Small Town Murder - #117 - Sexier Than Coal in Jasper, Alabama

Episode Date: May 2, 2019

This week, in Jasper, Alabama, a women seems to be the siren of coal country, as she attracts, and seemingly eventually marries most of the men in town. The problems start when she begins to forget to get divorced before remarrying... multiple times. This leads to warrants, fighting, greed, lust, and somebody ending up dead. This is a crazy tale of intertwined relationships, and some serious panhandle behavior!!Along the way, we find out about whether experiencing the past is always a good thing, exactly how many concurrent marriages are too many, and how many people have to know you wanted to kill someone before you're actually caught!!Hosted by James Pietragallo & Jimmie Whisman New episodes every Thursday! Donate at: patreon.com/crimeinsports or go to paypal.com & use our email: [e-mail] Go to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things Small Town Murder & Crime In Sports! Follow us on... twitter.com/@murdersmall facebook.com/smalltownpod instagram.com/smalltownmurder Also, check out James & Jimmie's other show, Crime In Sports! On iTunes, Stitcher, or wherever you listen to podcasts See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. What if you married the love of your life and then stood by them as they developed 21 new identities? What would you do? This Is Actually Happening is a weekly podcast that features extraordinary true stories of life-changing events told by the people who lived them. Listen to the newest season of This Is Actually Happening on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. This week in Jasper, Alabama, lust, greed, evil, and just plain stupid all simmer together to make a thick, hearty murder stew. Welcome to Small Town Murder. hello everybody and welcome back to small town murder yay yay indeed jimmy yay indeed my name

is james petra gallo i'm here with my co-host i am jimmy wissman thank you folks so much for joining us again on another incredibly wild insane uh episode of small town murder i don't even know what to say after last week because that was just i i don't even know that was the the highest that was mount everest of crazy yeah of just crazy circumstances and pocket robins and we've all had rocking robin stuff pocket robin stuck in our heads for a week now. We've all been singing that shit. I have a whole song full of verses. You have no idea how embarrassed I am that I've pretty much constructed an entire Pocket Robin song. You wrote a new song.

About a guy eating birds because he's a vampire murdering weirdo. Who's the guy that sings that song? Okay, I looked this up. I had to text Jimmy. Everybody, Rockin' Robin, the original Pocket Robin singer there his name is bobby day in case you don't know he's a great singer bobby day's real name his birth name stage name no stage name bobby day birth name robert bird come on robert fucking bird you gotta be kidding me man i've said no it's all meant to be man it's meant to be he wrote pocket robin and i was like i can't do that i can't do that he cooked up the buzzard and the

oreo no that's not gonna work he bought we'll do that we'll change the words so anyway wild episode last week go back and listen to that back in massachusetts in the northeast if you did not hear it but uh before we get to this week's episode, and it's another wild one, man. It's a doozy. Before that, Little House Cleaning, thank you to everybody for your reviews this week, your Apple Podcasts, iTunes, whatever the hell they are, reviews, Purple Icon. They helped drive us up the charts. So anybody who did that, God, we appreciate it so much.

If you haven't done it yet, that's an easy thing you can do to help the show. Give us five stars. It doesn't matter what you say. It's an easy thing you can do to help the show. Give us five stars. It doesn't matter what you say. It's not for our ego. Just to drive us up the charts. And wherever you listen, do the same. Wherever you listen, listen on Spotify or whatever. Do that.

Stitcher. I don't know. Check all those places out. Listen to that. There's somewhere you could do it. There's somewhere. Also, go to shutupandgivememurder.com for all your small town murder and crime and sports needs, first of all. And if you're not listening to crime and sports, you're hurting yourself.

Really, at this point, you're just hurting yourself. We'll tell you this. It's better if you don't like sports. That's the best way to say it. It's better. We won't ruin anything for you because most of it is really making fun of the whole thing. And so if you dislike sports, you're like, ah, that's all shitty. You'll like it more.

We promise you. I love sports. And I don't know. You can love sports. I don't know 90% of this shit. Yeah. So check it out. It has nothing to do with sports.

It's just people with good lives that completely screw them up. But that's an interesting story no matter what it is. They just happen to be athletes. But from shutupandgivememurder.com, you can get all your crime and sports and small town murder needs all of your uh your shirts and your merchandise your tour dates and your tour information not yet soon though in the next couple weeks we will we will be announcing the tour tickets will go on sale all the dates uh we can just give you some cities briefly here uh we're going to be, let's see, Dallas, Houston. What about Tampa? Tampa, Orlando, Atlanta.

What about Cleveland? Cleveland. We're going to Cleveland. Columbus. Des Moines, Iowa, for Christ's sake. Milwaukee, Chicago, Minneapolis. Absolutely. We're going to... Chicago?

Did you say that? I said Chicago. Philly, Pittsburgh. We won't forget about you, Pennsylvania. Oh, Pittsburgh. I can't wait. Pittsburgh, Boston. Hello, D.C.

We're going there. What am I missing? wait. Pittsburgh. Boston. Hello, D.C. We're going there. What am I missing? L.A. San Diego. West Coast. We're hitting you. Utah. Salt Lake, we're coming to you.

Denver. Coming back there because we liked it so much. A new one that we haven't been to. We're missing a couple. There's one called Burlington. Do you know where that's at? Fucking Vermont. Vermont.

I've never been there. It's in the map. I think we're going. I don't know. We're going places is what we're saying so we'll announce the whole thing nothing's for sale yet we promise that we will uh tell you as soon as it is we're all there charlotte charlotte here's the disclaimer quickly before we get into this because we have a thick episode we don't want to we don't want to get delay too much this is a comedy podcast yeah we're comedians we make fun of some stuff because there's there's a lot of stuff to make fun of when people

screwed up lives, and we're going to do that. Sorry. That's just the way it is. What we do, though, is we go out of our way not to make fun of the victims or the victims' families. That's how we work this because we're assholes, but we're not scumbags. That's true. And we feel better and we can sleep at night doing it like that.

So if that sounds good to you, then damn it, you're in for a goddamn good time. Damn it and damn it all. You're in for a good time. It's going to be crazy. Anybody who doesn't think true crime and comedy should ever go together from some moral standpoint, then you're not going to like the show. You're going to hate me. Have a good one.

Me too. You're definitely not going to like me. So have a good one and thanks for joining us. Everybody else, stand atop your desks or out your car windows or your hammies just scream it while your children are sleeping and you're doing housework or whatever you're doing or walking around scream shut up and give me murder damn it ruin those kids dreams let's go on a trip jimmy what do you say i'd love to let's do this we've been in the northeast for two weeks yeah we have we have. We've been in Eastern Pennsylvania and Massachusetts.

We normally bounce around. Let's go to the opposite of Massachusetts, Alabama. Okay. The absolute opposite. Not geographically so much. Well, north and south, but pretty much every other way. Jasper, Alabama, we're going to. Jasper, Alabama.

That sounds like a small town from a movie. Yeah. That really does. That's my old neighbor's dog's name. And that dog was vicious as fuck. Jasper. Isn't that a family guy of the old molester guys? Yes.

Come on. Jasper. That's it. Come on. Come on. Jasper. Let's watch some candy. I think that's what he does.

A lot of whiskey. Mike Henry's the actor. Oh, is that who that is? Funny as shit. He also does Cleveland. Oh. Yeah. He's a very versatile voice actor. He's funny. That's intense? Funny as shit. He also does Cleveland. Oh. Yeah, he's a very versatile voice actor.

He's funny. That's intense. Yeah, he does very different. So much range. Yeah, it is actually, yeah. An old molester to Cleveland. An old black actor. Pretty good.

To an old guy that touches kids. Not too shabby. Impressive. Yeah, because the black guy definitely doesn't touch kids. No. I mean, you know, of Cleveland. He doesn't sound anywhere near it. No, not at all.

So Jasper's in North Central Alabama here. Right kind of just in the middle. It's known as the tolerance belt. No, it's not at all. So Jasper's in north central Alabama here. Right kind of just in the middle. It's known as the tolerance belt. No, it's not at all. It's not known as the tolerance belt. Whatever the opposite of that would be. It's known as the, I don't know, the intolerance belt. It's a big notch in the Bible belt.

We'll put it that way. 45 minutes outside of Birmingham, Alabama. So it's kind of a little, you know, almost a suburb of Birmingham. About four and a half hours down to Mobile, Alabama, down in the corner there, which makes it about four hours and 45 minutes to Irvington, Alabama, which is our last Alabama episode. 73. I think I'll read it again. Which is amazingly funny. You should listen to that episode.

We have a good time down there. This is in Walker County. Zip code 35501. Area code 205. It's a big area because it's pretty rural. It's a big area, 28.63 square miles. Jesus. So a very large, spread out area.

Their motto here, their town motto is, it's kind of a frightening motto. Their motto here, their town motto, it's kind of a frightening motto. Anytime, we always do this, but anytime the South references the past in a motto, we tend to be a little, it just gets your, you just kind of go, what was that? Gets your attention. What are we talking about? Let's see here. Their motto, quote, experience from the past, knowledge for the future. Let's cut out half of that.

Let's go. Knowledge for the future. No experiences. We remember, but we'd like to forget. Let's not. Yeah. Not a lot of people here want to experience the past, probably. Let's just all not do that.

Pricing Alzheimer's. Yeah. Or their alternate slogan, heads up, I think they're starting again. That's a different segment of the population. That's their motto, whereas there's a different motto for another segment. I don't know which one is which, we'll say, but, you know, I think they're starting again. You can probably understand who that is. So history here.

We'll go through the history real quick here. Lorenzo Dow was the first guy to establish a trading post in the area in the early 1800s. There's nothing there. He just stuck up a trading post. And they just stick up a trading post, and it wasn't any traffic, really. It was just like, if anybody wanders by this area, then I'm standing here. I was hoping he was going to be half of the Jones market. It's a pretty good idea. It's not him?

No, it's not Dow and Jones. Just had a post. Just Lorenzo Dow. He's hanging out down there. Might have had a cousin up there that was more successful. Put his trading post in a better area. Not just in the woods

in the middle of northern Alabama. Put it right there on goddamn Wall Street. Yeah, it's a better place. Much better place. More traffic, more people. You'd think so. You'd think so. So in 1822,

a guy named Dr. Gordon Musgrogrove sounds like a sexy uh kind of happening swinging kind of guy doesn't he gordon musgrove he donated the land for the town and built a log cabin that was the courthouse school and church oh all of those things should be separate first of all multi-purpose building none of those things should be housed anywhere near each other they should be in separate corners of the town school court church keep the criminals away from the children and keep all those people away from church and keep the church away from all those people just keep both these criminals away from the church the school they should never intermingle exactly there you go don't intermingle and so yeah, the town was named by a guy named Hugh Lawler in memory of a Revolutionary War hero named Sergeant William Jasper,

who was in the Battle of Fort Maltry in South Carolina. And he was named after him. And it was settled in around 1815 when Dow came in here, incorporated all the way in 1886. So after the civil war during the civil civil war here union troops who were marching towards selma uh burned the courthouse and several other buildings yeah uh through here this was in the burn all this shit on the way to the ocean campaign policy oh yeah yeah that was uh leave nothing yeah nothing behind nothing nothing that can aid the enemy was what it was.

So they raided the farms for supplies. They stripped this shit bare. Salted the earth behind them. Is that where salt of the earth comes from? No, no. Salt of the earth is a good thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's what I mean.

Salting the earth is a bad thing. It's a horrible thing. It's totally a... Salt of the earth. It's like salting the earth is creating it to start anew. Is that what that is? I don't think so. I think it's like you maybe i don't know i don't know i know that salt of the earth is like just wholesome yeah i guess it would like that would be like something that

if you sifted out the right all the good parts the soil the the salts that would be left on top of the good shit would be them i have no idea but they would salt the earth which is why uh they didn't actually do that but oh to these people that's what it was and therefore that's why uh every southern flea market 98 of the uh of the tents are just confederate memorabilia and nothing else just flags and things like that and you just hear that they're starting again they go experience the past. No. Both sides of the aisle, all the way down the flea market.

Just flags. I've been to one in North Carolina. I was like, wow. That's a lot. There's a lot of Confederate flags. It's just a lot. Like, one or two tents would be a lot to me. I just got there from New York, so I didn't know.

But to see all of it i said is this a confederate flea market it's got like a couple of like boots with paintings and like a old starting lineup figures and shit like what are we doing here this is just all that we have we just got this it sells well and it was packed in there like i just people want to go buy some more confederate memorabilia every weekend. It just, holy shit. So anyway, after the Civil War is when the kind of the boom happened here. That's when the railroad, of course, came through.

They committed to come through Jasper, and the population grows from 200 people in 1886 to more than 3,000 in 1890. Oh, my God. from 200 people in 1886 to more than 3,000 in 1890. Oh, my God. So in less than five years, just the railroad, just to be able to get to and from the fucking place, boom. It shot up. Plus, with the railroad is industry also. And then there was coal mines there.

And with the railroad, they could take their coal out, and then they needed more workers. Brilliant. And that's how it goes. That railroad really did a shitload for America. Well, it did. Yeah. It made connected shit. Everything possible. Well, it did. Yeah, it made connected shit. Everything possible.

Well, it connected people. Besides that, before that, that was the only way you could travel besides a horse. So, you know, before cars and trucks and things, without the railroad, we'd just be sitting where we were. You ever ridden in a horse and buggy?

Like, in the buggy? Oh, no, that's no fun at all. I would kill myself if I had to go from New York to L.A. in that shit. Imagine that, well, with no roads but nothing just a trail rolling over pebbles and rocks this trail isn't bad i guess and the corpses of the people before you died the last people who died of dysentery along the trail you know with the shit here what a terrible ride yeah so uh in 1891 the paper said here the newspaper says there were six coal mines uh two

sandstone quarries 400 coke ovens hell yeah they were they were cooking it up good get out there on that corner we are baking it up get more baking soda we need to we make this rock motherfucker let's do this there's coke ovens here but i don't know what they're for i don't know what they're what they're cooking with that sort of mining i assume yeah they had a foundry a machine shop oh two sawmills a bricks a brick works four hotels and two banks in 1891 it's great they had 300 people five years before that i mean this is like uh if you think of like tombstone yeah there's like a kind of an eastern tombstone like we had nothing and then we just had to throw this town up quick as people came here you have to be just positive about everything like we're gonna be a fucking huge

this is this is the shit we've done jasper we've jasper baby it's gonna be on everybody's jasper oh boy so uh franklin roosevelt while he was, visited the town in 1940 to attend the memorial service of a friend of his, William Bankhead. Jasper is the county seat here. Very important. They have all the paperwork. God damn it. They fought and killed for it. I'm sure it's the county seat of Walker County, and it's located in the middle of what they call the Warrior Coal Fields, which are there.

It's the second largest coal fields in the nation, I guess. I assume West Virginia probably has more because that state's just a lump of coal with a house sitting on top, I believe. I don't think that, and they all live in it. Everyone who lives in the state's in one house sitting atop it. A church, the courthouse, the school, and all the residents in one log cabin atop a giant piece of coal that they all propel down and chip pieces off of all day and then climb back up is it fascinating to you as it is to me that they didn't foresee and forecast that that industry was going

to fucking die on a stick oh it's fascinating to me yeah well it's every industry we burn this and it shoots black shit everywhere not to mention gonna go forever did they think i'm sure the earth just keeps making more of this under here right every time we take some out it just regenerates it's like a it's like a lizard tail i feel like it's like a starfish the coal industry is one big gecko tail you chop it off three days four days it'll come back just bring it back so yeah i don't know so uh it's local they didn't care they were just like fucking jobs holy shit money and back then i don't think there was enough people to really drain it until later when the you know now now there's so many people we just we're doing it we're doing it we're really we're really putting a dent in this

apparently jasper's the location of the sci-fi channel show town of the living dead oh i don't know apparently i don't know that's like if it's filmed there or if it's that's they just use the name or what uh not this is a crazy episode not enough time to give a shit about that put it that way uh people from this town uh there's a couple of people uh butter beans from here no kidding the uh yeah the you know yeah ash eric ash there butter bean he's from this town. Giant fat old guy that boxes like a motherfucker. Yeah, you know the guy. Big American flag trunks that you could pretty much use as a car cover for a 92 Toyota Corolla

if you had to in a pinch. He's clean. Just a giant. He's clean Bam Bam Bigelow. That's what he is. Yeah, that's pretty much it. And a little fatter. And fatter, yeah.

Well, probably, yeah. Much fatter. And can't do what Bam Bam could do, cartwheels and shit. Oh, is that right? I'd love to see. Yeah, Bam Bam was an athletic fuck. All right. He could do backflips off the top rope and shit.

