Sibling Revelry with Kate Hudson and Oliver Hudson - Rob and Chad Lowe

Episode Date: April 14, 2022

Rob and Chad Lowe sit down with Kate and Oliver this week on Sibling Revelry. They discuss childhood anxiety, what it was like to move from Ohio to Malibu, sobriety, and much more.Executive Producers: Kate Hudson and Oliver HudsonProduced by Allison BresnickEdited by Josh WindischMusic by Mark HudsonThis show is powered by Simplecast.This episode is sponsored by:Ro.Derm (roderm.com/sibling)Coinbase (coinbase.com/sibling)HigherDOSE (Higherdose.com/sibling)Helix (helixsleep.com/sibling)See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an IHeart podcast. September is a great time to travel, especially because it's my birthday in September, especially internationally. Because in the past, we've stayed in some pretty awesome Airbnbs in Europe. Did we've one in France, we've one in Greece,

we've actually won in Italy a couple of years ago. Anyway, it just made our trip feel extra special. So if you're heading out this month, consider hosting your home on Airbnb with the co-host feature you can hire someone local to help manage everything. Find a co-host at Airbnb.ca slash host. Hey, it's your favorite jersey girl, Gia Judice. Welcome to Casual Chaos, where I share my story.

This week, I'm sitting down with Vanderpump Rural Star, Sheena Shea. I don't really talk to either of them, if I'm being honest. There will be an occasional text, one way or the other, from me to Ariana. Maybe a happy birthday from Ariana to me. I think the last time I talked to Tom, it was like, congrats on America's Got Talent. This is a combo you don't want to miss. Listen to Casual Chaos on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. It may look different, but Native Culture is alive.

My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. Somewhere along the way, it turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop. That's Dr. Lee Francis IV, who opened the first Native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other Native stories on the show, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Kate Hudson. And my name is Oliver Hudson. We wanted to do something that highlighted our relationship.

And what it's like to be siblings. We are a sibling rivalry. No, no. Sibling Rivalry. Don't do that with your mouth. Sibling Reveory. That's good.

Yeah, it was so funny. We were just riffing a little bit before, and I was like, you know, doesn't even, he's been a heartthrob, like, all of his life. And he's all, that has just been. put on him you know and i was like god isn't he sick of it doesn't he doesn't he it's like just jesus i am more than that and then boom he pops on rob low this is who we're talking about and chad

who i've known for a minute we played hockey together really great guys just really great human beings um anyway so he comes on i'm like okay here's what we were talking about he loves being a heartthrob he's like what are you crazy who doesn't want to be a heartthrob into their 40s and 50s i mean you know and he still is the guy is just still crazy sexy it's insane um i've actually been communicating with his son because he's a massive fisherman he actually owns a 31 foot bertram um 31 bertram that i am obsessed with i almost bought one of these boats and i'm a crazy fisherman as you know and he is just he's he goes well beyond me the guy is obsessed so we've been communicating and I think we're going to fish.

Anyway, these boys were great. So much fun talking to them. Their childhood is so crazy, interesting, and nuts. And, you know, but along, but through it all, you know, just the love that these boys have for each other is, that's pretty awesome. And Chad, uh, Chad's the shit. I really love him, you know.

We ask, I always ask, you know, our guests, especially when you have, you know, a big man. massive celebrity and then you know their their sibling is successful but maybe not as successful similar to my situation our situation and and i'm always saying do you feel competitive are you jealous is their envy and and every sibling is like no you know no we like and i'm always like well come on there's got to be something there chad low listen to his answer that's my boy keeps it real Anyway, enjoy Enjoy, enjoy two handsome men.

Chad and Roblo. Oh, look at Roblo. God, look at him. He had to get the light. He had to get his... Look at it. You had to get the light. Chad.

You got to get Roblo. Look at him. Look, he's so handsome. Okay, so he's definitely more of a heartthrock. We were, okay. No, we were talking about this. I was like, aren't you sick? Aren't you so sick of this shit?

Aren't you so sick of the heart? I am. You know, it's really hard that all people talk about it on my looks. It bums me out. I mean, I'm sick of it for you. I'm like, Jesus. And then Kate's like, no. Who gets sick of being a heartthrob?

He does. Nobody. Nobody. Are you kidding me? See? He's lying. He's lying. My favorite is I took, there was a whole period of my career where it was like,

I'm not taking my shirt off. I'm more. There's something to be objectified. got to 40, and I'm like, I'm fucking taking my shirt off. And I was like, use it or losing. Yeah, it's true. That's the thing. You kind of like, you kind of like lean in. At some point, you just got to lean in. Yeah, but kids, I know.

And since we're talking about sibling rivalry, which I think is apropos. Yeah. I grew up thinking I was Quasimoto. You did. You know, like, I mean, you literally, you get this complex. Like, when every girl in your high school is saying is telling you how good looking your brother is. That's a number.

I know. They do that to me too, but I'm a girl, so it's different. For real, though, like, is that something that would actually affect you where you're like, shit, that hurts? Or are you just making jokes? Oh, now we're getting deep. Oh, we're going to go even deeper. Oh, okay, just wait. This is the fun stuff.

You brought it up. I mean, it all, it all is, it's all part of the ingredient. It's all part of your ingredients. Yeah, right. Your experience. Oh. But I mean, you know, there was, I, I think I, you know, felt like maybe somebody would let me take my shirt off. I might be able to compete.

Mm-hmm. That's all. Right, Rob? Just give me the chance, man. I don't know. Listen, it's like, you got three young daughters at home. I know what that, that food is like. I don't, I'm not, I'm not looking over my shoulder anytime soon.

It's like when I, when I, like, when I, like, when I, it's like, when I, like, when I, it's like, when I had young kids in the house, it was like, oh, boy, I'm eating peanut butter and jelly sandwiches. I'm having milkshakes with the rest of them. And then maybe, then maybe you can kind of get it together again. Well, that was always hard. I mean, how do you, I mean, you've always, you know, through all your kids, you're always like never went to classic mom land. You always like, look at keeping it together. I like, yeah, well, you know, I like being feeling strong you know i like i like feeling strong and sexy rob it's sort of my uh right and if you want to know about me i'm just genetically blessed yeah exactly okay rob and chad

let's get into it because i know our time is time is of the essence so let's we're gonna start from the beginning so rob you wrote a book uh a bit back that was very like candid about your as childhood. But for those who don't know, and those who are just meeting the two of you as siblings today on our podcast, let's just start right from the beginning. Who's the oldest? That's me. I'm four years older. And where were you born? Charlottesville, Virginia. My dad was in his last year of law school at University of Virginia, and I was born at the University Hospital. Now, question, can you tell who's who just by our voices. That's oftentimes people mistake us for our voices. Our father, when I call him, I always

feel the need to let him know. I say, hey, dad, how are you? And I go, it's Chad. Just so he knows. Because our voices are similar. So Rob is older by four years. I know it's hard. It's hard to believe. And I am younger. That makes me younger by 40. Well, you. Good. I'm glad you cleared that up, Chad. You got the math degree, obviously. What can I do? Right. You got the brains. Okay, so Chad comes in, and I, I know this from my research, but it was a very interesting birthing process, right? You couldn't, you were born and your father, and you couldn't go in and see Chad.

