of, you know, things that you do? Does he have opinions on it or is he just sort of there to support you guys? No, my dad has instilled a very strong work ethic in both of us, I think. At a young age, he told us you have to get a job.

and you can't just ride on your family name. You've got to show your worth and make something out of yourself. And we just always had that in mind. I mean, I got my first job at 14. Where'd you work? I worked at a magazine. And I would sort of do everything from taking the trash out, taking lunch orders, shipping out the magazines to advertisers, just like all of the books.

brutal jobs. You said it in the documentary, your sister, Nikki, you said she never takes a vacation. You can't turn down a paycheck. I mean, where do you think that that stems from? I think from just the way I was brought up to what I went through, I just always knew that I never wanted to depend on a man. I always wanted to be in control and be the boss and not ever have to ask for anything. So I think just being raised in a way like that. just wanting, I don't know, I've always wanted to be an independent woman and just never have to ever be one of those girls. I feel like in L.A., a lot of girls are trained to be like

almost like these gold diggers who they have no like aspirations in life. All they look for is a rich husband. And that's not the way we are raised. I always just wanted me to be, I guess, the one. Do you think after doing this documentary going through this catharsis of sorts that you are now able to sort of be loved and love much more and deeper and be more vulnerable when it comes to relationships? Definitely. This is the first time in my life where I've been with my boyfriend now for over a year and this is the first time I've opened up my heart because I never did before. I never really loved anyone before because I didn't even know who I was and I was just so had this huge wall around my heart and now like the wall is down and I'm just I feel like the happiest person in the

what does that feel like I know it's sort of a bigger question esoteric but like what is it to open up your heart I mean what is that how does that translate meaning you're are you able to receive love better more yeah this is just the first time where I can really just be myself and I feel safe and I feel at home and just like floating on air because I other relationships, I've always just been so scared and always thought that they were cheating on me or just not trusting and not opening my heart where I almost like hated them all the time because I just thought bad things were happening or they were. And then this relationship has just been like perfect since our first day. And I don't know, I feel like it was just meant to be.

Good for you. Yeah. And Nikki, let's talk about your marriage and children. You met how you guys have been together a second now, haven't you? It's been almost 10 years. Nice. Well, what was it when you met your husband, now husband? What was like, did you know right away that that was, you're like, oh, I'm going to marry this guy? I mean, it was definitely, I know it sounds cliche. It was a love at first sight thing. Harris was standing there right with me. You were nearly 10 years ago at a wedding in Rome. And it was after the reception. And Paris was talking with some guy who James was friends with and he came over and he introduced himself. And I had just gone out of a serious relationship.

Paris did too. So we were like wanting to see cute boys. And we didn't see many at this wedding, but then he walked over and it was just like, whoa. But I was living in L.A. at the time, he was living in London. So it was very, very long distance, and we would occasionally meet up in New York halfway. And we did that for like a year. And then we both decided to move back to New York together. And then we had like a year engagement.

And then, yeah, we just celebrated our fifth wedding anniversary over the summer. And Paris, do you look up to your sister when it comes to that, meaning like you look at that as a successful relationship? and it's a beautiful one that you would want to emulate? Definitely. I feel, you know, just looking at Nikki, her family, her beautiful daughters, I love spending time with them. And I'm always, it makes me kind of sad. Like, I wish that I had that.

But now I know that I will have it soon. Are we going to have kids? Are we having children? Yes, definitely. I want to, like, next year. Ooh. Yeah. Fine.

It's a lot. It's a lot, but it's the best. Do you think that after this documentary that you guys, like, did you feel a difference in your relationship and closeness? Like we've always been just, like, we're like one. I don't know, like we've always been so close. But I think, you know, just talking about certain things, like Nikki had no idea of what I went through as well.

So I think that made us feel closer in a way because she understood me more and what I've been through. But we've always been so close. I don't even know how we could even get any closer. I don't have, like, we literally speak 10 times today. Have you noticed a different reaction from the public, meaning just more of an understanding? For sure.

Before I was about to come out, I was like, oh, my God, like, how are people going to react that people aren't going to think I'm insane? And just when it came out, like, the amount of, like, love and support and just people writing new letters and people I see on the street, just so many calls and people just, really just being so kind to me and understanding me, and I just felt so happy to just finally, I don't know, have people understand me and just really get why I'm the way I am.