Yeah, I've seen that. He was super athletic, Bam Bam. He was, for a big guy like that, Jesus, we're off the subject. Also, Tallulah Bankhead is from here, too, the actress. She was in a Hitchcock movie. Oh. I can't remember which one now. It doesn't matter.

I like Hitchcock. But anyway, it doesn't matter. i like hitchcock but anyway it doesn't matter i have a resident review of the town actually two oh great they're glowing both of them one first one's a two-star they're keeping it mild here now that is quote there's a lot of crime every other night you can hear gunshots and last week there was a break-in oh not a break-in last week oh boy yeah see he wouldn't have fit through the window. Don't worry. He didn't break in. You'd know if he broke in because there'd be rounded areas of broken out window frame.

Yeah, exactly. That's how he comes in with his arms up in the shape of boxing gloves at the end of his hands. You can tell it's him. Right. They all know in that town. But, yeah, that's two stars for that one. But that's a lot of crime. There was a break-in last week.

Oh, my God. And then this one here this is beautiful quote jasper sucks our mall is crap walmart is crap we got a cracker barrel and the people of jasper ruined it too they ruined the crack how dare you jasper you've ruined the cracker barrel now that's okay sir it was ruined before they got there. It's fine that the mall's crap. I get it. Malls are dying. Walmart's always been crap.

That's fine. But you ruined the Cracker Barrel, sir. And we're going to have words. Oh, those apples. You keep that riffraff out of the Cracker Barrel, goddammit. Keep it away from my apples. For Peach. It's Peach Goblin.

Oh, Peach Goblin. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, you're right. You're right. People drive like bats out of hell and think they own the road. I wish I could move. One star. But alas. One star. I cannot.

I'm stuck. Wow. This is. Cole didn't pick up like I thought it would. Well, the first half of the. I thought it was coming back. The first half of the review sounds like a 16-year-old wrote it. And then the first half of the review sounds like a 16 year old wrote it and then the last half of the review sounds like an 86 year old wrote it so it's pretty

funny people they drive like bats out of hell they think they own the road i wish i could move but i'm on a fixed income with the social security but the same 86 year old is like jasper sucks dude the mall's crap fucking walmart's crap and the cracker barrel kind of could go either way yeah cracker barrel and these people they ruined it too yeah that could go either way that's where like the that's the grandfather and the grandson and then the father came in the middle and said we go you know we got a cracker barrel these bastards ruined that too and they said put it in there we're we're making a review of the three generations Three generations of bitching. Throw it. No, we're not going to say it's three different people.

It's one aggregated. You each get 16-year-old gets Jasper sucks, the mall and the Walmart. That's you. I get the cracker barrel, and you talk about traffic, and then let's do this. How many stars? One star. Yes, sir. All right. We all agree on that.

Now, Jesus, the population of this town here, right now it is 13,854, which is a lot here. Down 3.2% since 2010. So people seem to be fleeing. I don't know. That's a lot of people, honestly, like in practical numbers. I'm going to put some stipulations on that coal burning. Maybe, but I think now, I think it's probably benefits. The more shit you set on fire probably i believe it's just today yeah there's a there's a fire deduction yeah

you need to put smoke in the air more of that oh there you go that's we're gonna give you a tax break so uh people that's i'm sure i don't know how what the hell's going on maybe not might have nothing to do with coal we don don't fucking know. I assume 45 minutes outside of Birmingham, there's probably a lot to do with people commuting to the city and jobs associated with the college. I would assume there is going to be a big deal. I can see that. So, yeah, that's probably going to be a big deal there. So I think that's probably more what this is less less about the coal fields, although

our story is going to kind of rotate around coal country here uh but uh yeah population like i said down median age here's 38.6 which is about a year older than normal pretty on the money male female populations are pretty normal uh with the ages there's more kids and there's more elderly people okay it's weird but there's like less people of middle age they only get one sentence about a cracker barrel, whereas everybody else gets more say in shit. Bulk of the population. Bulk of the population, yeah. Married populations right about even, 50-50, like normal.

Most of the shit's normal here, I would say. There's not a lot of stats that are kind of real out of whack as far as married. There's a few more widows because there's more old people. The divorce rate's pretty normal, though. Seems to be like less kids than normal, which is weird. I don't understand that, but whatever. The racial breakdown here, it's about 79% white, 15.5% black.

It's a little more white and a little more black than normal. It's usually about 62% white, about 12% black. Not a lot of Hispanic people, people about three percent hispanic which is normally about 17 so we're uh you know it's white and black it's the south uh so uh religious here though religion 65 religious yeah normal's 50 50 alabama you're gonna get it's gonna be heavy out here in the world uh 30 you want to talk about representing 38 baptist yeah because baptists are the catholics of the south as we know it's the same thing we had the exact opposite in massachusetts last week it was like 48 catholic it's the same shit that's incredible it's weird

yeah here 0.8 catholic i don't know about what do you want not coming down there you one of them italians one of them irish or something i don't know about that what do you want? They are not coming down there. You one of them Italians? Yeah. One of them Irish or something? I don't know about that. One of them churches. I hear they give wine to the children and then touch them. Why would you want to put the body in your mouth? That sounds disgusting. We touch our kids while they're sober down here.

While they're sober. You understand? Around. Like the Lord wants it to happen. Yeah, that's right. We understand that. Keep it around here. Keep it to happen. Yeah, that's right. We understand that. Keep it around here. Keep it around here.

0.0% Jewish, 0.0% Muslim. Not happening in Alabama here in a small town. We have the politics here. Last election, 82% Republican. My word. Very conservative in rural Alabama. my word he's very conservative in rural alabama uh 15.3 percent uh democrat and uh and about two and a half percent uh uh independent yeah so 15 democrat which is the pretty much the exact amount of black people here he's right is 15.3 democrat is was the voting nailed it and 15.26 black is

the population just saying i think there's a pretty divided pretty even on those lines probably down there they're starting again yeah i think it's just one of those uh unemployment rate here it's about normal a little high but not too high it's still like in the in the mid fours which is insanely low uh so it really doesn't matter household income though is a little bit low uh median household income here thirty nine thousand eight hundred dollars uh normally it's about almost fifty eight thousand now so it's a little bit low and there's a lot of people making way less than they should here than the normal uh seventeen and a half percent make under fifteen thousand a year uh another 9.3 percent make in the 15 to 20 000 range and 11.2 percent make between 20 and 30

thousand dollars 30 make under 30 more than that yeah 35 ish percent a little higher than that make under 30 grand a year jesus so that's a third of the population's making under 30 grand property wages that's yeah that's that's tough that. That's getting by in an apartment and struggling. It's not an easy life. That's not a lot of smiling. No, no, no. That's a lot of working is what that is. No time to smile. A lot of bill paying. You got a second shift to pick up. That's what I'm saying. A lot of bill paying

and a lot of work doing. A lot of in-punching, but not a lot of smiling. But the higher than $200,000 a year category, $200,000 a year is higher than of the but the higher than 200 000 a year category uh 200 000 a year is higher than that is higher than normal so there's more people here that make uh and it's like significantly higher than average so there's a high there's a high population i don't know if they own the mines or what but there's a high population of uh wealthy people here it's

interesting here uh the jobs too there's a lot of retail trade, that sort of thing. It's hard to see a lot of healthcare, social services, that sort of stuff, but otherwise it's pretty on average with the rest of the states, pretty much, except for mining. 5% mining, quarrying, that sort of shit,

and normally that's like 0.5%. So that's way higher than normal. Cost of living here, 100 being par regular average here. Cost of living is 83.3. So for the lower salary, that's a little, it's not that great. No, except for housing is very low. Housing here is a 43.7. So that's low.

Median home cost here, $110,000. So very low on the housing costs. point seven so that's low median home cost here one hundred ten thousand dollars okay so very uh low on the on the housing costs you can get a lot like there's uh ten percent of the houses are between eighty to a hundred thousand dollars so you can you can find a lot here that are that's pretty pretty cheap but uh renters are one third of the population here so there's a lot of that's the that's your thirty three percent that make under thirty grand they're renting right there you go. There's your renters. And if we've convinced you, I mean, how could you not be convinced that Jasper, Alabama is the place for you? We have the Jasper, Alabama real estate report. Your average two bedroom rental here, I found, is about $683 a month, which is pretty cheap.

It's way less than the national average. It's about half, a little less than half, a little more than half. I found a two-bedroom, one-bath, 996 square feet, so about 1,000 square feet. Small. This is a little starter home here. $89,900, which at least you can afford the starter home uh you don't have to be wealthy to afford a mortgage on that i found a four bedroom one and a half bath 1984 square foot it's a good place that's a it's a big place that's got a big lawn

on it it's it needs updating on the inside but i mean if you have three kids and you and you need a decent place to live at not a high price this place 122 000 bucks not bad so that there's your place yeah fuck the backsplash you need to actually live there yeah and then if you've you've done well you've extracted god knows what yeah from the earth. We've reached in and taken it. You've done well for yourself. I found a five bedroom, four bath, 4,868 square foot plantation. This place is pretty fucking sweet. It's like set way back. There's like trees and a big front lawn.

I see like big Southern family reunions happening on the front lawn. Tire swing and all that shit. The whole thing. 439,900 bucks. That's a deal. The whole thing. $439,900. That's a deal. That's a deal for a house like that. I mean, for a house like that, that's beautiful. Less than it would be in most every place we cover pretty much here.

Things to do. Not a lot of shit going on here. I found the foot, other than church, I found a lot of church stuff going on. I'll tell you that. I found the Foothills Festival you that i found the foothills festival oh it's at the foothills of the appalachian mountains gotcha at the end of the trail really well not at the end of the trail this is when the mountains end and then this is the flatlands here of the you know south so uh it began in 1997 and then was discontinued in 2000

in 2000 and then brought back in 2013 oh Oh, how about a 13-year break? 13-year break. They needed to plan, Jimmy. It's a hiatus, we'll call it here. It's a two-day festival that they call a unique mix of high-powered music festival and a southern craft vendors weekend. Ooh, talk about Jasper's burgeoning foodie community. I bet.

It's downtown. They talk about that they have two craft breweries and they're just really trying to say this is some shit here they say to uh share in the spirit of the community in jasper alabama by hosting a fun event at the safe environment for all individuals so they're trying to have a party there that's how progressive to throw all individuals. Everybody. Yeah. Even everybody. They didn't just go ages. No, they said it's what individuals, individuals. Damn it.

The picture of the event, the cover photo on the website is a guy with a banjo. So I'm assuming I will not enjoy this festival, whereas Jimmy would probably have a grand old time. Doesn't sound too bad he'd be like this is pretty good i gotta be decent james yeah if that fucking guy doesn't stop playing that banjo i'm going to beat him with it like the hockey talk man i can't take it anymore i'm losing my goddamn mind i've had it uh crime rate in this town what we're interested in here property crime and the crime rate is obscene in this town what do you mean for such a small place uh crime rate property crime is three times the national average that is a lot

for rural alabama and uh violent crime murder rape robbery and of course assaults the mount rushmore of crime uh is over twice the national average wow more than twice the national average it's it's a healthy robust it's a robust yeah that's a good way to put it it's a really it's a thick like juicy uh it's a burgoo of violent crime that's going on down here thriving yeah it's disgusting absolutely disgusting uh so uh speaking of violent crime we should talk about a murder. Let's do it. Let's do this. A murder here. Let's start out.

This is such a weird story. It's one of these stories where you're like, where do you even start? You have to take the story apart in layers almost and peel it apart and figure it out. Like a bird? Kind of like a bird or like any sort of animal you might find and take apart to try to fix your own brain like our last episode. If you haven't listened to last episode, you just have to hear it. Because to be able to explain it to you here, there's no way to do it justice. It's insane.

Let's just say there's a vampire and he's got very weird recipes of things that he makes. And it's just the weirdest damn thing. It's very grim, Karen. It's, it's grim, Karen, but it's also one of the funniest goddamn things you could ever imagine.

Welcome to the small town of Chinook where faith runs deep and secrets run deeper in this new thriller available exclusively on Wondery Plus religion and crime collide when a gruesome murder rocks, the isolated Montana community. Everyone is quick to point their fingers at a drug addicted teenager, but local deputy Ruth Vogel isn't convinced. She suspects connections to a powerful religious group. Enter federal agent VB Loro,

who has been investigating a local church for possible criminal activity. The pair form an unlikely partnership to catch the killer, unearthing secrets that leave Ruth torn between her duty to the law, her religious convictions, and her very own family. But something more sinister than murder is afoot,

and someone is watching Ruth. With an all-star cast led by Emmy nominee Sanaa Lathan and Star Wars' Kelly Marie Tran, Chinook is available exclusively and ad-free on Wondery+. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. In May of 1980, near Anaheim, California, Dorothy Jane Scott noticed her friend had an inflamed red wound on his arm and seemed unwell. She insisted on driving him to the local hospital to get treatment.

While he waited for his prescription, Dorothy went to the local hospital to get treatment. While he waited for his prescription, Dorothy went to grab her car to pick him up at the exit, but would never be seen alive again, leaving us to wonder, decades later, what really happened to Dorothy Jane Scott? From Wondery, Generation Y is a podcast that covers notable true crime cases like this one and many more. Every week, hosts Erin and Justin sit down to discuss a new case, covering every angle and theory, walking through the forensic evidence and interviewing those close to the case to try to discover what happened. And with over 450 episodes, there's a case for every true crime listener.

Follow the Generation Y podcast on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to Generation Y ad-free right now by joining Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to Generation Y ad free right now by joining Wondery Plus. So first we have to start out. Let's just start off with Shonda Johnson. Okay. Okay. Quick. Shonda Johnson.

What do you picture? Do you want it? Shonda Johnson. Quick. I picture a Waffle House waitress that is angry. Angry Waffle House waitress. Yeah. And black.

Okay. I was going to say, automatically what color? I don't need to know what she does for a living. That's not a racist thing. That's just a... You hear Shonda Johnson. Anything. If you hear, you know...

I almost used our agent's name because it's the most... But if you hear, you know, a... Saul? Saul. If you hear Saul Rosenthal, you think... Jewish guy. Jewish guy. You don't think giant black guy. Not your first thought. You hear Shonda Johnson. It just sounds like a black lady.

There's a woman with a ministry too by the same name and it was confusing. This Shonda Johnson, not black at all. Really? No. Yeah. And I say that doesn't matter either way in the crime, but you try to paint a picture. Yeah.

If you're painting a picture of a black lady, it's not. Yeah. It's what I mean. No pictures. You haven't seen this. This isn't a live show where I go. Here she is. And you go, oh, wow, I pictured your black.

It's not going to happen. Like, you can just all do that. But no here. Yeah. She's she's actually very white. She she's such a strange, strange bird to unpack here. It's hard to... Everything we say to unpack her is sort of offensive.

Like, sounds black, right? That's sort of offensive. The other thing is, like, men super dig her. She has no problem hooking up with men all over the place, but she's also excessively homely. Now, I only say that not to judge her looks or anything like that, but there you and that's in every report of this that you read, every newspaper report, every even in the court

documents, they mentioned that she's not that attractive. Really? Because the way she operates is you would imagine she's like using her her sexuality and her wares and she's like this this siren of like you know but she's not so it's yeah that's the but i don't know why it matters but it's like a it matters if there was a guy out there and he was like oh he he's you know he's hooked up with five wealthy women and he's taking all their money, you would want to know if he was like a troll. You'd be like, who the fuck is he doing that? Because you'd go, wow, he must be even more charming or manipulative because he's not even handsome.

With her, it's like, how is she pulling all these guys and getting them to do her shit for her? It's very weird. It's a very very strange thing it's fascinating because big nose kate is like she's historically this amazing uh prostitute that everybody wanted to sleep with yeah and she was a a hundred percent hideous looking woman if you've ever seen a picture of big nose kate you'd be like people legit well yeah well no but back then that was they were like she knows what she's doing right they had all been told that that's yeah right visual aspect sometimes doesn't matter yeah that's what i mean because of how they make you feel yes and everybody says she's got a certain way about her and she's got

an extreme confidence about her that's so sexy which is very sexy and and it's and if uh it's a strange thing and i and i know this goes the other way because I've heard women say this a lot, where unattractive guys can date up in looks if they have this weird confidence. Some swagger. You'll see it all the time. You'll be like, why is that chick with that guy? And then you'll see him get in his car, and it's like a broken down Honda. You're like, he doesn't even have a lot of money.