Yeah, well, the great story is that my dad, when he saw Chad fainted and knocked himself out. That's my favorite. I'm so ugly. This is the theme of our podcast. It was not. It was like, he was like, I thought I had beautiful children. That is not, Chadley, that is not true.

I can't let the, I can, it's not true. But, and yes, we weren't allowed to see, I wasn't allowed to see little Chadley until, I don't know what was going on with those hospitals. Well, in those days, people weren't allowed in. I mean, yeah, they took the baby and they would put them in the room. But why did he pass out and not? That is the question. That is one of the questions that, that Chad and I have offered.

Often, well, because listen, they, they, my parents split up not long after that. I think that was probably, okay. I think he was like, oh, boy, I got some real issues now. I'm sure. Sure of it. So you guys, you guys still to this day don't know why your father passed out at Chad's birth. Well, I've asked him, and he's like, he's like, oh, it's so overwhelming. I didn't know.

I mean, they just presented me with that little baby. And, well, I guess I just went down. Let's be honest. We all know. We don't need to even know, like, officially. Right. It's pretty clear, if you read the tea leaves, that, I mean, he was 28 when I was born. So, Robbie, he was 24 when you were born.

I mean, it's different time. I can't imagine having two children at 28 what I would have passed out, too, I think. I was 23 with Ryder. But you're a super, you're strong. And sexy. And sexy. Yeah. That's right.

Okay, so, so, Rob, you say you don't remember when Chad was born, really, though. I remember my mom telling me that she was pregnant. I remember that really well. And what she was going to, we're going to call, we can call him Chad. So I remember knowing that Chad's name before he was even around. And you didn't even, you didn't like that name, though, did you? I didn't like the name. I'd never heard of that name.

It sounded like a weird name to me. It was like, Chad, like Chad. And all I could think of is, you. You know, your just subconscious mind was all I can think of was Chad Chapstick. That's what I thought. They never know this. See what I'm learning. I'm so glad that you invited us on your podcast because I'm learning things about myself and my brother that I didn't know.

Do you remember when he was brought home or do you only have sort of like specific memories of when he was a baby? My earliest memory I was just thinking about this was we had one of those really gigantic white wicker. bassinets on wheels and it was huge at least well probably wasn't it's me it felt huge and i used to push it around the living room like a toy with chat in it and that was that was that's my first memory oh that's so sweet i didn't know you did that for me thank you and the rest is the rest is and it continued to push me around our whole lives so you were born in virginia yep and And then how long were you living there until you moved West Coast? The minute my dad graduated, he graduated law school there and then went to practice law in Dayton, Ohio, where Chad was born and where we both lived until I was 12.

And then we moved to L.A. to Point Doom. But your dad had already left by then. Your parents were no longer together. That's right. And how old are you both when they split? I was a year, so you must have been maybe five. Oh, so it's going on to you. Yeah, it's like us. So you don't, do you, you don't have memories probably of them together.

Do you? I do. Um, very, I actually have quite a few of them actually, but they're, but they're like you say, they're, they're, um, uh, like literally scenes from a marriage. They're scenes that we have, not, not the kind of memories where you can remember a whole, the totality of anything. But yeah, I do, for sure. And were they positive memories? No.

I mean, just reading your research, like, it seemed like it was a pretty rough childhood. It was, but that was, I was so young that I didn't, I didn't know. It was like, I remember, you know, them having dinners and this and the Christmases, but the painful more the more painful stuff was like you know at pre after the divorce the sort of that sort of whole you know being a five-year-old with going through a divorce type of stuff that or a number vividly i don't think kids ever really get over you know you know it's so funny um it's really funny because we have a similar situation dad left when i was i was four and a half or so and some of the memories that i have they're they're not memories that exist just in the sort of

normal life everyday life it's either you know the really good times or the really really bad times right right right you know and there's like there's like 15 of them no i know all together if you really think about it did you guys have this a similar experience with the with your parents during that time or is it a different perspective what do you think chadley i mean i obviously age Oh, my God. As our brother, Justin calls me. It's so weird. He's jealous. He's not in on the go. You know, I think a lot of it, obviously, you have to look at through the lens of the age that you are when the things happen. So I don't have any memory of our parents being together, my mom and dad being together. I have no memory. In fact, it's an interesting thing I've often thought about. I don't, I haven't, our mother had passed away a while back, but I don't think I ever saw them touch each other.

And so, but Rob and I do, and I'm interested, too, whether you guys have this experience, Rob and I will spend a great deal of time on the phone or when we see each other talking about the past and talking about things that happened and crying, and like, I'll have a vague memory about something that happened. And I will want Rob to corroborate or give me his take on it. And so we had the same experience, let's say, it was, well, I hope our dad isn't listening to But, you know, one time he, we were driving to an amusement park, and I think I was lipping off. I was probably six or seven.

And he said, you know, if you keep that up, I'm going to pull over and let you out. And we were driving through cornfields. And I said, and I kept going, and he did. He pulled over and let me out and drove off. And I'm literally in a cornfield going, oh, my God, he's serious. So, like, I could call Rob and say, do you remember? Did what really happen the way I remember it happening? Well, the good news is, if dad is listening, my mother did the same thing to Oliver, because he was farting.

Except it was on a Malfi drive in the Pacific Palisades. It's a little bit different. And Oliver kept farting in the car. And finally, Mom's like, if you do it again, I'm pulling over, and you're walking home. And he did it. And Mom pulled over, open the door. I mean, really. And Ollie was like, oh, my God.

She did it. She left. She left. That's right. And he walked up to the house. So Tom Hanks gave me a ride home. Yes. Wait, he did.

He actually did. No, he did not. Oh, God. I was like, that is to talk about a story. Never let the facts get in the way of a good story. Right? He should have lied. He should have lied.

Well, what about, when did you come to that age where you were actually brothers and you could sort of be together and being each other's presence and actually love each other, you know? I always thought we, I mean, look, Chad will tell you that we definitely had our moments where, we would fight and you know he would he his move was he would pull embarrassing pranks on me and then my move was be to like like punch him in the face that was like right we did our biggest fight was um we were my mom was on one of her cross country trips right chad this is the diner the famous diner sorry oh gosh yeah the famous the famous diner in in i think it was in jacks outside of jackson hall Wyoming and and um chad

kicked me with these cowboy boots in the shin as hard as he could under the table. And so I just across the table punched him in the face. So these people were so horrified. They went to my mother and said, that boy just out of nowhere punched the other one in the face. Oh, my. I was like, no, he kicked me in it. But like, so we definitely did that kind of beating on each other that people do.

But other than that, at least my, my truth is the kids saying. today um is that uh is that we always got along particularly in when i compare it to stories i hear of of other families yeah we've talked about it before but you know all kate wanted was love from me and i couldn't give it to her because i was trying to figure out my own shit from i'm from a divorced family so all she wanted to do was have me just accept her and i could barely accept myself, you know? So that was... That's really interesting because I, we, Rob and I both, my truth, my experience is that

from the get-go, we were thick as thieves, you know, from the get-go, we were like partners in crime. And I think a lot of that was born out of the situation, too, that we found ourselves in, which with, you know, mom having us out here in California. And then as soon as the, you know, summer broke and school was out, we were shipped back on a plane to Dayton, Ohio together. So, you know, we were, and we still are best friends. And, you know, closer than brothers, as they say in final.

Yes. But we, you know, and along with that comes periods of time where there's a certain estrangement or there's something that's happened. And, you know, that was an interesting. experience too. And I will share this. I don't know if I'm jumping too far ahead. But the big revelation for me, and I don't know if this would be the same for you, Kate, as being the younger sibling, but maybe it's different. Maybe it's not an age thing. But one of the big revelations for me one day was we were going through a period where it was like, might have been a little

strained for whatever silly reason. And I had this thought, I thought, you know, when something good happens in my life, the first person I want to call. is Rob. And I want to share that news. Conversely, the first person I would call it something bad happened in my life would be Rob, but especially when I was thinking about good things that happened. And, you know, if it was like, let's say, you've looked at a pilot or, you know, whatever, something small. I'd want to call him and I'd want to share in that joy with him. And I realized, you know, I can't ask for that from him if I'm not willing to give that to him in return. And so that was a big, a big moment for me. being the younger sibling, because as you said, Oliver, you know, when you're the older sibling,

there's something in that birth order and that, you know, and Rob proceeding and, you know, being an actor and kind of following in those footsteps, I realize, like, you know, I have a power in this too, and my power in this is I need to be able to give that back to him. That's really interesting because I'm the oldest, but it's different. And this is my own shit. This has nothing to do with Kate. It's definitely his own shit. But when I have something good happen, I have a bit of an inferior.

It's not good enough, meaning, yeah, I booked a pilot, but it's like, oh, well, have you seen almost famous, or do you know how many brands that I represent? I'm saying this is my own line. I'm not saying this is like 20 years ago. I know, but it's the best thing you've done. I know, but it was 20, exactly. I know, but listen. So that's where it is for me. I wish that I had more confidence in my own accomplishments.

You know what I mean? So that is a nice revelation to have, and it seems freeing. almost, at least from my perspective, you know? Interesting. It was very freeing for us and for me. And I know that once I got to that place, you know, I think, I mean, Rob can speak to that more than I could, but once I got to that place,

I think it opened up a lot of space for us to get even closer. You know what's interesting about this? Yeah, I mean, Chad and I talk all the time. And we can literally talk for hours about anything and do to like when I think are both of our wives when they know that we're on the phone just like like okay well I'm not good okay that's that's an hour that they're going to go and do their thing on yeah for sure that's not I don't think that that's actually typical I know it's like yeah yeah I think it's more of a sister thing yeah yeah that's so great yeah we we can we can gossip and

talk and reminisce and future trip I question what were your parents like like like What was the energy that you were sort of raised in, meaning what did they do? I mean, your father was a lawyer. You know, were you immersed in the arts? Well, but here's the thing, though. Our biological father, our father, was out of our daily lives before Chad can remember. And when I was five, so now we're talking about the first step, there were two stepfather's. so the first stepfather is still in our lives he's a profoundly decent like principal got me interested in politics got me really it was a reader like a lot of the stuff that I look back and I go that's I think him you know reading books um political social events reading the newspaper all current events that I

think his name is Bill that I think that was him he um so that and then they split up and then the next father was a Sakai Yunian analyst oh wow yeah no whoa so it would be like I always we were I think we were the practice patients a lot I mean I definitely felt like we were living with like a high school principal slash you know therapist like you know the therapy you We were in front of the, we went in front of the therapy board a lot. Don't you think, Chad? But how did you take that as kids sort of growing up with that? I know that this is just life and it is what it is, but was there resentments at all towards

mom? We want stability or, hey, who's the next one? I guess we'll just accept this. I just think kids are so resilient and they have nothing to compare anything to other than their own experience. And, you know, pound for pound, we were blessed that these guys, these men were They treated us great. They did the best they could.

Some were more flawed than others, but they were great. I mean, they, you know, they brought in a woman with two kids and did the best they could as fathers. And, you know, I have a ton of respect for that. And I didn't feel particularly displaced other than the geographical. The geographicals were super hard. Like, that was hard. moving, uprooting from a friend group across the country. That was brutal and it happened to me twice.

That was not fun. Mom and dad divorced. Is dad, is he in and out? Yeah, he's the weekends and, you know, ski trips, stuff like that. And then you moved to Los Angeles because, and that was because of your father or, no, your stepfather? Yes, it was because my, my, my, that stepfather got a job. working for the county running the like a division of the county's mental health department when this is how long ago was LA County had a mental health department. Wow. And hospitals

and facilities. What a concept. Yeah. What a concept. How about that? Yeah. And then they just decide to get rid of it. And then that was over. So yeah, so that's he, that's why we ended up in Southern California. And then we ended up in Malibu because, and this is a big theme, our mom was, or thought she was, Chad and I have so many debates about this, a universal allergic. So she was in theory allergic to anything. She could be allergic to perfume, plastic outgassing, carpets, paint, smog, foods, you name it. Anything could put her out for in back into the bed for weeks. And, interesting. Point Doom had the best air quality in Southern California. That's how we ended up there.

Okay, well, hold on. Wait a minute. I mean, did she choose these allergies? I'm meaning like, okay, today I'm around paint. I don't feel like, hey, I got some paint stuff. I need to lie down. And they're, dude. Right.

I mean, these are the great mysteries of life. I mean, here's my favorite. Here's my favorite. So we would buy, we didn't have a ton of money at all. I mean, at all. And, you know, we were the family that could go out and not order dessert. Like, that was like our vibe. And so when we bought a new car, it was a big deal.

It was used, too. We would buy, well, when we did buy a new car, she would have to leave it outside with the windows open for almost four months. Oh, my God. Before she could get into it. That's why I thought I was used. No, it wasn't used. It was because she would, the outgassing of the plighting of the plant.

The new car smell. Right, right. Yeah, yeah. Which we all long for. Listen, she was also, but ahead of her time, like, she was like, that paint has lead in it. Right. You know, and the notion of food allergies. I mean, I think there was some there there.

But there was also something else there. She was definitely ahead of her time. But where does this debate start? Because, Chad, do you have a different idea of? No, I think the debate is just trying to see the light and figure out what the, there is. And, you know, I mean, I think we both recognize that she had other issues, Kate, you know, as you mentioned, which we'll never know, but psychological issues, whether it was depression or, you know, clinical depression, whatever it was. But there was also, you know,

a lot of the things she was talking about in the early 70s, we've all now accepted as fact, which is the air we breathe can make us thick. The water we drink can make us sick, you know, that certain chemicals leak out of the furniture. I mean, it's that these things are, so that's, I think, where Rob and I are like, yeah, but, but why is she? Wasn't she? I wonder, you know, because obviously she's primary parent, did that kind of negative cycle of thinking that things are bad for you,

create any anxiety in either of you? That's a Chad Lowe question. Wow, Kate, you must know what you speak to ask that question. Yeah, yeah, definitely. I definitely have, it definitely, I think, affected me more to look at the, to look at the world around you with that kind of a lens. Yeah. And the thought that the air you're breathing makes you sick or that the water you're drinking

makes you sick. I was actually in an allergy hospital with her when I was, I think six or seven. I went with her to a hospital that was foremost in the field of, of food allergies. And I was often had a stomachache as a child, always, always had a stomachache. I mean, number one sign of children and anxiety. Anxiety. And so it was, oh, something's wrong.

Let's go to the hospital in Chicago. It's all gets so crazy. This is where Rob and I just go down the rabbit hole and start laughing ourselves, you know, to death here. But in some of it's just so profound and so bizarre. But, yeah, I went to an allergy hospital with her called Henroton Hospital. I'll never forget it. And I spent a summer with her there.

And I started by fasting for a week on nothing but water and taking diuretics and to cleanse my system to then test me for food allergies. And I'm sick. Okay. Wow. So, and then I remember we came home and we, I was only allowed to eat like a bowl of rice or blueberries. And the meat I could eat, you never wrap what the meat was that I was only allowed to eat caribou. Caribou. Where do you find caribou me?

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So be sure to sign up today. That's coinbase.com slash sibling. I guess what's interesting about this is that you can look at it from again two different perspectives. One of, wow, that sounds pretty crazy. The other is that the things that you're talking about scientifically are clearly things that people do to heal them and heal their gut and to balance their system out,

you might have been pretty young to be doing that. But at the same time, it sounds like she really was very much ahead of her time. Yeah, I mean, it's interesting. I mean, I just find that interesting that your mother was. Did that inform how you think and how you feel about your life? You know what I mean? Did you take your parents and how much did you rail against your parents and how much did you take, you know?

Well, for me, Chad, speaking here, I, you know, I had to work through a lot of that stuff early on. And I remember, you know, and high school years, especially as I started to get some independence and then, you know, like got a car and then moved out of the house. I kind of was like, I'm not going to get sick by the world around me. And I can eat whatever the hell I want to eat. and I can drink and do drugs and I can just go completely utterly insane. Right. It's Malibu in the 80s. It's going to get weird. It got weird. Yeah. You went to Sammo. Did you guys both go to Samo?

Yeah, I went to Samo and what was the junior high, which is now Malibu High. Yeah. My junior high was on Morning View there off Zuma. Oh, wow. you guys are real like Malibu kids old school oh yeah i i'm and i'm i'm obsessed like the great story that i need to write will do want to do have tried to do i think any really creative person has hopefully one of them in mine is the almost famous meets boogie nights version meets licorice pizza yeah of malibu of of of malibu from 1976 to 1986.

Well, and also, when we moved there, you know, as you guys know, there was, you know, there were two kind of classes, if you will, of Malibu. There was kind of a working class, which with a lot of the old families that had been on Point Doom, that really didn't want any part of city living that moved there. And then there were movie stars. And there was, you know, there were people, there was your mama. And there was, you know, Johnny Carson, and there was Bob Dylan and the Sheen. And people who didn't want to be in the,

city didn't want to be in Hollywood but wanted to escape to a place that all it sounds strange because it's so beautiful and so renowned but there was a certain normalcy about living there yeah didn't have like a hot people always like what was it like growing up in Hollywood I'm like I don't have any clue what it was like growing up in Hollywood we grew up on in Dayton Ohio in the summers and point doom you know which to me I was running around with kids who you know a few of them are dead you know a couple most of them live in a Gura now you know like yeah it was like I mean, we had friends whose dad worked at Sears. And, you know, it was just a different time.

Yeah, my mom used to drop me off on the Malibu. I'm a big fisherman. It's like a real passion of mine. Eight years old, I went and fish the Aquarius all day. The Aquarius was a boat. Oh, my God, I don't remember that. I used to come up on the pier. The Aquarius, the Aquarius is in Santa Barbara.

Yeah. It's in Santa Barbara Harbor now. And I see it. And I remember, how about when you used to be able to take fishing boats off of Paradise Cove? Yeah, that's right in first, started fishing out of Paradise Cove. And then the storm took. got the pier that's that's right yeah so this is all my area but i also loved when the the the market had a hitching post for horses yeah when i lived there people rode their horses to the market from

from from from uh yeah from cross creek yeah yeah my first job was at the point doom pharmacy yeah remember i was that i was a it was a different such a different time than it is now malibu it really was. I mean, the kids in Malibu really got heavy into drugs, a lot of them. Oh, yeah. And I think everyone who's lived in L.A. has had friends in Malibu, have, they've had friends who have actually died, you know. Oh, in my, okay, so the junior high I went to, which was now the high school, had 715 students. I remember that because I was the parliamentarian, the student council and um in the three years that i was there eight kids died wow really that's crazy now if that happened today oh my god yeah eight kids died yeah at the same school in a three year period

oh forget it would be international news yes nobody gave one fuck no yeah yeah it's a different it's just such a different time how were you guys at school together as brothers like were you were you close, you know, or was it sort of like, am a little older than you? Right. Because the four year difference was right on that cusp. So the only time we were ever together was in elementary school. After that, we were just enough to the four year difference. We were never in the same school.

So did the acting and the sort of love of storytelling start to actually come from being in Los Angeles? No, I was acting in Ohio. I was doing children's theater and summer stock and all that when I was eight in Dayton and you'd have thought that coming to California would be great because it's all I wanted to do. But I was heartbroken to leave Dayton and my friends. And only kind of begrudgingly was like, yeah, I guess California was, I mean, I love that like our, we moved to the, one of the lesser streets on, on the point, Wandermare. Oh, you were a Wandermare.

Yeah. And I, and I, and when they told, no view, but when they told me that our, Our broken down corral was built from wood from the remnants of the beach set of Planet of the Age. I was like, okay, this is a cool place. So you were always into acting. Yeah, what did that come from? I saw a play when I was a kid. It was the play Oliver with all the little kids in it, the little beggar kids. And I was like, I want to, it was like an aha moment, like a real, I was like, I want to do that.

There was a sign-up sheet in the lobby for a children's workshop. My parents signed me up and literally, I, Chad can tell you, it's all I ever wanted to do. I was like laser, laser. I used to take the bus from Point Doom to Santa Monica, get a transfer, take a bus to Beverly Hills, get a transfer, take a bus to Hollywood and Vine, go in for an audition, and repeat it, do my homework on the bus, come home, eat, and go to bed. Wow. Like, it's what I did. Wow. When did you start auditioning?

The minute I got there. So 12 years old. Yeah. And Chad, do you sort of look at Rob and as the younger sibling see sort of your entry point into the arts through your brothers, sort of motivated by your brother's love for the arts? You know, I think certainly exposed to it. I remember back in Dayton, he was doing Oklahoma, and I signed up to play something. I don't know what it was in Oklahoma. And I made it through one rehearsal.

I was like, I'm not doing this. But I did develop a fascination with traveling salesman. And so I went around telling everybody mistakenly that when I grew up, I was going to be a streetwalker. Because somehow in my six-year-old brain got the two confused. That's amazing. But that's what I that was my takeaway from from Oklahoma was I didn't I wasn't I just didn't have that interest that he did and like as Rob said he was he had that laser focus and that sense of purpose that that acting I mean I remember it was he had

movie pictures up on his wall and it was all about acting and movies and how movies are made and I didn't have any any interest in that I mean can I ask Rob a question I don't mean to hijack this and we're asking the questions here but do you think rob that when when you started acting was there any part because i wonder about this like was there any part of you that thought that getting being seen on stage because i'm so fascinated by what draws somebody to want to be in front of others was there something about needing love from dad or wanting to feeling that you weren't being seen or being heard do you think that played into that at all I, well, the first time I was ever on stage, ever, I remember it like it vividly.

And when the audience laughed. And I was too young to even, it wasn't like I had that power, but it felt powerful. And, and, and, and, and like, I had, I was in control of this collective experience. I could never have processed it that way because I was so young, but looking back on it, I remember the feelings. And I think that's what it was. And I think it's about being, you know, being seen having control for sure on stage. And to this day, it's why I prefer above all else being on stage is that of you walking out there with nothing when I do my one man show. And it's 2,000 people. And you have to deliver. and you're going to transport them. You've taken them in your hand and you are guiding them and you are the steward.

And that's the same way I love directing when I get to do it. Right. That's so interesting. And not that you were asking me this, Chad, but I'm going to... I want to add to this. Very Howard Stern question, by the way. Very stern.

Yeah, because, you know... Yeah. Because for me, like, you're talking about like, actually like, grabbing the audience like that interaction right yeah and for me i think my first feeling of being on a stage had nothing to do with an audience and everything to do with the light oh wow like for me it was like i couldn't see anybody wow and i saw was like this these lights on me this is alison wonderland right i mean i was in that performance as well

You were all about audience interaction. I was all about it. I was gone. I had, I was like, you know, I was transported to another world. She played Little Alice. And when she, when she came out, everything was, I mean, it was so big. And her chest was out. You've never seen any bigger acting in your life.

It was, it was like. Oh, God, it was amazing. It was in Colorado at the Wheeler Opera House in Aspen. and it was this really beautiful place if you've ever been. It's amazing. Yeah, it's insane. Yeah, I played Tweedle D in that

I was in fourth grade. I was Tweedle D, okay? We've had two performances. He brought the house down. We had two performances and something went wrong in both performances. The umbrella wouldn't open

and my guy goes, Tweedledum goes up on a line. Like, it never worked out, but it worked out. Ollie Tapp danced his way through it. You did. So, so. So perfect for, like,

uh, yes. and our careers and everything. So what was your, for both of your first jobs? Chad, what was your first? Well, I can say that, you know, it's funny to answer the question about, like, when I knew or if I wanted to be an actor, I was not going to be an actor and I was, and I was kind of defiant in a way, like, I'm not going to follow in anybody's footsteps, you know, I'm not

going to do that. That's his thing, you know, like, I got my thing. It's funny, I see with my kids now, they're all like, trying to find what their thing is that makes them unique and makes them special. And, you know, as a parent, you're like, you are unique. You are special. You just, you know, but I was not going to be an actor. And then I, you know, remember visiting, I think it was when I took the SAPs and, like,

whatever you get for writing your name, that was my score. And I went, well, I'm not going down the road of academia. That's for sure. Same with us. And I was like, anything might be interesting. And I remember visiting, Rob, I don't know, Rob doesn't even know this probably, but visiting the set of Hotel New Hampshire and watching you do a scene with, what was the young actress's name? I can't remember. Jennifer, Dundas?

Yes. Dundas, yep. And I watched her, and she gave a candle in her hands. I remember this so vividly. And I had this access to the making of and the process of acting. And I watched it, and I watched what he was doing, and I thought, I want to try that I think I could do this. And this looks really interesting. And I think I caught a glimpse of what you're talking about of the power that you feel.

You know, and you can feel that power. I feel that power a lot like you do, Kate, and that I get kind of so nervous and get so. But then when I'm in it, it's happening. And then when I'm done, the nerves come flooding back. And I really don't have any memory of what I just did. Right. And but I, I remember having a very instrumental talk with Martin Sheen. when Charlie and I were very dear friends.

And Martin, for some reason, was driving me out to meet Charlie at a David Bowie concert. It was the let's dance tour at Anaheim Stadium. And Martin, for some reason, needed to drive me from Point Doom to Anaheim Stadium. So, you know, for four hours, he talked my ear off about the public theater and about Joe Pat. And he's, you know, also from Dayton, Ohio. And he said to me, you know, I think you all.

are an actor. And I, and I was like, that, you know, blew my mind. And I said, well, what do you mean? He said, it's the way you look at things. I see you observing when you were Charlie. And I see you in the kind of standing off in the background watching everything. And that's what a great actor does. If they observe life, they study life. And I was in. Huck. If that's what acting was, I was in. Right. That's a good story. So from that point on, I think I realized, like, you know, I can do this. I can do this my own way. you will. And it's not until, you know, my later years that I just, you know, because there's the whole thing about nepotism and people, you know, people have a different point of view

about that. But I mean, I often am so grateful that Rob had whatever that was inside of him that exposed me to, who, who, it's something that's made me, you know, weep and cry and miserable and, but it's given me a beautiful life. So yeah. Well, it's also, I mean, Martin Sheen. I mean, that's not a bad, like, uh, pep talk. No, but it was Rob. I mean, Rob was the one. I mean, Rob was the pioneer for us and our family. Yeah.

I give full credit. Kate's going to be like, uh-huh, here. Envy. Yeah, right. Ever, no, envy. Is there ever, was there ever envy? I ask this all the time. Like, was there, was there the envious part of you?

Was there like, oh, my brother is, you know, a star and he's all this and he's all that? And I'm, I love it. I love it. But I'm like, God damn it. Like, what about me? And I don't know. Was there ever into that? Oh, Jesus.

