Small Town Murder - #208 - Two Dead, One Missing - Houston, Delaware

Episode Date: January 28, 2021

This week, in Houston, Delaware, a 911 call from an extremely unlikely source reveals a brutal & awful scene, with very little evidence, and one, very important thing missing. Investigators, including the FBI, are baffled, until a very creative technique gives a glimmer of hope. Luckily, this leads to the culprits, and one of the strangest, most insane tales ever told! Along the way, we find out that no one knows anything about Delaware, that you can't just claim a baby as your own, and that some people are just way luckier than others!! Hosted by James Pietragallo & Jimmie Whisman New episodes every Thursday! Donate at: patreon.com/crimeinsports or go to paypal.com & use our email: [e-mail] Go to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things Small Town Murder & Crime In Sports! Follow us on... twitter.com/@murdersmall facebook.com/smalltownpod instagram.com/smalltownmurder Also, check out James & Jimmie's other show, Crime In Sports! On iTunes, Stitcher, or wherever you listen to podcasts See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

You're listening early and ad-free on Wondery Plus. What if you married the love of your life and then stood by them as they developed 21 new identities? What would you do? This Is Actually Happening is a weekly podcast that features extraordinary true stories of life-changing events told by the people who lived them. Listen to the newest season of This Is Actually Happening on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. This week in Houston, Delaware, a 911 call from a very unexpected source prompts the discovery of a terrible and deadly scene and one very important missing thing. Welcome to Small Town Murder. hello everybody and welcome back to small town murder yay yay indeed jimmy yay indeed my name

is james petrigal i'm here with my co-host jimmy wissman thank you folks so much for joining us this week we have one of our craziest things that we have ever done this week this is uh ranking up with the pocket robins of the world and the things of that nature yeah and a classic this is one of those things where i don't know how this isn't like a household name this case it's absolutely bonkers i can't wait to do it and it's just crazy but before we get into that quickly just want to say thank you for everything you've done for us this week especially if you've given any uh reviews on apple podcast that purple icon they help and we don't know why so give us five stars it really helps drive us up the charts thank you for everybody that does that also head over to shut up and give me murder.com yes because this is the last week to get your

tickets to the virtual live show tomorrow night it is tomorrow night january the 29th and it will be available for 72 hours after so you can do it get in on that a lot of fun we're gonna have the visuals and we're gonna it's just like we going to pretend like we're in a theater. It's as close to a real show as we can do for you. It's a real episode. This is all we got. Yeah, a real case. We're going to have microphones in our hands, and you'll go, wow, are we in a theater?

Or am I in my living room? Then your cat will jump on your lap, and you go, okay, never mind. I'm home. That's what we want to do. These drinks are reasonably priced. Look at that. Shut up and give me murder.com right now. Also, all sorts of merch and everything you'd want.

And, you know, you can get information, find out about crime and sports, which you should be listening to if you're not. You can start this week because if you like small town murder, it's kind of what happened this week in crime and sports. So check that out. Wild case. No sports really at all except for it's made up sports because the guy's a sport he's a complete the liar it's hilarious and uh and a murderer so check that out catfisher do that yeah also ps i hate this movie because i have to watch terrible things so please help me and listen to that and uh share my pain so do all of that and of course patreon oh are we cooking on

patreon i'm right patreon.com slash crime and sports. Anybody over the $5 level gets access to all the stuff. Not only small town murder, but all the crime and sports extras too. Yes. And they're very rarely even sports related. It's mostly weird stuff. So that's what we do. Our past one that we just got done with was we had a crazy murder in Michigan for small

town murder, which you do. How happy were you? done with was we had a crazy murder in michigan for small town murder which you do how how how happy were you it's a murder that you cheer which is so rare but you go yeah all right then there's that and then we did for it he asked for it and then we did it literally then we did the death of steve mcnair over on crime and sports coming up on the future patreons next week we have love after lockup for small town murder we are going to talk about the new season of love after lockup my favorite oh god do we have passion for that and then over on crime and sports we are going to talk about mafia stuff because uh you've asked for

it so we're going to give you all sorts of mafia stuff yeah talk about like some uh the real life goodfellas kind of thing from a bunch of books that aren't henry hill and it'll be a lot of fun patreon.com slash crime and sports very quickly disclaimer yes of course this is a comedy show you know obviously we are comedians and this is we obviously there's murder okay it's good murder happens and bad things are gonna happen and it's true it is that but we're not gonna talk about a murder like it's something silly. We're not like, isn't it hilarious how the person was decapitated? That's not what it's about. There's a lot of crazy stuff that goes around a murder that is absolutely hilarious because the idea of, hey, let's kill people is kind of a crazy idea.

So when you think about that. It's actually kind of a funny proposal. Yeah. Unless you go through with it and then that's when it's not funny anymore. But that's the point. Right. So that's how that works. But what we do is we go out of our way not to make fun of the victims or the victims' families because we're assholes.

But we're not scumbags. And there's your deal. That's how it works there. So if that sounds good to you, we're going to have a good time. If you think true crime and comedy never go together at all, maybe we're not for you. I don't know but you should probably give it a shot give it a run uh yeah for everybody else that wants to have a good time and hang out and hear a crazy story i think it's time to clear the lungs and shout

shut up and give me murder let's do this jimmy wonderful let's go on a trip shall we let's go we're coming from pennsylvania last week western pennsylvania as a matter of fact so we're gonna go down to the east coast east coast coast this week and uh we're gonna head down to delaware great been a while um delaware is one of those states where if you said to somebody name all 50 states they'd get to 45 and they'd start to struggle and delaware would be one of those ones where they're like oh shit yeah delaware that's right there is a state over by maryland over there forgot about that it's one of those you know zero facts about delaware nope admit it you nobody does level with yourself you are we are going to houston delaware all right which is spelled houston delaware h-o-u h it's no yeah

like houston texas it is houston delaware but it's housed in delaware okay because this is one of those ones where i almost will give it to them because houston came after houston's the houston's because like there's houston street in new york that's spelled in new york city that's spelled houston and that's been around longer than houston's been a fucking place or sam houston was you know what i mean so whatever it's one of those it's a different thing and it's named after a guy and that's how his name was pronounced different houston so so is texas place right that was sam that was sam houston is a different statue yeah this is a different guy so it's a different thing uh this is central delaware it's all panhandle here the whole thing whole fucking steak one panhandle it's like three

counties broken down in a panhandle it's about a half hour over to dover if you want to get some dover excitement that's the capital oh yeah oh yeah that's where it all goes down jimmy that's where it all happens uh but they have the statue of you know johnny delaware out there that's beaconing to the people to come there you know johnny delaware jimmy people don't know too they're like people are googling johnny delaware which is johnny depp actually shortened his last name it used to be delaware that's what i thought it was too ethnic so he changed it yeah so it's just a statue of jack sparrow outside in full regalia that's how it works now in dover it's people don't understand from the outside but if you're from there, you get it.

It's about an hour and a half over to Baltimore. I'm going to Baltimore, D.C. area, either one. And about an hour to Port Penn, Delaware, which was our last Delaware episode, which was episode 165, April 1st, 2020. That feels like it was 1820. That's the guy that got – that's that was port penn named after penn right the guy i believe so yeah yeah he's got too much yeah we were everything is named after him this is in kent county which we've covered before that's where mary dell is as well which barbara ann peterson i believe was her name which was a a wild story what a story yeah that

in the end actually had a happy ending yeah which was good and we told it eight days before she died that was wild that's the most i feel like we killed her coincidence yeah she finally could rest that was so strange thank god somebody knows my somebody knows it i'm gonna i'm done now is that enough very weird uh area code 302 uh the history of this town we'll go through it quickly it's named after john wallace houston who lived from 1814 to 1896 you've never heard of him no nope he's a he's a lawyer and politician okay that's it he was a member of the whig party and the uh back then and he served as the u.s representative from delaware and a justice of the Delaware Superior Court,

where all of our famous, most famous people come from. Really? You can think of anyone. Just name a famous person from history. From history? Anybody. The Wright brothers. Julius Caesar.

He was on the Delaware Superior Court. Anybody. Just pick somebody. Name them. Delaware Superior. They were just, you know it. All of them. Yeah. Delaware Superior Court. Muhammad Ali. Delaware Superior superior court it's everyone from caesar to ali it's very

strange larry johnson delaware superior court grandmama delaware superior court so i wish he was in that would be amazing i would love that dunking on people with a gap with the wig on that's what i want perfect so uh in the 60s in the 1960s i guess i should say since we're talking about history right gonna be anytime specific especially that's an old place dover was a center nearby of manufacturing of space suits really worn by nasa astronauts in the apollo moon flights okay so they they manufactured pieces of it here um the suits that were dubbed a a7l was uh first flown on the apollo 7 mission in 1967 and was the suit worn by neil armstrong and buzz aldrin on the apollo 11 mission that's the orange ones yeah that's i believe so i don't

know what the fuck either way they only make a piece of them? Like the crotch or something? They still manufacture spacesuits, this company. The Space Shuttle soft suit components, arms and legs of the suit is what they manufacture. We're incapable of making a chest. Someone else makes the chest. This is Delaware. We have limited capabilities of chest making. What a weird state. Arms and legs only, everybody.

Come on. Let's go. Someone else is making a crotch. No, the legs stop at the hips. We're in trouble with building an ass in this thing. We got a crotch guy and we got a chest guy. Let's not interfere. We're not going to encroach on other people's territories.

What the fuck is that? I don't know. This place is the home of the Futuro houses. What are those? Do you know what the Futuro house is? That's where they make churros of tomorrow that's the churros of tomorrow um space churros otherwise no no they go great with tang what the fuck is that it's a it's like a fucking pod house it's a like a like

a flying saucer okay it looks like the gravitron. It looks like a flying saucer, but it's like just a big plastic, like, smushed down egg, basically. And people live in that? You live in that? Absolutely. You can. There's pictures. Look, he looks happy, doesn't he?

He looks miserable. Look at that guy. This miserable old man sitting in this thing. He looks so sad. And that's like an advertisement. Poor fuck. He's like, you want to live in this, Ethel? This is a piece of shit. Look at that. He looks so sad. Ethel. There's no woman in poor fuck he's like you want to live in this ethyl this is a

piece of shit look at that he looks so ethyl there's no woman in there it's just him he's taking the picture here's the ads for it you can like fiberglass vacation home what modular design of stressed fiber fiberglass and polyurethane it can be purchased ready to occupy as all this what do you do with is there there's no wheels on it how do you get it to where you need to go do you fly it it comes in pieces and then you put it of course it comes in pieces that's it it's some made in dover others made elsewhere well it says right here it's the jet and space age way of living i hate it i mean do that yeah who's who doesn't want that can't believe that business is bankrupt it looks that sounds and looks terrible yeah it was conceived

by maddie serranin in 1968 he was on acid when he did this he's like i want to live in like what if i smush down an egg and it felt like a flying saucer and i put windows on it and then that's him now sitting there you know if the aliens come that we're gonna make them want to make them feel like they're at home so we should make some some space houses i think so that way everybody knows we're on the same side um one guy who lives in chicago but people rent it as like airbnbs too because it's like they still exist yeah there's still there's a bunch of them around the country that like people rent out all the time so this one guy says uh richard garrett from chicago i'm gonna name him because he loves it he says a great find for me and the price is right and goes on to say he says it's basically like going on an

rv vacation he says being plastic construction though rain sounds like tupperware and a dishwasher oh i'm sure because it sounds like a tent basically uh so uh this town i only found one review of this town because it's very small and they love it. Five stars all the way. Quote, I was born and raised in Houston. I've seen a lot in the 54 years of my life. Some of it was great and some bad. As a little girl, I've experienced segregation, the building of a freeway, Watergate, and the assassination of several prominent public figures.

Growing up inston has its perks hold on that she made that sound like if you grow up in houston you get to see segregation and watergate and assassinations and a freeway she throws in there like those are a lot of really big things segregation watergate assassination of public figures segregation these are all huge and really bad and a freeway i've also seen a freeway she said she said she's seen good and bad one time i saw a cat eat some string like yeah there is no there's no good in that i guess building a freeway yeah they needed depends on what side of segregation she's on yeah i mean experience sounds like she's saying it's bad, so I hope anyway. Population of this town, 424.

Okay. Excessively small. 56% female, because it's such a small sample size. Who knows? A huge 55-year-old to 65-year-old population. Okay. Three times the usual amount of people that age. Weird. They don't live past that, and they don't move here before that.

I don't know what the hell's going on. Way married people it's like 61 married because a lot of people are older i think is the reason um so yeah less kids things like that uh race of this town actually different than you might think it's uh almost two averages here 67.7. It's normally about 62. 15.1% black. It's normally about 61. Or it's normally about 12. 3% Asian. It's normally 5. So, I mean, it's close.

Not a lot of Hispanics. 0.5%. I'm sorry. 13.4% Hispanic. So that's close, too. So it's almost, oddly, a 450-person town is on par an exact replica of the rest of the of the entire country mashed into one little weird town in delaware it's strange uh 33 religious so well under the average here of course uh the most is catholic but not by a lot we're not going to give

it a baptist of the north here because it's like one percent beating methodist so it's right there uh point one percent jewish so we do not get to sing this week uh catholics apparently are the baptists of the mid-atlantic coastal region probably so uh unemployment rate's a little bit high here a little over the national average median household income's decent normally it's about 57 and a half thousand here it is 51 250 so not terrible retail trade is 22 of the jobs which is a problem yeah that means uh kind of trend yeah low not stable benefits aren't there seasonal work seasonal for them yeah that's the other thing seasonal which isn't helping uh cost of living 100 is regular average uh here it's 95, so kind of high, but the housing is the low part.

It's a 77. Median home cost here, $178,000, which is under the average. I mean, it's not terrible, but still. Seems a little high. For here, yeah, it does. It seems a little high. Delaware at all. And it's right in the middle.

It's nowhere. It's not on the coast, any coast. It's just boom. There's nothing bringing you there. No, this is if Delaware had a bullseye, it would be Houston. You'd just aim your dart right at it. You're right in the old butthole of Delaware. Bink right there.

Oh, bullseye. Or the belly button. 50 points. No, it's the butthole. We're going with the buy picture. Delaware's bent over. All right. It's sticking.

That's the way I figured it. That's its fight spot. Sure. What the hell. That's the way I figured it. That's a sweet spot. Sure. What the hell? However you want to look at it. Yeah. 65% of the houses here are worth between $100,000 and $200,000. So, I mean, it's generally affordable, more than the rest of the country anyway.

So, if we've convinced you, damn it, nowhere else to be for you. We have for you the houston delaware real estate report your average two-bedroom rental here 840 which is well under the national that's super cheap it's like a third less than the national or under the national average. I found a three bedroom, one bath, 980 square foot. It's a trailer, Jimmy. I'm not going to lie to you. It's like an open area with some grass and some trees. And there's like a there's like a hill next to it.

There's a trailer and then some other trailer like structures that I don't know what the hell they are. I don't know. It might be a park. No, no, no. It's not. No, it's not a park i tell you that much it looks like maybe the beginnings of a junkyard like the the seeds of a junkyard someone's got the idea for one but 78 000 that's a deal for this little slice of heaven here i found a three bedroom one bath uh 1080 square foot actual house you you know, real house with a foundation and everything with no strange meth trailers near or by it.

It's in a nearby town real close by. Not great, but not terrible. One hundred eighty thousand dollars. Kind of your square feet. Yeah. Kind of your average house here. And I'm going to end the music here for this one because I have a description of something and oh oh fantastic so here we go here we are 134 acres oh here it is and i'm gonna just give you the the pitch right from the real estate thing just land

well let's talk about it uh sam yoder's farm offers so much more than an agricultural opportunity jimmy i know you've been looking for an agricultural opportunity this is so much more than an agricultural opportunity. Jimmy, I know you've been looking for an agricultural opportunity. This is so much more. But if it has more. It's more. It's a destination, a place for welcoming people. People, Jimmy. Enter the property down a long paved driveway that leads to ample parking and a 7,500 square foot community center with a stage, sound system,

and seating for up to 700 people. This sounds like Jonestown. This sounds like you're making a fucking jonestown it gets worse the center holds up to 350 people for sit-down dining which can be catered in the full-size commercial kitchen located in this facility it also includes a sprinkler system and storage area for tables and chairs this venue has hosted gospel concerts wedding receptions family reunions church gatherings and more since it was built in 2004 lodging is available on site with three post

frame cottages behind the center and a campground with 40 camping sites start your own jonestown everybody or start a country music festival no this, I'm sorry. This feels like everyone gathering in the pavilion. Come on, children. It's weird as shit. $2,250,000. It's 134 acres with a bunch of buildings and sound systems. What the hell else do you want here? Who would want that?