But are you still going after the billion, or is that, are you done with that? I think that was just such, like, a drive for me because I wasn't focused on my personal life. I only cared about that just to, like, hide from my personal life. But now I'm just so happy where I am that it's not the focus anymore. Like, I care more about having babies than I do about a billion. This is so great. A different B, different kind of B. A different.

You should do a book from billions to babies. From billions to babies. That's cute. I like that. That's cute. That's so cute. 250 days a year that you travel to lockdown, COVID. What does it feel like to not have?

to go show up to an event and not have to like, I mean, I was watching in the documentary and I can relate where like you're taking pictures with people and they're holding you and they're touching you and you're constantly being held and you want to make people happy, right? It's like you want to make them feel good. But then when you leave, you kind of feel like everybody's touching you. Yeah, you feel like a zoo animal almost like a zoo. I don't know. How does it feel for you to not have to do that any right now? I mean, does it change the way you see the future? Definitely.

Like, of course, I love my fans. Like, they're very sweet. But then there are those weirdos that, like, it's kind of just, like, draining. Because you feel like there's, like, these energy vampires around some people. And it's a lot. So the fact that I haven't had to do that in a year has been just so refreshing. And, you know, for the future, I really want to, you know, step back from a lot of that and not travel anymore because I don't need to.

Well, you know, as your, as your psychologist, I feel like, I feel like, you know, it's almost like you don't need, you love your fans, but you don't need their adoration as much as you did because you found something else, you know, you found something else within yourself and then your man, you know, so it's, you don't need them, you love them, but you don't need them anymore, you know. Yeah, I also don't need to travel like that anymore. It's just way too much. Oh, I had anxiety watching. The whole of the documentary.

With Zoom, you don't need to go. Right. Yeah, it's amazing. Oh, even you dealing with your clothes, like, it gave me anxiety. I was like, oh, my God, it started to feel like a little nauseous. I'm like, how do you even exist? There's clothes everywhere and what you're going to wear. And like, oh, my God, I need sunglasses and purses.

I'm like, holy fuck. I had almost near panic attack You would have a panic attack if you walked into her house I nearly did the other day This is also coming from someone who like lives in a hoarding house Like there's so much shit in Oliver's house Oliver I'm not a hoarder at all

Ollie If you okay so we went traveling together one time I've been trying to get them to Europe Oliver like never leaves I finally got them to Europe We went to Greece. We're on the plane together, and they brought their entire life onto this airplane. There was like blow up mattresses on like Lufthansa and like snacks, like three bags of snacks.

And like they hoard everywhere they go. My wife is prepared for anything and everything. If the plane goes down. Yeah. She's prepared. If the plane goes down over the ocean, she has a life raft. She's got parkas in case we're over the Andes or something We could be in Hawaii and she's got something just in case there's a snowstorm

I mean but I will say this it does come in handy Sometimes someone will say hey do you have like a buttermilk biscuit for my kid She goes oh yeah I've got one right here pulls one out of her purse Yeah it's literally you I mean she's got everything It's so true it's so true But, yeah, no, I actually, see, as a girl, I got excited about the closet and the racks of pretty rinds. No, but her leaving and the thing and the people running around and it's like 8,000 outfits and I've never worn the same thing twice.

Well, never wearing the same thing twice. I don't know how. That's so hard. Nikki, can you use that for yourself if you ever worn the same thing twice? Yes. I wear the same thing all the time. But you do, too, Paris. I mean, maybe just publicly.

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I think you went too fast it's helix sleep dot com slash sibling okay okay when you guys were let's say early 20s

was there a goal like what was like I guess separately you know Nikki did you have a goal in mind of like this is what I want to do this is what my future I want my future to look like um I always I mean my parents have such an amazing template of marriage it's almost too good it's like crazy they've been married over 40 years so I always knew I wanted to be married and have children um and I've always loved working

in design so the goal was to always be doing something in that space and I have been since I'm 16 years old. And it's something that I really enjoy and have fun doing. Do you ever like to do design for interiors? Like I'm looking at your house. I can see behind you that it looks nicely. You know, that's my husband's forte. He is such a brilliant eye and he loves interior design. What is that, is that like, what is it called? Like, Roller Rabbit? Roberta Roller Rabbit. Yeah, that looks like the shade behind there. Oh, Oliver. I know. See? I know a few things.

Okay, Ollie. Are you going to be strict with your girls, do you think? Like your parents were? I'm quite strict, but not like psycho. I let my kids watch TV. I let them have sweets. I mean, not all the time. I think everything in moderation.

