Small Town Murder - #211 - Frozen Blood Puddles & Banana Liqueur - Ely, Minnesota

Episode Date: February 18, 2021

This week, in Ely, Minnesota, a frozen puddle of blood opens up a mystery that turns out to be way more complicated than anyone could expect. A friendly night of partying among what seems to be strangers, turns into an attack that seems to really be personal, but is it? Or just a weird impulse that turns both hideous, and deadly? This one has all kinds of mystery, and brutality!! Along the way, we find out that towns are named for all kinds of weird reasons, that banana liqueur is never a good idea, and that frozen blood puddles are always going to draw attention! Hosted by James Pietragallo & Jimmie Whisman New episodes every Thursday! Donate at: patreon.com/crimeinsports or go to paypal.com & use our email: [e-mail] Go to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things Small Town Murder & Crime In Sports! Follow us on... twitter.com/@murdersmall facebook.com/smalltownpod instagram.com/smalltownmurder Also, check out James & Jimmie's other show, Crime In Sports! On iTunes, Stitcher, or wherever you listen to podcasts See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. What if you married the love of your life and then stood by them as they developed 21 new identities? What would you do? This Is Actually Happening is a weekly podcast that features extraordinary true stories of life-changing events told by the people who lived them. Listen to the newest season of This Is Actually Happening on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. This week in Ely, Minnesota, a puddle of blood leads investigators to a frozen body and a complete mystery that unravels into something even stranger than they initially expected.

Welcome to Small Town Murder. small town murder hello everybody and welcome back to small town murder yay yay indeed jimmy yay indeed my name is james petra gallo i'm here with my co-host i'm jimmy westman thank you folks so much for joining us this week on another crazy wild nutty edition of small town murder as always we have got just an absolutely weird case as usual for you today hope you enjoyed last week which was nuts too as you remember it's been so weird lately so hope you're enjoying all this craziness coming at you. If you are, you can tell the world about it. Get on Apple podcast, that purple icon on your phone there and give us five stars. We don't know why, but it helps.

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Of course it is. If you have been catching up, or if you haven't caught up, you want to catch up with this. Last time we did Old West Murders. That was a lot. Or, I'm sorry, that's the next episode. Old West Murders, which are crazy. Oh, my God. Think about it.

It was just insanity going on back then crazy stuff and people were like i don't know oh well very very interesting stories there a bunch of old west murders and uh love after lockup was the last one we got to talk about love after lockup it's the best show on tv season three oh it's amazing we got to really really get mad at a lot of people for screwing up their lives and we're so angry at them. Patreon.com slash Crime and Sports is where you get all of that, the back catalog, everything like that. And you get to be a producer. Jimmy will horribly mispronounce your name. For sure.

Well, he tries his hardest to get it right. So that's a lot of fun. Get on that. Patreon.com slash Crime and Sports. Patreon.com slash Crime and Sports is where you get all of that and you get access to all the crime and sports bonus and everything else there so hope you've been enjoying all that get on there patreon.com slash crime and sports and jimmy will mispronounce your name at the end of the show when we read it out and praise you to the to the top of the hills because you are a producer and

you keep the show going and we love you and on top of that if you just want to have good karma and also be a producer and get a shout out you can do that over at paypal using our email address crime and sports at gmail.com right uh so that said i think we need to do the disclaimer quickly obviously this is a comedy podcast yeah it's a comedy show the the murders are real i swear there's no it sounds crazy we find crazy murder so i could see you listening to it going ah they're joking about that no that's the that's the crazy part right the crazy part is sometimes the comedy we don't need to say a thing because it's just insane stuff happening and obviously the act of murder isn't funny no no one's we're not sitting here going they keep cut her how my god that's hilarious cut cut them into 12 pieces so fun that's not the funny part that's the point we are very respectful

of stuff like that you make jokes about all the stuff around a murder think about if you were like hmm we should kill that person right away someone could take a step back and go i think you should laugh at yourself because you're you're you're going off the rails here, buddy. So that's the way it is. We go out of our way not to make fun of the victims or the victims' families because we're assholes. What? But we're not scumbags. Yes, sir. And that's how that works.

So if that sounds good to you, you're in for a good time. If you think true crime and comedy should never go together and, you know, just not at all, you don't want to hear any jokes if someone's ever been killed, then maybe we're not for you. Maybe it's not. But it might be. I think maybe you might be looking at it the wrong way. Either way, though, I think it's time right now to sit back, take a deep breath, clear the lungs and shout, shut up and give me murder. Let's do this.

All right. Let's go on a trip. Terrific. Shall we? We are going up to the it's cold up here. Boy, we are going up to Minnesota. Oh's cold up here, boy. We are going up to Minnesota. Oh, boy. Oh, boy.

And northern Minnesota, too. This isn't like Minneapolis suburbs or anything. This is Ely, Minnesota. Ely, Minnesota, I should say. Ely. Like Robert E? Yeah, Ely, like that, like you would say that. It's E-L-Y is how you spell it.

God forbid if you said it ellie or something like that i'm sure we get a lot of tweets like we did with lino lakes trust me so this is in northeastern minnesota all the way up by canada yeah up in no man's land because this is where this is like a very north part of the united states like it's it's north of Michigan and Wisconsin and all that. It's Canada, basically. It's four hours to Minneapolis. That's how far north it is. Two hours down to Duluth.

Oh, boy. The party center of Duluth, Minnesota, where all the crazy stuff happens. A place that's so vanilla, the most famous thing there is Plaid Underwear. There's a company that just sells like Duluth underwear company. Isn't it? Duluth Trading Company.

It's just a bunch of plaid shit. Oh, there you go. It's like farmer gear. It's wild up there. Super wild. Farmer gear. Shit that's warm. Yeah.

Keeps you warm outside. And it's about four hours and 15 minutes to Corcoran, which was our last Minnesota episode, episode 188 back in september of 2020 my word so yeah it's been a little while six months or so this is in st louis county okay odd okay area code 218 and the town motto is there's not a lot of people here but this is this is what they've chosen uh you're not cold, are you? That's the town motto. What are you, some kind of pussy? Yeah, you're not cold, are you?

There's only 12 below outside. Jesus Christ. Wait till tonight comes around. That's when it's cold. Wait till winter shows up. This is only August right now. Shit. So the history of this place here,

the first Europeans to explore the area were fur traders. This is nowhere. No one said said we're gonna go up there and live people are like i hear there's shit to kill and trade up there i guess i can survive it heard we can gut a hat up there let's go there that's that's true i really feel like i'd like to take many animals and make them into a garment of some kind i'd like to gut a jacket i think i could do it so they search that's what they do they go into the wilderness to search for shit to trade furs uh it was the lake vermilion

gold rush though that brought the largest number of people here in 1865 okay so civil war ended um there's furs and now some people here there's gold yeah 1800s whenever anybody heard there was gold there was just a people going from one spot to the next that's where we're going now how many towns have we heard of that that was how they started was initially people quote heard there was gold right not even there was definitely gold not confirmation heard about it heard some gold was in this area. Pray tell. Yeah. Where's the gold?

A hard tell rumor of gold in them hills. In them nahr hills. So although hardly any gold was ever found, that's the thing. Bunch of people went there. Nope. One guy found a nugget once. He's like, look what I found. And everybody around like, fuck, he got the only one.

That's all there was. Somebody must have put that have put that here but around and shoot a jacket they did end up finding large deposits of iron ore up there which is not as good as gold obviously you don't hear people excitedly yell iron i found iron oh the main iron vein uh but a lot of new immigrants were coming in at that time from europe a lot of german immigrants and things like that so uh a lot of them came to this area uh looking for work in the mines and and uh it was called the minnesota iron range at that time yeah you know how cold it is how'd you like to work you know mine pulling iron out of the ground oh my god jesus christ this is ore so it's just rocks of fucking iron this is rough heavy yeah dense so ely is a weird name i wonder how it got it i found uh in 2020 the the ely echo

put it this way they wrote quote the name ely stems from the Isle of Eels, a wetland near Cambridge, England. In historic times, those lakes swarmed with the slithery fish, eels, obviously, that provided sustenance for ancestors of Samuel B. Ely. His clan arrived in the States from Ely, England in the 1600s. One ancestor was a close associate of Georgeorge washington and samuel a mining executive financed the railroad to ely in 1888 which launched our town so that's how this works yeah it's it's named after a place that had so many fucking eels they ate them that they ate them and then they then they they named shit after him now the french eat eel a lot they do but i know japanese in like growing up if you

go fishing and you catch an eel you cut the line and you don't keep it god no you just cut the line you don't even get your your lure is gone your hook is you just cut it that's i remember in the hudson river yeah when i was a kid i caught one in the hudson river my dad was like holy shit snip there's that goodbye just snip the line i was like all right let that digest that we don't need that don't need that that is ugly and scary it was fuck it was huge and gross and weird man they're ugly it was disgusting so that's how this town is is based on something very gross enjoy uh there's a this town is also famous famous for hoaxes. Oh. Oh, yeah. People from Ely, with the support of the city council, have created various hoaxes as a way of garnering free publicity for the city. This is why they do PR.

They are what? Like, PR firms do weird shit to get PR. They really do. Like, I was just reading this book about this, you know, the Rockstar Game Company that makes GTA and shit. In the beginning, they had this publicist who, without telling them they were doing this, started this Web site that was called like fuck Rockstar. And it was like, OK, all these mean, nasty things about disparaging. This was because in his mind, he had a big elaborate story that a programmer quit and then took this website to do this to get back at them. This was a PR guy's thing.

And they ended up calling the police and all this shit and found out that it was that not. It was crazy. So PR people are nuts. So this is what I mean. When you're trying for publicity, anything's possible. Sightings of Bigfoot in the Loch Ness Monster. Yes. Don't do that monster yes don't do that exactly you asshole what they do and then they sell you a keychain you go there and you buy lunch in a keychain and that's how they survive and we fix potholes that's it so one one hoax was that a was of a fictional family that paints the leaves of trees

every fall everywhere every fall um yeah their fictional family was retiring from the business and wanted people to send in a color application if they wanted to help carry out the tradition that was the thing they were they were cashing out on their paint oh my leaf painting these people go and change the colors from green to orange and red they change them and so if anybody else would like to come in and get an application. We got an opening or two. Yeah. Previously, they put out a story about Ely seceding from the United States to be a part of Canada because it's right by Canada.

So that was another thing to get them publicity. Both hoaxes were featured on the Chamber the chamber of commerce website ely.org like fucking.org was doing this wow in 2009 they made an international obviously joking around a bid to host the 2016 olympics clever and ely they're really bored up in this town i really hope everything's perfect in this town i hope somebody visit. I hope the roads are smooth. I hope the kids have so many textbooks and school shit they don't know what they're doing. I hope it's just an embarrassment of riches up there if they have time to do this shit. What, be liars?

Yeah, dicks they said in the in the bid that they had a man already employed with a bucket to drain miners lake south of town in order to provide stadium seating for the olympics a guy with a bucket so that's that was their big joke there's a guy with a bucket emptying it out you know they probably had a picture of some some dick out there bailing like with a waving with one hand holding a bucket shirtless with waders on. Says, you can do it, we can help on the side. Oh, you know it was. It's a Home Depot bucket. So the hoax became widely known through Minnesota, and it was reported.

It was like a big joke in radio stations, and they put out bumper stickers and shirts. And even a billboard bearing the slogan, Ely in 2016, became commonplace throughout the state so this was like a jesus that's what they otherwise nobody would know who the hell they are uh i got news for you i still don't even though we've talked about them for 15 minutes it's still hard right uh it's best known for being the entry point for the boundary waters canoe area wilderness a lot of outdoor shit a lot of lakes it's beautiful around here of course uh the international wolf uh wolf center is here and the north american bear center is also here wolves and bears wolves and bears lots of wolves and bears come on through

we got a center for it all we got wolves and bears and uh and hoaxes yeah have at it let's go uh also jessica Biel was born here. Really? Weird, right? How weird is that? She moved and got herpes. Good for her. I guess so.

She's fucking out of here. It's better than living here, I think. I suppose, yeah. Reviews of this town. Found a few. We'll give you a couple here. Here's a three star. Spent a week in Ely 817.

I assume August 17 on guided canoe trip, injured my hip on the trip. That's not the town's fault. No, sir. Uh, had to do laundry at the end of the trip. Well, you didn't bring enough underwear again. Like I said, you know how much, how many underwear you need, right? Uh, no handicap parking around the laundromat.

Well, bastards. So I faced by parked facing against the traffic to make it easier to get myself and the laundry out of the vehicle while in the laundromat this is really yeah while in the laundromat i received a parking ticket okay uh described the above circumstances but appeal was denied i've now paid the 42 fine but i'm not happy about it yeah it's not happy about it never see another jessica b. I've never seen another Jessica Biel movie. I'm not. It's her fault, too.

I'm trying to convince myself the town of Ely needs the money more than I do, but I won't return. There are other gateways to the Boundary Waters. So he will not return because of a $42 parking fine because he didn't bring enough underwear for his injured hip. So here's a two-star review uh quote this town tries to rely on tourism way too much and thus all the jobs are minimum wage the town has nothing to offer other than the boundary waters the taxes in this place in this place is absurd and they seem to be used in frivolous ways you know like putting out campaigns with fucking billboards to get the fucking Olympics for a small town.

That shit's expensive. So, I mean, small town coffers don't have that kind of money. What are they spending money on in this fucking place? Where are you going to put up the diplomats from foreign countries? It's all stupid. Best Western? All your fucking hoaxes. Jesus Christ.

The local government is just a bunch of good old boys stuck in the 1960s. The only people who do well in this town are resort owners and people lucky enough to have landed a mine job in Silver Bay or some other area mine. Lucky enough. Those are the, whoa, man, that's wild. Those are the people who do well. Fuck. That's well in this town is you get to be lowered into the ground. I understand it's a lot of places.

That's where the only good job is as far as you can support your family. But when you put the words lucky on someone who lowers themselves into the ground every day in a dangerous job, I don't know if lucky is the right term. They're happy to have a job, I'm sure. But they'd rather probably do something above ground. Sure. Or something like that. I don't know. I don't know, though. Or driving one of those giant-ass trucks down into a huge pit that they're mining. That's a tough job, too.

Fuck yeah, that is. They've got to carve those fucking roads into the side of those ledges. Anything mining is nuts. It's wild. No, thank you. It looks scary. Yeah. People in this town, population-wise, 3,425 people. Okay. So it's pretty small up there and down 14 since 1990 and

they want the olympics let's get the olympics they're obviously kidding but still shut up about it um more males than females and that's a lot of due to the mining and all the jobs here are either tourism related or they're like some crazy outdoor pulp Bunyan. Yeah, heavy lifting something or other. Yeah, mining, lifting, lumber, that sort of shit, agriculture, forestry, that sort of shit. Median age here, older too. It's almost 47 here, which is about 10 years older than the norm. All the demographics over 55 are high. All the demographics under the age of 55 are all low.

So it's a lot of old people. People stay here and die here. Not really a place where, you know, like you would have you're 32 and you got like a couple and they have a couple of kids and they go, let's move to Ely. Yeah, that's going to be that's not there's nothing on your own starting out now. Yeah. Going to land in Ely. It's just not going to happen unless you need a mining job and that's where you got one so uh married population is about normal it's almost 50 50 still but uh there are less single people with no children oh only five percent so if you're going out to the

bars looking for some fellow no children single people good luck with you a race of this town 97.6 percent white really that is pretty fucking white steaming white uh 0.6 percent black and uh they only they know that because even if the black people didn't want to be seen they're just in the snow yeah so they're like there we got one there and one here and that's yeah got them because everything is just bright white down, I assume. 0.4% Asian. Not a lot there either. It is 0.5% Hispanic. It's just a lot of white people. 47% of the people here are religious, because there is no God underground, everybody.

We know that. But then the lakes are beautiful there, though. Now, 47% religious. It's a good mix. There's some Catholics, some lutherans and methodists here and there you got a couple of presbyterians uh not many mormons 0.3 jewish so not gonna get a havenagila this week out of that but uh 0.2 islam too okay so i don't know funny to move to the middle of the snow uh, unemployment rate in this town is a little bit higher than normal.

It kind of ebbs and flows. Seasonal work, yeah. Seasonal work is a thing here. The median income is low here, though. The rest of the country, it's $57,652. Here it is $36,179. Much lower. Pretty low for household income.

Most of the households make under fifty thousand dollars a year a lot of the jobs are tourism related food services you know accommodations that's you work at a hotel yeah you sell fucking knickknacks right you know how that is you sell shit with like wood on it right because you live in the because it's the woods i picture this like the great outdoors yeah almost, right? Yeah. Kind of like just a lot of trees and a lake. Teenagers kissing on a veranda.

Yeah. Pool cues going into crotches. You know how it works. Cost of living in this town. She had some torque in those hips. She'd spun. She flung that thing when it crossed the bar. She threw a further Olympic javelin throw.

Oh, Jesus. She could have killed somebody with that thing. Yeah. Killed the bouncer. Something. Something. Something. And nobody even questioned that. No, nobody came over.

Is everything all right? Nope. Cost of living in this town is about 80. 100 is regular par. Housing is low, though. It's a 51. Yeah. And the median home cost here is $118,900.

Very affordable. So very affordable. They said the taxes were expensive, but I mean, your house costs nothing, so what do you want? You gotta pay for something. They gave you a home. Yeah, I mean, I get that you don't care about the Olympics, but come on.

Around half the houses here are worth under $100,000. So that's... They gotta be tiny, though, right? I mean, that's the thing. Some of them are big and on bigger property, and some of them are these tiny little kind of thing. Well, you know what? Let's find out.

All right. For you, the Ely, Minnesota real estate report. Your average two-bedroom rental here goes for about $770, which is about $500 below the national average. That's not bad at all. Pretty good. I found a three-bedroom, two-bath, 1,176 square foot. It's a tiny little house with a tiny little yard, and there's another tiny little house with a tiny little yard right next to it. They're little tiny houses in a row here, but they're nice.

They're clean, little nice houses. $103,000. My word. So, I mean, this is not bad. Very cool. Little house, especially if you're retired or something. That's perfect. Found a three-bedroom, two-bath, 1,771 square foot.

Now you're talking. It's not so nice as that one, though. It's a little run down. Okay. It's not quite as upkept. Just bigger. But it's bigger. $135,000.

A little work, that would be fine. Sure. Then I found this shit. Yeah. Three bedroom, three bath, 3,600 square feet. Wow. Beautiful. This is a picture.

This is, look at what it backs up to. Holy shit. That's your backyard. A big, giant, beautiful fucking lake. Is that the- Surrounded by beautiful trees. Is that the waters, James? giant beautiful fucking lake is that surrounded by beautiful trees is that the waters james that is the boundary i don't know if that's about it's a you're looking out at two islands for fuck's sake beautiful it's like on this dirt road and then you get you back up to the lake it is somebody just painted the trees it's beautiful they freshly painted trees

over an acre of land to all so no one can live right on top of you 950 000 bucks hell yeah so if you want to live you're on the lake though i mean that's expensive obviously but you're gonna what do you want that's how i want to retire right there's beautiful that'd be amazing place to retire that's how i want to quit all of you all of it damn it you're all going down things do. First of all, just outdoor shit and canoeing. This is an outdoor-y type of place. They have a winter festival, a winter celebration that's there to celebrate winter, where they have ice carvings and shit like that.

Oh, God. They love the freezing cold up there. You just shiver all day. Another thing they have, I just love the name of it, it's the Harvest Moon Festival, which reminds me of the Feast of the Hunter's Moon. Anything with a moon in it, I'm into that festival. I want to find out more about it. And that's in fall? That's in autumn.

And Ely also brings the Harvest Moon Festival, which takes place the first weekend after Labor Day. This is a three-day. It's still summer in Phoenix. They consider that. I get it. the rest of it. It's 12 degrees there. Yeah, yeah. Here, it's like,

well, we hope it gets under 110 in the next month and a half. Literally, that's what we're worried about. It's a three-day festival filled with arts, crafts, food, live entertainment, and activities to share with the family and friends of all ages.

Bring your old folks down here. Over 10,000 people join us. Holy shit. Wow. To enjoy this beautiful fall weather. That's three times the town size. Right. They're outsourcing it. Wow. Shop a delightful mix of original arts and crafts from over 125 local

and regional artists and craftsmen. Select from functional and decorative pottery. Functional. Functional I guess if you could use like a pot i guess like pottery hand-turned wooden bowls beadwork paintings leather and lots more this sounds like shit yeah this is hippie stuff oh it's like old people leather though like old men that right oh a guy that like will stamp your name in your belt yeah like a big beard and some

overalls making shit out of leather that's what i I feel like that this is, like a feed company hat on. It's like Jerome, but if these people were like, I'm just going to do this for my job. Exactly. Replace hippies for farmers, and that's what you got here, I think, is how this is. There will be pony rides in a petting zoo for children and family entertainment by the all-american stunt dog challenge they're bringing in stunt dogs dogs that do tricks the touring that's the that's the entertainment holy shit they're doing like stupid human tricks well yeah except with dogs stupid dog tricks so enjoy live music every day with timmy house h H-A-U-S, House, the singing Slovenes, the

singing Slovenes. Oh, my. Oh, my God. If you can handle how they talk, stick around for how they sing. This is rough. It's going to be the most aggressive form of the Fourth of July you've ever heard. That's fucking wild. You're sure to find that perfect piece of art for your home or that

unique gift for someone special. City ordinance does not allow dogs in the park. How the fuck are you going to have a stunt show? How are you going to have a dog stunt show if there's no goddamn dogs allowed in the park? You can bring them in, but I can't bring my fucking schnauzer. I can't bring my dog, but you can bring a whole team of dogs, I assume leashless, to jump around

and do things. They're going to backflip shit all over this place, but I can't bring my schnauzer. No, bullshit. Another one is the Dorothy Moulter Museum. That's what this looks like. Oh, what does she do? That's a museum. Oh, yeah. It's a cabin.

Barely. Kind of still? It's sort of like a, it looks like a large enclosed porch. It could use some Thom's a little bit. Yeah. But today, the Dorothy Moulter Cabin Museum are located there, known as the root beer lady. Oh, she lived for 56 years on Knife Lake in the Boundary Waters Canoe Area Wilderness. Gradually, she gained national prominence and extensive coverage in media books and documentaries over the years as people stopped here to drink her homemade root beer.

She makes root beer in that shithole. Gross. She first visited her home on Knife Lake in 1930, and blah, blah, blah, the Isle Pines Resort was typical of many Northwoods resort. I want to know more about root beer. That's what I want to know about. Do you drink root beer past, I don't know, age 12? I mean, with ice cream, root beer that's what i want to know about root beer past i don't know age 12 i mean with ice cream root beer float i suppose i like i need caffeine

sits around and drinks root beer we gotta stop at that lady's enclosed front porch because she makes root beer on her stove and i need to get some of that like that's a weird thing to stop and want right is it carbonated or is it just some flat shit otherwise it would just be like tar yeah there we go you could syrup i'm just gonna go pour you got a crack out in your driveway i'm gonna go fill that in quick and let it dry so this is spray some on your house lady it didn't there you go it doesn't look good yeah it's a smidge dry she sell it looks like coffee yeah like i don't oh it's it's really sweet gross so uh they have a museum now for her great perfect uh the crime rate in this town what we're interested in uh the property crime is about

one-third higher than the national average actually a lot of tourists and shit like that so yeah and a lot also too you get there's a lot of minors and you're gonna get some yeah some drunk nights and some public urination i I'm sure, and things like that. But violent crime, murder, rape, robbery, and assault, the Mount Rushmore of crime, is less than half the national average. Under half. Very safe. It's a safe place, but somebody might pee on something. You lose a thing or two.

Tourists. You figure parking tickets outside the laundromat, that's all going to factor in here. Figure that parking tickets outside the laundromat, that's all going to factor in here. That said, this safe, damn near Canadian town up here, let's talk about a murder. Great. Let's do it. Okay. March 14th, 1975.

Let's go back to then. 1975 in Ely, Minnesota. Oh, boy. Oh, baby. This uh some wild times like i can't imagine like i feel like the 70s wouldn't have really infiltrated here very much i don't picture a lot of saturday night fever looking motherfuckers walking around ely on march in march of 75 disco era yeah just come out of the mine and put your platforms on i don't see it happening butterfly collar and your bell bottoms.

Am I crazy? Get your chest hair out. I figure this is still a very flannel, car-hardy kind of place. Probably. Maybe some thinner dickies if you're not so inclined. Polyester doesn't seem warm. No. That's the thing.

So I don't think you could really. It probably never spread much to Minnesota. A lot of lined. Whatever the product is it the word lined is in it fur lined yeah polyester duck lined bell-bottom disco pants that would be amazing that would be something they probably had that they roll up the sleeves and it's got the plaid underneath. Furry plaid. They dance together. What's up? I don't picture that. Lined comes in everything that they wear.

Yes. I don't imagine. I feel like the 70s, they'd just be watching the rest of the 70s going, Jesus, the world's going crazy. You know? The hell's wrong with those people out there. They're wearing such little amounts of clothing. That's then. They're going to freeze to death. They're going to freeze uh one of them's getting frostbite well that happens

anyway i have to pay you go and get frostbite every once in a while when you live up here and now let's talk about this date march 14th 1975 it's still very very very cold up there by the way in march and early march March. That's still winter there. There's a car in a parking lot. It's a gold Plymouth Duster. Yeah. It's a Duster, baby. What year is it?

I don't know on the year. It's like a late 60s, early 70s, beat up Duster. It's a Duster. And we talked about my friend had the Duster and he would- I lived in one. He would bash it into garbage cans because it was such a pile of shit and it had a hole in the back floor that people would pee out of. So there was that. My mom's was about 13 years old, and the duct work for the heater was falling out of the bottom of the dash.

And it's an elephant dick tube that looks like an accordion, and it had holes all in it so the vents whenever you turn the air or the heat on you didn't come out of there it came out it's kind of leaked out everywhere out of the broken vents the tubing so you had to snuggle into the floorboard and rub your hands together against the tubing that's a nice one that's a nice one that's my house his had the the liner all fell in the roof and the roof that all sticks together so we just used to like set it on fire from time to time so like a blue flame would spread across the the car that's across the phone yeah yeah yeah set your car on

fire right after i bashed it into this mailbox and why don't you piss out of the hole in the back and you're gonna snuggle up to the heater on the floor. What a pile of shit these cars were. Garbage cars. And not a one of them was painted a decent color. Gold. Gold, neon fucking blue. My mom's was neon yellow or green. I want to say my buddy's was brown, I think, or something.

It was fucking rusty and primer, so I don't think it mattered at that point. It's a duster. I understand that anybody who's paid attention to the media would have to come to the conclusion that I killed my wife. Hi, my name is Zach Stewart-Pontier. I'm one of the filmmakers behind The Jinx, and I'm excited to bring you the official Jinx podcast. We'll be revisiting all six episodes of part one and watching along with part two as it airs on max starting april 21st bye-bye

the official jinx podcast listen on max or wherever you get your podcasts it's all a light-hearted nightmare on our podcast morbid we're your hosts i'm alina urquhart and i'm ash kelly and our show is part true crime part spooky and part comedy the stories we cover are well researched he claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch of humor. I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother****er lied.

Like a liar. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal, or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes, you should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Welcome to the small town of Chinook, where faith runs deep and secrets run deeper.

In this new thriller, available exclusively on Wondery Plus, religion and crime collide when a gruesome murder rocks the isolated Montana community. Everyone is quick to point their fingers at a drug-addicted teenager, but local deputy Ruth Vogel isn't convinced. She suspects connections to a powerful religious group. Enter federal agent V.B. Loro, who has been investigating a local church for possible criminal activity. The pair form an unlikely partnership to catch the killer, unearthing secrets that leave Ruth torn between her duty to the law, her religious convictions, and her very own family. But something more sinister than murder is afoot, and someone is watching Ruth. With an all-star cast led by Emmy nominee Sanaa Lathan and Star Wars Kelly Marie Tran,

Chinook is available exclusively and ad-free on Wondery+. Join Wery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Piece of shit. So this car was parked in the co-op store parking lot. Yeah. I assume that's just like a regular kind of a... The water company? No, the co-op. It's like the general store kind of deal here.

This is in Ely, Minnesota, right there. It's parked there in the morning. here this is in ely minnesota uh right there it's parked there in the morning um it apparently had been in this spot since uh march 9th since it broke down on march 9th it's yeah right since it died there and people are snuggled up around the here it died as on march 9th 1975 is since about 10 or 10 30 in the morning is the first time it was seen there and it's been there ever since yeah so five days sitting out there is just you know a couple days you never somebody got dropped off or whatever but five days you're like all right why is when the fuck is this car gonna gonna go away uh all the car's doors are locked so it's not like you can get in and somebody left it look around um so

eventually the police are called and when they get there to just see what the fuck's going on, the cops, first thing they notice before they even get inside the car is they notice something beneath the trunk of the car. And they don't. They're like, oh, it looks like it's dripping something, but not in a place where oil would be. It's instead a puddle of frozen blood. Wow. Underneath the trunk of the car area that they find on the ground. So they're like, oh, boy, we should probably get inside this car. Have a look-see, yeah.

Yeah. Otherwise, if you just see the car, the doors are locked, you go, I don't know, do you want it towed or not? You ask the owner if you want it towed, and if they do, then they'll tow it. Otherwise, I don't know what you want from me. It's bleeding, so we should take it. If it's bleeding, we're going to take a look inside and make sure and see what the hell's going on here. Why is this guy? There's a duster bleeding in the parking lot.

We got questions for this car. We got to ask this car a couple questions. Either we have another problem or this car's in terrible shape and someone's done something very bad to it. Either way. Or it's a go bot that needs a fixin'. Are you a transformer? What can I do to make you turn into a robot are you bumblebee can i help you do you need a paint job are you fuck what was that other one i can't remember the one i was thinking of an old actual

transformer it was gold it's got to be bumblebee i'm sure no no there was another one that was like it wasn't a it wasn't bumblebee it was another one that was like, it wasn't Bumblebee. It was another guy. It was a car. It was like kind of a shittier, lower level of Transformer. So all the doors are locked. They notice the blood dripping. So they go in the car and nothing is in the car. They pop the trunk.

Different story there. They find a young man in the trunk. Not alive, obviously. That would be a strange place to camp for five days in the freezing trunk. Whether there's blood dripping out of you. It's a guy named Jeffrey getters, uh, G O E D D E R Z getters is how it's pronounced.

Uh, he's 19 years old, Jeff. And he is, uh, he is, uh, very much deceased in the trunk of this car.

There is almost no blood left in his body. It's all in the trunk. It's all in the trunk and on the ground and somewhere else, too. That's the other thing. It's not all in the trunk. It's not all on the ground. All the blood that he should have had that he no longer does. So there must be blood somewhere else.

