Small Town Murder - #225 - The Baby Faced Serial Killer - Woonsocket, Rhode Island

Episode Date: May 27, 2021

This week, in Woonsocket, Rhode Island, when women begin to disappear, investigators begin to think that there may be a serial killer at work. But they have no idea what kind of door they've opened, once they get to interrogate their best suspect. What they hear is a tale of confusion, brutality, and absolute horror at the things that happened in one particular home! Along the way, we find out that some people live in places that they seem to hate, that several missing women is never a good sign, and that when you wan to dismember someone badly enough, you make the tools you have work for you!! Hosted by James Pietragallo & Jimmie Whisman New episodes every Thursday! Donate at: patreon.com/crimeinsports or go to paypal.com & use our email: [e-mail] Go to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things Small Town Murder & Crime In Sports! Follow us on... twitter.com/@murdersmall facebook.com/smalltownpod instagram.com/smalltownmurder Also, check out James & Jimmie's other show, Crime In Sports! On iTunes, Stitcher, or wherever you listen to podcasts# See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

You're listening early and ad-free on Wondery Plus. What if you married the love of your life and then stood by them as they developed 21 new identities? What would you do? This Is Actually Happening is a weekly podcast that features extraordinary true stories of life-changing events told by the people who lived them. Listen to the newest season of This Is Actually Happening on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. This week in Wound Socket, Rhode Island, women begin disappearing and investigators start to suspect a serial killer, but they never imagine the horrors that they eventually uncover. Welcome to Small Town Murder.

Hello, everybody, and welcome back to Small Town Murder. Yay! Oh, yay indeed, Jimmy. Yay indeed. My name is James Petrigallo. I'm here with my co-host. I am Jimmy Wissman. Thank you, folks, so much for joining us. Jimmy, you're yay. Very enthusiastic today. I like that. He loaded it up. He put his head back like a coyote in a cartoon.

He had to give it a pause and then let it out. Good job, Jimmy. Thank you, folks. Alvin is the blood moon. That's right. Thank you, everyone, for joining us. We appreciate it more than you could know. Back again.

It's been crazy lately with the show. Lots of crazy stories lately. And today, oh boy, today's the one we've been kind of sitting on for years, actually, waiting to go back to Rhode Island to do it. And it's a crazy episode. We'll get to that. We'll get the town stuff done very quickly today because there's a lot of murder to talk about here. Oh, yeah. Very quickly, though, I want to thank all of you out there for, number one, your reviews this week. Thank you for that. Apple podcast, that purple icon, giving us all of you out there for, number one, your reviews this week. Thank you for that.

Apple Podcast, that purple icon, giving us five stars helps us for some reason. We don't know why, but thank you for doing it. Please do it if you haven't. Head over to ShutUpAndGiveMeMurder.com right now. Right now. Immediately. Go. Go.

Check out all, first of all, merchandise. Tons of merchandise. Shirts and shoes and bags and things and stuff and mugs and you name it. We have it on there. Check all that out and check out tickets to live shows because they are coming, hopefully, to your area. All throughout, we have the very end of 2021 and then most of those are sold out. But I think there's a couple with New York has tickets and then 2022 going. And I think we are going to, we confirmed our Nashville date.

Yes. The Nashville live show that's been delayed many, many times will be January, what is it, the 11th or 12th? 11th? 11th and 12th? Early January. It's going to be 11th or 12th. It'll be up on, we'll put it on social media.

Shut up and give me murder.com. You can check it out there. So check all that out. Get your tickets to live shows. Check out Crime and Sports also if you haven't done that. And also check out P.S. I Hate This Movie because I have to watch terrible movies. I got Justin Timberlake last week. I got Twilight coming up this week.

I got my hands full over here. So check that out. And most of all, check out Patreon because Patreon is going crazy. It's where we do it. It's so good. Last week, the last one was the Richard Ramirez Childhood which was bonkers. And then

this week, our two bonus episodes are going to be number one for Crime and Sports, which you'll have access to because you have access to everything, the whole back catalog, both shows, is backstage wrestling fights. So you don't have to care about sports to hear about two righted up guys,

probably on other drugs as well, beating the crap out of each other in a locker room. That's, that's going to be funny over something that they probably shouldn't have. Oh yeah. It's a ridiculous things. That's fun stuff. And then small town murder.

We're going to do something that we do every once in a while. All the returning ones are favorites. So ones that we do more than once, we're going to go back into the newspaper archives and find some bat shit crazy old timey murders late 1800s early 1900s the murders were just

weirder back then I don't know why and the reporting of them was so yeah the attention paid to it is crazy so matter of fact so check that out patreon.com slash crime and sports right now for all of that. Better disregard for human life.

It's just insanity. You have to hear these things. These old accounts of murder are wild. So like we said, Patreon.com slash crime and sports and you'll be a producer so you'll get a shout out at the end of the show. Jimmy is going to mispronounce your name horribly and if you just want to have your name mispronounced, be a producer and have great get a shout out at the end of the show. Jimmy is going to mispronounce your name horribly.

And if you just want to have your name mispronounced, be a producer and have great karma and our undying affection. You can do that over at PayPal using our email address, crime and sports at Gmail dot com. Thank you. Thank you. Honestly, quickly, the disclaimer. This is a comedy show. Now, what it is, there's going to be horrible murders. That's what happens here at Small Town Murder. But we're comedians, so we're going to we're going to find jokes places. That's the thing. That's what happens here. It's small town murder. But we're comedians, so we're going to find jokes places.

That's the thing. That's what we do. We can't help it. It's just what happens if we were to talk about this and it's not recording. We'd make jokes. Thing is, we don't make jokes about certain things. We go out of our way to not make jokes about the victims or the victims' families. Why?

Because we're assholes. But? But we're assholes but but we're not scumbags jimmy that's how it works here there's plenty to talk about like what made you think you could get away with murder stupid that's funny making fun of a murderer is funny there's things like that that you can talk about around a murder the idea i think i'll kill that person that's a crazy idea that deserves to be looked at. So, that said, if you think that true crime and comedy maybe should never ever cross paths, maybe

we're not for you. We don't want to hear any complaining afterwards. But if you want to hear a crazy story and hang out, I think it's time to sit back and shout, shut up and give me murder. That's right. Sorry, I went off on that one.

Kind of took that one over. I apologize. Jimmy just stopped and looked at me like, Jesus Christ. Good Lord, man. I put my head back like you when you did your yay there. That was a lot. It was a murder to the moon there. So let's do this.

Let's go on a trip, Jimmy, shall we? Let's get this rig rolling. Let's do it. Let's head out of the moon there. So let's do this. Let's go on a trip, Jimmy, shall we? Let's get this rig rolling. Let's do it. Let's head out of the Midwest there. We're down south, out west, Apache Junction. Yeah. And let's head all the way to the East Coast over here. All right.

To the smallest state in the country by far. Yeah. You can just basically throw a baseball across it and get it to the ocean. We're going all the way to Rhode Island, baby. Woon socket, Rhode Island. Woon. Woon socket. Like W-O-O?

W-O-O-N socket, like a wrench. That's it. Woon socket, Rhode Island. I was like, is there a weird pronunciation? Nope. Woon socket. That's it. Is this Woon?

Woon? Who knows? pronunciation nope wound socket that's it is this wuan who knows uh it's in northeastern rhode island kind of right up at the tip off the top of it it's the whole state's just a panhandle so it doesn't matter enjoy your your panhandle re tiny pan tiny pan that's it it's all in the pan 20 minutes over to providence because everything is close in rhode island because it's not that big. And Providence is the big city there. About an hour to Boston. It's kind of a Providence feels like it's a Boston suburb. That's like Massachusetts to probably annex all of that.

Right. It's pretty much they get like Massachusetts news, like the Red Sox scores are at the top of the newscasts and shit like that. So part of New england yeah it's an hour to little compton rhode island which was that was our last rhode island episode episode 139 this is 225 right now so that's how long ago october 3rd 2019 was the last time we visited rhode island so was there a mention of like a little mc ren or something like that oh we had a lot there was a lot a little there was a there a mention of like a little MC Ren or something like that? Oh, we had a lot. There was a lot of little, there was a lot.

A lot of little guys. A lot of little somethings there. All sorts of little jokes in that episode. It's in Providence County, area code 401, eight square miles. And their motto here is, I mean, Jesus, they have two mottos that are like real mottos that are on the website that are true. One is a city on the move, which is pretty lame. I hope you didn't hire someone to come up with that one. And then the other one, it says all over the website, quote, getting it done.

So then there's a third motto. Is that like New England hillbilly for get her done yeah that's what i mean right city on the move so they're moving and getting done so then the third one which is kind of more you know they don't put it right on the website but you know it's there is you know where i can get some coke because i i have to i'm on the move and i gotta get a lot done so yeah i need coke so uh we'll go over very quickly with the history. Not and we won't do too much. A lot of this place is hugely influenced by French culture.

A lot of French. Yeah. A lot of French Canadians moved here for some reason. The city had the sixth largest population of French or French Canadian foreign nationals in the entire country in 1913. So back then. Now, reviews of this town. We'll let the people from the town tell you about the town more than we will today. All right.

Here's a five star. Okay. Five stars. So this is as good as it gets. Quote, it has a good. And by the way, just to remind you again, we didn't write these reviews. People all say review people get mad they fucking message me about it and they're like how dare you i'm like i didn't write that

that was someone wrote that and then i said here's a review of it i don't understand how that's my fault like how is that me you wouldn't go like see a yelp review of a restaurant you like and then go yell at, like, it doesn't make sense. It just makes no sense. Like, you know, uh, someone who read it and you yell at them,

like I didn't write it. I just read it to you. Right. So anyway, just to reach a re redress. Yeah. Five stars. It has,

it has a good amount of stores. There's a bus route that can take you anywhere in the city, and there's one that goes to Providence. Fantastic. There are plenty of schools with a brand new middle school. The people are from different cultures, but everyone seems to get along. We have our fair share of crime, but overall, it's a pretty safe place. That didn't sound like five stars to me. That sounded...

This is a real three-star wordy right it had a three-star energy to it so four stars here very short four stars pretty close to perfect the city of wound socket has been dying for years while cities that neighbor us are improving year by year how's that four stars what the fuck is happening imagine how great it was when it had five stars then if it only it's been dying for years it feels like the mayor's just been telling everybody give us five stars say whatever you want yeah you get like a free meal at the diner or something if you all right here we go the mayor's treating it like we treat our reviews yeah exactly as long as there's five stars i don't care if you

say it's a piece of shit yeah just say five stars that's great uh here's a one star not so happy yeah this is this is all very a lot of personal stuff here one star quote i got jumped a couple days ago okay there you go needed 1k in surgery on my mouth worst place i ever lived second most dangerous city in rhode island we also have nearly double the pedophiles in the national average of 18.1 we have 30.2 pedo capital that don't that's not the motto by the way city on the move pedo capital those things um also city on the move city on the move kids are at the playground yeah because they're chasing kids that's why they're on the move it's on the move or on the on the move after these pedophiles if i have the energy they have i'd bottle it jesus okay uh also

more rape and woony than chicago or boston Jesus. What? What's happening? Maybe per capita? I mean, I don't know. I can't imagine in total. I don't recommend anybody moving here. Too much crack, heroin, violence, burglaries, rape, and pedos. Really should just be nuked. Just go to real site. Everything here in Woonie is rated an F besides amenities.

Okay. Wow. That person had it in for them. They really hate it. Bad stuff. One year or one star one year because the first sentence is I've only lived here a little over a year. So I'm like one year. I've only lived here a little over a year.

And so far there have been two shootings and one fatal stabbing very close to where I live. Jesus. The woman was stabbed to death. Only one street over. Whoa. The Woonsocket Police Department are so useless that the Rhode Island State Police had taken over. I do not know if the state police still have

control of the city or not. There are pictures on Facebook of officers asleep in their police cars while on duty. They are worthless. From what I understand, if you are arrested on a Friday and have to remain in their jail until Monday, you barely get anything to eat if anything at all. They are a complete waste of financial resources that could be used to clean up the area and streets.

Jesus Christ. I mean, does that person think that cops go out like Batman? I don't know what they're doing. We have to wait for a crime and then we do the paperwork. That's the job. Well, yeah, you can't really go out and thwart things that haven't happened yet. It's not a proactive thing. What does this guy think happened?

It's hard. This isn't my, you know, what is that? What the hell is that movie where they know your thoughts? What the fuck was that? The Matrix? No. I don't know. Tom Cruise, Mel Gibson.

One of those. Either a Scientologist or a Nazi. One of the two was in it. I don't fucking remember. Anyway, one star. One star. This is the worst city in Rhode Island that I have ever lived. The crime is horrid. The drug deals and dealers are abundant. Well, I mean, if there's all those drug deals, there's going to be a lot of dealers to make

them. I would assume that's just logic. Fill the quota. That's just logic, sir. Sorry. The area is just trashy and neglected. The majority of the residents are scum and have no desire to change for the better. Wow, that's a solid, that's a really pointed barb there. I wouldn't even drive through this city before I ended up living here due to extenuating circumstances. I am doing everything in my power to get out of Woonsocket.

Disgusting. Last sentence is just disgusting, period. And finally, last one, two stars. I think the city has definitely taken a wrong turn crime-wise. I just feel like I've been noticing a lot of people getting arrested. Maybe they're getting arrested for small things, but either way, they're still getting arrested. Therefore, I definitely feel the city could improve drastically because otherwise the future generations will have the drug addicts as their role models and won't have bright futures.

Because they're arresting all the good people? I don't know. That sounds like a 12-year-old wrote that as part of a book report that they got cut. So population of this town peaked in population in 1950. So that tells you a lot. It's been here. Now it's population 41,508. It's down about 5% since 1990. Everything's very average,

male, female population, median age. It's all the same, 37 and a half is the median age. Few less married people than normal race of this town here. 65% white, which is pretty close to the national average. 6.4% black, which is about half the national average. 7.2% Asian, which is pretty close to the national average. 6.4% black, which is about half the national average. 7.2% Asian, which is a little over. And 17.3% Hispanic, which is pretty on the money as far as the national average. So it's a pretty diverse town in terms of that. More than normal, honestly. We have religion here. 54.4% are religious.

Jimmy, I'm going to give you one guess what the majority of the people are religion wise here. Catholic. I win. Catholics are the Baptists of the North and they comprise forty five percent of the population here. So that's a that's a lot. We have a Presbyterian or two. One point two percent Jewish. Get out of here.

Hava Nagila. Hava Nagila. Hava Nagila. I don't know the words. Hey. I like how Jimmy sings like a, he's like harmonizing with me. Yeah. He's like Nagila.

He's like Nagila. I'm like that hype man that just throws the like. Like the Cypress Hill guy? Yeah. Come on. Perfect. Last election, 60.5% of the people voted Democrat in Providence County. 37.6% voted Republican.

About 2% Independent. Unemployment rate here, high. It's 9.8% right now. My God. Which is national average is about six. It's 9.8% right now. My God. Which is national average is about six. So that's up, we'll say. Almost twice the people here make under $15,000 a year than normal.

And the median household income here, $38,340 a year, which is about $20,000 shy of the national average. For New England, this has to be the brokest community. That's what I mean. It is. And it's not that cheap either. It's not like it's super cheap to live here. Yeah. Cost of living overall is 100.

Here it's 103. Its average is 100. Here it's 103. So it's not cheap. Median home cost here, $207,800. Wow. So it's tough. $207,800. Wow.

So it's tough. And if we have convinced you, damn it, the only place for you to live is Woonsocket, we have for you the Woonsocket, Rhode Island Real Estate Report. Your average two-bedroom rental here goes for about $990 a month, which is a couple hundred below the national average, about $250 below. I found a three-bedroom, two-bath, 1,346-square-foot house here. It's a decent, clean house. They're very excited about their new roof. That's just all over the listing everywhere.

Even across the top, it's a red bar that says, New R roof. I'm like, holy shit. They're really into it. $219,000 for this though. That's like your average size house with your average cost of it. I found a five bedroom, three bath, 2,592 square foot house. A little bigger. It's okay. It needs a lot of updating. It's pretty 80s in there. It's roomy, though. It's got a lot of room. There's an above ground pool in the back, so there's that. He's saying that in Arizona that doesn't exist, because it would be 140 degrees if that happened. You could boil it.

Roll that thing up and throw it in the trash. You could make soup in it there. It would just not work there. $299,000 for that, though. $300,000 for a five-bedroom house. Yeah, 2,600 square feet. You could fix that up, maybe. I don't know.

So here's a 12-bedroom, six-bath, three-family home. It's an apartment on each floor. Sure. 3,878 square foot total. So, you know, 1,200 or 1,300 a piece about not the greatest, but you can rent out your mortgage payments. So there's that $629,000 for that to be a landlord of three people. That's a great deal. Not bad, right? That's not bad. So there's some deals, but I don't know if you want to make them because then you

have to stay here. So that's a problem. Things to do. I found not a lot going on here. Crack seems to be the main thing to do from what everybody says. From everything I read, there's just a lot of crack. Even in our story, there's some people that have problem. It's crack. It's 2021, man. Stop with the crack. It's an issue.

Heroin crack. Now, here one is Autumn Fest this is uh yeah oh yeah began in 1977 held over columbus day weekend they have food row lots of food a beer tent yeah of course um midway rides so i assume it's like carousels and uh fucking ferris wheel or shit like that yeah sporting events jimmy you want to know what they have i do dodgeball number one like men playing dodgeball after they've hit the beer tent which is dangerous they want us to go watch this but i don't know i think you're participating in it okay then there's mega war which is that quote new england's largest tug-of-war event oh my so it's just a big i thought it was gonna be

like war played with giant playing cards nope i got it too shit uh arts and crafts boots uh consumer showcase entertainment great entertainment at the bandstand they don't tell you who's coming so you know that's not gonna be great and then fireworks and a parade so there's that then also the french heritage festival and soiree of course there you go throw out your armpits and get in here let's do it uh you get they're going to have paws from the pawtucket red socks i assume the mascot mascot yeah bobo the clown will be there. So James won't. There would be clown blood on the walls if I was there. That won't happen.

There we go. And then Our Lady of Queen Martyrs Hall. That's the location. $10. And it says you get dynamites and beverage. I assume that's some sort of French snack or something that makes you shit. I don't know what that is. Dynamites. Dynamites?