Right, right. That is one of my slogans of life. Me too. Balance. I can get too excessive. I mean, I am a Libra, and that is, that's my sign, balance. Yeah, me too. But everything in moderation. Everything. Yeah, that's awesome. You and I. Everything in moderation. Yeah. Moderation is never your word. What do you mean? I'm so balanced. Are you crazy?

What sign are you? I'm September. No, I'm a Virgo, but no, I've done my chart. I've done my chart and a million times and everyone says you're way more Libra than you are Virgo. What are you, Kate? That makes sense. I'm an Aries. What are you, Paris? Aquarius. Oh.

I have a feeling that Paris will be a strict parent. I don't know about that. What do you think? I think so. I'm pretty, I'm going to throw cards on it. Think about what happened when she was sort of suppressed and not able to do anything. I think you're going to be surprised. I think what happens is.

Oh, my God, guess what? Paris is here. she could probably answer. Okay. Yeah, go ahead, Paris. I think about that a lot as well because when I was a teenager, I was like one day when I had kids, I'm going to let them do whatever they want.

But now that I know how it is to be a teenager, and I know, you know, especially now how dangerous it is, it's really scary, like the things I'm seeing. I think I will be really strict. But not so strict. And I will never send my kids away. I think I just will talk to them and try to work things out. but I don't know, it's hard

because I don't want to be super strict, but then again, I just know how bad a kid can be that I probably will be. Harris, you didn't answer that question. When you were in your early 20s, what was your vote? Like, did you have a goal in mind? I just, like, being an Aquarius,

I'm like a naturally creative person. And I always have loved music and art and fashion and beauty. So I just wanted to be, everything. I couldn't decide on one thing. I wanted to be a model. I wanted to sing. I wanted to DJ. I wanted to be an artist. I wanted to be a designer. I just wanted to do it all. But when I was little, I wanted to be a veterinarian. And then it all changed my move to New York. Yeah. Maybe this is the late life gig. Maybe Paris Hilton gets married and says, fuck everything. Has a baby. Has a baby. And now she's like, you know what? I'm opening up a, I'm opening up a

A vet, what does it call it, a veterinarian studio? What do you call those things? A veterinarian. What are you calling them? I'm going to the vet. You're a hospital. The vet. You call it a veterinarian, like, oh.

You're going to the vet. So, but if you're going to open up one, what do you call? I'm opening up a, an animal hospital or an animal clinic or, uh. Well, don't look at me like I'm crazy. Finish the sentence. Hold on. Finish the sentence. Oh my God, I'm going to open up a animal.

hospital or a clinic for animals. So you're not opening up a vet. Yeah, you're you are a... You're opening up a veterinarian facility. No one knows. I mean... You know what I've gotten into doing is fostering dogs. Oh, it's so nice.

Well, I mean, I just think about this, Paris. Paris Hilton veterinarian clinic. I think that's, that could be amazing. Yeah. I'll think about it. Think about it. Okay. So now that we are entering into the 40 zone of your life,

we're coming into a new decade soon. What is the goal? What are you looking forward to 2021? And beyond. 2021. I'm excited. I think, you know, 2020 was canceled. And 2021 is already been really crazy.

And it's only been like the first week. So I don't know what to expect. But I'm excited just for the next phase in my life to start a family and just to, I don't know, enjoy my life finally. It's so great. I'm excited. Even your hair is older. Oliver. It is.

It just looked. It looks great. It's like, it's just there's a. I have a photoshoot today. That's why I'm, like, dressed up. I know. I'm like, Paris, what are you wearing? She's like, um, I was like, do you have hair and makeup?

She's like, yes. I was like, great. And I knew when I signed on, she would have perfect lighting and perfect glam. And I'm like, what about you, Nikki? For 2021, I'm excited to launch my new sustainable shoe collection with French Soul. my baby collection with Dottie Dungarees and just I'm just excited for I'm excited for this year I think this pandemic has completely obviously changed the world it's changed the way we eat we travel we communicate everything and I look forward to seeing the world through new set of eyes and

and just being grateful and excited for the future because it has to be better than last year. It's got to be, right? Let's hope so. All right, let's do our speed rounds. One word to describe the other. Paris is fun. Nikki is strict.

You were going to say that. It's like me and Ollie. I'm fun. Yeah. All right. I'm fun too, though. Mickey, you're fun. You used to be more fun.