So, yeah, they find him there. He, like I said, in bad shape. We'll get to the autopsy in a moment. His wallet is not missing. He's still got his wallet in his back pocket, which is strange. And they do a little research here by going into the glove compartment and finding the registration and find out this is his car. So he is stuffed into the trunk of his own car with no blood left in his body. Strange.

Not the thing you'd expect to find in the co-op parking lot here. So they do an autopsy, obviously. The autopsy reveals that the cause of death is blood loss from multiple wounds. There's a wound two and three quarter inches long on each side of his head. Oh. Think about that. Which fractured the skull and bruised the brain wow that's like a car eat him two and three quarters like on each side yeah

like um you know like a hatchet oh no that length of a thing both sides of the head a massive gaping wound which went from the back of the neck around to the right side, cut the muscles of the neck down to the backbone, cut the mastoid bone and the skull, and penetrated the brain. My word. Think about that. What a violent, how the force you would have to have. That's like trying to decapitate somebody. That's like a failed guillotining it's a raged

rage-filled murder that seems like somebody with a you know like a broadsword coming at you like focused on the head and neck area it's wild uh the police or the pathologists believe the wounds were caused by a sharp weapon with considerable force no shit great call yeah good call you're a doctor right that's sweet we got that sweet jesus there were also large cuts on the left side of the face and neck think pretty soon they're gonna say it's not a suicide they're gonna classify it as a homicide really blow our minds here with their expertise there are large cuts on the left side of the face and neck one of which broke the jawbone and two teeth with a cut. Ouch.

That's a wow. The force of these of these blade attacks here. That's wow. In the opinion of the pathologist, the wounds were probably caused by a double edged knife applied with great force. Applied with great force. In addition, various lacerations, bruises, cuts were found, which, according to the pathologist, were incurred while Getters was trying to defend himself from the attack. And this is there's a lot here. The pathologist calls this a defensive wound.

Getters left thumb was missing. Oh, no. Just gone. They never found this thumb. It's not in the trunk with him he wasn't like in his pocket or something or you know stuffed in his shirt pocket it was taken just not around so thumb is missing and sliced off like it was a defensive wound came off um if somebody with like a sword was attacking you you would maybe lose your thumb like that hair stuck to the hand indicated that getters probably had his hand to his head trying to ward off the blows because his hand was like

stuck to his head with blood and holy fuck man yeah when they found him too he was frozen solid really he was fucking frozen it was say they had to thaw him out like frankie carbone and good fellas to give him a goddamn autopsy. March in Minnesota. Yeah, for five days in a trunk, frozen solid. Also, he said Getters had been alive when he was placed in the trunk. That's fucked up. That's fucked up.

So not only did all of these horrible things happen, he had survived this vicious attack and then was stuffed into a trunk and left there to bleed out and die and freeze to death. I mean, that's that's bad, man. They get worse. Yeah. Based on the stomach contents, the pathologist testified that getters could have died any time between. And this guy has this is there. I really find it hard to if a pathologist said this exact amount of thing between the blood loss and the freezing, I would say you're full of shit.

And you guess that because pathologists will tell you like it's a time of death is unless the conditions are 68 degrees and this and that, then we can tell exactly if you add add in warm spot for a while, then frozen, then we have no fucking idea. Throw in some rain. Throw in some rain outside, decomposition. Is it hot? Did it go faster? They go by bug growth. You can tell a certain amount by that, but what if they were frozen first and now they're not? Who knows?

So to say they died between 4 a.m. and 10 a.m. on March 9th, to put it within six hours. Specific. For days before. And then he says there's an 85% probability that he died before 8 a.m. on that day. So between 4 and 10, but most likely between 4 and 8. If my calculations are off, they may have been between eight and ten. But I think. Or the next day, because he's frozen goddamn solid.

So when someone's frozen solid, you can't. How is a pathologist in a week's time giving a better window of time of death as the cable company when they arrive? Of anybody when they fucking are unbelievable this is i'm sorry based on the stomach contents i get it that they go by the digestion and the thing but he's frozen solid man yeah there's no way you're putting it that's i mean the ice man used to freeze people solid on purpose because like six months because it would mess up the time of death so you don't know when i don't know whatever uh you can't there's no there's no insect growth there's no like maggots so you can't tell by that

there's no anything here the pathologist concluded that two weapons were probably used here okay a double-edged knife and an instrument with a broad flat blade that can make yeah two and three quarter inch lacerations that can penetrate your skull like a mace like a yeah or like a like a hatchet like an axe like like that sort of thing a big sword something of that nature so who is this young man jeff getters let's find out who he is and where he's from jeffrey gulford getters is his name is it g with jeffrey with a g jeffrey with a j okay which is strange because he's got double G past that. Didn't want to be triple G.

I guess his parents, they were kind to him. Yeah. He's born March 8th, 1956. He's got a little brother, Jay, and an older sister, Rose. Rose is the reason why he's in this area. Rose had moved to the Ely area with her husband. And, you know, Jeffrey's 19. And where he was, there wasn't a lot going on.

So he heard there was jobs in the mines up there. So he said, I'll go hang out up there and I'll stay with my sister and hang out. So that's what he does. He moves up. Slavic chicks and shit like that. Yeah, there's all sorts of Swedish chicks they pull out of mines. You know how it works. And he's also got at least two older brothers that I can figure out here.

His dad, Stan, is a miner. Stan the miner. And his mom, Katie, is a homemaker. Of course. Katie and Stan, a homemaker and a miner. Salt of the earth, babe. Sounds like he came back from World War II, got a job in a mine, and started plowing away and making as many kids as he could. That's what it sounds like.

Jeff and Jay were close. Jay's his younger brother by a few years, but they were close. They hunted and fished in the woods and did all that kind of shit together. They hung out, rode snowmobiles, and kind of had that kind of life. So rad. Yeah, that sounds like a fun life, fun teenage life. Hunting and fishing and snowmobiling and motorcycles and shit and dirt bikes. That's cool.

This is, I don't know how this came about. This is incongruous, I think. They hunted and fished together in the woods near their house, rode snowmobiles and motorcycles. They also modeled shorts and fashion shows on the stage at the local theater. Oh, that's weird. Why? Is it like a school thing? Like an in-betweener

some sort of charity event school fashion trying to get the girls accentuate the balls that's so weird shorts it's 1973 in minnesota what are you putting shorts on and those are short shorts that's what i mean those are those aren't like 73 shorts oh boy your ball's gonna come out like in the in-betweeners again it's a lot of breeze on the nuts that's a lot of nut breeze i gotta say so anyway they modeled shorts they spent their summers together up in uh this area visiting their sister rose they come up there for the summer yeah do all this shit outdoors in the woods and then jeff graduated from high school and said fuck yeah i'm moving to ely so i can become a a taco night miner taco taco night it's spelled t-a-c-o-n-i-t-e taco night he's mining taco night that sounds delicious yeah

i want to do everybody is there a job out there i can have in a taco night mine because that sounds wonderful what does taco night go on it's a it's a supreme vein there's tomatoes in here this is great oh there's sour cream i went too deep there's sour cream everywhere i hit the sour cream vein and now it's over oh jesus christ watch out here we go taco night what does it go on it's pouring out what what does that rock go it's got to be a rock right tonight it's i guess it's's they're pulling it from the ground. They're mining it. So I don't know, but it's delicious.

I've never heard of taco night, but it sounds amazing. I really just say it sounds like you come up every day going, man, how was work today? Delicious. It smelled amazing. It was so good. I'm telling you, it was great. I had so many tacos. I'm telling you, it was great.

I had so many tacos. So on his 19th birthday, which was March 8th, 1975, Jeffrey was going to go out and party and do some stuff. Rose and her husband gave him a birthday present. All right. They gave him a bottle of banana liqueur. What? Gross. 99 bananas.

Banana liqueur, like banana schnapps or something that's disgusting that's disgusting that's larry sanders with hank bottom of the rung booze what did hank do hank was on the couch crying and he was drinking it was the only thing in his office he's drinking banana liqueur and his assistant comes in and he's like oh my god hank what are you doing what are you drinking and he goes it's it's banana liqueur he goes my breath smells like a monkey's asshole crying he starts sobbing my breath smells like a monkey's asshole i love jeffrey tambor anyway he's fantastic so at the end of the night his breath smelled like a monkey's asshole that's that we know for that is confirmed that's a confirmed fact happy birthday happy birthday here you go banana liqueur gross why would someone drink that that's his drink of choice it's because he's 19 he's not 21 he doesn't know any better no but 19 that's drinking age was

18 back then in the 70s yeah fuck yeah Yeah, fuck yeah. Oh, Jesus. Yeah, this was especially They could have given him whiskey and they gave him that? They gave him banana liqueur. God damn it. Think about that. There you go, sonny boy. He works in the mines. He's a drinker. You're old enough to work in the mines, you drink, but not

banana liqueur. Don't drink that down with the fellas that work in the mines. I was gonna say, if you brought that around your minor friends, I feel like in the 70s, I feel like they'd go, well, la-di-da, banana liqueur. They're going to pants you and drag you assless through the fucking snow. Let me ask you a question, Jeff. What part of San Francisco you buy that bottle of banana liqueur in?

Did it come with a big purple dildo or what? Came in a box, you get banana liqueur and did it come with a big purple dildo or what came in a box you get banana liqueur and a dildo did you get that from your boyfriend or did you buy it for him which one right who'd you he give it to you or do you give it to him which one is it you know in the 70s these miners would not oh boy very progressive at all again imagine and't imagine. And it's disgusting. It's not good stuff. Banana liqueur. Any kind of liqueur is terrible. A banana, extra gross.

What does that mean? Why is it liqueur instead of liquor? Does that just mean it's more sugar than it's supposed to be? Probably. It also means it's for women. Well, back then, was that what it was? Maybe. It's a mixer of some sort?

A mixer, or was it for a specific thing? I don't know. Did you have it after a meal? You wanted it to taste like bananas for the rest of the night? I don't know what your- 99 Bananas is one of the worst things ever made. I've never had that. What is that?

It's that. It's banana liqueur. Oh, it's a banana liqueur? I'll buy you a little shot of it. I have not. The next time I come over. I'll smell it. Because it's like 12 cents.

They almost give it away. I'm sure. How'd you buy a pepsi that comes with a nine and a banana comes with that i ain't a purple dildo there you go you want one of those spinny yeah it's a spinny one on the end there you're gonna take some double a's and the gay fella in the back wants to give you his number he said yeah he he said you're gonna like him he he him. He likes that stuff, too. Feller is how they'd name him. The gay Feller. He says he'll drink it with you. He said, come on back here and bring your liqueur.

And also that purple dildo. He will put that shot in his mouth and then spit it back into yours. Oh, it's going to be sexy. That's what I feel like these guys would be like. Absolutely. They would make fun of his liqueur, but apparently he didn't care and he drank it that night man 19th birthday woo banana liqueur glug glug glug you're gonna wake up and hate yourself imagine the banana liqueur hangover what that's like no imagine the taste in your mouth from banana liqueur vomit. Think about that. No. The taste.

So sweet. Banana vomit. So sweet. I know I threw up, but I, God, I taste like. I taste like a monkey's asshole. Oh, that's the nastiest. That would be the worst. I can't tell.

I was going to say, I don't know if it would be better to have like a fruity taste to your vomit, but I don't think so. I don't think you want it. No no because the worst thing that ever happened to me one time is i threw up after i ate lucky charms oh no i did i forgot it was like a couple hours earlier and i threw up and i thought i was dying because i had like this rainbow colored throttle oh my god what the fuck is wrong with me and then i went oh i ate lucky charms right okay it really scared me though i thought i was a thought i had a real problem it's like it's every color of the rainbow oh my god there's pink hearts yellow moons orange stars and green clovers help me i used to do shots of soco and lime and that's the worst thing you'll ever throw up oh it's it's bernie on the way

everywhere it tastes like stomach acid going down yeah Yeah, that's... And it gets worse when it comes back. It tastes like bile. It's so bad. It's not good. It's a very terrible memory. I enjoyed it. Why? It's wrong.

I don't know. What's wrong with you? James, you... No wonder why you used to get thrown out of places all the time. You're drinking fucking Southern Comfort and Lime with a psychopath. What is wrong with you, Jimmymy you are that is i'm telling you i would love to go back and beat the shit out of 21 year old me at least it sounds like the latest and maybe 23 23 and younger could have used a good ass whipping from like future me

anybody else i wouldn't have given a fuck future you you need to come back and be like yeah i've come from the future i promise you don't do this don't do this but if you do it then everything will work out fine but you'll be miserable now yeah i mean you might need this for then so never mind keep doing it that's gonna taste bad in a few hours so you have the opposite approach my approach is always if i could go back i'd go do less yeah be even more it doesn't matter nothing you're doing here is going to accomplish you anything you will do nothing that matters to yourself or your anything until you're like in your late 30s so fuck off all you want now that's what i would have told myself stop trying stop it survive for now yeah

get to your 30s and then you'll start doing better but until then it's gonna be a mess right gonna be you're gonna hate everything enjoy and don't marry her don't marry her and try to do more drugs because it's gonna help you your sanity trust me so uh yeah they banana liqueur pulled out of the taco night mine there you go um she said that he drank it that night now let's introduce you to somebody else yeah roy eric walberg like like walberg mark walberg donnie walberg same spelling roy roy that's the next words out of my mouth so roy roy eric walberg that's amazing by the way late recently goldie hawn got a dog and named it roy so evidently fucking amazing it's her favorite line too is it really it has to be fucking hilarious there's no way that it's not it's the greatest deliver i just that's one of those things

where you like as a fan you know whatever you would if you ever you would never bring that up to somebody because they go i don't even remember that line. Right. But it's the funniest line in that movie. Evidently, it's got to be her favorite thing she's ever said. The look on her face is so like, oh, yeah. She sizes them up and everything. Roy.

Obviously, it's Roy. I don't know, though, and I don't care. At the same time. So anyway, Roy. Roy's mom's name. Oh, my God. This is bad. His name, Roy Eric Wahlberg.

That sounds fine. His mom's name, Myrtle Kangas. Hell, yeah. Myrtle Kangas. Jesus. Old Myrtle here. Myrtle, Roy's a young child compared to his other siblings. Roy is a young child compared to his other siblings.

He's got two older sisters, Judy and Joan, who were 12 and 9 when he was born. He's an oops. He's the baby, yeah. And obviously by the time he's 10 years old, they'll both be out of the house. So it's one of those. One woman here says that this is Roy's mother's girlfriend or girlfriend's mother. Mother's girlfriend. Okay.

Girlfriend's mother. Roy's girlfriend's mother. Roy's girlfriend's brother. Roy is 23 at this time. He's a few years older than Jeff here. She says, quote, his sisters told Roxanne, which is Roy's girlfriend at the time, that when Roy was born, it was like they didn't exist anymore. Yeah. So the mother got a boy.

She had two girls. And she had this boy, and she just doted on him and gave all her attention to him and kind of ignored the daughters, at least according from their point of view. They said that he would, they would, mother would lavish attention on him so much. And Roy Sr., because he's a junior this guy which we know from crime and sports could be a problem terrible roy senior kept his hands out of it he didn't even bother trying to fight the whole thing because he was like myrtle wouldn't let roy have any discipline you leave that boy alone and he was like fine he's yours i don't

fucking care got my name that's all i give a shit about that's it um he said uh and later roy will say quote poach deer spear walleyes and shoot deer out of season that's all my dad taught me okay shoot deer out of season out of season yeah illegal game oh illegal game yeah absolutely i guess they live in the woods so he's like i guess that's kind of a we'll knock on his dad trying to say his dad was kind of uh yeah not up and up completely here um now his girlfriend's mother will say he had a problem at home his dad never did nothing to reprimand him or anything his dad never did didn't never did do nothing to reprimand him or nothing i'll tell you what or nothing or nothing oh boy one time roxanne went out to his house with him. That's his girlfriend.

I don't know what he had done, but his mother kept a hollering to his father, get the belt, get the belt. Oh, boy. That's what she said. Oh, no. Kept a hollering. That's what she says. Kept hollering to the father, get the belt, get the belt.

Okay. But the father didn't budge. He didn't do nothing. She went and she got the belt and she started hitting him in front of Roxanne, who was standing by the door. Well, anyway, then I suppose he was very embarrassed. So he got up and he went into the bedroom and he came out with a gun and he calmly told his mother he was going to kill her.

He did this in front of his girlfriend. Yeah. Okay. Well, to kill her he did this in front of his girlfriend yeah okay well first he got his ass kicked in front of his girlfriend uh yeah let's just go over this scenario very quickly here again just just to just to back it up without a character voice or anything like that his mom was mad at him for something told his dad to get the belt his dad didn't do it. So his mom got a belt, started hitting him. This is while he's a teenager. He's got a girlfriend and all that, 20 years old or something.

He goes in his room to get a gun to tell his mother, I'm going to kill you. While dad still. While dad still hasn't moved. And his girlfriend is standing in the doorway like, what kind of white trash insanity have i gotten myself attached to you get back to hee haw imagine you being a girl a young girl and you go to your boyfriend's house and this is what's going on in front of you holy shit i'd be running across the yard so um yeah this is what happened so this woman says his mother backed down and they left roxanne was just flabbergasted. When she come home, she was very shook up. When she come home, by the way, not came home.

When she come home, she was very shook up. No shit. I would be too. Your boyfriend just threatened to kill his mom in front of you. After she beat him with a belt. Right. What is happening in this fucking town? Like, what's going on?

is happening in this fucking town like what's going on roy's mother uh would call the girlfriend's the girlfriend's uh house there repeatedly if her son was late getting home on a work night she would just call over there is he there is he there is he there over and over she appeared uh behind their house once taunting him outside the car where he was parked with roxanne like talking shit to him why would she do that because she's apparently a fucking nut job apparently the mother is myrtle kangas is out there by all accounts i don't know if it's a fact but it definitely doesn't sound normal by what these people are saying so they said he took refuge in their house until his mother started calling again and wouldn't stop at two or three in the morning. Roy went home, finally gave up and said, she's not going to quit. I just got to give up and go home.

She smoked him out. She smoked him out. Yeah, she he tried to run away and she didn't take. She just called the house all night the girlfriend's house until it was like fine i'll leave you're bothering everybody not yep um the uh girlfriend's mother said quote i told my husband as long as she's alive roy will never be better the uh the only thing that that roy would ever say to about the mother to the girlfriend's mother was quote she's a wonderful person she just wasn't a very good mother that's what he would say so he he could have could have had

a better home life i would say than this but i mean i've heard worse yeah on this show sure we've heard way worse i mean this but not much i mean apart from the he's not getting beat as bad there's not as much physical it's just kind of a torment. Weird redneck environment with a mother who has mental issues and obviously has some sort of strange, not even codependency, but some kind of weird, like a bizarre fixation, a bizarre fixation on the. It's a good way to put it. Very, very strange here. So now Roy's friends thought the opposite. They loved his mom.

She's hilarious. They did. They said Roy's mom was always behind him. Guy named Phil Potterjoy, who was best friends with Roy, along with a guy named Red Nelson. Yeah. Red, Phil, Roy. We're all going, Roy. Bunch of single syllable names.

That's it. Well, Red's real name is Daniel, but they don't call him Dan because there's already a Dan. Yeah. And, you know, his hair red, so we can call him Red. And Danny's a little boy's name. It's a little boy's name. You can call him Danny.

No. Dan sounds like, I don't know, like you wear in like a tie places. Well, thank you. So, you know. Red. We're going red. Perfect. Because your hair's red.

Yeah. And all this flannel. So is your neck. Yeah, so is all your flannel. Your hair, your neck, and your flannel all match. So I figured I'd just call you that. So I guess he said, this Phil Potterjoy, he said that at the time everybody envied Roy.

They said everybody envied roy for his looks yeah said he was a handsome guy he was charming yeah he had a cool car they said he had a the family's cabin was on the lake like they had like he had all these advantages for this area like where they're like yeah fucking all he was like a cool dude with a cool car a cool place to hang out minnesota rock star that's it they said his mother was behind him always you know they didn't realize that it was a more obsessive relationship than they realized they just realized it as like oh wow mother does stuff for him look at that so they said wow uh they said quote uh a lot of things i did with him that have affected me to this day as one of his friends said uh this is the phil potter joy mainly he said bad

treatment of women that they used to do together that was roy was definitely the the instigator of it how so he said well this guy says quote my wife says i don't have any respect for women and i guess i don't my wife says that that's my wife says i don't and i guess i don't he says that's how he starts this little description my wife my wife says i don't have respect for the women and i don't she would know she's right and she's right she know my wife so um yeah and i i guess i don't basically i'm a pretty good guy except for the fact that i don't have any i have consecutive sentences i don't. Basically, I'm a pretty good guy, except for the fact that I don't have any consecutive sentences. I don't have it.

My wife says I don't respect her and I don't. I'm a pretty good guy, though. Well, except for the fact that you don't respect. I'm a great guy. If you're a guy. Yeah, that's what that's. Yeah, I guess that's what I think. That's what it is.

Yeah. You know, if you're it's that kind of thing. You're a dude. He's a good dude. He does that with women. Well As long as you're a dude. He's a good dude. You're getting along great. He does that with women. Well, I don't know about that. He's a good dude.

He's nice to me. It's one of those things. Awful. So basically, I'm a pretty good guy, but there's deep down things that we did with women. What? Deep down? Oh, God. The next line.

He's so gross. This isn't me. Yeah. Okay. The next line. He's so gross. This isn't me. Yeah.

Okay. Quote, serial sex with a fat gal in town in the back of Wahlberg's van was one of them. Serial. What is that? Serial. Not like with a bowl of cereal. Like they would. One after the other. They would, I think, run a train on a, quote, fat gal in town in the back of the van whenever they felt like what's fat

in minnesota it's they're in good shape in minnesota actually it's one of the healthiest states in the country yeah i was gonna say i don't know i was trying to think like in minnesota i don't know she's probably who cares yeah she's probably a big girl i'm sure there's heavy girls i'm sure she's a heavy girl it doesn't matter either way you don't do that and you don't be mean to them right that's my point that's the point you're saying something like that about somebody that's willing to fuck you and your friend he's almost saying he feels bad but not that's what i mean this is a weird statement though i guess i don't basically i'm a pretty good guy but there's some things deep down we did with women serial sex with a fat girl fat gal in town in the back of Wahlberg's van.

I saw him get rough with Roxanne a couple of times. That's his girlfriend whose mother, whatever, the girlfriend who witnessed the abuse there. He said that Wahlberg wanted to keep it quiet. He said, quote, he had an image. Nothing seemed to bother him. Nothing seemed to bother him was his image and he was there to help people he wanted people to think that so he's got a definite like he wants to be a certain you

know have this people think of him as like oh he's a nice guy and he's handsome and everybody likes him he wants to be this perfect guy but he's also treats women like shit and you know hits his girlfriend and you know that's not cool so uh a lot of people are like that they said uh whatever you know hatred this guy said he treated women like shit but women were all over him all the time like he couldn't they couldn't get enough of him exactly he says quote no one had his charisma and no one since this guy has never seen his charisma before or since never he's a pussy babe ruth that's what he's just a flock to him well the way he put it was a pussy moses actually did he really said quote people followed him like moses or something he's he's so he likes to part

the knees that's what he is he really he parts the vagina the vaginal c he parts the lips is what he is. He really is. He parts the vagina, the vaginal C. He parts the lips is what he does, and then he enters. Pussy. That's what he is. I was going with Babe Ruth like calling a shot, but I nailed it. He got exactly where he was going with it. You know dirtbags. One thing Jimmy knows, it's white trash. I really know the worst of society.

Growing up in Phoenix really gives you an insight onto white trash i really know the worst of society growing up in phoenix really gives you an insight onto white trash like nothing else this is this place is like it's where they go it's a magnet for white trash it really is it's like the like the it's like it's like oakland in the 60s that's what it is it's like we phoenix now is oakland in the 60s it's where the canadian geese go yes if if white trash were canadian geese white trash flocks out for the winter collect in the last bastion of what they deem as their quote-unquote freedom it's true fuck you leave stop it stop bringing your hillbillory from around the country i know too much about you you goddamn hillbilly sight unseen people followed him like he was Moses. Pussy Moses.

Pussy Moses. I will spread the knees. I will spread. I wish I could name this episode Pussy Moses, but I don't think I can. Can you call it Spreading the Seven Knees? Probably not. So he said in high school, though, Roy was a loner who played the French horn. So you're not getting a lot of women playing the French horn in high school.

It's very, very few. He called them, quote, clean cut, straight laced. All the little old ladies liked him. So he's that kind of. He was a nice boy. He's polite, nice. I got my French horn under my arm. But then after that, they said that he, well this is the the crux of it they

said this is funny a darker version of him came back after a year at college yep a darker version who the ladies all love he went to concordia college in moorhead minnesota for a year yeah and uh came back with a totally new vibe. Totally new. Backpack full of banana liqueur. Well, he said, no, this guy, he was doing drugs now. Oh, shit. He got into drugs. And, of course, he's dabbling in Satanism a little.

Back then, in the 70s, it seemed like if you told a certain type of girl that you knew a little Satanism,anism that made her like oh he's dark and like you know blah blah blah like that seemed like a thing back then that was like cool he's got a snake yeah oh yeah he's so interesting oh man i bet he keeps snakes in his van i bet his whole i bet his van has the thickest shag carpeting on the walls in the back oh baby i can't wait to get in the back of that van it's all a light lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid. We're your hosts. I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly.

And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well-researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch of humor. I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing.

This mother****er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal, or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes.

You should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. In May of 1980, near Anaheim, California, Dorothy Jane Scott noticed her friend had an inflamed red wound on his arm and seemed unwell. She insisted on driving him to the local hospital to get treatment. While he waited for his prescription, Dorothy went to grab her car to pick him up at the exit, but would never be seen alive again. Leaving us to wonder, decades later, what really happened to Dorothy Jane Scott? From Wondery, Generation Y is a podcast that covers notable true crime cases like this one and many more.

Every week, hosts Aaron and Justin sit down to discuss a new case, covering every angle and theory, walking through the forensic evidence, and interviewing those close to the case to try to discover what happened. And with over 450 episodes, there's a case for every true crime listener. Follow the Generation Y podcast on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to Generation Y ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus. So yeah, that's what was going on here. He comes back a different guy. You know, one year in Moorhead, Minnesota. It's all it took. back a different guy you know one year and more had minnesota it's all it took it's all it took came back no longer a french horn playing nerd now he's he's a dark he's like he's like some sort of like johnny depp character like back when he was yeah not you know after gilbert great back

when he was still considered attractive to the world back then that's what he comes back as so he uh he said that he kind of told everybody about it they went on a smelting trip to lake superior oh i guess to get smelts yeah little fish is that it or is it are they going are they smelting shit down yeah like melt shit down i only think that it would probably be to get smelt because it's to the lake yeah unless they've got some factory on the water pot on lake superior i don't know maybe so either way it's awful we're gonna smelt some things down on the lake now uh so they go on a smelting trip to lake superior uh this potter joy guy said he said when he and roy stopped in a local bar he said only uh earlier that day he found out roy was carrying a pistol as well yeah and he said that night the dance floor was packed and uh you know it was loud

everybody's dancing they're in a fucking in a local bar with people having fun and dancing during this roy's dancing too he pulls his gun Why? Points it above his head and starts firing shots into the ceiling while everybody's dancing. What the fuck, Roy? What the fuck are you doing? We're trying to have fun. This isn't a... What are you doing? No.

Yeah. So this Potterjoy says, quote, he's in there going bang, bang, bang. People lived up there and he's shooting through the floor. What the fuck? There's an apartment. There's an apartment. Oh, my God. Above the place.

He's not shooting it outside or into the, you know, whatever. He's shooting it through somebody's floor. Oh, my God. Imagine that. Popping that thing to the crib. It's bad enough that you live above a bar where everybody's singing and dancing and screaming and everything. But now they're shooting guns through the floor. I'm moving.

Wow. So he says, quote, he was a crazy guy, a fun loving, crazy guy. So much fun. Just so much fun. My God. He said that he called Wahlberg had called himself a hope to die druggie by this point. So this is a guy who really looks for identity. Yeah.

He's, you know, all the old ladies like him. He's playing the French horn. He's getting good grades. Goes to college for one year. Now he's got to rebel. Comes back saying he knows about Satan, carrying a pistol, firing shots on the dance floor. He's a hope. I'm just a I'm a hopeless druggy.

Hope to die druggy. That's how hard I am. In a year? Yeah. In a year? Took him that long? hard i am in a year yeah in a year took him that long you don't even have a tolerance in a year no like in a year if somebody somebody could smoke weed every day for it i'm just saying weed not or even a drug oh yeah he's probably in something harder than that oh definitely i know for a fact but i mean he gets you could smoke weed just the most entry-level shit here yeah every day for a year okay and you have if you hadn't

smoked it before you couldn't hang out with me for an hour still every day for a year i would fucking have you asleep in an hour not enough time to build a thing for you yeah you know that for a fact that's just the way it is yeah so who said it somebody said it fairly your your brother may have uh i i can't believe he smokes as much. I can't do this. I cannot do this. This is all day for him. Well, at the time, before a show, especially before a show, I got to.

No, take it back. My cousin, Shannon, said it. Oh, yeah, yeah. Shannon said it. Before the show. And she smokes a shitload of weed. Yeah, yeah, before the show. And she smoked with you.

And she goes, I don't know why he's still smoking. I don't know why. He pulled out another joint. He goes, does he not think everybody's high now? Nope. I don't know. Not enough. I'm like, he's not yet.

No, well, no, I'm fine. I'm just, it's a live show, and I need to get in the groove. James, this was after. Oh, after. Everything was done. Oh, good. No, that was Denver, though. That was the night that I needed it that night. Oh, yeah was Denver, though. That was the night that I needed it that night.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. That was a rocky one. That was technically a bad time. Thanks so much. That was bad stuff. I sit next to us on stage working the projector manually. And it wasn't his fault either. Nope.

But I got a lot of yelling done that night. Yeah, you burned down the trees that night. Oh, motherfucker. It was happening. That was on that night. Burned down enough weed to cover the mountain it needed to be done too i didn't care and there was a lot of people in there so i was trying to share it's like a forest fire it was it was it had to be the only way it was gonna sanity was gonna keep so uh a lot of people liked him still uh now roy though he says about himself, I was so full of self-hatred that there was no way I could feel love for anyone.

I had no respect for me or anyone else. He said he hated Ely. He hated being there. And he didn't like his parents. And he worked with his parents, too. That's the other thing. He, like, I he his parents run the dairy the local dairy at this point so he uh is working at the dairy or some shit it's pretty

interesting mom beats the shit out of him day and night yeah oh boy with milk bottles apparently wet noodles or something wet noodles here's a guy here girls still liked him too girls are into this guy there's a woman named carol michaels um she is uh she met him when she was a kid when he was going out with her sister oh it was her she was it was her older sister and she says later on quote i first met roy when i was walking up to my house. He was giving one of my sisters a kiss. I thought, my turn will come. Wow. That's a... I got to age into that one. Wow.

Holy shit. When he's done with her, I am going to smell his fingers. Like, what are we talking about? I don't mean to be crass, but Christ almighty, my turn will come next. I'm going to get into my sister's boyfriend. That's just weird. Yeah. She said, quote, he was cute, had fast cars, and gave good parties.

There was a group of girls who were always after him. Jesus Christ. Roy is killing it, it sounds like. He started sneaking drinks while he was young from his parents' liquor cabinet. Because it's cold up there. Everybody does that, I think. For the last four or five years, he said he'd been drinking hard liquor all the time.

And then he said he got into college, and now here, he got into taking both hallucinogens and amphetamines. You want to rack up the hallucinogens, which is basically like a mid-60s Hell's Angel cocktail. He'll try anything. I'm going to trip and be on speed. LSD was the predominant drug that he liked, and he liked to take drugs and alcohol at

the same time. That was his thing. And hard liquor and LSD, which don't mix. It's pointless to drink while you're on acid. Pick your poison is the phrase. Well, there's also, if you're doing substances, there's always one substance that will dominate the rest of the substances. You know what I mean? Like you could drink a bunch of booze, but if you did two lines of Coke, you wouldn't even know you had any booze in you.

You'd feel 100% sober and feel all jacked up because Coke trumps booze. You know what I'm saying? Acid trumps everything. Acid is the umbrella. There's nothing you can do that can't affect that that will poke through that acid bubble you can drink all you want all you're gonna feel is like you're tripping because in your body a little affect you but your brain will not notice it at all it'll kill you it'll kill you it'll slow down everything and all that but your brain won't know you won't go man

i'm drunk or i'm dying i'm fucking tripping i know a kid in high school i i've this is i know people just like this and grew up with them and this is who i hung out with for assholes like this who ingested as much as they could of weird shit so i know a guy who he was uh he was tripping he was drinking he was smoking a ton of weed with dust in it we were smoking dust blunts and shit back in this is you know 11th grade we're smoking dust blunts he's drinking liquor from the bottle that guy and when we left i was like man you must be fucked up and he goes i'm tripping my ass off and i'm like you drank so much he goes i don't i'm tripping he goes i don't even fucking better i don't even feel any of that shit he He goes, I am tripping my balls off.

And that's all that matters. That is a guy that cannot be sober. He hates it. And he does fine now. He's a family. He's doing great. This was a man that used to do, he used to have a party at his place on a Friday. And he would sit with whatever leftover kegs were there

and not sleep till Sunday. He would just sit and drink the whole time and he was a disaster. A machine. A machine. I saw him eat a Wendy's hamburger that had rocks in it because he drove a bike there so he wouldn't get a DUI and he fell over the handlebars and all the food came out and he said, I was picking it up out of the dirt and it was all dirt in the hamburger. I was like, what did you do?

He goes, you want some burgers? And there was like grass and shit in them. I'm like, where did you get these hamburgers? I flipped over the handlebars, man. I'm like, what the fuck is wrong with you? Yeah, your food is trash now. That's what happened. And he's fine.

He turned out fine. I don't know how it happened. He's not fine that's what happened and he's fine he turned out fine i don't know how it happened he's not fine he's if i see him he's he's doing okay he's not fine no he's got a job and kids and a wife that somehow wants to be with him it's crazy i don't know what he's doing but congratulations to him for figuring it out so he was one guy i was like there's no he used to go to jail just for because he was bored what he was tight he'd get a lot of stress and he'd be like ah it's cool you go for like because he was always on probation for something yeah so he goes i just violate on purpose he goes so they'll put me in for like three months he goes i could chill out like regroup you know got no bills not he goes out

of plan he goes i know everybody in there it's cool like that was his fucking thing like i'll just go chill i was like what who goes to jail just to unwind for a couple months that's the weirdest thing it's literally what he did i don't know it's kind of like sandals yeah all inclusive he'd smoke the night before his uh his uh probation if he wanted to go back he goes i'll just smoke tonight i'll violate tomorrow degenerate sandals you know that's all degenerate sandals degenerate club med that's exactly what it is scum med instead of club med oh boy so he was always partying uh doing his thing and taking all this shit is what he says now he is living with his parents his parents own the uh ely dairy yeah i guess where you get all your dairy shit which roy had been managing for about a year. He's going to take over the dairy eventually, I assume.

His friends describe him as a, quote, average guy. They said Roy is a peaceful guy. He avoids fights. He doesn't really go after anything like that. He's just kind of an average guy. He says, quote, I celebrate every Saturday night. Every Saturday. And this particular Saturday in March, March 8th, he celebrated with beer, rum, coke, banana liqueur, speed, weed, and right before attending a party with his girlfriend, a bunch of LSD too.

This sounds like exactly what my friend did, minus the coke, because I don't play that shit. Push it inside me. Yeah. You're not fucking hanging out with coke with me. friend did minus the coke because i don't play that shit push it inside me yeah you're not hanging done fucking hanging out with coke with me i don't like coke but the rest of that stuff go crazy so he's uh he does that shit and uh um take some drop some acid too now his girlfriend roxanne the one who witnessed the weird shit at his house roxanne she says that when he wasn't on drugs he was a a peaceful guy, very easy to talk to.

But when he's on acid, he's a different guy. Yeah. He's, you know, he's on fucking acid. Right. Obviously. You're not in your right mind if you're on acid. No. If you're not, you're completely a different person.

Your focus is elsewhere. You're a four-year-old. You're a different person completely. I've never seen people get, like, real mean or anything on acid. Usually you get real, like, docile on acid is what i've always seen you turn a little child like we turn into a four-year-old yeah that's it because you're trying to absorb to your new habitat that's all yeah your brain is completely different right it's totally different so uh she said yeah nice guy when he's not on drugs so roxanne his girlfriend she and her sister brenda are driving around ely drinking beer yeah on the night of martin driving around

drinking beer i mean it's the 70s it's what you do i guess yeah you did yeah i guess like even like wow dude in the 80s yeah driving through the desert drinking it you know it's a very common thing it's rural areas too i have family in scranton and i had this cousin that when i was like 14 they own like this bar down this bound whatever he drove us in the dark through the woods yeah to the bar drinking feeding us drinks as underage very underage kids in the bar and then shit-faced with a drink drove us back through the woods in the pitch black. Absolutely. That's just normal.

It's just a thing. It was weird. Yeah, it's a thing that goes. So they're doing that. They see him. They find him. They find Roy, and they pick him up, I guess, while they're driving. Hey, there's Roy.

There's your boyfriend. You should pick him up. Okay, they pick him up. He told them that they're driving. Hey, there's Roy. There's your boyfriend. You should pick him up. Okay, they pick him up. He told them that he dropped two hits of acid before he left home. Yeah. So he's going to be tripping pretty hard. I'm having fun. Roxanne, she'll say later on that he giggled.

He was giggling and acting a little funny. He's tripping. That's your first hour of tripping. Once it starts hitting, everything's hilarious. It's childlike. Everything's fucking hilarious. Then he says that he wants to drop two more hits of acid. No, don't do that.

Which if you've ever done acid, that's the thing. The first hour is very dangerous because you feel like before you're really peaking on it, you feel just like this euphoria of laughter. And you're like, I got to have more of this. I wanted this to feel more. But if you wait, you will feel more. if you wait you will feel more the problem is you just feel this is so good i want more then you take more and it's like oh no a few hours done that a few hours later when you're like this is never gonna end then it's a different

fucking story because i've been in that one more hit here this is i'm having a great time oh i'm just making this worse. So he's doing that. Roxanne saw him take a small bottle out of his pocket and put something in his mouth. Another friend who was in the car said that she saw him put acid in his mouth at this time. So he's got liquid. I don't know if he's got liquid or if he dropped a hit and then washed it down. Got it. Washed the taste out.

Because it does have that weird taste. Could have been a sugar cube. Yeah. So it's, yeah. Either, yeah. Back then they used sugar cubes too. I don't know. I've only had it on paper.

Paper, yeah. But the three of them went to a party at 7.30 p.m. They hung out for about three hours. And Roy drank mixed drinks the whole time. So he is just getting it on. Oh boy. That's crazy. That's just, well I guess when you're tripping too, you can just getting it on. That's crazy. That's just, well, I guess when you're tripping too, you can just drink mixed drinks and it's

not, it doesn't affect you the same way. So he's just drinking them. I guess the acid annoyed his girlfriend. His girlfriend was annoyed with him. Because if you want to hang out with someone on a human level, you can't do it if they're tripping. They're just, they're another. It's a new world.

It's a new, they're both in different worlds. You have a five-year-old. It's the in different worlds yeah you have a five-year-old it's the same thing as if you have a four-year-old who's got like a you know a nintendo switch in their hand yeah got a playing ds or some shit like they're not in your world that you can't have a conversation with a four-year-old who's playing a video game right two different things are you know the fact that they're four and the fact they're playing a video game is they're not good communicators certainly preoccupied they're a little bit preoccupied so uh yeah she said that night it left him the lsd left him hard to get along with and hard to communicate with yeah which

yeah and she wants to talk about the relationship yeah well she just wants to hang out and like have her boyfriend with her at a party and he's just like giggling and tripping and acting weird and shit at least he's not firing guns into the ceiling excellent point you know so i mean good thing he's not on uh not on coke or anything his drug use would lead to some shit sometimes uh apparently he uh has smashed multiple windshields yeah not on acid on other things uh including his own he smashed other people's that's like his trick that he does is he likes to smash windshields yeah which is that's his go ah fuck roy's on the goddamn hood again right get roy off ah shit i just put the goddamn windshield on what an asshole yeah latimer from the program every goddamn yeah pushing heads through windows

through windows left and right. So he did that. He would occasionally freak out and trash an apartment. Huh? Go crazy like a rock band in a hotel room and start trashing shit. Yeah, but I'm not renting this shit for tonight. This is my shit. This is your shit. Right.

That's what I mean. Including his own girlfriend's apartment. Oh, God. He trashed his own girlfriend's apartment, which will not endear you to your girlfriend. No. If you have some drug-fueled freak out and rip up her apartment usually that's gonna get you pissed she's gonna be pissed at you for that um roy and uh and roxanne this particular night argued at the party um and all this type of shit they were arguing he He kept drinking. He's acting goofy on the acid. She's tired of him.

And eventually she takes off. Okay. She doesn't want to deal with him anymore. And so he is left with Brenda, the younger sister, Roxanne's younger sister. The one that's going to age into this. So that's no, no, that's a different girl. That's a difference. Carol Michaels.

This is Roxanne's girlfriend, Brenda. Carol Michaels will come up later on, by the way, from's a different girl. That's a different. That's Carol Michaels. This is Roxanne's girlfriend, Brenda. Carol Michaels will come up later on, by the way. From being 12 back then, she'll come up as an adult again. But for now, she's out of the story. So Roy and Roxanne argue at the party. After several mixed drinks, like we said, he leaves with Brenda. So fights, they get in fights all the time. Part of it is because he's on drugs he trashes her

apartment probably smash your windshield right too another thing is because he's always fooling around on the side oh by the way most of the time with underage girls really underage girl that's his thing that's his thing and um not exactly she's not even as mad at him for cheating it's the fact that he's always cheating with like a 10th grader that makes her a little weary of him. One time he was caught naked in the backseat of a car with an underage girl and got thrown in jail for statutory rape. Somehow the charges got dropped, but he was naked.

Just like Charles Manson got caught. It's the same exact thing. Unbelievable. They're like, nevermind. Back then it was so much. Nowadays, if you're caught naked with a minor in the back of your car, that's a very serious. Oh, God. Back then it was like, what are you doing, goofball?

Get out of there. It was not the same. Don't you know you can't do that? You can't. Oh, look at this. He's got that girl all naked now. What a jerk. I'll tell you what.

You'll be lucky if her dad doesn't punch you in the mouth. Like, that's. No. Jail. Yeah. Fucking 20 something years old, 23 years old. So Brenda, the younger sister, she says that she and Roy left the party together at about 1145. Brenda sent him into the Legion bar to look for her boyfriend.

So she stopped by a bar and she said, go in there and look for my boy. This is a very, this whole thing is just, we're going to look for my boyfriend in the bar because my girlfriend left. And oh, boy, he was in the Legion for about 10 or 15 minutes. And when he returned, he's in there for 10 minutes. He comes back and he goes, I couldn't find your boyfriend, but I got in a fight. Very helpful. Thanks, Roy. Hey, thanks, Roy. I did not find your boyfriend, but I did beat up fight. Very helpful. Thanks, Roy. Hey, thanks, Roy.

I did not find your boyfriend, but I did beat up a man named Richard. You know, I mean, shit. A man named Richard will not wonder why I was looking for your boyfriend next time. I don't know. Is your boyfriend named Richard? I think I might have beat up your boyfriend.

Oh, shit, my bad. So she said she didn't observe any cuts on him, but it was dark in the car. So who knows? Uh, during the six hours she was with him, Brenda said that he never became louder, boisterous, never lost his temper, never stumbled, never slurred his speech. He was just kind of giggly and silly. So the owner of the Legion bar said that he came into the bar around 1240, but he didn't see any fight.

No fight ensued. Okay. So who knows? He said, that's what I mean. I don't know if he got like had a weird fantasy. Yeah. He took, he's on the four hits acid. I mean, he could, you could fight, you could fight Jesus on four hits acid.

Literally. You could be like, man, I threw down on his ass. I'm lucky he's skinny. He's muscular though. He's sinewy. You know what I mean? You got to look out for him. He's tough, but, uh, you know, he's got a you know what i mean you got to look out for him he's tough but uh you know he's got a disadvantage so being 2 000 years old it's a i had a slight speed advantage on him and

i think i took it over so uh he said no fight happened he's the bartender says that uh he did he didn't even appear noticeably intoxicated when he was there so uh now roy to uh tumala who's roy's third cousin okay roy's third cousin roy yeah this is a good white trash episode here my brother daryl my other brother daryl yeah my third cousin daryl as a matter of fact as well uh roy was sleeping roy was sleeping in the apartment of cynthia teller on the evening of March 8th. At 5 a.m. on March 9th, which is just the continuation of this evening, he, Roy Tumela, and Cynthia Teller heard people running up the stairs and pounding on their apartment door.

So this Roy Tumela answers the door, and he sees red nelson who's there uh richard murdo another guy it's daniel red nelson richard murder murdo roy walberg here and jeff getters oh that's who's there by 5 a.m this is the foursome at 5 a.m yeah so midnight 12 40 it's just him and brenda by 5 a.m he's with three other guys, including our deceased young man, pounding on somebody's apartment door. He's had a crazy night. This is definitely an acid night. He's running around.

Yeah, he told them that there's no party. They thought there was a party at the apartment. It's just them sleeping. It's two people sleeping in there. We're here for a party. Yeah, they're like. The sleeping party? He opened the door.

The guy's in his boxers. His eyes half closed. It's dark in there he's like hey what's up he's like where's party and they're like huh fucking party oh fucking party get out of here you assholes so he tells him no party at the apartment and sends him away he goes back to bed he heard the group i guess they were in the house they came in the house because he went back to the bed but he left them out there he said he heard the group open the refrigerator looking for beer and then leave in five ten minutes so they're like there's no party but we're gonna make one okay we heard there's a party which means we're partying motherfucker there's two beers we can split them and dip let's do it so yeah everybody in so uh uh there's another guy coming in here terry gefeller he says that he was living at the wolf lake resort 10 miles west of ely on march 9th

and then he went out of town or he went out to warm up his truck between 6 15 and 6 30 a.m while warming it up that's a cold weather thing to do he saw a gold duster drive very slowly down the loop road and stop is what he says he saw the driver who he later will identify as red nelson okay he could not see if others were in the car he said he drove up behind the duster and followed it for a while as both vehicles headed toward eelly. He wasn't following it on purpose. He was just going that direction. Gefeller drove into the Holiday Station, which is a gas station, about 7.10 a.m. in Ely and bought a pie.

Bought a pie? Like a hostess pie? At what time? 7.10 a.m.? Like a hostess apple pie? It better have been. I hope so. It could have been. I hope he's just buying a whole pie.

Bought a cherry pie. Bought me a pumpkin pie over at the gas station at 7 o'clock in the morning. Peach cobbler and a cup of coffee. It's a peach. No, a whole cobbler. Not a slice of cobbler. Whole tin of cobbler. Just a big old round cobbler I'm going to take with me.

It's a big square cobbler. So he did that he said he went out to his truck his truck at that point and saw the same gold duster in the gas pump area of the station he saw the driver standing by the car but was unable to see if anyone else was inside just as he left he saw the duster head east outside of the city limits at about 7 15 a.m that's his story robert owens the manager of the gas station who knew Roy because he delivered dairy products there regularly because he's the dairy guy. He says that shortly after 7, Roy arrived at the holiday station in the gold duster. Roy was in the duster.

The manager thought that two others got out of the car, but he remembered that Roy got out from the passenger side and came in and talked with the manager for a while. The manager didn't notice any cuts or bruises on him. The car which he arrived in was filled with $1 worth of gas at the holiday station. Just enough to get to the next gas station. $1. I need $1. Take a dollar on two. I'll take one on two.

How is that? That's great. Four people, $1. I'll take $1 on two. I'll take one on two. How is that? That's great. Four people, $1. Yeah, but in 73, that was like 17 gallons of gas. 75? Was that right before the gas crisis? So, yeah, that would have been, because like a year later, that would have been like a teaspoon. Yeah.

So, now Roxanne, she testifies later on that Roy came to her apartment about 9.20 a.m. Okay. So, that's 7.20's 720 and now we got a two hour window there between them at the gas station talking to the manager getting a dollar's worth the gas and he shows up to the apartment at 9 20 a.m. she said he appeared tired shaky nervous and hung over he's had a long night yes it's I mean Jesus Christ I'm exhausted on this guy's night she noticed a tiny bruise on the bridge of his nose and a tiny cut or crack on his lip. There were two small cuts or scratches on his left hand.

She noticed his appearance had changed from the night before when she last she saw him. She said he now had on dress jeans instead of his work jeans. He's got work jeans and dress jeans. These are my going out jeans now come on these are my wedding jeans i wear weddings funerals yeah then my going out dress jeans and then i got my work jeans this is every day just every day you know what i mean i guess i can relate no i got it yeah you got your shit yeah i got but the blue one you'd have your jeans you wore at work yeah yeah i got blue ones that i just do whatever in you know what i mean black ones that are my nice jeans yeah that's my he's my funeral blacks yeah i have my around the

house jeans and you got your like going to dinner yeah jeans looking cool jeans that's right it just sounds funny it does it just does he had his work jeans and his dress jeans dress jeans is the thing that sounds that's what ruins it yeah dress jeans really your dress jeans they're just like the guy with the jordans who told me these are dress jordans and i went pardon with the shoes the dress jordans yeah yeah someone's you wear like jeans and just what the fuck out of here with that so anyway uh she uh she said her his appearance was different now he's got on his work jeans he's no longer wearing the flowered shirt he wore the night before that must have been some outfit uh flower shirt and dress your shirt that's his that's his outfit boy i got my flowered shirt on my best dress jeans i'm ready to party so he came

in and he laid his head on roxanne's lap for a while he then went into the bedroom took his clothes off and went to bed she noticed his long underwear was damp they all wear the long underwear by the way layers layers was damp from the knees down and that there was a hole in the knee he told her that that he got wet waiting through the snow and he told her that he thought he might have been in a fight at the Legion. I'm not sure. Red Nelson was with me. Eventually ask him, but I'm not positive right now.

So, yeah, she didn't hear anything about Jeff Getters being with him or anything like that. So Roy's story is he took a couple hits of LSD, went to a park. That's her view. Yeah. Now, Roy's point of view here is he took a couple hits to do like a some real care you know kurosawa shit here he uh he uh he at the party drank strong mixed drinks he said one after another he was pounding him pounding him after he took a bunch of acid he said that he was really loaded when he when he had left the party and he

had trouble maneuvering the steps that's what he says now they said he seemed fine but whatever he spent several hours with brenda and then he and red nelson and rich murdo drove around together drinking beer of course while they were driving a car why wouldn't you just stop somewhere and drink why you gotta drink in the car because it's warm somehow listen i've done it it's it's so fun i'd swear to you it's so fun to drink and drive i don't say that please we're gonna get so much as a kid and when it when it was completely innocuous in the desert don't don't do that please don't listen to to Jimmy about anything. I get what you're saying. There was no danger of anybody getting hurt but me.

In the desert, I get what you're saying. On the road? Fuck that. That's crazy. That's lunacy. They're just driving around the middle of the night in the roads. That's absurd, man. Getting hammered after they've been drinking all night.

That's what I mean. Yeah, you were in the desert by yourself. All alone. You crashed into some hole or something. I hit a tree or a rock or a cactus. You can bleed to death out there on your own. It's all on me, babe. No, you're not taking anyone down with you no that's true so uh he drove around now while they're drinking and drinking and driving a car flashed its lights at them while

they're drinking uh flashed the lights so he right pulled over and got out and talked to the driver of the car the driver smiled at him showing him a bottle of banana liqueur. Okay. That's what he said. You too? Me too. Hey, look at that. He's like, I got this.

He was like, you want to drink this with me? Yeah. So, and he asked Roy if he wanted to get into his car and help him drink this banana liqueur. Let's get into my car so we can drive around and drink banana liqueur. What a weird, how does this even happen? Right? So, Roy later found out that that, he didn't even know him. He didn't even know that was Jeff Getters until later.

He never met him. You drank it? I drank it. He flashed lights at a car going. He's like, what's up, buddy? Want to drink banana liqueur with me? That's his story? That's crazy.

I don't know about that. So Richard Murdoch, Red Nelson, and Roy joined Getters in his car, and they drove around in the Gold Duster. Getters in his car and they drove around in the gold duster. Getters was driving. As they drove, they all drank the banana liqueur and Getters told them about a girl named Liz who he had met that night. They drove by the girl's home and then

to Red Nelson's house where he had some vodka they were going to go pick up. Because you're driving, you run out of booze. Who wants to drive once you're out of booze? So they decided they wanted to get some beer at uh at cynthia teller's apartment that's why they all went up to that that's so that lines up with them showing up at the apartment they opened the door they took all the all the beer that was in the refrigerator and left and drank all the beer they then went to the wolf lakeort area looking for more beer.

Red Nelson drove. Getter sat in the front seat. That's where that other guy saw him do that loop and come back. Red Nelson drove. Getter's in the front seat. Roy and Rich Murdo were sleeping in the back. When they got to Ely, Roy and Murdo woke up. They dropped Murdo off at his home.

Getter said he wanted to check on his girlfriend once more and get some gas. What are you, just driving by this? He just met her that night. It's not your girlfriend, man. You're a stalker. Yeah. You met her that night, and you're going back and forth. This is weird. You're ruining it.

So they needed gas, so they pulled into the gas station. He remembered he might, that's when Roy said he remembered he might have to deliver milk that morning, so he went into the store and talked to the manager. When he got out of the car, like're not you're not expecting milk are you to see if the guy was surprised he wasn't carrying like a case of dairy if the guy looks surprised i'm fucked all right do i owe you milk yeah if he just goes hey what are you doing here this morning then i'm good but i could be fucked a couple days early aren't you right yeah yes I am no I'm just here for gas so that's amazing so he said he got back when he got back he noticed Jeff Getters was in the

driver's seat he said that he wanted to go home at that point Roy did so uh uh Getters dropped him and Nelson off at uh Roy's truck at theops parking lot. I don't know what that is. Getters drove away in the duster. Roy says he didn't see him again. He said he dropped him off about 7.30. That's his story. Later on, too, he'll say 8.15, 7.30. You know, time goes back and forth, but that's fine.

I was on acid. Yeah. Roy said that he took Nelson home and then drove home where he took out his contact lenses and snorted some speed to wake up because, you know, he was getting tired. Obviously, he then drove to Roxanne's apartment where she said he was acting funny because he was on speed. He did not remember what he said. He could only remember going to bed. He says he doesn't know how he got cuts on his hands and face. He said that his relationship with Getters was good and that he never he didn't do anything to him. He doesn't know how he got cuts on his hands and face he said that his relationship with getters was good and that he never he didn't do anything to him he doesn't know how he ended up

there he left him drove away somebody must have got him he said he has no idea um that doesn't know he said he took drugs and alcohol and uh how could he possibly have any fucking idea what happened sorry now that's the two points of view now here's what must have actually happened okay this is a great article it's in oddly enough and it'll make sense in wired.com you're gonna go why would this this is the least technologically anything we're talking about gold dusters and banana liqueur very little technology in the in this. In the 70s, drinking and driving. Is Wired getting into carbureted vehicles? No. They love dusters.

No, but dusters, yes. That's the weird part. No, that's the odd part. And the article is written by a guy named Ted Conover, who I'm like, I know that name. And I looked him up. He wrote that amazing book on being a guard in Sing Sing. Oh. He's the guy that went undercover

as a guard and sing sing it's called new jack not the wrestler new jack uh guarding sing sing or a year and sing sing or whatever it is by ted conover really good writer and a good investigative journalist type of guy so a excellent article here um a lot of good information only came from this article. So at one point in this evening here, Roy went to a local bar at the same time as Jeff Getters. That's where they ran into each other. Got it. Not flashing lights. It was Getters 19th birthday. He'd been drinking and everything like that, too.

Now, Getters had a date that night with an Ely woman. OK, but he forgot about it. Now, Getters had a date that night with an Ely woman. Okay. But he forgot about it. So he had made a date, but he forgot about the date, spaced it out because he was drinking and went to the bar instead. So he went to this bar and was hanging out. This is the Legion, I believe, the same place the guy Roy ran into looking for the other one's Brenda's boyfriend so he went in there and pretty soon he was hanging out with a college student who was home for the weekend from Duluth that's who he met that night that was the Liz girl that he was talking about they they and another couple went

down went for pizza down the street at 1 a.m. yep so that's what you do so they left they went at 1 a.m that's after he uh roy would have stopped at the bar they leave them uh getters offered her his class ring he just met this girl at the bar getters he's already giving her jewelry oh boy you have had five drinks in a slice of pizza with this woman you do not give away jewelry of any kind especially sentimental things this is why you don't drink banana liqueur exactly you get real real this is why the drinking age was raised to 21 because at 19 you'll give shit away you want a car you like dusters do you say you like this watch you listen it tells you want it you wear You just take it. My granddad gave me this class ring. Now, no one remembers whether Jeff and Roy spoke at the bar.

It's uncertain whether they even knew each other then. But sometime after two thirty a.m., they met on the streets of Ely somewhere. Not in the bar because everybody was gone somehow. So the lights flashing thing may have happened. Maybe they thought they confused him for somebody else or maybe it was just group of guys we're all partying but would you flash your lights at a car full of strange guys in the middle of the night that's a way to get beat up right that's a shot or shot or robbed or fucking woods of minnesota yeah in minnesota i'm thinking

that's they're gonna get out and beat the shit out of you probably and like leave you there think we're cute is that what it is that what it is look at him he wants to shake his ass at me that son of a bitch is that 99 bananas he wants your phone number that's what it is he's drinking banana liqueur now who drinks banana liqueur that's what i'm saying your boyfriend buy that for you it goes right back to that again he likes you roy right back to it roy so uh yeah they're you know probably just the last people around that night you know it's a quiet small town i assume you see a car you're like who's that and he probably recognized the car from the bar maybe recognized that it was him hey is that dude again yeah now getters driving uh later on his blood alcohol level is measured at 0.17 he's done it so that's

after the autopsy 0.17 is happy birthday and that's it's had to have come down a little since then so he was drinking everybody was really late you know tying one on tonight so uh he let roy take the wheel of the duster and he climbed in the back seat to go to sleep that's what we've put together from other people he said you drive my car i'm passing out so it's at this point that they were joined by daniel red nelson who is no i love how conover put it as quote daniel red nelson a shoplifter and vandal who sold drugs to kids that's how he describes him how would you like that to be your introduction into the national press jimmy wisman a shoplifter and vandal who sold drugs to kids. This is an all-around scum of the earth.

Great. Good. I feel wonderful. Yeah. Piece of shit. Jimmy Wilson. Jimmy Wissman. Piece of shit.

Sells drugs to kids. Wrecks shit. You know him. He's an asshole. Draws dicks on things. You know. He's a loser. So it's at this point that they meet up with with these three so it's not those three met up with getters it's getters and and and roy met up

with the rest of his scumbag crew and murdo yeah so uh the police theory was that walberg was talking shit to red nelson about his suspicion thatters, Getters didn't want to take any drugs. They were doing lines and shit. And he's like, no, no, he just wanted to drink booze. Because that's what he did. He drinks booze. He's 19. They said, I bet he's a narc.

They started saying he's a narc. You know, because they're doing speed. When you do speed, you get paranoid and you think shit. That's weird. Because you're weird. You're out of it. You're all out of it. paranoid and you think shit that's weird you're weird you're out of it you're all out of it so um also red nelson said that years earlier walberg uh was jealous of getters who had just moved there

but local girls had he started he does well with the local girls because he's new yeah so you know he's the new guy and roy doesn't like that that the local girl's starting to like him, especially the younger ones, because that's who he likes. That's his game. So that's Red Nelson's theory here. Now, as Getter slept, they stopped at Roy's truck, and they grabbed a hatchet. And they also grabbed a stolen Bowie knife at Red Nelson's house. So now they have a knife and a hatchet. This is while Jeff Getters is sleeping in the back seat.

They drove to a remote logging road eight miles north of town. And they stop there. Getters wakes up and he gets out to pee. Yeah. That's how it works. He gets out to take a leak. And his last words, according to Red nelson were quote oh no don't do that screaming um nelson will end up uh he'll end up turning and and giving evidence it'll be

state's evidence here he uh says that uh jesus christ yeah he says that uh um that uh getters and the hatchet uh they they attacked him with the hatchet, basically. Jesus Christ, this is rough. They attack him with the hatchet, and they basically throw the hatchet into the trunk and covered the blood-stained ground with snow. There's all blood there to cover that you know, to cover that up. And so they've never located the precise murder site here either. They went back to Ely with Getter's body in the trunk.

Nelson stopped at the car and Roy removed the hatchet from the trunk. And the hatchet was cleaned and returned to the inside of the car. Nelson and Roy returned to Ely and took Getter's car to the car wash and cleaned the bloodstains from the car nelson and roy returned to ely and took getter's car to uh to the car wash and clean the blood stains from the car they took the car to the co-op parking lot stole the tape player out of it of course jesus the tapes and the speakers what take the stereo take the stereo out and then they left it there this was after viciously attacking him while he was sleeping which is fucking ridiculous here um by the way uh like we said he will uh red will will plea to this and testify against uh roy and uh his sentence can be anywhere from well we'll get to that i'll

give you that here we go murdo took offdo. They dropped off before any of this happened. The guy whose name is damn near murder. They murder. They get rid of him. He's the guy who doesn't kill anybody. So apparently this red Nelson says the dialogue was that Getters was a narcotics agent. And basically they were talking about, you know, we got to kill this narc and all this type of shit. And yeah, so that's that's the thing. So they actually went to get weapons to do all this type of shit. And yeah, so that's that's the thing.

So they actually went to get weapons to do all this sort of shit, which is crazy. Now, the investigation, they're the people last seen with Getter with Getter. So Red Nelson and Roy Wahlberg are prime suspects. They knocked on that guy's door who saw them all together at 5 a.m. So this all goes on. You think it'd be pretty open and shut. Took 17 months before it's in a grand jury what this deal during those months uh roy freely talked with the lead

investigator uh talked with police tried to uh tried to like lead them in other directions and all that sort of shit he thought he he said he was playing mental chess with the police there so um walberg ends up obviously getting arrested for this whole thing and he's arrested for first degree murder and uh many years later he would say quote my memory is very very piecemeal i have an overall impression of of killing myself of killing myself for a long time i remember watching red commit the myrtle i mean the murder looking through the uh backup looking through the back of a pickup truck and about the last five years later i remembered wait a minute we had a camper on the back of the pickup i couldn't have looked out the back of the pickup he's like i'm realizing that like my memories aren't my memories like i see them but they're not they couldn't have happened that way oh that's not good at all that's not good at all and we

don't know if he's full of shit that's an easier way to say i didn't even know i did it or if he's that could be too i mean memories are weird like that and if you're on drugs it fucking further alters your memories and you could definitely say i know this happened and then you'd see it and go that's impossible for that to have happened. So I've done that, thought something definitely happened and it didn't. So, yeah, they talk about the like, they're talking about

the evidence and talking about everything like that and it shows that Nelson could recall even the smallest details of wounds on Jeff Getters and gave vivid accounts of the contents of Getters' car trunk when they threw it in there like he knew everything that was in the car trunk. He knew everything. I had attention to

detail. They said they took careful evidence careful time destroying the evidence at the scene of the crime. They they cleaned the hatchet very well. Their clothes were cleaned and immediately followed the crime. It's all this sort of shit. So this isn't if you're tripping you don't do this sort of thing so that's the thing i

think plus acid about eight hours and the last two you're not even tripping really anymore you're coming down so it feels like roy's using the the drugs is like a an excuse for uh not knowing yeah that's what i mean i don't know everything he's like, I know exactly what happened because Red's got a lot of motivation to know. He's got like a very much shrunken down prison sentence here. Now awaiting trial, Roy is in jail and he attempted to commit suicide while in jail and he was placed on the suicide list. psychiatrist his psychiatrist at the time said his ability to laugh was excessive under the circumstances he said i believe that the possibility of serving a life sentence is just now beginning to dawn upon him because of his fair complexion and youthful appearance he states that he's been getting a lot of pressure from the other inmates for sex I bet. Now, this is great. This is great. Now, Jeff's dad, Stan, is fucking pissed.

Really? He wants blood. Jeff's dad, Stan. He said that he's really, really upset. He says, quote, I had a long time before I could say the Our Father. I mean, forgive us our sins as we forgive those who sinned against us i could never forgive him ever and his idea of his fantasy justice his father is quote give me my 30 hot six i just want one shot that's all i need oh boy yeah he just wants to

take him out to he said while he's running across a field he just wants to take him out while he's running across a field. He just wants to treat him like a deer. Let him run. I'll still get him. Set him free. Give me one shot at him. That's what he's saying. I'll fix this. I got this.

And the rest of the getters kind of feel the same way. The children, they want the death penalty. They were skeptical of parole for him. They didn't want him getting out. They said, somebody that evil I personally don't believe can ever change their inside no matter what. That's his brother, Jay. And they said the same type of thing. Now, the trial, Red Nelson here, he is allowed to plead guilty to second-degree murder.

His sentence can run anywhere from zero to 40 years, depending on what they feel like giving him and how good of a witness he is, basically. We'll see. That's why he remembers the smallest fucking details of attacking this. And they did. They attacked him. Trying to get that sentence down to zero. They attacked him. And apparently the last thing that happened was Red telling Roy to to finish him off and that's what ended up

happening roy was attacking him with a hatchet and that's how it went down apparently here so um yeah so the judge is the judge has all the you know discretion here jeffrey's little brother jay um who was a high school student at the time he said that he uh we did everything we could to hold ourselves back to try not to choke that bastard there was so much anger and trapped violence high school student at the time he said that he uh we did everything we could to hold ourselves back to try not to choke that bastard there was so much anger and trapped violence now the first year in jail in prison uh because he is going to be sentenced guilty as fuck obviously and he is going to get a life sentence which does not translate to what you think it would here so uh we'll talk about that you sir may fuck off but

it's a little more than that in prison the first year roy's dad dies of a heart attack while shoveling snow off the roof of the house uh roxanne stopped visiting him because he's in jail she said she had migraine headaches whenever she went there it's stressful jail his psychiatrist prescribed him antidepressants and sedatives, but he ended up in the infirmary close to death from injecting himself with Dilaudid, which he somehow got in jail. What? And is injecting himself in jail. He can get that shit in prison.

He can get anything in prison, yeah, except fucking guns, pretty much. He doesn't have anything, though, in terms of value to get that, though, right? I mean, his parents might be putting money on his books. knows i would assume so he can survive maybe he's that ever golden butthole that's what i mean he is he is like he said he said to make himself less physically vulnerable he began lifting weights he tried to stay in his cell and do a lot of reading and um he slowly got better and better and he starts doing a prison run program called insight as he joins okay we'll talk about that in a second now carol michaels remember her yeah the little sister she she comes

back and uh she said she didn't care about the murder conviction what she said my whole reaction was that i didn't care her parents did and her her parents forbade him to visit him forbade her to visit him in jail but when she she turned 18, she went anyway. Oh, my God. And Roy had been in for a few years at that point. And Carol Michaels was visiting him all the time. She said, once or twice a week for years. Huh?

My turn will come. Wow. I asked him to marry me a couple of times, and he said no. Oh, boy. From prison. Yeah. He said it was pointless for me to wait around because he was going to be in prison for the rest of his life. Now, Insight, very quickly, is a program started by two prisoners who were smart people. They were both murderers.

They started this program where they lobbied the state legislature to basically allow them to apply for grants to get college education in jail, basically. So then they got it. So they do that. They did that there. They took standardized tests and whoever was accepted lived in a special cell block. They did their full time prison work and full academic schedule schedule and the whole deal. So they had computer work and everything. So Roy scored very

high and was accepted this is in the 80s um insight cell block was a they said it's it's a safe place basically it's all the people they're going to school and they're not trying to uh game the system or anything exactly they're not trying to no one's in there to try to you know rape each other or anything here so he starts doing his bachelor's degree, and he says that it was a slow start because his brain was a little addled. He said, my own theory was I was carrying so many chemicals in my body, like PCP, it just took time for that to dissipate and for my mind to start working again. Which is true. If you do drugs for a long time, you've got a brain cloud that takes a while to go. He said that he was just doing tons of drugs before that.

So anyway, what he does is he starts doing this, and he said that he was really good at it. He got his bachelor's in computer programming and started to work on his MBA. He said, I had to learn like five or six additional computer languages and basically just stay barely ahead of the other students. So he thought that it was, it was fun. He said he stopped doing drugs and he was the first time he was into something that wasn't terrible for him basically. And in the meantime, Insight had gone online and received a big grant from Control Data Corporation, which was a computer manufacturer. And Roy became lead instructor of Control Data's homework project,

a national training program for homebound and disabled people conducted over the network. This is the main guy. This is the guy. In many cases, the students were quadriplegic and programming with a mouth stick and shit like that. Wild. Yeah. He said, I just identified with them so much. were quadriplegic and programming with a mouth stick and shit like that so yeah he said i just identified with them so much they were isolated from the mainstream workplace just like me

a little different reason um yeah in 1982 he secretly teamed up with control data analyst barbara hansen which he ends up hooking up with as well to form a corporation. He's got a business. Digital Dispatch Inc. DDI sought contracts for computer based education programming from outside companies like Merrill Lynch and shit like that. The Florida State Lottery and then subtract contracted with Insight for programmers to do their work. Wow. So he's got a whole little scam going on here. Yeah.

He this is a little white collar scam he's got going on in prison. An article he read in 85 said that they anticipated the arrival of computer viruses coming. So the piece was theoretical, he said. But given what I knew about the people around me, he said, it's definitely going to happen, no doubt. So he began initial work on an antivirus program, which ended up working out and all this sort of shit. So he ends up he talks to a murderer who's in there, who's a computer genius who just killed a guy in a love squabble. And he said that inmates were basically weren't supposed to hang out with new people. But he got a hold of them anyway and got his picked his brain a little bit here.

Anyway, they start doing this. He'd eventually they said, quote, so he'd essentially in his cell on paper, write everything and I'd go back and put it in the computer and come back to him with error messages. And he would tell you how to fix them. That's how he did it with this guy. he had to fix them that's how he did it with this guy uh walberg gets transferred to insights headquarters in the medium security prison in lino lino lakes and was almost uh he immediately got a small office with a terminal on the internet he said that's where he lived when i got in front of that computer i could be communicating with all of academia people with larger ideas blah blah

blah so he likes the internet and uh he thought it was a good marketing tool. He made his first antivirus product, Data Physician, and he spread the word online. Barbara Hansen's in this sort of thing. show gross receipts of $813,904, $942,839, and $833,525, respectively. Where does that go? In 1991, Barbara Hansen took home a salary of $147,000. Okay, now, media interest was big, too. The first, the computer magazines started calling, and the national media Barbara Hansen routing the calls from her house there that she bought. She would send them to the Insight cell block and they had no idea they were talking to him in prison.

They didn't know they were talking to a prisoner because that had a regular phone line. You didn't have to go through the prison system. So he was quoted about sales of antivirus products in 1988 in the Washington Post from prison. National Public Radio's All Things Considered. He's on there. NPR. NPR. He's using Eric Hansen as an alibi, which is his middle name and Barbara's last name.

He told people that. Alias. Alias, yeah. That's his alias alias yeah that's his yeah that's his alias here and meanwhile here there's that other programmer who helped him do everything he's doing technicals to the murderer he's doing technical support calls and he said that uh uh he handled all the data physician physician tech calls from people at the u.s department of transportation department of energy the postal service the irs none of them knew they were talking to inmates from people at the U.S. Department of Transportation, Department of Energy, the Postal Service, the IRS.

None of them knew they were talking to inmates. Idiots. None of them. None of them. But in their defense, there's no way to know. There's no way for them to know. That's right. They got duped.

So he says, they said, you know, this must have been scary to run from in prison. He said, quote, oh, it was a terrifying time for me. He said that, you know, anytime this could happen, he goes, I knew if I got caught, I would fuck my parole up. He said, I never knew when my calls were monitored, but I'd spend days talking to these media people. I was getting so stressed out. Finally, Bill, that's the guy who helped him said, look, if you're going to crash, you

might as well grab ahold of the controls and have some fun on the way down. I took that in perspective and said, all right, let's go with it. Let's have some fun. But I always just assumed it was going to blow up in our faces. Now, he's doing all this. Nobody knows about it. But Jay Getters, the little brother who's now an adult, who's now an attorney, mind you, by the way. Yeah.

By now, he had gone to law school and become a tax attorney. Awesome. He wanted to be a prosecutor, but they told him in law school, you got too much. There's too much around you. There's too much for you to do that. It's too personal for you. You can't be personal. Be a tax attorney.

You'll make money and you won't want to kill anybody. Right. So that's what he said. He says that he knew about what was going on. He said that Roy had become a millionaire in prison by doing some computer shit. He said his mother was mouthing off up north. He said, you know, telling everybody that her son's so rich now god damn lady yeah he so they said it was uh they started an investigation and uh they do all this type of shit they look into everything and uh

they uh they do have this investigator look into shit and uh it's it's fucking interesting now the family is adamantly against him ever getting out of jail and everything like that but they they look into it and uh he says basically they sit down with a prisoner and tell him uh you jump through these hoops like a dog and you'll get out it started becoming quite evident that they were dead on course to release him at some point so he starts to get worried and uh getters says that he'll tell the department of corrections about the secret business so the department of corrections replied that a business that business does not exist and he's like it fucking does and they're like nope we checked it's nothing in there so getters tried to tell on him for the business, and the prison said, nope, you're wrong. Oh, boy.

That's that. So Jesus Christ. So Getters organized a campaign to stop him from getting parole, obviously, through public opinion. He wrote to the governor who didn't respond. He mounted a petition drive sending family members into the stores and bars of Crosby and Iron Range and canvassing everybody talking to people. Don't let him out. He appeared on local radio and television shows, spoke to political groups, told everybody to write the governor, allied himself with the National Victims Rights Group for murdered children.

I mean, you name it. It's wow. He does all this type of shit. Meanwhile, Myrtle's screaming about how her son's rich. Exactly. So in Minnesota, the power to parole to parole though none of that other shit matters power to parole rests solely with the commissioner of correction so you only have to convince that guy eventually eventually they would succeed in passing getter's law which transferred power of parole in first degree murder cases to a panel consisting of the governor, attorney general, and chief justice of the Supreme Court.

It goes to a lot of different people. In January 1993, he's up for parole, and they announce they will parole Roy. They have no idea. The commissioner here, Orville Pung, he said, this is a guy who represents no risk to the public he is probably an example the best example of a person who has changed i don't know of anybody who's been who has been so ready to get out it's just a person who have done done some remarkable things and so you know the brother's pissed the family's pissed did orville get a donation to his re-election committee what the fuck i don't know they're impressed that he is teaching people and doing and learned got a

bachelor's degree they they uh release him from prison july 23rd 1993 after 17 years in jail uh he's getting he gets like anonymous crank phone calls all the time right away saying how's it feel to be free too bad jeff can't be free and shit like that it's the family that's probably doing that no um carol michaels backs away she's been with him the whole time but she backs away when she realizes that he's in a relationship with his barbara hansen and she's doing him he's in a business with yeah um yeah her relationship uh it's fucking crazy so the Getters family hates him. They're still like trying to, you know, they still want him. Basically, they sue him.

They said, we can file a civil complaint. Yeah. So they do. And they said they file a civil complaint saying that Wahlberg offered an annual payment to the family of 5% of his net after income tax, after tax income, 80% of any inheritance or windfall earnings, and 50% of the proceeds from the sale of any business interest evidently for the rest of his life. That's what he said. So the, what is this, Jay?

He said, my original intent in turning, oh, this is him. My original intent in turning my life around in prison was to try and succeed economically in order to create an educational or business investment trust for your family there was nothing I could do to bring back the life that was lost but I had to at least try to do something positive I'd like

to try to do that again you mean ever yeah for the first time yeah so the offer was rejected though and they go into it further because they're talking about it, and he's like, the brother's like, if I do that, then I have to root for you to succeed. I don't want to root for this guy to succeed. That's a great point. For our family to make money, this guy's got to make millions of dollars.

I don't want him to make millions of dollars. Fuck this guy. So he's like, I really not really into that uh so they pursued the question of what became of the money uh they couldn't find his money too for a while it's it's bad uh walberg while they're coming after him he says oh god this is gonna fuck everything up because he's gonna come after me this is gonna go on and on and on and on and on. So now he starts claiming he's broke. He has no money, even though he definitely does. And lawyers are unsuccessful proving otherwise because he knows how to hide it.

So he said that he'd given away, loaned out, or lost everything. That's what he said. He has over $10,000 in credit card debt and his bank account's empty. And according to the books of DDI, he's not even making any money. So they end up with this big deal with a lifetime cap of $375,000 as the most money they can get. So that's how that works. And Jay Getter said, yeah, it's ironic, an eerie thing to know that financially I'm interested in his success. I don't like that.

Which, yeah. He said, what the family would really like would be if he just killed himself jesus christ yay wow okay jay i mean what are you gonna do so the station uh uh uh w minneapolis wccotv spent a year developing a 60 minute style expose on insight, the prison program. And it's called when prison pays off. And it basically makes everybody pissed off that people are going to jail and learning how to make money to do things is how that works.

So he's trying to piss everybody off. But I mean, you know, you got to do something. What do you want them to do i mean would you rather they just sit in there and rot and then come out and be a fucking drain on all of us or would you like them to go in there get corrected and be a functioning member of society exactly with some supervision and lack of trust but maybe pay some fucking taxes would be nice yes that's it help out but instead, before the show aired, the state had shut everything down. The computers and financial records were seized, and the four inmates on contract to DDI were

locked out of their offices. Roy Wahlberg basically was able to bullshit people that they had technical problems for a while, but after about 30 days, he had to close everything down. He said the Department of Corrections basically would clear it all up, but then he thought he was fucked he's like i'm so fucked he said the department of corrections he said uh they took all my shit i'm totally screwed i can't do the business oh by the way on some of their computers they found child pornography on there on a hard drive and announced it to the press that they had sent computers to the fbi so now he goes oh i'm fucked now now that's connected to my business oh that's his favorite

he's totally fuck he said but after the wrongful death suit i don't have the money besides suing the agency in charge of your parole may not be the best idea because he's on fucking parole so he says maybe i'll give up he says quote in times past people went down with their ship that's exactly what i'm inclined to do it's the honorable thing well i called my parole officer and asked if it was possible to have my parole revoked and they said no stupid that means we have to pay for you that's not how this works it's not a fucking motel that you can check into every once in a while no it's not the hojo um yeah so so he says that there's an old Native American principle that if your enemy has a knife to your throat,

you lean into it to rob him of the pleasure of your fear. I want to lean into the knife. It's like the ultimate fuck you. I'm leaning into their knife and they don't fucking expect it or like it. He says they want to control, but the only way the state or the family had power

is if he started caring about being free. That's he said so he expected to be arrested and um he said he even tried to kill himself he said he ran his car in his closed garage he said but that damn mitsubishi was too efficient i was in there all day long it takes no gas it takes no gas it runs very lean i don't know what to tell you so he said not long after a friend of his told uh said that roy loaned an old prison acquaintance his car and it had been used to commit a crime and so uh that's he said he's being looked into and he expects to be arrested and he does but not for that no february 1995 roy is arrested for possession of lsd that's how they bust him that's a 500 000 bail 25 years in prison and a provoked parole is what they're talking about with him uh his parole is going to be revoked all this shit the story

this is wild there's a woman named heather uh who he met at a pie shop okay tony a friend of heather's wanted to sell roy some lsd jason who was a young homeless man who'd been living with roy and uh and uh michelle who was walberg's latest girlfriend and kathy who was 15 who was a runaway were all hanging out jason the homeless guy and kathy the runaway had gone in roy's truck to a meeting with tony the drug dealer in a parking lot of the fanta suite motel in suburban burnsville on minneapolis's head to buy lsd yeah jason who was carrying 150 of what he said was roy's money called Roy from the motel to say that the truck wouldn't start. Roy and Michelle drove down to help.

Soon the truck started and in its cab, Jason handed the sheet of 100 hits of acid to Roy. In an instant, a swarm of agents from the South Metro Task Force arrested everybody, but not Jason, not Michelle, only Roy. The meeting had been a setup. Tony was a police informer jason um had turned on walberg and implicated him afterwards when they caught him uh and that's how that ended up happening police claim they hadn't targeted walberg and didn't know about his record until after the arrest just a lucky they don't know about him in minneapolis got him it's a lucky snack um yeah jay uh said that his jay getters the family there they said the family was elated about his arrest they loved it um yeah

they they get him uh possession of lsd as well as a tea handled knife they revoke his parole send him back to stillwater for at least another three years Wahlberg's mother closed the office that he had sold or gave away his computers, put shit in storage. And everybody that worked there went went off to work. He said, quote, I wasn't going to buy acid. I knew the cops were down there. I think he likes to sound smarter than he is. You can't know what it feels like to be the focal point of all that negative energy you can read about it the newspapers but you're not sitting there as the focal point having the pressure from reporters and listening to the direction they're going you question everything

after a while especially yourself yeah you're a piece of shit man yeah he said there's this he's a terrible human being he is he said this is a story about hatred gearing up after two fucking decades and ruining a beautiful person no he called himself a beautiful person is this guy does he sound like there's there's certain people he sounds like this is a story of you doing this to me even though i've done all this horrible shit i'm an awful human being and now it's come home to roost and it's your fault. Listen to this. I looked in the mirror the other day and thought, okay, what do you think? Thought, I've ruined my life.

I've done this. Where'd my teeth go? Nope. Quote, I could have been a professional. I could have been a contender. Fucking idiot. I could have been somebody. 2004, he is up for parole.

Yes, he is up for parole and he is denied parole. And he will not be up again for six more years after that. They do transfer him, though, to transferred from Lino Lakes to Oak Park Heights because of medical reasons. I know he was Lino. Yeah, I know. I know. He says he was they denied him parole due to disciplinary problems. He he's a dick.

He's a dick. Basically, he won his early parole, obviously. But then he's right back in there and he's stuck. Now, Jeffrey's parents, Getter's parents, they died. Katie died in 2007. Stan died in 2008. Jay's still around, though. Roy seems to be, as we can see still in prison oh there he

is never got out he has the most roy face he looks like a fucking roy doesn't that is roy hi roy he never got back out dude wow he got arrested they got it for lc 95 they've got him for 25 years no they just yanked his parole. They've never given him parole again. Wow. He got denied his parole and denied again and denied. He just keeps getting denied now. Now he's fucked. Stick around, Roy.

There he is. He's either in MCF Stillwater. I have two different find a prisoner things. Either in MCF Stillwater or in MCF Oak Park Heights. I cannot believe how Roy he is he is so fucking roy there he is and jeffrey is buried at the uh where is he at the lakewood cemetery in crosby minnesota that is beautiful though isn't that nice what a nice it's a picture of his headstone they have like really nice uh like a garden like flower baskets on like black like planter things around it so it's just these beautiful flowers coming down in front they have flowers growing in front of it in front it's

fucking gorgeous man like that's the grave you want right there absolutely that's all three of them too that's jeffrey mother oh that's father so that's the three of them in one big plot there on that thing so and that's nice it sucks that they're dead jeffrey's you know he should have been he should have been somebody he should have been 65 years old right now he's born the same year as my dad right you know what i mean he just died at 19 that sucks and this asshole though still in prison so fuck him hilarious i don't feel bad for roy walberg he can eat dicks yeah so uh hope you enjoyed that goddamn show that's a crazy what a ride right i mean that's a wild ride all like we were drinking and driving drinking driving tripping all day they're swerving everywhere man all sorts of

shit going on there wow if you liked it tell us about it tell the world about it get on apple podcast that purple icon tell everybody give us five stars it really really does help drive you up the charts we have no goddamn idea why in addition to that head over to shut up and give me murder.com for all of your crime and sports and small town murder needs right and we know you have needs listened and if you don't listen to crime and sports you're out of your mind listen to crime and sports trust us you need to hear crime and sports and also that listen to small or uh listen to uh psa hate this movie as well because i have to watch terrible terrible romantic comedy so make it worth my while that said also you want

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and damn it we respect you and on top of that if you would like to just just be a nice person say you want good karma you still want to be a producer yeah want to get your name mispronounced but you just want good karma you can donate on paypal as well using our email address crime in sports at gmail.com which is also a good way to get a hold of the show that said said, Jimmy, I think I need. Yeah. No Roy's. Please. No Roy's. I need the list of people who would never, ever, ever attack us with a hatchet after

sharing a bottle of banana liqueur with us. Hit me with those names right now, please. This week's executive producers are Liz Vasquez, Jordan Bennett, C.J. Buford, Trent Pearson, Filipino sex thing. Oh, good. That's helpful. You know you're doing something right at that point. Cody Ingram, George Neiman, and it's Eric Kohlkamp's birthday.

Happy birthday, bud. Happy birthday. Indeed. Other producers this week are Aaron Ozi and his girlfriend edna lopez uh yes bizarrely listen linda pata uh aaron doesn't want you to be his girlfriend anymore no no that sounds bad yeah it's not but he would prefer it if he called you his fiance uh for a short time and then hopefully call you his wife uh when you guys set on a date if you're okay with that take the ring from him right this second yes it's beautiful

right it's nice now start crying some of those happy tears and go be crazy kids call your sister you know facetime with your cousin and show her the ring it's gonna be unless you said no then it's aaron's. So I assume congratulations. And we're terribly sorry, Aaron, that we did this poorly for you. But we hope it works out. Congrats. The producers are Jen at Your Fandom or Mine. Brian Sprott.

Congrats on the weight loss, Brian. Keep going. James Marder. Jennifer Stevens. Peyton Meadows. Carl Kirshner's wife, Christy, had a birthday this week. Happy Brian. Keep going. James Marder, Jennifer Stevens, Peyton Meadows, Carl Kirshner's wife, Christy, had a birthday this week. Happy birthday.

Amanda Knight. Somehow I put an umlaut over the U. I don't know how I did that because you guys told me to type this stuff and now that's happening. How did you find the umlaut, Jimmy? What's going on here? I have no idea

i can barely scroll we're lucky i can scroll through these somehow i put a fucking umlaut in here amanda knight thomas de mello shay foden in australia marcos genara Jesus fuck Amanda Jacobs Monroe Quesada's boyfriend No that's best friend Her name's Emily and she had a birthday Happy birthday That's terrific Emily happy birthday Grant Stansberry Joseph nope that's Joshua

Francoeur Shanice Iorera. Bonner. Jude Kendall. John Percival. Zach Bonilla. Chris Mahi's giant cock. I can read that.

Holland's sour. Good for him. Evelyn Vallez. Joanna Ahern. She's fantastic. She's tearing it up. She's a wonderful woman. Janice Hill, Alexander Ciappiella's girlfriend, Kayla.

Jesus. I got to write better. She had a birthday, though. Happy birthday, Kayla. Happy birthday. Mark Drazinovich, Tanya Van Kampen, Mackenzie McLean, Thomas Smith, Trey Volkanar, Ashley Veo, Steve Schnell, Chris Bartley, Corey Cyphers, Ashley Berlage, I think Berlage. Okay, here, listen.

Did you have a stroke in the middle of that? No, those were all letters, I swear. You finally killed Jimmy, everybody. You did it. That name broke him. Mateu de Merm. His tongue fell out. It's over.

Robin with no last name. Carrie Cribb. Jason Lonegro. Final Sin. Sarah Svoboda. What Moyer, Kickstand with no last name, Laura Haddock, Christina with no last name, Georgia Bokow, Seth Miller, Stephen Sparks, Aiden Lovelie, Kristen Kirsten, Lowsome, Charles Rivera Jr. You're doing great, Jimmy.

You are. John McCarthy. Somebody wrote that. Well, see, you needed the encouragement. They knew it. It's true. Eduardo Villanueva, William Lepkowski, Michael Roberts, Ellen, oh boy, Elin, Engelbert Stoder. Wow, that's a handful there. I got to work harder at this.

Lexi Bean. Allison Carbaugh. Crystal Witt. Taylor LeMaster. Stephanie Utter. Monica Thornburg. Tom Jones. Ambrali Drew.

Sherry Sandoval. Lori Donaghan. Margarita Dixon. Vinnie Caputo. Fa Nate. Didixon, Vinnie Caputo, Fa Nate. Did you say Vinnie Caputo? I did. I have an uncle named Vinnie Caputo. That's pretty funny.

I don't think it's him, but I have an uncle named Vinnie Caputo. Shockingly. Is that surprising to everybody? Is that surprising that I have an uncle named Vinnie Caputo? Should surprise no one. named Vinnie Caputo. Should surprise no one. Jacob Gibson, Raymond Ramone Ponce,

Daniel Lawson, Marie Spaulding, Vox Payne, Andrew Steffen, Sunlit, Jimmy Feeney, Nicolette Keveny, DZ Heart ND, I don't know what that is. Catherine Callahan. I saw MD at the end. No, ND, not MD, Nn like north dakota i thought you said

md i was like a doctor man that person's a medical professional sir i don't know what the fuck that is joe yagielli yagiello uh tell ray sherman colby roberts jess perando ashley thielman nate sumter jamone would know last name or jayman christina felipe felipe philippe jonathan goldsmith holden smith eric kohler jennifer quintana yes uh mike's big banana tyler lamb chloe would know last name. Nick Howard. Bridger Fate, I think. I'm never going to know. Kat Evoli. Ivley. Karen O'Donnell.

Ryan Licio. Real fake person. Jeff Crowder. Monica Silva. Ren Jaeger. Ryder Beckard. A, what is this? Is that Amanda and I put a comma?

A comma and a Cipollini? Cipollini? Cipollini? Cipollini? This is what Jimmy sounds like in an Italian restaurant. I'll have the... I'll have the Cipollini. I'll have the Cipollini. Excuse me?

Scusi senor. Scusi senor. It's so embarrassing. The Chip-a-Chal-a-weenie. Excuse me? Excuse me, sir. Excuse me, senor. That's so embarrassing. Gustavo Pinedo, Audrey Martinuzzi, Brandon with no last name, Sundra Lemanski, Ingborg Slinning, Emma Grace, Aaron Schaus, Tim Kunkelman, Stephanie Quinto, Frog Pond Farm, Vanessa Hagler, Mark Lampier, Zach Pennington, Steve Zaccaranda, Don Dickinson, Ricky Elaine, Jimmy Hall, Mike Brown, Francesca and her asshole but not a scumbag boyfriend, Sebastian celebrated their sixth Valentine's

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Kayla Demi Lameri Barkley Nope Carver and Chastity Chris Brown hope you stop beating women please Cody Bell. Andy B.

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You guys are fantastic. Thank you so much for everything you do for us. We can't do it without you. Thank you, everybody, so much. Honestly, we cannot do any of this without you, and we just appreciate the shit out of everything you do for us we can't do it without you thank you everybody so much honestly we cannot do any of this without you and we just appreciate the shit out of everything you do for us so just thank you so much what if they wanted to get a hold of you and thank you oh you know where we're at there's enough you know where twitter handles and instagram there's plenty of people you know how to find you don't need to follow me well but if you do you know where i'm at you'll find it yeah you google

search people and yeah that all shows up. Jimmy James, small town murder. They'll pop up. Every one of them. It'll all pop up. And that's the same thing for me. You can find me on there, too. So we just want to thank you for everything you do for us. This one was crazy.

Everything. Yeah, we had so much fun doing this. We hope you had a lot of fun as well. And yeah, I hope everybody's not as mad as the Getters family is. I totally understand where they're coming from. Oh, Jay is pissed. It's a tough way to live like that, though, to let that eat you up inside. Jay, for hanging on to it and fighting to the end.

That's great. Gotta do it. I love it. That's what he wants to do. He can do it. So, yeah, I think it's time to that time again and decompress. Thank you again, everybody. And until next week, it's been our pleasure.

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