Every day. Yeah. Finally, someone who tells that. fucking true finally Jesus we've only done 100 billion every time we do this

and everyone's like no absolutely not and I'm like see there's people out there it's not natural it's not natural

for it's different for everybody I love it but you have someone you can text anytime now Oliver let's we can text

Chad but here's but here's the but here's the thing it I'm but along that end the other side of that coin or on the same path of that envy is an incredible pride.

Yes. And gratitude and just like if Rob get, I'm getting like chills. If something good happens with Rob, I hear absolutely 100% in that triumph and in the joy that that brings. There's not a part of me that wants his life. I don't want to be you, Rob. I love you to pieces. I'm so happy with my life I'm so happy where I am but I can also keep space

for when you know something happens I'm like yeah God I would love that too I don't want you not to have it but gee what about me like I would like that too yeah yeah I sometimes exist in a Jekyll and Hyde situation where we may go to the premiere I'm like fucking cane

cameras are flashing it's all better all the time and then they get in the theater and I'm like I'm so fucking proud for like crying I'm like she's incredible And then I leave the theater and it's like at the after party, I'm like, oh, she's, everyone's talking to her. It's fucking good. There's room for this.

There's room for all of these emotions, I'd say. There's room for all of it. It's true. It's true. It's right. It's really true. What was your first job? Rob.

Yeah, what was it, Chadley? What was your first job, Chadley? My, my Chadleys, I'll go Chadleys. My first job was I got two jobs in one day. It hasn't happened since. But I auditioned, I went in auditioned. I was working at the point in pharmacy as a stock boy because I was at that point needed a little my own money.

And I got a two job. I got home. I never forget. Our mother said, let's call your agent together. And I called. And I got a thing called Robert Kennedy and his student. Fimes, RFK and his times. I played a young Bobby Kennedy, which I was caught out of. But it was Brad Davis, a mini series about the Kennedy. And then I got another one called Flight 90

disaster on the Potomac, which with Barry Corbyn, I played the son. It was about the air Florida crash. I remember that. River and the ice rescue that happened. And I got both those jobs in the same day. Again, I thought that's the way it was always going to be. You're like, this is easy. I'm going to have multiple offers every day. And then, Rob, I mean, outsiders was your first big gig, right? But what was your first on-screen gig? Well, the first time I ever got paid for acting.

Yeah. Was I was still in Dayton. And there was a chain of carpet stores named Don Mendenhall's Carpet Talk. Don't ask me what that name is or meant. but I did a radio commercial for them and all I can remember is I couldn't read yet so the announcer would say it and I would repeat it and they cut the announcer out of it

and I was paid $10 and the new Partridge family album. Wow. Solid, solid compensation. My first job was actually singing in the chorus of Home Alone and when the kids, are all singing the Christmas songs. It's like I'm in that chorus. And I still, to this day, get residuals.

I just got the other day a $10 residual from home alone. Yeah. For that. Yeah. Well, they were much more generous then, I guess. Wow. No kidding. Oliver, what was your first gig?

Oh, God. It's probably with mom. It was. It was a movie called Out of Towners. The thing is, I didn't want to. Oh, yeah, that's right. I played my mother's son. There's obviously no nepotism involved here.

I just want to be clear about that. But no, my mother's son was Steve Martin. It was great. It was fine. I was 20 years old. I didn't want to be an actor. That's not what I wanted to do. I want to direct and write movies.

When she was acting, I had a camera from the sixth grade, fifth grade on making movies every single weekend. That's what I wanted to do. Acting came about because I went to college. I went to Boulder for like two years. I needed money. I needed money.

My whole family's doing it. I'll give it a try. I kind of liked it at first, but I was hung over, drinking and partying and going to auditions, not taking it seriously in any way. And finally I had to get my shit together. And then I did, you know, but that was my first gig at 20 years old. Prior to that, I had done one play in fourth grade. That is it.

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So just because I mean, and it's totally obviously, if you're open to talking about this, but I think it's really helpful for people who, you know, struggle to just, you know, hear sort of, you know, people's stories. When did you, when did that part of your life when you started to, like, party actually start to happen? And then when did, when in that moment did it become like this is now a problem? when you recognize the problem. As you alluded to, we grew up in a really weird time in a really weird place. I can remember going to an eighth-grade girls' party

and the big gift that everybody was giving each other were vials of Coke. And so that's the world I grew up in in Malibu. Yeah. And I remember that Coke was also what, it meant you were successful. Like that's what I mean we could we all know the actors

I don't need to name the names But I know you can think of them And it was like you know they were doing blow all the time And like that's what I'm being a movie star And that's what it meant to be You know you you know The Big House in Mulholland and the fucking blow And that's what movie stars did

And rock stars And so that I grew up with that message And so when I can all The other thing that I think is significant is I remember the very first time I ever tasted alcohol. I remember it because my father, he was still at home. This is a home memory, gave me a drink of his beer, and I chugged it.

Like, not, like, oh, what is this? I don't know what, I'm got to be five. And I was like, and immediately threw up. And I'm like, that's an alcohol. That is what alcohol, like, I was. born a born alcohol and and boy did i find the right career to to help that and you know i think you know then i got you know successful and famous and money and drinking and drugs and and it was great well it lasted great well it lasted like i look back on it with very few if

any regrets um i i don't think i romanticize it but but i but i I'm pretty clear-eyed about how much, excuse me, fucking fun it was until it wasn't. Right. Right. And then knowing, again, I had a moment of clarity like I had when I saw the kids on stage where I was like, if I don't change my life, I'm never going to have what I want in my life, ever. And I knew it, just 100% knew it in my DNA. But that wasn't enough to stop me.

And so I flirted for like a year and a half maybe of like, I'm going to stop drinking. Maybe I should stop drinking. I'm going to go a month without drinking. I'm going to sit in it. And it never really held. And then there was a night when my mother called me and told me that my grandfather had had a heart attack. He was very, very close to him. And she was leaving a message on the answering machine.

And I couldn't pick it up because I've been up all night partying. I didn't want, couldn't talk to her. So I thought, I know what I'm going to do. I'm going to not answer this now. I'm going to drink this bottle of Cuervo Gold that I kept by my bedside table because I missed all this George Clooney tequila stuff. Like, where was that one? I don't know. Like in my day, it was like, Cuervo Gold was the top of the heat.

Oh, yeah, that was it. That was it. You know, I'm a good, you know, listener of Steely Dan. Quervo Gold, the fine Columbia. They make tonight a wonderful thing, as they say. So I was like, all right, I'm going to drink, chug-a-lug this quervo so I can go to sleep so I can wake up to deal with this phone call. And that felt like logic to me.