I'm very fun. Kate used to be more fun. I've had no opportunities to be fun. Yeah. No, you just, you're too strict. You've got to let it go a little bit. Just in general. Ask Danny.

One word to describe the other at 13. We're not cutting that. Paris is flirty. Nikki is a tattletail. Hey, by the way, did you ever get in? trouble for tattletailing? Meaning your parents were fine like, hey, stop telling on your sister.

Oh, we did it. We did. Okay, one word to describe your relationship. Unbreakable. Close as fuck. Here's a good one. Hold on. If your sister was an animal, what would she be? Oh, this is good. Unicorn.

A kitten. Nikki says Paris would be the unicorn. And then Nikki would be A kitten. A kitten. What was the weirdest pet you had as a kid? I had a pet goat and monkeys and a lot of crazy pets. Oh, right.

I had rats, mice. How did you buy a monkey with your own money? I don't know. How does that happen? In Las Vegas, there's like this exotic pet store called Pet Kingdom 2000, and they sell like monkeys and tigers and like vintures. like kangaroos and ferrets and I just was obsessed every time

I went to Vegas with buying all these exotic pets. That's amazing. When we were little, our parents bought Jacqueline Smith's house and she had built this dollhouse for her daughter. Beautiful big dollhouse with electricity

and running water and it was super far away from the main house. Paris and I, unbeknownst to our parents, turned this doll house into like a pet store. And there was chinchillas, ferrets, rats, mice, guinea pigs.

We were like oddly obsessed with rodents. How do you get the animals past your parents? We would buy them a tropical fish on Hollywood. Remember Chris? Yeah, I was obsessed. So crazy. And then you just sneak them in. They wouldn't know because the backyard was so.

big that they wouldn't go back there. It was like this one. It was so far away from the house. They never went. Now I built a dollhouse, which I have in my backyard for my dogs, because I always said one day, I need to, like, have a dollhouse for my kids. And since I don't have kids yet, my dogs are my kids.

We call it the doggy mansion. What was your first celebrity crush? Ryder Strong from Boy Meets World. Oh, my God. I remember that kid. Harris and I were in love with him. We would, the back page of Tiger Beat and all magazines. He would write him love letters, like, obsessed. I loved Luke Perry. Oh, me too. Oh, I loved him so much. I was remember Luke, Luke Perry's voicemail on 902 and O. Oh, my God. It was, it was, you know the drill. Yeah, you. Yeah. Oh, okay, who is more of the

Brainiac? Dickey. No, we know who's most likely to be late. What sister's more dramatic? Me, maybe. Mickey. Oh, I wouldn't have expected that. Who's the wittiest? Me.

Are you even allowed to say that about yourself? That's amazing. Yes. If you're robbing a bank, who's robbing it and who's driving the getaway car? I'm driving the getaway car. Yeah. Paris is robbing. I feel like that could end.

That could be. Paris would like get sidetracked and like go for a copy. She'd like talk to people. They're texting. Yeah. She'd forget what she's doing. Yes. What am I trying to do?

You'd be like honking the horn. Yeah. Okay. Pet peeve. About each other? Yeah. When she does not respond to my texts or emails, I want to punch her in the face. Especially when they're work-related.

Will you go like an actual day, a full day without anything? No. No. Because then I'll just start harassing her. That's what I do to Oliver. I'm just like, pick up. Last night. Yeah, I'm like, answer the phone.

I'm like, I'm trying to cook. See, that's the great thing about siblings. There's no pride. Like, you don't care about it. being embarrassed in front of them. There's no judgment, like zero-ups. Yeah. What about you, Paris?

When she does, like, what you did to your brother, just, like, out on things as well. I don't like that. It's a pet peeve for me. That's so funny. Your favorite look of your sisters, that your sister's done and vice versa.

I mean, like, fashion? Yeah. Like one of your favorite, like, I loved that. Oh, my God. Valentino gown for her wedding. I would say yes to that. I loved all the photos you did when you hosted S&L. When you were like Audrey Hepburn for one look and you were,

there were such beautiful portraits. I don't know if you remember those. I do. Ollie, what was your favorite look of mine? I'd say Mom's dress from cactus flower I don't know It's the only one I know

I mean that's kind of like That was I was like 12 Yeah it's the only one I know I don't know I don't watch the other night The first wives club So good The best great The best the best soundtrack too

Yeah I like when she's like Fill him up Morty Mom's lips She's so good enough Love it Okay. Who's more competitive? We don't have a competitive sister nature. And I'm not just saying that. We really don't.