I don't want to eat anything that's called dynamite because I feel like that's going to come out wrong. That's either way. Crime rate. Crime. We're interested in here. The meat of this whole deal. Fuck.

Yeah. Property crime is actually everyone's high crime, high crime. But the actual crime rate is not that bad. I don't know if that's just because the last year because everybody's been inside. So but it's still compared to the national average, so I would assume that it would still be higher because it would all be equal. But property crime is just slightly above average,

just slightly above. And then violent crime, murder, rape, robbery, and assault, the Mount Rushmore of crime, obviously, is just about at average, just slightly like a 2% high or something. So it's not, you know, statistically not that bad. It's not unreasonable. No, no, it's really not.

So we have to, let's talk about a murder. Yeah, let's do that. Let's get into this. It's a long, it's a deep one. So I want to give it its due and give it its time. That's why we cut the town a little short here. First of all, I have to give credit to RhodeIslandMonthly.com. These two people who wrote an article, John Larrabee and Russ Olivo, wrote an article that was pretty good.

It encompassed a lot of good information. There's a couple things in there that people didn't have as far as interviews go. And there's a book, too, that I'll mention at the end that they that was written on this subject that really good information came out of. That's where the article got most of their info. But then they did some some backup or follow up reporting that was pretty damn impressive. So good shit there. Now, let's go back to July of 2004. Okay. Let's start there. In July of 2004, parts, and I say parts, of a human body are found in a landfill in Johnston, Rhode Island. Yikes. Yeah.

Somebody sees something. There's a torn bag, and somebody sees a limb or something. Do we know how that was found? Is it just like workers there? Yes. Somebody just came across it. I mean, that's who knows if somebody looking for, you know, people that love someone refurbishing furniture and shit.

They're looking for like a hubcap for a 72 Dodge Dart. They kind of cross. Yeah. Yeah. They get like half a torso instead. That's a whoops. The daisy. Whoops.

Didn't want to teach you to be cheap. That's shit. You know what? Get onbay with the rest of us just gonna say from now i gotta get a paypal account but still i think i can do it i gotta get on ebay i'm only 25 years behind that so we'll get on there if you hate ebay finding a body while while trash picking that'll get you right the fuck on there you know what what? Yeah, sometimes shipping is excessive, but guess what? I've never ever had anything shipped from eBay, had it arrive, open it up, and there was an arm in there.

That never happened once. Never a human foot in my package. It could happen, but it hasn't happened yet. Right. Jesus fucking Christ. Oh, boy. I ordered that starting lineup figure from 1989, and oh, boy, there's a foot in it. I thought this, uh, you know, starting lineup figure from 1989 and yeah, Oh boy,

there's a foot in it. I thought this box seemed heavy. Never happens. So anyway, uh, this, the, the parts that they find,

they end up identifying finally, uh, after a little while. And the woman is, it's a woman that we find out it's a 24 year old woman named Stacy Goulet. Shit. Uh, G O U L E woman named Stacy Goulet. Shit. G.O.U.L.E.T. Stacy Goulet.

French Heritage. There you go. Well, you got your wound socket. Nailed it. Yeah. She's clearly been dismembered and not all of her body parts are. We don't have all of a five. No, we have.

We have parts of her. Yeah. We find out she's a mother of two, which is awful. A seven-year-old boy named Dana, a three-year-old girl named Kimberly. So, I mean, yeah. Oh, by the way, she's also pregnant. Oh, no. Yeah, so.

Almost a mother of three. Not great. Horrible. It's very, very, it's awful, man. It's awful. Where are the kids? The kids are not with her. They weren't with her at the time that she disappeared.

So the kids are fine. She was just missing, which is good. Yeah, that's great. But the fact that she was pregnant and also she's a 24-year-old person, that sucks. That's horrible. She's been dismembered. Her family finds out. Her father says, you don't figure your kids

will go before you they're not supposed to i feel like my heart has been stolen away so you know that's not good um uh obviously awful every parent would would hate that especially 24 is young you know it's not like she was you're 85 and she's 53 and she got cancer or something and you're like oh i shouldn't have to bury my kid she's 24 that's a long life look yeah quite she's had a rough life though um especially lately she's had a rough life she's been trying to get her life together but she is addicted to drugs of all sorts of different variety and she's been walking the streets, if you know what I mean. So for, to get money for drugs. So,

um, yeah, her dad has been like, there's a one point her dad finds her on the street and talks to her and tells her, you're going to got to clean your life up and all that. And she's like, you know,

no, I'm not, you know, I'm not, I'm not doing turning tricks anymore. I'm not doing that. I'm just, you know,

trying to get by. And, you know, she was lying of course, but you know, it, you know, trying to get by. And, you know, she was lying, of course. But, you know, it's it's very sad, you know, that this happened. Yeah. She got in a bad spot in life here. And that was where she turned. And the problem is, too, they find she had been missing for a little while and now they find her. Now they're very worried about two other local women that are missing um because

they're afraid that they might have met the same fate obviously here are they are they her co-workers they are uh yes they are definitely they go to the same hr meetings these two uh here um one is audrey lynn harris uh she's 33 years old tiny Tiny, tiny little woman, Audrey Lynn Harris. She's five foot one, 100 pounds. So very, very tiny lady. She was last seen February 9th, 2003, walking on Arnold Street in Woonsock at Rhode Island. Rhode Island. She spoke to her mother on the telephone that day and she said that she was going to come visit, but then she never showed up to go there. She never was heard from again after that by her family at all. She just disappeared. She said that everyone said that even though she was on, you know, kind of on the street a little bit, she wasn't even didn't have like a set address. And, you know, obviously her habits and things would take her to different places. She was very uncharacteristic of her to not check in with her family and to just disappear without warning.

That was in February of the year before? That was in February of the year before. Almost a year and a half. Yeah. It's been a minute. This is almost a lot earlier. So, yeah. And the woman they found has not been dead for a year and a half either.

And she disappeared earlier in that year. So there's a spread here of a year and change of the disappearance. They don't know if they're connected or what. But the fact that three women disappear in less than two years that are all from the same area and all disappeared from the same area you know makes it kind of uh cause for pause exactly so she had three children as well audrey lynn harris obviously uh now april 3rd 2003 is when a detective paul savini was this uh it was assigned to investigate this case the disappear missing case of audrey harris yeah yeah. That her mother, Claudette, had filled out a missing person report saying she last spoke to her on February 9th and she never came by, even though she said she was going to

going to stop by. Claudette told the police that even though, you know, she said that the only thing she could tell her, she's a drug user. She doesn't have a permanent address. And the only thing she could tell her, she's a drug user. She doesn't have a permanent address. But it wasn't like her to not call home occasionally just to say she was okay because she knew her family worried about her. And she had a fondness for teddy bears.

They said if you find that she would have a teddy bear with her probably. She likes teddy bears and has teddy bears around her. I don't know if she had like a teddy bear. Claw machine participant. One of those are like those teddy bear backpack purses things in the early 2000s. I don't know if she had one of those. You know what I mean? Couple of key chains.

Yeah. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Just some teddy bear, general teddy bear, you know, stuff on you. Big business, those teddy bears. Oh, boy. Care bears wouldn't exist. No shit. Yeah. People love teddy bears. I people love teddy bears i guess they're fucking rad i guess because they're just like little babies

with like barriers you know they have the same proportions as a baby with an oversized head and like a round stomach short stumpy squeezable things is that it it's like perhaps you can squeeze the shit out of them and not hurt the baby is it a baby you can choke and not and still be okay i don't know not that why would anyone want to choke a baby i'm not sure but if you have the desire to do that i i think that i think i may i may be on the onto something but i think the origin of them was about teddy roosevelt the name yeah they named it after him but i wonder if they gave the first one to teddy and he's like hmm i like it the reason being it looks like a baby and when you choke it you get the feeling of choking a real child but without the after math of that obviously when you're choking the same

same size neck as a toddler i dig this i like it use my. Use my name. Use my name. But I don't know why they chose bears. I really don't. Or why they're the way the shapes there. Because bears don't look like that. Here's the thing. They don't. No. And also they picked a vicious animal, too.

Fuck yeah, they do. Bears are awesome because they're huge and they're fast and they're amazing. But they are fucking, they're like killing machines. I mean, good God. Like, that's that's something like here snuggle up with this a very effective uh meat garbage disposal is what it is yeah very effective you'd think you'd give there would just be like dogs that they would have but i guess you have a real dog so we need a stuffed dog for i suppose for kids i don't know what the hell have you ever seen a bear in the wild and thought for a second i'd love to snuggle that?

Yeah, yeah. You chase it down, you tackle it, and you try to hug it. That's what I do usually. It'd be great if you were declawed. I'd just snuggle the fuck out of you. Yeah, I'm sure those big teeth won't bother you at all either. This thing's gnawing on your head, just gnawing on Jimmy's skull. And it's like, I thought it was declawed!

I thought it was safe! Ouch. Those things are horrible animals. They're cool as shit though. Yeah, they're incredible and they're great for the ecosystem, but I don't want to be anywhere near one. They're like horses where you look at and you're like, how is that a thing?

You see like a grizzly bear, you're like holy shit, how does that exist in nature? It's like looking at a horse, you're like oh my god, look at that thing. How does that you see like a grizzly bear you're like holy shit how does that exist in nature like it's like looking at a horse you're like oh my god look at that thing how does that exist is that real there was a person at some point james that saw a horse and was like i'm gonna get on that yeah i bet if i ride that but look how fast it's running no no i'll catch it and i'll break its spirit and then i'll ride it. That's how fucking crazy people are. I'm going to beat the living shit out of that 2,000 pound animal. They saw a 1,500 pound fucking majestic, fast, muscular thing that clearly is in better shape than them. And they're like, I'll ride it.

And it's a whole family, really. And then I'll make it make more horses to ride. I'll ride it from New York all the way the fuck to Oregon. Watch me. That's some arrogant shit that we have. It really is. See that thing? No, no, I'll ride it.

See how beautiful it is? No, I don't want to watch it. I want to ride it. I'm going to use that instead of my legs. That's what I'm going to do. I'd like to harness this to the point where they'll use any measurement of power in the future to be based on this animal pulling things, because that's what I'm going to make it do.

Welcome to the small town of Chinook, where faith runs deep and secrets run deeper. In this new thriller, available exclusively on Wondery+, religion and crime collide when a gruesome murder rocks the isolated Montana community. Everyone is quick to point their fingers at a drug-addicted teenager, but local deputy Ruth Vogel isn't convinced. She suspects connections to a powerful religious group.

Enter federal agent V.B. Loro, who has been investigating a local church for possible criminal activity. The pair form an unlikely partnership to catch the killer, unearthing secrets that leave Ruth torn between her duty to the law, her religious convictions, and her very own family. But something more sinister than murder is afoot, and someone is watching Ruth. With an all-star cast led by Emmy nominee Sanaa Lathan and Star Wars Kelly Marie Tran, Chinook is available exclusively and ad-free on Wondery Plus. Join Wondery Plus It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid. We're your hosts.

I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well-researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch of humor. I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great.

A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother****er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal. Or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes. You should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts.

You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus and the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid. We're your hosts. I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well-researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch of humor. I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit

with a little bit of cursing. This mother f***er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal. Or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes, you should tune in to our podcast, Morbid.

Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. That's crazy. So Claudette, Audrey's mom, said that she had gone to talk to people at some of the local bars this is what she tells police that she did a little you know she did a little investigation yeah because she didn't want to go call the go to the police and then it turns out she was just hanging out with somebody and you know hold up with somebody yeah yeah so she talked to some of the people at the bars that audrey out at, but nobody had seen her in a while. So that's not normal for her. She's got a kind of a stomping ground that she hangs out on. So, yeah, her, you know, she was she's missing. And finally, by November 2004, because this is from, you know, April 2003, by November 2004, her mother just holds a memorial service for her, assuming that she's probably not with us anymore.

Obviously, you don't do that unless you've done enough reconnaissance. Is that what it is? Yeah, you've done a little recon on the situation here. Now, the detective looking into her case of her missing person found that she hadn't reported to her parole officer since she had been released from prison in 2003. She's released from prison in January, January 25th, 2003. So she was barely out of prison and she disappears and she never reported to her parole officer. So right away he's thinking maybe she's just jumping parole.

But still, it's it's a weird thing to do in this situation sure that doesn't make sense she'd been on probation for assault and battery as well as for resisting arrest at that point um so uh the detective contacted some of the vice squad cops but they told him that they hadn't seen her around either and they see all the ladies on the street yeah they're following this beat out yeah they know all these these ladies so uh he then he checks with all these other police departments just to find out if maybe somebody has her in custody on the off chance she you know got drove somewhere with someone had some drugs on her got picked up who knows um so he also just would go hang out down on the corner fucking fucking watch the corners, look waiting for it because they know he'd watch the drug spots because he knows she's going to cop at some point, probably if she's around and nobody there.

And then he'd find all the other women that are out and they would all say that she hasn't been in the area recently. It's crazy. So one of the women said she last saw Audrey at the end of January, right after she got out of jail. She said, yeah, she said she let Audrey take a shower at her house and gave her some clothes to wear. And she told the police that Audrey was seeing a corrections officer named Kerry from the adult correction institution who had given her a new winter jacket and some money. Okay. So she's saying he's she's this woman's yeah she's seeing some prison guard guy or something is that a gal or a girl carrie

we don't know we don't know that's the other k-e-r-r-y it's not even k-e-r-i like it's no it could be anything yeah we have no idea super confusing yeah we don't yeah they don't know so police track it down it is a man and that's who she's been with. Police track him down, and he doesn't work for the prison, but he had been a substance abuse counselor for the state, and that's how he met her. Got it. So shouldn't have been really fucking around with her anyway, but still. Borderline unethical? Is that the word? Yeah.

I don't think it's in the handbook to then help people, counsel them. And then when they're all better, take them out on a date, take them out for a night on the town when they're all better. See if she wants to go out dancing and see if you can get a piece. You know what I mean? I don't think that's how it was. So his name was Kerry Garner and he retired in March of 2002. Oh, yeah. So he's an older guy. He'd been the chief of treatment services for the substance abuse division of the Rhode Island Department of Mental Health. That's a fucking handle and a half. Does that fit on a card?

Holy shit. It's long. That's busy. That's busy. I got a lot of titles. There's a lot of words in what I. My title has a lot of words. I got to go.

Click. What do you do, sir? How much time you got? You got a while. much time you got let me let me ask you this could take a minute so uh yeah he worked there for 28 years and he'd known audrey for 10 years so known her for a while he's she is 33 so she's this has been going on a while with her he said that he got to know her a little better when she went from him for a referral for substance abuse treatment sometime around 2000. He said he referred her to the Talbot House in Providence, Rhode Island, for treatment. He said he last saw her on January 25th, 2003, when he picked her up in front of the public defender's office in Providence.

I guess that's when she got out of jail. her up in front of the public defender's office in providence i guess that's when she got out of jail he called her because she needed a ride home and he said he dropped her off at the top of west park place and moon socket and went on his way so i mean that's uh if that's true and he hadn't seen her since she'd been seen since then so i mean it's hard that's a sticky spot because at some point you're like uh you have to cut the ties and let her go away. At some point you got to stop being a helpful friend or I don't know, a tool, an instrument to keep her safe and not fucking be personal. Well, you can't do that with everybody. You can't have a personal relationship with everybody you talk to.

And this is a point now where the police, when they talk to a guy like this they have to go okay is he truly a good samaritan yeah is he just a nice guy who gave her a couple bucks in a winter coat and gave her a ride or is he you know a predator is he doing is he help these people so he can abuse them so that's what they're wondering at that point so uh they uh he said a few days later audrey called him to ask him for a ride to the adult correctional institution in Cranston so she could pick up some money she left in an account during her last incarceration. She's got some money on the book still in jail. She also wanted to pick up some clothes she left in his truck. I don't know why she'd leave clothes in his truck. I don't know if she was going somewhere where she couldn't carry them or what.

leave clothes in his truck i don't know if she was going somewhere where she couldn't carry them or what but uh he uh the garner guy said he could tell audrey was high and he didn't want to get involved with her problems at that point he's like i'm not gonna be your fucking ride everywhere and all that i could tell you're high so he told her he'd leave her clothes inside the door in the downstairs hallway of his house he's like so that's all i did so uh he said that she showed up to collect her stuff she rang the bell but he didn't want to see her. So he didn't answer the door. He could hear her talking out loud and cursing as she picked up her stuff and left. And that was that was the last he heard from her.

Yeah. She's like, motherfucker, asshole, piece of shit. Leave my son dressed by the door. And I was just supposed to pick my shit up in this trash bag. This is bullshit. How dare you shit out here and goddamn TJj maxx bags and shit like i'm fucking so uh garner said he had no idea where she was but he did know some of the people she hung out with and some of the places she stayed at so you know he said that she used to stay with some guy named pete on park avenue

and another guy named dave who lived on Avenue. Fifth and Park, both very fancy streets. Yeah, posh. Dumpy streets in Moon Socket. Those are different. Moon Hocket. In Moon Hocket, Rhode Island. That's where I'm staying now, Jimmy. So he also said that sometimes Audrey used to stay at his house

when she had no other place to go. The more they talked to him, the more they're like, you know, he's more involved. I him the more they're like you know he's more involved i just gave her a ride then it's like well i gave her a ride then i left her clothes outside but she only went to the inside of the door then it's like well she used to stay here sometimes kind of goes on and on she'd stay a couple nights then take a day then take off that's the way it was she'd probably come and clean up for a couple days and then go back out when she wanted to you know hit the track again and get drugs, I would assume. So she said that happened a few times. And she said he also said while Audrey stayed at his house, she also had sex with him.

Oh, boy. Oh, yeah. But apparently he made her sleep on his living room floor in his sleeping bag. He'd fuck her, but he wouldn't sleep in the same bed with her you know what kind of because she's a dirty street person so we you know i can't possibly let her sleep in my bed but you know what take those underwear off and let's get rocking you i'm i'm great now fuck i don't get anything you any any place you would put your dick you should be fine with that like you know touching your pillow or your sheets would put your dick, you should be fine with that touching your pillow or your sheets.