You're starting a cult or a militia. Right. One of the two. Buying it for a job. A cult militia. I guess that was Jonestown Buying it for a job. A cult militia. I guess that was Jonestown. Same thing. There you go.

Things to do. Oh, my. Obviously, so many. The annual June Jam. Jamming in June. Music festival. Oh, baby. It evolved from a tragedy.

This is right on their website. This makes me want to party. This is the first fucking sentence you read when you go to the website to look. Oh, what's this? June Jam. june jam that sounds fun from a tragedy the first line is the annual june jam evolved from a tragedy that occurred in 1978 and then it describes it three friends were electrocuted while working in magnolia delaware they accidentally leaned an aluminum ladder against a high voltage line you could have stopped it they were electrocuted i didn't need to know the details of this i don't want to buy concert tickets anymore

i'm concerned if my all my ladders are away from my power lines limbs came off as they exploded one young man sadly lost his life two of them survived but were burned severely then it says seven of their friends including bob hartley and john Tassler, rallied to help survivors. A very successful fundraiser was held at the fire hall, which morphed into the first annual June Jam. Now, great music and good times while helping others. Rest in peace, little buddy. We're going to smile about it. Rest in peace, because we have Jason Morton and the Chesapeake Suns playing on the fucking card.

What year? How many times have they done this now? Since 1978. So like fucking 40 years. Yeah, 42 years. It's this year, or 2020, the lineup. Joey Fulkerson and Nothing But Trouble. Nothing, not nothing.

Right. Tenfold Trouble is the next band. They put both the Trouble bands. It's all kinds of trouble together. You could have put... That's like if you're making a comedy lineup you don't put two people who are kind of the same next to you both have trouble in your name let's put a buffer like hot wire reunion they could have put them in there stop that hot wire is that a group that's playing yeah hot wire reunion a man died from hot wire no no that's why we have a band called hot wire reunion what

the fuck is maybe it's the burned people if it is that's fine then i'll give it to a bunch of skin graft guys petting hendrix like jimmy hendrix i guess i guess you're petting him johnny neal the lowercase blues and with no capital letters it's very clever jason morton and the chesapeake suns as mentioned before scrapple okay just scrapple that's just the name awful shit that people eat and the headliner damn the torpedo okay that's the headliner i hope they just do acdc fucking covers and just like play live wire and that's it everything off of a high voltage that would that would be amazing just playing old motley crew records and that's it everything that's a that's a reference to electricity play those songs that's all it's fucked up too because

the kickstart my heart yeah the that's the motley crew with what i was thinking so the year before too was like the same bands playing almost okay so it's the samelly crew with what i was thinking so the year before too was like the same bands playing almost okay so it's the same thing almost over and over but hey you know what don't get burned so crime rate in this town yeah what we're interested in property crime is a little bit high it's about a third above the average of the rest of the nation so strange for a town of 450 people i would say yeah how do you steal from someone if you they know them yeah hey they know your name bob took my shit who took it back tommy who took it well let's see let's line the whole town up and i'll tell you we'll get a get rid of the elderly

and the tiny children and then we'll you know the rest of the town i don't know 80 90 that's what i mean 80 90 people and i'll take a look we'll see. Gather everyone in the pavilion at the Sam Yoder Farm, and we'll pick somebody up. They can hold y'all. We'll make them drink the Kool-Aid. So it's about one-third high violent crime, murder, rape, robbery, and, of course, assault. The Mount Rushmore of crime, right about at average. So kind of your average town, like we said. It's demographically, it's broken down, except for the weird 55 to 65 giant population.

Outside of that, everything is very average in a town of small things. I like to call them baby boomers. I think so. Yeah. So that said, let's talk about a murder. Great. Because it's a lot of murder and it's just a lot of weird here. So we got to get right into it.

All right. Let's do it all right let's do it here um let's go back let's let's go back to the 80s what do you say jimmy me and you i like it we're going back to the 80s i don't know i don't i don't want to go there take my hand jimmy we're going back to the we'll be back here don't worry we'll have we'll have hulu and shit by tonight no it's not a i'm not crazy here what are you talking about i'm not out of my mind i don't want to have a fluffy hairdo, and I don't need that. But we're going to go just temporarily here.

We're going to go back, and we're going to talk about a couple of nice people. Great. Let's talk about some nice people. Everybody we talk about is terrible. Let's talk about nice people. There's a couple named Joseph Gibson Jr., which, obviously, Jr. is a red flag for us. It's a bad deal. Based on crime and sports.

Could have been his dad, us. It's a bad deal. Based on crime and sports. Could have been his dad, though. That's the thing. If you don't know, if you've never listened to crime and sports, somehow we've done almost 250 episodes of the show, and somehow an inordinate amount of the guys are either juniors or named their kid Junior. It's the strangest thing in the world. We thought it was funny the first, like, 50 times, and now it's the strangest thing in the world it's it math we thought it was funny the

first like 50 times yeah and now it's 250 we're like oh no right frightening this is getting the point where it's mathematically it's not just funny anymore it's not just the sample size it's called a thing it's it's playing out over time so either the dad or the son is a fucking problem something is bad uh he and beverly w gibson yeah who was his wife they are uh obviously a couple they're both from the area uh they married on september 12th 1981 at the wheat coat united methodist church very nice that sounds that sounds very um brown wheat coat yeah yeah no but it sounds those two getting married at the wheat coat united methodist church it sounds like john cougar mellencamp played at the reception he was

just starting out yeah and he was like very new i'll play i'll play at the reception man i can do it who did he about joseph and beverly and he was like i just use my wedding song i just use different ones for whoever's getting married. It's a little trick I play. It was before he went by all three names. He just called himself Cougs. The Cougs? Yeah.

Everybody, the Cougs. First of all, I want to give a big congratulations to the new Mr. and Mrs. Gibson. We are the Cougs. Here we go. I am the Cougs. You don't need to worry about these guys we are the coogs but you'll soon forget about them hit it sing the song every single wedding just scamming everyone so uh december 15, 1987, they give birth to their third child.

Beverly does. I don't think Matthew or I don't think Joseph had much to do with the delivery. Very little effort. Very little effort in the delivery. Beverly gives birth to a healthy baby boy at Kent General Hospital in Dover. They name the boy Matthew Joseph Gibson. He's eight pounds. Healthy, nice, eight pound baby boy Matthew Joseph Gibson. He's eight pounds, healthy, nice eight-pound baby boy.

Very nice. This is their third child. They already have two children, a five-year-old, Rebecca Ann, who they had about a year after they got married, and then one-year-old John Gregory. Sweet Jesus. Wow is all I have to say. And a newborn? A brand, brand new and a one-year-old which is hilarious it's exactly what my little brother has and it's so funny because i'm like you are nuts yeah but how

many more kids you want yeah you're crazy there's shit everywhere and i mean shit yeah and it's everywhere but nobody's ever planned to have a one-year-old and a newborn no that's never happened right i hope not it seems like that's a really that's always an accident it's it seems overconfident yeah if you're doing it on purpose it's very overconfident you're really arrogant yeah it's like i'm gonna open a restaurant yeah and then as you're doing it like you're just getting everything going and you know you're trying to figure out what you're doing you're like i needed to open a textile factory at the same time and i'm going to run both of them and i'm going to build it and i'm going to build all i run their hands at night when the restaurant closes that's basically what you're doing to sleep now that's what it is i'm

going to put in an automatic car wash too man well this you this would basically feel like you were just running a small business that'll never turn a profit if you have like three small children oh god what's going on you're just following them around five though they can help pretty well a little bit they can do quite a bit they can pick shit up you know what i mean my daughter was five when my son was born and it was great she was a big help one in brand new fuck you nightmare and the five-year-old can't really help out with a newborn or a one-year-old either so i'd drop one of those off at the fire station for sure pick pick pick the two you like best that's what we're keeping so uh they live in what looks like hazletville it's spelled h-a-z-l-e-t-t ville what would you think that is that's definitely hazel that's hazel that's hazel ville but it's hazel ville here what they could there's two t's that are completely ignored you

have to be kidding you can't have two silent t's no in a row no that's a hard t yeah it's two t's right that's like that has oomph to it yeah you can You can't do that. They just said, no, you know what? Yeah. Those two T's, that's a little aggressive. I don't think so. I'm not using any of them. How's that sound? I myself prefer case tapes.

What? Who decided? How can you not do the T's? It's Houston. It's Houston spelled Houston and Hasletville spelled Hasletville and said Hazelville. So I don't know what is happening in this area, but it's the next town over is Hazelville is where they live here. The Gibsons and they live in kind of a it's a kind of a remote area. Hazelville, that's not really a town.

It's a town, but there's no like when I go to look it up, there's not really any information on it. It's just it's an area where it says like Hazelville is at the corner of this road and this road. Like, that's all it says. So the town is an intersection that has nothing to it. There's four corners. Yeah. And then they kind of say that the rural shit around it, they kind of call it Hazelville. But it's weird.

So anyway, ignoring two T's altogether is together is two yeah that's we've never seen that before that is that's ballsy honestly that is just ballsy it's arrogant venting it's entitled it's a very entitled it's a lie you're a liar you can't do that you're an entitled liar so not these people but whoever has anything to do with that someone you're an asshole so let's talk about some other people here now that we've talked about the gibsons joseph and beverly and their their nice children rebecca john and young matthew and let's talk about joyce kemp greenwood uh she is 37 years old and like in 86 she's 36 87 whatever she's 37 so it's in her mid-30s at this point.

She is a local gal. She went to Caesar Rodney High School. She's a Houston gal. She was married for 15 years. She got married pretty young, had two daughters, and then got divorced recently. So in the last five years, she's been divorced. It was a long time. Which, I mean, happens. It just happens a lot. Mad common. Mad common. divorced yeah recently so in the last five years it was the worst time which i mean happens it just you know happens a lot mad common mad common my parents are divorced and your parents were you

get two kids and you realize holy shit i don't like you enough for this yeah i don't even like you i don't want to run i don't want to run a textile factory and a restaurant with you never mind uh all this shit so it's all a light-hearted nightmare on our podcast morbid we're your hosts i'm alina urquhart and i'm ash kelly and our show is part true crime part spooky and part comedy the stories we cover are well researched he claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people with a touch of humor i just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit

with a little bit of cursing. This mother f***er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal, or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's

most notorious crimes. You should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. In May of 1980, near Anaheim, California, Dorothy Jane Scott noticed her friend had an inflamed red wound on his arm and seemed unwell. She insisted on driving him to the local hospital to get treatment. While he waited for his prescription, Dorothy went to grab her car to pick him up at the exit, but would never be seen alive again. Leaving us to wonder, decades later,

what really happened to Dorothy Jane Scott? From Wondery, Generation Y is a podcast that covers notable true crime cases like this one and many more. Every week, hosts Aaron and Justin sit down to discuss a new case, covering every angle and theory, walking through the forensic evidence and interviewing those close to the case to try to discover what happened. And with over 450 episodes, there's a case for every true crime listener. Follow the Generation Y podcast on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to Generation Y ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus. Yeah, she has two daughters, but they don't live with her at this point in time. One is a teenager. They're both teenagers, but one is like 17, and I think they live with their dad at this point in time uh one is like it is a teenager they're both teenagers but one is like 17 and i think they live with their dad at this point in time so by the way do you remember in school

when and you it's kind of like a cliche where they say it's going to be on your permanent record right and it's a joke and you go yeah right you know my permanent record great and you laugh at that yeah you remember that yeah okay um i in elementary school joyce we're talking in the mid 60s when she's a child somebody wrote something down about her and now we're talking about it like almost 60 years later more than permanent record this is it's permanent yeah they mean permanent record apparently when she was in the sixth grade i'm not shitting you uh when she was in the sixth grade there's a report that says that she was a tattler i'm not shit you not jimmy permanent record kids if you're listening and you're a

child i mean i don't know your parents you should probably get them and figure out what's going on but with why you're listening to us but uh otherwise if you're just if you're a sane and you're just a little too mature for whatever permanent they mean permanent they're not fucking around there's gonna be two idiots like us saying in sixth grade you were a tattler 12 years old they labeled her a snitch stuck around a tattler yeah and a constant fighter oh and a tler. So she'll fight with you and then tattle about it, apparently. So very pleasant young lady, it sounds like, at 12. Sounds like her teacher didn't like her very much. Right.

This little shit. She's always fighting and tattling. I don't like her. She's got a mouth on her, it seems like. They'd go in the teacher's lounge and smoke and drink coffee and talk shit about her. Talk about this kid, yeah. Talk about what a dick she was back then. So Joyce, yeah,

watch out for your permanent records. Tadler, constant fighter. But we don't know about her now, obviously. You change from 12 usually. So then there's, oh, by the way, here she is if you'd like to see her there. Okay, that's our snitch, huh? She looks like

Olivia Newton-John at the end of Grease. Well, her hair's black though. She's got like a, she's got a helmet of hair. It looks like it Newton-John at the end of Grease. Well, her hair is black, though. She's got a helmet of hair. That's a lot of hair. It's bulletproof. My Christ. August 18, 1986, she meets another man. She meets another man, and it's serious.

Richard W. Lynch, Jr. Dick Lynch. Well, actually, he goes by Dickie Lynch. That's literally what he goes by. I shit you not. Dickie Lynch. Now, Dickie Lynch is about 26. Dickie Lynch is 10 years three months younger than her. Okay. So, yeah, he likes

a little bit of an old lady. It's all good. In your 20s. Here is Dickie Lynch. Holy shit, he looks 44. Well, that's the reality. He looks like... He looks horrified. He looks like somebody that's your guy he looks like he looks horrified he looks like somebody that manson would have rejected from the gang where he's like we can't have him around you'll be freaking people out man he also looks it's not gonna attract people that's gonna repel them i'm trying to bring people into the into the cult this is that picture looks like you can't

believe that that technology exists yeah he looks like they're gonna capture my soul that's what it looks like they're capturing my soul stop it that face oh man so bright well i gotta live inside a little tiny thing now so now i'm just inside there i live in there now now richard lynch local guy again he's the son of richard uh richard william uh senior so he's Richard William Jr. Obviously. Oh, God. Dick Billy Lynch. That's brutal. Dickie Billy Lynch over here, Jr.

Dick Bill Jr. That's no good. Dick Bill. Old Dick Bill. Old Dickie Bill. Dick Bill. How's it going, Dick Bill? You know all the kids call him Dick Bill.

How many fights did he get into? There's no way I wouldn't. That's the look when you call him Dick Bill. He looks like that. He's like, ah. Old Dick't. That's the look when you call him Dick Bill. He looks like that. He's like, ah. Old Dick Bill. Old Dick Bill. How you doing, Dick Bill?

Poor fucking guy. That's what you call like a mole on your dickhead. Yeah, Dick Bill. But the best part is he's Dick Bill Jr. I don't know why that makes it so much better. He's the little one. My daddy's Big Dick Bill. I don't know why that makes it so much better. He's the little one. My daddy's Big Dick Bill. I'm Little Dick Bill.

You know me. That's even better. Little Dick Bill. There are two Dick Bills. Two Dick Bills. Wow. So Dick Bill is the son of Dick Bill Sr. And Virginia Lynch is his mother.

And they live in Milford at this point. Now Joyce Lynch, when he ends up marrying joyce because they will get married old joyce uh there she is the daughter of byron bud of course so we got bud and dickie senior yeah are the two dads that's the dads at this wedding dickie senior i'm bud how you doing that that was the handshake they had dickie senior and Bud. Yeah. And her mom, Thelma. And then Virginia and Thelma talked it out.

This is very particular, this whole thing. Old Virg. Virg and Thelma had to talk it out. Well, we'll let Dickie and Bud meet and talk, and we'll just go have a drink over here. I feel like that was how that was. Thelma and Ginny. Oh, Ginny and Velma.

Now, he is raised, he was raised in Lynch Heights, old Dick Bill Jr. His last name is Lynch, and he lived in Lynch Heights. Built by and named for his 92-year-old grandfather. Wow. Who started this whole thing about 60 years ago. Dick Bill is the namesake dick bill is the his family the namesake he is he's the 92 year old dick bill the third dick bill original original dick bill there he is og dick bill incredible somebody og dick so Dick Bill. Incredible. Somebody. OG Dick Bill. Lynch Heights sounds much better than Dick Bill Heights. Doesn't

it? Dick Bill Heights. I think Dick Bill Heights would have been better. People wouldn't have known what was going on. Dick Bill Square. I feel like there's hunting in there or something. I don't know. Dick Bill. I'm catching Dick Bills. What you hunting today? Dick Bills? We got our own currency. They running this time of year. When the Dick

Bills running, you gotta get them. I'll tell you what. So're running this time of year. When the dick bill's running, you got to get them. I'll tell you what. So, yeah, the dick bills, our dick bill junior here, Richard Lynch Jr., he is the oldest of three kids. He has a sister, but he also had a brother, but his brother died. He lost his brother when he was a teenager when his brother had an aluminum ladder on off that was the thing and then they as well this was in 1980 he didn't learn his lesson no he went to june jam and thought it was thought it was a suggestion he didn't understand if it was a tragedy i'm so sorry no no actually his his

brother died of cancer oh fuck yeah that's why I didn't say cancer yet, because there would have been no jokes after the cancer part, because that's just sad. A teenage boy dying of cancer is just horrible. That is the most awful thing, man. No, there's really nothing funny about that. Nothing at all. Anybody under adulthood. Nope. Not a single joke about that.

Nope. It's fucked up. unless you're like you know 88 playing with house money right even then it's sad but you're like ah something would have got me yeah like i feel like if i'm 88 i'm like well i mean i was figure i'd be dead the next couple years either way so what the hell they say if we lived forever cancer would eventually kill us there you go that's the thing something but to get it at that young, that's fucked up, man. Ridiculous and awful. It's not fair. No, it's fucking horrible.

So Dick Bill here, Dickie Billy Jr., he grows up with what they call in this newspaper article a life typical of many Southern Kent County young men. What does that mean? From respected families. Oh. His family's got dough. Really? Yeah, he's

not trash this guy bills are killing it the dick bills yeah no they built a whole neighborhood it's named after them they own a whole bunch of property awesome they're like a respected hillbilly enclave yeah this is a this is no joke jimmy this is their top hillbillies a lot of petty blue in that house oh yeah absolutely i was choking on that one that was funny so he graduated from milford high school in 1979 worked a bunch of jobs here um you know in his early 20s he's not he's kind of a he doesn't really have the drive i feel his grandfather probably had by this age his grandfather was building a community named after him and he is just kind of floating from job to job fucking around but i mean also it's a different time this is we're

talking in the 80s early 80s he graduated in 79 that was economically not a good time it was real bad for the next few years too small towns even worse it was getting real yeah exactly uh he was a farm hand for a while i mean this he's doing whatever he can he worked at his father his father is a contracting business dick bill senior so he works at the contracting business he's an employee at an air conditioning company he's doing hvac as well tough stuff yeah i mean you add drywall and roofing to this it's a really rounded out resume of a lot of people i know you know what i mean like how many people do you know with that exact resume so many got some hvac i'll put up your drywall um did some roofing yeah back and uh there it's hot too hot for that though that's why i got inside doing a drywall now that

i did all this i'm gonna go do meth now um well i did meth while i was doing it it's hard to roof when you're sober you do that at 8 a.m forget about it that at 8 a.m. Forget about it now. So he worked at the HVAC company until he hurt his back. So now he's in his early mid-20s. And he's injured and can't quote can't work. So and I say that because we'll talk about it. His level of how well he can work or not. But who knows. So now the death of his teenage brother joyce always says that since um

since uh you know she met him this is what she says that the death of her of his brother made him uh really want a baby to carry on his father's name really because it's the they're a prominent family and you got the you know dickie billy granddaddy that the town's named after and his dad's a prominent guy and now his brother died so he's the only one who can carry on the name so he wants a son but that's his he's obsessed with that i guess his dad that's what joyce says right doing odd jobs with your dad though is not the way to do that granted you can want it all you want just yeah it's who knows i can do it so he's on disability um here at this point where he worked for like

we said an hvac company and now he's on disability and he and joyce get together in 86 and uh by 87 they're both unemployed yeah both trying to do a disability and uh there's one guy here who uh worked in one of the state offices and he said he remembers both of them joyce and dick bill jr here walking up with canes when they showed up at his business asking for help and getting a workman's comp claim hearing scheduled sweet jesus is a 25 year old guy and a you know 36 year old woman coming up i mean if they're injured they're injured but two people under-old woman coming up. I mean, if they're injured, they're injured. Two people under 40 hobbling. You're coming up in Cain's, you're like, Jesus, what the hell's going on here?

Were you in a horrible car accident? What's wrong with the two of you together? So Lori Richardson, who is his sister, she said that he worked also for the Baltimore Airimore air coil company near milford that sounds exciting that sounds like there's a lot of sparks flying around that's hvac stuff yeah i think it's the coil yeah i have no idea you could have asked me industrial as fuck you could ask me something about a space shuttle engine and i would have asked me about the nasa uniforms that's the stuff on the inner lining of the leg of the thing right yeah sure i have no idea i'm sure there's a coil in there somewhere seems like it right air coil is the thing that they put uh that keeps the the arm on the spacesuit inflated oh i got you so they

and puffy and also it's an hvac apparently yeah keeps your arm cool as well it's a it's gotta be an hvac it pumps it in i guess probably yeah yeah they manufacture commercial air conditions there you go there you go commercial ones so he said a back injury though put him out of work he's been on medical disability and um so anyway that one guy he hadn't received a disability check from baltimore air coil since january 1986 the year before yeah so it's been going a while here and he's have been having hearings before the industrial accident board of the state department of labor to settle a dispute with the company they keep having the hearings rescheduled and rescheduled which is you know the company doesn't care but this he's not getting a paycheck so he

cares company doesn't want to pay him no they're trying to yeah why not they're trying to you know draw it out as much as possible so um apparently uh people like donated food to him at some at one point and uh him and joyce here and uh one point this guy this cock guy he says they came in and brought a packet of letters from their attorney and ball and baltimore air coil they said they were in dire need of getting this action settled she said she was going to have a baby instead of chance of losing their home what absolutely so june 7th 1987 richard and joyce get married they get married right then mainly because she's pregnant wow so that's yeah so she's saying

she's in there with a cane saying i'm pregnant and we need money he's got a cane but he can throw dick oh you can throw do we use dickie bill yeah dick bill throws down let's be honest here dick bill doesn't need yeah he doesn't need to walk no to to give it to joyce and that's what he's doing here he's like dumplings you put that cane down and i'm gonna i'm gonna drop nokia in you that's right i am gonna get us a disability check here yeah so uh they get married they move into a little brick ranch house at 323 broad street and that's about may or april of 87 they do that now december 23rd 1987 joyce gives birth okay she gives birth here uh richard the uh old jenny lynch richard's uh dick bill senior's wife dick bill junior's mom they said that uh you know joyce was already pregnant when they got married that they knew

that already and uh so they were told the night of December 23rd is the baby came, but they didn't see the baby until the morning of Christmas Eve. So she had the baby next day. Pretend like Santa brought it. There you go. Hey, look at that.

It's a stork with a beard. Yeah. Perfect. A bearded stork flew into town with reindeer, even though he's a stork and doesn't eat them. Sure. Well, I guess to carry the baby, he's a stork and doesn't eat them. Sure. Well, I guess to carry the baby, it's a heavy load, all those babies, I would imagine.

The stork's wings are going to get tired from flying up and down chimneys anyway. Obviously. That's the problem. He's going to need some fresh legs around here. Well, he does eat cookies and milk all night, so he gets a little sustenance in there. So there's a baby announcement here. in there so there's a baby announcement uh here it's in the harrington journal which like i said these little rural kind of you know that's not really like i don't think the paper of record of the state you know it's probably the harrington journal but i don't think my not that it's a bad yeah not that it's a bad i'm sure it's a fine paper my birth was definitely not announced in

a newspaper no but yeah that's pretty cool it's yeah they said the item read congratulations to joyce and richard lynch on the birth of a son guess what the son's name is oh no is it dick bill the third rice three times the dick bill hat trick a hit one dick bill two three three dick bills unbelievable three dick bills j Unbelievable. Three dick bills, Jimmy. Triple the dick bill. Wow. Dick Bill Jr. Yeah. Yeah, they said in the announcement, because the grandparents, the Lynches, put this up,

that they were very proud. And, yeah. And, oh, no, this was her parents that put this up. Okay. Bud and Thelma. Yeah. They're all so proud there. So, yeah.

So, I mean, what a joyous time you're a couple you're married i mean you had to get married a little under the gun but you're happy you wanted to have a baby i guess the disability checks are flowing and he got the one he wanted he got he got the boy on the first try right which is silly honestly i mean the girl can carry the name on but in 1986 too nobody ever thought of that. That wasn't happening. It wasn't even a thought. No. And a woman that did it, people hated her.

Yeah. They're like, who the fuck she think she is? Jesus Christ. Her poor husband. Look at her with her pants. Must be a pain in the ass to put her pants on. Look at her wearing pants. One of those flats.

What a bitch. Jesus Christ. What a pain in the ass. She's got a pinion. I swear to God god she don't know how to cook i swear i could see it i look at her pants and i could see that she just don't know how to put a decent meal together comes home and has the audacity to ask what's for dinner i know it i know what she does i tell you what she comes in and tell you what i'm mad those fucking jeans

i'm mad i'm mad about them everything i keep saying makes my blood boil more and more that's what it feels like so christmas eve comes around it's december 24th 1987 a glorious time i think i got nintendo that year for christmas i want to say i was very little i would have no idea i was little but i think nintendo was a big one i think it was 87 that i got was it that year yeah because it was out for like three years of course or two years or something it wasn't brand new but i i you know yeah kids like us didn't get the brand new thing it wasn't we weren't getting it right on the cutting edge i had atari until i was 12 that's what i mean i had up until that point it was atari and i was like oh nintendo well other kids were already playing nintendo but like if now if we were little kids now yeah we

would have definitely not got ps5 for christmas it would have been like here's an xbox 360 that's like the fourth four fucking xboxes ago yeah you're gonna let's great the games are cheaper here you go it's great at the end of the of the year, they let us bring in our game systems and have just a free day. Awesome. And all the kids brought their fucking Super Nintendos, and I just sat there going, what is that? Whoa, cool.

Who wants to play Coleco with me? Anybody into Space Invaders? Come on over. There's a game where I got to get a dot past these other dots. It's pretty cool. Who wants to play? Yeah, no, take the controller and turn that dial. They're like, what the fucking dial?

Why is there a wheel on there? What is that? What is happening? So 5.30 a.m. on Christmas Eve, two hours. Here, 5.30 a.m., so that's very early in the morning, Christmas Eve, that's when kids aren't even up yet there. Five-year-old Rebecca

of the Gibsons, the first couple we talked about, the oldest of the Gibson clan of their three children, she wakes up and she wanders through her house, she's doing that while that's happening richard lynch dickie bill jr is calling his dad uh over in houston he's calling his dad telling

his dad that uh joyce gave birth to a son and that's when his dad calls the paper and all that kind of shit so he said hey dad i'm a father you're a grandfather very excited and everything like that so uh 7 30 a.m though 7 30 a.m little rebecca ann gibson at five years old is wandering around her house also awake is her one-year-old brother uh john gregory here he's wandering around too or at least in his crib doing his thing now rebecca walking around just looking for her parents obviously as every five year old does when they wake up because they want things. I'm hungry and shit and I want stuff. I'm also scared and I just need to see adults.

Yeah, I need to see adults and make sure they're there and then tell them to get things for me. That's what I need. So she's looking for that. She finds her dad, Joseph Gibson Jr. Unfortunately, she finds him in a bad place, as we'll talk about. She finds him in the doorway, in the front doorway of the house, with a gunshot wound to the back and bleeding all over the place. Five-year-old found that. Five-year-old finds her dad.

Does not wake up, obviously. She tries to wake him up, doesn't wake up. She can't find her mom at all. She's looking all over the house She can't find her mom at all. She's looking all over the house. Can't find her mom. Um, all she can find is dad and her one year old brother in the crib. So can't find anybody else.

So, um, she, um, ends up on the phone with nine one, one great five year old Rebecca. Yes. Um,

now you, you wonder how the shit that she find know to do that well she didn't know to do that well she just called a number and started talking to somebody and they told her to call 9-1-1 no it was she woke up she found you know her dad's face down too with the gunshot wounds that must have been traumatic shit uh couldn't wake him like i said she tried to she just tried to make a call basically and punched a bunch of numbers she just tried to make a call basically and punched a bunch of numbers she just dialed the number she dialed the wrong number i think she maybe tried to dial like one of her grandmothers a number that she might have thought she knew

and uh didn't get it because back then you used to have to remember phone numbers how weird you just press a button right even at five you knew a couple of people's phone numbers yeah and uh but she screwed it up and called somebody else and And some woman on the other end, she started telling her what happened. A five year old said, I woke up and my daddy, there's blood everywhere and I can't find my mommy. And like, this sounds horrific. Right. Now, the first the woman doesn't know if this is serious or something. It sounds creepy as shit.

How creepy is that? A baby, a baby voice calling. Imagine 730 a.m. Christmas Eve. You get a baby voice saying, I found my bloody dadm christmas eve you get a baby voice saying i found my bloody dad and i can't find my mommy help me be like what the holy shit this better be a nightmare that's a way that you james cannot mind your own fucking no i'd be like oh christ i gotta help this baby now something i do now damn it i gotta help her calm down baby yeah all right baby relax listen listen

i'm gonna tell you this once baby life's not easy right you're learning this now usually it takes longer no but i mean honestly i mean how horrible would that be to get that call you want to make this kid feel better you don't know what's going on you don't know if it's a prank you don't know what's going on so what she does know if it's a prank. You don't know what's going on. So what she does is she ends up, whether she calls 911 and gets them to get a hold of this kid, or if she tells the kid to hang up and dial these numbers and whatever. But eventually the kid gets on the line with 911, which is amazing, and basically describes what's happening, describes what she sees. The police realize they think it's a serious call.

This does not sound like a prank anymore. So basically, they have to keep her on the phone because she doesn't know her address. Because she's five. She doesn't know where the hell she is. And this isn't like now where they know exactly where you are and however long. A lot of this technology would have helped a lot in this case. So they end up keeping her on the phone until they can track where the call is coming to. And eventually they find the Gibson trailer.

Wow. Yeah, they get to the Gibson trailer. That's unbelievable technology for the 80s. Yeah, they had to trace it like that. They had to keep her on the line and like, oh, maybe she's here. And they ended up finally tracing this whole thing, which is incredible, honestly. So the tape, the 911 tape, by the way, has got to be horrific. I don't want to hear that.

Oh, no, I don't want to hear it either. I don't know why anyone would want to hear that. That sounds... 911 tapes are the worst. They're the worst. But a child describing... Nope. Nope.

Not doing it. I'd like to sleep for the next six months. I'd rather do my best to make cancer jokes. Or try to not. Either one. Do you know what I mean? I don't want anything to do with that. No, thank you.

No, it's fucking horrific, man. So the police arrive, and they find quite the scene. First of all, they discover before they get in the house, they discover mom. They find mom. Mom didn't take off. Mom. No, no. She's outside.

She's in her nightgown, slumped over in the car, shot gunshot wound to the back and another to the like the buttock area wow and uh and dad has a gunshot wound to the back 357 they're thinking that that large caliber of that nature 357 44 it's big holes something that leaves a giant exit wound and a yeah not good shit at all so she's in the car slumped in. She's in the car in her nightgown. With a gunshot in the back and in the ass. In the ass. She tried to make a run for it is what it seems like. That's unbelievable. Which is crazy.

And he was basically face down, heading toward the front door. So he was heading out the front door as well. So something was happening. I don't know. Whatever was going on, she tried to run away, and and they were chasing and he was chasing after as well i don't know if he got shot and did only made it that far or whatever the hell the deal is but uh the uh rebecca five-year-old rebecca 100 unhurt fine and the babies not a scratch on her. John, one years old, completely unhurt. Yeah.

Not a scratch on him. Matthew's missing, though. He's not there at all. Get out. They do not find the baby. The brand new newborn baby is completely gone. That's horrifying. So, yeah, this is the scene they walk in on. Little girl walking around.

Dad's blood on her. Yeah. Crying. One year old in the crib. One year old in the crib crying. No brand new baby. You know, full diaper and everything. Missing brand new baby. honor yeah uh crying and one year old in the crib one year old in the crib crying probably no brand new baby you know full diaper and everything missing brand new baby mom two gunshot wounds in the car slumped over dad 357 in the back oh boy this is his Christmas Eve Merry Christmas

everybody how'd you like to walk in on that and then go home to your family after that for Christmas like yay this is awful man so um now the police obviously investigators are like wow this is a horrible thing that could happen and it's they say it's actually at the time very rare uh they said killings and kidnappings normally aren't committed at the same time this is not a normal thing normally kidnapping is a sneaking thing and murder isn't so it's like a they're two separate two separate branches they don't understand it it's it's a arm and a leg of a spacesuit it's a with no crotch or just to connect them is it you know it's very strange they put everything in terms of spacesuits here it's very

odd place i don't understand it so uh the police officer here what is his name here charles d flag he's reg oh resident agent in charge of the wilmington fbi office oh he's not a police officer yeah he knows his shit he said quote kidnapping is one kind of crime and homicide is another like i said the arms and the legs and uh but a police superintendent said investigators have established no motive for the killings other than apparently obtaining the baby right that's the only thing they can tell um is the the they don't know what happened i mean the baby could be in a bush somewhere they have no idea but there's no uh like there's no like blood in the crib or anything in the bassinet none of

that shit so um they said um uh they said there's a lot of easier there's a lot easier ways to get a baby than murdering the parents yeah which seems like and more fun ways yeah you know fuck well yeah that's no shit so all the wild rumors i mean this is a small town so this scene does not seem like something they've never seen this before so they're saying was there like were they involved in some like drug dealing because this is this looks like a hit situation surely some some devil worship yeah oh no they oh yeah what were they into literally but they're like church people and all this shit so they're very they're not into drugs they don't do anything they have three little kids you are you know they're that's all they do is sit in the trailer with their kids and go to church and shit like then work they're

not real they're not really uh crazy people here they're um you know they were saying maybe like uh maybe uh beverly had the baby but maybe she was a surrogate for someone else but she wouldn't give up the kids so they came to kill everybody like these are the rumors they're all there is a uh they are going far oh god there's a couple of mini marts in these areas where people just gather and gossip and we'll talk about that in a little while it's ridiculous they're saying did they steal the baby so they could sell him on the black market because he's brand new and he's like a baby are they gonna sell him those are the ones that are worth the most they're brand new yeah they're not they just, they still smell, you know? Right.

They still smell like just baby. You can smell it on them. It's like puppy breath. Yeah. Oh, smell that baby. Come on. That's not even worn off yet. That's a fresh baby.

It still smells like fresh. Is that a fresh baby? Right. You can smell them and find out. That's what quote unquote baby fresh smells like. Yeah. That's it. They're making a drug deal.

Right. I don't know. Smell them and find out. How pure is it? How pure is he? Have a sniff. Have a sniff at him. That's pure baby.

That's 100% pure baby. So horrible though. There's a kidnapped baby when we don't know what the baby could be anywhere. Baby could be in a dumpster somewhere. We have no clue. That's obviously the worst case scenario. Sorry about that. Somebody got flushed him. Who knows who knows you don't know that's what i mean that's where my mind goes we've after 207 episodes before this who knows anything is possible so uh they're doing this investigation by early january they have no fucking clues whatsoever they have no

idea we're talking a week and a half go by two dead people in their home kidnapped one year old fresh baby fresh baby big shrug wow not a clue disappeared in the thin air so they have to get creative and they do now i can't stress enough how less how much less technology there was in the 80s i mean it wasn't like the you know 20s or something but uh computer technology was much different it was weak it was barely it was laughable we call that technology that's what i mean so like nowadays let's say if someone has a house phone you could probably i assume the phone company could scan and find everybody that's called that phone and do relatively short probably a couple of keystrokes they could bring up records there's a printout of it very quickly yeah back then no local calls

weren't registered like that right in a lot of places like that local calls are registers as local calls that's all it'll say so you can't it's hard to trace them you have to go in and it was hard so basically diamond state telephone company computers scanned 410 million phone calls to come up with a clue to come up with one clue. Delaware, Delaware State Police got the assistance of the phone company and they said they were grasping for straws. They didn't think this was anything that would possibly work, but they had no other ideas. It was either that or go, well, fuck it. I don't know. I guess. I guess that's's it wait till it turns up what are they saying down at the

mini mart underworld vendetta i suppose all right then what the hell so uh they're looking for something it's either that or listen to them that the guy that had to buy a newspaper today yeah and spout off his theory what do you think george i mean that's all it is they asked the phone company to run a check on toll telephone calls first of all made after december 1st uh to and from the home of joseph r and beverly gibson so they're like let's do that calls that needed to be paid yeah like a pay phone something like a long distance pay phone a broader search included telephone calls to other family members and they turned up a call from a certain person here they turn up a call from dickie bill from dick bill's house the lynch uh residents in houston to joseph r gibson senior okay not them

joseph gibson's father okay so joe gib Gibson's a junior. He's a junior, too. We're dealing with double juniors here. So junior, though. Yeah, they did. They this lynch didn't call him the father. There's a call there, which makes no sense. Okay. So they according to the police here, there was a call to Gibson Sr. asking for directions to Gibson Jr.'s mobile home. Weird. Yeah, Gibson and Beverly's house here because they said the baby was born and they wanted to contact the mother and come and bring them a gift. Because, you know, they're friends of theirs or whatever. So, both had a 398

exchange there for Harrington-Houston and the Gibsons had a uh 492 hartley exchange they're both within kent county uh but it's a toll call still so that's how they found it uh if that had not been the case the phone company wouldn't have been able to find the call because it would have just been a local call and that's all there is to it so they said they were very very fortunate to at least have this strand of something to connect to somebody that they didn't know who they were. Otherwise, everybody else was identified.

We know these people. We know these people. Who the fuck are those people? They don't know the lynches. What's going on here? So the state police request wasn't routine either. The phone company said, we try to cooperate with law enforcement. And this was definitely an extraordinary situation.

The costs and everything were, guess extremely extremely this was expensive yeah somebody had to sit around for hours like a team of people this was like a shitload of people on a bunch of computers this was not like one guy with a few keystrokes like on his phone yeah finding out something yeah i'll just send you the pdf you just download it like this is like a shitload of people trying to find it like it's crazy this looks like war games with matthew broderick right like i picture just like tv screen wall of screens the whole thing so police would like to talk to uh sure dick bill and joyce and find out what the hell they were doing calling them because this is the only thread they have so january 7th 1988 detectives come to the lynch house to ask a few questions and they do uh they get there they talk with joyce lynch and they notice

that she has an infant son also about the same age as uh you know less than a month old about the same give or take the same age as matthew that's missing so obviously that's a suspicious thing yeah they're like whoa here hold on a second uh so um they said joyce was very cordial invited them in they saw the baby they saw baby toys all over the place you know a house with a baby it looked like um she told them about the baby yeah we just had the baby and that he's got dark hair like my husband and blah blah blah and everything like that she said the child wasn't delivered in a hospital. They delivered at home by a midwife the night before. That's what she tells the police. Welcome to the small town of Chinook, where faith runs deep and secrets run deeper. In this new thriller available exclusively on

Wondery Plus, religion and crime collide when a gruesome murder rocks the isolated Montana community. Everyone is quick to point their fingers at a drug-addicted teenager, but local deputy Ruth Vogel isn't convinced. She suspects connections to a powerful religious group. Enter federal agent V.B. Loro, who has been investigating a local church for possible criminal activity.

The pair form an unlikely partnership to catch the killer, unearthing secrets that leave Ruth torn between her duty to the law, her religious convictions, and her very own family. But something more sinister than murder is afoot, and someone is watching Ruth. With an all-star cast led by Emmy nominee Sanaa Lathan

and Star Wars' Kelly Marie Tran, Chinook is available exclusively and ad-free on Wondery+. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. I understand that anybody who's paid attention to the media would have to come to the conclusion that I killed my wife. Hi, my name is Zach Stewart-Pontier. I'm one of the filmmakers behind The Jinx, and I'm excited to bring you The Official Jinx Podcast.

We'll be revisiting all six episodes of Part 1 and watching along with Part 2 as it airs on Max, starting April 21st. Bye-bye. The Official Jinx Podcast. Listen on Max or wherever you get your podcasts. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid. We're your hosts.

I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well-researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch of humor. I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing.

This mother f***er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal. Or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes. You should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.

And, oh, by the way, that's little Dickie Lynch III. Yep. No shit. Yep. That's what they named it. That's right. Dickie Lynch III. This is thr. No shit. Yep. That's what they named it. That's right. Dickie Lynch, the third.

This is, this is thrice. It's too much. Can you imagine that? By the way, this is Dickie Lynch, the third. And they're like,

Oh God, I can't do it. So the story of the birth though is wonderful. Um, it's, it's, you know, it's a,

between Christmas, between the, the season and also this, the story of a, of a birth. It's like, this is really, this is almost biblical. It's, it of a birth. It's like, this is really, this is almost biblical.

It's, it's amazing here. Let's hear it. This is, uh, if people heard this story, I'm just saying they might do different shit on Christmas. Uh,

so, uh, Dick bill jr here or Dickie bill. He, uh, he says that Joyce's contractions were timed about two minutes apart. This is on the 23rd when she had the baby, uh,

when she left, she left in a trans am. They have a trans black trans am awesome fuck yeah killer man got t-tops on that airbrush firebird on the fucking hood why else would you have the car you ain't got the airbrush fire hood so um she leaves with a black black pontiac trans am with a diaper bag and his 357 smith and wesson okay okay that's what she's good to have a baby just in case that midwife has a little lip yeah well that's the thing he says that she left to have a baby and she says she had a midwife at home so this is they're both telling you know contrasting stories he said this is his words not mine okay he said his wife asked for the gun to quote protect her from blacks she feared might be hanging around the clinic oh yeah when his wife

oh my i have never heard that as a reason to take a gun to have a baby baby hold on you're having distractions wait take my gun is it loaded what you better hope it is you never know that kid could be bad he could be a bad kid when he comes out so um at the clinic from quote blacks um yeah jesus now she came home about 2 a.m so she left with the trans-am a gun and a diaper bag comes home at 2 a.m which normally you stay in the hospital for more than a few hours they give you a day in there anyway um uh with blood on her hands four bullets missing from the the 357 chamber here and um so they asked her well they asked dickie bill here did you did you find that suspicious maybe that she had four bullets she went to have a baby what'd she do stop and shoot some cans or some target practice sometimes you gotta celebrate on the ride home fire a few out out the window. It's got T-tops.

She can fire out the top of that. It's just right out the top. It's safe. That's why we got the Trans Am with the T-tops. With blood on her hands to shoot at her. With the blood, she delivered it herself, obviously. They said, didn't you find this odd? He said, oh, God.

This is his response. He believed her. He said, well, why'd you fire the gun and she told me i fired to scare off the blacks she ran out of the clinic ran into the clinic i'm having a baby bang bang bang everybody out of my way oh scatter to scare what the fuck is going on what are you talking about this is the most ridiculous story and that the blood came from the baby's birth because they don't even wash you off she delivers herself what is this a tent in the middle of the right of the fucking field there's a bunch of nefarious people hanging out

to a bunch of quote black people just waiting to take i don't know what they're waiting to do out there obviously bad things if you need to fire warning shots as you approach. Fire two shots as you go in. Jump in the girdle and put your feet up in the search room. Catch me! And then two on the way out. As soon as that baby

pops out, you get in the Trans Am and it's two out the T-tops as you pull out the cars, as you pull out the parking lot. That's what the T and T-top stands for it's two it's two bang bang bitches two out the top that's what he believed i just figured she's scaring off the blacks as she entered the clinic so that's that is a hasty ass birth catch me this might be the worst story anyone's ever ever had ever okay um anyway when they're

talking to her there uh they're they're suspicious of the baby and um she says no this is my baby black hair just like my husband blah blah blah so they go all right we'll be back yeah that's cool so they go we're gonna they left to basically check her story out while they did that they had some investigators watch the house to make sure they didn't you know go to mexico or south america or something so they end up checking around her story doesn't quite check out no um yeah there's nobody they can't find anybody that delivered this baby there's not a lot going on here that's difficult so they returned to houston and tell joyce lynch there that uh you know we can you guys come down to the police station?

We got to sort some stuff out and, you know, do some paperwork and bring the baby with you, please. And, you know, don't leave him alone here. So they get down there. And so they said, quote, It's bittersweet. We got the baby apparently in good health and unharmed. At the same time are two young people people good and straight people who are dead good and straight what does that mean i don't know i'm not sure but his last name is flag which is hilarious a couple of breeders couple of birds are good it's not fair now joyce says no this is

my baby i was it was born here i was pregnant there's a birth announcement i was it was born at my home i had a midwife and the whole thing uh but investigators matched the footprints to oh little dick bill the third remember when they did that with matthew gibson so they're like well that's funny why do the footprints match it's kind of like fingerprints it's pretty similar there um and also they couldn't find they uh she couldn't name the midwife who delivered the baby which you'd probably know that woman i would think if she was in your vagina right yanking a large thing out of it well you're very vulnerable anyone who pulls something huge out of your vagina i feel like you'd at least get them get to know their name no name you'd know something you can pick them out of a lineup you

didn't meet them at that moment you've had conversations with them problem is no certified nurse midwives are assisting in at-home deliveries in Delaware except in the Amish community. It's the only place where that's legal at that point there who's a certified nurse. They give this whole thing. They find these stats. And she said the woman who helps, there's only one, the woman who helps with the Amish births, they talked to her. She wasn't there. She didn't assist Joyce. So investigators still are trying to figure out,

well, was she, where did her baby go then? Because everybody says she's pregnant and there's a birth announcement. She's got a baby with that's Matthew. So where the fuck is her baby? What's going on here? Did they kill him?

Was it, did she shoot black people? What's going on? Yes. So that's her story by the way that's her fucking story that's my story well and she's sticking to it midwife i don't know her name i don't know some amish broad like that's her fuck like i'm never rooting for like a murderer to get away with murder but at least try to be better at what you're doing try

we always have some pride That's what they did. But this is like... Have some pride. This is what you did? Yeah. I don't care if it's air conditioning repair, whether it's HVAC, scamming the disability system,

or murder. Be as good as you can be. Yeah. Fucking try. But apply yourself. Yes. So a search of the Lynch home, a full search.

You're like, we're going to check your house out while you're there. They get a warrant. They turn up a baby's garment with a lot of blood on home, a full search. We're going to check your house out while you're there. They get a warrant. They turn up a baby's garment with a lot of blood on it, which is not good. Not good in the trash. Also stuff in the trash. That's not the worst of it, though. They also find a 357 revolver with ammunition with the cylinder missing four shells.

Not great. And also handwritten directions to the Gibson's trailer. What? Not terrific. Yeah. Oh, and the shells, by the way, they match the bullets that are in the Gibson. So it's very, very bad stuff here.

It's a fucking automatic conviction kit is what you have here. But that's obviously not what's going to happen. So let's talk about it on it, though. Yeah. Yeah. Because they had blood from the other people and held the baby. And so they got blood on the baby clothes. So, yeah.

So they arrest. They're going to arrest the lynches here, as you might imagine. Obviously, they're going to accuse them of both of them of a double murder and a kidnapping. They're taken to the court here for the bail hearing. They're each charged with two counts of first degree murder, two counts of first degree murder involving a felony, first degree burglary, second degree conspiracy, possession of a deadly weapon during the commission of a felony and unlawful imprisonment. Oh, boy.

A lot of shit. They're not charged. Do you notice one charge is not in there? What's that? Out of all those? What is it kidnapping no you don't hear kidnapping at all no kidnapping charge why not they said because they didn't uh seek a ransom or make any other demands and at that time the state law what had a like people just didn't take a baby to have a baby they took they were only worried about people like holding babies ransom which seems

insane that's crazy you could just take a person you just take a baby for ransom i guess oh yeah i guess it's just mine now i guess it would just be like thievery at that point but not kidnapping unlawful imprisonment i think is what they ended up doing i guess so um yeah so therefore it didn't violate the state's kidnapping law which kidnapping specifically is like a holding it thing, which seems absolutely insane. The state says they're going to go for the death penalty on both of these motherfuckers. They don't like either one of them. Joyce is being held in the women's prison. Obviously, Richard's being held at the Delaware Correctional Center near Smyrna.

Apparently, they're being held without bail bail on the other charges, which doesn't matter because they have no bail on the murder counts, are $110,000 for each charge. So basically, if they could get out from under the murder one that's no bail, they still could never afford bail. They're still in a lot of trouble, yeah. Yeah. They were handcuffed together when they were brought into the magistrate court.

Isn't that romantic? I love that. How romantic is that? Isn't that nice? Any couple that... They were handcuffed together if they crime together that should be a thing i don't think we've ever had them handcuffed together like that though we usually separate them together i think it was two dudes though i'm pretty sure

that yeah yeah this is so much better this is amazing um apparently they showed up and there was cameras there and i guess joyce like was like oh my god and she like freaked out like oh this didn't expect this to happen. They walked in. They had to fill out court papers. They didn't say anything. They were very quiet. Joyce was wearing a red jogging suit with a Baltimore air coil company.

So they are furious. She's wearing a jogging suit that he had from a job two years ago. So it's an old like company swag that's terrible but the company still exists and they gotta be pissed why did we hire that fucking guy and a pastel bandana so very good very nice outfit she has there uh she chain smoked cigarettes while she waited for the hearing to begin uh she turned away and put her head to her hand each time the magistrate gave details of the murder charges. At one point, a detective asked if she was okay.

Her husband, Richard Dickie Balls, here, he just kind of... Dickie Balls. Dickie Balls, what I call Dickie Bills. Dickie Balls. He just stood there. Now, police, they don't know how they picked the Gibsons or how they know. They don't know them. So they're like, how did you figure this out to get them?

That's the weirdest thing that they can't figure out. And they're thinking like a jury is going to want to know why. Where do you guys cross lines? Exactly. So they said they had to search. Matthew was born, a woman identifying herself as Dawn called Joseph R. Gibson Sr., his father, and asked directions to the trailer, like I said, so they could visit and give a gift, right? So Joseph and Beverly, the young couple, lived in a trailer on the parents' property. That's how that works. Seems like everybody's doing that here.

It's a very common thing. Very common. The grandfather happily gave the woman Dawn directions. Sure, that's how that works seems like everybody's doing that here very common thing very common the grandfather happily gave the woman dawn directions sure that's great short time later according to the grandfather a woman driving a dark car with pop-up headlights you know like a trans am uh stopped at the home of a neighbor of the gibsons asking for directions to the trailer the way it was set up you really had to know exactly where it was or else you weren't going to find their trailer it was like on a property it wasn't like an address that you can go right here like if they could never get pizza delivered or any kind of uber eats and grub hub would not work no grub hub here you're out of

you're out of luck so uh they drive like we said they drive an 85 black Pontiac. Jesus. So the neighbor identifies the lynch's car as the one driven by the woman. So the state police and the FBI also sees several other pistols from the lynch's home there. And they were trying to figure out which one they figured out. It was the 357 that did the trick. They said, quote, at this time, the only motive is that she wanted a baby. That's it. I don't know if she. It's probably they. But they had no lead until that phone thing, too, which was fucking nuts.

Wow. That's crazy. Really? It is. That's wild. That didn't work. That was it. That baby might be theirs today.

That kid would be 23 years old, and I think his name was Dickie Bill III. He'd have no goddamn idea. So at this point the baby baby matthew is reunited with his family they give him back to the grandparents which is very nice here um they said uh thelma gibson was holding him holding the baby and she said quote i just knew that was matthew when they found the baby she said i just knew it was um she said that uh she said quote your mind gets to go in a mile a minute you think at times they could have gotten away from here then maybe the baby could still be

in the area they were saying where'd you think the baby was um they were she said quote it was like he was saying here i am i want to be fed that's the baby i don't know why that is apparently the baby's gained some weight by the way here is five-year-old rebecca holding the little baby reunited there so that's a nice picture oh rebecca you goddamn hero yeah she is a fucking hero this kid so uh people were suspicious beforehand now neighbors as you can see look at the newspaper neighbors found couple suspicious here's her bandana by the way i'd show you that yeah there it is so uh neighbor's been finding them suspicious now for years years they all been suspicious so yeah that's a great that's a great newspaper article it's this very small town thing neighbors found couple suspicious um yeah they say

that uh at the mini martin houston now that's that we're gonna really focus on the mini martin that's where it all goes down where Wait till you hear from Mabel. Mabel is going to tell you everything. Not the mini-mart. Mabel Moore down at the mini-mart, the owner. She knows all the gossip now. God damn it. He had bought Richard Dickey, Bill Jr. here, purchased four cans of baby formula from the mini-mart two weeks before that.

And they said that didn't seem particularly strange. two weeks before that, and they said that didn't seem particularly strange. They said that he had been saying that his wife was pregnant, so they had seen Joyce. She said she was pregnant, so they were asking, when are we going to get to see this baby? When are you bringing this baby in? He said, pretty soon.

He's got a cold right now. That's according to Mabel Moore, the owner down at the Houston Mini Mart. The kid's already got a cold he came out the he came right out to shoot with a cold i'll tell you what they pulled him out he's a sniffly little shit about a viral motherfucker i'll tell you he's a pain right in my ass i'm gonna give him some robituss and see how that works kids already costing me on dimetab oh man uh they said it didn't seem out of the ordinary there um Apparently, she paid a $348 grocery tab with cash right before her arrest, which is strange, and then charged another $8 for gas and cigarettes, which is probably a pack of cigarettes and five bucks on tank five.

In the 80s? Yeah. That's probably what it was. Five on five and a pack of two packs of smoke it was eight dollars on pump five 835 and then give me two packs give me two packs of cigarette make it three so mabel says quote very friendly she told my husband boy having that baby just tore my back up that's what she told told mabel's husband boy mr moore what a weird way to say that usually comes out the front lady nope tore my back up so uh mabel's husband boy mr moore what a weird way to say that usually comes out the front lady

nope told him back up so uh mabel moore said all summer and part of the winter she wore the maternity clothes but she didn't look like she was pregnant that's what some of them other girls here said too now they're talking all sorts of gossip they said she paid her usually paid her monthly tab with food stamps and public assistance checks oh Oh boy. And lots of people there. None of the neighbors saw the baby come home. None of that stuff. The police said they know no link between the Gibsons and the Lynches. Nothing. They don't

know how or why they would choose this target. They don't understand it. They said, we don't believe Joyce Lynch was in the hospital at the time of the birth. She wasn't in the hospital, wandered around and went, there's a baby, I'll go take it like i'll plan that there was no how do you pick this it wasn't like raising arizona where they saw him on tv a story oh they had all these fucking kids they don't know what to do with them yeah this was just random so uh the only connection they could find

was not even a real connection apparently dick bill jr here dickie bills he bought a house like two years before that through the farmer's home administration's georgetown office where joseph gibson worked okay uh this was well before this but they ended up uh moving out and his father ended up maintaining the mortgage payments but they said that there's no they said quote we don't believe that gibson ever saw these people in his whole life we're pretty sure there's no connection because joseph gibson did not come to our office at all so they didn't even he just worked there but he didn't show up he wasn't in the office he did his other shit so there's no way like i mean there's no way that but it's weird that they were connected in that way but they would have never met there's no way that it's weird that they were connected in that way, but they would have never met. There's no way that they could have met.

And that's all they could find on them. So they said, I don't understand. And when they were looking, they said that one of the cops said, I didn't feel that someone had come from another state to do this. The Gibson home is a hard place to find. We felt that our best bet would be someone in Delaware. I felt all along that the child had been taken away safely and that it had probably been cared for, even though it was very bizarre to discover a crime where the child had been taken away with that much violence. It's good that they had it all. They knew it all afterwards.

Now there's closure. Exactly how we thought it was. Exactly how we assumed. Just how we thought it was. That's police work, y'all. That's right. Chalk it up. So one of Dick Bill's high school friends here it's

really a fucking end zone dance isn't that that's what it was it's like we knew they'd be playing the deep zone and we just dumped it off underneath and we just knew that we could we could then get the blocks we needed choreographing all week for this shit yeah it's really funny where were you when you didn't know shit how about that how about where were those declarative we think the babies cared for and safe even though there's where was that then how about that hail mary you threw uh with the fucking phone company let's do that yeah that's man hours don't act like you game planned for this shit that's unbelievable a high school friend of dickie bill's talking they're talking to people all the way back then 10 years earlier in high school j of Dickie Bill's talking. They're talking to people. All the way back then? Ten years earlier in high school.

Jesus. They said that everybody was very shocked at this. He says, quote, he was never in any kind of trouble that I knew of. He was just one of the guys. Yeah. That's all. No trouble. Well, that's because he was a teenager when you knew him.

What the fuck are you talking about? He didn't really murder people when I knew him. He had a C average or so. Pretty decent dude. Decent guy. Backup fullback on the football team. What the fuck are we doing? about didn't really murder people when i knew him average or so i mean decent dude decent guy backup fullback on the football team what are we doing never talk to anybody in high school if you're going to interview anything about me james i won't please never do that they don't know high school they know nothing about me i mean you know uh he could roll a blunt i'll tell you what i was

at a party one at one time with him he rolled up real nice. You know, come think of it. I think he drinks. I think there's some booze in him. He had like a nose. Yeah, yeah. Hands, if I remember correctly. There was that. Two eyes.

Nobody knows shit. They don't know anything about me. So, someone who does know, they talked to Joyce's 17-year-old daughter. Maybe do you know some insight here? And this is Tracyacy her name is and she said that um she said her mom was pregnant over the next few months they bought baby clothes and furniture because they're still like where's your baby right if you were pregnant this long uh she said quote i have lived with her for 16 years i would never have believed her capable of any of this that's the person you talked that's her she's like i

have no idea yeah now mabel moore down at the mini mart she got other opinions here she said we figured the baby was dead or out of the country that's her statement yo grim mabel is fucking she's not just grim we thought maybe there were there was a we we smelled some fire we thought you know somebody's barbecuing a baby. I just pictured him just with a spit roast, just turning him like a suckling pig. But I, you know, doing like a. I smelled hickory. I said, they are cooking that baby.

With like an apple in his mouth, doing like a dance around him. Maybe it was them blacks that hang around the front of the clinic. That's why you bring a 357, because otherwise they'll do a, have a ceremony around your baby fucking maybe mabel's nuts she is dark yeah she's mabel's fucking grim she said we would have never thought it right here in our own backyard safe small town murder that's it right there she said quote she came in in maternity clothes and one of the girls asked her if she was going to have a baby. Her stomach was flat. I could see she wasn't pregnant.

She said, but it didn't register because of her preoccupation with other customers. Everybody knows everything after the fact, which I find. I knew everything. But I just at the time I was too busy to say nothing. She said that's her theory. She wasn't pregnant. Saw her all baggy in maternity clothes. and I was like, that chick ain't pregnant. She ain't pregnant.

Want coffee for you? Hold on a minute now. Somebody needs gas. Between Christmas and New Year's Day, Richard Lynch here, Dickie Bills, showed up at the store for gasoline and informed Mabel Moore's husband, David, that his wife had delivered the baby. He said, well, my wife had a baby. She had a little baby boy.

And he said, congratulations, and they were happy for you, blah, blah, blah. They said that Joyce was putting off bringing the baby to the store. She said, quote, having a baby really tears your back up. She tells everybody that. She'll tell everybody. Now, Lola O'Day, who writes a social column in the Harrington Journal, she writes about all the happenings in town. You know, whether Mabel Moore

is talking to so-and-so and having a tea and sandwiches for... Holy shit. What's the book club doing this week, ladies? Which is... It's actually even worse than that. It's not even a book club. What does it say? Oh, boy.

Anyway, okay. She was on vacation for several days after christmas the social column lady and asked for social news for members of her crafts club yeah craft club right uh one of the members was thelma kemp joyce lynch's mother and she said quote the girls in the craft club told me that she had the baby she announced the news with congratulations in the craft club told me that she had the baby. She announced the news with congratulations in the journal. She later learned that, obviously, the baby turned out to be Matthew Gibson. And she said, quote, I was just sick. I feel terrible for all concern. Because she put out a big thing in the paper about it.

I thought I was a good journalist. I thought I got a scoop. Right. Craft club. That's why I joined craft club. That's where all the hard news comes from. Everybody out there, you hear a story, you're like, wow. I mean, Watergate, that was broken in craft club that's where all the hard hard news comes from everybody out there you hear a story you're like wow i mean watergate that was broken in craft club obviously the whole other thing it's

all a cover-up for craft club it's that's what it was it's how stories are broken big things g gordon liddy hates craft he hates it it just blew the whole doors off everything poor bastard took down the whole Nixon administration. So evidence against them. Let's talk about it. What do they got? Well, witnesses here that week before the killings said a woman with brown hair driving a black car resembling a Firebird or Camaro drove through the neighborhood asking for directions to the trailer. They obviously have that car, and she has long brown hair. to the trailer.

They obviously have that car and she has long brown hair. Joyce Lynch's description on a police tape of the exact position of Joseph Gibson's body when Rebecca Gibson discovered it Christmas morning. Joyce also described

the position of Beverly Gibson's body as it lay slumped in the family car. And just guessing. Lucky guess. They also said that they think that Lynch's acted together to fake a pregnancy so they could kidnap a baby. Wow. That's what the theory is.

They talk about the bloody sleeper found in the trash at the house, the bullet casings from the murder weapon, a note with directions to the Gibson's trailer, and a partial right print of the thumb was used to link Richard to the crime. They found a partial thumb print at the scene. Bastard was there, too. Yep, he was there, too. As many as 70 Kent and Sussex County residents with the last names of Wright, W-R-H-I-G-T.

I-G-H-T. Did I say G-H? Jesus. H-I-G-T. Wow. Well, I slept two hours last night, so whatever. Right. We're a target of the plot.

Apparently, the prosecutors found a list bearing the names and phone numbers of 70 different families named Wright. What? So apparently, they were going through. Looking for the right baby. They picked a name, and they were like, the Wrights. We look at they they picked a name and they were like the rights we'll find a right and we'll go through and that's who they were they were going to investigate that i don't know if they're going like name by name smiths are next then the

joneses what do you want to bet it got the tuckers are coming we'll know when it's right yeah what about right what about oh that's the one now um there's another pregnancy that we need to talk about here um let's talk about this uh richard lynch i guess she promised him a christmas baby she kept saying we're gonna have a christmas baby um but it's not the only guy that this has happened with apparently enter michael levitsky yeah let's talk about him he is as it's put in the newspaper, quote, an invalid. No, he's disabled in some way. In the newspaper, they call him an invalid. I'm like, Jesus Christ. That's not nice.

That sounds awful. So, yeah, he's in a wheelchair. And anyway, Joyce Lynch and he were an item in 1985. Very recently, she told him that she was carrying triplets that he fathered oh but eventually offered separate excuses for the loss of each fetus as it went on well lost one of them we're down to two but one out of three ain't bad i guess literally that's what happened until they were all gone she said uh he said quote levitsky said it put me in a tailspin i didn't know what was happening.

I was hoping we could salvage at least one child. Jesus, that's fucking grim, man. Anyone saying that from a wheelchair makes it even grimmer, doesn't it? Makes it even sadder. You just want to hug the guy. Anybody say salvage as they sit in a chair. Yeah, I picture him picking it out of a pile, looking it over to see if it's dented or anything. And throwing it over his shoulder.

Soft spot, still good? Well, I think it's good still. Like a cantaloupe. He recounted... Salvage. Salvage. He recounted various escapades he shared with Joyce Lynch since they first met at a Philadelphia rehabilitation hospital for the disabled in 1984.

They were just fucking in the hospital? Where all of our couples meet. Not a Philadelphia nightclub or philadelphia restaurant or a philadelphia rehab hospital for the disabled good lord joyce lynch was there to get therapy for a back ailment she received while working at milford memorial hospital in the early 1970s levitsky broke his neck in a diving accident when he was 13 and he's described as quadriplegic but as some upper body movement and was able with some difficulty to like he can grip a microphone he's got very limited upper body movement that is fucked up that's messed up man um so when he was released

from the hospital in march 1984 joyce lynch decided not to return home to her family and instead moved into an apartment with Levitsky so they met while they were recovering in the hospital and when they both got out they said let's get a place together yeah because you know we've been living together almost anyway so they lived there until August 84 he says after an argument Lynch went in the bathroom they got in a big argument she's screaming and yelling went in the bathroom then joyce came out and said quote are you happy now i just lost one of your children it was supposed to be three boys that's what she said um so um by the way when were these three boys due yeah

christmas day christmas fucking day 85 every time Every time we fight, I lose a baby. That's it. You upset me, babies fall out. So they introduced records showing that basically Joyce listed four different men as a contact person during her frequent hospital visits or trips to the emergency room in the last few years. So she had all sorts of different people she's been with which doesn't matter um he said levitsky said quote when i first met her i don't know how to say this but she she was almost flat chested and her breasts began to get larger and there was milk seepage yeah that's what she said i don't know how to say that either when we were making love it would be there oh no no which by the way he's mistaken as we'll talk about um or she might have been taking some kind of medication that

causes that because that could happen but we'll say this is i will say it's 100 impossible for things that he's saying that that could have happened happened her boobs grew when she was lactating well no just the whole thing um i asked her myself i said you are small you don't look like you're carrying two now this was after the argument obviously she said she was always carrying small that's how she carries yeah to others that's what she does she said during her first marriage to frank greenwood she had the two teenagers you know that she has now they were both small um yeah so after joyce lynch returned to Delaware with Levitsky, they moved into a trailer. Joyce claimed to have lost the second fetus by slipping on a handicap ramp installed for Levitsky.

You and your fucking ramps. One of his wheelchair ramps. ADA is ruined by chances of having babies. You piss me off. Baby gone. Slip on your ramp. That's number two. Blame everything on him. We're down to one i guess um jesus christ this is two months later joyce tried to commit suicide

levitsky said uh i guess joyce drew a circle on her stomach in eyebrow eyebrow pencil to outline what she said was the head of the remaining embryo he's right here when her parents arrived to calm her down levitsky said joyce told them she planned to stab the unborn fetus with a butcher knife holy shit that was the that's why she drew a circle that was a target the bull's eye i'm gonna stab it in the head with a butcher knife that's what she told her parents so they were like let's not um how about let's go have a hospital stay so she's in the hospital for a little while i don't know what kind of hospital but one that you go to when you want to stab your unborn fetus with a butcher knife horrifying yeah so uh i guess uh hospital stayed

in 1985 in january levitsky gets a call from Joyce. Joyce claims to be in a hospital emergency room rather than where she actually is and said the last of the triplets was stillborn after she was kicked in the stomach by her teenage daughter during a fight. Okay. Wow. So now I have none of your babies. None of them. Stillborn. Teenage daughter is an asshole.

Real asshole here. None of them. Stillborn. Teenage daughter is an asshole. Real asshole here. After the call, Levitsky said a nurse at Milford Memorial Hospital asked him if he was involved with Joyce Lynch, whose married name was Greenwood, obviously, at the time. And Levitsky said yes. And the nurse showed him medical records.

Doc, by the way, highly illegal to show a person someone else's medical records. But he needed to see this. They're married or not? No, they're not married.'re not you can't do that no you absolutely can't but he's uh sobbing saying she just lost the last of our triplets and blah blah blah she says i'm not supposed to do this but i had to show you something here are her medical records that document her 1978 hysterectomy she's not she can't even have them she has not been able to have any baby since 1978 so all of this is bullshit everything all the pregnancies are bullshit it's all bullshit she wants she's not physically possible not physically capable um she said i was thinking he said i was thinking more with my feelings than with my brain you can add your dick in there and

you got an accurate thing there so joy Joyce Lynch, I guess, started to. He brought that up and she he said that the nurse was a liar. You know, they make up medical records all the time. And she started to get sick of Levitsky. And so she ended up getting a little scheme together to get him out of the trailer so that Richard Lynch could move in because that's what ends up happening. Levitsky, Jesus said, Lynch said Joyce told him she arranged surgery for his bed sores. Poor man at Kent General Hospital. Follow up treatment was to be done at Rehabilitation Care Center in Smyrna.

So before they left, Levitsky signed over his Social Security checks to her so he could, you know, she could take care of business while he was in there. his social security checks to her so he could you know she could take care of business while he was in there the hospital admitted him for a few days until he could be transported to the rehabilitation facility that joyce told him about uh delaware hospital for the chronically ill it wasn't a rehab center it was a nursing home that's where she sent him she put him away she put him in a fucking home and took his social security checks because he knows because he knows yeah she tried to just stash him um he said i had no idea it was a nursing home i was sort of tricked in there i was lied to poor bastard this is this i'm so sad for this man and he's just stuck in there stuck it's fucking horribly end up getting out obviously a friend of hers named valerie brown friend of

joyce's uh from farmington delaware told police that in March, Joyce discussed the idea of faking a pregnancy. I'm thinking about faking a pregnancy this year. I got to tell somebody that she said Joyce had been talking about wanting to have a baby, but she knew she couldn't. So she said maybe she would adopt a child, but wear maternity clothes. So her friends and family would think she's pregnant. That's what she said. Maybe I'll adopt a kid, but I'll pretend it's mine. She said that she, quote, wanted to have a christmas baby it had to be a christmas baby she's got an

obsession with christmas babies she's a lunatic i would say so so uh richard also they find testimony from a woman that richard was seen visiting a patient at kent general hospital on december 17th the day matthew was born she saw a man later identified as richard lynch peering in the nursery window picking one out creepy uh yeah uh now the mother-in-law also believed this richard lynch's mother she said she totally believed joyce she said joyce asked me if i would like to feel the baby she pulled up her top i saw her whole belly okay well she said that she uh she felt something move in her abdomen she was hungry she had arby's and then fucking yeah she's like i gotta set this deuce loose but before i do you want to feel the baby kick did you just say set the deuce set this deuce loose but before you said that with so much ease.

How many times have you said that in your life? I don't think I ever have, but I feel like someone who talks like that would say. God, that's so gross. I feel like somebody who talks like that would be like, I'm going to go set this deuce loose. You said that with so much ease. Ryan. I saw you say it to Sarah after dinner. I've never said that.

Oh, baby, that was the best mac and cheese. I've got to set this deuce loose. I don't think I've ever said or heard that terminology. God damn it, James. It rhymes, and I feel like a redneck would say that. The alliteration is nice. I'm going to go set this deuce loose, and then you can, before I do, though, you want to feel the baby kick. Thoroughly grossed out.

That grossed you out? Oh, my God. Oh, god man it just sounds horrible it does sound bad that's the point it's supposed to so a woman that kidnaps babies would say that yeah she this uh virginia said that uh her stomach grew progressively larger in the fall of 1987 until november she said quote she was ready to bust then she said she listened to joyce's stomach through a stethoscope and heard a heartbeat yeah joyce's because there's nothing in there she said fuck man you put a stethoscope on a body you hear its heartbeat you think fucking dummy she said i i had no doubt she was pregnant i thought i'm done i'll put a notice in the paper it's easy to fake shit when you're surrounded by goddamn idiots

that's the thing no one seems to have a clue no one so then there's another dude they talked to because she was also messing around on the side during all this. Andrew C. Poulsen told the cops here that about October of this year, two months before all this happened, he was working as a parking attendant with the lynches at the Delaware State Fair Raceway in Harrington. Oh, yeah. Both the lynches and him. He's a parking attendant.

And while Richard would be working in one section, Andrew and Joyce would be in another section. And they'd sneak off to the Trans Am. And tear her back up. That's right. He said, we would talk. She would kiss. She would talk. We would talk.

She would talk. That's what that sounded like. I mean, I didn't do much talking. Hard to get a word in edgewise with that one. You know Mabel? She's a lot like Mabel. He said, I would talk. Kiss. I put my hands on her breast. get a word in edgewise with that one uh she you know mabel she's a lot like mabel uh he said i would talk uh kiss i put my hands on her breast i put my hands on her leg on her stomach she did

not feel like she was seven months pregnant he said she wanted me to have sex with her but i never did i don't know about that he said that she wore maternity clothes and uh while he thought quote in my head she was not pregnant he He said, I continued the friendship because, quote, I was determined to find out what she was up to. Thank you, Detective Palson. We appreciate it. Listen to what he said. Everyone at this post. I knew it.

I just had to. I damn knew it. Afterwards, they know everything. Everyone in this story. But this is the most hindsight. 2020. they know everything everyone in this story but this is the most the hindsight 2020 he says uh he uh he had sent her a bunch of letters also they found out this palace and said joyce well why if she's a liar just send her a bunch of letters and he said quote they were only intended to keep track of the lynches right he said that uh he sent joyce lynch a piece of baby clothing

as a christmas present to maintain the, but only to feel him out. Just to keep in close contact. Yep. He said that he has epilepsy, which causes him to have seizures, which Joyce says she has also, which no one's ever actually seen happen. So, you know. Everybody in this story has major health issues. Issues and problems. And I don't know what's going on with the spacesuit factory, but it's spitting out some weird emissions and chemicals out there.

Yeah. And also they found now an FBI agent also says that they found blood on Beverly Gibson's bathrobe, which is not good. That carried the same genetic markings of spots and spatters found on an infant sleeper that the police took from a trash bag at the lynch's home. So Lincoln there, they said, quote, you can see every marker on the sleeper matches every marker on the robe and that they have come from the same person. That's special. That's I can't. Jimmy Special Agent Michael Vick. Yeah, he drowned two dogs. Yeah. And Agent Michael Vick. Yeah. He drowned two dogs.

Yeah. And then he said that. Jesus Christ. Special. I mean, at this rate, they're giving him everything else. I mean, what the hell? Make him a special agent. Here's a badge.

Go find people killing dogs. Jesus. How fast we've forgiven that guy. Forget about it. Well, that's an interesting whole other story. The prosecutor says, quote, it is a capital crime. we've forgiven that guy oh forget about it well that's an interest a whole other story uh the prosecutor says quote it is a capital crime yes we we will be pursuing the death penalty as far as i know not fucking around that's romantic they could hold hands for better content uh

conductivity that'll be very nice yeah that's great his and hers chairs it's awful jesus fucking because it is the electric chair yeah do still which obviously is crazy yeah so uh they were doing it in florida until what three weeks ago probably yeah may 1989 joyce's trial okay joyce's trial first. They put the strangest thing in the newspaper. They do a profile of every juror in the newspaper before the trial. Why do you do that? Right. Why are they allowed to do that?

Because there was a ruling right before this where the newspaper was going through something trying to get it. So they were allowed to do that. And a judge ruled that they're allowed to do that. There should be so much anonymity. Crazy. Poor bastards. I mean, that's... Can you imagine if like that's fucked up i mean in the if it was like a mafia trial you're putting these people in danger right um they so and the way they talk about them too they they like describe the way they look let me read you a couple hazel riley

42 dover married wears glasses is st Parts of her shirt is stout. She's a pig. Parts of her short brown hair down the middle. I don't even know what that means. Oh, parts her short brown hair down the middle. Before being selected, she told the judge she remembered reading about the case when it first happened, but assured him that she was in canter made impartial. She's the forewomanial she's the four woman

she's the only one stout enough to handle the job she's the one in charge in case this shit gets out of hand and y'all got some opinions she's the one to take it out on uh james a legates 26 of dover average build divorced what does that have to do with anything stout average build divorced father of three children ages eight two and one! Leave my kids out of this! What? He has a mustache, wears jeans, and is the youngest juror. He told the judge he could be impartial despite the fact that he has a son that's the same age as Matthew.

Marion M. Haller, 54, of Milford. Married. Has two grandchildren. Ages two and four, in case you want to kidnap them. Who live with a daughter in new jersey no jesus you can find them in jersey wait short brown hair stern expression what might as well say not real hot not turning me on she looks pissed don't really jerk it to her not gonna stroke to her later george m dixon 48 married a dress unknown that's good a white-haired short man who

wears tinted wire rim glasses a guard at delaware correctional center near smyrna how is he allowed to be a juror truly he's gonna fucking deal with this he probably that's where that guy was that's where her husband was that's you can't do that that's not right um said he knew of one of the witnesses who works in the canine unit but didn't know her uh said he would not judge her credibility different from others donald francis niser 56 of smyrna married retired military officer used glasses to review his juror profile form but does not wear them normally in court he is of average height has short black hair that is beginning to gray. Fuck you, man. He has a deep voice and a stern demeanor. Oh, my God.

Mary Lou Hurd, 50. Dover. Married. Short. Stylishly dressed woman with short brown hair with specks of gray. One of few jurors during the selection process who spoke clearly and directly to Ridgely when queried about her ability to serve. Has a 23-year-old son. I mean, I kind of want to fuck her. Yeah. I mean, she's pretty hot. What is this? indirectly to ridgely when queried about her ability to serve as a 23 year old son i mean i

kind of want to fuck her yeah i mean she's pretty hot what is this vetra a gunter uh 27 address unknown married to a prison guard of whom she told ridgely doesn't discuss work with me when on jury duty three years ago she complained that it was a waste of taxpayer money to keep so many people sitting around doing nothing all day. Is a mortgage loan adjuster for a bank. Teresa Whalen, 68. Married and retired. Grandmother.

Has curly white hair. She likes a single strand of pearls with her outfits and admits to a hearing problem. What is this, a dating profile? As soon as she reaches her seat each day, she immediately untangles a hearing device about the size of a transistor radio and places the orange earplugs over her ears i don't use it all the time at this time this is just like a backup she says great oh she has plenty of extra batteries with her she says norman yankwit uh a corrections officer at the prison near smear another corrections officer so many of these people uh yeah like juror ford says hasn't had any contact with the lynches who are being held separately here uh mostly bald with connecting sideburns that lead to close cropped beard and mustache what does this matter lawrence maroney these are just great i'm gonna keep going uh

he's from hazelville so he knows wow yeah short and round with thinning black hair remembers that quote one was shot in the doorway and one in the car and that the baby was missing said in spite of what he knew he had formed no opinions he's been to see mabel he's formed a fucking opinion no i'm just gonna sit it out and see what happens he says robert lee bloodsworth tall balding and thin has a three-year-old son and two-month-old daughter he said that that wouldn't affect his partiality and uh oscar collins heavy set balding gentleman who relies on black rimmed glasses as he often sits forward in the jury seat he has four grown children and four grandchildren they give their ages to ridgely asked him during

the process he works for a gas company the last time he read about the case was quote when it happened and i don't know what year okay so like i said that's unbelievable and that guy thinks he's being a journalist right yeah he thinks he's going on his way to get to the bottom of a fucking a news story that everybody needs to know but what you're doing is invading people's privacy they need to know the jury for a woman's fat jimmy they need to know that that man is unattractive otherwise what's gonna happen you know how blind and deaf these fucking ugly people are yeah so joyce is uh her trial comes up here um obviously they bring in all the evidence that i said before yeah michael

levitsky comes into the wheelchair and tells this horrible story of how we put her what she did to him and all this shit and faked pregnancies and uh they bring in her ex-husband and doctors both to verify that she had a hysterectomy they put her medical records in the face it's ridiculous she definitely wasn't pregnant we know that for a fact. Joyce testifies. And the Joyce's thing is they're being tried separately. And Joyce's thing is she's being tried first. Their strategy.

She is a public defender, by the way, also. Yeah, of course. Richard has a lawyer. Really? His family bought him a lawyer. Oh, because they got Dick Bill money. They got Dick Bill money. She gets a public defender.

Their whole case is Richard is a monster who forced me to do this and controls every move that i make and wants and made me do this okay okay and i didn't do anything i wasn't even there he came home bloody with a baby in his hand and was like here take care of that basically is what she said take it easy but even even more dramatic. Right. She said that she, and she cried on the stand. She said, told the jury how her husband subjected her to nightly vaginal examinations with a flashlight, spoon, and knife. I don't mean to laugh because that's horrific, but I don't even know how that works. Trailer park EPT? What is that works. That is a trailer park EPT.

What is that? A flashlight and a spoon? He put on a miner's helmet. It was terrible. He looked like those guys that were lost in the mine down there. Oh, my God. Are you kidding me? I mean, I don't mean to...

Oh, I mean it. That's fucking ridiculous. If there was a 2% chance it was oh i mean it that's fucking ridiculous if there was two percent chance it was true i wouldn't be cracking up like because that's horrible but this didn't happen that's the thing so she's acting like that's the the torture that he she was put through yes see if she was pregnant yes to make sure she was pregnant that's how much pressure she had to produce a baby and then that's how bad he wanted a baby bad enough to where he'd examine her and then when it didn't work out he'd go take one okay he'd take a baby she recounted incidents when he injected painkillers into her buttocks and acted as the go-between with her

medical doctors what he was shooting her up he was he was the one dealing with all the medical things what she needs what i'll inject her don't worry and then he came home and did it that's not how you take pain no uh the night of the murders she said that he drugged her forced her to the hazelville trailer and threatened her as she tried to prevent the shooting of the fleeing beverly gibson okay she said we shot you know joseph first and then beverly took off and and dick bill i couldn't stop him yeah he was just closing in it was over yeah she said quote this is on the stand quote i went over to richard and i jumped i just jumped on his back to stop it she said uh he said the same thing could happen to me and he shoved me against the car and he shot her twice all right so just cold-blooded that richard's get off of me bitch

yeah we're killing her and we're taking this baby she just cried yeah clutched her pearls they both are cardigan they both have canes but she's capable i guess with an ass full of uh oxys you can do shit like that apparently uh also she said that uh the gun accidentally went off and doesn't have a safety. And then they brought an FBI agent to come on and say the gun has a safety. Actually, this gun does. I don't know what you're talking about. So she's lying about that. And also, they contradicted a statement to the police about the night of the murder.

A couple of things. So closing arguments come up. And this is Joyce's lawyer here. Quote, Richard Lynch's desire, Dick Bill, his desire to have a boy, a boy to carry on the name, transferred into an obsession. Joyce Lynch was a wife who tried to cope with her husband's obsession. You're going to see a pattern of how a young, vivacious woman transformed into a withdrawn individual who had lost many friends to a point where only two people

in the world of joyce lynch were she and dickie yeah that's it he he just there's nothing she could do joyce lynch had no control over her actions on the night of the slaying she said quote we have no idea the quantity of Stadol. That's what that is. It's, I guess, what am I looking for? Painkiller? A painkiller. Stadol?

Stadol? I don't know. That was injected into her. We don't know that any of it was injected into her. He told the jurors that his client had lied to the police about her knowledge of the killings to protect her husband because she was scared

because he said that could happen to you um also uh she said that uh the lawyer in the closing said that she passed out after two injections and then when she came to richard lynch put a baby in her arms he literally said here you go take it take it yeah now you take care of that goddamn baby you You better make yourself lactate. So he reminded the jurors that Joyce Lynch had insisted to police that she told the truth during the thing. And Lynch told police that on the night of the slayings that her husband took her to the Gibsons' home, she remembered stumbling around in a drug stupor, hearing the gun going off, seeing the bodies of the Gibsons. Then she passed out and woke up with a baby in her arms what a story what a story and uh so um yeah the state says that she they said

quote the state says she lied in her statements you're darn right she lied she lied to protect richard and because of her feelings of ambivalence towards richard uh joyce sat there the whole time the prosecutor says that lindsay joyce's defense that she was too drugged to be guilty of the crimes is valid only if lynch did not understand the wrongfulness of the crime or if she did not intend to commit the crime quote she doesn't even believe it herself he says uh she didn't she says she didn't do it she expects you to acquit her of these charges because you don't because you believe her um yeah so uh during the closing arguments lynch said uh they also said that she never people said she

never believed she was pregnant and they talked about her hysterectomy so it looks bad yeah june 22nd 1989 is the verdict we're talking about four counts of first degree murder two regular two and commission of a felony and all that they find her guilty on all four counts of murder-degree murder, two regular, two in commission of a felony, and all that. They find her guilty on all four counts of murder. So what do people think outside the courthouse? Oh, I'd sure like to know. That's what I want to know. Let's talk about it. What do they think her sentence should be?

Because it's going to be death or life. One juror here, or I'm sorry, one person outside the courthouse here, Beth Webb, who's a cousin of Beverly Gibson, so I mean, obviously, she said, quote, I think she's going to get what she deserved. I'd like to see her get the death sentence or as harsh a sentence as she can because she caused many grief. Now, I think it's her turn. Many grief. Many people.

Many grief. Much grief would have probably been smoother. But the murders were senseless here. Joyce Baines, she's just a lady on the street. She said, quote, she's getting what she deserves, but she should get more like electrocuted. Wow. Wow. That is rough. Start a whole

jamboree after her. Oof. These are all ladies, too. Trudy Borish, 28. She said, quote, I think she should get what the Gibson's did. They got the death sentence, and I think she should, too. Wow.

Yeah, these people are hardcore. Harry Donovan, 67. He attended the first and the last days of the trial. He's an observer here. He said, quote, There was no question that she was guilty. There's too much evidence. The baby and the gun. There's enough to convict them.

He says, quote, I think anyone that would take another baby's woman and kill the woman and her husband deserves what she gets and uh margaret chambers of smearness says there's other ways of getting a baby without killing there's adoption foster children sex very true fucking yeah um so the next day sentencing comes around life or death on the table you ma'am may fuck off life Life without parole. Oh, they're going to hang on to her forever. Forever. Life without. September 89 is Richard's trial.

Okay. Now, pre-trial here, there's some shit they got to go over. Some evidence, first of all. There's some juror things. There's suppression hearings to keep the juror from seeing photographs used to identify Richard Lynch as the man seen in the hospital looking at nursery people. Okay. So they're trying to get that ID out of court. They don't want that because that connects him to the baby right there. You get him out of that out of the baby thing and then you got a case.

So they do that. I believe, by the way, your honor, this is a court. What do they um i believe by the way your honor this is a what do they want pictures and witnesses this is a court of law there's no place for evidence here your honor this is ridiculous you have to suppress this you have to admit your honor that picture looks exactly like my client i'm sorry that's not fair i mean clearly that's i mean they're gonna find them guilty if they see that the uh jury is five women and seven men um they say that it's going to be the same as joyce's trial because it's the same they have the same fucking evidence and they were they were there together so it's all kind of the same thing minus the hysterectomy

basically uh they don't know whether to go for he knew she was faking or they're just going to try to concentrate on he was there killed people and took a baby with her so same a lot of the same evidence uh here um so uh they do all of this and uh um the state contends the couple conspired to kill the gibsons after visiting the county's two hospitals to select a baby that joyce could legitimize as a fake pregnancy and they said that uh yeah that's how that was but uh one thing here is that uh uh crucial to the defense's case is the theory they have psychiatrists that have examined joyce lynch and say she suffers from pseudocysis uh commonly known as a quote hysterical pregnancy which sounds like it's from the 40s yeah cheer up bitch you're having an hysterical pregnancy that's cheer up bitch times yes there's a baby inside you and you will get it

out don't worry stop being hysterical let me smack her you feel better now thank you doctor fucking ridiculous um anyway they said that condition which makes females have imitation symptoms of a real pregnancy so it's not actually you're hysterical oh it means just psychotic behavior it's a psychosomatic pregnancy basically where you you feel like you're pregnant actually you have symptoms and you imitate it and all this pregnancy and they said that worked with joyce's mental instability to lead her to this scheme ah the old i'm a dummy she's crazy defense because Because he says, Richard's defense is he's just a gullible guy that had to go along with I'm a dummy, she's crazy.

That's the defense. I'm a dummy, she's crazy defense. It's perfect. Perfect fucking defense here. So, Jesus fucking Christ. During the trial. I suppose you can't go any other way, though. What else do you do?

I'm a dummy, she's crazy. That's it. I do what she says. She's a lunatic. She's real smart, but she mean. That's all you can't go any other way, though. What else do you do? I'm a dummy. She's crazy. That's it. I do what she says. She's a lunatic. She's real smart, but she mean. That's all you can say. I don't even know what else to say here. So in the middle of the trial, Stephen, or Stephen, geez, I'm talking about Dick Bill.

Yeah. He, oh, because the one guy's name is Stephen B. Potter. That's his attorney. That's why. They make a formal complaint to the court that Dick Bill has been getting the shit beaten out of him by prison guards at the correctional center. They said they punched him

in the stomach. Quote, after he got finished visiting with his parents on Sunday, two guards assaulted him while his hands were cuffed behind his back. My client would never provoke anyone. They said, quote, and they said, we got a call and we'll have an internal investigation. Who the hell knows? Nothing ever nothing ever came of it who knows maybe they didn't rough them up anymore so back to the trial defense maintains he's a gullible man tricked into

believing his wife gave birth to their son at a milford clinic where she had to bust off 357 shots to scare away black people as she entered it and then ran out with blood on her hands still her way in and out and then they also let the mother just still have blood all over her on her hands just leave take your bloody baby and get the fuck out of here might want to buck some shots there's a lot of black people milling about it's a little late out there be safe jesus christ yeah doesn't get it doesn't get light out for a while if you know what i mean you better be careful what is happening so uh yeah and having and also potter just the lawyer potter describes joyce as having a split personality one that believes she was pregnant and the other that knew she wasn't that's the the hitch here so the judge allows the psychiatrist

to tell the jury about the diagnosis of a flor woman who had a similar antisocial manipulative personality as Joyce Lynch. Not even about Joyce Lynch. Just another person. Here's some evidence of somebody else's life. Basically, this exists as a thing. That's what he's doing. What did that lady do? Apparently, committed murder and baby theft was diagnosed as suffering from the same thing.

False pregnancy. It was a 19 year old that did this, that he was talking about. Yeah. So that's how that ended up happening. Now, um, one witness here,

uh, is, uh, uh, they bring in the psychiatrist. It's John S. O'Brien. And I guess he was the first to like,

uh, make this diagnosis. So it's kind of, it's kind of, you know of controversial whether this exists or not. It's something that he said. But either way. So anyway, other people said, though, people testified that they saw Joyce's stomach and it looked like she was pregnant. Like lots of people.

The 20 witnesses said they saw her pregnant, thought she was pregnant richard had no way of like i was right next to richard we both thought she was pregnant like i don't understand how he would know like they're saying that he has no idea they contend the lynch's the state though says the lynch is plotted and committed this on purpose they did it together they stalked people the whole deal uh they said that the analysis of joyce's personality was based on incomplete evidence because the psychiatrist didn't interview her her first husband who was married to her for 15 years he should know shit they only uh talked to a bunch of ex-lovers from the last few years what the fuck uh virginia lynch richard dickie bill's mom testifies

that uh about her son's character and that richard was uh um richard was easily manipulated by a woman like joyce so the closings here they talk about how uh state police interviewed him at his home they took two statements and uh he admitted that uh he gave false information to the one statement when he gave another he said in his second statement he began to realize his wife might his wife must have been involved in the killings you know so he's like oh boy what am i going to do now they said it was possible that richard lynch was taken in by his wife's false claims of pregnancy he said joyce lynch was mentally disturbed domineering woman who was obsessed with having a child and described richard lynch as quote docile immature and subservient i'm a dummy she's

crazy that's the worst three words to put together docile immature and subservient he said uh they said expert witnesses they said that they contended the police lied about how richard lynch's thumb print ended up on a note bearing directions to the gibson home that was found there they're saying it was a big lie they did it on purpose um they. They said that Richard Lynch testified that he saw the note for the first time and touched it after the arrest. They said they showed it to him and he picked it up. And that's how they got his finger. That's the first time he ever saw it. First time I seen it and touched it.

Now, like I said, he wasn't with her when she was seen stalking around in the car and asking directions to the thing. So who knows? the car and asking directions to the thing so who knows he said quote to protect the slender thread upon which the prosecution rests they said that the police have lied that's what happens second

note bearing directions to the Gibson home was found in Joyce Lynch's purse when she was arrested that's not good that's real bad that didn't have his fingerprints on it so he she said you know why would she need two notes? Then that's what the prosecution said. If she acted alone, why would she need it twice?

The other one was his copy. So the prosecutor said that several of the Gibson's neighbors testified they saw a car resembling Joyce's speeding away from the Gibson's driveway after shots have been fired. Another neighbor claimed he said to have seen an off-road vehicle closely resembling Richard Lynch's small four-wheel drive truck, leaving the vicinity of the Gibson home at one point. He also pointed out that spent shell casings from the 357 were found in the trash in his home and the ballistics test obviously matched them. So they have the same case against him although it's i'm a dummy she's crazy uh so the verdict comes in december 2nd 1989 dickie verdict not guilty on every fucking charge

no way across the board how eight charges not guilty they love him not guilty how do you all that that damn joyce not guilty wow just an idiot acquitted they believed that he told that she said i'm gonna take this gun to protect myself from the blacks outside the clinic and then came home and that she he believed that and the jury went i mean i would have believed him too seems plausible wow maybe they should have done profiles on these jurors to see other fucking idiots they didn't do profiles on this one no that was the other one yeah that's what i mean they need to do it on these people that's why they got it right so the prosecutor said quote it should be fairly obvious that we are distraught with this obviously destroyed uh he said i don't know if we can say there's one thing that was significant that made it happen just they don't know uh the jurors listen to this shit they interviewed the jurors one juror robert d dennis

who served on it said quote said richard lynch jr quote just seemed like a normal boy in love that got all messed up wow that's how much they saw a normal boy in love got all messed up. Yeah, that is wild. Thomas P. Dickey, who's another juror, all the Dickies, said, quote, I don't want to have to say anything, he said. He said, but they apparently offered, they said, quote, you should talk to the state attorney and superintendent of police. The state had to prove beyond a doubt that he was guilty. So they didn't, in our opinion. There you go he said quote uh one said quote i feel sorry for the gibson family but you can't that let that interfere with what you're doing he said uh they uh apparently kept cutting down and eliminate took the initial vote and then kept cutting down and eliminating the differences

in the verdicts over the next three days and they said quote when a young man's total life is at stake you got to be sure you did the very best we weren't there to impress people and we did our best i'm not here to impress you we're trying to do this right we think he didn't do it the defense attorney said fuck yeah thank god you did that he said everybody had him convicted but the matter of the fact is he was innocent uh victims relatives are pissed obviously sure uh one here barbara ann uh stats who's the sister of beverly gibson's father said i just can't believe it the gibsons and webs are a dignified family and what we feel is better left unsaid they bought that whole thing classy yep then she said i can't believe it

uh another one richard uh who is this uh this is uh jean e stats that's the 17 year old cousin of beverly she said quote i have a question for the jury who made this uncalled for shocking decision did you honestly listen to the state's attorney or were you sleeping uncalled for uncalled for now back to the mini mart uh mabel mabel said they asked how are people feeling mabel said they're upset yeah they're upset uh she said that yeah they're um they feel like they're they're of equal guilt the lynches customers expected a conspiracy conviction saying they couldn't believe richard lynch could be so gullible that his wife faked a pregnancy, murdered, and stole a baby without him knowing. They said, quote,

He might not have pulled the trigger, but no one can tell me that he didn't know about it. He had to have some kind of knowledge about what's going on, one customer says. Yeah, and they said that Joyce Lynch was not familiar with weapons and would have had a hard time firing a.357 four times in any accurate sense. To hit anybody with it. To hit anything. They're super accurate, though. You can hit shit with them.

Especially from close range. You've got to be able to hold on to it. Yes, exactly. They said that Dickey was a well-known hunter. And they said, quote, justice was not done. That's what they said there. I tend to agree. Dickey Lynch said himself, old Dickey Bills, he said, quote. That's what they said there. I tend to agree. Dickie Lynch said himself, old Dickie Bills, he said, quote.

I think they got it right. He said, quote, I feel sorry about what happened. Ain't nothing I can do to change it. That's exactly what, ain't nothing I can do to change it. That's how they quoted him. So Dickie's a free man. They let him out of jail. He's like, is this for real?

Are they going to cop? Is Ashton Kutcher going to pop out somewhere? I know that show's coming up soon because I feel it in my blood. He said, they asked him, what are you going to do? He goes, well, I'm going to pursue a divorce, first of all. Yep. And his wife said, Joyce said she's been trying to pursue a divorce also to file her own divorce from her jail cell. But it's difficult.

He gives a bunch of interviews, gets phone calls from calls from people hangs out what was your first day like he said that uh and his first day off him and his old friends went to the elks lodge in milford a favorite hangout for him and his wife uh yeah they before they were charged obviously um they said that uh you know he his parents uh used an answering machine to screen out the harassing phone calls. Obviously, they said, quote, we had a couple of kooks come up. That's Virginia Lynch. One caller threatened lynched and left his name. Another man roared a truck into the lynch's front yard, refusing to leave the truck, but blowing its horn to stand on the front yard doing a blow in the horn.

We want to get away for a little while, Virginia Lynch says. But her son plans to stay in the area because, quote, everybody knows he's here. And the guy who owns the Lynch's house where the baby was found and all that type of shit, he's bought the house

and he says it's great. He said publicity hasn't bothered me at all. He gives tours of the red brick rancher pointing out the small room where Matthew Gibson was. That's where they kept him right there oh my god people come over his uh he works for a railroad firm and his friends are like think he's crazy he said it really doesn't affect me they didn't kill him here if they had

i won't think i would have bought the house that's good that everybody is housed in delaware tell me that's not one of the craziest phillips oklahoma level stories we've ever goddamn had it's real life raising arizona minus uh killing nathan arizona yeah minus brutal butchering of the two parents so his name was nathan arizona nathan arizona yeah i'm the wife i couldn't remember her i don't know her name i don't know bethany i was gonna say nathan and so and so and then i didn't have it it. So I just had the Arizona. I don't know what her name was. So, yeah, that is that's a crazy ass story. Holy shit.

Yeah, they both were there. I think they both went in. She held the baby while he shot them dead, probably. And, you know, she rounded up the kid and got the diaper bag and all that shit. That's what I feel like happened. Can you imagine killing two people and their two other babies slept through it? Slept through it. Three fifty seven shots. Those kids are good sleepers.? Slept through it. They slept right through it.

357 shots. Those kids are good sleepers. That's a good sleeper. Man, that's awesome. You could watch TV. You could fuck in the next room. For sure. Do whatever you want in that house with those kids.

Oh, man. Good kids. They raised them well, and it's a shame that they're gone. Anyway, if you like that show, holy shit, tell us about it. Tell the world. Get on Apple Podcasts. Give us five stars. It helps drive us up the charts.

It really, really is a helpful thing to a show. I don't know why. Also, go to shutupandgivememurder.com, first of all, for all your merchandise, and second of all, for your virtual live show tickets. It's happening. It's happening this Friday, January 29th, 2021. It's available for 72 hours after the actual live show ends as well. So check it out.

I'm telling you, it's a real show. We're going to pretend like we're in a theater. Visuals, microphones, it's on. Get there and check it out. Seriously. I can't wait. Do that. We can't wait.

Shut up and give me murder.com. Real case. Good stuff. We're fucked up virtually together. Let's do it. I'll be on a lot of edibles there. I can't wait. Jimmy will be drinking his whiskey.

It's going to be fun. We're going to have a blast. Do that. Get your merch as well. Listen to Crime and Sports, please. That helps a lot. You definitely want to hook up with Patreon. We have all sorts of great Patreon coming up.

Love After Lockup is our next Patreon episode. What a show that is. We talk about that. We have so much fun talking about that. It's wild. And then we have the kind of real mafia stuff on the other show from a bunch of books, kind of guys from the Goodfellas movie and peripheral shit like that. We'll talk about a lot of fun stuff there. That is patreon.com slash crime and sports.

And in addition to that, you will get a shout out. Jimmy will mispronounce your name. I'll ruin it ruin your name because you're a producer and if you just want to have good karma and still be a producer very easy to do that over at paypal using our email address crime in sports at gmail.com you can do that there follow us on social media uh we are at murder small on twitter at small town pod on facebook and at small town murder on instagram that said there's only one thing for me right now my i need the list of the most fabulous wonderful

goddamn people who would never murder us and steal our babies jimmy hit me with that list right now this was executive producers are suzanna platt melissa turner matthew nielsen courtney chenier i think chenier chenier uh jordan bennett again thank you so much claire koenig or birthday too last week last week that's right no it was like a month ago oh i'm we should redo this no no you're good okay just messed up happy oh it's just last week again birthday yeah you're right claire koenig or koenig i think have uh hafid christobal he's a bear who loves us terribly he's a sweetheart thank you hafid uh peter renex bailey with no last name hans dickle hans dickle uh nick brown justin autry bethany mcgee dylan incant uh what is this anting oh boy incantalupo i was gonna say it's probably italian and there it is jake mcdonald rachel hilliard brown zuri coley galloway uh erica

schaefer mike daniels alf aldo and wait was aldo felici and his wife alexandra felici of course it is well thank you right amanda king byron pearson uh elliot bressler and andy owenby thank you guys so much for everything you do. We truly are at your feet. Just to be at your feet? Is that what he said? I don't remember. Other producers this week are Brendan Ables, Danelle Randall, Jude, nope, that's Judd Spisdy, Travis Marshall, happy

birthday, Aaron Newton, Rogue Riley Creations, Liz Vasquez, Jennifer Baird, Anna Lakey, Norma Gardner, Sean, oh Baird, Anna Lakey, Norma Gardner, Sean Mayorani, Shane and Lindy Grant, Jacob Cook, Melanie Aguilar. Anglicize your last names, fellow Italians. Maxwell Davis, Eric Schiller, Rabbi Shmulalovich.

I don't know why he likes me saying that. John Kelly, Andrew McCoy, Lisa Moore, Craig Widgecans. I don't know. That's never going to happen. Amanda Knight, Caleb Cook, Nicholas Koutsis, Ingrid Stoke, Mary Brutus, Sarah Surridge, Emily King, Melanie Elisa Darcy, Dustin Manley, Megan Guza, Michaela Rotert, I think Rotert, Janice Hill, Todd Robertson, happyela Rotert, I think Rotert, Janice Hill, Todd Robertson, happy birthday,

Pasqualani Elardi, nope, that wasn't even right. I was all excited about it. Pasqualina Elardi, Total Axe in Michigan. If you like throwing axes, that's the place to do it. That's so much fun. I swear to God, James, I want you to do it. It's a blast. Valerie Callahan, Froggy Fred, Deborah Townsend, happy birthday.

Jude Kendall, Maria Rasper, Sandra Hurd, Victoria Blau, Thomas Smith, Trey Jelly, Christopher Shadow Lord Tope, Ashley Vio, Barbara with no last name, Ryan Rayan, Kimigishi, Kimigisha, Rayan? Jesus. Marie Kirkland. Mike Palante. David Tozer. Brandon Clancy. Richard Smalley. Eric Rodriguez. Jacob Russell.

Jorge Torres. Danielle with no last name. Cynthia Pulido. Paul Whitley. Haley Bennett. Don Coker. Kristen Clark Owens. Jill Wofford.

107 Dildos. Valerie Dunkelberger. Burger. Amanda Rodriguez-Hauk, Mary Spangler, Michelle O'Hara, Andrew Richards, Vangelica Marshall, Amira Alleman, Ashley Allen, Trevor Larson, Nick Chevy, Jessica Roper, Rebecca Larson, Maggie Schultz, Allie Stroke, Fangirl Productions, Sarah Parker, Megan Paulson, Jeff Cox, Nick with no last name, Brittany McKinney, Daniel Crabtree, Chris McLeed, Haley Horn, Tandy Wallace, I think that's what that says. Macy Loomis, Marie Rose, Justin Burke, Courtney Babcock, Katrina Young. Nope, that's King. What the fuck? Why do you guys like that I do this? Carla Jaquais, Michelle Fournier, Travis Waterman, Eric Simmons, Rebecca Bialik, Heather Flippen. Flippen, Ryan Rowan, Jamie Sharp, Myra, Murphy the Dog Crumb, Sarah Jane Delia Vecchia, David Burgess, Dana Anderson, Stephen Musgrove, Lloyd Browning, Kate O'Connor, Patty Galvin, Ava Salters, Derek Schell, Wade Johns, Jason Havilik.

Have a lock. God damn it. Conrad Brower, Devin Williams, Joe Turner, Chrissy Rayburn, yes, Ben Sobosker. A big pause. I know. Sarah Schultz, Deborah Hardy, Isaac Cox. I suck, Cox. I get it. Gotcha.

You son of a bastard. Christine with no last name. Audrey Thomas. Fiona Crisp. Eric Smart. Josie Jose. Montalvo. Jackie Davis. JC?

Jackie, probably. Ryan Coruro. What? Coro? Okamoto? I'm trying so hard. Your mouth just gave up halfway through that. Rhiannon Garrett. Jalen Bates. Diffin. Narelle Armstrong. O' car. Rubble. Rhiannon Garrett.

Jalen Bates. Diffin. Narelle Armstrong. O'Brien. Risa. Risa. Hirsch. What is this?

Michael. What? M-I-C-H-Y-L-E. Is that really Michael? Burge? McKell. I don't know. LBC.

Dana. Dana. Dana. No last name. Melinda Nuth. Nutt, probably. Sarah Gardner. Melissa Hanna. Nikki. Nikki Allen. Bailey Chapman, Clinton Whaten, Catherine Schmidt, Melissa Benson.

God damn it, Amanda Kershoff, Destiny Lewis, Candice Metzler, Stephen Haas, Brendan Brenda, Calicoat, Devin Hess, Mario Guerra, Greg Arnold, Zachary with no last name, Amy Fenton, that's an N, not an M, Travis Eisel, Nick Jacoby, Emily Crum, Wayne Holland, Kate Meredith, Edward Hansen, Gina Chauvey, Nate with no last name, Brandon Bonderson, Jameel Parker, Matthew, nope, that's Mark, Piotrowski, Stacy Peterson, Moises Lopez, Ella Ellis. Ella Ellis. Esther with no last name. Melissa Jeter. Jester.

Jeter. Son of a bitch. Steven Lundberg, Robert Scott, Julianne Armstrong, Mackenzie Hahn, Katie C. Fee. That's an F. Jonathan Hayslip, Shelly Ewan-Chuck. Ewan-Chuck. Ewan-Chuck.

Debbie Robbins, Frederick Nicolasi. I'm sorry, Frederick. slip uh shelly ewan chuck you want chuck you and chuck uh debbie robbins frederick nicola nickel nicolasi i'm sorry frederick white horse eventing chloe smith i think smith could be either tremaine eat lastly fuck austin johnson brandon anderson uh kevin carter jim hackman rattle pod at uh akad zali reynoso the the pud james the pud the pod the pud well there's the one there's several of them but that one's the nicholas brown uh anna bird's i hope of the uh frozen vegetable fortune misty baird uh cody clement ian steven christopher steven even even even steven yeah there we go christopher leonard cameron smith moyd uh what is this mojo rola what is that real moji rola oh a wall oh a lobby tom thorough thurlow uh kayla lopez quentin caspari jenny woods ian quist mcquiston

alex chapman crystal o'brien whitney dixon christy martin guy gax fan that's i know what that is is that the inventor of uh dungeon dragons i think it is i think that's right amanda charles carly schrantz sorry cotessa spalding cindy sutton uh joanne car carnotowski david holloway mike nope David Holloway, Mike, nope, that's Mark Wilkie, Danielle Damara, Nick Buchlegel, Tiana with no last name, Alexis Stark, Jessica Macklin, Brandy Toussignard, Christina Norton, Nick with no last name, Jenny Picard, Jimbo Hoy, Dirty Balls Podcast, Laura Latner, Gordon Duncan, Giggles Shearer, Chris Cook, Lisa Becker, Tommy Marlowe, God damn it, Drake Sharp, Lisa Whittle, Christy with no last name, Jerry White, Alexandria Parks, Tara Kershaw, Martin Thompson, William Wise II, Bobby Bergstrom, Anne-Marie Bryant, Chad Bartling, Katie Toolman, Jacqueline Sauer, Marie Bryant, Chad Bartling, Katie Toolman, Jacqueline Sauer, Adria Allen, Ricky Durr, Titiana Sanchez, Jesse Eddy, Tiffany Flores, Gavin Oberyn, Kimberly Moriarty, Matt McCarthy, Nikki Kane, Summer Stevens, Jesse Bartle, Joseph Bain, Jason Baxter, Corinne Ertle. Is that a roll? I am getting, I'm doing really well.

Laura Leach, Jamie Osbar, Michael Frisbee. I hope, that would be amazing. I hope you have a billion Frisbee dollars. Paul Steinbeck, Joe Lay, Joel, Joe Lee, Paige Long, Jen Sarver, Avery Dabrowski, Melissa Tolini, Cade Brenchley. Fuck, I've ruined it, Kate Eliza,

Eric with no last name, Julian Mays, April Downing, Justin Wilson, Xavier Carrizales, Mitchell Berkey, Daniel, nope, that's Daniel, LaMare, Rick Carter,

Luke Casey, Alyssa Neva, Kaylee with no last name, August West, Brian Ribby, Daniel Ream, Joseph Sullivan, Marilyn with no last name, Luis with no last name, Jennifer Zug brian ribby daniel ream joseph sullivan maryland with no last name louise

with no last name jennifer zugat levy uh levy steven uh kabika michael mitch schultz jason davis nicole ellerby kent 1988 peter bignel uh melissa yazzie tommy trotter jeremy hunt brandon edwards billy lynch chandra magni magni manny i don't know jennifer nope that's Tommy Trotter, Jeremy Hunt, Brandon Edwards, Billy Lynch, Chandra, Magni, Magni, Manny. I don't know. Jennifer. Nope, that's Jeff Harrell. Brandon Blizzard of the Dairy Queen Blizzard fortune. Well, clearly.

Jeremiah Zediker. Jared Forer. Rachel McKenzie. Kelly J. Jesse Taman. Garrett Clark. Miranda Pollard. What is this? L-V-R-S lvrszz i'm never pronouncing that

amanda uh litz schmidt schmidt god damn it andrew ducholtz jimmy wojcik lauren osavado daniel harris steven ranks uh nicholas hotchmuth stained studios ben mullen craig williams charlie with no last name kathleen thane Nicholas Hotchmuth, Stain Studios, Ben Mullen, Craig Williams, Charlie with no last name, Kathleen Thane-Milgett, I think, Ernest Thomas, Rohan the Jeweler,

Rohan Bajaj, Madeline Stewart, Mike Virgo, and then Mike with no last name, Evan Post, Sean with no last name, and also Sean Mara. I love that one.

There's Sean and then another Sean, and it's two different people for sure. Sandra Hurd, Austin Richards, Captain Mowenz, Kenzie Jones, Lexington Katsakian, Caleb Bamey, Not-So-Steely Dan, Sarah with no last name, Katie Benzinger, DJ Hoglio, Laura Salmon, Sarah Raboon, Kenneth Enoch, Mary Doubtit, Zach... She doubt it, doubt it. She does. Dave Brown, Michelle Dawson, Bailey Hall, Danny Schaub, Aaron Saxon, Jennifer with no last name,

JJ Puck, I think it's Puck, Lauren with no last name, Emily Sorrell, Christy Facey, Rachel Spans, Tommy Rounds, Tommy Pounds is who it is. Hey, Tommy Pounds, Tommy Pounds is who it is. Hey, Tommy Pounds. Yeah, he does. Namita Kara, Rezzy, Rez, Rez, Steve Geralt, Anath- Nope, that's Angel. Angel Cavanaugh, Nathan Sanders, Marissa Jane Rossi, Rossi. Hey.

In two R's. Janice. Rossi. Janice Rossi. Sarah Birnbaum, Brian. Kakser. Kakser. Bare Birnbaum. Brian. Caxer. Caxer. Barely knows her.

David Gleason. Jesse Sensabaugh. Linda Bright. Jen DeSimio. Robert Carroll. Pooh. Toe. El Kello.

Leia. I don't know. Matthew Lacewell. Mary Wood. Ashley Moore. Ben Sullivan. Mary Ann Dane. Kristen Buford.

Jerry Rumney. Amy Beck. Elizabeth Metz. Andrea Hocknadel. well mary wood ashley moore ben sullivan mary ann dane kristin buford jerry rumney amy beck elizabeth metz andrea hock natal kristin buford cr cronin david gomez caitlin florino florine florian jesus jay jay pew and cough it fucking that's a tough one jay. Leif Distan, Kev Dangerous McDonald, Kelly J., Angela Ansman, Shannon Ott, Tiffany Spees, Todd Peters, S.M. Ripper, Rachel Adams, Tristan Miller, Robin Larson, Angela, nope, that's Angie, Cantaloupolis, Devin Bronger, Jade Montague, Justin Elzey, Tom with no last name, Devin Bronger, Jade Montague, Justin Elzey, Tom with no last name, Vince Piscitelli, Jules Harris, she's fantastic, Cindy Vilsack, Jeffrey with no last name, Sophie S., Mark Fisher, the coach, obviously,

Angie Kajawa, Jake Kokesh, Liza Rubichaud, William Shaw, Amanda Smith, M. with no last name, Kenneth Allen, Deez Nuts, Frank Lee, and also Frank Lee Osterhout. Thank you all so much, and all of our patron sponsors. You guys are terrific, and we can't thank you enough. Thank you, everybody, so much. Honestly, from the bottom of our hearts, you have done everything for us that, I mean, that our parents didn't do,

our teachers, everything else, that you didn't do it, we they didn't but you have so thank you for that and what if they wanted to thank you jimmy how could they get a hold you can thank me ever anywhere you want uh shout it into the void uh yell out the window right just do that there's nothing you can do you know how to look us up on the internet if you want to follow us that's good i don't need it yeah it's fine but do it if you want thank you so much for everything that you do for us thank you it's uh you're you're the ones that are important not me that's what i'm saying thank you so much that said everybody i think it's time to

call it a day it's a crazy ass story so i go to bed i hope you enjoyed that everybody and uh i don't know hug your kids make sure that your wife is really pregnant if she is i don't know what the hell to say get a spoon and a flashlight. Get your spoon and your knife and your flashlight. A knife! What are you doing with the knife? I don't get it. Until next week, everybody. It's been our pleasure. Bye. Hey, Prime members, you can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free on Amazon Music.

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