What's going on? He's got some weird confidence about him that somehow works. uh it's the same thing men are the same way we go for that too you know and sometimes too it's not sometimes you just go for that sometimes it's the extreme of either uh poll uh poll is that yeah that's sure people that are like super super weak sometimes people just want to help them but they have to be handsome as shit that's the thing yeah it's a it's a confidence versus appearance thing where you can be uber confident and hideous yeah and you'll get you'll get laid you'll get a mate and you can be super handsome and not have any confidence and people will find you all the time it's a weird thing yeah but if you are not confident

and you're ugly alone forever that's what it is yeah this society wants nothing to do with you no one's reaching out to you it's a weird thing so but yeah she uh she's got like bleach blonde hair that she doesn't even really keep like you know she's got roots and shit like that like she's known for that she's not like uh she's not like uh excessively it's a word she's not she doesn't put herself together no i don't want to say that i mean like she doesn't she doesn together no i don't want to say that i mean like she doesn't she does she's kind of down to earth she lives in coal mining country and she's not like a prissy she describes herself like after high school like she'll tell people that she doesn't know like oh yeah i was the homecoming queen and you know everybody wanted to date me

and i was this beauty queen but that none of that shit was true real she just like made all that up and it was part of her thing and guys were like i don't know she's not that hot but i guess she was hot you know and i guess it's cool like she seems confident about it if she thinks she's hot i guess i think she's hot too yeah guys are very easily convinced we are we're super easily convinced but i'm saying that if you have a swagger, that's it. And I meant that to say that she was attractive and not classically beautiful. I think it came out way wrong. That came out way fucking wrong. I still loved it. Yeah.

But you didn't. Not what I meant. That was my Andrew Jackson moment the opposite way. It meant that she would come off attractive even though she's not like, you know, a classic like, you know, beauty in a sense. You know what I'm saying? Like classically handsome and classically beautiful. They run parallel.

You're right. That's what I mean. Like, yeah, it's a different thing. So it's a, but there's a swagger about it where, and I think that this woman had that. Jesus Christ, that was a hole to dig. Sorry, everybody. I don't know what the fuck I'm doing. Should I go get you my Michael Day award?

Jesus Christ. That was just the stupidest thing. Well well if i knew how to say what i want to say it would help so anyway uh she but she's that sort of thing she uh is very uh self uh like conscious about her teeth they're very crooked and shit she needed braces and didn't get them so she doesn't like smile and pictures and shit uh she dropped out of high school um and she's not we'll call it she's not a real studious worker either that's the other thing she's not real you know she's just kind of a people take care of me that's kind of her attitude uh she uh lies to people uh tells people she was the like the head cheerleader and the homecoming queen uh she tells people she has a job the head cheerleader and the homecoming queen

she tells people she has a job as a paramedic where she makes really good money and none of this stuff is true she doesn't work hardly at all she dropped out of school and you know no one gave a shit about her in high school it's just one of those things she just she needs to dream she's in and i get it man she's in a place that seems she's in the middle of nowhere. It doesn't seem like there's a lot of like there's not a lot of there's not a lot of excitement. There's not a lot of glitz to it. There's not a lot of anywhere.

So your imagination can run wild. She's got a boring life. So she's got a spice kind of in spicing it up. She's and she's trying to drag other people into it. And that's the part where it sucks. That's the part where it sucks. But that's what makes her feel good that people that she feels like she's like the she's she feels like she's the homecoming queen and that's what she wants to feel like and that's fine i mean like

i said guys will make shit like that up too yeah that's this is not gender specific at all this is very much i told the girl i was in the fucking service for christ there you go whatever works is what it is so uh i'm an idiot she would lie a lot that's so fucking funny but dudes dug her though man she was just something about her was attractive and so they were really into her uh uh within a few months of quitting school she's about 18 years old she gets married uh uh she gets married um and then so she gets married and she ends up breaking up with this guy relatively quickly. But then while she is broken up, she realizes she's pregnant. So that's a problem. She realizes she's pregnant and then she has to figure out what the fuck am I going to do?

I guess I'll find some other guy. So she found another guy and married him, too. OK, so she's been married, divorced, married again at a very young age here by 18. She is. People say that the best way to describe her is one of her sisters says, quote, In a certain way, Shonda has her own little world. But that doesn't make her a bad person. She just had her own little world but that doesn't make her a bad person she just had her own she didn't want to be this average person from an average place that nobody cared about she wanted to be something special like a lot of people want to be and some people get out of there and they go somewhere else and they you know yeah they go i'm gonna go to the

city and be something or i'm gonna go here i'm gonna go wherever and she just said fuck it i'm stuck here i'll just make some shit up and try to make my life as better best as i can it's not a bad plan it's understandable as shit making up stories and experiences that you wish you had we all know people like this too everybody knows people like this uh and so she uh she's so she's already been married and divorced and uh had two weddings and all this type of shit. Her first husband, a guy named Jeff Nelson, not the ex relief pitcher for the Yankees and Mariners. I didn't remember. Tall, righty.

Not him. He filed police reports about her twice. They were married for six years and she he files police reports twice claiming that she tried to kill him. But no charges were ever brought. So he filed a report. They came, asked some questions, and were like, I don't fucking know. Whatever. This is fucking white trash people.

Who cares? That's what I feel like happened. I feel like they went out there, and they were like, she tried to kill you. Do you have any stab wounds on you? No. And they're yelling and screaming. There's kids crying in the back of the trailer. And the cops are like, all right, we'll take the report thanks a lot oh she tried to kill you quote unquote without touching you or doing anything okay rural alabama i'm sure that call

comes in every week that's what i mean they're like have a good one asshole like i'm sure it was one of those things but that happened twice so there was some there was some conflict in this marriage going on that who the hell knows. And I mean, they're young people. I mean, when you're 22 and you have kids and you're struggling to make ends meet and you're not one person's not working and there's going to be issues there. I don't know if anyone's trying to kill anybody, but sounds like a strained relationship. It's exactly.

It sounds like a strained relationship. Her second marriage she married a guy named jimmy tidwell hell yeah here jimmy tidwell jimmy tidwell uh jimmy tidwell who sounds like a nascar driver he does absolutely sounds like a nascar driver he divorces her only after about five months oh so this does not last long no this is a quickie marriage so six years for the first one five months for the second one brutal uh brutal yes so uh you know she's she's she's burning through them pretty quick but she's young i mean anybody young once you start marrying it's just it could really get out of hand it can add up fast it can add up fast and so i mean the first one i was so young what a

mistake you know this is the right one well fuck that wasn't the first one, I was so young. What a mistake. You know, this is the right one. Well, fuck, that wasn't the right one. I just wanted to get out of that first one. Now I'm 23. I'm 23. I've been married twice. But what if I find somebody I like? I'm not supposed to marry them then because I could be married three times by the time I'm 25, which sounds insane, but it's really pretty reasonable if you think about it.

Super easy. It's so fucking weird. My mom was divorced twice and had three kids when she was 25. That's what I mean. That's bananas. It sounds crazy, but if you think about it in that context, like we just said, you go, man, that could happen. I can see it.

I can see it. Yeah. It just snowballs. Yeah. That's the thing. So she meets another man here. She meets a man named Randy McCuller. Okay.

Randy McCuller, they get together and they seem to be the picture of happiness, these two. This is interesting here. We'll talk about all of this. They first get married, I say first, on June 24, 1995. They have a small ceremony at a church. It's near McCullers' parents' home, the church. It's right in the same neighborhood. So there's whole families there it's a big deal uh the two of them met at the uh at a country bar that they both frequented all of her marriages started that way that's yeah yeah let's

be honest there's a little bit of betty lou beats in her background okay except betty lou beats had like a different thing going on but it's still it's a little bit of betty lou beats type of deal where she's gun barrel sheds gun barrel city texas where she meets meets a lot of guys at bars and marries them and uh her story's way different though it's got she's got a weird background this woman's background is not of the betty lou beats is like yeah that was yeah her background was crazy there's plenty of excitement there yeah her mother in and out of the institutions like anything that betty lou beats did'd go, that's not surprising. But whatever happens to her, you never know.

I mean, because she seems like, at this point in the story with Shonda, you know, she seems like she could be an aggressor or she seems like she could get tied up with the wrong person very fucking easily. So that's where Betty Lou Beetz, the whole story, you're like, she's going to do something bad. You just know it, that this is not going to turn out well. story you're like she's gonna do something bad right you just know it that this is not gonna turn out well uh so anyway they get married first at this uh church and uh they met at the bc lounge which will come up multiple times in the story which is the country bar where they both hung out uh now the problem was uh uh they they all they at the wedding too they uh they were you know they it was a it was like a big affair. They had all their friends there. It was a small ceremony, but for them, they had everybody they knew there, families and that sort of thing.

So it was a big, warm ceremony here. They were very casual people. Like McCuller was a cowboy boot and western shirt kind of guy. And she would wear... Everyone in the black tie affair. Yeah, that's what I mean. Exactly. He's the guy coming in. It's like Garth Brooks. Yeah, that's what I mean. She was a, exactly. He's the guy coming in.

It's like Garth Brooks. Yeah, he's coming in with jeans and maybe you're maybe getting a bolo tie out of the guy. If it's like a funeral. If someone he really respects dies, you might get a bolo tie out of him. A scorpion on him. He's still going to wear his hat, mind you.

But, you know. And she was real casual, too. She would wear jeans and, you know, she liked like short skirts and shit, though. She wanted to flaunt a little bit. That's my trying to work it that's cool let her do what you do your thing girl yeah so uh yeah she was uh they said the reverend here said that they were i mean the whole ceremony couldn't have had a like a more into each other couple he said quote they were just as happy as they could be couldn't't keep their hands off each other. So, I mean, they were just ready to get into it.

Yeah, it was going to be a good. Let's get out of here and consummate. It's going to be a good honeymoon. Let me tell you something. So this honeymoon is going to smell funny. It's going to be gross. Now, everything on the surface sounds wonderful. I mean, this sounds idyllic.

A small town town little white church wedding with your family your friends uh at the church right by your parents house with the reverend you grew up with i mean this is this is some old school shit here this is uh bad marriages and yeah the good one this is john cougar mellencamp has his pen fucking poised over a pad waiting to write a song about these two right now just watch this is gonna work out she came from a bad background yeah i could just make it to the same tune they all sound the same fuck it who cares whatever it's all jack and diane it's a difference strum that guitar it's the same shit so uh yeah uh so that sounds idyllic and beautiful and like they're gonna run off into

the sunset they're gonna put just married and big letters with a bunch of cans on the back of their convertible and drive off as she turns in her seat and waves with her wedding dress flowing in the breeze you know the scene i'm getting at we were so busy at the wedding i forgot to throw this bouquet somebody catch it there you go and then the the woman who's been sad the whole time uh catches it who had to like make all the plans and didn't get to participate and her bridesmaid dress doesn't fit right and she's so sad she didn't have time to fix it because she was fixing everybody else's fuck-ups because no one has any responsibility here except for kathy yeah so you know and the hairdresser got drunk and everybody's hair looks like shit kathy saves the day kathy then you wonder why she's so fucking, why Karen's so grim because her sister Kathy's got to do all this shit.

That is hilarious. This is her sister, Put Upon Kathy. Both of my aunt's names. There we go. We have Grim Karen and Put Upon Kathy. This woman,

she works, she's, Put Upon, Put Upon Kathy. Unbelievable. Put Upon Kathy is uh i mean that she every office has a put upon kathy yeah she's the one who's like i didn't even get any pizza i ordered it and i didn't even i had to take everyone's order you want fucking pineapple and hawaiian or whatever horse shit that is i got everybody's shit down once i did everything and then finished what i had to do

it's all gone i got all the cake gave everybody a piece set a piece of the guy get a slice fucking guy ate too the guy get a sled the maintenance guy got a piece he doesn't even fucking know the guy that's retiring and he got a piece put upon kathy not fair god damn it i'm crying groom karen and put upon kathy both of my mom's sisters do they fit those profiles and it's beautiful oh that's fucking amazing hello aunt karen and aunt kathy we're sorry you're so grim and put upon we hope that things get better for you and that people respect you more i can't wait till kelly's character comes out this is so yeah uh the the problem here is it wasn't as as perfect as as it would seem uh in actuality just before the ceremony uh mcculler here the groom to be uh contacted the preacher uh hallie i contacted him and said i've got a problem uh i know you've got the whole outfit on and i got my you know my special western wedding gear on and she's got her nicest bedazzled short skirt on and we're all ready to fucking roll here

my wedding snaps on yeah and i got my cousin and my ex-wife and there she is and you know the whole deal she whatever it is there, you know, he's like, this is all fine, but there's an issue that I found out. And that is because, um,

her divorce isn't final yet. Oh no. So, um, how are we going to get married? Like, you know, in an hour,

cause she's still married. So, uh, shoulder shrug. So what do we do here? the preacher said all right well that's that is a problem you're correct legally that's going to be an issue but what we can do is tell you what let's just have the wedding and as far as anybody else knows that's your wedding and it's beautiful as far as all me and you and son and uh sean to know uh this is a practice ceremony all

right it's a little little practice we'll All right. It's a little practice. We're just doing a little brush up. Take one. Take one. All right. Let's do it. Just a rehearsal. A little practice ceremony and said that once the divorce is final, you know, I'm sure in

the next couple of days or whatever, you guys come to my house, the preacher's house, and I'll just marry you in my living room. Beautiful. And then, you know, that'll be the legal ceremony. But as far as everybody else concerned, that not their business you know we'll have a nice little ceremony you don't have to go out there and go she's a whore she's a whore sorry everybody she's still fucking mad we can't grandma i know you might not live till the next ceremony but she's she didn't tell me she's still married to somebody else i'm sorry she that's a weird

announcement to make at your wedding that's a terrible thing to find out right now. It's not good. No. So he says, okay, fine. And July 11th, 1995, the marriage certificates finally filed. Okay. So it takes another two weeks to get everything finalized. The problem here is they have issues right away as a couple.

Well, because she lied to him out the gate. Well, she's lied to him and she's just not real into the marriage, we'll say. He works a lot and she doesn't work at all. And what she would do is go to the lake with her friends every day. Oh, that's not cool. While he's working. So he was like, that's kind of, he got a little pissy. Yeah, fuck that.

Yeah, he got a little bit pissy with that after a while. She'd put a bathing suit on and go to the beach and be like, and he's like, bye, I'm going to work all day. He's waking up, she makes him a pot of coffee and jumps in the back of an F-250. I'll see you tonight, honey. You know, surfboards on the top and racks and shit, even though it's a lake in alabama still though it may that's the scene that's the scene too you can't have a uh

you know pick up a girl for the beach in a happy setting where no one's got a shirt on if you have surfboards on top uh so yeah so this is all going on so his parents were saying that he was growing a little bit tired of that yeah it was kind of like got got pissy pretty fast this is bullshit yeah his mother said his mother betty by the way betty mcculler yeah uh she sounds like a very she bet excellent cookies i bet she throws the hard er on the end of that yeah absolutely hard and every other one absolutely everything else she uses she's a woman who always has a pie cooling on a windowsill, though, like a cartoon pie, I feel like. Smells beautiful.

Smells amazing. She said about Shonda, quote, she'd put on her bikini, throw a towel around her, and go to the beach. He was working, and she was out partying. Randy was a Christian, and he just couldn't take a life like that. So, yeah, he's not thrilled with this. I don't give a shit what your religion is. No. He could be Muslim. That doesn't matter. He could be this i don't give a shit what your religion no

he could be muslim he could be i don't care what doesn't matter he could be an atheist and he wouldn't give a shit this is not cool i'm working you're having fun go fuck yourself i pay the bills you go to the beach this is bullshit yeah bullshit how about i work half as much as i work now you work the other half and then we'll both go to the fucking beach she wants to go on her own uh but he thought he was signing up for like this little like oh she's gonna stay in the house all the time and make me dinner and he thought he was getting like a cool christian housewife and she's like fuck that shit i'm going to the beach it's like somewhere in the middle is probably better for everybody i would say you know she'll need to be a housewife or this yeah somewhere in the middle so uh yeah she's out partying all that so uh it doesn't take long before they end up separating

uh pretty pretty soon after that uh uh very shortly honestly it's like a couple of months they're separated already so this did not last long she has 60 day beach vacation that's it yeah that's what it was basically yeah tortured yeah he got she got like a little like a workman's comp vacation sort of thing and went to the beach and i would lose my fucking mind yes well he did okay so uh they separate uh the weird thing about this uh about three months uh they about a month and a half after they uh separate which is a little over three months after they're married uh he mcculler here receives a phone call from a friend of his

that says of all things this is amazing uh the friend says uh you know your wife that you just married you're familiar with and she's like yeah oh yeah i know her the big thing that goes to the beach all the time yeah uh yeah well i just saw her down at the courthouse uh marrying another dude so that's weird didn't you guys just get mad are you divorced did you get an annulment or something he's like no no we're very much married as a matter of fact uh that's super weird that she would be down at the courthouse you know marrying someone. So, yes. So this she was seen having another marriage ceremony and a legal venue as well. Like, yeah, this isn't like some sort of weird, you know, a little like like a hippie commitment ceremony that doesn't count. Like this is at the court.

You're filing fucking state paperwork. This is real. This is some real shit. So, yeah, he's he's super pissed. Yeah, because he doesn't know if maybe they'll get back together. They're just separated. Right. And, you know, you got to at least divorce me before you marry somebody else, I feel like.

He and Put-Upon Kathy would get along real well. Oh, he should hook up with, if Put-Upon Kathy wasn't his cousin, I mean, they still hook up. But, you know, it would be a legal thing. Otherwise, they could really get together. Courthouse won't recognize it. I picture put up on Kathy pulling up her bridesmaid dress because it keeps falling down. It's like my fucking goddamn thing. I wish I could have got it fitted.

It's too loose. Piece of shit. Fucking damn it. Gina didn't do shit. She was supposed to do the invitations. I told you that. I sat up all night doing those i had a lazy asshole who did the centerpieces me that's right me i put them together i put the fucking covers

on the chairs you don't know shit you don't know anything you fucking bitch shut up no and she grabs and pulling away next thing you know there's extensions coming out and fucking dresses are being torn put upon kathy's lost her fucking mind i've had it and grim karen's just sitting in the corner smoking just shaking her head going this always happens i knew this would be a terrible day i knew no one would get along i was gonna stand up when they said does anyone have any reason why these two i was gonna say because it's all terrible this day is gonna go terrible you guys this day isn't working she's just always smoking she could be in any environment there there's no smoking she's put that out you're in a church and no one notices it matters it doesn't

matter she's like my elderly uncle back in the day who that would smoke anywhere and people just look at him like you know you can't smoke here and he'd just take a drag staring right at him and they just go all right and they wouldn't even tell him not to smoke he was like i'm an old man and i ain't fucking stopping so either tackle me or fuck off don't worry time will put this oh i used to love that shit he would do that just look right in their face and just take a drag and they just go okay guess you're not gonna stop those words fell on deaf ears all right then so uh yeah so anyway uh uh so there she's marrying another man uh who the fuck is she marrying obviously uh that's a goddamn good question uh she's fine she finds out she finds a man named Bill McIntyre Jr.

Oh, boy. Oh, boy. Junior. Oh, Billy Mac. Bad news. Billy Mac Jr. here. Now, Billy Mac and Shonda here met while they were working at a sleeping bag plant. What?

That exists? What? I thought about that. I'm like, okay, well, sleeping bags exist, so they must make them somewhere. But to think that somewhere exists a standalone building that's just this is where the sleeping bags are made. All of them are made here. It's super fucking strange to me. I don't know why. It sounds like I just see a field with one of those metal corrugated steel buildings, just sleeping bags on assembly lines.

It's a very sad environment. Yeah, that'd be a terrible job. And people are just overseeing it, and their job is to check the zipper at the end. Make sure it doesn't stick. That's super annoying. How sleepy would you get just working there? I could just fucking go to sleep right now. Just rubbing them.

These are soft. Super warm. What a tease that is. It's warm in there. Put your arm in there. It's cold outside, but it's a nice sleeping bag right there. It's going to be all cold outside man nice sleeping bag good stuff yeah sleeping bag plant which shit job it's one of the few jobs she has at any time at least she's not at the beach yeah she's got it well this is when they broke up so she's got to have something

damn it so yeah can you imagine you tell her to get a job and then she fucking does that and meets a dude and marries him while you're still married. While you're still married. Yeah. So now the problem here is here's the issue with all of this. Again, in between all of this, she already has a son from the first husband that we talked about. She broke up and then tried to find. She got that second husband.

That didn't last long and she found McCullers. That obviously is a mess. It's over. Goes to the beach. tried to find she got that second husband that didn't last long and she found mccullers uh that obviously is a mess it's over goes to the beach now she's looking at number four right with uh with billy mack here so uh uh problem here is she's also pregnant with mcculler's child oh my word in the two months they were together he has managed to impregnate her somehow and uh well he's a religious man so he christian he prayed on those sperm and they came through for him they made it all the way to the target so uh yeah so she's pregnant with the sec with the third husband's who she's still married to his child when she's having

like a shotgun courthouse wedding with another guy with his with his baby the other guy's baby with the other guy's baby still is nuts this guy's baby still isn't. This is nuts. This is very, very confusing, this whole thing. Now, Billy Mac, though, he is in love. Yeah. He has found the one. Okay. His mother here, Frida, Frida McIntyre. Absolutely.

She said, by the way, McIntyre, that might be one of them Catholics, I think. We're going to keep, steer clear of them. They might have some of that Reba money in the bank sounds kind of irish i'm just saying that's all i'm saying i don't know you know how them people are yeah that's all uh now he she said uh old frida mcintyre said quote he thought us or he told us he thought this was the girl that god meant for him she is sent by god uh, Bill talked her out of having an abortion. He carried her to her doctor's appointments and he was right there in the delivery room. So she wanted to have an abortion from the third husband's kid here.

And he said, no, we'll raise it. Are you nuts? I'll raise it as my own. I don't care. We'll go to hell. Yeah. So, yeah. So she marries Billy Macy mack uh here which

is just wild uh now billy mack a little about him he is uh in the process when they get married of completing a degree yeah in a home study course of it gets worse it out. He's he's completing his degree. And you're like, oh, this is good in a home study course. Not quite as good in becoming a preacher. And it drops down even more. And it starts right where it starts. Right back to the beginning there. So it's a home study course in preaching.

So it's a step up from HVAC. I thought that's where you were going. He might as well just have a homeless man yell at him something. He goes, I learned a lot today. It's a home study course in preaching. Isn't that where all of them are, though? You can just make it. Yeah, I guess it's true.

You need one book. I think that's where the school was. It's in an alley by a dumpster taught by a homeless faculty. You don't even got to buy books. You go to a church and take one. You got it right there. Done. Guy up there screaming, you don't need a home.

God's provided everything out here. Son, just grab a dog and eat it. There's food everywhere. It's fine. Ain't y'all seen a dumpster? Fuck. Lazy sons of bitches. Kathy filled it up.

Everybody knows it's it. Did you get any, Kathy? No, we're sorry, Kathy. I'm sorry yeah everybody knows it's it did you get any kathy no we're sorry kathy i'm sorry now it's fine i picture homeless men just punctuating every sentence with fuck fuck know what i'm saying it really punctuates and everything just like that's how they do that's the pause the clean way of that is period yeah period he goes fuck like half a question half of an exasperated thing and half just a punctuation it's it's it's all go in any situation go anywhere y'all don't have more dr pepper fuck yeah but it's there's a more yeah y'all don't have any more dr pepper fuck

or y'all have all that dr pepper fuck yeah but it's a it's it's the processing you got it we had the timing yeah it's the processing because he's thinking about either you don't have this or holy shit you got all this what would i do with all this dr pepper and then he pictures himself drinking all he's like fuck that'd be great and he's like amazed and you know astonished at the same time it's a really great word to fuck so every thought's so perfect apparently that's his uh yeah that's his that's his course of education, being yelled fuck by a homeless man behind a dumpster. I understand that anybody who's paid attention to the media would have to come to the conclusion that I killed my wife. Hi, my name is Zach Stewart-Pontier.

I'm one of the filmmakers behind The Jinx, and I'm excited to bring you The Official Jinx Podcast. We'll be revisiting all six episodes of Part 1 and watching along with Part 2 as it airs on Max, starting April 21st. Bye-bye. The Official Jinx Podcast. Listen on Max or wherever you get your podcasts. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid. We're your hosts.

I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, Morbid. We're your hosts. I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well-researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch of humor.

I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother****er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar.

And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal, or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes, you should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts.

You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid. We're your hosts. I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well-researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people.

With a touch of humor. I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother****er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal,

or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes, you should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app

or on Apple Podcasts. So, yeah, and this is in addition to he's working at the factory still, obviously, but she starts to not work at this factory after a while. She stops working at the factory. She only ends up working there about two weeks after they get married. You know, she's a married woman.

She's supposed to... What am I doing with this job? She's supposed to live a certain lifestyle that he needs to provide. I got a job. It's called a wife. Yeah, exactly. Wife.

I'm going to be a mother to that other guy's kid. I got shit to do. You know, you can understand that. Stay at home. Fuck that. I'm a wife. It's fine. He starts having some health problems that he

can't quite figure out though uh within that year he starts having some health problems while they're married uh uh she uh she would lie to her in-laws because her in-laws would say well what are you doing like he's working and he's sick he's like not feeling well and he's working his ass off what do you do and she said i'm a paramedic so she lied to the paramedic she even said i make 52 000 a year as a paramedic in 19 this is not we're talking 1995 so that's a lot 52 grand a year in jasper alabama in 1995 as we've heard what the houses cost now right in 95 they were way less like you're doing well you could buy were way less like you're doing well you could buy a good size fucking you're doing well for yourself if you're making that money down there back then uh but that's not true at all and you can tell how untrue it is by the fact

that she she begins uh because she has no money because she's you know there's the budget's tight in the family so she doesn't have a lot of money to go fuck around. So what she does is she starts selling Billy Mac CDs, compact discs, not like financial CDs, actual spinny music things, starts selling them because you could do that in the mid-90s. For five bucks or three bucks a piece? Well, they were like 20 new,

and you could sell one for like six or five, but even five, if she didn't pay for them, it's like Goodf and you could sell one for like six or five, but even five. She didn't pay for them. It's like good fellas. They take the booze in the front and sell it out the back door at a loss. It's all a profit. It doesn't matter. It's the same thing.

So she would sell CDs for money to go out drinking, to go to bars and hang out with other dudes and drink. And he's at work and he's sick. And his parents are grilling her. And she's like, no, I'm out saving's lives so it's it's a weird thing here so on august 2nd 1996 billy mack goes to the hospital to figure out what the hell's wrong with him and they finally figure out what's wrong with him what is they diagnose him with aids actual not hiv full-blown fucking aids like he's sick and he's been sick and this is why he's been sick because he has fucking aids oh jesus so wow that's a lot that's a lot to take in that's heavy okay yeah he's got aids uh that's not disputed right uh he gets diagnosed with aids uh turns out she doesn't acquire the disease at all uh-huh she

doesn't end up how she didn't get i have no idea maybe they didn't consummate no they were fucking oh they were fucking yeah from what they were they were yeah that's that's she finally figured out condoms maybe but i mean she was married to the guy i just don't picture that's not trash she was pregnant they're probably fucking while she was pregnant and she's all how's the baby not get it too he's also super christian also so he wouldn't be like i'm gonna have protected condom sex with my wife like that would be weird especially if she's already pregnant she's not like you're gonna knock her up yeah so i mean i don't know he wouldn't think like unbelievable it's super weird but he doesn't get it the kid ends up being fine yeah it's very weird but uh he 100 have has aids and uh she the day he is diagnosed with aids she leaves yeah that's it goodbye sir she's fucking gone

i mean if that's your husband maybe i mean jesus christ maybe stick around for a little bit maybe stick around a little while at least to see how it's see how it fucking shakes out i don't know pretty fascinating he comes home I have horrible news. Right. Because especially this is in 96. I mean, in the 90s, people think of HIV and AIDS differently now. They shouldn't. I mean, if you have AIDS, that's if you're in deep shit.

Right. HIV is a lot more controllable now. In the 90s. Oh, forget it. If someone said they had HIV, you were like, oh, Jesus Christ, you'll be dead soon. Also, never even talk to me. Forget being near me. don't look at your watch you don't know me i mean magic johnson that was only about five years before that he announced he had hiv we were like oh fuck magic johnson's gonna be dead see you around nobody wanted him to play in the all-star games and literally people there were nba players

protesting magic johnson playing in the all-star game because what if what if they he sweat on them or what if he got cut and rubbed on them nosebleed they fucking free all fucking dead they freaked out yeah they acted like anthrax that's what they treat they they treated it like if he cut himself the the blood would be an airborne fucking chemical weapon that would kill you dead on the court like not even give you hiv you just you'd melt yeah why are my knees on the floor because my shins have melted oh god he's got acid blood like the wicked witch of the west you're just a pile of uniform afterwards just says a jersey with west on it or east it's fucking ridiculous so it's just acid spelled funny that's all it is man

that's all it is is acid spelled all fucked up i don't know how these people spell their blood acid it's bad so that's how they that's how they took it that's depressing so she just left yeah took off on him so he comes home honey i have bad news i have aids and i'm gonna die and then she's like oh wow that's terrible guess what you don't have a wife anymore either so live with that have a good one asshole call frida i'll be at the beach that's cold-blooded and she's cold-blooded uh so he ends up moving back in with his parents because he needs help fucking yeah and there's no reason to spend a bunch of money if he needs medical attention too on the next thing and she's like well better find somebody else then i mean she she like just crossed she went aids and just scratched off billy mack billy mack jr and wrote next to it

aids parentheses yeah got the aids okay so uh yeah they end up, she ends up going on. Uh, uh, she meets a man named Ronnie Webb next. Okay. Uh, Ronnie Webb, this relationship starts right when he gets diagnosed in September of 96. So, uh, uh, about, uh, uh, a month into this relationship, uh, this whole thing's going on Ronnie Webb within a couple of weeks. a couple of weeks uh she uh uh she ends up moving in with ronnie webb and she's pregnant again so with ronnie webb's kid yeah well obviously not not billy max yeah max got nothing so this is well yeah you go shit whose kid is this oh good uh so yeah this starts here so by the way this whole time she's still married to randy mcculler still from before she's still married to that fucking guy from the church

ceremony and that whole thing she's still married to number one right and she's been married twice now and now she's moved in with another guy she's got two kids and she's got two other kids so uh when she's with ronnie webb for about a month mcculler hears about this and he's like whoa wait a second slow down so she not only left me married this other guy was she while she's still married to me you're telling me now that guy has aids and she's left him and is now hooked up with somebody else and is knocked up again he says you know what i can't fucking take it anymore i have some uh i don't know if it was a vengeful thing or what it was but he says you know what i'm gonna do i'll file a bigamy complaint against her oh boy still illegal here this is

fucking alabama not utah lady i know it's illegal in utah still but you can't help it that's just an easy one so there you go yeah so uh i figured that's what he would say you know whatever so uh yeah in the heat of an argument forget it he said where you think this is who do you think you are jesus christ who do you think you are john stockton he's not even mormon i think he's got one great wife he's probably stockton i know he went to gonzaga that's a catholic school so i doubt he's mormon probably he didn't go to byu then again jim jim mcmahon went to byu and i'm positive he's not mormon so who the fuck knows so uh anything's possible here so uh anyway uh uh he files a bigamy complaint and they get an arrest warrant for johnson here uh shonda is arrested

and indicted for bigamy by the winston county grand. So she's now an indicted bigamist, which is amazing. McCuller is listed as a witness on the arrest warrant against Shonda. And he also testified before the grand jury during the proceedings in the indictment. There was testimony of his that was, he's considered the main witness. He's the guy going, she married me and is still married to her. I'm still married'm still married to her so yeah i can file it i don't even know why you need a witness that's that's a paperwork thing well we have a marriage certificate and a marriage certificate and no divorce in between in between so that the paperwork done guilty yeah i don't need anybody to go yes i married her because i have a piece of paper saying he fucking married

her i mean the defendant could say something like uh we agreed to dissolve this i thought he did it uh so having him there yeah i guess so i never agreed to shit i didn't agree to shit uh yeah she was at the beach and next thing you know she's married two more times and this guy's dying of aids shit's getting weird dude very bizarre yeah uh church on sunday gotta go it's just getting fucking weird so yeah he testifies against her uh uh his testimony was huge in the in the whole bigamy case uh so they're going to you know move forward with this bigamy case later on they've just indicted her now at this point she starts getting pissed off yeah now she's pissed yeah because i mean who the fuck does what does fucking randy think he is number one mcculler here sure who does fucking randy think he is

he's gonna tell her she can't go out get married fucking get divorced get knocked up with other people's kids move in with people she just met at the goddamn bc lounge no you don't tell me what to do you know who i am i am shonda god damn it you don't tell me what to do. You know who I am? I am Shonda, goddammit. You don't tell me what to do. She's gone back. I have a talk show coming out called Shonda. Shit is going to fly. It's going to run right after Yolanda. It's Yolanda and Shonda.

That's right. And, oh, who was the one? Oh, goddammit. I'm going to forget. Goddammit. There was a talk show. Another one like this? Yeah, that was like that. There was Yolanda. There was Yol gonna forgot yeah there was a talk show another one like this yeah that was like wanda there was yolanda but there was another one too and fuck i can see her goddamn

face and it's gonna kill me now did it rhyme no but it was it was a it was a black lady with the not wanda sykes in the 90s i don't know who the hell she was but she was good at what she was doing i don't remember but anyway uh uh here uh she says uh uh she starts getting pissed off and she just starts saying casually uh just to her friends that she wants uh somebody to do away with randy mcculler or have something done to him but just casually yeah like she's around like i wish something would happen to him yeah i wish somebody would fucking run him over with their car. He's just a pain in my ass. I can understand.

He's got me up on bigamy charges. Yeah. You know how that goes. How dare he? Every time someone files a bigamy charge against me, I do the same thing, though, to be honest. I'm like, I need to get them killed. So I get it. I understand.

So, yeah, now, she'd say that to this web guy all the time who she's in this relationship with at one point she uh even talked to actually suggested that this web guy uh she goes tell you what why don't you get some dynamite and just go blow up his car what just go blow up his car blow up his house just wherever he is take a bunch of dynamite and fucking light it and he'll explode this is rocky and bullwinkle problem solved about yosemite sam it's fine what the fuck you do some dynamite what is that is a murder the most inefficient murder weapon i've ever heard of wherever he is just blow it up he'll explode how many time to a railroad track first what are you talking about i've seen it in a cartoon he'll fly through the air and go

and then he'll land and he'll just be this black sooted up like burnt all his hair will be singed off trail and all that shit yeah it'll be it's perfect it's really eyeballs sitting on top file super easy you know it goes so uh yeah he was like i don't think that's a good idea uh you know i'm not really good with the dynamite i don't know what i would do with that uh so she was super pissed though she's looking for obviously a way to because she could go to jail from this bigamy charge and she could also lose her kids and all this type of shit so she's not happy and she's pissed at her boyfriend for not fucking killing this guy god damn it what being a pussy get some dynamite and blow this fucking guy up what's wrong with you pussy what do you put upon

kathy get your shit together and go do it what the fuck man kathy would do it she would too she'd be like fine really you can't get your own dynamite but i'll do it this time but i'm not doing it next time my schedule's clear today fine i never i'll get my mother to pick the kids up and i'll just do it it's fine you owe me you owe me though it's okay she just walks away fine i'll i'll feed yeah it's fine yes and i'll walk your dog tomorrow also so she's pissed off it's the spring of 1997 she's pissed off she's got a big of me charge over like you know very common everyone's got that. She's got a bigamy charge. She's got this douchebag who won't even blow up her fucking ex-husband like a pussy. You got another guy with AIDS who's all pissed at her. She's still not divorced from him.

You know how it goes. It's tough to be married to one person. Imagine being married to many people. That sounds terrible. That sounds terrible. Imagine that shit. No. Because you have to deal with your ex-wife, which is rough anyway.

Imagine if she actually had some legal claim to you still. And you had to listen. No. Like, I can't listen to more than one person. I can't. I fucking can't physically do it. I just don't have the energy. My text is?

My texts are enough already. I've had enough of this shit. There's zero claim to me. That's about enough of that shit. Your legal claims are minimal no so uh so she goes to the bc lounge to you know drink it off and blow off some steam and sure and then see the little bit and hey she meets a guy what the fuck right she's always looking for somebody new to hang out with uh so she does. She meets a man. She meets Tim Richards.

This guy has an amazingly round head is the best way. It's really remarkable when you look at it. You don't see heads this shape. It's round. His head itself is round. And then it doesn't just round out and then come down normal in the face like most people the circle continues his his head from jaw to the top of his head is one like a marble yeah it's so strange his cheeks and his fat face it's just this round thing it's yeah it's he it's i've never seen

a more marble head on a person more round than costanza yeah yeah it's that type of head yeah but costanza's around the temples yeah still comes down his cheeks don't this costanza yeah yeah it's that type of head yeah but costanza's around the temples yeah still comes down his cheeks don't this guy at the cheeks it's just this round head it's so fucking weird this is the bc lounge does that stand for bigamy charges i think it's the big the bigamy charge lounge i think it is right here this is incredible so she gets all of them this is the bar she's just going you would think they would be like this is the bar she hangs out at if a guy was talking to her when she like went to the bathrooms like the bartender would come over like while he was wiping a glass and go you know she's married to three guys right now and then just walk away and one of them had aids right and he

raises an eyebrow and he fucking turns the other direction and walks off leaves this guy standing there going um should i wait for him to come back or should i just leave now he doesn't even wait for a fly just turns as he wipes the rim of that glass throws a five down on the fucking bar and takes off thanks man you know aids is just acid spelled funny you know how that works man hey ain't no thing ain't no thing he just does the old he's like well you can't get aids twice know what i mean buddy elbows his ribs and the bartender's like jesus really more potent that's a that's a joke that people this is actual you know okay all right it's like whatever dude he's an idiot get it twice it's like some old stupid joke that people say. That's disgusting.

I figure that's like some dude in a bar in that situation would say as a joke all drunk. Can't get AIDS twice, buddy. In the old elbow. That's gross. It's gross. So anyway, this guy, this is Tim Richards she meets. He's a delivery truck driver. He's a very, he's an adopted guy okay he's very simple everyone describes him the first word they use is simple Alabama simple

I was just gonna say Alabama he's simple for rural Alabama so take that for what it's worth in context yeah he is subjectively simple that's a he's not creating relatively simple no not at all he's just going what's that again how you spell that you mean you mean blood it's a fucking acronym with tim huh what a what now it's an acrobat what's that i love the circus i get them sometimes in my basement them acronyms though you got to put traps down and have them spray sometimes they got to put a tent over the whole damn house you got to take the dogs out of they'll kill them i swear gas will kill them damn dogs but them acronyms die good lord a lot of legs on them acronyms are real gross so tim well poor tim here he's a truck driver uh he is he's

divorced his first marriage failed he's very lonely his adoptive parents describe him as quote simple and trusting so perfect guy for shonda obviously because she is you know that's how you describe her too better trusting innocent. You know how it goes. Better known as a statistic and prey. Yeah. Shonda, I assume when she looked at him, she looked at him like the fucking predator looked at things. And like it was computer graphs and assessments going on of this percentage of fucking brain damage he might have. It'll take me this long to get him to marry him.

I can, you know'd take this long to die from aids there's all these different charts going on so he says quote uh uh or the her uh he says quote when i found out she was pregnant because she's pregnant at this point i'm hanging out in the bar uh when i found out she was pregnant i went over and patted her on the stomach and said we're all gonna have to take care of this which sounds like we should get you an abortion honestly when you say take care of it we're all gonna pool our money and take care of this we're gonna put a collection right now hey everybody I'm putting an ashtray on the bar she needs an abortion just if you could

put a couple bucks in please also Tim you never mentioned that she's pregnant unless she looks you in the eye and goes, I'm pregnant. I think she did. Okay. And then he was like, I found out she was pregnant. He was like, I scoped out a lady with a chubby belly and assumed there was a baby in it and assumed she had a baby inside of her. No, he says that he saw a single mom who needed help.

And she already had two kids. And she's got this other one on the way. And she was in a rough spot. And he said, man, he fell in love that night. He just fell right in love with her. Told everybody he was in love with her. Told his parents that, quote quote she laughed a lot she's very pretty to me which means i know but not everybody else uh he said he you know he believed all the stories about her being a beauty queen

and being all that sort of thing and being a homecoming queen and he just fell for her whole act he was right on it uh so he uh he said that so that told everyone they dated for about four weeks and then she asked him to move in with her so they date for four weeks that's about her deal she tries you out for three four weeks and then she's like fuck it this is a live-in relationship uh you meet my kids there you go so uh on on on May 10th, 1997, Shonda insists that she and Tim go to Gatlinburg, Tennessee. Yeah. Home of Dolly Parton. She's going all the way there.

Well, they're not going to see Dolly Parton, though. They're going to get married. Oh, no. Because she insists she's got to go get married. He has no idea she's already married to two other people. Has no clue about this. No, he doesn't know these people exist. He just knows that, you know, her ex-husband left her and she's pregnant.

And what a sad situation. And that's a poor woman. And so he says, I'll absolutely marry you. You bet you, you know. Oh, man, I'm going to do the honorable thing here. So they get married on the bank of a brook, like out in the wilderness there in the mountains in Tennessee. Out in the country. They have this nice little ceremony.

She's stacking up wedding photos. Yes, she is. She's got a whole closet. That's just wedding albums in there. That's all. Just lots of them. Fuck, man. This box is real heavy is this your

knickknacks no no no no no she's got it she's gonna start selling dvd box sets of the of the fucking videos of the weddings shonda's 12 weddings everybody see her marry this guy that guy the guy with aids see her waddle down the aisle pregnant oh the wackiness that goes on at a shonda wedding fucking 24 95 oh christ bonus deleted seasons of put upon karen kathy god damn it bonus scenes put upon karen or put upon kathy now you got me doing it put upon kathy as she organizes the wedding i'm putting the i'm putting them on as fast as i can i don't have the guest list i wasn't supposed to have it even i'll find it okay fine order fast while supplies while supplies last and the stinger is kathy just going god damn it i did the centerpieces it cuts away it cuts

away i'm buying i would totally buy that i'm in on that shit so uh they get married uh which is fucking crazy let's just say uh yeah so at this point uh uh her first husband has filed to get custody of her son good claiming she's an unfit mother she leaves her children with neighbors for extended periods of time because all this going out every night she's got two two and three kids during all this so she's like he's not she's not paying attention i'll take care of the kids my parents are here we can all take care of the kids whatever and she doesn't even fight it really she just says you want them take them there you go it's their son there you go knock yourself out so gives the kid away uh to the ex-husband not just like people in the street uh you know she's not that kind of crazy uh so uh

meanwhile here the bigamy charge is still going through and she still has to stand trial for bigamy she's got her kid taken away she's on her third fucking illegal marriage and her second husband has aids shit's getting weird in alabama it's getting strange down here so uh south of the mason dixon line here uh so uh all this is going on and uh it's at this point they get married and then right pretty much in the first couple weeks of their marriage, Shonda starts really asking Richards here, her new husband, if she would kill McCuller. Oh, my God. Her other husband that's filed the bigamy charge. Bring a simple Tim involved?

Let's get simple Tim involved in this, and maybe he'll do it. He's simple. I can talk him into it. So, now, finally, on November 6, 1997, McCuller files for divorce against her. And as part of the divorce complaint, he also seeks custody of their child, Chad McIntyre. Yeah. And requested also a DNA test to make sure it's fucking his, too. He's like, let's make sure, as a matter of fact, let's put that in the paperwork, too.

that in the paperwork too uh so uh after she he had filed these bigamy charges he also received a large legal settlement uh from an auto he had a car accident where a logging truck hit him oh god damn it which sounds terrible yeah and he had suffered serious injuries and was couldn't work and so he got a very large sum of money from this logging company apparently it was like all their fault lucky to be alive exactly it's one of those where they're like, just give him fucking money. Shut him up. How many logs does he want? Well, can we pay in logs or money?

Which would you rather have? Give you a hundred grand for each log you took. How many logs did he take? How many logs did he take? So, uh, yeah. So she,

uh, uh, hears about this and she says, okay, technically I'm still married to this guy with all this money. Oh no. Um, so I, he's going to divorce me now. abyss and she says okay technically i'm still married to this guy with all this money oh no um so i he's gonna divorce me now then i won't be anywhere legally connected to that money if i'm gonna do anything i better do this shit quick before this divorce goes through because but i

also then there's the bigamy charge which if i don't do it there's still that going through but if if i if if somehow something happens to mccullers i get the money possibly and i don't do it there's still that going through but if if i if if somehow something happens to mccullers i get the money yeah possibly and i don't get bigamy charged this is fucking great this sounds beautiful silence a witness and get paid i get my kid too everything boom done uh so uh she says she tells simple tim here uh this guy got this settlement if he dies the money's either gonna go to me or the kid either way it's fucking me because i'm gonna get the kid because he's fucking dead so you know we gotta do this shit uh so he was not he was kind of blowing he's blowing her off the whole time about it he's like i don't think so this you know you know let's not do that like i'm gonna get

dynamite he doesn't yeah i don't have any dynamite the acme company is all sold out the coyote bought it all i don't know what to tell you so november 28th 1997 uh thanksgiving it's there they're having thanksgiving dinner it's tim richards uh and uh and shonda uh they're having dinner at the home of audrey gray who's tim Richard's sister. So they're having family Thanksgiving. At the end of the meal, they're about to leave, and Shonda Johnson, she says that her and Simple Tim were going to go, quote, headhunting, she said, and said that they had a gun in the back of the car, which that's an odd thing to announce at the end of Thanksgiving. Delicious stuffing.

Fantastic. The homemade cranberries. See, that makes it it's so much better than out of the can we're gonna go kill a guy have a good one on head hunting we're gonna go shoot people in the head there's guns involved have a good one yeah glad you put that sausage in that stuffing really kicked it up that's the key right there yeah and kept all that no fruit either nobody needs raisins in that shit. Thank you. Thank you. See, you know what you're doing. So she said that they had

also discussed on an earlier visit that Tim and Shonda had discussed that they were going to try to get custody of her son Chad and they were going to take McCullers to court. They had discussed that in earlier occasions and now they're just saying they're going to go headhunting.

At one point in the custody conversation uh in the presence of tim richard's sister there was a mention of shonda uh saying that she was raped by mcculler at one point and at that point uh uh she the sister realized that this woman was trying to get tim to actually do this yeah she's like she wasn't just like you should kill him it was like he fucking raped me and you should kill him right like then it was like getting serious so uh she took her brother aside and told him not to be stupid think about what you're doing here that's done between them or whatever that's the law can take care of that but you don't be killing people that's crazy which you know makes sense obviously speaking logic to the guy you know how it is is. So November 30th, 1997, a couple days later, early morning hours of November 30th, a guy named David O'Mary, who is a vice president of the First National Bank of Jasper.

Oh, he's crushing. He's one of the above 200K people in that town. He is driving down Alabama Highway 195. in that town. He is driving down Alabama Highway 195. He drives past the Harmony Missionary Baptist Church, and he notices in the parking lot, there's a car parked there,

and he notices what looks like a man lying next to the car. So he goes in, and he turns in. Would you stop? I wouldn't even look at the church. I wouldn't even notice it. That's the thing. I was going to say it. I don't know. It was another. I can't even say I would stop, because i wouldn't even look at the i would i wouldn't even notice it that's the thing that's i was gonna say i don't know there's another i can't even say i would stop because i wouldn't even notice and if i did notice like oh he must be laying down i don't know what the fuck people are doing for the church i don't know what people do at church maybe he's connecting

with the lord through i don't fucking know how people pray i don't know that's the thing i wouldn't know it's a baptist church i've never been there before maybe he's fucking praying through the i don't know what you have to do maybe you have to make gravel angels while you pray i have no clue so uh not it's not though he pulls into the parking lot this uh vice president of the bank uh he pulls into the parking lot and approaches this person and notices that the man uh was a had a gray complexion yeah and he looks a little closer and notices that he's also got a bullet hole in him and that he's dead as well okay so there's a dead man in a church parking lot so he's like oh shit he calls the cops uh there and uh they come and it's mccullers yeah uh they find obviously it's

going to be him uh so what the fuck happened here between thanksgiving and here that caused this guy to be dead uh very simply uh this was the right after thanksgiving uh uh the saturday that the 30th they uh hired they got a babysitter the tim and sean they got a babysitter and went out that night they went to the cooler which was a restaurant in jasper alabama isn't jasper's the fucking town and roadhouse is it jasper's the town in it's not alabama though it's like missouri i think but jasper is the fucking town that's why it sounds like a small town there's going to be a rumble patrick swayze is kicking the shit out of all these people through here with his fucked up pancreas he's still flying through the air yeah kicking people in the face

those are kicks hitting people with pool cues and shit jasper okay that's what it is thank jesus that would have bothered me all night so I'm happy that happened I always see that dog that could smile next door that's what the guy taught him to do and the smile would the guy it would snarl and it was the

scariest thing and you couldn't tell if he was smiling or if he was fucking furious and that's why I always was terrified of that dog that's hilarious and that's why i'll never forget the word jasper because that thing i was always afraid it was gonna eat me jesus christ so it's it's jasper's got a whole bunch of stuff going on here so they go to the cooler with a k uh which is a restaurant there they sit down and ask for a menu but they're told the kitchen's closed uh so they go back to their apartment in jasper uh they sit around they're like well fuck man the kids are gone what are we going to do here so after a while they both decide to go to the bc lounge or else do you

go to the bc lounge uh which is there uh at that point uh they say uh that shonda had told simple tim here richards that randy mcculler was also at the BC Lounge and that he usually left the lounge between 12 and 12.30 a.m. So that was his time to go, and she said that'd be a good time to get rid of him at that point. So they get to the BC Lounge.

They spot McCuller's car. I feel like Tim Richards the whole time is thinking, at some point during this, I'll be able to talk her out of this. Like, I'll just go along with it because otherwise it's going to be a crazy night. I'll just say this, and then, well, maybe, you know, there's a guy there. He saw us. We can't do it.

And, you know, I'll get out of this somehow. So they go there. They go to the BC lounge. They spot his car. Tim Richards gets out of the car and slashes McCuller's tire. That's what he does here. So McCuller comes out of the car and slashes McCuller's tire. That's what he does here. So McCuller comes out of the lounge, drunk,

drives home still, obviously, because he's a good Christian. That's what you do. It's a rural Alabama. I feel like this might be commonplace. With a flat tire. Didn't notice. Well, he noticed after a while.

He gets in his car and drives out of the parking lot. And at this point, they lost him. It's a rural area. They lost a guy with a flat tire. He gets in his car and drives out of the parking lot. And at this point, they lost him. It's a rural area. They lost a guy with a flat tire? He's got a flat tire. Because they didn't want to pull out right behind him and look like they were following him.

So they had to wait a while. And once they pulled out, I guess he had already gotten to a turn point. And they were like, fuck, gone. Aliens took him. I'm not sure. So they lose him. So they drive all around jasper looking for him like he's got to fucking be around here somewhere so they drive all around jasper till they finally

find him at an omelet shop in jasper uh okay if it's called the omelet shop they find him there uh they watch him leave the omelet shop and he's following they follow him traveling north on Highway 195. This guy is driving a lot with a flat tire. And drunk. Okay. At one point, as they're following him, they finally see that he's pulled over. He's pulled over into the church parking lot. Probably finally realized he had a flat fucking tire. He ate some food and was sober enough.

Like, why? My car usually isn't this shitty. Why is this running like this? Oh, wow. I'm riding on my rim. God, that's a lot of sparks back there yeah well it's lighting up the night it's bright out here at night oh those are sparks that is my wheel on pavement it is not that bright at night uh yeah so all this is going on uh they see him in there they turn around and turn into the parking lot of the church at that point so uh uh they pull up to mcculler and shonda starts arguing with him uh apparently she had already put shells

uh in a rifle when they were following him around she had loaded a rifle already uh so she starts arguing with him uh as they pulled up apparently before she started arguing with him she uh put the shells in the chamber and she said and uh simple tim said she shoved it the weapon into his hands and she said quote do it do it get it over with so she's like this is the it's fucking go time here he is middle of nowhere let's fucking shoot him so apparently when he got out when she got out when she was arguing with him uh richards pointed the gun out the window at him at his head and fired and shot him in the head and while backing out of the parking lot out they shot him and so richards was like oh shit we got

to get out of here as they're pulling off she said that uh he said that shonda was laughing and clapping and smiling oh my god like fucking finally did it whoo like if you were like i don't know do you take the other one to your own head like at that point yeah i would be terrified of that woman fucking did it fuck like like when they got married she threw a bouquet out into the church parking lot this is the most fucked up wedding ceremony ever unbelievable uh so they they yeah they leave him dead in the parking lot uh she's laughing and all that sort of shit uh uh so uh uh they pulled away they're they're they're leaving uh she's laughing uh uh they threw the gun and its case off of uh two different river bridges that were around okay gun over here case over there

and then they went back home uh they go back to their apartment uh uh there this was uh they actually went home first sat there and went well we should get rid of that gun in case we really shouldn't keep that we shouldn't keep that right no that's bad so then they left and went out and threw the shit away closets are full of wedding pictures. I can't fit anything in there. I'm selling these box sets like mail order, so I need to have them in stock. It takes a lot of room. So yeah, they do that.

They throw it off. It's near Good Springs, Alabama, the bridges where they throw the shit off. They threw the rifle into the river. They do all of that. They threw the gun case into Baker's Creek, which is the same area, I guess. Then they go back to the apartment where Shonda is jacked up and wants to fuck. Yes.

She is like, let's get it the fuck on. Throw biscuits. Man, we fucking did this shit. We finally killed it. We overcame everything. This is fantastic. And he went, I'm not really feeling it right now. He said, I don't think so.

And she was apparently not happy about that at all i'm sure she was super fucking pissed uh but he said he just wasn't into it because he didn't expect that they were actually gonna do it it was kind of also sean the murder doesn't make me horny uh yeah he said he felt kind of bad yeah like you know anybody with a conscience does they feel normal people would not feel good about that but she she felt fine about it he's less simple than we thought yeah he's or more either one i'm not sure less simple i think more less simple people would still fuck i feel like a simple person can't compartmentalize those two very different emotions so uh yeah so he he stayed up all night he said he didn't sleep that night. He was kind of damaged by the whole thing.

She just was like, you don't want to fuck? Fine. She went to sleep. So she was fine, which is so funny in the homicide book. They always say that David Simon homicide book. It's not a steadfast rule, but it's one of those pretty good indicator. If you get two different suspects for the same thing and you put them in two separate rooms and they always let them sit for a while. The guy who goes to sleep is the one who did it.

Period. Makes sense. Because if you're innocent, you're not comfortable with this situation. You're not sleeping. You're pacing. You're picking your ass. You're looking out the door. You're like, where the fuck are you?

When are you going to get to me? I want to get out of here now. Let's go. Can we talk? Whereas the fucking guilty guy is like, well, I knew this was going to happen. I guess I'll take a nap and wait. I don't think I'm getting out of here. that's what it is i should learn to sleep here i mean obviously there's some people who know that and they act the opposite intentionally but

most people that's their reaction if they're guilty they just go to sleep they're caught it's over with time to rest finally yeah some human shit here uh so the next day after this man finds that the vice president of the bank finds finds him dead there in the church parking lot, they immediately question Shonda Johnson. Yeah. Does they look into the affairs? Well, as he always married to a woman that he has a bigamy charge against. This is let's talk to her. This is pretty obvious here.

Number one. Yeah. She denies any involvement whatsoever. Don't know what you're talking about. I have no idea what you mean. Don sense i have no problem yeah i i'm sure i'd love him to be dead but i didn't kill him uh three months go by nothing no arrests what cops are just just stymied by the whole thing they're they think it's her but they have no proof and they have no way they have no weapon they have no proof and if she's not going to say it and if he's not going to if simple tim or sean

is not giving it up who's going to fucking give it up no one else knows about it so that's that oh by the way she's pregnant again oh jesus in the interim between the murder and the time uh you know this next three months that go by there's no arrest she gets pregnant simple timmy from simple tim simple tim slip one past the goalie and there he is uh but the problem is over these months the police keep talking to her they keep chipping away at her this is what they'll do they keep wanting you to repeat that story because you haven't said it in a month maybe you'll fuck it up now and then they'll go well you said this last time what happened and that's you catch them in a lie you know if something if you lie it's hard to keep that same lie going every month sure you have to remember it right it's uh it's nice that's what's nice about the truth is you don't really have to remember it's it's in your head comes to you

pretty quick because you you have like a vision of what happened because you it actually happened right it's much easier so yeah uh finally over the course of months she changes it differently i was i don't know anything about it i wasn't there at all i heard i don't know but people have told me that that tim did it my husband but i don't know anything about it you know i didn't do anything finally in the last version of all this after three months she says okay fine uh tim did it tim did everything uh uh it was all his idea but i was in the car oh don't do that she said i was there i was this is the other thing that's the window they give you they said to her probably look he did it maybe you didn't even want him to do it maybe you were in the car

and all that but yeah but but we can't know that you know he did it unless you were there right and she goes all right i was there but i didn't fucking do anything and i saw him and i didn't want him to do him she take all we understand yeah well you it unless you were there. And she goes, all right, I was there, but I didn't fucking do anything. And I saw him and I didn't want him to do it. And she'd say, oh, we understand. Well, you just said you were there. Now you're just as much in it as he is. So, yeah, and they also think probably it was her idea. That's the other thing.

They look at Simple Tim and they're like, hmm. Probably not. I'm going to go with bigamy over here. Not many benefits for old Simple Tim. Yeah. I'm going to go with bigamist Shonda instead. Simple Tim, bigamist Shonda. I don't know about this.

Old lying, bigamist fucking... You could slap a lot of different adjectives on the front of her name and it would all fit. So, finally, yeah, it's all Tim's idea, but she was there. Now, a friend of hers, a woman named Bobby Feltman,

she talked to the police and they were asking, like, do you think they're asking her friends if she's telling you anything and blah, blah, blah. Now, her friend said, Bobby here said, you know what? This makes a lot of sense. This makes perfect sense because this is exactly what a guy would do with her because she's been a victim her whole of all of these men. She says that she says that bobby don't she says that every one of shonda's husbands except for mcintyre beat her uh which they that was never accused even by any the only police report that's ever been filed was her first husband saying that she was going to kill him twice there was never anything filed the other way so i mean it might

be true we don't know but she never mentioned it to anybody except for this person and never filed a report which people do hide that shit too you never mentioned it to anybody except for this person and never filed a report, which people do hide that shit, too. You never know. And she may have told Bobby, and Bobby just wholeheartedly believed it. So she just relayed to the cops what she heard. You don't know. It could be true, and she could have hidden it out of embarrassment. It could be complete bullshit, and she could be saying it to Bobby to get sympathy because

she's a liar, too. We have no fucking idea about that. because she's a liar too we have no fucking idea about that uh but uh either way she says that uh you know there's no way that shonda was involved she says about shonda this woman quote she tries to treat her husbands like the bible says but then they run her over oh no okay you can say she's a nice person who wouldn't kill her husband but don't bring the bible into this she's married to three different people at the same fucking time and left one as soon what's the bible say about leaving people as soon as they get aids right i think in sickness and in health is right there in the fucking i know it's not in the bible but it's right there in the vows right it's pretty close also the bible says uh you can

hit a woman so yeah take it easy bobby you can stone your children to death for working on sunday do you know that that's in there there. Throw that shit out, Bobby. Fucking, yeah. Let's not do that shit. So, yeah, they didn't quite buy the whole story that she had. So they turned to Richards, to Simple Tim here, and they said, look, Simple Tim. We need you to simplify it. Look, man, break it down as only you can.

Only you can really just break it from an A to B. So we need you to do that. He first just denied everything, but then finally broke down after they played him audio tapes of her blaming it on him. Oh, shit. So that's the other thing, too, is they're going to do that. And they

said, well, she says that you were he was like, she didn't say that about me. and he was they were like you know play and they're like she was all innocent i don't know i i tried to stop him but he was an animal and he couldn't he just wanted him dead and uh so uh tim simple tim said quote i just started crying when i heard the tapes because he feels very played at this point uh so uh why did he open up his heart to her oh he did he he was he was he was willing to take care of her kid shoot her fucking husband it's all in lie to the

cops he's willing to fucking do a lot for her though james you can't get your heart broken unless you give it to somebody that's listen you took a chance that's true a real chance if there's two things that come out of this episode it's you can't get your heart broken unless you give it to somebody and that aids is just acid spelled funny those two things really what i want everyone to take to heart maybe put it on a magnet on your fridge i'm a goddamn podcast yoda tonight throw that live laugh love right in the garbage and replace it with AIDS is just acid-spilled funny. It makes you much better. Oh, my God. I think it's beautiful. Jimmy's going to die.

Yeah. Holy shit. Yeah, they'll throw that sign right in the garbage there and put this one up instead. So, yeah, get it for you, everybody. Get it for your mom. It's perfect. Holy Christ.

So, yeah, the police obviously believed that it was Shonda behind the murders in reality here. So they offer Simple Tim a deal. They say, look, in exchange for your testimony, you can plead guilty to murder and not get life without parole and not get the death penalty. You can get a chance of parole. He does. He agrees. He agrees to testify. He pleads guilty uh here at this point

by the way shonda since she's in jail anyway she pleads guilty to bigamy because she's like fuck it sentence me i'm already in here well it's time served i don't give a shit might as well get it over with while i'm awaiting trial because the sentence for bigamy isn't like 20 years 12 days yeah i think it's six months a year year, some shit. So she does that. The problem is, though, the defense claims that it's all Tim. They say no. They're saying it's all Simple Tim. Simple Tim has done this before.

Simple Tim wrote a note threatening one of her ex-boyfriends one time. It's all Simple Tim. This ex-boyfriend, his name is David Prescott. They were saying that David Prescott, by the way, she also tried to recruit him to kill McCullers and he said no.

As soon as they talked to him, the cops talked to him, he went, oh, he's the guy she was asking me to kill all the time? Yeah, she's been wanting that guy dead forever.

Hey, she finally got somebody to do it. Good for her. Way to go. She accomplished something. I'm proud of her. She's usually a sl slacker she kind of doesn't really get accomplished goals beach but now not bad uh so uh this is not good and also ronnie webb her other boyfriend that she was living with before also was there to testify that oh yeah she begged me every goddamn day

wanted nothing more than for me to kill McCullers, gun, dynamite, whatever I could do. So there's several people going, because it's all the chronology, too. Like, she went to this guy, he said no. She went to that guy, he said no. She went to that guy, he finally said yes. Like, it's pretty simple.

The state decides they will, in fact, seek the death penalty against Shonda. Oh, Shonda. They want Shonda. They want Shonda. By the way, the death penalty against Shonda. Oh, Shonda. They want Shonda. They want Shonda. By the way, the death penalty at this point for Alabama, if you're sentenced here, puts you in the electric chair. No kidding. Not in the lethal injection range.

Nowadays, though, I think it was 2013, they added in the choice of one. I was reading this one case where this woman got executed like a month before you had the choice oh so she had to go and she was trying to get it stayed so she could choose lethal injection and they said nope and they put her in a fucking electric chair so this is for the electric chair this is a big game we'll say this is this is for the title right here this is to not have your eyeballs melt and explode in your fucking sockets this is a pretty good one a wet super bowl put on your head yeah this is not great at all uh so uh he agrees like we said agrees to plead guilty in exchange for life with the possibility of parole simple tim he must

testify against her uh at the trial they admitted uh evidence of her bigamy conviction, her prior bad acts, which included adulterous relationships, which she had an attempt to get her romantic partners to murder her ex, her current still bigamist or bigamy victim husband. Right. I don't know what to call it. Bigam E. I don't know. All of this shit. Evidence that she attempted to enlist her every partner she had in hurting McCuller, claiming sympathy, trying to get sympathy by claiming he had raped and beaten her. There was evidence indicating that she had taken different partners that she had to McCuller's home and drove by in in an attempt to kind of prod them along.

Like, the house is right there. You can just run in and kill them. Like, shit like that. They were like, no, I'm good. We'll stop. We'll just keep going to Jack in the Box. We're fine. The cooler's still open.

It's still open. They're still serving. So if I killed him, then the kitchen's going to be closed. Right. And then she found out that's true later on. Cooler with a K. Cooler with a k cooler with a k in alabama in alabama so uh yeah uh so plenty of evidence of that people uh people uh testifying to that evidence that she manipulated tim in the hope of uh she tried to get tim to have an

altercation with david prescott who she also had an affair with before uh so she was trying apparently that note was sent at the behest of her where where she told him everything to say, even like, you say this and say that. It was like, shit, he didn't even know. Like, you know, and he was like, you did this and this and this, and I'll kick your ass. And he was like, I don't know what she's talking about. He's just telling me what she did. They introduce exhibits of the first marriage to Jeff Nelson here. They talk about that,

87 to 93. They talk about Jimmy Tidwell, who lasted in 1994, as I knock things all around the studio. They say both of these marriages were before she met McCullough, but the evidence of these marriages kind of emphasize the rapidity

of her relationships, of her settling down long-term relationships. She goes through them quick. They also introduced the wedding book and videotape they got in that closet. Boy, I'll tell you. Of Johnson's marriage to McCuller, which is admissible because they're trying to go,

see, she was marrying him, and look how happy she looks. See what a liar she is? She was actually married to somebody else and bullshit yeah look that's what they're trying to do she did to put upon kathy oh poor kathy jesus she had to do everything fuck didn't even get a piece of cake got shit didn't get the little gift that all the other rides made because she had to put the fucking gift bags together and there was nothing left. Wasn't one left for her. It's all right. It's fine. Damn it.

She's great. She goes home and she just, she makes a lean cuisine and she sits and she eats it and she goes, okay. Next time. I'm going to do this. Next time it'll be better. Yeah, it's going to be better next time. Just, I can't take it anymore. Karen opens the door and now it won't.

Just a thing of hummus and some chips. Nothing else. Just, it's a full tub of hummus night.'m just gonna relax we'll be fine tomorrow i can't take it anymore light a candle so uh yeah they introduce all this shit they also uh introduce uh i don't know what what uh what relevance this has but this is alabama so they try to bring up inflammatory shit they uh they uh uh had testimony of one of the investing officers uh on some other thing that was weird and then they also had johnson's description of certain sexual practices between her and mcculler which they just wanted to be like see she's not a christian a christian woman wouldn't do that

she wouldn't reverse cowgirl no this girl like shit like that like they're they're trying to you if you watch like any of these courts uh court situations in the south if it's a conservative area they will 100 try to paint a defendant as like a sexual oh your sex life is coming out for no if you watch the staircase thing, half of that is about he was having sex with men on the side. He was having gay, with the heavy accent, gay sex, where she would draw it out to four syllables. You're like, wow. It is three letters, lady. Calm down.

She made it sound like Satan. People were like, oh, gay sex. Oh, Jesus. It's coming for me in my own home, gay sex. I'll be sleeping. My kids will be sleeping. Someone's going to put a penis in their mouth.. So, Jesus, it's coming for me in my own home. Gay sex. I'll be sleeping. My kids will be sleeping. Someone's going to put a penis in their mouth. They won't even know it's coming.

It's evil. Jesus. So, yeah, the state introduces evidence that she had a child and all that type of shit here. They also they brought up her her questionable abilities as a mother were raised by the state in an effort to prove that she also was manipulating her son into certain behaviors and beliefs and shit like that. They also said they introduced evidence of her saying that she believed if McCuller died, either her or her son would get his money, all that sort of shit. They introduced the evidence of the marriage and the bigamy evidence and all this sort of shit uh they introduced the evidence of the marriage and the bigamy evidence and uh all this type of shit uh the can the evidence of her physical relationship with not wrote with uh with ronnie webb uh a lot of fucking evidence against her that seems it's pretty

circumstantial and would be a decent circumstantial case except for when the guy who pulled the trigger comes and goes she fucking shoved it in my hands and said, do it, do it, do it. And talked about nothing but killing her. Right. So that killing this guy, that was a, that was a big deal.

Uh, also the fact that, uh, uh, uh, Webb's friend, David Prescott, uh,

she told when she was pregnant with Webb's kid, she was having an affair with David Prescott and told David Prescott that it was his baby, even though she knew it was Webb's to try to Jack prescott up into killing mccullers it's like well i got your baby now so you gotta help me and it turns out wasn't even his baby it was webs but she was telling both of them it was their babies to try to get both of them to do that meanwhile she was already married to two people so this is that's where nancy Grace goes bombshell bombshell. Yeah. Gay. I feel like she'd lead that charge. So, yeah, this is a fucking mess here.

All of this shit that they're that they're doing. They say that she was having she was approaching that David Prescott trying to rekindle their affair while she was going out with this one and married to these two and pregnant with that one. The whole thing was was crazy and it resulted in uh threats uh being made by richards toward prescott telling him to stay away from shonda and not uh see her anymore uh so finally uh they they uh they tried to try to prove motive they They introduce, like I said, the bigamy conviction and the whole deception and the whole deal. It's a pretty good case, I would say. Pretty strong. Pretty strong. And she is found guilty in late 1998.

Found guilty of this charge of murder there. She awaits sentencing. Remember, death penalty on the table here. She awaits sentencing. Remember, death penalty on the table here. While she is awaiting sentencing in early January of 1999, old McIntyre there, he dies of AIDS. Oh, poor fuck. So 1999. He died of AIDS.

Yeah, he ended up dying three years after he's diagnosed. So it's rough. That's a rough way to go down for him. So at least he's away from her. I don't know. It's the best spin I can put on it. Otherwise, Jesus, that's a rough rough way to go down for him so uh at least he's away from her i don't know it's the best like the best spin i can put on it otherwise jesus that's not great so january 18th 1999 uh 19 january 19th 1999 is her sentencing uh at least the jury part of it where they recommend the sentence and uh the the prosecutor to the jury says quote what we have is somebody who wanted randy m McCuller dead, and she finally found somebody weak minded enough to do it. Yeah.

Which Richard is there. Hey, take it easy. Thanks, man. I'm right here. I'm down. I'm right here, man. Fuck, dude. This is messed up.

So finally here, the jury recommends the death penalty for her. Shit. They recommend the death penalty. her. Oh, shit. They recommend the death penalty. They recommend the electric chair. Obviously, the judge doesn't have to follow that. But when they go to the judge to do the sentencing, there's a lot of aggravators in terms of lying. There's a bunch of stuff that's not great in terms of aggravating.

Not a whole lot of mitigating circumstances here. This is all shit done by perpetuated and you know forced by her own hand yeah so not a lot of sympathy for her and the judge tells her you ma'am yeah may fuck off gets death in the electric chair oh shit for shonda johnson here oh my god take a fucking hike lady yeah uh so that's a oof boy it's super real that's that shit just hit yeah that's crazy i mean this turned from like a that shit just hit. Yeah, that's crazy. I mean, this turned from like, you know, oh, this is fun. And we're going to shoot people in a parking lot to the electric chair.

Oh, boy. No fucking around. So about Richards here, Tim, simple Tim, like we said, avoids the death penalty, you know, does provides them with everything they need. They ask him to do one of these sheriff's detectives here said, quote, I don't think Tim would have ever spent a day in jail if he hadn't met Shonda. He's not a guy who does shit wrong. No, like he had to be really talked into this over a long period of time by a woman that he was manipulated by or by somebody.

But he's manipulated by easiest for a woman to do it. That's why back in the day with spies they would send you know women to infiltrate shit because they could get close to a guy it's the way it works so uh uh that now her four children all by different people here are living with all the father's different families so all four kids are with a different family somewhere with so they're all they don't even know each other uh but but tim richard's son uh who is conceived uh who was conceived in the interim right after the murder here uh i think she uh he she lives with uh johnson's mother which i don't whatever caused her i don't want kids around that yeah no doubt her parents no more no more no more

kids in your fucking house you you mess this one the fuck up somehow yeah this is a problem go to the dad's mom's houses might not be your fault but i don't really care at this point so uh yeah uh so she this boy lives with her mother uh this is shonda's mother's name is wanda so they're wanda and shonda yeah and uh perfect her mother denies all this shit her mother is angry angry fucking venom and fire to these courts she is pissed she says quote she is not a bigamist and she didn't kill nobody nobody jimmy not a bigamist even though there's paperwork that shows she's a bigamist. She's convicted. Didn't kill nobody.

She is fucking an angel. God damn it. I'm keeping her room just like it was. I'm keeping all the stuffed animals on the bed so when they realize their terrible mistake and let her out of prison, she'll have a place to go and be comfortable. And I'll bring her cupcakes and I'll make cookies and everything will be fine again. Okay. It's all going to be good.

I understand. I'll get my little girl back home. It's going to be okay. So after all of this, Tim Richard says he still loves Shonda. Oh, my God, Tim. What are you doing? Jesus Christ, Tim. She tried to fucking set you up to take the fall for this here.

He says he doesn't care. He says that he felt terrible about testifying against her. He said that, quote quote he should be the one who's on death row not her what is he doing he says quote i took one life with a gun and i took another just by speaking that's real hard to deal with unbelievable fucking the whole thing is his fault his mind everything he just feels terrible which i mean you should feel terrible you killed a guy but you shouldn't feel completely responsible there was another person involved in this it wasn't your idea he gave his heart to her yeah so jay did january 31st 2000 shonda is moved to death row

that's when shit gets real real when you're like oh boy this is a 23 hour lockdown and uh oh boy this is this is put upon engram uh so 2005 she has an appeal. So 2005, she has an appeal here. She has an appeal, and the appeal is over whether the judge should have told the jurors to limit how much they considered the evidence about bigamy and prior adulterous acts. How much they should take that into account in kind in kind of assessing her as a person basically how much are you supposed to take into account that's the thing well the law has kind of standards for this because as you might imagine this has come up a few times in cases over the years so they kind of have god guidelines here uh she uh claims in her appeal that improper evidence and testimony was admitted concerning the bigamy uh specifically the testimony by a deputy district attorney concerning the evidence found to establish probable cause to support the bigamy claim.

The bigamy complaint. It's real. There's a lot of paperwork shit here. She also complains that the documents supporting that testimony were improperly introduced. that the documents supporting that testimony were improperly introduced. She's going for, you know, real picky shit here. And that Richards was allowed to testify concerning the same evidence. So she said it was tainted evidence that two people then testified about. And nobody was, that wasn't struck.

She also argues that the state only needed to prove that she committed murder after McCullough was subpoenaed to testify or had testified in a grand jury proceeding and that the murder stemmed from his capacity as a witness. And the state did not need to prove, she says, that she was actually a bigamist or was convicted of bigamy. So she said they went over the line to overdo saying she's a bad person about the bigamy. They said, you could have just said she was a fucking, that I'm a bigamist. You did not have to introduce evidence to show I was a bigamist just to belabor the

point and make me look worse. No, no. The point is that to give as much evidence as possible so that you can't fucking dispute it. And they're trying to make you look worse because that's a fucking trial. That's what they do at trial for right or wrong. That's what, that's the game. Each side's trying to make the other side look bad and your side look good

that's how shit works uh so uh she also argues that richard's testimony concerning concerning her adulterous relationships with other men like david prescott and ronnie webb was a relevant and prejudicial uh she contends that testimony was introduced solely to make her look bad, just for bad character. She also disputes the admissibility of the testimony of Richards concerning the solicitation to have Tim assault David Prescott there. For some reason, she says that that shouldn't be in there, even though he's saying that she told me this.

So it seems pretty... She says, though, that's not the same thing i didn't get convicted of that so that shouldn't go in there that's like bad character shit that you're trying to introduce it's like well that's pretty good evidence though right that you like to try to get people to do your physical bidding like sorry dude uh well what a judge rule on that too too. Yeah. Yeah. And there's some ruling here. They said, well, the general rule is that evidence of separate crimes is inadmissible or only probative where the only probative function is of such evidence is to show bad character or an inclination or propensity to commit the type of crime for which the accused is being tried. If the accuser's commission of another crime or misdeed is an element of guilt or otherwise tends to prove their guilt then the proof of their crimes or misdeeds should be admissible so they're saying if she tried to get tim they're saying basically it's the same thing she's got the same guy who

she got to kill that guy tried to get him to kill this other fucking guy too so this is what she does it's not a matter and it's relevant to this case because it's the same guy in the same kind of breath is what they're saying uh it's it's kind of uh you know stickily it's a gray area legally like all fucking appeals are uh so they talk a lot about when evidence uh is is admissible in this particular case they said that uh it's there's a lot of very legal shit here that i will definitely not get into because your goddamn heads will fucking melt. Nobody wants that shit. Like somebody sprayed AIDS on them. Like it's AIDS all over that shit.

It is acid spelled. A little funny. So, yeah, they they talk about the they try to determine whether it's part of one continuous transaction, basically. And they talk about that in terms of the nearness and time and place of the earlier to the time and place of the final difficulty, whether the earlier and the final difficulty arose from the same cause or dispute and blah, blah, blah. Along those lines, you guys get it, I think. So the state here was required to prove as as an element that mcculler was a witness and that there was a casual relationship with the intentional murder uh and that mcculler

and his role as a witness they're trying to say you were killing him because he was a witness and that's what you do so that was a big deal here uh the details of her bigamy were admissible proof of motive that's why they let that in there because otherwise they'd have wouldn't have the motive and that the murder was committed in order to conceal another offense uh they also held that as part of the motive so that makes sense the other offense being bigamy uh so uh basically they said that uh uh proof of the details of the earlier adulterous relationships where she attempted to solicit her partners to assault or murder McCuller were admissible because it was an unshaken chain of events is what they're getting at, which makes a lot of sense. That included the evidence indicating she had listed enlisted the sympathy and support claiming McCuller had raped and beaten her and that she told all these men the same thing and tried to get them to do this.

So there's a lot of gray fucking area here with this and the the appeal is clever they really get deep because they talk about the uh the the error here in allowing evidence of testimony that from richards that johnson uh prompted the altercation between he and prescott and they have a real field day with that piece of evidence because apparently they're saying that uh they're saying that oh jesus this is hard to explain it's hard to explain if you're not an attorney i think it is basically it was hard enough for me to understand and now i have to try to regurgitate it i was just gonna say it's not an attorney i'm doing my best it's hard it's hard here so I was just going to say, as not an attorney, I'm doing my best.

It's hard. It's hard here. So they're basically trying to say that you can't. Okay. I'm going to skip over all that and put it in as simple terms as possible here is you can put, you can have, you can introduce prior bad acts and you can do all this if it's an unbroken chain of events that leads to it. So if you tie one thing into it, then you can tie the other shit into it. of events that leads to it so if you tie one thing into it then you can tie the other shit into it and you can talk about uh you can talk about all the salacious details you want and introduce testimony of it if it has anything to do with what you're doing okay that's basically what it is even tim would understand that tim would understand that also they they the judge is supposed to

limit what it is though the judge is supposed to know the scope of this. And also her attorney is supposed to object to things. This is what I'm trying to get out here. Is they're supposed to object to things that are going too far in that case. And she really doesn't give any objection to any of the shit being introduced. And there's not a real fight over it. And the judge does not tell the jury, jury hey limit your scope to shit that has anything to do with this and take because you normally the judge will instruct on shit like

that there was no limiting instructions is what they're getting at okay it's a long way to say that but that's a really it's fucking pain in the ass i had to figure it all out read it and figure out what it meant so i don't know i gave you i gave it to you in three minutes. It's the best I can do. You don't like it? Eat dicks. So basically, yeah, they do all this. There's a bunch of these errors here. The trial court, they decide in the decision here, the trial court gave no limiting instructions concerning the use of evidence of Johnson's prior bad acts to the jury. The jury was neither informed as to what limited purposes the evidence should be considered, nor informed as to what purposes the evidence could not be considered.

We'll skip to the end here. Because we find plain error in the absence of limiting instructions, informing the jury of the proper purposes for which the evidence could be considered, or the purposes for which that evidence could not be considered. The judgment of this trial court is due to be reversed and the cause remanded for a new trial fucking reversed and remanded.

Oh my God. Fucking overturned her conviction. Unbelievable. Un-fucking-believable. She was going to get the chair. She was getting the chair. So October 2006, she has another. It's an appeal by the state of her appeal in the whole deal here. They really get into this shit, too. It's a bunch of legalese shit with the prior bad acts and everything like that.

In the end, they say, accordingly, we conclude that the trial court did not commit plain error in failing to give the jury a limited instruction regarding its use of evidence relating to Johnson's prior bigamy conviction and prior bad acts, including her adulterous relationship, sexual manipulations, and proddings, because that evidence, as discussed, was properly admitted as substantive evidence in the offense which Johnson was charged and was not offered for purposes of impeachment. Therefore, the judgment of the Court of Criminal Appeals is reversed and the case is remanded for further proceeding consistent with this opinion.

They just reversed the reversal. This is like a game of Uno. Yeah, exactly. Back to one. Fuck. Back to me. Skip a turn. Shit.

Back to me. Draw two, motherfucker. Draw two, bitches, exactly. Back to one. Fuck, back to me. Skip a turn. Shit, back to me. Okay. Try two, motherfucker. Try two, bitches, and skip you. Okay. That's what happens. She got an appeal, reversed her remanded. Yay. Next year, the appeals court says, no, no, no, fuck that.

Let's reverse your reversal. Right back to where you were. Eat dicks, lady. I didn't even know that was possible. Yeah, it happened. Well, that happened. They can give you a new trial and take it away. That's what happened to Adnan.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. They gave him a new trial and they went, never mind. Forget it, sir. Never mind. So it's sent back to the lower courts for resentencing. And then they said, this was after she took it all the way to the Supreme Court. The Supreme Court in a 9-0, the state Supreme state supreme court nine zero decision said there was no need for limiting instructions because the evidence was quote properly admitted as substantive

evidence of the offense by which she was charged and uh you ma'am may once again fuck off yeah back to the chair with you okay so she's getting the death penalty again. She's getting the goddamn chair again. Okay. So, January 2008, Simple Tim recants his testimony. No, Tim. He says, I'm died. Never mind. Oh, Tim. I'm out. Jesus Christ.

He says that she killed him on her own and he wasn't even there. Okay. Now, he says that, quote, my lawyer told me we needed to stick to the story to get her. He says, I have evidence to prove my innocence. That's his story now. Now, the prosecutors were just kind of like, I don't know what the hell is going on. What the fuck we're doing here. Simple or something.

Yeah. What is he? Kind of a little simple, a little roundheaded. That's what I think. He says, quote, his attorney says, quote, I can assure you he wasn't coerced by me to confess it. That happened in 2000. And Mr. Richard signed a plea agreement and stated that that he was the shooter. They said he's filed.

Now he's filed court documents to get his guilty plea and life sentence thrown out. State courts have turned aside his challenges. He's trying to go to the federal courts at this point. So he says now he doesn't love shonda anymore he doesn't love her but he'd like to help her if he could he would like to help her but he doesn't love her oh boy and uh yeah so uh he says in his affidavit that he uh pulled into the parking lot of the church alone without johnson after johnson was already there and had murdered McCuller. He says, quote, she threatened to kill me if I ever told this story. He says that he would have never confessed to the crime without pressure from his attorney,

and his attorney denies that there. The attorney says, quote, he is eligible for parole one day, and his wife got the death penalty. That's all i want to say about that because they asked him did you do a bad job as a lawyer for him and he goes let's see the woman got the death penalty and he's getting parole and he's the trigger guy so i think i'm a fucking good lawyer thank you very much i'm a goddamn hero yeah motherfucker who's the only decent fucking lawyer here uh so uh yeah he's trying to get that done. It never gets done. They tell him, no.

No. You said what you did, and that's tough shit. So, April 2012, he escapes. Tim did? Simple Tim escapes from prison. What did he do? Okay, this is what I mean. The story just keeps getting crazier.

It's been crazy. Let's keep going. Oh, my God. So, he received a life sentence, but he was eligible for parole. Keep in mind, he escapes April 2012. You know when he's eligible for parole, finally? July 2012? March, May 2013.

Oh, my God. 13 months away. 13 months away. Oh, boy. He was at the State Cattle Ranch, which was a prison in Greensboro. He was found missing from his bunk during an inmate head count in the middle of the night uh the local officials say he feel fears for the safety of his staff and the victim's family yeah it's a minimum security facility are

you sure he didn't just chase a butterfly he might have he's out there like chasing after a balloon going it's pretty it's pretty no they catch him and he's like i thought i saw a quarter shit i was lost i'm bad with directions so uh it's a minimum security prison uh this place and uh it's interesting one a local official said a minimum security prison is no place for a convicted murderer to be god damn it uh u.s marshals and local police have fanned out across central alabama where he has disappeared they found no trace of him yet they tracked his scent with dogs but the trail eventually ran out oh my god this fucking guy is the fugitive now he escapes into

the wilderness uh here in his hometown uh the sheriff here richard's hometown they told the deputies that they were to be on high alert looking for him because he's simple. He's just going to go to his parents' house, they think. He says, quote, we've been checking local addresses that would be familiar to him, the homes of family members and places he's been associated with in the past. Like he said,

he was being run by, he was at the cattle ranch, which is a farm run by the Department of Corrections that once raised cows to feed inmates across the state it no longer operates that part of it but uh they said that uh this whole thing he's a keep a lookout for him he's a large man standing six four weighing 230 pounds and uh yeah that's a big guy big giant escape escaped murderer. Be careful. They said that another local politician blasted the state budget cuts, saying that's what put him in a minimum security prison. He said the cattle ranch shouldn't be a place where the state puts murderers.

How about you stop politicking? That's he turned it into that. And the prison spokesman said, actually, motherfucker had nothing to do with that. She said, actually, he's at the minimum security facility because in July 2010, he was nearing a possible release date, which was three years from then, and he was in prison for a certain amount of time with a clean disciplinary record,

not one disciplinary anything against him, not one mark, no write-ups, nothing like that. So he was eligible to go there. That's why he went there. The system just made him eligible for it it was normal uh because if you're gonna let him out in fucking three years right maybe ease him into that with him you know see if you can trust him in a minimum uh security environment let's not throw him into society fresh out of fucking maximum security he can't go one day we can't have him out there he could escape and then just

bye have a good one get a job at fucking mcdonald's and be around kids see you later like what the fuck is that yeah let's let's ease these motherfuckers into this shit so uh yeah they said he he met his thing uh it's insane though that uh he had a disciplinary free record uh the whole deal he had not been disciplined once during the 14 years one month and two days that he served before escaping. Not one thing. April 11, 2012, he's caught. He's caught after a few days. He's caught for a job as a bagger at a grocery store.

He's just down the street from the jail. He's actually caught in Akron, Ohio. Oh, my God. He got far, man. Wow. He got far. Yeah, corrections said they found him. They do believe he received help from someone to get all the way there. It was Alliance, Ohio he got far uh yeah correction said they found him uh they do believe he received help from

someone to get all the way there it was alliance ohio he got to uh he was discovered like we said missing and that's where they found him uh they found him uh at an address at 11 45 a.m he was unarmed and taken into custody without any incident uh it was just like a uh uh address of a friend he'll be placed in a facility with a higher security level level uh there they said that they uh will sign a warrant to prosecute him for a criminal first degree escape which would obviously uh be up to the district attorney to prosecute uh there uh the uh the the guy says quote it's unknown if additional charges will be filed until he's returned and the investigation's

complete. But they said they're probably just getting pretty good. The Alabama Department of Corrections said that, I'd like to applaud the U.S. Marshals for their help and persistence in apprehending the inmate there. And in 2013,

Shonda goes all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court to try to get her conviction put aside. And she does not. They say, you keep fucking off, lady. Have a good one. And she's still waiting to die. She's still waiting. She's at the Tutwiller Death Row right now. There she is in Alabama.

And Tim there is at the limestone correctional set oh they give him some more time center yeah he's he could have been out and he's not out so he's gone she's gone that is jasper alabama and uh story what the fuck happens down there my fuck what the fuck is going on with you people down here? Jesus Christ almighty. You really found a good one. Jesus. She's like Betty Lou Beats and Peru, Indiana. They're like mixed up in one and then throw fucking one of our weird white trash guys

in there, too, because she's sort of like a guy. She really is. Like her murdering type is more of a guy type of thing. I feel like so i handled like a dude i mean mine is the fact that she got somebody else to do it it's so weird when you look at all these cases because i look for cases and i look for like women men whatever like women they all not only but 95 of the cases i see women kill a their kids that's the most common or b their husbands they kill their kids uh out of uh

usually some sort of chemical imbalance or something like that they don't have any like practical gain other than holy shit it's finally quiet and that's like a mental problem where they snap right uh either that or they kill their husbands for insurance money or because they were abused but most of the time it's cheating or he's cheating most of the time it's not even jealousy though they don't kill a lot for that or they're cheating on him yeah just need him to go and they because they want insurance money and to be with this other guy of the time, it's not even jealousy, though. They don't kill a lot for that. Or they're cheating on him and they just need him to go. Because they want insurance money and to be with this other guy. That's the thing.

It's like a greed thing, whereas guys will kill for anything. Anything. They'll kill for fucking, they don't give a shit. They'll kill for, they're jealous, they'll kill because they're

out of being slighted. Women don't give a shit about that. No woman gets in an argument with a woman, leaves for four hours, comes back, and then kills that woman because they got in an argument. That's not what women do. She calls her friends and says, listen, that fucking bitch.

And whereas the man will go home, think about it, have a half bottle of whiskey and come back with a shotgun when everyone else forgot it ever happened and shoot the guy. Because how dare he say that to me? Embarrass me. He embarrassed me. Yeah. He made me not feel like a big man. So it's just fucking weird, dude. It's a weird thing

and uh this was a strange ass case and she what a story she reminded me of that so if you like that case i know what you can do it's very very simple you can go to patreon.com no don't do that yet if you like that case actually if you like anything go give us a review that's what we'd like you to do give us a review go to itunes or apple podcast whatever the hell it is wherever you listen to podcasts and give us five stars it doesn't matter what you say tell us you're following instructions following directions that's all good and dandy uh go to shut up and give me murder.com check out everything there we have lots of cool merchandise all sorts of links you can follow us on social media which we advise you You can follow us on social media, which we advise you to do. Follow us on social media so when we release the tour dates

and the ticket sales, you can get on it right away if you want to buy tickets right away. Because some people got shut out last time. They didn't get their tickets soon enough because they didn't know about the show until after it was sold out. Some of these venues aren't huge.

They're not fucking... Yeah, we have a couple that are... They're stadiums. Yeah, exactly. Well, yeah, none of them are stadiums. We have a couple that are smaller, and so they might sell out faster. So you probably want to... Anybody who missed Nashville, you know it sold out pretty quick.

So, you know, we just... We want people who want tickets to get tickets. So follow us on social media. You get them rather than seeing them on some fucking snake site. I hate that shit. It drives me bananas. That's the worst. So, yeah, you can do that at Murder Small on Twitter, at Small Town Pod on Facebook,

and at Small Town Murder on Instagram. Follow us there and keep up with all of our stuff that we have going on. And if you've done all that and you still feel like, good God, I haven't done enough, then you can be a hero of ours. You can be one of our producers who we talk about at the end of every show. And who we, goddammit, we just love so much. And we're just, we couldn't do the show without them. So you can do that very easily by going to patreon.com slash crimeinsports.

Or you can just head over to PayPal and use our email address, which is crimeinsports at gmail.com. And you can make a one-time donation. And goddammit, I think it's time that we hear this list of people, Jimmy. Lay it on me. Hit me with it like a shotgun in a church parking lot. Let's do this. This week's executive producers are Gary Howard and his family. Thank you, Gary.

All the goddamn time. He's so nice to us. Appreciate that, brother. Thank you. Alexis Seeger, like Bob. Jennifer Deal. Katie McDaniel. Corinne Price. Ryan Borky. Jennifer Deal. Katie McDaniel. Corinne Price.

Ryan Borky. Lisa Adams. Angela Miller and Justin Miller. Every week there's... Thank you guys so much. Really, we appreciate it. Thank you. It's amazing.

Romp Fest. I'm not sure what that is. Google it. It may be a festival that you like. I don't know. Cool. Check it out. Thank you.

Ryan Dempsey. Jordan Bennett in Canada, Candice Kennedy. I forget where she's at. What city is she? I don't know. Because we have seen her in different places. Yeah. Atlanta. So many times.

But then I don't think she's from Atlanta. And she was going to be in Nashville. So she's in the south somewhere. She's in the south. She was going to come to Florida. But thank you, Candice. And then Dave Schenaley. I think that's Schenaley.

I hope it is Schenaley. Schenaley. Okay. It's Schenaley. I hope it is Schenaley. Schenaley, okay. It's a pain in the ass to write because I don't know how to spell that. Thomas Smith, Jeremy Jennings, Rebecca Doe, Lonnie Hall, Rebecca McDonough, Grant Reynolds, Gina Kutajaroff. That's a fucking tough one. I'm getting it. I think so.

David Withers, Tucker Prater, Alicia, no, Ashley Dawn, Jay Linkey, Brooks and Paige Carter, Snoopy Noodle. All right. Yeah. Sure. Whatever. Why not? Ellie Bertoni, Brenda Likovic, John Codling.

He's an artist up there in New York. Thanks, John. Thank you. Drew Shockley. Nick Dunn. Nicky Dunn. Liz Vasquez. Vasquez.

No, that's a Z. It's Vasquez. I don't, but Spanish culture is so tough to pronounce their words sometimes. It's a little difficult. Neil Campbell. Kayla Roberts. Ryan Shank. Kimberly Goerg.

Goering. Goering. Doug Wilkinson. Luke Evans. Sounds like a country artist. He does. He does. You know, that's a country artist.

There's one earlier that sounded like a country singer, too. There's a lot of them in here. Amber Fortune Brown, Tyler Sheets, Joe Heilberg, Lauren Boyd, Larry David. Probably not, but it's a guy. Jesse Hartman, again, thank you. Sarah Fox, Audrey Harbottle, Travis DeArment,

Pauline Hoyt, no, it's hot. No, is that a Y? It's a Hoyt. It's definitely Hoyt. Lisa Kay, with no last name, Camille Cummings, Amanda Mitchell, Reagan Shalkley, doesn't matter. Thank you so much. Brendan Ables, Chandler Davis, Karen Warner, Donna Pond, Heather, Kimberly Reba, Jessica Dustin, Deontre Br I'm pretty sure that is. All right. I'll buy that. Hannah Cooper. Lauren Henkel.

Henkeli? Henkel. A lot of problems there. Dylan. That's Dylan. Dylan Harvison. Liz Roberts. Clay Thorson.

Pam with no last name. Selesha. Selesha Waits. Misty Wilkins. Tabitha Dunlap. Riz. First name. They go by Rizzo. You mentioned them before. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you remembered. Yeah. And you were Dunlap, Riz, first name, they go by Rizzo.

You mentioned them before. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you remembered, and you were right. Laura, I don't remember what it was, but she sent something, or he, I don't know. Yeah. And they mentioned that you were right. It's a Greek reference, yeah. Laura Sauter, Lindsay Bennett, Pamela Rogers, Casey Huffman, AJ Vieira, Barbara Livingston, Chuck, no last name, Dario, no last name, Jeslyn Stocker, Dan Neimer.

That's a fucking cool name. It's not bad. It's a fun one. Dan Neimer. Dan Neimer. It sounds like a swear word. It's got the ne-ne-ne. It's nice. Christina Listland, Lauridsen.

Oh, that's a three-word name. That's what that is. Christina Listland Lauridsen. That's what it is. Okay. Chris Knowles. Probably no relation to Beyonce. Kim LaDuke.

That's what that is. That's an L. Luke Holman. Kelly Higbee. Silky BH. Is that a silky butthole? I don't know. Maybe.

It could be. Could be. Could be somebody fucking with me. Or it's Silky, and I'm ruining their poor name. I'm destroying it. Jeremy Parenti, Keisha Davison, Shannon Precup, Julie Schletter, Justin Christie, Jessica Shannon, Carlin Rickles, or Caroline Rickles, Stephen uh stephen rude and snow academic genius attorney genital attorney genital okay uh with with her very nice nicely done there academic genius attorney

genital whittaker uh daryl daryl donahue uh paul powell janice hill cow uh rachel jones damien damien uh barney yes damien barney uh kevin mcdonald allison morris krista walker lauren Jones, Damian Barney, Kevin McDonald, Allison Morris, Krista Walker, Lauren Demerath, Steven Greger, Tyler Gwill, Amy Spicer, Cheyenne Ryder, Rachel Stora, Aaron Clark, Barbara Loser, Hannah Simmons, Julianna Hopper, Cheryl Dodge, Matt Kerr, Alec Ritchie, Ashley Veal, James Lombardo, Gage Simmons, Penny Coleman, Jody DeGarcy. No, DeGasari. DeGarcy. DeGasari. All right.

I don't know. There you go. Lana. No, it's Lana. That's what that is. It's Lana. Alan Hopsfinfarger. Nice.

Hopsinsperger. Hop and Hop. Hopson Spurger. That's it. Thank you, guys. We can't tell you how much we appreciate that, guys. Thank you, guys, for everything you do for us. Honestly. So that said, Jimmy, where could they follow you on social media?

You can find me at Wisman sucks. W.H. I.S. M.A. N. Sucks. And don't don't reply to other people's things. Say them right to us.

So that we have the opportunity to come back to you. Oh, please. And I do my best to reply to all you guys, whether it's snarky or not. Where can they find you? That's true. You can find me at Jimmy P is funny, or you can copy and paste my last name from the show description, copy it, and hey, I don't have any shit to say. It's all right there. It's all right.

You can say it right to me. I don't care. And it's not a matter of, you know, no one wants to kick anybody's ass or anything like that. It's just like, shut up. Shut up. Because don't say anything to people that you wouldn't say in person. I've said that forever. Exactly.

And especially when you deal with people that you might actually run into someday. Probably not a good idea. It's really not. Just for fucking. Very simple of him. Just very simple. Very, very simple. Holy shit. That said, guys, very simple. Holy shit.

That said, guys, thank you so much for tuning in. We've had a blast on another insane goddamn episode. Absolutely. We'll keep coming back every time. Uh, and until next week,

everybody, it's been our pleasure. Hey, Prime members, you can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free on Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today. Or you can listen early and ad-free with Wondery Plus and Apple Podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.