No, but I mean like in games. Like you're playing Monopoly or... Harris doesn't care. So I guess me. Who's the better cook? Me. Who makes the better cocktail? Me. What do we like to drink? What are our drinks of chocolate?

choice here. In the past few years, I've become more of a tequila girl. I never used to like tequila, but it's a little harsh the taste, so I always have it with something sweet, like pineapple juice. It gives me a hangover, but it's, I like fruity, sweet, girly drinks. I love Jose. I love, I love, okay, I like all of it. I mean, no marijuana in your life, anyone into weed that's too bad we should we should end this one time you've been the most intimidated

um not intimidated but Paris and I were talking the other day about like one of the craziest things that we've ever done and it was when we were cast in sex in the city we were going

to be Samantha Jones's new neighbors in the meatpacking district, her loud, rowdy neighbors. And Paris and I were in L.A., and we didn't get on the flight to shoot sex in the city, which is, to this day, one of my biggest regrets. Not only, by the way, did we not show up, we were so scared that we didn't even call. We just, like, we didn't show up, and we didn't come. It's one of the biggest regrets ever Because I was so obsessed with the show But it's just shows

It just scared the shit out of you But how crazy to not even call And say we're not coming Oh my God What did they do? They were like Paris's agent calling This was like before texting and everything

Being like are you guys alive Where are you? Okay Poster growing up on the wall. New kids on the block. The whole matter to an old cast. If you could cast your sister from another celebrity,

who would that celebrity be? Like to play you? To play you. Like in real life or in a movie about us? In a movie about you guys, who would you cast? Kim Bees singer, like Catwoman Days, Paris. It's good.

They looked alike. I was like, Paris, you were so, obsessed with her. Zoe Dashnell. She had like those bright blue eyes. And she reminds me when you had, you had your hair dark. That is so random. She's really pretty and she's really sweet. I love that. That's a good one. I like that. Okay. And if there was a song to sum up your sister, what song would that be? Wild and free. Isn't that a song? I'm sure. Good, right? Nikki, it would be, I've never been asked this question before. I like your questions. I did. Um, Uptown girl

Yes That's great I love that song Okay so this is our last question Is it two parter One is if there's something you could alleviate from your sister Something that would you think would make her life feel better

Or make it more optimal And then the second part of the question is What a characteristic of your sister That you wish you had more of in you this is nicky speaking um i i would take away some of paris's PTSD and um pain and nightmares that she suffers from and what was the second part what of your sister do you as you had more of in you um i just i love how unconventional Paris is in every sense

of the word. She doesn't follow rules. She doesn't follow trends. She sets them. She sort of marches to the beat of her own drum. She's an original. She's unique. There's no one like her.

Thank you. And for me, I would take away or alleviate you just I don't know I just feel like you're kind of like sometimes uptight

and you don't let go and be free and like I don't know like that part of you where you could just be like unresponsible

and just like rage and rage okay and the thing I would like the character that I would like

you is just to be like more responsible sometimes and beyond time. All right, you guys. Cool. Listen, thank you for doing this. I love you both. Thank you guys so much.

That's good. I appreciate it. All right. Bye, guys. Sibling Revelry is executive produced by Kate Hudson and Oliver Hudson. Producer is Allison Bresnick. Editor is Josh Windish. Music by Mark Hudson.

a.k.a. Uncle Mark. I'm Jorge Ramos. And I'm Paola Ramos. Together we're launching The Moment, a new podcast about what it means to live through a time as uncertain as this one. We sit down with politicians, artists, and activists

to bring you death and analysis from a unique Latino perspective. The moment is a space for the conversations we've been having us, father and daughter, for years. Listen to The Moment with Jorge Ramos and Paola Ramos on the IHartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Introducing IVF disrupted, the Kind Body story, a podcast about a company that promised to

revolutionize fertility care. It grew like a tech startup. While KindBody did help women start families, it also left behind a stream of disillusioned and angry patients. You think you're finally like that? in the right hands. You're just not. Listen to IVF Disrupted, the Kind Body Story, on the IHeart Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On a cold January day in 1995, 18-year-old Krista Pike killed 19-year-old Colleen Slemmer in the woods of Knoxville, Tennessee. Since her conviction, Krista has been sitting on death row. How does someone prove that they deserve to live? We are starting the recording now. Please state your first and last name.

Krista Pike. Listen to Unrestorable Season 2, Proof of Life, on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast.