Sibling Revelry with Kate Hudson and Oliver Hudson - Sibling Melodies with Brothers Osborne

Episode Date: April 28, 2025

If you thought the rock & roll lifestyle was bumpy, wait until you hear how these country crooners grew up!Kate and Oliver are joined by hitmakers T.J. and John Osborne for a fun and VERY revealing episode.From the grown-up parties they attended as kids, to a life-changing confession, this is the story that inspired the songs.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an IHeart podcast. September is a great time to travel, especially because it's my birthday in September, especially internationally. Because in the past, we've stayed in some pretty awesome Airbnbs in Europe. Did we've one in France, we've one in Greece,

we've actually won in Italy a couple of years ago. Anyway, it just made our trip feel extra special. So if you're heading out this month, consider hosting your home on Airbnb with the co-host feature you can hire someone local to help manage everything. Find a co-host at Airbnb.ca slash host. I'm Jorge Ramos. And I'm Paola Ramos.

Together we're launching The Moment, a new podcast about what it means to live through a time, as uncertain as this one. We sit down with politicians, artists, and activists to bring you death and analysis from a unique Latino perspective. The Moment is a space for the conversations we've been having us father and daughter for years. Listen to The Moment with Jorge Ramos and Paola Ramos

on the I-Heart Radio app, podcast or wherever you get your podcasts. Introducing IVF Disrupted, the Kind Body Story, a podcast about a company that promised to revolutionize fertility care. It grew like a tech startup. While Kind Body did help women start families, it also left behind a stream of disillusioned and angry patients. You think you're finally like in the right hands.

You're just not. Listen to IVF Disrupted, the Kind Body Story, on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, it's your favorite Jersey girl, Gia Judice. Welcome to Casual Chaos, where I share my story. This week, I'm sitting down with Vanderpump Rural Star, Sheena Shea. I don't really talk to either of them, if I'm being honest. There will be an occasional text, one way or the other, from me to Ariana,

maybe a happy birthday from Ariana to me. I think the last time I talked to Tom, it was like, congrats on America's Got Talent. This is a combo you don't want to mess. Listen to Casual Chaos on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. It may look different, but Native Culture is alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. Somewhere along the way, it turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop.

That's Dr. Lee Francis IV, who opened the first Native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other Native stories on the show, Burn Sage, Burnbridge. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Kate Hudson. And my name is Oliver Hudson. We wanted to do something that highlighted our relationship. And what it's like to be siblings. We are a sibling rivalry.

No, no. Reveory. Don't do that with your mouth. Sibling, Reveory. That's good. Ollie, I'm really excited about this. The Osborne bros.

The OBSs. The OBSs. The brothers Osborne actually are very loved in Nashville. and, you know, my team, all my music team, and they're all Nashville based. And I just got from my manager, Jake, he was like, you're going to love these guys. Do you know them?

So let's bring them and John. I don't. I don't know them at all. But I know that, I don't know if it's John or TJ, but one of them is like, wants to be your best friend. And I think you're going to love him. Yeah, I think we need to hang. I think you're going to find a new best team today.

Hi. Hi, everybody's funny. Welcome to the show. show. Good to be all the show. Yeah, this is very tempting. You know, I'm 10 days without a cocktail, which for me is like four and a half years. Really?

Yeah. And no cigarettes, no alcohol. That's crazy for me. Well, I've had some cigarettes, but I've been letting off the alcohol. Wait, did you quit cigarettes and alcohol at the same time? No, here's the thing. I don't, I'm weird. I don't smoke if I don't drink.

I need it. Ah, there you go. It's really interesting. You know what I mean? I mean, like, if I have a, if, if liquor touches my lips, I'm like, where are my American spirits, you know? Yeah, I know. They are. They do.

They do. They do. But, why? Oh, see, my problem, my problem with cigarettes is it's coffee and cigarettes. I used to be mine. So I wake up and I'm like, oh, well, smoke. Do you have a stay on coffee in the morning? I quit when I quit.

She quit a long time ago, yeah. I have to say, I watched all of her at the family barber. Q this Sunday, watch our brother smoke, our other brother smoke. And I was really impressed that you didn't have a cigarette. No, I know. Well, here's the thing. Like, I don't know, lowercase, A, alcoholic, I'm not sure what I am, right? But I drink, I drink too much. Meaning, when I do drink, I can't have two drinks. I have to have 20. You know what I mean? Yeah, I feel you. I cannot just go to and, hey, cool. we're good.

I have to have 20 drinks and 80 cigarettes rather than two drinks and two cigarettes. I don't understand when people, they're like, I quit drinking, so I'm drinking non-alcoholic beer. It's like, what? Why do you do that? Forget it.

It's just like, I just want the calories. Yeah. No, forget it. I feel like it's because, I feel like if you got into the art of the drink, then maybe you, you would enjoy one drink

and not five of them. I guess, I guess. Like if you like took the time to make a negroni or like a paper plane. Yeah, but I make 10,

I make 10 negronies. That's the thing is odd, but that's like, yes. I mean, that could be maybe if you're bringing into a problem, but at the same time,

like, I'm of the mind like, if almost, why go kind of part of the way? Like, I'm right there with you. That's all. And by the way, I'm a great drunk, meaning I can have 78 drinks.

No one's going to know I'm drunk. Well, that's because you're drunk. Okay, I can tell you, I can tell you, I have moments with Oliver where sometimes I'm like, No. You okay? And he's like, yeah, yeah, you know, just feeling a little drunk. I'm guessing, though, that you're, are you a happy drunk? I'm a happy drunk.

I'm very happy. I'm fun and happy. I have the best time ever, you know. The problem is, so if you're an alcoholic and you're a problem, you're a problem. for someone else, I think that's really bad. But if you're only really a problem for yourself, that's not bad. Yeah, that's true. You know?

By the way, I love this rationale. We're redefining alcoholism. This is so problematic. Oh, man. You know, I sometimes think about, like, our grandparents' generation, they were all alcoholics. They drank every night. I mean, my grandma drank a scotch.

and water, at least two every night. Our dad is, everyone, he's actually fine. We all preface it with this. Yeah, he had a little bit of cancer. Our dad went through radiation treatment and everyone was like, how's your dad doing? And I'm like, well, he's doing this radiation treatment. But I think the thing that's really killing him isn't the radiation treatment,

it's the fact that he can't drink beer, why it's happening. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, you're like, this is no fun. When he had his last radiation treatment, they all went to the hospital to, you know, bring blooms. and but his gift was a 18 pack of Corr's light. Amazing. Amazing.

I'm glad he's okay. Then we'll get off to alcohol, but I was just skiing and the Coors Light, you know, I would wake up and I was in Montana and I'd have like three cores lights and a couple fireball shots and then go to the mountain. And then I'm like, fuck, yes, it is time to ski, baby. And then I, yeah, and then I hit the, and then I got out. lunch and have like a few gin and tonics and I'm like fuck yeah and then get home after skiing and then make a couple like tequila sodas and smoke a thousand cigarettes I'm like it's the best

fucking day ever it is and then and then after day seven I'm like I feel like shit and it's time to like I'm almost 50 I got to get it together you know and it's been 10 days and the thing is I've never I've never felt you never felt better I mean you feel incredible you feel so good that you need a drink. That's the thing. It's like, I don't feel hungover. I feel amazing. Like, I need a cocktail right now. How can this possibly be better? I know.

A drink. Exactly. Exactly. I think we need to get rich roll on this program. I think it's time you have a counselor. No, I'm good. I'm good. I'm good.

I will. It's going to be good. Osborne, brother. Now, are you guys in Nashville right now? Where are you? We all are. Yeah. This is, we're, we're right downtown Nashville. This is our manager. This is his office. I was with Jake Bazden last night who just loves you guys.

Who's my manager. Yes. And, uh, I saw him a few weeks ago. He's the best. There's a really great sushi restaurant here in Nashville called 888 and was at the bar. And we kind of had known each other for a while,

but I had forgotten that he was your manager and then I guilted him into guilting you guys into making it happen. I'm glad that it worked. I'm so happy. But wait, is 888? Is 888 the place that does the vinyl night? Yes, they do vinyl. Oh, I had sushi.

I love that place. It's really good. So good. So you guys are from Maryland. Yeah. We're East Coast, East Coast boys. We,

you know, I think that's like, was the weirdest thing for everyone's like, how the hell do you get in a country music band from Maryland? But it's like, we're like little, we're going with the Chesapeake Bay, a little small watertown called Deal.

It's like 4,000 people. And, you know, that's, yeah, that's it. That's where we're from. Good flounder fishing. right is there

striped ass some stripers yeah I'm a huge fisherman I have a boat I catch big tuna I'm I'm gonna go on I'm obsessed Southern California is amazing in the last 10 years those big bluefin have just come in through their sort of migration patterns and so every year around June

actually right now they're starting to show up you get big you know 200 300 pounders like 40 miles offshore from fucking Sanamonica I already going to do that without drinking yeah I have done that yet. By the way, I'm not quitting drinking. But I haven't, I haven't been on my boat yet this season. So, you know, we'll, we'll see. I want to go out this year. I have, I've never been on your boat. Yeah, it's great. Should we do a podcast from your boat? Oh, yeah. That'd be

interesting. You know, the thing, the sad, the sad reality is that T.J. and I get horrifically seasick. Do you? Well, like on the bay, if it's not too choppy. Yeah. And, but we went, We were in Key West, and we went fishing for Mahi, Mahi, which was great fishing, by the way. Yeah, I'm sure you've done it. But if I can't see land anymore, it is full on Bunderfest. And, of course, we were hungover. We were partying for a lot of days. And at one point, T.J. and I were both sitting on a cooler.

And we're out with some friends and some strangers, and we were sitting next to each other on a cooler. He would throw up, and we would switch, and he would go fish, come back. I would throw up. who would swish and I would go fish and it was fun about an hour and then I never do it again there's nothing worse than being seasick it's just fucking horrendous and by the way when you're hung over and seasick you cannot get worse than that yeah yeah I don't we don't really get seasick you I don't get seasick the only time in seasick I took a boat up from L.A. up to Vancouver and we were Morrow Bay and Tide went on that night and had to get up at like 4 a.m. to get out of the, you know,

the inlet and all that. And I was like, uh-oh. And I was done. Did you take a boat from L.A. to Vancouver? Yeah. I mean, I didn't drive it. I was on, I was on the boat helping sort of ferry. My dad. Yeah, it was incredible. I had the best. I'm sure it was incredible, but I'd be like bringing a helicopter. Yeah, yeah. Is it Maryland? That is the Mason-Dixon line. I mean, not too far from, right?

You're kind of like... Very good. Geography buff over here. Yeah. You're kind of... Just like, just south of it. We're like technically south of the Mason-Dixon line,

but we're far enough north where we don't really give a shit or the Mason-Dixon line is. I think it's like, was maybe, I think kind of perfect for us though, because, you know, even in like country, it's like, you know,

we're not like the most country. We're not really rock. We're kind of in this like in between. Like, what are we, you know? And up there, it's like,

yeah, north everyone considered you from the south and everyone from the south considered you from the north it was like we're kind of being in like no man's land a little bit well you know our mom our mom's from tacoma park maryland kind of outside of dc i did not know that that makes me happy i was the only other person i knew from uh maryland was like tony bxton so this is really like and tony hawk a lot of tony's from there oh yeah yeah she went to blair blair high school. I would be shocked if your mom had this or gave

two shits about it. But you know, Maryland, it's the other thing, I didn't realize this growing up there, but our base player at the time was like, man, he's like the only other state I've seen have like the Texas pride where it's stickers and all the fanfare around it. He's like, it's Maryland

and I'm like, no way. And then I started thinking about it. And we are kind of really oddly crazy about like our state flag. There's the really classic thing I was just in Phoenix a couple of days ago. And I was like, oh my God,

it's a crab that has the Maryland flag like on it. And it's just like a weird thing that no one would have a single clue what it's about. When you're from Maryland, you're like,

I will defend that person to the death. Yeah. I know them. They got into a road rage incident right now. I'm getting out with them. I'm going to ask mom about it. But my mom actually,

my mom and my, so our family is basically, That side, they were the only ones that were kind of a little bit north, whereas everyone else was, was Arkansas and Nashville. Mm-hmm. So the whole-oh, and Nashville? Yeah, so most of the Hans are actually in Nashville. They are? Yeah.

The fuck is going on, but we didn't. I mean, but they didn't, that wasn't, they wouldn't, they didn't live in now, they're there now. They didn't live in Nashville, like. Yeah, so, so, so, so, so, so granddad. They were, they were. I know. The whole world is opening up. So our granddad.

Wait, wait a minute. Our granddaddy is Arkansas. Yes. He moved to Maryland because he was a musician. Yes. And that's where he had all of his gigs. Right.

But the Hans were still Arkansas. Right. So, no. So he had five brothers. They all grew up in Arkansas. Yes. But they went. Two stayed in Arkansas.

Sorry. Only Uncle Degg was Arkansas. and the other three went to brothers went to Nashville and our granddaddy went to Maryland. Oh, so they were in Nashville. Little Han history. That's wicked. Wait, on the other side of the family,

you have musicians as well, right? Yeah, but just like Italian. Italian, Oregon, Italian. Yeah. Yeah. I was in a band years ago and had written a bunch of songs. All about this, wow.

Well, Kate needs to. Her career needs to keep going and take off in the music world. Then she'll sort of bring me along. I'll do some cuts. I'll do some background vocals. And then, bang, I get a feature. I found a freestyle that Oliver did and sent it to me called the motherfucking palisades. And I literally was, I was going through all my old music, like old music.

And I found it. I have it. Oh, my God. It's in there, dude. It's in there. Release it. Sidebar, were you both okay after the fires? You guys are all right?

Yeah. I mean, fortunately, yeah. I was right on the edge. I just got in this week back into my house. Oh, wow. Yeah. Our brother had a mishap. Oh, geez.

Yeah. His house burnt down. Yeah. It's been so weird, honestly. Like, the whole experience has been quite something. I bet. I can't imagine. I bet.

Okay, wait, when I was down. This is all edited out material. But when we go there, we, Mary Steenbergin and Ted Danson are like really close friends of ours. So we stay with them in the Palisades every time we go there. Apparently, their house is okay, but they said it's like, just look, a bomb went off. It's so sad.

Yeah, I mean, I was saying before, you know, I've said this a million times, but the worst, the only thing worse than having your house burned down is the one that's standing. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like, within all the rubble, you know, you see these, one house and you're just like I don't want that anymore. Holy fuck. What am I supposed to do? I can't

sell it. I can't collect the insurance. I can't move back in. Like what am I supposed to do here? I know. You got it. September always feels like the start of something new, whether it's back to school, new projects, or just a fresh

season. It's the perfect time to start dreaming about your next adventure. I love that feeling of possibility. thinking about where to go next, what kind of place we'll stay in, and how to make it feel like home. I'm already imagining the kind of Airbnb that would make the trip unforgettable, somewhere with charm, character, and a little local flavor. If you're planning to be away this September, why not consider hosting your home on Airbnb while you're gone? Your home could be the highlight of someone else's trip, a cozy place to land, a space that helps them feel like a local. And with Airbnb's co-host feature, you can hire a local co-host to help with everything, from managing bookings to making sure your home is guest ready.

Find a co-host at Airbnb.ca. slash host. I'm Jorge Ramos. And I'm Paola Ramos. Together we're launching The Moment, a new podcast about what it means to live through a time, as uncertain as this one. We sit down with politicians. I would be the first immigrant mayor in generations, but 40% of New Yorkers, were born outside of this country. Artists and activists, I mean, do you ever feel demoralized?

I might personally lose hope. This individual might lose the faith, but there's an institution that doesn't lose faith. And that's what I believe in. To bring you depth and analysis from a unique Latino perspective. There's not a single day that Paola and I don't call or text each other, sharing news and thoughts about what's happening in the country. This new podcast will be a way to make that ongoing intergenerational

conversation, public. Listen to The Moment with Jorge Ramos and Paola Ramos as part of the MyCultura Podcast Network on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I started trying to get pregnant

about four years ago now. We're getting a little bit older and it just kind of felt like the window could be closing. Bloomberg and IHeart Podcasts present IVF Disrupted, the kind body story. A podcast podcast about a company that promised to revolutionize fertility care.

Introducing Kind Body, a new generation of women's health and fertility care. Backed by millions in venture capital and private equity, it grew like a tech startup. While Kind Body did help women start families, it also left behind a stream of disillusioned and angry patients. You think you're finally like with the right people in the right hands, and then to find out again that you're just not. Don't be fooled. By what? All the bright and shiny. Listen to IVF disrupted, the kind body story, starting September 19 on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hi, I'm Jenna Lopez, and in the new season of the Overcover podcast, I'm taking you on an exciting journey of self-reflection. Am I ready to enter this new part of my life? Like, am I ready to be in a relationship? Am I ready to have kids and to really just devote myself and my time? I wanted to be successful on my own, not just because of who my mom is. Like, I felt like I needed to be better or work twice as hard as she did. Join me for conversations about healing and growth. Life is freaking hard.

And growth doesn't happen in comfort. It happens in motion, even when you're hurting. All from one of my favorite spaces, The Kitchen. Honestly, these are going to come out so freaking amazing. Be a part of my new chapter and listen to the new season of the Overcom. for podcast as part of the MyCultura podcast network on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hey, it's your favorite jersey girl, Gia Judice. Welcome to Casual Chaos, where I share my story. This week, I'm sitting down with Vanderpump Roll Star, Shea Shea.

I don't really talk to either of them, if I'm being honest. There will be an occasional text, one way or the other, from me to Ariana, maybe a happy birthday from Ariana to me. I think the last time I talked to Tom, it was like, congrats on America's Got Talent. This is a combo you don't want to miss. Listen to Casual Chaos on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. So you grew up in a family of musicians. Your family, weren't your parents' musicians? They were.

And they both tried to come to Nashville and running soft. I mean, they wrote a bunch of really cool songs that were, actually, we talked about, like, re-recording them, like, in a more professional setting. That's cool. I know it would be really cool. Yeah. You just kind of grow up around it. We didn't really know any different.

We didn't know that it was an unusual thing to kind of later in life. But, you know, when I look back now, I mean, how hard it was for us to kind of get started doing it, I mean, they had five kids and they were like, you know, our dad's a plumber. Our mom's a hairdresser. I mean, they were like, you know, they were paycheck to paycheck at best. so I mean them coming down here and still trying to make it happen so when we little kids and I actually posted a video about this yesterday there's this little thing I found where it was like basically I can't it was a this video of this videographer like this like his like really cute

parents and they're his the kids like filming and it's like really low quality and they're like keep doing it you're such you're so good at this and then it fast forward to him later in life and he's like shooting professional films it made me cry as I was like this reminds me of our childhood. Like, we didn't have anything, but our parents believed in us, and they were like, you got this,

you guys were really good, but we were terrible. And it definitely gave us the confidence to keep going and doing this. But yeah, I mean, having that background is absolutely the driver, I think.

Were you actually terrible? Or you just thought you were? No, yeah. I mean, I wouldn't say actually. I think, I mean, when we were little, it wasn't great.

It wasn't great. Well, how old is little? How old is little? So 10, 11, 12. Okay. Well, so you're little, meaning like you shouldn't be that dope yet. But I love it.

They were like, you know, they would have like everyone stop and listen and be like, yeah, the song and we would come and it's like, you know, it was just, I mean, probably cute to them.

I guess sometimes they would laugh and because I think. It was cute. I thought it was cute. But when I was like eight, I was like, what the fuck? Like laugh at me. Like,

there's a performance here. T.J.'s voice also dropped when he was like nine years old. Right. I was going through puberty, and I was supposed to say talking up here? He's three years younger than me. He's like, what's up, man? Yeah. Palisades.

So he was just kind of destined for glory. But anyway, so back to your original question, yeah, we grew up, we kind of, I think, like, the first thing we wanted to accomplish was, like, our dad, his brother and our cousin, Johnny, like, were the three. people they would always sit around at the kitchen table and play originals they might do like bob seeker covers or something and we always wanted to join in but they would not let us join unless we really took it seriously uh and so we like what we wanted was a literal seat at the table in our kitchen to just play with our uncle and our dad and our cousin um and that's kind of where it started and then they were i mean our some of them were like our cousin you know johnny like he was tough you know he wasn't just going to you know give you a paddle on the back for nothing but but

I mean, you had to actually impress them. So it really, it raised the bar for us. And that was like our first goal. Did you have a piano in the house, or was it all guitar? You did have a piano in the house and we were wretched. I still have a piano in the house. My wife's a really good piano player. I'm wretched.

But guitar was the thing. We always had guitars laying around. And our dad would play just, you know, it was just always there. It was never in your house. And it's one of those things when you grow up that way you think it's normal. And it's really not that normal. It's not normal for the third music all the time. So I do feel very lucky in that fact.

And having parents that support what you want to do is also something that you realize isn't that common as well. I feel like we could have decided to be anything between an astronaut to a mime. And our parents are like, you've got a kid. So that kind of encouragement was really helpful. They sound awesome. I know. They are. They're fucking wild.

Yeah, we're very, very loud. Tell me more. Tell me more. Like, what, so we free-spirited, huh? I mean, just sort of, yeah, 100%, yeah. So, like, you grew up, like, they were the kind of parents. I'm just assuming that, like, they were the kind of parents that, like, would have parties and be hanging out, and you never felt like you were had to be in another room.

It was just, like, a big, they were open. Oh, and, like, again, they couldn't afford a babysitter or anything like this. So if they went out to party, they would just bring us with them. And then they did some person's house until whenever they decided to go home. We were just hang out. Like, and so we never really, we didn't hang out with kids that much. We hung out with people and were like, you know, our age now. And, you know, I think, again, it was like, then my dad would break out the guitar.

And then it'd be like, you know, John, I think one of his first accomplishments was just learning the chords to free bird. And, you know, the power of course. And everyone's like, watch them play, you know. And so it was, yeah, it was. Were you guys always tight growing up? Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah, very close. So we slept in bunk beds.

We grew up. We slept into the same bed. Yeah. In the same womb. But yeah, we had bunk beds until I graduated high school. And then the great irony of that being, you fast forward until about 15 years ago, we're back on the bus. Fucking bunk bed. And, but yeah, you know, I mean, we're very, very close, very, very tight.

You know, we love and adore each other like brothers. We also fight like brothers. But, you know, in terms of sibling bands, we're doing pretty well. we're not going to do the you know the oasis Gallagher brothers thing anytime soon it's done close well I was going to ask

you guys this actually before the start I was curious like I don't know like was you know we John and I we've been up and about this we've talked about it in articles before I guess but you know there was a time where we went we did like a couple's there

we like went to a therapist together we were really hard and people would be like a couple I'm like I know it sounds weird but it was like soon incredibly helpful. I don't know if that's... Wow, cool.

I did that with Oliver once. It was a failed attempt. It's hard for the other person when you're always right. Am I wrong about this? Yeah. I just like can't have her thing and, you know, I'm like,

I know, Oliver... Why did we have a therapy session? Oliver can't handle when I feel hurt and have to express it to him. No. It's like he can't deal with it. He's like, no, I'm not dealing with this.

I can't deal with it. I feel too much shame already. I feel too much guilt, too much shame for being a terrible brother. And now that you feel hurt, I just don't want to hear it. No, it's too formal. I don't like communicating like a therapist, meaning like, I feel that you did this and it makes me feel this way. And I'd rather have a normal conversation, not with a therapy speak.

Right, exactly. Well, thank you for asking. And then on top of it, I guess. this from Kate all the time which you know it's an impossible to penetrate hey Kate you know I just here's my thing I feel like sometimes you can be condescending to me and you make me feel like I'm not good enough or whatever I'm saying I'm sorry you feel that way and then she goes exactly she goes well I'm sorry you feel that way I'm like I am I hate it I hate it yeah but that's such a bullshit what do you want me to say there is no taking accountability that's not taking accountability

for someone's feelings, it's just saying, well, I'm right, but I'm sorry you feel that way. I'm sorry you're such a bitch. Yeah, I'm sorry you're such a fucking idiot loser. Right. Right. Exactly. Well, I'm sorry you feel that way.

I'm like, what? No. Well, what else are you going to say? I, I feel like. Oh, wow. Like, I didn't really think that I was making you feel like that. And I would never want to hurt you. Yeah, but it doesn't.

No, of course not. Of course not. But it doesn't change. the experience how your your experience no it doesn't so my thing is it's like if i have a boundary if i have a boundary or if i have a point of view and it's not liked or it's not appreciated or it makes you feel bad then you're in that sort of thing where it's like i hate that this makes you feel bad but that is my boundary no but you also have to take accountability that maybe look inward and say well what did i

I do to make him or whoever feel that way. Listen, I gave you half. I gave you half. Guys, I just want to be. It was my idea. It was my idea. I just want to say this is beautiful. I gave you the money.

It was my idea. We got a lot of progress here, guys. I'm very proud. Thank you, guys. Listen, I'm so glad we had you on. I'm glad we had you on. Now, Palisades therapist, though. I ain't a hundred a hundred dollars.

You guys, I already can't wait to hang out with you. I'm so excited. Hold on. I want to get into Brothers Therapy, which could be in a good title for a new album, by the way. But, you know, Brothers Therapy, how was? That's interesting. I've never, how did that go?

Oh, it's 11.11. Means nothing. I mean, here's the thing. We kind of, we were like really at it. Like, we couldn't even, there was a moment we literally could not be in the same room with each other without. From a creative place. Did it start with a, from a creative place? I think a lot of things.

Creative probably mixed in with like shit when we were five. I don't know. Yeah. But like the one thing that was really interesting, though, without going too far into it and boring the peers out of everyone listening to this is, um, is we were like pissed. And when we sat down with the therapist, he was like, man, he's like, this is awesome. And I was like, what do you mean? This is awesome.

Like we could be angry. And he was like, well, he's like, you guys are so pissed off because you care so much. like if you all came in here and you were apathetic and you didn't care at all he's like that would be a huge problem and really challenging to fix is if you guys really the reason why you're fighting with each other is because you guys fucking love each other so much

and I was like damn that's some dead eye mine fuck I was that I do kind of like you know now I do a lot of times not always we still get into it believe me but I do there are moments to be like you know what okay

we're getting we're getting like we're button heads because because we care. Hold on. Take me back to the moment of who was the one who said, you know what,

brother? I think we should go to couples therapy. Like, who said that? I'm not sure. I know at the time I was doing.

Their manager. Like, yeah. They're not running on the wall. They're like, well, 16% of zero is zero. So we got a big of shit.

I don't know. At the time I was already doing a lot of therapy, I've been very open. about my mental health and stuff like that I have dealt with anxiety and I've come leaps and balance it's been really really great me too me too me too but I'm on lexapro

so oh really I'm on Symbolta so like we do it works and it's been amazing amazing well my antidepressant's better than you so fuck off yeah no you're ever depressed it's not well at least I'm still drinking I mean that's a problem I'm still drinking

you need alcoholism shit you're better than mine and anyway so But I did a lot of work, and it was really, really helpful. And there's a really great thing in Nashville called Porter's Call, who help a lot of musicians and artists for free, and it's funded by artists in Nashville. That's great.

Because, you know, when you're up and you're struggling and you can't afford the time or the money to deal with mental health. So there was a guy there that I had known for a long time, and I just knew he was always really great, and that's who we met with this guy named China. He is a gods and a mental health community of Nashville. And it was really, really great. Of course, I left there being like,

he didn't tell my brother he was wrong one time. But you know, when you really do think about it, it's like he's right. Our intentions are the same. We want it to be great. And then, you know, so you guys look like amazing siblings and you truly do love each other. But there are moments where it rubs, right?

Well, just imagine that you're pursuing a music career together. that rub just happens a lot. And a lot of times it stems from just lack of honest communication. And that allowed us to be just a little bit more forthcoming with how you feel. And that's been a huge help. That's so great. Was it a vulnerability issue? Meaning like being able to be truly vulnerable with each other beyond just making music and with your feelings and say, hey, you know what?

This is how I feel. But you know, you actually, you touched us a little bit earlier. And I agree with you. It seems like this. oh, it's like, like, goofy, like way of dealing with it. But the actual, when you do just say like, hey, it is, you do,

it doesn't make me feel this way. Yeah. It's not, the reason why I mean, at least for me, that does work very well is, it's not accusing them of doing something. It could be on me that I feel this way. Yes. This is how I'm feeling and it may be totally irrational.

Well, buddy, I'm sorry you feel that way. That made me feel so good. Okay, good. Anyhow, without going on and on about it, we highly recommend just for anyone individually. No, I love this stuff. I think it's important. I mean, I talk about it all the time. We've actually wanted to do with our whole family.

Oh, my God. Opportunity to do that. That would be a lot of work. You imagine that. Yeah. But at the same time, I feel like it's kind of more scary than it is because it is going to be hard work. But I feel like the outcome of it, it seems like it would be really, I don't know, it's like getting on a roller coaster. September always feels like the start of something new, whether it's back to school,

new projects, or just a fresh season. It's the perfect time to start dreaming about your next adventure. I love that feeling of possibility, thinking about where to go next, what kind of place will stay in, and how to make it feel like home. I'm already imagining the kind of Airbnb that would make the trip unforgettable, somewhere with charm, character, and a little local flavor. If you're planning to be away this September, why not consider hosting your home on Airbnb while you're gone? Your home could be the highlight of someone else's trip, a cozy place to land, a space that helps them feel like a local. And with Airbnb's co-host feature, you can hire a local co-host to help with everything from managing bookings to making sure your home is guest ready. Find a co-host at Airbnb.ca slash host.

I'm Jorge Ramos. And I'm Paula Ramos. Together we're launching The Moment, a new podcast about what it means to live through a time, as uncertain as this one. We sit down with politicians. I would be the first immigrant mayor in generations, but 40% of New Yorkers were born outside of this country. Artists and activists, I mean, do you ever feel demoralized? I might personally lose hope. This individual might lose the faith, but there's an institution that doesn't lose faith.

And that's what I believe in. To bring you death and analysis. from a unique Latino perspective. There's not a single day that Paola and I don't call or text each other, sharing news and thoughts about what's happening in the country. This new podcast will be a way to make that ongoing intergenerational conversation public. Listen to The Moment with Jorge Ramos and Paola Ramos as part of the MyCultura Podcast Network on the IHeartRadio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I started trying to get pregnant about 14. years ago now. We're getting a little bit older and it just kind of felt like the window could be closing. Bloomberg and IHeart podcast present IVF disrupted the kind body story, a podcast about a company that promised to revolutionize fertility care. Introducing Kind Body, a new generation of women's health and fertility care. Backed by millions in venture capital and private equity, it grew like a tech startup. While Kind Body did help women start families,

it also left behind a stream of disillusioned and angry patients. You think you're finally like with the right people in the right hands and then to find out again that you're just not. Don't be fooled. By what? All the bright and shiny. Listen to IVF disrupted, the Kind Body story, starting September 19 on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Janica Lopez, and in the new season of the Overcover podcast, I'm taking you on an exciting journey of self-reflection. Am I ready to enter this new part of my life? Like, am I ready to be in a relationship? Am I ready to have kids and to really just devote myself and my time? I wanted to be successful on my own, not just because of who my mom is. Like, I felt like I needed to be better or work twice as hard as she did. Join me for conversations about healing and growth.

Life is freaking hard. And growth doesn't have. happen in comfort. It happened in motion, even when you're hurting. All from one of my favorite spaces, The Kitchen. Honestly, these are going to come out so freaking amazing. Be a part of my new chapter and listen to the new season of the Overcomper podcast as part of the MyCultura podcast network on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hey, it's your favorite Jersey girl, Gia Jude Ice. Welcome to Casual Chaos, where I share my story. This week, I'm sitting down with Vanderpump Rural Star, Sheena Shea.

I don't really talk to either of them, if I'm being honest. There will be an occasional text, one way or the other, from me to Ariana, maybe a happy birthday from Ariana to me. I think the last time I talked to Tom, it was like, congrats on America's Got Talent. This is a combo you don't want to miss. Listen to casual chaos on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Isn't it amazing, though, the freedom there is in just, like, being okay to allow someone to just be who they are? Yeah, I know.

Like, without carrying any personalization or without taking it on, just to just kind of be like, it's okay. Well, I really have to do that with my parents. you know, like, because look, they're not, they're in their 70s, they're not changing, you know, like, it's like, okay, mom, that is so not something we say anymore, but, you know, we're, I don't have a ton of time left here. Yeah, you do, and you realize, like, also, like, I think, like, I really, I'm a big believer in the three generational household, and we grew up in a three-generational household. So we had grandma and we had mom. And, you know, so we, you know, we grew up with grandma down in the kitchen every morning. And, and their stories, their way of living, their perspective is so different from ours. But then it's so important

to understand it. Whether you let, whether you agree with it or not, whether it's like to have like a, there's so, there's so much wisdom in it, whether it's something. to change or whether it's something to continue on, you know? Yeah, but I think that's only, I think that's an amazing perspective to have, but that's only something you realize when you grow up and mature, you know, as a kid, you'll get me the hell out of here, this is crazy, and, you know, and you grow up and realize actually how formidable and important those things are. I think one of the weirdest things growing up and becoming an adult is when you realize that your parents are just people and not parents,

you know, when you're a kid, you think, oh, this is my mom and dad. superheroes they can do anything and then you realize oh no they're just people just trying to figure shit out um yeah awakening and then you can really start to respect them as the people they are versus having to respect them as parents and the same thing goes for anyone like you know a grandmother or a grandfather um when we were kids like i said we lived in a duplex and our dad's mom lived next door with our uncle and their kids so that was a three-generational thing and she was just a she was a bad bitch, man. She was tough. She spoke like all

the time. She drank Mickalob heavy, like all day, played cards, watched. She was a huge fan of the Washington Redskins. Oh my God. I'm like, I marry this woman. She was being hated in Washington Redskins sweatshirt, like a bad bitch. And then when you're around that as a kid growing up,

you realize like, oh man, that's like there's, that's a type of tough that you have to kind of witness at that age. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm like every Everyone's grandparents had these. It was like really huge random, like, fork and spoon that was made out of wood. Yeah.

You know, like, like, what is it? Wait, that's so funny. Yes. I know exactly what you're talking about. But every time, man, she would grab that big ass spoon and we were like, she would whip your ass. Yeah. But she grew up tough.

And this goes to your point, Kate. that being subjected to those different generations allows you the perspective that you need. Because even just the fact that our grandparents and great grandparents lived in times of actual war. Yeah. And it just changes you. It changes you in how you are and how you're raised.

And they pass that down. Yeah. And I also think that's why history too is so important. But knowing your own history, like, it is a part of like who, you wonder like, where do I get my grit? Like, where does that really come from? you know but but also like i we drive to colorado all the time and this last time i drove i just had this this like thing about america where it's like we're so fucking crazy that we decided

in order for a better life to drop everything we have and risk risk traveling hundreds of miles with wagons and horses to like for our half of our family to to to to to to to pay perish for a better for more for more and they're still doing that yeah it just it's it's it's it's it's it's it's just it's amazing to know you know how and that wasn't that long ago you know i semi recently just finished a book called undaunted courage which is about lewis and clark and it's a fucking thousand page about their entire expedition and how it's incredible i mean it's just unbelievable read really amazing all the things that had to go right in order for that to happen.

You know, it's so much of it is happenstance. It's just kind of all happened. And then, you know, it's like you go out, and your parents, your parents' parents, their parents, parents, you keep going back. I mean, you remember playing Oregon Trail as a kid? I just felt like dysentery was fucking everywhere. Everyone was getting scared, you know?

Yeah. So your ancestors are just like, well, I'm just kind of avoided dysentery. And, you know, like, there have been plagues throughout history, and it's just you are. Like, you've managed to make it through all that. your history has brought you here.

And I think, too, like, why we're so fascinated with the family dynamic is, like, that informs every choice you make. Yeah. That's it. Like, and the person you're sitting next to you, your bro, and the person that, you know, couldn't make it here today to my house, my bro is, like, a huge part of what will inform generations to come. Of course, yeah.

Of course, but there's patterns that need to be, you know, admired and, broken. You know what I'm saying? And I think that, you know, and I've done a ton of work on myself as well. And I think that, you know, there are certain moments where you look at your past and say, I'm not going to be that. And then there are certain things that you want to emulate. But I also think that there needs to be some compassion and forgiveness in the people who have created bad patterns. Because if you go back one more generation, you realize where the fuck they came from. Exactly. Totally. Exactly. And that's a really good point because you have to realize that we have the luxury of being able to take the time to fix those things.

You go back a generation or two or three, they didn't have that time. I mean, you look at the Great Depression, you look at just, you know, the Vietnam era, the civil rights era, all these things. I mean, people still kind of are just like trying to make ends meet. And we're lucky that we are in a place where we're afforded just the time and also the resources to change those things. and those will have impact. Well, not only that, but just a deeper recognition about the human condition and mental health

and understanding that these are things that need to be, that need to be tackled. You know, when my dad's dad bailed on him, my dad had no tools. There was no, there was no therapist. There was no one saying, hey, Billy, you know, you need to, we need to get through this. You know what I'm saying? Like, that just didn't fucking happen back then. So you're going to repeat that. go who's your therapist that's a conversation and you're like this is amazing that people ask that

when we were kids that was something you just don't talk about totally i mean and probably the biggest problem now is it's i mean it is therapy is just sadly a luxury i mean there's just most people could never afford it yeah yeah well how has it changed your writing like therapy yeah do you think like being more and like do you like well it's gonna change their new It's their new albums called Brothers Therapy and the first single is Patterns. Like, I mean, perfect. No, but I mean, do you think, like, the more, do you think, like, do you find that, like, because I find that sometimes a lot of artists need to live in a more chaotic type of state

to access a certain type of writing? There is, there certainly is that, but it's not that you haven't lived it. You know, it's always a lived experience that you have. And as much as I would like to forget certain things, you can't. And you can always access that. Yeah. And I think accessing it is actually quite healthy. And writing about it becomes quite cathartic.

And it's just that becomes another form of therapy. Talking about it like we're doing is another form of therapy. So it's all something that is still a part of you. Even if you're in a better place, you can still access those things if you're willing to. Yeah. I mean, that's the thing, just having the confidence, I think, to be able to go somewhere that may be vulnerable or might make you feel like, like a weak or something. You know, I think you do kind of get to a point in your life where you do have a lot

of strength in your, and your weaknesses and acknowledging them. And I, you know, as far as writing is in that regard, I mean, or creating anything, you don't want any guardrails. You don't, there's like, you don't want any area you can access. Yeah. So I feel like that is really something, the luxury that we have later in our lives now, where it doesn't seem like there really isn't anywhere we can't go if we want to. When did you start?

making music together as adults. Like you both had solo careers, right? Yeah, yeah. So, and just a brief synopsis of how it happened. I came down to Nashville first. He came down to Nashville not long after that. I was going to school here at Belmont. And he was like kind of living in my dorm room at Belmont,

but he was also 16, just telling everyone that he was in. Like I said, he had a low voice at 9. So at the time he was 16. And so, yeah. And then, you know, I don't know. Well, sounded like it was in my 30, sorry. I love my God was in my 30. What the hell?

Sounded like you're in the 30. Sorry, I got to care about that. You're also, yeah. Huge. And, and, but yeah, so I was in a separate band that's in this band. That's how I ended up writing with your uncle, Mark, the first side project. T.J. was signed to the same publishing company. we were writing a lot of songs

for the band that I was in the band felt disbanded at the time he was getting some notoriety in town we started playing shows together people thought that we were doing the duo thing but we hadn't discussed it and people kept showing up being like we love that you guys

are finally doing a band together but we're not doing a band which you know is to slight sidebar but so relevant is our mom ever since the beginning she wanted her children in a band together. Of course. Yeah. I mean, that's going to be every parent's dream. Like exactly. There's no way you could listen to your mom. You know, I was like, I'm not doing that.

Like, no, you don't know what you're talking about. And yeah, I was doing these solo shows, but I would always have him play guitar because he was, you know, badass. And then when we would finish, everyone would always be like, you guys together, not really acknowledging that there was, it wasn't a duo, but they would always talk about it like it was. And we were like, man, maybe it is supposed to be this. And then honestly, to, you know, a total lesson in admitting you're wrong and your mom's, right, is that we got together. As soon as we joined like the duo thing, everything just started like happening, like falling in place really fast. Yeah.

Shortly after. Yeah. What was your first moment of like, like, like, real noticeable, like after a show or. or maybe a meeting or something like, oh, like where you're like, oh, we're, we're, we're, we're, we're, we're, we're, we're, we're, we're, we're, we're, we're, we're, we're, we're, we're going to our publishing deal together. Again, there's a lot of buzz. He was, um, signing with this publisher in town named Kelly King. And then they were hashing out a deal and we were doing so much stuff together that they were like, hey, we can't, we want to sign you both. So the business in a way was already kind of, pushing us together. We weren't fighting it because we played music together since we were kids. It didn't seem like something that we had to think about. And at that point it was like, okay, once

you put pen and paper and ink and contracts and lawyers and shit, then it feels really, you know, it felt like a marriage in a way. And then that's when we were like, okay, we fully committed to that. And it was off to the races ever since.

It's obviously it's something that we should have listened to when we were much younger, but in a way, I wouldn't have changed the thing. Well, her original idea, I will say, is she would say, you say, I'm T.J. Osborne, and he'll say, I'm John Osborne. And it was all supposed to be our sister in there. And she'll say, I'm Natalie Osborne, and we're the siblings.

Oh, no. That's a little too far. A little bit. Like, we love you, mom, but. Like, great pitch. Great pitch. When you write, do you write with other artists as well? Yeah.

Do you always do it together? Do you ever separate and write with artists? Initially we wrote a lot together, but lately just because we don't have time, we write, we've been running a lot separately. And it's been going well. It's been interesting because, you know, obviously we have different influences and things we want to say. And there has been this. The strangest thing of it all is that for this project, we've actually written a part for the majority of. of it. We've always written together previously. And I feel like somehow it's like so far the most

us sounding music we've ever made. It's like we've been kind of always musically all over the place a little like and not necessarily we didn't want to be. We just like so many different types of music. There might be one's not country leaning when it feels like more soul or whatever. But this is oddly the most like focused sounding music we've ever done and we're not we're writing it separately, which is I don't know. Wow. No, but when you say you're writing it Are you writing it with other writers or just, just you got, oh, yeah, that's so interesting. Sometimes we write with, you know, like one of the songs on this album, like, I wrote by myself. I will do that kind of thing.

But we have, there are certain writers in town that we've written, have written with for so long that they just know us. Yeah. You know, writing with someone for the first time is fun, but it's just a little awkward. You have to get to know them. They're learning you. It's just a kind of a blind date. These writers that we write with normally we've written with for over a decade. And there's no wondering what we're about.

They know what we're about. They've written, there's one in particular, this guy named Lee Thomas Miller, is one of our favorite writers in the world. He just knows everything about us. We know everything about him. He might as well be a family member at this point. And so when we're writing separately,

he's almost like the third brother or the third beetle. And it just works. And I think building those relationships over time has been very helpful. Well, when you're writing together, when you're writing separately, I mean, is there a concept that you have in mind for the album to where it's like, well, here's kind of conceptually where we're at? It's a great question.

It actually probably points to why I think it has been so focused is, we've kind of have made a bit of like a return to where we started, like a little bit musically and also just the direction. I mean, when we first started off, I mean, we were just kind of leaving our hometowns, like we were going to bigger, better things in our minds. and then we've kind of like have come full circle and we're like you know we love where we're from and it was a huge influence on us and the people around us were a huge influence on us and we've kind of returned to the influence of that so some of us really kind of

you can kind of trace back some of them are specific some of them are a little bit more ambiguous but it is a very family small town focus to it kind of goes back to that Like, you know, with our dad was, you know, a self-employed plumber. Our mom was like a, you know, contracted hairdresser. And so there was this thread within us, even still for us, even though we're doing music,

it is, we're still like these kind of sole proprietors or whatever. And kind of this, you know, strap it up, you know, by your bootstraps and get it done kind of songs. And so it feels very focused in that way, which is probably, you know, to. I'm glad you asked that because I think that has a lot to do with why it is sounding a certain way. Because we are very focused on what we want it to be. Let me guess the title. Crab cake. No?

God, Oliver is so close. We have crabs, but we have crabs. That would be an amazing. If you could still do hidden cracks, that would be. Well, you can create a separate genre called crab cake country. That's actually really good. Crab cake country. It's like a sort of a subgenre of country music, Maryland country.

Grab cake country. September always feels like the start of something new, whether it's back to school, new projects, or just a fresh season. It's the perfect time to start dreaming about your next adventure. I love that feeling of possibility, thinking about where to go next, what kind of place we'll stay in,

and how to make it feel like home. I'm already imagining the kind of Airbnb that would make the trip unforgettable, somewhere with charm, character, and a little local flavor. If you're planning to be away this September, why not consider hosting your home on Airbnb while you're gone? Your home could be the highlight of someone else's trip,

a cozy place to land, a space that helps them feel like a local. And with Airbnb's co-host feature, you can hire a local co-host to help with everything from managing bookings to making sure your home is guest ready. Find a co-host at Airbnb.ca slash host. I'm Jorge Ramos. And I'm Paola Ramos.

Together we're launching The Moment, a new podcast about what it means to live through a time, as uncertain as this one. We sit down with politicians. I would be the first immigrant mayor in generations, but 40% of New Yorkers were born outside of this country. Artists and activists, I mean, do you ever feel demoralized? I might personally lose hope.

This individual might lose the faith, but there's an institution that doesn't lose faith. And that's what I believe in. To bring you depth and analysis from a unique Latino perspective. There's not a single day that Paola and I don't call or text each other, sharing news and thoughts about what's happening in the country. This new podcast will be a way to make that ongoing intergenerational conversation public. Listen to The Moment with Jorge Ramos and Paolo.

as part of the MyCultura Podcast Network on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I started trying to get pregnant about four years ago now. We're getting a little bit older, and it just kind of felt like the window could be closing. Bloomberg and IHeart Podcasts present. IVF Disrupted, the Kind Body Story, a podcast about a company that promised to revolutionize fertility care. Introducing Kind Body, a new generation of women's health and fertility care. Backed by millions in venture capital and private equity, it grew like a tech startup. While Kind Body did help women start families, it also left behind a stream of disillusioned and angry patients.

You think you're finally like with the right people in the right hands, and then to find out again that you're just not. Don't be fooled. By what? All the bright and shiny. Listen to IVF Disrupted, the Kind Body Story, starting September 19 on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Jenna Lopez, and in the new season of the Overcover podcast, I'm taking you on an exciting journey of self-reflection. Am I ready to enter this new part of my life? Like, am I ready to be in a relationship?

Am I ready to have kids and to really just devote myself and my time? I wanted to be successful on my own, not just because of who my mom is. Like, I felt like I needed to be better or work twice as hard as she did. Join me for conversations about healing and growth. Life is freaking hard. And growth doesn't happen in comfort. It happens in motion, even when you're hurting. All from one of my favorite spaces, The Kitchen.

Honestly, these are going to come out so freaking amazing. Be a part of my new chapter and listen to the new season of the Overcomper podcast as part of the MyCultura podcast network on the IHHHHHH Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hey, it's your favorite jersey girl, Gia Judice. Welcome to Casual Chaos, where I share my story. This week, I'm sitting down with Vanderpump Rolls Star, Sheena Shea. I don't really talk to either of them, if I'm being honest.

There will be an occasional text, one way or the other, from me to Ariana, maybe a happy birthday from Ariana to me. I think the last time I talked to Tom, it was like, congrats on America. got talent. This is a combo you don't want to miss. Listen to Casual Chaos on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. So, TJ, I can't, we have to tap on this because it's such a huge, I mean, it's a very admirable

you're coming out, you know, in country music. You were like the first, you know, kind of. country music, sort of signed country music to a major label to come out as gay. You did? Wait, what? What? And I just wonder, like, how, I just want to, like, how did that, was it just like a no-brainer you just had to do it?

Or was it like, was it really challenging for you? Were you scared? I have so many questions. Yeah, I mean, I could talk about this for a lot. time, but I mean, I guess, you know, yeah, so I was really fearful. I knew I always wanted to come out. In fact, John had referenced earlier where we sat down and signed the contract together. And before that happened, I actually came out to him then. I'm like, before we are like contractually bound to one another, you need to know that I'm gay. And it was really sweet. He's like, you know, he knew. And we had a very emotional moment. But I was like, I don't intend on staying. it forever. Like, I have to do this. Now, my kind of goal the whole time was, like, I wanted to have success and kind of do it at the height of our career. And then it was like, well, how the hell do you know you're at the height of your career? You don't know that to go down. And so I was

like, well, you know, the whole thing of what I didn't want to have, what the biggest thing that was the hardest for me, actually was emotionally I was at peace with myself for the most part. My family, my close the people that needed to know new I had had relationships um I had come to you know peace with myself uh it was the fact that I just didn't want it to really look opportunistic but the problem is is there's always something to promote there's like an album we just released or there's a tour about to happen or a single we just put out or and so it was really really challenging to figure out when that space happened and honestly COVID really made that room for me and in that moment there was no touring we put out an album already and we

weren't going to release one for a while and I'm like this is the best window of opportunity I'm probably ever going to have and it was like let's just take a leap of faith and do this and I will say I think probably what people use the word of having the courage or whatever but what really gave it to me wasn't innate it was actually the people around me like John my manager people that had something about really something to lose themselves who didn't have one even well what well maybe you should wait till it was everyone was just like we got you we love you um and you know it was time and so when it happened um it was also it was there was so many things that that were gone on and about it but i tell you what was really weird is the one the article was written i wasn't you i wasn't

allowed to see it until it was released it was um came out through uh time magazine and they were like you can't see the pictures, you can't see anything, because you know editing. And I was like, and so then they were like, well, this article's going to go live. And no one, they're like, I think it will go live tomorrow. But if we were in the middle of the election, which was another thing, do I want to come out in the middle of this? We're like, well, if there's some bombastic news between Biden and Trump, you're going to get bunked out for that, obviously. And so I was like, which, by the way, that was happening every week. So I was like, what is this going to happen or not?

So when the article came live, I was like, my manager was like, it just, she's like, it just went, went up. And I was like, I felt like literally the error just was like, yeah, and then my phone was blowing up and I'm reading the article and I'm like crying and I'm laughing. And it was like this thing that I did not expect to have in that moment. I kind of originally, I just wanted to do it and not talk about it and just get on with my life like it always been. I felt totally different. The minute it happened, I was like, you know, I want to talk about this. It's not visibility if I don't. And secondly, you know, in that article, Sam Lansky wrote,

and I came to know Sam through Jason Owen, manager. And Sam, it was the simplest thing. The most simplest things are always right here. But I was like, you know, it's just a small part of me that I'm gay. It's not like, you know, who cares? And he was like, well, what if it isn't? Like, what if it's actually the biggest part of you? And I was like, I never, I think I minimized it so much for like my, wait a minute.

Yeah. And I'm like, well, it is. It is a huge part of me, you know, and I've minimized this about me just to feel better about it. It must have felt like you finally got like your first biggest breath of air, like, in terms of like, you know, like a huge weight being lifted off. but all of that emotion, but finally, like you say, like having, being able to actually be able to just talk about it. Yeah. And I, you know, reference it actually to an earlier thing you talked about, but I didn't

want to go up, get in the weeds with this, at least in reference to whatever we were speaking about at the moment. But is, you were talking about just kind of places you go creatively. And I felt like it was really sitheling to me creatively when I would write because there were so many topics I would avoid because I didn't want to be questions about it. But all of our music, for the most part, it's always been kind of non-binary because of that, which actually ended up being a beautiful byproduct of our music. It is that way, so it's kind of a lot of people can see themselves in the narrative's narrative.

But I, you know, in that regard, I was like, holy cow, like being on stage. I was, I never realized I was having this, like, micromanaging moments in my mind, split seconds, where I may not do a gesture that I thought might be perceived as unmasculine, or something, you know, or these aren't things I was conscious of until I didn't have to do it anymore. And I was like, holy shit. Like, I could go out on stage and do it all I wanted to.

Did you get any negative sort of feedback or haters or just, you know, assholes, essentially? Yes and no. Yes and no. We had kind of, because we knew we wanted, we wanted to do this from kind of jump, we had to have really slowly, like, curating a fan base that we knew would probably be pretty,

accepting of it or our first big hit was say a little longer God and I look like now like the balls we had like we in context now this doesn't seem that crazy but then there was

we had like a gay couple in there been an interracial couple in there and all these things that now seem kind of like who cares but at the time it fucking pissed people so they didn't want to kill literally wanted to kill us

really yeah we had like death threats and so I was like well you think that's crazy give it Just wait. Holy shit. And so anyhow, so by the time we kind of got here, I don't think it was necessarily like, you know, we kind of were okay with shedding some of those early on that we knew.

Yeah. Yeah. So yes. However, you know, there's a lot of people that are going to hate anyways. I mean, you guys, I'm sure know this as well as anyone. And we get asked all the time, like, when did you guys first feel like he was successful? And we always say, like, when we got haters, when people started talking shit. Like, we're doing something.

But inevitably, people are always saying something mean or making something about whatever. But the country music community at large is very receptive. Extremely so. And in fact, people that I didn't even expect, some of the more conservative artists in the world of met, who were really super, super cool with me. And it's been, yeah, it's been quite a wonderful experience. Yeah. I think it's amazing. And there's, you know, I know, like, in certain parts, like the four corners of the U.S., you know, certain things have been more acceptable at times.

But, like, you're that, that, that, that, there's certain moves that people make that, like, open, you open the floodgate for a lot of different artists. And so. And you've done that, I've seen a lot of gay country artists. It's just amazing, yeah. And now, you, there's quite a few of them in Nashville. and I don't think they would have had that courage without him doing with you. It's amazing.

Certainly encouraged me that I had seen at the time, you know, like a very well-known, like radio personality and public group of CMT, like Cody Allen, came out not that long ago, and it was super encouraging. And then artist, songwriters, I'm sure you've probably written with Kate or like seeing like Shane McAnally and people who were figures from like kind of the underbelly

Nashville that had become like really well-known and just had these very seamless lives. and you know and there is and there tends to always be this kind of thing where people who will say like the first like he was the first you know the whatever category of this person to ever do this and some some people have gotten twisted about that and I feel like it's it's a little it kind of is distracting from what the real narrative is to me I don't really to me it was like not about being the last you know like I don't really give a shit whether I was the first or the fourth or the eighth or whatever.

I just want to go hopefully. And, you know, me and our family friend Fancy, who's openly gay, amazing artist. I love that name. That I almost named my daughter Fancy. Really? Well.

I did. Fancy Fugia. And everybody's like, you're nuts. And I'm like, I love that name. Pretty amazing. I think he named himself in this instance, but I, uh, that is a different.

very beautiful. However, I, you know, I think was this kind of, he had mentioned this, and I think it's right on spot on. It's just to get to a place of where it's just not even, doesn't even need to be mentioned. Some people will say to me, they're like, who cares? Stop talking about it. No one cares. And I'm like, sweetie, I wish they didn't.

Like, trust me. There's no one born in the world that wished it was not a thing than me. believe me. September always feels like the start of something new, whether it's back to school, new projects, or just a fresh season. It's the perfect time to start dreaming about your next adventure.

I love that feeling of possibility, thinking about where to go next, what kind of place we'll stay in, and how to make it feel like home. I'm already imagining the kind of Airbnb that would make the trip unforgettable, somewhere with charm, character, and a little local flavor. If you're planning to be away this September,

why not consider hosting your home on Airbnb while you're gone? Your home could be the highlight of someone else's trip, a cozy place to land, a space that helps them feel like a local. And with Airbnb's co-host feature, you can hire a local co-host to help with everything from managing bookings to making sure your home is guest ready. Find a co-host at Airbnb.ca slash host. I'm Jorge Ramos.

And I'm Paola Ramos. Together we're launching The Moment, a new podcast about what it means to live through a time, as uncertain as this one. We sit down with politicians. I would be the first immigrant mayor in generations, but 40% of New Yorkers were born outside of this country. Artists and activists, I mean, do you ever feel demoralized? I might personally lose hope. This individual might lose the faith, but there's an institution that doesn't lose faith. And that's what I believe in.

To bring you depth and analysis from a unique Latino perspective. There's not a single day that Paola and I don't call or text each other, sharing news and thoughts about what's happening in the country. This new podcast will be a way to make that ongoing intergenerational conversation public. Listen to The Moment with Jorge Ramos and Paola Ramos as part of the MyCultura podcast network on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I started trying to get pregnant about four years ago now.

We're getting a little bit older, and it just kind of felt like the window could be closing. Bloomberg and IHeard podcast present. IVF disrupted, the Kind Body story. A podcast about a company that promised to revolutionize fertility care. Introducing Kind Body, a new generation of women's health and fertility care. Backed by millions in venture capital and private. equity, it grew like a tech startup. While Kind Body did help women start families, it also left behind a stream of disillusioned and angry patients. You think you're finally like with the right

people in the right hands, and then to find out again that you're just not. Don't be fooled. By what? All the bright and shiny. Listen to IVF disrupted, the kind body story, starting September 19 on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Janica Lopez, and in the new season of the Overcover podcast, I'm taking you on an exciting journey of self-reflection. Am I ready to enter this new part of my life? Like, am I ready to be in a relationship? Am I ready to have kids and to really just devote myself and my time? I wanted to be successful on my own, not just because of who my mom is.

Like, I felt like I needed to be better or work twice as hard as she did. Join me for conversations about healing and growth. Life is freaking hard. And growth doesn't happen in comfort. It happens in motion, even when you're hurting. All from one of my favorite spaces, The Kitchen. Honestly, these are going to come out so freaking amazing. Be a part of my new chapter and listen to the new season of the Overcumper podcast

as part of the MyCultura podcast network on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Hey, it's your favorite jersey girl, Gia Jude Ice. Welcome to Casual Chaos, where I share my story. This week, I'm sitting down with Vanderpump Rural Star, Sheena Shea. I don't really talk to either of them, if I'm being honest. There will be an occasional text, one way or the other, from me to Ariana. Maybe a happy birthday from Ariana to me. I think the last time I talked to Tom, it was like,

congrats on America's Got Talent. This is a combo you don't want to miss. Listen to Casual Chaos on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Have you had other artists confide in you about their sexuality and ask you sort of, I'm not ready to do this yet, but how did you do it and, you know, anything like that? Yeah, I mean, there has been. I'm obviously not outing outing people. Of course not, but I'm just saying just generally.