And I had this moment of, dude, you're so fucked up. And that was it. The next day, I have been carrying the business card of a drug and alcohol counselor in my wallet for a year. year and a half. I couldn't keep a pair of sunglasses for a year and a half, but I kept this. And I woke up the next day, pulled out the card, called her, named Betty Wyman. She put me on a plane to Sierra Tucson. And that would be 31 years ago in May. Wow. That was amazing. That was it. Way to go. Amazing. Amazing. And Chad, did you have a similar story? somewhat in that I'm an alcoholic and an addict and yeah I mean I definitely you know it was interesting

as they talk about in the program it's you know it's attraction rather than promotion right and it's like if you want what I have I'll show you how to do it so you know I here's here's another great irony I'm Rob's sobriety birth date is 10th. Mine is May 11th. Wow. Wow. We're, you know, I'm coming up on 19 years in, in a few months here, and he's got 31 coming up. So, um, and we both like exactly the same kind of blend. Right. Yeah. Same, the same kind of chemistry. We were, we were, we were very good wingmen. I was about to say, did you guys party a lot together? Oh, as much as we could. As much as we could. Are you kidding me?

Yeah, we had, and again, to Rob's point, that there are some memories that I definitely, you know, would, I have no regrets and have great memories. And again, like you said, it was fun, it was fun in games until it wasn't. And then I found myself in that incomprehensible demoralization of I can't live with it and I can't live without it. And I knew I had a problem. And it was really scary, you know. and I got to the point with mine, and I was hiding from everybody in my life, not let no one was really aware.

Even Rob. I think, I don't know if he was even aware. No, I mean, I didn't know it had ever become a problem for him. I knew he did it. He, like, he would love to party and was maybe probably still doing it, but I felt like he was probably partying the way, quote, unquote, normal people. I actually didn't know it. progressed to that. Yeah, and I didn't, and it was, because I have, I have a lot of recovery knowledge under

my belt. I was at Family Week with Rob at Sierra Tucson, and I have friends, other friends who've gone through, you know, recovery. And so it's not, it wasn't like this strange, you know, discovery for me. So I had, you know, I had a little bit of a head full of recovery. So, um, that just helped with the game, you know, and wanting to hide it all. But when Rob recovered, didn't you, did you, did you look at that as an impetus to maybe try? Or was it like, I'm just going to be on my own, do my own thing? Well, no, I mean, I definitely felt like when he got sober, there was, I was like, good luck to you. I mean, good for you. I'm happy and I was grateful to him. But there was never a part of me that was like, that's my path too. Right. Right.

I just knew I had a lot more fun in me. I thought. You know, and it was never like a morning drinker or everyday drink or anything like that, it's such a cunning and baffling and powerful disease, you know, it just, it's really snuck up on me. And I, and I, and I think that speaks a lot to kind of the genetic component of it. Because, you know, I was always, you know, very aware of like, I need to get on the wagon. I've got a big meeting coming up. I'm going to go dry this whole week. And so I'd laugh about dry January. I'm like, if you have to go dry in January, you might want to work at the other 11 months of the year. but but but i and again no judgments at all but you know it just for me it just it got to the point

where uh i was you know killing myself um and and the easier softer way for me seemed to be dying which i look back on that now and i just think that's it's so incredibly sad to think that i how much i would have lost and that i could have gotten to that place and i had that moment of clarity when I looked in the mirror and, you know, had been on a run for a few days, and I couldn't see myself anymore. And I, and I started crying. And I just thought, I don't even know who I'm looking at right now in this mirror. And also that, you know, that stereotype of like, well, is this what an addict and an alcoholic looked like? Because I don't think it is. And, you know, my first meeting, you know, I had kind of a big event that happened. Basically, I got caught,

and which was the greatest in some ways a very painful day but also one of the greatest of my life because it's when I really was able to let people know what I would have been hiding and so I was able to let my secret out and I picked up the phone book and I looked I looked in the beginning of the phone book of the enemies I'll just say and I made a call and went to a 12 step I know that feeling man I know the feeling of holding it in and having to sort of finally let it off your chest you know for me it's a little different i know you guys got to go i won't get into my whole story but like it was you know a two and a half years of holding in i was unfaithful to my wife we were engaged and i spiraled down and i was had an addiction i mean there's no doubt about

it i would i would cry and then go out and and pour myself a drink and get right back out there in the field and it was just fucking horrendous to me and finally after two and a half years of just annihilating myself, I finally had to come clean because I couldn't live with myself anymore. And the day that I did, that sort of relief, even though I'm risking everything in my life at that point, was so great. I mean, it was like, oh, God, just to get it off of my chest, you know. Yeah. It was also so great because that moment took the pressure off my divorce. It did. It was a perfect timing. It was perfect timing. I was getting divorced and everybody was mad at me and then i was like well and then all he's like i have a sex addiction and i'm like

oh thank god thank god oh thank god i got like a thank you note everybody can't by the way can i need to point out something to those who might be listening and questioning about all this here are multiple addicts sex addicts drug eggs bag logs in recovery happy and we're talking about and we're laughing and that's the thing that that that i find so remarkable and i and like i want to tell because my biggest the thing that kept me from getting sober for so long was my fun would be dead right like my like like i would i'd be a stick in the mud i'd be some funny dutty and like dude we laugh more i laugh more now like the fact that we're all laughing about this this stuff it's deadly serious. But we get through it and we have the tools to get through it and we're able to laugh

about it. I think that to me is probably the most unexpected thing that people don't know is waiting for them in recovery. Yes. And I this is why I also think it's so important to be open about these things because it also does show people that, you know, when you get to the other side of it, there's just an enormous community of people who are right there with you, like have had the same experiences. And, you know, there's something very liberating about, you know, that's why, you know, the first step is to just not be in denial. And the second, you're not in denial, like you said,

it's your first step into, you know, integrity. It's like our trainer. My trainer would say it's awareness, and awareness leads to integrity. And I think it's a really interesting. Yeah, it's a good point. That's a great point. You guys are going to have to go. We have one question.

Oh, we're not going to do any speed route. We don't have time. Let's do the final one, which is, which is the good one. You go for it. Okay. Speed rounds. You saved the good one for last, clearly. I wish we could have done some of these.

I can do five. I can do five minutes. Okay, let's do a couple then. One word to describe the other. This is, we're supposed to, they're going to quick. They're both. Yeah, when I do these speed rounds, I don't edit. I do whatever pops into my head.

Yeah, good. And so I, Chad, I got sweet. And now I'm acting so I can find the word. Oh, it's so sweet. It's hard. It's hard. Unless it pops right into your head and that just happened to happen. I have a bunch of them are popping in, but I'm like, I'm like.

Go, Chad. I'm floundering so badly. But you can edit this awesome. Yeah, we can edit it. We can edit whatever you want. Unless you like radio silent, the message. We're not editing it. This is a window into how you feel about your brother.

This is a total window. Are you kidding? This is a grievous. This is better than anything. Now we understand. How about we just move on, Chad? No, Chad. Chad, give us a word.

Oliver's got me. Hears. Oh, I like it. I like it. Okay. A song to sum up your childhood. Oh, so many. Chad and I do this all the time.

We send each other. these like tick-tock clips of obscure songs from our childhood it's a super fun game yeah one of the best gifts rob ever gave me when he went to do the outsiders was his i got his room and i got his record player and his records and i got to discover all of the great music he had discovered before me so i got all the jackson browns and the spring themes and the pretenders and all these great albums and So what one song that for both of us are individual? For our childhood? Dude, I might have to go with Year of the Cat.

We have this thing about the song Year of the Cat. We just like it's such a great song. You know this song? It just sends us right. Al Stewart's song. No. Oh, come on. I don't know it.

How do we not know the Year of the Cat? You do. If you hear it, you'll know it the second you hear it. Well, I love that that it's a. massive, massive radio, yacht rock classic 1976. The year I was born.

That's why you don't know. You weren't born yet. Definitely. Definitely we built this city, right? We built this city on rock and rock. Oh, yeah. But that's, okay, it's really the same song. It's like a total pop bubble gum,

like guilty pleasure. Yeah. Super guilty pleasure song. Next one is first concert. Sir. That's easy. ELO, for me, it was ELO in Dayton, at Hara Arena in Dayton, Ohio.

Cool. Mine was David Cassidy. Oh, my God. At Hara Arena. I win. What about? Who's the better cook? Oh, me.

Chad, that's not a question. Have you ever cooked, Rob? I'm, I, I eat, I like to eat. I do not like to cook. I have no desire to cook. I know that I'm a lesser human for that. I'm very aware that that is a flaw and nothing to be proud of.

But, but, but chat is a way, way better. What about first, first celebrity crush? Celebrity crush. Yeah. But not like a real one, not like one that you were working with. Well, I guess if he was. No, no, no, no. He could have been little too.

I mean, you know, yeah. No, he was, he was like working with that. Sure. He's like, it's like, Demi Moore. I mean, it could have. Well, that's like when you tell your spouse, like, you have a, you get your freebie. Hall pass.

You're like, no. And I'm always like, but that, you can't have that freebie because that could actually happen. Right. I'm like, no, that, my freebie is never happening. Yours could actually happen.

Right. That can't be your freebie. My first celebrity crush was Olivia Newton, John. Oh, yeah. Good one. Mine was Yvonne Craig, who played Batgirl. Oh, my Godman TV series. Don't sleep on Batgirl.

No, she was hot. I remember her. I think that started my thing for redheads. Yeah, the dream is still alive. First kiss, and then we'll do our last question. Julie Ziegler, who was playing a jitterbug in the production of the Wizard of Oz that I did at the Dayton Playhouse and hiding.

Here are the ingredients that fucked me up forever, and I chased forever. Starlet, young actress, hiding in the dark. secrecy and the smell of grease paint. Oh, yeah. Oh, that will affect you up. I like that. All of that sounded great. Right?

Yes, it did. Very visceral texture. My first, the first kiss I remember was we were living in Montrose, Colorado, for about six months on our way from Dayton, Ohio. And I was in second grade, I think, first grade. A third grade or fourth grade girl said she was going to teach me, How do you French kiss? I don't remember her.

I don't remember her name, but I do remember her tongue and bring into my mouth. I'm thinking, what the hell is this? Amazing. Wow. Okay.

All right. Last question. You want to ask her? You want me to ask. Go ahead. You go. It's a two-part question. The first part is,

if there was one thing that you could alleviate from your brother that you think would optimize their life, what would that be? And the second part, is if there was something that you could emulate from your brother

that you wish you had more of or that you think would, you know, better your own life, what would that be? Easy. This is an easy one for me to answer. And the older brothers had more time to think about this one. Chad's in the hot seat again. I know.

Do you want to go first? No. No. You can't. It's going to go out all of a sudden. I would relieve my brother of his, I want to phrase it right because it has a lot of different iterations. And his, I would say second guessing of himself or, I would say second guessing of himself or hesitancy on

decision making and what I would like more of that he has is easy I would love to have his empathy I would love to have more more of that not that I'm not empathic but Chad Lowe he feels he cries more right

I know I'm a crier I'm a crier I'm a crier I cry all the time I cry even when I just cry just when I'm like you know what I should cry I should cry okay Chad it's your turn what would I relieve I think I think I would relieve his I think I would and again similarly it's hard to it's hard to say this because it's not like a word but I think I I would, I think I would take some of the fracture off of my brother and his, his sense of having to be all things to all people.

I would relieve that. It's almost like giving him permission to be flawed and to be, not have, not have it all together. Not that he doesn't feel like he always does, but there is that part where I feel like have you been sitting in my men's group therapy? You plug to listening devices? Wait a minute. You have a men's group. Can I be invited to that? I think there's a lot of air talking we have to all do. And what would I, what would the other one? What would I like to get of his? What do I want of his? Yeah, it's like something that you would like to emulate. Well, I think I try to do it. And, do it at times and it's not just it's not it's kind of what you what he was saying like uh that self-assuredness

the the the and it's it's it's not that i'm not self-assured it's it there's a weird thing with being empathetic and also you know not wanting to always interject and wanting to stay back and mind my place and there is a part of me though that does that that that that would like and works to have that kind of um uh authority i think that he has that rob has is too is more of more authority uh with with things in my life if that make that yeah yeah great well thank you guys this is really fun this is so nice you guys i were it's just so damn cute together it's just it's just it's just not to be believed and amazing questions just so such great thank you i i love it oh i'm glad i'm glad we were able to do it this was you guys

are so much fun i could you do another five hours this i know i know Sibling Revelry is executive produced by Kate Hudson and Oliver Hudson. Producer is Allison Bresden. Editor is Josh Windish. Music by Mark Hudson, aka Uncle Mark. If you want to show us some love, rate the show and leave us a review. This show is powered by Simplecast. Hey, it's your favorite Jersey girl, Gia Jude Ice.

Welcome to Casual Chaos, where I share my story. This week, I'm sitting down. with Vanderpump Rule Star, Sheena Shay. I don't really talk to either of them, if I'm being honest. There will be an occasional text, one way or the other, from me to Ariana, maybe a happy birthday from Ariana to me. I think the last time I talked to Tom, it was like, congrats on America's Got Talent. This is a combo you don't want to miss.

Listen to Casual Chaos on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. It may look different, but Native culture is alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. Somewhere along the way, it turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop. That's Dr. Lee Francis IV, who opened the first native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other native stories on the show, Burn Sage Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The internet is something we make, not just something that happens to us.

I'm Bridget Todd, host of the tech and culture podcast. There are No Girls on the Internet. In our new season, I'm talking to people like Anil Dash, an OG entrepreneur and writer who refuses to be cynical about the Internet. I love tech. You know, I've been a nerd my whole life, but it does have to be for something. Like, it's not just for its own sake. It's an inspiring story that focuses on people as the core building blocks of the Internet. Listen to There Are No Girls on the Internet on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.

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