You put your dick inside of that. The outside should be fine. What are you doing? What the fuck is wrong with you? Clean enough to leave your cock in it. It's fine for your bed. Not to mention, I don't know, just some common niceness. If you're goodly enough to do that that i think you know at least you should have

a comfortable you should give her the good pillow as a matter of fact she's come on dude you're a retired treatment counselor or whatever the fuck you are you getting laid that often by someone 20 years younger than you you should be thrilled by this give her a knee pillow too one yeah you know what i mean don't let her legs stick together you You stay in the wet spot. Come on. You lay in that. Give her the good side. Perhaps the bed's just too small and he sprawls out. In that instance, then you sleep on the couch, motherfucker. Yeah, there you go.

Give her some comfort. Man. He also refused to let police search his apartment for any of her belongings as well. He wouldn't do it. He said, get a warrant if you want to come in. Yeah. They checked and determined that Audrey did withdraw $42.30 from her inmate account at the institution on January 30th, which is what he said. She wanted a ride there.

Audrey's friend, Dave Parker, the Pittsburgh Pirate Great. Not him, but Dave Parker. Wouldn't it be amazing if it was Dave Parker parker it'd be amazing i'd love that i love dave parker he's one of my the cobra is his nickname first of all one of the great nicknames of all time and just a cool guy we also had dave stewart who was awesome too great dave parker though in the late 70s during the world series there's this great shot of him just in the dugout foot up on the step of the dugout, just smoking a cigarette. Just during a game. Just loving life.

I love Dave Parker so much. I don't care. I'm going to get up and hit a home run when I finish this Winston. When I finish my cool, I'll be there. Hold on a minute. On deck, schmond deck. I'm almost done with this. I'm almost done. Hold on a minute. I just got done with the joint. I like on deck schmond deck i'm almost done with this i'm almost done hold on a minute i just got done with the joint i like to smoke a cigarette when i'm done

what are we talking about here so uh yeah dave parker said he knew audrey for about 10 years as well and they initially had a sexual relationship but then they ended up just being friends you know how it works out mature adults yeah it's just a jerry and elaine type of thing it's not right so yeah in september 2002 he said he had to take out a restraining order on audrey because she was so high on drugs she became very violent with him and started attacking him so uh he said just before he applied for it he said that he and audrey were in his car and she started assaulting him while he was driving, which is never a good idea. Never beat the driver. You never hit the driver.

Never. What's the goal there? To knock him out and crash into a tree? What's the end game that you're trying to accomplish here? If you're clearly not threatening enough to be serious to cause bodily injury, then why are you hitting no why are you doing this what is happening is this a warning shot what is what is happening i will hit you so hard you'll kill us both let's do it i don't care it's a weird thing to do right

so uh when uh when asked what he thought happened to audrey Parker said, quote, I guess she got in with the wrong person and someone killed her. That was his response. Dave. Which is an odd. You should say, no clue. I don't know. I didn't do it, so how would I know? Perhaps she met a man who owns a rocket ship and they're on Mars.

And right now they live on Neptune. Why are you being so, why do you have so many hypothesis, Dave? It's so weird. They interviewed also Tim Harris, who's Audrey's brother. And Tim said he last saw her also at the end of January. He said he and a friend were driving down Park Avenue when he saw Audrey in a gray pickup truck near Dunkin' Donuts. He stopped when Audrey saw him and she got out of the truck and got into his car. Tim's friend left and Tim and Audrey went to a party at a nearby house.

They smoked some crack together and then talked. So, you know, some sibling crack. You want to share crack with your sibling? Tim say she's probably dead, too. Yeah, I would assume somebody killed her. I mean, that's just my opinion. I haven't seen her since we smoked that crack. She's probably dead.

What do you think? Now, Tim said Audrey called their mom and told her that she was going into rehab at that point. And Tim asked Audrey if she wanted to go to McDonald's to get something to eat. She said no. So Tim left her there. And when he came back, she was gone. And that's the last time he saw her. So, yeah, they talked to Dave Parker again.

They talked to a bunch of other people. Another one of her boyfriends named Pete Ganya. And he was the one he points them in the direction back to Kelly Garner, the rehab guy. So they go back to there. He figured Garner was lying about when the last time he saw her was because he was trying to save his job because he had a job at some other place being a counselor now. But, yeah, it's it's one of those. He was her counselor and all that kind of shit. So in the end, though, none of them panned out and they didn't find any proof of anybody actually being in contact with her at a later date or being around her or killing her or abducting her or anything like that

then the third woman is 42 year old christine dumont yeah okay now one of the things that's strange they all are they're all on the street they're all into drugs they're all into prostitution and everything like that christine not into like it's a hobby, but yeah, she likes fry fly fishing and selling her body. Like those are the two things she's into. So they're other than that, they're not, they don't fit a type. They're all very different. Um, yeah.

Uh, the, uh, Stacy's 24 and she's white. Um, Audrey is 33 and she's black and christine is 42 and white so they're all 10 years apart in age and different races and different looks so that's not like that's a factor but they all race parts a big deal because that's not uh usually i mean that's not unimportant right might not be important but it might It may be a lot of times. So now Christine Dumont, 42 years old. She was all she was last seen getting out of a car on Arnold Street. Sound familiar?

It sounds like a joint. That's the place to go if you want to get abducted. It sounds like this was April 23rd, 2004, and she was never heard from again at that point. Same thing, walking down Arnold Street when she disappeared. And Christine also has a long history of she's the exact same problems as everybody else. Drugs, prostitution, the whole deal. It didn't take long here. Her sister knew something was wrong pretty quickly because she would check in with her

all the time uh her name is madeline derosier is her sister and she said that uh christine hadn't picked up her disability check at the post office so when someone who is on drugs doesn't pick up a check you know that there's an issue they would be Yeah. She doesn't want to go. She's not into prostitution. She would much rather have a check that she doesn't have to do this shit today. That's what I mean. But that was the drugs that were the problem. That's what her sister said is the drugs made her. She would go need to need more and more money.

Right. Obviously, because if you're smoking crack that that that habit adds up yeah you don't just be like i'm gonna set aside 10 bucks a day for it and then that'll be nice like it builds you just keep doing it so you don't need them like uh you need crack a little bit more than you need cigarettes like yeah it's a lot cigarettes you can i'll smoke a pack today that's gonna be grumpy yeah that's all you'll be grumpy but you won't be like and throwing up and yeah and fucking actually sick all sorts of problems yeah yeah and uh jittery so um another thing also she hadn't called her two sons in a couple of days she's another one she's got two kids so so far we're up to seven kids of missing women at this point

so um she hadn't called her two sons in a couple of days and she always checked in with her son. She said despite everything, she always loved her kids and she called them every single night no matter what to say goodnight and to check in with them. So her sister said she found out that the kids hadn't heard from her in two days. days so she called another relative who'd been uh you know taking care of the one of the two kids and to ask if she'd called there and she hadn't called there either so um yeah and she's had a tough life christine we found out uh she's had a very very tough life she her her father uh worked in a dye house to support eight kids. So that's coming up hard. You know what I mean? They didn't have a lot of money, that sort of shit,

but it wasn't the worst thing. Christine was the youngest for a long time, and then they had another one under her. They said she was spoiled. She always wanted her own way. Going to school, she was always well-dressed. Her socks matched her clothes, and her fingernails matched her outfits. She was a very particular girl. And then when she was a teenager though she kind of got wild and that sort of shit and it wasn't uh wasn't easy for her uh especially because she was

hit by the left front shield of the 52 of a 52 car, which was traveling between 20 and 25 miles an hour. The shield is like a big brush guard up front. She got hit by that, and it's used to push aside objects, obviously, shit that's on there. She ends up being dragged beneath the wheels of the train. Oh, my God. And then hurled 40 feet into the air, and she landed in a gutter at the crossing this is before she went missing this is this is when she was a kid when she's a teenager this happened my uh the train finally came to a stop uh as a result all of the skin on the right side

of her face as well as her arms and legs was completely ripped off. She was in a coma. She was already in a coma when the rescue squad got there to get her. Oh, boy. Wow. She's brought in. They tried to take x-rays of her to see how much, but the blood was so thick they couldn't even see things in there because everything was so thick. She was in a coma for three months. Three months. And it took months for her to start speaking again and after all that kind of

shit she uh never went back to school even though she was in her teens um she didn't go back to school she was uncomfortable and then when she was 18 she met a guy named joe who was 31 which is just what you want and they moved in together and all of that sort of shit and uh she was doing well though she was clean and she was not on drugs and everything was fine and then things started to fall apart and then joe fucked her up yeah just that marriage didn't work out and things got worse and then she started getting into drugs and as her sister madeline said quote my sister was a rip-off artist and i didn't appreciate it. She would take any money. She would take money from people, tell them she was going to buy them drugs and then take off with the money.

I had a front door and a back door and she would rip off somebody outside, then run in the front door and run out the back door. She did it to so many people. And then she's got somebody that's pissed off at her sister standing in her living room. Exactly. So then she's got to explain that either she's got to pay their moth or she's got to fucking you know close the door and lock it and hope they don't break it down right so she's saying basically that there's any number of people that might be angry at her right that are people that you don't know what they're going to do you know usually people that you've ripped off for drug money aren't the most reasonable people

usually so um she said that like you know prostitution was never really her like main thing she liked ripping people off better because she thought it was easier and i'm sure it is i mean i wouldn't want to that's you know whatever she said she did sell herself occasionally to get money for drugs though that's when she needed extra cash so um she was once uh arrested solicitation, but was never actually they'd ended up dropping the charges before anything happened. So I don't know if it was a first offense or what. Then at one point she meets a guy while she is on the street, meets a guy who throws her in a trunk and beats the living shit out of her. She eventually gets a hold of a tire iron in the trunk.

And when he opens the trunk, she starts a hold of a tire iron in the trunk and when he opens the trunk she starts hitting him with the tire iron in the stomach hell yeah but didn't do enough damage to ward off the even more big of a beating she got after that from this poor this with this poor woman so um they ended up uh going to a bank the police do and because they heard out heard about that and they viewed tape of a ATM transaction from the morning she was assaulted. They observed a man who fit this description and and the woman and another and Christine Dumont were all there. They all had been giving they had given them. They saw them using the ATM about 1255 a.m.

Police learned the ATM card. They got went all the way back to all of this research and found Timothy Scanlon of Wound Socket was the guy who this ATM card was linked to. That's the guy that she thinks kidnapped her and put her in the trunk. So they enter his name into the database and they discover that he'd been arrested a month earlier. So he's got a mugshot. So they check his booking photo against the photo taken at the ATM and they go, oh, boy, let's check this guy out. So they went to talk to his mother, who said that he did own a Mercury Marquis, which is what they that she owned a Mercury Marquis, but that Tim sometimes drove it. So that's the car that she said he was driving.

So the police search her apartment, but they don't find anything that belongs to him there. So they just keep going. They also learned that he had sold a 1988 GMC Jimmy on April 11, 2003, and they discovered that it was crushed in a pile of crushed vehicles and an auto parts junkyard. And they discovered that it was crushed in a pile of crushed vehicles in an auto parts junkyard. So they pulled out this pancake of a car so they could search for DNA evidence and fibers, which is crazy. They brought it to the station to inspect it. They also had the Mercury, the marquee towed to the garage, and they checked that out.

When they inspect the Mercury, they notice some damage to the rear quarter of the driver's side. Then they find the top of the lid of the trunk. They find damage. There was also some damage to the lid of the trunk. And then the detective opened the trunk to check inside. And he said he was able to detect fresh scratch marks and dents to the inside of the driver's wheel well. Scratch marks from the inside, which means people have been in there, or raccoons. One of the two.

I don't know. Depends on what you're picking up on the road. Maybe it's a bear. Like we were saying, they're tough. I thought it was DeClaude. It was a very, yeah, it was DeClaude bear. Couldn't get through. He also noticed damage to the gray carpeting

inside the trunk, and when he examined the black rubber gasket around the opening of the trunk, he saw a reddish stain that looked like blood near the marks on the lid of the trunk. So he noticed red stains that looked like blood on the driver's side floor that was in the trunk. And they collected all of that. Scanlon was arrested for kidnapping and assaulting Christine and another and the other woman that he had with her. And they indict him and everything like that. They deliberate eight hours.

They convict him of three counts of first-degree sexual assault, one count of first-degree robbery, one count of assault with a dangerous weapon, and one count of felony assault. Now, they're thinking the problem is he'd also been charged separately with the assaulting and kidnapping of Christine, but they were forced to drop the charges against him because she disappeared before she had a chance to testify against him. So, as you might imagine, he is prime suspect numero fucking uno here. Absolutely. Had a lot of reason here.

here um they end up sentencing him to 50 years in prison uh for the woman he attacked before christine and they also sentenced him to 25 20 years probation to be served afterwards as well but they realized that he hadn't been uh involved with the disappearance or her death even though he had threatened to kill her while he was in prison so they're like it's not him so what the fuck basically but he is a bad fucking guy he's a terrible terrible man he just happened to not have killed christine or audrey or stacy at that point so a little more about stacy stacy went missing from the same area it was a different street but in the same area same track there um as audrey and christ and Christine does sometime between July 3rd, late night, July 3rd, early morning of the 4th of July 2004.

On July 7th, her boyfriend went to the Woonsocket police station and spoke with police officers about her disappearance. And he said he reported her missing three days earlier. Actually, he said that she'd done some crack with a friend that night on July 3rd. She smoked some crack on Park Avenue and had planned to watch the fireworks at the World War II Memorial State Park in Woonsocket, which is where that festival is, by the way. The one for the Autumn Fest is there. Is it the World War II Memorial State Park? Park.

That's where that is. Yeah. So she went to watch the fireworks at about 9. Instead, at about 9.30, they left the friend's apartment to go to East School Street so she could, she put it, she wanted to go turn a trick so she could get more crack. She was just going to go do that quick rather than watch fireworks. You know what's better than fireworks? Crack. So around 10.30, they ran into Stacy's dad,

who was driving a pickup truck, and he asked her how she was doing. This is what I was telling you there. She told him that she'd stopped doing turning tricks, and she wasn't doing that. And so he started, he gave her like dad shit like he was giving her clean up take care of your kids stay out of trouble they ended up hugging and parting ways and all that sort of shit so it wasn't like a real contentious conversation it's

just a supportive dad he was being a supportive dad trying not to scare her away but also saying please because as a father you still have to say please don't smoke crack and turn tricks i beg you you know even if you're not trying to you just not trying to scare them you have to say those are words yeah please don't do that those phrases are imperative to this conversation they really are so he drove off and never saw her again so uh apparently he uh her and her boyfriend then walked up East School Street and Stacy told her boyfriend she wanted to work that night and began looking for Johns in a park. So as Stacy kept walking, the boyfriend stopped a guy he knew on the street to ask for a cigarette, but he didn't have one. Then he turned around and Stacy was gone. He said he couldn't find her anymore. He walked all around the street, but he didn't have one. Then he turned around and Stacey was gone. He said he couldn't find her anymore.

He walked all around the street, but he didn't see her. He kept walking. He sat down for a while and then he decided to go to the police station because he said that she was never gone for more than an hour when she was turning a trick and now she was gone for a couple hours. He figured she probably got arrested. He's like, ah, she probably got arrested. I better go to the police station. I'll go look for her there. But they said that she probably got arrested. He's like, ah, she probably got arrested. I better go to the police station.

I'll go look for her there. But they said that she wasn't there. I don't know what you're talking about. So he said he went back to his friend's house and went to bed about one o'clock in the morning. Minus your girlfriend? Yeah, he's like, I just went to bed, I guess. I mean, eventually you get tired, I guess. Yeah.

So the police aren't real thrilled about that story either. No. They're kind of like, hmm, that sounds sketchy. He told police that she'd been missing one other time for about 24 hours. At that time, she was with a guy named Gary who had a room at the Country Squire Motel, which I'm sure is... It's classy. I hear the lamb chops from room service are divine there.

Just divine. At the Country Squire? At the Country Squire? The Country Squire Motel. Absolutely. It's amazing. Their wine list, shocking. It's so good. The charcuterie and cheese is incredible.

I got to try that next time. The olives they bring, always in season. Incredible. Oh, that's amazing. See, I had so many things on that menu I had to try. Sometimes they come with the little figs. Amazing. The sweet and the salty of the cheese, it's amazing. See, I had so many things on that menu I had to try. Sometimes they come with the little figs. Amazing. The sweet and the salty of the cheese.

It's a real nice combination. Yeah, we got the tuna niçoise as an appetizer, so we didn't hit that up. Little tartare, James. You know how it is. At the old country squire motel in North Smithfield. You know how it is there. It's all class. Squire implies hookery is happening here what the yeah it implies squiring squiring a penis where you know somebody doesn't want it for money that's what that is unless there's money involved right

so uh turned out gary kept stacy in the room against her will at that time and had forced himself on her. So, he's another candidate there. That's what you do at the Country Squire Motel. I mean, if you're not, then you're not fitting in. You know, this is our captive assault room here. It's a very special room at the end of the hall. Are you trying to blend or not, James? Jesus. room at the end of the hall are you trying to blend or not james jesus he also the boyfriend told police that stacy had complained to him in the past about other customers who wouldn't let

her leave including a married guy who drove a blue osmobile uh and a couple other people too so these are all people that creeped her out because they said anybody ever creep her out basically i mean is hooking and prostitution is very similar to kink shaming in that the the moment that we try to make it like a horrible thing is the moment that becomes super dangerous yeah and and and it being illegal makes it so much more dangerous oh god if we want to pretend horrifying that we give a shit about women we need to make this shit legal this is crazy the danger that they're in oh it's unbelievable the lifestyle is is insane it's fucking insane and the problem is though like legally a lot of these women because the women are doing it under legal

circumstances those a lot of times they're not like they don't live on the street and they don't smoke crack and they don't have things like that they're doing this like they have like a business plan like i'm absolutely yeah i'm gonna do this for this many years and then i have this business that i'm opening whereas this is a day-to-day existence this is just it's horrifying you can't classify this as like they chose like a career path it's just like it's literally ceos of their own business this is this is yeah they're managing their addiction through this and that's yes fucking horrific this is okay i'm okay today but now i don't have any money and this is the

only way i can get money quickly right cash i can't pass a drug test to get a job exactly because it's a it's a problem it's it's it sucks man it really sucks it's drugs are the issue here you know the the addiction of it so um she had an interesting background, too. Her parents were divorced. Ray, the guy who her father, who tracked her down and told her not to turn tricks anymore. Sure. He actually took off and wasn't around. And her mom married another guy named Norman Goulet, who adopted her. So she always wanted to live with her real father, though.

She had that things will be better with my dad. You know, kids have like a if one parent goes away, they have like a fantasy about them. Life would be perfect with that person. Meanwhile, they run away because they're not perfect. That's the point. So, yeah. So eventually, Debbie divorced this guy and she remarried Ray. She remarried her original Stacy's dad but stacy kept the last name

of i don't know if they didn't fill out the paperwork or what but they uh divorced like they were still married when stacy disappeared or when her her remains were found but then they divorced almost immediately after that because that trauma is difficult yeah so um yeah uh stacy ended up meeting a man uh and they went out for a couple weeks when she was young when she was 18 and uh the first time they had sex she got pregnant so wow that's rough man oh my like i realize that's an obvious opportunity and it certainly happens yeah can can you imagine that's rough that's rough going opportunity, and it certainly happens. Yeah. Can you imagine? That's rough.

That's rough going. It'd be great if nature could give you a freebie or two, you know what I mean, just to get your fucking legs under you. Yeah, your eggs should have to get used to the dose that you're getting. Something, right? Yeah. Get your eggs under you then, not your legs under you. Yeah, the first dose, your eggs should be immune. Yeah, I got to feel my sea eggs under you then not your legs yeah the first dose you're you should your eggs should be immune yeah i gotta feel my sea eggs you know it takes a couple of times

so shouldn't be able to take the first batch and it takes that's horrible she was only 17 when her son dana was born oh god so um then a couple years later they had another they had kimberly the daughter when he was born. When he was born. Yeah. When he was born, she was 17. So pregnant when she was 16. So during the investigation of Stacey's disappearance, a police officer called her boyfriend and asked him to come down for questioning. And he told him that he was the number one suspect in the disappearance.

But he said, I don't understand. I don't know what you're talking about. He said, I'm not even close to her. This is her ex-husband. He said, we don't really like each other and we don't go near each other. He says, if we see each other, she chucks the bird at me and I'll say something stupid to her. Other than that, we don't see each other. So that's like even your ex-wife and you have a better relationship than that.

Slightly. You walk in in she gives you the finger you call her a twat and then you walk away that's not what happens you try to be civil you know what i'm saying i mean if i read my text messages to you you'd probably think no this is probably exactly the same verbal typing if the finger at you more or less yeah it's like it's like something stupid and then i go text me about the kids and then it then it devolves into awful that's that's essentially how it goes that's yeah it's not in front of the kids it's not healthy that's what it is so the in may of 1980 near anaheim california dorothy jane sc Scott noticed her friend had an inflamed red wound on his arm and seemed unwell. She insisted on driving him to the local hospital to get treatment.

While he waited for his prescription, Dorothy went to grab her car to pick him up at the exit, but would never be seen alive again. Leaving us to wonder, decades later, what really happened to Dorothy Jane Scott? From Wondery, Generation Y is a podcast that covers notable true crime cases like this one and many more. Every week, hosts Aaron and Justin sit down to discuss a new case, covering every angle and theory, walking through the forensic evidence and interviewing those close to the case to try to discover what happened. And with over 450 episodes, there's a case for every true crime listener. Follow the Generation Y podcast on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts.

You can listen to Generation Y ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus. I understand that anybody who's paid attention to the media would have to come to the conclusion that I killed my wife. Hi, my name is Zach Stewart-Pontier. I'm one of the filmmakers behind The Jinx, and I'm excited to bring you The Official Jinx Podcast. We'll be revisiting all six episodes of part one and watching along with part two as it airs on Max, starting April 21st. Bye-bye. The Official Jinx Podcast. Listen on Max or wherever you get your podcasts. Cops told the boyfriend to come down the next morning, but then they called him back and told

them to forget it. They have another lead. Now you're not the number one suspect anymore. He says, quote, when I heard she'd been murdered, I felt real sad. I wanted to cry. No matter what was going on between us, I always loved her because she was my kid's mother. The kids saw it on the news and I had to be honest with them because I didn't want them to hear it from someone else or from a kid or from a kid my son was going to school with. He also said that she had a good side to her. She was bright and had the most balls I've ever seen on a woman. She would just stick up for herself if she thought she was right. She was a little spitfire. She was unbelievable. She was one big ball of energy,

but she was also very gentle. She liked simple things, but she wasn't one of those flashy, I want, I want girls. She just wanted the simple things. She wanted to get by in life and be happy. Marry her. Yeah, well, he did.

She's terrific. He did, and then they got divorced, and then now, yeah, her remains are being found in a in a in a uh whatever the fuck so landfill yeah landfill now um they do have another lead and they want to talk to a young man who we'll talk about right here uh a guy named jeffrey mail hot uh he is 33 years old at the time. Um, and he's just kind of a, he's not a, there's not a lot you can say about him. Put it that way. Um, this one in this book, they sum it up really well when they say the perfect, the

perfect representation of him is that there's no picture in his 1989 high school yearbook of it. It just says camera shy shy he's just a blank space this guy not real he just never he can't figure out who he is you know what i mean um people that even know him are like i don't know like they're like well how would you describe jeffrey and he's like i don't know like he's just like a guy wow i don't know what he like does stuff i don't know like they don't know anything about him he's not a real he's just kind of like wallpaper he's just there okay um yeah they there's not a real nobody there's nothing stands out about him like oh

this is he does this crazy shit and then you know he sniffs fucking glue all the time or whatever he doesn't fit into any stereotypical mold that anybody can just say he's this that's it no one john d cristofaro who's a former classmate of his says quote i'd see him at parties or in bars always toward the back of the room never mingling that's the memory most people would have of him wow just there but not making any impression part of the landscape part of the landscape yeah like an extra he's like an extra in his own life, basically. He's a bush in his life. In the school play, in the fourth grade school play, he plays a tree. I'm a rock this year.

So that's kind of what he is. He grew up in a nice neighborhood. Everybody says he kind of kept to himself. He's, you know it's that's it they said uh uh when he was nine his parents got divorced and he said everybody said he was a lot quieter after that yeah and traumatized him a little then when he was 17 his mom died of lung cancer which is 17 17 is a young age to lose a parent that's tough that's tough on anybody and then 22 when his father died so god damn it 22 22 yeah 22 is too young to have no parents you know like

something could happen to one of them or whatever but you gotta have somebody at 22 that's a little also between 18 and 28 you're figuring shit out still and if something happens that's traumatic and you have to regress and go to your parents house he has he doesn't even have that opportunity no it's really it's really difficult and that's anybody and that would be a be a tough thing so he he tried once he became an adult he really tried to have an identity because he has no identity like normally like remember in high school you'd be like oh who's that's that kid? Oh, that's Craig. You know, he's like, you know.

He's one of the jocks. He's a jock or like, you know, he's like a goth kid or he's like this or he's like, you know, he's a nerd or whatever the fuck you'd say. He has no identity. Nothing. Nothing. He's just Jeffrey who's kind of boring. You know, that's it. So he tried to find an identity and he tried everything.

He bought a Harley. Oh, I bought a Harley, bought a leather jacket. My guy tried to, like, just, you know, go to, like, places where bikers hung out and just, like, hang out there. Like, I'm one of you guys. Yeah. What do you say? Motorcycles, huh, fellas? That's right.

Motorcycles and chicks. Right. He just didn't fit in. Yeah. You know, he's, by the way, reports have him at anywhere between 5'3 and 5'5 in terms of height. So, I mean, any of those, it's the same guy. That's, yeah, it doesn't matter at that point.

And I will say this this and i feel bad because i feel like and i mean no pun intended i feel like i'm punching down about this sorry but i'm not oh i'm not i'm not no you're not either straight away babe but there is a certain psychological thing that happens it's not the same thing it's different with each guy but when you get guys that are under five five that's a different psychology it's a different guy it's a different guy they have there's a lot of i mean it's not everybody but i would assume in most people it's a lot there's a lot of inadequacy things there's a lot of that it's probably and this is only from talking to women about this but it seems like it's the equivalent of if a woman, if a girl is very heavy in high school.

You know what I'm saying? That she feels like, even if everybody likes her and she's popular and people want to fuck her, she still feels like, I don't fit in with those cheerleader girls or whatever. Because that's how you feel in high school, right or wrong. And in terms of ostracized, not as ostracized, but even outcast, the short man is essentially the chubby girl. It's the same thing. Yeah. The short guy has to have a fucking giant personality. Like you get like Big Ed from 90 Day Fiance.

He's the guy that I showed you the picture and we said he looked like Ram Man and then found out he had a disease. Yeah. But he's like 4'11 and he's got this crazy like he's got to, he puts costumes on, he's got a tattoo of his face on his fucking leg. You know what I mean? He's got a shower curtain of his face. Like, he bought his own merch and put it up in his fucking house. That's crazy. I don't have a small-town murder shower curtain just because it's my shit, so that's weird.

That's hilarious. That's, like, a little narcissistic, I feel like, and this guy takes it to another level. He's just that's hilarious that's like a little narcissistic i feel like and this guy takes it to another level he's just got pictures of himself on his wall there is something hilarious about podcasters wearing their own shirt in public it is it's pretty fucking funny it's a bit far we don't do that no we don't you just don't do that at our shows i don't do that even when there's like a reason to wear our shit no if you're a band you don't do that at our shows. I don't do that even when there's like a reason to wear our shit. No, if you're a band, you don't wear your own shirt on stage. That's Bush League. Lars is not wearing a Metallica shirt behind the drums.

He's not doing it. It's considered kind of Bush League to do that. Yeah, it's weird. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Nikki Sixx doesn't have a fucking shout at the devil shirt. No, because back in the day, he would have had a flowing blouse with slashes in it. He would cover up the fishnet, James.

Yeah, well, you don't want to cover the fishnet. Hey, Jimmy, you don't want to cover the fishnet. That's where the action is. James, you've got to see the nipples. Oh, it's the nipples. The nipples. He's got nipples. He's got a nipple shirt.

Unbelievable. So he tries to fit in there doesn't fit in he um he liked wrestling a lot in the 90s he was super into wrestling as you know the monday night wars late 90s wrestling was very big so he said he wanted to build his body up so he tried to weight train so he gets like thicker so he's like five three and kind of a thick little guy now you know what i mean and uh he even thought maybe i could be'3 and kind of a thick little guy now. You know what I mean? And he even thought maybe I could be a wrestler. You know, I'm a little guy.

Maybe I could be a manager or something. So he even thought about that. He went to karaoke at the karaoke bar. Anything. Sang, you know, fucking kiss songs and shit. I want to be known for something except for being. Please. And then even there, he'd like sing a song and they'd be like, yeah, that's great and then somebody they'd just ignored he just doesn't have he doesn't stand out

he doesn't stand out oh my god this feels so familiar give it time buddy do comedy i was gonna say i'll give them credit at least he's trying things he's not just like well fuck everybody they suck you know i don't need to fit in. He's like, well, fuck, I'll try shit. I need to fit in. I want to get laid here. What am I doing? Most of these guys turned to AR 15s and shit. You know what I mean?

Yeah. Yeah. Shooting them at people, not just like having them and taking them to a range or some shit either. Just like, I'm going to fucking kill everybody because God damn it. I can't find what I'm good at. That's what's going on. So,

um, he said that, uh that nobody noticed him. The manager at the box seats sports bar there that he sang karaoke at said, quote, he didn't really stand out in a crowd. Bad or good. He never stood out. Jesus. Just a fucking boring guy. Oh, no.

Yeah. He ends up getting his own place here at 221 Cato Street in Woonsocket. It's a multi. It's a four unit house. Remember the real estate report? That's why I put a multi unit in there. So we talk about it. It's a multi unit for family home.

Two of them were vacant. So he gets one of them. Two of them are getting renovated. So they're empty. And then there's a third one vacant that he rents. And then there's an old lady across the hall. And then're empty. And then there's a third one vacant that he rents. And then there's an old lady across the hall. And then she died, and then nobody else moved in.

Just him in this giant-ass place? Him in a four-family house. Just a big, empty house. He can't even be included at home. No. People die. People fucking leave. Renovations don't go well.

They must have whoever's renovating your house doing it. I'm sure i would assume so just taking out all the electric yeah just ripping it out ever after they just put it in so he lived there he found it was private it was quiet i mean it's a big house with empty apartments above and below you so i mean very quiet except for between i don't know 6 a.m. and noon. That evidently is the working hours of people these days. I had no idea. They show up before you and leave before anything's done. What happened?

Did they leave for lunch? Oh, no, for the day. No, no, they're gone for the day. So he hangs out there. He does have a small group of friends. They think he's a good guy. They say he's out there. He does have a small group of friends. They think he's a good guy. They say he's very sensitive. He's called very generous, good humored. They say he likes to make jokes.

He likes comedy stuff. He watches comedy shows. And he can go back and forth and joke around with them and shoot the shit, basically. Quoting Dane Cook. Oh, God, I hope not. In 2004? Is that when this is? He probably was.

Yeah, he probably was. Let's hope not. But he was a Simpsons fan, I heard he said. So maybe he was just quoting Simpsons lines, which is way preferable. So they said that he liked to drink on the weekends, just when he wasn't working. A girlfriend of his said that he would sit by a campfire sometimes and he would drink so hard that he would be slurring his speech and mumbling and shit like that. But it was only on the weekends. He's a machinist at a company called Avery Denison.

Wow. I don't know. I don't know what a machinist does, but they make metal parts. James, it's incredible. You say something with machines. So that's, that seems impressive or at least a skill work of some kind. So,

um, she always said about him, this woman that, uh, went out with him that she always kind of thought something was a little off about him though. Um, she said he was really,

really OCD. Like she thought he had like a legitimate obsessive compulsive disorder, everything in his home his car even in his pockets in his wallet everything had to be perfect in the right spot facing a certain direction yeah very uh control oriented with all the little things she said he would multiple times a night he would check his wallet to make sure that all the bills face the same way and the stack was like it was the right height out of the wallet or in the wallet. You know what I mean? Everything was perfect. He'd like take his wallet out to fix it and make sure it didn't get out of whack in his pocket. People rearrange their sock drawer.

He's doing it with his wallet. That's exactly with everything he does. That's the other thing. wallet that's exactly with everything he does that's the other thing uh people in his apartment were afraid to touch him his stuff because he was so crazy about it being in order and everything was in such perfect order like at a museum you don't want to touch anything because it'll like oh they know which direction it's facing if i move it i'm going to be in trouble like his they said like his cds and his dvds if you like looked at it if you looked at a CD or a DVD back when that was a thing, once you put it back, he would frantically rush over and make sure it was straight in the right direction and you put it in the right slot and it was in the right place. Yeah, very, very, very OCD.

Wow. So I get that a little bit because I'm like that to a certain extent with things, but not like that where I'm like, oh my God, what happened? I got to fix that right now. I'd be like, mental note, i'll fix that later right you know these people leave so they don't think i'm fucking crazy exactly that's the difference of i can control it to not look crazy whereas i can't control and i have to do it is a different thing what i do is certainly fucking insane but i don't want people to see it never never uh she said that he was dark sometimes she and other friends also uh knew where he hid his spare house key and they would use it from time to time to go inside and check on him because quote sometimes

he wouldn't answer the phone or come to the door for days. Quote, it was like he dropped off the earth. So that was a common thing that happened. One night she said she told him that she was falling for him. You know, they were in a relationship. Yeah. And he said, quote, I'm sorry. I can never be in love with anyone. I'll always be alone.

That's what he told her. That's dark as fuck. That's some dark shit. He didn't even try to lead her on or anything. He was like, nope, sorry. I'm a loner. Loner, Dottie. Yep, I'm a loner, Dottie. Sorry, I can't. I'm a rebel. Can't do it.

Here I go again on my own. Get on the hood of my car right now. I'll tell you why. Well, I'll stay with you for a while. If you get on the hood of my car, sprawl out and let me scream, here I go again on my own at the top of my lungs at the T-tops of my 87 Trans Am. What do you say?

Do you think he's just like a picky guy and just is not into her like that and he thinks he can get better? Oh, I don't know. That's the thing. Is he one of those guys? She said that they got along. She said she'd ride with him on his motorcycle and they'd go play pool together and they had nicknames. She called him Bear.

He's a tiny bear. And he's a Berenstain bear. And she called him Butterfly. He called her Butterfly. So they had little nicknames. She also said, because they were asking about this, she said that they got into some sexual things together, just a little bit, got a little kinky, a little freaky.

She said that she was comfortable enough with him to do weird shit with him. All right. That's something. She wasn like scared of him or anything she would uh uh she wanted him to choke her sometimes so he would happily oblige and they would that was a thing they would do when some people are into fucking being choked and choking man whatever it takes for you to come i'm doing it you know well know? Well, yeah, most guys are like that. That's one thing where I'm out right there. Because if you, like, I've heard too many murder stories, and I'm not going to be accused of, you know what I'm saying?

I'm not going to go to prison because somebody was like, I can only come if you choke me. Like, that's your fucking problem then. You choke yourself. My handprints aren't going to be. My six foot four can palm a fucking basketball. Handprints aren't going to be wrapped six foot four can palm a fucking basketball. Handprints aren't going to be wrapped all the way around your fucking throat. You're going to have to make that happen on your own, sister. I'm sorry.

I can't do it. I'm not going to accidentally kill anybody during sex. The trick is, James, you squeeze the sides and push the webbing in. that way you don't know you don't hurt anybody but look my you know what i'm saying yeah you squeeze the sides and you're gonna paralyze her i'm gonna yeah it's not gonna go well i'm i'm a big huge guy they're gonna come over find sarah dead that's not gonna work out but it was just five one like 110 pound i'm in fuck i'm in deep shit at that point i'm a murderer then i'm not gonna be like no no she said i should only come if i choked her they'd be like yeah right hands behind the back done done i'd be done not doing it i think it's more i don't know for sure but i think it's more of like slowing the blood flow

to the brain more than the the cutting off the oxygen does that make sense well there's there's i read about this too and there's like physical there's physical get offs on this with the lack of oxygen that people get on. And there's also a certain like control and wanting to be controlled. Yeah. That goes on that some people are into and power dynamics. Yeah. So there's a lot of different reasons for choking that people do. Makes it feel dangerous.

Like I'm like I'm taking this more than she's given it you know what i mean that's yeah well yeah and women are the usually women are the ones that like yeah they want it yeah they're the ones that request it a lot that's not a thing i want james you don't just start choking women especially not at that time no you know like oh now we're doing this because it was asked for yeah that's yeah yeah that has that's a request that's a total request live situation we're not going to just play that in the rotation if you want to hear that you're going to have to call in and ask for it you know what i'm saying we don't play the deep cuts right you got to get in you got to call in and ask for i'm your puppet before it just gets played yeah well that's even a probably it's got to be like a deep cut. I'm not you know, we don't play the B sides unless anyone asks for it.

So she said that she said she would that she would tell him to basically choke her until breathing became a little difficult. And then he would stop and she would get some air and they'd go back and do it over and over again. That was like their thing. She said, quote, we both enjoyed it i remember telling him my god you look so psychotic when you do that as does anyone who's fucking and choking someone at the same time that's a that's a psychotic look you know he's probably surprised that he's capable first of all something there is a little i'm sure there's a little bit of crazy behind the eyes when it happens. But that's the thing.

He's got a little spark of something here. Yeah. Now, women have been disappearing as far back as the early 90s, and they always thought you never know if it's serial killers, if it's whatever. But as we know, prostitutes are a extremely, extremely and I'm using this very specifically this term because people that say sex worker, that kind of encompasses a lot more. Also, that we're saying this specific thing doesn't also include dancers and people like that. This specific thing is people who are on the street getting into strangers cars. That's a very specific thing.

So that's why you know we're using the clinical term fear for it so uh they you know they it's they said this is this it's not uncommon for them to disappear because they're they're the most murdered people there are people don't look at them like people and a lot of times they're not they don't have families looking for them sometimes look at gary ridgeway how many women did he kill because no one was fucking looking for them right they were runaways they were people who had gone there to do this and not be around their family so it's difficult and these are people that are need the most help and they're given obviously the

hardest path so unbelievably vulnerable and their job entails meeting someone new and being the most intimate you can be with a person and alone with that person. And it's... You don't know that person. Think about it this way. Guys,

your girlfriend, your wife, your daughter, your mother, some of the streets that you've seen, and we've all seen women on the streets

in whatever city you live in or even bigger town or whatever. Would you want any of those women in your life just not not even doing what those women are doing? But would you let them walk down that street at midnight or would you say, fuck out of here? What are you doing? Are you crazy? Take this knife and a fucking stun gun and, you know, don't get murdered. So it's just dangerous to to be out at that point. It's just dangerous to be out at that point. So said summer of 2004, though, when three women get missing in 17 months, they said, quote, they just disappeared.

This is a police detective. They just disappeared. We had no clues, no suspects. They just kind of vanished. So it was always in the back of your mind that maybe it's somebody one person doing this. You know, who knows knows they might be just really good at it uh they said though in the past deaths after a while they'd always been able to pin down these you know three women disappeared in a year they would figure out that it was all

isolated that wasn't together one woman died over here another woman was killed by her husband and then this woman was whatever um oftentimes it was you just never know so they are obviously looking this now what broke the case is in mid-july this is where that the one's ex-boyfriend didn't have to come in wasn't the number one suspect anymore a tip came into police headquarters called in on the tip line and suggested that detectives meet a woman named jocelyn martell uh who was she she had a, you know, arrest record, quite a lengthy arrest record for drugs and prostitution and everything else. They found her at a detention center awaiting trial.

So good place to talk. She tells them of an encounter with a man who offered sex for cash, obviously, and then attacked her inside of her apartment she described the building and its location matched 221 cato street remember that yeah that's where our friend jeffrey lives uh where no one else lives but him there that's right as we remember so um they end up the the police look around because she described the house they match it to that description to that house. So they look and say, see who lives there.

And they go, only one fucking guy lives here. That's convenient. You know, they figure out who he is. They show her a photo spread. And she said, that's the guy, Jeffrey Malhotz, the guy who did this to me. So they end up tracking down in the following days. They track down several more women who describe similar assaults uh perpetrated here so um yeah this was enough to get an arrest warrant for for

him so july 16 2004 jeffrey mail hot comes home from his machine job work yeah and he finds a bunch of police detectives sitting there waiting for him, which is never a heartening thing to have happen. I mean, one is too many. One is too many. You're like, either someone died or you think I did something. One of the two. Either way, bad times for me. Don't like this.

They never just come over to check, see how you're doing. It's very rare. Me and my homicide squad just wanted to come over and make sure that the new transmission you got in your car is working out for you. It's okay? All right. We'll be on our way then. What's your favorite local grocery store? We're just wondering because Pete here just moved into the area and he's wondering, you know.

We're just knocking on doors. Heard there was building the Whole Foods around here, but I think that's a bit pretentious. Do you know where the Trader Joe's is? What do you think? Right? The Whole Foods is a little much? So they were waiting to arrest him for assaulting this woman somebody found an identity all of a sudden yeah identity definitely

jesus unfortunately it's ted bundy uh is the identity he's trying to fulfill by uh doing this so uh they bring him down to the police station and they start talking to him now he has no fucking idea why he's there as we'll find out he's done plenty of stuff and he has no clue exactly what's going on so uh he knows he's these women he's definitely done bad things to them because that's why they've gone to the police and identified him so um anyway when they meet him the police are completely off guard because they're they're thinking okay we might have a serial killer and we think this is the guy and then they meet him and they go oh he's not the guy this little guy he's a five foot three chubby milquetoast boring like he's a machinist yeah this he's not doing this is not i think we have some sort of mistake here they said he was polite friendly soft-spoken never had

a never had any arrests at all, not even a speeding ticket. Guy's clean as a whistle, you know, whatever. His landlord called him the ideal tenant, said he has a steady job, always has the rent check on time. Perfect tenant. We love him. Doesn't fuck anything up. Have you seen his apartment? It's the neatest.

I've never seen anyone keep an apartment so neat. I'm not even going to have to paint when he moves out. It's tremendous. Look at his DVD collection. You can understand how he does for my fucking place. Yeah, that's what I mean. He's going to keep everything perfect. That's the guy you want.

They said that, yeah, he had a lot of muscle on there, but they said he still looked like a little kid because he's like 5'3", and he's got kind of a baby face, and he's kind of pudgy, too, which gives him more of a baby face. So they're like this can't be the guy but then one of the detectives said quote he had the whole jekyll and hyde thing going everybody we work everybody he worked with loved him the landlord he's yelling that we should leave this poor kid alone we thought maybe he had something to do with one of them two of them but there's no way that this guy's a serial killer no fucking way we've never heard anybody be so universally praised as just a calm nice easygoing guy so he's probably not killing

people and the look of him and everything so james is he that's the question they've got to ask now though is he is he an outcast and ostracized or is he a fucking chameleon and a genius who knows that's the thing or is he just kind of aleon and a genius? Who knows? That's the thing. Or is he just kind of a guy who slips through the cracks and then picks the lowest hanging fruit? You know what I mean? Lashes out because of that. Who knows? We'll find out a lot here

because they set up a video so they could do the interview. First, I think I find interesting, and I find homicide interrogations fascinating, by the way, because it's the ultimate battle of it's the ultimate mental chess game. Yeah. You know what I mean? If you have a person who murdered someone and two people sitting in a room who think that you murdered someone and they're trying, they don't have the evidence to arrest you or else they already would have. But for the murders, but they're trying to get you to admit it is a crazy thought because they don't have the evidence yet and they need that piece. Yeah. That'll make them not have to chase anything down. Yeah.

You can tell. And you can tell because when they do have great evidence, like on the first 48, when they have great evidence, they'll still go at a guy because no matter how well good evidence he is, you still want a confession. Yeah. Confession. So they'll still keep going at him. But if he's being a ball breaker and he won't give anything and whatever they're like you know what fuck it who cares see you later we have your dna and ballistics eat a dick motherfucker and they just leave whereas if they have nothing they'll pound away until the person says i'm leaving basically because they have nothing else to go on no evidence and the well you know when

someone's trying to sell you something and you don't want to buy it imagine if that product was life in prison what are the odds you're going to buy that that's what they're selling this person in this chair i'm not buying your extended car warranty fuck yeah from prison imagine life in a fucking prison that's what they're or maybe the death penalty who knows that's what they're trying to sell you, and they're telling you that you'll feel better if you acquire that. Think about that. Think about the mind fuck that is. You'll feel better if you acquire it. You know what I mean?

Yeah. That's a crazy job. That's your job. What do you do? If somebody takes that job time after time. Yeah. I sell people prison. That's what I do.

Are the hours good? Oh, no. I'm up 36 hours at a time. I haven't seen. Yeah. I sell people prison. That's what I do. Are the hours good? Oh, no. I'm up 36 hours at a time. I haven't seen my kids. I don't know. I don't even know how old my kids are. I think I have a boy and a girl. I'm not sure.

I'm not positive. I haven't seen them in that long. But the good part is- I've been selling the worst timeshare of all time for 40 years. Yeah. And you only have to sign up for 40 years. You can pass it down to your children. They'll be stuck with this responsibility of paying for this.

That's what it is. You can inconvenience your family, make them drive all the way the fuck out here to visit you there. You're going to get 52 weeks a year here. 52 weeks a year, 24-7, 23 of which in a cage. What do you say about that? Can I sign you up? Well, okay. I got to get it off my chest.

It's the ultimate like trying to get you excited over a car, and then when you pull in your driveway, you're like, why did I buy this? It's the ultimate that because you're going to feel better, and you cry, and they go, it's okay. You can tell us anything about it, and maybe they came at you and I understand. And then as soon as you're done, they're like, all right. Yeah.

So that's first degree murder. We're putting him away. He's going to County right now and someone's going to be looking up his asshole in about 15 minutes. So wipe those tears away, chief. We got to go finish the paperwork for the DA. We got to go. Yeah, we got to go.

Sorry. That's what they do. And then you're just like oh man i think i have buyer's remorse about that life in prison that i just got myself i can't please yeah that's what that is right the recantations are absolutely buyers remorse yeah that's what it is it's exactly going lifetime really yeah he's trying to bring back uh jewelry he bought for someone that wasn't really his girlfriend but he still had it engraved and they're like we're not taking back an engraved piece of jewelry are you crazy that's

what that is it's fucking engraved you put her name on it says it says to Julie I can't sell this who am I going to sell it I don't have to be someone named Julie I don't think it's going to work that's incredible so anyway the gamesmanship of a homicide

what am i gonna put it out no one's buying it it's a specialty item it's custom am i supposed to do with this now with you this is jared do you think we're just gonna smelt that back down no good god no this is this is done now we can't wipe that out you asshole scrape it off with a nail file no it's gold motherfucker you ruined it uh i love it so he that's why i love the gamesmanship of a of a homicide interrogation. It's just there's gamesmanship on the people's part. The perpetrator or alleged perpetrators, they're trying to come across a certain way or, you know, they're doing their thing and they they they have certain tells that they have if they fall asleep in the interrogation room. That's a pretty good sign that they're guilty. That's one of those.

It's just it's like the first rule of homicide. if that you leave them in there for two hours if they fall asleep probably guilty because an innocent person left in a homicide interrogation room for two hours is banging on the door going why the fuck am i in here let me out talk to me and get me the fuck out of here i didn't kill anybody what's happening whereas everybody else like well i'm caught now i guess it's time to rest. Thank you. So tired. Yeah, this is whoof. Boy, I'm exhausted. So he the the guy, the homicide detective has him read his own Miranda rights on the video.

So he said, I understand I have the right for this and I this and I that. So he read the Miranda rights rather than reading them to him, which I think I don't know if that's that might just be the rule in Rhode Island or something. But it seems like a bit of gamesmanship if it's not of as far as you're trying to make him a participant right away. Yeah. But does is there legalities in that that if they read them that that it's not the same? No, no, no. Because they're still being read their rights. They're reading their rights.

And then they say they understand them. They they check the boxes and they sign it saying i understand i understand so to me though it's a bit of gamesmanship in terms of you're going to participate in the process you're not going to be a passive a passive participant participant in this you get you talking because that's what they'll do a lot of time just try to ask them whether they'll ask them regular questions to try to find something that they can have in common maybe that they can talk about and you know put it that way so they said do you know why you're here and he said no idea this is a six hour interrogation by the way this is coming up we're not going to talk about the whole six hours obviously but we'll hit the important points because it's i'm fascinated with interrogations and shit. So this is this is amazing.

Going from I have no idea where I'm why I'm here to where they go. And he says, no idea. All I know is you as assault with a dangerous weapon. I have no idea what this is all about because I'm in the homicide department. And the cop said, OK, we've had a few complaints come in recently. And he said a few complaints. And he goes, yeah, we'll get to that, though. You know, we'll talk about all of that.

So basically, they're trying to be nice to him. Now, experienced interrogators can tell. That's the other thing, too, is they're watching a person in the room to see what kind of person they are. They watch them over the camera in the box to see what they're doing, because're going to approach different people different ways you know what i mean somebody who thinks they're real tough you you go at that motherfucker that's the way to do it that's what they do like they'll get right in their face they'll they'll you know what i mean if they're an introvert they might back off a little bit they're trying to make them comfortable this guy they see is kind of a soft-spoken calm guy so they're going to go him nice, nice and try to be friends with him and see if they can draw him out that way.

So it's pretty interesting. The detective here says, I feel like you can get more flies with honey than with vinegar. You treat people with respect. Talk to them in a kind way. Offer them a drink, anything like that, in order to get information. It's the other thing. On the first 48, whenever someone's confessing, they have like a water and a bag of Cheetos next to them while they're confessing because they were given something.

Um, you said there are a number, number of interview techniques, but the most effective way is to be straightforward with them. The whole idea is to gain their trust, make them comfortable and make them want to open up and talk to you. If you're going to be a hard ass with them and give them a hard time, then they're just going to close up and you'll you. If you're going to be a hard ass with them and give them a hard time, then they're just

going to close up and you'll never get anything out of them. The days of hitting people with phone books or something like that are over. That just doesn't work. They did that. Yeah, because it didn't leave bruises. Yeah, they work people over with phone books. But they they beat cops and beat people with phone books to get a confession out of them. Yeah, that's old school.

That's like this. Yeah, you put a phone book, you put it up someone yeah and then you punch through it yeah yeah it's a dispersion cops were doing that back in the day yeah to get confessions out of people so uh which is horrible obviously so uh i wonder how many false confessions go stop beating me jesus so white pages that happens yeah it's good god it's heavier i don't like it he said quote he was probably wondering what the hell we were going to talk to him about, wondering what we had on him. And if we were going to ask him about the dead girls, obviously, that's through the back of his mind because he's sitting there knowing he's guilty of murdering these three girls. So that's what they're going in thinking. So they talk about that sort of shit and they just just have a conversation.

Are you married? He said, no, I'm single. They're like, you you got a girlfriend he goes ah we just broke up a few weeks earlier i'm not seeing anybody else you know uh where she live and she lives with her mom you know he's they said so no one lives with you he said no uh he said the last person to live with you was your girlfriend and he said that they didn't live together i said do you see any other type of girls which is a weird any other type of girls what does that mean and he said that they didn't live together. I said, do you see any other type of girls, which is a weird, any other type of girls? What does that mean? And he said, no.

And they said, any relationship with any other girls? And he said, not right now. They said, no one night stands even or anything like that. You know, single guy, like you said, obviously a handsome strapping stud muffin like yourself. Not a, you're not just picking them up left and right. You strike me as a coxman nothing nothing right now yeah you probably have a you have to fight them off at closing time don't you no um so he said yeah well yeah you know but nothing i mean no i haven't done that in a long

time they said how long would you say he said probably like four or five months ago is the last time i had a one-night stand and they ask her they ask him who was it with which this? Which this poor girl, this poor fucking woman is like, yeah, fucking I'll bang this guy. And now there's it's coming up in a homicide investigation. Good God. It's literally become like a federal case almost that I banged this guy. Not cool. He said her name was Dawn. That's all he knew.

So poor Dawn. She he said they met at the White Horse Saloon in Chappachet. I don't know what that is. And he said he took her back to the apartment. And the cop said, that's it. And he said, yeah, last four months, that's everything. And they said, OK, ever picked up a prostitute? Yeah.

Quote, unquote. He says, quote, I've seen him around, but i haven't picked up any i've seen him around you know you just see him he said uh are you sure about signs and shit that say signs stay open yeah it's one of those you see him around right you know how it is i see things i see cats around i see like you know trees you see things so unless you ask right he said are you sure about that and uh he said i'm positive i mean i've picked up a girl that i thought i had seen before who was looking for a ride and then she kind of propositioned me but i let her right out i just let her out you know i found out she was a prostitute i was like oh god no that is way above my dainty sensibilities i cannot do that

not what i was looking for ma'am no no no and they said are you you're sure about that there um yeah where'd you pick her up then and he said arnold street uh-huh which is we know that one they said do you know her name and he said no no not at all he said he knew her before but then i don't know didn't know her name so um yeah he's sitting there uh all the stories are pretty similar of all of the women that said he uh you know took him did weird shit to them in his apartment um but instead he um yeah each one said that they went to the place went to to his apartment because he said, we'll go back there and have a couple of drinks and relax. And then each girl said that they found themselves in a chokehold gasping for air. Apparently, he would choke them.

They'd be gasping for air. This wasn't something they asked for. This is just something he was doing. And at the end, he would let them go. And then he would tell them to leave. That's what he would do. He'd release them and say, get the fuck out of here. I choked you now.

So they had also while they were doing this or this was there. They went back to fuck. And then before they fucked, he started choking them. And then they would leave. Basically, that's how it works. So he wouldn't even end up fucking him. So, yeah, they said they're talking about that. And he said at one point the detective says look

this is serious stuff so try to be as truthful as possible if you picked up a prostitute you picked up a prostitute if you're embarrassed we really don't care we're trying to get to the bottom of something but if we start out like this where it appears like you're not telling the truth things don't look good for you. And it goes downhill from there. So and he's like, oh, OK, like they're like, you know, we're going to think bad things of you. And this is the type of guy that you can tell doesn't want you to not like him. You know what I mean? That's one of the things that I think the police officer picked up on is his desperation for people to like him.

So, you know, we won't like you anymore. It's time to type of thing. So he wants to. Yeah. Play on the shame of him having to pay for sex. Yeah. Like, we don't care about that. You know, but if you lie to us here, then, you know, it's going to get bad for you.

We're not going to we're not going to trust you anymore. Between friends brag about the pussy you're getting. Let's go. Let's go. Come on. Tell me about all these ladies. What were their tits like? Let's do it.

We're guys. Come on. Let's change your oil. What do you say? Letits like? Let's do it. We're guys. Come on. Let's change your oil. What do you say? Let's go out in the parking lot. This locker room we're in. Let's go. So he nodded and they said, again, ever pick up a prostitute?

And he said, yes. Uh-huh. Now it's yes. And they said, okay, when was the last time you did it? He said, probably four or five weeks ago. And that's another thing in homicide investigations all the time. People don't want to admit to like they were selling drugs to somebody and then that person got killed later and the homicide people are like i don't fucking care about drugs do you understand that see this

what says on my shirt homicide murder cops right don't give a shit about drugs sell all the drugs you want don't care need to find out who killed the fucking dead guy it's all i'm worried about sell the drugs don't kill the guys that's yeah it's a bad business plan if mcdonald's was killing everybody that ate their fucking burgers they'd never get to one billion sold never ever well they would but then it would take a lot then it would be over after that because they've killed everyone they killed everyone so uh he said four or five weeks ago they said do you remember who it was or even what she looked like he said um quote um she was probably about my height dark hair that's pretty much all i remember i don't remember any details and they said what happened where'd you bring her he said we went back to my place this is the quote we went back to my place and did the sex

which makes him sound like he's like a fucking eastern european immigrant we go to my place and we did the sex or he's literally never had sex never or he's borat one of the two and i did the sex i said yes it was so good so um the cop jumped in. Blowjob sex? Hell yeah. What'd you do? And he said, yeah, blowjob. That's his response. And they said, okay.

I love the response to that quote. Okay. And everything went well. No problems. Like he was installing a hot water heater. Everything went well. No leaks or anything. You're good.

Water's heating up. All right. I think you're all set there. You got a hard time. Put it in her mouth. No teeth dragging everybody happy all right he said yeah it was um and she left right after he said that uh um he was very kind of um uh stumbling over his words type of thing he said quote yeah it was um she she left right after so he's nervous though as you would be as now i will say this as a normal person who's embarrassed any normal guy who's some guys have no shame they don't care

like i fuck hookers all the time i don't give a shit i have i knew a guy who we were in vegas at the hard rock cafe and he's six o'clock in the morning before he went back he's like i'm gonna go grab a hooker real quick i was like what what is wrong you're just what what is wrong with you like no it's time for that yeah it was the end of the night he's like yeah what the hell and the bartender at the hard rock all knew that what they were doing because at six he goes all right ladies six a.m you got to clear out now i'm going to give everybody five minutes to wrap up what you're doing and clear out ladies and there was half guys and half ladies but he was talking to the women who were closing deals so yeah so guys though that do this some guys are embarrassed and if strangers that wear

suits and ties bring you in a little room and ask you about it you might be a little uncomfortable you know yeah so they said how many times were you with this girl he said just once he said he didn't remember her name he said i think it was on a Saturday night. He said, that's the only prostitute he ever picked up. And they said, how about any other girls? And he said, that's the only one I've been with. They said, you sure about that? He said, absolutely. So he asked if the cop asked if maybe Jeffrey had a disagreement with this girl about anything. And he said, no, not at all. Jeffrey had a disagreement with this girl about anything. And he said, no, not at all.

And then the guy said, nothing went wrong in the apartment. And then Jeffrey said, no. Well, she did kind of get upset at me. And he cracks. He goes, because I didn't have as much money for her as she would have liked. And they said, didn't you agree on this before you went up? Right. That's the you don't. They don't.

No woman of the night will come to your home unless you've agreed on a price. I'm sorry. You already know. And generally, if she comes to your place, the money's on the table before anything happens. Yes. That's how it works, man. And that's what's going on. And he said that she said she wanted 30, but I only gave her 20.

Oh, boy. And the guy said after. And he said, yeah. And then he said, after? And he said, yeah. And then he said, quote, the cop said, she took care of you without a down payment? There you go. Because as we know, it's the money first. And he said, yeah. And he said, the police officer says, quote, wow, pretty trustworthy hooker, huh?

And Jeffrey said, mm-hmm. This is just ridiculous. So then they go from that to, you know, it's a light conversation. They got him to admit to something he doesn't want to admit to. That's embarrassing. So then they switch up the tactic and they say, quote, do you have any problems in your life right now? He said, no, I'm fine. He said, everything's good.

You're mentally OK. And he said, yeah. And then he said, the cop says, you're a neat guy, huh? And he said, the cop says, you're a neat guy, huh? And he said, yeah. And he said, inside of your house, because I'm sure, geez, you even fold your undies, he says. So he said, you even fold your underwear. And he laughed, and Jeffrey did, and said, yeah, I get that from my mom. So now they're laughing.

And oh, yeah, you're a neat guy and all that kind of shit. And then he says, well, she taught you well. Oh, yeah. Where does your mom live? Now, he knew damn well that his parents were dead already but he wants to get to something you can get personal with him about where's your mom live my mom's dead and he says she died yeah my mother and father back when i was a kid they both died of cancer my mom died in 1988 my father in 1993 and so they go oh that's terrible how old were you i was 17 and i was 22 oh my god that's terrible they both had cancer how old were they mom was 41 dad was 47 um you know and they went oh you're kidding me nope oh god that must have been so hard on you who took care

of you you were only 17 you poor thing and you know he said that uh they both remarried and he had a pretty large family besides that and uh they said you know what month they died in and he said uh my mom was july my father was september they said you coped with that pretty well and he said yeah it was rough for the first you know a little while when my mom died but obviously it was devastating and after a little while, you get over it, you move on with your life. So they're like having like a heart-to-heart with him about that.

And he said, with my father, it wasn't such a big surprise. You know, at first when my mom died, it was like, oh my God, you don't even believe that something in your family, someone in your family could die like that, that young and stuff. And, you know, then with his dad, he wasn't surprised. They asked him if he had any problems with drugs or alcohol. He said he's never taken any kind of drugs, but he did drink beer, although not an alcoholic. He's like just on the weekends. Doesn't fuck my life up or anything. try to do it this way. Maybe you don't, you know, Hey, after you're drinking. And he said, no,

I was sober. Uh, then they wanted to know, they said, uh, why did you pick, decide to pick up a woman anyway? And he said, I had just been unlucky lately and it just happened. So they said, well, do you have any motor, any hobbies? He said, he drives motorcycles. He said, I go on motorcycle runs and things like that. And he says, yeah, I do weightlifting. And he said, yeah on motorcycle runs and things like that and he says yeah i do weight lifting and he said yeah i don't know if you saw my basement i have a gym down there that's all my equipment so he's been working out they said all right jeff i appreciate you being honest with us as far as telling us about the prostitutes i know that's embarrassing and he said yeah i apologize for that male hot says i apologize for that and he said to be quite honest here i believe there's a little more than that maybe a few other hookers at your apartment maybe jeff come on buddy that's that's that's a quote there and he says well not recently so now it's not recently oh what's going

on now they said well how about in the past year and he said in the past year probably three so you make him a little comfortable, he opens right up. He wants a friend. You can tell. Some people want a friend. And he said, what about the last two years? He said, like, maybe a couple. Then there's this line.

Quote, listen, we're guys, too. We're all guys here. Come on. Yeah. We're all guys. And he goes, yeah. And he goes, do you remember what these prostitutes look like? And he said, not really.

And he said, what's the earliest date you picked one up? And he said, probably four or five years ago. That was the earliest. And, you know, he said, that's all. And so they go on. He said he only took one lady back to his house. He went to motels with a couple others. And he said the first one he ever was with,

he took to her place in Providence. He said, you know, they go back to where he was living, this and that. They questioned him again, subject of, of,

of ladies here. And again, how many, how many prostitutes have you been with in your entire life? He said, four, three of them in the previous four years and one about five years ago so they said let me ask you this again okay have you ever had a problem with a prostitute in your

house any physical activity other than what you agreed to and he said nope no no real problems no and they said any reason at all why prostitutes are having a problem with you at all because they're making complaints to us so any problem with that he said no i don't get it a quote a couple of them actually said i look like a cop and they said what is that yeah he's trying to be like make friends with them now i don't know no they told me i'm one of you i'm one of you guys yeah so that's right we're buddies he said any of them ever get hooked up on on that and think you're a cop and freak out or anything like that and he said that no uh none of them ever freaked out they just got a little nervous around him till he convinced him that he wasn't a cop that was all and uh he said look looking looking around thinking like somebody

was going to jump out and arrest them or something like that, thinking I'm trying to, like, play a sting or something. And they said, again, quote, Jeff, did you ever have a problem with a prostitute in your house? They've asked him this question so many times. So many times. And he said, I've never had a serious problem with a prostitute in my house, no. Oh, Jeff. Okay, Jeff. Oh, Jeff.

Jeff. prostitute in my house no okay jeff jeff jeff if jeff would have just said lawyer assault on the one lady is all they have on him but instead he says all this stuff so they said what do you consider serious and he said well assault with a deadly weapon like the one girl why he's sitting here is basically what he considered serious he told that uh he told him that that uh the police he told him that that uh the police officer told him that his hands could be considered deadly weapons referring to the fact that he'd been choked or charged with choking two women he said that's never happened i've never assaulted anybody period i'm not a vicious person and they said no and he said no so did you ever

get into it with him physically pushing shoving and? And he said, no. He said nothing. Some of these girls, they freaked out or whatever, and they just go on like normal. They leave. Do they run out? And Jeff says, well, yeah, when they're in a big hurry to leave because they're out to get their next fix. And they go, how do you know that? And he says, because the last one I was with, she was like, quote, I need to go party and I need, you know, I need to get some shit. Because that's what she would say, obviously, to this guy. And he said that.

Yeah, that's what she said she needed the money for. I need to go find my man. He's going to give me a fix. That's what he said the quote was. And he said, the cop said, did she threaten you because you didn't have enough money? Maybe you were threatened and scared by this, you know, this streetwise person. There's a little window in the corner of the room maybe she came at you maybe it was self-defense maybe you were a guy trying to defend your home you

could get a stand your ground i think there's stand your ground apply to here i think it does i think you're gonna be a doctrine right here yeah it's right here it's all good um he said no she didn't threaten me she was just aggravated she was like whatever asshole fucking dickhead you know started swearing at me and shit like that and just left. And he said, what would you say if I told you several girls told us what your apartment looks like to a T and we can pretty much verify and that one thing that pops out is your neatness and how everything is set up in that apartment. How could that possibly happen unless they'd been there? What would you say about that? And he said, what would you say about them describing my apartment? I really don't know.

So they said, you know, and that's why you've got to be start being a little more honest with us because this can look worse than it is. Yeah. And he said, yeah. He said, maybe you just got something going on in your life. You've got problems and you're not this bad guy that you're being portrayed as. Do you understand what I'm saying? And he said, yeah.

He said, you have no record. You've never been arrested before. You've never even had a problem. You're saying you're not a violent man or anything like that. Yeah. He's like, okay, I like where this is going. And he said, put some fucked up shit

that has taken place in your apartment, okay? And you're going to have to help yourself out with this problem. And he says, yup. He's going along. He says, because you can end up in a big fucking pickle okay and he said okay he's just answering whatever his last thing yep okay okay 52 weeks sign right

here yeah i'm telling you do you know what i'm talking about yeah okay what happened what as far as the prostitutes he says yeah obviously what the fuck are we talking about? Not talking about your dodgeball DVD. What the fuck do you think? So he says, Jeff, we understand what you're going through, man. Yeah. He said, and Jeff said, no, I just can't do that. I've had prostitutes in my house. Yeah, but I never.

And they said, he goes, Jeff, Jeff, Jeff. All quiet. Jeff, Jeff, Jeff, Jeff. He said, and the guy goes, I've never. And they said, he goes, Jeff, Jeff, Jeff, all quiet, Jeff, Jeff, Jeff, Jeff. He said, and the guy goes, I've never. And he goes, Jeff stops him. He goes, Jeff, you're on the right track. OK, what happened? You've had some problems, right? And he goes, I've had misunderstandings. Yeah, but I've never I've never never touched anybody i've never physically forced myself on anybody and he goes no i can tell something's eating away at you jeff it's very obvious what

is it doing because we've been doing this for a long time jeff goes jeff he goes all right this isn't fucking stories that we're getting this is serious serious stuff okay jeff he goes we're hearing about and you've, serious stuff. Okay, Jeff. He goes, we're hearing about, and you've had some problems in your apartment with these girls and you know, and I'm thinking it's because you've had some problems in your life. Okay. I don't think you're a bad guy. And he said, yup. And he goes, but I think people are going to portray you as this bad guy. You understand what I'm saying? And he says, I do. He says, I think that's your job to help us out here. So you can, uh, to let us understand what's

going on in your head. OK, so we can help you. That's what we need to do is help you. He said, because it's so clear in your eyes that something is bothering you. And I think that's happened. I think that things have happened sometimes, which isn't you. This isn't you, Jeff. Jeff, it's not you. And he said, quote, No, I'm not. I'm actually just amazed that this is Jeff. Now, he goes, I'm actually just amazed this is all happening right now that I'm being accused of like being abusive to people. I don't know what else to say. And he says, What would you say if I told you that more more girls have told us to lay out of your apartment described it to a T than you're saying you've been with in five years. And he just kind of sits there and they go, let's get down to this. Several girls told us certain things you've done. Okay. Do you know what I'm talking about? You do, don't you?

And he goes, yeah. He goes, what is it? If you get this off your conscience, it's going to be like somebody lifted a fucking car off your back. I've seen this a thousand times. Just tell me, what is it? And he said, um, I've it and he said um i've and he said you what and he says i've gotten a little physical okay understatement of the year now we're

talking now we're talking so um uh it's at this point that they whip out pictures. Okay. They whip out pictures of Christine Dumont, of Stacey Goulet, of Audrey Harris. Oh, shit. They line them up on the table. Now they put them on the table. And they said he looked pretty jolted. And they just said, I don't know any of these girls. And they said, how are you so damn sure? And his answer, quote, because I've never killed anybody.

That's what you're getting at, right? Oh, Jeff, you idiot. And the cop goes, I don't know if anyone in in these pictures was killed jeff but they are missing so not good um it's at this point where the cops are also searching his house and uh 221 cato street wow uh three rooms looks like a bachelor pad furnished with mismatched kind of furniture. Yeah. Yeah. He's got PlayStations and shit like that. You know the apartment.

Yeah. Single guys don't go out and buy beautiful living room sets. They'll buy a TV and a PlayStation and sit on a fucking beanbag. They don't care. You got a milk crate for a nightstand. We know what it is. We know how it works. Mattress on the floor.

We get it. So they sprayed everything with luminol oh boy tub floor walls all this aerosol can of luminol in the first time i heard about this shit when i was like 14 i was stunned that this existed and i want to meet whoever created this shit it's amazing yeah so everybody knows that they put this and it reacts with the blood and then you turn the light you know you turn it on and then you got a nightlight and blood spatter. Exactly. So once they do it, the bathroom light went off and they said it was a fucking mess in

there. As soon as they turn the light off, the porous grout lines between the tiles became a luminescent grid. They said, wow, Just a grid lit up. They said the tub, the toilet, the floorboards, the pipes, sections of the tiled wall, they took it all because it all had blood all fucking over it. They said by the time they finished,

all that remained in the bathroom was a hole gaping to the basement below. Every item and every chunk of debris, they packaged it up and everything like that. So the mop he used to clean the floor, they had that tons of evidence of blood and DNA and everything in that. He kept it there. They seized his home computer to see if he'd ever talked about this with other people. And he didn't, though. They also grabbed a picture from Halloween that he's dressed as a wrestler and choking a teddy bear.

Oh, Jesus. They're like, this ought to do it. He likes to choke things. So in the basement, they found a handsaw, a recently purchased one that has a picture of a shark on a wooden handle, and it's hidden behind his washer and dryer. hidden behind his washer and dryer. Yes, they also look at tapes from surveillance camera at a local hardware store and show him buying the tool just one day after the last victim disappeared. Oh, no.

From there, they go to the street. Melhot had told the police that he disposed of a latex glove at one point. Basically, they go out into the sewer lines because they think things might have been flushed down the toilet or something like that. So they do that. They explore a pipe using a video camera. They found an infestation of a bunch of worms

attracted by a high-protein material that had come down the drain. Something like, you know, flesh. A public works crew dug up several feet of sewer line and uh they couldn't get anything out of it though uh they said that it was uh his just stuff there basically because he had so much protein that he was drinking to okay basically his shit was attracting them because there was so much protein in it. Creatine. Yeah. Yeah. So at the same time, they're scouring the landfill for anything else as well, which is terrible in July. Nobody wants to do that.

So an officer in training tore open a trash bag. That's how they were looking there for her. And they found a human body part. I didn't want to give it away earlier, but that's how they found her. They were looking for her. They collected DNA material, and that's how they found a human body part i didn't want to give it away earlier but that's how they found her they were looking for her they collected dna material and that's how they found who she was obviously and uh so they had to tell the parents her parents about that and everything the landfill search though found no traces of harris or dumont and similar dna tests were you know performed on everything they gathered more than 170 items and evidence.

By the way, he still had his motorcycle, $17,000 Harley Fatboy, all perfectly spotless and under a cover and everything behind his apartment. That's a real bike, man. For a guy that big, that's a big bike. For a 5.3 guy? Well, he wants to be Mr. Diesel, though. That's a lot of soft tail for that bike. I'm eating a lot of it's a lot of soft tail for that bite eating a lot of protein jimmy so they said haven't you heard that these women disappeared

and he said he hadn't heard about him quote i'm not really a news person oh boy you know how that goes um i'm not a real newsy kind of guy he said i mean i turn on the news here and there but i've never heard of them being mentioned. And so they go back. All right. What do you do? What do you do with these women? Yeah. He goes, what do you usually do with them?

He goes, quote, I choke them a little bit. He goes, OK, yeah, that's what I'm getting at. Jesus. What the fuck? He goes, OK, I've been talking about for the last two days. Fucking we've been going in circles. He goes, OK, I'm sure you felt better about getting that off your chest. I'm looking at you and it doesn't sound,

it doesn't seem like something that you would normally do, right? And he goes, no, no, it wasn't. And they go, what happens? What makes you do this? And he goes, well, it was from drinking. And they go, you think it's from drinking? And he said, yeah.

And they go, how many girls have you choked? Now be honest with me. And he'd say, he said, quote, I'd say like probably five or six. And then he goes, five or six. And how long has this been going on he said the last year or two the same choke every time and he says pretty much he goes from the from the back with my arm and he basically puts him in a chin lock that's what he does like you're like a

wrestling chin lock uh like a sleeper hold yeah and he said uh the cop said where'd you get that from like wrestling or something and he goes well maybe well, maybe. Yeah, I guess. He's like, I suppose, yeah. And he said, it's. And then the cop said, it's not normal. And he said, no. And the cop said, not normal at all. I mean, this is something that you're going to have to deal with in your life and you're going to have to get help for, all right? And he goes, mm-hmm, yeah, sure.

He goes, and that's going to start by you being honest with us like you have. And we appreciate that. He goes, you're showing us your true colors of being a man right now. And that's what's important. What you did isn't important. It's how you react now. He said, when was the first time you had a girl in your apartment? They go back and forth with that. He can't remember exactly what she looks like. Blah, blah, blah. He says, they said, did she pass out? And he said, yeah. And they said, all of them? And he said, no, some of them. He goes, and what happens after they pass out? And Jeffrey said, I just left her there until she woke up, and then she left the house. And he said he did that with all of them. They said, do you get any sexual gratification when this happens?

Be honest. And he said, no, actually, I don't. And the cop said, no. And he said, no, it's just when I've been drinking. So he said, would i don't and the cop said no and he said no it's just when i've been drinking so uh he said would you normally drink before you go out and he says just a beer they asked do you feel a little bit of rage there and he said he admitted that he felt some rage when choking the women and he told the police that the women who didn't pass out after he choked them did their best to fight him off once they they started fighting, he said he just let them leave his apartment.

He said, quote, they ran out of the house. So he said, weren't you worried they'd tell your story to the police? And he said, actually, one lady said she had a phone and she was calling 911, but the cops never came. So I don't know. So they asked, when did you choke anyone last? And they're going back and forth. And they said, you you know last couple months and uh he kept emphasizing none of them were black none of the he would say none of them are black meanwhile one of these women obviously is black um he said he never knew their names and uh

anyway he said uh um what's going on in your head when this is happening? And Mel Hott said, I honestly don't know. Like, I just think it's due to alcohol. And he said it wasn't for gratification. They said, did you cry or anything afterwards? He said, yeah, I mean, I felt bad afterwards. You know, why did I do that, you know? And he said he hasn't sought any professional help or anything like that. He hasn't, like, you know, told anybody about it, told any friends.

He just said they leave. they seem upset when they leave and uh then they said uh none of them lashed out at you hit you back or anything he said one did he said what happened she fought me off and got away and the guy was clever the cop says that was the black girl right and he goes honestly i think she might have been yeah she might have been black this is Now all of a sudden she's black. Yeah, that's what I mean. You keep poking, you know, chipping away. And he said, all right. I mean, obviously you understand when you're choking them.

He said a choke hold isn't allowed. I mean, they're outlawed for officers because they're dangerous. He goes, they're dangerous, right? And the guy, Jeffrey, says, yeah. He goes, what can happen? And Jeffrey goes, you could kill somebody, which sounds like you just lectured a five-year-old. And he said, how could you kill someone? And he goes, suffocating them.

And he said, I never intended to kill anybody, which was an interesting thing to say. And you go, why'd you do it? And he goes, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. go why'd you do it and he goes i don't know i don't know i don't know he said uh he said what if he had done what would you have done if you one of the women you choke never woke up he said well i would have called the police because i wouldn't have been able to live with myself if i killed someone you know jesus christ i would have been a wreck and he says how do you know

how are you able to live with these other things you're remembering now and he says uh that's something honestly it feels good to talk about right now jeffrey does and he says he's been hiding in a couple years and um then they said is there any chance that maybe you took your choking games a little too far at some point and he said no and he said have you ever killed anybody be honest with me jeff jeff jeff what happens when you choke him jeff jeff what happens when you choke him jeff and he says quote uh this is the cop i have to be honest with you there's another thing we need to talk to you about did you push it a little too far with some of them may you know one of them or one of them i mean that's something you've got to relay to us do

you know what i mean if you took it too far if you've got if you took it too far if you've got to relay to us. Do you know what I mean? If you took it too far, if you've got a problem, you have to tell me. And Jeff said, yup. He just said, yup. Yup what? Yup. And he said, and you've let all the other girls go and stuff like that. I mean, obviously you're showing that you're doing this for God and for God knows what reason. And we could delve into a few things to try to figure out why.

But there's a very high chance that it could have gone too far. And he said, it's never gone too far. I'd never I'd never kill anybody. And that's when they start kind of going at him about his parents dying. And he said, you know, they had proper burials. They're in consecrated ground, Jeff. He said, the families of these girls can't mourn. They can't say goodbye.

They'll have to live with that the rest of their lives. How are you going to do that? And then they spread the pictures out again. And they said, what happened, Jeff? Tell us the pictures. Yeah. What happened? He said, you just pushed it too far.

Right. Things got out of hand. And then they tell him they try to they say that, you know, if you accidentally killed him, it'd be better for you to confess now because then you'll get a lesser punishment which isn't true but you know you can tell a guy anything when he's in there he said i don't know any of these girls and he said no and he goes no none of these is the ones i had he goes are you positive he goes that was a pretty quick look why don't you take a little closer look at him and he said yeah well there's three of them then all of a sudden now there's three of them that he knows out of the girls. And he goes, they all kind of look the same. I mean, I can think of some of the girls

that talk to us. I mean, are you sure? And Jeff said positive. And he said, he said, well, you weren't even sure it was a black girl. So how can you know that these are the pictures and know right away that these are any of the girls? He says, well, because, you know, I'm looking at their faces. And he says, he says, these girls are all over and you've never seen them before. He said, if I did, I would recognize him, you know, because it's usually dark. I wouldn't recognize him, you know, because it's usually dark out. So he said, so you're not 100 percent sure. He goes, no, I'm pretty sure.

So they're going around. He wants to make sure. He said, they've never none of them have ever been in my apartment. And they're talking about how can you be so sure you're drunk when you do this? You said he said, quote, Jeff, you know something. We deal with these girls all the time. Maybe I'm not a very good cop or anything, but I forget their names even. I mean, who can remember these these fucking women coming in and out?

He goes, we've been dealing with them for 10 or 15 years and I forget their faces, forget who they are. And yet somehow you're able you're telling us that you drink so much that you go into doing things like that, that you like, but you still can't clearly 100% you can on the drop of a dime, tell us that none of these are them. And so, uh, he goes out, he goes, uh, can you pick them out? Keep looking. And he says, don't matter. That's what Jeff said.

Don't matter. He says, no, don't you think we're trying to get to something? He says, it's just that you answered awful quickly. Are you sure none of these girls were in your apartment? He said, so if our collectors, they find any evidence, it's a mistake. If they go in there, they find the hairs, fibers. It's a mistake. It's all a mistake.

He said, yeah, I've never done any. I've never killed anybody. That's what you're getting at right now. So then he says, who said these girls were killed? First of all, Jeff. And that's what he said, because you're basically accusing me of, you know, choking, choking this girl, you know, choking her until she didn't wake up. So now they're going back and forth.

Then he goes, hey, look, we're all guys, Jeff. They go back to that. We're all guys here. He goes, we all have some weird tendencies, don't we? We all have one little peccadillo that makes us horny. You know how it is when you're a guy. Your dick makes you do weird things, Jeff. Sometimes I get in the wife's asshole without asking.

Hey, it just slips in. You know what I mean? He said, quote, we already know that you have your own things. You've already told us you've done this with these girls. He said, you've already agreed that things've done this with these girls he said you've already agreed that things could go bad with these girls now i'm already uh now i've already told you that what it looks like and that one of these girls could have happened it was all an accident right we're clear on that and he says he said it's like the sergeant told you these girls are missing we want to find out what happened we want their families to have closure he says i have nothing to do with

this okay so then uh he tells him that uh uh you know, you know all this thing about, you know what this is like. You had your parents, all this type of shit. You only choked five or six of them. And then finally, he says, Jeff, your life will be over, over unless you get this off your chest. OK, I know what happened. I know what happened, Jeff. I know you're not a bad man. That's I know.

I know you're not a bad man. I know. I know you're not a bad man. I know you just took it too far. What happened, Jeff? What happened? You pushed it too far one night, didn't you, Jeff? Things got out of hand. Tell me. And Jeff said, yes.

And he starts crying. And the detective says, all of them? And he said, mm-hmm. All three? And he said, all three. He said, three he said all right good job where are they where are they now jeff and he said dead oh boy oh boy funny but terrible at the same time yeah uh the cop was caught so off guard by this sudden admission he didn't even know what to do he was like where are the well what's this then i mean shit he's know what to do he was like where are the well what's this then i mean shit he's answering questions fuck man he thought maybe the other cops were playing

a joke on him and put mail hop basically he thought maybe this was all a big punked and like this whole thing's a joke this isn't a real case and that they got this guy as like an actor to come in and confess to serial killing because it's too stupid holy shit he actually was like am i being punked he just said yes and cried and said all three nobody does that so he said where are they and he said they're they're in garbage bags oh god damn it he said garbage bags where he goes i just dumped them in trash containers they talk about all around moon socket and he says where are you going to show us where you put these girls jeff and he said yeah so he's going to do that uh he um he said that uh this whole thing they talked about what happened he said uh wow he goes i just want to be totally honest i don't want to hide it anymore i don't want this shit inside me anymore i want to do

what i have to help this situation in any way I can. And I want that to be my last act. I'm not expecting forgiveness. So he said over the years, he's picked up as many as 30 prostitutes. He said, took him back to his apartment most of the time because he didn't want to get arrested in a car somewhere, which is whatever. He couldn't recall exactly how many women he choked but he guessed 10 or 12 survived and escaped and they said what happened and um they said okay you're doing the right thing you know what a lot of people are going to be thankful for this he goes you got to think hard you're the only

one that's got to tell us where the girls are how did you fit them in trash bags he said cut them up he said you cut them all up where he said my house in the bathtub what did you what did you cut them up with a saw what kind of saw just a regular saw you can get in lowe's just a wood cutting saw he didn't even use a circular saw he used a fucking hand saw that they found downstairs that's what he used they said are, are we talking electric? And he said, no, just a handsaw. And the guy said, handsaw? Like, holy shit, you have to put in some effort to do that. That is personal.

And horrific. And he said, mm-hmm. He said, each girl was cut up? Mm-hmm. Three? Three. So then at this point, they ask him if he wants a soda or a cigarette just to keep him going. They want to keep them going.

And, um, he says that, uh, wow. He says, you put them in what type of trash bags? He says, trash bags. Yeah. We just said that stupid. Where'd you get them? He said, like at Walmart, the drawstring kind. Jesus said, did you already have them?

He said, no, actually I did. I had them the first time. Okay. The first time you already had the trash bags after that, did you go out and buy them? He said, no, I already had them. said no actually i did i had them the first time okay the first time he already had the trash bags after that did you go out and buy them he said no i already had them he buys in bulk people he's got a lot of trash bags are trash bags only for disposing of of body parts that's it i got else i'm james i'm a i'm a potential murderer i have so many trash bags i do too i buy yeah i buy them when they're on sale they said uh uh who was the first girl

and he said she was and pointed at audrey they said do you remember the date he said last year february or march she was cut up and put in a trash bag and disposed of where and he said rock ridge apartments in the brunswick bowling alley oh boy um so he said okay different parts different places he said yeah the second girl where second girl, where is she? Same thing. I did the same thing for all three. That was earlier this year. They go over the time. The last one, probably about a month ago.

He said, all the girls were choked. Do you remember what night you picked up Stacey Goulet? I don't remember the exact night. They said it was around the 4th of July. He said, probably around the 4th of July, probably right around that time. I'm not sure. Picked her up on Arnold Street in front of Warehouse Liquors. They said, okay, this young lady right here, the first one, Audrey Harris, how many pieces did you cut her up in? And let's describe how you actually went about this. Oh, God. And he said, yes. And they said, head? And he,

yes. And they said, limbs, head, torso cut in half from the waist is what he said. Okay. Each one was placed in a plastic bag. No, each one was placed in several bags, probably like four or five bags. Reason being to make it smaller. When did you come up with this idea? Like a couple of days after I did it. Where was she? She was in my bathtub.

How long was she in your bathtub? I put her in there after I choked her. Why did you keep her preserved or anything like that? Like you're sitting in July with a decomposing body. And he said, no, no. But you were able to stay in your apartment with her in your bathtub. Did you sleep while she was there? And he said, while she was there. Yes, I did. Wow. There was no smell given off or anything like that. No one else lives there. it's all he's all alone who gives a shit um yeah at one point he got up to his feet to demonstrate his choking technique he said i lean back so it puts more pressure on their neck oh boy um yeah he said uh you know he was talking given details he said his victims fell to the floor unconscious both were up in minutes and they tried to get out so he said uh he he figured he had to do more. He said one said she's standing in the bedroom saying, please, master, let me go, because they're doing like a role-playing thing there.

I think she offered me my money back. And he said, any of these girls fight back? That was when he let go. Did they cut you or anything? He said a couple of scratch marks. One of them gouged my eye to get away. And finally, they talk about audrey harris he said he was at a strip club and drank too much and he picked her up uh they agreed on 30 for sex and uh he was thinking he was going to have sex

with her he wasn't thinking he was going to kill her uh he said i was going to have sex with her just straight sex yeah she asked for the money um and, he said that when I got in the house, I just gave her a little tour of the house and went into my bedroom. She got undressed. I got undressed. I was wearing a pair of shorts and she was totally naked. Then she asked me for money and I went to give her the money and she turned around and I started, that's when I went from behind and just started choking her. And he said it was probably seven or eight minutes and uh that they were in the apartment before that said just talking and uh he said he was really drunk he doesn't remember much of that he said there was no arguing just that was it he said uh she was kicking and scratching

trying to get away as she was losing her breath she stopped struggling then i let her go i looked at her her eyes were open but she wasn't looking at anything i figured she was dying that's when i got the pillow i suffocated her too uh so the cop says so it wasn't accidental and he said no obviously not so um he didn't say obviously not so um yeah he talked about all of this um he talked about all the different girls girls kicking and screaming and they're struggling and no one heard it because there's nobody there. Jesus Christ. He says about the other girl, he saw blood bubbles coming up and he figured she was dying. And but then she was breathing.

So he suffocated another one to do that. It's he said it was just an urge. No particular reason why it happened. Just an urge to do it. He said, after I took the pillow off, I stood back for a few minutes, just kind of looking and pacing around, not knowing what to do. Then he went to sleep. He went to sleep. And next day he went to Walmart.

He got plastic heavy like tarps and a carpet. And he rolled her up in that put her in his truck and drove her to go dump her somewhere in the city or in the town of wound socket and instead thought he was going to get caught so he got paranoid brought her back to the house picked her back up brought her back inside and that's when he decided to dismember her so that's how you feel driving around texas with weed in the car can you imagine a dead body in the bed of your pickup truck with a fucking carpet oh my god jesus christ so he said that how did he figure this out he goes well i thought about the sopranos and when they killed ralphie

that's what they did when they killed joey pants there joe panoliano he goes they called tony and then you know or tony had to call everybody and they cut him up in the bathtub and that's how they got rid of him so he was like i guess that's what you do wow so he goes i figured that's it he went into his bedroom and changed into his uh kid rock t-shirt he did this with a kid rock t-shirt on basically you got latex gloves a kid rock t-shirt and a with with red white and blue Kid Rock letters and a handsaw. And he went to fucking tackle this. That's what you wear if you're painting the bathroom.

That's what he's doing. He's painting it red, so may as well wear the white uniform. He said he draped Audrey's head over the side of the tub and sawed it off. That's how he started. tub and sawed it off oh god that's how he started uh sawed off arms and feet draping each body part over the tub finally cut her torso in half um and all that sort of shit other dismemberments he did the same thing basically it just he did the exact same thing through the he threw drove around to different uh he just got better at it yeah you know he knew what he was doing he drove around you think he would have got an electric saw at some point, but he kept with the fucking with the saw there.

You stick with what works, I think. Yeah. They said, what were you thinking about when you're driving around to get a prostitute? Sex or choking? And he said, sex. I wasn't thinking about choking. And they said, what's the big rush? I'd say the actual.

And he said, I'd say maybe actually getting them into my place. And the guy said, the door shuts. And, you know, and he said, you could say it like that. Yeah. And he's got them then. He feels like he can possess them then and do what he wants with them. And then they said, let me ask you a question. If you had the chance to kill again, would you?

And he goes, I probably would. I probably would. Then once they were like, all right, I think we got everything. We'll get back to you. He goes, quote, I'm sorry. I lied we got everything. We'll get back to you. He goes, quote, I'm sorry. I lied to you guys.

Um, I'll see you around guys. I got, I got a bike week this week. Uh, yeah. And they said, quote,

Jeff, listen, we deal with this stuff a lot. Okay. We understand these things happen. Okay. We understand that things like this happen. Now you've come this far. Okay.

And again, I do really appreciate what you're doing and I hope you feel a little better about this whole thing. And he said, mm-hmm. And yeah, that was that. And also, by the way, they said, they tried to get him to confess to more.

They go, there's other girls that haven't turned up. And he said, mm-hmm. And they said, he said, no, there's not. I'm not going to confess. He goes, I'm not gonna confess to three and not confess to any more. Okay. But there's a girl that was missing his last apartment right down the street from him. A prostitute missing.

So they think that he admitted to the ones that he knew they had him dead to fucking rights on. And there's more. For sure. There's more. There's got to be. He said. You don't get comfortable butchering women in your fucking apartment. And there's more. For sure. There's more. There's got to be. He said the lady here. You don't get comfortable butchering women in your fucking apartment.

That's not number one. That's not normal. No. He said the police officer, the detective said for him it was all fantasy. He'd slip into this fantasy escape in his depressive world. And once he'd taken his first step, once he kills, he's like an alcoholic. He's had a taste. He's addicted.

And there's no way he's going to stop. Now, his friends said, the Jeff I knew was never quiet. This is the woman who dated him. He was always laughing. No matter what someone needed,

he couldn't say no. Up to the day of his arrest, I could say nothing bad about him. An employee of the local strip club that he went to before he picked up Audrey, the K2U strip club, he said, quote, I K2U strip club.

He said, quote, I never had any suspicions whatsoever. In fact, when I first heard about the charges, I thought they made a mistake. That's what everybody says. Now, Christine Dumont's sister has a different. Anybody that owns a strip club, if somebody's in there a lot and then arrested for murder, you should just go, we run a strip club. He was a regular. Of course, he's a scumbag. What arrested for murder. You should just go. We run a strip club. He was a regular. Of course, he's a scumbag.

What do you think? He ate lunch here. He ate food. What do you want? He was here when the sun was up. What are you talking about? Of course, he's not a good guy. Jesus Christ.

Christine Dumont's sister recognized him. Recognized him. sister recognized him recognized him said that he she remembers him out from being outside her apartment lot not long before her sister disappeared quote he had dropped her off he was yelling uh she said that christine came in telling her to lock the door because she just stole his money which is her mo and she said we you know he said we've she said we've all heard it people saying well it's because they're prostitutes. That's why they were killed. He didn't just kill my sister.

He took away so many pieces of people's hearts. He made it. He made her out to look like she was trash. I don't I don't feel any kind of relief in any way. I know justice will prevail, but it will take some time. He she said, it's no comfort knowing he can wake up every day. He can eat. He can be among his people

open his eyes and look in the sky while my sister is still in some landfill somewhere because the other two girls were never found the two women were never found never never found um that's it otherwise they wouldn't have known anything um so yeah he did all of this and he fit the profile to a T to when they did like a profile of it. They talked about a guy who he has to do, you know, dehumanize people, basically see their victims as less than him. Talks about how, you know, he's trying to replace his inadequacies and identities with identities that imply power and control. I'm a wrestler.'m a harley guy you know i'm a fucking you know you see a lot of guys do that but they don't kill anybody right how many

guys do you know like that i know 10 guys like that so it's just a thing yeah i i'm a thing now look at me i you know they're looking for a thing right um but yeah he says uh as long as he can hold on to these wrongheaded notions as he's riding the streets of filth. But once he's apprehended and gets some feedback, the fantasy bursts and he realized he's done some despicable things. So he can basically stay in his fantasy world where all of this is OK. And they said that he says that while his parents were kind and loving, their early deaths could have affected him a lot. I'm sure it did. It affects a lot of people, but they don't kill everybody.

He said, we're talking about frustration, catastrophic losses in this guy's life. I think that's a key to understanding why. He said, when did you first know something inside you wasn't right? 20s, 30s? How old are you now? And he said, 20s, 30s. I'm 33 right now. Somewhere in my 20s, I knew something wasn't right 20s 30s how old are you now and he said 20s 30s i'm 33 right now somewhere in like my 20s i knew something's wasn't right it's usually about 30 as the average age of a serial killer will start killing really takes them that long to build the fantasy up and to have to

do it you know that's the that's the thing so um yeah um they said i think he said i think alcohol may be a trigger but it's something inside me he said i have a problem that's what he said i agree yeah he decides to plead guilty of course three counts of first degree murder because he doesn't i don't think want all of these details coming out in court no and that's hard to rebut yeah three counts of first degree murder two counts of assault um he says at the sentencing, quote, nothing I can do can take away the pain. I hope God can give the families, both victims and my own, some peace. The judge says you, sir, may fuck off life in prison. That's OK. Yeah. Chance of parole after 40 years, though.

That's not he's eligible for parole in 2047. We're at least not good at all. Old, old enough to where hopefully a woman could fight him off if they had to. But the frail in wheelchairs and children are not safe. No, they're not. That's what I mean. The even Goulet's ex-husband, Steve Craig, who was accused of that shit. He says that, quote, I still get nauseous when i see gar garbage trucks i try not to ride behind them uh another piece of impact here january 2008

robert dumont uh a relative obviously uh was it's a the brother uh i'm sorry uh her brother there christine's brother was found dead in a holding cell. Um, after he was brought into the police station, he'd been arrested for breaking into an apartment across the hall from where he lived. And, uh, they said he was standing against the bars and not moving. And they found that he tied his shirt around his cell and hung himself.

His longtime girlfriend said that, he became very depressed ever since his sister, Christine was murdered in 2004. He's never been the same and he's tried to kill himself before, and it just didn't work. Now, Jeffrey's in prison, and his ex-girlfriend exchanges letters with him. She says, quote, he sounds upbeat. I wrote back and asked, did you ever feel that way, that rage with me?

And he said, never. She was like was i almost killed um why wasn't i special uh yeah other people in the jail have said that he's pretty open about talking about it he doesn't care you just talk about it his last known address was uh jeffrey melhot 126800 maximum security PO box, eight, two, seven, three Cranston, Rhode Island. Oh, two, nine, two. Oh, so if you want to yell at him and call him a piece of shit, that's where you can

reach him. Then in 2010, he was trying to sell shit. He made an outline of his left hand and it was available for 3499 on some poor shit. One of those murder fucking jerk-off sites. Fucking assholes. Like a fucking Thanksgiving turkey kind of thing? Yeah. Ridiculous.

The only person, the only one of these ladies I could find where she was buried is Stacy Goulet, who's buried in the St. John Baptiste Cemetery in Norfolk County, Massachusetts. Well, that's because the other two are still in the landfill, James. That's what I mean. We don't know where they are. So now there's a very quickly two other guys. We never do this on the show, but this is so specific. There are two guys named Jeff Mailhot in the Northeast who do not need this publicity. Poor bastards.

do not need this publicity. One is a Minnesota University basketball assistant coach who used to serve as an assistant coach at Iona. He works for Rick Pitino's kid. And another one, this guy, the worst. And I'm saying this because please go to this guy if you have a problem. Dr. Jeffrey Mailhot. He's a dermatologist. He's got out of 11 ratings, he's got five stars on healthgrades.com. He looks's a dermatologist. He's got out of 11 ratings.

He's got five stars on healthgrades.com. He looks like a pleasant guy. I'm pretty sure he has never strangled anybody. He knows all about your skin and will not make a lampshade out of it. No. As far as we know. And how many how much business has he lost? Honestly, a ton.

I'll go to the guy who's I'm not going to Jeffrey Dahmer's acupuncture. I'm just not doing it. You know, no matter how much he's not to Jeffrey Dahmer's acupuncture. I'm just not doing it, you know? No matter how much he's not that Jeffrey Dahmer, it just sounds weird. And he's in Massachusetts, too. It's right there. I'm not going to Dennis Rader's chiropractic. No.

Come on. Hop up on the table. I'll give you an adjustment. So that is Woonsocket, Rhode Island, and Jeffrey Malhot, and Christine. That's just a terrible, terrible... Stacey, Christine, Audrey. That's just a terrible, terrible Stacey, Christine, Audrey. That's just an awful fucking story. What a story. A terrible, terrible man.

Holy shit. Can you imagine how long he could have gotten away with that? I mean, 2004, think fuck that they got it together, that three victims is about as far as you can get now. Yeah, but I think there's more. There's got to be, right? There's more that he just hasn't admitted to but it's a and it didn't take it wasn't science and technology that got him it was someone who got away going to the police and and giving a physical description it's a it's a thing so if you like that show or at least enjoyed the crazy ass story or how we told that i should say because no one would like that story

get on Apple podcast give us five stars tell the world about it because it really does help a lot I don't know why but it helps drive you up the charts more people find the show and that's good for everybody especially our wallets so please do that it helps a lot also you can follow us on social media

at murder small on Twitter and at small town pod on Facebook, at Small Town Murder on Instagram. You can find out all the dates, the rescheduled dates for our live shows. Whenever they are rescheduled, we post them there. And then they're on Shut Up and Give Me Murder dot com, which is where you can go for everything Small Town Murder and crime and sports related. And you want to do that. Get your merchandise tickets to all the live shows for 2022 2022 yes 2022 i almost said 2025 i had to stop myself uh 2022 yeah enough 2022 get all your tickets for that and like we said nashville is

going to be sometime in the second week i believe of jan of January. 11th and 12th. January 11th, January 12th. We have Small Town Murder and Crime and Sports there. So we're not sure which night is which, but it's one of those two nights. If you go to ShutUpAndGiveMeMurder.com, you can find out, too. So check that out. Patreon, Patreon, Patreon. The other thing, real quickly, James, the Nashville show, they don't have like a they change their ticketing system and they don't have emails to email people that their tickets have been moved so go to the website

and check it god damn it we changed our ticketing system to make it less good we were like this is this is way too convenient way too many people know what to do and let's make it so it's a lot more confusing what What do you say, everybody? Perfect. Great. Emails didn't go over. What the fuck are they thinking, Zanies? Come on, Zanies. 11th and 12th. Jesus Christ.

Lucy, you can do something about that. Yes. At least you can yell at someone to do something about that. She's better than that. She's great. She's way better than that. That is piss poor. And I know that frustrates her, too, probably. I'll bet it does.

Check that out. Get your tickets right now. But Patreon, this week week we have so much good stuff on patreon patreon.com slash crime and sports two episodes this week we have backstage wrestler fights yeah which are hilarious drugged up righted up dudes fighting each other can't go wrong there but for real and backstage uh that's a lot of fun we're gonna have that we're gonna hotel rooms and everything and then for small town murders bonus episode but you'll get access to everything with just the five dollars that gets you access to both shows patreon the whole back catalog the whole deal we're gonna do old

timey murders which is one of our it's like one of my favorites it's like uh date you know prisoner dating game and personal ads and old timey murders. Those are my three like favorite bonus topics where we're going to go back to the late 19 or late 1800s, early 1900s and get some murder on and see what's up with that. So that's going to be a lot of fun. Patreon dot com slash crime and sports. In addition to that, Jimmy will give you a shout out at the end of the show. Read your name off and mispronounce your name brutally. Oh, for sure. Get a absolutely.

So you can check that out there. And if you just want to be a great person with good karma and get a shout-out at the end of the show because you're a producer, you can do that over at PayPal as well using our email address, crimeandsportsatgmail.com. That said, there's nothing else I need. I need to feel better after that dirty, disgusting story of this terrible person. I need to feel warm and cuddly by hearing the names of my favorite goddamn people in the world

who would never, ever drape our body parts over a bathtub, cut us up into tons of pieces, and drive around and sporadically dump us in different dumpsters. Jimmy, hit me with those names. Real verbal teddy bear. This week's executive producers are Damon Stevens, Jordan Bennett, Simon Shedd got a new job, and he had a birthday this week. Good for you, Simon. Happy birthday, Simon. He's the best.

Good for you guys. Thank you. They're awesome people. Thank you. Other executives this week are Ann Fountain, Amanda Powers, Connor Thomas, Christy Burrows, and she donated every possible way that you can. Thank you so much, Christy. Thank you so much. Eric Crabtree, Justin McAlexander,

Darren Weiferich, I think. Yes, Darren. Did I say Darren? I don't even know what I said. Darren, whose wife is rich. Yes. Other producers this week are James Marder, Jennifer Stevens, Carl Kirshner, Peyton Meadows,

my little buddy Jalen Tross. He messaged us on PayPal because I was like, I don't want to. I said they lost their grandparent because I didn't know what to say. And then realized I don't have to assume a gender because they is fine. But Jalen wrote to make sure that I understand. Jalen is a boy. So now we know that. So now we know that.

We didn't know. I think it's just because we made a mistake and we were like is that who knows and then we were like well shit we just gave them right we just gave them a gender so i don't know thank you hang in there keep being amazing uh also liz vasquez alejandro alejandro alejandro martinez that's a uh beautiful isn't that a uh that a who sings that I don't know doesn't matter Navigators USA chapter 110 Terror and Fordham Baldi's Richard Johnson donated in memory

of Fawn Lebowitz and it was his birthday and I called him on Instagram and he didn't answer I think it was his birthday I don't know somebody just wanted me to call him Lebowitz what does that name sound Fawn Lebowitz I don't know is Somebody just wanted me to call him. Fawn Leibowitz. Why does that name sound familiar? Fawn Leibowitz. I don't know. Is that a joke somewhere?

Is that an OJ's? Is that one of Cole Brown's friends or something? Don't look at me. I haven't got a clue. I think it might be. I'll look it up while you're doing these. All right. Mike Kuehling, Maria Rasper, Megan Blank, Kelsey Kautz, I think, Regina Phipps, Baron Ashikonzi, Ashkonzi, Ashkenazi, what?

Ashkenazi? Yeah? Ashkenazi? Yeah. There's an Australian pervert dirt bike rider with that last name. I hope it's not him. Maybe it's Barron. I don't know. Also, Thomas Smith, Sam McHale, Jude Kendall, Alexi Knapp, Matt Britt got a new liver, and Maggie gifted him the CIS live show in the hospital. Thank you, Maggie.

That was very nice. That's awesome. And hang in there, Matt. I, Maggie. That was very nice. That's awesome. And hang in there, Matt. I hope you fucking rock that liver out. Good for you. Hell yeah. Also, Christy Kelly lost her pup, Baxter, and he was a good boy, and she's very hurt about it, obviously.

April Dunning's friend, Megan Noosh, had a birthday. Happy birthday, Megan, or Megan Noosh. I don't know if that's the right name. Janice Hill also. Jean-Léon Magnato. Raj rerun Dwayne and their mentor Shirley. Yes, the What's Happening crew. I love it.

Thank you. Rear Admiral Jack Mehoff, of course. Well done. Avon Merger. Susanna Platt. Juan Epstein's fro. Michael Haugsma. What? That might be me typing wrong.

DeVitas Marascovas. Jesus Christ. DeForest Bloom had a birthday. Happy birthday, DeForest. Ashley Veo, Eric Curtis, Julie Maynard Standard, Tessa Hupp, Nick Nurenberg, E.W. Calivari, Amelia Wilson, Matt Hutchinson, Telly Hickey, Elizabeth Greenup, Kayla Moore, Amanda, Amanda Ribello, Isabella Quintana, Corinne Lemaire, Ryan Miller-Shasky, Christina Rock, Heather Yarbrough, Nita Moore, Abigail Sheets, Gino Falk, Jim McCormick, Clay Campbell, Tiffany Cunningham, Amy with no last name, Kel Nelvel, Andrew Marist, Kimberly Easton, Roger Ekberg, Jordan C., Taylor Johnson, Christy Simmons, David Fuller, Amanda Wegman. I love Amanda. That's my favorite name.

Amanda Wegman, Clayton Watson, John Manderfield, Michelle Bork, Skyler Stewart, Alana Abel, Heidi Johnson, Justin Killingbeck, Craig O'Mahoney, Andreas, James Rhodes, James Blue, Michael Phaeton, Michelle Mazuris, Nick Libicap, fuck these last names this week, Andrew Temple, Jennifer Shantz, Taylor Kenschmerich, Heather Gilliam, Jessica Collins, Daniela Rios, Ashley Milton, Mark Spears, Rachel Farmer, Kyle Hopkins, Julie with no last name, Unionize Your Workplace, Rory Douglas Cobb, Mary Borg, Susanna Beagle, Bianca Arano, Laurel Fay, Michaela DeGager, Debbie Ard, Bailey Freer, Frederick Keefe, Laura Chadwick, Alina Mitchell, Natalia Buxo-Berge, Amanda Barden, Brooks R. Tabb Evans, Mark Connolly, Patrick Roseberry, Mary Sider, Liz Wilcox, Jennifer Dalton, Victoria Bollock S. Brad, Nicole Carlson, Ace2014508. That might be their social.

I'm not sure. Jacqueline Cuscuna, Jolene Loritz, Kate Ciccone, Tink with no last name, Natalie with no last name, Kyle Biercy, Cindy Moreau, Lee Searcy, Doc Strand, Doc Strange. Yeah, no. Justin Weir, Brooke Hudson. What's that? That's no. I don't know for sure, to be honest with you.

Brooke Hudson, Travis Parker. Say again. I seem confused. I'm very confused. Every week, this is a fucking nightmare. Brooke Hudson, Travis Parker, Samantha Michelle, Erica Morris, Shelby Topham, Trin Gozier, Rosa Lee, Tammy Altman, Galactic Commander and Baby Girl, Catherine Campbell, Melissa Hawkins, Samantha with no last name, Drew Dibble, Diddle?

It's Diddle. My Christ. Diddle. That is tough. Fred Mercado, Christina Kapitsa, Charlie Bourne, Brandon Koch, Marcy Goodfellow, Kim Phillip, Jessica Rowe, Alyssa Rizzo, Emily Rowe, Laura Marshall. I think that's Marshall. Travis. Nope, that's Tricia.

Tricia Rhea, Melissa V. Stotsky, Christopher Stalin, Kelly Flaherty, Tiffany Kaiser, Joe McNeary. Oh, boy. McNeary. Kate Cohane kit and greg terry dowdy savannah with no last name amy montgomery what is it i'm just laughing arena arena streelitz donna farron andy andy drew lalle, Shea Beaton, Joey Kirch, Lauren with no last name, Ryan Unrow, Connor Thomas, Madison East, Douglas Jamison, Randy Michelle Allen, Tyler Tharp, Amanda Foltz, Aislinn Partington, Heather Ling, Davey McCrory, John Welty, Devin Lee, Dean with no last name, Kayla Lacey, Jocelyn Sabori, and Rick Parando, and obviously all of our other patrons. You guys are truly amazing.

Thank you for what you do. Thank you, everybody, so much, so, so much for everything that you do for us. We cannot, honestly, we can't thank you enough for everything you do for us. We're blown away by it, and we're just grateful to you. So just thank you for doing everything you do for us. Hope you love the Patreon episodes. We put a lot of work into them because we really want you to love them

because you're giving us money. So, Jimmy, how can people tell you they love you? How can they do it? Oh, shit. I'm on the internet, on Instagram and Twitter, and I appreciate you guys being a part of that. Where can they find you? You Google us.

You know how to find us. Google the show, and it's on there somewhere. Follow us out with us keep coming back every goddamn week this guy found hookers to kill james they can find us that's true yeah you can find us if you can find the right plastic wrap at walmart to wrap a body in that said until next week. It's been our pleasure. Bye. Hey, Prime members, you can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free on Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today. Or you can listen early and ad-free with Wondery Plus and Apple Podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.