I think there has, mostly what I've gotten is people that have been like, hey, thanks. like it's mostly from the fans like not even artists or people who were like you know I've always loved country but I always felt uncomfortable being at the shows or like I never really and that makes me feel so good like people can have someone that that makes them you know I've had a couple people um who were like who did come out that post were like you know you were one of the people that helped encourage me and that is that means more than any of the yeah yeah with our careers I mean and that I'm just music in general. It's like being able to have an impact on someone's life and a positive

effect is just always, I mean, it's really, it's the, you originally want to go and be like, oh, I want to be successful. And I want to, you know, kind of like, man, when these, when those things happen, you realize, holy shit, that's really what it's about. What an amazing thing to, to also like, you know, you're, again, it's like there's nothing, there's, there's nothing self-serving about the need for you and the, the thing for you to have to just be open. with you who you are transparent like just like have that freedom but not to know the kind of impact that it actually would made would have made on others you know it's like that that is the purest form of like how to really make a difference for people is when it's just coming from

the most honest place of like you weren't even thinking the kind of impact it could have made you know that's what's amazing and that's there's some part of me that actually it's like it does almost feel a little more selfish. I mean, I had to, like, I had to have to it for me. Like, I was in, and the other thing that was really tore me up is people that were around me who felt like they had, it was like their cross to bear. And I'm like, guys, like there was someone who accidentally out of me once. And he came to me and he was like, he was like, I feel horrible. I thought this person knew. And I'm like, brother, like, it's fine. Like, you don't have to lose a second asleep. You shouldn't. Like, it's not, you know, if you've done it in malice,

I would probably be. I was like, you know what? This is bullshit that, you know, we're close. John and I, we have always been very like who we are unabashedly. And, you know, I felt like this one thing is just like really, it's conflicting with like just who we are, you know? And it was just time. I was like this has to happen.

And, you know, again, I feel like it has made my, the bond stronger with those around me. Some people that maybe felt like they didn't really know me very well because I kept my distance for this reason. And man, like my relationship has gotten better. But I think the biggest thing is honestly with our fans, I feel like my relationship with them has gotten like so honest. And it's really brought like a closeness, I feel like, between me and them. I was hiding from so much. I didn't want to get close to a lot of people that I didn't trust. Yeah.

And where it's like pretty, pretty bad ass. Yeah, to see their support was amazing coming out. in support of TJ and it felt it was it made our relationship so much stronger and you have a love and appreciation for them already because they're taking time or their lives and spending money to come see you um but that felt like so um so purposeful and honest and sincere and that was just an amazing moment to witness and our mom finally accepted it she you know for the longest time she was like she'd be when I first came out to her she said you know I told her she goes oh no you're not I'm like, I am.

Like, no, you're not. And I'm like, it's a phase. And then she's like, well, is your sister gay? I'm like, what the hell? Man, you know, like, what the hell? They've seen the way I dress. There's like, there's no way that dude's guy. I was like, you know, I was like, you know, I was talking with someone.

I said, it takes sometimes your parents a long time to come around to it. I was like, you know, my mom, it took her many years to, you know, finally come to terms with it. She's like, you're right. But I still think you need to be with Miranda Lambert. And I was like, I take that back. I think she's still struggling with this actually. Oh, my gosh. So she was just sort of in a bit of denial, essentially, but not angry.

She was more of denial. She was an hairdresser for Christ's sake. That's what I'm saying, right, yeah. The first gay man ever saw my life was like her coworker. I was just like, oh, my God. this is so much fun I want to hang out those yeah you guys

I don't know but you do you do whatever you want but I will likely be drinking me too I'll be drinking I'll be 100% be drinking it's just about a I need a break and then I need to learn to mitigate and have my nights where it's wild and crazy I believe I feel like this part of you taking a break because I coincidentally have myself

yeah I'm just taking a break because I just need it I, you know, and a reset. I need a reset. I also need to prove to myself that I do actually have control. Yeah. Oh, oh, one million percent. A million percent. By the way, these 10 days, it's going to be three weeks.

Then I go to Cabo for a golf tournament. There we go. I will be drinking. Which is a disaster. Next week for our soon-to-be brother-in-law's bachelor party. Oh, fun. Fun. Fun, exactly.

So it's going to happen. I just, you know. Well, we have to, I have to get to Nashville. Maybe I will get Ollie out there. we can do like some sibling revelry shows. I lived there for two years. I did the show Nashville for two years. I was on.

That's right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I just live right near Belmont. I live right just down the street from Belmont, actually. You lived over there for like 15 years. It's the best spot. Well, we should make a, we should. The Gladstone building.

Yeah. Oh, that's right. You were in Nashville. I forgot. Yeah, I lived there. The Gladstone building, you know, near a Belmeadish. I think that was my favorite thing you've done is Nashville. I loved that.

I'm convinced that show is partly the reason actually I think a big reason why Nashville as a city has blown the fuck up but everyone knew about Nashville but once they saw like they got a window into it

the city has changed yeah yeah that wild a wild window a soap opera window of Nashville that's right oh you guys are the best we gotta end with our question

because you're which is all you you ask it's a two-parter um basically you're looking at your brother and what is that thing that you would love to emulate something that he has that you wish that you had and then and then the flip of that is the flip of that is what would you what would you want to alleviate from your brother something that you know if you could take away their life would be better. I would say John is very patient, except from

we're both impatient drivers. But outside of that, John has a lot of patience. It is one of my weakest qualities I wish I had it, but I don't. And alleviate from him, I would say one of my strengths is actually I don't really get that stressed or hold that

much anxiety for whatever reason. So give me something. alleviate that anxiety. That's right. I get that. I appreciate that. I My brother is a very bold, brave, strong person, even aside from coming out of his country artists, it's kind of his nature. A lot of times of meetings, he'll, like, go for the jugular,

and I'm like, hell yeah, that's not kind of my nature, and it's really great to have that. And also his big muscles. Probably his lack of efficiency. Because I know it's not necessarily like, oh, my God. It's just, I don't know it kind of, It does trouble him as well as it doesn't people around him. It does trouble him.

But, you know, more just the kind of like the white knuckling side of things and, you know, and that as well. So I would, you know, just give him maybe a little bit of, I don't know, maybe I should give him one of my, my SSRI. Yeah, of course. That's good. Or Xanax. Oh, you guys are the best.

This was fun, boys. This is a blast. So much fun. I would love to. So fun. Yeah. We'd have a great time, no doubt. Thank you for having us, you guys.

You guys are so busy. Yeah. This was great. Thanks for coming on. Bye guys. Oh, cool guys. They're the best. We need to hang out.

There's so many people who always avoid we need to hang out with. No, but we will hang out with them because they're close with the, you know, the sort of inner circle of the team. But they're so great. And what a wonderful, what wonderful spirits and energy. and I love it. So fun. I love everybody that we talk to. But then every once in a while,

there's just the people that feel like you came from the same, like we came from such different backgrounds, but we're cut from a similar cloth. Yes. You know? One million percent. You immediately feel like with them completely comfortable. I feel like I could say absolutely anything,

which of course I did. And it's just, I love that. I love that. And I also think it goes back to what we're talking. talking about when it comes to like how you were how you like your your history your family history yeah and you obviously like they had some you know people in their history that had real you know wild hairs up their heinie yeah and so did we yeah a lot of wild hairs up a lot of hynies yeah yeah yes and out of that comes a certain type of energy yeah you know exactly that's

the meshing of those two energies it's good oh i love you I love you. I'm Jorge Ramos. And I'm Paola Ramos. Together we're launching The Moment, a new podcast about what it means to live through a time, as uncertain as this one. We sit down with politicians, artists, and activists

to bring you death and analysis from a unique Latino perspective. The moment is a space for the conversations we've been having us father and daughter for years. Listen to The Moment with Jorge Ramos and Paola Ramos. on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Introducing IVF Disrupted, the Kind Body Story, a podcast about a company that promised to revolutionize fertility care. It grew like a tech startup. While Kind Body did help women start families, it also left behind a stream of disillusioned and angry patients.

You think you're finally like in the right hands. You're just not. Listen to IvyF Disrupted, the Kind Body Story. on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, it's your favorite Jersey girl, Gia Judice. Welcome to Casual Chaos, where I share my story. This week, I'm sitting down with Vanderpump Rural Star, Sheena Shea. I don't really talk to either of them, if I'm being honest. There will be an occasional text, one way or the other, from me to Ariana.

Maybe a happy birthday from Ariana to me. I think the last time I talked to Tom, it was like, congrats on America's Got Talent. This is a combo you don't want to miss. Listen to Casual Chaos on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. It may look different, but Native Culture is alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. Somewhere along the way, it turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop. That's Dr. Lee Francis IV, who opened the first Native comic bookshop.

Explore his story along with many other native stories on the show, Burn Sage Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey guys, it's Stephanie Beatriz. And Melissa Fumero, and this is More Better. We are jumping right in and ready to hear from you. Your thoughts, your questions, your feelings about socks with sandals. And we're ready to share some possibly questionable advice and hot takes. God, that sucks so hard though. I'm so sorry.

Can you out petty them? Can you match their pettiness for funzies? Yeah. All the things. Because aren't we all trying to get a little more better? Listen to more better on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast.